00:00:02 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news any Yeah, today is your last podcast. 00:00:13 Speaker 2: I know, some period of time, Yeah, until at least twenty twenty seven. I'm sad. 00:00:20 Speaker 1: I gotta say you definitely watch back what you're gonna say. You're like, I'm pretty jazz to never do this podcast. Jazz, I mean sad. 00:00:28 Speaker 2: I was saying to enter our producer before we started. I'm going to come back. 00:00:31 Speaker 1: To the podcast, you know when you return from not like. 00:00:37 Speaker 2: Yeah, is it in a month? Yeoh no, no, no, no, you're not going to see me. But I'm going to come back to Bloomberg. But I have all these good vibes, like this is my last podcast. I filed my last newsletter, Tomorrow is my last TV show. I don't like saying goodbye again and again and again, but I feel like it's part of the process. 00:00:55 Speaker 1: It is definitely part of the process. I'm sorry to burden you with another good bye. There is like administrative Yeah, we have to be like friends, listeners. This podcast will not be going dark for six months. 00:01:09 Speaker 2: We're rebalancing, rebalancing. 00:01:12 Speaker 1: Take August off. Then we'll be coming back to you with like a rotating cast of guest hosts who will not be filling Katie's shoes, but will be chatting with me. Yeah about the financial news of the week and whatnot and so forth. 00:01:30 Speaker 2: Yeah, we'll miss you. I'll miss you, Matt, and I'll miss this podcast because it's fun to have an hour locked in a room with you. Every week. 00:01:37 Speaker 1: It has been Wow, that doesn't sound sincere no. 00:01:40 Speaker 2: It is. 00:01:43 Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the Money Stuff Podcast. You're a weekly podcast where we talk about stuff related to money. I'm Matt Levine and I heard the Money Stuff column for Bloomberg Opinion. 00:01:54 Speaker 2: And I'm Katie Greifeld, a reporter for Bloomberg News and an anchor for Bloomberg Television. Have a segue. Okay, speaking of rebalancing, Okay, three fifty one exchanges. 00:02:13 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, you're going right into three fifty one exchanges. I mean, you love a three fifty on exchange. We're going to get some ETF into into the last podcast we do. 00:02:22 Speaker 2: It's amazing that it's I mean, it's one of the conversations happening this week, is all it's podcast. The Treasury Department, or the ETF industry in general, is getting very inventive in all the ways that it's like ducking taxes or at least deferring them, And the Treasury Department is like increasingly annoyed about that. 00:02:42 Speaker 1: Right because like when I like first became aware of ETFs, the story was that index ETFs are more tax division than index mutual funds because when people trade out of an ETF, it doesn't cause taxes for the people who remain in the ATF. Like if you own an ex mutual fund, like people who like leave the mutual fund like causes selling of stock, and so that causes the tax realization event for you, and so you have to pay taxes even though you haven't sold your mutual fund shows. And that's like the nub of the idea. But then over time ETFs realized that all of their stock trading could be done in kind so that they never had to encur taxes for their customers, for their investors, And so if you own an ETF, you should never have to pay taxes on the trades that the ETF does. They could do cash stock trades, like they don't anymore because they've learned. They've learned that they don't have to. There's a thing called a heartbeat, which is like a way you can like move stocks out of the ETF and move new stocks in without incurring taxes. So this is great. You can run and actively managed GTF without paying taxes. Now I say it's great. It's obviously great for like the customer. A few years ago Bloomberg zach Matter had a big story about this, sort of suggesting that maybe it's not great and that in fact it is a dodge around the tax rules. It's just like a matter of perspective, right, Like if you think that ETFs are supposed to not pay taxes, then yeah, it's great. If you think that, like you know, you're supposed to pay taxes when you sell stock, then like it's not great. But it's just like an esthetic question. And that's where the state of the art was a few years ago. And then people realized that if an ETF is an entity that can trade stock without paying taxes, like a lot of people want to be able to do that. Yeah, so why shouldn't you, like a rich family, also be an ETF and not have to pay taxes when you sell stock. And so that's what people have invented, which is called the three footy on exchange ETF which is you make yourself into an ETF and then you don't have to pay taxes when you sell stock. 