WEBVTT - Civic Cipher 031922 The U.S. Gun Problem 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:00.920 And now. 0:00:02.920 --> 0:00:06.080 Watching my back like that. 0:00:07.960 --> 0:00:13.560 Strike Waters headquarters behind and the BIS. 0:00:13.039 --> 0:00:13.560 In the borders. 0:00:13.600 --> 0:00:16.040 We're just tuning in the civic secern I'm your host, Rams' job. 0:00:16.360 --> 0:00:19.599 I'll go by the name Q War Thursday through Sunday, 0:00:19.720 --> 0:00:22.600 sometimes my Monday. 0:00:22.800 --> 0:00:24.400 This indeed, we should stick around. We got a lot 0:00:24.400 --> 0:00:30.240 more coming away and fruiting conversation about guns. This time 0:00:30.240 --> 0:00:32.959 we're about overdue for a conversation about guns. For those 0:00:33.120 --> 0:00:36.120 listening to the show, you know that Q is I 0:00:36.120 --> 0:00:38.320 wouldn't call you a fan of guns, but you're certainly 0:00:38.360 --> 0:00:40.640 if you understand their place in society a little bit 0:00:40.640 --> 0:00:42.000 more than I do. I'm not a big fan of 0:00:42.000 --> 0:00:44.680 guns at all. And we have to tell a story 0:00:45.280 --> 0:00:48.400 because it's relevant. We're also going to spend a little 0:00:48.400 --> 0:00:52.240 time talking about the Floating Freedom School that is going 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:54.920 to be our way black history fact, and I promise 0:00:54.960 --> 0:00:57.000 you want to stick on stick around for that because 0:00:57.840 --> 0:01:00.480 it's just a neat little way that a man was 0:01:00.480 --> 0:01:03.319 able to circumvent the law and educate black students at 0:01:03.320 --> 0:01:06.240 a time when black people were not allowed to be educated. 0:01:06.440 --> 0:01:12.200 But first, let's discuss how to become a better ally. 0:01:12.400 --> 0:01:16.760 So this comes from NPR, A new musical, inspired by 0:01:17.520 --> 0:01:21.720 a satirical afro futurist novel called Black No More, opens 0:01:21.760 --> 0:01:26.600 off Broadway. It was presented by the New Group. Set 0:01:26.640 --> 0:01:29.319 during the Depression, both the book and the musical examine 0:01:29.560 --> 0:01:33.160 race in America with an outrageous plot device. An inventor 0:01:33.200 --> 0:01:35.520 comes up with the machines, a machine that turns black 0:01:35.520 --> 0:01:39.360 people white. In a dappursuit to wreak, Trotter aka Black 0:01:39.400 --> 0:01:42.880 Thought of the Roots here center stage to set the scene. 0:01:42.959 --> 0:01:46.760 Sitting in a barbershop chair, he wraps, this is Harlem, 0:01:47.040 --> 0:01:49.920 the big apples core seventy or more years before there 0:01:49.920 --> 0:01:52.160 were any Apple stores. I wish I could heard him 0:01:52.160 --> 0:01:55.640 say that, because that's an adult rolling off his incredible 0:01:55.800 --> 0:01:58.640 yeah man off his voice. So Trotter wrote the lyrics 0:01:58.640 --> 0:02:00.320 so much of the music, which ranges from hip hop 0:02:00.360 --> 0:02:01.760 to R and B to jazz and folk, and he 0:02:01.760 --> 0:02:05.760 plays doctor Junius crookman, inventor of the Black No More machine, 0:02:06.000 --> 0:02:08.400 which will turn any black person white for fifty dollars. 0:02:08.760 --> 0:02:10.959 Trotter says, the doctor believes this Black No More device 0:02:11.120 --> 0:02:13.959 is the solution to race relations to America. I think 0:02:13.960 --> 0:02:17.280 the line is to solve American race problem. As we 0:02:17.360 --> 0:02:19.440 know it. But yeah, you know, I don't think a 0:02:19.440 --> 0:02:22.639 solution is ever reached. And that is the twilight Zone 0:02:22.680 --> 0:02:24.960 like premise of Black No More, which features a script 0:02:24.960 --> 0:02:27.639 by Academy Award winner John Ridley. In nineteen thirty one 0:02:27.680 --> 0:02:33.600 novel by George Schuler has they take no prisoner's attitude 0:02:33.639 --> 0:02:36.600 toward not just why supremacist and politicians, but then the 0:02:36.680 --> 0:02:42.720 veiled figures from the Harlem Renaissance. It goes on to say, 0:02:43.360 --> 0:02:48.040 of course, particularly when they're black, making fun of black people. 