1 00:00:02,480 --> 00:00:05,760 Speaker 1: From the heart of where innovation, money and power. CALLI 2 00:00:06,600 --> 00:00:11,119 Speaker 1: in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with 3 00:00:11,200 --> 00:00:27,560 Speaker 1: Emily Jay. I'm Caroline Hyde in New York. In Family 4 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 1: Chang this is bring Bag Technology. Coming up in the 5 00:00:30,080 --> 00:00:34,040 Speaker 1: next hour. Airbnb hosts attempt to navigate tricky legal maze 6 00:00:34,320 --> 00:00:37,400 Speaker 1: amid state abortion bands while hosting women seeking to get 7 00:00:37,400 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 1: abortions may not be all that easy. Plus, as the 8 00:00:41,040 --> 00:00:43,560 Speaker 1: biggest names in tech and media gather at some valley, 9 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: we'll hear from Amajiki twenty three and me about the 10 00:00:47,080 --> 00:00:50,960 Speaker 1: company's new study on well long COVID, in the current 11 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:54,320 Speaker 1: state of biotech stocks, and door Dash and uber sink. 12 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 1: After Amazon agrees to take a stake in grub Hub's business, 13 00:00:57,600 --> 00:00:59,760 Speaker 1: details of the deal and why prime members might start 14 00:00:59,800 --> 00:01:03,160 Speaker 1: to favorite grub as in every service. Let's talk about 15 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:05,520 Speaker 1: the U. S. Supreme Court ruling, of course, to end 16 00:01:05,560 --> 00:01:09,520 Speaker 1: federal protection for abortions happened last month. Already, many people 17 00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:11,600 Speaker 1: wanted to try and find a way to help. Some 18 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:14,479 Speaker 1: hosts on Airbnb offered to open their homes to guests 19 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:16,920 Speaker 1: who needed to travel to states that will still allow 20 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:20,680 Speaker 1: the procedure. However, some of those hosts, well, I'm realizing 21 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:22,559 Speaker 1: it isn't as easy a solution as it might seem. 22 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:25,959 Speaker 1: Bloomberg's Michael Tobin wrote all about this. Joins US now 23 00:01:26,480 --> 00:01:29,280 Speaker 1: talk to us about how hosts were looking to potentially 24 00:01:29,319 --> 00:01:33,160 Speaker 1: step in and allow travel to states that allowed abortions 25 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:36,400 Speaker 1: right after the Supreme Court decision came out. Hosts immediately 26 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:38,920 Speaker 1: we're changing some of their listings to say, if you're 27 00:01:38,920 --> 00:01:40,959 Speaker 1: a woman and needed to travel across state lines to 28 00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:43,440 Speaker 1: get an abortion, you're welcome to stay at my place 29 00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:46,280 Speaker 1: for free. And this is host really stepping up at 30 00:01:46,319 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 1: a time where abortion access is being limited in almost 31 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:53,559 Speaker 1: you know, half of US states. And quickly host learned 32 00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:55,200 Speaker 1: that it was not as easy to do this as 33 00:01:55,240 --> 00:01:57,760 Speaker 1: they thought. There are very restrictive laws in states like 34 00:01:57,800 --> 00:02:01,280 Speaker 1: Oklahoma and Texas that will actually put out bounties on 35 00:02:01,320 --> 00:02:03,760 Speaker 1: people who aid in a bet abortions. And this was 36 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 1: an issue that came up last year and companies like 37 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:08,880 Speaker 1: Uber were saying that we're going to defend our drivers 38 00:02:08,960 --> 00:02:12,760 Speaker 1: if they are implicated um in these lawsuits. And quickly 39 00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:15,160 Speaker 1: what we've seen happen is some of these hosts takedown 40 00:02:15,320 --> 00:02:18,240 Speaker 1: these listings and then partner with local nonprofits who are 41 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:22,000 Speaker 1: able to provide housing, so perhaps be a little less obvious, 42 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:24,639 Speaker 1: a little less implicating to anyone who's looking to use 43 00:02:24,680 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 1: that home. I'm also interested in whether Abb said how 44 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:30,679 Speaker 1: Uber came to try and help an offer to pay 45 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:32,799 Speaker 1: the legal fees of its drivers. What have I been 46 00:02:32,840 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 1: be done for their hosts? Right? So Airbnb has said 47 00:02:36,040 --> 00:02:38,200 Speaker 1: that if any of its hosts are implicating these laws, 48 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:40,560 Speaker 1: they will defend them, and they said that last September. 49 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:43,400 Speaker 1: And they also said if any other states pass laws 50 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:45,200 Speaker 1: that are similar to the one in Texas, will step 51 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:47,399 Speaker 1: up and do the same. The company has also made 52 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:50,200 Speaker 1: an unspecified donation of Planned Parenthood last year, but they 53 00:02:50,200 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 1: haven't said anything else aside from you know, what's happened 54 00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: after the Supreme Court ruling. And this is a company 55 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:59,359 Speaker 1: that's really stepped up to provide housing to Ukrainian Afghanistan 56 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 1: refugees when those crisis were happening, But we haven't heard 57 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:05,600 Speaker 1: about any of their plans or partnerships domestically. I mean, 58 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:08,640 Speaker 1: it has to be said in many ways, the Ukrainian 59 00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:11,800 Speaker 1: refugee crisis is in no way politically divisive. We still 60 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:14,880 Speaker 1: know that one third of the US population, at least 61 00:03:14,880 --> 00:03:18,960 Speaker 1: on a Pew survey, agreed that abortions should be illegal. 62 00:03:19,080 --> 00:03:20,919 Speaker 1: So we have to realize that this is a very 63 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:25,960 Speaker 1: politically charged conversation, and indeed not everyone agrees. I'm interested in, therefore, 64 00:03:26,200 --> 00:03:29,320 Speaker 1: whether we expect the companies to stand to make comments 65 00:03:29,320 --> 00:03:31,920 Speaker 1: about how they support their employees as well, because this 66 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:34,600 Speaker 1: is something we've seen many businesses say that's correct, and 67 00:03:34,720 --> 00:03:37,200 Speaker 1: Airbnb has said that they will pay for employees who 68 00:03:37,240 --> 00:03:39,640 Speaker 1: need to go across state lines to get an abortion, 69 00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 1: but we haven't seen that extended to hosts yet or 70 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 1: to guess, so at that point, it's still re meant 71 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:48,680 Speaker 1: to be seen what the company plans to do. What 72 00:03:48,760 --> 00:03:52,840 Speaker 1: about therefore, solutions that some of the actual hosts have 73 00:03:52,880 --> 00:03:54,640 Speaker 1: been coming up with. You say that they've been working 74 00:03:54,640 --> 00:03:56,520 Speaker 1: with not for profits? Is that largely in the way 75 00:03:56,520 --> 00:03:58,320 Speaker 1: in which that they If you're looking to be able 76 00:03:58,360 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 1: to offer your home for free to those who want 77 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:03,080 Speaker 1: to travel, is that the way to partner with nonprofits charities? 78 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:04,880 Speaker 1: That's what I've seen so far. One host that I 79 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:07,240 Speaker 1: spoke to, who is in Virginia, said that they're going 80 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:09,800 Speaker 1: to be partnering with a local nonprofit and they actually 81 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:12,520 Speaker 1: have two women who are coming to stay at their homes. 82 00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:14,520 Speaker 1: So this is somebody who's been able to partner with 83 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:17,560 Speaker 1: a local nonprofit and make it successful. They've taken down 84 00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:19,720 Speaker 1: the language from their listing on Airbnb, but they're still 85 00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:22,960 Speaker 1: making it available through their nonprofit. Another host that I 86 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:25,480 Speaker 1: spoke to in New Mexico said that they had to 87 00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:27,280 Speaker 1: take down the listing because of a threat that they 88 00:04:27,320 --> 00:04:29,880 Speaker 1: got against their family. So it really does show how 89 00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 1: serious this can be, and they really hope that the 90 00:04:33,120 --> 00:04:36,680 Speaker 1: organization's um They hope that Airbnb will partner with the 91 00:04:36,760 --> 00:04:41,360 Speaker 1: organizations to make this safe for all parties involved. And lastly, 92 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:45,000 Speaker 1: what about sort of the next step of of investigative 93 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:48,200 Speaker 1: reporting for yourself, Like when you're looking at the ways 94 00:04:48,200 --> 00:04:50,960 Speaker 1: in which this conversation continues to happen, are there other 95 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:52,920 Speaker 1: companies that you're discussing this with. Is there are other 96 00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:54,839 Speaker 1: ways in which you think a BB and the likes 97 00:04:54,880 --> 00:04:57,080 Speaker 1: will have to eventually become more clear in some of 98 00:04:57,120 --> 00:04:59,599 Speaker 1: their advice. I think what we're going to see is 99 00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:01,599 Speaker 1: he's come news. You're just going to be continued to be, 100 00:05:02,279 --> 00:05:04,760 Speaker 1: you know, put under public pressure, in the public spotlight 101 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:07,240 Speaker 1: to what they're going to do to support employees and hosts. 