Speaker 1: This is the Patriots Catch twenty two podcasts with Evan
Speaker 1: Lazar and Alex bar Blazar and Lazarn.
Speaker 2: Hello, everybody nailed it, Joined as always by our barat.
Speaker 1: Here is Evan Lazar and Alex Bars.
Speaker 2: With that in mind, I want to segue to the
Speaker 2: coaching staff a little bit and talk some Patriots. We'll
Speaker 2: take some emails. Oh, take some.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna talk about this tremendous defense they've built.
Speaker 2: Phillies.
Speaker 1: Yeah, now, I'm not that interested in The defense is unbelievable.
Speaker 2: It's good defense. I don't know if it' unbelievable. It's
Speaker 2: good defense.
Speaker 1: That front's awesome, man, come on.
Speaker 2: It's good front.
Speaker 1: Oh no, Evan, why are you saying because you were
Speaker 1: just gonna pass by talking about that defense last week?
Speaker 2: Because I don't care. I still don't care.
Speaker 1: They had one of the greatest performances in Super Bowl history. Relax,
Speaker 1: they had one of the that was one of the
Speaker 1: best defensive performances in recent Super Bowl history. Who else
Speaker 1: is up there?
Speaker 2: Really? I mean the Patriots against the Rams in twenty
Speaker 2: eighteen for one, Okay, the Broncos against the Panthers twenty
Speaker 2: fifteen better, greatest Super like, let's let's all relax. It's
Speaker 2: just slit. That's all just.
Speaker 1: It's a good front. It's a good front, fifty pressure
Speaker 1: rate with no blitz. Yeah, they're good.
Speaker 2: Okay against a calm down against a backup left tackle
Speaker 2: and a backup left guard and Patrick Mahomes playing terrible
Speaker 2: in the game. It's a great want me to say.
Speaker 1: I want you crazy, I want there were a great
Speaker 1: want to say there was a great defense and give
Speaker 1: them recognition instead of blowing by him like you tried
Speaker 1: to do last week.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, I didn't like you think that this
Speaker 2: is all premeditated, like it's not that deep.
Speaker 1: No, I honestly totally forgot about that clip, But boy
Speaker 1: did that sound great coming back from that game.
Speaker 2: Got them very fired up right out of the gate
Speaker 2: there marine with that opening. My goodness.
Speaker 1: Not unless you just respect that defense, especially when because
Speaker 1: we're gonna talk about like four those like everything has
Speaker 1: to be like, oh, this is the greatest thing of
Speaker 1: all time.
Speaker 2: Like everybody claims that I have this like bad recency bias.
Speaker 2: This whole world has a terrible recency bias, Like can
Speaker 2: we all just calm down? We did the same thing
Speaker 2: with Patrick Mahomes and Andy Reid, And no, it wasn't Paul,
Speaker 2: it wasn't the Oh, it was just this chapter versus
Speaker 2: Brady's first. No, there was genuine conversation going into the
Speaker 2: Super Bowl about whether or not the Chiefs dynasty was
Speaker 2: better than the Patriots.
Speaker 1: Fact fact, And they got punked. So let's give credit
Speaker 1: to the group who punked them. Two things. One, we're
Speaker 1: gonna talk about like three or four guys on that
Speaker 1: defensive front is potential Patriots today, So let's let's give
Speaker 1: them their credit.
Speaker 2: And I have a I have a take on that.
Speaker 2: That that okay.
Speaker 1: And two you mentioned rec bias. We're doing recency bias
Speaker 1: players today. Might two that are gonna get right under
Speaker 1: your skin.
Speaker 2: We might.
Speaker 1: I know you have one of them, very interested.
Speaker 2: I gotta take a breath. We just started out. We
Speaker 2: came in hot today. I don't even know why we
Speaker 2: just did. You just got so excited over there about
Speaker 2: your little, your little moment in the sun for defense
Speaker 2: that mattered. Hey, Patriots fans. If you want to see
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Speaker 2: All Right, so we were together for the Super Bowl.
Speaker 2: We watched the Super Bowl together, and I will have
Speaker 2: I will say that I didn't really feel like I
Speaker 2: had a rooting interest going into that game. As the
Speaker 2: game unfolded and as I watched that absolutely beautiful massacre
Speaker 2: of everybody's darling, the Kansas City Chiefs, I had a
Speaker 2: lot of fun watching the Eagles kill the Chiefs. The
Speaker 2: DeVante Smith touchdown. I definitely got excited out of my
Speaker 2: chair for that one. That was like nail in coffin No.
Speaker 2: Twenty eight to three reducts, like this game is over
Speaker 2: over when that happened, and we talked a little bit
Speaker 2: about it last week. I was annoyed last week about
Speaker 2: all the talk about comparing the two dynasties and comparing
Speaker 2: Brady and Mahomes and Reid and Bill and all this
Speaker 2: kind of stuff. And I feel vindicated. And I don't
Speaker 2: think Patriots fans. Don't let them figure wag you into
Speaker 2: this victory. Lap, like, take your victoria here, take it to.
Speaker 1: What Jim Murray said on the Sports of this Week.
Speaker 1: We had to hear this crap for the last two weeks, correct,
Speaker 1: you know, Oh, well, you know, if you're so good
Speaker 1: and you're so secure, be the bigger man, act like
Speaker 1: you've been. No. No, we got finger wagged for the
Speaker 1: last two weeks, called fanboys for Oh, you don't know
Speaker 1: what you're talking about. You're just emote. First of all,
Speaker 1: you could be emotional about that team for a lot
Speaker 1: of us, that's like what we grew up on. Second
Speaker 1: of all, Yeah, when we had to hear things that
Speaker 1: were wrong non stop for two weeks, we're gonna be
Speaker 1: a little annoyed. And now that we've been proven right,
Speaker 1: like we knew we were going to be, we have
Speaker 1: a right to enjoy it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that I agree with. And then they moved the
Speaker 2: goalpost and they changed the argument to oh, actually was
Speaker 2: just comparing Mahomes's first seven seasons right as at seven seven,
Speaker 2: eight seasons with Brady's first you know chapter and.
Speaker 1: No, no, no, no, you were him the greatest of
Speaker 1: all time. Yeah, And people even say, well, no, that's
Speaker 1: not what we were saying. No, that is exactly what
Speaker 1: you were saying. You were saying he was going to
Speaker 1: pass Brady historically, and that this is the whole thing about.
Speaker 1: When the goat conversation is over, it should have never begun.
Speaker 1: That's the point. Having it at this stage is so
Speaker 1: ludicrous because the longevity matters. And to not include that
Speaker 1: part when when you were all saying, oh, you can't
Speaker 1: give Brady props for being a longevity merchant, you absolutely
Speaker 1: can in the National Football League playing over two decades.
Speaker 1: When you were all down playing the whole longevity thing,
Speaker 1: this is exactly why we were telling you to shut up,
Speaker 1: because it matters what you do over the entirety of it.
Speaker 2: So you're you're going crazy right now over this. This
Speaker 2: was your station's doing. This was your stations doing, Jim Murray,
Speaker 2: this was your station's doing.
Speaker 1: It was not just a sports time no, but.
Speaker 2: Every single guest that they had on during Super Bowl
Speaker 2: Week last week, that those were the questions they were proposing,
Speaker 2: Bill or Reid, Brady or Mahomes I think Helsey or Gronk,
Speaker 2: Chiefs or Patriots, Which one's better, which one's more impressive?
Speaker 2: All this and again not to this point, there was
Speaker 2: legitimate conversations about this being a competition overall that were
Speaker 2: way premature, And when you really look at it now,
Speaker 2: for Mahomes, he's twenty nine years old, going to be
Speaker 2: going into his age thirty season here. If he were
Speaker 2: to catch Brady, he'd basically have to win a Super
Speaker 2: Bowl every other year for the next decade, yep, to
Speaker 2: catch Brady, And that in itself, I think is totally
Speaker 2: far fetched that that is going to happen. Are they
Speaker 2: gonna have a puncher's chance as long as Mahomes is
Speaker 2: healthy and Mahomes is upright? Yeah, absolutely, they'll be in
Speaker 2: it every single year, just like the Patriots were in
Speaker 2: it every single year. But to expect them to now
Speaker 2: not have any drought like the Patriots had. The Patriots
Speaker 2: went a decade without winning one. Now they were in
Speaker 2: a couple, but they went a decade without winning one.
Speaker 2: Expecting Patrick Mahomes to rattle off another five Super Bowl
Speaker 2: wins to pass Brady and then that next ten years
Speaker 2: of his career, assuming he makes it that long to
Speaker 2: begin with, is why this was all crazy to begin with.
Speaker 2: And I can't believe how much of a conversation it
Speaker 2: was last week.
Speaker 1: And for all the renegging on the Mahomes Brady conversation,
Speaker 1: which is absolutely appropriate. I actually think Sunday was a
Speaker 1: worse look for Andy Reid than Patrick Mahomes.
Speaker 2: I could see that.
Speaker 1: And that's not say it wasn't a bad look for Mahomes,
Speaker 1: but the guy. I mean, if we're going to talk
Speaker 1: about him in the same breath as Belichick, Belichick's the
Speaker 1: greatest defensive mind in the history of the game. Andy
Speaker 1: Reid has to be the greatest offensive mind in the
Speaker 1: history of the game to be in that conversation, and
Speaker 1: I mean, I can see if you want to start
Speaker 1: going down that road, but on the biggest stage. And
Speaker 1: Is Felger called it this week the Final Exam, which
Speaker 1: I think is true. We were allowed to grade these
Speaker 1: games more than other games. We are absolutely allowed to
Speaker 1: put more weight on these games, positive and negative than
Speaker 1: other games. We got stopped. And did you see any
Speaker 1: sort of real adjustment in there, any sort of creativity. Yes,
Speaker 1: the offensive line was not good. Move Joe Tooney back
Speaker 1: into guard. Try that mix in a screen. Do some
Speaker 1: you rpo something to counter the offensive line struggling? That
Speaker 1: was not the same creative Chiefs offense we've seen at times.
Speaker 1: I did not see the appropriate adjustments in there that
Speaker 1: you would expect from a coach with Reed's pat agree,
Speaker 1: it was a rough look for Andy Reid. And he
Speaker 1: has plenty of good games too that are on his resume.
Speaker 1: But that one is going to sit there as a knock.
Speaker 1: That one is absolutely gonna sit there as a.
Speaker 2: So I agree, now, just to be objective a little
Speaker 2: bit sure, and be fair a little bit. I also
Speaker 2: watched the Philadelphia Eagles in twenty seventeen go up and
Speaker 2: down the field against the Patriots defense. Yeah. Now, granted
Speaker 2: that was a Malcolm Butler situation that was maybe a
Speaker 2: little bit actenuating circumstance what is but there was no
Speaker 2: adjustments that night. There was no there. There was no
Speaker 2: Belichick masterful stroke.
Speaker 1: And you know what happened after that. A lot of
Speaker 1: people came out and started saying, maybe Belichick isn't the
Speaker 1: greatest of all time. A lot of people that Bill,
Speaker 1: and I'm not saying they're right, but Bill still has
Speaker 1: to wear that game, I think more than any game
Speaker 1: in his career.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So if that was the case for Bill, this is
Speaker 1: this Bill one out of his way to sabotage that game,
Speaker 1: it is a little different, and Andy Reid might not
Speaker 1: have had that option of Oh, we have this, you know,
Speaker 1: potential silver bullet.
Speaker 2: In our back pocket and we're just not gonna play it.
Speaker 2: Like I maybe that is makes it a little bit different.
Speaker 1: Doesn't that make it work for Reid? He couldn't come
Speaker 1: up with an answer. Bill had an answer, he didn't
Speaker 1: go to it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we couldn't come up with that, I guess. I mean,
Speaker 2: I just think if you're gonna hold it against Reid
Speaker 2: in terms of you know, adjusting, lack of adjustments and
Speaker 2: no answers and all that kind of stuff. I mean,
Speaker 2: there were games, especially that one, where defensively the Patriots,
Speaker 2: you know, Bill's side of the ball had no answers
Speaker 2: for an opponent. And then offensively there were games where,
Speaker 2: you know, the two Giant Super Bowls, where they really
Speaker 2: didn't play a great offense in those games. Now, that's
Speaker 2: not Bill's side of the ball, so I guess you
Speaker 2: don't hold that directly against him in the same.
Speaker 1: Also, they never got blown out like that, No, it
Speaker 1: was never as lopsided that that I think was really.
Speaker 2: What stood out. And then we can kind of talk
Speaker 2: about sort of the rosters and things like that. But
Speaker 2: I think one of the main things that stood out
Speaker 2: from this perspective, the Patriots Chiefs thing was just the
Speaker 2: Patriots always stayed attached, like they always found a way
Speaker 2: to keep the game close, whether it was you know,
Speaker 2: the second Eagles Super Bowl where Brady throws for six
Speaker 2: hundred yards and basically goes round for round with the
Speaker 2: Eagles offense to keep the Patriots in the game, or
Speaker 2: the Patriots defense you know, basically in two thousand and
Speaker 2: seven keeping it a game for a period of time.
Speaker 2: You know, they were able to always stay close and
Speaker 2: attached on the scoreboard, where they had the leads in
Speaker 2: fourth quarters, they had possessions where they could take the
Speaker 2: lead in fourth quarters, you know, things of that nature.
Speaker 2: And they never let anybody get away from them on
Speaker 2: the scoreboard, which is just extremely impressive in something that's
Speaker 2: a feather in their cap. You can't deny that they
Speaker 2: were never embarrassed on the biggest stage twice. Now this
Speaker 2: Chiefs dynasty has been embarrassed at the Super Bowl twice,
Speaker 2: So we'll see. And you know, to all the comments
Speaker 2: I see a lot from Chiefs Kingdom and those you
Speaker 2: know that Brady will go lost to the Ravens in
Speaker 2: the divisional round like all of a sudden, the nine
Speaker 2: divisional round is making a comeback, ye or was that
Speaker 2: the wildcard round?
Speaker 1: Part? We're allowed to say that game means more in
Speaker 1: both directions.
Speaker 2: In both directions, I think it's just funny that we're
Speaker 2: now going back like fifteen years to like a random
Speaker 2: wildcard loss to now find a way to like compare
Speaker 2: it and with that season, you know, there's context, Like
Speaker 2: Brady was coming off to torn acl in two thousand
Speaker 2: and eight, so he wasn't completely at his peak of
Speaker 2: his powers coming back from the injury. As we all
Speaker 2: know around here. Wes Welker blows out his knee in
Speaker 2: a meaningless Week seventeen game in Houston. I will never
Speaker 2: forget that. I was devastated at the time. I couldn't
Speaker 2: believe it. I was like, oh my god, Now that
Speaker 2: didn't Wes Welker wasn't going to tackle Ray Rice Like,
Speaker 2: that's not It wasn't all because of that, but that
Speaker 2: obviously took the air out of the balloon a lot
Speaker 2: for the Patriots offense and their ability to match what
Speaker 2: the Ravens were doing offensively that day without their best
Speaker 2: player at that position at that point.
Speaker 1: And it's just different in the Super Bowl. And if
Speaker 1: you look at the games, has had really one great
Speaker 1: Super Bowl. Even in some of the wins he's been pedestrian.
Speaker 1: He has multiple interceptions in three or five he has
Speaker 1: a seven to six it's I think is it's seven
Speaker 1: to six or eight to seven touchdown interception ratio aided
Speaker 1: by that ridiculous stat adding performance at the end of
Speaker 1: the game. Yeah, which robbed us of Carson Wentz super
Speaker 1: Bowl snaps first the Eagles, which would have been hilarious. Uh,
Speaker 1: we're allowed to get those games count more. We're allowed
Speaker 1: to count those And it goes both ways. If Mahomes
Speaker 1: comes out, you know, down the road and throws her
Speaker 1: five hundred yards in a Super Bowl, that will mean
Speaker 1: significantly more than you know, if he did it in
Speaker 1: you know whatever, the thirteen second game. Yeah, it means
Speaker 1: a lot more than that. So those Gateway it's a
Speaker 1: what have you done for me lately? Sport? And I
Speaker 1: will say on the flip side, I'm always somebody who
Speaker 1: says when people are like, oh, Brady, you know the
Speaker 1: eighteen Super Bowl, Brady sucked. You know, it's all about
Speaker 1: you know, what are you doing that game? No, it's
Speaker 1: winning a super Bowl is about the whole season and
Speaker 1: not just that one game. So it will be fair there.
Speaker 1: Patrick Mahomes did have another good season. It wasn't as
Speaker 1: good as some of this bed another good season. But
Speaker 1: you want to take the discussion to that level, you
Speaker 1: want to talk about the greatest of all time, not
Speaker 1: just great, but the greatest of all time. Those games
Speaker 1: are tie breakers, and I don't think Brady needs the
Speaker 1: tie breakers he had over Mahomes. But if we get
Speaker 1: to that point, or Belichick needs it over Read or
Speaker 1: Gronk over Kelsey who was non existent. Yeah, if we
Speaker 1: get to the point where those games do come into
Speaker 1: the conversation actually come into the conversation as tiebreakers, we
Speaker 1: are absolutely allowed to weigh those more than I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: the nine wild card, regardless of what the circumstances were
Speaker 1: in that game.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you really look at it, at this point,
Speaker 2: Patrick Mahomes has had up until twenty eleven. For Tom Brady, right,
Speaker 2: he's been to five Super Bowls, he's won three, he's
Speaker 2: lost two, and I know that Brady, you know there's
Speaker 2: a longer period of time for Brady than Mahomes. But essentially,
Speaker 2: Mahomes has had Chapter one. And I think what a
Speaker 2: lot of people forget or just didn't give enough credence
Speaker 2: to is that Brady had this whole second chapter with
Speaker 2: the Patriots from twenty fourteen to twenty eighteen where he
Speaker 2: won three more and then went to another one and
Speaker 2: then one again in Tampa Bay. Like he had two
Speaker 2: Hall of Fame careers, Mahomes has one right now. He
Speaker 2: has a one Hall of Fame career. He's gonna be
Speaker 2: a first ballot Hall of Famer, as he should be.
Speaker 2: But right now, Patrick Mahomes, the comparisons for him are
Speaker 2: Joe Montana and you know, John Elway and Peyton Manning
Speaker 2: and Troy Aikman. Troy, He's a better quarterback than Troy Aikman.
Speaker 2: But I just mean the three Super Bowls.
Speaker 1: I think he's past Peyton I'll give him that. I
Speaker 1: think he's past Peyton Manning because of his two Super
Speaker 1: Bowl wins, one of which he was undoubtedly carried to
Speaker 1: right like, he didn't have a ton of success in
Speaker 1: the postseason. Beyond that, Mahomes has been much more consistent.
Speaker 1: I'll put Mahomes ahead of Manning at this point. I
Speaker 1: said that last year, so this isn't a new take.