0:02:48.440 --> 0:02:51.160 The challenge for the creative team, especially the writers, was 0:02:51.200 --> 0:02:53.680 to move the story from broad satire to something with 0:02:53.720 --> 0:02:56.680 a beating heart. And I think what they've come up 0:02:56.680 --> 0:03:00.480 with is a really fascinating morality tale. So become a 0:03:00.480 --> 0:03:03.400 better ally. Why not check out this musical based on 0:03:03.440 --> 0:03:07.600 the novel Black No More at your earliest convenience? 0:03:08.200 --> 0:03:09.520 How long is it off Broadway? 0:03:10.919 --> 0:03:14.720 That I don't know, but again Google is let's. 0:03:14.520 --> 0:03:17.200 Find let's find out and go see it. 0:03:18.080 --> 0:03:20.600 Yeah, let's go see it. Be better to see it 0:03:20.639 --> 0:03:22.720 than just read about it. But yeah, and I don't 0:03:22.720 --> 0:03:24.880 get to those very often, so yeah, we should do that, 0:03:25.400 --> 0:03:28.480 and you should see it too, if you're listening to us, 0:03:29.280 --> 0:03:35.080 So yeah, now, let's move on. Sorry. Comes from yahoo 0:03:35.120 --> 0:03:40.120 dot com. Colorado police officer who fairly shot a bystanders 0:03:40.120 --> 0:03:43.960 held a hero for stopping a gunman armed with a rifle, 0:03:44.920 --> 0:03:49.720 will not be charged, prosecutor said Monday right. The officer, 0:03:49.720 --> 0:03:53.640 whose identity has not been made public, had objectively reasonable 0:03:53.720 --> 0:03:57.840 grounds to believe the officer and others faced imminent danger 0:03:57.880 --> 0:04:01.400 when the officer opened fire June twenty first in Arvada, 0:04:01.480 --> 0:04:05.400 north of Denver, killing a bystander, John Hurley, forty years old. 0:04:06.480 --> 0:04:12.360 First Judicial District Attorney Alexis King told reporters quote, officers 0:04:12.440 --> 0:04:17.800 saw that day a mass shooter, heard many rounds of gunfire, 0:04:17.800 --> 0:04:20.680 and broad daylight in the heart of old Town, Arvada. 0:04:21.320 --> 0:04:25.359 King said, he continues, Thus, the officer's decision to shoot 0:04:25.440 --> 0:04:29.800 John Hurley was legally justified, despite his heroic actions that day. 0:04:31.160 --> 0:04:37.400 In other words, there was a man who was in 0:04:37.440 --> 0:04:43.080 the middle of a mass shooting, right, and there was 0:04:43.120 --> 0:04:51.560 another man, this man Hurley, who saw this happening, had 0:04:51.600 --> 0:04:54.160 a gun and engaged the mass. 0:04:53.920 --> 0:04:56.520 Shooter, killing him. 0:04:58.240 --> 0:05:02.640 Then the police show up and they kill Hurley. That's 0:05:02.760 --> 0:05:04.520 basically I'll read the rest of the story, but just 0:05:04.560 --> 0:05:07.919 so you can follow it, but they killed Hurley thinking 0:05:07.960 --> 0:05:09.920 he was the mass shooter when he had already shot 0:05:09.920 --> 0:05:10.440 the masshooter. 0:05:10.960 --> 0:05:17.360 Go ahead, you the mass shooter. Amongst the mass shooters 0:05:17.440 --> 0:05:26.800 victims hmm are the police officer Gordon Beasley. So imagine 0:05:26.839 --> 0:05:33.120 this story as Ramsy's just told you. Mass shooter murders 0:05:33.200 --> 0:05:43.640 police officer. Law abiding citizen who's a gun owner kills 0:05:43.960 --> 0:05:49.440 mass shooter who also murdered a police officer. Then the 0:05:49.480 --> 0:05:53.400 police kill him. 0:05:53.560 --> 0:05:56.840 I don't mean to laugh, but the irony slaps you 0:05:56.920 --> 0:06:02.960 in the face. And here's the thing. There's been this narrative, 0:06:05.200 --> 0:06:09.359 this entirely unfounded narrative. No, I can't say that. I 0:06:09.440 --> 0:06:13.039 have to be fair. There have been instances where a 0:06:13.080 --> 0:06:15.960 person was acting crazy, another person had a gun, they 0:06:16.200 --> 0:06:19.440 shot that person, and perhaps some lives were saved. Right, 0:06:19.880 --> 0:06:22.440 so I will