102 00:05:07,360 --> 00:05:10,080 Speaker 1: And this kind of is similar to you know, the 103 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 1: conversation about who's an employee and who's a contractor, right, 104 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 1: and that's very clear with what you see with Uber 105 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:17,800 Speaker 1: and Uber is stepped up to say, and the Airbnb 106 00:05:17,920 --> 00:05:19,880 Speaker 1: two to their credit if you're implicated in any of 107 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:22,279 Speaker 1: these lawsuits will defend you. So we'll see if that 108 00:05:22,320 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 1: actually happens. Michael Tobin, it's a great story. Thank you 109 00:05:24,839 --> 00:05:27,400 Speaker 1: so much for coming on to talk about it. Meanwhile, 110 00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 1: another story that we continue to watch, the crypto crash 111 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:32,120 Speaker 1: has claimed another victim, this time broke A. Voyage and 112 00:05:32,240 --> 00:05:35,479 Speaker 1: Digital has filed for Chapter eleven bankruptcy protection. Now the 113 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:38,159 Speaker 1: firm sites market volatility and of course the collapse of 114 00:05:38,160 --> 00:05:40,599 Speaker 1: the all important hedge fund, and had lent money to 115 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:44,600 Speaker 1: Three Arrows Capital. Last month, Voyager had secured a five 116 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: million dollar credit line from the cryptomogul and White Knight himself, 117 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:51,560 Speaker 1: Sam mag Munfreeze. I'll meet a research Interestingly, they'll meet 118 00:05:51,560 --> 00:06:02,880 Speaker 1: a research too. Let's get out live to Sun Valley 119 00:06:02,920 --> 00:06:06,320 Speaker 1: for Alan and Co's conference Media Mobile Zeo business tycoons. 120 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:08,840 Speaker 1: They gather there are annually rope Place to say, also 121 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:13,880 Speaker 1: gathering with them and Lovelow, you've got a very special guest. Yeah, 122 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:17,240 Speaker 1: let's go from billionaires and deals to health and data. 123 00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:19,719 Speaker 1: Bring in the CEO of twenty three and me and 124 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:22,280 Speaker 1: would you hi? How are you? I'm good? How are you? 125 00:06:22,680 --> 00:06:25,280 Speaker 1: The weather is beautiful, but it's been busy. You've been 126 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:27,920 Speaker 1: coming to this conference for a long time, but you're 127 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 1: very busy generally speaking. Correct twenty three and you're coming 128 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:35,280 Speaker 1: out of the pandemic. The consumer around the world is 129 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:39,479 Speaker 1: thinking a lot about their health. How's that helped you people? 130 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:42,080 Speaker 1: You know, it's interesting with COVID, it was the first 131 00:06:42,080 --> 00:06:44,520 Speaker 1: time when we would publish articles that that would actually 132 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 1: drive sales. So COVID definitely spurred people to be hyper 133 00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:52,880 Speaker 1: aware of health, definitely interested in what's going on. And 134 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:55,680 Speaker 1: three me definitely saw a bump that people were interested 135 00:06:55,720 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: in the research that we were doing. And people are 136 00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:01,839 Speaker 1: definitely interested in health. And as we enter this second 137 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:06,919 Speaker 1: half and economies are opening and many people are double 138 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:10,640 Speaker 1: vaccinated boosted, are they still coming to you? What is 139 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:14,400 Speaker 1: their consciousness about health data? I think people come to 140 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 1: twenty three and me there's there's you know, clearly half 141 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:20,160 Speaker 1: of our customers come for ancestry and then another half 142 00:07:20,200 --> 00:07:23,120 Speaker 1: definitely are very interested in the idea that they're empowered 143 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 1: to take care of themselves and they're empowered with information 144 00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:29,520 Speaker 1: about prevention. And I think people have learned with the pandemic. 145 00:07:29,560 --> 00:07:31,440 Speaker 1: There's like obviously like we think about mass when we 146 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 1: think about vaccines, like all of that ties in with 147 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:36,200 Speaker 1: the world of prevention. So suddenly being able to tie 148 00:07:36,200 --> 00:07:39,000 Speaker 1: that as well with saying type two diabetes, are there 149 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 1: things that you can actually do to prevent it? Are 150 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:44,200 Speaker 1: there actions that you can take? So lifestyle environment, I 151 00:07:44,200 --> 00:07:46,480 Speaker 1: think it all wraps in. People definitely start to think 152 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:48,640 Speaker 1: about that more and more. What can they do to 153 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:51,840 Speaker 1: just be healthier in general. There's about Spasics twenty three 154 00:07:51,840 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 1: and me just run through what it is you offer 155 00:07:53,760 --> 00:07:57,000 Speaker 1: and how it works three me. It's it's incredibly simple. 156 00:07:57,040 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 1: You spin in a tube, we collect your DNA, and 157 00:08:00,920 --> 00:08:03,480 Speaker 1: we help you interpret your DNA. And we're different than 158 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:05,360 Speaker 1: all the other companies out there, and that we never 159 00:08:05,400 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 1: said we're just ancestry, we're just health We really wanted 160 00:08:09,000 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 1: to have this holistic vision of like we're about you 161 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:15,840 Speaker 1: and understanding your DNA and DNA is fascinating, like you 162 00:08:15,880 --> 00:08:18,280 Speaker 1: share it with all this life around us. You and 163 00:08:18,320 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 1: I are ninety nine point you know, five percent the same. 164 00:08:21,640 --> 00:08:23,560 Speaker 1: So how is it can we understand the DNA to 165 00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:26,760 Speaker 1: understand why we're different? Some people, you know are introvert, 166 00:08:26,840 --> 00:08:28,920 Speaker 1: Some people are extroverts. Some people love you know, our 167 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 1: high risk for type you diabetes, some people are not. 168 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:35,200 Speaker 1: Um how can we actually understand how the DNA influences 169 00:08:35,240 --> 00:08:37,560 Speaker 1: all of that? So we return near ances to results 170 00:08:37,559 --> 00:08:40,200 Speaker 1: to people, and we return health results to people, and 171 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:44,640 Speaker 1: we engage them with their own personal DNA. How many 172 00:08:44,640 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 1: of these kits are you selling and where are they 173 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:49,520 Speaker 1: doing best? Is it here in the United States? Is 174 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:52,120 Speaker 1: it in other markets? Where is their most engagement? We're 175 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:55,400 Speaker 1: focused mostly on the US right now. UM. We also 176 00:08:55,440 --> 00:08:57,680 Speaker 1: sell in the UK, we sell in Canada, we sell 177 00:08:57,720 --> 00:09:00,560 Speaker 1: in sixty six countries, but we don't sell health everywhere. 178 00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:03,280 Speaker 1: Health is still highly regulated and most of the world, 179 00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:07,360 Speaker 1: so it's mostly in the US. UM we have you know, 180 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:10,080 Speaker 1: we still see we see good update from our customers 181 00:09:10,080 --> 00:09:13,720 Speaker 1: that are really interested in again both understanding ancestry and 182 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 1: understanding health. And what's interesting is that there's a real 183 00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:19,600 Speaker 1: tie in of like most people can relate and say like, Okay, 184 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:22,080 Speaker 1: if you're of Jewish descent or if you're of African descent, 185 00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:25,520 Speaker 1: you're potentially at higher risk for certain conditions. So there's 186 00:09:25,559 --> 00:09:28,280 Speaker 1: a real tie in between the ancestry and what your 187 00:09:28,280 --> 00:09:33,719 Speaker 1: health predispositions are. You made an interesting acquisition Lemonade telehealth. 188 00:09:33,760 --> 00:09:37,839 Speaker 1: It was another kind of big pandemic era ticket. Yeah, 189 00:09:37,880 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 1: how has that gone for you? The reason why we 190 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:43,760 Speaker 1: bought Lemonade is very different than why other groups got into, 191 00:09:44,600 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 1: you know, telehealth. It's not because we wanted to get 192 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 1: into urgent care and you know strep throats in the 193 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:53,520 Speaker 1: whole telemedicine craze. But rather, we saw suddenly this opportunity 194 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:57,760 Speaker 1: that people are comfortable talking to their clinicians online and 195 00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:02,720 Speaker 1: that frankly, most clinicians are not trained on genomic medicine, 196 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:05,079 Speaker 1: meaning that if you go and you get your genetic 197 00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: results for Alzheimer's or chronic kidney disease or other conditions, 198 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:13,840 Speaker 1: most physicians today are not trained on what to do 199 00:10:13,920 --> 00:10:16,840 Speaker 1: with that. And so twenty three and me, by acquiring Lemonade, 200 00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:20,480 Speaker 1: now has the opportunity to offer the full stack, meaning 201 00:10:20,520 --> 00:10:23,280 Speaker 1: that I can give you access to a direct to 202 00:10:23,360 --> 00:10:27,160 Speaker 1: consumer approved FDA cleared test. I can get you your 203 00:10:27,200 --> 00:10:30,920 Speaker 1: genetic information, and now I can actually provide clinicians who 204 00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:35,120 Speaker 1: are trained on genetic information and a pharmacy that is 205 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:39,120 Speaker 1: also trained on how your genetics interplay with medications. So 206 00:10:39,160 --> 00:10:42,280 Speaker 1: I can offer now that full service too of our customers. 