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Speaker 1: Alz Media, Hey everybody, Robert here, and the International Academy

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Speaker 1: of Digital Arts and Sciences have announced that three different

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Speaker 1: Cool Zone media shows have been nominated for awards at

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Speaker 1: the thirtieth annual Webby Awards. You can vote on these

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Speaker 1: now if you just google the name of the podcast

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Speaker 1: and the category. Behind the Bastards has been nominated in

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Speaker 1: the Experimental and Innovation Podcasts category. It Could Happen Here

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Speaker 1: is in the News and Politics Podcasts category, and James

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Speaker 1: Stout's mini series Migrating to America A Dream Worth Dying

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Speaker 1: For has been nominated in the Podcasts Documentary category. And

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Speaker 1: you can find links to vote for each of these

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Speaker 1: podcasts in the episode description and in the posts on

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Speaker 1: social media for episodes that It could Happen Here and

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Speaker 1: Behind the Bastards. Thank you. Welcome back to Behind the Bastards,

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Speaker 1: a podcast where I am presumably on vacation or at

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Speaker 1: least working on a different series of episodes. And this week,

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Speaker 1: as for the last three episodes, my good Pal Grammy

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Speaker 1: Award winning Greasy Will this guy's here, Yeah is here

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Speaker 1: to talk to us.

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Speaker 2: This guy is here to talk to us about Part

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Speaker 2: four of Phil Specter, which and to be To be fair,

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Speaker 2: I've been drinking the whole time, but now I feel

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Speaker 2: like this is a celebratory shot, which is out of

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Speaker 2: the celebrations.

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Speaker 1: We out two different recording days, folks.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so I can get really because if we'd had

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Speaker 2: to keep going on the first one, I just wanted

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Speaker 2: to keep you alive. Yeah, which, by the way, I

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Speaker 2: have some words for your viewers. Uh oh oh no,

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Speaker 2: after the grammy hold on to take the shot first.

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Speaker 2: Uh hey, guys, hey guys, how about how about let's

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Speaker 2: not talk about my appearance.

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Speaker 3: You know, these dark circles under my eyes are genetic.

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Speaker 2: Every person in my family who has a drug or

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Speaker 2: alcohol addiction gets them. So this is rude of you

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Speaker 2: to just assume I'm drinking too much. Was adcast sorry

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Speaker 2: for having fun?

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Speaker 4: You know he's still got the job done.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I made it through. And then look what you

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Speaker 2: got out of this. You got me saying dang, dude,

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Speaker 2: I should tell them about Phil Spector because not everybody

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Speaker 2: knows the whole story of Phil Spector and it's so

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Speaker 2: incredibly interesting, which is where we will pick up after

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Speaker 2: a word from these sponsors or whatever. Wow, some sponsors,

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Speaker 2: and we're back I always wanted to say that. It

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Speaker 2: felt right.

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Speaker 4: You're so professional right now?

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Speaker 2: Thanks, Yeah, I know. I'm actually I stream every week.

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Speaker 5: I do.

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Speaker 2: I spend a lot of time on the Internet. I'm

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Speaker 2: so good at talking to nobody, so it's amazing to

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Speaker 2: have somebody to actually talk back to Normally. It's just

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Speaker 2: like the comment section on one of my stupid ass videos,

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Speaker 2: which you know, don't so Phil Spector, Uh, he just

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Speaker 2: had an article when the the I think this is

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Speaker 2: one of the most insane cause and effects of history

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Speaker 2: that has ever happened. Because Phil Spector, he has this

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Speaker 2: journalist come and this journalist writes a piece on him

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Speaker 2: for the U for Interview magazine or some I wrote

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Speaker 2: it down, but I don't remember, so let's just pretend

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Speaker 2: I said it. So he he writes an article for me,

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Speaker 2: he puts it in this magazine and it comes out

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Speaker 2: and Phil breaks his sobriety, loses it, starts drinking menacingly, right,

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Speaker 2: he loses his mind. He's he's, he's kind of it's

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Speaker 2: it's not a positive article. It's positive in the sense

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Speaker 2: that it's like, hey, I'm talking about Phil Spector and relevant. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: but it's negative in the fact that, like Phil sees

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Speaker 2: all the bad things that this guy says about him,

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Speaker 2: and he starts drinking again, and he finds himself on

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Speaker 2: the night of February second, two thousand and three, at

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Speaker 2: the House of Blues. This is where he will run

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Speaker 2: into Lana Clarkson. And I feel as though we do not.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's hard to give victims as much attention

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Speaker 2: as they deserve, right, It's like, that's that's that's a

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Speaker 2: very difficult thing because the interesting part of this whole

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Speaker 2: thing is that Phil Specter is fucking insane and this

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Speaker 2: was a fairly normal Los Angeles person living their life,

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Speaker 2: and so it's like the bulk of the story lies

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Speaker 2: on crazy boy, right. So yeah, I do want to

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Speaker 2: spend just a moment first off, to show you Lana

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Speaker 2: Clarkson beautiful. She's beautiful.

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Speaker 3: This is her a like almost forty years old, probably.

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Speaker 2: She is a beautiful woman. She was an actress, She

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Speaker 2: worked in Hollywood. She friends, had many friends, She had

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Speaker 2: a lot of friends. A lot of people remembered her

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Speaker 2: lovingly when she was gone. All right, so this is

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Speaker 2: our story of Lana Clarkson. Lana Clarkson was born on

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Speaker 2: April fifth, nineteen sixty two in Long Beach, California, and

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Speaker 2: she grew up in the southern California endless orbit of Hollywood.

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Speaker 2: You know, it's like the industry always feels really close

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Speaker 2: to you when you're in Los Angeles, no matter what

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Speaker 2: suburb you in, it feels like you're you're not far

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Speaker 2: from the big leagues. Right from an early age, she

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Speaker 2: gravitated towards performance, and at six feet tall, she had

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Speaker 2: a striking presence that made her hard to ignore. Like

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Speaker 2: many Angelino's, Clarkson absorbed the idea that Hollywood rewarded persistence

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Speaker 2: and if you stayed visible long enough, something would eventually

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Speaker 2: break your way. And I think that's a very reasonable

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Speaker 2: Los Angeles feel. It's like, you know, there is a

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Speaker 2: lot of there's a lot of hey, you could make

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Speaker 2: it at any time, I'm here kind of feels.

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Speaker 1: And it's it's true in that, like it is the

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Speaker 1: only way people who aren't born into the industry or

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Speaker 1: whatever succeed. But if you are not a nettle baby, right,

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Speaker 1: this is the only thing that works. But also it

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Speaker 1: still fails for ninety percent of people.

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Speaker 2: To guess, I mean, yeah, I'm being yeah, yeah, that

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Speaker 2: very optruistic.

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Speaker 3: Yes, it's it's not. It does not go well for

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Speaker 3: a lot of people.

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Speaker 1: But no, I mean, yeah, we're sitting here as two

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Speaker 1: of the people in our own fields who like managed

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Speaker 1: to make it through that ninety nine percent thing. And

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Speaker 1: it is like, I know that a lot of people who, yes,

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Speaker 1: you know, wound up somewhere else.

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Speaker 2: I went to school with like seventy five people, and

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Speaker 2: I know one of them that still has a job

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Speaker 2: in the audio world. And that is just the I know,

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Speaker 2: the class before me, the class after me. I know, like,

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Speaker 2: I know hundreds of people that came in with me,

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Speaker 2: and I know none of them still having job.

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Speaker 1: It's wonderful to tell people to chase their dreams. You're

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Speaker 1: also so you don't lie to them when you do it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you can chase your dreams for a while, you know,

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Speaker 1: have an exit plan, have a gamble.

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Speaker 2: Just rationalize, rationalize to yourself, like, here's the thing, right,

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Speaker 2: this is what I tell people about this, which I

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Speaker 2: think is the best advice. If you're the type of

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Speaker 2: person who when people tell them you're never gonna make it,

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Speaker 2: go like no, no, no, that's you. I make it.

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Speaker 2: I do it. No one can tell me. In fact,

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Speaker 2: I'm gonna do it three times as hard because you

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Speaker 2: said I couldn't. Then maybe this life is for you.

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Speaker 2: Maybe if you thrive on people telling you know, and

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Speaker 2: you think that that's the coolest thing ever, and you

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Speaker 2: just want to shove it in their face, you are

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Speaker 2: you don't know anything. I'm going to spite you. Third wife,

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Speaker 2: second wife. Yeah, all right. So by the nearly early

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Speaker 2: nineteen eighties, she is landing small parts. She's getting some

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Speaker 2: brief exposure in mainstream productions. She's in Fast Times at

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Speaker 2: Richmond High. She's a little little background character in there.

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Speaker 5: You know her.

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Speaker 2: Her steadier work came in genre films, where she became

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Speaker 2: recognizable to audiences through fantasy and cult B movies such

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Speaker 2: as Barbarian Queen, Barbarian Queen two and Death Stalker Feels

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Speaker 2: Very You might remember me from such works as Barbarian,

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Speaker 2: Barbarian Queen two, Death these are these are super B

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Speaker 2: movie type things. In later years, we get weird about

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Speaker 2: saying B movies as though we're supposed to call them

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Speaker 2: like lesser grade movies. I don't know what lesser off market.

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Speaker 2: I don't know what. It's weird. They're b movies. I

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Speaker 2: don't know why that suddenly got pc in any way.

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Speaker 2: And I'm ranting about this right now because it made

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Speaker 2: me mad.

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Speaker 1: It was okay, oh, it.

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Speaker 2: Made me mad. There was a bunch of articles that

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Speaker 2: I read about Lona Clarkson specifically that were like, you

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Speaker 2: should call her a B movie actress. That's degrading, and

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Speaker 2: I'm like, that's just no love to be We called

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Speaker 2: Bruce Campbell right being reactor, right exactly anyway, Campbell anyway. So,

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Speaker 2: but so Barbarian Queen was actually produced by Robin Corman,

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Speaker 2: who did the original of the nineteen sixty Little Shop

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Speaker 2: of Horror. So it wasn't They're not like a prestigeal.

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Speaker 2: But she's connected.

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Speaker 1: She's doing well yeah and Carman Yeah, that's nobody. Yeah yeah.

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Speaker 2: And they gave her a foothold in the industry and

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Speaker 2: a loyal cult following too. She's like an early comic book,

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Speaker 2: you know, comic con type thing, you know, like shees

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Speaker 2: show up to those things and all the nerds are like,

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Speaker 2: Barbarian Queen. Uh, she does kind of. She's type cast, right,

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Speaker 2: She's a six foot tall, beautiful blonde woman. She is

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Speaker 2: very much type cast as either the like the warrior

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Speaker 2: queen or the bimbo. Right, She's like she's in those

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Speaker 2: two categories. And you know, when you start reaching your

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Speaker 2: forties that that's a tough one because you're not physically

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Speaker 2: the same as you were when you were in your

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Speaker 2: twenties doing you know, action movies, swinging stories around and everything.

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Speaker 2: And also you know, it's like as the bimbo role,

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Speaker 2: it's like you're starting to look older, right of course,

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Speaker 2: And I'm not trying to be derogatatory toy. It's just

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Speaker 2: the industry we live in. It's an honest thing that

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Speaker 2: we have. You know, it's Hollywood. So as the years

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Speaker 2: passed though, she leans into the identity and she's attending

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Speaker 2: comic and genre conventions where she signs autographs and she

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Speaker 2: stays connected to her fans. She has a website in

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Speaker 2: the early two thousands, which is something you know, like

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Speaker 2: you're connecting that that's the you know, the heartbeat of

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Speaker 2: nerds if you had a website in the early two thousands.

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Speaker 2: But you know, Hollywood has a way of quietly moving

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Speaker 2: on from people, and as the directive video boom of

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Speaker 2: the eighties faded, so did many of the roles that

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Speaker 2: had sustained her. Her career didn't collapse so much as

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Speaker 2: just narrow. You know, it's a slow erosion of opportunity.

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Speaker 2: And everybody in la was going it goes through it.

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Speaker 2: You know, it's like there's just less roles for the old,

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Speaker 2: older woman than there is for the young buxom beauty

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Speaker 2: or whatever. You know. In the early two thousands, while

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Speaker 2: at a house party, she's dancing in her high heels

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Speaker 2: and she slips and falls, breaking both of her wrisk.

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Speaker 2: The accident derailed her acting career because of course you're

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Speaker 2: not You're not going to auditions with two two broken

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Speaker 2: risks or whatever. And and and you know she's starting

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Speaker 2: to see her career kind of slip away. You can't

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Speaker 2: in the in the world, in this world, in the

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Speaker 2: all the entertainment, you can't take a break, Robert. You

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Speaker 2: know that you work yep seven hundred days a year. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you are working like you are a busy bee over

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Speaker 2: there doing episodes all the time, which is why I'm here.

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Speaker 2: You alive, yes, and you have an amazing productive output.

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Speaker 2: But it is you know, if you were to force

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Speaker 2: to take a long break, you know, it could damage

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Speaker 2: your career because people move on. You know, that's just

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Speaker 2: the fact of what happens. Yeah, So she begins pivoting

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Speaker 2: to comedy. She starts writing her own stand up act,

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Speaker 2: and like she's trying to do other things like get

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Speaker 2: out of her type cast. Around two thousand and two,

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Speaker 2: while Clarkson was still pursuing acting, she takes a job

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Speaker 2: at the House of Blues on Sunset Strip. She gets

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Speaker 2: a job working in the Foundation room upstairs, which is

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Speaker 2: where musicians and industry figures and celebrities are all kind

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Speaker 2: of hanging out. It's the VIP room of the Hollywood

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Speaker 2: Sunset Strip. Like, so you know, it's a good place

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Speaker 2: to be still being connected, right, Yeah. Like many who

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Speaker 2: took those jobs, she understood that proximity could still mean possibility,

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Speaker 2: and she hoped that meeting the right person might reopen

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Speaker 2: doors that had quietly closed. It was the kind of

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Speaker 2: compromise that Hollywood encourages you to, like stay close enough

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Speaker 2: to the spotlight so you can kind of, you know,

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Speaker 2: be in proximity of good things happening. If you spent

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Speaker 2: any time in any entertainment industry at all, like you

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Speaker 2: get what's going on. Like some sometimes the phone just

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Speaker 2: stops ringing, and you got to start hustling in different ways.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Right, on the night of February second, Clarkson was working there.

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Speaker 2: And she's still holding onto the idea that her story

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Speaker 2: in Hollywood isn't finished. She's forty years old, but she's

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Speaker 2: still hopeful, still recognizable in certain circles, and still navigating

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Speaker 2: that fragile space between past visibility and future chance. The

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Speaker 2: night she met Phil Spector that would, you know, bring

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Speaker 2: her into infamy for the rest of her life, but

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Speaker 2: obviously for the worst reason. Yeah, Lana's story is the

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Speaker 2: story of a billion people, right, It's like we've seen

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Speaker 2: so many of these, you know, they flicker for a

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Speaker 2: little bit, but they you know, it's it's hard. This

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Speaker 2: is a hard city. There is not a lot of

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Speaker 2: room to have a billion Robert Downey juniors, right, we

247
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Speaker 2: need right, like people will come and go. That's how

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Speaker 2: it's hard. It's harder for a woman probably, you know,

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Speaker 2: like this town chows people up and spitzer out. So

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Speaker 2: but she's still hopeful. She is writing on her blogs

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Speaker 2: really hopeful things all the time. I'm excited about this.

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Speaker 2: I wanted to there's no there's no air of like

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Speaker 2: sadness around what is going on. And this is important

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Speaker 2: because she's about to end up dead and there's going

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Speaker 2: to be a lot of doubt cast upon her mental

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Speaker 2: state at this time. But yeah, seemingly she's a very

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Speaker 2: happy person, still believes in like the best will come

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Speaker 2: for her.

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Speaker 6: Right.

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Speaker 2: When Clarkson first encountered Spector, she miss she reportedly mistook

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Speaker 2: him for a woman.