Speaker 1: I think him in Montana is kind of the debate
Speaker 1: right now.
Speaker 2: I always give Peyton a lot of credit, and I
Speaker 2: think Brady gives Peyton a lot of credit for the
Speaker 2: field general stuff. Yeah, like that that really changed the game.
Speaker 2: Like quarterbacks, I don't think we're doing that where they
Speaker 2: were making all the calls at the line of scrimmage
Speaker 2: and audibling and checking into plays and really controlling the
Speaker 2: chessboard like Peyton would and being that advanced in terms
Speaker 2: of the pre snap reads and the pre snap processes
Speaker 2: and all that stuff. Brady kind of added that onto
Speaker 2: his game because Peyton was doing it right. You know,
Speaker 2: it's another thing to master, to add to the skill set,
Speaker 2: to add to the repertoire. And with Mahomes, he's he
Speaker 2: kind of changed the game with his playing style. He's
Speaker 2: an unorthodox quarterback. He doesn't have like the picture perfect
Speaker 2: mechanics like Brady did, and he doesn't have some of
Speaker 2: those what there's like cliche quarterback things. He changed the
Speaker 2: game to dual thread and off script and off platform
Speaker 2: and all that kind of stuff. Now being the in
Speaker 2: vogue style of play. You know, That's what in a
Speaker 2: lot of ways drew people to Drake May you know,
Speaker 2: is that he has that ability to do those types
Speaker 2: of things. What I wonder for mahomes and and I'm
Speaker 2: really curious, like I'm actually genuinely curious to see what
Speaker 2: he does here as those physical tools start to diminish
Speaker 2: into his thirties a little bit, can he pivot to
Speaker 2: being the Brady style quarterback. I think he's shown signs
Speaker 2: of it. I think he's gotten a lot better at
Speaker 2: reading defenses and pre snap and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 2: But I want, like that's going to have to be
Speaker 2: the pivot, because you're not going to be able to
Speaker 2: run around and make plays like that forever. And he
Speaker 2: hasn't done it as much lately as maybe he did
Speaker 2: early on in his career. But I wonder if he'll
Speaker 2: have that ability, And I'm looking forward to seeing if
Speaker 2: he can, because that's how he's going to prolong his career.
Speaker 2: He's going to prolong his career by becoming a really
Speaker 2: good pocket. Well.
Speaker 1: The other interesting thing is he's gonna have to do it,
Speaker 1: at least some of that without Andy Reid, Like, if
Speaker 1: he matches Brady, he plays twenty years. He's not gonna
Speaker 1: do that all with any Reid. And I know Reid
Speaker 1: said he'll be back next year.
Speaker 2: Yeah, It'll be like a Bill Losh George Sefferts type
Speaker 2: of situation.
Speaker 1: Right. So, and look, Brady did it all with Bill,
Speaker 1: but there were different offensive coordinators in there, there were different iterations.
Speaker 1: And then obviously he goes to tamp and reinvents himself.
Speaker 1: So that's another feather in the cap that Mahomes needs
Speaker 1: to have. Let's talk about I think that's enough, singer Wagon.
Speaker 2: Let's talk about the rosters, because there are some interesting
Speaker 2: things to polk here from the Patriots there for the
Speaker 2: Patriots from a past perspective, the overwhelming narrative coming off
Speaker 2: of this Super Bowl is the trenches, which you know, welcome,
Speaker 2: like Glad's the glad we're here, right. But I feel
Speaker 2: like that is something that we should talk about a
Speaker 2: little bit more though, because the other shoe to drop
Speaker 2: kind of off the Super Bowl, and I myself included
Speaker 2: during the game, tweeted I took the bait too a
Speaker 2: little bit, was well, let's just sign all the Eagles
Speaker 2: defensive linemen that at free agency. Yeah, and I'm not
Speaker 2: sure I would be weary of doing that. Not that
Speaker 2: I am completely saying don't go out and sign Josh
Speaker 2: Wet or Milton Williams, but you also can't pay those
Speaker 2: guys top of market contracts and expect to get the
Speaker 2: exact same production that they were getting in Philly. You know,
Speaker 2: I don't know necessarily about Sweat. I think Sweat might
Speaker 2: be able to kind of translate into different systems. But
Speaker 2: like a guy like Zach Bond, for example, to me,
Speaker 2: screams he was in a perfect situation for his skill set.
Speaker 2: He had a great defensive line in front of him
Speaker 2: to keep him clean, he had Vic Fangio using him
Speaker 2: exactly how he was supposed to be used. I would
Speaker 2: just personally be a little bit weary of over extending
Speaker 2: for those players in free agency and expecting them to
Speaker 2: come in and put up the same production and if
Speaker 2: they did in the in the postseason run, there is
Speaker 2: no Jalen Carter, right, There's not going to be a
Speaker 2: Nolan Smith on the other side for Josh Sweat. There's
Speaker 2: not gonna be a Jalen Carter clogging double teams and
Speaker 2: stuff like that for Milton Williams, Zach Bond is the system,
Speaker 2: Is it Fangio, you know, is it the defensive line
Speaker 2: he's in playing in front of him, you know those
Speaker 2: types of elements of it. I do think you have
Speaker 2: to factor in here absolutely.
Speaker 1: And it's like you said, you know, Josh Sweat comes here,
Speaker 1: He's going to get a lot more attention. Now you
Speaker 1: hope Christian Barmore can come back. He's kind of that
Speaker 1: guy getting some attention in the middle. You maybe draft
Speaker 1: somebody on the other side, but you're building this thing up.
Speaker 1: Josh Sweat's the one guy look at and look, can
Speaker 1: you say that for just that any player? You know,
Speaker 1: you put him in a new situation you don't know,
Speaker 1: so it can't scary off entirely. Josh Sweat's the one
Speaker 1: guy I look at and say, yeah, he I think
Speaker 1: he's not gonna put up those massive numbers, but he
Speaker 1: translates he can be a primary pass rusher, which they need.
Speaker 1: He's arguably the best player at his position in free
Speaker 1: agency this year. PFF has him as the second ranked
Speaker 1: edge rusher behind Khalil Mack, who just doesn't make sense
Speaker 1: for the Patriots at this point.
Speaker 2: Game wonder.
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, so Josh Sweat is the one guy I
Speaker 1: would hammer in on. But to your point off the top, like,
Speaker 1: I know, we've had people calling or I've had people
Speaker 1: tweet at me and like, oh are we bringing back
Speaker 1: Sodo Sign one Draft one attackle right, all that it's
Speaker 1: not Sodo. It's Triple T this year. Trenches, trenches, trenches.
Speaker 1: That is that is the theme for the off season.
Speaker 1: Triple T trenches, trenches, trenches. We had. We went from
Speaker 1: Sodo last year was QBA three. Yeah, and now it's
Speaker 1: Triple T trenches, trenches, trenches.
Speaker 2: I would like to think that we were headed towards
Speaker 2: Triple T. Anyways, given the fact that they were dead
Speaker 2: last and now that it's nice Sason dead last and
Speaker 2: pass block win rate dead last and run block win rate.
Speaker 2: They've been dead last and pass block win rate two
Speaker 2: years in a row.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So and it's been like historically bad. It's not
Speaker 1: just like their last the last year. Weren't they the
Speaker 1: worst even like the last decade.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was bad, and I really would like to
Speaker 2: think that it wasn't just the Super Bowl that swayed
Speaker 2: them towards Oh now we have to address the offensive line,
Speaker 2: like I would hope that we were already here well
Speaker 2: before that point.
Speaker 1: That was the philosophy in Tennessee. And they didn't ultimately
Speaker 1: get there. But you look at the way they kind
Speaker 1: of built it up in Tennessee. It was when I
Speaker 1: say trenches, we I include linebackers in that, like front
Speaker 1: seven players, Right, That's kind of how they started building
Speaker 1: it in Tennessee.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'm all for it, like I've been all
Speaker 2: for it. The one thing that I would point at
Speaker 2: though with this, with the way that they approach it,
Speaker 2: is I do think accently relocate or allocation and value
Speaker 2: and all that stuff does matter. And I think a
Speaker 2: lot of people hear the word value and think of
Speaker 2: Bill trading down and you know, Bill, you doing things that, oh,
Speaker 2: we're gonna sign this player who's seventy five percent as
Speaker 2: good as that player, but he's half the price. Like
Speaker 2: that's not necessarily what I'm saying. All saying is is
Speaker 2: you know what is the best approach in terms of
Speaker 2: allocating resources based off of the board, like, for example,
Speaker 2: in the draft. And we're gonna get into like the
Speaker 2: tiers that I posted on Patriots dot Com this morning
Speaker 2: and get into your mock draft too a little bit
Speaker 2: as well. When you look at this draft, it's absolutely
Speaker 2: loaded on the defensive line. They have defensive lineman through
Speaker 2: the third and fourth round that have starter grades for
Speaker 2: some people. Daniel Jeremiah CD he has twenty four starter
Speaker 2: grades on defensive linemen in this try defensive tackles and
Speaker 2: that's a huge number. So you have not a guy
Speaker 2: that gives those easily either. Yeah, you have to look
Speaker 2: at the the way you know the drop offs, right,
Speaker 2: like where are the tiers, where are the clusters of players?
Speaker 2: And it's an either or scenario. Would you rather a
Speaker 2: Will Campbell at four? And then let's say, you know,
Speaker 2: a tackle at thirty eight, you know, defensive tackle at
Speaker 2: thirty eight, a pass rusher at thirty eight? Josh Sawyer
Speaker 2: or or Jack Sawyer. I think it's like Josh Simmons
Speaker 2: and Jack Sawyer, And for some reason, I like, I
Speaker 2: like mix that up Jack, you know, Jack Sawyer, let's
Speaker 2: just throw a name out there. Or would you rather
Speaker 2: Mason Graham and Arianti Ursery?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 2: You know, these are the conversations that are actually happening
Speaker 2: inside a lot of buildings, maybe inside this building. So
Speaker 2: there's that element of it. And then, like I mentioned,
Speaker 2: I think Josh Sweat would be a nice pickup for
Speaker 2: the Patriots, but I'm not paying Josh Sweat twenty million
Speaker 2: dollars a year because I don't think he's a twenty
Speaker 2: million dollar a year player. I think he's a good player.
Speaker 2: I think he's better than what you have in that role.
Speaker 2: But I would also say that if you're gonna do that,
Speaker 2: like that has to come as a compliment to an
Speaker 2: interior guy that's also going to rush the passer, because
Speaker 2: what was happening with Josh Sweat is he's getting the
Speaker 2: quarterback is funneled to him right, Like he's right. You know,
Speaker 2: Jalen Carter and Milton Williams and Nolan Smith and all
Speaker 2: these other guys are pushing quarterbacks in his direction. Like
Speaker 2: you have to find ways to do that too if
Speaker 2: you're the Patriots. He can clean it up, like I think,
Speaker 2: you can get the quarterback on the ground, and he
Speaker 2: can sack the quarterback and do all those types of things.
Speaker 2: But he, to me, is not the centerpiece of your
Speaker 2: pass rush. He's a complimentary.
Speaker 1: Well, the other thing you have to remember is like
Speaker 1: for everything they need to do they're not gonna do
Speaker 1: everything they need to do this offseason. They can't. It's
Speaker 1: too much. So do you pay Josh Sweat this year
Speaker 1: knowing okay, like, we're gonna have an opportunity to get
Speaker 1: that other guy next year, but this is our chance
Speaker 1: to get this guy. We're gonna get them, Like, I
Speaker 1: would just keep that in mind, that expecting them to
Speaker 1: fill every single hole this offseason. I wrote about this
Speaker 1: in my mock draft, Like I was pretty liberal with
Speaker 1: some of the additions I made in free like hypothetical
Speaker 1: editions I made in free agency. And even still I
Speaker 1: couldn't get everything done that I wanted to get done,
Speaker 1: because it's just they have so many needs and they
Speaker 1: have a lot of resources. They have a lot more
Speaker 1: than maybe any other team in the league. Yeah, but
Speaker 1: it is a finite amount. Yeah, and they needs so
Speaker 1: much that it's there. There might be a two year
Speaker 1: plan and we're gonna have we might have to see that.
Speaker 1: You know, if they add a guy like Josh Sweat
Speaker 1: and then they don't, and then you know it's bar
Speaker 1: More and then who's on the other side, Well, that
Speaker 1: guy might be coming next year. That might be Dylan Stewart,
Speaker 1: would be two years, but like that guy might be
Speaker 1: down the road. But this is just how these are
Speaker 1: the guys we can get right now. They fit into
Speaker 1: our plan. We're gonna add them, and then we'll get
Speaker 1: the rest of the pieces as we go. I think
Speaker 1: with Sweat in particular, it's interesting because not only is
Speaker 1: it a clear need, even if he's not the primary guy,
Speaker 1: he fits the tight They had a lot of success
Speaker 1: with Harold Landry and Tennessee, who's kind of an undersized guy,
Speaker 1: and that's the big Sweat. That's the big knock on
Speaker 1: Josh Sweat right now. He's maybe a little smaller than
Speaker 1: you want that that edge rusher to be. But they
Speaker 1: made that work with Landry into a lesser extent some
Speaker 1: other guys. So if he fits the mold of what
Speaker 1: they're looking for, even if they can't get the player
Speaker 1: to compliment him right now, they may look get it
Speaker 1: and say let's just get him in so we have
Speaker 1: him because we have a chance to add the kind
Speaker 1: of player we want to add. And then if we
Speaker 1: don't get to address the other part until next year, well,
Speaker 1: now we have this taken care of, so we can
Speaker 1: put more attention on that.
Speaker 2: I definitely. I like Joshua as a player. I'll radiate
Speaker 2: rediorate what I said. I just he to me cleans
Speaker 2: up the trash, like he's the guy that is going
Speaker 2: to get the quarterback on the ground. He's an athletic guy,
Speaker 2: he can rush off the edge. Obviously he's gonna have
Speaker 2: that ability to finish plays. But I don't think that
Speaker 2: he's the one that is really starting to play right or.
Speaker 1: I think you may be understelling him a little bit.
Speaker 1: I don't think he's like a you know, sixteen sack
Speaker 1: a year guy.
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't think. I think he's had one
Speaker 2: double digit sack season his entire career.
Speaker 1: But how much of that, too is It's so funny
Speaker 1: because you always talk about Georgia like this, and I'm
Speaker 1: gonna apply it to the Eagles, which is all Georgia
Speaker 1: guys up front. How much of that is There's only
Speaker 1: so many sacks to go around for all of those players.
Speaker 2: It could be a piece of it. I I just
Speaker 2: I don't know. Maybe maybe I'm underselling him. I just
Speaker 2: I would be weary. I don't think I think a
Speaker 2: lot of those guys, like look at look at the
Speaker 2: Patriots history of teams poaching that type of guy from
Speaker 2: a Super Bowl roster thinking that they're gonna get that
Speaker 2: type of player, that type of production, and it often
Speaker 2: didn't go that way.
Speaker 1: Well, let me flip it and it you know, different
Speaker 1: kind of style of play. But Matthew Judon came from
Speaker 1: a very successful Ravens front, ye came here and was
Speaker 1: elevated because now he was the guy.
Speaker 2: I guess I just like the way I think. No, okay, no, right,
Speaker 2: But like Judoon was already making Pro Bowls with the Ravens,
Speaker 2: that's true. I just I think judonim is a better player.
Speaker 2: But I look at Josh Wett and I think he's
Speaker 2: a little bit better than than Kyle van Noy was.
Speaker 2: But and kylevin Noy's had a great, uh kind of
Speaker 2: resurgence here with the Ravens, by the way, So I'm
Speaker 2: not trying to like throw shaite at Kyle van Noy.
Speaker 2: But Kyle van Ney has this big breakout with the Patriots,
Speaker 2: signs this huge contract with Miami in free agency, and
Speaker 2: he wasn't the guy, Like, he wasn't the same guy.
Speaker 2: And I just worry about what this Eagles front. I
Speaker 2: don't worry as much about it with Josh Sweat as
Speaker 2: I do with Milton Williams. I think Milton Williams is
Speaker 2: a really fun player. But Milton Williams, you have Jalen Carter,
Speaker 2: you have Jordan Davis, you have a lot of guys
Speaker 2: on the inside. He's basically a three technique in the
Speaker 2: B gap, one on one with the guard all day long.
Speaker 2: Like that was he got that advantage. Now, if you're
Speaker 2: gonna tell me that Christian Barmore is going to draw
Speaker 2: these double teams like you know, like Jalen Carter did,
Speaker 2: then sure, I mean, I guess you could make that
Speaker 2: argument that Milton Williams is still gonna see those types
Speaker 2: of matchups. But that, to me was a lot of
Speaker 2: what led to Milton Williams' breakout.
Speaker 1: Was it?
Speaker 2: He he was kind of like the fourth guy you
Speaker 2: know that teams are worried.
Speaker 1: I'm with you on that, Milton Williams. And I'm not
Speaker 1: saying there isn't a place for Milton Williams in New England.
Speaker 1: There is, yeah, but for what he's gonna command, for
Speaker 1: the role he's probably gonna play here like Josh Sweat's
Speaker 1: the guy if you're gonna look at the Eagles for agents,
Speaker 1: and who's most likely to come close to replicating the
Speaker 1: impact on this defense that they had on the Eagles defense.
Speaker 1: Josh Sweat. That doesn't mean Milton Williams wouldn't be a
Speaker 1: good player here, But I don't think you're gonna be
Speaker 1: able to get that guy.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Not anti them signing Milton Williams because they need guys
Speaker 1: up the middle. Yeah, but he's not gonna be the
Speaker 1: player he was in phil He's gonna have a different
Speaker 1: role here.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I would agree with that, and we'll see what happens.
Speaker 2: I just I wouldn't I wouldn't be overly upset if
Speaker 2: they signed any of these guys. I again, it's just
Speaker 2: the price tag thing for me. I just would be
Speaker 2: weary of thinking, Okay, we're just gonna plug Josh Sweat
Speaker 2: or Milton Williams or Zach Bond into our defense and
Speaker 2: he's gonna play exactly like he did down the stretch
Speaker 2: for Philadelphia. Like, I just don't know if that's going
Speaker 2: to be the case. I mean, it's not quite like
Speaker 2: this is the extreme extreme example, but like Cony ely right,
Speaker 2: like as like the game of his life in the
Speaker 2: Super Bowl for the Panthers and was never really heard
Speaker 2: of from again. Do I think Milton Williams is gonna
Speaker 2: be better than that post Super Bowl? Yeah? Probably, But
Speaker 2: you know, those are the types of examples. I think
Speaker 2: van Ney is probably a better example than that one.