207 00:10:42,920 --> 00:10:46,480 Speaker 1: That was a successful acquisition, it's been missing. I mean, 208 00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:50,840 Speaker 1: you out there looking for similar opportunities to build out 209 00:10:50,960 --> 00:10:53,360 Speaker 1: the twenty three and me offering well. Acquisitions take a 210 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:55,040 Speaker 1: lot of time to integrate, so I would say the 211 00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:57,880 Speaker 1: first step is like is the integration, but then really 212 00:10:57,920 --> 00:11:01,640 Speaker 1: be able to start to train missions um and provide 213 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:04,320 Speaker 1: those to our customers and provide that full package. Like 214 00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:07,840 Speaker 1: people today still don't necessarily know what to do with 215 00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 1: all their genetic information. So there's a whole process for 216 00:11:10,720 --> 00:11:14,280 Speaker 1: us of educating our customers like we're gonna we're gonna 217 00:11:14,280 --> 00:11:16,959 Speaker 1: give you healthcare providers now who can help you actually 218 00:11:17,280 --> 00:11:20,440 Speaker 1: understand how do you actually potentially translate that into your life, 219 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:22,640 Speaker 1: and lots of ways that we can actually leverage the 220 00:11:22,720 --> 00:11:26,640 Speaker 1: service to help you encourage behavior change. You're the CEO 221 00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:31,640 Speaker 1: of a publicly traded company. Now healthcare is important for 222 00:11:31,679 --> 00:11:36,680 Speaker 1: consumers that we're in a challenging inflationary environment, and we've 223 00:11:36,679 --> 00:11:38,319 Speaker 1: been having a lot of discussions in the last twenty 224 00:11:38,360 --> 00:11:42,320 Speaker 1: four hours about where does the consumer stop spending. Do 225 00:11:42,360 --> 00:11:46,640 Speaker 1: you think that the consumer will continue to assign importance 226 00:11:46,679 --> 00:11:51,240 Speaker 1: to spending on healthcare data monitoring metrics or is that 227 00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:54,600 Speaker 1: something that there's a risk that consumer spending slows down. 228 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:57,520 Speaker 1: I think I think there's a couple of interesting trends. 229 00:11:57,559 --> 00:12:00,000 Speaker 1: So I think first off is people are really frustrated 230 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,880 Speaker 1: aided with a lack of transparency and healthcare, the surprise bills, 231 00:12:04,440 --> 00:12:07,040 Speaker 1: and I think that there's definitely an encouragement people want 232 00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 1: to have more control. And I think one thing that 233 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:11,600 Speaker 1: twenty three and ME has really led on is being 234 00:12:11,640 --> 00:12:15,040 Speaker 1: a low cost provider of information and making it really 235 00:12:15,080 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 1: affordable and accessible. So I think more and more there's 236 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:20,480 Speaker 1: going to be a trend where people want to be 237 00:12:20,559 --> 00:12:23,600 Speaker 1: in control, they want to know exactly what they're paying for, 238 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:25,240 Speaker 1: and they want to be able to know that they're 239 00:12:25,280 --> 00:12:29,199 Speaker 1: actually getting a reasonably priced service. So I think that 240 00:12:29,280 --> 00:12:32,400 Speaker 1: twenty three ME, at our current price for a health 241 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:35,720 Speaker 1: and answerstree kit, it's in that range of reasonable for people. 242 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:40,880 Speaker 1: What is the energy. He big picture outlook for the 243 00:12:40,880 --> 00:12:43,320 Speaker 1: rest of this year and beyond, well for this year 244 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:45,280 Speaker 1: and beyond. I mean I look at I focus on beyond. 245 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:47,240 Speaker 1: So for me, I've always been very much focused on 246 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:49,160 Speaker 1: the long term vision. And the long term vision is 247 00:12:49,200 --> 00:12:52,200 Speaker 1: a totally different type of healthcare system that is frankly 248 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:56,719 Speaker 1: about your best interest. Today's healthcare system makes money when 249 00:12:56,760 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 1: you are sick and you go into the system, and 250 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:02,160 Speaker 1: so I've all has been focused on a self pay, 251 00:13:02,280 --> 00:13:05,600 Speaker 1: direct a consumer model because my relationship is directly with you. 252 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:08,440 Speaker 1: How is it that I can win as a company 253 00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:10,440 Speaker 1: and you can win as an individual if I can 254 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:13,080 Speaker 1: keep you healthier? So I really look at a world 255 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:16,320 Speaker 1: how do I actually empower you to be healthy? At 256 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:18,000 Speaker 1: a hundred? How do I empower you to be as 257 00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:20,960 Speaker 1: healthy as you possibly can and not actually get sick? 258 00:13:21,000 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 1: To begin with final question very quickly, do you think 259 00:13:23,960 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 1: twenty three and me is seen as a potential partner 260 00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:28,840 Speaker 1: from a big for a bigger health care system or 261 00:13:28,880 --> 00:13:32,160 Speaker 1: even a potential acquisition that have you ever thought about 262 00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:36,360 Speaker 1: doing that? I think now that we've acquired lemonade Um 263 00:13:36,400 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 1: and the focus that we have on genomic medicine and 264 00:13:38,640 --> 00:13:41,199 Speaker 1: the delivery delivery of medicine. I think that twenty three 265 00:13:41,200 --> 00:13:43,680 Speaker 1: and Me could play a really important role in helping 266 00:13:43,760 --> 00:13:47,160 Speaker 1: bridge consumers who actually have their genetic information with the 267 00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:50,280 Speaker 1: rest of the medical world and how they're operating, and 268 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:53,400 Speaker 1: start to bridge that genomic divide, like help people actually 269 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:56,280 Speaker 1: understand what is this information, how to use it in 270 00:13:56,360 --> 00:13:58,320 Speaker 1: a clinical setting as well as how to use it 271 00:13:58,320 --> 00:14:01,319 Speaker 1: in a lifestyle setting. Right, three and C and mujiki, 272 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:04,560 Speaker 1: It's not just billionaires and deals, it's health and data 273 00:14:04,880 --> 00:14:07,920 Speaker 1: as well. Caroline back to you in New York. She 274 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 1: might well be a million billionaire. We'll have to check 275 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:13,319 Speaker 1: the Blombo billionaire's list. But what a wonderful interview, what 276 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:16,120 Speaker 1: a fascinating CEO and majiki they're trying through me and 277 00:14:16,160 --> 00:14:18,160 Speaker 1: our own ed Ludlow. We'll be back in Some Valley 278 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:21,520 Speaker 1: on Thursday live with event Right CEO Kevin Hart's Don Gavern, 279 00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:24,840 Speaker 1: Major League Soccer Commissioner. Make sure you tune in at 280 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 1: five pm Eastern two pm Pacific. Coming out door dash 281 00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:31,560 Speaker 1: shares draw up after competitor grub hub struck a deal 282 00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:35,200 Speaker 1: with Amazon. Our grub Hub will have easy access to 283 00:14:35,240 --> 00:14:57,520 Speaker 1: Amazon's broad consumer base. That's next as a Broomberg. Apple's 284 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:00,600 Speaker 1: latest mapchips have shaken up the personal computer or industry, 285 00:15:00,960 --> 00:15:03,880 Speaker 1: driving sales of Apple's map books and imax and pushing 286 00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:07,040 Speaker 1: rivals to search for new solutions. In just the last 287 00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:09,440 Speaker 1: year and a half, Apple has output the M one 288 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 1: to the M one Ultra, to the M two and 289 00:15:11,920 --> 00:15:14,640 Speaker 1: over the next year, I expect new M two Pro 290 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:17,960 Speaker 1: and Max chips, as well as the first M three chips. 