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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: An orange haired man with the ball spot, cheez It's

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Speaker 2: toilet paper, the red roof in what happened in the

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Speaker 2: case of Carly Russell. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for being with us here at Foxcination and series

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Speaker 2: XM one eleven. Let's start at the get go with

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Speaker 2: the nine to one one call. Take a listen to

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Speaker 2: our cut.

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Speaker 3: Seven seventy one. It's going to be forty nine south

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Speaker 3: my Market ten. It's going to be a child walking

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Speaker 3: on the three four year old child walking on the

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Speaker 3: side of the interstate.

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Speaker 4: Thanks to Harpie's going to be close mind.

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Speaker 3: I ran Ridge Stadius the day and with the hazards on.

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Speaker 3: Child's gonna be a white male wearing a white T

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Speaker 3: shirt and a diaper from shift for for forty two.

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Speaker 3: Harp's advising there's no cars in the area where the

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Speaker 3: child's been abandoned on the side of the ridge or negative,

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Speaker 3: but she's saying that she would stand by for police

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Speaker 3: forty two call her RP back, she's not at their vehicle.

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Speaker 2: If you're willing to take the time and the energy

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Speaker 2: and you dissect, nine one one calls you learn so much.

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Speaker 5: Take and listen to the rest of that.

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Speaker 3: CALLO for cla read in color to Nicole Russell out

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Speaker 3: of Birmingham to let them come around on everyone's world before.

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Speaker 3: We're not getting a female to answer forty two our

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Speaker 3: coffee ty four.

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Speaker 4: That's the RP.

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Speaker 3: We're trying to call her back. She's a non answering

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Speaker 3: abut the interstate as well. Can give me a description

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Speaker 3: on the child and a southbound walking south down here

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Speaker 3: four south bend walking south down. It was a toddler

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Speaker 3: three four year old wearing a white T shirt and

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Speaker 3: a diaper. RP. You've arrived in a brand Mercedes along

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Speaker 3: with our pieces Christmasty.

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Speaker 4: Thank you for just of ours.

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Speaker 3: Her vehicles on log running. Call our personal long and

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Speaker 3: you can set for her.

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Speaker 2: Phone all personal belongings except for the phone in the car.

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Speaker 2: The car unlocked and still running. That is what police

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Speaker 2: confronted when they go to answer nine one one call

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Speaker 2: made by Carly Russell reporting a toddler walking unattended alone

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Speaker 2: along the side of a freeway.

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Speaker 5: Listen our friends, ABC thirty three forty.

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Speaker 6: Police need help finding a missing twenty five year old woman,

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Speaker 6: Carlthia Russell, who goes by Carly. Police say around nine

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Speaker 6: thirty Thursday night, Russell called nine one one, stating she

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Speaker 6: saw a toddler walking along I four fifty nine. Then,

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Speaker 6: after calling nine one one, Russell stopped to check on

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Speaker 6: the child and called a family member to report the

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Speaker 6: same details.

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Speaker 5: The family member lost content with her.

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Speaker 6: Officers found Russell's vehicle in some of her belongings, but

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Speaker 6: were unable to find her or a child.

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Speaker 2: Joining me in allstar panel to make sense of what

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Speaker 2: we know right now, But first to Savannah Sat multimedia

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Speaker 2: journalist reporter waff forty eight, Alabama.

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Speaker 5: Savannah, thank you for being with us.

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Speaker 2: Not only does she make a nine one one call,

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Speaker 2: she also contact her family telling them she had seen

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Speaker 2: this toddler walking along the side of a freeway. And

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Speaker 2: then you hear a commotion shuffling on the other end

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Speaker 2: of the phone and she screams, and that's the end

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Speaker 2: of the call.

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Speaker 5: Do I have that right?

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Speaker 7: Yes, that's pretty much you know what has been reported

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Speaker 7: by her family and as well as the Hoover Police Department.

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Speaker 2: Now explain to me, Hoover is a little bit outside

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Speaker 2: of Birmingham, Is that correct?

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Speaker 7: Yes, it's very close to the Birmingham metropolitan area.

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Speaker 2: Very close to the Birmingham metropolitan area. And what can

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Speaker 2: you tell me about this stretch of road where Carly

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Speaker 2: Russell says she sees a tot boy walking along in

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Speaker 2: a T shirt and a dipe.

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Speaker 7: But first thing I can tell you is that Birmingham,

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Speaker 7: much like where I live in Huntsville, is mostly interstate roads. Busy,

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Speaker 7: busy roads, thousands of cars on it every single day.

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Speaker 7: So the idea of her pulling over on the shoulder

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Speaker 7: of the interstate to check on a toddler is strange

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Speaker 7: and wild to everyone. Because you think of interstate, you

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Speaker 7: think of busy stretch of highway where most accidents tend

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Speaker 7: to happen. So you think you think of a toddler

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Speaker 7: on the side of the road, most people would be

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Speaker 7: worried and concerned as well. I don't know if everyone

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Speaker 7: would side to check, especially at night like that, but

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Speaker 7: most people would be concerned.

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Speaker 2: Joining me from Alabama is James shell Knutt, high profile lawyer,

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Speaker 2: former SWAT officer and with Metro major case. He's shall

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Speaker 2: not law firm dot com. James, this is your neck

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Speaker 2: of the woods.

