WEBVTT - Bonus 2: Ganienkeh

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<v Speaker 1>Campsite Media. Hey everyone, we've got another bonus for you.

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<v Speaker 1>We'll be back to Derek's story next week, but right now,

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<v Speaker 1>I want to share a story I came across while

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<v Speaker 1>reporting the series. It's about a handful of Mohawk activists

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<v Speaker 1>back in the nineteen seventies who redefined what sovereignty could

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<v Speaker 1>look like. The battle they fought laid the groundwork for

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<v Speaker 1>the case that Derek is making today. Their story begins

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<v Speaker 1>at a small campground in the Adirondacks. Today, the Adirondacks

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<v Speaker 1>in Essex County, New York are only a day's drive

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<v Speaker 1>from home for half the people in the United States

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<v Speaker 1>and Canada. Reminds me of Switzerland. Moss Lake Camp is

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<v Speaker 1>tucked away at an inlet at Eagle Bay, surrounded on

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<v Speaker 1>all sides by forest and mountain range. It's that part

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<v Speaker 1>of Upper New York State where you can't find any

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<v Speaker 1>cell service and gas stations double as town squares, but

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<v Speaker 1>that's sort of what makes it a perfect getaway for canoeing, fishing,

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<v Speaker 1>and camping. And Scron Lake one of the most beautiful

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<v Speaker 1>of the hundreds of lakes dot the Adirondack landscape. Again,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm reminded of Switzerland. From the nine twenties all the

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<v Speaker 1>way through to the nineteen seventies, Moss Lake hosted a

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<v Speaker 1>girl Scout sleepaway camp. Thousands of girls would spend their

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<v Speaker 1>summer breaks riding horses, playing tennis, practicing archery, sailing boats,

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<v Speaker 1>and learning how to fence. Picture a perfect summer break postcard.

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<v Speaker 1>And that was Moss Lake well until Mohawk warriors from

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<v Speaker 1>Gonawaga arrived on winter and told the world that they

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<v Speaker 1>were taking their land back from Campside Media and Dan

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<v Speaker 1>Patrick Productions. This is Running Smoke. I'm Rogi Gola and

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<v Speaker 1>this is our second d tour episode, the Standoff. In

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<v Speaker 1>the course of reporting Running Smoke, I took a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of drives between New York City and Montreal. It's a

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<v Speaker 1>beautiful drive through the cat Skills and Adirondacks, with plenty

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<v Speaker 1>of tiny towns along the way. Before colonists arrived in

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<v Speaker 1>the America's this whole swath of wooded, mountainous land was

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<v Speaker 1>Mohawk territory for the most part. That history has been

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<v Speaker 1>totally wiped off the map, and just about all the

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<v Speaker 1>Mohawk territories and reservations around today are in Canada. But

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<v Speaker 1>on one of those drives, I took a small country

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<v Speaker 1>road lined with abandoned barnes and forest proper middle of nowhere,

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<v Speaker 1>and I ran across the sign that said Gnana Territorial

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<v Speaker 1>High Stakes Bingo and there was a line of cars

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<v Speaker 1>down the road for the smoke shop next door. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>I may be a simple city slicking podcaster, but there

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<v Speaker 1>seemed to be a story here. So I asked around

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<v Speaker 1>to see if there was anyone in Gnange that could

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<v Speaker 1>sit down with me and talk about the history of

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<v Speaker 1>the place. And that's how I was introduced to this

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<v Speaker 1>young man Um. My name is Rio de herne Um.

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<v Speaker 1>I currently live here in the community on Bear Klan

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<v Speaker 1>and I come from the family called Ryalwady told me

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<v Speaker 1>the story of Ganyange actually began in Gnawake, Derek's territory.

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<v Speaker 1>It was back in the late sixties and the community

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<v Speaker 1>was dealing with internal tensions. Mohawk people, the traditional long

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<v Speaker 1>house people there in Gonawaga, were having difficulty being able

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<v Speaker 1>to practice who they are. The traditional culture practiced the

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<v Speaker 1>long house and the laws and everything that um goes

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<v Speaker 1>along with being a traditional Mohawk Indian. Now, a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of Mohawk politics can get boiled down to divide in

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<v Speaker 1>the community between folks who ascribed to an older form

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<v Speaker 1>of Mohawk tradition and folks who split off from that

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<v Speaker 1>back in the eighteen hundreds. It's a million times more

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<v Speaker 1>complex and nuanced than that, of course, but for now,

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<v Speaker 1>that's the divide Gnawaga was dealing with. One large effect

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<v Speaker 1>of that split in the community was the presence of outsiders,

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<v Speaker 1>white people. The offshoot community was happy to intermarry with

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<v Speaker 1>white people and bring them onto the reserve, where as

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<v Speaker 1>the more traditional community wasn't quite on board with that.