291 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:20,520 Speaker 1: But all of this has taken a toll on Apple's 292 00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:24,080 Speaker 1: chip efforts for its other products. Case in point two, 293 00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:27,360 Speaker 1: of Apple's most popular devices, the iPhone and the Apple Watch, 294 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:30,320 Speaker 1: will not be getting their typical big chip upgrades this year. 295 00:15:31,040 --> 00:15:33,760 Speaker 1: For the first time since Apple began designing its own 296 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:37,480 Speaker 1: iPhone processors, the base iPhone four team models won't be 297 00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:40,200 Speaker 1: getting an all new chip. Those phones will stick to 298 00:15:40,240 --> 00:15:44,080 Speaker 1: the eight fifteen from the iPhone thirteen instead. Only the 299 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 1: more expensive iPhone fourteen Pro line will get a faster 300 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 1: A sixteen processor. Similarly, for the first time in its 301 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:53,000 Speaker 1: own history, the Apple Watch will be sticking to the 302 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:56,240 Speaker 1: same processor technology for the third year in a row. Well, 303 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 1: the Series eight will get an ESS eight chip. The 304 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:00,960 Speaker 1: processor will be on par with the S six chip 305 00:16:01,120 --> 00:16:05,600 Speaker 1: from the Series six. Apple has also been facing hurdles 306 00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:08,480 Speaker 1: with the development of its first cellular modem, with test 307 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:12,320 Speaker 1: versions of the component facing overheating issues. I don't expect 308 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 1: an Apple modem to arrive until at the earliest. I 309 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:19,440 Speaker 1: believe all of these issues are in part the result 310 00:16:19,520 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 1: of Apple's chip department being spread too thin, as well 311 00:16:22,640 --> 00:16:25,520 Speaker 1: as a new focus on the Mac. It's also, of course, 312 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:28,640 Speaker 1: due to industry wide battlenecks like the chip shortage, which 313 00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:31,320 Speaker 1: is leading to higher prices, as well as rising shipment 314 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:35,720 Speaker 1: costs and t SMC. Apple's manufacturing partner is also not 315 00:16:35,800 --> 00:16:39,120 Speaker 1: without blame due to its somewhat rocky transition to new 316 00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:43,600 Speaker 1: three nimeter processor technology. I'm Mark German. This is power 317 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:50,160 Speaker 1: on thanks to putting gum and then don't forget sign 318 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:54,240 Speaker 1: up from max weekly power on news dot com. Now 319 00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:55,920 Speaker 1: I'm still got Amazon because it's stuck a deal to 320 00:16:55,960 --> 00:16:59,040 Speaker 1: take up of grub hub and it will say will 321 00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:01,440 Speaker 1: offer it's primary is in the US in one year 322 00:17:01,480 --> 00:17:03,840 Speaker 1: membership to the feed delivery service. Now. Clubhub is owned 323 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:06,800 Speaker 1: by the Dutch company Just Eat Takeaway, which announced plans 324 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:09,080 Speaker 1: to find an investor or bitter for the US business 325 00:17:09,080 --> 00:17:11,680 Speaker 1: in April and he's saying new meg intelligence some place 326 00:17:11,720 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 1: to say it's here to tell us why why did 327 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:18,840 Speaker 1: Amazon want to get into the delivery service? Well, the 328 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:22,280 Speaker 1: lines are clearly blurring between what Amazon is doing in 329 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:25,360 Speaker 1: terms of last smile delivery versus what these companies are 330 00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:28,280 Speaker 1: doing in terms of food delivery and grocery delivery. And 331 00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:31,400 Speaker 1: I think Amazon used them as a threat. And for Amazon, 332 00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:34,520 Speaker 1: it's an easy way for them to you know, partner 333 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:37,840 Speaker 1: with grubhub, which has been losing share, but it does 334 00:17:37,920 --> 00:17:41,159 Speaker 1: have a good, you know, customer base in cities and 335 00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:44,120 Speaker 1: urban areas, so it is also a way for them 336 00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:46,840 Speaker 1: to segment the market. They did a similar partnership at 337 00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:50,200 Speaker 1: Delivery in the UK, so they're really targeting that high 338 00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:54,440 Speaker 1: end users that grubbub has, albeit its losing share, but 339 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 1: I think that's the play here. And then over time 340 00:17:57,280 --> 00:18:00,159 Speaker 1: they want to bundle everything. You know, they already have 341 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:03,359 Speaker 1: music video, well at one more service and their prime 342 00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:08,280 Speaker 1: subscription becomes something that customers can do with that. Why 343 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:11,640 Speaker 1: go to the high end is certainly for me delivery 344 00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:14,719 Speaker 1: it started by really doing the top end restaurants, then 345 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:16,720 Speaker 1: went a little bit lower but it is the high 346 00:18:16,840 --> 00:18:18,720 Speaker 1: end by more recession proof in the moment, is that 347 00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:23,080 Speaker 1: the idea, yes, And and also they have higher repeat purchases, 348 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:25,800 Speaker 1: so you know, when when you talk about subscriptions in 349 00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:29,000 Speaker 1: this business, it's all about frequency and how can you 350 00:18:29,280 --> 00:18:32,640 Speaker 1: have the customer you know, order more kind of more 351 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:36,000 Speaker 1: times than they would have done otherwise. So in this case, 352 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:38,920 Speaker 1: I think the other problem that I see for door 353 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:41,760 Speaker 1: Dash and Uber is they charge a take rate based 354 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:46,080 Speaker 1: on the basket size or you know, Amazon can say, okay, 355 00:18:46,119 --> 00:18:48,879 Speaker 1: we'll give you a flat fee. Yes, it doesn't matter 356 00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:51,440 Speaker 1: in terms of you know, how many times you order, 357 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:54,679 Speaker 1: and that could be very disruptive to the business model 358 00:18:54,840 --> 00:18:57,800 Speaker 1: of Uber and door Dash. I mean they're already struggling 359 00:18:57,800 --> 00:19:01,280 Speaker 1: with profitability. If this was to come, I think that 360 00:19:01,359 --> 00:19:03,800 Speaker 1: would be a big pressure on on their take rates. 361 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:05,399 Speaker 1: Talked to us about the structure of the deal and 362 00:19:05,440 --> 00:19:08,080 Speaker 1: about their option basically to eventually own the full assets 363 00:19:08,119 --> 00:19:11,280 Speaker 1: that they wish. I think Amazon in this environment can't 364 00:19:11,440 --> 00:19:14,400 Speaker 1: make a big acquisition. They already bought MGM, they bought 365 00:19:14,440 --> 00:19:17,520 Speaker 1: Whole Foods, but now I think the regulatory environment is 366 00:19:17,520 --> 00:19:21,080 Speaker 1: more challenging. Even the delivery partnership went through intense deal 367 00:19:21,119 --> 00:19:24,879 Speaker 1: scrutiny and so my hunches. You know, even though they 368 00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:28,480 Speaker 1: would have gotten this asset very cheap. I mean, just 369 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 1: he paid seven point five billion for groub Hub. It 370 00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:35,159 Speaker 1: will be substantially marked down in this environment. But I 371 00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:38,920 Speaker 1: think for Amazon, they really think partnership is one way 372 00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:41,880 Speaker 1: for them to gain you know, access to grow hub 373 00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:44,200 Speaker 1: customer base, and they can do everything that they would 374 00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:46,960 Speaker 1: have done if they had acquired the asset, So makes sense. 375 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:49,320 Speaker 1: In general, we can see more consolidation in the space. 376 00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:51,240 Speaker 1: I think when you're talking about the pricing structure as 377 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:54,480 Speaker 1: thinking of my instacat bills and how much I'm assessing 378 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 1: how much you know, I get added on from me 379 00:19:57,080 --> 00:20:00,520 Speaker 1: just walking into a store. Are we seeing more insolidation 380 00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:02,399 Speaker 1: likely in the space in general, Well, there will be 381 00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:04,720 Speaker 1: a lot of pressure, right So if you're getting into 382 00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:08,399 Speaker 1: a slow economic environment where customers are pulling back on spending, 383 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:10,760 Speaker 1: there are just too many subscriptions out there that a 384 00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:14,040 Speaker 1: customer has and they have to pay back on what 385 00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:17,040 Speaker 1: is a discretionary versus what is not, and that will 386 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:21,119 Speaker 1: be a catalyst for you know, consolidation because order growth 387 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:25,520 Speaker 1: will slow down substantially. Remember they're up against COVID comps 388 00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:28,719 Speaker 1: georda Ash and Uber grew triple digit order volume growth 389 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:31,199 Speaker 1: and and so those comps are very tough, and that 390 00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:34,160 Speaker 1: would be a catalyst for install Card and the smaller 391 00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:36,080 Speaker 1: guys to give in and say, okay, we need to 392 00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:38,639 Speaker 1: partner with a Walmart or a Target or you know 393 00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:42,320 Speaker 1: one of the big retailers out there. Man saying always 394 00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:52,760 Speaker 1: say small, bling back intelligence, great analysis. As always, this 395 00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:55,480 Speaker 1: is bag technology. I'm Caroline Hide in New York. She 396 00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:58,800 Speaker 1: has a ribban surging. On Wednesday, the electric vehicle maker, 397 00:20:58,840 --> 00:21:02,320 Speaker 1: reaffirming it's in port auction. Target revealed the production accelerated, 398 00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:04,960 Speaker 1: in fact in the second quarter. Riven still on track 399 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:08,480 Speaker 1: to produce twenty five tho units this year. Bloomberg's and Ludlow, well, 400 00:21:08,520 --> 00:21:10,280 Speaker 1: we're never going to let him relax over there in 401 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:12,040 Speaker 1: some valley, and we're going to keep you on top 402 00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:13,760 Speaker 1: of all the ev news. As we know you love it, 403 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:17,600 Speaker 1: ed and you know this is a market like market reaction. 