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Speaker 1: Hey, guys, Saga and Crystal here.

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Speaker 2: Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election,

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Speaker 2: and we are so excited about what that means for

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Speaker 2: the future of this show.

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Speaker 3: This is the only place where you can find honest

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Speaker 3: perspectives from the left and the right that simply does

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Speaker 3: not exist anywhere else.

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Speaker 2: So if that is something that's important to you, please

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Speaker 2: go to Breakingpoints dot com. Become a member today and

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Speaker 2: you'll get access to our full shows, unedited, ad free,

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Speaker 2: and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.

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Speaker 3: We need your help to build the future of independent

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Speaker 3: news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints

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Speaker 3: dot com.

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Speaker 4: Hi, good morning, and welcome to the Counterpoints.

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Speaker 5: Emily, how you doing, ghead?

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Speaker 6: It's really rainy here in Washington, DC, but it's that's

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Speaker 6: December for you here.

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Speaker 1: It is used to be snowy here in December, but

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Speaker 1: not so much anymore anyway, Thank you for that. Exon

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Speaker 1: wanted to start, wanted to start really quick?

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Speaker 5: Himn hot just now.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's it's obnoxious on my way in. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: this could be snow, and when I was a kid

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Speaker 1: this would be snow. Instead, this is gross. But I

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Speaker 1: wanted to update people real quickly on the thing that

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Speaker 1: still told you about in the morning, where she encouraged

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Speaker 1: everyone to buy Ray Fatt a layer's book of poetry

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Speaker 1: and prose, which came out yesterday called If I Must Die.

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Speaker 1: We've been pushing everyone to buy it over the last week,

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Speaker 1: trying to make it a best seller.

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Speaker 4: I just checked.

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Speaker 1: It's number sixty three in the world right now. The publisher,

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Speaker 1: as Crystal mentioned, told me that as of several days ago,

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Speaker 1: already ten thousand orders had come in, probably closer to

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Speaker 1: thirteen fourteen thousand by now, which means it has a

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Speaker 1: real shot of making the New York Times bestseller list

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Speaker 1: in its first week out. So basically, you have until

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Speaker 1: Friday to put your orders in. It is completely out

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Speaker 1: of stock. They sold out their entire first print run,

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Speaker 1: but you're still able to order it.

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Speaker 4: That just means you won't get it until they do

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Speaker 4: another print run.

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Speaker 1: So if you already ordered a copy, go get some more,

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Speaker 1: because you know you have people in your life who need.

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Speaker 4: A great book of poetry and prose.

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Speaker 1: And it's a message to Ray Fott's surviving family and

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Speaker 1: to the Palatine and people in general that he has

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Speaker 1: not forgotten. He has not been forgotten. They have not

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Speaker 1: been forgotten. We have nothing to do with it commercially.

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Speaker 1: All the royalties go to a surviving family. We just

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Speaker 1: would love to see this sor so, thank you for that.

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Speaker 5: Keep calling poetry is a great holiday gift.

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Speaker 1: It is, absolutely it absolutely is.

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Speaker 6: We have a really packed show today, really packed show today.

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Speaker 5: The news is relentless. We're going to start actually with

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Speaker 5: a little news.

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Speaker 6: I guess about Mitch McConnell, and we'll go then into

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Speaker 6: the breaking story that's unfolding continuously about Luigi Mangioni. Kenklippenstein

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Speaker 6: secured the manifesto, released the released the manifesto yesterday, so

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Speaker 6: we have all kinds of new details to talk about.

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Speaker 6: When it comes to the assassination of Brian Thompson. We're

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Speaker 6: then going to talk about updates also relentless breaking news

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Speaker 6: cycle from Syria. We're going to break down the Pete

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Speaker 6: Hegseth rape allegations from the police report for everyone that's

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Speaker 6: you came out a few weeks ago.

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Speaker 4: But it looks like he might get through.

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Speaker 5: He looks like he might get through.

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Speaker 1: Oh, it's important for people to know whether or not

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Speaker 1: they're depending on secretary as a rapist.

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Speaker 6: And Ryan suggested we actually like kind of walk through

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Speaker 6: the police report, so stay tuned to go through that

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Speaker 6: with us. We're going to talk about the Trump Department

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Speaker 6: of Justice getting caught by Michael Horowitz, Inspector General who

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Speaker 6: produced actually a very good report on Russia collusion not

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Speaker 6: that long ago, finding improper spying on journalists and Republican

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Speaker 6: and Democratic lawmakers. So people, it was like twenty Republicans

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Speaker 6: twenty one Democrats.

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Speaker 5: Or maybe reverse twenty one Republicans and.

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Speaker 6: Twenty Democrats, but absolutely improper spying on journalists to catch leakers.

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Speaker 6: And we've got a great bill Mark clip. You're gonna

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Speaker 6: want to stay tuned for the bill Mark Club.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and the ethnic cleansing of Northern Gaza continues with

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Speaker 1: these assaults on multiple hospitals, come a lott When Hospital

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Speaker 1: and Anesian Hospital. We won't have a chance to talk

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Speaker 1: about that day. I'll be on the show tomorrow filling

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Speaker 1: in for Crystal. Sure, sure we'll get to that.

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Speaker 4: For our Pakistani audience. We had a big.

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Speaker 1: Story yesterday over a drop site. You can read that there.

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Speaker 1: We don't have a chance to get to that one either.

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Speaker 1: Maybe we can do that tomorrow. Basically, we according to Leeks,

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Speaker 1: we got out of Pakistan. The November twenty sixth massacre

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Speaker 1: that we covered was actually pre planned and it was

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Speaker 1: basically an ambush. Just so maybe we'll talk about that

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Speaker 1: more tomorrow. But so much going on in the world.

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Speaker 1: Let's just get into it.

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Speaker 5: Let's get into it.

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Speaker 6: We're going to start with this first tear sheet and

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Speaker 6: just do a kind of quick report from Capitol Hill

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Speaker 6: where Mitch McConnell, who's no longer the Senate Minority leader,

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Speaker 6: he had a fall.

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Speaker 5: We can put a one up on the screen. This

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Speaker 5: is from the Associated Press.

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Speaker 6: He fell and sprained his wrist yesterday literally on Capitol Hill.

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Speaker 6: There was you know, you could see medical personnel going

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Speaker 6: into assist him in his office. And the reason we're

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Speaker 6: talking about this is that Mitch McConnell is clearly too

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Speaker 6: old to be in office. And by old, I mean

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Speaker 6: there are people who are older than him. I think

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Speaker 6: Bernie Sanders might be older than him. When I say old,

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Speaker 6: I mean he's incapacitated. He's we're getting to Feinstein territory with.

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Speaker 1: The Yeah, so I'm curious, do we know physical verse

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Speaker 1: mental incapacity? Here.

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Speaker 5: I mean mentally, he seems perfectly sharp.

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Speaker 4: Right, he had that brain freeze, but he had.

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Speaker 6: That brain freeze. Yeah, I shouldn't say perfectly sharp. He seems,

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Speaker 6: you know, like an older man. But you know, he

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Speaker 6: doesn't seem like Biden. I guess Biden is the comparison. Yeah,

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Speaker 6: Mitch McConnell doesn't seem to have gone to Biden levels.

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Speaker 1: Right, And what we can reveal here is that there

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Speaker 1: are he's going to enormous lengths to basically cover up,

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Speaker 1: you know, how physically frail at least he has gotten yes,

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Speaker 1: which you know presidents like JFK and FDR all did

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Speaker 1: you know, attempting a tempting to show more physical vigor

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Speaker 1: than they had. But go ahead comes from this comes

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Speaker 1: from your side.

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Speaker 6: I was just gonna say, I mean, I think it's

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Speaker 6: it's for the reason that you're saying it's important that

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Speaker 6: we probe Mitch McConnell's health right now, because he's still

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Speaker 6: incredibly influential in center Republican leadership. They're about to have

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Speaker 6: the majority, so he's a very consequential figure. Still, he

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Speaker 6: doesn't need to be in office. He's had physical medical challenges,

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Speaker 6: and yet we can put a two up on the screen.

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Speaker 6: This is actually an exclusive image that we have here

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Speaker 6: at breaking points.

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Speaker 5: This was the day after the election.

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Speaker 6: Mitch McConnell at Reagan International Airport in a wheelchair being

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Speaker 6: pushed by a staffer. That may not seem like a

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Speaker 6: big deal. There has been reporting that he uses a wheelchair,

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Speaker 6: and there may or may not be a couple other

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Speaker 6: photos of him in a wheelchair floating around out there.

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Speaker 6: I didn't see many, and that's because they're carefully trying

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Speaker 6: to prevent these photos from being published because they to

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Speaker 6: your point, Ryan, it's as similar to FDR and JFK.

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Speaker 6: And not wanting to give any sense of incapacity, but

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Speaker 6: Mitch McConnell is staying in the Senate too, As he said,

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Speaker 6: make sure that the fight for Ukraine as he sees

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Speaker 6: it is complete.

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Speaker 1: As a sub committee chair of this important Armed Services panel,

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Speaker 1: he has personally intervened. Probably you know, without Mitch McConnell,

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Speaker 1: Ukraine may not have the funding that it has yes

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Speaker 1: this point.

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Speaker 5: He has made it a priority.

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Speaker 1: Now I have my own piece of reporting that I

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Speaker 1: can add to that. A source of mind flew next

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Speaker 1: him on a commercial flight and when they arrived, there

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Speaker 1: was a wheelchair waiting for him, but McConnell angrily kind.

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Speaker 4: Of refused it.

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Speaker 1: So you know, it's not that he's constantly in need

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Speaker 1: of a wheelchair, and he's very clear, he's very cognizant

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Speaker 1: of what it represents. His refusal to use it yesterday

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Speaker 1: led obviously to his fall and to his injury, to

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Speaker 1: the injury on his face and his wrists, I think

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Speaker 1: more importantly from a political perspective.

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Speaker 4: The source also.

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Speaker 1: Said that he ate a tune a fish sandwich on

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Speaker 1: this commercial flight, but he wasn't in first class. He

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Speaker 1: was not in first class. And at that point, it's like, okay,

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Speaker 1: your flying coach, despite the fact that you could fly

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Speaker 1: first class, because you want to be with the people.

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Speaker 1: You want to show that you're a man of the people.

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Speaker 1: You sit down among these people of which you are

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Speaker 1: one of the men, and you open up a tune

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Speaker 1: of fish sandwich, go to first class. The level of

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Speaker 1: take that to first class, the people will be okay

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Speaker 1: without you being in there right, just get to come on.

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Speaker 6: The level of out of touchness at that point is astounding,

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Speaker 6: not surprising, but astounding.

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Speaker 1: On the line, I try to not bring any like

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Speaker 1: even like you know, fries or anything that's gonna even

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Speaker 1: so if it smells good life fries, No nobody, nobody

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Speaker 1: wants to smell your food.

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Speaker 5: And it's just a small space anyway.

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Speaker 1: That's why the world made like granola bars.

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Speaker 5: That's true. Brian does love granola bars.

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Speaker 1: That does the trick. You don't need a tune of

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Speaker 1: fish sandwich.

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Speaker 6: Mitch McConnell, Yeah, to write his point, has put himself

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Speaker 6: in a position on a subcommittee chair arm service where

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Speaker 6: he's and he said as much.

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Speaker 5: He's not being quiet about this.

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Speaker 6: He sees the reason that he's continuing to stick around

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Speaker 6: the Senate des try having right. He had that brain

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Speaker 6: freeze everyone remembers where he just sort of seems to

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Speaker 6: pause in the middle of a sentence. Has actually it

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Speaker 6: happened twice? He's clearly so. While he may be on

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Speaker 6: a good day in perfectly healthy mental shape, he may

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Speaker 6: feel like he's him his old self. We can put

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Speaker 6: a three up on the screen. This is more examples

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Speaker 6: of his physical health problems.

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Speaker 5: You can see just as.

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Speaker 6: Yesterday, Yeah, banded on his face and his wrist is

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Speaker 6: really swollen and purple. But when I started this black

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Speaker 6: by saying Mitch McConnell's too old to be in the Senate.

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Speaker 6: I mean there are people who are older at this

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Speaker 6: point who are probably sharper. I think Bernie Sanders is

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Speaker 6: older than him.

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Speaker 4: Although he were in Ukraine, they'd can script him to

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Speaker 4: the front line.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, he'd be ready to go.

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Speaker 6: Bernie Sanders, I think also said yesterday in an interview,

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Speaker 6: it's a little bit of breaking news too that this

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Speaker 6: will probably be his last time.

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Speaker 5: So it will be eighty nine when I get out

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Speaker 5: of here.

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Speaker 4: Because he was just elected. He got six years. Yeah.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 6: But Mitch McConnell, even after all of these health problems,

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Speaker 6: refuses to resign and continues to put himself in powerful positions.

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Speaker 6: He did step down as Senate minority leader and soon

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Speaker 6: to be sent a majority leader, but he continues to

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Speaker 6: put himself in powerful positions because he is clinging to

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Speaker 6: his ability to continue funneling money to Ukraine. He sees

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Speaker 6: it as an existential crisis for democracy. This is how

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Speaker 6: he would phrase it. He's not been quiet about any

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Speaker 6: of this, and we think that it's important that he

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Speaker 6: should be transparent actually.

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Speaker 5: About what his health is and how ill he is.

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Speaker 1: And there you go, And from that perspective, I understand

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Speaker 1: why he would stay in because when you're a senator

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Speaker 1: and a chairman of a powerful committee that doles out money,

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Speaker 1: it's not as if it's a constant intellectual contest.

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Speaker 4: He's not playing speed chests all day long.

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Speaker 1: He just needs to sit in that position, box everybody out,

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Speaker 1: demand that they've moved the money that he once moved,

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Speaker 1: and just stand there until it happens.

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Speaker 4: So in that sense, as long as.

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Speaker 1: You're with it a little bit out of the day

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Speaker 1: and you can be wheeled in and out, you actually

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Speaker 1: can do just as much for the most part in

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Speaker 1: that position as you could as a thirty six year old, spry,

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Speaker 1: young senator.

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Speaker 5: Yep, yeah, no, it makes sense.

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Speaker 6: Let's move on to the unfolding saga of Luigi Mangioni,

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Speaker 6: whose manifesto was was first released in full by Front

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Speaker 6: of the Show Ken Klippenstein yesterday. We can put V

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Speaker 6: zero up on the screen. This is the manifesto itself.

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Speaker 6: It's very short as far as manifestos.

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Speaker 4: Go, and it has a manifesto.

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Speaker 6: Barely a manifesto has a banger of a first line.

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Speaker 5: Here to the Feds.

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Speaker 6: I'll keep this short because I do respect what you

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Speaker 6: do for our country. One of the weirdest openings that

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Speaker 6: any manifesto in history. Ryan, you wanted to do a

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Speaker 6: somewhat dramatic reading of this. We should add that MANGIONI

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Speaker 6: had an extradition hearing yesterday's being extradited from Pennsylvania where

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Speaker 6: he was caught at that Altoona, Pennsylvania McDonald's and he's

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Speaker 6: being extradited to New York to face murder charges. So

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Speaker 6: that's what was unfolding yesterday. He will play clips of

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Speaker 6: this and everything. But Ken said a lot of people

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Speaker 6: in media had this manifesto but were not publishing it.

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Speaker 6: They were publishing just snippets of it and not releasing.

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Speaker 5: It in full.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and what's wrong with me? Why didn't I have

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Speaker 1: this yet?

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Speaker 6: Yeah?

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Speaker 5: Who did? Why did nobody give this a riot?

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Speaker 1: I mean, Ken has been Ken has been all over this,

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Speaker 1: from being one of the first Edge lords to like

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Speaker 1: celebrate the murder of Brian Thompson and since then has

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Speaker 1: has got has gotten some videos out of United Health

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Speaker 1: from you know, obviously leaked by United Health employees who

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Speaker 1: agree more with Ken than Ken's critics, and then he

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Speaker 1: then he got the manifesto as well.

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Speaker 4: It is utterly bizarre.

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Speaker 1: I can't even think of a reason why the mainstream

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Speaker 1: press got their hands on this and didn't publish it,

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Speaker 1: but did quote from it.

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Speaker 4: Earth are you doing?

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Speaker 1: It's like, I don't even see how this helps manufacturer consenter.

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Speaker 1: It's such just just a just little manifesto. We read

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Speaker 1: some more of it.

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Speaker 4: This this hit.

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Speaker 1: I state plainly that I wasn't working with anyone. This

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Speaker 1: was fairly trivial, some elementary social engineering basic caad a

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Speaker 1: lot of patients. The spiral notebook, if present, has some

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Speaker 1: has some stractly notes and to do lists that illuminate

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Speaker 1: the gist of it. My tech is pretty locked down

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Speaker 1: because I work in engineering, so probably not much info there.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, we'll see about that.

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Speaker 1: I do apologize for any strife of traumas, but it

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Speaker 1: had to be done. Frankly, these parasites simply had it coming.

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Speaker 1: And there's a TikTok going around of they had it coming.

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Speaker 1: The song from Chicago with some nice edits a reminder

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Speaker 1: of the US has the number one most expensive healthcare

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Speaker 1: system in the world, yet we rank roughly number forty two.

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Speaker 1: Roughly number forty two is kind of a funny phrase

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Speaker 1: number you're either forty two or or not?

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Speaker 4: You say roughly forty.

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Speaker 1: If I'm doing edits of his manifests, I would say

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Speaker 1: just say roughly forty because when you say forty two,

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Speaker 1: that's implying some specificity.

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Speaker 5: You should have submitted this to drop site.

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Speaker 1: He should have United is the largest is the indecipherable

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Speaker 1: largest company in the US by market cap. I don't

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Speaker 1: think that's true. Oh, behind only Apple, Google, Walmart. I'm

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Speaker 1: here editing the guys.

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Speaker 6: Everyone's in the process right now. You're seeing behind the curtain.

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Speaker 1: It has grown and grown, but has our life expectancy?

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Speaker 5: No.

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Speaker 1: The reality is these indecipble have simply gotten too powerful.

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Speaker 1: They continue to abuse our country for men's profit because

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Speaker 1: the American public has allowed them to get away with it.

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Speaker 1: Obviously the problem is more complex, but I do not

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Speaker 1: have space, and frankly I do not pretend to be

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Speaker 1: the most qualified person to lay out the full argument.

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Speaker 1: But many have illuminated the corruption and greed. E. G Rosenthal,

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Speaker 1: Michael Moore, assuming it means Michael Moore there decades ago

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Speaker 1: and the problems simply remain. It is not an issue

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Speaker 1: of awareness at this point, but clearly power games at play.

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Speaker 4: Evidently I am.

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Speaker 1: The first to face it with such brutal honesty.

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Speaker 6: You know, the last line is actually kind of I

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Speaker 6: think central to the debate over ethics and people's reactions

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Speaker 6: here in that. Brent, I'm genuinely surprised there haven't been

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Speaker 6: similar acts of like anti health care terrorism, because that's

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Speaker 6: how bad the health insurance system is. And I'm not

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Speaker 6: saying obviously nobody is saying, well, maybe some people are.

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Speaker 6: Obviously nothing is justified as a horrible thing to do.

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Speaker 6: But I'm very surprised that we don't see like, actually

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Speaker 6: more violent protests of how bad our health insurance system is.

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Speaker 1: It is a little surprising in that sense, because being

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Speaker 1: on the phone with these insurance companies and the best

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Speaker 1: of times is a nightmare situation. Being on the phone

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Speaker 1: with him when they are delaying your treatment for trivial

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Speaker 1: paperwork reasons that obviously were manufactured for the purpose of

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Speaker 1: delaying your treatment in the hopes that you either die

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Speaker 1: or don't need the treatment. It moots the treatment at

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Speaker 1: some point. Yeah, you would kind of think that somebody

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Speaker 1: would have done this earlier. Yeah, I mean, it's kind

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Speaker 1: of surprising in that sense. Yeah, So I.

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Speaker 6: Was gonna say, we have a video of him being

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Speaker 6: he shouted something that people we're trying to put together,

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Speaker 6: and I think we have a decent transcript of what

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Speaker 6: was said. This is Lui Jiman Mangioni yelling what you're

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Speaker 6: what you're probably going to hear here is something to

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Speaker 6: the extent of it's an insult to the American people.

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Speaker 6: There's some debate about what he's actually saying. Ken says

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Speaker 6: that it's him saying this is completely out of touch

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Speaker 6: and an insult to the intelligence of the American people.

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Speaker 6: So let's go ahead and roll this video experience.

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Speaker 1: So his what his lawyer is saying is that they're

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Speaker 1: strongly implying that a lot of evidence was planted on him.

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Speaker 1: And what I think is going on there and with

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Speaker 1: his this thing stinks here is that they want to

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Speaker 1: give a jury a reason in the face of overwhelming

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Speaker 1: evidence to acquit him. And so what what they're trying

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Speaker 1: to do this is just my guess, is give the

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Speaker 1: jury an excuse to do jury nullification. And people can

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Speaker 1: look look that up. They probably a lot of people

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Speaker 1: have looked it up. Really, jury nullifications when you you

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Speaker 1: know that somebody did the crime, but you think it

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Speaker 1: was either there's something wrong with the law or you

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Speaker 1: think the crime was justified in that particular circumstance. And

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Speaker 1: so the jury it's kind of I think it's even

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Speaker 1: illegal to do jury nullification. But how they're going to

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Speaker 1: prove it, And so the jurors will say, you know what,

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Speaker 1: we find this guy not guilty. And so by saying

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Speaker 1: that all this stuff is planted in this it would

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Speaker 1: it would then give a juror who wanted to do

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Speaker 1: that some read to hang on to. That's my that's

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Speaker 1: my guess, because you know they're saying, he's caught with

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Speaker 1: everything manifesto.