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Speaker 3: Keep in mind, she's she's six foot tall. He's five

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Speaker 3: foot four.

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Speaker 2: He's wearing big wigs and like dressing all crazy, like

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Speaker 2: he's got platform heels and shit, why is.

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Speaker 1: He wearing because he wants to be taller. Yeah, of

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Speaker 1: course she mistakes him. Yes, that makes sense.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, he looks like an old woman in Hollywood. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: by this time, he's like he's wearing elaborate wigs and

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Speaker 2: eccentric clothing and his theatrical presentation kind of become a

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Speaker 2: part of his public persona. All right, he walked, He

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Speaker 2: walks right into the Foundation Room, no hesitation, just like

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Speaker 2: walks straight in there. And this is a high class

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Speaker 2: VIP area. So Lana Clarkson, being the hostess of the

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Speaker 2: Foundation Room, is like, hey, o hey, ma'am, missus, lady,

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Speaker 2: you know. She's like trying to stop him from walking

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Speaker 2: to know who he is, and he gives her the

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Speaker 2: old don't you know who I am? I'm not a

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Speaker 2: missus like I'm Phil fucking Specter. Now, keep in mind,

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Speaker 2: is fucking two thousand and three, right, Yeah, it was

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Speaker 2: in the seventies. It's been a minute, right, two whole

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Speaker 2: generations have come and gone of people no longer listening

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Speaker 2: to his music regularly.

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Speaker 3: So it's like nobody knows who he is, and you know,

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Speaker 3: and this is a very classic la you.

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Speaker 2: Don't know who I am? You know who I am.

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Speaker 2: I can't believe you don't know who I am?

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Speaker 7: Has happened to anybody who encountered somebody who was even

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Speaker 7: slightly famous in Los Angeles.

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Speaker 2: That you So I wanted to tell this side story

291
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Speaker 2: because it was one of the funniest things that's ever

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Speaker 2: happened to me in the industry. I had a guy

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Speaker 2: say that to me, you don't know who I am?

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Speaker 2: And I said, I said no, and I know tons

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Speaker 2: of people, so that is so embarrassing for you. And

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Speaker 2: they were like, and they were like, what's your name?

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Speaker 2: You're never gonna work in this town again. And I

298
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Speaker 2: was like my name greasy wheler man, write it down,

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Speaker 2: take a picture. I don't give a fuck, do you know?

300
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Speaker 2: And I was like, I hear that so often. It

301
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Speaker 2: means nothing. It's lost all meaning to me. And he

302
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Speaker 2: turns out. So it turns out. The next day he

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Speaker 2: calls my last boss, the boss that I had at

304
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Speaker 2: the time working at the studio. He calls her and

305
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Speaker 2: she says, and this is a quote from her direct quote,

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Speaker 2: Kandas Stewart, she's the homie. She said, you know that

307
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Speaker 2: guy's killed people before. You should probably you should probably

308
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Speaker 2: not anger him.

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Speaker 1: Beefing with Sugar night.

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Speaker 8: No context of or anything, just you know that guy's

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Speaker 8: killed people, right, No?

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Speaker 2: How not? Why not? Where?

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Speaker 5: All? Right?

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Speaker 2: So Lana's manager steps into the situation, you know, the heat,

315
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Speaker 2: Phil loses his mind. Manager steps in, Sorry, mister specter,

316
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Speaker 2: we got to the table for you. Let's put you

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Speaker 2: down like we got everything. And Lana is super embarrassed,

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Speaker 2: she's super apologetic, like she's pretty new to the job still,

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Speaker 2: she hasn't been working there long and uh, and you

320
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Speaker 2: know she's trying, she's doing this to meet people, and

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Speaker 2: now she's just angered of what she perceives to be

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Speaker 2: a very powerful person.

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Speaker 8: But again, it's like early two thousands. How was she

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Speaker 8: supposed to know who Phil Spector is?

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Speaker 2: One hundred percent? One hundred percent? So she's trying to

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Speaker 2: make up for it. She does her best to try

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Speaker 2: and like give him extra attention, oh, mister Spector. And

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Speaker 2: Phil seems to really enjoy getting this, like, oh, now

329
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Speaker 2: you care about who I am feeling? You know, it's like,

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Speaker 2: you know, he seems to really feel empowered by the

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Speaker 2: whole thing. Uh, the waitress, if you remember, he goes

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Speaker 2: he went to Dantanna's with another date, a high school friend.

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Speaker 2: Then he takes her home because she's like, I don't

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Speaker 2: I don't want to get lit anymore. And he was

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Speaker 2: like all right, So he takes her home, and then

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Speaker 2: he comes back and starts drinking with the waitress, right,

337
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Speaker 2: and then he takes the waitress to the House of Blues,

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Speaker 2: and then at the House of Blues, the waitress is like,

339
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Speaker 2: I don't want to drink anymore. I need to go home.

340
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Speaker 2: I gotta work tomorrow. Right, It's it's like late, it's

341
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Speaker 2: near closing time. He comes in, like very close to

342
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Speaker 2: closing time, and it's late. It's like almost two am,

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Speaker 2: and she's like, I'm trying to go home. So Phil's like,

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Speaker 2: go go have my driver to make you home. Get

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Speaker 2: the fuck out of here. I don't want to be

346
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Speaker 2: seen with somebody not drinking. He's like making fun of her.

347
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Speaker 2: He's like mad that she wants she orders the water.

348
00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:09,240
Speaker 2: He's like, nobody drinks water around me? Are you crazy? Party?

349
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Speaker 1: Yeah?

350
00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:12,520
Speaker 2: You know, want a party, you know. So so he

351
00:19:12,640 --> 00:19:17,080
Speaker 2: sends her home and then he starts trying to put

352
00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:20,480
Speaker 2: his moves on Lana Clarkson. Right. She's now she's in

353
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Speaker 2: a position of very serious power imbalance. You know, this

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Speaker 2: is this is a very Weinstein esque power imbalance where

355
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Speaker 2: now she not only is she you know, trying to

356
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Speaker 2: make things up to him, but he's also feeling the

357
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Speaker 2: joy of being in that situation and pushing things even further.

358
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Speaker 2: He's like, yeah, have it, sit down, have a drink

359
00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,760
Speaker 2: with me, and she's like, I can't. My boss says no.

360
00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:45,800
Speaker 2: He's like, tell your boss that I'll leave if if

361
00:19:45,880 --> 00:19:47,680
Speaker 2: you don't sit down and have a drink, like you know,

362
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Speaker 2: like he's he's going off on this ship.

363
00:19:50,080 --> 00:19:53,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, and he really has never gotten used to not

364
00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:54,920
Speaker 1: having that much power.

365
00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:58,040
Speaker 2: Yes, like, yeah, yeah, for sure, he still enjoys it.

366
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Speaker 2: Like for some people it gets to that point like, bro,

367
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Speaker 2: it's not even like fun anymore. I only want to

368
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Speaker 2: like I just want to be left alone, you know.

369
00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:11,360
Speaker 2: But for him, he clearly still is like yes, so yeah,

370
00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:13,800
Speaker 2: you know, I'm sure Lana led on that she was

371
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Speaker 2: an actress probably during the conversations, because that's what you do, right,

372
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Speaker 2: You've seen this situation a thousand times in Hollywood, because

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Speaker 2: that's networking. That's what would you believe networking.

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00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:28,199
Speaker 3: Is anyway, So he's telling, you know her, come back

375
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Speaker 3: to my place.

376
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Speaker 2: Come back to my place. Is almost closing time. We

377
00:20:30,119 --> 00:20:31,480
Speaker 2: got to get out of here. Let's come back to

378
00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:33,640
Speaker 2: my place in Alhambra. We'll talk about things. I'll show

379
00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:38,000
Speaker 2: you some stuff. Phil notoriously loved taking people to his

380
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Speaker 2: house and showing him his like five seconds in Easy

381
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Speaker 2: Rider all the time and being like not send them

382
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Speaker 2: a baby. So I'm sure he was like, you know,

383
00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:49,360
Speaker 2: I was an easy Rider, right, yeah, yeah.

384
00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:51,840
Speaker 1: Is not close.

385
00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:57,639
Speaker 2: So so the distance between the House of Blues and

386
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Speaker 2: Alhambra is far it is.

387
00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:00,960
Speaker 8: That's not closed.

388
00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:03,920
Speaker 2: That's far far far, right, It's like, yeah, this and

389
00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:08,360
Speaker 2: this is important to this conversation because at two o'clock

390
00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:11,400
Speaker 2: in the morning, you don't leave.

391
00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:16,440
Speaker 3: Your safety network with an extremely.

392
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Speaker 2: Intoxicated man, no matter who it is, unless you're not

393
00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:22,400
Speaker 2: feeling a bit like I got to take a chance

394
00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:24,720
Speaker 2: on this, like this might be an opportunity for me,

395
00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:27,320
Speaker 2: you know. And this is this is very clad. This

396
00:21:27,400 --> 00:21:29,600
Speaker 2: is just just power balance, you know, It's just what

397
00:21:29,760 --> 00:21:32,159
Speaker 2: it is. It's how it's how Hollywood operated for a

398
00:21:32,280 --> 00:21:34,800
Speaker 2: long long time, and it's only now starting to get

399
00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:37,840
Speaker 2: even the tiniest bit. Better follow me for no more

400
00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:41,480
Speaker 2: inside stories of the horrible things that happen in this town.

401
00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:45,879
Speaker 2: All right, So she's thirty thirty miles away. You know,

402
00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:47,639
Speaker 2: they're going to get into his car and drive down Hombro.

403
00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:51,480
Speaker 2: She has to be, according to everybody, she has to

404
00:21:51,560 --> 00:21:54,280
Speaker 2: be really coerced. She does not want to do this.

405
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:56,320
Speaker 2: But Phil keeps being like, yeah, come on, come on,

406
00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:58,080
Speaker 2: come on, let's do it. Let's do it, right. But

407
00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:04,560
Speaker 2: also keeping mind that Phil is shit housed right now.

408
00:22:04,880 --> 00:22:08,160
Speaker 2: Like he is a tiny man. He's maybe one hundred

409
00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:10,840
Speaker 2: and forty pounds, maybe like one hundred and thirty pounds,

410
00:22:11,160 --> 00:22:13,960
Speaker 2: Like he's five foot barely nothing, you know, like, and

411
00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:16,159
Speaker 2: he's been drinking Navy grogs all night.

412
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:19,040
Speaker 3: If you've never had a navy grog, it's mostly alcohol.

413
00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:20,320
Speaker 2: It's almost all.

414
00:22:20,240 --> 00:22:20,480
Speaker 5: Out that.

415
00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:28,640
Speaker 8: Just thinking about a navy Yeah, it's but also le yes,

416
00:22:29,359 --> 00:22:29,959
Speaker 8: but it's a lot.

417
00:22:30,119 --> 00:22:32,800
Speaker 2: It's a lot of alcohol. And he's been drinking them

418
00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:37,359
Speaker 2: all night, right. Uh, he's slurring his words and and

419
00:22:38,080 --> 00:22:40,760
Speaker 2: you know, even when he's not slurring, he's pretty not

420
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:44,120
Speaker 2: like when he's not drunk, he's like pretty not understandable

421
00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,560
Speaker 2: to begin, And I want to show because so I

422
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:50,280
Speaker 2: want to show this. Uh, I need you to understand.

423
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:52,680
Speaker 2: This is what he's like when he's sober. This is

424
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,240
Speaker 2: an interview he gave, and this is the types of

425
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:59,440
Speaker 2: things he says and how he sounds when he is sober.

426
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:04,800
Speaker 1: Excellent. Did you even realize that Mickey Mouse was a

427
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:05,400
Speaker 1: black man?

428
00:23:08,600 --> 00:23:13,680
Speaker 5: Mickey Mouse was the first black movie star before Shirley Gemble,

429
00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:18,720
Speaker 5: discovered by Walt Disney, the first black star.

430
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:20,000
Speaker 2: To win an Academy Award.

431
00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:24,440
Speaker 5: He was black, he wasn't mine, and he was black

432
00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:27,960
Speaker 5: movie he was movies black movie stars.

433
00:23:28,480 --> 00:23:31,719
Speaker 1: And that was before during segregation. All the people were

434
00:23:31,760 --> 00:23:32,240
Speaker 1: going to see it.

435
00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:34,520
Speaker 5: And he didn't talk on an accent, and it was

436
00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:39,159
Speaker 5: Walt Disney's voice, and nobody pays any attention to that.

437
00:23:39,680 --> 00:23:40,199
Speaker 3: He broke the.

438
00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:41,560
Speaker 2: Color line before anybody.

439
00:23:42,560 --> 00:23:44,840
Speaker 4: Wow, I have a lot of notes on that.

440
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:48,320
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, do you Robert, please tell me tell me

441
00:23:48,359 --> 00:23:48,920
Speaker 3: about the notes.

442
00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:52,399
Speaker 1: Sounds like he's saying he was the first black movie

443
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:56,080
Speaker 1: star before Shirley Temple. Yes, that's right. Kind of sounds

444
00:23:56,119 --> 00:23:58,320
Speaker 1: like you're saying Shirley Temple was a black movie star.

445
00:23:58,480 --> 00:24:01,200
Speaker 2: She was not. She was face not black, right, but

446
00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:04,640
Speaker 2: all right, no, here's here's all right. So that's one

447
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:08,800
Speaker 2: I think. I think. I think that Phil is making

448
00:24:08,880 --> 00:24:11,840
Speaker 2: a joke because later in her life Shirley Temple took

449
00:24:11,880 --> 00:24:14,480
Speaker 2: the name Shirley temp She made a man named Charles

450
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:16,200
Speaker 2: Black and took the name Shirley Top.

451
00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:19,320
Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's the joke.

452
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:21,919
Speaker 2: I think he's making a joke, right.

453
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,080
Speaker 1: Okay, But well, and you know, because there's there's this

454
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:28,199
Speaker 1: whole thing where like Mickey Mouse, I think there's an

455
00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:30,280
Speaker 1: argument to be made. Is kind of like his character

456
00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:33,840
Speaker 1: is based in part on designs from like minstrel show,

457
00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:37,959
Speaker 1: right right right? I thought maybe that was the argument

458
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:38,800
Speaker 1: he was making.

459
00:24:41,400 --> 00:24:44,880
Speaker 3: Even weirder, Oh, I got so he is like, that's

460
00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:45,480
Speaker 3: what he sounds like.

461
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,440
Speaker 2: Sober, right, you can imagine this dude, twelve navy grogs

462
00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:53,040
Speaker 2: deep at two thirty in the morning is legible.

463
00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:55,919
Speaker 1: It's like trying to It's like trying to decipher ancient.

464
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:58,920
Speaker 1: To Syrian, yes, all of all of his all of

465
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:04,640
Speaker 1: the secure already. Footage shows him leaving the club stumbling right.

466
00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:06,960
Speaker 2: He gets in his car. He calls Lana over. She

467
00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:10,240
Speaker 2: finally is like, okay, fine. They arrive at his house

468
00:25:10,280 --> 00:25:12,480
Speaker 2: around three am after closing down the House of Blues,

469
00:25:12,520 --> 00:25:14,639
Speaker 2: and Fill and Lana go inside and are inside for

470
00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:18,880
Speaker 2: about two hours. When outside Phil's limo driver, Adriano desuze

471
00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:21,040
Speaker 2: here's a loud noise. He gets out of his car

472
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:22,800
Speaker 2: and sees Phil walking out the front door of his

473
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:26,440
Speaker 2: house holding a revolver. He says to Adriano, I think

474
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:31,240
Speaker 2: I've killed somebody. Uh you you should listen to the

475
00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:33,680
Speaker 2: nine one one tapes. I did not get them because

476
00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:35,119
Speaker 2: I'm a hack and a fraud. Just like you know,

477
00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:38,600
Speaker 2: it's a lot of work and remembering is hard. Yeah,

478
00:25:38,680 --> 00:25:41,280
Speaker 2: you should listen to the nine one one. Because Adriano

479
00:25:41,320 --> 00:25:44,399
Speaker 2: gets on there. He says, I think my boss killed somebody,

480
00:25:44,520 --> 00:25:45,960
Speaker 2: and they're like, what makes you think that? He's like,

481
00:25:46,000 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 2: he fucking said.