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Speaker 8: You know.

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Speaker 2: I can't go anywhere without a camera watching me and

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Speaker 2: that's fine with me. Fine, Look, I'd be mad if

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Speaker 2: you didn't. But woten cameras have revealed a toddler walking

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Speaker 2: along the side of the road.

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Speaker 9: Well, you know they would possibly have. You know, these

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Speaker 9: cameras only have a certain amount of resolution. This was

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Speaker 9: at night, there was a lot of other things moving,

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Speaker 9: So what they reveal more than anything is the actual

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Speaker 9: roadway itself, which is what they're in. The purpose is

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Speaker 9: so there's not always the best of views off the roadway.

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Speaker 9: But if that toddler was close to the roadway, then yeah,

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Speaker 9: you would think that that tddler would be on the video.

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Speaker 2: You know what, We're so used to a murder occurring,

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Speaker 2: the investigation occurring, and the jury verdict in one hour

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Speaker 2: on TV.

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Speaker 5: That's what people think really happens. It's not like that yet.

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Speaker 2: There may be video, but you may not be able

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Speaker 2: to see a thing if it's raining or bad weather.

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Speaker 2: It's not like on TV and in the movies. Hey guys,

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Speaker 2: I want you to now here front In her own words,

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Speaker 2: Carly Russell calling nine to one one an hour cut

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Speaker 2: ten now one one.

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Speaker 10: Version records say hi, I am on Interstate four fifty nine,

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Speaker 10: and there is a key just walking by their selves.

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Speaker 7: Oh, hold on, hold on?

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Speaker 4: Where where I'm forest down?

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Speaker 9: Are you?

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Speaker 4: I'm right next to the exit exit ten by the

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Speaker 4: number minute, like to get off by the Hooper minute? Okay,

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Speaker 4: figure before that exit? Yes, okay?

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Speaker 10: And where you're headed southbound or northbound to toward two

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Speaker 10: to eighty fort tuscalusive?

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Speaker 4: Okay? And was the child on the rusher right side,

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Speaker 4: on the right side where they walk on northbound.

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Speaker 7: And around the down they're walking towards tuscalusive.

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Speaker 4: Walking south found Okay.

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Speaker 2: Cheryl McCullum joining me h, founder director with the Cold

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Speaker 2: Case Search Institute, starting a hit series Zone seven and

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Speaker 2: forensics expert. She's clearly in her right mind. She's giving

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Speaker 2: very specific location information regarding the four fifty nine, very clear.

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Speaker 11: She starts for the salutation Hi, there's no fear, there's

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Speaker 11: no urgency, there's no concern. She's not getting to the

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Speaker 11: baby first. Most people, when there's a bad accident or

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Speaker 11: a fire or something they're going to run to to

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Speaker 11: go help, they holler to somebody else to call down

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Speaker 11: one one. She's literally supposedly watching a baby walk down

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Speaker 11: an expressway at any minute he could be hit by

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Speaker 11: a car, he could fall off into a ravine, and

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Speaker 11: she's just sitting in her car, chilling, talking to now

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Speaker 11: one one, waiting for them to ask for the next question,

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Speaker 11: and not saying, y'all need to get out here. I've

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Speaker 11: got to get out of the car and go get

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Speaker 11: this trial.

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Speaker 5: Take a listen to more of that nine on one call,

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Speaker 5: like a toddler, like.

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Speaker 4: Maybe like three or four. Did you pull over with

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Speaker 4: them or are you still with them?

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Speaker 12: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: Okay, are you with the child right now?

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Speaker 7: No, I'm not. I didn't get out of the car.

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Speaker 12: I'm just I can see them though.

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Speaker 4: Can you do mind staying and keep an eye on

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Speaker 4: them until we get there? Yeah?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, sure, Yeah?

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Speaker 4: Okay. What kind of car are you in?

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Speaker 10: I'm in a red Mercedes Ben and that a Savannah

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Speaker 10: receiving suv.

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Speaker 4: I mean it's a sedan start. Can you put your

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Speaker 4: hazards off for me? Yeah? They're only okay. Did you

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Speaker 4: talk to the child on or did you say anything

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Speaker 4: to know? Okay?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 4: Do they look like they're injured?

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Speaker 3: No, they don't.

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Speaker 5: Okay.

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Speaker 2: She is clearly in her right mind and coherent and more.

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Speaker 2: Listen to Carly Russell in her own words.

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Speaker 4: Are they wife like a senec or angel? They're white

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Speaker 4: as a male or female?

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Speaker 7: I think it's a boy, a little boy.

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Speaker 4: I'm right now. Okay. Is you wearing clothes?

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Speaker 13: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: Okay, I want is you wearing?

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Speaker 12: It's a white T shirt.

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Speaker 11: And it doesn't look like he has any pants on.

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Speaker 7: It looks like a diaper.

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Speaker 4: You don't see any cars anywhere? No, no cars anywhere? Okay,

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Speaker 4: all right, what's your name?

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Speaker 7: My name is Carli Russells.

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Speaker 4: And you don't see any injuries on the shelf from

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Speaker 4: where you're at. Correct? No, no, but I can't really

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Speaker 4: see them that good. Try to keep an eye on

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Speaker 4: them for the best they can, because I don't want

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Speaker 4: you to lose shack of them. And do they have

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Speaker 4: shoes on?