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<v Speaker 1>There was maybe over a thousand um French people living

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<v Speaker 1>in the community of Gonawaga at the time, and you know,

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<v Speaker 1>the community was growing, and the long House people were saying, like,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, why are so many people, Why are so

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<v Speaker 1>many white people within our territory. You know, all our

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<v Speaker 1>all of our all of our lands have been taken

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<v Speaker 1>away from us, and we live on this little posted

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<v Speaker 1>postage stamp size of of land. And yet they still

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<v Speaker 1>they still want more, they still want to take that

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<v Speaker 1>from us. You know, it was an issue that has

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<v Speaker 1>divided the community for generations, and it is still immensely

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<v Speaker 1>controversial in modern gotwage politics. But back in the seventies

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<v Speaker 1>that question was amplified by the burgeoning Native rights movement

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<v Speaker 1>sweeping across North America from Wounded Knee. The occupation of

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<v Speaker 1>Wounded Knee ended yesterday on the Fifteen of the occupants

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<v Speaker 1>were arrested. The others were allowed to go. Breathe in

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<v Speaker 1>to Marlon Brando and Saggy Little's protests at the OSCARS

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<v Speaker 1>accepted the award for Marlon Brando and the Gut Brother

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<v Speaker 1>This Jock Little Feather. Hello, my name is Sashin Little Feather.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm APACHE and I'm president of the National Native American

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<v Speaker 1>Affirmative Image Committee. I'm representing Marlon Brando this evening. The

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<v Speaker 1>reasons for this being are the treatment of American Indians

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<v Speaker 1>today by the film industry excuse me and on television

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<v Speaker 1>and movie reruns, and also with recent happenings at Wounded

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<v Speaker 1>me the March on Washington, and the occupation of Alcatraz,

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<v Speaker 1>and so many more acts of defiance against an oppressive

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<v Speaker 1>system that had robbed Native Americans of their rights, dignity,

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<v Speaker 1>and ancestral lands. Doug George Canndio, a Mohawk journalist and historian,

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<v Speaker 1>was around when these things were all happening at that time.

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<v Speaker 1>Gonalaga was influenced by this, and they decided that they're

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<v Speaker 1>going to create something called a Warrior Society. The warriors

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<v Speaker 1>were a remnant of old Mohawk tradition and represented a

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<v Speaker 1>sort of Night's code for what a man should be

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<v Speaker 1>and how he should serve as community. It was a

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<v Speaker 1>revival of Mohawk pride. They're more protectors than anything else.

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<v Speaker 1>The name they use for warriors, let's calla gheta at

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<v Speaker 1>its root um refers to them providing, you know, that's

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<v Speaker 1>what they do. The elders need more wood for their fireplace,

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<v Speaker 1>the warriors will provide that. The garden needs tending. The

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<v Speaker 1>warriors can help. The protest needs to be organized. The

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<v Speaker 1>warriors got you. Warrior society needs symbols, It needs, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>things that they can show. And so Louis Hall Duchy,

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<v Speaker 1>who was an incredible artist and a great student of history, decides, well,

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<v Speaker 1>how do we do this? You know what symbols can

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<v Speaker 1>I come up with that that can we can use

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<v Speaker 1>that define us as a group that's willing to to

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<v Speaker 1>actually take a physical stand and fight. The flag featuring

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<v Speaker 1>a long haired man over a sunburst against a red

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<v Speaker 1>background became the symbol for resistance. It's the same flag

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<v Speaker 1>depicted on Derek White's car. The formation of the Mohawk

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<v Speaker 1>Warriors added fuel to the fire, and tensions in Gottawaga

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<v Speaker 1>boiled over on October fifte and so basically the Mohawk Uh,