482
00:25:46,840 --> 00:25:50,960
Speaker 1: It killed somebody. Also, by the way, quick piece of

483
00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:52,879
Speaker 1: advice for those of you who are going to kill somebody,

484
00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:54,639
Speaker 1: don't say you killed somebody.

485
00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:57,920
Speaker 2: Don't say you killed somebody. Not a brilliant move, not

486
00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:00,359
Speaker 2: exactly what I consider it to be the most eligent

487
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 2: way to get out of a crime.

488
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:04,640
Speaker 1: Just one simple change you can make to your murders

489
00:26:04,760 --> 00:26:07,439
Speaker 1: to have better, better responses to them, folks. That's all

490
00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:11,440
Speaker 1: I'm saying. Yeah, yeah, yeah, literally, yeah, it's just one

491
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:13,000
Speaker 1: little change when you kill someone.

492
00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:16,680
Speaker 2: A little little legal advice here, legal advice I should

493
00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:17,000
Speaker 2: have made that.

494
00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:19,560
Speaker 1: That's not a lawyer, but I bet a lawyer will

495
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:22,040
Speaker 1: agree with me. Don't say you murdered someone.

496
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:25,879
Speaker 2: I'm gonna make you a jingle for like the next one.

497
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:28,200
Speaker 2: That's like not actually legal advice.

498
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:29,480
Speaker 1: Yeah.

499
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:36,399
Speaker 2: Adriano is just a little backstory on him. He is

500
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:39,960
Speaker 2: a an immigrant. He's I believe Brazilian immigrant. Uh and

501
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:45,000
Speaker 2: he uh he speaks English extremely well for somebody who

502
00:26:45,040 --> 00:26:47,680
Speaker 2: has a Brazilian immigrant. He definitely has an accent without

503
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:51,359
Speaker 2: a doubt. But this will be called into into you know,

504
00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:53,520
Speaker 2: the testimony. For a lot of you, there will be

505
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:56,600
Speaker 2: a lot of questions about how much he understands English

506
00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:59,440
Speaker 2: during this time, but if you listen to the nine

507
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:00,960
Speaker 2: one one to TAKEE, he clearly has a good ad

508
00:27:01,119 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 2: grasp of English. He tries to call his you know,

509
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:08,760
Speaker 2: Michelle Blaine, his Phil's manager or whatever, but she doesn't answer,

510
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:11,200
Speaker 2: and she says later is like the only night she's

511
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,400
Speaker 2: ever left her phone in the car, which is really

512
00:27:13,520 --> 00:27:16,080
Speaker 2: really funny to me because I actually picture that she

513
00:27:16,280 --> 00:27:18,879
Speaker 2: was like just like for one night, like I'm not

514
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,680
Speaker 2: answering Phil's fucking phone calls. This guy's crazy, because she

515
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:23,879
Speaker 2: does say he's always calling her in the middle of

516
00:27:24,040 --> 00:27:25,760
Speaker 2: all of his assistants, Like, yeah, Phil calls me in

517
00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:27,879
Speaker 2: the middle of the night just to like be like

518
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:31,639
Speaker 2: what are you doing? You know, So I'm sure she

519
00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:36,640
Speaker 2: was like, I left my phone in the car, but aside, right,

520
00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:42,359
Speaker 2: the cops show up and they don't really know what's

521
00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:45,320
Speaker 2: going on. They just there's a gun. Somebody's been killed.

522
00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:49,040
Speaker 2: So they show up and Phil first. They pull up

523
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:51,639
Speaker 2: and Phil is inside his house just pacing back and forth,

524
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 2: and they do a standard tactical approach, which makes perfect

525
00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 2: fucking sense. And Phil comes outside and he's just rare

526
00:28:00,040 --> 00:28:02,800
Speaker 2: umbling incoherently. They're like stir get down on the ground,

527
00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:06,080
Speaker 2: and he's like, oh fuck, I didn't do anything, you know,

528
00:28:06,280 --> 00:28:09,440
Speaker 2: Like he's just like rambling. He's visibly intoxic and he's

529
00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:13,480
Speaker 2: really trashed, right, But then he starts to be like, hey, guys,

530
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:17,240
Speaker 2: you got to check this out, this woman, you know,

531
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:22,120
Speaker 2: like he like he starts playing like the worst dumb

532
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:24,720
Speaker 2: angle that I've ever seen, where it was like, hey,

533
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:26,400
Speaker 2: you guys, gotta tell you, guys, you want to see

534
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:30,359
Speaker 2: this dead body. And he keeps trying to stick his

535
00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 2: hands in his pockets, and at this point the cops

536
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:34,159
Speaker 2: have no idea what's going on. They keep being like,

537
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:35,640
Speaker 2: take your hands out of your pocket, take your hands

538
00:28:35,640 --> 00:28:39,080
Speaker 2: out right, but never you won't dance, yes, yeah for cops,

539
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:42,160
Speaker 2: Yes for sure. Hey these are my hands, they're here,

540
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:45,440
Speaker 2: look right here, look at them police video.

541
00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 5: You know.

542
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,840
Speaker 2: So he won't do it. He keeps sticking his hands

543
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:52,040
Speaker 2: and uh in his pockets and they shoot him with

544
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:53,040
Speaker 2: a taser and.

545
00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:55,920
Speaker 1: I don't know, I guess he doesn't get to do that.

546
00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 2: I don't know if the taser bounced off of him

547
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:00,240
Speaker 2: and he just got an unlucky like shot out of

548
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:03,920
Speaker 2: the taser, or if Phil is just like in Hulk

549
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 2: mode at that point or whatever. They just say the

550
00:29:06,000 --> 00:29:09,120
Speaker 2: taser is ineffective in all the sources, right, So I

551
00:29:09,160 --> 00:29:11,120
Speaker 2: don't know if he just is like, you know, they

552
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:11,720
Speaker 2: got hurts.

553
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 1: I've known a couple of people that happened to I've

554
00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:18,280
Speaker 1: know someone who ripped the leads out, so it does

555
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:19,080
Speaker 1: happen from me.

556
00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:21,320
Speaker 2: I knew a guy who ripped the leads out and

557
00:29:21,360 --> 00:29:24,120
Speaker 2: then broke two cop dog's legs and was charged for

558
00:29:24,160 --> 00:29:28,120
Speaker 2: attempted murder. So no surprise there, right, And he was

559
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:30,880
Speaker 2: on a herculean amount of alcohol at the time.

560
00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 3: That makes sense, maybe a little myth who's saying, you know,

561
00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:36,560
Speaker 3: but yeah, point.

562
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:38,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, So who else is on a little bit

563
00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:39,240
Speaker 1: of meth?

564
00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:44,920
Speaker 2: Well, a herculean amount probably according to my research, the

565
00:29:45,120 --> 00:29:46,680
Speaker 2: sponsors of this show.

566
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:55,080
Speaker 3: Let's cut to him, and we're back.

567
00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 2: We're the most back, and we are. Philis just walked

568
00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:02,640
Speaker 2: out of his house with a dead Lina clarks In

569
00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:06,040
Speaker 2: in the foyer of his In the foyer, I'm gonna say,

570
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:08,920
Speaker 2: I'm gonna say, foyer, you know, I want to I

571
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 2: want to class it up a.

572
00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 1: Little bit a year, just to really throw a year.

573
00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 2: Yes, solid people are gonna love that pronunciation. There won't

574
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:22,680
Speaker 2: be a subreddit about that, all right.

575
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,280
Speaker 3: So so they're mad. They tried to shoot him with

576
00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:26,680
Speaker 3: the taser.

577
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:27,800
Speaker 2: Phil won't go down.

578
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 1: It didn't work, didn't take And.

579
00:30:29,480 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 2: So the front cop has one of those big, like

580
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:35,640
Speaker 2: forty pound shields and they just rush him with this shield.

581
00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:38,880
Speaker 2: Keep again your mind again, that is like a third

582
00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:43,520
Speaker 2: of Phil Specter's body weight easily, so they fuck him up.

583
00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:46,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, that does not surprise me. Yeah, I bet that

584
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 1: shield wad more needed.

585
00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:50,760
Speaker 2: Inside the house, the cops find Lina clarks And slumped

586
00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:54,160
Speaker 2: over in a chair with by the front entrance. There's

587
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:56,760
Speaker 2: a gun by her left foot and blood splatter all

588
00:30:56,800 --> 00:30:59,920
Speaker 2: over her shirt and her skirt. There's an open drawer

589
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:05,480
Speaker 2: beside her and an empty leather holster matching the gun

590
00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:08,480
Speaker 2: that is at her feet. On the floor are her

591
00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:10,640
Speaker 2: front teeth, which have been knocked out of her mouth

592
00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:11,840
Speaker 2: up the muzzle of the god.

593
00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:17,280
Speaker 1: At first look, exactly the way you wouldn't shoot yourself.

594
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:21,120
Speaker 2: Yes, but at first look it does appear as though

595
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:23,760
Speaker 2: Lana Clarkson has possibly killed herself.

596
00:31:23,840 --> 00:31:26,000
Speaker 1: Sure it certainly, yeah, yeah, yeah, of course, but of.

597
00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:30,640
Speaker 2: Course Phil can't shut the fuck up, right, which sure naturally,

598
00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 2: you know, so he started, he's he's and one cop

599
00:31:35,680 --> 00:31:39,640
Speaker 2: has the presence of mind to start an audio recorder

600
00:31:39,720 --> 00:31:42,360
Speaker 2: sets it aside, and he's like, would I believe it?

601
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,360
Speaker 2: Like she just her head just did that, you know,

602
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:49,120
Speaker 2: like just nothing, I didn't do anything. I can't believe

603
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:51,400
Speaker 2: this woman came into my house like this. Right, he's

604
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:53,760
Speaker 2: like losing his mind. He's talking all sorts of shit,

605
00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,640
Speaker 2: but like cops are like, okay, well we're I mean,

606
00:31:57,720 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 2: we're gonna at least take you to jail, collect some evidence,

607
00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 2: do due diligence. Even though believable enough of a story,

608
00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:08,320
Speaker 2: but we'll we'll get to why it falls apart. Pretty

609
00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 2: it gets pretty flimsy. Sure, he's taken to jail. He's

610
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 2: talking like most of the time, and then suddenly he said,

611
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:17,080
Speaker 2: and he says stuff like, oh, she kissed the gun,

612
00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:19,280
Speaker 2: you know, like he says like weird stuff like that.

613
00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:21,920
Speaker 2: But his stories are just like intertwining. It's like he's

614
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:26,080
Speaker 2: he's inventing the narrative as this is happening, as he's

615
00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 2: being questioned as they're talking to him, he's inventing the

616
00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:33,240
Speaker 2: narrative and just seeing what makes sense, you know, what

617
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:35,160
Speaker 2: people react to. It seems like he's a bit of

618
00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:37,360
Speaker 2: like a choose your own adventure game over here, and

619
00:32:37,440 --> 00:32:40,080
Speaker 2: he's like, if the CoP's eyebrows go up, turn the

620
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:44,160
Speaker 2: page ninety seven, you know so. But eventually he does

621
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:47,200
Speaker 2: start sobering up and realizes he should shut the fuck up,

622
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:50,719
Speaker 2: which he does, and the next day he gets He's

623
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:54,080
Speaker 2: bails himself out on a one million dollar bond. Of

624
00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:58,960
Speaker 2: course he has that money, so ye. Michelle Blaine, his assistant,

625
00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:01,600
Speaker 2: and Phil the up in a hotel because the police

626
00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:05,720
Speaker 2: are searching his house and conducting a thorough investigation. Immediately,

627
00:33:05,840 --> 00:33:07,880
Speaker 2: the cop on the sea, the cop, the detective that's

628
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,640
Speaker 2: assigned to the case. He immediately realizes that this is

629
00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 2: going to be under intense scrutiny. So he unlike many

630
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:19,239
Speaker 2: of the other court cases that are famous for this time,

631
00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:22,480
Speaker 2: we're Oj Simpson just happened, Robert Blake just happened. A

632
00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:27,440
Speaker 2: lot of botched fucking police work in these cases, intentionally

633
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:30,560
Speaker 2: or not. Who knows. OJ's son probably killed him anyway,

634
00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:37,160
Speaker 2: So he recognizes, I better do things by the book,

635
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:41,640
Speaker 2: I better do things right, right, So he starts suspecting Phil,

636
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:46,320
Speaker 2: and he starts collecting serious evidence, and the evidence collected

637
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:51,840
Speaker 2: points that you know, it's probably nefarious at least, right,

638
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:56,400
Speaker 2: But there's some conflicting pieces of evidence. First, Lana does

639
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:59,800
Speaker 2: have gunshot residue on her hands, but Phil does not.

640
00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 1: Oh, okay, So.

641
00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:09,200
Speaker 2: Phil, somehow in this situation has not gotten gunshot residue

642
00:34:09,280 --> 00:34:09,600
Speaker 2: on him.

643
00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:13,000
Speaker 1: Yeah, which is possible, but yeah, that definitely is like

644
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:16,440
Speaker 1: an argument that his defense attorney is going to be

645
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:17,399
Speaker 1: able to use. For sure.

646
00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:21,120
Speaker 2: Yes, there is blood all over Lana's shirt. This is

647
00:34:21,400 --> 00:34:24,840
Speaker 2: I mean, if anybody's ever seen this type of injury

648
00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:29,200
Speaker 2: or this is a bloody event. Yah. The way you know,

649
00:34:29,640 --> 00:34:33,040
Speaker 2: the head basically compresses everything and it expels back out

650
00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:35,759
Speaker 2: the mouth, which is why. Also her her teeth were

651
00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:38,960
Speaker 2: knocked out, right, So she has a tremendous amount of

652
00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 2: blood on her, on her chest and on her legs.

653
00:34:43,480 --> 00:34:49,280
Speaker 2: But it stucks at a very specific point, right. Phil's

654
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:52,000
Speaker 2: saliva is on her drink glass as well as hers,

655
00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:55,080
Speaker 2: suggesting that they did kiss, and it's also on her breast,

656
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:58,960
Speaker 2: so there is some sexual contact that has occurred. In

657
00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:04,520
Speaker 2: some manner without a doubt. Right, Phil does not have

658
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:08,239
Speaker 2: blood splatter on himself, at least not in the suggested

659
00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:13,840
Speaker 2: amount had he been in that situation. Right upstairs, the

660
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:16,279
Speaker 2: police find the white jacket that Phil was wearing when

661
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:18,160
Speaker 2: he was last seen at the House of Blues, And

662
00:35:18,239 --> 00:35:21,640
Speaker 2: although it has blood on it, the specs are tiny.

663
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:25,240
Speaker 2: This is not like indicative of what you would expect

664
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:29,319
Speaker 2: for someone who has just killed somebody that way, right,

665
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:33,400
Speaker 2: It's like that he is he is conspicuously absent of

666
00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:35,640
Speaker 2: any evidence that points to and you know, like with

667
00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:38,279
Speaker 2: stuff like that blood. You know, forensic We've done our

668
00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:42,480
Speaker 2: conversations on forensic evidence and everything being kind of a

669
00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:45,960
Speaker 2: made up CSI bullshit thing, but there is a certain

670
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:49,279
Speaker 2: expectation for certain things, like the amount of blood that

671
00:35:49,360 --> 00:35:51,920
Speaker 2: should be on you and the gunshot residue that should

672
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 2: be on you had you been the one pulling the trigger. Right,

673
00:35:57,360 --> 00:36:01,080
Speaker 2: So they find this this white jacket, and then they

674
00:36:01,160 --> 00:36:04,120
Speaker 2: also find the gun that's on the floor by her foot.