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Speaker 8: No?

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Speaker 4: Sure, not that I can be.

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Speaker 10: I can't really see that. Looks all right, I've got

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Speaker 10: them on the way. Okay, just try to say, keep

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Speaker 10: an eye on them, but offsters are on the way.

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Speaker 4: Okay, okay, say.

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Speaker 1: Time stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 4: All right, what's your name? My name is Carli Russells.

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Speaker 4: And you don't see any injuries on my shelf from

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Speaker 4: where you're at? Correct?

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Speaker 7: No, no, But I can't really see them that good.

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Speaker 4: Try to keep an eye on them for the best

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Speaker 4: they can, because I don't want you to lose shack

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Speaker 4: of them. And do they have shoes on?

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Speaker 7: No, not that I can see. I can't really see.

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Speaker 9: That was fine.

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Speaker 10: I've got them on the way, okay, Just trying to say,

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Speaker 10: keep an eye on them. But the offsters are on

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Speaker 10: the way, okay.

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Speaker 2: They straight back out to Savannah, sat joining US w

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Speaker 2: AFF forty eight and Bama Savannah again, thank you for

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Speaker 2: being with us. Police get there really quickly. But when

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Speaker 2: they get there, they see Curly's red Mercedes, but they

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Speaker 2: don't that's Carly Russell. They don't see Carly and the

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Speaker 2: vehicle is still running. No sign of the toggler. What

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Speaker 2: did police find when they get there Savannah.

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Speaker 7: Well, they find her purse. It had been left in

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Speaker 7: the passenger seat, along with the wig that she had

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Speaker 7: either had on that day or just had whipmer She

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Speaker 7: planned to wear everything that, you know what it was

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Speaker 7: expected to be on her person, except for her phone

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Speaker 7: was found in that red Mercedes on the.

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Speaker 4: Side of the road.

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Speaker 2: Everything except the phone is found. Guys, we're talking about

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Speaker 2: a woman who calls reporting a toddler on the side

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Speaker 2: of the road. When police get there, there's nothing there

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Speaker 2: and me police immediately begin to search.

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Speaker 5: Could you tell me?

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Speaker 2: Let me go to Mike Hatchell, joining US president and

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Speaker 2: founder of Peace River Canine Search and Rescue. You can

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Speaker 2: find him at PSAR dot org.

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Speaker 5: Mike.

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Speaker 2: Given that situation, what do police or what should police

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Speaker 2: do immediately to find not only this woman, Carly Russell,

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Speaker 2: but the baby.

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Speaker 14: Well, once they get there and they arrived, of course

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Speaker 14: they're going to get as many officers as they can.

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Speaker 14: This is a high priority call when it comes in

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Speaker 14: like this, we have children in danger, We have a

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Speaker 14: woman that's calling there by the side of the road.

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Speaker 14: Every law enforcement officer in that area is going to

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Speaker 14: take that call and be there as quickly as they can.

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Speaker 14: They're going to start from the off ramp and work

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Speaker 14: their way back up. They're going to try to find

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Speaker 14: the kids, and they're going to try to find her,

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Speaker 14: and then they're going to bring in all the resources

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Speaker 14: they can at this point because the phone is outside

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Speaker 14: and she's not with the phone and there's no one

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Speaker 14: to be found. Of course, the air assets will come in,

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Speaker 14: the helicopters, and then the canine units will come in

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Speaker 14: and they'll start tracking to see if they can locate

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Speaker 14: anything in that area.

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Speaker 2: Mike Hassel joining us from Peace River Canine and Search

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Speaker 2: and Rescue. Well, Mike, you're exactly correct. Take a listener

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Speaker 2: our cut twenty six. This is Chief Dervis with the

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Speaker 2: Hoover PD.

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Speaker 13: Hoover Police deployed all available assets from the point and

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Speaker 13: the search for carding. Additional resources are called in to

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Speaker 13: include our own drone unit. Crime scene investigators Numrous Detective

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Speaker 13: responded to the scene throughout the day Friday. Officers from

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Speaker 13: surrounding local federal agencies assistant Hoover Police to search for Cardi.

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Speaker 13: Russell officer's return to the scene on four fifty nine

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Speaker 13: to conduct a thorough line search for evidence. K nine

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Speaker 13: teams from the County Chef's Department response to check for

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Speaker 13: any sign of Carty, the child that she claimed to see,

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Speaker 13: and anything else that could be considered evidence in this case.

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Speaker 5: Those searches all turned up empty.

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Speaker 2: Also, we learn that the police immediately call get in

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Speaker 2: touch with T Mobile to ping the phone in real time.

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Speaker 2: Joining me Lee Reeber, Mobile device forensic expert CEO Oxygen Forensics, Inc.

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Speaker 2: Author of Mobile Forensic Investigations and host dob I love

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Speaker 2: this name. Forensic Happy Hour, Lee, thanks for being with us.

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Speaker 2: So we're hearing that Ellie law enforcement got an immediate

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Speaker 2: ping on Carly Russell's phone, or at least try to.

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Speaker 5: How does that work?

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Speaker 9: Yeah? Sure, generally the telco company is going to send

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Speaker 9: a signal to the device itself with a response. And

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Speaker 9: so with the phones now with either GPS enables or

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Speaker 9: just stand yourself signal, it's just a sales agnal. They

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Speaker 9: could utilize it to triangulate it with a GPS nowadays.