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<v Speaker 1>the traditional traditional Mohawk people and all the other groups

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<v Speaker 1>kind of clashed. The traditional community of Gonawaga had issued

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<v Speaker 1>a notice for all outside people to leave the reserve,

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<v Speaker 1>and October fifteen was supposed to be the deadline. Of course,

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<v Speaker 1>things didn't pan out that way, and Mohawk Warriors staged

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<v Speaker 1>a protest that quickly turned violent. Newspapers at the time

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<v Speaker 1>called it the Siege at the Long House. So there

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<v Speaker 1>was a lot of fighting going on and it came

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<v Speaker 1>to the point where after one night it became very

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<v Speaker 1>very violent. There was like it was like kind of

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<v Speaker 1>like riots and um like police cars were being flipped

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<v Speaker 1>and stuff like that. The Montreal Star reported that supposed

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<v Speaker 1>outsiders were threatened, even though they lived in Gottawaga for generations.

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<v Speaker 1>Homes were set on fire and cops fired tear gas,

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<v Speaker 1>and once the dust settled, the traditional Mohawk people decided,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, there has to be a better way. They

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<v Speaker 1>didn't want to fight their their own people. So instead

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<v Speaker 1>of going back out to cause any more heartache, they

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<v Speaker 1>went to the Long House and they start having meetings.

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<v Speaker 1>They start having meetings what are we gonna do? Like,

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<v Speaker 1>how are we gonna approach this? Where are we gonna go?

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<v Speaker 1>So they decided that they needed their own place. So

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<v Speaker 1>some of the older people that were still alive at

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<v Speaker 1>that time basically said that, you know, we have all

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<v Speaker 1>of this land outside of this this community Gonawaga. We

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<v Speaker 1>have this land. We have to go back to it.

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<v Speaker 1>So the people decided, well, why don't we just do that,

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<v Speaker 1>We'll be right back. Yeah. They asked my brother and

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<v Speaker 1>a cousin of mine. Um, they were just teenagers to

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<v Speaker 1>enter this girl scult camp that they had found in

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<v Speaker 1>the western at run Ducks. And they went into the

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<v Speaker 1>camp and it had been, um a former girl scult camp,

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<v Speaker 1>and the girl scults left it and they went in.

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<v Speaker 1>The camp had actually been built in nineteen thirties as

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<v Speaker 1>a camp for Native boys and girls, a summer camp.

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<v Speaker 1>Here's how a booklet from one described the spot. Have

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<v Speaker 1>you ever dreamed of the spot? Far? From the madding crowd,

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<v Speaker 1>an ideal spot in the wilderness, away from the din

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<v Speaker 1>and dirt and the noise of the city and the

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<v Speaker 1>company with congenial friends. Wouldn't you like to know of

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<v Speaker 1>a spot so near that it's easily reached, so well

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<v Speaker 1>equipped that you can be as comfortable as at home,

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<v Speaker 1>and yet wild, beautiful and unspoiled. The traditionalists now had

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<v Speaker 1>a location to build their own community, but they were

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<v Speaker 1>wary of being stymied, not just by law enforcement but

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<v Speaker 1>their own community, so they kept the location a secret.

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<v Speaker 1>They didn't want anybody else to know, so everybody else

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<v Speaker 1>in the community of ghana Wage who was involved um

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<v Speaker 1>didn't know the location, and that was for security reasons.

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<v Speaker 1>They didn't want any policing agencies or anybody to get

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<v Speaker 1>win of this, just in case they would attempt to

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<v Speaker 1>stop them from from moving. They let out just enough

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<v Speaker 1>false information that the location was going to be in Vermont,

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<v Speaker 1>so it was a diversion. So in yeah, May thirteenth,

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy three is when they ultimately decided to make

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<v Speaker 1>the move. So they had gathered at the two oh

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<v Speaker 1>seven long house in ghana Wage and they got all

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<v Speaker 1>the people there they packed up everything. Some people just

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<v Speaker 1>packed up whatever they could fit in their vehicle and

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<v Speaker 1>left everything behind house Ferner sure, everything just what they

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<v Speaker 1>could fit, and then they took off. Nobody knew this location,

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<v Speaker 1>but they just kept driving. The border between New York

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<v Speaker 1>State and Vermont. There was state police and different policing