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Speaker 4: We just read his alleged manifesto.

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Speaker 6: He's on tape, allegedly on tape, you can't really see

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Speaker 6: his face in the fuzzy CCTV.

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Speaker 1: Video, but found him with a gun that like, you know,

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Speaker 1: the right, you know, So if you believe that all

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Speaker 1: of that evidence is is real and it's actually his

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Speaker 1: like he's one hundred percent guilty. If you believe that

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Speaker 1: and you don't want to find him guilty, then you say, well,

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Speaker 1: maybe they planted it on him. That It's very similar

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Speaker 1: to the kind of OJ defense that they did that

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Speaker 1: they that they said, look.

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Speaker 4: Maybe maybe they planted this glove, like these are.

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Speaker 1: These these cops are racist, Like here they are saying

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Speaker 1: the N word. And so for jurors who were like,

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Speaker 1: you know, I kind of want to find him guilty,

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Speaker 1: there was enough of they were able to say, look,

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Speaker 1: maybe maybe this was planted. Because they because there was

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Speaker 1: so much evidence, they couldn't say that the evidence.

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Speaker 4: Wasn't beyond a reasonable that they had.

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Speaker 1: They had to say, the evidence is itself fake.

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Speaker 6: So his attorney, to Ryan's point, said you can't rush

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Speaker 6: to judgment in this case or any case yesterday, and

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Speaker 6: we can put the next element up on the screen.

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Speaker 6: He is he was fighting his extradition to New York City,

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Speaker 6: where actually Alvin Bragg will quote seek the Governor's weren't

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Speaker 6: to secure his transfer. I'm quote coordinating with the DA's

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Speaker 6: office and the assign a request for governors weren't to

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Speaker 6: ensure this individual has tried and how the accountable.

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Speaker 5: Public safety is my.

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Speaker 6: Top priority, and I'll do everything in my power to

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Speaker 6: keep the streets of New York safe, said Kathy Huckle,

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Speaker 6: new York governor, in a statement. So that's he Menjioni

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Speaker 6: is fighting this. He's not sort of just like give it,

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Speaker 6: putting his hands up and being like yep, I wrote

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Speaker 6: it all in the manifesto. I'm sorry if this causes

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Speaker 6: any trauma, which, by the way, is a line from

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Speaker 6: the manifesto. So it's kind of an interesting disconnect between

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Speaker 6: what the manifesto says and.

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Speaker 5: His approach to the case so far.

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Speaker 6: Right, Yeah, the manifesto is literally I did this and

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Speaker 6: I'm really sorry it had to be done.

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Speaker 4: Gonna have some problems.

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Speaker 6: That's a pretty significant disconnect between what he's saying, which

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Speaker 6: is as an insult to intelligence American people. We don't

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Speaker 6: quite know what that's referring to, but it sounded like

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Speaker 6: he was, and we know from his attorney that he's

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Speaker 6: fighting the charges. So anyway, all that is to say,

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Speaker 6: that's a pretty significant disconnect.

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Speaker 5: Obviously.

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Speaker 6: Now this is a quote from an enepy see articles

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Speaker 6: is B three.

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Speaker 5: We can put this up on the screen.

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Speaker 6: They're digging into his video game use so in the

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Speaker 6: game call, well, I'll just read from this first graft

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Speaker 6: Luigi and Manngioni once belonged to a group of IVY

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Speaker 6: League gamers who played Assassins, a member of the group

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Speaker 6: told NBC News. In the game called among Us, some

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Speaker 6: players are secretly assigned to be killers in space who

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Speaker 6: perform other tasks while attempting to avoid suspicion from other players.

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Speaker 5: Ryan.

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Speaker 6: On a scale of zero to ten, how newsworthy is this.

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Speaker 1: It's not even on the scale. It's just funny. It's

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Speaker 1: just hilarious. Like you've probably people watching this have probably

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Speaker 1: played among Us. I've played it actually with my kids.

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Speaker 1: It's a it's a little kids game, and it's just

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Speaker 1: it's a silly game that you know, college kids play

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Speaker 1: to you can play it as a grown up.

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Speaker 4: Whatever.

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Speaker 1: That's hilarious. That's utterly hilarious.

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Speaker 5: Someone said to NBC News.

444
00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:56,880
Speaker 6: I just found it extremely ironic that you know, we

445
00:20:56,880 --> 00:20:58,800
Speaker 6: were in this game and there could actually be a

446
00:20:58,880 --> 00:20:59,680
Speaker 6: killer among us.

447
00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:00,359
Speaker 4: Okay, funny.

448
00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:03,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean if you're if you actually played among

449
00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:06,879
Speaker 1: Us with the assassin, that is a fun story to

450
00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:07,560
Speaker 1: tell your friends.

451
00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:11,359
Speaker 6: I'll give them that is it aunt tell NBC News, yes,

452
00:21:11,480 --> 00:21:12,040
Speaker 6: because they will.

453
00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:14,880
Speaker 1: And then if your NBC News, it's fun to put

454
00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:17,720
Speaker 1: at the bottom of the story. Yeah, it's I hope

455
00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:20,240
Speaker 1: that they understood how ridiculous. They were sounding.

456
00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:21,760
Speaker 6: Among us as a child friendly who'd done it? Game

457
00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:23,960
Speaker 6: in which a group of friends run around several space

458
00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:26,840
Speaker 6: light space station like maps. The crewmates, who are simply

459
00:21:26,920 --> 00:21:31,160
Speaker 6: drawn cartoonish looking astronauts, run around the ship and complete tasks.

460
00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:33,879
Speaker 6: The intent of the game question mark. One member is

461
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:36,120
Speaker 6: a killer and attempts to off the other crewmates.

462
00:21:36,119 --> 00:21:40,200
Speaker 1: Actually, if you remember, Hassan Piker, AOC and ilan Omar

463
00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:41,520
Speaker 1: played it on a stream together.

464
00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:43,320
Speaker 4: Oh really back during the pandemic.

465
00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:44,800
Speaker 5: Got to watch out for AOC?

466
00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:45,640
Speaker 4: Interesting?

467
00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:48,639
Speaker 6: Yeah, another New Yorker who's mad about the healthcare system.

468
00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:51,520
Speaker 1: Just facts, yeah, yeah, yeah.

469
00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:54,960
Speaker 6: Just just spit in facts now before. There's also some

470
00:21:55,160 --> 00:22:00,520
Speaker 6: obviously probing of Fluiji Mangoni's Reddit history, so Forbes reports,

471
00:22:00,840 --> 00:22:03,880
Speaker 6: UHG shooter Luigi Mangoni appears to have been a redditor

472
00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:07,560
Speaker 6: and he researched back pain and backpacks.

473
00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:10,879
Speaker 5: This is really sad, Brian.

474
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:15,000
Speaker 6: The more that we're learning about Mangioni's experiences with his

475
00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:17,439
Speaker 6: own long term it looks like he had a chronic

476
00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:20,879
Speaker 6: back problem. Again, this is all being pieced together from

477
00:22:21,160 --> 00:22:23,720
Speaker 6: the trails, like the breadcrumbs that he left on the internet,

478
00:22:24,359 --> 00:22:28,840
Speaker 6: But it's turning out to be an extremely sad story.

479
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:32,119
Speaker 1: Yeah, back pain, which thankfully I have not really had

480
00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:34,080
Speaker 1: to suffer with in my life, but from people who

481
00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:37,200
Speaker 1: talk about it is utterly debilitating.

482
00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:39,159
Speaker 4: Yeah, it is.

483
00:22:39,680 --> 00:22:42,040
Speaker 1: When it's not with you, you're thinking about it, thinking

484
00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:44,840
Speaker 1: about the possibility one little tweak and it's going to

485
00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:48,919
Speaker 1: be back. When it's with you, it is just absolutely

486
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:53,800
Speaker 1: all consuming. And the medical profession when it comes to

487
00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:55,679
Speaker 1: treating back pain is.

488
00:22:57,359 --> 00:22:59,960
Speaker 4: Just no better than random quackery, it seems like.

489
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:04,040
Speaker 1: And so he wound up getting these some screws put

490
00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:06,479
Speaker 1: into his back that his family and friends say like

491
00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:08,240
Speaker 1: ended up making them crazy.

492
00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:09,800
Speaker 4: That's it.

493
00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:15,600
Speaker 1: That's not an uncommon response from people who've gone through this,

494
00:23:15,680 --> 00:23:19,600
Speaker 1: because it's just the grieving from the life that you

495
00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:23,040
Speaker 1: had to the life that you now have, I think

496
00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:25,760
Speaker 1: can send people around the bend.

497
00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:28,159
Speaker 6: It's frustrating when you're trying to solve a problem and

498
00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:30,960
Speaker 6: you're paying into a system and then the system is

499
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:31,600
Speaker 6: blocking you.

500
00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:33,120
Speaker 5: And that brings us again to.

501
00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:39,840
Speaker 6: Like, as awful as Maggioni's alleged decision seems to have been,

502
00:23:41,040 --> 00:23:43,960
Speaker 6: it is surprising to me that we don't get more

503
00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:48,000
Speaker 6: like domestic unrest from how bout our healthcare system is.

504
00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 5: Because it will drive people crazy, and I want to

505
00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:51,160
Speaker 5: drive people crazy.

506
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:52,920
Speaker 1: And I wonder if psychologically it was a little bit

507
00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:56,080
Speaker 1: harder for him because he grew up a rich prep

508
00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:59,199
Speaker 1: school kid who is not used to being told no.

509
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:02,520
Speaker 6: Well, apparently his family owns a nursing home that is

510
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:05,119
Speaker 6: riddled with problems.

511
00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:06,640
Speaker 1: Complaints, also called a nursing home.

512
00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:11,359
Speaker 6: Right, yes, absolutely, yes, yes, but actually this one appears

513
00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,399
Speaker 6: to be exceptional in rankings like national rankings.

514
00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:17,440
Speaker 5: I can find out what we're talking, but yes, exceptionally.

515
00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:19,760
Speaker 4: He went to this rich prep school called Gilman in Maryland.

516
00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:22,720
Speaker 1: If you're from Maryland and you saw this, you're like, Okay,

517
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:26,719
Speaker 1: this tracks yeah Gilman kid, Yeah, Gilman Kid.

518
00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:27,439
Speaker 4: Could Papa do this?

519
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:28,440
Speaker 7: Well?

520
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:34,719
Speaker 6: That's I just think it's an insane statement on not insane,

521
00:24:34,720 --> 00:24:38,120
Speaker 6: it's like the least surprising statement actually, but it's a

522
00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:41,440
Speaker 6: very powerful one on how horrible the healthcare system is. Is

523
00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:43,800
Speaker 6: that you can come from a background of privilege, and

524
00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:46,640
Speaker 6: unless you're like tippy tippy top of the one percent,

525
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:51,400
Speaker 6: you can have the same terrible experience with the healthcare system.

526
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:55,920
Speaker 6: It's like a shared socioeconomic experience. Now it's obviously much

527
00:24:55,920 --> 00:24:59,600
Speaker 6: worse for people who can't afford health insurance and or

528
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:01,919
Speaker 6: struggle to pay their bills and have kids and are

529
00:25:01,960 --> 00:25:04,160
Speaker 6: doing two jobs to have their health insurance.

530
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:04,720
Speaker 5: It's insane.

531
00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:07,359
Speaker 6: But you can actually still be wealthy in this country

532
00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:09,879
Speaker 6: and our health insurance system can utterly fail you in

533
00:25:09,920 --> 00:25:12,600
Speaker 6: the most frustrating ways. And that actually goes to your

534
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:15,000
Speaker 6: point about how frustrating it must be if you are

535
00:25:15,040 --> 00:25:19,240
Speaker 6: privileged and you're used to having everything be at your fingertips,

536
00:25:19,440 --> 00:25:22,679
Speaker 6: you can see psychologically how that could drive you even crazier.

537
00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, And also, and not to undermine our man's fundamental

538
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:30,479
Speaker 1: point here, but the healthcare system is also not magic.

539
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 1: Like there are there are some things that even the best,

540
00:25:36,400 --> 00:25:40,159
Speaker 1: the best providers, the best physicians, with all of the

541
00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:43,720
Speaker 1: money in the world can't fix. Like that's that's just

542
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,800
Speaker 1: a fundamental part of the human condition and it always

543
00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:50,399
Speaker 1: will be right no matter what Peter Tiel tries to

544
00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:52,200
Speaker 1: do with young people's blood or whatever.

545
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:57,560
Speaker 4: Just now we are we are we are so some level.

546
00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:01,080
Speaker 6: Yeah, so his family, including his father there apparently this

547
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:05,000
Speaker 6: is just they own lore in health systems. It's a

548
00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 6: for profit nursing home they've been fine for health inspection

549
00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:12,280
Speaker 6: violations according to records that have been posted as all

550
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:15,280
Speaker 6: of this has come out, and it's got like a

551
00:26:15,320 --> 00:26:18,800
Speaker 6: two out of five Medicare rating Quality Measures rating of

552
00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:23,080
Speaker 6: two out of five, so it appears to be you

553
00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:25,600
Speaker 6: know not. Someone was posting about it saying that it

554
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:28,000
Speaker 6: was a measure of hypocrisy, and it's like, well, if

555
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 6: Maggioni is guilty in this case, it may not be hypocrisy.

556
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 6: It may be his partially psychologically and we're trying to

557
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,440
Speaker 6: do like armchair psychiatry here, but it might have been

558
00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,520
Speaker 6: what drove him insane is that his own family and

559
00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:44,320
Speaker 6: his own privilege was built on a system that was

560
00:26:44,400 --> 00:26:45,160
Speaker 6: hurting him too.

561
00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:47,760
Speaker 5: I mean, that's something that I can volunteered at.

562
00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:51,119
Speaker 1: That he volunteered at that nursing home. Of course reports

563
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:51,480
Speaker 1: when he.

564
00:26:51,440 --> 00:26:54,520
Speaker 5: Was in high school, right, so he may have seen

565
00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:55,280
Speaker 5: it all up close.

566
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:56,480
Speaker 4: Yeah.

567
00:26:56,520 --> 00:27:00,720
Speaker 6: Well, Bill Burr on his Monday Morning podcast went on

568
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:03,480
Speaker 6: a similar rant to the one that he went on

569
00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:06,160
Speaker 6: over the weekend. To that Crystal and Sager covered Let's

570
00:27:06,240 --> 00:27:09,159
Speaker 6: roll this clip of Bill Burr weighing in on the

571
00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:12,760
Speaker 6: media coverage this time of what media coverage and just

572
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:16,959
Speaker 6: general people's general reactions to what's happened with MANGIONI.

573
00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:19,520
Speaker 8: You know what's annoying me about this, this kid who

574
00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:22,520
Speaker 8: killed this ceo is none of these news programs are

575
00:27:22,560 --> 00:27:26,439
Speaker 8: talking about the incredible lack of empathy from the general

576
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:31,320
Speaker 8: public about this because of how these insurance companies treat

577
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:34,640
Speaker 8: people when they are at their most vulnerable. After we've

578
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:37,360
Speaker 8: all given them our money every fucking month and now

579
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:39,720
Speaker 8: we finally need you, and all you do is deny us,

580
00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:42,480
Speaker 8: And then these pussies and all of these things are

581
00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:45,520
Speaker 8: taking the pictures of their CEOs off their websites. You know,

582
00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:48,359
Speaker 8: I gotta be honest with you, Okay, I love that

583
00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 8: the fucking CEOs are fucking afraid right now. You should be,

584
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,960
Speaker 8: by and large, you're all a bunch of selfish, greedy,

585
00:27:57,119 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 8: fucking pieces of shit, and a lot of you are

586
00:28:00,560 --> 00:28:05,360
Speaker 8: mass murderers. You just don't pull the trigger. That's why

587
00:28:05,359 --> 00:28:08,240
Speaker 8: it looks clean. That's why these people look, oh my god,

588
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:12,000
Speaker 8: oh he was just you know, walking into a hotel.

589
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 8: It's like, okay, but what was his job, what did

590
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:14,400
Speaker 8: he do?

591
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:15,719
Speaker 1: What was the results of it?

592
00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:19,359
Speaker 6: The every man truly, and if you're not if you

593
00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:24,160
Speaker 6: are horrified by that argument from Bill Burr and you're

594
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:27,359
Speaker 6: like a beltwey journalist or pundit, then you should go

595
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 6: sit down at a bar in normal America and talk

596
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:31,040
Speaker 6: to people.

597
00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:33,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, and a lot and a lot of the people

598
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,800
Speaker 1: who are saying, look, we have lower costs and these

599
00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 1: people with some of these some of these outcomes are better.

600
00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 1: And also the insurance companies are not. You know, the

601
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,960
Speaker 1: real problem the problems for providers. A United Health is

602
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:47,320
Speaker 1: a provider too, they own they're like massively involved in

603
00:28:47,320 --> 00:28:49,480
Speaker 1: the provider side as well.

604
00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:52,800
Speaker 4: But the CEO was making ten million dollars a year.

605
00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:56,560
Speaker 1: It's one thing to say, this is a really difficult

606
00:28:56,560 --> 00:28:58,760
Speaker 1: problem to solve, and we're all trying.

607
00:28:58,760 --> 00:29:00,840
Speaker 4: We're all working together to try.

608
00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:03,840
Speaker 1: To make sure that we can give the best care

609
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:08,320
Speaker 1: to the people who need it. When you walk when

610
00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 1: you say that and then you walk out of the

611
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:13,920
Speaker 1: room with a bag filled with ten million dollars, people

612
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:16,480
Speaker 1: are going to give a little bit less credibility, yes

613
00:29:16,640 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 1: to how concerned you are.

614
00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:20,760
Speaker 4: And when that ten million.

615
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 1: Dollars is just a little kickback for the billions that

616
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:27,760
Speaker 1: you're sending to shareholders who are also walking away with

617
00:29:27,800 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 1: that money, you lose even more credibility around how serious

618
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 1: you are about taking care of patients.

619
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:39,880
Speaker 6: I had Ken on actually Undercurrents to talk about Ken.

620
00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:42,600
Speaker 6: I kind of disagreed with the way that you reacted immediately,

621
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 6: but I also think it's really precious to see Chris

622
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:51,840
Speaker 6: Cuomo just retired to his fainting couch and clutch his

623
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,000
Speaker 6: pearls over the reaction of people like you and Taylor

624
00:29:55,200 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 6: Lorenz because about just tone policing about the United Healthcare CEO,

625
00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:03,840
Speaker 6: Like he doesn't have a leg to stand on unless

626
00:30:03,880 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 6: he's using all of his journalistic resources to probe the

627
00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,440
Speaker 6: corruption in the health insurance system regularly, which.

628
00:30:10,240 --> 00:30:14,560
Speaker 5: He's not doing. He only cared when Ken was mean.

629
00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 6: To the dead CEO who was appears to be unjustly murdered,

630
00:30:20,480 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 6: And so that's like, it doesn't make the murder right,

631
00:30:22,840 --> 00:30:25,720
Speaker 6: but it also doesn't give you any more credibility when

632
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:29,080
Speaker 6: you're weighing in to tone police people who are upset

633
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 6: about the healthcare system and you're not regularly concerned yourself

634
00:30:32,680 --> 00:30:34,000
Speaker 6: about the healthcare system.

635
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:39,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, and Don Junior showed unusually poor instincts out of

636
00:30:39,120 --> 00:30:42,080
Speaker 1: the gately on this. He did the whole put the

637
00:30:42,080 --> 00:30:44,120
Speaker 1: image of the guy up and said, you know, Internet,

638
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:49,320
Speaker 1: do your thing, and his all of his replies are

639
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:51,040
Speaker 1: just like, I don't see anything done.

640
00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 5: He put an image of Mangionia, yeah.

641
00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:56,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, saying like the Internet do your thing, like go

642
00:30:56,320 --> 00:30:57,120
Speaker 1: find this killer.

643
00:30:57,360 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 4: Oh, and all of his followers were like, I don't

644
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:02,400
Speaker 4: see nothing. So that was it was.

645
00:31:02,720 --> 00:31:04,880
Speaker 1: It was like, oh, I forgot, I forgot. Don Junior

646
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:07,320
Speaker 1: is a prep school kid, but not the kind that

647
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 1: Luigi became, because he's really done a good job of

648
00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:17,440
Speaker 1: of donning the garb of the populist and he missed.

649
00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:19,760
Speaker 4: He missed. His dad would not have made that mistake.

650
00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:22,000
Speaker 6: It would be interesting to see, I mean, because at

651
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,800
Speaker 6: first it started, nobody really knew what to make of it,

652
00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:26,880
Speaker 6: and it started as an example of like disorder and

653
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:31,360
Speaker 6: chaos on the streets of New York City, right. It

654
00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:34,080
Speaker 6: starts as a narrative like that, which, by the way,

655
00:31:34,400 --> 00:31:36,840
Speaker 6: this as it unfolds, this is Gotham City, Like this

656
00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:40,040
Speaker 6: is straight out of freaking Batman. Like that's how sad,

657
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:44,120
Speaker 6: and like Bruce Wayne this, yeah, it's insane.

658
00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:46,080
Speaker 4: Bruce Wayne was the victim, not the killer.

659
00:31:46,160 --> 00:31:49,440
Speaker 1: I don't know, but Bruce Wayne the richest man in

660
00:31:49,440 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 1: the world, and all he wants to do is go,

661
00:31:51,400 --> 00:31:54,160
Speaker 1: like round up a few muggers. How about you build

662
00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:55,600
Speaker 1: a hospital, Bruce Wayne.