675
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 2: It has no blood on it and no prints. And

676
00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:10,400
Speaker 2: upstairs in a bathroom they find a cloth diaper that

677
00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:12,880
Speaker 2: has blood all over it, you know, like the.

678
00:36:13,120 --> 00:36:16,920
Speaker 3: Like true like baby like old school baby. They references

679
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:17,160
Speaker 3: a lot.

680
00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:19,359
Speaker 2: I've never used a cloth diaper to clean my guns,

681
00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:22,040
Speaker 2: but apparently that's like the jam or was in the

682
00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:24,680
Speaker 2: early two thousands. I don't know, they talk. They talk

683
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 2: about it as though I'm supposed to just know that

684
00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:27,319
Speaker 2: that's what we've got.

685
00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:30,080
Speaker 1: Sure you could, like, I can see why it would work,

686
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:31,759
Speaker 1: and it's probably cheap. Yeah.

687
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:34,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, And as someone who loves guns, I've never even

688
00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:36,120
Speaker 2: thought about that. And I have a baby, so I

689
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:36,360
Speaker 2: don't know.

690
00:36:36,840 --> 00:36:38,640
Speaker 1: I've never had a but I've never had access to

691
00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 1: I've never seen a fucking fabricousper Yeah.

692
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:44,680
Speaker 2: It's very yeah, I mean, you know, anyway, so they

693
00:36:44,840 --> 00:36:46,640
Speaker 2: mentioned it a lot. It's a big deal, but don't

694
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:48,880
Speaker 2: I don't really get why the diaper part of it

695
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:52,719
Speaker 2: was so significant, but they they But it is that

696
00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:55,160
Speaker 2: it is covered in blood, and he is clearly probably

697
00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:58,320
Speaker 2: evidence points to the fact that he probably used this

698
00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:01,040
Speaker 2: to clean off the gun, because obviously the gun should

699
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:05,560
Speaker 2: have fingerprints and blood on it and has neither. What

700
00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:08,279
Speaker 2: I consider the most damning evidence is that Lana was

701
00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:11,880
Speaker 2: found in the chair at Phil's front door with her

702
00:37:11,960 --> 00:37:17,200
Speaker 2: purse slung over her shoulder. It seems very indicative that

703
00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:21,680
Speaker 2: she was trying to leave, right. Yeah, they're in a big,

704
00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 2: twenty two room mansion and she's by the front door

705
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:28,719
Speaker 2: with her purse over her shoulder. It seems like she

706
00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:34,239
Speaker 2: is trying to get out of this house. Yeah, there's

707
00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:36,760
Speaker 2: some you know, like I said, some really conflicting stuff.

708
00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 2: There's blood like everywhere except on Phil, and there is

709
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:47,439
Speaker 2: gunshot residue again not on film. Everything in Phil's house

710
00:37:47,520 --> 00:37:48,959
Speaker 2: is read. By the way, this is just a side

711
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:50,960
Speaker 2: note that I found. Really everything in his house. When

712
00:37:51,000 --> 00:37:52,799
Speaker 2: you look at the crime scene photos, they're all read.

713
00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:55,759
Speaker 2: Everything's read everywhere. Damn. It's been such a pain in

714
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:58,480
Speaker 2: the ass trying to find evidence inside this house. That's

715
00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:00,480
Speaker 2: just like red everywhere.

716
00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:04,080
Speaker 1: It's crazy, seking blood spatter in that house. Yeah, So.

717
00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:09,640
Speaker 2: They also find vic it in and alcohol in Lana's blood.

718
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:12,600
Speaker 2: The bullet went in her mouth and pierced her spinal

719
00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:15,640
Speaker 2: cord and likely killed her almost instantly. They find a

720
00:38:15,760 --> 00:38:19,080
Speaker 2: bruise on her tongue, which is a very unlikely thing

721
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:22,280
Speaker 2: if she had put the gun in her mouth herself.

722
00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:24,759
Speaker 2: You know, it's like, that's not an injury you have

723
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:29,960
Speaker 2: if it hasn't been forcibly put in your mouth. The

724
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:32,440
Speaker 2: cops build their case, and it's not until November of

725
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:34,920
Speaker 2: two thousand and three that they finally charge Phil formally

726
00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:38,240
Speaker 2: with murder. So good, solid six months goes by before

727
00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:41,080
Speaker 2: they you know, but they're doing their job appropriately. You

728
00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:43,759
Speaker 2: can't half ass these charges. You have to make sure

729
00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:49,759
Speaker 2: that coming into this you are absolutely ready for it. Right. So,

730
00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:52,839
Speaker 2: something I never see in any of the documentaries about

731
00:38:52,880 --> 00:38:55,760
Speaker 2: this is it's not until March two thousand and seven

732
00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:59,080
Speaker 2: that they begin the trial for Phil. The entire time

733
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:02,880
Speaker 2: he's walking around Freeman, so she's killed in in February

734
00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:04,680
Speaker 2: of two thousand and three, he does not go on

735
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 2: trial until March of two thousand and seven. Right, he

736
00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:13,919
Speaker 2: has years of just walking around free knowing what he's

737
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:16,160
Speaker 2: done and everything that's going on, you know, so he

738
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:19,080
Speaker 2: just you know, he's just chilling. During this time. He

739
00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:23,359
Speaker 2: does his best to be smirch Lana at every opportunity,

740
00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:27,680
Speaker 2: Like he starts beginning his like public narrative, and his

741
00:39:27,800 --> 00:39:29,840
Speaker 2: lawyers are basically like, Phil, you need to stay the

742
00:39:29,920 --> 00:39:33,040
Speaker 2: fuck off of the goddamn like TV. And he's like,

743
00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:35,799
Speaker 2: you guys, don't know what I'm doing. I'm making a case.

744
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:40,400
Speaker 2: I'm gonna get there, right. He begins claiming that she

745
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:43,080
Speaker 2: killed herself and that he was the victim in the situation.

746
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:46,960
Speaker 2: It's like he literally is like, this happened to me.

747
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 2: This happened to me. Can you believe it? Like she

748
00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:51,600
Speaker 2: killed herself and this happened to me, and I'm the

749
00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:53,759
Speaker 2: innocent victim in I had to deal with it.

750
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:54,279
Speaker 1: Yeah?

751
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:54,680
Speaker 2: Yes.

752
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:55,120
Speaker 1: Uh.

753
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:57,200
Speaker 2: He was angered by his lawyers in two thousand and

754
00:39:57,239 --> 00:39:59,520
Speaker 2: six because they couldn't get his case thrown out. So

755
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 2: he be this like series of home videos that he

756
00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:07,719
Speaker 2: posts on the what is still very much the new Internet, right,

757
00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:10,320
Speaker 2: this is like the early two thousands. He's making his

758
00:40:10,440 --> 00:40:14,880
Speaker 2: own website and posting these videos on and his assistant

759
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:18,560
Speaker 2: Michelle Blaine, she she helps him make these videos, right,

760
00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:23,080
Speaker 2: and it's they're the most unhinged videos here. Sophie, could

761
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:29,160
Speaker 2: you show the I forget what it's called self interview? Yes? Yeah, yeah, yeah,

762
00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:31,319
Speaker 2: that's the one, Sophie. Could you show that for us?

763
00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:33,160
Speaker 4: Unfortunately I can.

764
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:38,600
Speaker 6: Not have anything to do with her dad. She may

765
00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:42,160
Speaker 6: have accidentally taken her own life. She may have purposely

766
00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:44,840
Speaker 6: taken her own life. She may have been eating the

767
00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:47,560
Speaker 6: gun with her dancing. She may have been doing anything.

768
00:40:47,840 --> 00:40:51,719
Speaker 6: I don't know why, when, how, or where, in what circumstance.

769
00:40:51,840 --> 00:40:54,920
Speaker 6: She may have taken her wrong life, whether she planned.

770
00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:55,080
Speaker 5: To or not.

771
00:40:56,719 --> 00:41:03,160
Speaker 2: Are you lawyer just sitting over there? Like, are you freestyling? Motherfucker?

772
00:41:03,440 --> 00:41:07,680
Speaker 1: Get pounding tombs? Pounding tombs?

773
00:41:08,280 --> 00:41:10,920
Speaker 2: I always think I think about did you see this

774
00:41:11,080 --> 00:41:14,000
Speaker 2: recent thing with the billionaire? Do I forget his name

775
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:15,840
Speaker 2: of the billionaire? Do where his lawyer is like, if

776
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:17,799
Speaker 2: you don't shut the fuck up right now, I'm gonna

777
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:18,080
Speaker 2: kill you.

778
00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:22,680
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, that's a good defensive attorney.

779
00:41:22,840 --> 00:41:24,400
Speaker 2: Yes, that guy is a professional.

780
00:41:24,440 --> 00:41:28,160
Speaker 4: That's why he makes more than a five word answer.

781
00:41:28,320 --> 00:41:29,640
Speaker 4: I'm gonna fucking kill you.

782
00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:34,040
Speaker 2: This motherfucker is out here wearing puka shells and Hawaiian shirts,

783
00:41:34,080 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 2: being like, I don't know why she did it.

784
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:39,080
Speaker 3: She's kicking then in her mouth and was dancing.

785
00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:39,800
Speaker 8: I don't know.

786
00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:44,960
Speaker 3: Michelle his assistance, She says, this is where she really

787
00:41:45,040 --> 00:41:45,800
Speaker 3: starts to like.

788
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:48,160
Speaker 2: The facade of Phil breaks down for her, and she

789
00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:50,960
Speaker 2: she starts being like, I don't know if I'm like

790
00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:54,160
Speaker 2: cut out for being around this shit, and she tries

791
00:41:54,239 --> 00:41:57,120
Speaker 2: to quit, and Phil she brings her son with her

792
00:41:57,480 --> 00:41:59,520
Speaker 2: to quit because she's afraid of Phil. Her son's like

793
00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:02,840
Speaker 2: giant Phil, saying he's gonna kill her. Pheels like screaming

794
00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:04,719
Speaker 2: at the top of her lungs while she's walking out.

795
00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:07,680
Speaker 2: She says that Phels sexually harassed her. Claimed that. She

796
00:42:08,239 --> 00:42:10,640
Speaker 2: claims that Phil told her, hey, we should get married

797
00:42:11,120 --> 00:42:13,040
Speaker 2: so that you don't have to testify, you know, because

798
00:42:13,080 --> 00:42:15,680
Speaker 2: if you were married, you can't be you can't testify,

799
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:19,200
Speaker 2: you know. And she's like, I don't know anything, motherfucker,

800
00:42:19,400 --> 00:42:20,080
Speaker 2: Like she.

801
00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:25,520
Speaker 4: Does the ship of this motherfucker, Please tell me. She

802
00:42:25,600 --> 00:42:26,160
Speaker 4: sues the show.

803
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:29,200
Speaker 2: She does sue him. She has to sue him because

804
00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:32,040
Speaker 2: he he promises her money. He promises her all sorts

805
00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:34,520
Speaker 2: of stuff. Uh and and he does not come through

806
00:42:34,600 --> 00:42:37,120
Speaker 2: on his promises. So it does end up like all

807
00:42:37,160 --> 00:42:39,320
Speaker 2: this like film stuff. She gets her names all over it,

808
00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:41,400
Speaker 2: and shit, it looks really bad for her. It probably

809
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:44,439
Speaker 2: does suck up her career for a little while. But Hollywood, baby,

810
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:49,080
Speaker 2: it's probably fine. So she she does leave. She files

811
00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:51,640
Speaker 2: a lawsuit against him, claims what she I think she

812
00:42:51,719 --> 00:42:53,360
Speaker 2: does make a little bit of get a little bit

813
00:42:53,400 --> 00:42:55,520
Speaker 2: of it back, but I'm sure it most of it,

814
00:42:55,640 --> 00:43:03,480
Speaker 2: got blood sucking fucking lawyers. Yeah. So so the court case, right,

815
00:43:03,600 --> 00:43:06,879
Speaker 2: the prosecutors, they they go out and they're like, hey,

816
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:10,720
Speaker 2: anybody had a gun pressed to their head by Phil Spector?

817
00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:16,400
Speaker 2: And fortunately, fortunately John Lennon is dead. So he got

818
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 2: a gun pressed right against his head, so he got uh,

819
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:21,920
Speaker 2: he's done for Actually I don't think he did. I

820
00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:23,799
Speaker 2: think he got shot in the chest. But anyway, I'm sorry,

821
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:27,439
Speaker 2: I just I needed that. So but they do find

822
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:31,000
Speaker 2: they find many, many people. One of them I'm gonna

823
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:32,160
Speaker 2: go through like there's like.

824
00:43:32,239 --> 00:43:35,680
Speaker 1: A football stadium full of people who had guns pulled

825
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:37,000
Speaker 1: on them by Phil Spector.

826
00:43:37,160 --> 00:43:40,600
Speaker 2: It was not a challenge to find people that, Yeah,

827
00:43:40,600 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 2: it was, it was. It was really not like so.

828
00:43:43,520 --> 00:43:48,320
Speaker 2: Joan Rivers testifies Joan Rivers, the comedian Joan Rivers that

829
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:51,040
Speaker 2: we all know and loved and everything. I think she's dead.

830
00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 2: If not, she's dead in spirit to me, she's so

831
00:43:55,200 --> 00:43:58,120
Speaker 2: In the in the mid nineteen seventies, she says she's

832
00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:01,160
Speaker 2: at Spector's home and he she tries to leave, and

833
00:44:01,320 --> 00:44:02,839
Speaker 2: he won't let her. He points a gun at her head,

834
00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:05,000
Speaker 2: tells her don't fucking go anywhere. You're staying right here

835
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:09,960
Speaker 2: forces people at gunpoint to stay. This is the picture

836
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:12,480
Speaker 2: that they want to paint. This is what they're trying

837
00:44:12,560 --> 00:44:17,000
Speaker 2: to say. Phil gets mad when people want to go home.

838
00:44:17,160 --> 00:44:23,759
Speaker 2: He doesn't like it, so Joan rivers, she testifies. Bj Cook,

839
00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:27,400
Speaker 2: another singer, claims that around the mid nineteen seventies, testified

840
00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:30,000
Speaker 2: the Specter threatened her with a gun during an argument

841
00:44:30,040 --> 00:44:33,359
Speaker 2: while she was visiting him. She wasn't allowed to leave

842
00:44:33,440 --> 00:44:36,760
Speaker 2: until he could calm down. Pam Shaw or Pam Jackson,

843
00:44:36,800 --> 00:44:40,480
Speaker 2: depending on who reports it, she testified Spectacle a gun

844
00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:42,760
Speaker 2: during an argument and blocked her from leaving her residence.

845
00:44:42,880 --> 00:44:46,960
Speaker 2: Kathleen Sullivan in the nineteen eighties testified that Spector threatened

846
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:49,680
Speaker 2: her with a firearm during a confrontation at his home.

847
00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:53,480
Speaker 2: There is they like I think that. I think the

848
00:44:53,719 --> 00:44:57,000
Speaker 2: end tally was like twelve people that they found that

849
00:44:57,120 --> 00:45:00,640
Speaker 2: were open to Like, yeah, Phil Spector threaten me with

850
00:45:00,719 --> 00:45:03,800
Speaker 2: the gun trying to leave his house. It's always that narrative,

851
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:06,160
Speaker 2: especially since you know Lana is found with her purse

852
00:45:06,239 --> 00:45:08,560
Speaker 2: on her shoulder. She's trying to leave the house. This

853
00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:11,920
Speaker 2: is when Phil Spector loses his mind. Is when you

854
00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:12,719
Speaker 2: try and go home.

855
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:20,800
Speaker 3: Yeah yep, so, So Spector during the trial is insane.

856
00:45:20,960 --> 00:45:24,480
Speaker 2: He's crazy. It's it's this is why. First off, this

857
00:45:24,680 --> 00:45:27,040
Speaker 2: is why every time my pubes get a little unruly,

858
00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 2: I tell my girlfriend that I'm putting Phil Spector on trial,

859
00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:33,799
Speaker 2: right because uh oh here, let me pull this. Let

860
00:45:33,840 --> 00:45:35,520
Speaker 2: me pull this photo up. This is amazing.