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<v Speaker 1>agencies kind of set up along the border just to

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<v Speaker 1>catch anybody trying to come in, like any any any

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<v Speaker 1>Indians trying to come into the States. So while everybody

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<v Speaker 1>was looking over here, the rest of the traditional people

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<v Speaker 1>were moving in the opposite direction. They arrived about five

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<v Speaker 1>o'clock in the morning and it was raining. They just

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<v Speaker 1>arrived and they set up and they just slept in

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<v Speaker 1>there in their vehicles that night. In the morning when

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<v Speaker 1>they all woke up and they started exploring some of

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<v Speaker 1>the cabins and the the recreation hall I believe it

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<v Speaker 1>was was still was still there um and it was

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<v Speaker 1>scheduled to be torn down maybe a week later, and

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<v Speaker 1>it just you know, so they got lucky there and

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<v Speaker 1>they just went in and they occupied it. It seems

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<v Speaker 1>like a great fine, but they realized very quickly for

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<v Speaker 1>the first winter that this was not place where mawks

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<v Speaker 1>actually lived. They hunted, but it was too cold for

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<v Speaker 1>them to grow gardens, you know, to grow the things

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<v Speaker 1>they needed to sustain their lives. It's great for hunting

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<v Speaker 1>hulk or moose or whatever it was, but it wasn't

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<v Speaker 1>a place for mawks would established permanent villages. Hence the

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<v Speaker 1>whole summer camp thing. Winter camp just didn't work there.

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<v Speaker 1>So I heard one story that a woman donated two

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<v Speaker 1>horses to uh Lewis Hall and a couple of years

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<v Speaker 1>later asked how they how the horses treated them, and

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<v Speaker 1>he said they tasted good. Yeah, yeah, you know, things

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<v Speaker 1>are tough. So Moss Lake was cold as hell and

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<v Speaker 1>not the best for growing food, but there were still

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<v Speaker 1>advantages to the location. It was a tiny lake and

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<v Speaker 1>surrounding this lake was essentially like mountains, so it provided

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<v Speaker 1>a good protection, a good fortress for the people at

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<v Speaker 1>the time. Because it was there was a lot of roadblocks.

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<v Speaker 1>The state police where there, and you know, there was

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<v Speaker 1>tension there, you know, every day the people that the

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<v Speaker 1>people didn't know whether the police are gonna come in

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<v Speaker 1>or not or when, so they were on The tensions

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<v Speaker 1>were high for for quite some time, and so from

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<v Speaker 1>nineteen seventy three to nineteen seventy seven, um Ganyaga existed

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<v Speaker 1>in Eagle Bay, and throughout those three years there was

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<v Speaker 1>over two hundred negotiations between the State of New York, UM,

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<v Speaker 1>the federal government, and the people of Ganyaga about how

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<v Speaker 1>they're gonna how they're gonna deal with the situation. At first,

0:13:37.960 --> 0:13:40.960
<v Speaker 1>they just wanted to kick the people out of the territory.

0:13:41.040 --> 0:13:44.560
<v Speaker 1>But at the time the people were lucky because the

0:13:44.600 --> 0:13:47.360
<v Speaker 1>world was watching, so it kind of kept them back,

0:13:47.640 --> 0:13:52.000
<v Speaker 1>um from doing anything. So within that time they negotiated

0:13:52.000 --> 0:13:54.760
<v Speaker 1>back and forth, like whose land is it? Is it?

0:13:54.880 --> 0:13:56.800
<v Speaker 1>Is it the State of New York? Is it the

0:13:57.320 --> 0:14:01.360
<v Speaker 1>traditional people? And do you you The white people will say,

0:14:01.640 --> 0:14:03.800
<v Speaker 1>you know, you proved to us that this land belongs

0:14:03.840 --> 0:14:07.000
<v Speaker 1>to you. But the traditional people switched. They said, no,

0:14:07.720 --> 0:14:10.640
<v Speaker 1>this line belongs to us. We've been here since time memorial.

0:14:10.960 --> 0:14:14.640
<v Speaker 1>You proved to us that it belongs to you. And

0:14:14.720 --> 0:14:18.080
<v Speaker 1>so they were never able to prove the land belong

0:14:18.160 --> 0:14:20.680
<v Speaker 1>to them throughout those three years. That's what they tried

0:14:20.680 --> 0:14:23.640
<v Speaker 1>back and forth. They couldn't prove the land was theirs.