be fair. I will see that. But 0:06:24.839 --> 0:06:29.039 this narrative that that exists largely I won't say on 0:06:29.040 --> 0:06:32.920 the right, but largely with gun owners, is that the 0:06:32.960 --> 0:06:35.240 only thing that will stop a good guy with or 0:06:35.560 --> 0:06:37.040 the only thing I will stop a bad guy with a 0:06:37.080 --> 0:06:40.080 gun is a good guy with a gun, right, which 0:06:40.240 --> 0:06:44.400 in this case was true. Until the good guy with 0:06:44.480 --> 0:06:47.520 the gun got shot too. And I'm not here to 0:06:47.560 --> 0:06:50.960 pick apart that argument, but I am here to say, 0:06:51.480 --> 0:06:55.400 you know, maybe there's a gun problem, and maybe these 0:06:55.880 --> 0:07:00.200 overly simplistic solutions that people keep trying to offer for 0:07:02.240 --> 0:07:11.240 they're not realistic right now on this show. I I 0:07:11.280 --> 0:07:13.520 don't want to say we because Q is a different 0:07:13.560 --> 0:07:18.920 man and he's got different opinions, But I ramses who 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:22.840 has been to New Zealand, who has been to you 0:07:22.880 --> 0:07:25.320 know places, you know, Hong Kong, and you know Q's 0:07:25.320 --> 0:07:27.320 been in all these places too. But I've been to 0:07:27.360 --> 0:07:29.640 some different places and Q's been in some different places. 0:07:30.280 --> 0:07:33.760 But I've seen places where they don't have gun violence 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:37.960 and guns are just as legal. It's a part of 0:07:38.000 --> 0:07:41.440 their freedoms, right. And then there's places where there's no guns. 0:07:42.000 --> 0:07:43.840 It is not a part of their freedoms. But that 0:07:43.920 --> 0:07:46.320 means nobody has any guns, not the police, not the 0:07:47.080 --> 0:07:49.600 you know, they don't have a Second Amendment as it were. 0:07:49.680 --> 0:07:51.360 But there are places where you are allowed to have 0:07:51.400 --> 0:07:53.960 a gun, and the police are allowed to have guns too, 0:07:53.960 --> 0:07:56.440 and they don't carry it with them. Like the assumption 0:07:57.120 --> 0:08:00.520 isn't like, well, what if something happens. You know what, 0:08:00.880 --> 0:08:03.480 if I need to end someone's life today, you know, 0:08:03.600 --> 0:08:06.440 the assumption is if I need a gun, it will 0:08:06.480 --> 0:08:10.200 be close by. But my day to day activities don't 0:08:10.240 --> 0:08:12.040 require that. So I'm not going to live in fear 0:08:12.200 --> 0:08:14.480 in that way. If I need a gun, I'll go 0:08:14.520 --> 0:08:16.520 get it out of the trunk of my car. Right, 0:08:17.160 --> 0:08:19.880 And so there's that pause, Do I really need to 0:08:20.000 --> 0:08:22.120 end this person's life? Because if I do, I need 0:08:22.120 --> 0:08:23.760 to go to the trunk, get it and then come 0:08:23.800 --> 0:08:25.880 back and then in this person's life. Right. And I 0:08:25.960 --> 0:08:29.400 understand that, you know, sometimes you have to make split 0:08:29.440 --> 0:08:31.960 second decisions and in this country, you know, blah blah blah. 0:08:32.000 --> 0:08:36.400 But the point is not that Ramses has the solutions. 0:08:36.920 --> 0:08:44.120 The point is that that narrative, you know that that 0:08:45.440 --> 0:08:47.480 the only thing that can stop a bad guy with 0:08:47.559 --> 0:08:49.839 a gun is a good guy with a gun, That 0:08:49.960 --> 0:08:55.600 narrative that you know, we need more guns, not less. 0:08:55.679 --> 0:08:57.599 Remember there were a few years or a couple of 0:08:57.640 --> 0:08:59.720 years ago that we were talking about getting teachers guns 0:08:59.760 --> 0:09:02.040 and school in schools. 0:09:01.600 --> 0:09:03.880 And that was the problem. 