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Speaker 9: You know they didn't get within a meter with a

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Speaker 9: precise location for that device.

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Speaker 2: Guys the Hoover PD and beyond pulling out all the stots.

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Speaker 2: But then they do something that I do all the time.

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Speaker 2: Take a listen our cut twenty four.

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Speaker 13: Data from Cardy's phone, including her Life at three sixty

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Speaker 13: APP shows that she traveled approximately six hundred yards in

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Speaker 13: her vehicle while she was on the phone. Was nine

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Speaker 13: one one stating that she was following a child six

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Speaker 13: hundred yards that is six football fields straight, six hundred yards.

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Speaker 2: Okay, how many times during the day and the night

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Speaker 2: is my family subjected to the ding ding ding ding,

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Speaker 2: where I'm looking for the iPad or the cell phone,

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Speaker 2: anyway I can find it. And that's what they did

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Speaker 2: year Cheryl McCollum. Life three sixty can find you if

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Speaker 2: you're in another country, they can find you, of course,

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Speaker 2: if you're in another state. But they do it here

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Speaker 2: and they see that it goes six hundred yards six

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Speaker 2: football fields straight.

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Speaker 5: What does that tell you, Cheryl McCollum.

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Speaker 11: Then there was no way a three or four year

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Speaker 11: old is walking six hundred yards. They're not gonna walk

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Speaker 11: six hundred football fields while you're just again following behind

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Speaker 11: them in a car, not showing care and concern. The

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Speaker 11: other thing that stuck out for law enforcement because it

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Speaker 11: did for me Day one. She's the only person on this.

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Speaker 5: Highway that saw this child.

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Speaker 11: That's the only nine to one one call they got.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, Cheryl McCollum, I'm I'm a frequent nine

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Speaker 2: on one caller, and very often the dispatch will say, we've.

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Speaker 5: Already got a car on the way, we've gotten another call.

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Speaker 11: Fixty people had to pass that child during that six

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Speaker 11: hundred yard froll. Nobody else called.

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Speaker 5: Especially then here's the other thing.

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Speaker 4: She's already, she stated, Charlie.

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Speaker 11: Had her hazard zone. There is no way in the dark,

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Speaker 11: going seventy miles an hour that you saw a baby

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Speaker 11: up ahead with enough time to stop and pull over

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Speaker 11: behind that child.

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Speaker 9: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I don't know about that, But everything else you said

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Speaker 2: I agree with. And the moment we heard that everybody

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Speaker 2: skidded to an abrupt halt. But I could rationalize and

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Speaker 2: explain it. But here's one thing I can't explain away

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Speaker 2: that She's take a listen our cut for ABC thirty

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Speaker 2: three forty bober.

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Speaker 8: Police's new information is raising serious questions about the details

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Speaker 8: of Carlie Russell's disappearance. Police now say that they have

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Speaker 8: not found any evidence of a toddler walking down the interstate,

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Speaker 8: as we are told Carly reported in her nine to

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Speaker 8: one one call and subsequent call to a family member.

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Speaker 8: Police also tell us that Carlely bought snacks at the

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Speaker 8: target on Highway to eighty after leaving war. That food

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Speaker 8: wasn't found in her car or with her cell phone

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Speaker 8: and wig, which were discovered at the scene.

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Speaker 2: Okay, let's just get it right down to it. Savannah

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Speaker 2: sap one question, what snacks? I want to know what snacks?

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Speaker 2: She got at Target that she took with her chasing

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Speaker 2: this top. What were the snacks?

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Speaker 7: According to police, she had bought branola bars and cheese

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Speaker 7: crackers or cheez its.

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Speaker 2: Okay, so what happened to them? Where are the snacks

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Speaker 2: she just bought? Now we also know that after her job,

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Speaker 2: where does she work?

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Speaker 7: Savannah Sap Police reporters here thinks she worked at some

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Speaker 7: spa at the Summit. I'm forgetting the name of it.

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Speaker 5: What is the Summit?

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Speaker 7: The Summit is a kind of an upscale shopping center

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Speaker 7: in that area, lots of different stores, high traffic area.

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Speaker 7: But she had been working at a spa in that location.

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Speaker 2: I went to go take a look at the Summit.

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Speaker 2: It's woodhouse day spa. I wanted to go look at

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Speaker 2: the Summit and walked around.

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Speaker 5: There's every posh outlet. It's not outlet.

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Speaker 2: There's stores that you can think of, little artists in

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Speaker 2: bakeries who are like a cupcake will cost seven or

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Speaker 2: eight dollars, that kind of place. That's what we're talking about.

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Speaker 2: It's not like she is walking through a high crime area.

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Speaker 2: She works there. Leaving there, goes to a Tazeki restaurant,

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Speaker 2: gets food, we think to take home that food is

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Speaker 2: still in the vehicle, but the Target snacks are not.

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Speaker 2: What else do we know about what she may have

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Speaker 2: had with her Take a listen to our cut twelve.