0:14:23.760 --> 0:14:29.680
<v Speaker 1>And even though it was never officially publicized, we are

0:14:29.800 --> 0:14:33.160
<v Speaker 1>are legitimate, we are correct that the land belongs to

0:14:33.280 --> 0:14:35.680
<v Speaker 1>us uh and it doesn't belong to the State of

0:14:35.720 --> 0:14:38.600
<v Speaker 1>New York where it does not belong to the federal government.

0:14:39.000 --> 0:14:44.600
<v Speaker 1>That's to me, is incredible that the traditionalists were successful

0:14:44.640 --> 0:14:49.120
<v Speaker 1>in getting the New York government, the American government to

0:14:49.360 --> 0:14:52.840
<v Speaker 1>grant them land rights of any kind, right, I mean,

0:14:52.920 --> 0:14:57.040
<v Speaker 1>just it seems extraordinary given the history. I don't know

0:14:57.080 --> 0:15:00.240
<v Speaker 1>any other examples where something like this has been successful, either,

0:15:00.280 --> 0:15:03.440
<v Speaker 1>do I. I don't know of any other examples right now,

0:15:04.160 --> 0:15:07.400
<v Speaker 1>any situation that anybody else has has been able to

0:15:07.440 --> 0:15:10.520
<v Speaker 1>pull off that similar to what Kanyanga has been able

0:15:10.560 --> 0:15:15.400
<v Speaker 1>to do. Um as with the the United States federal

0:15:15.400 --> 0:15:18.040
<v Speaker 1>government or New York State, it's not it's not that

0:15:18.440 --> 0:15:24.880
<v Speaker 1>they granted us. They were forced to acknowledge and give

0:15:24.960 --> 0:15:28.600
<v Speaker 1>us back our land, so we we just took it back.

0:15:38.160 --> 0:15:43.440
<v Speaker 1>You're listening to your running smoke. Once New York State

0:15:43.440 --> 0:15:46.400
<v Speaker 1>had agreed to return territories to the Mohawks, there's still

0:15:46.440 --> 0:15:51.280
<v Speaker 1>one more step left, actually returning the land. Turns out

0:15:51.360 --> 0:15:53.560
<v Speaker 1>it wasn't a straightforward hand over. The State of New

0:15:53.640 --> 0:15:55.640
<v Speaker 1>York had to figure out how they were going to

0:15:55.680 --> 0:15:58.680
<v Speaker 1>deal with the situation. How are they gonna deal with

0:15:58.720 --> 0:16:01.520
<v Speaker 1>it without having to tell the public. There are people

0:16:01.600 --> 0:16:05.800
<v Speaker 1>that the land doesn't belong to them. Uh So, in

0:16:05.880 --> 0:16:09.120
<v Speaker 1>order to save face, they basically created a trust, a

0:16:09.120 --> 0:16:12.280
<v Speaker 1>Turtle Island Trust is what it's called. And that was

0:16:12.320 --> 0:16:15.960
<v Speaker 1>a nonprofit organization that gang the people of Gunyaga and

0:16:15.960 --> 0:16:18.880
<v Speaker 1>the land can be put into. Uh So, it's not

0:16:19.000 --> 0:16:22.600
<v Speaker 1>taxed and it can't be touched. Part of this deal

0:16:22.640 --> 0:16:25.359
<v Speaker 1>with New York was that they needed a new location.

0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:30.080
<v Speaker 1>Most Lake was great, but completely unsustainable. They needed a

0:16:30.080 --> 0:16:33.000
<v Speaker 1>place that was better for agriculture and year round living.

0:16:33.600 --> 0:16:37.840
<v Speaker 1>They liked the location here, which is originally was called

0:16:37.840 --> 0:16:41.480
<v Speaker 1>Minor Lake. So they moved here in ninety seven. And

0:16:41.520 --> 0:16:43.960
<v Speaker 1>we're just simply moving from one part of our territory

0:16:44.080 --> 0:16:47.000
<v Speaker 1>to the other. All that land, all the the land

0:16:47.000 --> 0:16:51.040
<v Speaker 1>in the Adirondaic Mountains, nine million acres within New York

0:16:51.080 --> 0:16:55.000
<v Speaker 1>State is Mohawk land. We're not relinquishing that. And then

0:16:55.040 --> 0:16:59.280
<v Speaker 1>ever since we've been here, we've been kind of developing slowly.

