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Speaker 1: I was in this world of startups. I had made

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Speaker 1: my way up from an intern to then being a

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Speaker 1: community manager, to then starting the sales team with the CEO.

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Speaker 1: And as things began to grow and grow and grow,

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Speaker 1: and as I began to accrue more and more power,

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Speaker 1: do you become lost? You're in this sunken place to

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Speaker 1: a certain extent, not saying this happens to everyone, but

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Speaker 1: in an environment like the one that I was in,

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Speaker 1: an environment like the one that this character down is in.

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Speaker 1: The question isn't how would you change? The question is

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Speaker 1: how wouldn't you would? And that is Mateo a scareport

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Speaker 1: on Naked talking about the life of compromise in a

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Speaker 1: fictional way. But I'm pretty sure you guys will enjoy

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Speaker 1: this book, and more importantly, you'll enjoy him. A Naked

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Speaker 1: that's coming up in just a few moments is the

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Speaker 1: greatest sports and in the same can make you Chepi

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Speaker 1: and they carry Chappie a champion. They car with Chappi

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Speaker 1: and Chappi and they care with Champion. They care with Hey, everybody,

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Speaker 1: thank you for hanging out with us. I hope you

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Speaker 1: enjoyed Don lemon uh. Last week, Don has a new

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Speaker 1: morning show. I love to always promote it. Don has

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Speaker 1: a new morning show on CNN, And I know you

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Speaker 1: guys are thinking, I don't watch CNN, but this is

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Speaker 1: this is a breath of fresh air. It's a fun

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Speaker 1: don Don Lemon that I knew before he had to

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Speaker 1: be so serious and talk politics. But you're gonna enjoy.

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Speaker 1: You're gonna enjoy his new morning show, his new co host,

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Speaker 1: Hoppy Harlow all good things. So tune in and make

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Speaker 1: sure you support him. Meanwhile, like updates, updates, updates, Your

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Speaker 1: girl is always, you know, figuring out ways to tie

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Speaker 1: in guest with with life stories. Um and this week's

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Speaker 1: guest Matteo New York Times best selling author black Buck.

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Speaker 1: Have you guys read the book. It's it's fiction and

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Speaker 1: there are parts loosely based on Matteo a scareports life.

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Speaker 1: Look at that name, right, I did it. Yeah, I'm

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Speaker 1: proud of myself. Uh. There are parts of the book

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Speaker 1: that are based on his life, right, But it's a

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Speaker 1: it's fiction. But it's oftentimes when we say art imitates reality.

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Speaker 1: It is definitely one of those moments. He writes about

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Speaker 1: a young man by the name of Darren who goes

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Speaker 1: from working at Starbucks to quote unquote trying to live

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Speaker 1: the dream and work in a startup tech company, and

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Speaker 1: he finds himself really quickly compromising in a lot of ways.

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Speaker 1: And so I want to live on that word compromise.

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Speaker 1: I think that, and I'm speaking from my own experience.

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Speaker 1: I was a local news reporter for very many years,

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Speaker 1: probably like six years before I got the opportunity to

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Speaker 1: to go play with the big boys at ESPN, and

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Speaker 1: at the time, I didn't know what that meant for

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Speaker 1: me in terms of what that would do for a

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Speaker 1: profile or a platform. But I did know that it

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Speaker 1: is an opportunity to do what I loved on a

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Speaker 1: bigger stage. I didn't know. I did not know, honestly

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Speaker 1: did not know what that meant. And pretty quickly I

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Speaker 1: became very familiar with the culture of ESPN, which was

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Speaker 1: very much like a cult in a lot of ways.

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Speaker 1: And I had access, and I had privilege, and I

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Speaker 1: had resources that I had never had before. Not simply

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Speaker 1: referring to getting paid well, because I wasn't getting paid

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Speaker 1: well in the beginning, but it was Oh I worked

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Speaker 1: for ESPN. I wasn't carry champion anymore. I was carry

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Speaker 1: Champion who worked at ESPN. That was my name. My

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Speaker 1: first name was Carry Champion, my last name was who

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Speaker 1: worked for ESPN or who works for ESPN rather, And

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Speaker 1: what happens is is that you lose your identity and

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Speaker 1: you begin to compromise in small ways. Right you don't

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Speaker 1: even know you're doing it, But in small ways, you

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Speaker 1: ignore uh certain colleagues who say things that could be

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Speaker 1: considered racist or offensive. You do things that you wouldn't

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Speaker 1: normally do because you know it really is against who

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Speaker 1: you are as a person in your spirit, doesn't feel right,

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Speaker 1: but you do it anyway for the sake of TV,

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Speaker 1: or for the sake of saving your platform or getting

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Speaker 1: along with the more popular people. There's just a lot

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Speaker 1: of compromise, and you don't even realize that you're compromising

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Speaker 1: because you're in the flow. You are living this life.

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Speaker 1: And I only use that as an example because in

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Speaker 1: this book, black Buck, he is he being. Matteo writes

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Speaker 1: about a fictional character named Darren who was at Starbucks

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Speaker 1: and somehow one of the people who came in as

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Speaker 1: a customer really liked his salesman like quality and said,

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Speaker 1: come work for me at this tech startup and he

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Speaker 1: realizes quickly that he likes what it feels like to

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Speaker 1: have a little money, to have a little access, to

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Speaker 1: have a little privilege, and lo, behold, he has really

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Speaker 1: sold his soul. He's dancing with demons and devils and

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Speaker 1: compromising and ways in which he didn't really understand until

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Speaker 1: he understood. And for me, it's important to highlight this

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Speaker 1: book because it is a constant reminder of what happens

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Speaker 1: to us every new opportunity we get, especially for black folks,

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Speaker 1: because we really get to create in our world with

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Speaker 1: our people, we often have to seek their approval, whoever

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Speaker 1: they may be in this In this particular case, it's

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Speaker 1: the white man's approval, and that's usually what it is.

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Speaker 1: We have to get their approval. We have to get

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Speaker 1: their acceptance in order to get the American dream, in

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Speaker 1: order to live the life that we think we want

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Speaker 1: to live. And it it's a proposed that I have

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Speaker 1: Mateo on this week as I embark again on yet

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Speaker 1: another adventure. It's interesting I'm starting on my new show.