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Speaker 13: On July thirteenth, at approximately eight twenty pm called it

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Speaker 13: left work from a business at the Summit. Surveillance video

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Speaker 13: from her place of employment so is Carly concealed a

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Speaker 13: dark colored bathroom, a roll of toilet paper another items

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Speaker 13: belonged to the business. Prior to her departure, she ordered

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Speaker 13: food from Taziki's at the Colonnade and traveled there. She

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Speaker 13: then traveled to Target on two to eighty, where she

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Speaker 13: purchased some granola bars and cheese its. From there, she

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Speaker 13: remained in the parking lot at that shopping center until

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Speaker 13: nine twenty one pm, when she drove to I four

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Speaker 13: fifty nine, carding communicator on her cell phone with individuals

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Speaker 13: known to her while in her path of travel up

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Speaker 13: to the point of calling nine to one one at

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Speaker 13: nine thirty four pm.

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Speaker 2: They're right there, you're hearing again the Hoover PDE Chief

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Speaker 2: Nick Dervis, trying to make sense of what happened to

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Speaker 2: some of the evidence. Curious doctor Sherry Schwartz, joining US

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Speaker 2: forensic psychologists specializing in capital mitigation at Panthermitigation dot Com

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Speaker 2: literally wrote the book of criminal behavior Emperor Law on

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Speaker 2: Psychology intersect doctor Sherry Schwartz, Why why hoard TP toilet

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Speaker 2: paper right before you go missing?

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Speaker 12: Well, it's to me you are planning to be away

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Speaker 12: for a while and not near a bathroom that has

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Speaker 12: toilet paper. That is a really strange thing to take

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Speaker 12: with you unless you think you're going to need it

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Speaker 12: because you're going somewhere where there may not be toilet paper.

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Speaker 2: Guys, I'm trying to figure out what other evidence we're

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Speaker 2: going to uncover. I want to talk about clues left behind.

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Speaker 2: Savana sat What can you tell me about computer searches

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Speaker 2: we believe were made by Carly Russell.

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Speaker 7: This is something that I believe shocked everyone around this

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Speaker 7: case when we heard it from Hooverer ped yesterday during

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Speaker 7: this press conference. When they looked at Carly's phone records,

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Speaker 7: she had made some really questionable Google searches. She had

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Speaker 7: looked up the movie Taken with Lea Mason. She had

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Speaker 7: search quote do you have to pay for an amber alert?

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Speaker 7: She had also searched what the maximum age is for

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Speaker 7: an amber alert. All of these searches raised eyebrows and

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Speaker 7: a lot of suspicion for those who have covered the case,

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Speaker 7: and those who have, you know, put a lot of

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Speaker 7: effort into trying to find her.

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Speaker 5: Take a listen now our cut thirty two the Hoover

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Speaker 5: PDA chief.

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Speaker 13: Part of what data includes several Internet searches and the

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Speaker 13: days leading up to their disappearance that I think are

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Speaker 13: very relevant to this case. On July eleventh, at seven

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Speaker 13: thirty am, the term do you have to pay for

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Speaker 13: an amber alert?

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Speaker 5: Was searched.

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Speaker 13: On July thirteenth, at one three am, the day of

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Speaker 13: her disappearance, the term how to take money from a

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Speaker 13: register without being caught was searched.

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Speaker 5: And that's not all. Take a listen to more from

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Speaker 5: Chief Jervis and Cut thirty three.

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Speaker 13: On July thirteenth, at to thirteen am, the day of

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Speaker 13: her disappearance, the term Birmingham bus station was searched. On

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Speaker 13: July thirteenth, two thirty five am, a search for a

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Speaker 13: one way bus ticket from Birmingham to Nashville was conducted

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Speaker 13: with a departure date of July thirteenth. On July thirteenth,

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Speaker 13: at twelve ten PM, a search for the movie Taken

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Speaker 13: a film about a production was conducted. There were two

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Speaker 13: searches later to amber alerts on a computer at Carter's

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Speaker 13: place of employment, including one regarding the maximum age of

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Speaker 13: an amber alert.

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Speaker 2: O Kedo Key to Lee Reeber and Mike hat Sol

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Speaker 2: first to Mike had Sole, president founder Peace River Caneine

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Speaker 2: Search and Rescue. Really do you have to pay for

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Speaker 2: an amber alert?

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Speaker 14: Well, the taxpayers pay for the amber alert.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, taxpayers pray for that. That's me, that's us. How

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Speaker 2: much did this search do you believe? Just give me

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Speaker 2: a rough estimate. You got drones, You've got well, of

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Speaker 2: course there's volunteers out there. The family adamant screaming at

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Speaker 2: the top of their lungs that the media is not

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Speaker 2: covering her disappearance as much as other disappearances. I mean,

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Speaker 2: it goes on and on. The police are being pillaried.

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Speaker 2: But how much money? Just give me a ballpark with

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Speaker 2: the drones, the searches, the additional man hours, the investigation.

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Speaker 5: What are we talking about here?

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Speaker 14: Somewhere between two hundred and fifty thousand and five hundred

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Speaker 14: thousand dollars.

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Speaker 2: Is my rough guess, okay, I'm sorry, could you just

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Speaker 2: slow down and say that I need to let that

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Speaker 2: just sink in.

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Speaker 14: Two hundred and fifty thousand dollars probably minimums is somewhere

445
00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:49,040
Speaker 14: around and a half a million dollars.

446
00:23:49,520 --> 00:23:53,200
Speaker 2: Why what possibly could cost two hundred fifty thousand dollars.

