1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:06,760 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio news. 2 00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:12,119 Speaker 2: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live 3 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:14,920 Speaker 2: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Apple car Playing and 4 00:00:15,040 --> 00:00:17,919 Speaker 2: broud Otto with the Bloomberg Business app Listen on demand 5 00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:22,280 Speaker 2: wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 6 00:00:22,920 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 3: Boy, the appointments John are coming fast and furious from 7 00:00:26,079 --> 00:00:29,040 Speaker 3: the Trump group here in terms of his appointments to 8 00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:32,320 Speaker 3: his cabinet naming some I guess zar is the term 9 00:00:32,400 --> 00:00:36,239 Speaker 3: for some of these people. But he's certainly wasting no 10 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:39,840 Speaker 3: time this time around to setting things up for his team. 11 00:00:39,880 --> 00:00:41,720 Speaker 3: And if you want to get the inside skinny on 12 00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:45,839 Speaker 3: kind of what's happening with the Trump group, mister Trump himself, 13 00:00:45,880 --> 00:00:49,400 Speaker 3: President Like Trump. Tim O'Brien's the best guy, right, I mean, 14 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:51,600 Speaker 3: he's senior executive editor Bloomberg Opinion. 15 00:00:51,840 --> 00:00:55,880 Speaker 4: He has a very long history with Donald Trump. 16 00:00:56,120 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 3: You can google that and see the history there, so 17 00:00:58,240 --> 00:01:01,720 Speaker 3: he knows what he's talking about. President Like Trump has 18 00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:03,800 Speaker 3: been very busy for the last three or four days 19 00:01:04,160 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 3: filling out his cabinet. What's your takeaway because there's some 20 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:08,640 Speaker 3: unusual choices. 21 00:01:09,160 --> 00:01:11,840 Speaker 5: Well, you know, the thinking had been during his first 22 00:01:11,920 --> 00:01:13,800 Speaker 5: visit in the White House that he had this mix 23 00:01:13,840 --> 00:01:17,680 Speaker 5: of advisors that were people there who were loyalists. There 24 00:01:17,680 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 5: were people there who were public servants who wanted to 25 00:01:21,080 --> 00:01:25,080 Speaker 5: just fill portin rolls, people like Mattis, for example, and 26 00:01:25,120 --> 00:01:27,039 Speaker 5: then there were other people who were like hangars on 27 00:01:27,760 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 5: and in there running their own agenda. But it was 28 00:01:30,319 --> 00:01:34,120 Speaker 5: a mixed bag, and I think from his view, I 29 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:36,920 Speaker 5: think he walked away from his first experience in the 30 00:01:36,920 --> 00:01:40,080 Speaker 5: Oval Office feeling like not everybody was on board with 31 00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 5: his agenda. He wasn't sure everyone was loyal to him, 32 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:46,039 Speaker 5: and the thinking was coming into this round he would 33 00:01:46,040 --> 00:01:50,640 Speaker 5: appoint more loyalists and people who were more deft at 34 00:01:50,640 --> 00:01:53,120 Speaker 5: sort of manipulating the wheels of government in order to 35 00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:55,800 Speaker 5: help him push his agenda through. And I think what 36 00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:58,840 Speaker 5: you've found in this recent spurt of appointments is you 37 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 5: certainly have loyalists, there's no doubt. But whether or not 38 00:02:01,720 --> 00:02:05,240 Speaker 5: they're competent is another matter, and they're certainly controversial. Matt 39 00:02:05,280 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 5: Gates is sort of front and center as an exhibit 40 00:02:07,960 --> 00:02:11,679 Speaker 5: of he's been named Attorney General. He's someone who has 41 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:14,680 Speaker 5: been under investigation by the FBI and the DOJ for 42 00:02:14,760 --> 00:02:18,480 Speaker 5: sex trafficking by the House Ethics Committee for a similar 43 00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:22,280 Speaker 5: range of charges. He is the most unlikely person imaginable 44 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:25,280 Speaker 5: for a role like this. Republicans came out strongly against him. 45 00:02:25,400 --> 00:02:28,200 Speaker 5: Susan Collins said she was shocked by it. He has 46 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 5: to go through the vetting process with the Senate, so 47 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:34,400 Speaker 5: we may not make it through. But he's not necessarily 48 00:02:34,440 --> 00:02:36,920 Speaker 5: someone you would put in the Justice Department because he 49 00:02:37,000 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 5: is technically proficient, you know. On the other hand, Marco 50 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:44,200 Speaker 5: Rubio got appointed to be Secretary of State. He has 51 00:02:44,320 --> 00:02:48,680 Speaker 5: very strong national security credentials, He's got a diplomatic experience. 52 00:02:49,040 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 5: He is a serious person for a role like this. 53 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:54,679 Speaker 5: And so you know this array of people, you know, 54 00:02:54,760 --> 00:02:59,640 Speaker 5: Christy Nomant Homeland Security, Tulsea Gabbard at DNI. Neither of 55 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:03,040 Speaker 5: them have any experience that would recommend them to those jobs, 56 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:07,280 Speaker 5: particularly management or subject expertise. But the common thread binding 57 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:08,960 Speaker 5: all of these people's loyalty to Trump. 58 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:13,560 Speaker 1: Now Congress of course is now Republican controlled, or will 59 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:18,239 Speaker 1: be under President Trump. Does anybody there can they still 60 00:03:18,280 --> 00:03:22,359 Speaker 1: get through the process having Do they still face hurdles 61 00:03:22,440 --> 00:03:23,679 Speaker 1: in the process? 62 00:03:24,120 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 5: Yes, I think they do, and I think you know, 63 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:29,639 Speaker 5: the interesting sort of barometer of that was the battle 64 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:32,040 Speaker 5: to be Senate majority leader. There was a lot of 65 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 5: push from the Maga wing of the party to have 66 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:38,280 Speaker 5: Rick Scott appointed his majority leader, and it ended up 67 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:41,560 Speaker 5: being John Thune, Senator John Thune, and I think he 68 00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:47,400 Speaker 5: represents the wing of the Senate that prizes the institutional 69 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 5: independence of the Senate and the role it plays as 70 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 5: a as a check on presidential power. And there was 71 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:57,680 Speaker 5: a big push from Tucker Carlson in that wing of 72 00:03:57,680 --> 00:04:00,120 Speaker 5: people you have to name Rick Scott the Senate, and 73 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,400 Speaker 5: it asserted itself. John Thune is in there. And I 74 00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:05,440 Speaker 5: think some of the commentary you got from Republican members 75 00:04:05,480 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 5: of the Senate yesterday about Matt Gates's appointment, you know, 76 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 5: they all said he's still got to get through the 77 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 5: nomination process, and so I do think you're going to 78 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 5: see some of that. 79 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:17,600 Speaker 3: Tracy Alloway from Bloomberg News just mentioned from some of 80 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:20,839 Speaker 3: her sources that maybe one of the strategies of nominating 81 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:23,120 Speaker 3: Matt Gates is it will allow President look Trump to 82 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:26,039 Speaker 3: see who's with him and who's not with them in 83 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:27,720 Speaker 3: the Senate by just looking at the votes. 84 00:04:27,880 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 4: It's gonna be pup public votes. That kind of makes 85 00:04:30,160 --> 00:04:30,719 Speaker 4: some sense to me. 86 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:33,679 Speaker 5: It does, and he may get a lesson that even 87 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:37,080 Speaker 5: though he got elected president by a healthy margin, not 88 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:39,840 Speaker 5: everyone in his party is one hundred percent with him 89 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:42,040 Speaker 5: on his agenda, even within his own party. The other 90 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:44,159 Speaker 5: way to interpret what might be going on with Gates 91 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:47,479 Speaker 5: is Gates is just sort of a sacrificial lamb, and 92 00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 5: Trump will put him in there, it will soften the 93 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:52,440 Speaker 5: Senate up, and then he'll come back with someone else 94 00:04:52,440 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 5: who maybe even more extreme or more capable, or whatever 95 00:04:56,400 --> 00:04:59,040 Speaker 5: you want to define it, which is a comment has 96 00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 5: been a Supreme Court nominee strategy at different times in 97 00:05:02,040 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 5: the past. 98 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:04,240 Speaker 1: There was a movie years ago, I don't know if 99 00:05:04,240 --> 00:05:08,000 Speaker 1: you remember, with Albert Brooks Broadcast News, and there was 100 00:05:08,040 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 1: a great scene in there where he's talking about his rival. 