861
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:37,880
Speaker 4: This is broke Robert.

862
00:45:40,360 --> 00:45:44,760
Speaker 2: This is Phil Spector's hairdoos during the trial, right, changes

863
00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:51,840
Speaker 2: his hair every fucking trial. This brings us to this

864
00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:54,080
Speaker 2: is like one of my favorite.

865
00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:57,040
Speaker 1: Moments how he got it back right? Okay, one of my.

866
00:45:57,200 --> 00:45:59,360
Speaker 3: Favorite moments in early Hollywood history.

867
00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:02,400
Speaker 1: This is his way to talk about these hairs.

868
00:46:02,440 --> 00:46:07,000
Speaker 2: So before we do that real quick, I just want

869
00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:09,640
Speaker 2: to pivot and show you Phil Spector's one of my

870
00:46:09,840 --> 00:46:13,759
Speaker 2: favorite moments in Internet history, right is during this time

871
00:46:14,239 --> 00:46:19,160
Speaker 2: because there was a thread where they kept continuously photoshopping

872
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:24,040
Speaker 2: bigger and bigger hair on Phil Spectora. Here it's in here,

873
00:46:24,360 --> 00:46:27,640
Speaker 2: yeah here it is. So the Internet thought this was hilarious, and.

874
00:46:27,719 --> 00:46:31,360
Speaker 3: They just keep keep photoshopping bigger and bigger hair.

875
00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:34,640
Speaker 1: Until he's got like the Death Star version of the

876
00:46:34,920 --> 00:46:36,279
Speaker 1: event afro on his head.

877
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:39,279
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, so he is, I mean he is making

878
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:40,200
Speaker 3: a spectacle of this.

879
00:46:40,239 --> 00:46:41,759
Speaker 2: Try let's go to the hair real quick. You're talking

880
00:46:41,760 --> 00:46:44,440
Speaker 2: about that, yeah to me, So he's wearing different wigs

881
00:46:44,600 --> 00:46:45,239
Speaker 2: all the time.

882
00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:48,120
Speaker 1: First off, what's fascinating about this to me is that

883
00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:52,960
Speaker 1: the first three look like mugshots, like he has just

884
00:46:53,040 --> 00:46:55,200
Speaker 1: committed and one of them he has no wig and

885
00:46:55,280 --> 00:46:57,480
Speaker 1: he's balding, and he looks like he got off the

886
00:46:57,600 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 1: con Air flight. It was like whatever, By the way, yeah,

887
00:47:01,800 --> 00:47:04,680
Speaker 1: that is I mean, that is his literal mugshot. The

888
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:07,120
Speaker 1: other one does look like a mug shot, but he

889
00:47:07,200 --> 00:47:09,719
Speaker 1: has a wig on, but he's looking up at the

890
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:13,680
Speaker 1: camera with eyes so wide it looks like he's just

891
00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:15,439
Speaker 1: seen a hand grenade go off.

892
00:47:15,600 --> 00:47:17,919
Speaker 2: So I want to point out so I'm pretty sure

893
00:47:18,440 --> 00:47:21,800
Speaker 2: that the second one is his actual night of the

894
00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:25,360
Speaker 2: incident booking photo, and then the first one is his

895
00:47:26,040 --> 00:47:28,040
Speaker 2: booking at the time of prison photo.

896
00:47:28,239 --> 00:47:30,120
Speaker 1: That makes sense, so it does.

897
00:47:30,520 --> 00:47:34,120
Speaker 3: They are probably mugshot and he does look fucking crazy.

898
00:47:35,719 --> 00:47:38,080
Speaker 2: The third one he looks like Beetlejuice, which is amazing.

899
00:47:38,280 --> 00:47:42,000
Speaker 1: He looks like Beetlejuice. The top right one he looks.

900
00:47:41,840 --> 00:47:44,840
Speaker 2: Like he just got done with his boy band audition.

901
00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:47,680
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, he looks like Ben Stiller in

902
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:53,239
Speaker 1: Tropic Thunder as simple Jack like that, right, Yeah, and

903
00:47:53,320 --> 00:47:55,719
Speaker 1: then the bottom one, it looks like he's it looks

904
00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:58,400
Speaker 1: like someone gave the super ooze that made the teenage

905
00:47:58,480 --> 00:48:03,239
Speaker 1: music Ninja Ninja Turtles to Joe Dirt's mullet like foot.

906
00:48:04,480 --> 00:48:05,200
Speaker 1: That's what I've got.

907
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:09,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's amazing, dude, he's showing he's making a total

908
00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:11,359
Speaker 2: spectacle out of this whole thing.

909
00:48:11,480 --> 00:48:13,640
Speaker 1: They're all very different. Yeah, yeah, he is.

910
00:48:13,760 --> 00:48:16,800
Speaker 2: He's absolutely like this is the joke, and he doesn't

911
00:48:16,800 --> 00:48:19,200
Speaker 2: take any of it serious in any way, shape or form.

912
00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:22,799
Speaker 2: He's constantly arguing with his prosecution or with his defenders.

913
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:27,719
Speaker 2: He's he's like his lawyers quit time after time after time.

914
00:48:28,080 --> 00:48:28,200
Speaker 1: Uh.

915
00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:31,120
Speaker 3: For the record, I want to put this is another

916
00:48:31,200 --> 00:48:34,520
Speaker 3: thing real quick. I'll go to is over here. There's

917
00:48:34,560 --> 00:48:35,400
Speaker 3: also a picture here.

918
00:48:35,520 --> 00:48:40,000
Speaker 2: This is al Pacino playing Phil Spector in a later movie, which,

919
00:48:40,120 --> 00:48:43,240
Speaker 2: by the way, is so stupid and amazing. I highly

920
00:48:43,320 --> 00:48:46,640
Speaker 2: recommend you watch it. Al Pacino as Phil Spector, you think,

921
00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:49,839
Speaker 2: you think, like, oh no, he's going over the top,

922
00:48:49,880 --> 00:48:51,760
Speaker 2: but then you see the old videos of Phil Spector,

923
00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:54,640
Speaker 2: like he's underplaying Phil Spector.

924
00:48:56,080 --> 00:48:57,359
Speaker 1: Pulling a gun off and enough.

925
00:48:57,520 --> 00:49:01,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, he's underplaying Phil Spen without a doubt. It

926
00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:06,320
Speaker 2: is a really stupid, bad court documentary type style movie,

927
00:49:06,600 --> 00:49:09,960
Speaker 2: but it is. It's really good. I totally recommend watching

928
00:49:10,000 --> 00:49:12,920
Speaker 2: it as funny as hell. Al Pacino as Phil Spector

929
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 2: is amazing, It's so good. Throughout the preceding Specter remained

930
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:20,760
Speaker 2: free on bail, continuing to live outside prison while trial unfolded.

931
00:49:21,000 --> 00:49:25,400
Speaker 2: His courtroom appearances became media spectacles, fueled by increasingly bizarre

932
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:30,279
Speaker 2: wig choices which I just showed you, towering curls, unnatural

933
00:49:30,400 --> 00:49:33,719
Speaker 2: things like they became symbolic of a man attempting to

934
00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 2: control public perception even as his legal defense has fallen apart. Sophie,

935
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:41,479
Speaker 2: this is for you, Sophie. Yes, Phil. For his part,

936
00:49:42,360 --> 00:49:45,080
Speaker 2: he does acknowledge that the froze a little overwhelming, right,

937
00:49:45,440 --> 00:49:48,080
Speaker 2: but he claims it wasn't out of respect disrespect for

938
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:51,000
Speaker 2: the trial, but rather that he was paying respect to

939
00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:55,240
Speaker 2: Ben Wallace and Albert Einstein, which of course is fucking insane.

940
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:59,240
Speaker 8: Stein, I fear Ben Wallace at Albert Einstein.

941
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:03,600
Speaker 2: You'm mad, Sophy, will you will you play the video

942
00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:06,040
Speaker 2: of Phil describing described.

943
00:50:05,680 --> 00:50:09,360
Speaker 8: This is yes, this is amazing, It's incredible.

944
00:50:09,719 --> 00:50:11,279
Speaker 4: Robert doesn't know who Ben Wallace is.

945
00:50:12,360 --> 00:50:17,680
Speaker 2: You will shortly. I had another question about the photograph

946
00:50:17,840 --> 00:50:20,240
Speaker 2: that's all over the internet of you with the afra

947
00:50:20,760 --> 00:50:23,560
Speaker 2: and what I thought was, I think he has a

948
00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:28,279
Speaker 2: sense of humor, So what was with you with that?

949
00:50:28,920 --> 00:50:28,960
Speaker 6: That?

950
00:50:30,040 --> 00:50:33,280
Speaker 5: That was a tribute to Ben Wallace, Detroit Pistons forward.

951
00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:35,000
Speaker 5: Took me four and a half hours to get my

952
00:50:35,080 --> 00:50:37,319
Speaker 5: hair that way. I woke up at four four four

953
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:40,200
Speaker 5: o'clock in the morning or lay a glock with Cheryl

954
00:50:40,320 --> 00:50:42,359
Speaker 5: to get my hair. That's straight up in the air

955
00:50:42,680 --> 00:50:46,000
Speaker 5: like that. She permed it, She did everything do it.

956
00:50:46,719 --> 00:50:50,680
Speaker 5: And Ben Wallace is a forward who's the most valuable

957
00:50:50,760 --> 00:50:54,000
Speaker 5: defensive player of the year. He used to be with

958
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,200
Speaker 5: the Detroit Pistons the year they won two years ago.

959
00:50:57,640 --> 00:50:59,920
Speaker 5: He wore his hair like that. Adams a tribute down

960
00:51:00,160 --> 00:51:03,960
Speaker 5: Einstein and they told it was done in jest. But

961
00:51:04,160 --> 00:51:07,120
Speaker 5: I was wearing my hair like Almer Einstein in those days.

962
00:51:07,560 --> 00:51:11,000
Speaker 5: I was wearing my hair like Dylan, and nobody was

963
00:51:11,040 --> 00:51:11,960
Speaker 5: making fun of Dylan.

964
00:51:12,440 --> 00:51:13,920
Speaker 2: I spent a lot of time on it.

965
00:51:14,080 --> 00:51:18,000
Speaker 5: Intributed to Ben Wallace and tribute to Albert Einstein, a

966
00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:23,200
Speaker 5: phonographed I saw beyond my wildest dreams. But I hadn't

967
00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:26,440
Speaker 5: wearing my hair that way for about eight months to

968
00:51:26,560 --> 00:51:30,600
Speaker 5: a year, and it never photographed that pictures that day.

969
00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:34,120
Speaker 5: It got a little extreme. It got a little extreme,

970
00:51:34,480 --> 00:51:39,640
Speaker 5: but photographed for some reason in one phonograph, only in

971
00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:41,719
Speaker 5: one photograph that he.

972
00:51:41,800 --> 00:51:43,520
Speaker 8: Even knows who Ben Wallace is.

973
00:51:43,680 --> 00:51:45,440
Speaker 2: That is so crazy to me.

974
00:51:45,560 --> 00:51:49,360
Speaker 1: He starts with Ben Wallace, this one guy who was

975
00:51:49,440 --> 00:51:54,920
Speaker 1: at the time was significantly like famous, irrelevant, but also

976
00:51:55,080 --> 00:51:57,560
Speaker 1: it was about these other guys who are a lot

977
00:51:57,680 --> 00:52:01,000
Speaker 1: less relevant right now. But I'm just gonna making it

978
00:52:01,160 --> 00:52:04,560
Speaker 1: increasingly unlikely that I'm telling the truth. Yes, he's like

979
00:52:04,800 --> 00:52:08,040
Speaker 1: and also Mozart, like, okay, brother.

980
00:52:08,600 --> 00:52:11,640
Speaker 8: This is this like right after the Pistons win in

981
00:52:11,719 --> 00:52:12,600
Speaker 8: two thousand and four.

982
00:52:12,960 --> 00:52:16,480
Speaker 2: I would assume. So he does like he does, like sports,

983
00:52:16,560 --> 00:52:20,040
Speaker 2: like he goes to like he's he's seen often like games,

984
00:52:20,080 --> 00:52:20,560
Speaker 2: And I know.

985
00:52:20,719 --> 00:52:22,680
Speaker 8: I saw him at a Laker game when I was

986
00:52:22,760 --> 00:52:23,080
Speaker 8: a kid.

987
00:52:23,800 --> 00:52:27,800
Speaker 2: I saw that. Fuck yeah. He also I don't know

988
00:52:27,840 --> 00:52:31,240
Speaker 2: if you noticed it, but he hilarious, like never admits

989
00:52:31,320 --> 00:52:33,719
Speaker 2: to wearing a wig, like in that thing he said

990
00:52:33,760 --> 00:52:36,560
Speaker 2: I woke up and I was I worked on it

991
00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:39,080
Speaker 2: for five hours and everything. Yeah, And they're like, so

992
00:52:39,239 --> 00:52:41,239
Speaker 2: I watched his documentary and I forget which one it was.

993
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:47,120
Speaker 2: But they actually interview his wig guy. He's like, he's like, no, man,

994
00:52:47,239 --> 00:52:48,480
Speaker 2: I fucking make his wigs for him.

995
00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:49,000
Speaker 1: Man, I make him.

996
00:52:49,400 --> 00:52:51,680
Speaker 3: He comes in, he's very particular about his wigs.

997
00:52:51,719 --> 00:52:52,680
Speaker 2: He comes in all the time.

998
00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:56,560
Speaker 3: But he like, he will never ever admit that he's

999
00:52:56,600 --> 00:52:57,200
Speaker 3: wearing a wigs.

1000
00:52:57,360 --> 00:52:59,680
Speaker 2: There's a reporter that interviews him and they say that

1001
00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:01,840
Speaker 2: while they were interviewing him, they're like, yeah, so what

1002
00:53:01,920 --> 00:53:03,560
Speaker 2: about your ways. He's like, what wigs? What wigs? I

1003
00:53:03,600 --> 00:53:05,440
Speaker 2: don't wear wigs. What are you talking about?

1004
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:05,799
Speaker 5: I did?

1005
00:53:05,840 --> 00:53:07,320
Speaker 2: This is my natural hair. And he goes and he

1006
00:53:07,400 --> 00:53:10,560
Speaker 2: gets a fuckload of like photograph, like an armful of

1007
00:53:10,560 --> 00:53:12,400
Speaker 2: photographs and comes back and dumps them in his lap.

1008
00:53:12,480 --> 00:53:14,560
Speaker 2: And see, see these are all me with my hair.

1009
00:53:14,640 --> 00:53:16,520
Speaker 2: This is real hair. Normal people keep.

1010
00:53:16,480 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 1: This many photos to prove that their hair is real.

1011
00:53:18,880 --> 00:53:20,680
Speaker 2: This is a normal thing. This is a normal thing

1012
00:53:20,719 --> 00:53:22,840
Speaker 2: to do. I don't know what you're talking about.

1013
00:53:23,920 --> 00:53:26,600
Speaker 3: You know who won't wear wigs do their murder trial?

1014
00:53:28,040 --> 00:53:31,160
Speaker 1: Probably Washington State Highway Patrol because they don't get charged

1015
00:53:31,200 --> 00:53:32,239
Speaker 1: with murder when they killed her.

1016
00:53:32,840 --> 00:53:43,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, see they were good for them, and we are back.