404 00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:21,320 Speaker 1: Why because they are making progress. You know, they've produced 405 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 1: twenty vehicles approximately in the first quarter. They've jumped to 406 00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:28,280 Speaker 1: fort hundred in the second quarter. You know, this is 407 00:21:28,359 --> 00:21:32,159 Speaker 1: about a production ramps. You remember, Caroline two thousand and eighteen, 408 00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:35,000 Speaker 1: how kind of micro focused we were on Tesla and 409 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:38,000 Speaker 1: the production hell and Rivian is showing that it is 410 00:21:38,119 --> 00:21:41,760 Speaker 1: making progress, and the street basically looking at that and saying, okay, 411 00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:45,760 Speaker 1: we believe you. The vehicles is possible this year. And look, 412 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:48,360 Speaker 1: I know I'm in some valley, but guess who else 413 00:21:48,480 --> 00:21:52,440 Speaker 1: is in something? J Scaringe, Rivian CEO, may already said 414 00:21:52,480 --> 00:21:55,840 Speaker 1: hello to him, so you know, it's kind of interesting 415 00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:58,000 Speaker 1: for him to be here, but this is certainly a 416 00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:00,880 Speaker 1: company now heading in the right direction in factory at least, 417 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:03,520 Speaker 1: so he said hello. Did he say anything that he did? 418 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:06,879 Speaker 1: You know, Garrange is an interesting guy. You know. A 419 00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:08,960 Speaker 1: lot of sources tell me that he is often the 420 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,679 Speaker 1: smartest person in the room, but he comes across as 421 00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:15,440 Speaker 1: incredibly humble. It's an interesting one because Allen and co 422 00:22:15,640 --> 00:22:19,360 Speaker 1: hosts a tech media and telecoms conference, and you wouldn't 423 00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:22,399 Speaker 1: think the automotive really fits into that. He's not the 424 00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:26,240 Speaker 1: only automotive executive here. Of course, Mary Barra, the GM CEO, 425 00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:28,560 Speaker 1: is also here. But I said, what are you going 426 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:30,680 Speaker 1: to be talking about? And I think you know, for 427 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:32,760 Speaker 1: them it's a little bit of a victory lap. They 428 00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:34,359 Speaker 1: did the sixth biggest I, P O and U S 429 00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:37,359 Speaker 1: history in November. The stock has been under immense pressure since, 430 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 1: but they are still kind of the Golden company with 431 00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:42,560 Speaker 1: some serious Wall Street backing. Okay, so where do they 432 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:44,720 Speaker 1: go from here? Then? Ed, they're ambitious, and I think 433 00:22:44,760 --> 00:22:46,960 Speaker 1: this has been part of the Street's concerned that they 434 00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:50,720 Speaker 1: talk about being able to ramp production at that Illinois 435 00:22:50,800 --> 00:22:54,600 Speaker 1: facility not just to this year, but to a hundred thousand, 436 00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:57,360 Speaker 1: then a hundred and fifty thousand units annually. They plan 437 00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:00,400 Speaker 1: to break ground on a factory in Georgia very soon 438 00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:04,160 Speaker 1: that could build four hundred thousand units annually and they're 439 00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:06,520 Speaker 1: going to start production on that. So they have a 440 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:09,600 Speaker 1: lot going in fifteen billion dollars approximately on the balance sheet. 441 00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:12,199 Speaker 1: It's really about the month by month and quarter by 442 00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:15,720 Speaker 1: quarter execution. That's what the streets laser focused on. Beautiful head, 443 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:19,480 Speaker 1: We thank you, stay well. Meanwhile, raising venture capital isn't 444 00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 1: as easy for startups and turning out to be challenging year, 445 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:26,280 Speaker 1: say the very least, there's a recession potentially looms over 446 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:29,720 Speaker 1: the economy. Founders are thinking a smarter ways to secure money. 447 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:32,200 Speaker 1: Joining us now to discuss all this from M thirteen 448 00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:35,600 Speaker 1: is the managing partner, Carl Alama, and it's great to 449 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:37,639 Speaker 1: have some time with you, Carl, and just talk to us. 450 00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:40,120 Speaker 1: We're just hearing about, you know, companies that recently went 451 00:23:40,200 --> 00:23:42,080 Speaker 1: public and the strain that they've been under from a 452 00:23:42,119 --> 00:23:45,320 Speaker 1: public perspective. In the private market, how are you seeing 453 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:48,520 Speaker 1: valuations and how are you seeing a willingness of founders 454 00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:50,680 Speaker 1: to want to raise in this sort of environment. Yeah, 455 00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:53,959 Speaker 1: it's a very interesting time for sure in venture capital. 456 00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:57,520 Speaker 1: I think the whole problems everything that's happening in the 457 00:23:57,560 --> 00:24:00,880 Speaker 1: public markets, it is really kind of cacheting back into 458 00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:03,200 Speaker 1: the private markets. At the end of the day, we 459 00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:05,120 Speaker 1: all invest in these companies because we want to see 460 00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:07,480 Speaker 1: them go public, want to see them grow and create 461 00:24:07,520 --> 00:24:10,440 Speaker 1: great valuations. And when there's so much uncertainty in the 462 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:14,040 Speaker 1: multiples and how to value these businesses, brigaches back from 463 00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:16,840 Speaker 1: the late stage investors who are holding off, waiting for 464 00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:20,320 Speaker 1: the market to settle and find its bottom back through 465 00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:23,440 Speaker 1: the earlier stage investors like ourselves, who ultimately want to 466 00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 1: make sure we're invest in companies that can get later 467 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:30,000 Speaker 1: stage funding. I mean you've invested in Bird, Butnova's allocate. 468 00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:33,040 Speaker 1: I mean, we all know daily harvest headspace, many people 469 00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:35,320 Speaker 1: using that in this current environment at the moment. Lift 470 00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:39,879 Speaker 1: You're no stranger also to navigating companies during downturns, the 471 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:42,520 Speaker 1: Great Financial Crisis two thousand and eight, and they're on 472 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:45,920 Speaker 1: what's different this time? If anything? Yeah, it's interesting. I've 473 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:48,320 Speaker 1: actually I was an operator before I was an investor. 474 00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 1: I had a company back in the late nineties that 475 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,720 Speaker 1: I was able to exit through the bubble bust of 476 00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:56,000 Speaker 1: two thousand and had a fintech company in two thousand 477 00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:58,720 Speaker 1: and eight that we navigated through. We eventually were able 478 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:01,680 Speaker 1: to exit in two thousand and and so, Uh, definitely 479 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:06,120 Speaker 1: went through these challenges myself. I think that every every 480 00:25:06,160 --> 00:25:09,359 Speaker 1: economic downturn is different in its own right. Uh, this 481 00:25:09,800 --> 00:25:12,800 Speaker 1: downturn is you know, a lot of people, there's a 482 00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:15,720 Speaker 1: lot of conjecture about what's driving it, but ultimately there's 483 00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:18,640 Speaker 1: a lot of international activity going on that's driving inflation, 484 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:20,800 Speaker 1: that's driving some of these things that are really scaring 485 00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:23,960 Speaker 1: the you know, the market. The one big difference is 486 00:25:24,600 --> 00:25:27,600 Speaker 1: um whereas in two thousand and eight, really money just 487 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:30,399 Speaker 1: dried up. I think the situation we have today is 488 00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:32,760 Speaker 1: there is a lot of money sitting on the sidelines. 