0:09:04.679 --> 0:09:07.439 Yeah, you know what I mean. And then, of course, 0:09:08.640 --> 0:09:14.480 because police have guns, the narrative that police need guns right, 0:09:15.920 --> 0:09:19.480 so that they can save lives and they can you know, 0:09:19.960 --> 0:09:25.200 stop the bad guys or whatever. I feel like police 0:09:25.240 --> 0:09:28.000 can do all those things without guns, you know, or 0:09:28.400 --> 0:09:33.520 the vast majority of them. And you know, we've gotten 0:09:33.600 --> 0:09:38.559 really comfortable in this country with the idea of qualified immunity, 0:09:39.720 --> 0:09:43.640 that there is just some collateral damage. Some people gotta 0:09:43.760 --> 0:09:45.679 die in order for police to do their job. Some 0:09:45.720 --> 0:09:47.920 innocent people just got to die in order for police 0:09:47.920 --> 0:09:49.560 to do their job. And they're, oh, sorry, and they 0:09:49.559 --> 0:09:51.880 call this guy Hurley, they call him a hero for 0:09:52.040 --> 0:09:54.160 stepping in and stopping the gunmen. And of course it 0:09:54.200 --> 0:09:56.360 was an accident. It didn't mean to die. And then 0:09:56.400 --> 0:09:59.960 guess what, nothing changes, The same thing can happen tomorrow. 0:10:02.040 --> 0:10:02.240 Right. 0:10:03.280 --> 0:10:05.840 Qualified immunity means that even though this was an accident, 0:10:05.920 --> 0:10:08.240 this officer will not be charged because he didn't know 0:10:08.280 --> 0:10:08.720 any better. 0:10:08.840 --> 0:10:09.000 Right. 0:10:09.040 --> 0:10:10.559 And I'm not here to debate whether or not that's 0:10:10.640 --> 0:10:19.440 right or wrong. I am here to say that we've 0:10:19.440 --> 0:10:23.200 been talking about these things, you know, police have there's 0:10:23.320 --> 0:10:26.600 been a culture, certainly the culture that we've seen on 0:10:26.640 --> 0:10:29.280 the videos. You know, I'm not talking about your uncle 0:10:29.280 --> 0:10:33.559 who's an officer, whoever you are listening I'm not talking 0:10:33.559 --> 0:10:36.840 about this person. I'm talking about a culture overall where 0:10:36.960 --> 0:10:43.880 police can hide behind the idea of fear many times, 0:10:44.800 --> 0:10:52.439 where ready fire aim is a justifiable course of action. 0:10:53.920 --> 0:10:59.319 Life is worth so little, especially black life, It's worth 0:10:59.360 --> 0:11:04.200 so little, and then there's no accountability behind it. And 0:11:04.240 --> 0:11:08.160 that's the part that hurts the most. You know, people 0:11:08.200 --> 0:11:13.480 talk about all kinds of you know, what are black 0:11:13.480 --> 0:11:16.920 people doing about Chicago, you know, and the murder rate there? 0:11:16.920 --> 0:11:18.640 What are black people doing about this and that and 0:11:18.679 --> 0:11:21.360 the other thing? You know, Yeah, you know, something happens there. 0:11:21.840 --> 0:11:28.120 There's the possibility that you could potentially get justice for 0:11:28.240 --> 0:11:30.640 the wrongful that if some person on the street goes 0:11:30.679 --> 0:11:33.640 and takes the life of your child, there's the potential 0:11:33.640 --> 0:11:36.880 for there to be justice there. A police officer does it, 0:11:37.320 --> 0:11:39.800 and they can it doesn't have to it can be 0:11:39.840 --> 0:11:43.520 on video. The police officer does it because of qualified 0:11:43.520 --> 0:11:46.440 immunity because they had a gun at the ready. There's 0:11:46.480 --> 0:11:48.520 no justice in that. It just died and that's the 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:51.640 cost of doing business. And everyone seems to be okay 0:11:51.679 --> 0:11:53.559 with that. Go ahead to I. 0:11:53.559 --> 0:11:57.640 Want to be clear in those cases, there's not the 0:11:57.920 --> 0:12:03.120 possibility of justice when the evidence of the wrong duel 0:12:03.240 --> 0:12:07.560 is so clear, right, because that sounds like kind of 0:12:07.640 --> 0:12:10.480 vague and kind of no. If the person that murdered 0:12:10.480 --> 0:12:15.280 the other person is on video and that video was 0:12:15.600 --> 0:12:19.160 legally obtained, which is another really really weird part of 0:12:19.200 --> 0:12:23.360 American freedom. We can watch you murder somebody on video, 