101 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:13,960 Speaker 1: I think he's the devil, not really, but you know, 102 00:05:14,120 --> 00:05:17,520 Speaker 1: nobody's going to follow somebody with horns and goes. He says, 103 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:21,080 Speaker 1: just little by little, that person is somebody who is 104 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:24,640 Speaker 1: going to lower our standards. Where are our standards right 105 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:27,600 Speaker 1: now with these nominees. 106 00:05:28,320 --> 00:05:30,920 Speaker 5: Well, they're Donald Trump's standards right now. And I think 107 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:33,479 Speaker 5: I think the moment that we're in now is where 108 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:36,320 Speaker 5: is that balance between the thing he wants as an 109 00:05:36,320 --> 00:05:39,760 Speaker 5: individual and what our institutions and our laws and our 110 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:43,680 Speaker 5: democracy needs in a nonpartisan way to simply function in 111 00:05:43,720 --> 00:05:47,680 Speaker 5: a healthy and constructive way. And I think it's really 112 00:05:47,920 --> 00:05:50,599 Speaker 5: you know, the Republicans control Congress. Now, Trump has a 113 00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:53,039 Speaker 5: tri fact that he has an unusual amount of power. 114 00:05:53,839 --> 00:05:53,919 Speaker 6: And. 115 00:05:55,400 --> 00:05:57,080 Speaker 5: I think it's really going to be on the members 116 00:05:57,080 --> 00:05:59,760 Speaker 5: of his own party to check his behavior for the 117 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:01,719 Speaker 5: time being. If it goes beyond that, it may go 118 00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:04,920 Speaker 5: to the courts. But right now it's really in Congress's hands, 119 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:08,800 Speaker 5: and we'll have to see. I'm you know, I don't 120 00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:10,320 Speaker 5: have a crystal ball, so I'm not sure how that's 121 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:11,680 Speaker 5: going to play out. I do think there's going to 122 00:06:11,720 --> 00:06:14,640 Speaker 5: be pushback against Gates, for example. I think there will 123 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:17,039 Speaker 5: be pushed back against Christino. I think they will be 124 00:06:17,040 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 5: pushed back against Tulsey Gabbert, like she has no intelligence experience. 125 00:06:21,720 --> 00:06:25,120 Speaker 5: She was a member of the Waiian National Guard. And 126 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:27,599 Speaker 5: you know, the thing to remember though, is Trump thinks 127 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 5: cinematically about himself and he likes surrounding himself with people 128 00:06:31,320 --> 00:06:33,560 Speaker 5: he as he's always said, look like they're out of 129 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:35,960 Speaker 5: central casting and they look like they play the part. 130 00:06:36,040 --> 00:06:39,240 Speaker 5: Square chins, flowing locks. They look good on the poster. 131 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:42,359 Speaker 5: That doesn't necessarily mean they're good at management. As we 132 00:06:42,400 --> 00:06:44,680 Speaker 5: all know from any organizations we've been in over the years, 133 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:48,200 Speaker 5: good looking people often that doesn't equate with great management 134 00:06:48,279 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 5: or great expertise. 135 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:51,560 Speaker 1: We were talking about Elon must before, and I think 136 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 1: you mentioned in your column is he getting too taking 137 00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: too much attention away from Donald Trump? And how's that 138 00:06:57,920 --> 00:06:58,560 Speaker 1: going to play out? 139 00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:04,440 Speaker 5: Well, that's a really interesting observation because it's injuring to 140 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:07,719 Speaker 5: watch jd Vance, I think, who has very much presented 141 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:11,000 Speaker 5: himself as the number two following mister Trump's lead. He 142 00:07:11,000 --> 00:07:14,320 Speaker 5: phrases everything that way. Elon is a force of nature 143 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:17,800 Speaker 5: and and loves the spotlight as much as Trump does. 144 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:21,680 Speaker 5: And historically Trump doesn't share the spotlight very long with anyone. 145 00:07:21,720 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 5: You may remember the first term, I don't know how 146 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:26,040 Speaker 5: many weeks, and I think it was weeks after Steve 147 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:29,080 Speaker 5: Bannon appeared on the cover of Time magazine, as you know, 148 00:07:29,160 --> 00:07:33,320 Speaker 5: the sort of wise man puppeteer guiding Trump along, and boom, 149 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:37,640 Speaker 5: in short order, he was gone. You know, Trump understands 150 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:40,200 Speaker 5: the value of having Elon Musk the world's richest man 151 00:07:40,240 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 5: with him. You know, that was a big factor I 152 00:07:44,280 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 5: think in how his candidacy was perceived. You Knowltra ultra mail, 153 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 5: ultra successful, ultra capable, and Trump likes to live in 154 00:07:54,080 --> 00:07:57,600 Speaker 5: that glow. But the second people start saying that Elon 155 00:07:57,720 --> 00:08:00,920 Speaker 5: Musk is telling Donald Trump what to do, Alon is 156 00:08:00,920 --> 00:08:02,760 Speaker 5: probably have to pack up and go back to Austin. 157 00:08:03,760 --> 00:08:06,880 Speaker 4: Is president? Like Trump? Is he a lane duck president today? 158 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:09,520 Speaker 5: Like that's like, why do you ask that? That's an 159 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:11,600 Speaker 5: interesting question, Like what suggests that to you? I mean, 160 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:14,200 Speaker 5: you know it's I would say no, but I don't. 161 00:08:14,200 --> 00:08:14,560 Speaker 5: I don't know. 162 00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:16,560 Speaker 4: I kind of feel like he can't run for another term. 163 00:08:16,880 --> 00:08:19,240 Speaker 3: So I kind of feel like, unless he repeals the 164 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:22,640 Speaker 3: twenty second Amendment, well okay, and maybe you can factor 165 00:08:22,720 --> 00:08:22,920 Speaker 3: that in. 166 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:25,720 Speaker 4: But if I'm a senator, I'm like, do I have 167 00:08:25,760 --> 00:08:28,040 Speaker 4: to really worry about this guy? I know it's four years, 168 00:08:28,040 --> 00:08:29,600 Speaker 4: but it's just four years. 169 00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:31,400 Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, I do think there's a strong faction 170 00:08:31,440 --> 00:08:35,079 Speaker 5: in the Senate that's that are They are traditional conservative Republicans, 171 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 5: they're not maga, and they're worried about the own future 172 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:40,880 Speaker 5: of the party. It's it's character, what it stands for, 173 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:43,280 Speaker 5: what kind of a force it is in US politics? 174 00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:46,200 Speaker 5: And I think they see Trump as a useful blunt 175 00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:50,120 Speaker 5: force to win an election, to dismantle parts of the 176 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:56,000 Speaker 5: administrative state, bring taxes down, uh, you know, revisit some 177 00:08:56,080 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 5: other Republican policies that are familiar from years and while 178 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:07,480 Speaker 5: also dispensing with all of the cartoonish, buffoonish and dangerous things. 179 00:09:07,480 --> 00:09:11,040 Speaker 5: Trump also likes to stick his feet in more often than. 180 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:15,880 Speaker 1: Not in the election, sort of the post mortem. One aspect, 181 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 1: I was thinking, did people go into the polls and say, 182 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:23,880 Speaker 1: I can vote number one on the economy and number two, 183 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:29,600 Speaker 1: there's a state ballot initiative on reproductive rights, and I 184 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:33,720 Speaker 1: can vote on that. Separate, Keep those two things separate. 185 00:09:34,880 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 1: Is that kind of what happened in some cases? 