447
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:56,159
Speaker 14: You got hear assets or running anywhere from two thousand

448
00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:59,680
Speaker 14: to five thousand dollars an hour to operate. That's their

449
00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:03,120
Speaker 14: bird rate and what their fixed costs are. And then

450
00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:05,440
Speaker 14: on top of that, you've got the officers are there,

451
00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:07,760
Speaker 14: You've got over time, You've got hazard pay, so they're

452
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,000
Speaker 14: not only just making their normal salary, but they're getting

453
00:24:10,040 --> 00:24:12,480
Speaker 14: extra money as well for the hard work that they're

454
00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:15,399
Speaker 14: putting in. And then of course you've got all the

455
00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:19,199
Speaker 14: other detectives. You've got the state police involved, You've got

456
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:23,600
Speaker 14: the FBI involved. There's a lot going on here on

457
00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:27,119
Speaker 14: this case because according to the situation that we have now,

458
00:24:27,160 --> 00:24:29,879
Speaker 14: we have two missing kids and a missing girl. So

459
00:24:29,960 --> 00:24:32,760
Speaker 14: you got three people missing at this point that the

460
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:36,800
Speaker 14: state believes are something's happened, and so you've got everybody

461
00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:40,280
Speaker 14: possible out there. This is James, It's not just.

462
00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:42,920
Speaker 9: The monetary cost. I agree with everything he just said.

463
00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:46,320
Speaker 9: That's probably a realistic is but if not conservative. But

464
00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:50,400
Speaker 9: there's also other costs. The other costs are collateral damages

465
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,840
Speaker 9: that are hard to quantify from a money standpoint, which

466
00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:56,040
Speaker 9: is there other people out there who have been victims

467
00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:59,879
Speaker 9: of crime that these resources have been diverted off of

468
00:25:00,119 --> 00:25:06,080
Speaker 9: their cases. There's a community placing this community in fear.

469
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,199
Speaker 9: And those are costs that can't be quantified, but they

470
00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:09,960
Speaker 9: sure do exist.

471
00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:10,239
Speaker 11: Well.

472
00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:14,720
Speaker 2: Not only that, whenever a jury hears a true scenario,

473
00:25:15,080 --> 00:25:18,480
Speaker 2: a true crime where someone has been kidnapped, can't you

474
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,320
Speaker 2: just see some let me just put it out there,

475
00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:26,119
Speaker 2: a whole defense attorney technical legal term arguing, oh this

476
00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:29,120
Speaker 2: is just another gone girl, this is just another take

477
00:25:29,160 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 2: and it's all bs.

478
00:25:30,720 --> 00:25:33,520
Speaker 5: Don't convict my client. I can see it happening.

479
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:50,600
Speaker 1: Time Stories with Nancy Grace.

480
00:25:55,280 --> 00:25:57,760
Speaker 2: Cheryl McCollum, Are you sitting down, You may need to

481
00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:02,760
Speaker 2: lay down the plot of Take Him. Liam Neeson, a

482
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:06,440
Speaker 2: former government operative, of course, is trying to reconnect with

483
00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:11,359
Speaker 2: his daughter. His worst fears come true when sex slavers

484
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:15,119
Speaker 2: abduct the daughter and her friend after they arrive in

485
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 2: Paris for a vacation with just four days until his

486
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:24,399
Speaker 2: daughter will be auctioned off into sex slavery, Liam Neeson

487
00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:27,000
Speaker 2: must call on every skill he has ever learned in

488
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:28,440
Speaker 2: black ops.

489
00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:31,119
Speaker 5: To rescue her. What's going to come next?

490
00:26:32,119 --> 00:26:36,800
Speaker 2: Did she watch Gone Girl on Netflix before she disappeared?

491
00:26:37,400 --> 00:26:42,240
Speaker 2: Did she potentially look at the case of Chloe Stein

492
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:45,359
Speaker 2: ringing a bell? Take a listen to our cut thirty

493
00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:47,320
Speaker 2: five KDKA.

494
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:51,600
Speaker 15: State Police are investigating this young woman, Chloe Stein, who

495
00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:55,040
Speaker 15: has been missing since last night eleven PM.

496
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:56,440
Speaker 5: And I just talked to her mother.

497
00:26:56,920 --> 00:27:00,320
Speaker 15: As you can imagine, she is just distraught, breaking down,

498
00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,080
Speaker 15: just telling me she just wants answers, and right now

499
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:05,959
Speaker 15: State police are trying to do that. They say they

500
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:10,760
Speaker 15: got a call this morning from Chloe's boyfriend, who said

501
00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:15,280
Speaker 15: that he had communicated with her around eleven PM last night,

502
00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:18,440
Speaker 15: saying that she was being pulled over. Her mom said

503
00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:21,600
Speaker 15: something was wrong with her headlight, and at that point

504
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 15: the family never heard from her again.

505
00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:27,760
Speaker 5: Okay, I'm literally jumping out of my skin right there.

506
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:30,400
Speaker 5: Couldn't you fast forward that just a tiny bit?

507
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:35,320
Speaker 2: Jackie for Peace, say the woman pretended she was kidnapped

508
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:39,680
Speaker 2: so she wouldn't have to admit she wasn't going to graduate.

509
00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:44,960
Speaker 2: She played around, didn't get her hours. Isn't that Chloe.