00:04:44 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's quite good, and there's some for that. Notable Bloomberg News had a great big take on this this week and they they scraped the filings and they identified some of those wealthy families. 00:04:54 Speaker 1: One of them is the guy who invented the hot pocket. 00:04:56 Speaker 2: Yeah, the family behind the hot pocket gay plot in sure of Game Stop fame, and then the one Yet. 00:05:05 Speaker 1: He's like thinking, he's like, kind of I thinks I'm thinking about this because like one thing I wrote about this and not to get through ahead of ourselves, is like these things are technically public exchange. You and I could buy shares of the CTF. I feel like the Game Stop people are going to find the game plotkin ETF. What are they going to do with that? 00:05:24 Speaker 2: I don't know, Like, yeah, that's a good question. 00:05:28 Speaker 1: It's like his personal wealth is exchange traded now or will be. 00:05:32 Speaker 2: And so basically, so I, a wealthy investor, take my portfolio of appreciated and probably concentrated assets to the ETF. 00:05:43 Speaker 1: Yeah, they're putting it un concentrated, but go. 00:05:45 Speaker 2: On, Yeah, well I'm just thinking. 00:05:46 Speaker 1: I'd be too concentrated. But you can. There are ways around that. There are always around that. 00:05:50 Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe your portfolio is more concentrated than you would like it to be. You take it to the ETF or you make an ETF and then it uses in kind to basically diversify your portfolio. 00:06:02 Speaker 1: Once the stuff is in the ETF, you can sell your concentrated low basis stock and use the proceeds to buy S and P five hundred or whatever without paying current taxes. Yes, because you're not selling it, you're like in kind swapping it. 00:06:16 Speaker 2: Yeah, you're just deferring. You decide when you want to take the tax hit. 00:06:21 Speaker 1: Yeah, if you sell the ETF shares, if you take cash out of the thing and you pay taxes. 00:06:27 Speaker 2: But unless you die. 00:06:28 Speaker 1: Unless you die, right, which is not advised, it kind of is. 00:06:32 Speaker 2: Right, Yeah, for your errors, right. 00:06:34 Speaker 1: You know. I used to always quote my tax professor in law school had two laws of tax, which is that it's always better to make more money than less money, and always better to die better than sooner. But neither of the things is always absolutely true from a tax perschient of anyway. But yeah, if you die, then your air is going to base a step up and you never pay any of the taxes on the games. 00:06:54 Speaker 2: So Bloomberg had this great article this week just sort of outlining how much of a thing it's become. I think they found crunching the filings that one hundred and five of these ETFs have been created so far. 00:07:05 Speaker 1: It's so wild because it's like there's all sorts of like high net worth tax strategies that you don't see public filings for it because like this one, to save taxes, you have to become an ETF, so you have to like exchange trade. 00:07:18 Speaker 2: Your yeah, portfolio. Bloomberg News also had a scoop this week out that the Treasury Department considers some of these products as abusive and is looking at its tools tools that has available to address this proliferation. And it wasn't just three fifty one, so they were also looking at box spread ETFs. 00:07:38 Speaker 1: And then there's like every talked about the box Spready that a good one. 00:07:42 Speaker 2: That's another zach miiter. 00:07:43 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll leave it for an habit. 00:07:45 Speaker 2: Zachmeider. He actually has a Pultzerprise. 00:07:48 Speaker 1: Which is reporting about taxes. 00:07:50 Speaker 2: Pretty cool, but yeah, looking at some of the reporting that we have. There's an interesting quote in the Big Take about what might be inviting more regulatory scrutiny now, And this has been going on for like two years, but what's become a little bit different is now you have some issuers who aren't just working like with one individual very wealthy family. They're like soliciting seed contributions is productized. 