Speaker 2: You know, Malcolm Butler right like, has a great run
Speaker 2: with the Patriots, signs this big contract with Tennessee. Isn't
Speaker 2: the same player, right? You know that happened all all
Speaker 2: the time with the Patriots and the dynasty years. There
Speaker 2: is another eagle though, in the trenches that I would
Speaker 2: be interested in. I was interested in him last year,
Speaker 2: and I wish that the Patriots had been more aggressive.
Speaker 2: I'm kind of in on mckaye Becton, like I would
Speaker 2: be intrigued by McKay Beckton, probably to continue to play
Speaker 2: him at guard, like, not at tackle. He played right
Speaker 2: guard for Philly. I would play him on the left
Speaker 2: side here. He played left tackle, you know, throughout his career,
Speaker 2: so he's been on the left side before. But I
Speaker 2: think that that's a player that had a really good year,
Speaker 2: is hitting free agency. He'll probably get paid, but I
Speaker 2: don't think he's gonna get like Tray Smith level money. Paid,
Speaker 2: and that's a professional NFL caliber starting guard. And now
Speaker 2: that's really where I'm at with the offensive line. I
Speaker 2: bring up Tray Smith because he's also a free agent
Speaker 2: with the Chiefs. We'll see if they let him get
Speaker 2: to free agency. But I look at the Commander's model
Speaker 2: a little bit more with this and say, just get
Speaker 2: representable offensive lineman and free agency. I'm not expecting you
Speaker 2: to go out there and sign you know, Joe Thomas,
Speaker 2: Quentin Nelson, Zach Martin, right, just go out there and
Speaker 2: get guys that can play in the league at the position,
Speaker 2: and that just gives you a lot of flexibility about
Speaker 2: what you do with everybody else. Like now, maybe Cole
Speaker 2: Strange trains full time at center right and he's the
Speaker 2: David Andrews replacement, or you know, Leyden Robinson. You're not
Speaker 2: putting all your eggs in Laden Robinson's basket of having
Speaker 2: a you know, year two leap and being a starting
Speaker 2: caliber guard in year two, because I don't think he
Speaker 2: was a starting caliber guard as a rookie. I think
Speaker 2: he was a rookie guard as a rookie. So if
Speaker 2: you get one of those types of players, a Makai
Speaker 2: Becton type of player. It really just helps you in
Speaker 2: a lot of ways. I think on the interior of
Speaker 2: the offensive line. Just have respectable NFL caliber starters on
Speaker 2: the line, and then maybe you can add some of
Speaker 2: that that ceiling in the draft, you know it. Maybe
Speaker 2: then it becomes a day too, you know, Josh Connerley
Speaker 2: or three, you know, those types of guys that you
Speaker 2: can kind of add to that ceiling of the group.
Speaker 2: But I'm kind of Becton. I thought he had a
Speaker 2: good year for them.
Speaker 1: The Becdan thing interests me. Copycat league, right, Yeah, how
Speaker 1: many teams are going to go out and try to
Speaker 1: find these like oversized tackles that failed, yeah, and kicked
Speaker 1: them inside the guard. Yeah, and that doesn't mean like
Speaker 1: they can all do it, But I'm trying to think
Speaker 1: of because these are the tackles that I always liked
Speaker 1: that I was gravitating, right, Yeah, Darien Canard, who's already
Speaker 1: kind of done this, you know, if he doesn't catch
Speaker 1: on full time as a starter in Cleveland, Dwan Jones
Speaker 1: would be somebody I could see doing this. Maybe some
Speaker 1: guys in this draft I thought was very telling that
Speaker 1: Anthony Belton took some guard reps at the Senior Bowl.
Speaker 1: Given the way McKai Beckton broke out, it's gonna be
Speaker 1: really interesting to see these teams try to find the
Speaker 1: next Mackai Becton. But yeah, if you're the Patriots, you
Speaker 1: want to do that, go to the original call him.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I was in on Beckton on exactly the contract
Speaker 2: that he ended up signing in Philadelphia last season, last offseason,
Speaker 2: just that flyer, right, Like, I thought that out of
Speaker 2: all the options that they had in free agency. Now,
Speaker 2: I was thinking of him more a tackle obviously than
Speaker 2: that card, but out of all the options that were
Speaker 2: in the free agent market last year, at least there
Speaker 2: was an upside there that, you know, a former first
Speaker 2: round pick, still relatively young, really had his career derailed
Speaker 2: with the Jets because of injuries more than any It
Speaker 2: wasn't you know. When he was healthy, he was a
Speaker 2: solid player in jazz in New York, right, and then
Speaker 2: he goes to Philadelphia, goes gets with Stoutland and moves
Speaker 2: inside and things look up for him. So I'm in
Speaker 2: on Becton. I would be in on Sweat if I
Speaker 2: was the Patriots. It's it's a little bit like a
Speaker 2: t Higgins situation where you kind of have no choice
Speaker 2: right to be in on Josh Sweat, but I'd be
Speaker 2: wary of the money on those defenders in Philadelphia. All right,
Speaker 2: So that that's the Super Bowl, I want to talk
Speaker 2: a little bit draft. Now, we'll take your calls. Got
Speaker 2: a lot of emails coming in as well. Eight five
Speaker 2: five PATS five hundred is the phone number, and podcasts
Speaker 2: at Patriots dot com is the email address. I always
Speaker 2: want to say the old email address. I always forget.
Speaker 2: It's the TPX hotline by the way, Okay, don't don't
Speaker 2: say the old ones TPX hot line. But I want
Speaker 2: to get into the tears that I posted today on
Speaker 2: Patriots dot com, and I want to get into your
Speaker 2: mock draft a little bit too as well. And these
Speaker 2: are sort of our both of our kind of first like, yeah,
Speaker 2: stabs at this.
Speaker 1: Class, we gotta do recently buyas today too, because I
Speaker 1: want you to talk about yours and then ones that
Speaker 1: will annoy you.
Speaker 2: Okay, So let's start with the tears though, And the
Speaker 2: way I tried to break this up was basically the
Speaker 2: guys that I would consider drafting, sticking and picking at
Speaker 2: four overall and just taking this guy if he's there,
Speaker 2: and then guys I would then consider if they were
Speaker 2: to make incremental trade downs. I'm not anticipating them the
Speaker 2: trade down from four to twenty, right, we're.
Speaker 1: Talking about last week. You were all into that, but.
Speaker 2: I'm talking about four to eight, four to nine, four
Speaker 2: to twelve, you know, something like that, a more realistic
Speaker 2: trade down. So I had two top tiers. Tier one
Speaker 2: was I don't know if they still do this in
Speaker 2: the NFL draft. They don't think so, but I'm gonna
Speaker 2: go with the old cliche. These are the two players
Speaker 2: that I am running the card up to the podium, right,
Speaker 2: I am no questions asked, We're running the cart up
Speaker 2: to the podium. If these two guys, even if they
Speaker 2: don't do it anymore physically, you still do it. You
Speaker 2: still write down the name and spread to the stage
Speaker 2: to make a point about how happy you are to happen.
Speaker 2: So my number one player in the draft is Abdual Carter.
Speaker 2: And and just for the record, I want you to
Speaker 2: vouch I've been here for a little while. You you
Speaker 2: were I have.
Speaker 1: You've been like a month ahead of everybody else, Like
Speaker 1: when Carter was a mid first round sick. You were like,
Speaker 1: you might be top ten, and then when he was
Speaker 1: top ten, you were like, you might be top five.
Speaker 2: It might be top one.
Speaker 1: Well, and then when everybody put him top five, you
Speaker 1: were like, you might be the best player in the draft.
Speaker 1: You have been like a step because you started watching
Speaker 1: college football. Crazy what happened?
Speaker 2: I enjoyed it. It pulled me in it.
Speaker 1: Did you know there's a whole.
Speaker 2: Like four months because that's like that's like semi pro football,
Speaker 2: Like that was like the top of the time.
Speaker 1: You don't you don't, I don't.
Speaker 2: I don't need to watch like Apple Atch and State.
Speaker 1: I want to watch, Okay, but there's like two to
Speaker 1: three big games every week that are like playoff caliber games.
Speaker 2: So here's my argument for Carter over Travis Hunter, which
Speaker 2: wasn't easy. Like Travis Hunter, I think is an exceptional prospect,
Speaker 2: so it wasn't easy. But my biggest argument, which is
Speaker 2: sort of on your side of the street, for Carter
Speaker 2: over Hunter, is it's just so easy to project the role,
Speaker 2: Like it's so easy to see the skill translate perfectly
Speaker 2: into a you know, a weak side pass rusher in
Speaker 2: the NFL, just a demon off the edge like that's
Speaker 2: such an easy vision for this is how we're going
Speaker 2: to use the player, Whereas with Hunter, as we know,
Speaker 2: it's more complicated. It's a more complicated projection of exactly
Speaker 2: how you're exactly going to move the player or use
Speaker 2: the player at the next level. Abdul Carter is just electric.
Speaker 2: He's in his electric through and through first step, explosiveness, bend,
Speaker 2: turn the corner, ability, cross the face, inside the gap,
Speaker 2: you know, whether it's a spin or it's just an
Speaker 2: inside counter crossover. He can line up in line, rush
Speaker 2: over the guards and centers, just like the guy I'm
Speaker 2: about to compare him to. He can play a little
Speaker 2: bit off the ball if you really want to do
Speaker 2: that in certain matchups by quarterbacks, sideline to sideline, range, relentless,
Speaker 2: modor hustle. Just an excellent player. I hate comparing, you know,
Speaker 2: I hate comparing players to like future Hall of famers
Speaker 2: or current Hall of famers, So I always try to
Speaker 2: put that caveat in there, But it is really the
Speaker 2: skill set and the type of player that he is
Speaker 2: is Micah Parsons.
Speaker 1: So how much of the twenty twenty three stuff did
Speaker 1: you watch from him?
Speaker 2: I did watch a little because I wanted to see
Speaker 2: more of his off ball line back.
Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. Like the Micah Parsons comp to me,
Speaker 1: comes with being more than a pass rusher. Yeah, he's
Speaker 1: a guy that is going to be not just capable
Speaker 1: in coverage, but a plus in coverage. Yeah, is gonna
Speaker 1: be a guy that can line up in different spots.
Speaker 1: I think he is a Micah Parsons level pass rusher.
Speaker 1: I don't think the other stuff. He's not bad at it.
Speaker 1: He can do it at the NFL. I don't think
Speaker 1: he translates like Parsons does in that regard. I'm with you.
Speaker 1: I have him top of my board for the Patriots.
Speaker 1: That if the Patriots the first overall pick penning a trade,
Speaker 1: that is who I would take, ye Abdul Carter. I
Speaker 1: don't think, like out of who's the best speed rusher
Speaker 1: in the NFL that's not Parsons. Yeah, I mean that
Speaker 1: was the other Like, I just I don't know how
Speaker 1: well that other stuff it'll transfer, but not to that
Speaker 1: lovel that.
Speaker 2: That was the other thing that you know reasonable. So
Speaker 2: I called him Micah Parsons light because I hate I
Speaker 2: don't want to put that on him. That he's gonna
Speaker 2: be Micah Parsons, so I called him Micaeh Parsons Light,
Speaker 2: And I think that what really obviously the ability to
Speaker 2: go you know, the two way go constantly right. He
Speaker 2: can beat you inside or he can beat you outside
Speaker 2: around the corner. But really what stood out to me
Speaker 2: that made him so much like Parsons is how he
Speaker 2: can line up over the interior and rush as like
Speaker 2: an inline rusher. That's something that I believe, you know,
Speaker 2: separates Parsons from a lot of guys, is that Parsons
Speaker 2: can basically rush on all five offensive linemen and with
Speaker 2: right which is a very very rare trait. He is
Speaker 2: not just, you know, just an example. We're just talking
Speaker 2: about him. Like Judon was very open about the fact
Speaker 2: that he didn't really feel comfortable doing that, Like you know,
Speaker 2: he wasn't really He tried to add that to his bag.
Speaker 2: I think Dante high Tower tried to help him at
Speaker 2: it to his bag. And he wasn't officially on the
Speaker 2: staff at the time, but he studied high Tower and
Speaker 2: he tried to add that to his back. Abdull Carter
Speaker 2: is already doing those types of things. I think his
Speaker 2: experience playing off the ball helps him see it through
Speaker 2: that interior lens right, so that he can play on
Speaker 2: the inside or he can play on the outside. And
Speaker 2: just the last thing on him, he's just scratching the
Speaker 2: surface because he only played one full season as a
Speaker 2: full time edge rusher, so his instincts in his feel
Speaker 2: for the position is only just sort of getting going right.
Speaker 2: So once he really finds that groove of a pass
Speaker 2: rush plan and counters and block anticipation and recognition and
Speaker 2: instincts like, he's going to be through the roof. So
Speaker 2: the fact that he's already this good at it, this
Speaker 2: early in his development at that position tells you how
Speaker 2: high that ceiling is and how good he could potentially be.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm always big on the position change players,
Speaker 1: and that's why because if you change positions and you
Speaker 1: do it at a high level quickly, it shows that
Speaker 1: you have an ability to prove your game. You take
Speaker 1: coaching well, you learn all of that. So that is
Speaker 1: I would say Parsons' biggest enough part. Look at that,
Speaker 1: I would say Carter's biggest question is also arguably his
Speaker 1: biggest strength. With any play of the recently changed positions,
Speaker 1: you're gonna just have questions about the technical side and
Speaker 1: the development, but which are there for him. But the
Speaker 1: fact that he developed as quickly as he did in
Speaker 1: one year is also a plus in that it shows
Speaker 1: that he's a quick learner.
Speaker 2: So Abdul Carter number one, number two in this tier,
Speaker 2: we're still in the run the card up to the
Speaker 2: podium tier Travis Hunter. So what I think is so
Speaker 2: fun about Travis Hunter is that there's nobody that you
Speaker 2: talk to that has any question about his talent and
Speaker 2: or his ability as a prospect. But everybody kind of
Speaker 2: has a different take on how they'd use him. So
Speaker 2: I'm with you on this. There has to be organizational
Speaker 2: symmetry of this is how we're going to use him
Speaker 2: before you turn the card in, Like, he has to
Speaker 2: be on board with it. You have to be on
Speaker 2: word with it from the top down in the organization, GM, coach, whatever.
Speaker 2: You can't get into it and just say we're just
Speaker 2: gonna grab the talent and figure it out later. I
Speaker 2: think there has to be a plan in mind. That
Speaker 2: being said, I will continue to stress and continue to
Speaker 2: pound the table. I think he's a better wide receiver.
Speaker 2: I think he's a more valuable wide receiver, maybe not
Speaker 2: a better wise he is a more valuable wide receiver.
Speaker 1: That it's the it's the would you rather have an
Speaker 1: A plus corner or an A minus receiver?
Speaker 2: And I'm taking the receiver. And I just think, you know,
Speaker 2: Dante Scarneki did the interview. I think it was with
Speaker 2: Chris Price with the Globe, right, and that quote is
Speaker 2: kind of making the rounds of either draft guys that
Speaker 2: sack the quarterback or score touchdowns. Well, if you put
Speaker 2: him at corner, like unless he's picked six ing, he
Speaker 2: ain't scoring very many touchdowns.
Speaker 1: Right, so you want you want to put him on
Speaker 1: the edge.
Speaker 2: I exactly, I want to rush in the passer. He'd
Speaker 2: probably bad at it when you watch when you watch
Speaker 2: his game at wide receiver, and I kind of am
Speaker 2: proud of myself for this comm I see a lot
Speaker 2: of DeVante Smith in his game, Okay, because he's he's
Speaker 2: got length, but he's he's slender, right, he doesn't have
Speaker 2: the build, but he's he's got length and he's got size,
Speaker 2: and he's really a great contested catch player for his size.
Speaker 2: Especially he's a sixty five percent contested catch rate guy.
Speaker 2: Last year at Colorado, Ted McMillan at six foot five,
Speaker 2: two hundred and ten pounds was a sixty percent catch
Speaker 2: rate guy. So but he beat Hunter a couple of times.
Speaker 2: So yeah, like with like one handed grabs. But so yeah,
Speaker 2: Like my point being, he's a much better contested catch
Speaker 2: player than you would think. Uh. And I would also
Speaker 2: say that his ability and his explosiveness with the ball
Speaker 2: in his hands is electric like that that's a he's
Speaker 2: a game breaking player. And if I'm an NFL team,
Speaker 2: that's just that's still the golden goose to me, especially
Speaker 2: for the Patriots, but just in general, Like you want
Speaker 2: guys that are going to change the game, and I
Speaker 2: think that he has that ability to really create big
Speaker 2: plays all over the field from the wide receiver position.
Speaker 2: And if you put him at corner the comparison that
Speaker 2: I drew at corner with Sauce Gardner, I think you'd
Speaker 2: be a really good corner. I think he's more of
Speaker 2: his own corner than he is a man to man
Speaker 2: corner because his instincts in his clicking clothes and read
Speaker 2: and react on the ball is just next level, Like
Speaker 2: his ability to see the ball get into passing lanes,
Speaker 2: jump routes like intercept the football. He's a ballhawk like that,
Speaker 2: that's his best trade as a cornerback. I think he
Speaker 2: can play Manton Man. I'm not saying he's incapable of
Speaker 2: playing Manton Man, but I do like that idea if
Speaker 2: you're gonna be in this more Tennessee type of scheme,
Speaker 2: like if you played Christian Gonzales on the boundary full time,
Speaker 2: whereby in a lot of formations and looks, you're probably
Speaker 2: gonna be man to man on the weak side, and
Speaker 2: then Travis Hunter can kind of just roam on the
Speaker 2: other side of the field. That's also very enticely like,
Speaker 2: that's a very enticing duo. But I definitely feel like
Speaker 2: if I was an NFL team, the value that he
Speaker 2: brings to the team at wide receiver is just significantly
Speaker 2: more at corner. And then you just hope that you
Speaker 2: can develop some of the real details of the position
Speaker 2: at wide receiver. Sure, all right, so here's my next tier. Yeah,
Speaker 2: this is I would take him at four, but I'm
Speaker 2: not doing cartwheels like I would do with the top two, right, Yeah,
Speaker 2: but I'd still take him at four without a trade down.
Speaker 2: So this is where I think I am different from
Speaker 2: some people, maybe not you, but other people. I have
Speaker 2: Will Campbell as the next player on this list at
Speaker 2: number three. Pro comparison Ryan Ramchick, who also had issues
Speaker 2: with length coming out thirty three inch arms.
Speaker 1: But he stayed at tackle.