1017
00:53:43,360 --> 00:53:47,600
Speaker 2: So the defense did their best to slander Lana. They

1018
00:53:48,120 --> 00:53:50,960
Speaker 2: they portray her as a failed B movie actress who

1019
00:53:51,040 --> 00:53:53,320
Speaker 2: was down on her lucky and depressed. They pushed the

1020
00:53:53,400 --> 00:53:56,520
Speaker 2: theory that she was a starfucker essentially and that she

1021
00:53:56,640 --> 00:53:59,440
Speaker 2: only went with Phil in the hopes that, you know,

1022
00:53:59,640 --> 00:54:02,000
Speaker 2: she could take advantage of a celebrity, and when that

1023
00:54:02,120 --> 00:54:04,239
Speaker 2: didn't work out in the middle of the night, she

1024
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:07,600
Speaker 2: killed herself out of a fit of depression. They brought

1025
00:54:07,719 --> 00:54:12,279
Speaker 2: in her friend, who is this shitty woman. Her name

1026
00:54:12,400 --> 00:54:15,799
Speaker 2: is Pumpkin Pie. For the record, that's her name. That's

1027
00:54:15,880 --> 00:54:19,800
Speaker 2: all She's ever referred to as Pumpkin High. Yes, and

1028
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:23,120
Speaker 2: she is the least believable witness that you've ever seen. Like,

1029
00:54:23,360 --> 00:54:27,960
Speaker 2: her testimony is fucking bunkers. It's like everything's like she texted,

1030
00:54:28,120 --> 00:54:30,279
Speaker 2: she texted me that morning and she was depressed. She's

1031
00:54:30,520 --> 00:54:34,839
Speaker 2: always depressed. She hated her life, she says it. Lana

1032
00:54:34,840 --> 00:54:36,920
Speaker 2: always said she was gonna kill herself if she didn't

1033
00:54:36,920 --> 00:54:39,640
Speaker 2: get this role or you know, like like things that

1034
00:54:39,960 --> 00:54:42,800
Speaker 2: some things that like I believe right, like yeah, but

1035
00:54:43,000 --> 00:54:45,400
Speaker 2: like but like in the way that we all have

1036
00:54:45,480 --> 00:54:47,400
Speaker 2: a sense of humor, like you do. I'll fucking off

1037
00:54:47,480 --> 00:54:49,880
Speaker 2: myself if I don't get this role. You know, I

1038
00:54:49,920 --> 00:54:56,520
Speaker 2: should definitely get this one. Yes, yeah, And they do

1039
00:54:56,719 --> 00:54:59,800
Speaker 2: everything to portray her as a washed up failure u.

1040
00:55:00,280 --> 00:55:04,840
Speaker 2: They even played her sketch comedy real, which admittedly was

1041
00:55:05,040 --> 00:55:08,920
Speaker 2: not very good. It was it wasn't good, right uh.

1042
00:55:09,080 --> 00:55:13,640
Speaker 2: And the defense they like the the like Phil's wife

1043
00:55:13,760 --> 00:55:16,680
Speaker 2: laughs during she snickers, you know, like while they're playing it,

1044
00:55:16,920 --> 00:55:19,759
Speaker 2: they make it out to be a laughable situation. But

1045
00:55:20,000 --> 00:55:23,360
Speaker 2: this kind of backfires on them in the sense that

1046
00:55:23,600 --> 00:55:27,399
Speaker 2: it actually humanized her really hard. Dura number nine from

1047
00:55:27,480 --> 00:55:30,080
Speaker 2: the from the Trial says the reel had the opposite

1048
00:55:30,080 --> 00:55:32,279
Speaker 2: effect and humanized her. This isn't a quote, I'm just

1049
00:55:32,320 --> 00:55:35,000
Speaker 2: reading it. The reel had the opposite effect and humanized

1050
00:55:35,000 --> 00:55:38,520
Speaker 2: her even more to the jury. But despite that, the

1051
00:55:38,600 --> 00:55:40,560
Speaker 2: jury could not come to an agreement and they were

1052
00:55:40,600 --> 00:55:43,080
Speaker 2: deadlocked at ten two, and the judge declared a miss trial.

1053
00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:46,160
Speaker 2: So Phil Spector goes free.

1054
00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:49,279
Speaker 1: Justice is done.

1055
00:55:49,840 --> 00:55:53,759
Speaker 2: So yeah, thank you. And the end, no, no, we

1056
00:55:53,960 --> 00:55:57,160
Speaker 2: get justice. We get justice, my friends, Okay, So one.

1057
00:55:57,080 --> 00:55:58,320
Speaker 1: Thing I know about the Phil story.

1058
00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:01,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I real quick, I just want to bring

1059
00:56:01,880 --> 00:56:04,240
Speaker 2: up Rochelle Spector. I mentioned her a few times already.

1060
00:56:04,320 --> 00:56:08,080
Speaker 2: Rachelle Spector was Prospector's third wife. She met him initially

1061
00:56:08,160 --> 00:56:10,799
Speaker 2: in the nineties, but they didn't get married in two

1062
00:56:10,800 --> 00:56:12,560
Speaker 2: thousand and six, probably because she was like underage, I

1063
00:56:12,600 --> 00:56:15,640
Speaker 2: think when she met him. And also, yeah, it gross Phil,

1064
00:56:15,719 --> 00:56:17,880
Speaker 2: but you know, at least he does wait, you know,

1065
00:56:18,160 --> 00:56:22,920
Speaker 2: like we're from an era of gentleman Jimmy Page, David Bowie,

1066
00:56:23,040 --> 00:56:26,840
Speaker 2: George Harrison. Let's not be forgetting that.

1067
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:29,720
Speaker 3: Our idols were all horrible, horrible.

1068
00:56:29,400 --> 00:56:34,239
Speaker 2: Sexual devious. Yeah yeah, but but Phil always did seem

1069
00:56:34,280 --> 00:56:37,080
Speaker 2: to wait till they were proper adults. So good good

1070
00:56:37,120 --> 00:56:40,680
Speaker 2: for him, no matter how good it was you can say.

1071
00:56:41,239 --> 00:56:43,359
Speaker 2: But they do get married in two thousand and six

1072
00:56:43,440 --> 00:56:47,560
Speaker 2: while Inspecter's waiting on trial, and then she's decades younger

1073
00:56:47,600 --> 00:56:50,200
Speaker 2: than Phil, and unlike his previous partners, entered his life

1074
00:56:50,239 --> 00:56:53,080
Speaker 2: when his music career was long over and his reputation

1075
00:56:53,239 --> 00:56:57,640
Speaker 2: had already become what it was, as you know, murdering, reclusive, eccentric.

1076
00:56:57,920 --> 00:57:01,880
Speaker 2: So there's very serious, very serious questions about her motivation,

1077
00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:06,359
Speaker 2: girl do such a thing. Yes, her motivations absolutely seem

1078
00:57:06,480 --> 00:57:09,160
Speaker 2: to be because she knows Bro's about to go to

1079
00:57:09,239 --> 00:57:10,680
Speaker 2: jail and she only has to hold out for a

1080
00:57:10,760 --> 00:57:12,920
Speaker 2: few more years and then she possession of good.

1081
00:57:13,040 --> 00:57:15,600
Speaker 1: She's in a good situation here, yes, smart, Yeah, I

1082
00:57:15,600 --> 00:57:15,920
Speaker 1: don't know.

1083
00:57:16,080 --> 00:57:19,920
Speaker 8: I take the sorry pause. That was not a good situation.

1084
00:57:20,360 --> 00:57:21,880
Speaker 4: He's on trial for murder.

1085
00:57:22,320 --> 00:57:25,919
Speaker 8: She could that is a dangerous game. It's not worth

1086
00:57:26,040 --> 00:57:26,520
Speaker 8: the check.

1087
00:57:26,960 --> 00:57:27,960
Speaker 4: What are you doing?

1088
00:57:28,840 --> 00:57:32,800
Speaker 2: What are somebody has a moral compass and a and

1089
00:57:33,200 --> 00:57:38,000
Speaker 2: an aversion to danger here thinking I'd have done that,

1090
00:57:38,400 --> 00:57:40,200
Speaker 2: you know, I had a marry phil Spector at this

1091
00:57:40,320 --> 00:57:43,120
Speaker 2: point it seems like it seems like a proper risk.

1092
00:57:43,760 --> 00:57:46,040
Speaker 8: Absolutely not, and he looks like shit anyways.

1093
00:57:47,960 --> 00:57:50,400
Speaker 2: She so, she's always like in the media talking to

1094
00:57:50,480 --> 00:57:53,840
Speaker 2: the media and ship. She's behind him all the time.

1095
00:57:53,960 --> 00:57:57,120
Speaker 2: She speaks to reporters on his on his behalf, insisting

1096
00:57:57,160 --> 00:58:01,600
Speaker 2: on his innocence. She also gets repeatedly warned by the

1097
00:58:01,680 --> 00:58:04,720
Speaker 2: judge during these trials to shut the fuck up or

1098
00:58:04,760 --> 00:58:07,080
Speaker 2: they're gonna throw her out, because she'll be like, something

1099
00:58:07,080 --> 00:58:09,480
Speaker 2: will happen. She'd be like that's not true, you know,

1100
00:58:09,720 --> 00:58:12,960
Speaker 2: like just just being disruptive.

1101
00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:14,720
Speaker 4: And stupid, cursing ass woman.

1102
00:58:15,800 --> 00:58:16,000
Speaker 5: Yeah.

1103
00:58:17,000 --> 00:58:20,000
Speaker 2: In two thousand and nine, Spector was retried for the

1104
00:58:20,080 --> 00:58:22,920
Speaker 2: murder of Lana Clarkson, and this time it lacked the

1105
00:58:23,040 --> 00:58:25,880
Speaker 2: spectacle of the first trial. After the first trial, the

1106
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:29,560
Speaker 2: cameras aren't as interested. People don't really give a shit anymore. Yeah,

1107
00:58:29,640 --> 00:58:31,840
Speaker 2: it's like that was a big deal then, but it's

1108
00:58:31,880 --> 00:58:34,320
Speaker 2: not a big deal now. No one cares. His team

1109
00:58:34,360 --> 00:58:37,200
Speaker 2: went from several high profile lawyers down to just one,

1110
00:58:38,040 --> 00:58:40,800
Speaker 2: but the prosecution stuck with their premise. Phil Spector has

1111
00:58:40,840 --> 00:58:44,040
Speaker 2: a long history of gun violence and a fear of

1112
00:58:44,120 --> 00:58:47,880
Speaker 2: abandonment that ended in him using his gun as a threat,

1113
00:58:48,320 --> 00:58:50,920
Speaker 2: and when Lona Cark Clarkson rebuked him and tried to leave,

1114
00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:54,280
Speaker 2: he became enraged and killed her. This time, the jury

1115
00:58:54,360 --> 00:58:57,400
Speaker 2: did come back in agreement Phil Spector had killed Lana Clarkson.

1116
00:58:57,840 --> 00:59:00,440
Speaker 2: Phil is convicted of second degree murder and he was

1117
00:59:00,480 --> 00:59:03,720
Speaker 2: sentenced to nineteen years to life in prison.

1118
00:59:04,520 --> 00:59:07,440
Speaker 1: Good cool justice.

1119
00:59:08,280 --> 00:59:11,720
Speaker 3: Yeah happen sometimes, Yeah, sometimes it happens.

1120
00:59:12,040 --> 00:59:14,400
Speaker 2: Now, briefly, I do want to talk about what I

1121
00:59:14,480 --> 00:59:18,400
Speaker 2: actually think is the most likely scenario. I've spent a

1122
00:59:18,640 --> 00:59:23,000
Speaker 2: lot of time digging into this and like I've developed

1123
00:59:23,040 --> 00:59:26,800
Speaker 2: my own theory, which is a bit maybe, I mean,

1124
00:59:26,880 --> 00:59:29,960
Speaker 2: maybe maybe it makes some people mad, but we always

1125
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:31,640
Speaker 2: want to put the victim in a positive light. But

1126
00:59:31,800 --> 00:59:34,680
Speaker 2: I don't think she would have gone from Alhambra to

1127
00:59:34,800 --> 00:59:39,000
Speaker 2: Hollywood if she wasn't desperate and looking to take advantage

1128
00:59:39,040 --> 00:59:43,760
Speaker 2: of this situation, right, I don't think that, like you know,

1129
00:59:44,360 --> 00:59:49,120
Speaker 2: so forty is old in Hollywood years, absolutely, And I

1130
00:59:49,240 --> 00:59:52,200
Speaker 2: think the momentum, loss and everything made her desperate to

1131
00:59:52,360 --> 00:59:56,040
Speaker 2: really make something happen, right, which we know, like you know,

1132
00:59:56,600 --> 01:00:01,560
Speaker 2: desperate is the situation where where people will fly or fall.

1133
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:05,080
Speaker 2: In this situation, she just became the victim of a

1134
01:00:05,320 --> 01:00:08,360
Speaker 2: shitty situation, right. I think she went with Phil hoping

1135
01:00:08,440 --> 01:00:10,480
Speaker 2: she could use him to get an opportunity, but I

1136
01:00:10,560 --> 01:00:13,000
Speaker 2: don't think she had any intention of sleeping with him.

1137
01:00:13,080 --> 01:00:15,280
Speaker 2: I think when Phil tried to get sexual with her,

1138
01:00:15,680 --> 01:00:19,160
Speaker 2: she was like, no, this is my limit. I am

1139
01:00:19,280 --> 01:00:20,640
Speaker 2: not interested in this.

1140
01:00:21,680 --> 01:00:24,560
Speaker 1: Waving a gun around. You seem like you have an

1141
01:00:24,600 --> 01:00:26,880
Speaker 1: absolutely a lot of reasons not don't want to get

1142
01:00:26,920 --> 01:00:29,040
Speaker 1: with Phil spector, Yes, but I do.

1143
01:00:29,200 --> 01:00:32,800
Speaker 2: Not want to negate like the conversation that should be had.

1144
01:00:32,880 --> 01:00:37,440
Speaker 2: It's like he was ridiculously drunk. He is absolutely like

1145
01:00:37,720 --> 01:00:41,240
Speaker 2: like blind drunk at this point, right, and he's probably

1146
01:00:41,280 --> 01:00:44,720
Speaker 2: sexually assaulting her. That is very definitely a likely situation.

1147
01:00:45,440 --> 01:00:48,360
Speaker 2: But I think she got frustrated and was like, all right,

1148
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:50,480
Speaker 2: I'm out of here. You promised me one drink. I've

1149
01:00:50,520 --> 01:00:52,520
Speaker 2: had my one drink. It's time to go. I think

1150
01:00:52,560 --> 01:00:54,640
Speaker 2: she put on her purse, and I think Phil, like

1151
01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:58,200
Speaker 2: he has done many many times before, pulled out his gun,

1152
01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:01,080
Speaker 2: sat on her lap, and forced it into her mouth

1153
01:01:01,120 --> 01:01:02,880
Speaker 2: and said like, I'm going to kill you if you

1154
01:01:04,120 --> 01:01:08,200
Speaker 2: and I truly believe honestly that it was an accidental

1155
01:01:08,400 --> 01:01:10,320
Speaker 2: that he killed her accidentally.

1156
01:01:10,040 --> 01:01:11,640
Speaker 1: Negligently, but yeah, I think it was.

1157
01:01:11,720 --> 01:01:16,080
Speaker 2: Yes, negligently is what I would consider absolutely, because if

1158
01:01:16,120 --> 01:01:19,600
Speaker 2: you look at all the accounts, every single account that

1159
01:01:19,720 --> 01:01:22,120
Speaker 2: I read about Phil Spector waving a gun around and

1160
01:01:22,160 --> 01:01:26,120
Speaker 2: threatening people to a t, they all said, I didn't

1161
01:01:26,200 --> 01:01:28,000
Speaker 2: really think Phil was going to kill me. I think

1162
01:01:28,000 --> 01:01:32,480
Speaker 2: he was just drunk and being dumb, right, I think

1163
01:01:32,520 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 2: he had. I think he had done it so many

1164
01:01:34,760 --> 01:01:36,960
Speaker 2: times in his life, and I think that he had

1165
01:01:37,000 --> 01:01:39,520
Speaker 2: been and I think that this one time he was

1166
01:01:39,600 --> 01:01:42,640
Speaker 2: too drunk and he pulled that trigger, and and he

1167
01:01:42,840 --> 01:01:45,840
Speaker 2: negligently killed her. And because the earliest things he said

1168
01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:48,480
Speaker 2: was an accident. I didn't I didn't mean to. There

1169
01:01:48,680 --> 01:01:51,200
Speaker 2: wasn't there one supposed to happen, you know, Like those

1170
01:01:51,240 --> 01:01:52,680
Speaker 2: are the first things that he says.