663
00:31:57,320 --> 00:32:01,680
Speaker 6: Actually think i'd actually watched the Ryan Grim written Batman.

664
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:06,480
Speaker 4: Yeah, Taxtatman. It's ridiculous, but.

665
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:09,800
Speaker 5: That is exactly what you're like. It is like ripped

666
00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 5: out of a Batman plot.

667
00:32:10,880 --> 00:32:14,200
Speaker 6: But I mean it's just like if your energy, if

668
00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:16,880
Speaker 6: your moral energy, is going to it is like more

669
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:21,640
Speaker 6: directed to being outraged at Edgelord's like Ken for like

670
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:24,920
Speaker 6: maybe being callous. You don't have to agree with the

671
00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 6: way Ken and Taylor Lorenz and others approached the initial

672
00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:35,080
Speaker 6: reports to be like, hey, maybe the main story here,

673
00:32:35,840 --> 00:32:37,800
Speaker 6: you know, it's like, don't don't kill people in the

674
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 6: streets of Manhattan and cold Blood and uh, don't run

675
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:45,200
Speaker 6: a system and benefit from a system that is like

676
00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:48,520
Speaker 6: sucking the life out of people. Seems like a fair

677
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:50,960
Speaker 6: two things can be true assessment here.

678
00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:56,480
Speaker 4: Maybe Oh yeah, okay, I don't like killing. Yeah, I'm

679
00:32:56,520 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 4: uncomfortable about killing.

680
00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:03,160
Speaker 6: Okay, Well, we've established that everyone should see Ryan's belt today.

681
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 6: By the way, it's very whimsical. It's not the belt

682
00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:11,760
Speaker 6: of an edge lord in news out of Syria. We

683
00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:13,840
Speaker 6: can put this first element up on the screen top.

684
00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:17,360
Speaker 6: US Military Commander in the Middle East, General Michael Carilla,

685
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:20,880
Speaker 6: visited US commanders and troops as well as members of

686
00:33:21,040 --> 00:33:24,960
Speaker 6: the SDF at several bases in Syria yesterday. That is

687
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:29,400
Speaker 6: cursy of reporter Jared Sezba and Ryan Also The New

688
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:31,680
Speaker 6: York Times was just like tallying up all the countries

689
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:38,040
Speaker 6: that are currently bombing in Syria yesterday worth mentioning. It's Russia, Aaron, Israel,

690
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:40,800
Speaker 6: the United States, and Turkey. So five countries right now

691
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:43,600
Speaker 6: actively bombing Syria.

692
00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:47,040
Speaker 1: So you can understand everybody gets in Yeah, that's right.

693
00:33:47,120 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 5: And C two, we want to put this up on

694
00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:49,960
Speaker 5: the screen as well.

695
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:55,479
Speaker 6: US troops are staying in Syria, according to the White House.

696
00:33:55,680 --> 00:34:00,080
Speaker 6: And I actually asked Rand Paul yesterday that that'll it

697
00:34:00,120 --> 00:34:02,400
Speaker 6: will air today on undercurrins. I asked him if it's

698
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,040
Speaker 6: possible that we actually might up ending end up sending

699
00:34:05,040 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 6: more troops to Syria as a result of this, because

700
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:09,520
Speaker 6: he's saying, you know, we do have nine hundred troops

701
00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:11,520
Speaker 6: in Syria right now, at least that's the troops that we.

702
00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:12,360
Speaker 5: Know about in Syria.

703
00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:15,719
Speaker 6: Right now, and he was saying that's a target, that's

704
00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:18,040
Speaker 6: not a detern. There's the line that he is totally

705
00:34:18,080 --> 00:34:21,160
Speaker 6: fair assessment. But I asked, you know, some of your

706
00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:22,879
Speaker 6: colleagues going to use the point that you just made

707
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:25,360
Speaker 6: us and excuse to bring more troops in. And I

708
00:34:25,400 --> 00:34:27,920
Speaker 6: think the Reuter's article by Jeff Mason that we just

709
00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:30,600
Speaker 6: had up on the screen seems like it's potentially going

710
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:32,480
Speaker 6: in that direction. I don't know, Ryan, do you think

711
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:35,040
Speaker 6: it's possible that we end up putting more troops actually

712
00:34:35,080 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 6: in Syria right now amidst all of the chaos?

713
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:43,319
Speaker 1: You know, I think that they're much more likely to

714
00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:48,799
Speaker 1: flood you know, weapons to our proxies and mercenaries and

715
00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:54,280
Speaker 1: rather than try to deploy more troops, more US troops

716
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 1: just before a new president comes in, because I think

717
00:34:57,400 --> 00:35:00,520
Speaker 1: that's true, I think that's tricky politically. I don't know,

718
00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:03,200
Speaker 1: let's let's let's play, let's play your Rampaul Cliffs.

719
00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 4: I think C three B.

720
00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 5: Yeah.

721
00:35:05,560 --> 00:35:07,920
Speaker 6: In the scuttle butt on Capitol Hill, of course and

722
00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:11,080
Speaker 6: in beltwayh media is that this is just posing a

723
00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:13,880
Speaker 6: real threat to Taulsi Gabbert getting confirmed as Trump's Director

724
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:17,000
Speaker 6: of National Intelligence. She's literally meeting with senators like yourself on.

725
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:18,000
Speaker 5: Capitol Hill this week.

726
00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 6: What do you think that this helps or hurts taulsy

727
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:25,160
Speaker 6: Gabbert's actual ability to be confirmed in any way, Senator Paul.

728
00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:25,920
Speaker 1: Not necessarily.

729
00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:29,360
Speaker 9: You know, I think that the history of Syria in

730
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:32,080
Speaker 9: the Middle East is such a complicated one that it

731
00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:35,880
Speaker 9: isn't really clear. You know, Like I say, were there

732
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:42,120
Speaker 9: positive aspects to uh, the sod regime? You know, very few,

733
00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 9: but one of them was the protection of Christians. You know,

734
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:49,680
Speaker 9: Is there you know, pluses and minuses to Galani or

735
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:51,160
Speaker 9: this new offshoot of Alvenusra.

736
00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:52,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, there certainly are.

737
00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:54,839
Speaker 9: One they got rid of the dictator, but two will

738
00:35:54,840 --> 00:35:58,880
Speaker 9: they replace that with a religious intolerance towards others? I

739
00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:01,560
Speaker 9: don't know that it definitely change just her chances. I

740
00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:04,600
Speaker 9: think her twenty year military career, she's a lieutenant colonel.

741
00:36:05,080 --> 00:36:09,120
Speaker 9: The way she's been treated unfairly by the intelligence state,

742
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:11,839
Speaker 9: putting her on a terror watch list and obstructing her

743
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:15,239
Speaker 9: ability to travel, I think that she's gaining momentum. There

744
00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:18,359
Speaker 9: was a rally recently with military veterans. There's a lot

745
00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 9: of senators that have come out for so I think

746
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 9: they're gonna have a tougher time defeating her. They will try,

747
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:26,440
Speaker 9: and these are the people who are part of what

748
00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:30,960
Speaker 9: they call the bipartisan consensus in Washington foreign policy consensus,

749
00:36:31,000 --> 00:36:34,120
Speaker 9: which is one of, you know, give aid to everyone,

750
00:36:34,239 --> 00:36:37,440
Speaker 9: give arms to everyone, and be involved in everyone's wars.

751
00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 9: It's a policy of you know, eternal intervention. And those

752
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:45,200
Speaker 9: people are always going to be opposed to anybody questions that.

753
00:36:45,640 --> 00:36:48,040
Speaker 9: But I for want, am enthusiastic about her nomination and

754
00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:50,799
Speaker 9: will do anything I can or everything I can to

755
00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:51,480
Speaker 9: try to help her.

756
00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:53,799
Speaker 1: I really like the music behind the clip that had

757
00:36:53,800 --> 00:36:55,719
Speaker 1: me on the edge of my seat listening to Ram

758
00:36:55,800 --> 00:36:58,920
Speaker 1: Paul like, where's this is really suspenseful.

759
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:02,280
Speaker 6: He's like, you're watching Jack. Yeah, it was a teaser clip.

760
00:37:03,160 --> 00:37:05,840
Speaker 6: I was like, yeah, you're ready to yeah so. But

761
00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:07,359
Speaker 6: but anyway, I think that gets to the point about

762
00:37:07,680 --> 00:37:11,440
Speaker 6: the future of US involvement in Syria because the scuttle

763
00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:13,719
Speaker 6: buck being that Tulsa Gabbert now she's just tanked. And

764
00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:15,480
Speaker 6: I think, and I say this in an episode which

765
00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:18,440
Speaker 6: is going to air in a bit that it's maybe

766
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:21,920
Speaker 6: more likely that Tulsa Gabbert gets confirmed as a result

767
00:37:21,960 --> 00:37:24,040
Speaker 6: of this because now you have even people like Lindsay

768
00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:27,120
Speaker 6: Graham talking about the problems with the rebels now that

769
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:30,760
Speaker 6: they're in power, and so it all becomes so apparent,

770
00:37:30,840 --> 00:37:35,120
Speaker 6: like post Asad, the various factions, and the sort of

771
00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:38,360
Speaker 6: ridiculousness of the United States arming Brandpa mentions.

772
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:40,960
Speaker 5: At one point in twenty sixteen, Elon.

773
00:37:40,840 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 6: Musk tweeted this recently to an LA Times article about

774
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 6: how the Pentagon and the CIA were funding different warring

775
00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:50,839
Speaker 6: factions in Syria at the same damn time. It is

776
00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:54,319
Speaker 6: so absurd and that will be in full bear now

777
00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:55,360
Speaker 6: that a Sad is gone.

778
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:59,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, And the awkward part here is that, right, so

779
00:38:00,160 --> 00:38:04,520
Speaker 1: has always had these these kind of complex politics that

780
00:38:05,000 --> 00:38:08,959
Speaker 1: are not not squarely put into isolationists or anti war

781
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:13,239
Speaker 1: because she was a strong and relentless supporter of the

782
00:38:13,239 --> 00:38:16,880
Speaker 1: global War on terror against you know what what she

783
00:38:17,040 --> 00:38:20,000
Speaker 1: what whatever she wants to call it, like Islamic terrorism,

784
00:38:20,040 --> 00:38:24,839
Speaker 1: whatever she is, like yes, like she seems like her

785
00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:32,200
Speaker 1: her like hostility to Islamism and sometimes even Islam just

786
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:35,279
Speaker 1: shines through and like as powerfully as Air Towan and

787
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:39,640
Speaker 1: the Kurds, like you know, fine, you know, it's it's

788
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:42,920
Speaker 1: it's intense, and so now that those factions that she

789
00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:47,359
Speaker 1: has been uh no, fighting against literally and and also

790
00:38:47,640 --> 00:38:53,440
Speaker 1: politically for a decade have actually won, right before potentially

791
00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:57,160
Speaker 1: she gets into the position, uh is she going to

792
00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:00,920
Speaker 1: be trying to arm opposition groups to the new kind

793
00:39:00,920 --> 00:39:04,400
Speaker 1: of dominant groups in Syria because she's so.

794
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:06,320
Speaker 4: Hostile to them, And it's going to be interesting.

795
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:09,440
Speaker 1: I mean, the whole thing is like, it's just absurd.

796
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:13,200
Speaker 1: Like there was a there was a New York Times

797
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:18,120
Speaker 1: report that said, in Washington, American policy makers are telling

798
00:39:18,160 --> 00:39:20,200
Speaker 1: all of the kind of Jahadis groups or whatever you

799
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:24,040
Speaker 1: want to call them, that they better not ally with Isis,

800
00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:29,440
Speaker 1: which means the American policy is basically coming down to,

801
00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:32,920
Speaker 1: we draw the line at isis al Qaeda?

802
00:39:34,680 --> 00:39:35,440
Speaker 2: You know what?

803
00:39:35,800 --> 00:39:43,680
Speaker 1: Okay, al Kada offshoot former isis Okay, but isis absolutely not.

804
00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:46,239
Speaker 1: We have we have it's the line in the sand

805
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:49,520
Speaker 1: is our red line. We're not allying, but yeah, we

806
00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:54,960
Speaker 1: have standards. Meanwhile, literally, the al Qaida guy in Damascus, now, well.

807
00:39:54,800 --> 00:39:56,440
Speaker 6: He has such an interesting story, by the way, and

808
00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:58,000
Speaker 6: I was curious to ask you about this.

809
00:39:58,600 --> 00:40:00,719
Speaker 5: His personal story is.

810
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:05,160
Speaker 6: In itself a testament to the follies of US interventionism.

811
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:09,719
Speaker 6: He was at least reportedly radicalized by US policy and

812
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:10,600
Speaker 6: Israel right.

813
00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:15,560
Speaker 1: Well, Yes, his family was displaced from the Golan Heights

814
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:20,880
Speaker 1: in what sixty seven when Israel occupied the Golan Heights

815
00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:25,040
Speaker 1: and then yes, and then he was radicalized further in

816
00:40:25,080 --> 00:40:29,239
Speaker 1: two thousand during the Israeli crackdown on the Second Intifada

817
00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:33,080
Speaker 1: and the collapse of the peace process there. And then

818
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:39,279
Speaker 1: he goes to Iraq to fight along with other insurgents

819
00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:43,560
Speaker 1: against the against the American invasion of Iraq, and he

820
00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:46,959
Speaker 1: talks about that in his CNA interview and elsewhere where.

821
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,560
Speaker 1: He says, basically what the argument that he's making.

822
00:40:49,440 --> 00:40:52,760
Speaker 4: Is like, the US was wrong to invade.

823
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:55,840
Speaker 1: Everybody believed the US was wrong to invade and occupy Iraq.

824
00:40:56,120 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 1: I went there to fight them, that was the right

825
00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:00,840
Speaker 1: thing to do. But the way that many of the

826
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:05,439
Speaker 1: people who fought them did so deliberately killed civilians. He said,

827
00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:08,040
Speaker 1: I never participated in that. Groups I was involved with

828
00:41:08,200 --> 00:41:10,799
Speaker 1: did I have broken with them? And a lot of

829
00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:17,400
Speaker 1: that is the ideological splits with al Qaeda and ISIS

830
00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 1: are overblown, Like the ideology is still pretty similar. What

831
00:41:21,800 --> 00:41:27,839
Speaker 1: he has recognized is that politically speaking, this idea that

832
00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:30,440
Speaker 1: you're going to create a caliphate in a world that

833
00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:34,320
Speaker 1: is hostile, abjectly hostile to you, and that you're hostile

834
00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:39,480
Speaker 1: to as well, is absurd and will never work, that

835
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,360
Speaker 1: the world will unite against you and destroy you. And

836
00:41:42,440 --> 00:41:47,440
Speaker 1: so it is a pragmatic pivot to say, look, we

837
00:41:47,560 --> 00:41:50,440
Speaker 1: just you can't do that. We don't have the assets

838
00:41:51,000 --> 00:41:55,480
Speaker 1: to accomplish this goal. Therefore it's a complete suicide mission.

839
00:41:55,520 --> 00:41:57,840
Speaker 4: And he was not interested in a suicide mission.

840
00:41:58,560 --> 00:42:02,080
Speaker 1: So he understood good that he had to talk about

841
00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:09,160
Speaker 1: recognizing all the different sects and ethnicities and religions in Syria.

842
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:12,759
Speaker 1: And so, you know, if he's going to get off

843
00:42:12,760 --> 00:42:16,440
Speaker 1: the US terrorist and he had to pick the right enemies.

844
00:42:16,480 --> 00:42:19,880
Speaker 1: What he did is he very strategically.

845
00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:21,640
Speaker 4: Targeted.

846
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:24,799
Speaker 1: You know when after violently went to war with al

847
00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:27,600
Speaker 1: Qaeda in ISIS in Syria and then and then kept

848
00:42:27,640 --> 00:42:29,480
Speaker 1: coming back. This is what you were hearing from American sources,

849
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:32,160
Speaker 1: kept coming back to the US, Look, we're fighting your

850
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:34,720
Speaker 1: enemies here, aren't.

851
00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:39,160
Speaker 4: We your friend? And they'd like yeah, maybe.

852
00:42:39,440 --> 00:42:43,040
Speaker 1: So it wasn't as if the US started arming necessarily

853
00:42:43,520 --> 00:42:47,800
Speaker 1: this force, but they stopped trying to kill him and

854
00:42:48,360 --> 00:42:52,040
Speaker 1: otherwise made it possible for him to have room to maneuver.

855
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:56,960
Speaker 6: Interesting other anecdote from his life or point for its

856
00:42:57,200 --> 00:42:59,120
Speaker 6: it's probably more powerful than an anecdote, is that he

857
00:42:59,120 --> 00:43:03,319
Speaker 6: was actually detained in Abu Grabe by when he went

858
00:43:03,360 --> 00:43:06,120
Speaker 6: to Iraq, he ended up detained in Abu Grab by

859
00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:10,360
Speaker 6: US forces. So he has his own history with American interventionism,

860
00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:12,920
Speaker 6: and I think that's why it's sort of naive and

861
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:15,440
Speaker 6: probably why even the Lindsay Grahams of the world are

862
00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:19,359
Speaker 6: now expressing sort of skepticism about how Golani governs as

863
00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:22,640
Speaker 6: they're cobbling together a new government in Syria right now.

864
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:27,319
Speaker 6: So the pessimism is probably more warranted than any optimism

865
00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:29,719
Speaker 6: we're hearing from people referring to the freedom fighters in

866
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 6: Syria right now.

867
00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:32,960
Speaker 1: And also we can get to some of that pessimism

868
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:36,359
Speaker 1: in this next point, which is that the two main

869
00:43:36,760 --> 00:43:39,680
Speaker 1: invasions and incursions going on in Turkey now, I mean

870
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:42,760
Speaker 1: in Syria are being led by Turkey and by Israel.

871
00:43:43,520 --> 00:43:47,359
Speaker 1: On the Turkish side, they've been relentlessly attacking Kobani, which

872
00:43:47,560 --> 00:43:53,000
Speaker 1: was a symbol of Kurdish resistance to ISIS back in

873
00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:59,040
Speaker 1: twenty fourteen fifteen, and when the US got involved in

874
00:43:59,120 --> 00:44:03,360
Speaker 1: that fight, bombing kind of isis positions as the Kurds

875
00:44:03,480 --> 00:44:06,360
Speaker 1: held out in Coobani, that that ended up turning the

876
00:44:06,440 --> 00:44:09,920
Speaker 1: tide and creating this and really cementing this alliance between

877
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:14,279
Speaker 1: the Kurds and the and the US in north in

878
00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:17,280
Speaker 1: northern Syria. For our Friday show, we're going to interview

879
00:44:17,280 --> 00:44:20,920
Speaker 1: an American who fought with the Kurds and was up

880
00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 1: was there even even fairly recently. So stick around for

881
00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:30,439
Speaker 1: that for that Friday show to learn more about that conflict. Now,

882
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:34,359
Speaker 1: the American alliance with the Kurds appears to have led

883
00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:37,480
Speaker 1: to and this is all developing now something of a

884
00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:42,080
Speaker 1: ceasefire around Cobani in exchange for the Kurds withdrawing from

885
00:44:42,120 --> 00:44:46,400
Speaker 1: mon Beach, which was another huge battle back back in

886
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:50,239
Speaker 1: twenty sixteen, which our guests actually participated in.

887
00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:52,520
Speaker 4: So he can he can talk about that that the

888
00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:55,680
Speaker 4: liberation of mon Beach by.

889
00:44:55,520 --> 00:45:00,520
Speaker 1: The Kurds was was a pivotal victory. They are with

890
00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:02,640
Speaker 1: this is this is what the news reporting is that

891
00:45:02,640 --> 00:45:05,040
Speaker 1: the Kurds are going agreeing to kind of withdraw from

892
00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:09,000
Speaker 1: Eastern Aleppo Province and from mon Beach in exchange for

893
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 1: Airdwan calling off the massive murderous assault on on the Kurds. Well,

894
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 1: we'll see how long that lasts. The Kurds nobody has

895
00:45:23,120 --> 00:45:26,560
Speaker 1: been betrayed I think, in the region more times and

896
00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:31,920
Speaker 1: by more people than the Kurds, who were absolutely screwed

897
00:45:31,960 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 1: in Syke's Pico by the Kurdish. The Kurdish region UH

898
00:45:36,280 --> 00:45:42,440
Speaker 1: covers deliberately Iraq, Iran, Syria, and Turkey. So if you

899
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:44,120
Speaker 1: if you if you look the map where those four

900
00:45:44,200 --> 00:45:48,080
Speaker 1: where those four countries intersect, that's that's all a Kurdish region.

901
00:45:48,120 --> 00:45:49,520
Speaker 4: They basically just drew a circle.

902
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:52,400
Speaker 1: Around it and divided them among those four different countries.

903
00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:54,080
Speaker 4: The thinking being.

904
00:45:55,440 --> 00:45:59,000
Speaker 1: Making these countries more ethnically diverse would make it easier

905
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:05,520
Speaker 1: for colonial domination of them UH, and then dividing the

906
00:46:05,560 --> 00:46:08,560
Speaker 1: Kurds would make it harder for them to attain any

907
00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:13,040
Speaker 1: any semblance of self determination or any nationality. And in fact,

908
00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:15,759
Speaker 1: you know it has there are there is obviously a

909
00:46:15,840 --> 00:46:20,480
Speaker 1: Kurdish you know, ethnic solidarity, but all of the different

910
00:46:20,560 --> 00:46:23,920
Speaker 1: Kurdish groups of Iranian Kurds are racking Kurds, Syrians, Turks

911
00:46:23,960 --> 00:46:26,799
Speaker 1: like they have their beefs inside a rack. You've got

912
00:46:26,840 --> 00:46:30,920
Speaker 1: two Kurdish factions that are constantly you went to war

913
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:33,400
Speaker 1: with each other in the nineties, and it's and you know,

914
00:46:33,440 --> 00:46:37,279
Speaker 1: there's a lot of kind of hostility among them, and

915
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:41,840
Speaker 1: you divide and rule, you know, classic British policy, updated

916
00:46:42,160 --> 00:46:46,560
Speaker 1: updated for today. And so if if you want to

917
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:49,200
Speaker 1: bet on anything, you can bet on the Kurds being betrayed.