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Speaker 1: It's called The Carey Championshow God Dish shout out the

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Speaker 1: collage DJ callt or colleage, depending on when you talk

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Speaker 1: to him. Um, So I'm getting my new show and

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Speaker 1: it's going to be on Amazon, and it will be

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Speaker 1: something new for me. But I can't get caught up

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Speaker 1: with the platform. And I'm saying I'm telling you this

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Speaker 1: in real time, like as I'm thinking about it in

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Speaker 1: real time. I have to say true to who I am.

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Speaker 1: I have to be authentic, and I can't compromise to

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Speaker 1: make other people feel comfortable on this platform. I don't

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Speaker 1: know what that means for me. I don't know what

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Speaker 1: that looks like. But there will be those times while

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Speaker 1: I'll have to make tough decisions and tough choices, whether

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Speaker 1: it be do I cover this story, do I really

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Speaker 1: speak true to what I feel about this person? Do

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Speaker 1: I do what is expected of me? Or do I

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Speaker 1: do what is true to me? That's the question we

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Speaker 1: ask ourselves often. And as I sit and talk to

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Speaker 1: my tale today, I'm grateful that his energy, I mean,

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Speaker 1: his energy is at ten and his authenticity is even higher.

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Speaker 1: And I appreciate where he lives. He lives at an

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Speaker 1: intersection where he is very true to himself and and

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Speaker 1: it's almost like that's the only way I'm gonna be.

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Speaker 1: I will never not change that's who I am, and

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Speaker 1: I love it because right now that's how he feels.

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Speaker 1: And that's not to say he will change, but it

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Speaker 1: is interesting what happens when you get acts us and

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Speaker 1: resources and people have expectations of you if you start

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Speaker 1: to compromise in little ways because you don't want to

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Speaker 1: lose it all. People hate to lose it all. I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna tell you something. I say this all my friends,

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Speaker 1: people who make a little bit of change and have

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Speaker 1: a little bit of access and a little bit of

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Speaker 1: resources get real comfortable. And you never want to go

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Speaker 1: back to being broke. You don't even know what broke is.

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Speaker 1: You're like, I don't remember being broke. I went broke.

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Speaker 1: I'm real comfortable being comfortable. I don't even know what

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Speaker 1: broke is right now. And because you never want to

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Speaker 1: go back to a life that you live that you

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Speaker 1: think was less than oftentimes people do compromise. His book

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Speaker 1: Black but Out, New York Times bestseller, and we begin

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Speaker 1: with him telling me a story about how he went

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Speaker 1: on the Today's Show. He has now been I guess,

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Speaker 1: accepted in that echosystem because that they like him. They

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Speaker 1: like how he speaks, they like how he presents on television,

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Speaker 1: and so he was tasked with acknowledging new and upcoming writers.

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Speaker 1: He's become an authority if he will. And that's the

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Speaker 1: access that we talked about, the resources that we talked about,

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Speaker 1: and how do you stay true to yourself? Sit back, relax,

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Speaker 1: enjoy this edition of Naked. I was I was on

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Speaker 1: the Today Show yesterday with your homie Craig. I love Craig.

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Speaker 1: What did he he? So? I was there with him,

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Speaker 1: Al Roker, all these people, and I said, Craig, I

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Speaker 1: did some research on Naked with Carret Champion And I said,

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Speaker 1: I saw you were on there and he said, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was so uh. I knew that you had had

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Speaker 1: a great conversation. Oh really, what did he say nice

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Speaker 1: things about me? Because you know, Craig be trying to

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Speaker 1: act like we didn't. We all go back, back, back back.

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Speaker 1: He we were really just started talking about his book.

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Speaker 1: And you know they're slick. You're you're in TV, so

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Speaker 1: you know what it is. We were talking and then

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Speaker 1: I heard some guy in front of us being like fifteen.

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Speaker 1: I said, what, Oh, you didn't know you were coming

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Speaker 1: back for TV. Craig and all of them are talking

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Speaker 1: and then I hear homies say five, and I said,

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Speaker 1: are we about to go live? And then at one

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Speaker 1: we were in it, but Craig and all of them

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Speaker 1: were just talking mad normal. Well, yeah, because they do

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Speaker 1: it every morning for four hours, and you're like, wait,

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Speaker 1: it's in my time. We that's so wrong, huh. Now

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Speaker 1: we had. We had a good time though. It was

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Speaker 1: really like an incredible segment. I was happy with how

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Speaker 1: it went, and Craig and all of them were were

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Speaker 1: the best host So just prep me for this for

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Speaker 1: prime time with you. Yeah, exactly. I'm actually gonna have

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Speaker 1: you on my show show too. But can I can

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Speaker 1: I ask you a question? Mateo is here with us, Mateo,

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Speaker 1: I want to make sure I'm pronounced your name correctly.

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Speaker 1: Pronounce it for me, scrapor a scar of por. Mateo

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Speaker 1: is scared and what's the what's the origin? So my

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Speaker 1: mom's from Jamaica and my dad's from Iran. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's different. Are you carry I love it? Yep, Carrie Champion,

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Speaker 1: but it looks like Cary I I respond to either.

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Speaker 1: I don't take it personal. I'm not. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: That doesn't bother me either way, talk to me about

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Speaker 1: and it's funny that you mentioned the Today Show. Let's

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Speaker 1: start there, so so talk to me about that experience.

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Speaker 1: How do you get the phone call and who said

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Speaker 1: we want you on the Today Show. You're the most

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Speaker 1: amazing writer. Now it wasn't like that. So we have

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Speaker 1: at this point, um a relationship because last year Jenna

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Speaker 1: bush Hager picked me for the Read with Jenna book

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Speaker 1: Club on the Today Show, and because we were in

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Speaker 1: the pandemic, we did a virtual interview and that was

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Speaker 1: wild for me. Back then, I had like an iPhone six,

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Speaker 1: so I'm in my apartment trying to get the WiFi

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Speaker 1: right and I was like, please don't render me pixelated. Um,

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Speaker 1: And we had a great conversation and then we did

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Speaker 1: an i G Live conversation. So from there, I guess

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Speaker 1: they liked what they saw and I was in their ecosystem.

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Speaker 1: And a few months later they asked if I would

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Speaker 1: be a surprised guest for these incredible booksellers from New

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Speaker 1: Jersey and they wanted to me to surprise them with

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Speaker 1: saying that I'm going to give them some copies of

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Speaker 1: my book, and so you know, I'll do you one better.