00:08:16 Speaker 1: Yeah, if you could do that, Like the first time you do this, you have to do it for like a billionaire because it's expensive to figure it out. The hundredth time you do it, it's like, yeah, yeah, it cous like one. 00:08:25 Speaker 2: Hundred and six times you do it, so it's. 00:08:28 Speaker 1: Like definitely being productized. The other thing that I think there's a little bit of subtex stuff is that there is a requirement that the portfolio you contribute has to be fairly diversified. You can't have more than I think it's twenty five percent of your money in one stock, or more than fifty percent and five stocks. And so the most obvious use of this trait is like you're a startup founder, you have zero basis super appreciated stock, you go public, you have like a billion dollars of built in gains and you want to diversify without selling, and so you put it into any If you can't do that, you can't do that with just one stock. You need to have a diverse wide portfolio. My understanding is that people have found borrowing mechanisms where like you take your appreciated stock and you borrow a lot of money to contribute other stock, and then you have the diverse wide portfolio and then you can do the whole trade. So that seems like cheating too. 00:09:20 Speaker 2: Yeah, when it comes to the Treasury Department getting upset about these things, it kind of reminds you of a conversation that we've had about crypto a bunch of times, which is it's in the code. You know, it's in the tax code. This is all That's not really true, is it. 00:09:35 Speaker 1: There's some Treasury regulation that determines exactly what the contours of this are, and the Treasury could change the regulation. 00:09:43 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:09:44 Speaker 1: But also, like tax is a weird system because I know, like you're like, oh, crypto, code is a lot. It's in the code. That's not how tax works. Tax always has like a form and function analysis, where like even if you can like find your way through the rules, judges and the irs will be skeptical if you're doing stuff that like clearly has only the purpose of eating taxes. Yeah, so tax is not exactly a code as law world, even though the code is literally the law. 00:10:09 Speaker 2: No. 00:10:09 Speaker 1: I know, I understand as a former derivative structure and lover of you know, financial shenanigans, I'm also disappointed. But as you know, a lawyer and citizen, I'm like, you know, I shouldn't be able to take it away too much. 00:10:22 Speaker 2: We'll put this on the list of the things that you know, I'll be looking at in six months, like will the treasure actually do anything about it? Or the forum in which they said that they considered some of these products abusive and that they were looking at it was an industry gathering that Bloomberg Is reported on. Yeah, it wasn't. 00:10:41 Speaker 1: Take it back a little bit, not like the hot Pockets family are going to jail. It's like, you know, but will. 00:10:46 Speaker 2: The progress beyond worried noises? I don't know, remains to be seen. 00:11:07 Speaker 1: Speaking of regulators making worried noises, we talk. 00:11:11 Speaker 2: About cell phone. 00:11:14 Speaker 1: Can I tell you so? This is incredible. So Gary Cancer was the chair of the SEC in the Biden administration, and during his reign as the Chair of the SEC, he spearheaded a crackdown on investment bankers texting on their personal phones about work. Yeah, that extracted billions of dollars of funds from banks, brokerages, ratings agencies, private like everyone had to cough up money because it turns out that there is not a financial services from on earth that never had an employee who texted about work on their personal phones. Right, So that was kind of like his big initiative at the SEC that in't cracking down on crypto before he was the chair of the SEC quite a long time before he was the chair of the the Commited Futures. 