186 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:40,319 Speaker 5: Well, I certainly think that was truth. With white women. Yeah, 187 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:42,600 Speaker 5: you know, the three cohorts that you see in exit polls, 188 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:44,000 Speaker 5: and we got to wait for more data to come in. 189 00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:47,920 Speaker 5: These are not highly exact, but I think I think 190 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:50,640 Speaker 5: I think he moved Trump moved up like four or 191 00:09:50,720 --> 00:09:54,160 Speaker 5: five percentage points with white women between twenty sixteen and 192 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:57,840 Speaker 5: twenty twenty four. He moved up something like I think 193 00:09:58,080 --> 00:10:01,920 Speaker 5: eight points with black men, and with Latino men it 194 00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 5: was more than twenty points, and with Latino women it 195 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:10,360 Speaker 5: was substantial. I think Latino men there's a huge Catholic 196 00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:15,360 Speaker 5: cohort there. They are anti abortion. I think that informed 197 00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:18,160 Speaker 5: their vote. I think you know what you're asking, Michael 198 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:24,200 Speaker 5: about the splitting the abortion ballot. I do think there 199 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:26,280 Speaker 5: was a number of women who were turned up by 200 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:29,400 Speaker 5: Trump's history as a sexual predator. He had been convicted 201 00:10:29,400 --> 00:10:32,840 Speaker 5: of sexual assault, were found liabel for sexual assault, and 202 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:36,079 Speaker 5: it was anti abortion. But they felt they were traditional 203 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:38,200 Speaker 5: Republicans and they wanted to stay in the party, and 204 00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:40,640 Speaker 5: ballot measures gave their ability to split their vote. 205 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,959 Speaker 3: YEP, fascinating, fascinating days we live in here again to 206 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:47,599 Speaker 3: President elect Trump nominating or putting up a lot of 207 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:49,679 Speaker 3: folks for to fill out his cabinets. So we'll see 208 00:10:49,679 --> 00:10:50,920 Speaker 3: how that plays out over the next couple of days. 209 00:10:50,920 --> 00:10:53,440 Speaker 3: Tim O'Brien's senior executive editor for Bloomberg Opinion. 210 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:58,840 Speaker 2: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live 211 00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:01,959 Speaker 2: weekdays at ten am me staring on applecar Play and 212 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 2: Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business. You can also listen 213 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:08,480 Speaker 2: live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station, 214 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:11,560 Speaker 2: Just say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven thirty. 215 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:14,360 Speaker 3: All right, we got John Tucker here in for Alex 216 00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:16,240 Speaker 3: steel On. Paul Sweeney. You're live here in our Bloomberg 217 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:19,360 Speaker 3: Interactive Brokers studio. We're streaming live on YouTube as well. 218 00:11:20,520 --> 00:11:23,560 Speaker 3: YouTube dot Com. Just search Bloomberg Podcast and that's where 219 00:11:23,559 --> 00:11:26,079 Speaker 3: you'll find us. That's where the advertisers going. Advertisers are 220 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 3: going to advertise. The digital media. Think Facebook, think, you know, Google, 221 00:11:32,720 --> 00:11:37,360 Speaker 3: think even YouTube is huge business in terms of advertising spend. 222 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:39,520 Speaker 3: And we're there, which is good things. 223 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:41,960 Speaker 1: So let's just daring to know. What counts as innovation 224 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:44,880 Speaker 1: in the airs space these days is the short term 225 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:47,599 Speaker 1: videos that the videos that I see. 226 00:11:47,360 --> 00:11:50,000 Speaker 3: I think that better targeting. That's kind of always the 227 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:53,040 Speaker 3: holy grail. So you want to be you want somebody 228 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:56,280 Speaker 3: advertising grills to a guy like you, right, you're the 229 00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:56,679 Speaker 3: grill guy. 230 00:11:56,720 --> 00:12:00,839 Speaker 1: And or videos where the most effect for me the 231 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:04,079 Speaker 1: things that I'm interested like woodworking, where it's a show 232 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:07,480 Speaker 1: and they're using a piece of equipment and giving it 233 00:12:07,559 --> 00:12:08,800 Speaker 1: the run through, and I'm like. 234 00:12:08,800 --> 00:12:10,559 Speaker 4: You know what, I gotta have that I gotta have that. 235 00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:11,280 Speaker 4: That's how it works. 236 00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:15,280 Speaker 3: Marked August, president and CEO of Mountain. He joins us 237 00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:18,680 Speaker 3: from Miami via zoom thing. Hey, Mark, we actually had 238 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:22,160 Speaker 3: a really interesting data point on the global media, global 239 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 3: advertising space today last night with Disney. Their streaming business 240 00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:31,000 Speaker 3: is turning profitable and like really profitable. What do you 241 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:32,559 Speaker 3: take away from the Disney numbers. 242 00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:36,480 Speaker 7: Well, I'm not surprised. I think what you're seeing happen 243 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:40,520 Speaker 7: is the second half of twenty twenty four and now 244 00:12:40,559 --> 00:12:44,600 Speaker 7: going into twenty twenty five, essentially all of the streaming 245 00:12:44,679 --> 00:12:49,000 Speaker 7: networks have reached the largely reached the tipping point of 246 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:52,920 Speaker 7: being like streaming first, Like that's where they're all a 247 00:12:53,080 --> 00:12:57,320 Speaker 7: sales effort is focused, they're focused and advertising as you 248 00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:00,560 Speaker 7: guys were mentioning the innovation and things like that, And 249 00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:04,240 Speaker 7: I think Disney is right there at the you know, 250 00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:08,760 Speaker 7: head of that pack, really focusing a business on streaming 251 00:13:08,800 --> 00:13:13,199 Speaker 7: and advertisers are responding and basically the growth and profitability 252 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:15,959 Speaker 7: that's resulting from it is a direct result of that. 253 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:18,319 Speaker 7: So they're at the head of the pack right now 254 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:20,000 Speaker 7: in terms of that kind of growth. 255 00:13:20,200 --> 00:13:23,079 Speaker 1: Mark, are they hanging on to linear TV? To satisfy 256 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 1: old people like me. 257 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:28,600 Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean, obviously they still own the assets. But 258 00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:32,800 Speaker 7: I every conversation I have with every streaming network, they 259 00:13:32,920 --> 00:13:35,200 Speaker 7: just want to talk about streaming. I think they see 260 00:13:35,640 --> 00:13:38,640 Speaker 7: linear is obviously it's a revenue stream for it, but 261 00:13:38,679 --> 00:13:41,960 Speaker 7: it's not it's not the meetings they're having as to 262 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 7: how do they better monetize linear. It's all about, you know, 263 00:13:46,480 --> 00:13:50,440 Speaker 7: audience first, which you know, the what we're taking AI 264 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:54,320 Speaker 7: to help identify the right consumers and making all of 265 00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:56,880 Speaker 7: that available to brands and doing it on the biggest screen, 266 00:13:56,920 --> 00:14:00,120 Speaker 7: on fifty five in screen, sixty five in screen as 267 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:02,200 Speaker 7: opposed to a phone, which is like a five point 268 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:02,920 Speaker 7: five industry. 269 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:04,120 Speaker 4: You know, it's interesting. 270 00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 3: I was reading some research on the Walt Disney Company 271 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:09,680 Speaker 3: this morning from Lar Martinette Needham and Company. What she does, 272 00:14:10,120 --> 00:14:11,880 Speaker 3: and she says, investors just think this way. It's just 273 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 3: kind of mushed together the digital streaming UH business as 274 00:14:16,120 --> 00:14:18,320 Speaker 3: with their linear And what's going to happen over time 275 00:14:18,400 --> 00:14:20,560 Speaker 3: is the digital business is going become a bigger, bigger, 276 00:14:20,600 --> 00:14:24,920 Speaker 3: bigger percentage of that you know, streaming of that business 277 00:14:25,200 --> 00:14:27,280 Speaker 3: of the video business. And you can see the growth 278 00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:30,480 Speaker 3: rates just accelerate over time as linear gets smaller and smaller. 279 00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:33,120 Speaker 3: Who else out there, Mark, do you think is going 280 00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:35,360 Speaker 3: to be a really viable player out there? I'm not 281 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:38,280 Speaker 3: sure everybody who's out there in the marketplace can survive here. 282 00:14:39,040 --> 00:14:40,240 Speaker 3: How do you think it's going to shake out in 283 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 3: the streaming wars? 284 00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:44,440 Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean we've talked about this before. I mean 285 00:14:44,480 --> 00:14:48,960 Speaker 7: it's really easy to figure out who's gonna survive and thrive, 286 00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:51,320 Speaker 7: which is you just play a game where you know, 287 00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:54,480 Speaker 7: one person names the network and another person tells you 288 00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:56,800 Speaker 7: why they would go there and watch. So I say 289 00:14:57,000 --> 00:15:00,200 Speaker 7: ESPN and you say sports. If I say Netflix, you 290 00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:04,640 Speaker 7: would say, you know, comedy documentaries, new shows every Tuesday. 