918
00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:55,240
Speaker 1: The the more, the the the even more threatening assault

919
00:46:55,880 --> 00:46:58,840
Speaker 1: on Syria has been coming from Israel, which and we

920
00:46:58,840 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 1: can put this up on this screw means from drop

921
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:07,760
Speaker 1: site News, which is they have been just absolutely annihilating

922
00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:14,040
Speaker 1: any semblance of Syrian self defense or sovereignty. They started

923
00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:17,840
Speaker 1: by going after what they said was a chemical weapons depot,

924
00:47:18,000 --> 00:47:20,879
Speaker 1: Like what, what do you want chemical weapons to wind

925
00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:23,480
Speaker 1: up in the hands of ISIS or al Qaeda. I

926
00:47:23,520 --> 00:47:26,200
Speaker 1: was like, okay, well, you've launched more than three hundred

927
00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:29,839
Speaker 1: air strikes at this point according to the Syrian Observatory

928
00:47:29,880 --> 00:47:33,160
Speaker 1: there and only a couple of those are at the

929
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:38,279
Speaker 1: alleged chemical weapons place. Otherwise you're going after radar, you're

930
00:47:38,280 --> 00:47:42,600
Speaker 1: going after defensive weapons, You're going after helicopters, airplanes, airports

931
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:48,239
Speaker 1: like they're rapidly and systematically destroying the entire kind of

932
00:47:48,320 --> 00:47:53,560
Speaker 1: infrastructure of this of the Syrian state while creeping further

933
00:47:53,640 --> 00:47:57,920
Speaker 1: and further into Syrian territory around and beyond the.

934
00:47:57,920 --> 00:47:58,880
Speaker 4: Goal on Heights.

935
00:47:59,160 --> 00:48:03,359
Speaker 1: There was an opportunit unity to reach out. And even

936
00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:05,640
Speaker 1: if you want to stick with the chemical weapons, the

937
00:48:05,680 --> 00:48:08,920
Speaker 1: OPCW is there to deal with chemical weapons. This is

938
00:48:08,920 --> 00:48:12,520
Speaker 1: the United Nations institution that has set up for this.

939
00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:17,080
Speaker 1: Jolanni has made it very clear that he wants his

940
00:48:17,120 --> 00:48:20,200
Speaker 1: group delisted from the terrorist that he wants to be

941
00:48:20,320 --> 00:48:26,200
Speaker 1: part of the world of Nations. If the requirement is

942
00:48:26,200 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 1: that you send in inspectors and you put the chemical

943
00:48:28,520 --> 00:48:31,680
Speaker 1: weapons and trucks and you take them out, obviously he's

944
00:48:31,719 --> 00:48:32,920
Speaker 1: going to agree to that.

945
00:48:35,239 --> 00:48:36,000
Speaker 4: Instead.

946
00:48:36,239 --> 00:48:40,920
Speaker 1: And so Israel had an opportunity, and Jolanni and the

947
00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:44,600
Speaker 1: rest of this faction that took over Syria has been

948
00:48:44,680 --> 00:48:47,920
Speaker 1: very clear that they don't actually have a beef with Israel,

949
00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:54,160
Speaker 1: to the chagrin of the Access of Resistance, and so

950
00:48:54,280 --> 00:48:57,719
Speaker 1: Israel had an opportunity to say, good welcome, give up

951
00:48:57,760 --> 00:49:03,040
Speaker 1: those chemical weapons, sign a peece steel, and let's let's

952
00:49:03,200 --> 00:49:07,720
Speaker 1: coexist here peacefully. Instead, immediately they send in the tanks

953
00:49:08,280 --> 00:49:14,640
Speaker 1: and are just leading this kind of rampage across Syria.

954
00:49:15,360 --> 00:49:21,200
Speaker 6: The infighting over chemical weapons is just such a disaster.

955
00:49:22,120 --> 00:49:23,000
Speaker 5: Different factions they.

956
00:49:22,960 --> 00:49:25,319
Speaker 1: Could easily just get the OPCW to come in and

957
00:49:25,320 --> 00:49:25,799
Speaker 1: grab them.

958
00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:29,759
Speaker 6: And different groups are getting bombed by other groups for

959
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:33,799
Speaker 6: taking the Asade what is said to be the Asade stash,

960
00:49:34,040 --> 00:49:35,680
Speaker 6: and it's just a complete.

961
00:49:35,320 --> 00:49:37,920
Speaker 5: Disaster, which is obviously what was always going to happen

962
00:49:37,960 --> 00:49:39,880
Speaker 5: if ended up being toppled.

963
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:43,560
Speaker 1: But right, and remember in two thousand and three when

964
00:49:43,560 --> 00:49:45,640
Speaker 1: the US invaded Iraq, the thing that we did was

965
00:49:45,680 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 1: called deepathification, which meant we wiped out the entire Iraqi

966
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:55,000
Speaker 1: bureaucracy and military. Anybody who had anything to do with

967
00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:59,120
Speaker 1: the military of the bureaucracy was fired. Done, you're out.

968
00:50:00,200 --> 00:50:05,880
Speaker 1: And what did that do. It took tens of thousands

969
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:09,239
Speaker 1: of men, many of them young men, who were just

970
00:50:09,360 --> 00:50:12,560
Speaker 1: punching cards, who were willing to work for whatever government

971
00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:18,759
Speaker 1: came next, and it made them completely untouchable, and so

972
00:50:18,880 --> 00:50:23,400
Speaker 1: they funded an insurgent, They joined an insurgency the state.

973
00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:26,319
Speaker 1: If you collapse the state, some power is going to

974
00:50:26,360 --> 00:50:31,160
Speaker 1: come in. So Israel by deliberately destroying the state capacity

975
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:36,080
Speaker 1: right at the outset is going to create a failed

976
00:50:36,080 --> 00:50:39,879
Speaker 1: state and a civil war, and not a clean civil war,

977
00:50:39,960 --> 00:50:45,600
Speaker 1: but just faction against faction. And clearly strategically they believe

978
00:50:45,680 --> 00:50:53,240
Speaker 1: that a massively weakened and constantly fighting Syria is somehow

979
00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:56,920
Speaker 1: geostrategically beneficial to them right across the border, rather than

980
00:50:56,960 --> 00:51:05,839
Speaker 1: having an actual functioning state. But that misunderstands what has

981
00:51:05,880 --> 00:51:09,200
Speaker 1: always come out of those types of situations. When you

982
00:51:09,239 --> 00:51:12,439
Speaker 1: get your failed state in Afghanistan, you know, Alkaiti gets

983
00:51:12,520 --> 00:51:16,200
Speaker 1: refuge there failed state in Iraq and Syria over the

984
00:51:16,239 --> 00:51:18,920
Speaker 1: last ten fire, and then Isis blows up out of it.

985
00:51:19,200 --> 00:51:21,600
Speaker 1: You don't know what you're going to get, so I

986
00:51:21,600 --> 00:51:23,720
Speaker 1: guess good luck with all that. Like, but it seems

987
00:51:23,760 --> 00:51:29,040
Speaker 1: like the only strategy they have is throwing more American

988
00:51:29,080 --> 00:51:31,319
Speaker 1: bombs at wherever they feel like.

989
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:36,800
Speaker 6: Well, let's watch Matthew Miller, a State Department spokesman, respond

990
00:51:36,840 --> 00:51:39,200
Speaker 6: to some questions along these lines. This was from yesterday.

991
00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:39,400
Speaker 1: Ran.

992
00:51:39,719 --> 00:51:42,560
Speaker 10: Yeah, a lot of sentiments have been expressed, such as

993
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:48,200
Speaker 10: Syrian lead, smooth transition, unified Syria, although we are seeing

994
00:51:48,239 --> 00:51:51,239
Speaker 10: it being dismembered before our eyes, and so on. But

995
00:51:51,360 --> 00:51:56,000
Speaker 10: nobody speaks of these Radi attacks three hundred, that they

996
00:51:56,040 --> 00:52:01,520
Speaker 10: struck three hundred military sites. So why are you not

997
00:52:02,040 --> 00:52:05,040
Speaker 10: talking about what Israel is doing to Syria? What it

998
00:52:05,080 --> 00:52:07,800
Speaker 10: has done to Syria in the last twenty four hours,

999
00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:11,320
Speaker 10: So destroyed the navy, destroyed all the air force and

1000
00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:14,120
Speaker 10: did all that is the purpose, and that is the

1001
00:52:14,120 --> 00:52:17,400
Speaker 10: purpose to have a the medathriized Syria.

1002
00:52:17,920 --> 00:52:21,920
Speaker 11: So I will let Israel speak to its own operations

1003
00:52:21,920 --> 00:52:23,640
Speaker 11: and what it is they are trying to accomplish. I

1004
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:25,520
Speaker 11: will say that on behalf of the United States, We're

1005
00:52:25,560 --> 00:52:28,400
Speaker 11: going to discuss them, uh, these matters with them privately

1006
00:52:28,440 --> 00:52:31,279
Speaker 11: before I appine on them publicly. I would say that

1007
00:52:31,360 --> 00:52:33,640
Speaker 11: broadly speaking, we of course don't want to see any

1008
00:52:33,680 --> 00:52:37,600
Speaker 11: action that makes a Syrian lead process more difficult, and

1009
00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:40,520
Speaker 11: we ultimately want to see a peaceful process for not

1010
00:52:40,600 --> 00:52:41,800
Speaker 11: an escalation of the conflict.

1011
00:52:41,880 --> 00:52:45,600
Speaker 10: So you think what you're saying is that what Israel

1012
00:52:45,719 --> 00:52:48,560
Speaker 10: is doing, whether it's conquering the rest of the Gulan

1013
00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:52,400
Speaker 10: and so on, the attack that it's conducting it is

1014
00:52:52,400 --> 00:52:56,160
Speaker 10: like thirty five kilometers from Damascus and so on, that

1015
00:52:56,280 --> 00:52:58,480
Speaker 10: is a private matter. So is that a private is that?

1016
00:52:58,719 --> 00:53:01,040
Speaker 10: So is that decision no siety.

1017
00:53:01,120 --> 00:53:04,440
Speaker 11: First of all, let me just point out with respect

1018
00:53:04,520 --> 00:53:08,680
Speaker 11: to the location of Israeli forces, and I'm not attesting

1019
00:53:08,719 --> 00:53:10,280
Speaker 11: one way or the other. I know they are conflicting

1020
00:53:10,400 --> 00:53:13,480
Speaker 11: claims about where they are, and they have strenuously denied

1021
00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:15,279
Speaker 11: that they are close to Damascus. They have said that

1022
00:53:15,280 --> 00:53:17,160
Speaker 11: they are in the in their forces on the ground

1023
00:53:17,160 --> 00:53:18,759
Speaker 11: are in the buffer zone. And I spoke to this

1024
00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:21,920
Speaker 11: at length yesterday. But no, but when it comes to

1025
00:53:22,200 --> 00:53:24,760
Speaker 11: their operations, I think it's appropriate for us to speak

1026
00:53:24,800 --> 00:53:27,359
Speaker 11: to them privately first ascertain what it is they're doing

1027
00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:30,919
Speaker 11: before we you pine on that publicly. They are close

1028
00:53:30,960 --> 00:53:32,040
Speaker 11: ally of bars, and that's what we're.

1029
00:53:31,880 --> 00:53:32,239
Speaker 4: Going to do.

1030
00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:36,400
Speaker 1: This administration cannot leave stood enough. Well what have you

1031
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:36,960
Speaker 1: been here for?

1032
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:39,840
Speaker 5: They'll leave, and I don't think you'll like who replaces them.

1033
00:53:39,920 --> 00:53:43,360
Speaker 4: Ryan, No, I don't think so either. No, We'll be

1034
00:53:43,360 --> 00:53:44,319
Speaker 4: here to complain then too.

1035
00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:51,120
Speaker 6: Pete Haig Seth, obviously Donald Trump's nomination for Defense secretary,

1036
00:53:51,239 --> 00:53:54,520
Speaker 6: went on Hannity this week, and while the Trump campaign

1037
00:53:54,560 --> 00:53:59,040
Speaker 6: and Trump himself has been backing Pete Haig Seth pretty enthusiastically,

1038
00:53:59,120 --> 00:54:02,040
Speaker 6: along with basically the entire conservative movement in the MAGA movement.

1039
00:54:02,080 --> 00:54:04,880
Speaker 6: At this point, Hegseth went on Fox. Obviously his mom

1040
00:54:04,920 --> 00:54:06,400
Speaker 6: went on Fox last week as well, but he went

1041
00:54:06,440 --> 00:54:10,480
Speaker 6: on Hannity to offer obviously vigorous defense of himself. So

1042
00:54:10,560 --> 00:54:12,680
Speaker 6: let's go ahead and roll this clip of Pete Hegseeth

1043
00:54:13,120 --> 00:54:14,480
Speaker 6: on Sean Hannity's show.

1044
00:54:14,840 --> 00:54:20,120
Speaker 9: You had a consensual relationship, it was investigated, you were

1045
00:54:20,200 --> 00:54:23,160
Speaker 9: fully exonerated, and correct me if I'm wrong.

1046
00:54:23,239 --> 00:54:26,680
Speaker 5: Here, wasn't there videotape evidence.

1047
00:54:26,280 --> 00:54:30,319
Speaker 2: That was largely responsible for exonerating you.

1048
00:54:32,719 --> 00:54:35,279
Speaker 12: I mean, in addition to personal personal witnesses and all

1049
00:54:35,360 --> 00:54:39,080
Speaker 12: of that. It was fully investigated at the time, years ago,

1050
00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:42,000
Speaker 12: and I was completely cleared. And that's why, Sean, you know.

1051
00:54:41,920 --> 00:54:43,960
Speaker 5: What I look forward to. I looked forward to the

1052
00:54:44,000 --> 00:54:48,000
Speaker 5: FBI background check. I look forward to the actual under.

1053
00:54:47,719 --> 00:54:51,080
Speaker 12: Oath conversations with senators as we go through the process.

1054
00:54:51,160 --> 00:54:53,760
Speaker 5: Because again, this is what the Left.

1055
00:54:53,640 --> 00:54:54,120
Speaker 7: Does, Sean.

1056
00:54:54,200 --> 00:54:58,279
Speaker 12: It's the anatomy of a smear. They take something and

1057
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:02,240
Speaker 12: then they add anonymous sources and contortions and flat out lies,

1058
00:55:02,520 --> 00:55:04,760
Speaker 12: and then they try to try you in the media

1059
00:55:04,800 --> 00:55:07,920
Speaker 12: before you can even get into the doors with senators.

1060
00:55:08,040 --> 00:55:12,239
Speaker 6: So that's Pete Hegsath commenting on these rape allegations or

1061
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:16,160
Speaker 6: this rape allegation from twenty seventeen, and now that his confirmation.

1062
00:55:16,760 --> 00:55:19,640
Speaker 6: Having met with Joni Ernst, jani ern saying she's had

1063
00:55:19,719 --> 00:55:23,880
Speaker 6: very good conversations with Pete Heggseth, herself a survivor of

1064
00:55:24,080 --> 00:55:24,920
Speaker 6: sexual assault.

1065
00:55:25,440 --> 00:55:29,080
Speaker 5: She says that she is now feeling good about the nomination.

1066
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:30,359
Speaker 5: They're having good conversations.

1067
00:55:30,400 --> 00:55:34,160
Speaker 6: It looks like Hegseth is on a path to being confirmed,

1068
00:55:34,160 --> 00:55:37,080
Speaker 6: whereas a week ago people were more skeptical about whether

1069
00:55:37,160 --> 00:55:38,880
Speaker 6: that happened. I think it has always been likely that

1070
00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:41,160
Speaker 6: he was going to get confirmed, even if there were

1071
00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:43,000
Speaker 6: going to be troubles along the way.

1072
00:55:43,840 --> 00:55:44,799
Speaker 5: But Ryan, you.

1073
00:55:44,760 --> 00:55:46,080
Speaker 6: Thought it would be good now that it looks like

1074
00:55:46,160 --> 00:55:48,880
Speaker 6: Heigseth actually is going to be confirmed, and there's doubling

1075
00:55:48,880 --> 00:55:51,680
Speaker 6: and tripling down on the nomination to actually go through

1076
00:55:51,719 --> 00:55:54,680
Speaker 6: the police report from twenty seventeen, and you've pulled the

1077
00:55:54,840 --> 00:55:55,719
Speaker 6: relevant excerpts.

1078
00:55:55,920 --> 00:55:58,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, and in the spirit of treating our audience like adults,

1079
00:55:59,040 --> 00:56:03,160
Speaker 1: wanted to go through and and put forward the different

1080
00:56:03,200 --> 00:56:05,920
Speaker 1: pieces of the police report that would enable you know,

1081
00:56:05,960 --> 00:56:10,360
Speaker 1: Hannity and and Hagseth to make those claims and to

1082
00:56:10,480 --> 00:56:13,040
Speaker 1: be clear, none of what we're saying here is that

1083
00:56:13,480 --> 00:56:15,239
Speaker 1: this is a good guy. This is a good dude,

1084
00:56:15,280 --> 00:56:17,239
Speaker 1: this is a moral guy. He's not nominated for being

1085
00:56:17,280 --> 00:56:19,920
Speaker 1: a moral guy. He's nominated to run the Secretary of Defense,

1086
00:56:19,920 --> 00:56:25,000
Speaker 1: which is reminiscent of Arlo Guthrie's line in Alice's Restaurant,

1087
00:56:25,040 --> 00:56:28,840
Speaker 1: where you know he can't he gets a deferment to

1088
00:56:28,840 --> 00:56:30,759
Speaker 1: get drafted to go over to Vietnam, and he's like,

1089
00:56:30,800 --> 00:56:33,719
Speaker 1: you're telling me that I'm not moral enough to go

1090
00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:38,239
Speaker 1: burn babies, women and children over in Vietnam because I'm

1091
00:56:38,280 --> 00:56:42,160
Speaker 1: a litterbug. So that's that's a scale that we're talking

1092
00:56:42,160 --> 00:56:44,320
Speaker 1: about here. But the question is is he guilty of

1093
00:56:45,000 --> 00:56:48,279
Speaker 1: sexual assault and why we're charges not pressed? And I

1094
00:56:48,280 --> 00:56:50,480
Speaker 1: think if you go through the police report you can

1095
00:56:51,320 --> 00:56:53,400
Speaker 1: you can decide for yourself whether or not he should

1096
00:56:53,400 --> 00:56:54,960
Speaker 1: have been And I think, but I think you'll understand

1097
00:56:54,960 --> 00:56:57,000
Speaker 1: a lot more about it then then we get in

1098
00:56:57,000 --> 00:57:00,000
Speaker 1: the press was just kind of vague allusions to it.

1099
00:57:00,040 --> 00:57:01,920
Speaker 1: But the police report is out there. It's twenty two pages.

1100
00:57:01,960 --> 00:57:03,319
Speaker 1: It's not that long. You can read it. You could

1101
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:06,320
Speaker 1: put up D two here, which is the beginning of

1102
00:57:07,040 --> 00:57:11,080
Speaker 1: this police report. Jane Doe in twenty seventeen goes to

1103
00:57:12,560 --> 00:57:15,759
Speaker 1: a hospital where she is from says that she was

1104
00:57:15,800 --> 00:57:18,520
Speaker 1: the victim of sexual assault about roughly a week earlier

1105
00:57:18,720 --> 00:57:22,800
Speaker 1: at a conference in Monterey. The nurse reports it to

1106
00:57:22,840 --> 00:57:26,880
Speaker 1: the police and put up D three here. Essentially, her

1107
00:57:26,960 --> 00:57:30,000
Speaker 1: version that she tells the police is that she's at

1108
00:57:30,040 --> 00:57:31,880
Speaker 1: this conference. She goes to a bar. She's hanging out

1109
00:57:31,880 --> 00:57:33,479
Speaker 1: with Pete Hegseth and another woman.

1110
00:57:33,640 --> 00:57:35,840
Speaker 5: Hexith is a speaker at the content at the conference.

1111
00:57:35,880 --> 00:57:37,040
Speaker 5: She's his handler.

1112
00:57:37,240 --> 00:57:41,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, and she winds up blackout, drunk, either drugged, some

1113
00:57:41,400 --> 00:57:44,040
Speaker 1: other situations. She has barely but any memory of it.

1114
00:57:44,480 --> 00:57:47,840
Speaker 1: The memories come back to her over the next several days,

1115
00:57:48,040 --> 00:57:50,560
Speaker 1: and then she goes to the hospital and reports this crime.

1116
00:57:50,600 --> 00:57:55,360
Speaker 1: So that's essentially her version of it. So to counter

1117
00:57:55,480 --> 00:57:58,280
Speaker 1: that version of it, Hegseeth or as defenders would basically

1118
00:57:58,320 --> 00:58:02,280
Speaker 1: have to show that she was not significantly intoxicated. And

1119
00:58:02,320 --> 00:58:04,720
Speaker 1: so the rest of the police report kind of invest

1120
00:58:04,840 --> 00:58:09,720
Speaker 1: basically investigates that question. And so we can put up

1121
00:58:09,720 --> 00:58:11,600
Speaker 1: the next element on the screen here.