00:12:01 Speaker 2: Training Commission, which I only fully appreciated like two weeks ago. 00:12:04 Speaker 1: It was in like the two thousand times. During that time, MF Global, the futures brokerge run by John Corzine, collapsed and there was some controversy there because Corson is quite politically connected and it was, you know, partners at Goldman with Gensler, and Gensler like recused himself from the review. But anyway, political stuff came up and there were like reviews of this, and it turned out that Gensler had been emailing CFTC staff about MF Global from his personal email on his personal computer. And it turns out that the reason he did that was that and this is from like a wester Journal story about the CFTC Inspector General report. Mister Gensler repeated the use his personal email while dealing with MF Global issues while he was away from the agency's Washington headquarters, saying, quote, he did not know how to access his official email at home anyway. 00:13:04 Speaker 2: Anyway, it's just good comedy. 00:13:05 Speaker 1: And he ran the SEC. He cracked down on crypto and cell phones. 00:13:10 Speaker 2: And and this is a neat intersection. Actually, yeah, of both of those things. 00:13:14 Speaker 1: Right. So JP Morgan paid like a two hundred million dollar fine, right, and the SEC goes after JP Morgan for the phones. Like JP Morgan is not going to like go to court and fight tooth and now, because you know it's like a repeat player, it has to have the favor of the SEC. He also went after Coinbase to just shut down coin Base. There was no like, let's compromise. It was like Coinbase, crypto, all of it illegal. So Coinbase had really no choice but to fight tooth and nail. And one thing they did as part of their just you know, all out war with the SEC was send the SEC a subpoena saying we want to review Guy Gansler's communications about the crypto industry to see if you can't buy it, you know whatever. And a judge's like, okay, you can ask for that, and so they said, you know, please give us any messages from Carriagancler's you know home phone too, it's personal fun too, about the crypto industry, and the SEC came back and said, we accidentally deleted Love Carry Counselors communications from the relevant time period because of an it, you know, misunderstanding. And so this week Coinbase published an op out of The Wall Street Journal gloating about they've settled at the SEC. No longer than the Garry Agunsler SEC and more sympathetic SEC. They've settled with the SEC, which has agreed to pay them one hundred and fifty thousand dollars for cel phone. 00:14:35 Speaker 2: And misuse, which is not very much. 00:14:37 Speaker 1: It's not very much compared to the two hundred million dollars that jav Morgan paid, but you know, the SEC is somewhat less profitable. 00:14:43 Speaker 2: Yeah, also it's just like, I guess it's more symbolic than anything. 00:14:47 Speaker 1: Although I wrote about this like if I'm the banks who paid these penalties, like if you little attempted to like ask for a refund, you know, or partial refund, be like hey, guys, like can we see your can munications about cell phones and they're like, no, you can't because I was already know we deleted them all and then strike a settlement. But again, like banks are in a different position from coin they have to sort of you know, stay friendly with the regulator like coinbase. 00:15:13 Speaker 2: Yeah, Coinbase. I was reading this and I was in some ways reminded of Grayscale suing the SEC after they had been repeatedly denied converting GBTC into at. 00:15:25 Speaker 1: A long period of the SEC was like absolutely opposed to crypto and all forms, and if you're a crypto firm, you have nothing to lose, you know, Yeah, you have to fight the SEC. The posture of like traditional financial services has never been We're going to fight the SEC to the death because you just need a lot of like irregulatory sympathy from them. But crypto that was just not true. 00:15:45 Speaker 2: Yeah, well maybe we won't see banks do this, maybe we'll see more crypto firms do this. 00:15:49 Speaker 1: But well, the crypto firms didn't pay the cell phone funds. Although interestingly, like when the SEC brought its big case against Coinbase, basically saying, you know, you're operating in the League securities change, you're not registered as a national security exchange, and you're trading all these crypto tokens that we think are securities. Right, one of the things they said in that is by not registering as a securities exchange, Coinbase is not complying with record keeping obligations. So like is he wanted to see coinbas the selfhonse too, but instead they were a host on their own cell phone. 00:16:25 Speaker 2: Some poetic justice for coinbase. 