291 00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:08,040 Speaker 7: If you know, if I say CBS, there's probably applause 292 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:11,080 Speaker 7: in the conversation. Doesn't mean CBS is going to go away, 293 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:13,680 Speaker 7: but it's certainly going to be more challenging for them 294 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 7: and their number of networks like that. And so I mean, 295 00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:19,440 Speaker 7: the people with a brand with a clear reason to 296 00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:22,480 Speaker 7: want to go and watch content there and be entertained 297 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,160 Speaker 7: there are going to thrive, and the others are going 298 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:29,800 Speaker 7: to be challenged and probably ultimately become part of some 299 00:15:29,880 --> 00:15:32,320 Speaker 7: of those other brands, and I think in terms of 300 00:15:32,360 --> 00:15:36,240 Speaker 7: the advertise and extend the question there. I think Netflix 301 00:15:36,400 --> 00:15:39,280 Speaker 7: is I don't think people fully realize how big a 302 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:41,760 Speaker 7: backlog they're building right now. So half of all new 303 00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:45,960 Speaker 7: subs are for their cheapest package, which is ad supported, 304 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:50,080 Speaker 7: but in they're not really serving that many ads relative 305 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:53,400 Speaker 7: to the number of subscribers. So they're building a huge 306 00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:56,760 Speaker 7: revenue backlog that's going to get unlocked as they get 307 00:15:56,960 --> 00:15:59,400 Speaker 7: as good as everyone else and monetizing, and I think 308 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:03,120 Speaker 7: that's going to you know, like like I'm super long 309 00:16:03,160 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 7: on Netflix right now, meaning like if there was any 310 00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:08,880 Speaker 7: stock I would want to invest in, it would be Netflix. 311 00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:12,040 Speaker 7: And I'm not that far behind on Disney, although you know, 312 00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:14,560 Speaker 7: Disney has parks and other things that make it a 313 00:16:14,560 --> 00:16:16,520 Speaker 7: bit harder to you know, bet on the future. 314 00:16:16,960 --> 00:16:19,040 Speaker 1: Can you close out real quick? What is the state 315 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:22,280 Speaker 1: of the digital ad business right now for your perspective. 316 00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:26,160 Speaker 7: Yeah, it's very healthy. I think overall the best part 317 00:16:26,280 --> 00:16:29,720 Speaker 7: of digital advertising is the long tail, mid size and 318 00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:32,600 Speaker 7: small companies that you know my own company, that's what 319 00:16:32,640 --> 00:16:36,080 Speaker 7: we focus on is bringing long those small, mid sized 320 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 7: advertisers into the streaming television world. Advertising for the first time, 321 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:43,000 Speaker 7: I think all these streaming networks have really woken up 322 00:16:43,040 --> 00:16:45,800 Speaker 7: to how that's an opportunity. I always like to say, 323 00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:47,920 Speaker 7: it's really easy. The two ways to grow a business. 324 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:50,440 Speaker 7: You can grow the number of customers or the revenue 325 00:16:50,480 --> 00:16:52,280 Speaker 7: per customer, and the TV industry for a lot of 326 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:54,920 Speaker 7: years in neither of those things. And so now I 327 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:57,640 Speaker 7: think they're waking up. They've woken up to we need 328 00:16:57,680 --> 00:17:01,000 Speaker 7: to grow the number of customers, and in streaming there 329 00:17:01,040 --> 00:17:03,440 Speaker 7: actually are some ways to grow the revenue for customers. 330 00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:06,679 Speaker 7: So that's why I think it's media world is actually 331 00:17:06,720 --> 00:17:08,880 Speaker 7: getting reinvigorated with growth right now. 332 00:17:09,280 --> 00:17:11,359 Speaker 3: Mark, thanks so much for joining us. Always appreciate getting 333 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:13,040 Speaker 3: a few minutes of your time. Mark Douglas, President and 334 00:17:13,080 --> 00:17:16,400 Speaker 3: CEO of Mountain. He's based in California, but he's done 335 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:18,760 Speaker 3: in Miami. How come all the smart young folks are 336 00:17:18,760 --> 00:17:20,879 Speaker 3: down in Miami, John and they're not in Sheboygan. 337 00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:23,840 Speaker 4: They're in Miami. Either in LA and He'll. 338 00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:26,720 Speaker 1: Be are stuck in a hermetically sealed both with each other. 339 00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:27,600 Speaker 4: Exactly right. 340 00:17:27,840 --> 00:17:30,120 Speaker 3: That's what the smart people do, Mike mclowan. They're all done. 341 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 3: And I guess Florida that's where the smart kids are. John, 342 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:34,840 Speaker 3: thank you so much for sitting yesterday. 343 00:17:36,440 --> 00:17:40,320 Speaker 2: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live 344 00:17:40,400 --> 00:17:43,159 Speaker 2: weekdays at ten am Eastern on Apple car Playing and 345 00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:46,160 Speaker 2: Broun Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand 346 00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:50,520 Speaker 2: wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 347 00:17:51,600 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 3: John Tucker sitting in for Alex Steel on Paul Sweeney 348 00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 3: We live here on our Bloomberg Interactive Broker Studio, or 349 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:59,320 Speaker 3: streaming live on YouTube as well. John Lisa was just 350 00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:02,080 Speaker 3: talking about, you know, some technicals on yes ANDP five hundred, 351 00:18:02,119 --> 00:18:03,840 Speaker 3: So I type in S and P five hundred, you know, 352 00:18:04,160 --> 00:18:07,480 Speaker 3: SPX index, and then it hit our SI for relative 353 00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:09,320 Speaker 3: Strength index, and it kind of says, you know, it 354 00:18:09,400 --> 00:18:11,600 Speaker 3: got a nice little chart there, and it shows you, 355 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:13,720 Speaker 3: you know, when you're at an indext level of seventy, 356 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:16,520 Speaker 3: maybe it's a little overbought, and if it's down at thirty, 357 00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:18,679 Speaker 3: maybe a little bit over sold. We're sitting here at 358 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:21,240 Speaker 3: sixty four point five and we bounced or it came 359 00:18:21,280 --> 00:18:23,359 Speaker 3: off of that seventy level just a few days ago. 360 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:26,080 Speaker 3: So from a technical perspective, maybe a little bit in 361 00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 3: the short term, a little bit expensive. 362 00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:31,520 Speaker 1: But also twenty three times projected earnings at this point. 363 00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 3: Maybe that's the photography sold out that Magne it was 364 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:36,080 Speaker 3: in seven it's only you know, eighteen times. 365 00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 4: So let's see what the professionals are doing there. 366 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:41,399 Speaker 3: Margie Pttel joins that she's the senior portfolio manager at 367 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:45,479 Speaker 3: All Spring Global Investments. She's up there in Boston. Margie, 368 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:50,119 Speaker 3: you woke up a week ago today a Republican in 369 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:52,480 Speaker 3: the White House, Republican in the Senate, and now we 370 00:18:52,560 --> 00:18:57,080 Speaker 3: learned today Republican control of the house. Here, your folks 371 00:18:57,119 --> 00:18:59,440 Speaker 3: at All Springs, you change your outlook at all for 372 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:02,280 Speaker 3: think about allocating capital? 373 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:07,080 Speaker 8: No, I think we're still looking for continued economic growth, 374 00:19:07,520 --> 00:19:09,840 Speaker 8: maybe more modest, say one and a half to two 375 00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:12,760 Speaker 8: and a half percent in real growth. And we'll have 376 00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:15,919 Speaker 8: to see if any of these plans Republicans have announced, 377 00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:19,560 Speaker 8: how soon they will actually be enacted, how much of 378 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:22,040 Speaker 8: a positive they'll go to the real economy. The market's 379 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:23,879 Speaker 8: like it so far, but we'll have to see. So 380 00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:28,080 Speaker 8: we're leaking more towards modest growth, same themes as we've 381 00:19:28,080 --> 00:19:28,720 Speaker 8: had all year. 382 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:33,200 Speaker 1: Well, stocks don't operate in a bubble. How closely should 383 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 1: we follow what's happening in the bond market as we 384 00:19:35,640 --> 00:19:36,480 Speaker 1: look at equities. 