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Speaker 1: Gonna give him a hundred copies, but I'll also do

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Speaker 1: an event with them in person. So we surprised them,

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Speaker 1: had a great, great segment, and then months later I

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Speaker 1: found myself two hours from Brooklyn to New Brunswick, New

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Speaker 1: Jersey to show up and and do this event and

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Speaker 1: there was a ton of love. And then maybe a

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Speaker 1: month or so ago, the producer reached out saying that

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Speaker 1: they'd like to know if I would go on air

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Speaker 1: in person to recommend books. And for me, part of

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Speaker 1: my personal mandate, aside from putting other would be writers

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Speaker 1: on and sharing information, is to help lift up my peers.

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Speaker 1: So I said, say less, got to read and put

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Speaker 1: a list together. There was a lot of that TV

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Speaker 1: back and forth that you're extremely familiar with, and uh,

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Speaker 1: we had a blast. I I appreciate that. So tell

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Speaker 1: me why was it a blast? Give me your experience

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Speaker 1: from And this is interesting because I have you on

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Speaker 1: my podcast. I know what it goes into. I know

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Speaker 1: what it takes to interview someone. The preparation a lot

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Speaker 1: of times though, especially when you're in that kind of

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Speaker 1: environment you're on TV for hours, it's automatic and you

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Speaker 1: know what questions to ask automatically. You just know what

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Speaker 1: too you feel. You listen, you figure it out. But

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Speaker 1: on the other end, talk to me about your preparation

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Speaker 1: for the today's show. You know what this This tells

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Speaker 1: me that I'm talking to the right person because you

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Speaker 1: use the P word. You know. I had a lot

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Speaker 1: of people reach out and say, men, you were a natural,

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Speaker 1: and I said, understand that I practiced a bit. You know,

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Speaker 1: I thought about what I was going to say. Um.

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Speaker 1: I studied some of the previous segments where they bring

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Speaker 1: up writers, and they only have three and a half

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Speaker 1: to four and a half minutes. So I knew I

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Speaker 1: had to be succinct. Um. I was there not in

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Speaker 1: service of myself, but in service of the book. So

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Speaker 1: I wanted to do right by them. So, yes, I

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Speaker 1: I looked at previous segments. UM I put together my

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Speaker 1: own notes of what I wanted to say, of what

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Speaker 1: would reach the viewers and not only excite them to

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Speaker 1: get them to buy these folks books. Um me, naturally,

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Speaker 1: I'm a charismatic person. I'm a positive person. I'd like

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Speaker 1: to have fun. Um, but there needs to be a balance, right,

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Speaker 1: So I said, not gonna just go up there and

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Speaker 1: you know, cut it up with all of them and

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Speaker 1: you know, just like just like UH, have a have

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Speaker 1: a festive time. There was gonna be some of that,

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Speaker 1: but there had to be a lot of substance that

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Speaker 1: I was that I was giving out in terms of

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Speaker 1: these books. So I say it was an incredible time

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Speaker 1: that we had a blast because I was very taken

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Speaker 1: care of. You know, I went there. Um, they sent

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Speaker 1: me a car, which for me, I live in Brooklyn,

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Speaker 1: and I don't live in uh this part where there's

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Speaker 1: there's million dollar homes around, like old homes owned by

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Speaker 1: black folks, and like, you know, Brooklyn, this part of

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Speaker 1: where I'm at, and that's nice, but there's also like,

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Speaker 1: you know, a men shelter right next to me. So

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Speaker 1: for me, I woke up and I looked down my

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Speaker 1: window and there was an escalade and I was like,

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Speaker 1: this looks a little this looks I was like, this

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Speaker 1: looks a little out of place. Um, and I hop

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Speaker 1: in and and me and and the man who was

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Speaker 1: who was driving. We had a great conversation. And I

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Speaker 1: get there and you know how it is like they

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Speaker 1: have someone that's there to greet you. The welcome is

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Speaker 1: very warm, bringing you around and bring you to the

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Speaker 1: green room. For me, what was surprising even though I

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Speaker 1: I had been to Rockefeller Center before, but I was

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Speaker 1: really only outside doing some anniversary for Read with Jenna,

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Speaker 1: where myself and other Read with Jenna picks were packing

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Speaker 1: boxes for libraries around the country. But I've never been

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Speaker 1: in there in the studio. So it's like they bring

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Speaker 1: me into the green room. There's other people and there

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Speaker 1: I don't really know them. They don't really know me.

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Speaker 1: I'm just watching the show. And then I have to

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Speaker 1: go to the bathroom. You have to let me out

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Speaker 1: of the green room and buzz me into another room

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Speaker 1: and it's like you gotta walk through this metal detector.

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Speaker 1: And I said to one of the people and there,

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Speaker 1: I said, brother, this is just like the Pentagon. He said,

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Speaker 1: you don't even know and uh. Then you know. People

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Speaker 1: that I had conversed with only via email came in

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Speaker 1: and we had a great conversation. People who had seen

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Speaker 1: my segment before that helped facilitate that came in and

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Speaker 1: then it was showtime. And showtime for me was they

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Speaker 1: brought me in to get miked up, and then the

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Speaker 1: producers telling me like, yo, you're about to do in

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Speaker 1: teaser in two minutes, so we're gonna sit you down

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Speaker 1: and wave these books around. So I sit down and

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Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, what's your name? You know, I'm here

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Speaker 1: to have like many connections with people. What I'm saying,

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Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying, you know my name, And just

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Speaker 1: like out of out of respect, him like what's your name?

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Speaker 1: And he's like, oh, you know Yusuf. I believe he

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Speaker 1: says his name was, And I was like, bet, thank

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Speaker 1: you Yusuf. So I sit down, I do this teaser

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Speaker 1: and then Al Roker and all of them, Chanelle, Dylan

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Speaker 1: and Craig come over after their segment and we're chopping

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Speaker 1: it up. And that's like I told, you know when

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Speaker 1: I heard the fifteen you know, thirty ten. But they

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Speaker 1: were all so warm when we first met um, and

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Speaker 1: I was extremely grateful because I knew Al had read

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Speaker 1: my book, but Craig had as well, and it just

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Speaker 1: meant a lot that, you know, it resonated with them

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Speaker 1: so deeply. And then we had our time up there

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Speaker 1: and talking about being in the moment right so I

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Speaker 1: had practiced. Um, you might know a little bit about

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Speaker 1: my book. It's based on a young black man. He's

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Speaker 1: working in sales. You know, all white New York City

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Speaker 1: tech star, he loses himself, he hopefully redeems himself. It's

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Speaker 1: partially based on my experience where I was in sales.