Speaker 2: He stayed at tackle and was very very good for
Speaker 2: the Saints for a long time. You know. Now he's
Speaker 2: kind of getting up there in age and injuries and such,
Speaker 2: but a good player for the Rams for a very
Speaker 2: long time at left tackle or Saints. Excuse me, don't
Speaker 2: know why I said Rams. The biggest thing that I
Speaker 2: see with Campbell is that I think his footwork and
Speaker 2: his base and his balance and his PAS sets is
Speaker 2: good enough that he's going to be able to overcome
Speaker 2: the arm leg. Now, if it checks in at the
Speaker 2: combine and he's got thirty two inch arms and they're
Speaker 2: really below threshold, then we're gonna have to change the
Speaker 2: conversation a little bit. But as long as we're in
Speaker 2: the range of thirty three inches, when I watch him play,
Speaker 2: I see a stout, you know, crisp moving tackle and
Speaker 2: pass protection that has excellent feet, excellent ability to mirror
Speaker 2: guys on island. I just don't necessarily see the length
Speaker 2: being the major issue. Now. He does drift at times
Speaker 2: in his pas sets, and he'll overcompensate and kind of
Speaker 2: commit to the outside and open up that inside counter
Speaker 2: that's spin to the you know, the inside pathway to
Speaker 2: the quarterback. That's something that they're gonna have to work
Speaker 2: with him on technically, but it's.
Speaker 1: Also something where if you have a three hundred and
Speaker 1: sixty pound left guard and Mkay Beckton's standing there, he
Speaker 1: can take up a lot of room. Yeah, it's gonna
Speaker 1: help you out.
Speaker 2: I don't I don't look at anything on Will Campbell's
Speaker 2: tape and say, you know, that's a deal breaker at tackle,
Speaker 2: and given where the Patriots are on the offensive line,
Speaker 2: giving where again, or you know, looking at the entire landscape,
Speaker 2: giving what the options are for them to fill that
Speaker 2: need at left tackle, I think that Will Campbell is
Speaker 2: the best option on whether it's free agency or the draft. Like,
Speaker 2: I'm taking Will Campbell over Cam Robinson. I'm taking Will
Speaker 2: Campbell over Alaric Jackson. I'm taking Will Campbell over Calvin Banks.
Speaker 2: I'm taking all across.
Speaker 1: If if he gets searched, I don't think he's going
Speaker 1: to Ronnie Stanley.
Speaker 2: I probably take Ronnie Stanley in that scenario and then
Speaker 2: draft somebody on Day two with upside. But at the
Speaker 2: same time, I could be talking into either way with
Speaker 2: Ronnie Stanley's agent Price.
Speaker 1: I just I just wanted to ask you that question.
Speaker 2: But I think that looking at the realistic options for
Speaker 2: left tackle, the cleanest way is sometimes just straight the
Speaker 2: straight line right, and the easiest projection of you know,
Speaker 2: the best player to fill that need is Will Campbell,
Speaker 2: and I can't I can't get too far away from that,
Speaker 2: Like you have to respect.
Speaker 1: How many years are gonna kick it down the road.
Speaker 1: Like if you don't like Will Campbell, fine, what are
Speaker 1: you doing at tackle? Ronnie Stanley's not gonna be We
Speaker 1: don't think it's gonna be available. If you want to say,
Speaker 1: you take a Layeric Jackson over him, maybe there's no
Speaker 1: other better tackle. They can't kick this thing down the
Speaker 1: road another year, especially not now that they actually have
Speaker 1: a freaking quarterback. So yeah, I'm with you. So you
Speaker 1: wouldn't take Campbell at four last week?
Speaker 2: Though? What changed? Did I say that? Yeah?
Speaker 1: We had that whole argument about the trading down thing,
Speaker 1: and I don't know, you know, I'm not comfortable with
Speaker 1: him at four, but I'm comfortable with him at six
Speaker 1: or whatever.
Speaker 2: And sometimes, like I say these things and then you
Speaker 2: think about it some more and then you put it
Speaker 2: pen to paper and your mind changes. I like I,
Speaker 2: Like I said, I, the main thing that I can't
Speaker 2: get around is if it's not Will Campbell left tackle,
Speaker 2: then what is it right? And And that that, to
Speaker 2: me is the scarier it's scarier right to just go
Speaker 2: with and I know they can't, they're gonna get a
Speaker 2: better player than choose the cor four, but to go
Speaker 2: at the mystery box of like whatever you're gonna find
Speaker 2: in free agency or whatever you're gonna find on Day
Speaker 2: two of the draft. And it was one thing when
Speaker 2: you and I think Doug Moron's a good coach, maybe
Speaker 2: Doug Moroon can coach up a Day two pick at
Speaker 2: left tackle. But it was one thing when you had
Speaker 2: Dante Scarnekia turning every Sebastian Volmer and Marcus Cannon into
Speaker 2: starting caliber tackles, Like you don't have that luxury anymore.
Speaker 1: And it's also like the whole argument about oh, well,
Speaker 1: you're overdrafting him, like people need to get over that.
Speaker 1: They just you're not large league.
Speaker 2: Right, So you look at Daniel Jeremiah, look at Dan Brugler,
Speaker 2: like they all have him in the top ten. It's
Speaker 2: not like you're drafting a guy that's projected, Oh.
Speaker 1: Well, he should have gone six, and you're taking for
Speaker 1: he's the number one player in the draft, assuming the
Speaker 1: arms checkout. Yeah, number one player in the draft at
Speaker 1: a premium position, out a position you need. It's not
Speaker 1: an overdraft. Well, if you take a tackle top five,
Speaker 1: he should be your franchise guy. If he's the top
Speaker 1: ten left tackle in the league. Yeah, makes you know,
Speaker 1: maybe one or two All Pro teams, couple of Pro Bowls.
Speaker 1: But like for a decade, you have that position where
Speaker 1: you can trust that guy, set it and forget it.
Speaker 1: He's not Joe Thomas, he's not Pina Seol, but just
Speaker 1: a set it and forget it left tackle for ten years.
Speaker 1: That's not an overdraft to me, not in this class,
Speaker 1: not for where the team thinks they are. If Joe
Speaker 1: Walt was in this draft and they took him over Jolt,
Speaker 1: yeah that would be an overdraft. But Joe Walt's not
Speaker 1: in this class. Pine Soool's not in this class. If
Speaker 1: you get it ten years, set it and forget it
Speaker 1: left tackle, which we both think he can be.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if you.
Speaker 1: Get a ten year set it and forget it left tackle.
Speaker 1: Fourth overall, Yeah, it's it's maybe not n A plus, it's
Speaker 1: a solid B plus. And you know what sometimes you got.
Speaker 1: I would have absolutely been happy with the B plus.
Speaker 2: Sometimes you gotta hit that.
Speaker 1: I struggled with seven or eight.
Speaker 2: Right, like you gotta hit it down the fairway sometimes.
Speaker 1: Another good I would you know you hit how many
Speaker 1: shots in her own of the woods? You put one
Speaker 1: hundred and fifty yards dead? Miiddle, you're kind of gonna
Speaker 1: feel good about that.
Speaker 2: I don't know that. I don't know that from experience,
Speaker 2: but I'll take your word for it.
Speaker 1: Uh see, if you started golfing, you could actually make
Speaker 1: more of these analogies.
Speaker 2: Oh MANU. But that That's where I'm at with Will
Speaker 2: Campbell right now. Again, I don't think his arm length
Speaker 2: is his biggest issue. I think his biggest issue is
Speaker 2: hitting his landmarks and drifting in his PAS sets. And
Speaker 2: I think that that's coachable. I think that's correctable for
Speaker 2: him to stick and tackle. And and That's where I'm
Speaker 2: at with Bill Campbell. You know, other guys like Ramcheck
Speaker 2: is the one that I picked just because I thought
Speaker 2: their skill sets were similar. But like Matt Light, Taylor Decker,
Speaker 2: you know, there's plenty of guys that played at Obviously,
Speaker 2: Rashaun Slater is like the poster child for this right now.
Speaker 2: That's why I didn't want to use him, because it's
Speaker 2: kind of like low hanging fruit. But all those things,
Speaker 2: all those guys thirty three thirty three and a half
Speaker 2: inch arms, had length issues, had concerns about it coming
Speaker 2: out of in as prospects, and we're all perfectly fine
Speaker 2: in the league. Even Joe Thomas wasn't like the longest
Speaker 2: guy in the world, and he is obviously one of
Speaker 2: the best left tackles of all time. So there's plenty
Speaker 2: of evidence that this has worked out for other guys.
Speaker 1: I still go back. If you could take Rashawn Slater
Speaker 1: fourth overall in this draft, would you do it?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: And I mean I don't remember. I didn't study the
Speaker 1: line as closely that year, Like how would you compare
Speaker 1: Campbell to Slater? And I know I just did that
Speaker 1: whole rant about right, don't compare players between drafts, but
Speaker 1: as comparable players, how would you compare Campbell as a
Speaker 1: prospect to Slater.
Speaker 2: Campbell's nastier. Campbell has a little bit more of a
Speaker 2: mean finish to his game. Slater is more athletic. Okay,
Speaker 2: So I think theered different players, which is why I
Speaker 2: didn't want to necessarily use them as the cop But
Speaker 2: I Rashaan Slater, I think fell a little bit in
Speaker 2: the draft because the threshold was really thirty four inches, right.
Speaker 1: No, I remember doing this with Slavery that year. Everybody
Speaker 1: was yelling at us to use a guard.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so you know, he changed the game a little
Speaker 2: bit in that respect. Last thing on Campbell, when I
Speaker 2: was talking to Ryan Cowden at the Senior Bowl, the
Speaker 2: Patriots assistant GM. Essentially, the thing that I asked him was,
Speaker 2: you know, described to me a Rabel player. And he
Speaker 2: obviously wasn't going to get into the weeds of you know,
Speaker 2: all the details and all the nuances, but the quote
Speaker 2: that he gave me was that Mike Rabel, the number
Speaker 2: one thing that he looks for him player is effort
Speaker 2: and Finishill Campbell that that is something that he wants
Speaker 2: to instill in the program in Foxborough is effort and
Speaker 2: finish and uh will Campbell is all of that, right Like.
Speaker 2: He is a high effort, finishing, maueling offensive tackle who
Speaker 2: also has extremely high end football character, right like, really
Speaker 2: a projected decade long captain in the league. And as
Speaker 2: much as you want traits and as much as you
Speaker 2: want upside, and as much as you want all the
Speaker 2: fancy stuff in this draft as well, I do think
Speaker 2: they're trying to build a culture here, and they're trying
Speaker 2: to build a program here, and we talk about that
Speaker 2: a lot on this show. And Will Campbell is a
Speaker 2: program builder, like that is a culture building pick.
Speaker 1: If there are two players in this there are two
Speaker 1: players atop this draft, I think that are Drake May.
Speaker 1: I don't want to say you start a culture with
Speaker 1: because Drake May is a culture guy. To yeah, Drake
Speaker 1: May is a program guy. It's Will Campbell, and it's
Speaker 1: Travis Hunter.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: You go look at what Travis Hunter did at Colorado
Speaker 1: with some of his teammates and things like that, and
Speaker 1: the way Dion used him to sell that program. I
Speaker 1: think that translates to the NFL. And you look at
Speaker 1: the way Will Campbell's teammates talk about him and the
Speaker 1: responsibilities he took on starting as a true freshman at
Speaker 1: LSU and the SEC. Those are guys that know what
Speaker 1: it's about to not just be a part of a
Speaker 1: football team, but be the face of a football team.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying Abdol Carter can't do that. I'm not
Speaker 1: saying Mason Graham can't do that. I'm not saying Ted
Speaker 1: McMillan can't do that. But they haven't. And you know,
Speaker 1: like there's really good examples of Travis Hunter and Will
Speaker 1: Campbell being guy you know, captains, leaders, outwards facing, front facing,
Speaker 1: dealing with the media, things like that. There are not
Speaker 1: a lot of tackles in college Hunters different. He's been
Speaker 1: a superstar since he was like seventeen years old. Number
Speaker 1: one recruiting country, right, But the tackles don't talk to
Speaker 1: the media in college football. Campbell did. Will Campbell's a
Speaker 1: guy that you can build this thing around. Travis Hunter's
Speaker 1: a guy that you can build this thing around. That's
Speaker 1: not the be all end all. That doesn't mean you
Speaker 1: can't draft the other guys, but that certainly should hold
Speaker 1: some weight.
Speaker 2: So the last guy I have in this tier, which
Speaker 2: again is I take him at four without a trade down,
Speaker 2: and this is.
Speaker 1: You want to Will breaking news here first, little Patriots,
Speaker 1: just breaking news. We got Matt Patricia Yes has been
Speaker 1: hired as the defensive coordinator at Ohio State. Oh wow, so.
Speaker 2: Were's there's some Ohio State connections there. Certainly we have
Speaker 2: Bill and Ryan Day and Chip Kelly and Vrabel. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I can I give you now my number one wish
Speaker 1: list item for the twenty twenty five college football season.
Speaker 1: Sure Ohio State UNC playoff game.
Speaker 2: Oh my god?
Speaker 1: Need oh come on, you don't want to see that.
Speaker 1: I need it? No, need it, need it? Or you
Speaker 1: know what whatever bowl game it's supposed to be thrown
Speaker 1: away played at the Fenway Bowl. That is a new
Speaker 1: England game.
Speaker 2: Let's get back to the program now. Okay, you're good,
Speaker 2: you're good. You got your map.
Speaker 1: I just want to site. That was Pete Damilsinger finalizing
Speaker 1: a deal.
Speaker 2: Okay, so my last guy in this tier and then
Speaker 2: I'll get to the next tiers and we'll go a
Speaker 2: little bit faster. Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, I will go
Speaker 2: a little bit faster because we're taking a lot of
Speaker 2: time on this. This is no trade down. There's no
Speaker 2: other option. You have to make a pick, and for
Speaker 2: some reason, the first three guys I said, are no
Speaker 2: longer on the board. I don't know if that scenario
Speaker 2: whatever happened. I mean to make a trade now, but
Speaker 2: you can't trade down I would. I think Mason Graham's
Speaker 2: talent wise is worth the fourth overall pick. I just
Speaker 2: I am still in the school thought of positional value
Speaker 2: with Mason Graham. It's why I don't have him above
Speaker 2: Will Campbell. He is a very very good pocket disruptor.
Speaker 2: He is a pressured guy, a high motor guy, a
Speaker 2: hard charging defensive lineman. He's very violent with his hands.
Speaker 2: He's got a couple of really good moves, you know,
Speaker 2: swim move, arm over, two hands, wipe, gets into the creases,
Speaker 2: gets into the gaps, quickly, explodes off the ball like
Speaker 2: he is a high energy impact pass rusher. He's not
Speaker 2: a finisher though he's a disruptor. He's not a finisher.
Speaker 2: He's a disruptor. And I do have maybe more concerns
Speaker 2: than other people do that I've seen with his run
Speaker 2: defense and his film against the run gets a little
Speaker 2: high with his pads. He doesn't get great arm extension,
Speaker 2: doesn't have great length to get great arm extension, and
Speaker 2: doesn't absorb double teams. Consistently all the time. So my
Speaker 2: fear with him, with Mason Graham is, you know, he
Speaker 2: gets into the league and because of his body type
Speaker 2: and because of some of the deficiencies that he has,
Speaker 2: that he's going to be a little bit easy to
Speaker 2: move in the run game, which would be my one
Speaker 2: concern with him being this three down force, right, this
Speaker 2: three down player. Now projecting him as a three down player,
Speaker 2: I think that the comp I see a lot of
Speaker 2: is Christian Wilkins, right, like that sort of guy that
Speaker 2: is a little bit stouter, you know, a little bit
Speaker 2: shorter in terms of his arm length and his size,
Speaker 2: but it's just really quick into gaps and really good
Speaker 2: at defeating blocks with his hands and things like that.
Speaker 2: So I like Mason Graham. I don't love Mason Graham
Speaker 2: as much as everybody else. I do like him, and
Speaker 2: I would take him if I had to write, if
Speaker 2: there was no other option there, I would take him.
Speaker 2: But I definitely worry about positional value, three down value
Speaker 2: run defense, and more importantly we talked about it earlier.
Speaker 2: Is it a huge drop off from Mason Graham to
Speaker 2: what you could get at the top of the second
Speaker 2: round at the same position. You know, is it a
Speaker 2: huge drop off in this draft and do you need
Speaker 2: that player, Like, do you need that player to be
Speaker 2: a centerpiece player on the interior defensive line or do
Speaker 2: you have that guy already in like a Christian Barmore
Speaker 2: for example. And you're really just looking for the Milton
Speaker 2: Williams like, you're just looking for the complimentary piece next
Speaker 2: to Barmore. If you told me that Barmore is never
Speaker 2: going to play football again because of the blood clot situation,
Speaker 2: and Okay, maybe I change my tune a little bit
Speaker 2: on Mason Graham, but I still don't. I still think
Speaker 2: it's a luxury pick for a team that's not in
Speaker 2: luxury mode.
Speaker 1: I'm with you on that, and the Barmore thing certainly
Speaker 1: impacts it. But to me, I don't think he'd be
Speaker 1: a bad pick. I don't think he would be a
Speaker 1: bad pick. Yeah, but I don't think he's the best
Speaker 1: pick they could make.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a good way put it.
Speaker 1: So you know, he's a good player, he'll be a fit.
Speaker 1: You talk about needing somebody to kind of set things
Speaker 1: up for a guy like Josh Sweat, Maybe he becomes
Speaker 1: that guy. But he's not a bad pick, But I
Speaker 1: don't think. I think getting a state and forget it
Speaker 1: left tackle. I think getting a playmaker off the edge,
Speaker 1: like a true playmaker off the edge. I think those
Speaker 1: are going to impact the football team more than a
Speaker 1: guy like Mason Graham will.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a great way.
Speaker 1: Or trading back like I. So this is where I
Speaker 1: differ from you. Again, I don't think Graham would be
Speaker 1: a bad pick. Pick it for I'm seriously taking calls
Speaker 1: at that point.
Speaker 2: This is like the calls are crap.
Speaker 1: And also, are you the same for Campbell because you
Speaker 1: had them in the same tier? Are they really two
Speaker 1: different tiers?
Speaker 2: No, I'd say I'm probably in the same boat. Like
Speaker 2: I'd still take calls if it's Campbell, you know, but
Speaker 2: I think that i'd be a little bit more. I'd
Speaker 2: be a little bit more gung ho about taking Campbell,
Speaker 2: Like I'd probably pound the table a little bit.
Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. It's different for me. Like Campbell,
Speaker 1: I would take it for and feel good about it.
Speaker 1: I'd still take calls obviously, but I you know, I
Speaker 1: kind of have to be wooed a little bit ors
Speaker 1: with Mason Graham if it's like all right, I'm gonna
Speaker 1: have Mason Graham or I can have you know, I
Speaker 1: don't want to spoiler alert, but if it's Mason Graham
Speaker 1: or Tyler Warren and an extra second round pick, yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, an extra top fifty pick, I think I'd
Speaker 1: rather have Warren in the extra top fifty pick than
Speaker 1: just Mason Graham. Will Campbell. I might need a little
Speaker 1: bit more. I might need like a future first and
Speaker 1: which I think you could get and I wouldn't lose
Speaker 1: sleep over doing that, but I need a little more
Speaker 1: to trade out of Will Campbell.