00:16:27 Speaker 1: It's really very funny. It's really like Paul Gray, while the chief legal officer at Coinbase, wrote this out in the Rolltrey Journal, just to gloat, you know, yeah, I just to be like, you know haha, and like I did hear from like one or two financial services where I'm just being like, God bless them before we're not happy about the cell phone Charactown. 00:17:04 Speaker 2: Let's talk about truth. API. 00:17:06 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so wild. This happened last week, but it's like still reverting. 00:17:11 Speaker 2: I know it's naive, but my primary, most urgent question remains, it's like, how is this legal? 00:17:17 Speaker 1: How like Like the answer is if Trump does it, it's legal. 00:17:23 Speaker 2: That's not satisfying. 00:17:24 Speaker 1: It's very unsatisfied. No, Like, so Trump Media PA. Have we mentioned is a nuclear fusion company? 00:17:32 Speaker 2: I feel like we have and I had no recollection of that until you. 00:17:36 Speaker 1: Yeah, but Trumbdia and Technology Car publicly traded, you know, multi billion dollar market cap company is a social media platform. Its revenue is something like a million dollars a quarter from I don't know, ads, untruth social maybe or something I don't really know, not from nuclear fusion amusingly, but they did buy a nuclear fusion company, but they are merging with a nuclear fusion company. Their business is now a social media company some like etf stuff and a nuclear fusion company. Perfect, But their social media company has a new revenue source, which is that they've announced that they're launching an API where you can get fast, let's say, fast access to tweets, truths, posts on truth social. Now most social media companies have APIs, so like an X you can get access to like the fire hose of posts on x truth Social it's launching an API with ten accounts, so you can get fast access to ten accounts because you don't care about everyone posting on truth social. No, you would probably pay more for one account with that one account. Donald Trump's account is very market. 00:18:48 Speaker 2: Moving, yeah, people and very active. 00:18:50 Speaker 1: And very active and people you know have they currently scrape it and they have automated tools to you know ingest Donald Trump's market movingnouncements and trade on them. And truth Socials like, we want some of that revenue. So instead of just giving it to everyone at the same time for free, they'll they'll give it to hedge funds and quantitative training firms who pay one hundred thousand dollars a month early. Now they say it's not early, they say it's at the same time as everyone else, which is like a philosophical like if you get the feed from truth social at the same time that like it gets sent to like you know, render in the browser, like you get it a little faster. It's just like you it arrives at your computers before it arrives at the eyeballs of other people. Right, but it's like whatever, it's imperceptibly faster it's a millisecond faster, and that is long enough for I freak training firm to make use of the information. So they're sort of selling advanced access to the US government's policy pronouncements. It's only something like a millisecond of advanced access. So it's like, yeah, it's like deniable. 00:19:55 Speaker 2: Yeah, apparently this is launching August first, Like this is a done. 00:19:59 Speaker 1: Apparently at least like five firms signed up, which means that the majority of their revenue will come from selling advanced access to Trump's pronouncements, right, because like they make you know, a million dollars a quarter, right, so five subscribers at a one hundred thousand dollars a month is like, you know, one point five million dollars a quarter. So most of the revenue is going to come from selling advanced access to to Trump's policy pronouncements, which is quite a business, quite a business. And you know, eventually we'll be superseded by all the revenue from nuclear fusion, right, but for now selling advanced access to treats. 00:20:36 Speaker 2: Again, I don't know. I go back to my naive questioned, like, how could this be legal? Given that we do get policy via posts. 00:20:45 Speaker 1: It's just the bizarre new world it is. You know, it's interesting if you were like posting on Twitter or X, right, and X, you know sales an API, you could argue that X would be making money by selling advanced access to US policy pronouncements. An X would probably say no. Look like every organization has a you know, advanced data feed. The New York Times in Bloomberg will deliver news to subscribers, right, like people pay for access to news. Yeah, it's different. Though, It's one thing to say if X did it, they would be reasonable. It's different when the company is majority owned by the president, right, like he is profiting on his own policy pronouncements and you know, creation of volatility. Yeah, that's that's what everyone wants, man, that's what everyone wants. 