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:28.240 but if the video wasn't attained, right, you're still going 0:12:28.320 --> 0:12:33.280 home with no punishment. The criminal justice system and its flaws, 0:12:34.160 --> 0:12:37.800 that's one of the many however, in most cases, especially 0:12:37.840 --> 0:12:39.640 if the gunment is black. When you talk about this 0:12:39.720 --> 0:12:43.600 black on black crime since we brought up Chicago, if 0:12:43.640 --> 0:12:45.840 the people know who committed the crime and it can 0:12:45.880 --> 0:12:49.000 be proven, that person's going to jail unless they're a 0:12:49.040 --> 0:12:52.439 police officer. And that's what Rams is talking about. Yeah, 0:12:52.720 --> 0:12:57.240 so it's a very face of obvious and compelling evidence. 0:12:57.280 --> 0:13:01.480 This person's going to prison unless they're a police officer. 0:13:03.040 --> 0:13:06.920 And it's that it's in that space that you find 0:13:07.880 --> 0:13:15.680 what your life is worth to the country, to the 0:13:15.400 --> 0:13:20.800 to the society in which you live, right, And that's 0:13:20.880 --> 0:13:27.280 where the affirmations black lives, and that's where those things 0:13:27.280 --> 0:13:30.240 come into play. It's not to say that we don't 0:13:30.240 --> 0:13:31.240 have our own problems. 0:13:31.280 --> 0:13:31.880 You know what I mean. 0:13:32.400 --> 0:13:36.800 I think that it's something like eighty percent of crime's 0:13:36.880 --> 0:13:40.200 done or I won't even say the number. But the 0:13:40.280 --> 0:13:45.920 majority of crime committed to white folks is by white folks, 0:13:46.000 --> 0:13:48.160 just like the majority of crime committed to black folks 0:13:48.160 --> 0:13:51.040 by black folks. Because guess what, that's who you live by, right, 0:13:51.320 --> 0:13:53.120 But no one talks about white on white crime or 0:13:53.120 --> 0:13:55.200 tries to use it as a way to, you know, 0:13:56.040 --> 0:13:58.559 change the subject on white people, you know, because it's 0:13:59.160 --> 0:14:00.160 Hispanic or anyone. 0:14:00.360 --> 0:14:03.520 It's based on proximity, not skin color. Like that's just 0:14:04.040 --> 0:14:09.640 the very obvious fact of it. Yeah, and that story rams, 0:14:09.640 --> 0:14:14.440 it's I hate to say, it gets worse, but you're 0:14:14.440 --> 0:14:18.360 reading what the district attorney says here. Had he survived, 0:14:18.920 --> 0:14:23.320 we would have praised his bravery and engaging a mass 0:14:23.360 --> 0:14:28.360 shooter before anyone else was killed. He acted to defend others. 0:14:28.920 --> 0:14:34.480 We will remember him for his selflessness. This is the 0:14:34.480 --> 0:14:36.040 part that kind of shook me. 0:14:36.640 --> 0:14:39.440 Okay. 0:14:40.120 --> 0:14:47.080 The victim's mother, Wow, she prayed that no one else 0:14:47.080 --> 0:14:50.720 would have to face the kind of situation her son did. 0:14:52.040 --> 0:14:54.840 And her words, as we pull ourselves together to move 0:14:54.880 --> 0:14:59.040 forward in life, consider using Johnny's commitment to doing the 0:14:59.120 --> 0:15:02.560 right thing, even at the greatest cost. To inspire your 0:15:02.600 --> 0:15:07.880 own actions, this mother has to speak in a forgiving tone. 0:15:08.240 --> 0:15:11.840 She encouraging others to do the same thing her son did, 0:15:12.360 --> 0:15:15.560 even though it resulted in him being murdered by the 0:15:15.720 --> 0:15:18.800 very people he was trying to protect. 0:15:21.840 --> 0:15:28.000 Now, watch this, I'm not going to be foolish here. 0:15:28.720 --> 0:15:31.320 If there is a mass shooter, what is it that 0:15:31.440 --> 0:15:37.920 Ramses wants. It's a fair question. Ramses wants the police 0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:42.680 to show up with guns and take out the mass shooter. 0:15:43.160 --> 0:15:43.360 Right. 0:15:44.040 --> 0:15:47.560 It is urgent, it is happening right now. We need 0:15:47.600 --> 0:15:50.800 to do this before innocent, more innocent people lose their lives. 