385 00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:42,159 Speaker 8: Well, I think it's interesting because you've actually had the 386 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,439 Speaker 8: bond market, looking at treasuries actually move up. You know, 387 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:47,520 Speaker 8: the FED made a cut of fifty basis points in 388 00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:50,400 Speaker 8: the funds er eate and instead of bringing yields down, 389 00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:52,600 Speaker 8: we had the ten year treasury actually go up by 390 00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:55,480 Speaker 8: six to five basis points. Today is even higher, say 391 00:19:55,520 --> 00:19:58,800 Speaker 8: around four point four percent. But I think with inflation, 392 00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:01,520 Speaker 8: say two and a half three percent, I don't think 393 00:20:01,560 --> 00:20:04,119 Speaker 8: a four and a half is percent yield on treasuries 394 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:07,760 Speaker 8: is really enough to be a negative or slow down 395 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,439 Speaker 8: economic growth. I think it's really a neutral factor. And 396 00:20:10,520 --> 00:20:13,440 Speaker 8: maybe it says more we have a huge supply of treasuries, 397 00:20:13,800 --> 00:20:17,119 Speaker 8: and so that is really dragging down the relative relationships 398 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:20,800 Speaker 8: between say treasuries and stocks or high yield bonds or 399 00:20:20,800 --> 00:20:25,280 Speaker 8: corporate bonds, making traderes look relatively cheap just because there's 400 00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:26,000 Speaker 8: too much supply. 401 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:29,560 Speaker 3: Argue on in the equity side of the business here, 402 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:31,679 Speaker 3: if you believe the Republicans they are going to be 403 00:20:31,680 --> 00:20:36,080 Speaker 3: pro growth, pro economy, do I does that suggest I 404 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:39,080 Speaker 3: can invest along those lines? Maybe think about more economically 405 00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 3: sensitive stock speed industrials or maybe even energy yea. 406 00:20:44,119 --> 00:20:47,720 Speaker 8: And actually industrials have been leading the market all year, 407 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:50,080 Speaker 8: which to me has been telegraphing that the market is 408 00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:52,680 Speaker 8: not worried about economic growth or even the scene. A 409 00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:56,240 Speaker 8: sector like industrials besides tech, be so strong. And we've 410 00:20:56,240 --> 00:20:58,520 Speaker 8: actually seen an energy look like it says it's filing 411 00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:00,800 Speaker 8: on a little bit of life here. Whether that's in 412 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:05,440 Speaker 8: reaction to growth or prospective new rules relating to US 413 00:21:05,560 --> 00:21:08,280 Speaker 8: exploration and development left to see, but I think those 414 00:21:08,320 --> 00:21:10,960 Speaker 8: are continuations. Industrials are one of the best sectors year 415 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:13,520 Speaker 8: to date. They look like that's going to continue next year. 416 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:16,080 Speaker 1: Is any of this priced in right now, like a 417 00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 1: proposed fifteen percent corporate tax rate. 418 00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:20,879 Speaker 6: No. 419 00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:22,680 Speaker 8: I just think that if you look at how much 420 00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:26,040 Speaker 8: the market has moved since the election, maybe we really 421 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:28,840 Speaker 8: need a breather. Plus, we pretty much finished with third 422 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:32,320 Speaker 8: quarter earnings, which once again we're pretty good say earnings 423 00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:35,280 Speaker 8: or up say average average about nine percent, So that 424 00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:39,479 Speaker 8: certainly supports higher stock levels through the fourth quarter. And 425 00:21:39,640 --> 00:21:42,040 Speaker 8: really December is always a good month for stock so 426 00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:44,120 Speaker 8: it looks like we may have some short term modeling 427 00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:46,680 Speaker 8: here and then have a strong finish to the year. 428 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:50,479 Speaker 3: Fixing comes actually back in the green here, just broadly 429 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:54,040 Speaker 3: defined MARGIE and best performing sector and fixed that come 430 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:58,560 Speaker 3: has been US corporate high yield like really outperforming. Where 431 00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 3: do you see opportunities in the credit markets. 432 00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 8: Well, you know that's been the trend. High yield was 433 00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:06,360 Speaker 8: the best performer in twenty two when the had began 434 00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:10,080 Speaker 8: grates twenty three and so far year to date, and 435 00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 8: in fact, the yield spreads have actually narrowed as treasures 436 00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:16,960 Speaker 8: have backed up, so highield bond prices have held firm, 437 00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:20,320 Speaker 8: yields have held firm while treasuries went up. So that's 438 00:22:20,359 --> 00:22:23,480 Speaker 8: for example, double bs now yield less than two percentage 439 00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:26,479 Speaker 8: points over the same maturity treasury. So that says to 440 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:29,760 Speaker 8: me the market is not worried about defaults. In fact, 441 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:33,160 Speaker 8: corporate defaults in high yield next year twenty five should 442 00:22:33,160 --> 00:22:36,720 Speaker 8: probably be under two percent. So basically you actually could 443 00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:40,840 Speaker 8: see yield spreads narrow even from these historic narrow levels. 444 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:43,200 Speaker 1: And what's the panther head for the FED twenty five 445 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:47,840 Speaker 1: at the December meeting and maybe appalls in January. 446 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:50,160 Speaker 8: Well that's what's priced in, but you know you can 447 00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:53,359 Speaker 8: see it really the Fed's actions at the margin, haven't 448 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:55,919 Speaker 8: had a lot of influence on the equity markets or 449 00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:58,119 Speaker 8: frankly on the economy as a whole. The economy is 450 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:01,120 Speaker 8: chugged along, and so I don't think the market will 451 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:04,120 Speaker 8: react to another twenty five basis point. It's pretty much 452 00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:06,400 Speaker 8: a big deal, I think for the outlook. And then 453 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 8: and then said, taking a. 454 00:23:07,560 --> 00:23:10,000 Speaker 3: Pause, MARKI thank you so much for joining us. Really 455 00:23:10,040 --> 00:23:12,560 Speaker 3: appreciate it, always getting a chance to chat with you. 456 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 3: Margy Pateel, She's a senior portfolio managered all Spring Global 457 00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:17,640 Speaker 3: Investments up there in Boston. 458 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 2: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live 459 00:23:23,160 --> 00:23:26,680 Speaker 2: weekdays at ten am Eastern on applecar Play and Android 460 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,480 Speaker 2: Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. You can also listen 461 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:32,680 Speaker 2: live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station 462 00:23:33,080 --> 00:23:38,040 Speaker 2: Just Say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven thirty. 463 00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:41,080 Speaker 3: Our good friends Meta find seven hundred and ninety eight 464 00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:45,400 Speaker 3: million euros eight hundred and forty million US dollars by 465 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:48,720 Speaker 3: the European Union over classified ads dominance. 466 00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:51,840 Speaker 4: I look at the stock unched on the day, no 467 00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:52,480 Speaker 4: real change. 