489 00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:36,919 Speaker 1: The money hasn't dried up. I think the market volatility 490 00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:40,639 Speaker 1: has created nervousness and created caution on the part of 491 00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:43,399 Speaker 1: the investors themselves, and so that money is going to 492 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:46,159 Speaker 1: have to come back to work. Uh, these funds, these 493 00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:48,800 Speaker 1: later stage funds and investors have to put that money 494 00:25:48,840 --> 00:25:51,600 Speaker 1: to work within a certain predetermined period of time. And 495 00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:54,880 Speaker 1: so really as the market really finds its bottom, there's 496 00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 1: a lot of money ready to come back in. So 497 00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:59,560 Speaker 1: we actually are very very positive and hopeful about the 498 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:02,639 Speaker 1: future are um and the opportunity for these companies to 499 00:26:03,480 --> 00:26:06,639 Speaker 1: raise money in the future. But the period between here 500 00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:09,560 Speaker 1: and there is really the unknown. You were, of course, 501 00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:12,280 Speaker 1: as he said, in fintech and one key fintech name 502 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:15,080 Speaker 1: pin up of where you and I originally helm from 503 00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:20,080 Speaker 1: in Europe corner, I mean huge downgrade in terms of 504 00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:24,200 Speaker 1: its overall market valuation. How did as a previous leader 505 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:26,239 Speaker 1: of businesses in this time, how do you ensure they 506 00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:28,480 Speaker 1: were able to weather these storms? Have these companies raised 507 00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:32,240 Speaker 1: enough previously? If they're not, how they're also helping their employees? Well, 508 00:26:32,280 --> 00:26:36,560 Speaker 1: who kind of wanted a liquidity moment. Yeah, that's a 509 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:40,680 Speaker 1: it's an interesting question. You you have to consider the 510 00:26:40,760 --> 00:26:43,280 Speaker 1: amount of capital you have, your ability to run. I 511 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:45,399 Speaker 1: think you know, the companies that have a lot of 512 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,080 Speaker 1: capital on the balance sheet, whether they're private or whether 513 00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:51,520 Speaker 1: they're public, are the highest potential to see through this time. 514 00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:54,240 Speaker 1: If you do think of it as a prefixed period 515 00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:56,440 Speaker 1: of time, really just have to manage the business through it, 516 00:26:56,960 --> 00:26:58,960 Speaker 1: and once you get through the other end, hopefully the 517 00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:01,200 Speaker 1: market begins to turn you begin to see the benefits 518 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,680 Speaker 1: of the building and running a solid business. But your 519 00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:08,359 Speaker 1: question about employees are so important, especially in the earlier stage. 520 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:11,480 Speaker 1: You know where in this market as well, where there's 521 00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:14,720 Speaker 1: very low unemployment, employees do have a lot of options 522 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:16,719 Speaker 1: to think about moving around and think about the things 523 00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:18,960 Speaker 1: they want to do. A lot of companies are thinking 524 00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:22,920 Speaker 1: about layoffs and some kind of tightening on their earnings potential. 525 00:27:23,440 --> 00:27:26,520 Speaker 1: And the one really really important thing is to keep 526 00:27:26,600 --> 00:27:29,800 Speaker 1: your best performers and to motivate them. So one thing 527 00:27:29,880 --> 00:27:31,760 Speaker 1: we really speak to our CEO is about is just 528 00:27:31,920 --> 00:27:35,000 Speaker 1: how to really deliver that vision, bring them along for 529 00:27:35,080 --> 00:27:37,920 Speaker 1: the ride. Make sure everybody realizes that you know, these 530 00:27:38,000 --> 00:27:42,240 Speaker 1: businesses aren't changing. It's just that they vision is something 531 00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:44,360 Speaker 1: that they have to be much more efficient about achieving, 532 00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:47,480 Speaker 1: and so bringing the best team along with you and 533 00:27:47,560 --> 00:27:49,680 Speaker 1: making sure they're motivated to see through the end of 534 00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:53,879 Speaker 1: that journey is incredibly important. Camp companies as give us 535 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:57,520 Speaker 1: your assessment of the overall econ economy and recessionists that 536 00:27:57,600 --> 00:27:59,760 Speaker 1: you see, because the companies that you have fun and 537 00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:02,639 Speaker 1: in a pass are sort of very discretionary names tonal 538 00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:05,439 Speaker 1: of course, the likes of Headspace and Lift and Daily Harvest, 539 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:08,320 Speaker 1: all of these things are kind of well treats. Really, 540 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:10,600 Speaker 1: if you're thinking of those that don't have all the 541 00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:14,200 Speaker 1: cash washing about, do you worry that they are going 542 00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:16,880 Speaker 1: to have a tougher time as people are pulling back 543 00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:21,159 Speaker 1: slightly on their purse strings to a degree, Yes, I 544 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:23,520 Speaker 1: mean you're talking about really the latest stage businesses. Some 545 00:28:23,600 --> 00:28:25,879 Speaker 1: of these have already edited, of course, so they're are 546 00:28:25,920 --> 00:28:28,240 Speaker 1: really in up portfolio any longer. So we don't really 547 00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:31,240 Speaker 1: you know, we we realize our benefit at the exit point, 548 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:33,040 Speaker 1: whether it's an EM and a transaction or an I 549 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:36,720 Speaker 1: p O, so we don't necessarily maintain our ownership through 550 00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:40,120 Speaker 1: you know, the public status of the business um those 551 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,200 Speaker 1: public companies across the border, tech companies across the border 552 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:48,680 Speaker 1: obviously suffering massive compression of their valuations, and realistically, when 553 00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:51,360 Speaker 1: you see the multiples and the evaluations that were in 554 00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,520 Speaker 1: place last year, they were probably unrealistically large. So have 555 00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:58,760 Speaker 1: they overcompressed. Probably if they've overcompressed, then there's opportunity for 556 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:01,840 Speaker 1: growth again once they at bottom. And that's really as 557 00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:05,440 Speaker 1: an as an investor in my personal private or public 558 00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:08,840 Speaker 1: portfolio of my own, you know, it's really about for 559 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 1: me waiting it out and allowing these good companies that 560 00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:14,840 Speaker 1: have good fundamentals see through the downturn and begin to 561 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:17,920 Speaker 1: get recognized for their value again. Car, So it's great 562 00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:20,440 Speaker 1: to catch up with you when you have such portfolio 563 00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:23,480 Speaker 1: as yours and then exited and ones that remain, of course, 564 00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:26,400 Speaker 1: the companies that you still wait for that exit to occur. 565 00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:29,520 Speaker 1: Carl Anama really wiser words coming from the managing partner 566 00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:32,560 Speaker 1: of M thirteen handle weather this particular storm. Another story 567 00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:36,240 Speaker 1: will continue to watch. Walmart, talking of or consumer discretionary, 568 00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:39,360 Speaker 1: reportedly told some supplies they need that new fuel and 569 00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:41,440 Speaker 1: pickup fees are coming. According to The Wall Street Journal, 570 00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:44,400 Speaker 1: the giant retailer will charge companies that use Walmart to 571 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:47,160 Speaker 1: transport goods to its stores and warehouses. Some are Walnuts 572 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:50,800 Speaker 1: Walmarts competitors such as Amazon have already imposed similar fees 573 00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:54,320 Speaker 1: this year coming up in the wake of rapid pandemic 574 00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:57,760 Speaker 1: related gaming industry growth. Convoy Ventures so now saying a 575 00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:00,800 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty million dollar fund. But how much of 576 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:04,400 Speaker 1: that is being allocated to the blockchain gaming we'll discuss. 