0:17:00.520 --> 0:17:05.359
<v Speaker 1>Younge was founded on principles of true traditional Mohawk life, hunting, fishing,

0:17:05.440 --> 0:17:08.919
<v Speaker 1>and farming for your own food, real self sufficiency and

0:17:08.960 --> 0:17:12.320
<v Speaker 1>respect for the land. It was regarded by many mohawks,

0:17:12.400 --> 0:17:14.800
<v Speaker 1>is one of the few places where real mohawk life

0:17:14.800 --> 0:17:17.639
<v Speaker 1>could actually still be practiced. It was a place of

0:17:17.720 --> 0:17:20.119
<v Speaker 1>such purity that it even served as a drug and

0:17:20.200 --> 0:17:23.840
<v Speaker 1>alcohol rehab location for natives from around the country. But

0:17:24.000 --> 0:17:27.600
<v Speaker 1>even a community built on such strong principal tenants has

0:17:27.640 --> 0:17:33.680
<v Speaker 1>to make compromises somewhere just to survive in the modern world. So, um,

0:17:33.800 --> 0:17:36.440
<v Speaker 1>when we first got here, we didn't have very many

0:17:36.560 --> 0:17:39.680
<v Speaker 1>We didn't have you know, essentially, we didn't have any anything.

0:17:39.720 --> 0:17:43.119
<v Speaker 1>We're pretty poor, nom, no money whatnot. So a lot

0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:47.440
<v Speaker 1>of people would kind of give us donations food, um, clothing.

0:17:47.680 --> 0:17:50.440
<v Speaker 1>So with these donations, um, sometimes we would get other

0:17:50.480 --> 0:17:54.280
<v Speaker 1>things like beads or sometimes that women would buy beads

0:17:54.320 --> 0:17:58.080
<v Speaker 1>and and sewing thread and which they started making craft

0:17:58.560 --> 0:18:01.600
<v Speaker 1>And so with they started making crafts and selling it.

0:18:02.040 --> 0:18:03.560
<v Speaker 1>They made the money from the crafts, and that's what

0:18:03.600 --> 0:18:05.480
<v Speaker 1>they put towards the cigarettes. And so they would buy

0:18:06.040 --> 0:18:08.240
<v Speaker 1>like one case of cigarettes at a time, and they

0:18:08.280 --> 0:18:12.480
<v Speaker 1>would travel back and forth from Guanyanga to Akwazasne getting

0:18:12.520 --> 0:18:14.959
<v Speaker 1>the one case of cigarettes today, so they would sell that.

0:18:15.960 --> 0:18:17.960
<v Speaker 1>Then they would take that money and go buy another

0:18:18.000 --> 0:18:20.040
<v Speaker 1>case and next you know, it was like two cases,

0:18:20.680 --> 0:18:22.600
<v Speaker 1>then it was three, and so on and so forth,

0:18:22.680 --> 0:18:25.879
<v Speaker 1>until you know, we were getting many, many cases of

0:18:25.920 --> 0:18:29.520
<v Speaker 1>cigarettes and that's how our cigarette business started. One of

0:18:29.560 --> 0:18:32.560
<v Speaker 1>the first things that was built here was the Bengal

0:18:32.600 --> 0:18:36.240
<v Speaker 1>Holl to help generate some income so we can start

0:18:36.520 --> 0:18:39.679
<v Speaker 1>moving forward with the projects that we needed to get

0:18:39.840 --> 0:18:42.360
<v Speaker 1>done or what the projects that we felt most important

0:18:42.359 --> 0:18:47.040
<v Speaker 1>portant to us. Since then, we've we've developed, UM, we

0:18:47.080 --> 0:18:49.800
<v Speaker 1>have a gas station over here, we have a small

0:18:49.880 --> 0:18:55.720
<v Speaker 1>holistic center, m we have a golf course that's being developed.