1122
00:58:11,920 --> 00:58:16,400
Speaker 6: This is her saying she was in contact by text

1123
00:58:16,440 --> 00:58:18,560
Speaker 6: messages between Jane Doe and.

1124
00:58:18,560 --> 00:58:19,480
Speaker 4: They got at them.

1125
00:58:20,440 --> 00:58:21,120
Speaker 5: Yeah, he was.

1126
00:58:21,120 --> 00:58:25,120
Speaker 6: Giving off quote creeper vibe, a creeper vibe. So to

1127
00:58:25,160 --> 00:58:27,680
Speaker 6: the point you were making Ryan, this is information about

1128
00:58:27,680 --> 00:58:33,120
Speaker 6: Pete Heiss like sort of being very flirtatious. He's a

1129
00:58:33,160 --> 00:58:36,360
Speaker 6: new baby at the bar with all of these women

1130
00:58:36,400 --> 00:58:39,680
Speaker 6: who are not his wife, and he is just giving

1131
00:58:39,720 --> 00:58:40,520
Speaker 6: off a vibe.

1132
00:58:40,560 --> 00:58:43,280
Speaker 5: He's trying to get people up to his room.

1133
00:58:43,520 --> 00:58:49,200
Speaker 6: Is what the kind of that's the gist of those memories.

1134
00:58:49,040 --> 00:58:50,680
Speaker 1: From the night, So you can put up the next

1135
00:58:50,720 --> 00:58:54,280
Speaker 1: element here. These are text messages that she exchanged with

1136
00:58:54,320 --> 00:58:58,760
Speaker 1: her husband, and you can you can read them for yourself.

1137
00:58:58,880 --> 00:58:59,960
Speaker 4: You can find them in there.

1138
00:59:00,480 --> 00:59:03,680
Speaker 1: And he's like whoa, He's saying, her world, it's like

1139
00:59:03,680 --> 00:59:04,200
Speaker 1: two am.

1140
00:59:04,400 --> 00:59:06,880
Speaker 4: You're usually not out at two am.

1141
00:59:07,160 --> 00:59:10,240
Speaker 1: She doesn't respond to him anymore after about two are

1142
00:59:10,240 --> 00:59:10,640
Speaker 1: you okay?

1143
00:59:10,680 --> 00:59:12,640
Speaker 4: Where are you? What's going on? And you can see that.

1144
00:59:12,960 --> 00:59:16,400
Speaker 6: He was at the conference. Her husband's also at the conference.

1145
00:59:16,520 --> 00:59:18,640
Speaker 1: Right, you can go to D six here. This is

1146
00:59:19,080 --> 00:59:22,600
Speaker 1: another person that was with them.

1147
00:59:22,760 --> 00:59:26,680
Speaker 6: She was aware of the situation. That's why that's her

1148
00:59:26,720 --> 00:59:30,320
Speaker 6: sort of use to the police report here. She told

1149
00:59:30,320 --> 00:59:32,000
Speaker 6: this person or the Jane Doe told the person that

1150
00:59:32,000 --> 00:59:34,000
Speaker 6: she must have fallen asleep.

1151
00:59:34,360 --> 00:59:35,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's right.

1152
00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:38,760
Speaker 6: And this person said that the Jane Doe did not

1153
00:59:38,840 --> 00:59:41,600
Speaker 6: have a hard time walking and was slurring her words,

1154
00:59:41,720 --> 00:59:42,280
Speaker 6: which is.

1155
00:59:42,360 --> 00:59:43,240
Speaker 5: From HEGs Us.

1156
00:59:44,200 --> 00:59:46,840
Speaker 6: You can read that in different ways depending on how

1157
00:59:46,880 --> 00:59:48,880
Speaker 6: you're seeing the situation. You can say that means she

1158
00:59:48,920 --> 00:59:51,360
Speaker 6: knew exactly what she was doing, or you can say

1159
00:59:51,840 --> 00:59:55,400
Speaker 6: that means she must have been later drugged if she

1160
00:59:55,400 --> 00:59:58,040
Speaker 6: had no memory of the situation. But I think probably

1161
00:59:58,080 --> 01:00:02,000
Speaker 6: Hegsas sees that as sort notch in his corner.

1162
01:00:02,120 --> 01:00:04,960
Speaker 1: And so D six is the key spot here. That

1163
01:00:05,080 --> 01:00:08,400
Speaker 1: is kind of what Hannity and Hegsath they're referring to. There,

1164
01:00:08,520 --> 01:00:11,680
Speaker 1: they found a bunch of surveillance video from the hotel.

1165
01:00:12,520 --> 01:00:14,680
Speaker 1: So they're walking together kind of arm in arm neither

1166
01:00:14,840 --> 01:00:19,080
Speaker 1: you know, the morning. She doesn't appear to be intoxicated,

1167
01:00:19,200 --> 01:00:21,480
Speaker 1: because her assertion was that.

1168
01:00:21,360 --> 01:00:23,040
Speaker 4: She was blackout drunk.

1169
01:00:23,560 --> 01:00:26,480
Speaker 1: Video of her kind of arm in arm walking normally

1170
01:00:27,960 --> 01:00:30,880
Speaker 1: in the morning undercuts that. Basically, here they talk, they

1171
01:00:30,880 --> 01:00:34,040
Speaker 1: get surveillance video of them by the pool, and also

1172
01:00:34,400 --> 01:00:36,440
Speaker 1: looks like talk to a security guard who kind of

1173
01:00:36,440 --> 01:00:38,800
Speaker 1: went to break up kind of an argument that they

1174
01:00:38,840 --> 01:00:41,400
Speaker 1: were having by the pool. The security guard says that

1175
01:00:41,440 --> 01:00:44,640
Speaker 1: Hegxath actually seemed kind of drunk. He yells at the

1176
01:00:44,640 --> 01:00:47,720
Speaker 1: cop at one point, I have freedom of speech. It's

1177
01:00:47,720 --> 01:00:50,240
Speaker 1: two am and he's being told to quiet down at

1178
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:50,800
Speaker 1: a conference.

1179
01:00:50,800 --> 01:00:52,520
Speaker 4: He's drunk, and he's like yelling at the.

1180
01:00:52,560 --> 01:00:54,320
Speaker 1: At a I've got free speech, but yelling at a

1181
01:00:54,320 --> 01:00:56,280
Speaker 1: mall cop that he has free speech. And this is

1182
01:00:56,320 --> 01:01:00,200
Speaker 1: going to be our secretary of defense. But what oh,

1183
01:01:00,720 --> 01:01:02,720
Speaker 1: none of this is funny except that part. I mean,

1184
01:01:02,720 --> 01:01:07,919
Speaker 1: that's pretty funny. The security guard says that Jane Doe

1185
01:01:07,960 --> 01:01:11,280
Speaker 1: was there and did not seem inebriate at all. So again,

1186
01:01:11,160 --> 01:01:14,480
Speaker 1: think about if you're a prosecutor, you're gonna have to

1187
01:01:14,480 --> 01:01:16,520
Speaker 1: bring all of these you're gonna have to bring this

1188
01:01:16,560 --> 01:01:19,800
Speaker 1: surveillance camera, you're gonna have to bring this security guard

1189
01:01:19,800 --> 01:01:22,280
Speaker 1: who was gonna say okay, she says she was blackout drunk.

1190
01:01:22,320 --> 01:01:24,880
Speaker 4: She did not look that drunk to me.

1191
01:01:24,960 --> 01:01:27,640
Speaker 6: And that excerpt also showed the police officer saying I

1192
01:01:27,640 --> 01:01:30,880
Speaker 6: found additional security footage of them walking arm and arms, smiling,

1193
01:01:30,920 --> 01:01:33,360
Speaker 6: and neither appeared to have an unsteady gait.

1194
01:01:33,520 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 5: That's the quote from the report.

1195
01:01:34,800 --> 01:01:37,280
Speaker 1: So was that so we could put up the next

1196
01:01:37,280 --> 01:01:37,720
Speaker 1: one here.

1197
01:01:37,920 --> 01:01:39,160
Speaker 5: This is at the bar.

1198
01:01:39,480 --> 01:01:42,120
Speaker 1: So basically what's going on here hexeth is Hexath is

1199
01:01:42,160 --> 01:01:42,760
Speaker 1: at the bar.

1200
01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:44,080
Speaker 4: And he's hitting on a woman.

1201
01:01:44,760 --> 01:01:47,640
Speaker 1: The woman wants absolutely nothing to do with him, and

1202
01:01:47,760 --> 01:01:50,920
Speaker 1: she goes and gets Jane Doe, which she tells the

1203
01:01:50,960 --> 01:01:53,960
Speaker 1: police she brought her in to be a crotch blocker.

1204
01:01:54,000 --> 01:01:57,280
Speaker 1: Now I think she was being polite to the police there,

1205
01:01:57,320 --> 01:01:59,800
Speaker 1: and in her description of that term, everybody knows what

1206
01:01:59,840 --> 01:02:02,320
Speaker 1: the arm is, we don't have to use it here, uh,

1207
01:02:02,400 --> 01:02:04,840
Speaker 1: And so so brings Jane Doe in there to just

1208
01:02:05,080 --> 01:02:07,439
Speaker 1: get get this creep off of me. And so then

1209
01:02:07,960 --> 01:02:10,760
Speaker 1: Jane ends up, you know, spending a lot of time

1210
01:02:10,840 --> 01:02:11,760
Speaker 1: chatting with him.

1211
01:02:11,840 --> 01:02:12,720
Speaker 5: Right the witness.

1212
01:02:13,440 --> 01:02:16,840
Speaker 6: She was hoping that Jane Doe's presence would detour Hexas attempt.

1213
01:02:16,440 --> 01:02:19,400
Speaker 5: To have sex with that witness. And he was touching

1214
01:02:19,520 --> 01:02:20,040
Speaker 5: her knee.

1215
01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:25,400
Speaker 6: It's uncomfortable apparently, and she said that he seth invited

1216
01:02:25,440 --> 01:02:28,480
Speaker 6: her back to the hotel room and she politely declined that.

1217
01:02:28,560 --> 01:02:30,440
Speaker 6: And this is where the Jane Doe gets involved.

1218
01:02:30,640 --> 01:02:32,240
Speaker 4: So we can go to D ten.

1219
01:02:32,360 --> 01:02:36,040
Speaker 1: Then this is Hegsas's version of the story, where he's

1220
01:02:36,080 --> 01:02:39,840
Speaker 1: basically saying that they walked back to his his room together.

1221
01:02:40,200 --> 01:02:42,760
Speaker 6: He doesn't remember even getting into that argument by the pool,

1222
01:02:42,880 --> 01:02:46,120
Speaker 6: but again that's there's witnesses.

1223
01:02:45,760 --> 01:02:51,120
Speaker 1: Right, so the guys seems like pretty drunk. Based on

1224
01:02:51,160 --> 01:02:55,840
Speaker 1: all of this. He says he's kind of surprised that

1225
01:02:55,880 --> 01:02:57,600
Speaker 1: she's coming back to the room with him. M hm,

1226
01:02:58,640 --> 01:03:00,960
Speaker 1: you know, because clearly like he was hitting on somebody

1227
01:03:00,960 --> 01:03:01,880
Speaker 1: else the whole night.

1228
01:03:02,000 --> 01:03:04,040
Speaker 4: He's like, what's going on.

1229
01:03:04,120 --> 01:03:08,120
Speaker 1: Like, how is this happening? So Hegsath independently, you know,

1230
01:03:08,280 --> 01:03:10,840
Speaker 1: told the police. Jane Doe stated that she would tell

1231
01:03:10,840 --> 01:03:13,040
Speaker 1: her husband that she had fallen asleep on a couch

1232
01:03:13,200 --> 01:03:17,960
Speaker 1: in someone else's room. Haggxath continue to ask Jane Doe

1233
01:03:17,960 --> 01:03:19,640
Speaker 1: if she was okay because he did not want Jane

1234
01:03:19,680 --> 01:03:22,120
Speaker 1: Doe to get in trouble. Haggxath told Jane Doe that

1235
01:03:22,160 --> 01:03:24,400
Speaker 1: she did not have to worry about him saying anything.

1236
01:03:24,400 --> 01:03:28,120
Speaker 1: Haggas stated Jane Doe showed early signs of regret. Haggath

1237
01:03:28,160 --> 01:03:30,480
Speaker 1: did not elaborate on the signs of regret. I think

1238
01:03:30,520 --> 01:03:33,000
Speaker 1: why that's why this part is relevant. The stated that

1239
01:03:33,000 --> 01:03:35,480
Speaker 1: she would tell her husband that she had fallen asleep,

1240
01:03:36,160 --> 01:03:38,280
Speaker 1: is that Haggxath would not have known that there were

1241
01:03:38,320 --> 01:03:41,640
Speaker 1: these other text messages where she's telling other people that

1242
01:03:41,720 --> 01:03:44,400
Speaker 1: she kind of fell asleep. That would be kind of

1243
01:03:44,440 --> 01:03:46,760
Speaker 1: corroborating evidence that she'd.

1244
01:03:46,960 --> 01:03:47,880
Speaker 4: Like, how would he have made that?

1245
01:03:49,480 --> 01:03:53,280
Speaker 1: Because that's that's a pretty specific detail. And then she

1246
01:03:53,440 --> 01:03:57,040
Speaker 1: did then go and say tell people like, look, you know,

1247
01:03:57,080 --> 01:03:58,680
Speaker 1: I fell asleep in somebody's room.

1248
01:03:58,760 --> 01:03:59,120
Speaker 4: Sorry.

1249
01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:04,120
Speaker 1: Elsewhere in the police report they quote the person that

1250
01:04:04,680 --> 01:04:06,960
Speaker 1: whose room she came back to saying that she got

1251
01:04:06,960 --> 01:04:09,080
Speaker 1: into the room with her own card, no problem, didn't

1252
01:04:09,080 --> 01:04:11,400
Speaker 1: seem drunk, and then then did not seem hung.

1253
01:04:11,240 --> 01:04:11,880
Speaker 4: Over in the morning.

1254
01:04:12,080 --> 01:04:15,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you know, nobody can know what happened in

1255
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:22,480
Speaker 1: the room. But the claim was not that he, you know,

1256
01:04:23,200 --> 01:04:25,840
Speaker 1: violently kind of forced himself on her. The claim was

1257
01:04:25,880 --> 01:04:27,880
Speaker 1: that she was blackout, drunk.

1258
01:04:28,200 --> 01:04:32,040
Speaker 5: Or to consent or to inebriated to consent essentially.

1259
01:04:31,760 --> 01:04:34,280
Speaker 1: And you can see why there's so much evidence that

1260
01:04:34,320 --> 01:04:36,880
Speaker 1: would have been presented in court that would have undermined

1261
01:04:36,880 --> 01:04:37,800
Speaker 1: that claim.

1262
01:04:38,040 --> 01:04:39,040
Speaker 5: It would have been very hard.

1263
01:04:39,080 --> 01:04:42,120
Speaker 6: And this is what the this is what law enforcement

1264
01:04:42,120 --> 01:04:43,680
Speaker 6: in the area has since said, is that we would

1265
01:04:43,720 --> 01:04:46,680
Speaker 6: have to have had proved this but beyond a reasonable doubt,

1266
01:04:46,760 --> 01:04:49,400
Speaker 6: And this is very much he said, she said, situation

1267
01:04:49,640 --> 01:04:52,919
Speaker 6: with a lot of evidence against that. She said, part

1268
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:54,760
Speaker 6: of it doesn't mean that's impossible. It doesn't mean her

1269
01:04:54,760 --> 01:04:57,360
Speaker 6: story is impossible. It just means that proving her story

1270
01:04:57,400 --> 01:05:02,720
Speaker 6: would be borderline impossible. So this is twenty seventeen. She

1271
01:05:02,920 --> 01:05:06,120
Speaker 6: gets a lawyer and starts making noise in twenty twenty,

1272
01:05:06,680 --> 01:05:09,560
Speaker 6: and it looks like we don't know the date of

1273
01:05:09,600 --> 01:05:11,920
Speaker 6: the settlement. Actually, it looks like it happened shortly after

1274
01:05:12,440 --> 01:05:15,080
Speaker 6: the lawyers got involved in late twenty twenty, So areund

1275
01:05:15,120 --> 01:05:17,520
Speaker 6: December twenty twenty, so I would assume that the settlement

1276
01:05:17,600 --> 01:05:22,040
Speaker 6: happened in early twenty twenty one. You can see why

1277
01:05:22,160 --> 01:05:24,400
Speaker 6: someone would try to make noise about a Fox News

1278
01:05:24,520 --> 01:05:27,360
Speaker 6: host that they had an encounter with. And obviously there's

1279
01:05:27,360 --> 01:05:29,400
Speaker 6: a police report in this situation. She got a rape

1280
01:05:29,480 --> 01:05:33,440
Speaker 6: kit the next morning and there was saman so you

1281
01:05:33,760 --> 01:05:35,760
Speaker 6: can understand why she would try to.

1282
01:05:35,680 --> 01:05:38,960
Speaker 5: Bring this up and why Heike Seth, who didn't want to.

1283
01:05:38,920 --> 01:05:40,320
Speaker 4: Set go public about it.

1284
01:05:40,400 --> 01:05:42,160
Speaker 5: She still we still don't know who she is.

1285
01:05:42,360 --> 01:05:43,320
Speaker 4: It's the situation, you know.

1286
01:05:43,600 --> 01:05:48,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, her husband's now being interviewed, and like her, her

1287
01:05:48,920 --> 01:05:52,520
Speaker 1: husband in this police report is presenting evidence that undercuts.

1288
01:05:52,120 --> 01:05:52,800
Speaker 4: Her own story.

1289
01:05:53,400 --> 01:05:56,200
Speaker 1: Yes, if you're reading between the lines, you're like, he

1290
01:05:56,240 --> 01:05:58,400
Speaker 1: doesn't seem to buy it. You could see it if

1291
01:05:58,440 --> 01:06:00,720
Speaker 1: you're reading this police report, read the met.

1292
01:06:00,640 --> 01:06:01,280
Speaker 5: Too part of this.

1293
01:06:01,520 --> 01:06:03,320
Speaker 6: Either way, you can say you can understand where it

1294
01:06:03,320 --> 01:06:09,120
Speaker 6: would galvanize her to say, hey, this powerful married man

1295
01:06:10,000 --> 01:06:12,640
Speaker 6: was being really creepy to me and it ended up

1296
01:06:12,800 --> 01:06:15,440
Speaker 6: in a tragedy for me, or you can see where

1297
01:06:15,480 --> 01:06:17,760
Speaker 6: it would be like, I bet I can get money

1298
01:06:17,960 --> 01:06:19,520
Speaker 6: at this point because he's not.

1299
01:06:19,480 --> 01:06:20,640
Speaker 5: Going to want this to be public.

1300
01:06:21,080 --> 01:06:23,440
Speaker 6: So you can read it in a couple of different ways,

1301
01:06:23,480 --> 01:06:25,600
Speaker 6: but I think the most important way to read it.

1302
01:06:25,680 --> 01:06:29,560
Speaker 6: Ryan said, it just can't be proven. Hegxeth has obviously

1303
01:06:29,760 --> 01:06:32,640
Speaker 6: copped to the adultery. He's admitted that.

1304
01:06:33,000 --> 01:06:36,120
Speaker 1: Right, and he literally had just had a child with

1305
01:06:36,160 --> 01:06:37,840
Speaker 1: the woman he had a fair on it was previous.

1306
01:06:37,840 --> 01:06:38,880
Speaker 5: Why, Yeah, it's really good.

1307
01:06:39,400 --> 01:06:41,120
Speaker 1: You can read the email from his mom. His mom's like,

1308
01:06:41,480 --> 01:06:44,400
Speaker 1: you're such a dog. Stop treating women so awfully. Yeah,

1309
01:06:44,480 --> 01:06:47,200
Speaker 1: it's really gross, and it's extra gross when he's then

1310
01:06:47,280 --> 01:06:52,120
Speaker 1: draped with all this like Christian morality and preaching.

1311
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:53,840
Speaker 6: Well, you know, I will say a lot of people

1312
01:06:53,920 --> 01:06:57,640
Speaker 6: who are late in life converts to like zealous Christianity,

1313
01:06:57,680 --> 01:07:02,080
Speaker 6: like they're really on fire, have very hard backgrounds, and

1314
01:07:02,280 --> 01:07:05,280
Speaker 6: they tend to be people who are clinging to their

1315
01:07:05,280 --> 01:07:08,760
Speaker 6: faith because they feel so emotionally desperately in.

1316
01:07:08,720 --> 01:07:11,000
Speaker 1: Need of it self spiritual medication.

1317
01:07:11,600 --> 01:07:14,920
Speaker 5: Maybe, and it's kind of what it's there for, but

1318
01:07:15,160 --> 01:07:16,760
Speaker 5: it does. It's not to me.

1319
01:07:16,880 --> 01:07:21,160
Speaker 6: That's like not a surprising thing from somebody who's ardently Christian.

1320
01:07:21,200 --> 01:07:24,080
Speaker 6: I've interviewed Pete Hegseth and he's surprised me. I interviewed

1321
01:07:24,160 --> 01:07:27,120
Speaker 6: him last year and I was just surprised by how

1322
01:07:28,440 --> 01:07:30,440
Speaker 6: sort of I was surprised by.

1323
01:07:30,280 --> 01:07:31,800
Speaker 5: How intellectual he was.