577 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:20,680 Speaker 1: There's a Blomberg so crypto the space in what we 578 00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:24,120 Speaker 1: call a winter industry. So I'm saying crisis, But what 579 00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:27,440 Speaker 1: about the underlying technology? What about in the space for gaming? 580 00:30:27,520 --> 00:30:31,000 Speaker 1: Convoy Ventures is seeing potential. The gaming focused VC firm 581 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:33,360 Speaker 1: has raised a hundred fifty million dollars for a new fund, 582 00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:36,760 Speaker 1: which will include investments in blockchain games. Joining us now, 583 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:40,600 Speaker 1: Josh Chapman, managing partner at Convoy Ventures. How is the 584 00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:44,600 Speaker 1: gaming space going to ride this out? Do you think? Josh? Absolutely? 585 00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:46,200 Speaker 1: And thank you for having me, Caroline, thank you for 586 00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:49,200 Speaker 1: having me on the show. Um. Blockchain gaming space is 587 00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:52,880 Speaker 1: going to thrive during this next period of macroeconomic cycle 588 00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:56,120 Speaker 1: for a couple of reasons. One is blockchain gaming rises 589 00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:59,200 Speaker 1: on the back of the gaming industry, which already has 590 00:30:59,320 --> 00:31:02,480 Speaker 1: three billion avers worldwide. Uh, the average age is thirty 591 00:31:02,520 --> 00:31:06,480 Speaker 1: six years old. Um, you know gamers or women, and 592 00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:08,719 Speaker 1: this has to become a global industry. You know, over 593 00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:11,480 Speaker 1: the last five to ten years, you're seeing about a 594 00:31:11,560 --> 00:31:15,960 Speaker 1: hundred million people joined the gaming industry in general. On 595 00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:18,880 Speaker 1: the back of that, there has been technological innovation in 596 00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:22,400 Speaker 1: gaming for decades, ever since the nineteen seventies when the 597 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:26,480 Speaker 1: gaming industry really really started with blockchaining gaming specifically, you're 598 00:31:26,520 --> 00:31:29,640 Speaker 1: looking at an industry that's basically bringing two primary things 599 00:31:29,760 --> 00:31:33,320 Speaker 1: to the gaming industry. One is business model innovation, which 600 00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:35,320 Speaker 1: I can dig into a little bit more, and second 601 00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:39,160 Speaker 1: is the digital asset ownership of the consumer. And those 602 00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:41,800 Speaker 1: two trends are going to drive a success of blockchain 603 00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:44,200 Speaker 1: gaming for the next decade. Now, I don't want to 604 00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:46,000 Speaker 1: say that all of your investments are in any way 605 00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:48,720 Speaker 1: blockchain related and only partially and any partially this one 606 00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,280 Speaker 1: will go into it. But you have got some big names, 607 00:31:51,320 --> 00:31:53,320 Speaker 1: and of course sky Maybos would have been the real 608 00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:56,640 Speaker 1: pin up, but that's become a kind of controversial game 609 00:31:56,680 --> 00:31:59,400 Speaker 1: to be associated with Acts Infinity, just because of the 610 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:02,160 Speaker 1: way in which well suddenly they've moved away in this 611 00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:05,160 Speaker 1: pay play to earn kind of model. How do you 612 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:08,280 Speaker 1: see the space evolving and and why is it so controversial? 613 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:11,400 Speaker 1: Do you think, you know, I don't see it as 614 00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:14,520 Speaker 1: a very controversial thing. I would actually pivot that more 615 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:17,720 Speaker 1: to what they're doing is truly quite innovative and that 616 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,440 Speaker 1: sometimes sees resistance in the gaming industry. And so when 617 00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:24,040 Speaker 1: you look at the success of Skymavis, you're looking at 618 00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:26,640 Speaker 1: a team that has been incredibly ambitious and really pushed 619 00:32:26,680 --> 00:32:29,640 Speaker 1: gaming to ex limits by saying, when you play, you 620 00:32:29,760 --> 00:32:32,320 Speaker 1: can earn this in game token thing that you could 621 00:32:32,360 --> 00:32:35,480 Speaker 1: actually trade on external exchanges. Hence why there is a 622 00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:39,040 Speaker 1: token attached to the Skymavis platform. We have been thrilled 623 00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:42,040 Speaker 1: with how the Skymavis team has navigated, especially the last 624 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,920 Speaker 1: six months and different challenges. They have done a great 625 00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:47,560 Speaker 1: job at reopening the bridge. The founders and the company 626 00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:49,840 Speaker 1: really took ownership of a lot of the things that 627 00:32:50,040 --> 00:32:52,560 Speaker 1: kind of went down, and uh, they've really done a 628 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:56,000 Speaker 1: great job navigating navigating this period. But what's been most 629 00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:58,800 Speaker 1: controversial that you're kind of getting at is the fact 630 00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:03,560 Speaker 1: that should playtime be rewarded with financial rewards and the 631 00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 1: idea is actually not that novel, because people have been 632 00:33:06,520 --> 00:33:10,040 Speaker 1: gifted things in games for decades, through cosmetic items, through 633 00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:14,480 Speaker 1: gift boxes, through perks, through discounts. What we're talking about 634 00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:18,040 Speaker 1: is that the blockchain ecosystem in general has brought this 635 00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:23,800 Speaker 1: token financial uh personal ownership to the gaming industry, and 636 00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:26,480 Speaker 1: the two combined has actually been quite powerful. And so 637 00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:29,960 Speaker 1: the sky maybe this is truly one of the most successful, 638 00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:34,040 Speaker 1: is not the most successful blockchain centric platform on the planet, 639 00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:36,680 Speaker 1: and we just happened to be fortunate enough to be 640 00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:40,240 Speaker 1: an investor in this amazing team. Of course, actually Infinity 641 00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:42,800 Speaker 1: also suffered a hack. I'm now reporting that it was 642 00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:46,320 Speaker 1: related to a particular tap part of the talent looking 643 00:33:46,320 --> 00:33:49,360 Speaker 1: at the LinkedIn ad and we're looking too those reports 644 00:33:49,400 --> 00:33:51,960 Speaker 1: as to how on earth had happened. But of course, 645 00:33:52,000 --> 00:33:54,600 Speaker 1: when we suffer hacks like this, you, as a backer 646 00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:57,120 Speaker 1: of the company, should you be there is a sort 647 00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:00,000 Speaker 1: of money of last resorts, some sort of bailout options. 648 00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:04,120 Speaker 1: Absolutely well, I can't get into that specifically about how 649 00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:05,720 Speaker 1: that went down, but I can tell you that the 650 00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:09,279 Speaker 1: bridge has been reopened and fully funded, and I can 651 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:12,000 Speaker 1: also say that we're super impressed with how the team 652 00:34:12,040 --> 00:34:14,359 Speaker 1: at their own expense, and how the company balanced you got, 653 00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:17,680 Speaker 1: its own expense, came forward to protect the community from 654 00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:20,840 Speaker 1: having to take that hit. Right. That hack was you know, 655 00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:24,520 Speaker 1: an unfortunate event, but the team and the company really 656 00:34:24,560 --> 00:34:27,000 Speaker 1: stepped up to own that. When it comes to the investors, 657 00:34:27,040 --> 00:34:29,440 Speaker 1: of course, we're incentivized for the success of this company, 658 00:34:29,480 --> 00:34:31,640 Speaker 1: and so we'll continue to be in their corner. I 659 00:34:31,680 --> 00:34:34,040 Speaker 1: obviously can't get into the exact details on how that 660 00:34:34,239 --> 00:34:37,799 Speaker 1: bridge was kind of plugged in gas, but um, they 661 00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:40,919 Speaker 1: really navigated it incredibly well, and as an investor, we're 662 00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:42,960 Speaker 1: thrilled to continue to be in their corner and support 663 00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:46,440 Speaker 1: them publicly on on on publications like this as well 664 00:34:46,520 --> 00:34:49,279 Speaker 1: as you know, privately in border remedience with them. So 665 00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:53,240 Speaker 1: what kind of other gaming startups there for are pushing 666 00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:56,160 Speaker 1: the envelope, being innovative, using new ways in which to 667 00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:58,640 Speaker 1: use the blockchain as the underlying technology, but also n 668 00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:01,279 Speaker 1: f T s and ways in which to real hold. Yeah, 669 00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:03,200 Speaker 1: so you're seeing a lot of things that we get 670 00:35:03,239 --> 00:35:06,919 Speaker 1: excited about. The convoys were really specialists on investing into 671 00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:09,840 Speaker 1: the technology and platforms and infrastructure for the future of 672 00:35:09,920 --> 00:35:13,800 Speaker 1: the video gaming industry. That technology and infrastructure side on 673 00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:16,040 Speaker 1: the platform stuff that we look at of you know, 674 00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:18,960 Speaker 1: the next Discord, the next Twitch, the next roadblocks. Those 675 00:35:19,000 --> 00:35:20,880 Speaker 1: kind of companies are what we're trying to invest in 676 00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:23,759 Speaker 1: at the early stage at Seeds Series A UM. The 677 00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:27,239 Speaker 1: type of technology the blockchain brings is really things around UH, 678 00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:31,360 Speaker 1: digital asset ownership, digital identities UM and a new business model. 