00:21:36 Speaker 2: So apparently, according to reporting, the pitch included a quote attributed to a JP Morgan portfolio manager saying, we're one truth social post away from being up or down five percent every day, and I. 00:21:50 Speaker 1: Do the pitch is. The pitch is like, this guy creates so much volatility, you need to pay us to get advanced access to it. 00:21:56 Speaker 2: Yeah, I do wonder, I mean how true that is? Like I feel like we could be overegging just the amount of useful signal that comes from these truth Social posts. If you're like, I mean hedge funds are going to pay for it. 00:22:13 Speaker 1: Yeah, you're big hypergens trating for him, like a million dollars a year to like once a year with recently high probability like get out first in a catastrophic market drop because he declares war on truth social Like yeah. 00:22:26 Speaker 2: Easy fair, I mean, yes, the price it's not like every. 00:22:29 Speaker 1: Day it's it's a huge source of value. It's like insurance. Yeah, it's protection money. 00:22:34 Speaker 2: Yeah, but even still, I don't know, it feels reminiscent of the Taco discussion, Like what he's putting out on truth Social doesn't actually always match what happens in reality, and. 00:22:47 Speaker 1: You you definitely need like an AI model to try to extract some signals from it in the middle of second advantage you get. 00:22:53 Speaker 2: But like, yeah, the signals, there are signals. I just wonder if some of his posts might lose their potency. 00:23:01 Speaker 1: Yeah, but like this is not a one hundred million dollars a year business, but it's a yeah, a billion dollars year business for five you know, for five quant training firms. 00:23:12 Speaker 2: Well, I'm excited for their next journings report, you. 00:23:14 Speaker 1: Know the I actually am because yes, like the revenue will triple, quadruple, and it will all come from this. 00:23:22 Speaker 2: That's the thing. I feel like you'll be able to back it out. 00:23:24 Speaker 1: They might. They might just like break it out separately. 00:23:27 Speaker 2: That would be useful. 00:23:28 Speaker 1: It's tiny business. Yeah, but even if they don't like, yeah, like, because the run rate has been pretty steadily, like a million dollars of miscellaneans. I've always joked that it's like a substack. It's like it makes about as much money as like a well read substack newsletter. But it's you know, it pays one hundred million dollars a year and executive benefits. But now it'll be slightly different, Yeah, slightly different. I do want to tell you one other thing. 00:23:50 Speaker 2: Yeah, please started to talk about yeah, and then we quickly shushed ourselves because we. 00:23:55 Speaker 1: Wanted to save it for the podcast. But I had an email today and I wrote about it. Someone's launching sports Indexes, which is yet another like a pincer movement around sports etss. 00:24:07 Speaker 2: Yeah what does that mean? Yeah, tell me what this means. 00:24:09 Speaker 1: I hoped it meant that, like when the index goes up, it's because sports. 00:24:13 Speaker 2: Are up, just general sports sports, They're. 00:24:18 Speaker 1: They're more sporting, more points are being scored. But that's not what it means. What it actually means is that like they have a sports index for each team. I think like eventually athletes too. 00:24:27 Speaker 2: But whatever, but like each sports team. 00:24:29 Speaker 1: Yeah, so like each team in season. So each baseball team, let's say right now, will have a We'll have an index, and the index broadly speaking, will go up when the team wins or does other good stuff, will go down when the team loses or does other bad stuff exactly how like what the methodology of that is? I don't know. The point I think, I think is we've talked about the sports candling ats, right, so right now there's like a proposed sports candling ETF where it's like actively managed, non transparent. A guy makes some bets and you hope the guy makes some good bets. You can't like sit down and watch a game and be like, oh, I hope this team wins because it's in my portfolio, right, because you don't even know, right or like, but it's not like transparent. And we talked about like they should just be like a bet on the Mets ETF, where you know it doubles if the Mets win and goes to zero if the Mets lose. But that's really inconvenient because I, like your ETF goes to zero, you have to kind of restart from scratch every day. 00:25:25 Speaker 2: This whole thing. 