Speaker 2: Last thing on Mason Graham. If you put Mason Graham
Speaker 2: on the defensive line, and you put him next to
Speaker 2: key On White, and you put him next to bar More,
Speaker 2: and then you sign a guy like Josh Swede who
Speaker 2: could come in and actually get the quarterback on the.
Speaker 1: Ground, A defensive lines now fixed.
Speaker 2: You have a great defensive line. But I don't think
Speaker 2: Mason Graham is the finishing piece, right like, I don't
Speaker 2: think he's the centerpiece of what you're doing. I think
Speaker 2: he's a really good disruptor. I think he's a really
Speaker 2: good pocket pusher. But you are going to have to
Speaker 2: have somebody on the edge that's going to come in
Speaker 2: and get double digit sacks and put the quarterback down.
Speaker 2: I don't think that's gonna be Mason Graham. So to me,
Speaker 2: you know, to go back to the scar thing like
Speaker 2: the guys that sack the quarterback and guys that score touchdowns.
Speaker 2: I would not put Mason Graham in the sack the
Speaker 2: quarterback category. Disrupt the quarterback, affect the quarterback, certainly, sack
Speaker 2: the quarterback, I don't know. So that's where I'm at
Speaker 2: with Mason Graham. This next tier, my third tier, is
Speaker 2: a bigger tier. This is like kind of a chunk
Speaker 2: of this. Oh yeah, it's a good plug, good plug.
Speaker 2: This tier is trade down tier, and I'm talking about
Speaker 2: realistic trade downs, not four to twenty like we're like.
Speaker 1: Forded, like you were so excited about last week.
Speaker 2: Like you know, for to like twelve is probably the
Speaker 2: lowest I know, right, you know in that category for
Speaker 2: these types of players. So here's where I had them
Speaker 2: ranked within the tier at number five on my board.
Speaker 2: Tyler Warren from Penn State. I love Tyler Warren. If
Speaker 2: the Patriots are in a different spot and they had
Speaker 2: the trenches and everything kind of short up a little
Speaker 2: bit more and you were able to take more of
Speaker 2: a luxury item. Tyler Warren is a lot of fun
Speaker 2: baby gronk, Like he's the closest thing I've seen to
Speaker 2: Gronk since we started doing this. He's not gronk, but
Speaker 2: six six two sixty and moves well at that size.
Speaker 2: Is gronkish right like that. There's not that many guys
Speaker 2: that fill out the suit like that, that move like
Speaker 2: Tyler Warren does.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be interested to see what he measures in at.
Speaker 1: He doesn't look to.
Speaker 2: Sixty, that's what he's listed as.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm gonna be interested.
Speaker 2: So he obviously has the ability to win above the
Speaker 2: rim in the red zone. Us His body uses frame,
Speaker 2: uses catch radius, versatility through the roof, like you can
Speaker 2: line this guy up anywhere, even in the backfield. Played
Speaker 2: wildcat quarterback for Penn State, and when you really watch
Speaker 2: that Penn State offense, like he kind of carried that offense,
Speaker 2: you know he was he was the guy in that offense.
Speaker 2: And I look at Drake May, I look at Josh McDaniels.
Speaker 2: You know, Drake May I think has already shown a
Speaker 2: pension for liking tight ends and throwing the ball to
Speaker 2: tight ends. I think he'd be comfortable with his tight
Speaker 2: end being the number one targeted player and the offense hunter.
Speaker 2: Henry probably was at number one targeted player last year
Speaker 2: and h and Josh mcdaniels's experience with maximizing a tight
Speaker 2: end with Warren skillset. So is he a watered down gronk. Yeah, absolutely,
Speaker 2: everybody's watered down gronk in that body.
Speaker 1: He's not gonna be the biggest tight the best tight
Speaker 1: end of all times, correct.
Speaker 2: But he's gonna be a very good player. The one
Speaker 2: knock on him that I would give other than like
Speaker 2: some technical stuff in blocking gets a little high, gets
Speaker 2: pushed around a little, but sometimes in line blocking he's older.
Speaker 2: He's an older prospect and he's gonna be twenty four
Speaker 2: or twenty five as a rookie. I've sort of gone
Speaker 2: back and forth of how much I care about that.
Speaker 2: But when you really think about tight ends, like you
Speaker 2: do have to consider how how much you know? How
Speaker 2: long are you really gonna have the player for now?
Speaker 2: I always feel like that's putting the car before the horse,
Speaker 2: to worry about, oh, are you gonna get your eight
Speaker 2: R nine year ten if you're at the point where
Speaker 2: you want them at your eight r nine year ten,
Speaker 2: you're in pretty good shape. So I'm not too concerned
Speaker 2: about the age. But that is a factor that you
Speaker 2: have to put out there. But Tyler Warren was a
Speaker 2: lot of fun. He was a really fun study.
Speaker 1: I think the bigger factor for me with Tyler Warren,
Speaker 1: and I really like Tyler Warren too. I think he's
Speaker 1: the best tight end in this class is what is like,
Speaker 1: what's the plan? And I'm not saying there isn't one,
Speaker 1: but I don't think you can essentially bench Hunter Henry.
Speaker 1: And that's not saying don't take this great player because
Speaker 1: you have a thirty year old tight end, But if
Speaker 1: you're trying to like make things work for Drake May,
Speaker 1: if you draft Tyler Warren, you our best offense is
Speaker 1: a lot of twelve. And we know Josh McDaniels can
Speaker 1: do that. But you kind of it almost like Travis Hunter,
Speaker 1: where it's all right, we're gonna draft Traf, we're gonna
Speaker 1: draft Tyler Warren and see what happens. Right, You got
Speaker 1: to kind of know and if you have an inkling
Speaker 1: that he could be the guy you're playing in free
Speaker 1: agency sort of needs to reflect a team that's gonna
Speaker 1: play a lot of twelve Yeah, so that's the one
Speaker 1: thing for me with Warren. And I know people get
Speaker 1: annoyed when you talk about fits with the first round pick,
Speaker 1: like just draft the best player available. You can't draft
Speaker 1: a guy that you're not gonna be able to use.
Speaker 2: So I just think that what makes me feel better
Speaker 2: about that because I hear what you're saying.
Speaker 1: I'm not anti that. Like Josh McDaniels has had a
Speaker 1: ton of success running offenses that are very heavy in
Speaker 1: twelve personnel. They chased that for years, yeah, and they
Speaker 1: can never quite get it. They went through like.
Speaker 2: That the turns out and nobody is what was his name, Chandler,
Speaker 2: Scott Chandler.
Speaker 1: They went through the Scott Chandler's of the world. Marty
Speaker 1: Bennett worked for a little bit of time. I wish
Speaker 1: he'd been here longer. One of my favorite Patriots. But
Speaker 1: like we know Josh daniels can do it. But that's
Speaker 1: something that like you kind of have to there's more
Speaker 1: to it than that, and you have to be ready
Speaker 1: to go in head first and say we're going to
Speaker 1: be a twelve personnel offense.
Speaker 2: So the thing that makes me feel a little bit
Speaker 2: better about it is that I do think Tyler Warren
Speaker 2: is so versatile that he kind of blurs the lines
Speaker 2: between eleven and twelve. Now I'm not saying that he's
Speaker 2: going to play outside receiver at a high volume, but like,
Speaker 2: you can play him in the slot, you can play
Speaker 2: him off the line of screamage, you can play him
Speaker 2: out of the backfield. Like, there's different ways that you
Speaker 2: can move him around in the formation and get different
Speaker 2: looks out of him. So he's a really versatile, you know,
Speaker 2: chess piece type of player. So it's not like you
Speaker 2: have two y tight ends and you're running double y
Speaker 2: offense all the time. You do have that ability to
Speaker 2: move him around.
Speaker 1: So you've talked a lot in the past and in
Speaker 1: a different context, but you've talked about, well, they need
Speaker 1: to bring more of what the Bills are doing to
Speaker 1: help Drake mey. Yeah, could he be your Dalton Kincaid
Speaker 1: And then after Henry's Dawson.
Speaker 2: On Yeah, well we might get to Dalton Kincaid here
Speaker 2: in a second, but yeah, yeah that I could.
Speaker 1: There's a better com for Dalton. Yeah, Okay, I mean
Speaker 1: I think this.
Speaker 2: Guy's better than Dalton Kinkaid, but there's a better player
Speaker 2: that is.
Speaker 1: But like I'm with you, Like if they were to
Speaker 1: draft Tyler Warren, that's what I would be pointing at,
Speaker 1: Like what the Bills are doing right, Like, that's kind
Speaker 1: of what I would want them to try to do.
Speaker 2: Okay, So the next player here on my list, I
Speaker 2: had to put him on because the guy's just a
Speaker 2: straight up ballers is Jalen Walker from Georgia linebacker. I
Speaker 2: don't think that the Patriots are gonna be in a
Speaker 2: position where Jalen Walker makes a whole lot of sense
Speaker 2: for them. I know a lot of people really love
Speaker 2: him as an edge rusher. I think that he's like
Speaker 2: a Jamie Collins Dante high Tower Girodmeo type where he's
Speaker 2: playing on and off the line of scrimmage. I think
Speaker 2: he's gonna have to play a little bit of both,
Speaker 2: like a hybrid type of role. I don't know if
Speaker 2: the Patriots are necessarily in a spot where that's the
Speaker 2: player that you're gonna take. But Jalen Walker is a
Speaker 2: dude like that guy is definitely a really good football
Speaker 2: player and he fits sort of that pass Pats linebacker,
Speaker 2: a role of you can play from really all three
Speaker 2: spots right off ball, linebacker, in line rusher, edge rush, sure,
Speaker 2: and just use him in different ways and things like that.
Speaker 2: But I actually think he's a little bit more athletic
Speaker 2: than like a high tower in space. So the combat
Speaker 2: I used, Actually the guy would just talking about is
Speaker 2: Zach Bond, who can play on an off line of scrimmage,
Speaker 2: cover a lot of ground. Jalen Walker is a big
Speaker 2: time player. He's gonna be a great football player somewhere.
Speaker 2: I just don't know if it necessarily makes sense for
Speaker 2: the Patriots, but he has to be on the list
Speaker 2: if you're gonna talk about this list. The next guy
Speaker 2: that I'm really serious about, though, who I just absolutely
Speaker 2: was blown away by his Colston Lovelin with Michigan, who
Speaker 2: I feel like is now everybody is in love. Like
Speaker 2: Dame Bruger had him at eleven and his top one hundred,
Speaker 2: his latest top one hundred. Jeremiah I think had him
Speaker 2: at like seven, like really high, like top ten player.
Speaker 1: Here's the top tight end coming into the season. And
Speaker 1: then Warren had the year he had, But Loveland was
Speaker 1: the guy that was getting all the hype really until
Speaker 1: like November.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so a couple of different combs for him. I
Speaker 2: settled on brock Bauer's light because I think that that's
Speaker 2: just the easiest one to for everybody to kind of understand.
Speaker 2: There's a little Sam Laport, There's a little Sam laporta
Speaker 2: there right, there's a little Dalton kink there. You know.
Speaker 2: He is a receiving tight end. He is not a
Speaker 2: necessarily a big time blocker, although I think he can
Speaker 2: hold his own in certain matchups if you're going to
Speaker 2: have him block on the perimeter and and block defensive backs,
Speaker 2: like he's not going to dig out defensive ends, Like
Speaker 2: that's just not going to be his game at two
Speaker 2: forty five. But he is explosive, Like he is an
Speaker 2: absolute explosive, big time playmaker at the receiver position, can
Speaker 2: play out of the slot, can run routes in line.
Speaker 2: You know, he gets into the scene in a hurry,
Speaker 2: He gets over the top of the second level in
Speaker 2: a hurry, really good at the top of the route.
Speaker 2: Explosive player all over the film. He was awesome, Like
Speaker 2: he was really fun to watch. A lot of the
Speaker 2: same traits I would say as like a Bowers or
Speaker 2: a Laporta or some of these tight ends that are
Speaker 2: coming up.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think he got lost in the wash during
Speaker 1: the season because Michigan really only threw the ball like
Speaker 1: ten times a game. Yeah, so he didn't have a
Speaker 1: ton of any Like you said, he's not a plus blocker,
Speaker 1: so he didn't have a ton of opportunities to show
Speaker 1: what he can do. But now I think when go
Speaker 1: back and they look like they're rediscovering them, there is
Speaker 1: a projection because like you said, there's some really impressive
Speaker 1: stuff on that tape. It's not a lot of tape. Yeah, Like,
Speaker 1: how how long did it take you to watch him
Speaker 1: versus watching Tyler Warren? Right? One guy was the centerpiece
Speaker 1: of the offense.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 1: That like that, that entire Penn State offense. They had
Speaker 1: Tyler Warren Adam lining up, a tight end, receiver, a
Speaker 1: running back, quarterback, He lined up at center and caught
Speaker 1: a touchdown on the same play, which was awesome. I
Speaker 1: know you hated that, but it was sick.
Speaker 2: I don't know. It supports my argument now, so I'm
Speaker 2: with you.
Speaker 1: You hated it. Whereas Colston Loveland, they probably should have
Speaker 1: used him more, but they couldn't because they just didn't
Speaker 1: have the quarterback play to really have any semblance of
Speaker 1: a pass game. They had to run the ball a ton.
Speaker 1: That meant that, you know, they had to kind of
Speaker 1: hide him as a blocker and things like that. There's
Speaker 1: tremendous flashes, but you have to project some sort of
Speaker 1: consistency because he was never given and I'm honest saying
Speaker 1: he can't be consistent. He was never given an opportunity
Speaker 1: to play in a volume role. And if you're drafting
Speaker 1: a tight end as high as Coulston, Loveland is probably
Speaker 1: gonna go, Yeah, it's gonna be in a volume rold
Speaker 1: brock Bauers had what one hundred something targets last year. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Colson Lovelin had nothing close to that in college. So
Speaker 1: again it doesn't mean he can't do it, but you
Speaker 1: have to be really confident in your evaluation because you
Speaker 1: haven't seen him apples to apples in the role you're
Speaker 1: probably drafting him into.
Speaker 2: So the thing that you know in terms of role
Speaker 2: that really intrigues me about him is that I would
Speaker 2: say his best route is like the quick post or
Speaker 2: the skinny post right where he just runs right behind
Speaker 2: the linebackers or runs away from a defender and off coverage.
Speaker 2: And when you really think about Josh McDaniels' offense, like
Speaker 2: those bang play action plays where you're pulling guards and
Speaker 2: leading with the full back and you're getting those linebackers
Speaker 2: to fall step up the field, and then Colson Lovelin
Speaker 2: is just gonna burst right by that second level and
Speaker 2: he's gonna be gone in a blur. He could really
Speaker 2: really eat on those types of schemes, you know, those
Speaker 2: Charles Barkley, you know, pull the backside guard, make it
Speaker 2: look like power, and then have the linebacker come down
Speaker 2: and all of a sudden, you have a four or
Speaker 2: five tight end at two forty five coming across the field. Like,
Speaker 2: there's not a lot of guys that are gonna be
Speaker 2: able to recover and win that foot race. So I
Speaker 2: look at Closon Lovelin in a gap scheme and a
Speaker 2: downhill rush offense with a quarterback that's operating in the
Speaker 2: gun and running gun action and RPO and all these
Speaker 2: different type of things. I look at him as just
Speaker 2: a really great fit in that.
Speaker 1: So let me ask you this with him and Warren right,
Speaker 1: you talked about with Mason Graham, and I agree with you,
Speaker 1: this is an unbelievable defensive tackle class, and part of
Speaker 1: the pause with Mason Graham is like, you're not worried
Speaker 1: about going to that next level because you're still going
Speaker 1: to get a playmaker at that next level. Would you
Speaker 1: feel the same about Warren or Lovelan because this is
Speaker 1: a really good tight end class too.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't because the need for that centerpiece playmaker
Speaker 2: for the Patriots is so high, it's so important, and
Speaker 2: I feel like those two guys can do that and
Speaker 2: the next guy, I do have the receiver on my
Speaker 2: listen next, Okay, so don't worry. Okay, But then I
Speaker 2: feel like these two guys, these two guys, to me,
Speaker 2: are the two best playmakers in the class on offense
Speaker 2: other side, outside of Travis Hunter, who is this own unicorn.
Speaker 1: There's one more agree with me.
Speaker 2: I that isn't a devalued position. Uh That that to
Speaker 2: me is they're the two best pass catchers in this
Speaker 2: draft and so that that that's important, especially if you
Speaker 2: can find a way to hit the trenches in different ways.
Speaker 1: I would agree with that these are the two best.
Speaker 1: You know, we we kind of put this disclaimer out
Speaker 1: a couple months ago that we have. Travis Hunter is
Speaker 1: the number one Travis Hunter in draft when we rank
Speaker 1: the positions. He's kind of his own thing. I would
Speaker 1: agree with you the two best pass catchers in the
Speaker 1: TEW draft. I'm with you on that.
Speaker 2: Okay. So at number eight, finally, I know a lot
Speaker 2: of people, I'm sure, where's Ted McMillan. All right, here's
Speaker 2: Ted McMillan. And for the record, because I'm for the
Speaker 2: cause and because I'm trying to be open minded, I
Speaker 2: actually went back and watched Ted McMillan a second time
Speaker 2: because the first time I was kind of underwhelmed.
Speaker 1: As you know, well it depends which games you watch
Speaker 1: with him.
Speaker 2: The second time I watched him again. I watched them again,
Speaker 2: and I again, I tried, I try, and I see
Speaker 2: a vision for him. But what I keep coming back
Speaker 2: to is the cop which I just think is is
Speaker 2: just a one for one, maybe the perfect comp for
Speaker 2: any player in this draft. To me, he's just Drake London, right,
Speaker 2: He's Drake London two point zero. Now, Drake London is
Speaker 2: a thousand yard receiver with good quarterback play in Atlanta.
Speaker 2: So it's not like he's a terrible player, right, He's
Speaker 2: a very good player. But if Drake London is your
Speaker 2: number one receiver, then you kind of have like a
Speaker 2: low end wide receiver one as your top dog, right Robinson, Yeah, okay, fine,
Speaker 2: you need a complimentary piece at least you need either
Speaker 2: another one B or you need like the stud. And
Speaker 2: he became, you know, the Jamar Chase, and he becomes
Speaker 2: the T Higgins. If he's T Higgins to Jamar Chase
Speaker 2: for you, he has a really good T Higgins right,
Speaker 2: Like T Higgins, I don't think is a bad comp
Speaker 2: honestly from a player standpoint, but if he's your Jamar Chase,
Speaker 2: I still think that you are behind the eight ball
Speaker 2: a little bit. The other thing I would say with Ted,
Speaker 2: and I'll get to the positives. If you were to
Speaker 2: put him in last year's wide receiver class.