1324
01:07:31,920 --> 01:07:35,040
Speaker 6: And that may sound ridiculous, but I know people kept

1325
01:07:35,040 --> 01:07:37,640
Speaker 6: biases against Fox and Friends hosts. I kind of did

1326
01:07:37,720 --> 01:07:40,800
Speaker 6: going into the interview because they turn on a lot

1327
01:07:40,800 --> 01:07:43,200
Speaker 6: of books that are you know, they're books to sell books.

1328
01:07:43,600 --> 01:07:47,440
Speaker 6: But he's he's more he's a more nuanced figure than

1329
01:07:47,480 --> 01:07:50,240
Speaker 6: I think people give him credit for being. But clearly

1330
01:07:50,240 --> 01:07:53,640
Speaker 6: a rampant adulterer, does not have a history of treating women.

1331
01:07:53,680 --> 01:07:54,560
Speaker 4: Well, he's a dog.

1332
01:07:54,920 --> 01:07:58,840
Speaker 5: He's a dog. Clearly drinks too much, but I also.

1333
01:07:58,880 --> 01:07:59,440
Speaker 4: Or drank too much.

1334
01:07:59,480 --> 01:08:02,640
Speaker 6: That night there was a there's right now a weaponized

1335
01:08:02,720 --> 01:08:06,840
Speaker 6: smear campaign that's very obvious to Republicans, and it's backfiring

1336
01:08:07,040 --> 01:08:09,120
Speaker 6: on people who don't want Pete hag Seth to be

1337
01:08:09,160 --> 01:08:12,240
Speaker 6: the Defense Secretary, including Jenny Ernst, who's very close. I

1338
01:08:12,240 --> 01:08:15,160
Speaker 6: think with people in like Pentagon circles who don't want

1339
01:08:15,200 --> 01:08:18,280
Speaker 6: a disruptor obviously to get in the middle of their system.

1340
01:08:18,880 --> 01:08:19,840
Speaker 5: Two things can be true.

1341
01:08:20,040 --> 01:08:22,560
Speaker 6: The system needs to be disrupted, and this particular disruptor

1342
01:08:22,680 --> 01:08:25,000
Speaker 6: might not be qualified. The thing I would worry about,

1343
01:08:25,040 --> 01:08:28,240
Speaker 6: I'm curious what you think about this is compromot blackmail

1344
01:08:28,360 --> 01:08:31,479
Speaker 6: on the head of the Pentagon. If he's been drinking

1345
01:08:31,479 --> 01:08:33,600
Speaker 6: and sleeping around for so long, that seems to be

1346
01:08:33,640 --> 01:08:35,080
Speaker 6: a pretty serious concern.

1347
01:08:35,520 --> 01:08:39,320
Speaker 1: I mean for the intelligence community. Yeah, that's a big concern.

1348
01:08:40,280 --> 01:08:44,080
Speaker 1: I have no interest in the Pentagon being a well

1349
01:08:44,120 --> 01:08:48,960
Speaker 1: functioning institution. It's a good line and like waging effective wars.

1350
01:08:49,120 --> 01:08:54,400
Speaker 1: So if he's compromised good, it's bad. Like it's a

1351
01:08:54,439 --> 01:08:57,000
Speaker 1: bad thing, it's bad for the world. Yeah. So if

1352
01:08:57,040 --> 01:09:02,320
Speaker 1: he's bad at running it good and maybe he'll bring

1353
01:09:02,320 --> 01:09:04,040
Speaker 1: a wrecking ball to some of the corruption in there.

1354
01:09:04,479 --> 01:09:08,720
Speaker 1: Maybe more likely he's just completely ill equipped to run

1355
01:09:08,760 --> 01:09:11,240
Speaker 1: an institution of this size, and the institution will eat

1356
01:09:11,320 --> 01:09:11,639
Speaker 1: him up.

1357
01:09:12,120 --> 01:09:13,479
Speaker 5: Who knows, we'll see.

1358
01:09:16,200 --> 01:09:19,839
Speaker 6: Donald Trump announced yesterday that he was picking FTC Commissioner

1359
01:09:19,920 --> 01:09:24,320
Speaker 6: current FTC Commissioner Andrew Ferguson to lead the agency, which

1360
01:09:24,360 --> 01:09:27,720
Speaker 6: is obviously now helmed by Lena Kahn, who would cover

1361
01:09:27,840 --> 01:09:31,200
Speaker 6: a lot on this show. Ferguson is kind of a

1362
01:09:31,280 --> 01:09:34,000
Speaker 6: known figure for people who follow these types of things.

1363
01:09:34,720 --> 01:09:37,720
Speaker 6: But let's go to the next element here. This is

1364
01:09:37,920 --> 01:09:41,400
Speaker 6: Trump appointing Andrew Ferguson.

1365
01:09:41,000 --> 01:09:44,720
Speaker 1: And this was being circulated by his yeah, allies, Ferguson.

1366
01:09:45,680 --> 01:09:47,719
Speaker 1: There's some question as to whether or not Ferguson himself

1367
01:09:47,800 --> 01:09:51,040
Speaker 1: was circulating this, but certainly, certainly his allies.

1368
01:09:51,520 --> 01:09:52,720
Speaker 4: We're circulating this.

1369
01:09:52,760 --> 01:09:55,000
Speaker 1: And if you're just watching it, I mean, if you're

1370
01:09:55,000 --> 01:09:58,479
Speaker 1: just listening to it and not watching it. Emily, this

1371
01:09:58,520 --> 01:10:01,000
Speaker 1: is kind of not if you like Lena Kon.

1372
01:10:01,400 --> 01:10:04,480
Speaker 6: It's a big chunk of text, but it says successfully

1373
01:10:04,479 --> 01:10:08,000
Speaker 6: fought to end the Biden FTC's anti business policy of

1374
01:10:08,040 --> 01:10:11,560
Speaker 6: refusing to end merger investigations early and allow firms to

1375
01:10:11,600 --> 01:10:13,920
Speaker 6: close their deals as soon as the FTC finds no

1376
01:10:14,120 --> 01:10:18,679
Speaker 6: competitive harm. Represented Virginia numerous other states in the landmark

1377
01:10:18,720 --> 01:10:21,280
Speaker 6: anti trust suit against Google's ad tech monopoly. So I

1378
01:10:21,320 --> 01:10:24,799
Speaker 6: just want to note those two things being literally together

1379
01:10:24,920 --> 01:10:28,519
Speaker 6: in the bullet points. This is the nuance of the

1380
01:10:28,600 --> 01:10:29,880
Speaker 6: rights opposition.

1381
01:10:29,479 --> 01:10:30,280
Speaker 5: To Lena Khan.

1382
01:10:30,880 --> 01:10:33,120
Speaker 6: There are some people on the right, including Jdvance, who've

1383
01:10:33,160 --> 01:10:35,720
Speaker 6: been very positive about Lina Khan, others who have been

1384
01:10:35,720 --> 01:10:37,680
Speaker 6: sort of in the middle about Lina Kon, and then

1385
01:10:38,160 --> 01:10:40,320
Speaker 6: a third group that are just absolutely opposed to Lina

1386
01:10:40,360 --> 01:10:43,439
Speaker 6: Con in every turn. Ferguson appears to be somebody in

1387
01:10:43,479 --> 01:10:46,160
Speaker 6: the middle. Yeah, So, like you can see, they're bragging

1388
01:10:46,160 --> 01:10:49,000
Speaker 6: there about him being part of the anti trust monopoly

1389
01:10:49,960 --> 01:10:53,920
Speaker 6: suit against Google. I'm sorry, the ad tech monopoly suit

1390
01:10:53,960 --> 01:10:56,200
Speaker 6: against Google. Obviously it's an anti trust one as well.

1391
01:10:56,240 --> 01:11:00,599
Speaker 6: But and then the next bullet point is about over reach, right,

1392
01:11:00,680 --> 01:11:02,960
Speaker 6: anti trist overreach, And that's sort of interesting.

1393
01:11:03,080 --> 01:11:06,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, And they and that that a sheet talk that

1394
01:11:06,800 --> 01:11:09,839
Speaker 1: memo talks a lot about being too tough on mergers,

1395
01:11:10,200 --> 01:11:12,479
Speaker 1: that Lina Con is too rough on the business community,

1396
01:11:12,479 --> 01:11:12,880
Speaker 1: that they're going.

1397
01:11:12,840 --> 01:11:14,000
Speaker 4: To do a lot of deregulation.

1398
01:11:14,880 --> 01:11:19,800
Speaker 1: It's ironic that and almost poetic and anti poetic whatever

1399
01:11:19,880 --> 01:11:25,200
Speaker 1: that Trump made this move ousting Lena Khan and replacing

1400
01:11:25,920 --> 01:11:28,720
Speaker 1: her with Ferguson. On the same day, one of one

1401
01:11:28,720 --> 01:11:30,800
Speaker 1: of her most significant victories.

1402
01:11:32,240 --> 01:11:32,760
Speaker 4: Came through.

1403
01:11:32,800 --> 01:11:35,880
Speaker 1: If you can put up this this Fox Business article

1404
01:11:35,960 --> 01:11:40,639
Speaker 1: on the on the screen next the Kroger Albertson merger

1405
01:11:41,320 --> 01:11:44,400
Speaker 1: was was blocked as a twenty four billion dollar merger

1406
01:11:45,080 --> 01:11:50,559
Speaker 1: that that Lena Khan had had fought and arguing not

1407
01:11:50,920 --> 01:11:54,559
Speaker 1: just that it would be bad for consumers, there's kind

1408
01:11:54,560 --> 01:11:57,840
Speaker 1: of there's been there's agreement across the spectrum, even among

1409
01:11:57,840 --> 01:12:00,639
Speaker 1: the kind of pro business side, that if you can

1410
01:12:00,720 --> 01:12:04,440
Speaker 1: prove that there is going to be harmed to consumers,

1411
01:12:04,479 --> 01:12:07,439
Speaker 1: then then then you can block a merger. That's called

1412
01:12:07,439 --> 01:12:10,920
Speaker 1: the consumer welfare standard. Now, the if you can prove

1413
01:12:10,960 --> 01:12:14,639
Speaker 1: it is the part uh that the pro business side

1414
01:12:14,640 --> 01:12:17,960
Speaker 1: hangs her hat on and says and just constantly argues, well,

1415
01:12:17,960 --> 01:12:18,880
Speaker 1: all these mergers.

1416
01:12:18,640 --> 01:12:20,000
Speaker 4: Are going to be good for consumers.

1417
01:12:20,280 --> 01:12:22,479
Speaker 1: We're going to give you lower costs, and look you're

1418
01:12:22,520 --> 01:12:25,280
Speaker 1: going to it's going to be wonderful, trust us, and

1419
01:12:25,280 --> 01:12:27,559
Speaker 1: then it happens and then it's not and it's done,

1420
01:12:27,840 --> 01:12:29,200
Speaker 1: so you're screwed.

1421
01:12:30,880 --> 01:12:31,599
Speaker 4: In this case.

1422
01:12:32,640 --> 01:12:38,040
Speaker 1: She argued that actually additionally, the FTC and going back

1423
01:12:38,080 --> 01:12:40,680
Speaker 1: to its original meaning when you know when it was

1424
01:12:40,720 --> 01:12:42,400
Speaker 1: it was created, and so when some of these acts

1425
01:12:42,439 --> 01:12:47,240
Speaker 1: were created, that that enabled its powers, the power of

1426
01:12:47,280 --> 01:12:49,880
Speaker 1: workers and the and the well being of workers matters too,

1427
01:12:50,600 --> 01:12:55,000
Speaker 1: And so she argued that this merger would would depress wages,

1428
01:12:55,280 --> 01:12:59,479
Speaker 1: would make it and would would hurt worker power, which

1429
01:12:59,520 --> 01:13:02,960
Speaker 1: is also an interest of the federal government of the

1430
01:13:02,960 --> 01:13:04,920
Speaker 1: people of the United States, which is kind of a

1431
01:13:05,040 --> 01:13:07,679
Speaker 1: radical take, like, well, we're supposed to care about workers,

1432
01:13:07,880 --> 01:13:10,439
Speaker 1: but yeah, actually it's in the law, you're supposed to

1433
01:13:10,960 --> 01:13:14,679
Speaker 1: here she is, I love this talking to Hassan Piker

1434
01:13:15,000 --> 01:13:19,000
Speaker 1: on his stream about this this decision being blocked.

1435
01:13:19,479 --> 01:13:23,080
Speaker 13: What kind of labor protections does that offer to people

1436
01:13:23,080 --> 01:13:25,320
Speaker 13: that are working at these corporations.

1437
01:13:27,920 --> 01:13:31,320
Speaker 14: So one thing that our lawsuit alleged was that if

1438
01:13:31,320 --> 01:13:34,639
Speaker 14: this merger goes through, it's going to mean higher grocery

1439
01:13:34,680 --> 01:13:37,880
Speaker 14: prices for shoppers, but it's also going to be worse

1440
01:13:38,080 --> 01:13:41,120
Speaker 14: for the workers. And this is the first time that

1441
01:13:41,200 --> 01:13:44,519
Speaker 14: the FTC has ever sought to block a merger, not

1442
01:13:44,720 --> 01:13:47,120
Speaker 14: just because it's going to be bad for consumers, but

1443
01:13:47,280 --> 01:13:50,320
Speaker 14: also because it's going to be bad for workers. And

1444
01:13:50,479 --> 01:13:54,080
Speaker 14: you know, especially in recent decades, anti trust enforcers had

1445
01:13:54,120 --> 01:13:56,760
Speaker 14: not really been focused on the worker harms as much,

1446
01:13:56,800 --> 01:14:00,880
Speaker 14: and that's something we've really looked to change. So the

1447
01:14:00,960 --> 01:14:05,639
Speaker 14: complaint lays out how previously, when there was, when there

1448
01:14:05,680 --> 01:14:10,000
Speaker 14: has been competition between Kroger and Albertson's, that the workers

1449
01:14:10,040 --> 01:14:14,040
Speaker 14: at each store were able to use that competition as

1450
01:14:14,160 --> 01:14:17,200
Speaker 14: leverage when they were trying to bargain, and that if

1451
01:14:17,240 --> 01:14:20,519
Speaker 14: you allow these two companies to merge, that leverage that

1452
01:14:20,560 --> 01:14:24,680
Speaker 14: comes from having a potential alternative employer or an alternative

1453
01:14:24,720 --> 01:14:27,680
Speaker 14: store where customers can go if there's a strike, but

1454
01:14:27,800 --> 01:14:32,120
Speaker 14: eliminating that leverage point and bargaining leverage would ultimately be

1455
01:14:32,160 --> 01:14:34,599
Speaker 14: bad for workers. So again this is still being litigated,

1456
01:14:34,600 --> 01:14:37,680
Speaker 14: but that was in the complaint as an explanation for

1457
01:14:37,800 --> 01:14:40,880
Speaker 14: why this merger would be bad for workers. When the

1458
01:14:40,960 --> 01:14:45,160
Speaker 14: FTC team put on the trial, they actually had on

1459
01:14:45,200 --> 01:14:48,400
Speaker 14: the stand some of the workers that are currently employed

1460
01:14:48,439 --> 01:14:51,080
Speaker 14: by these stores so that they could also share their

1461
01:14:51,200 --> 01:14:53,800
Speaker 14: experience and just generally, I mean, there's a lot of

1462
01:14:53,840 --> 01:14:58,840
Speaker 14: empirical evidence that now shows that after mergers, workers have

1463
01:14:58,960 --> 01:15:02,719
Speaker 14: seen you pay cuts or a limit in any pay rises.

1464
01:15:03,520 --> 01:15:06,559
Speaker 14: You often see layoffs, you can see workers have less

1465
01:15:06,640 --> 01:15:10,799
Speaker 14: negotiation power to figure out well I even have a stable,

1466
01:15:10,880 --> 01:15:15,120
Speaker 14: predictable schedule. And so you know, these are all dimensions

1467
01:15:15,120 --> 01:15:17,559
Speaker 14: of competition on the labor front that are important to

1468
01:15:17,600 --> 01:15:18,400
Speaker 14: protect for people.

1469
01:15:18,800 --> 01:15:20,920
Speaker 1: First of all, it's pretty cool to have an FTC

1470
01:15:21,120 --> 01:15:23,200
Speaker 1: chair that goes on a Sundpiker's stream.

1471
01:15:23,800 --> 01:15:25,880
Speaker 4: We were four years in power. It was. It was

1472
01:15:25,960 --> 01:15:26,559
Speaker 4: quite a run.

1473
01:15:27,800 --> 01:15:31,760
Speaker 1: We'll see, we'll see where it goes from here. The

1474
01:15:32,160 --> 01:15:35,800
Speaker 1: big fear among supporters of the kind of Lena Khan

1475
01:15:35,920 --> 01:15:39,479
Speaker 1: approach to FTC was that Melissa holy Holyoak, who is

1476
01:15:39,520 --> 01:15:42,200
Speaker 1: a commissioner on the on the FTC, that she would

1477
01:15:42,240 --> 01:15:45,439
Speaker 1: get the chair gig. And she's as hostile as you

1478
01:15:45,439 --> 01:15:50,120
Speaker 1: can get to the kind of con canter wing wing

1479
01:15:50,200 --> 01:15:54,479
Speaker 1: of that bipartisan, transpartisan movement. So the fact that she

1480
01:15:54,479 --> 01:15:58,479
Speaker 1: didn't get it is something. But the fact that somebody

1481
01:15:58,760 --> 01:16:02,439
Speaker 1: got it who says that that she was too tough

1482
01:16:02,439 --> 01:16:06,000
Speaker 1: on mergers, like the day that she blocked this like huge,

1483
01:16:06,080 --> 01:16:08,160
Speaker 1: because what the Wall Street Journal would always say about

1484
01:16:08,200 --> 01:16:13,200
Speaker 1: her is she filed another frivolous BS case that's just

1485
01:16:13,240 --> 01:16:16,960
Speaker 1: gonna eat up money. And then when a judge, you know,

1486
01:16:17,120 --> 01:16:21,559
Speaker 1: gets this complaint, he's gonna knock it away because you know,

1487
01:16:21,640 --> 01:16:23,519
Speaker 1: this is a this is a child who doesn't even

1488
01:16:23,560 --> 01:16:26,280
Speaker 1: belong in this job, and she doesn't understand how the

1489
01:16:26,360 --> 01:16:29,080
Speaker 1: law works. And time after time after time, the judges

1490
01:16:29,120 --> 01:16:31,120
Speaker 1: are like, these are good points.

1491
01:16:31,360 --> 01:16:32,360
Speaker 4: This merger's blocked.

1492
01:16:32,680 --> 01:16:34,760
Speaker 6: Well, what she said on Hassan show there is like,

1493
01:16:35,439 --> 01:16:37,960
Speaker 6: so it's one of the reasons conservatives don't like hers, because,

1494
01:16:38,160 --> 01:16:40,639
Speaker 6: as Rachel Bovert has talked about to us and others,

1495
01:16:40,680 --> 01:16:44,840
Speaker 6: is the consumer welfare standard of Robert Bork was gospel

1496
01:16:45,000 --> 01:16:46,600
Speaker 6: on the right for a really long time, not just

1497
01:16:46,640 --> 01:16:48,479
Speaker 6: the political right, but just sort of the pro business

1498
01:16:48,520 --> 01:16:50,760
Speaker 6: community for a long time. The consumer welfare standard and

1499
01:16:50,800 --> 01:16:52,479
Speaker 6: what Lena Kahan was saying there is is not.

1500
01:16:52,920 --> 01:16:55,120
Speaker 4: When we're saying pro business, they mean pro big business.

1501
01:16:55,400 --> 01:16:58,000
Speaker 1: And also the mergers and acquisitions lawyers who make money

1502
01:16:58,000 --> 01:16:58,439
Speaker 1: on these.

1503
01:16:58,280 --> 01:17:00,879
Speaker 5: Mergers absolutely pro oh big business.

1504
01:17:01,120 --> 01:17:05,320
Speaker 6: And the consumer welfare standard is predicated on this idea

1505
01:17:05,400 --> 01:17:09,000
Speaker 6: that consumers will choose to shop at places where they

1506
01:17:09,040 --> 01:17:12,040
Speaker 6: treat workers well, and that is not the case when

1507
01:17:12,080 --> 01:17:16,479
Speaker 6: you have monopolies, right, Like, it's this ridiculous sort of cycle.

1508
01:17:16,600 --> 01:17:17,760
Speaker 5: And right, I just looked this up.

1509
01:17:17,800 --> 01:17:20,960
Speaker 6: Actually, we invited Andrew Ferguson to come on a Friday

1510
01:17:21,000 --> 01:17:26,520
Speaker 6: show with Matthew Stoller to talk about conservatives and antitrust

1511
01:17:26,600 --> 01:17:29,160
Speaker 6: policy back in June and never got a response. So

1512
01:17:29,240 --> 01:17:32,439
Speaker 6: your point about Lena Kon going on the Hassan Pikers

1513
01:17:32,400 --> 01:17:35,639
Speaker 6: stream is really interesting because one of the reasons Khan

1514
01:17:35,760 --> 01:17:37,760
Speaker 6: irked a lot of people in the business community is

1515
01:17:37,760 --> 01:17:41,920
Speaker 6: that she's just she's the new brand ician, right, Like

1516
01:17:41,960 --> 01:17:45,880
Speaker 6: she's actually like very much, very much in the moment,

1517
01:17:46,320 --> 01:17:49,439
Speaker 6: and that was irritating because it was a threat. It's like,

1518
01:17:49,520 --> 01:17:52,080
Speaker 6: this is a this is a popular movement behind Lena

1519
01:17:52,120 --> 01:17:54,680
Speaker 6: kan People seem to like what she's saying. There's a

1520
01:17:54,720 --> 01:17:57,120
Speaker 6: lot of media interest in her, and that poses a

1521
01:17:57,160 --> 01:18:00,599
Speaker 6: threat because it makes the right more interested in warding Lenacon.