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Speaker 1: I was spitting on the phones NonStop and then rose

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Speaker 1: up in this organization. So I know what it means

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Speaker 1: to be in this moment when the lights are shining

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Speaker 1: on you, or when you're talking to a prospect live

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Speaker 1: and you have to rely on muscle memory. So I've

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Speaker 1: done enough work where the muscle memory kicked in. But

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Speaker 1: there were things going down during those five minutes, Like

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Speaker 1: before we started, I asked the woman next to me,

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Speaker 1: Um Dylan, I said, where do I look. She's like,

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna be looking straight on. I said, okay, So

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Speaker 1: I'm in there. I'm looking straight on while the segments going,

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Speaker 1: and I see Chanelle across from me, mouth, look at us,

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Speaker 1: look at us. She mouthed it to me. So then

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Speaker 1: I just started to look at them, and then I

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Speaker 1: felt whenever they wanted me to move on to the

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Speaker 1: next book, there was a gentle nudge, like bet tell

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Speaker 1: us about that one, tell us about that one. So

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Speaker 1: we were working together. It was a dance, and when

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Speaker 1: it ended, you know, we were laughing. I hugged out

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Speaker 1: Broker and Chanelle said, you know, I didn't know if

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Speaker 1: I was gonna mess up your flow, but you took

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Speaker 1: the note and adjusted immediately, And I said, thank you

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Speaker 1: for helping me. So that's why I say it was

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Speaker 1: a blast. Chanel Jones. Really that's my girl. That's my

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Speaker 1: oh are ale girl. Um, well, the business is small.

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Speaker 1: We grew up together, right, A lot of us grew

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Speaker 1: up together, and a lot of us don't know each other,

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Speaker 1: but we know each other from TV, like you know,

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Speaker 1: probably knew me from ESPN. And I have my own

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Speaker 1: show with Jamal Advice UM with and so she can.

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Speaker 1: She and I talked a lot about UM being a

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Speaker 1: disruptor in this world and and our place and how

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Speaker 1: does it look in terms of being black and our platforms,

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Speaker 1: and you can relate to that UM and I and

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Speaker 1: and by the way, there's different ways to do it.

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Speaker 1: You don't have to be Um Jamal Hill and tell

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Speaker 1: the President he's a white supremacist. You could be Carrie

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Speaker 1: Champion and you could tweet and you can, and you

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Speaker 1: can get in front of every platform and tell white

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Speaker 1: people that they need to do better. Or you could

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Speaker 1: be Chanelle and just be sitting there in your presence,

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Speaker 1: be a reminder that this is our opportunity you don't have.

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Speaker 1: There's there's so many different ways to disrupt the system

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Speaker 1: and and don't feel like you're doing more or less.

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Speaker 1: And so as I say that, you talk about Jenna

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Speaker 1: Bush picking your book, was that pandemic when she picked

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Speaker 1: your book for the book club? Yeah, it was. It

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Speaker 1: was really like towards the end of when I got

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Speaker 1: the email, not the call, and then on January my

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Speaker 1: book came out and I believe that I went on

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Speaker 1: the Today Show virtually on the sixth. Okay, so tell

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Speaker 1: everyone about your book. I'm interested in And first of all,

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Speaker 1: just tell me about your book first before I ask

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Speaker 1: you about Jenna, the Jenna experience, and guys, the only

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Speaker 1: reason why for those listening, I was so very curious

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Speaker 1: about your experience, UH doing TV, because I think often

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Speaker 1: times people who do TV forget that it is nerve

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Speaker 1: racking for those who don't do TV. And you're going

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Speaker 1: on the Today Show and you got out broker there.

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Speaker 1: Out broker by by himself is intimidating just seeing al

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Speaker 1: You're like, dude, I wrote with you, you sitting here

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Speaker 1: next to me shooting it, and I'm like, okay, that's

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Speaker 1: how you know what I mean. I get nervous when

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Speaker 1: I see Al. You know what I mean? If Al

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Speaker 1: says hey, carry, I'm like, well he knows me, you

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Speaker 1: know what I mean? So I couldn't even imagine you

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Speaker 1: know what you are feeling. So I was I was

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Speaker 1: very interested in your television experience from a different perspective.

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Speaker 1: And you're telling me they're talking to you is if

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Speaker 1: you know better, they're telling you we're doing a teaser.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, does he know what a teaser is? And

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Speaker 1: then they're not telling you which camera to look at,

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Speaker 1: and from my experience, is best not to give you

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Speaker 1: too much direction and so you can be yourself. But

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Speaker 1: I love Chanelle for for tapping you in meanwhile, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I appreciate it. I mean out put me at ease. Actually,

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Speaker 1: And and there was a an inside joke I'll say

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Speaker 1: at least on my end regarding al and and the book,

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Speaker 1: and we discussed it after the segment um. But there

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Speaker 1: was just a lot of level around, especially a lot

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Speaker 1: of love from Al and me. I'm also the type

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Speaker 1: of person where when the lights are on a rise

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Speaker 1: to the occasion. Yeah you know, yeah, yeah, you're you're

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00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:51,200
Speaker 1: you're handling. This interview is if just a well seasoned

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Speaker 1: to pro which I appreciate, which makes you a good writer.

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Speaker 1: Tell everyone about black men. So Black Book is about

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Speaker 1: a young man named Darren. He's living in bed Side, Brooklyn.

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Speaker 1: He has his loving mom, his supportive girlfriend, his best

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Speaker 1: friend in his neighborhood, and his neighborhood has him. Darren

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Speaker 1: is also working at a Starbucks in Midtown Manhattan, thirty

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Speaker 1: fourth in part to be specific, and one day this

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Speaker 1: suave white guy comes in and he says, give me

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Speaker 1: my regular, but for some reason, Darren says no and

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Speaker 1: sells them on another drink. This man, impressed, invites Darren

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Speaker 1: all the way up to the thirty six floor and

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Speaker 1: extends an invitation for Darren to join his elite sales team.