510
00:27:45,280 --> 00:27:47,679
Speaker 2: She didn't want her feeling to know she wasn't going

511
00:27:47,720 --> 00:27:52,840
Speaker 2: to graduate. It's graduation day Saturday, and so she goes missing, okay,

512
00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:55,440
Speaker 2: and of course, you know, here's the poster shop for

513
00:27:55,880 --> 00:28:00,240
Speaker 2: fake kidnappings. Sherry Puppini cut thirty eight our Friends Matt

514
00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:00,960
Speaker 2: Gutman GMA.

515
00:28:01,160 --> 00:28:04,680
Speaker 16: In November of twenty sixteen, Sherry Peppini vanished for twenty

516
00:28:04,720 --> 00:28:07,760
Speaker 16: two days. Then on Thanksgiving morning, she materialized on a

517
00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:10,760
Speaker 16: highway nearly one hundred and fifty miles from home, a

518
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 16: trucker stopping and calling nine to one one for her.

519
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:15,920
Speaker 16: That call her for the first time this morning?

520
00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:22,959
Speaker 14: What's hurting? You're chained up?

521
00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:25,119
Speaker 4: She's chained up.

522
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:31,560
Speaker 2: The woman just goes a wall, leaving her husband and

523
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:34,520
Speaker 2: children behind to try to figure out where's mommy, and

524
00:28:34,800 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 2: shacks up with her old boyfriend and then actually brands herself,

525
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:45,360
Speaker 2: you know, like a cattle to claim to Hispanic females

526
00:28:45,440 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 2: her words, not mine, abducted her, I guess, to ultimately

527
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:51,800
Speaker 2: sell her into sex slavery.

528
00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:54,920
Speaker 5: Well, that didn't happen. She turned up for Turkey lunch

529
00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:55,719
Speaker 5: on Thanksgiving.

530
00:28:56,280 --> 00:29:00,040
Speaker 2: Okay, let's go back to our case in she I

531
00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 2: want you to take a listener what Curly Russell has

532
00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:05,880
Speaker 2: to say in our cut twenty eight that poor Chief

533
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:08,640
Speaker 2: Nick Durvis man, he gave it all, spent so much

534
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:09,200
Speaker 2: money and.

535
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:10,840
Speaker 5: This is what happens listen.

536
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:13,440
Speaker 13: Detectors were ready to obtain a brief statement from her

537
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 13: prior to being treated and released. During the statement, she

538
00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:21,280
Speaker 13: told detectives that while driving down to the interstatement, she

539
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:23,160
Speaker 13: saw a baby walking down the side of the road

540
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:24,600
Speaker 13: and called nine one one.

541
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:25,960
Speaker 5: She started.

542
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:27,640
Speaker 13: When she got out of her vehicle to check on

543
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:30,560
Speaker 13: the child, a man came out of the trees and

544
00:29:30,720 --> 00:29:32,440
Speaker 13: mumbled that he was checking on the baby.

545
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:35,040
Speaker 5: She claimed that the man then picked her up and

546
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 5: she screamed. She stated he then made her go over

547
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:38,640
Speaker 5: a fence.

548
00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:41,880
Speaker 13: She claims he then forced her into a car and

549
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:44,600
Speaker 13: the next thing she remembers is being in the trailer

550
00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:45,959
Speaker 13: of an eighteen wheeler.

551
00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:48,920
Speaker 5: Okay, I've got to play some more. You have to

552
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 5: hear this.

553
00:29:50,720 --> 00:29:53,600
Speaker 2: Aren't you a little bit curious about a guy with

554
00:29:53,760 --> 00:29:56,440
Speaker 2: orange hair and a big ball spot Take a listener,

555
00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:57,400
Speaker 2: cut twenty nine.

556
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:00,800
Speaker 13: He stated that the male was with a female. However,

557
00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:04,680
Speaker 13: she never saw the female, only hearing her voice. She

558
00:30:04,800 --> 00:30:07,600
Speaker 13: also told detectives she could hear a baby crying. She

559
00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:09,960
Speaker 13: told detectives the male had orange hair with a big

560
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:12,720
Speaker 13: bald spot on the back. She said she was able

561
00:30:12,720 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 13: to escape the eighteen whinner and fled on foot, only

562
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:17,239
Speaker 13: be captured again and then was put in a car.

563
00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:20,680
Speaker 13: She claimed she was then blindfolded, but was not tied

564
00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 13: up because the captor said they did not want to

565
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:26,600
Speaker 13: leave impressions on her wrists. She said that they took

566
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:29,520
Speaker 13: her into a house and made her get undressed. She

567
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 13: believes they took pictures of her, but she did not

568
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:34,880
Speaker 13: remember them having any physical or sexual.

569
00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:36,360
Speaker 5: Contact and more from chief service.

570
00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:38,720
Speaker 13: She stated the next day she woke up and was

571
00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:41,840
Speaker 13: fed cheese crackers by the female. She said the woman

572
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:45,280
Speaker 13: also played with her hair, but could not remember anything else.

573
00:30:46,040 --> 00:30:48,080
Speaker 13: At some point, she was put back in a vehicle.

574
00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:50,760
Speaker 13: She claims was able to escape while it was in

575
00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:54,640
Speaker 13: the West Hoover area. She told detectives she ran through

576
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:58,440
Speaker 13: lots of woods until she came out near her residence.