Speaker 1: Don't do it. You know how I hate this.
Speaker 2: If you were to put him into last year's wide
Speaker 2: receiver class, I think he's wide receiver five last year.
Speaker 1: It's unfair though, because like, yes, this year's a bad
Speaker 1: wide receiver class. Last year was generational.
Speaker 2: So my point by bringing that up though, isn't so
Speaker 2: much like I hear what you're saying and I get
Speaker 2: what you're saying. My point of bringing that up, though,
Speaker 2: is that what you're getting at is that you're you're
Speaker 2: gonna be reaching on this player at four, Like you're
Speaker 2: just you are like this this player at four is
Speaker 2: a reach. You know, you are really talking about him
Speaker 2: probably comfortably in a regular draft class, being drafted someplace
Speaker 2: in the teams right or maybe early twenties, and now
Speaker 2: the Patriots because they have this glaring need at wide
Speaker 2: receiver and he does fill the suit, You're you're gonna
Speaker 2: just draft him at four because of the w R
Speaker 2: next to his name, And that's risky, Like, that's a
Speaker 2: huge risk. That's how teams bust on that position in
Speaker 2: particular throughout the course of history in the draft is
Speaker 2: by reaching on that position. The things I like about
Speaker 2: Tet McMillan, he's a little bit misunderstood. I don't think
Speaker 2: he's a contested catch artist. I think he's a very
Speaker 2: good number.
Speaker 1: People see the size and they project him as he's
Speaker 1: not bad at the catch point.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's not bad.
Speaker 1: But his what makes him different than these other like
Speaker 1: six five, two hundred and fifteen pound receivers is he
Speaker 1: makes plays with bal in his hands. Yeah, he's he's
Speaker 1: a thread at all three levels because he can great
Speaker 1: after the catch. That's what makes him special. That he
Speaker 1: is as good at the contested catch point as you
Speaker 1: would expect a six to five receiver to be. He's
Speaker 1: not Rainy Moss. Yeah, but he's not completely inefty either.
Speaker 1: He's solid. He's fine that that alone. Yeah, he'd be
Speaker 1: like a Day two pick. It's what he does after
Speaker 1: the catch that makes them special. My biggest concern about
Speaker 1: Tet McMillan, though, is the consistency. Fifty percent of his
Speaker 1: receiving yards last year came in four games, including the
Speaker 1: what three hundred something against a really bad New Mexico.
Speaker 2: Team, which a tape I have not watched and will
Speaker 2: not watch.
Speaker 1: I understand that what you really got to do is
Speaker 1: go watch his best game in college I think is
Speaker 1: Colorado last year because he took it to Travis Hunter.
Speaker 1: I don't know that the only guy that's had better
Speaker 1: the only guy that had better success against Hunter as
Speaker 1: a corner is Ao Manor from Stanford. And that was
Speaker 1: really all in one half. And I don't know if
Speaker 1: you've watched that one.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm getting to You're gonna have a lot.
Speaker 1: Of fun with that tape. But like McMillan's interviews are
Speaker 1: gonna be big because is that lack of that Arizona
Speaker 1: team is not good? They were not good. Fafita is
Speaker 1: a fine college quarterback. I don't think he's much an
Speaker 1: NFL prospect. He's a fine college quarterback. They really didn't
Speaker 1: have anything else there. So was it an issue of
Speaker 1: teams just completely blanking him and taking away he was
Speaker 1: getting the you know, the Calvin Johnson treatment. That picture
Speaker 1: with the two defenders right there, Like, how did he
Speaker 1: see it? I think that's gonna be very telling to
Speaker 1: hear his side of why were these games different than
Speaker 1: these games?
Speaker 4: So?
Speaker 2: I think he's a decent separator for his size. I
Speaker 2: think he's a decent route runner. He's a sudden movere.
Speaker 2: He can stop and start quickly and create separation. I
Speaker 2: think his best route is probably like a comeback or
Speaker 2: a nine stop where he just you know, vertically releases
Speaker 2: and then stops down at the top of the route
Speaker 2: and creates that separation. He's got a good feel for
Speaker 2: zone over the middle of the field. Like, I think
Speaker 2: he's a good route runner for his size at six
Speaker 2: foot five, you know, he's a very good change of
Speaker 2: direction talent type of player. So don't get it twisted
Speaker 2: to think that this guy is like, you know, some
Speaker 2: jump ball artist and that's how he made all of
Speaker 2: his yards. I don't see him that way. My concern
Speaker 2: with him is that he's not He really isn't a burner,
Speaker 2: and he doesn't really change gears very well either. He's
Speaker 2: kind of a glider and more of like that sort
Speaker 2: of type of player.
Speaker 1: The way I've said it, he's not slow, yeah, but
Speaker 1: you wouldn't call him fast either, like he is functional speech.
Speaker 2: So I don't think he's pulling away from anybody, is
Speaker 2: my point. So when you talk about third level separation
Speaker 2: and vertical separation and all that kind of stuff, that
Speaker 2: stuff becomes important because you need the defensive back. I
Speaker 2: respect the fact that he can go by you. Yeah,
Speaker 2: And if you don't respect that, then all these comebacks
Speaker 2: and nine stops and in cuts and all that kind
Speaker 2: of stuff that's all over his tape, that's good. Like
Speaker 2: now you're just gonna get those suffocated, Like those are
Speaker 2: just gonna be the routes everybody covers.
Speaker 1: Well. He also didn't face press in college, so there's
Speaker 1: an adjustment.
Speaker 2: So we'll see. I'm not like a hard no on
Speaker 2: Ted McMillan. It has to come in a trade down
Speaker 2: for me. And like I said, I think that he's
Speaker 2: best suited as a robin in an NFL offense to
Speaker 2: a true batman. And if they signed to Higgins and
Speaker 2: it really doesn't make any sense. You know, it has
Speaker 2: to be somebody that's gonna play the Z the slot,
Speaker 2: you know, play inside off of him playing on the outside.
Speaker 2: You know. Last thing I would say maybe one of
Speaker 2: his better attributes in terms of if you want really
Speaker 2: to get that vertical field stretching ability, he can run
Speaker 2: routes from the slot and he does it pretty well.
Speaker 1: He can play all three positions, which is kind of
Speaker 1: cool for a guy that side. You can't see that.
Speaker 1: That's where he's different than Drake Lindon. That is maybe
Speaker 1: a little bit better. Yeah, that's pretty rare for guy
Speaker 1: that side.
Speaker 2: He's not a first level separator there, Like he's not
Speaker 2: gonna run juke routs and things like that. But if
Speaker 2: you want him to run the seam, if you want
Speaker 2: him to split cover two, like, he can get up
Speaker 2: the field that way. And if you get him on
Speaker 2: some linebackers and safeties in the middle of the field.
Speaker 2: Then he can win those foot and this thing.
Speaker 1: Is like, you can put him even if you get
Speaker 1: him on a slower corner, yeah, just or a smaller
Speaker 1: corner because of the stride length. If you get him,
Speaker 1: you don't need him to run a dig to separate
Speaker 1: at the first level because he's so big and he
Speaker 1: has those long legs. If you get him on a drag,
Speaker 1: he'll pull away from the corner and boom. Now he
Speaker 1: used the ball with room and run.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah again, I fine player, wouldn't take him at
Speaker 2: four and would be eyes wide open to the fact
Speaker 2: that he's probably not the answer. He's he's an answer,
Speaker 2: but he's probably not the answer. All right, So let's
Speaker 2: fly through the rest of these because I don't want
Speaker 2: to take you one.
Speaker 1: More guy on the list. No no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: no no. You had one more guy on that list.
Speaker 2: Yeah too, Oh you too, I remember one, oh at
Speaker 2: the very bottom. Yeah, well that's different. Those are my
Speaker 2: honorable mentions.
Speaker 1: Oh okay, yeah, honorable mentions.
Speaker 2: I'll get to all out of your moment with that.
Speaker 2: So my next guy on the list was Will Johnson
Speaker 2: out the cornerback from Michigan who I thought was was good.
Speaker 2: I think is his own corner. I think he plays
Speaker 2: best in cover two, where as a cloud corner on
Speaker 2: the flats and you know, ballhawking and off coverage where
Speaker 2: he can pedal and read and react and see things
Speaker 2: in front of him if he presses. I do worry
Speaker 2: about his long speed and his ability to stay connected
Speaker 2: down the field. But the corner that I compared him
Speaker 2: to his Christian ben for with Buffalo, who was one
Speaker 2: of the best zone corners in the league. Now i'd
Speaker 2: see a little bit of that, see a little bit
Speaker 2: of like prime Josh Norman to his game, you know,
Speaker 2: like I think those guys are good comps. His tape
Speaker 2: against Roma Dunsay and the National Championship game was it
Speaker 2: was a good film for him. Had a couple of penalties,
Speaker 2: but I thought overall was pretty solid against the Dunsa
Speaker 2: So I did go back and watch that one. Like
Speaker 2: Will Johnson, but not in love with him to the
Speaker 2: point where I'm taking him over positions that the Patriots
Speaker 2: need a little bit more than corner. But he's in
Speaker 2: this conversation, in this trade down scenario, I'm.
Speaker 1: Good Will Johnson. They have Christian Zalez. There's good cornerback.
Speaker 1: He's not a bad position. Free agency, Like you need
Speaker 1: a guy that can be a complimentary guy. I'm good.
Speaker 1: I don't need them to take Will Johnson fair enough.
Speaker 2: Last one Kelvin Banks. He came in at number ten
Speaker 2: on this list again trade down scenario tier here with
Speaker 2: with Kelvin Banks. I think the biggest thing that I
Speaker 2: worry about with Kelvin Banks is when he has to redirect,
Speaker 2: when he has to change directions and he has to
Speaker 2: mirror guys, he tends to lose control and he gets
Speaker 2: a little bit wild with his technique when those things happen,
Speaker 2: and that leads to some really ugly quick losses, right,
Speaker 2: which is the ones that you don't want to see
Speaker 2: on film. But he's a really good run blocker. I
Speaker 2: think he's already really good in that way. And he's
Speaker 2: pretty good at protecting his edge, like I think he's
Speaker 2: gonna make you take the long way home to the quarterback.
Speaker 2: He's very good at, you know, playing inside out and
Speaker 2: protecting the inside and making the guy go around the edge,
Speaker 2: which is what you want and from an offensive lineman.
Speaker 2: So I actually look at him and I compared him
Speaker 2: to Darnell right with Chicago. You know, just a really
Speaker 2: good run blocker who can pass protect. And I actually
Speaker 2: wonder if he's best stuited to play right tackle in
Speaker 2: the league, especially in this type of system. If he's
Speaker 2: here with the Patriots with Josh McDaniels, if he plays
Speaker 2: on the right side, and their gap heavy again and
Speaker 2: they're doubling and they're pulling guards and all that good stuff,
Speaker 2: you know, full backs and things. Him next to Mike Godwen,
Speaker 2: it would move some people like that would be a
Speaker 2: very very good right side. I don't know if he
Speaker 2: has the body control and the talent to play on
Speaker 2: an island at left tackle in the league. I don't
Speaker 2: know if I would put him there, but I do
Speaker 2: think that he's In this conversation.
Speaker 1: I think you're under selling him a little bit. I
Speaker 1: think his athleticism. People are underrating his athleticism and that
Speaker 1: makes up for some of the other stuff he's also.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's Josh McDaniels. We know they're gonna be
Speaker 1: heavy with like screens and things like that. You get
Speaker 1: him out in front, leading on a toss or leading
Speaker 1: on a screen. Yeah, he's a menace. So I think
Speaker 1: he has franchise tackle upside. Now there's a way to
Speaker 1: get there. Yeah, Like Campbell is more ready plug and play.
Speaker 1: I think Banks is more of a project looking closer
Speaker 1: at him than maybe I thought during the season, But
Speaker 1: I think he can be a set it and forget
Speaker 1: it tackle in the NFL.
Speaker 2: Yep, I agree. I don't know if it will be
Speaker 2: on the on the left side, but I agree that
Speaker 2: he's a starting caliber tackle in the league. All right,
Speaker 2: So my honorable mentions here MIKEL Williams from Georgia. Another
Speaker 2: guy that if they were in a different position and
Speaker 2: they could take the ball of clay and work with
Speaker 2: him and refine his skill set and all that kind
Speaker 2: of stuff, Like he's gonna be a good player down
Speaker 2: the road. It just might take a year or two
Speaker 2: to get him there. He'd be fun. I really liked
Speaker 2: armand Mambu from Missouri, but he has a little bit
Speaker 2: too much Isaiah Winn vibes to me like short with
Speaker 2: short arms and like doesn't really have the measurables to
Speaker 2: play tackle in the NFL.
Speaker 1: But if he doesn't play tackle, he's a right tackle.
Speaker 1: He's not like you're not considering him on the left.
Speaker 2: Yeah, great, great feet for Membo. Josh Simmons, just a
Speaker 2: little blurb on him that I wrote up in this
Speaker 2: just if he was healthy, we'd be having a very
Speaker 2: different conversation about Josh Simmons. But we'll never know. We'll
Speaker 2: never know if he would have performed well in the
Speaker 2: College Football Playoff. We never will never know what his
Speaker 2: numbers and what his film would have looked like if
Speaker 2: he had stayed healthy throughout the entire year. And that
Speaker 2: injury torn Butteler tendon is the same injury that Cole
Speaker 2: Strange had that keep him kept him off the field
Speaker 2: for a calendar year. So he suffered that injury in
Speaker 2: November against Oregon. That means that you're looking at Thanksgiving
Speaker 2: of his rookie year best case scenario, So most likely
Speaker 2: you're looking at a red shirt rookie season for Josh Lichens.
Speaker 1: They can't afford to have their first round pick.
Speaker 2: Not play no, And he's a great candidate for like
Speaker 2: the Niners, the Chiefs, like teams like that that are
Speaker 2: are looking for the upside and can have and take
Speaker 2: those chances. You know at the back end of the.
Speaker 1: Page, and look, it didn't work out. I've compared him
Speaker 1: to Dominique Easley. The Patriots tried that, however, many years ago,
Speaker 1: because they were in the position to do it. It didn't
Speaker 1: work out like that. You want a guy with that
Speaker 1: talent later in the draft. That's how you get them.
Speaker 1: Malcolm Mitch would be another one.
Speaker 2: Last one.
Speaker 1: Do it? Say it?
Speaker 2: Ashton Denty from Boise State my comp for Ashton Dent.
Speaker 1: I saw this. This was interesting.
Speaker 2: Maurice Jones Drew.
Speaker 1: I think he's a little more powerful than that, but
Speaker 1: it's not a bad comp.
Speaker 2: Low center of gravity, explosive, big playmaker from everywhere. He's
Speaker 2: got that trunk right, He's got that that thick lower
Speaker 2: body to run through on tackles.
Speaker 1: The Tampa running backer we call the muscle Hamster, Doug Martin.
Speaker 2: Doug Martin's much better.
Speaker 1: He's much better, but he's got that. He's the build.
Speaker 2: I love mj D. Shout out mj D. I think
Speaker 2: I think he's got a little bit of MGD in
Speaker 2: his game. I wish he was better as a receiver,
Speaker 2: Like if he was if he was a true pass
Speaker 2: catching back also, then like you could kind of get
Speaker 2: that Alvin Kamara vibe did you watch.
Speaker 1: And he didn't watch any of twenty twenty three, did
Speaker 1: you No? They used him a lot more in the
Speaker 1: pass game last year.
Speaker 2: I wish I was a better receiver.
Speaker 1: You think he's not Kamara, He's not CMC, but he's
Speaker 1: a better receiver.
Speaker 2: Right if he was with his contact balance and explosiveness
Speaker 2: He's got like he's like the ball carrying running version
Speaker 2: of Alvin Kamara, right, but he's not the receiver that
Speaker 2: Alvin Kamara was. If he was both of those things together,
Speaker 2: then like he would be in Matt McCaffrey. Like take
Speaker 2: him in the top ten, and he's.
Speaker 1: Not a liability as a receiver though, Like he can
Speaker 1: be a factor. You're not gonna build your pass game
Speaker 1: around him, but he can. I'm trying to think of,
Speaker 1: like who the comp would be for that, who like
Speaker 1: wasn't a primary receiving back, but like factored in to
Speaker 1: the pass get factors in the pass catching game. I'll
Speaker 1: think about it.
Speaker 2: So by the last line of this entire post, if
Speaker 2: they take out Ashton Gentry in the first round with
Speaker 2: their first pick, I will be on the side of
Speaker 2: the Tobin Bridge and you will have to talk me
Speaker 2: off the ledge so I'm not for it. I'm but
Speaker 2: I had to mention his name.
Speaker 1: What I always say, Yeah, I have to talk about it.
Speaker 1: You talked about it. I'm happy.
Speaker 2: Did you like my tears?
Speaker 1: I did? Those are good. I'm trying to think of
Speaker 1: a running back now that's like that kind of Joe
Speaker 1: Mixon would be a good one. We're like they would
Speaker 1: throw the ball at Joe Mixon a couple times again,
Speaker 1: like didn't build anything around it, both in Houston and
Speaker 1: in Cincinnati. But like you weren't taking Joe Mixon out
Speaker 1: of the game to throw the football.
Speaker 2: That's fair.
Speaker 1: Fair.
Speaker 2: That's where I think is. So he's not as big.
Speaker 1: He's not as big, but like that kind of role
Speaker 1: in the passing game.
Speaker 2: He's not as big as this guy either, But like,
Speaker 2: is he like a souped up Ormandra Stevenson.
Speaker 1: Uh. Yeah, he's a better blocker, and Steevens is a
Speaker 1: good block That's the other thing. He's a really good
Speaker 1: pass blocker.
Speaker 2: You're trying to sell it. It's not working.
Speaker 1: I'm just saying he's a good player. He's gonna be
Speaker 1: a Cowboy. That's like the most obvious pick Ever's.
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Speaker 2: England Patriots. All Right, I'm very sorry that we've been
Speaker 2: keeping all these people on hold and all the emails.
Speaker 2: So the last thirty minutes is all going to be
Speaker 2: about you, guys. We got emails, we got calls. We're
Speaker 2: going to start with Patty and Agoam. If he's still there,
Speaker 2: what's up, Patty?
Speaker 5: I'm still here, guys going on not much. A few questions.
Speaker 5: I'll run through them quickly because you know, I don't
Speaker 5: want to keep the other calls on the line. But
Speaker 5: question one top the draft, do the Titans really run
Speaker 5: it back with Billy Jeans and take Abdul Carter Travis Hunter.