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Speaker 1: At first, Darren says no, then he reluctantly agrees, and

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Speaker 1: he soon finds out he's not the only black salesman there.

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Speaker 1: He's the only black person in the entire company. So

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Speaker 1: he goes through hell and back in order to make

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Speaker 1: it to the top. Once he's there, he has power, status, money,

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Speaker 1: but then he says, hold up, I don't want to

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Speaker 1: be the token black guy. So he launches a plan

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Speaker 1: to help other young people of color infiltrate America's tech

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Speaker 1: startup sales teams, redefining what it means to be a

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Speaker 1: minority in the workplace. Beautiful based on a true story,

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Speaker 1: he or ariants talk to me about how it went

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Speaker 1: down for you. Yeah. I hesitate to say based on

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Speaker 1: a true story because it's fiction. And that's the number

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Speaker 1: one That's the number one question people ask me around

428
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,240
Speaker 1: the world, Like I was in Paris last month, and

429
00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:16,480
Speaker 1: the first question is how much of this is real?

430
00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:20,720
Speaker 1: How much? Said yeah? I mean when we when we

431
00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:23,399
Speaker 1: first started talking, I was telling you that this is

432
00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,080
Speaker 1: pulling from my personal experience to a certain extent. Right,

433
00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:29,240
Speaker 1: I worked in sales, I lived in bed style when

434
00:21:29,240 --> 00:21:31,320
Speaker 1: I was twenty one. On my version of the come up,

435
00:21:31,520 --> 00:21:33,240
Speaker 1: you know, when I was trying to break up, break

436
00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:36,359
Speaker 1: into this world of startups. Um, I understand you know

437
00:21:36,440 --> 00:21:38,640
Speaker 1: the the aspects of growing up as a black man

438
00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:40,840
Speaker 1: in America. Of course, there was no research that had

439
00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:43,800
Speaker 1: to be done in regards to any of those, um,

440
00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:46,719
Speaker 1: but there are definitely many scenes that never happened in

441
00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:50,440
Speaker 1: my life that that yeah, of course right, And and

442
00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:52,840
Speaker 1: there there are characters who could be based on a

443
00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:57,960
Speaker 1: composite can we say loosely based, Can we say yeah,

444
00:21:58,119 --> 00:22:01,320
Speaker 1: loosely based or some experiences space What would you how

445
00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:04,160
Speaker 1: would you describe it when you when I would say

446
00:22:04,280 --> 00:22:10,000
Speaker 1: for legal purposes, it's fiction, but no, it's it's partially

447
00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:12,080
Speaker 1: inspired by my life. And and you know, carry like

448
00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:14,920
Speaker 1: when I had to when I was working with my publisher,

449
00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:17,240
Speaker 1: I had to fill out a legal questionnaire. The book

450
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:19,560
Speaker 1: is set in the same building I worked in, in

451
00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:22,679
Speaker 1: the same exact building. The the startup is on a

452
00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:25,480
Speaker 1: different floor, but there's some overlap that I did to

453
00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:27,159
Speaker 1: make it easier on myself. And then I had to

454
00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:29,560
Speaker 1: create a lot of differences between myself and the character

455
00:22:29,960 --> 00:22:33,159
Speaker 1: and my own experiences and experiences of these people in

456
00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:36,359
Speaker 1: order to distance myself, because if I was writing about

457
00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:38,919
Speaker 1: my own history blow by blow, it would have been

458
00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:41,040
Speaker 1: too close and I wouldn't have been able to write

459
00:22:41,040 --> 00:22:43,080
Speaker 1: the story that needed to be written to reach people

460
00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:45,400
Speaker 1: in the way I wanted to reach them. So when

461
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,720
Speaker 1: the book first came out, though, and people were asking

462
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:50,800
Speaker 1: me that question, I was straight up trolling them. I said,

463
00:22:50,840 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 1: you know what, it's twenty seven point three percent real,

464
00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:56,520
Speaker 1: and then another interview it's thirty nine point seven. And

465
00:22:56,560 --> 00:23:00,200
Speaker 1: then finally some man from MPR was like, Yo, don't

466
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:02,160
Speaker 1: play me like I've heard you give out these different

467
00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:04,360
Speaker 1: numbers and other interviews. How much of it is real?

468
00:23:04,720 --> 00:23:07,480
Speaker 1: And I said, I'm joking around about it because it's

469
00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:10,479
Speaker 1: hard to quantify. If you point to a page and say, MATEO,

470
00:23:10,600 --> 00:23:12,760
Speaker 1: did this happen, I can tell you yes or no.

471
00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:15,080
Speaker 1: I would be honest about it, but it's hard to

472
00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,960
Speaker 1: quantify on the whole. But what I will say is

473
00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:22,320
Speaker 1: that one of what these characters feel is our our

474
00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:24,439
Speaker 1: emotions that I have felt in my own life, and

475
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:27,240
Speaker 1: I had to mind my own emotional history in order

476
00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:30,440
Speaker 1: to imbue these characters with these emotions that would feel

477
00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:33,600
Speaker 1: real and resonate with readers. Reader, reader, Hey, everybody, don't

478
00:23:33,600 --> 00:23:35,720
Speaker 1: go anywhere. We get deeper and deeper and deeper in

479
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:37,639
Speaker 1: this conversation on the other side of the break. You know,

480
00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:39,880
Speaker 1: we talked about Kanye. We can't help but to talk

481
00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:42,800
Speaker 1: about Kanye. Uh. That's coming up on Naked You can

482
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:45,080
Speaker 1: fast forward past the commercials. Don't tell nobody I told

483
00:23:45,119 --> 00:23:46,840
Speaker 1: you to do that, I might get in trouble, but

484
00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:50,240
Speaker 1: you can do that back in the moment. Every champion

485
00:23:50,320 --> 00:23:52,439
Speaker 1: and care every champion is to be a champion, a

486
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 1: champion and carry Champion and carry Chapion. A champion and

487
00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:59,920
Speaker 1: carry Chappion and carry CHAPPI Sports and Entertaining can Naked

488
00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:10,520
Speaker 1: Worry Champion and Carrie Chappions Champion a Champion. They care

489
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:14,359
Speaker 1: with Champion, Champion, they care with Champion, They care with

490
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:21,960
Speaker 1: chap Hey, everyone, welcome back to Naked Mateo Waxing poetically