1171
01:01:52,920 --> 01:01:56,840
Speaker 3: And I truly believe that that is probably what happened.

1172
01:01:56,880 --> 01:01:59,520
Speaker 2: I think that he was just a bad gun owner

1173
01:02:00,040 --> 01:02:03,600
Speaker 2: who murdered somebody who it's still murdered. It doesn't it

1174
01:02:03,720 --> 01:02:04,080
Speaker 2: kills her.

1175
01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:08,800
Speaker 1: And it doesn't change the punishment that he just I

1176
01:02:08,840 --> 01:02:09,880
Speaker 1: can buy that share, and I.

1177
01:02:10,080 --> 01:02:13,840
Speaker 2: Just I personally believe, you know, and and also it

1178
01:02:13,920 --> 01:02:16,240
Speaker 2: doesn't change. Also, you know, like Phil Speckser is a

1179
01:02:16,280 --> 01:02:20,280
Speaker 2: horrible person. His legacy leading up to this is one

1180
01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:22,120
Speaker 2: of being an absolute piece of.

1181
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:23,920
Speaker 4: Dog shit society.

1182
01:02:24,880 --> 01:02:27,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, he is a menace. He wrote some entire light.

1183
01:02:27,760 --> 01:02:29,800
Speaker 7: You wrote something in your script that you did not

1184
01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:32,440
Speaker 7: read that I think is relevant to which is that

1185
01:02:32,560 --> 01:02:34,840
Speaker 7: you wrote that earlier in the day that she had

1186
01:02:34,840 --> 01:02:37,800
Speaker 7: bought multiple pairs of shoes, which I think.

1187
01:02:37,720 --> 01:02:39,960
Speaker 2: Is she bought a bunch of shoes. She absolutely was

1188
01:02:40,040 --> 01:02:43,600
Speaker 2: not killing herself, like despite the you know, like you

1189
01:02:43,680 --> 01:02:45,320
Speaker 2: don't buy a bunch of shoes. And then be like

1190
01:02:45,600 --> 01:02:48,880
Speaker 2: tonight's the night you know it's that's not really You

1191
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:52,280
Speaker 2: don't make future plans if you're gonna off yourself, and

1192
01:02:52,440 --> 01:02:55,680
Speaker 2: she had future plans, she talked about her future plans.

1193
01:02:56,040 --> 01:02:59,960
Speaker 2: It does not, in any way point towards her being suicide.

1194
01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:03,080
Speaker 1: I think that is much more suggestive of Phil either

1195
01:03:03,200 --> 01:03:05,680
Speaker 1: killing her, as you said, fucking up doing the thing

1196
01:03:05,800 --> 01:03:07,840
Speaker 1: he does all the time. I think likely.

1197
01:03:08,920 --> 01:03:11,080
Speaker 2: I think the explanation for the lack of gun residue

1198
01:03:11,120 --> 01:03:13,320
Speaker 2: on his hands was probably that her hands were surrounding

1199
01:03:13,400 --> 01:03:15,840
Speaker 2: his hands while he had a gun held to her

1200
01:03:15,920 --> 01:03:18,200
Speaker 2: face or possibly all the way in her mouth.

1201
01:03:18,320 --> 01:03:20,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe she's fighting him because it's terrifying and the

1202
01:03:20,960 --> 01:03:23,800
Speaker 1: gun pulls the trigger, right. Yeah, I think that that is.

1203
01:03:23,840 --> 01:03:27,720
Speaker 2: The most valid explanation. He also absolutely cleaned up afterwards.

1204
01:03:27,720 --> 01:03:29,440
Speaker 2: There's no prints on the gun, there's no blood on

1205
01:03:29,480 --> 01:03:32,720
Speaker 2: the gun. He absolutely cleaned the gun afterwards in order

1206
01:03:32,800 --> 01:03:35,800
Speaker 2: to try and obfuscate some of this situation, and then.

1207
01:03:36,280 --> 01:03:40,200
Speaker 7: Spent years and years trying to ruin this woman's reputation.

1208
01:03:40,800 --> 01:03:44,400
Speaker 2: Yes, he goes to jail in two thousand and nine.

1209
01:03:44,920 --> 01:03:50,840
Speaker 2: He spends six fucking years free after he kills this woman,

1210
01:03:51,520 --> 01:03:53,840
Speaker 2: six years. America.

1211
01:03:55,040 --> 01:03:57,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, this is the country I lost.

1212
01:03:57,720 --> 01:04:01,880
Speaker 2: My leg for half lost, but I love the feeling

1213
01:04:01,960 --> 01:04:03,840
Speaker 2: in my leg. I lost the feeling in my leg

1214
01:04:03,960 --> 01:04:09,720
Speaker 2: that counts. Yeah, so this it sucks. He spends the

1215
01:04:09,800 --> 01:04:13,760
Speaker 2: remainder of his life incarcerated. He spends decades, you know,

1216
01:04:13,880 --> 01:04:17,640
Speaker 2: prior to this emotion, constructing these walls, and then he

1217
01:04:17,760 --> 01:04:21,520
Speaker 2: gets imprisoned by the walls that, you know, we construct

1218
01:04:21,560 --> 01:04:25,360
Speaker 2: a society. That's my ooh, look at that moment, right,

1219
01:04:25,480 --> 01:04:28,800
Speaker 2: we all feel smarter now. In December of twenty twenty,

1220
01:04:29,160 --> 01:04:32,240
Speaker 2: Phil contracted COVID while in prison, and in January of

1221
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:34,720
Speaker 2: twenty twenty one, he died of complications from COVID.

1222
01:04:34,840 --> 01:04:35,840
Speaker 4: That didn't mean to laugh.

1223
01:04:37,840 --> 01:04:40,080
Speaker 2: He calls his daughter and it's like and to tell

1224
01:04:40,120 --> 01:04:42,320
Speaker 2: her because she he loses contact, but he calls her

1225
01:04:42,400 --> 01:04:44,760
Speaker 2: to tell her, I didn't die on my birthday. Look

1226
01:04:44,800 --> 01:04:48,280
Speaker 2: at me, you know. Yeah, that's that's his big you know,

1227
01:04:48,440 --> 01:04:50,360
Speaker 2: thay his daughter again to the end of his life.

1228
01:04:50,440 --> 01:04:55,040
Speaker 2: She and still today, Nicole. She she proclaims his innocence

1229
01:04:55,280 --> 01:04:57,640
Speaker 2: and she stands by him, says a wonderful father. She

1230
01:04:57,720 --> 01:05:02,880
Speaker 2: loves him as a his other kids fucking hate him.

1231
01:05:02,920 --> 01:05:06,000
Speaker 2: Show up during the trialer like this dude, he did

1232
01:05:06,080 --> 01:05:07,520
Speaker 2: shitty things, but his daughter.

1233
01:05:08,120 --> 01:05:10,200
Speaker 4: I just wonder what wig he was buried with.

1234
01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:14,640
Speaker 2: Actually, Sophie, if you wouldn't mind pulling up, Oh, actually

1235
01:05:14,680 --> 01:05:15,120
Speaker 2: it's me this.

1236
01:05:15,200 --> 01:05:18,240
Speaker 3: Time, me, this time, I will pull up. We do

1237
01:05:18,440 --> 01:05:21,320
Speaker 3: have a picture of Phil Spector, the last picture before

1238
01:05:21,360 --> 01:05:21,760
Speaker 3: he dies.

1239
01:05:22,320 --> 01:05:27,040
Speaker 2: It looks like this. Somewhere here it is bam, there

1240
01:05:27,120 --> 01:05:30,400
Speaker 2: he is Phil Spector and all of his glory.

1241
01:05:30,920 --> 01:05:33,920
Speaker 1: He does look like an extra from the Santa Claus.

1242
01:05:35,240 --> 01:05:38,200
Speaker 2: No wig, crooked teeth, hearing aids in because he's probably

1243
01:05:38,280 --> 01:05:42,240
Speaker 2: going deaf at this point. It is a stark contrast

1244
01:05:43,080 --> 01:05:46,040
Speaker 2: of everything about him. He dies, you know, pretty much deaf,

1245
01:05:47,200 --> 01:05:49,320
Speaker 2: no hair. It's all the things that he fought his

1246
01:05:49,560 --> 01:05:52,000
Speaker 2: entire life and here he is at the end of

1247
01:05:52,040 --> 01:05:54,480
Speaker 2: his life. Go fuck yourself, Phil, That's how you go

1248
01:05:54,600 --> 01:05:58,200
Speaker 2: out now, because because that is a bit it's a

1249
01:05:58,280 --> 01:05:59,960
Speaker 2: bit of a happy ending. I'm not gonna pretend it's

1250
01:05:59,960 --> 01:06:03,160
Speaker 2: a happy end. No, he's dead because I like to

1251
01:06:03,240 --> 01:06:06,080
Speaker 2: leave us on in even happier ending. Because we go

1252
01:06:06,280 --> 01:06:09,160
Speaker 2: through a lot, don't we hear at Bastards, we we

1253
01:06:09,320 --> 01:06:11,240
Speaker 2: go through a lot, right, It's just it's you know,

1254
01:06:11,480 --> 01:06:13,760
Speaker 2: I I I listened to the Himmler episodes.

1255
01:06:14,360 --> 01:06:19,080
Speaker 3: I it was hard Man or the Varenti Barrier episode.

1256
01:06:19,960 --> 01:06:22,080
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah yeah that guy.

1257
01:06:22,440 --> 01:06:22,560
Speaker 5: Uh.

1258
01:06:23,160 --> 01:06:24,480
Speaker 2: This shit's sad, you know.

1259
01:06:24,920 --> 01:06:25,040
Speaker 6: Uh.

1260
01:06:25,120 --> 01:06:26,880
Speaker 2: So I want to leave you with a happy ending

1261
01:06:27,480 --> 01:06:31,200
Speaker 2: of ending. After escaping Phil Spector in nineteen seventy two,

1262
01:06:31,320 --> 01:06:33,600
Speaker 2: Ronnie Spector Or as she would later go by her

1263
01:06:33,720 --> 01:06:36,920
Speaker 2: maiden named Ronnie Bennett, again entered what she later described

1264
01:06:36,960 --> 01:06:39,520
Speaker 2: not as a triumphant comeback, but a long, grinding fight

1265
01:06:39,640 --> 01:06:43,560
Speaker 2: to reclaim her life, identity, and voice. The divorce left

1266
01:06:43,600 --> 01:06:47,920
Speaker 2: her financially constrained and legally silenced, while Phil retaining control

1267
01:06:48,000 --> 01:06:51,800
Speaker 2: over much of her catalog and publishing uh. For years,

1268
01:06:51,920 --> 01:06:55,840
Speaker 2: Ronnie struggled with alcoholism and instability, problems she openly acknowledged

1269
01:06:55,920 --> 01:06:58,680
Speaker 2: and as scars from her captivity, like this is what

1270
01:06:58,800 --> 01:07:01,360
Speaker 2: she went through and this is why she is like that, right,

1271
01:07:01,760 --> 01:07:05,040
Speaker 2: But she never fully disappeared. Throughout the seventies and eighties,

1272
01:07:05,120 --> 01:07:08,720
Speaker 2: she continued recording and performing sporadically, collaborating with artists like

1273
01:07:08,800 --> 01:07:11,840
Speaker 2: Any Money, Joey Ramone, and slowly rebuilding her sense of

1274
01:07:11,960 --> 01:07:16,240
Speaker 2: self outside Phil's shadow. Survival not stardom was the priority.

1275
01:07:16,320 --> 01:07:21,520
Speaker 2: Hold on a second, fuck, I forgot to mention the Ramones.

1276
01:07:21,920 --> 01:07:23,560
Speaker 2: He pulled a gun on the Ramones and didn't let

1277
01:07:23,640 --> 01:07:26,480
Speaker 2: him leave the studio. I don't know how I missed

1278
01:07:26,520 --> 01:07:29,200
Speaker 2: that one. That's a big So the Ramones are recording

1279
01:07:29,560 --> 01:07:31,640
Speaker 2: rock and roll high School and Phil is brought in

1280
01:07:31,800 --> 01:07:34,240
Speaker 2: to record them and he pulls a gun on the

1281
01:07:34,280 --> 01:07:35,800
Speaker 2: whole band and says, you're not leaving until you get

1282
01:07:35,800 --> 01:07:39,520
Speaker 2: the songwright right. Some members of the band later deny it,

1283
01:07:39,640 --> 01:07:41,600
Speaker 2: but Joey Ramones said it happened, so it's like that.

1284
01:07:41,880 --> 01:07:45,840
Speaker 2: But yes, so Joey Ramone definitely. They probably in the

1285
01:07:45,920 --> 01:07:51,120
Speaker 2: studio were like, hey, so Phil crazy, right? Fuck that guy.

1286
01:07:51,560 --> 01:07:53,680
Speaker 2: That guy was a nut, right, you know. I'm sure

1287
01:07:53,720 --> 01:07:58,760
Speaker 2: they had some memories that they shared. In the nineteen

1288
01:07:58,800 --> 01:08:03,040
Speaker 2: nineties and two thousands, On experienced a long overdue reprisal

1289
01:08:03,440 --> 01:08:06,080
Speaker 2: as rock history began to properly credit girl groups and

1290
01:08:06,120 --> 01:08:10,320
Speaker 2: female vocalist. Her influence became undeniable. Be My Baby was

1291
01:08:10,400 --> 01:08:13,360
Speaker 2: canonized as one of the most important pop recordings ever made,

1292
01:08:13,560 --> 01:08:17,040
Speaker 2: and Ronnie herself was recognized not just as Phil Spector's muse,

1293
01:08:17,400 --> 01:08:21,200
Speaker 2: but as a single, irreplaceable voice. She reunited with the

1294
01:08:21,280 --> 01:08:24,720
Speaker 2: Ronettes for selective performances and released new music on her

1295
01:08:24,760 --> 01:08:28,280
Speaker 2: own terms, and became a beloved figure among younger musicians,

1296
01:08:28,479 --> 01:08:31,479
Speaker 2: who saw her both as a pioneer and a survivor.

1297
01:08:31,760 --> 01:08:32,200
Speaker 4: Oh yeah.

1298
01:08:32,560 --> 01:08:35,959
Speaker 2: Her nineteen ninety memoir Be My Baby was especially important,

1299
01:08:36,200 --> 01:08:39,559
Speaker 2: breaking decades of silence and reframing her story as one

1300
01:08:39,600 --> 01:08:44,800
Speaker 2: of endurance rather than victimhood. I will tell you this

1301
01:08:44,920 --> 01:08:48,920
Speaker 2: book she wrote, is tremendous. She deserves every ounce of

1302
01:08:49,000 --> 01:08:51,479
Speaker 2: credit for being a survivor that she is, because she

1303
01:08:51,640 --> 01:08:53,400
Speaker 2: looks at all this stuff the same way I look

1304
01:08:53,439 --> 01:08:56,599
Speaker 2: at like surviving the Iraq War, you know where it's

1305
01:08:56,720 --> 01:08:59,759
Speaker 2: like like this is the worst thing that's ever happened

1306
01:08:59,800 --> 01:09:01,360
Speaker 2: to me, But I'm gonna make jokes out of it

1307
01:09:01,479 --> 01:09:05,360
Speaker 2: instead of like letting it destroy me. She absolutely has

1308
01:09:05,479 --> 01:09:08,960
Speaker 2: such a strength and such a sense of humor about

1309
01:09:09,000 --> 01:09:11,759
Speaker 2: all the things that happened to her. Even the coffin.

1310
01:09:12,160 --> 01:09:14,640
Speaker 2: She's like, I guess he thought that was gonna scare me,

1311
01:09:14,760 --> 01:09:19,600
Speaker 2: but Rose five four, Yeah, let's not kid ourselves. It

1312
01:09:19,680 --> 01:09:21,639
Speaker 2: wasn't like he was gonna physically put me in there.