1522
01:18:00,640 --> 01:18:02,280
Speaker 5: Matt Gates very supportive.

1523
01:18:01,840 --> 01:18:04,679
Speaker 1: For Lila Kon, for example, also a conservative.

1524
01:18:04,400 --> 01:18:08,000
Speaker 6: Conservative, so you can see why they would be threatened

1525
01:18:08,120 --> 01:18:10,720
Speaker 6: by Lena Kon like actually getting invitation even to go

1526
01:18:11,040 --> 01:18:11,920
Speaker 6: talk to Hassan Piker.

1527
01:18:11,920 --> 01:18:12,840
Speaker 5: I don't know which way it went.

1528
01:18:12,920 --> 01:18:17,759
Speaker 6: Maybe they pitched her to Hassan, but either way, Andrew

1529
01:18:17,800 --> 01:18:23,160
Speaker 6: Ferguson is going to have a slightly tougher for time

1530
01:18:23,200 --> 01:18:27,680
Speaker 6: on this one because Lena Kon obviously was popular in

1531
01:18:27,760 --> 01:18:29,040
Speaker 6: new media spaces like this one.

1532
01:18:29,160 --> 01:18:29,559
Speaker 4: Yeah.

1533
01:18:29,920 --> 01:18:34,120
Speaker 1: Indeed, let's move.

1534
01:18:33,920 --> 01:18:38,600
Speaker 6: On to this Inspector General report that was published yesterday

1535
01:18:38,840 --> 01:18:42,200
Speaker 6: by d j IG Michael Horowitz a familiar name to

1536
01:18:42,240 --> 01:18:44,880
Speaker 6: a lot of people because he published an Inspector General

1537
01:18:44,880 --> 01:18:49,440
Speaker 6: report on some of the Russia collusion, FAISA application, malfeasins

1538
01:18:49,920 --> 01:18:53,240
Speaker 6: that happened surrounding Carter Page and all of that stuff,

1539
01:18:53,280 --> 01:18:55,679
Speaker 6: and was popular on the right because of that report.

1540
01:18:56,040 --> 01:18:57,479
Speaker 5: Rightfully so, because it was a good.

1541
01:18:57,360 --> 01:18:59,760
Speaker 6: Report and needed to be done. But this next one

1542
01:19:00,120 --> 01:19:02,519
Speaker 6: maybe slightly less popular with the right. It was published

1543
01:19:02,600 --> 01:19:06,320
Speaker 6: yesterday and found that the Department of Justice under Donald

1544
01:19:06,320 --> 01:19:09,760
Speaker 6: Trump and his Attorney General Bill Barr improperly spied on

1545
01:19:10,200 --> 01:19:13,920
Speaker 6: members of Congress, congressional staffers, and actually journalists as well,

1546
01:19:13,960 --> 01:19:17,799
Speaker 6: in an effort to track it down who was selectively leaking.

1547
01:19:17,840 --> 01:19:20,080
Speaker 5: We can put the first element up on the screen.

1548
01:19:20,320 --> 01:19:22,479
Speaker 6: This is a report from Politico. The headline is watchdog

1549
01:19:22,520 --> 01:19:25,599
Speaker 6: faults DOJ and Trump's first term for secretly obtaining records

1550
01:19:25,680 --> 01:19:29,160
Speaker 6: of lawmakers and journalists. It's a little bit more complicated

1551
01:19:29,240 --> 01:19:32,400
Speaker 6: than just having done it secretly, and we can go

1552
01:19:32,479 --> 01:19:35,439
Speaker 6: through some of the inspectors some of the Inspector General

1553
01:19:35,479 --> 01:19:39,080
Speaker 6: report Ryan, because I think it's fairly important now that

1554
01:19:39,120 --> 01:19:43,160
Speaker 6: we have another Trump administration suiting up, and before we

1555
01:19:43,200 --> 01:19:45,160
Speaker 6: do start going through it, we can put it up

1556
01:19:45,200 --> 01:19:45,639
Speaker 6: on the screen.

1557
01:19:45,640 --> 01:19:45,760
Speaker 11: Here.

1558
01:19:45,800 --> 01:19:47,800
Speaker 6: This is the E two tear sheet. You can see

1559
01:19:47,800 --> 01:19:49,160
Speaker 6: the PDF of the report itself.

1560
01:19:49,160 --> 01:19:50,040
Speaker 5: You can go through it yourself.

1561
01:19:50,040 --> 01:19:53,760
Speaker 6: It's very long, but very long and very detailed, sort

1562
01:19:53,760 --> 01:19:56,439
Speaker 6: of step by step process of how warrants were retained,

1563
01:19:56,680 --> 01:20:01,680
Speaker 6: how warrants were obtained or obtained poorly or improperly in

1564
01:20:01,720 --> 01:20:06,479
Speaker 6: many cases. But essentially, the Trump Air Justice Department was

1565
01:20:06,520 --> 01:20:10,000
Speaker 6: doing something that was I think perfectly reasonable and understandable

1566
01:20:10,479 --> 01:20:12,920
Speaker 6: for the Attorney General would do, which is tracked down

1567
01:20:13,000 --> 01:20:16,400
Speaker 6: the selective leaks that were coming out of classified information

1568
01:20:16,640 --> 01:20:19,840
Speaker 6: weaponized against Donald Trump. We now know for sure, and

1569
01:20:19,880 --> 01:20:22,720
Speaker 6: we knew this at the time in many cases that

1570
01:20:22,800 --> 01:20:27,639
Speaker 6: these selective leaks were giving a very false picture of

1571
01:20:27,680 --> 01:20:30,760
Speaker 6: what was happening with carter Page. They were leaking to

1572
01:20:30,840 --> 01:20:36,040
Speaker 6: show that carter Page and others were like definitively involved

1573
01:20:36,200 --> 01:20:40,280
Speaker 6: in some strange plot like ripped from a Clancy novel

1574
01:20:40,479 --> 01:20:45,880
Speaker 6: about Russia collusion that just there wasn't there, and so

1575
01:20:45,920 --> 01:20:48,160
Speaker 6: Bill Barr was trying to track down who was leaking

1576
01:20:48,200 --> 01:20:50,439
Speaker 6: this class fed information. His deputies were trying to track

1577
01:20:50,439 --> 01:20:54,200
Speaker 6: down who was leaking this classified information. So in the process,

1578
01:20:54,240 --> 01:20:58,720
Speaker 6: though the dj was not following the proper channels that

1579
01:20:58,760 --> 01:21:01,479
Speaker 6: you need to man the reading this report. One reason

1580
01:21:01,520 --> 01:21:04,880
Speaker 6: that's kind of an interesting read is that the bureaucratic

1581
01:21:05,120 --> 01:21:06,519
Speaker 6: process of obtaining these.

1582
01:21:06,479 --> 01:21:09,840
Speaker 5: Ports insane, which it should as it should be.

1583
01:21:10,000 --> 01:21:13,960
Speaker 6: Yes, absolutely, one hundred percent as it should be. Did

1584
01:21:13,960 --> 01:21:14,920
Speaker 6: were you going to say something ran?

1585
01:21:15,040 --> 01:21:19,720
Speaker 1: No, no, just yeah, like it's and uh. Eric Holder put

1586
01:21:19,760 --> 01:21:27,479
Speaker 1: this in took place actually after the DJU basically spied

1587
01:21:27,560 --> 01:21:31,800
Speaker 1: on James Rosen, the Fox News White House correspondent, who

1588
01:21:32,040 --> 01:21:36,320
Speaker 1: was working on a story with with a source regarding

1589
01:21:36,479 --> 01:21:39,599
Speaker 1: North Korea's kind of new something something involving North Korea,

1590
01:21:40,040 --> 01:21:44,040
Speaker 1: and they swept up his communications, and the entire media

1591
01:21:45,240 --> 01:21:49,120
Speaker 1: left to right stood up to Eric Holder and said,

1592
01:21:49,160 --> 01:21:51,560
Speaker 1: this is outrageous. Many of us call on him to

1593
01:21:51,600 --> 01:21:57,559
Speaker 1: resign over that, including us over the hoving impost. And

1594
01:21:57,640 --> 01:21:59,599
Speaker 1: in response to that pressure, he put in this new

1595
01:21:59,600 --> 01:22:03,040
Speaker 1: policy that if you're going to pick up the communications

1596
01:22:03,520 --> 01:22:07,719
Speaker 1: of a journalist, even if it's incidental in a report

1597
01:22:07,760 --> 01:22:10,320
Speaker 1: on a car, investigating a car teller or something. If

1598
01:22:10,360 --> 01:22:12,519
Speaker 1: you wind up, if you see a journalist there, you

1599
01:22:12,560 --> 01:22:15,639
Speaker 1: need to come to the Attorney General himself and make

1600
01:22:15,720 --> 01:22:19,040
Speaker 1: your case that this breach of our norms, because it's

1601
01:22:19,040 --> 01:22:22,360
Speaker 1: just norms. Legally, you know, if they get a warrant,

1602
01:22:22,360 --> 01:22:25,200
Speaker 1: they can go after anybody they want, but the norms

1603
01:22:25,200 --> 01:22:27,240
Speaker 1: are the journalists are to be protected, and so they've

1604
01:22:27,400 --> 01:22:31,559
Speaker 1: set up these special protections that also cover members of Congress,

1605
01:22:31,600 --> 01:22:35,240
Speaker 1: which to me, I think are also good. Like members

1606
01:22:35,240 --> 01:22:38,280
Speaker 1: of Congress, whether you're Marjorie Taylor Green or Adam Schiff

1607
01:22:38,720 --> 01:22:41,360
Speaker 1: or AOC, I think should be off limits.

1608
01:22:41,400 --> 01:22:44,960
Speaker 6: Dana Rhorbaker, Yeah, absolutely. So let's get into what Qurowitz

1609
01:22:44,960 --> 01:22:47,519
Speaker 6: found a little bit here. This is where we'll start.

1610
01:22:47,560 --> 01:22:49,360
Speaker 6: On page five, we can put the next element up.

1611
01:22:49,640 --> 01:22:51,800
Speaker 6: Says he found that the Department failed to convene the

1612
01:22:51,840 --> 01:22:54,960
Speaker 6: News Media Review Committee they have a committee committed to

1613
01:22:55,000 --> 01:22:59,040
Speaker 6: any such things to consider the compulsory process authorization requests.

1614
01:22:59,439 --> 01:23:03,120
Speaker 6: The Department did not obtain the required DNI certification in

1615
01:23:03,200 --> 01:23:05,960
Speaker 6: one investigation, and we were unable to confirm whether the

1616
01:23:06,040 --> 01:23:09,680
Speaker 6: DNI certification it obtained in another investigation was provided to

1617
01:23:09,720 --> 01:23:13,439
Speaker 6: the Attorney General before he authorized the request, and the

1618
01:23:13,479 --> 01:23:17,600
Speaker 6: Department did not obtain the Attorney General's express authorization for

1619
01:23:17,840 --> 01:23:21,200
Speaker 6: the ndos that were sought in connection with compulsory process,

1620
01:23:22,040 --> 01:23:26,280
Speaker 6: with compulsory process issued in the investigations. So that's from

1621
01:23:26,360 --> 01:23:29,960
Speaker 6: the executive summary basically. But yeah, on this next element,

1622
01:23:30,360 --> 01:23:34,320
Speaker 6: you can see they're talking specifically about the New York

1623
01:23:34,360 --> 01:23:37,519
Speaker 6: Times and the Washington Post. CNN is swept up in this,

1624
01:23:37,680 --> 01:23:40,559
Speaker 6: they say, as we describe in this chapter, chapter three

1625
01:23:40,600 --> 01:23:43,719
Speaker 6: of the report, the Department complied with some, but not all,

1626
01:23:43,840 --> 01:23:46,719
Speaker 6: of the then appical provisions of the news media policy

1627
01:23:46,760 --> 01:23:49,400
Speaker 6: in CNN and New York Times and Washington Posts, many

1628
01:23:49,439 --> 01:23:51,280
Speaker 6: of which provisions have been put in place beginning just

1629
01:23:51,280 --> 01:23:53,599
Speaker 6: six years earlier. That's what Ryan was referencing from twenty

1630
01:23:53,600 --> 01:23:56,040
Speaker 6: fourteen and twenty fifteen, which horror, which references a lot

1631
01:23:56,120 --> 01:23:58,719
Speaker 6: in this report. He says, in our judgment, this deviation

1632
01:23:58,760 --> 01:24:02,080
Speaker 6: from the Department's owned requirement indicates a troubling disparity between

1633
01:24:02,080 --> 01:24:05,320
Speaker 6: on the one hand, the regard expressed in Department policy

1634
01:24:05,600 --> 01:24:08,080
Speaker 6: for the vital role of the news media and American democracy. Yes,

1635
01:24:08,160 --> 01:24:10,080
Speaker 6: I know, the DJ loves that so very much, And

1636
01:24:10,120 --> 01:24:12,200
Speaker 6: on the other hand, the department's commitment to complying with

1637
01:24:12,240 --> 01:24:14,880
Speaker 6: the limits and requirements that it intended to safeguard that

1638
01:24:15,160 --> 01:24:17,920
Speaker 6: very role. So basically, if you go into the report,

1639
01:24:18,200 --> 01:24:21,519
Speaker 6: what happens with these journalist communications? These are non content

1640
01:24:21,600 --> 01:24:25,600
Speaker 6: communications requests, so they're trying to pull who the journalists

1641
01:24:25,640 --> 01:24:30,080
Speaker 6: were emailing and calling, and that in and of itself

1642
01:24:30,080 --> 01:24:33,080
Speaker 6: would be enough obviously to figure out who's leaking. And

1643
01:24:33,120 --> 01:24:36,000
Speaker 6: that's why you need to have the provisions that were

1644
01:24:36,000 --> 01:24:38,679
Speaker 6: put in place followed, because it's a very serious thing.

1645
01:24:38,880 --> 01:24:39,840
Speaker 5: When you're looking.

1646
01:24:39,600 --> 01:24:44,160
Speaker 6: At who journalists are talking to, you should be the

1647
01:24:44,400 --> 01:24:50,080
Speaker 6: absolute highest standard. And so when we have potentially cash

1648
01:24:50,080 --> 01:24:53,440
Speaker 6: Hotel coming into the FBI and a loyalist like Pambondi

1649
01:24:53,479 --> 01:24:57,240
Speaker 6: coming into the DOJ, Bill Barr was kind of a

1650
01:24:57,280 --> 01:25:02,400
Speaker 6: loyalist but ultimately really bucked Trump. So imagine what a

1651
01:25:02,400 --> 01:25:06,240
Speaker 6: loyalist who's even sort of more maga than Bill Barr

1652
01:25:06,439 --> 01:25:08,559
Speaker 6: might do in some of these situations, even if they're

1653
01:25:08,640 --> 01:25:12,760
Speaker 6: kind of swampy like Pam Bondi. Legitimately is these are

1654
01:25:13,000 --> 01:25:16,920
Speaker 6: really serious things, really serious powers that I would just

1655
01:25:17,120 --> 01:25:21,719
Speaker 6: tell the right canon will be abused against conservative media.

1656
01:25:22,320 --> 01:25:26,840
Speaker 6: Little guys like imagine, imagine right the slippery slope as

1657
01:25:26,880 --> 01:25:30,320
Speaker 6: these powers start getting abused, because there are and it

1658
01:25:30,320 --> 01:25:33,439
Speaker 6: always happens this way, there are rightful uses of these

1659
01:25:33,479 --> 01:25:37,439
Speaker 6: powers when selective leaks of classified information that can damage

1660
01:25:37,479 --> 01:25:42,760
Speaker 6: national security literally can Yeah, that's a reasonable use of

1661
01:25:42,800 --> 01:25:44,800
Speaker 6: trying to figure out who is leaking. I don't think

1662
01:25:44,800 --> 01:25:47,800
Speaker 6: it's necessarily a reasonable use of going after journalists communications,

1663
01:25:47,800 --> 01:25:51,840
Speaker 6: but it may be a predicate, a reasonable predicate for

1664
01:25:51,880 --> 01:25:55,840
Speaker 6: an investigation. And it is what convinces you to let

1665
01:25:55,880 --> 01:25:58,440
Speaker 6: those powers get bigger and bigger and bigger.

1666
01:25:58,160 --> 01:26:01,080
Speaker 1: And bigger, and the right exactly, and these norms get

1667
01:26:01,080 --> 01:26:04,640
Speaker 1: loosened in a ratchet effect. It moves one direction and

1668
01:26:04,800 --> 01:26:08,000
Speaker 1: only tends to move in one direction. So let's say, well,

1669
01:26:08,080 --> 01:26:09,760
Speaker 1: Adam Schiff is one of the members of Congress that

1670
01:26:09,800 --> 01:26:12,120
Speaker 1: they spied on here, and Swallowell like, let's say you

1671
01:26:12,120 --> 01:26:13,160
Speaker 1: hate Adam Shift.

1672
01:26:12,960 --> 01:26:16,439
Speaker 5: And Cash Pattel by the way, and Cash Battel twenty

1673
01:26:16,520 --> 01:26:19,280
Speaker 5: one Democrats and twenty Republicans.

1674
01:26:18,720 --> 01:26:21,559
Speaker 1: And Cash Betel is a great example here. So so

1675
01:26:21,760 --> 01:26:23,920
Speaker 1: take take Adam Shift. You hate Adam Shiff, you think

1676
01:26:23,920 --> 01:26:25,479
Speaker 1: he's a trader, you think he should be spied on.

1677
01:26:26,360 --> 01:26:31,560
Speaker 1: He's now an incoming senator, if there's a Democratic administration

1678
01:26:31,960 --> 01:26:34,320
Speaker 1: in the next ten to fifteen years, you know he's

1679
01:26:34,479 --> 01:26:35,920
Speaker 1: going to be likely CIA chief.

1680
01:26:36,520 --> 01:26:38,200
Speaker 4: He's going to be pissed. You spied on him.

1681
01:26:39,160 --> 01:26:41,640
Speaker 1: You want him with all these powers Now now he

1682
01:26:41,640 --> 01:26:43,200
Speaker 1: can spy on you in reverse.

1683
01:26:43,560 --> 01:26:45,679
Speaker 4: So that's my message to the right.

1684
01:26:45,760 --> 01:26:49,000
Speaker 1: Now, the message to the left would be like, all right,

1685
01:26:49,040 --> 01:26:53,000
Speaker 1: you spied on cash Pattel. The left, Yeah, yeah, Democrats

1686
01:26:53,040 --> 01:26:56,400
Speaker 1: spied on cash Pattel when he was a Hill staffer.

1687
01:26:57,479 --> 01:27:00,000
Speaker 1: Now he's gonna be running the FBI, and he's pissed.

1688
01:27:00,479 --> 01:27:03,959
Speaker 1: He's very pissed, like he has sued you know, everybody involved.

1689
01:27:05,000 --> 01:27:08,360
Speaker 1: His case got thrown out, but he's like, guys angry

1690
01:27:08,680 --> 01:27:10,920
Speaker 1: as he should be. You spy on a Hill staffer

1691
01:27:11,400 --> 01:27:13,760
Speaker 1: and so now he's going to run the FBI. Look

1692
01:27:13,800 --> 01:27:17,439
Speaker 1: what you did, Like, so don't don't do this stuff.

1693
01:27:17,920 --> 01:27:19,080
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's serious.