0:15:50.880 --> 0:15:53.920 Right absolutely, I'm with you one hundred percent. Because Rams 0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:57.960 is saying police shouldn't have guns. Yeah, I'll always say 0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:01.720 that ultimately that's what we want, But in the immediate future, 0:16:01.760 --> 0:16:04.360 I realized that's not realistic because there's a lot of 0:16:04.360 --> 0:16:08.600 guns out here, right, So I get it, I understand. 0:16:09.760 --> 0:16:17.720 But I think that this story illuminates the problem, which 0:16:17.760 --> 0:16:21.400 is why we're talking about it, and I think it 0:16:21.600 --> 0:16:25.400 lets us further know that the problem isn't more guns. 0:16:25.520 --> 0:16:28.120 The problem isn't well, I'm going to carry my gun 0:16:28.160 --> 0:16:31.240 with me everywhere, and I'm going to make a difference 0:16:31.240 --> 0:16:33.600 if I run across a mass shooter or someone being 0:16:33.640 --> 0:16:35.800 taken advantage of, or you know, whatever the case is, 0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:42.320 because there is this psychogun culture that exists, right, and 0:16:42.720 --> 0:16:47.280 black people have certainly been on the receiving end of 0:16:47.320 --> 0:16:52.560 that with respect to police since the beginning of guns 0:16:52.560 --> 0:16:53.520 and police. 0:16:53.840 --> 0:16:54.040 You know. 0:16:57.120 --> 0:17:02.240 And so anytime that I can challenge a narrative that 0:17:02.400 --> 0:17:06.320 people are trying to establish that is very pro gun, 0:17:07.280 --> 0:17:10.800 you know, I do my best to say, let's keep 0:17:10.840 --> 0:17:16.919 it all in perspective here, right, because what does it 0:17:17.000 --> 0:17:19.280 mean to be a good guy with a gun who 0:17:19.359 --> 0:17:21.640 stops a bad guy with a gun If you get 0:17:21.720 --> 0:17:26.240 killed by the police and then they just that that's 0:17:26.280 --> 0:17:30.719 again just collateral damage, man's cost of doing business. And 0:17:30.760 --> 0:17:34.040 then because of qualified immunity, even if his mom wanted justice, 0:17:34.119 --> 0:17:38.560 like yo, my son was helping out, there's no way 0:17:38.600 --> 0:17:40.959 she could sue. There's no way she could get compensation. 0:17:41.119 --> 0:17:44.159 There's no way that you know, I'm not sure what 0:17:44.280 --> 0:17:46.199 happened here, but I don't know how she's paid for 0:17:46.240 --> 0:17:49.280 the funeral for her child, you know, I don't know 0:17:49.320 --> 0:17:51.719 if he had kids I don't know, you know what 0:17:51.720 --> 0:17:56.960 what's next, right, And so there's a whole system that 0:17:57.200 --> 0:18:03.000 deserves criticism. It deserves it because that's how we make 0:18:03.040 --> 0:18:04.680 it as good as it can be. And those people 0:18:04.720 --> 0:18:07.440 that are holding on to the way it is right 0:18:07.480 --> 0:18:11.320 now are ignoring the realities, which is that it doesn't 0:18:11.400 --> 0:18:15.080 always work. And if you feel like this collateral damage 0:18:15.119 --> 0:18:17.480 is acceptable, then I need you to check your morality. 0:18:17.600 --> 0:18:21.080 Go ahead, you and Ramsey, you're being generous because even 0:18:21.119 --> 0:18:24.560 a point that you've made on other shows, Ramsey is 0:18:24.560 --> 0:18:29.399 saying it doesn't always work. A different and maybe even 0:18:29.560 --> 0:18:32.960 better way to say that is that it almost never works. 