Speaker 1: I don't think those two things are mutually exclude. I
Speaker 1: think they could go get another quarterback in the veteran
Speaker 1: market or draft, you know, Jalen Milroe or Will Howard
Speaker 1: on day two Kyle McCord uh to compete with Levis. Basically,
Speaker 1: do I always go back to what the Panthers didn't
Speaker 1: in I think it's two thousand and nine where they
Speaker 1: drafted Jimmy Clausen in the second round. It might have
Speaker 1: been twenty ten or on day two, and it was
Speaker 1: kind of like a well, if he works, great and
Speaker 1: if not, we'll have a high pick next you and
Speaker 1: we'll actually get the guy and they get cammed, So
Speaker 1: I there's a chance that they have a new quarterback
Speaker 1: and don't take a quarterback first.
Speaker 5: Overall, all right, Question two to deez, do you guys
Speaker 5: get to seed? I don't know if it's ruder or boiter,
Speaker 5: but Chad Ruter's three round mac on NFL dot Com.
Speaker 2: I didn't see enough. But Chad's a good good I read.
Speaker 2: What did he say?
Speaker 1: Oh? Did he have gent six?
Speaker 5: I don't know if he HADDENTI six. I just paid attention,
Speaker 5: paid attention to the Patriots picks. So he had Carter
Speaker 5: going four, He had Arianta Ers going with their second
Speaker 5: round pick, and then Isaiah Bond and Henderson running back
Speaker 5: from Ohio State, which I wouldn't be.
Speaker 2: That would be awesome, decent draft.
Speaker 1: I would take that. I mean, I don't love Bond,
Speaker 1: he wouldn't love Henderson. So we get some good debate,
Speaker 1: but like overall, that'd be a pretty solid draft.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I like that one. Why don't you you're a
Speaker 2: hater on Bond?
Speaker 1: Last question.
Speaker 5: Before I get to the last question that I'll take
Speaker 5: off there, I wanted to know what you guys thought
Speaker 5: of this comparison too, because I see a lot of
Speaker 5: like Mike Parsons comparisons with Abdul Carter, and he's been
Speaker 5: my draft crush since, like I think the Wisconsin and
Speaker 5: Ohio State back to back games, I was like, who
Speaker 5: the hell is this guy? This guy is a freaking animal.
Speaker 5: I think the more apt comparison with him that I see,
Speaker 5: he's the same size, Dame build and everything is von
Speaker 5: Miller because von Miller wasn't great against the run coming
Speaker 5: out of college, but he was an absolute freaking animal
Speaker 5: coming off the edge. And the last thing, I'll take
Speaker 5: it off there, guys, what would you What do you
Speaker 5: guys think or how do you feel if you watched
Speaker 5: anything on him? About Malachi Carter? I think the safety
Speaker 5: out of Alabama, who who's kind of like a proof
Speaker 5: free safety. And if I got his name wrong, I'm sorry,
Speaker 5: but I'll take that off there.
Speaker 2: Guys, Thanks bag, thanks for the call. Appreciate you waiting.
Speaker 2: I don't mind the von Miller comp I hold von
Speaker 2: Miller in really high regard, so I try not to
Speaker 2: throw that that comp around for a lot of people.
Speaker 2: But I guess Michael Parsons is also a pretty dark,
Speaker 2: good player.
Speaker 1: I would say von Miller was much more technically advanced.
Speaker 1: He had a deeper bag, he was more refined. If
Speaker 1: you want to talk about a ceiling, like where does
Speaker 1: Carter get to? Yeah, that's probably like if he maxes out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think he's probably more Von Miller than Michael Parsons.
Speaker 1: But it's not about him as a prospect. Like again,
Speaker 1: Carter just really started playing this position full time last year.
Speaker 1: You can see that there is still learning, active learning
Speaker 1: going on. Anything on your Malachi Starks is gonna be
Speaker 1: a top fifteen pick. I don't think they need to
Speaker 1: take a safety that high. I think that's who he
Speaker 1: asked me.
Speaker 2: Oh no, he has Malachi Moore more from my.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he's not bad. I really like I'm kind of
Speaker 1: familiar with him, Like he's fine. I don't know that
Speaker 1: he's gonna be If they draft a free safety, I
Speaker 1: want them to get a guy that's going to be
Speaker 1: able to be on the field sixty seventy percent of
Speaker 1: the time. I really like Andrew mccooba from Texas. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he he his range is rare, he can cover so
Speaker 1: much ground and the ball skills need work, but I
Speaker 1: think that's coachable but right now he can get to
Speaker 1: the spot, which I think is the harder ask. So
Speaker 1: he's a you know, late day two pick. I like him.
Speaker 1: I liked Billy Bowman at the Senior ball. Moore is
Speaker 1: kind of in that same group. He wouldn't be a
Speaker 1: bad pick, but there's other players I like better for
Speaker 1: that role.
Speaker 2: Yeah, fair enough, all right.
Speaker 1: Also just that that maculate it. That would be so
Speaker 1: perfect for this show. It's not gonna happen because Carter's.
Speaker 2: That's a decent lock, but I'm cool with it.
Speaker 1: We get two players that we both love and Phil
Speaker 1: needs and all that, and then we get Isaiah Bond
Speaker 1: versus Travion Henderson. The debates we're going to have on
Speaker 1: those two would be outstanding because I get my bully
Speaker 1: ball running back and you get your fast and nothing
Speaker 1: else receiver.
Speaker 2: Okay, I think you're under selling one thing about Isaiah
Speaker 2: Bond fast and answer the question even fast, And you
Speaker 2: were right that he's just a speedster. You're right about that,
Speaker 2: but he has built a lot different than like a
Speaker 2: taekwondo okay, but like he's not he's not a string bean,
Speaker 2: like he fast and fast?
Speaker 1: That okay, So you still can't answer that question that
Speaker 1: I have a need for. When's the next Olympics. That's
Speaker 1: where you go.
Speaker 2: If you're just listening and you played, if you played
Speaker 2: receiver and he started at Alabama and Texas and like
Speaker 2: you're doing something.
Speaker 1: We want Matthew Golden. If we're getting Texas receiver.
Speaker 2: All right, we might talk about Matthew Golden here soon.
Speaker 2: All right, Brad is in Ohio? What's up? Brad?
Speaker 3: Hey?
Speaker 2: How you guys doing good?
Speaker 6: Good?
Speaker 3: I just wanted to agree with Patty about the the
Speaker 3: running back from Ohio State, the Henderson guy. Yep, yeah,
Speaker 3: I'm you know. I'm a Michigan fan, so I do
Speaker 3: agree he would be a great fit.
Speaker 1: Let me ask you this, who would you rather have
Speaker 1: Henderson or quin Shawn Jenkins.
Speaker 3: I'd rather have Dave Donovan Edwards.
Speaker 1: That's a true Michigan fan right there. There you go.
Speaker 3: Well, no, no, no, I'm just saying I'm him and
Speaker 3: a Patriots Josh McDaniel of all fans. I just think
Speaker 3: that would really fit, guys, I don't, I really did.
Speaker 3: I think Donovan will fit. There's a running back from
Speaker 3: Iowa too, I think coming out Johnson and then I'm
Speaker 3: just gonna spit out of a couple of names real quick,
Speaker 3: because I know there's other callers. That way we can
Speaker 3: get through these, because you guys can give me an idea.
Speaker 3: Is this safety from Ohio State coming out Caleb Downs?
Speaker 1: No, No, he is at the top of my board
Speaker 1: for twenty twenty six. He's so freaking.
Speaker 3: Good, outstanding. Yeah, the guy's gonna be a breath. Coach
Speaker 3: to Loveland is gonna him and Drake May together would
Speaker 3: be a problem for any defense. I agree, you know,
Speaker 3: Coach to Loveland against with J. J. McCarthy, that's when
Speaker 3: he was actually ever ever able to thrive. And even
Speaker 3: then they held him back. They didn't really let, like
Speaker 3: you said, allow him to, you know, to kind of
Speaker 3: transcend into what he should be. And then uh, Josiah
Speaker 3: Stewart in the fourth rounds of that possible.
Speaker 2: Uh yeah, yeah. I thinks for the call, Brad, we
Speaker 2: just want to get to everybody. I Jasiah Stewart. I
Speaker 2: think it's gonna be a top one hundred packs.
Speaker 1: I think so.
Speaker 2: But he's he's a lot of fun. Uh, He's that
Speaker 2: type of guy you're gonna get a lot because he
Speaker 2: went to Michigan and He's kind of a situational pass rusher,
Speaker 2: like you're gonna hear a lot of But I think
Speaker 2: he's his first step is better than was. I think
Speaker 2: he's a little bit more explosive off the ball, uh
Speaker 2: than Josh was. But he he's a lot of fun
Speaker 2: and he was kind of that guy that got a
Speaker 2: lot of those cleanup sacks and stuff with you know
Speaker 2: Graham and the other guys who's the was it Grant
Speaker 2: right the DT in the middle and there from Michigan.
Speaker 2: So yeah, I really liked him at the Senior Bowl.
Speaker 2: Watched his tape and saw a lot of the same things.
Speaker 2: Go watch Josiah Stewart against USC last year. Just took
Speaker 2: those tackles to freaking lunch, like eight quarterback pressures, two sacks, stripsack.
Speaker 2: He was all over the quarterback in that game. So
Speaker 2: he's a lot of fun. He's not going to set
Speaker 2: the edge, like he's not Afroony Jennings. He's not going
Speaker 2: to set the edge. But if you want somebody to
Speaker 2: rush the quarterback and sack the quarterback on third down,
Speaker 2: then Josiah Stewart can definitely do that. Let's go to
Speaker 2: one of our favorites, Mark is in Connecticut. What's up, Mark?
Speaker 3: Hey, guys, I had a good one for you.
Speaker 6: So I am of the thing of moving down between
Speaker 6: seven to ten because I think you can add a
Speaker 6: second round pick, and by doing that, you can pick
Speaker 6: up Kyler Warren. Because we've seen what Drake May. He
Speaker 6: likes to throw at a big tight end and it's
Speaker 6: just what Josh McDaniels. It's gonna be a great fit,
Speaker 6: I really believe. And then with that additional second round pick,
Speaker 6: you compare that with your third round pick and move
Speaker 6: back up at the U into the back of the
Speaker 6: first round and maybe get another tackle. If you don't
Speaker 6: do that free agency, it's just want to get you
Speaker 6: guys to take on that.
Speaker 1: I don't hate the idea. Then I don't hate the
Speaker 1: idea of moving down to moving back up, whether it's
Speaker 1: for Warren, whether it's for somebody else. I like Warren,
Speaker 1: and he laid out that's the argument Tyler Warren, Drake
Speaker 1: May likes throwing a tight ends. Josh McDaniels is very
Speaker 1: experienced with two tight end sets, with maximizing guys like that,
Speaker 1: Like you want to talk about, I've shot down a
Speaker 1: lot of guys because well, least he's gonna work here.
Speaker 1: He's a good player, But is he gonna work here? Yeah,
Speaker 1: Tyler Warren's the opposite. I think I feel better about
Speaker 1: him than I would on a neutral you know, discussing
Speaker 1: this neutrally league wide because there is such a clear
Speaker 1: path for Tyler Warren in New England. I know it
Speaker 1: sounded before like I was shooting it down saying, well,
Speaker 1: you know you're gonna run a lot of at twelve. No,
Speaker 1: like you're gonna run a lot at twelve with Josh McDaniels.
Speaker 1: It makes sense. I just want to go back to
Speaker 1: last caller too, because he asked about a couple other players. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Caleb Johnson is basically your day two Ashon genty, bigger, back, physical,
Speaker 1: but has some bursts. He's a good player, Probably gonna
Speaker 1: go higher in the patch to take a back. And
Speaker 1: then he mentioned Donovan Edwards, who I took in my
Speaker 1: last mock draft for the Patriots on ninety five at
Speaker 1: sports sub dot com. He's exactly right, Donovan Edwards in
Speaker 1: a Josh McDaniels offense, if they're gonna go back to
Speaker 1: early down and passing down right, and they don't want
Speaker 1: to spend big on a running back. I think I
Speaker 1: said this to you last week. He's Rex Burkhead. He's
Speaker 1: gonna be able to play both roles, and he gives
Speaker 1: you backup for Andre Stephenson. He gives you back up
Speaker 1: for Antonio Gibson. He's a guy that can be a
Speaker 1: factor week in and week out and do a variety
Speaker 1: of things. So he is a fantastic Patriots fit. He's
Speaker 1: currently being projected in the seventh round. I think that's
Speaker 1: low but about right. But like grabbing him later on
Speaker 1: day three, he fits tremendously into what I think they're
Speaker 1: gonna try to do with their running backs.
Speaker 2: Yeah. My one question with the tight ends with Warren
Speaker 2: and Loveland, and I kind of went back and forth
Speaker 2: and had a tough time with this as well. There's
Speaker 2: no doubt that Warren is the more well rounded and
Speaker 2: more polished, just like you were saying earlier, Like there's
Speaker 2: tape of him at a high volume carrying an offense
Speaker 2: and all that kind of stuff. There's no doubt about
Speaker 2: that with Warren. But even though he's more well rounded,
Speaker 2: Loveland is definitely the more dynamic player, right, So, like,
Speaker 2: which one do you gravitate towards as an offense is
Speaker 2: gonna be an interesting conversation that I think is gonna
Speaker 2: become closer and closer as the draft gets closer, because
Speaker 2: you know, there's gonna be two schools of thought, like
Speaker 2: one one school is gonna be you know, this guy
Speaker 2: is gonna you know, Loveland is is a true chunk artist,
Speaker 2: like he is a big play, explosive athlete at his size,
Speaker 2: especially whereas Warren is is just a well rounded, polished
Speaker 2: tight end prospect. And which one do you gravitate towards? Like,
Speaker 2: I think it's a good conversation for.
Speaker 1: What they are right now, I'd probably go with Warren.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I have Warren a little bit ahead of Loveland too.
Speaker 1: I think there are teams where Loveland might make more sense.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think a lot of those, you know,
Speaker 2: those teams you look at guys, you know, Brat Bauers
Speaker 2: is kind of like a unicorn, but like you look
Speaker 2: at like a Sam Laporta for example, Like if you
Speaker 2: put him in that kind of exotic run, smash mouth
Speaker 2: type of team that likes to play action and likes
Speaker 2: to sneak tight ends out and all that kind of stuff,
Speaker 2: then like having someone as explosive as Loveland. I think
Speaker 2: it translates a lot like Sam Laporta in De Troit.
Speaker 1: You know, I could totally see Loveland Kansas City. Okay,
Speaker 1: I can see that like as Travis Kelsey's replacement.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a good point. Andy is in Subbury. What's
Speaker 2: up Andy? Hey?
Speaker 6: Guys?
Speaker 4: How are we doing today?
Speaker 2: Good?
Speaker 1: Good?
Speaker 4: So I'm completely in agreement with you. If either Hunter
Speaker 4: or if either if either Hunter or Carter is THEREK
Speaker 4: for you take him. Other than that, I would trade
Speaker 4: down to about the six or seventh spot. And I'm
Speaker 4: still a Teed McMillan guy. But I really was interested
Speaker 4: in hearing you guys out on Tyler Warren because I
Speaker 4: love him and like you said, Jess McDaniels is a
Speaker 4: master with poo tight insects. I could see him with
Speaker 4: Paul and with Hunter, Henry and Drake me.
Speaker 2: Thanks guys, thanks for the calling. He appreciate it. We
Speaker 2: talked a lot about Tyler Warren earlier, but we're both there.
Speaker 2: I think Tyler Warren is a guy that's on both
Speaker 2: of our radars, probably in the trade down, but really
Speaker 2: intriguing player. Do you want to get to some of
Speaker 2: these emails. We got a bunch of emails. Can we
Speaker 2: do rapid fire?
Speaker 1: We can because I want to give.
Speaker 2: These guys. So Floyd email is in from Michigan. Floyd's
Speaker 2: a regular listener, so I appreciate that, and he kind
Speaker 2: of gets me here a little bit. This is a
Speaker 2: good rebuttal to my Will Campbell over Mason Graham. He
Speaker 2: said that I have said in the past that you
Speaker 2: don't reach on need in the draft, that you take
Speaker 2: the best player available. You don't reach on need. And
Speaker 2: a lot of people have Mason Graham over Will Campbell.
Speaker 2: So wouldn't taking Will Campbell over Mason Graham be reaching
Speaker 2: because of the tackle position. I think my just one
Speaker 2: kind of rebuttal. It's a good point. He kind of
Speaker 2: got me there a little bit. Is just that I
Speaker 2: have I look at Will Campbell Mason Graham as closer
Speaker 2: as prospects than other people.
Speaker 1: I don't that's I understand not reaching for talent people.
Speaker 1: Why are you reaching for Will Campbell? I don't think
Speaker 1: I'm reaching. Now, let's see again city our measurement. But
Speaker 1: in this interesting he's still training as a tackle. Yep,
Speaker 1: Jeremy or as of like two three weeks ago. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so he knows something maybe there, Like, I don't think
Speaker 1: it's a reach for Will Campbell at four. I don't
Speaker 1: I wouldn't reach for a player at four. I don't
Speaker 1: think Will Campbell's all reach it for.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree with that. This is from Brian who
Speaker 2: says that he's a listener since the Sealing s days,
Speaker 2: so shut out there to clintis the Travis Hunter question
Speaker 2: that I think we get a lot here?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Is is it like having two bites of the apple with
Speaker 2: one player because if you try him out at receiver
Speaker 2: and he fails, then you can move him to corner
Speaker 2: or vice versa. Like, do you feel like that adds
Speaker 2: value to that Travis.
Speaker 1: Underdill, because that's not really what it is, because he's
Speaker 1: still getting older as you're going, and what at twenty six,
Speaker 1: twenty seven, you're gonna have him start learning a new
Speaker 1: position that he probably hasn't spent a lot of time
Speaker 1: at the last few years. It honestly kind of reminds
Speaker 1: me when I worked in minor league baseball and these
Speaker 1: guys would come through after you know, four or five
Speaker 1: years trying to be a catcher, trying to be a
Speaker 1: shortstop couldn't get up to the system and that you know,
Speaker 1: they go back to a ball and start trying to pitch.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So, and it's not a perfect comparison, but like, no,
Speaker 1: your your development plan is what it is. If it
Speaker 1: doesn't work, somebody else is probably going to try to
Speaker 1: do that.
Speaker 2: Yep. So a couple of Josh Simmons questions. One person
Speaker 2: pointed out that in the past Vrabel is taking some
Speaker 2: risks on some injury guys, you know, Caleb Farreley like that,
Speaker 2: those types of players back, and another one just asking it.