679 00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:33,160 Speaker 1: That alludes to this a little bit earlier, but the 680 00:35:33,239 --> 00:35:36,640 Speaker 1: business model innovation that blockchain brings to gaming is going 681 00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:38,960 Speaker 1: to be, in our view as big as the rise 682 00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:41,880 Speaker 1: of the free to play gaming business model that emerged 683 00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:44,720 Speaker 1: in the late two thousands. The free to play business 684 00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:48,840 Speaker 1: model UM brought in about fifty to eighty billion of 685 00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:51,160 Speaker 1: value to the gaming industry, which is now valued that 686 00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:54,640 Speaker 1: over two billion. We think blockchain gaming, with the rise 687 00:35:54,719 --> 00:35:59,080 Speaker 1: of a marketplace business model that allows for the transfer 688 00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:03,880 Speaker 1: of transactions automatically without having to rely on counterparties, is 689 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:06,640 Speaker 1: a very powerful technology that the gaming industry is going 690 00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:10,560 Speaker 1: to absolutely take advantage of and integrate into Web two. 691 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:12,360 Speaker 1: I think you're going to also see a lot of 692 00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:15,200 Speaker 1: gaming companies not necessarily go the I C O round, 693 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,960 Speaker 1: but they will incorporate some type of n F t 694 00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:21,440 Speaker 1: revenue component to what they're doing. We think this can 695 00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:25,000 Speaker 1: be incredibly powerful and it's already proving to generate billions 696 00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:28,000 Speaker 1: of dollars already in the last twelve d eighteen months. 697 00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:31,759 Speaker 1: Chess Chapman, managing partner of Convoy Ventures, thinking about the 698 00:36:31,840 --> 00:36:33,759 Speaker 1: new ways in which companies will raise funds as well 699 00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:35,759 Speaker 1: as the ways in which they'll continue to develop me 700 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:47,279 Speaker 1: thank you so much. China accusing the US of technological 701 00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:50,360 Speaker 1: terrorism and it's pushed to stop a SML and Nicon 702 00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:53,480 Speaker 1: from setting key chip making technology to the country. Now 703 00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:56,360 Speaker 1: joining US now as the man who helped break that scoop, 704 00:36:56,600 --> 00:36:59,600 Speaker 1: Eric Martin, And it really is interesting about how the 705 00:36:59,719 --> 00:37:02,879 Speaker 1: US is leaning on SML calls the Dutch equipment maker 706 00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:07,040 Speaker 1: and Japanese make an econ as well, China responding pretty 707 00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,960 Speaker 1: aggressively to it. That's right, Caroline. But we've seen is 708 00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:14,480 Speaker 1: China rejecting the pressure that the US is putting on 709 00:37:15,000 --> 00:37:19,759 Speaker 1: a SML as well as on Nikon of Japan. But 710 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:23,600 Speaker 1: a SML having by far the biggest market share of 711 00:37:23,719 --> 00:37:28,360 Speaker 1: this technology. D you v deep ultra violet lithography that 712 00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:31,359 Speaker 1: etching equipment for chips, I can't tell you how much 713 00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:35,880 Speaker 1: I had to look into that sort of technology when 714 00:37:35,880 --> 00:37:37,840 Speaker 1: I used to report on s MLS numbers and some 715 00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:41,080 Speaker 1: of the other European equipment makers. What do you think 716 00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:43,920 Speaker 1: China could do? In response, what do you what about 717 00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:46,320 Speaker 1: their own innovation within the country to be able to 718 00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:50,680 Speaker 1: develop such such equipment. Well, we've certainly seen efforts by 719 00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:56,040 Speaker 1: the Chinese to develop their own uh DUV equipment. To date, 720 00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:58,200 Speaker 1: they haven't had a whole lot of success with it. 721 00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:02,960 Speaker 1: A SML remains the by and large, the sole provider 722 00:38:03,160 --> 00:38:06,120 Speaker 1: of d u V to China, and these are not 723 00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:11,399 Speaker 1: the most advanced etching etching equipment. This is the kind 724 00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:14,600 Speaker 1: of next The second generation is slightly older generation that 725 00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:18,040 Speaker 1: we're talking about, but still the most commonly used in 726 00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:21,400 Speaker 1: in this industry. And so this is something that the 727 00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:25,600 Speaker 1: Chinese definitely have a desire to to steal a march 728 00:38:25,800 --> 00:38:30,280 Speaker 1: on the advanced countries uh the you know, rich countries 729 00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:33,239 Speaker 1: they are selling and making this equipment, but that they 730 00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:36,640 Speaker 1: have thus far not been very successful in that effort. 731 00:38:37,160 --> 00:38:39,560 Speaker 1: So when the US realizes this is the way it 732 00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:43,560 Speaker 1: can really applied pressure from a technological standpoint, do you 733 00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:46,400 Speaker 1: think it will bear fruit? I know, asked this previously, 734 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:49,960 Speaker 1: But have we had any further from nikon from a 735 00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:52,680 Speaker 1: SML as to whether they are willing to respond. Well, 736 00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,680 Speaker 1: we understand is that a s mL so far has 737 00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:59,239 Speaker 1: not gone along with UH and has objected to the 738 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:03,480 Speaker 1: U s push on the Netherlands for SML to be 739 00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:06,080 Speaker 1: cut off from these kinds of sales. UH. You know 740 00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:09,280 Speaker 1: they're feeling is that, UH, that this is not something 741 00:39:09,400 --> 00:39:12,280 Speaker 1: that the you know, that the US should be should 742 00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:16,320 Speaker 1: be doing. UM. But we've seen a broad US push 743 00:39:16,719 --> 00:39:19,839 Speaker 1: on China UH and on Smike and some of these 744 00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:25,200 Speaker 1: chip producers in China, and it's something that the Bureau 745 00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:28,800 Speaker 1: of Industry and Security is you know, on a daily 746 00:39:28,840 --> 00:39:32,240 Speaker 1: basis looking at in terms of trying to stop China 747 00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:35,800 Speaker 1: from matching or overtaking the US and this kind of 748 00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:39,680 Speaker 1: technology on the on the national security concern. Next thing 749 00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:42,960 Speaker 1: you're looking for, Eric, well, whether a SML you know, 750 00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:46,560 Speaker 1: eventually does go along with this or whether you know, 751 00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:50,319 Speaker 1: more more aptolutely if the government of the Netherlands goes 752 00:39:50,360 --> 00:39:52,759 Speaker 1: along with this with blocking the sale of this kind 753 00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:55,400 Speaker 1: of technology, because this is a real choke point for 754 00:39:55,560 --> 00:39:58,960 Speaker 1: China's chip industry and something that could really hamstring China 755 00:39:59,040 --> 00:40:02,440 Speaker 1: going forward, Eric Martin, with all the scoops, we thank you. 756 00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:05,680 Speaker 1: We look forward to how that story continues to progress. Meanwhile, 757 00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:07,920 Speaker 1: that does it for this addition of Blow Big Technology tomorrow, 758 00:40:08,160 --> 00:40:10,439 Speaker 1: Well we're back in some valley event, right. CEO Kevin 759 00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:14,319 Speaker 1: Harts do GABA Major League Soccer Commissioner Football we call 760 00:40:14,360 --> 00:40:17,000 Speaker 1: it really If you're British, make sure they tune in 761 00:40:17,080 --> 00:40:19,440 Speaker 1: five pm Eastern, two pm Pacific, and don't forget to 762 00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:21,600 Speaker 1: check out our podcast. You can find it on the 763 00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:24,840 Speaker 1: terminal as well as online on Apple, Spotify. An i 764 00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:27,680 Speaker 1: heeart from New York. This is Bloomberg