1313
01:09:24,960 --> 01:09:28,080
Speaker 2: When Phil Spector was convicted and in prison, Ronnie did

1314
01:09:28,160 --> 01:09:31,920
Speaker 2: not gloat. She simply said justice has been done. When

1315
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:34,320
Speaker 2: she died in twenty twenty two, she was remembered not

1316
01:09:34,800 --> 01:09:37,000
Speaker 2: as someone who survived a monster, but as an artist

1317
01:09:37,040 --> 01:09:40,519
Speaker 2: whose voice changed popping. And she did get to outlive

1318
01:09:40,560 --> 01:09:43,920
Speaker 2: Phil Spector. She got to see him die and lived

1319
01:09:43,960 --> 01:09:46,639
Speaker 2: a happy year and a half two years damn near

1320
01:09:47,080 --> 01:09:52,840
Speaker 2: without him in the world. So good on her. Thankfully

1321
01:09:53,080 --> 01:09:57,639
Speaker 2: she found happiness and success despite going through this whole thing.

1322
01:09:57,800 --> 01:09:59,320
Speaker 1: And she got to see him die.

1323
01:10:00,080 --> 01:10:04,719
Speaker 2: And that, my friend, Robert, is your two week vacation,

1324
01:10:06,439 --> 01:10:09,519
Speaker 2: all summed up the story of Phil Spector. He is

1325
01:10:09,600 --> 01:10:10,280
Speaker 2: without What do you think?

1326
01:10:10,320 --> 01:10:10,479
Speaker 5: Wait?

1327
01:10:10,520 --> 01:10:12,760
Speaker 2: Where h ken do you?

1328
01:10:13,600 --> 01:10:14,360
Speaker 3: Let's for assess this?

1329
01:10:15,640 --> 01:10:15,760
Speaker 4: Uh?

1330
01:10:16,320 --> 01:10:18,720
Speaker 2: What was what was the most insane thing you think

1331
01:10:18,880 --> 01:10:19,840
Speaker 2: of all of all this?

1332
01:10:20,479 --> 01:10:24,200
Speaker 1: The sheer number of very famous people he pulled guns on.

1333
01:10:24,560 --> 01:10:27,200
Speaker 1: Just thinking about how much clout you have to have

1334
01:10:27,560 --> 01:10:30,479
Speaker 1: to pull a gun on, like the Ramote, John Lennon,

1335
01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:34,920
Speaker 1: the Ramon Lennon and everyone Leonard. Don't say anything about it,

1336
01:10:35,160 --> 01:10:37,200
Speaker 1: like Leonard, Hey man, I know you wrote Hallelujah, but

1337
01:10:37,240 --> 01:10:38,679
Speaker 1: you got to keep your mouth shut.

1338
01:10:40,680 --> 01:10:41,240
Speaker 2: Hallelujah.

1339
01:10:41,280 --> 01:10:44,799
Speaker 1: He didn't pull the trigger, all right, tell.

1340
01:10:44,720 --> 01:10:46,320
Speaker 2: Me what do you think? What what's the craziest thing

1341
01:10:46,360 --> 01:10:47,000
Speaker 2: of this old dude.

1342
01:10:47,040 --> 01:10:48,280
Speaker 4: I don't know that Mickey Mouse.

1343
01:10:52,080 --> 01:10:54,760
Speaker 2: He just he offered that willingly. He didn't know what

1344
01:10:54,880 --> 01:10:56,920
Speaker 2: he prodded him. They were like, do you think was

1345
01:10:56,960 --> 01:11:03,080
Speaker 2: the first Charlie Temple and Mickey Mouse? It's so funny, man.

1346
01:11:03,280 --> 01:11:05,720
Speaker 2: There's so many parts about this guy. And here's why

1347
01:11:05,800 --> 01:11:09,360
Speaker 2: it's so interesting to me, right, is because as a musician,

1348
01:11:09,400 --> 01:11:11,600
Speaker 2: as a producer, as a person who's worked in the

1349
01:11:11,680 --> 01:11:15,160
Speaker 2: music industry, I've met this guy one hundred times at

1350
01:11:15,280 --> 01:11:18,280
Speaker 2: least already. I've met this guy so many times. I've

1351
01:11:18,439 --> 01:11:24,840
Speaker 2: absolutely seen people who I guarantee in thirty years or whatever,

1352
01:11:24,880 --> 01:11:27,720
Speaker 2: I'm gonna be sitting at home and there's gonna come

1353
01:11:27,760 --> 01:11:31,400
Speaker 2: on and be like, yes, all coming, Yes, all I coming.

1354
01:11:31,520 --> 01:11:34,920
Speaker 2: That was absolutely gonna happen. I predicted this for sure.

1355
01:11:35,160 --> 01:11:41,200
Speaker 2: You know, can't wait for the Tell Court interview. So yeah. So,

1356
01:11:41,360 --> 01:11:43,840
Speaker 2: I mean that's the thing that I really enjoy about

1357
01:11:43,880 --> 01:11:47,000
Speaker 2: this story is is the you know it is It

1358
01:11:47,120 --> 01:11:50,439
Speaker 2: is generally just the story of a shitty, shitty, shitty person.

1359
01:11:50,640 --> 01:11:55,200
Speaker 2: There's a lot of those in Hollywood, but I I

1360
01:11:56,040 --> 01:11:58,280
Speaker 2: like to separate, like, this is one of the like,

1361
01:11:58,400 --> 01:12:00,760
Speaker 2: for example, right when Michael Jackson and when when a

1362
01:12:00,840 --> 01:12:04,439
Speaker 2: lot of the most recent things have come out, I

1363
01:12:04,560 --> 01:12:06,160
Speaker 2: kind of made a choice, like I feel like, man,

1364
01:12:07,040 --> 01:12:09,280
Speaker 2: I don't need to listen to your music anymore, Like

1365
01:12:10,439 --> 01:12:12,599
Speaker 2: all the classics are there, but I just don't. I don't.

1366
01:12:12,640 --> 01:12:15,000
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna get mad if anybody else does, but

1367
01:12:15,160 --> 01:12:18,160
Speaker 2: I definitely I'm I'm I'm drawing a line between that

1368
01:12:18,400 --> 01:12:22,240
Speaker 2: was that was wrong and I don't like it lost profits.

1369
01:12:22,280 --> 01:12:25,320
Speaker 2: I don't listen to lost profits anymore. But Phil Spector

1370
01:12:25,439 --> 01:12:30,360
Speaker 2: had such an undeniable hold on so many important artists

1371
01:12:30,400 --> 01:12:33,559
Speaker 2: and so many songs that it's just like to erase

1372
01:12:33,680 --> 01:12:36,679
Speaker 2: that would be erasing a core part of my being

1373
01:12:37,880 --> 01:12:41,920
Speaker 2: existed before Phil Spector killed Lona Clucks in two thousand

1374
01:12:41,920 --> 01:12:44,759
Speaker 2: and three. You know, like all of those songs existed

1375
01:12:44,800 --> 01:12:47,439
Speaker 2: in my life before then. And and it really is

1376
01:12:47,520 --> 01:12:50,519
Speaker 2: like it's it's difficult, it's it's a difficult thing. And

1377
01:12:50,960 --> 01:12:54,960
Speaker 2: and also, you know, I like to take some tiny

1378
01:12:55,040 --> 01:12:58,240
Speaker 2: bit of solace in the fact that, like I can.

1379
01:12:58,160 --> 01:13:02,680
Speaker 3: Tell other people how horror he was. Yeah, it was

1380
01:13:02,760 --> 01:13:03,800
Speaker 3: this shittiest person.

1381
01:13:03,880 --> 01:13:06,600
Speaker 2: He made some bangers, He did some amazing things that

1382
01:13:06,800 --> 01:13:10,360
Speaker 2: that are like just not have not been replicated in

1383
01:13:10,439 --> 01:13:15,960
Speaker 2: the music industry and undeniably a huge sonic inspiration for me.

1384
01:13:16,160 --> 01:13:21,360
Speaker 2: Like I literally consider myself to be the stereo phil Specter.

1385
01:13:21,560 --> 01:13:28,080
Speaker 2: Like this dude, he was divorced three times. Nail it, Phil,

1386
01:13:28,479 --> 01:13:32,200
Speaker 2: you know, I know, but musically musically really uh he

1387
01:13:32,720 --> 01:13:34,519
Speaker 2: he he, he does so much.

1388
01:13:34,640 --> 01:13:36,760
Speaker 3: I truly believe in what he did, like this way

1389
01:13:36,840 --> 01:13:38,960
Speaker 3: that he crafted the music that he did.

1390
01:13:39,040 --> 01:13:41,559
Speaker 2: It's it's how I like to use the studio as

1391
01:13:42,000 --> 01:13:44,760
Speaker 2: part of the process of making music to have these

1392
01:13:44,840 --> 01:13:48,280
Speaker 2: creative moments. And I'm largely inspired by him and the

1393
01:13:48,320 --> 01:13:51,800
Speaker 2: Beatles in doing that, and so it is hard to

1394
01:13:52,960 --> 01:13:56,280
Speaker 2: remove that. So my my justification is that I'm just

1395
01:13:56,360 --> 01:13:58,400
Speaker 2: out here telling you guys how shitty it was, so

1396
01:13:58,560 --> 01:14:00,759
Speaker 2: it alleviates my conscience.

1397
01:14:03,120 --> 01:14:07,439
Speaker 1: Well, there's worse ways to alleviate your conscience, Yeah, Phil

1398
01:14:07,479 --> 01:14:08,840
Speaker 1: spe a few of them.

1399
01:14:10,560 --> 01:14:13,160
Speaker 3: Man, So thank you so much for letting me do this.

1400
01:14:13,240 --> 01:14:14,080
Speaker 3: This was so much fun.

1401
01:14:14,880 --> 01:14:18,360
Speaker 2: If you're interested in the music from the episodes, I'm

1402
01:14:18,439 --> 01:14:20,600
Speaker 2: gonna give that to Sophie so she can post it.

1403
01:14:20,680 --> 01:14:23,200
Speaker 2: I'm also going I'm gonna give even like the stems

1404
01:14:23,320 --> 01:14:25,439
Speaker 2: and the sessions, so if you're a musician and you

1405
01:14:25,479 --> 01:14:27,320
Speaker 2: want to remix some of this stuff to make your

1406
01:14:27,320 --> 01:14:31,880
Speaker 2: own little home bastards weird, it's weird. You can grab

1407
01:14:31,960 --> 01:14:34,960
Speaker 2: those from Sophie. I'll put them on my stuff too. Also,

1408
01:14:36,080 --> 01:14:38,799
Speaker 2: I'm fighting the music industry from the inside. I actually

1409
01:14:38,920 --> 01:14:41,040
Speaker 2: I did all the label thing. Obviously, I have a

1410
01:14:41,120 --> 01:14:43,080
Speaker 2: Grammy and I've done the whole label thing. But I

1411
01:14:43,200 --> 01:14:45,960
Speaker 2: decided to be the change I want to see in

1412
01:14:46,040 --> 01:14:49,120
Speaker 2: the music industry, and so I am starting my own label.

1413
01:14:49,200 --> 01:14:52,080
Speaker 2: I am working very hard at pushing my own identity

1414
01:14:52,200 --> 01:14:56,040
Speaker 2: in this that is different from the exploitive AI driven

1415
01:14:57,160 --> 01:15:00,240
Speaker 2: ownership of publishing bullshit that the industry has been come

1416
01:15:00,280 --> 01:15:02,840
Speaker 2: and I really am trying. So if you care about

1417
01:15:02,880 --> 01:15:06,000
Speaker 2: that at all, guilt trip. For all of you listeners,

1418
01:15:07,760 --> 01:15:09,400
Speaker 2: come and check out my new artist. Her name is

1419
01:15:09,439 --> 01:15:12,400
Speaker 2: Violet Lux. I'm going to release this song concurrent with

1420
01:15:12,560 --> 01:15:15,040
Speaker 2: this with these episodes so that you can you can

1421
01:15:15,080 --> 01:15:17,840
Speaker 2: hear my very first artist that I'm signing to the label.

1422
01:15:18,200 --> 01:15:23,160
Speaker 2: It is. It's entirely Phil Spector inspired type stuff. I'm

1423
01:15:23,240 --> 01:15:25,240
Speaker 2: wall of sounding with the music. But if you like

1424
01:15:25,560 --> 01:15:28,200
Speaker 2: nineties grunge rock, if you like Alison Chains, if you

1425
01:15:28,320 --> 01:15:30,400
Speaker 2: like Mazzie Starr, if you like Nirvana, if you like

1426
01:15:30,439 --> 01:15:32,360
Speaker 2: Smashing Pumpkins, this is going to be right up your alley,

1427
01:15:32,439 --> 01:15:35,240
Speaker 2: so come check it out. The vinyl will be coming

1428
01:15:35,280 --> 01:15:37,960
Speaker 2: out too, so check that out as well. Uh and

1429
01:15:38,360 --> 01:15:40,360
Speaker 2: and yeah, I got a podcast and other shit, So

1430
01:15:40,720 --> 01:15:42,760
Speaker 2: I thank you for letting me do this. Man, this

1431
01:15:42,840 --> 01:15:46,599
Speaker 2: has been so much fun. I love telling my friend

1432
01:15:46,720 --> 01:15:49,080
Speaker 2: this is like what we do when we're just hanging out,

1433
01:15:49,680 --> 01:15:51,320
Speaker 2: like explaining people to.

1434
01:15:51,400 --> 01:15:54,360
Speaker 1: Each other, Phil and yeah particular.

1435
01:15:54,479 --> 01:15:56,360
Speaker 2: So it's it's fun to get to do this on

1436
01:15:56,520 --> 01:15:58,960
Speaker 2: the stage that you have become. And I'm so proud

1437
01:15:59,000 --> 01:16:01,439
Speaker 2: of you, man, it's awesome you doing so well with

1438
01:16:01,600 --> 01:16:04,519
Speaker 2: all this. And I'm for you too, and your nerds

1439
01:16:04,600 --> 01:16:07,240
Speaker 2: on the subwritting talk on Sophie, I swear to god,

1440
01:16:07,240 --> 01:16:09,559
Speaker 2: I'll hunt you down like that Jay and Silent Bob movie.

1441
01:16:09,880 --> 01:16:10,840
Speaker 2: Beat the shit out of you.

1442
01:16:11,000 --> 01:16:11,960
Speaker 1: That's right, that's what we do.

1443
01:16:13,960 --> 01:16:15,720
Speaker 2: This has been a podcast. That's how I end my

1444
01:16:15,800 --> 01:16:16,920
Speaker 2: podcast by.

1445
01:16:17,320 --> 01:16:18,280
Speaker 1: It is over.

1446
01:16:23,080 --> 01:16:25,639
Speaker 7: Behind the Bastards is a production of cool Zone Media.

1447
01:16:25,840 --> 01:16:28,519
Speaker 7: For more from cool Zone Media, visit our website cool

1448
01:16:28,560 --> 01:16:31,720
Speaker 7: Zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app.

1449
01:16:31,760 --> 01:16:35,639
Speaker 7: Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Full video

1450
01:16:35,720 --> 01:16:38,400
Speaker 7: episodes that Behind the Bastards are now streaming on Netflix,

1451
01:16:38,479 --> 01:16:41,720
Speaker 7: dropping every Tuesday and Thursday. Remind me of Netflix. You

1452
01:16:41,760 --> 01:16:45,200
Speaker 7: don't miss an episode. For clips in our older episode catalog,

1453
01:16:45,320 --> 01:16:48,400
Speaker 7: continue to subscribe to our YouTube channel YouTube dot com

1454
01:16:48,600 --> 01:16:52,519
Speaker 7: slash at Behind the Bastards. We love about forty percent

1455
01:16:52,600 --> 01:16:54,000
Speaker 7: of you, statistically speaking,