0:18:34.320 --> 0:18:38.119 None of these things that they're supposed to be preventing 0:18:38.240 --> 0:18:42.600 or ever prevented. It's always a response to something bad 0:18:42.640 --> 0:18:47.320 that has already happened. The strategies, the training, the whole 0:18:47.359 --> 0:18:51.680 infrastructure is not designed to prevent crime from happening, which 0:18:51.720 --> 0:18:55.119 is the craziest part. With the amount of money being spent, 0:18:56.520 --> 0:19:01.760 the entire infrastructure of what they're doing be crime prevention, 0:19:02.920 --> 0:19:07.600 which would not require the guns and the militarization of 0:19:07.640 --> 0:19:11.560 our police forces. They just respond in the most to 0:19:11.680 --> 0:19:18.160 crimes that already happened and in this case, even when 0:19:18.200 --> 0:19:22.080 you tell them something's gonna happen, they still wait for 0:19:22.160 --> 0:19:25.640 it to happen. If somebody calls and threatens to kill 0:19:25.680 --> 0:19:28.199 you and you call the police on them, the police 0:19:28.280 --> 0:19:31.560 can't do anything to that person until they've already tried 0:19:31.640 --> 0:19:36.720 to kill you. And I say try, hoping it wasn't successful. 0:19:37.960 --> 0:19:40.679 The brother of this man who went on this mass shooting, 0:19:40.800 --> 0:19:44.359 who killed a police officer at least one, there was 0:19:44.400 --> 0:19:48.199 a note found in his home saying he intended to 0:19:48.320 --> 0:19:53.920 kill as many Arvada officers as he possibly could. Earlier 0:19:54.000 --> 0:20:00.640 that day, this gentleman's brother asked the police to him 0:20:01.040 --> 0:20:04.520 because he might do something crazy. I'm guessing they didn't 0:20:04.920 --> 0:20:08.680 because in their minds, well, the idea that he might 0:20:08.720 --> 0:20:11.359 do something crazy doesn't mean anything to us. He hasn't 0:20:11.400 --> 0:20:14.480 done anything yet, so it's all good. And that is 0:20:14.600 --> 0:20:16.200 part of the problem, folks. 0:20:17.400 --> 0:20:22.640 And you know, there's been this push. You know, we've 0:20:22.640 --> 0:20:26.960 been critical about the phrasing, but for better or worse, 0:20:27.080 --> 0:20:29.639 it is the alarming nature of it has gotten a 0:20:29.680 --> 0:20:33.119 lot of attention, but defund the police, which really means 0:20:33.800 --> 0:20:36.639 rethinking what policing means. And I think to your point, QE. 0:20:36.680 --> 0:20:44.240 You know, someone threatens something and the police are powerless 0:20:44.240 --> 0:20:47.639 to do anything because they're just words, you know. And 0:20:48.359 --> 0:20:51.040 I think it illustrates that the function of police is 0:20:51.080 --> 0:20:53.919 to respond to crimes that have already happened. And so 0:20:54.520 --> 0:20:58.400 the case, the argument makes itself. The case makes itself 0:20:58.480 --> 0:21:02.000 because it's like, well, what can we do to prevent 0:21:02.760 --> 0:21:06.439 a crime from happening. Well, let's invest in programs that 0:21:06.600 --> 0:21:10.440 prevent crimes from happening. And then what's the next logical question, Well, 0:21:10.480 --> 0:21:13.720 where does the money come from to make that investment? Well, 0:21:14.400 --> 0:21:18.560 if we're preventing crimes from happening, then we have a 0:21:18.680 --> 0:21:23.080 budget to respond to crimes that have already happened. That 0:21:23.240 --> 0:21:27.520 budget seems like the most logical place to pull from 0:21:27.800 --> 0:21:30.359 to invest in these programs to prevent the necessity of 0:21:30.400 --> 0:21:34.560 that big budget, hence defund the police. 0:21:35.000 --> 0:21:39.520 The crime prevention budget should absolutely come from the crime 0:21:39.560 --> 0:21:41.760 response budget. Like what are we even talking about? 0:21:41.840 --> 0:21:44.879 Hold on one second, watch this. So for those that know, 0:21:44.960 --> 0:21:50.280 you know, I do a show it's called uh if 0:21:50.280 --> 0:21:52.880 you wanted to look it up, the Black Information Network 0:21:52.960 --> 0:21:56.600 Daily Podcast. Right, we call it our Daily Story, But 0:21:57.040 --> 0:22:04.439 the Black Information Network Daily Podcast and It's a show 0:22:04.520 --> 0:22:09.720 that I do on behalf of iHeart Media, so you 0:22:09.760 --> 0:22:12.080 can look it up on their platforms. I did a 0:22:12.119 --> 0:22:14.640 recent episode where I talked to a man black man 0:22:15.480 --> 0:22:17.239 civil rights activists. 