Speaker 2: You know, didn't hear us talk about Josh Simmons. I
Speaker 2: did mention him in my Honorable Mentions in my post
Speaker 2: this morning on Patriots dot com. But I think the
Speaker 2: biggest thing to me with a guy like Simmons is
Speaker 2: just that we'd be having a different conversation. If he
Speaker 2: was healthy and he played the same way throughout the
Speaker 2: entire college football season that he did in the first
Speaker 2: five games, then he would be left tackle ot one,
Speaker 2: Like he'd be the top tackle in the draft.
Speaker 1: That's what I don't want to hear. Well, you know,
Speaker 1: if he was healthy, but he's not. Yeah, we're not
Speaker 1: drafting in a world where he's healthy, So you just
Speaker 1: you can't make that argument because it's not the reality.
Speaker 2: YEP. Question from David, another regular listener from Madrid. He
Speaker 2: mentioned that he read the breakdown I did on the
Speaker 2: Rabel and Terrell Williams defense and talking a lot about
Speaker 2: four to five defenses and even fronts and four to
Speaker 2: three and that kind of stuff, And does that change,
Speaker 2: you know, the way that they approach the draft, And
Speaker 2: I definitely think it does. But I do wonder if
Speaker 2: Rabel's a good coach, and good coaches are able to adapt, right,
Speaker 2: and if he looks at it and he says, okay, well,
Speaker 2: we could try to run the four down mechanics that
Speaker 2: we ran in Tennessee. But that's a complete overhaul, like
Speaker 2: defensive line linebacker room, like Jawan Bentley can't be here,
Speaker 2: Jelani Tavai can't be here, you know, Devon Godshaw can't
Speaker 2: be here, like these guys that have played a lot
Speaker 2: of snaps for you and are important players over the
Speaker 2: last couple of years. I'm not saying that they could.
Speaker 2: They might, they won't take that approach, but I do
Speaker 2: wonder if they kind of pivot or tweak, so they
Speaker 2: don't have to completely throw everybody out at the bathwater, right,
Speaker 2: because then you're getting into a position now where you're
Speaker 2: talking about like a two or three year rebuild on
Speaker 2: the defensive side of the ball, and you're in this
Speaker 2: canoe and you have all these holes and you're taking
Speaker 2: on water, and now you're just creating more holes in
Speaker 2: the canoe by doing that. So I do think that
Speaker 2: there's a happy medium there, like a balance that they
Speaker 2: could strike. What that sort of thing? Yeah, all right,
Speaker 2: do we have a lot of lengthy questions here, but
Speaker 2: so this one of rumors, you know, free agency rumors,
Speaker 2: AJ Brown, DK Metcalf, T Higgins, you know all the
Speaker 2: name wide receivers you hear a lot about. I don't
Speaker 2: think that the AJ Brown rumors are very realistic, do you.
Speaker 1: I wish I'd like them to be. I don't know
Speaker 1: that they are, but I'm gonna keep my hopes up.
Speaker 2: We do have some people outside of this show and
Speaker 2: outside of you that are starting to talk a little
Speaker 2: bit about DK Metcalf coming available. So maybe so.
Speaker 1: Let me address this. Let me address this one thing
Speaker 1: on DK Metcalf. I know there was that clip he
Speaker 1: was on with was it? Uh who was he on
Speaker 1: with like a couple of weeks ago, Katie Nolan, Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think and was asked, you know, oh, and he
Speaker 1: said like, oh, I'd never live in Massachusetts. One, it's
Speaker 1: always Rhode Island. That's not a bad commute. Two And
Speaker 1: more realistically, like guys say that if you're gonna if
Speaker 1: you know you might be negotiating a contract with the
Speaker 1: Patriots down the road, Yeah, you're not gonna say yeah,
Speaker 1: I'd love to play there, right, So you know he's
Speaker 1: not gonna live here. There's a dollar amount that he'll
Speaker 1: live here. And I think it's very important for the
Speaker 1: Patriots to let it be known. For Metcalf, for Brown,
Speaker 1: for any other wide receiver that's thinking that they need
Speaker 1: their next deal, there is a big fat contract waiting
Speaker 1: for them if they can make their way here. I
Speaker 1: think that's important to be known. I'm not ruling Dk
Speaker 1: Metcalf out because that comment he made with Katie Nolan,
Speaker 1: not saying that it's not relevant. But everybody has their price,
Speaker 1: you know, for for thirty million a year, come live
Speaker 1: here for three four years. Yeah, Suddenly that conversation looks
Speaker 1: a little different.
Speaker 2: So I feel as similarly with T Higgins, because I
Speaker 2: feel like a lot of people are they're not They're
Speaker 2: not gonna get T Higgins. There's no way he'd pick
Speaker 2: to come here if he's an unrestricted free agent. I
Speaker 2: feel the same way a little bit with T Higgins.
Speaker 2: Where is T Higgins? Is he Jamar Chase? No, he's
Speaker 2: not Jamar Chase. But the Patriots are kind of in
Speaker 2: a spot where they just have to overpay for talent
Speaker 2: at this point. So I'm rolling out the red carpet
Speaker 2: for T Higgins too if he's a free agent, and
Speaker 2: I'm winning the bidding war, and a lot of these
Speaker 2: players like they'll just take the highest. He will take
Speaker 2: the money, They'll take the money. And I also think
Speaker 2: you're in a little bit of a positioning. You have
Speaker 2: an NFL caliber head coach. Now, you have a respected,
Speaker 2: you know, high end coach and Mike Rabel, and you
Speaker 2: have a quarterback, a young quarterback, but a quarterback that
Speaker 2: I think a lot of receivers will look at and say,
Speaker 2: I don't know if we're gonna win right out of
Speaker 2: the shoot. I don't know if we're gonna be you know,
Speaker 2: if we're gonna where exactly how long it's gonna take.
Speaker 2: But he can get me the ball, Like, there's no
Speaker 2: question about that. So if you're a receiver and you
Speaker 2: get the money, you got a quarterback that can play,
Speaker 2: you have a coach that knows what he's doing. It's
Speaker 2: not the greatest situation, but it's not the worst situation
Speaker 2: either anymore. I think there is right worse situations. So
Speaker 2: I think that that that hasn't going for has they
Speaker 2: have that going for them? And like I said, you
Speaker 2: just just throw money at them. Just just you gotta try.
Speaker 2: You gotta try. You gotta try to pitch te Higgins
Speaker 2: on coming here. All right, we'll take this last call
Speaker 2: and then we'll do some recency bias worry how about that?
Speaker 2: All Right? William is in Philly? What's up, Willie?
Speaker 3: Hey?
Speaker 7: What's going on? How you doing? He could all right, Hey,
Speaker 7: all right, I got I guess I gotta make this
Speaker 7: showing brief because I don't call like that like I
Speaker 7: used to when a So is this this a third
Speaker 7: rebuild basically or is this.
Speaker 1: Going to be the fourth? Uh?
Speaker 7: Second, it's the second? Okay?
Speaker 1: Well, because so like the Cam Newton year was a reset,
Speaker 1: they tried the mac Jones rebuild. And now that like
Speaker 1: I I market by quarterbacks. I guess if you want
Speaker 1: to say it's by coaches, then he adds third, but
Speaker 1: I go by quarterbacks, so it's second.
Speaker 7: Okay. The gentlemen, they gotta get they gotta get this right, seriously,
Speaker 7: like Elliot wolfs got to get this right. I mean,
Speaker 7: it's you had the due threat, the dual threat quarterback.
Speaker 7: You have the coach, all right, you you let's go.
Speaker 7: You know what I'm saying, like, let's go. Let's don't
Speaker 7: play a round. Know who you want going for the
Speaker 7: AC going to Drake, get your players that you're supposed
Speaker 7: to have this build this put players around Trake. Make
Speaker 7: you didn't do around Meg Jones, you really did. You
Speaker 7: played around and s going on his rookie deal.
Speaker 2: This.
Speaker 7: Don't do that to Drake. Okay, And that's what I
Speaker 7: have to say.
Speaker 2: Thanks, Thanks, William appreciated. Good to hear from you. Uh yeah,
Speaker 2: look at I don't hold what Bill Belichick did against
Speaker 2: this regime. I don't even really hold what happened last
Speaker 2: year against his dream. I know Elliot Wolf's still here.
Speaker 2: I know he has a prominent title, but they're they're
Speaker 2: the Big Three, Mike Rabel, Ryan Cowden, Elliott Wolf. Two
Speaker 2: of them have the same brain, and that's Mike Rabel
Speaker 2: and Ryan Cowden. And when you get to that vote
Speaker 2: and there's two against one on everything, like, who do
Speaker 2: you think is going to win the battle? Right, It's
Speaker 2: gonna be Mike Rabel. Mike Rabel is gonna have the
Speaker 2: final say. So, I don't necessarily look at it like
Speaker 2: it's the same front office, is the same setup. I
Speaker 2: think it's pretty significantly different. So there's a new rebuild.
Speaker 2: It's it's thanks they're basically on try number three. I
Speaker 2: guess try number two. I would say, really, yeah, of
Speaker 2: trying to do this whole thing all right, uh, recent bias,
Speaker 2: what do you got?
Speaker 1: I got two for you there. These are depth players
Speaker 1: I'm getting really in the research now, Okay. Number one, Yeah,
Speaker 1: Joseph Evans utsa geez so for all he was the
Speaker 1: Shrine Bowl.
Speaker 2: Yeah, for all.
Speaker 1: We talk about, you know, Mason Graham and Dion Walker
Speaker 1: and like these interior pressure guys, they also need to
Speaker 1: get a true run stopping nose tackle. Doesn't need to
Speaker 1: be in the top one hundred, but they need to
Speaker 1: get a guy who can stop the run. Joseph Evans,
Speaker 1: big physical think he's like six five three forty from Utsa.
Speaker 1: Had an injury last year that cost the most of
Speaker 1: the season. That's kind of knocked him down boards. He's
Speaker 1: a late day three guy now. But we're gonna do that.
Speaker 1: We do this every year. We find like a handful
Speaker 1: of nose tackles we like late in the draft and
Speaker 1: just try to throw them in mock drafts to be like,
Speaker 1: that guy's gonna help address the run. So I just
Speaker 1: did my first mock draft. I needed one of those guys.
Speaker 1: Joseph Evans UTSA.
Speaker 2: Okay, roadrunner.
Speaker 1: Road Runner, that's right, next one, meet me my other one.
Speaker 1: And I saw some people talking about this in the
Speaker 1: chat earlier. Kicker is indeed, so I I finally went,
Speaker 1: you like, looked at all.
Speaker 2: The cower in fifty five minutes into the show, Allow
Speaker 2: a kicker minute.
Speaker 1: Go ahead, Well, under Bill, the kind of role thumb
Speaker 1: was they wanted kickers with experience kicking in inclement weather,
Speaker 1: which I think is a good idea. I would hope
Speaker 1: they continue that. But I'm looking at this class. These
Speaker 1: are all guys that kicked in the South. There's really
Speaker 1: not a lot of guys with the experience kickers. One
Speaker 1: is Joonahdalmas who was not good in the playoffs Softom
Speaker 1: Boys and State. If there's one guy that fits better,
Speaker 1: call Sauls. Ben Sauls from pitt He was what is it?
Speaker 1: I think five of six from fifty plus last year
Speaker 1: and a lot of that.
Speaker 2: That's it.
Speaker 1: He's used to kicking the afterture at Heinz Field.
Speaker 2: Which is it's one of the toughest, if not the
Speaker 2: toughest stadium for NFL kickers.
Speaker 1: I don't know that they're going to draft a kicker
Speaker 1: this year. I think there's a chance that they bring
Speaker 1: back Sly or another VAD and that guy competes with
Speaker 1: Romo and maybe UDFA. Maybe Sauls is a u DFA.
Speaker 1: I don't know. There's I'm okay not using a draft
Speaker 1: pick or high draft pick on a kicker this year.
Speaker 1: They it's not the class to do it. But if
Speaker 1: they want a rookie kicker, to me, Ben Sauls is
Speaker 1: the guy.
Speaker 2: Ben Salts the kicker, there's your kicker. I am definitely
Speaker 2: in a much different spot in my research than you, clearly,
Speaker 2: so I'm still in the top one hundred and.
Speaker 1: Hang out real quick, because I have his numbers six
Speaker 1: of seven from fifty plus last year, twenty one of
Speaker 1: twenty four total.
Speaker 2: Okay, there's your kicker minute Ben Saws. So a couple
Speaker 2: of guys that I think, uh, you know, stood out
Speaker 2: to me. One of them I think is gonna it.
Speaker 2: Surprised you. I texted you about it this morning. I
Speaker 2: was pleasantly surprised by Trey Harris from ole Mis. He
Speaker 2: not a burner, definitely not a burner. Not your guy,
Speaker 2: that's not your turn receiver. He can't run. He's probably
Speaker 2: gonna run like a four five five like honestly, he's
Speaker 2: He's definitely not fast.
Speaker 1: So he has an ad isaya bond. Doesn't have an
Speaker 1: hand so he has quite.
Speaker 2: The end, but his is He's a very very good
Speaker 2: route runner, very good route runner, like deceptive good salesman,
Speaker 2: changes tempo, changes, speeds within the route, can separate at
Speaker 2: the top break down at six foot three like to
Speaker 2: be able to get in and out of a break
Speaker 2: in the three steps and gain ground out of breaks
Speaker 2: and create separation at the top of routes like that's
Speaker 2: hard to do with that size. He has some catch radius,
Speaker 2: he has some gantastic catchability as well. What I what
Speaker 2: I was intrigued by is that, Okay, if we're talking
Speaker 2: about third round, you know, the Atlanta pick or their
Speaker 2: original third round pick, once he runs the forty fair
Speaker 2: when we talk about those that range of the draft.
Speaker 2: Like his skill set, he is a typical perimeter receiver,
Speaker 2: Like he is an outside X receiver. Is he the
Speaker 2: X receiver? No, but he is a X receiver. And
Speaker 2: if they are going to you know, get some other options,
Speaker 2: you know, fill some other holes elsewhere on this offense
Speaker 2: to be bringing dine guys like, I think he fills
Speaker 2: a role on the outside. So the comp that I
Speaker 2: came up with was Brandon lafel Right, who also ran
Speaker 2: like a mid four five. Wasn't a burner, but was
Speaker 2: a good route runner, was good at the catch point.
Speaker 2: I had some size to him, had some girth to
Speaker 2: his body type, and that was just kind of heady, right, Like,
Speaker 2: he's just kind of witty with his route running. And
Speaker 2: I look at I look at Trey Harris's similar type
Speaker 2: of player. I thought that I was going to get
Speaker 2: into Trey Harris's film and see a slow, contested catch,
Speaker 2: jump ball kind of guy and I thought that he
Speaker 2: ran routes a lot better than what I was expecting.
Speaker 2: So if we're talking about him in the third or
Speaker 2: fourth round after he runs a four to six, then like, sure,
Speaker 2: I'm in. I think I could be persuaded with that.
Speaker 1: I think realistically, and this is gonna sound counterdudive. That's
Speaker 1: the highest they should be taking a receiver is like
Speaker 1: late in the third because they need to go get
Speaker 1: a veteran. They need to go get a proven guy,
Speaker 1: and they're you can only have so many bodies at
Speaker 1: the position, and these guys need to play. So you know,
Speaker 1: let's say they add t Higgins. Yeah, him and McMillan
Speaker 1: aren't gonna be on the field together. Now him and
Speaker 1: Buka Mike might make sense, but yeah, you don't. There's
Speaker 1: other positions where they need premium asslets. They have Pop
Speaker 1: Douglas coming back, they have Kendrick Bord coming back like Kaishawn.
Speaker 1: But you have depth guys, yeah right, you have depth receivers.
Speaker 1: It's not like you have nothing in that room. You
Speaker 1: need somebody at the top of the depth chart. And
Speaker 1: that guy, unless you know it's Ted McMillan, who you're
Speaker 1: you don't even sound convinced about would be that that
Speaker 1: guy's probably not in this draft. So like a guy
Speaker 1: in that range, like I really like Kay Williams from
Speaker 1: Washington State who's probably gonna go around there maybe a
Speaker 1: little later. That's about where they should probably be taking
Speaker 1: a receiver. And in the Josh McDaniels offense, the X
Speaker 1: is not as much of a factor, so just having
Speaker 1: you don't need that, maybe you don't need that dominant X.
Speaker 1: If they get one, great and McDaniels will adjust, but
Speaker 1: it's not necessary like it is in some other offense.
Speaker 2: So I look at it like in the top one
Speaker 2: hundred the tiers of that X prototype. So obviously Ted
Speaker 2: is the is the top tier in this draft, right,
Speaker 2: He's the top tier X. I think Jayden Higgins is
Speaker 2: tier two. I think he's the second best X receiver
Speaker 2: in this class. And that body type, you know, six '
Speaker 2: three plus, good size, good catch radious, good ability to
Speaker 2: win on the outside. And then I would put Trey
Speaker 2: Harris as the third tier, right, So we're doing those
Speaker 2: like rungs the tiers of player. I liked him a
Speaker 2: lot more than I thought I was going to, so
Speaker 2: I'm kind of in on Trey Harris. Now, last thing
Speaker 2: I just look at, you know, a lot of those
Speaker 2: Day two guys for Strepo, Jalen Noel, the kid from
Speaker 2: Utahs Day. What's his name, Yeah, Jalen Royals. Those guys
Speaker 2: are slots. Like those guys are kind of pure slot
Speaker 2: maybe Z type of receivers and Royal's case. So there's
Speaker 2: not a ton I would say true ex body types
Speaker 2: on Day two other than Higgins and and other than Harris, Like,
Speaker 2: those are the two guys that are kind of in
Speaker 2: that mold. So I liked them. I thought he was
Speaker 2: a good player. That's it. That's all I got, all right,
Speaker 2: So that does it for today's show as a beefy show,
Speaker 2: that's it. That was a catch twenty eight.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we got you wanted the draft, you gave me the.
Speaker 2: We were in the weeds on that one, and we
Speaker 2: came out of the gate hot with some of your
Speaker 2: super Bowl takes, your yours.
Speaker 1: I heard too much the last few weeks and not
Speaker 1: take that victory.
Speaker 2: Listen. So we'll be back next week, do a little
Speaker 2: combine preview combines right around the corner a week from
Speaker 2: Mondays almost mark sec and maybe I won't be alone
Speaker 2: maybe we'll see, we'll see. We're working on it, so
Speaker 2: we'll be back next week, same time, same place to
Speaker 2: break down the Combine, preview the Combine, talk about arm
Speaker 2: length and all that good stuff, so I can't wait
Speaker 2: for that. And one last time, Easy to Drink, Easy
Speaker 2: to Enjoy bud Light, the official beer sponsor of the
Speaker 2: New England Patriot. We'll see you guys next week.
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