00:25:26 Speaker 1: The index just solves the problem. The index is like the index is at like seven thousand, and if the Mets win, it goes to like seventy five hundred, Right, So you're just in a continuous ETF that goes up and down with the Mets winning and losing. You buy your favorite team's ETF index ETF right index in quotes because it's not an index. It's called an index, but it's just like some sort of numerical translation of the team's performance. And then like if the team does well, you make money, and if it does poorly, you lose money. And so you have like sports scandling, but in a true ETF wrapper. 00:25:57 Speaker 2: So by the time I come back, there's going to be like eight. 00:26:00 Speaker 1: Different product structures of sports ETFs. 00:26:02 Speaker 2: Yeah, maybe you can get some like pair trade left. 00:26:05 Speaker 1: To become a consultant for an Isn't that just inevitable? 00:26:08 Speaker 2: I mean, just wait until I'm back or I don't know. 00:26:10 Speaker 1: Maybe I'm kidding. By the way, I would never. I would never. 00:26:15 Speaker 2: There's a twinkle in his eyes. 00:26:16 Speaker 1: There's something in my eyes. 00:26:18 Speaker 2: Oh oh, it's a tier tier. Also speaking into existence, someone's definitely going to launch a diversified ETF of three fifty one exchange ETFs. 00:26:30 Speaker 1: Oh I joked about that, but they're not. Really. 00:26:34 Speaker 2: It's got to be careful with these jokes. 00:26:36 Speaker 1: Like someone emailed me to be like yeah, but like, look at what's actually in it, right, So, Like, first of all, there's a pretty high management family ets because they are you know, they're not an ETF. They're like someone's tax advisor getting paid for tax advice, right, So like the management and secondly, you know, it is essentially some guy's diversified portfolio, which means that what the ETF manager does is go out and buy diversified et y. 00:27:00 Speaker 2: Yeah. 00:27:00 Speaker 1: So like these ETFs are wrapped around QQQ and SPY or whatever, and so that you're paying two levels of fees to own like these people's portfolios. And it's not really a good product for anyone other than the rich family that plopped. 00:27:16 Speaker 2: The stuff into the three, you're not actually getting hot pockets. 00:27:19 Speaker 1: You're not getting hot you're not getting you're not getting a lot of special sauce. You're getting like these people have made a lot of money doing something else, and now they're like coasting and diversifying, and you're getting the coasting and diversifying with two layers of fees. And then if, as I joked, someone launches a diversified ETF of these ETFs, then you're paying three levels of fees. Just too much probably, but someone will do it, Yeah, because like the pitch of the diversity ETF is like, look at all these rich families with like fancy financial advice. They have created these bespoke ETFs just for themselves. Don't you want the same financial product as the founding only have hot pockets? You can get it with our diversive IDT. It's a good pitch, It's just. 00:28:04 Speaker 2: Like wrong, Yeah, it doesn't bear out that way, right. 00:28:16 Speaker 1: And that was the Money Stuff Podcast. I'm Matt Levine. 00:28:19 Speaker 2: And I'm Katie Greifeld. 00:28:20 Speaker 1: You can find my work by subscribing to The Money Stuff Newletter on Bloomberg dot. 00:28:24 Speaker 2: Com, and you can find me on Bloomberg TV every day on the clothes between three and five pm Eastern. 00:28:31 Speaker 1: We'd love to hear from you. You can send an email to money Pod at Bloomberg dot net. Ask us a question I mean, we might answer it on the air. 00:28:38 Speaker 2: You can also subscribe to our show wherever you're listening right now and leave us a review. It helps more people find the show. 00:28:45 Speaker 1: The Money Stuff Podcast is produced by Ana Mazerakus and Moses One. 00:28:49 Speaker 2: Our theme music was composed by Blake Maples. 00:28:51 Speaker 1: Amy Keen is our executive producer. Thanks for listening to The Money Stuff Podcast. We'll be back next week with more stuff. Bob