468 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:54,560 Speaker 3: It's up sixty percent year to date, so I'm kind 469 00:23:54,600 --> 00:23:56,680 Speaker 3: of thinking it's not that big a deal. But let's 470 00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:58,680 Speaker 3: go to an expert on that, Man Deep saying, senior 471 00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:00,720 Speaker 3: tech analysts for Bloomberg Intelligence Joints is here in our 472 00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:03,879 Speaker 3: Bloomberg Interactive Broker studio because he remembers the way to 473 00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:06,639 Speaker 3: New York City, unlike his managers. Man Deep, thank you 474 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:09,080 Speaker 3: so much for joining us here. What does it mean 475 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:10,600 Speaker 3: for Meta here? 476 00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:15,120 Speaker 6: I mean this could be a harbinger of more fines 477 00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:19,240 Speaker 6: simply because even though this particular fine is like a 478 00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:22,280 Speaker 6: zero point five percent of their total revenue, so really 479 00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,280 Speaker 6: not a big deal. But in the grand scheme of things, 480 00:24:25,400 --> 00:24:29,120 Speaker 6: what the EU is doing is saying their Digital Markets Act, 481 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 6: which really prevents the gatekeeper companies, and Meta is deemed 482 00:24:33,080 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 6: as a gatekeeper along with Alphabet and Microsoft and Amazon 483 00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:42,960 Speaker 6: and Apple. These companies can give preferential treatment to their services. 484 00:24:43,000 --> 00:24:46,119 Speaker 6: So in this case, Meta was fine because they show 485 00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 6: you ads on Facebook marketplace when people are browsing their 486 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:55,280 Speaker 6: social media platform. And one could argue, you know, I mean, 487 00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:58,840 Speaker 6: they do it because they have this marketplace. It fits well, 488 00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:03,760 Speaker 6: it improves the user experience. But clearly EU doesn't want 489 00:25:04,119 --> 00:25:07,399 Speaker 6: that to happen, especially with these gatekeeper platforms and the 490 00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 6: same logic applies, you know, with Apple giving preference to 491 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:15,960 Speaker 6: their Safari browser or their maps, or Alphabet giving preference 492 00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:19,560 Speaker 6: to their maps or flights product. So that's the kind 493 00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:23,959 Speaker 6: of the really the focus that EU regulations have when 494 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:27,080 Speaker 6: it comes to these gatekeeper companies. And we'll probably see 495 00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:28,720 Speaker 6: more finds in our view. 496 00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:32,280 Speaker 1: How many regulatory speed bumps are there out there for 497 00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:35,840 Speaker 1: this the digital ad business. It just seems to generate 498 00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:38,040 Speaker 1: all this work for regulators. 499 00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:40,560 Speaker 6: I mean, there are two ways to look at it. 500 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:45,200 Speaker 6: One is clearly there are you know, so many kind 501 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:49,040 Speaker 6: of regulations that are focused on these companies the ad 502 00:25:49,119 --> 00:25:52,639 Speaker 6: businesses that generates you know, one hundred and fifty billion 503 00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:55,840 Speaker 6: dollars plus in the case of Meta, in the case 504 00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,480 Speaker 6: of Alphabet over two hundred billion dollars. So clearly the 505 00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:02,200 Speaker 6: focus is on the scale here. But the other side 506 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 6: of it is it actually prevents more competition because why 507 00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:10,280 Speaker 6: would an Oracle or some other tech company get into 508 00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:12,919 Speaker 6: an ads business where you are at the risk of 509 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,639 Speaker 6: paying over a billion dollar fines, Like, it's just not 510 00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,760 Speaker 6: worth it anymore, you know, because of the scale of fines, 511 00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:21,960 Speaker 6: I mean eight hundred and forty million dollars. It's it's 512 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:24,560 Speaker 6: a lot of money, but it's an It's not a 513 00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:27,119 Speaker 6: lot for a company that's generating over one hundred and 514 00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:30,240 Speaker 6: fifty billion dollars in revenue. So that's where I do 515 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:34,600 Speaker 6: think it has an unintended consequence in terms of limiting competition. 516 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:37,600 Speaker 6: But at the same time, I mean, it's very clear 517 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:40,040 Speaker 6: what the EU wants to do is they want more 518 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:43,560 Speaker 6: third party products. Apple can't just say you have to 519 00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:47,480 Speaker 6: use Safari browser. They want more choice screens. So that's 520 00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:51,440 Speaker 6: the same concept that's applicable to all these gatekeeper companies. 521 00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:52,760 Speaker 2: I don't know. 522 00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 3: I was back in the day when Microsoft is getting 523 00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:57,480 Speaker 3: fined by the opinion twenty five years ago. 524 00:26:58,320 --> 00:26:59,080 Speaker 4: How did that work out? 525 00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:04,240 Speaker 6: I mean beast Yeah, Well, all these companies have to 526 00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:07,399 Speaker 6: make some remedies. That's what Microsoft did. Is you can't 527 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:10,840 Speaker 6: just bundle, you know, Internet Explorer with everything and be 528 00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,600 Speaker 6: able to get away with it. So I think there 529 00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:17,160 Speaker 6: are some things that they can do on their own, 530 00:27:17,240 --> 00:27:19,840 Speaker 6: but clearly when it comes to paying these fines, and 531 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:24,000 Speaker 6: the finds could range anywhere from you know, low single 532 00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:27,439 Speaker 6: digit to high single digit off their global revenue. So 533 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:30,960 Speaker 6: in the case of Meta, the finds could be as 534 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,280 Speaker 6: big as you know, ten billion dollars. I wouldn't be 535 00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:37,840 Speaker 6: surprised if if it keeps happening and EU thinks they're 536 00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:40,960 Speaker 6: not in compliance, we're talking about potentially a ten billion 537 00:27:41,000 --> 00:27:41,760 Speaker 6: dollar fine here. 538 00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:45,640 Speaker 1: The regulatory lineup is changing in your rank the faces 539 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:49,640 Speaker 1: and in the United States, does it matter that we're 540 00:27:49,640 --> 00:27:52,160 Speaker 1: going might be going toward regulatory light. 541 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:55,560 Speaker 6: I don't know for Meta and Alphabet it will be 542 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,880 Speaker 6: regulatory light given a lot of these anti trust cases 543 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:04,480 Speaker 6: were started in Trump's first term, so and there is 544 00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 6: no indication whatsoever that says you know, these companies are 545 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:11,199 Speaker 6: likely to get away with it. I mean, we know 546 00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:15,080 Speaker 6: the stance of Vice President Electate events in terms of 547 00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:18,040 Speaker 6: what he thinks about the big tech companies. So I 548 00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:21,200 Speaker 6: don't think the regulatory scrutiny is going away anytime. 549 00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:24,399 Speaker 3: But here's the big wildcard I think, which is Elon Musk. 550 00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:26,359 Speaker 3: We had Dan I haves on from what bust security 551 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:30,800 Speaker 3: is on and he says as rites to electric vehicles, 552 00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:36,280 Speaker 3: he thinks this could really accelerate electric vehicles adoption. 553 00:28:37,359 --> 00:28:39,880 Speaker 4: But it's you know, the conflict of interests. Who knows 554 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,440 Speaker 4: they'll figure it out a guess, but he could be 555 00:28:43,440 --> 00:28:44,840 Speaker 4: positive for big tech. 556 00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:48,080 Speaker 6: It could be I think on the electric vehicle side 557 00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:51,880 Speaker 6: or robotaxis, probably lesser regulation. But when it comes to 558 00:28:51,920 --> 00:28:57,160 Speaker 6: these giant AD businesses, I think that's where every regulator 559 00:28:57,560 --> 00:29:00,480 Speaker 6: kind of agrees upon the fact that these companies have 560 00:29:00,520 --> 00:29:02,760 Speaker 6: too much power when it comes to the AD revenue 561 00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:03,920 Speaker 6: and the dollars they generate. 