577
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:02,040
Speaker 13: During this inven uar, detectives noted that Carly had a

578
00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 13: small injury to her lip, and she claimed that her

579
00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:05,560
Speaker 13: head was hurting.

580
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:07,680
Speaker 5: She also had a tear on her shirt.

581
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:11,200
Speaker 13: Detectives alternated that she had one hundred and seven dollars

582
00:31:11,320 --> 00:31:14,120
Speaker 13: cash in her right sock.

583
00:31:14,440 --> 00:31:17,840
Speaker 2: Again, echo sais Sherry Peppini, who never saw her to

584
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 2: female Hispanic abducters, but only heard their voices. That's convenient

585
00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:25,520
Speaker 2: when it's time for police to draw a composite picture.

586
00:31:25,800 --> 00:31:29,560
Speaker 2: Cheryl McCollum, Cold Case Research Institute Director and founder.

587
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:31,720
Speaker 5: There are so many holes in that story. I could

588
00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:33,400
Speaker 5: drive a mack truck through them.

589
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:36,480
Speaker 11: Oh my lord. First of all, she never mentions the weapon.

590
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:40,600
Speaker 11: She's able to escape multiple times. She says the assailant

591
00:31:40,760 --> 00:31:43,520
Speaker 11: grabbed her, but she never says he also grabbed a baby.

592
00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:45,920
Speaker 11: If he's grabbing her with one arm and the baby

593
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:48,080
Speaker 11: with the other to get somebody over the fence, how

594
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:50,360
Speaker 11: in the world could she not escape? Then? How in

595
00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:52,960
Speaker 11: the world does nobody on this highway see any of

596
00:31:53,040 --> 00:31:57,080
Speaker 11: this happening? No scuffle, no fight, no nothing. She again

597
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 11: can remember being fed she's crackers, but not whether or

598
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:05,600
Speaker 11: not she was sexually assaulted. She's able to escape multiple times,

599
00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:08,400
Speaker 11: only to be captured again somehow, and she goes from

600
00:32:08,840 --> 00:32:11,920
Speaker 11: a vehicle to attract your trailer to somehow. So when

601
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 11: they finally, you know, don't capture her again for the

602
00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:18,520
Speaker 11: fourth time, lulla Behold, she's in her own freaking neighborhood.

603
00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:21,120
Speaker 2: It is amazing that she remembers the cheese crackers but

604
00:32:21,240 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 2: not her sex attack. But now the family is angry,

605
00:32:26,320 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 2: claiming that Curly Russell is having to deal with quote

606
00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:36,120
Speaker 2: trauma of people quote just making completely false allegations about her.

607
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:41,080
Speaker 2: They're angry, They're angry. I wonder how the Hoover p

608
00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:46,560
Speaker 2: D feels straight to doctor Sherry Schwartz, forensic psychologist, What

609
00:32:46,880 --> 00:32:47,520
Speaker 2: is happening?

610
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:51,000
Speaker 12: Doctor Sherry, Well, I think for the family, you know,

611
00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,560
Speaker 12: they need to believe that this happens, because the alternative

612
00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:58,480
Speaker 12: is they have to believe that Carly just basically had

613
00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:01,520
Speaker 12: a complete lack of conserent learn or any regret or

614
00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:05,400
Speaker 12: remorse about their distress. How this would create distress for them.

615
00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:09,320
Speaker 12: So I think for them, they're invested in, they want

616
00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:12,640
Speaker 12: to be supportive. They are needing to believe this story,

617
00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:16,160
Speaker 12: and so it does feel like a personal attack that

618
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:18,880
Speaker 12: their daughter, their loved one, is being attacked.

619
00:33:19,080 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 5: Savannah sap In the midst of all their pain.

620
00:33:21,880 --> 00:33:26,760
Speaker 1: This woman is safe and sound at home with her family.

621
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:31,000
Speaker 7: Go ahead, dear they you know, since Carly's return, they

622
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:36,480
Speaker 7: have been eerily quiet and not allowing investigators to talk

623
00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:37,680
Speaker 7: further with Carly.

624
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:40,960
Speaker 2: Guys, take a listen. Now we're cutting nineteen. This is

625
00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:41,760
Speaker 2: from NBC.

626
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:43,400
Speaker 5: She's having to deal.

627
00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 2: With the trauma of people just making completely false allegations

628
00:33:48,240 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 2: about her.

629
00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:52,040
Speaker 6: Her family now urging the public to let the investigation

630
00:33:52,240 --> 00:33:54,760
Speaker 6: play out, but mentioning an abductor.

631
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:58,040
Speaker 5: Her mother was asking to read a brief message to

632
00:33:58,160 --> 00:33:58,640
Speaker 5: the public.

633
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:03,600
Speaker 7: Carlie has given detective her statement so that they can

634
00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 7: continue to pursue her abductor.

635
00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:12,319
Speaker 5: Do you believe that there's an abductor still out there? Absolutely? Absolutely, Well,

636
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:14,279
Speaker 5: you got to hand it to the mother. There's no

637
00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:15,680
Speaker 5: love like a mother's love.

638
00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:19,759
Speaker 2: If you have information, dial two zero five eight two

639
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:21,320
Speaker 2: two fifty three hundred.

640
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:22,640
Speaker 5: Goodbye, friend,