491
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:27,240
Speaker 1: turn the valume up, y'all. The story that you tell,

492
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:31,800
Speaker 1: the fictionalized story that you tell, um is overall very

493
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:35,399
Speaker 1: very real for my generation, for your generation, for the

494
00:24:35,480 --> 00:24:37,679
Speaker 1: generation behind us. The come up is a real thing

495
00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:40,560
Speaker 1: for people who who see the quote unquote American dream

496
00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:43,560
Speaker 1: and want it and and and really make deals with

497
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 1: the devil or do what it takes to to get

498
00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:51,320
Speaker 1: to a certain place. I I say this to you

499
00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:54,680
Speaker 1: as someone who did that right and and in in

500
00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:57,640
Speaker 1: many ways I'm still doing that. I worked at ESPN,

501
00:24:57,680 --> 00:24:59,160
Speaker 1: and I made a lot of deals with the devil

502
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:03,520
Speaker 1: too become known and to have a platform, a sacrifice,

503
00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:10,280
Speaker 1: my integrity, a lot of times, right, what was the takeaway?

504
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 1: Why do you think this book because I'm telling you, yes,

505
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:15,400
Speaker 1: it makes sense I hear. But why this book in particular,

506
00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:18,480
Speaker 1: why do you think it registered with so many Because,

507
00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:21,960
Speaker 1: as you said, it reflects the reality that so many

508
00:25:22,000 --> 00:25:24,960
Speaker 1: of people, so many people have experienced and are experiencing.

509
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:27,480
Speaker 1: You know a lot of people who read the book

510
00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:29,879
Speaker 1: will write to me or speak to me at events

511
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:32,720
Speaker 1: and say, it was hard for me to get through

512
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:34,879
Speaker 1: this because that was me. You know a lot of

513
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:37,080
Speaker 1: a lot of older women who say I was the

514
00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:39,440
Speaker 1: only black woman on an executive team, or I was

515
00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:42,320
Speaker 1: the only person here, the only person doing that, and

516
00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:45,159
Speaker 1: it was hard to stomach parts of your book because

517
00:25:45,440 --> 00:25:48,760
Speaker 1: it rangs so true. Um. But then on the flip side,

518
00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:51,440
Speaker 1: there people who say, you know, three weeks after the

519
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:54,160
Speaker 1: book came out, I was in tears because a young

520
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:56,679
Speaker 1: man he emailed me and he's like, you know, I'm

521
00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,200
Speaker 1: a young brother from Atlanta and for the majority of

522
00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:01,520
Speaker 1: my life, I have ever felt like someone. When I

523
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:04,160
Speaker 1: read your book, I finally felt seen and I felt

524
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,879
Speaker 1: like I was worth something, and that I mean I

525
00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:09,760
Speaker 1: was crying. I was crying, like three weeks after the

526
00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:12,879
Speaker 1: book came out from that email, so there's multiple size

527
00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:18,040
Speaker 1: to the responses. But again, what I believe has ensured

528
00:26:18,160 --> 00:26:20,200
Speaker 1: that the book is reaching that people needs to reach

529
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:21,720
Speaker 1: in the ways that it needs to reach them is

530
00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:25,000
Speaker 1: that it's just speaking so many truths. And it doesn't

531
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:29,159
Speaker 1: mean that um aspects of the scenes aren't made up,

532
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,680
Speaker 1: but the undercurrent that's flowing throughout the whole novel, from

533
00:26:31,720 --> 00:26:34,879
Speaker 1: beginning to end, is looking to reflect the reality that

534
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,560
Speaker 1: so many of us know, so many of us experienced.

535
00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:40,520
Speaker 1: So I think that to answer your question of why,

536
00:26:40,640 --> 00:26:45,399
Speaker 1: it's because people see themselves in the narrative and in

537
00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 1: some ways that's empowering. You're it's very empowering, and it's

538
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:55,000
Speaker 1: also a gut check, Um, is this the life you

539
00:26:55,080 --> 00:27:00,520
Speaker 1: want to live? Let's talk personally. Mm hm. When did

540
00:27:00,560 --> 00:27:03,400
Speaker 1: you decide that wasn't the life he wanted to live? Yeah?

541
00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 1: You know, when when you're here, Karen and you're talking

542
00:27:05,320 --> 00:27:10,480
Speaker 1: about sacrificing your integrity and making deals with the devil, um,

543
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 1: you already know I have done the same as well.

544
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:16,280
Speaker 1: You know, people people ask, Okay, where's the overlap, and

545
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:17,879
Speaker 1: and I say, you know, in the same way that

546
00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:21,440
Speaker 1: Darren lost himself. I lost myself too. Um. I was

547
00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:23,880
Speaker 1: in this world of startups. I had made my way

548
00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:27,080
Speaker 1: up from an intern to then being a community manager,

549
00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 1: to then starting the sales team with the CEO. And

550
00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:32,720
Speaker 1: as things began to grow and grow and grow, and

551
00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 1: as I began to accrue more and more power, um,

552
00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:38,879
Speaker 1: you become lost. You're in this sunken place to a

553
00:27:38,960 --> 00:27:42,119
Speaker 1: certain extent, not saying this happens to everyone, but in

554
00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:44,800
Speaker 1: an environment like the one that I was in, an

555
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:47,399
Speaker 1: environment like the one that this character Darren is in.

556
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:50,520
Speaker 1: The question isn't how would you change? The question is

557
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:55,879
Speaker 1: how wouldn't you? You're making money? The question the question

558
00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:59,480
Speaker 1: isn't how how could you change? Is how couldn't you change?

559
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:04,080
Speaker 1: You know, especially Darren? This character, he is twenty two.

560
00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:08,320
Speaker 1: He's at Starbucks making around nineteen thousand dollars overnight. He's

561
00:28:08,359 --> 00:28:12,199
Speaker 1: making around sixty five thousand UM on target earnings, if

562
00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:14,560
Speaker 1: not you know, a little bit less just base salary.

563
00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:17,360
Speaker 1: There's free food, they're going out to the clubs. There's

564
00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:19,840
Speaker 1: all these people who don't look like him. They're drinking.