562 00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:06,480 Speaker 1: I know this is just tangential, but Tim O'Brien's coming up, 563 00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,000 Speaker 1: and I want to ask him that question about Elon Musk. 564 00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:14,200 Speaker 1: Elon generates right now a little more attention than is good, 565 00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:16,400 Speaker 1: buddy the president of the elect and you've got to 566 00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:19,240 Speaker 1: wonder how that's going to play into the dynamics go. 567 00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:20,640 Speaker 4: That it's going to be amazing. 568 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:23,480 Speaker 3: What are the tech Have the tech companies said anything 569 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:25,320 Speaker 3: about this election? Here? Have you heard anything from the 570 00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:28,280 Speaker 3: tim Cooks of the world or anybody else there about 571 00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:28,760 Speaker 3: this election? 572 00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:33,000 Speaker 6: I think again our view is out of the mag seven. 573 00:29:33,520 --> 00:29:38,040 Speaker 6: Probably Alphabet and Meta will have to contend with more 574 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:41,720 Speaker 6: scrutiny than the rest of the mag seven, simply because 575 00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:44,080 Speaker 6: I think Apple has done a good job and it 576 00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:48,480 Speaker 6: comes to building the relationship with Trump and Amazon as well. 577 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:53,040 Speaker 6: So in this case, clearly you're going to see more 578 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:55,760 Speaker 6: pressure on alphabet and Meta. 579 00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:58,160 Speaker 1: What's the big story that you're following right now? What 580 00:29:58,480 --> 00:29:59,960 Speaker 1: really captures your attention? 581 00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:04,600 Speaker 6: I've spoke you know when it comes to the Trump administration. 582 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:05,760 Speaker 4: Tariffs is a big deal. 583 00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:10,080 Speaker 6: You know of what sort of export restrictions will come 584 00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:13,520 Speaker 6: into play given everyone is so focused on AI and 585 00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:18,120 Speaker 6: what impact does that have on the development and the 586 00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:20,720 Speaker 6: pace of AI. That to me is the biggest thing 587 00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:21,280 Speaker 6: out there. 588 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:23,360 Speaker 4: Man Deep sing one of the best. We appreciated man 589 00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:25,160 Speaker 4: Deep Singh. He's a senior technology analyst. 590 00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:27,440 Speaker 3: He kind of runs all of our technology research on 591 00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 3: a global scale because technology is a global business. Obviously, 592 00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:32,800 Speaker 3: Asia is a huge part of that, and we have 593 00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:36,480 Speaker 3: a big team in Asia covering the companies there. We've 594 00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 3: got folks in Europe as well, but it's kind of 595 00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:42,280 Speaker 3: run right out of here from New York with Mandeep 596 00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:46,040 Speaker 3: Singh anarag Rana doing it all. And so technology big 597 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:49,680 Speaker 3: big issue here again. Meta fined by the European Union 598 00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:52,520 Speaker 3: seven hundred ninety eight million euros about eight hundred and 599 00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:57,680 Speaker 3: forty million US dollars over the classified ADS dominance that 600 00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:00,720 Speaker 3: it has. So I have to see how these companies navigated. 601 00:31:02,200 --> 00:31:06,080 Speaker 2: You're listening to the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast. Catch us live 602 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:09,680 Speaker 2: weekdays at ten am Eastern on applecar Play and Android 603 00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:12,480 Speaker 2: Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. You can also listen 604 00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:15,680 Speaker 2: live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship New York station 605 00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:19,560 Speaker 2: Just Say Alexa playing Bloomberg eleven thirty. 606 00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:22,200 Speaker 3: All right, we got John Tucker sitting at Fralex Steel 607 00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:24,000 Speaker 3: on Paul Swhen. You're live here in our Bloomberg Interactive 608 00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:26,280 Speaker 3: Broker studio or streaming live on YouTube as well ashead 609 00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:29,360 Speaker 3: over YouTube dot com search Bloomberg Podcast and that's where 610 00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:32,600 Speaker 3: you find us Joe Wisenthal, Tracy Alloway, Odd Lots podcast 611 00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:35,400 Speaker 3: host there in our studio. John, you should talk with 612 00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:41,600 Speaker 3: Joe and Tracy. Big, big weighty issues today. This is 613 00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,960 Speaker 3: this could be big waity chickens the chicken industry. Do 614 00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:47,320 Speaker 3: you think of the chicken industry often? 615 00:31:47,400 --> 00:31:47,640 Speaker 2: John? 616 00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:49,320 Speaker 1: I love chicken. 617 00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:50,000 Speaker 4: I love chicken. 618 00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:51,640 Speaker 9: Everyone loves chicken. It's so good. 619 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:54,400 Speaker 1: But I give the chicken roasters at the food town. 620 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:56,080 Speaker 5: Do you there? 621 00:31:56,120 --> 00:31:56,360 Speaker 8: You go? 622 00:31:56,680 --> 00:31:58,160 Speaker 1: You know what? It ain't cheap. 623 00:31:58,320 --> 00:31:58,920 Speaker 4: It ain't cheap. 624 00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:01,640 Speaker 3: Didn't you know it's a big business behind here, Tracy Jia, 625 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:03,160 Speaker 3: thanks so much for joining us here in our studio, 626 00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:06,240 Speaker 3: Tracy talk to us about how you guys look at 627 00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:09,240 Speaker 3: the US economy through the medium of chicken. 628 00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:12,320 Speaker 10: Yeah, that's right. So we're releasing a three part series 629 00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:15,479 Speaker 10: called Beat Capitalism, and it's all about chicken and what 630 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,120 Speaker 10: it says about the structure and nature of the US 631 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:22,760 Speaker 10: economy and things like consumer demand and inflation, also the 632 00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:26,080 Speaker 10: labor market and how we structure that, and then finally 633 00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 10: how we think about the power of companies more broadly. 634 00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:32,240 Speaker 10: And the weird thing about this series is, I guess 635 00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:34,440 Speaker 10: it sounds a little bit random for us to be 636 00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:38,000 Speaker 10: doing a whole thing on chicken, but like eighty percent 637 00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 10: of the guests that we have on in this series 638 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:43,200 Speaker 10: have already been on all blots before talking, so it 639 00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:45,160 Speaker 10: seemed like a natural fit for us to do. 640 00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:48,560 Speaker 9: There's so much there in terms of looking at one 641 00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:52,760 Speaker 9: thing that people consume in myriad ways, chicken, and then 642 00:32:52,840 --> 00:32:55,720 Speaker 9: going back and figuring out how many interesting I guess 643 00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:59,160 Speaker 9: I would say macro questions that you can start to 644 00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:01,479 Speaker 9: pick at from looking at how you get from an 645 00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:03,520 Speaker 9: egg to a bird. So you know, there's the question 646 00:33:03,600 --> 00:33:07,080 Speaker 9: of just how pricing power works at the retail level. 647 00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:12,080 Speaker 9: There's obviously, as tracers talk about market competition and the 648 00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 9: degree to which a handful of large, massive poultry companies 649 00:33:17,960 --> 00:33:20,920 Speaker 9: are this huge, you know, dominant player in the supply chain. 650 00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:24,440 Speaker 9: There's labor issues, which is, you know, we think of 651 00:33:24,520 --> 00:33:27,000 Speaker 9: like uber and we think about gig workers. A lot 652 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:29,920 Speaker 9: of chicken is essentially grown the same way technically independent 653 00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:33,800 Speaker 9: contractors growing birds in their own farms, et cetera. There's 654 00:33:33,840 --> 00:33:36,840 Speaker 9: the pandemic and the health related issues when thinking about 655 00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:38,640 Speaker 9: bird flu and the effect that that had on egg 656 00:33:38,680 --> 00:33:41,280 Speaker 9: prices which were so salient, and then egg prices had 657 00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:44,680 Speaker 9: a effect on how people perceived inflation. So there's almost 658 00:33:44,760 --> 00:33:47,760 Speaker 9: no topic in the US economy over the last several 659 00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:51,320 Speaker 9: years that on some level can't be understood by this 660 00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:53,280 Speaker 9: one specific supply chain. 