0:22:17.359 --> 0:22:17.840 And. 0:22:19.119 --> 0:22:22.120 He was a person that really believed that the police 0:22:22.280 --> 0:22:26.000 needed more money, not less right, And on that show, 0:22:26.040 --> 0:22:28.679 I couldn't say too much of anything because it's not 0:22:28.760 --> 0:22:30.879 the nature of that show that you know, I was 0:22:30.960 --> 0:22:33.040 interviewing him. The episode was about him, that was what 0:22:33.119 --> 0:22:41.000 it was. But everything that he said, as eloquent as 0:22:41.040 --> 0:22:43.320 a masterful of speaker as he was, everything that he 0:22:43.400 --> 0:22:46.680 said wouldn't hold a candle to what you just said. 0:22:47.359 --> 0:22:51.200 Because you're absolutely right. If we can invest in crime 0:22:51.240 --> 0:22:55.160 prevention in that, you know, and we can actually decrease 0:22:55.760 --> 0:22:57.879 the crime or prevent the crime from happening in the 0:22:57.920 --> 0:23:02.800 first place, then what's in this necessity of this this 0:23:02.920 --> 0:23:05.359 budget to you know, go to war against the people 0:23:05.400 --> 0:23:08.480 that we're supposed to, you know, be protecting. There's something 0:23:08.520 --> 0:23:10.399 else too. I came across this. It just reminds me. 0:23:10.400 --> 0:23:14.159 It's a little bit of a tangent. But you know, 0:23:14.200 --> 0:23:16.840 if enough people are breaking a law, it shouldn't be 0:23:16.840 --> 0:23:20.000 a law. You shouldn't arrest all the people and put 0:23:20.000 --> 0:23:22.840 them in jail to change the law. The law is wrong, 0:23:23.080 --> 0:23:25.439 not the people. The people are the people should dictate 0:23:25.480 --> 0:23:29.199 the laws, not the other way around. And again a 0:23:29.320 --> 0:23:33.400 fundamental shift in how we're thinking about what is policing, 0:23:34.520 --> 0:23:36.920 What are laws? What should the laws be? 0:23:37.000 --> 0:23:37.399 You know what I mean. 0:23:37.440 --> 0:23:41.040 Obviously we've seen marijuana laws change marijuana. It hasn't really 0:23:41.119 --> 0:23:44.720 hurt anybody unless it was illegal and people were able 0:23:44.760 --> 0:23:47.600 to monetize it and people fought over the money, you 0:23:47.680 --> 0:23:51.639 know what I mean. And then of course we have 0:23:51.720 --> 0:23:55.480 to rethink guns, and so this is the show where 0:23:55.520 --> 0:23:57.840 we have to talk about that. You know. Obviously, we 0:23:57.920 --> 0:24:01.159 implore you listeners to get active in your communities and 0:24:01.800 --> 0:24:05.800 take action, write your legislator, legislators and so forth, and 0:24:07.119 --> 0:24:09.800 we'll change the world together. Before we end, go ahead. 0:24:10.280 --> 0:24:11.879 Before we move on, I just wanted to speak to 0:24:11.920 --> 0:24:14.680 a point that rams Is made earlier about my thoughts 0:24:14.760 --> 0:24:19.280 and my thoughts on guns and their place in society. 0:24:20.200 --> 0:24:25.880 I've been terrified of guns my whole life. If there 0:24:26.040 --> 0:24:30.720 was a national ban on guns and it needed votes, 0:24:30.760 --> 0:24:34.879 I'd be vote one and two, I'd be early. I 0:24:34.880 --> 0:24:37.159 would camp out, you know when the new iPhone comes out, 0:24:37.240 --> 0:24:39.760 I would camp out at the site like I'd be 0:24:39.880 --> 0:24:46.560 first and second. Sure, my becoming a gun owner was 0:24:46.560 --> 0:24:51.840 a response to very, very extreme and urgent circumstances. That's 0:24:51.920 --> 0:24:55.879 fair at a time when the country was not just 0:24:56.280 --> 0:25:03.000 hyper polarized against black and brown people. In my home 0:25:03.560 --> 0:25:06.640 where everybody there is black and brown, and I mean 0:25:06.720 --> 0:25:11.280 black and Mexican specifically because our country was our pregnant 0:25:11.400 --> 0:25:17.439 had become president on the basis of keeping Mexican people 0:25:17.520 --> 0:25:21.320 out of our country. Build that wall was his actual 0:25:21.440 --> 0:25:26.000 quote unquote war cry. So when my daughter and my 0:25:26.200 --> 0:25:33.280