565
00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:22,400
Speaker 1: He starts to drink like oh, you know. He gets

566
00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:25,520
Speaker 1: caught up, and not only that there is the emotional

567
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:30,280
Speaker 1: resonance of this powerful messianic character of the CEO saying

568
00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:33,000
Speaker 1: that you, Darren, just as all of these other people

569
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:36,119
Speaker 1: here are anointed, You're part of the people that are

570
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:39,280
Speaker 1: really making a difference and disrupting the world for the better.

571
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:42,640
Speaker 1: This is the This is the the mindset that a

572
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:45,440
Speaker 1: lot of people working at startups have. I was there.

573
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:48,960
Speaker 1: I not only spread this mindset, but it was a

574
00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:51,040
Speaker 1: gospel that was handed down to me as well. And

575
00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:53,560
Speaker 1: I'm using these religious terms because in many ways it

576
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:55,600
Speaker 1: can feel like a cult, and what I found is

577
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:59,120
Speaker 1: that there's a difference between cult and culture. So for me, right,

578
00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:02,600
Speaker 1: there's all of these people and I'm here at you

579
00:29:04,320 --> 00:29:07,600
Speaker 1: now with a younger version of me um across the

580
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,280
Speaker 1: interview table, and I'm saying all of these things to

581
00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:13,000
Speaker 1: them and watching them not and and watching them almost

582
00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:14,760
Speaker 1: foam at the mouth if they want to be a

583
00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:17,400
Speaker 1: part of this ship that's taking off, when in fact,

584
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,160
Speaker 1: a lot of these people are not curing cancer, changing

585
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:23,040
Speaker 1: the world by making a more ergonomic chair or whatever

586
00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 1: they're doing. But this isn't to say, and it's important

587
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 1: for me to point out real quick, is that in

588
00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:33,040
Speaker 1: my journey, right, I experienced a lot of things, but

589
00:29:33,200 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 1: on the whole I wasn't a victim. I was a

590
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:40,120
Speaker 1: young king prating, perpetrating. Yes that part, I was complicit

591
00:29:40,240 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 1: in this cycle. And Darren, while he has victimized, and

592
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:46,520
Speaker 1: he experiences a lot of wild racism, and I took

593
00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:48,720
Speaker 1: some of that from my life outside of the workplace

594
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:51,240
Speaker 1: to translate it into the workplace, to show people what

595
00:29:51,360 --> 00:29:53,920
Speaker 1: it can feel like, or to reaffirm to the reader

596
00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:56,760
Speaker 1: of I know you know what this is like. But

597
00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 1: the point being is that Darren then have has these

598
00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:03,880
Speaker 1: experiences and then turns around and hurts the people who

599
00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:07,360
Speaker 1: loved HIMUK conditionally. This is all to show that heroes

600
00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:10,240
Speaker 1: and villains good and bad, black and white. It's not

601
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:13,520
Speaker 1: as cut and dry as that. There's complexity and there's nuance,

602
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:16,600
Speaker 1: and I think that when sometimes I hate to even

603
00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 1: cut you off because he's preaching though, but sometimes we

604
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:22,160
Speaker 1: play this role. Sometimes we're the hero and then sometimes

605
00:30:22,200 --> 00:30:26,240
Speaker 1: we're the villain. Like what's going on now? I don't

606
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:27,600
Speaker 1: know if we're gonna talk about, you know, but you

607
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 1: know what I'm talking about? What's going on now? Yeah? Yeah,

608
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:35,560
Speaker 1: talk about it? I mean, uh, we we see it

609
00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:39,480
Speaker 1: happening with Kanye. You see it happening with Kanye West.

610
00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:44,160
Speaker 1: Kanye West has no doubt received the brunt of racism

611
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 1: throughout his life, especially while trying to break into this

612
00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 1: extremely white, extremely classist um industry of fashion. And then

613
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:57,200
Speaker 1: what does he do instead of trying to spread information

614
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 1: and help lift all of these people up. He's gonna

615
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:02,560
Speaker 1: go and wear a shirt that says white Lives Matter,

616
00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 1: which feels like a slap in the face, and it

617
00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:07,200
Speaker 1: feels downright diabolical. I was texting with some of my

618
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:10,120
Speaker 1: homies and I'm like, Yo, that just felt downright diabolical

619
00:31:10,240 --> 00:31:13,320
Speaker 1: to me. But what part is not right? What part

620
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:16,280
Speaker 1: in the book would be the equivalent of what Darren

621
00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:21,840
Speaker 1: didn't necessarily where a white Lives Matter shirt? He didn't

622
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:23,880
Speaker 1: necessarily didn't he didn't do anything as it reads it,

623
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 1: But but he's complicit in For example, there's a scene

624
00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:29,760
Speaker 1: when the character of Rhett the CEO, who is this

625
00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:34,040
Speaker 1: messing in a character he's charismatic, he's you know traditionally

626
00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:36,200
Speaker 1: as Americans who said good looking in like a John

627
00:31:36,280 --> 00:31:40,040
Speaker 1: Ham type of way, and he the company is under

628
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:43,760
Speaker 1: fire for something that had taken place and then Rhett

629
00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:47,840
Speaker 1: hits up Darren the only black employee, the only black

630
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 1: individual working there. It's important for me to differentiate between

631
00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:53,720
Speaker 1: an employee and an individual. But the only black individual

632
00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:56,520
Speaker 1: working they're young, and Rhett says, Yo, I need to

633
00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:59,040
Speaker 1: I need to get you up on rise and shine America,

634
00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:02,320
Speaker 1: you know, in nor to defend this this company. And

635
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 1: it's because what transpired was related to the murder of

636
00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:08,680
Speaker 1: a young woman of color. So Red is using Darren

637
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 1: as this shield in a way, and Darren knows what

638
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:14,320
Speaker 1: it is. Darren is not an idiot. He knows what's

639
00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:16,520
Speaker 1: going on, but he's complicit because he believes in the

640
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 1: mission of the company. So I'm not gonna say it

641
00:32:19,000 --> 00:32:22,040
Speaker 1: is the exact equivalent of him doing something diabolical like

642
00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:25,240
Speaker 1: wearing a White Lives Matter shirt. But he's complicit in

643
00:32:25,720 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: being a pawn in the way that so many of

644
00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:34,479
Speaker 1: us are used right now, it's by definition, but if

645
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:37,480
Speaker 1: we're being honest, many of us are complicent. How many

646
00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 1: times have we been in the room as a black

647
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:42,000
Speaker 1: person and heard somebody white or somebody other say something

648
00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,960
Speaker 1: that really just does not sit well with you, and

649
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:48,600
Speaker 1: we don't say anything, and we let their version of

650
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:51,719
Speaker 1: what they believe black is exist. But you know how

651
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,160
Speaker 1: those people are. You're not like that, You're not like them,

652
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 1: but they talk like that, you know how those you know,

653
00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:59,760
Speaker 1: but like those you know what I mean, And we

654
00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 1: just sit there and we're like huh or you hear

655
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:06,680
Speaker 1: them say something. Now, that's no longer the case for me,

656
00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 1: as I'm sure it's no longer the case for you.