661 00:33:53,360 --> 00:33:55,680 Speaker 1: And it's not that the small producers were taken over 662 00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:59,200 Speaker 1: by the big guys. They just couldn't afford to compete 663 00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:01,000 Speaker 1: all anymore. 664 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,960 Speaker 10: Yeah, what it is, it's actually really interesting the chicken 665 00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:06,920 Speaker 10: labor market. So you have these sort of small scale 666 00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:11,120 Speaker 10: chicken producers, but they're all contracted out to big they 667 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:15,000 Speaker 10: call them integrators. So think about companies like Tyson or Purdue, 668 00:34:15,040 --> 00:34:18,080 Speaker 10: and Tyson will give you the baby chicks, then you 669 00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:21,120 Speaker 10: are responsible for raising them. But Tyson also gives you 670 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:24,799 Speaker 10: the food, they give you the medicines, They tell you 671 00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:27,920 Speaker 10: exactly how you have to raise your chickens, but you, 672 00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:30,680 Speaker 10: as the farmer, are taking on basically all the risk 673 00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:33,799 Speaker 10: of actually doing that. So if Tyson says we want 674 00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:36,880 Speaker 10: a better barn for those chickens, you have to build it, 675 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:39,800 Speaker 10: and that's pretty costly. And it kind of fits into 676 00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:42,719 Speaker 10: a broader criticism of the economy right now, which is 677 00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:46,320 Speaker 10: we have these really large, powerful companies that are dictating 678 00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:49,319 Speaker 10: terms not just on the pricing side, but potentially on 679 00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:53,000 Speaker 10: the labor side as well. And we also have more 680 00:34:53,040 --> 00:34:56,959 Speaker 10: and more money being made by intermediaries. And we spoke 681 00:34:57,000 --> 00:34:59,600 Speaker 10: to one person from the DOJ. She calls it the 682 00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:02,560 Speaker 10: tear any of the intermediary in this economy. 683 00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:06,040 Speaker 3: I'm going at Tyson's the stock. This is a big company. 684 00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:08,720 Speaker 3: It's twenty three billion dollars a market cap, nearly stocks 685 00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:13,800 Speaker 3: up eighteen percent a year to date. Joe, is the 686 00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:15,279 Speaker 3: chicken business a good business? 687 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:15,960 Speaker 4: Yeah? 688 00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:18,080 Speaker 9: I mean, so you look at Tyson, but you know, 689 00:35:18,239 --> 00:35:21,440 Speaker 9: look at a stock like Wingstop, Okay, and that's I 690 00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:23,480 Speaker 9: don't know, what it's done over the last few months. 691 00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:25,239 Speaker 9: I haven't pulled it up in a while, but I mean, 692 00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:29,080 Speaker 9: that's one of the most extraordinary long term stocks you'll 693 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:33,000 Speaker 9: see on the market. It's a it's a fantastic business. 694 00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:33,200 Speaker 6: You know. 695 00:35:33,280 --> 00:35:35,359 Speaker 9: One of the things that we get into as well 696 00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:38,879 Speaker 9: on this episode is you know the McNugget, Right, it's 697 00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:42,759 Speaker 9: just this like chunk. They're delicious. They are various versions 698 00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:45,239 Speaker 9: of some sort of part of the chicken meat than 699 00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:48,440 Speaker 9: deep fried everybody loves it and sandwiches, but like, this 700 00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:52,520 Speaker 9: is the emergence of an industrial process that emerged over time, 701 00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:55,560 Speaker 9: right because at some point, as you know, chickens were 702 00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:58,360 Speaker 9: grown in the backyard and the meat wasn't really that good, 703 00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:01,799 Speaker 9: et cetera. And then signs came to the rescue, made 704 00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:05,080 Speaker 9: the big birds bigger, made them fatter, made them juicier, 705 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:09,120 Speaker 9: made them tastier. It found ways to process that meat 706 00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:11,120 Speaker 9: such that we can get a chicken tender or a 707 00:36:11,200 --> 00:36:14,160 Speaker 9: chicken finger or a McNugget, et cetera. So there's also 708 00:36:14,239 --> 00:36:18,399 Speaker 9: this sort of long term march of science story as 709 00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:21,480 Speaker 9: the chicken has become a more wonderful food to eat 710 00:36:21,480 --> 00:36:23,680 Speaker 9: in various forms and flavors a real quick trace. 711 00:36:23,719 --> 00:36:26,000 Speaker 1: I thought we had regulators who watched over this thing 712 00:36:26,040 --> 00:36:29,560 Speaker 1: and made sure there's competition. Especially, but the small business 713 00:36:29,640 --> 00:36:32,320 Speaker 1: owner guy raised with chickens wasn't going to get crushed. 714 00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:35,560 Speaker 10: That's an excellent point. They've done some stuff. So they 715 00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:37,840 Speaker 10: have done some things to sort of crack down on 716 00:36:37,880 --> 00:36:40,960 Speaker 10: the integrators and the terms that they can dictate to 717 00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:44,120 Speaker 10: small scale farmers. So, for instance, if you are a 718 00:36:44,120 --> 00:36:47,120 Speaker 10: small scale farmer and you want to switch your integrator, 719 00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:49,399 Speaker 10: you want to work with another big company, they used 720 00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:51,919 Speaker 10: to punish you. They could penalize you for doing that, 721 00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:54,359 Speaker 10: you know, charge you money. The DJ has cracked down 722 00:36:54,360 --> 00:36:57,399 Speaker 10: on that. But you know, there's clearly a lot more 723 00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,560 Speaker 10: to do here, and it's interesting one of the approaches 724 00:37:00,600 --> 00:37:03,160 Speaker 10: the DOJ is taking now again going back to that 725 00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:07,280 Speaker 10: intermediary point, they're not necessarily looking at Tyson and Purdue, 726 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:10,480 Speaker 10: although they tried previously, but they're looking at a company 727 00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:12,920 Speaker 10: like Agrostats. Have you ever heard of that one? 728 00:37:13,239 --> 00:37:13,479 Speaker 2: Never? 729 00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:15,279 Speaker 1: But I'm sure it controls my life and. 730 00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:16,399 Speaker 6: Some Yeah, yeah, yes. 731 00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:20,480 Speaker 10: It's a pricing database for groceries basically, so if you 732 00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:23,839 Speaker 10: are selling a grocery product, this company will tell you 733 00:37:23,880 --> 00:37:27,160 Speaker 10: what it thinks you can sell that for and you 734 00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:29,840 Speaker 10: can guess what effect that has on the market. So 735 00:37:29,880 --> 00:37:33,320 Speaker 10: there's currently a suit going through on agrostats. 736 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:36,360 Speaker 3: Hi Tracy Great Stuff, Great Story, Tracy Alloy, Joe Wisenthal, 737 00:37:36,360 --> 00:37:38,680 Speaker 3: Odd Lots podcast host. 738 00:37:38,840 --> 00:37:40,680 Speaker 4: Joining us here in our Bloomberg and Active Broker. 739 00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:44,520 Speaker 3: They've got a three part podcast coming out, Beak b 740 00:37:44,719 --> 00:37:48,840 Speaker 3: Eak Beak Capitalism, talking about the looking at some of 741 00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:52,120 Speaker 3: the issues in the US economy through the medium of 742 00:37:52,560 --> 00:37:55,000 Speaker 3: chicken and who doesn't like a good chicken sandwich. 743 00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:59,719 Speaker 2: This is the Bloomberg Intelligence Podcast, available on apples, Spotify, 744 00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:03,160 Speaker 2: and anywhere else you get your podcasts. Listen live each 745 00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:06,560 Speaker 2: weekday ten am to nooon Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, 746 00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:10,080 Speaker 2: the iHeartRadio app, tune In, and the Bloomberg Business app. 747 00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:13,200 Speaker 2: You can also watch us live every weekday on YouTube 748 00:38:13,400 --> 00:38:15,200 Speaker 2: and always on the Bloomberg terminal.