0:18:56.119 --> 0:18:58.680
<v Speaker 1>The first nine is pretty well developed. They're they're working

0:18:58.720 --> 0:19:03.120
<v Speaker 1>on the back nine right now. And yeah, and then

0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:05.560
<v Speaker 1>we were once we got enough money, we were able

0:19:05.600 --> 0:19:08.240
<v Speaker 1>to build a school. I think they were altered. There

0:19:08.280 --> 0:19:11.800
<v Speaker 1>could have been alternatives. We didn't need to fixate on tobacco.

0:19:11.920 --> 0:19:13.720
<v Speaker 1>We didn't need it was it was the thing that

0:19:13.840 --> 0:19:16.280
<v Speaker 1>produced a great deal of profit, and it did so

0:19:16.480 --> 0:19:19.960
<v Speaker 1>fairly quickly. The same with the Bengal Hall. And UH.

0:19:20.080 --> 0:19:24.280
<v Speaker 1>The traditional rules UH say that we're not supposed to

0:19:24.320 --> 0:19:26.880
<v Speaker 1>get involved with that commercial activity because it brings harm

0:19:26.920 --> 0:19:29.640
<v Speaker 1>to people. You know, it creates an addiction and it

0:19:29.680 --> 0:19:33.720
<v Speaker 1>exploits people. The weakness. It's based on greed, and the

0:19:33.760 --> 0:19:36.439
<v Speaker 1>same with tobacco, as I mentioned before, because it is

0:19:36.480 --> 0:19:39.600
<v Speaker 1>a sacred thing. There were I think that we're alternatives

0:19:39.640 --> 0:19:42.200
<v Speaker 1>to doing this, but I think people by that time,

0:19:42.840 --> 0:19:46.040
<v Speaker 1>you know, we're geared towards a high profit at that

0:19:46.280 --> 0:19:49.120
<v Speaker 1>minimum effort, and so that's what they that's what they did.

0:19:49.800 --> 0:19:52.040
<v Speaker 1>But forty three years later they're still there. So I

0:19:52.080 --> 0:19:55.000
<v Speaker 1>give him enormous credit. It's not a community where you

0:19:55.119 --> 0:19:57.480
<v Speaker 1>have one or two people that have all the money.

0:19:58.240 --> 0:20:00.280
<v Speaker 1>You know that it's fairly share. It's share or do

0:20:00.320 --> 0:20:05.240
<v Speaker 1>I think fairly equitabilia for whoever loves here. So that's

0:20:05.280 --> 0:20:08.840
<v Speaker 1>that's actually a good example of all thinks these things

0:20:08.880 --> 0:20:13.200
<v Speaker 1>can be done. Thanks for listening. We'll be back next

0:20:13.200 --> 0:20:22.359
<v Speaker 1>week with the final episode of Running Smoke. Running Smokes

0:20:22.359 --> 0:20:25.760
<v Speaker 1>a production of Campsite Media, Dan Patrick Productions, and Workhouse Media.

0:20:26.240 --> 0:20:29.320
<v Speaker 1>The series was written and reported by me Roger Gola.

0:20:29.640 --> 0:20:32.800
<v Speaker 1>Our producers are Leah Papes, Blaine Gerbig, and Julie Dennischet.

0:20:33.359 --> 0:20:37.080
<v Speaker 1>Our editors are Michelle Lands and Emily Martinez. Sound designed

0:20:37.119 --> 0:20:40.600
<v Speaker 1>and original music by Mark McAdam, additional sound and mixing

0:20:40.680 --> 0:20:44.320
<v Speaker 1>by Ewen Lyone from Ewan, additional reporting by Susie McCarthy,

0:20:44.880 --> 0:20:47.840
<v Speaker 1>our executive producers or Dan Patrick, Josh Deano camp said,

0:20:47.920 --> 0:20:51.720
<v Speaker 1>Media Paul Anderson, Nicknella, and Andrew Greenwood for workhouse media,

0:20:52.320 --> 0:20:55.560
<v Speaker 1>fact checking by Mary Matthis and Angelie mccotty, artwork by

0:20:55.560 --> 0:20:58.719
<v Speaker 1>Polly Adams, and additional thanks to Greg Horne Johnny Kaufman.

0:20:58.800 --> 0:21:01.679
<v Speaker 1>Sierra Franco Blue has been Van Brocklyn and Shawn Flynn

0:21:06.680 --> 0:21:06.720
<v Speaker 1>h