1694
01:27:19,120 --> 01:27:21,439
Speaker 6: I mean it is really serious when you start setting,

1695
01:27:21,960 --> 01:27:24,280
Speaker 6: when you let the precedent slip like this and don't

1696
01:27:24,280 --> 01:27:27,400
Speaker 6: get caught until there's an inspector general report a long

1697
01:27:27,479 --> 01:27:30,360
Speaker 6: time later. And part of this is you're supposed to

1698
01:27:30,360 --> 01:27:33,479
Speaker 6: give reporters enough time to respond, and that wasn't done

1699
01:27:33,479 --> 01:27:37,679
Speaker 6: in all of these cases to actually have a legal

1700
01:27:37,720 --> 01:27:40,920
Speaker 6: response to their communications being pulled to the government. As

1701
01:27:40,960 --> 01:27:45,160
Speaker 6: a journalist, I mean, right now, we've seen how crucial

1702
01:27:45,240 --> 01:27:48,960
Speaker 6: independent media has been and independent voices in Congress, like

1703
01:27:49,000 --> 01:27:51,240
Speaker 6: people who are willing to book the party line. We've

1704
01:27:51,240 --> 01:27:54,320
Speaker 6: seen how important that is to understanding like Cash Purtel

1705
01:27:55,360 --> 01:27:58,519
Speaker 6: as Matt TeV came on Undercurrents last weeked and made

1706
01:27:58,520 --> 01:27:59,920
Speaker 6: this point. He was like, the new nes memo that

1707
01:28:00,080 --> 01:28:03,200
Speaker 6: we were told by selective leaks, by the way, was

1708
01:28:03,280 --> 01:28:06,519
Speaker 6: absolutely wrong, was vindicated. And Cash Bettel was basically the

1709
01:28:06,560 --> 01:28:10,720
Speaker 6: author of the Neuns memo. Those independent voices have been

1710
01:28:11,000 --> 01:28:14,040
Speaker 6: like really important to understanding what's going on when nobody

1711
01:28:14,080 --> 01:28:16,080
Speaker 6: else in the Republican Party wanted to really talk about

1712
01:28:16,080 --> 01:28:19,679
Speaker 6: how bad the FBI was was were hesitant to question

1713
01:28:19,760 --> 01:28:23,200
Speaker 6: the Russian investigation. Initially, it's easy to forget there was

1714
01:28:23,240 --> 01:28:25,800
Speaker 6: even hesitation on the right about that, but there was

1715
01:28:26,240 --> 01:28:28,960
Speaker 6: These independent voices in Congress and in the media are

1716
01:28:29,160 --> 01:28:32,000
Speaker 6: some of the more important voices right now. There's a

1717
01:28:32,000 --> 01:28:36,200
Speaker 6: lot of literal disinformation coming from the establishment, and so

1718
01:28:36,479 --> 01:28:40,920
Speaker 6: as soon as these powers sort of slip into getting

1719
01:28:40,920 --> 01:28:44,960
Speaker 6: bigger and bigger without proper oversight. Then guess who's coming

1720
01:28:44,960 --> 01:28:48,479
Speaker 6: after independent media. It'll be Adam Shift, It'll be Eric Swallwell,

1721
01:28:48,520 --> 01:28:51,640
Speaker 6: it'll be those types of people, or maybe even like

1722
01:28:52,400 --> 01:28:54,160
Speaker 6: on the right. I think right now, people on the

1723
01:28:54,200 --> 01:28:56,760
Speaker 6: right are primed to over use these powers because they

1724
01:28:56,760 --> 01:28:59,519
Speaker 6: have good reason to want to know what happened. And

1725
01:28:59,640 --> 01:29:03,280
Speaker 6: that's how things end up getting expanded in very bad

1726
01:29:03,320 --> 01:29:05,720
Speaker 6: directions because it's like it's easy to convince people you

1727
01:29:05,760 --> 01:29:09,160
Speaker 6: should be going after and you should be using this power,

1728
01:29:09,960 --> 01:29:11,919
Speaker 6: and so you sort of feel like you have permission

1729
01:29:12,000 --> 01:29:13,360
Speaker 6: to make the power broader and broader.

1730
01:29:13,520 --> 01:29:15,519
Speaker 1: Yeah, got to protect what's left of this republic.

1731
01:29:15,760 --> 01:29:16,320
Speaker 5: Let's do it.

1732
01:29:16,800 --> 01:29:19,760
Speaker 1: And so it's been a bleak show. You know, we

1733
01:29:19,800 --> 01:29:24,479
Speaker 1: talked about war, ethnic cleansing, sexual assault, the selling out

1734
01:29:24,479 --> 01:29:27,360
Speaker 1: of the anti trust agenda. So let's do a little

1735
01:29:27,400 --> 01:29:29,639
Speaker 1: palate cleanser and talk about Bill Maher for a little bit.

1736
01:29:29,680 --> 01:29:30,680
Speaker 5: Let's talk about Bill Moore.

1737
01:29:30,920 --> 01:29:33,240
Speaker 6: And it's a palate cleanser because this clip is sort

1738
01:29:33,240 --> 01:29:37,880
Speaker 6: of delightful in some ways as either a point about

1739
01:29:37,880 --> 01:29:42,240
Speaker 6: cancel culture never existing or about cancel culture being over.

1740
01:29:42,439 --> 01:29:43,280
Speaker 5: So let's go ahead and.

1741
01:29:43,439 --> 01:29:47,719
Speaker 6: Roll Bill Maher talking to actor Zachary Levi on Club

1742
01:29:47,840 --> 01:29:50,679
Speaker 6: Random and Zachary Levi for Contacts, came out in support

1743
01:29:50,680 --> 01:29:52,600
Speaker 6: of Trump, like right before the election. It was a

1744
01:29:52,640 --> 01:29:55,400
Speaker 6: matter of days before the election, and he was talking

1745
01:29:55,400 --> 01:29:57,840
Speaker 6: to Bill Moore on Club Random. Let's go ahead and

1746
01:29:57,880 --> 01:29:59,639
Speaker 6: see how their exchange went.

1747
01:30:00,280 --> 01:30:02,879
Speaker 7: You got canceled for for basically say.

1748
01:30:02,760 --> 01:30:06,519
Speaker 1: Have I been canceled? Well, I hope I haven't been

1749
01:30:06,600 --> 01:30:07,400
Speaker 1: canceled yet.

1750
01:30:07,800 --> 01:30:09,200
Speaker 4: I mean, if it happens that happens, like.

1751
01:30:09,320 --> 01:30:13,000
Speaker 7: I mean, come on, didn't you lose jobs for that?

1752
01:30:13,120 --> 01:30:14,240
Speaker 7: Isn't that what canceling is?

1753
01:30:14,360 --> 01:30:18,040
Speaker 13: No for coming out and voting for Trump? Yeah, I mean, listen,

1754
01:30:18,080 --> 01:30:21,000
Speaker 13: I have yet to see what the ultimate effects of

1755
01:30:21,000 --> 01:30:23,280
Speaker 13: all that are going to be. I already had multiple

1756
01:30:23,320 --> 01:30:25,320
Speaker 13: jobs that I was in the process of shooting or

1757
01:30:25,360 --> 01:30:26,960
Speaker 13: that I have yet to shoot, and none of those

1758
01:30:27,000 --> 01:30:30,440
Speaker 13: have been compromised. All those like, none of my producers

1759
01:30:30,520 --> 01:30:34,360
Speaker 13: or any of these studios behind those films or projects

1760
01:30:34,960 --> 01:30:37,880
Speaker 13: have called and said, hey, listen, this is a you know,

1761
01:30:38,040 --> 01:30:40,520
Speaker 13: a lying too far and we can't have you associated

1762
01:30:40,520 --> 01:30:43,479
Speaker 13: with the project anymore. We're all still full steam ahead

1763
01:30:43,520 --> 01:30:47,519
Speaker 13: on those How it ultimately like plays out in the future,

1764
01:30:47,560 --> 01:30:49,080
Speaker 13: I don't know. You know, I'm going to sit down

1765
01:30:49,080 --> 01:30:49,960
Speaker 13: with my team.

1766
01:30:50,439 --> 01:30:50,920
Speaker 4: I have yet.

1767
01:30:50,920 --> 01:30:54,479
Speaker 13: I've been in Eastern Europe making this movie all during

1768
01:30:54,520 --> 01:30:56,519
Speaker 13: the election and everything. I mean, I was all, you know,

1769
01:30:56,840 --> 01:30:58,720
Speaker 13: kind of disconnected a lot from what was going on

1770
01:30:58,800 --> 01:31:01,240
Speaker 13: other than social media and following the news and kind

1771
01:31:01,240 --> 01:31:04,320
Speaker 13: of seeing the play by plays. But you know, I'm

1772
01:31:04,320 --> 01:31:06,240
Speaker 13: gonna sit down with my team and we'll talk about

1773
01:31:06,240 --> 01:31:08,360
Speaker 13: because I haven't talked to any of them. They might say, hey, listen,

1774
01:31:08,400 --> 01:31:10,200
Speaker 13: we've had some phone calls with some people and they

1775
01:31:10,200 --> 01:31:11,320
Speaker 13: don't want to work with you anymore.

1776
01:31:11,840 --> 01:31:12,360
Speaker 1: I don't know.

1777
01:31:13,000 --> 01:31:14,839
Speaker 7: I could have sworn that already happened.

1778
01:31:15,000 --> 01:31:19,320
Speaker 13: No, No, yeah, I think it was because when I

1779
01:31:19,360 --> 01:31:23,040
Speaker 13: did the town hall with Tulci and Bobby, so basically

1780
01:31:23,200 --> 01:31:25,000
Speaker 13: I was stumping for Bobby.

1781
01:31:25,000 --> 01:31:27,200
Speaker 4: I really wanted Bobby to be Bobby Bobby Kennedy.

1782
01:31:27,320 --> 01:31:31,840
Speaker 7: Yeah, he sat there, and you know, I don't agree

1783
01:31:31,880 --> 01:31:37,320
Speaker 7: with everything, but among people in my field, especially who

1784
01:31:37,360 --> 01:31:42,160
Speaker 7: were considered liberals, I have definitely been the most supportive.

1785
01:31:42,800 --> 01:31:47,960
Speaker 7: You know, his general view of health and medicine and

1786
01:31:48,000 --> 01:31:50,840
Speaker 7: how it all works and what's important is closer to

1787
01:31:50,880 --> 01:31:52,400
Speaker 7: mine than Western medicine.

1788
01:31:52,680 --> 01:31:56,519
Speaker 6: So I think funny thing there was zachar le By

1789
01:31:56,560 --> 01:31:59,479
Speaker 6: saying he hasn't yet lost jobs, and bellmart saying I

1790
01:31:59,479 --> 01:32:01,720
Speaker 6: could have swore that happened, because it takes us back

1791
01:32:01,720 --> 01:32:03,880
Speaker 6: to the central point of the cancel culture debate, which

1792
01:32:03,920 --> 01:32:06,800
Speaker 6: is are you just getting criticism or are you actually

1793
01:32:06,840 --> 01:32:07,960
Speaker 6: facing consequences?

1794
01:32:08,000 --> 01:32:09,200
Speaker 5: And I don't know, I.

1795
01:32:09,200 --> 01:32:12,040
Speaker 6: Think Ryan would probably agree, and it gets to your

1796
01:32:12,400 --> 01:32:14,880
Speaker 6: great essay Elephant in the zoom or reported essay Elephant

1797
01:32:14,880 --> 01:32:17,680
Speaker 6: in the zoom like part of cancel culture was absolutely

1798
01:32:17,840 --> 01:32:20,839
Speaker 6: absolutely real. There are people who said it never happened,

1799
01:32:20,880 --> 01:32:23,000
Speaker 6: it was never real, it was consequence called.

1800
01:32:23,040 --> 01:32:24,280
Speaker 5: It was sort of always incoherent.

1801
01:32:24,520 --> 01:32:26,879
Speaker 6: On the one hand, people were saying, it's just consequence culture,

1802
01:32:27,200 --> 01:32:29,200
Speaker 6: but also it's not real, right, like you're just you're

1803
01:32:29,280 --> 01:32:32,880
Speaker 6: just getting you're just facing consequences for your we would

1804
01:32:32,960 --> 01:32:35,559
Speaker 6: name it right, Yeah, exactly, you're just facing consequences for

1805
01:32:35,640 --> 01:32:39,640
Speaker 6: having unpopular opinions. But but also like, this thing is

1806
01:32:39,680 --> 01:32:41,680
Speaker 6: not really happening. It's it's not at all, you know,

1807
01:32:42,000 --> 01:32:44,360
Speaker 6: a problem, don't worry about it. There's nothing to see here.

1808
01:32:44,400 --> 01:32:49,440
Speaker 6: So that said, I think this is maybe becoming incoherent

1809
01:32:49,560 --> 01:32:54,519
Speaker 6: on the right because the second Trump administration or the

1810
01:32:54,560 --> 01:32:57,479
Speaker 6: second Trump election. What's interesting about it is you get

1811
01:32:57,479 --> 01:32:59,840
Speaker 6: the guy winning the popular vote, you do have sort

1812
01:32:59,880 --> 01:33:03,200
Speaker 6: of a broad swath of celebrities coming out supporting him.

1813
01:33:03,240 --> 01:33:05,400
Speaker 6: Still a lot of celebrities supporting Kamala Harris, no question

1814
01:33:05,439 --> 01:33:07,960
Speaker 6: about it. These tech guys now coming out support of

1815
01:33:07,960 --> 01:33:10,800
Speaker 6: Donald Trump. We talked about the Federalist headline like the

1816
01:33:10,880 --> 01:33:13,679
Speaker 6: day before the election, which was it's no longer there's

1817
01:33:13,720 --> 01:33:17,600
Speaker 6: no social stigma around supporting Trump anymore. So this is

1818
01:33:17,600 --> 01:33:19,720
Speaker 6: going to this could potentially be incoherent, right, like if

1819
01:33:19,760 --> 01:33:23,519
Speaker 6: the social stigma around supporting Trump is mostly gone, which

1820
01:33:23,560 --> 01:33:25,559
Speaker 6: I agree in the rest of the country outside you know,

1821
01:33:25,640 --> 01:33:28,400
Speaker 6: some type of like C suite at the thirty Rock building.

1822
01:33:28,920 --> 01:33:31,840
Speaker 6: If you say that, then it also says like cancer

1823
01:33:31,840 --> 01:33:32,639
Speaker 6: culture's kind of over.

1824
01:33:34,160 --> 01:33:35,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was a wave.

1825
01:33:35,560 --> 01:33:36,080
Speaker 5: It a wave.

1826
01:33:36,280 --> 01:33:39,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm totally over and some I think I think

1827
01:33:39,720 --> 01:33:44,680
Speaker 1: the more hermetically sealed ecosystems are still operating under some

1828
01:33:44,720 --> 01:33:49,639
Speaker 1: of its ideological riggors. But in general, yeah, oh of course, yeah, yes,

1829
01:33:49,680 --> 01:33:52,280
Speaker 1: not so much. Yeah, there was a right and the rights.

1830
01:33:52,360 --> 01:33:55,120
Speaker 1: The rights probably isn't quite over yet because you guys

1831
01:33:55,120 --> 01:33:58,040
Speaker 1: were later and adopting it internally and so you've got

1832
01:33:58,080 --> 01:34:00,720
Speaker 1: to it's got to work through your system. They're your

1833
01:34:00,760 --> 01:34:04,759
Speaker 1: own like mirror world bizarro version of of cancel culture.

1834
01:34:05,200 --> 01:34:06,439
Speaker 5: Yeah it will.

1835
01:34:06,920 --> 01:34:11,880
Speaker 1: You're not sufficiently sufficiently anti woke like it like.

1836
01:34:12,640 --> 01:34:14,760
Speaker 5: This is a raging debate on the white right right now, yes.

1837
01:34:15,600 --> 01:34:18,880
Speaker 1: Which is which gets weird because it's like, you say

1838
01:34:19,040 --> 01:34:24,840
Speaker 1: anything related to racial justice, diversity, make any basic point.

1839
01:34:25,560 --> 01:34:27,160
Speaker 1: Tell me if I'm wrong on the right. People are like,

1840
01:34:27,520 --> 01:34:30,920
Speaker 1: DEI woke. Yeah, You're like no, no, no, whoa, whoa, whoa.

1841
01:34:31,120 --> 01:34:36,120
Speaker 1: I'm just saying, like, everybody should be treated with the equality.

1842
01:34:36,320 --> 01:34:38,800
Speaker 1: Did you say equality? This happened equity?

1843
01:34:39,080 --> 01:34:40,599
Speaker 6: This happened to me once when I was like, maybe

1844
01:34:40,640 --> 01:34:43,360
Speaker 6: the Conservatives should put a woman.

1845
01:34:43,080 --> 01:34:46,800
Speaker 1: On this cancel hert hancel this woman.

1846
01:34:47,560 --> 01:34:49,519
Speaker 6: I was like, it doesn't have to be any specific woman,

1847
01:34:49,560 --> 01:34:51,519
Speaker 6: but if you believe that men and women are different,

1848
01:34:51,880 --> 01:34:55,120
Speaker 6: then maybe a woman will have valuable takes on abortion,

1849
01:34:55,520 --> 01:34:57,519
Speaker 6: maybe maybe a pro life woman.

1850
01:34:57,800 --> 01:35:00,920
Speaker 1: Drag this woman. Yeah, it's been nice working with you. You're finished.

1851
01:35:01,160 --> 01:35:03,240
Speaker 4: Yeah, that is the kind of thing you say.

1852
01:35:03,280 --> 01:35:05,480
Speaker 1: You say anything that gets anywhere near it.

1853
01:35:05,479 --> 01:35:08,200
Speaker 4: It's like, whoa, yeah, we much.

1854
01:35:08,280 --> 01:35:10,640
Speaker 6: Well because and this is actually I think becoming a

1855
01:35:10,640 --> 01:35:13,479
Speaker 6: serious problem because there is a need, there's a legitimate

1856
01:35:13,479 --> 01:35:15,639
Speaker 6: need for litmus tests. If you're the Trump if you're

1857
01:35:15,640 --> 01:35:18,240
Speaker 6: the incoming Trump administration, you were trying to put all

1858
01:35:18,320 --> 01:35:19,960
Speaker 6: kinds of litmus tests. And this was a problem for

1859
01:35:20,040 --> 01:35:24,519
Speaker 6: Jonie Ernst about loyalty up on the hiring process or

1860
01:35:24,520 --> 01:35:28,120
Speaker 6: the confirmation process, because you know that the second somebody

1861
01:35:28,160 --> 01:35:30,000
Speaker 6: is like Bill barr And is not fully loyal to

1862
01:35:30,000 --> 01:35:32,160
Speaker 6: Donald Trump or Mike Pence is not fully loyal to

1863
01:35:32,200 --> 01:35:35,519
Speaker 6: Donald Trump, then boom, like your whole agenda could crumble.

1864
01:35:35,720 --> 01:35:37,000
Speaker 5: It could become a house of cards.

1865
01:35:37,040 --> 01:35:38,519
Speaker 6: So they're trying to not build a house of cards,

1866
01:35:38,560 --> 01:35:40,840
Speaker 6: They're trying to build a house of stone. And that's

1867
01:35:40,880 --> 01:35:43,360
Speaker 6: where their litmus tests are becoming important to them. And

1868
01:35:43,439 --> 01:35:47,719
Speaker 6: so they use these types of stand ins as litmus tests.

1869
01:35:47,840 --> 01:35:49,639
Speaker 5: And it can, like I think.

1870
01:35:49,600 --> 01:35:52,719
Speaker 6: Really poison or pollute I should say pollute the discourse

1871
01:35:53,160 --> 01:35:54,040
Speaker 6: because it's not honest.

1872
01:35:54,080 --> 01:35:55,479
Speaker 1: Always take it from me, it's toxic.

1873
01:35:56,200 --> 01:35:59,400
Speaker 5: Take it from Ryan, it's toxic. It's toxic.

1874
01:35:59,439 --> 01:36:02,320
Speaker 6: And so maybe the mainstream wave of cancel culture is

1875
01:36:02,360 --> 01:36:04,679
Speaker 6: coming to And there was a time when if Zachary

1876
01:36:04,720 --> 01:36:07,760
Speaker 6: Levi had just breathed so much in Trump's direction, he

1877
01:36:07,960 --> 01:36:13,360
Speaker 6: legitimately probably would have lost jobs in Hollywood. Maybe, yeah,

1878
01:36:13,439 --> 01:36:13,920
Speaker 6: it happened.

1879
01:36:13,960 --> 01:36:17,439
Speaker 1: I mean there were some pretty yeah. Twenty sixteen, Yeah, seventeen, twenty.

1880
01:36:17,200 --> 01:36:20,000
Speaker 6: Sixteen, seventeen eighteen. Trump is a Russian asset. You're yeah,

1881
01:36:20,040 --> 01:36:22,479
Speaker 6: one hundred percent, you're a trader, all of that. So

1882
01:36:23,040 --> 01:36:24,360
Speaker 6: this is sort of a fun note to end the

1883
01:36:24,360 --> 01:36:24,960
Speaker 6: show on Ryan.

1884
01:36:25,080 --> 01:36:28,040
Speaker 5: There you go, thanks for tuning in. I'm excited about

1885
01:36:28,080 --> 01:36:29,760
Speaker 5: the Friday show me too.

1886
01:36:29,880 --> 01:36:32,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, if you missed earlier on the show, we're talking

1887
01:36:32,080 --> 01:36:37,000
Speaker 1: to you basically an American leftist who went to fight

1888
01:36:37,080 --> 01:36:41,880
Speaker 1: for the the anikocamis the of the YPG, which good

1889
01:36:41,920 --> 01:36:42,280
Speaker 1: for him.

1890
01:36:43,120 --> 01:36:46,200
Speaker 6: It'll be interesting conversation, especially this week. So thank you

1891
01:36:46,200 --> 01:36:48,080
Speaker 6: so much for tuning in Breakingpoints dot com if you

1892
01:36:48,120 --> 01:36:49,479
Speaker 6: want to become a premium subscriber.

1893
01:36:49,520 --> 01:36:51,439
Speaker 5: There's also fun Christmas merch.

1894
01:36:51,439 --> 01:36:54,839
Speaker 6: I've enjoyed seeing everybody's pictures in their Breaking Points sweaters.

1895
01:36:54,880 --> 01:36:58,040
Speaker 1: I was wearing as Oh, you were all right, but

1896
01:36:58,120 --> 01:36:59,680
Speaker 1: it's like, is that you on the sweater the guys yes,

1897
01:36:59,760 --> 01:37:02,120
Speaker 1: today it's really.

1898
01:37:01,880 --> 01:37:05,200
Speaker 5: It is awkward. It is the same thing with the mugs.

1899
01:37:05,520 --> 01:37:08,000
Speaker 5: Oh yeah, yeah, I'll be on the zoom call. Sometimes

1900
01:37:08,000 --> 01:37:08,760
Speaker 5: with the mug at.

1901
01:37:08,680 --> 01:37:11,719
Speaker 6: Home, I'm like, oh shit, cut my face.

1902
01:37:11,520 --> 01:37:13,920
Speaker 5: On a mug again. Not a good look. Not a

1903
01:37:13,960 --> 01:37:14,320
Speaker 5: good look.

1904
01:37:14,320 --> 01:37:16,599
Speaker 6: Well, thank you everybody, breakingpoints dot com as a reminder,

1905
01:37:16,600 --> 01:37:27,120
Speaker 6: and we'll see you back here on Friday.