657
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:10,680
Speaker 1: But it takes a while to walk to that freedom.

658
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:12,840
Speaker 1: It takes a while to walk to that free stage

659
00:33:12,840 --> 00:33:15,080
Speaker 1: and that free space and live in that space. It

660
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:19,160
Speaker 1: really does. And things still happen, and things still happen

661
00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:22,440
Speaker 1: all all the time, right, Like me in this position

662
00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:25,040
Speaker 1: as an author, I'll be invited around the world to

663
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 1: different book festivals. When I just brought up Paris before,

664
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,400
Speaker 1: I had an experience in Paris that was similar that well,

665
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:34,960
Speaker 1: that was that was reminiscent of this, and to be

666
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:39,880
Speaker 1: completely honest, on the spectrum, on the spectrum it was

667
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:44,800
Speaker 1: it was not even as intense as other things that

668
00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:47,800
Speaker 1: we've heard or experienced. Right. It was some guy, he

669
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:50,760
Speaker 1: was him and his wife. There were French, white French folks,

670
00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: and um, they had a lot of good energy initially,

671
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:54,880
Speaker 1: and we were having a great conversation while I was

672
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:58,840
Speaker 1: signing books. The man spoke like he was like he

673
00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:01,200
Speaker 1: had and this is even weird to say. Okay, I'll

674
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 1: be specific like he was from Texas, so he spoke

675
00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:07,800
Speaker 1: like an American from Texas and this isn't. This isn't

676
00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:11,360
Speaker 1: where I'm going. But I said, man, you sound straight

677
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:13,160
Speaker 1: up like you're from Texas. And his wife's like, no,

678
00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:15,440
Speaker 1: he's French. So I'm joking with him, and I said,

679
00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:17,359
Speaker 1: you know, talk to my editor in French real quick.

680
00:34:17,640 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 1: So he talks to her in French and my editor says, yes,

681
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:23,400
Speaker 1: he's French. So I signed their books. I'm saying goodbye, Revoi,

682
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:25,800
Speaker 1: and then Homie before he leaves, has hold on, I

683
00:34:25,840 --> 00:34:27,920
Speaker 1: want to tell you something, and I said okay. He's like,

684
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,359
Speaker 1: I want to tell you a joke. I said all right,

685
00:34:30,719 --> 00:34:32,399
Speaker 1: and he says, so I was on the plane coming

686
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:35,839
Speaker 1: back from somewhere and the stewardess comes over and says,

687
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:38,440
Speaker 1: would you like coffee, sir, and he says yes. She

688
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: says how would you like it? He says no cream,

689
00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:43,279
Speaker 1: no sugar, and the stewardess says black and he says yes,

690
00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:44,759
Speaker 1: but I didn't know if I could say it because

691
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:47,080
Speaker 1: the stewardess was black. First of all, I've heard this

692
00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:49,759
Speaker 1: joke before. Second of all, is not funny. And third

693
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:51,320
Speaker 1: of all, I was like, what is going on? So

694
00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:52,759
Speaker 1: I look at the dude and I'm like, first you

695
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:54,880
Speaker 1: could have said black. Second of all, that's not funny.

696
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:57,640
Speaker 1: And then he just walks away. And this is me

697
00:34:58,239 --> 00:35:01,080
Speaker 1: right as someone would think. And I'm again me little

698
00:35:01,120 --> 00:35:04,719
Speaker 1: lo me right. But I'm at this um, I'm at

699
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:09,759
Speaker 1: this festival, and I'm they're signing books and there's a

700
00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 1: line and all of these things. You would think that

701
00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:14,840
Speaker 1: when you get to a certain place, right, that you

702
00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:18,480
Speaker 1: would be immune. But that's the trap they're in because

703
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:20,320
Speaker 1: you have O J saying I'm not black, I'm o J,

704
00:35:20,719 --> 00:35:22,880
Speaker 1: I'm not black, I'm Kanye. These people that think that

705
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:26,520
Speaker 1: they're post race then eventually get got either by themselves

706
00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:29,080
Speaker 1: or other people. So I bring that experience up to

707
00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:33,120
Speaker 1: say that these things still happen. They will happen, and

708
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:35,560
Speaker 1: it's just knowing how to navigate and also standing your

709
00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:38,680
Speaker 1: truth and say like, no, I'm not with that. Lebron

710
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:43,319
Speaker 1: reminded me and the world that no matter how much money,

711
00:35:43,480 --> 00:35:46,240
Speaker 1: has no money, how well he can put the that little,

712
00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:48,480
Speaker 1: that little orange ball into a basket. He's still a

713
00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:51,800
Speaker 1: black man. When he moved to Britwood in his forty

714
00:35:51,920 --> 00:35:56,200
Speaker 1: million dollar house, I'm I'm I'm estimating, he was greeted

715
00:35:56,440 --> 00:36:00,279
Speaker 1: with the inward spray painted on his traveway, right on

716
00:36:00,520 --> 00:36:02,640
Speaker 1: the door of his TRAPI They just reminded him, I

717
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:06,160
Speaker 1: don't give Look, you're no different. And once you started

718
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:08,320
Speaker 1: talking and talk, he's reminded every time he tries to

719
00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 1: tweet m about what's right and what's wrong that you

720
00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:19,000
Speaker 1: are simply the hardy are too. And that's the trap.

721
00:36:19,480 --> 00:36:21,560
Speaker 1: You think your money makes you immune. You think your

722
00:36:21,560 --> 00:36:25,760
Speaker 1: success makes you immune, and the reality is you're not immune. Kanye.

723
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:31,319
Speaker 1: You are you. You saw as quick as you possibly could,

724
00:36:31,440 --> 00:36:34,560
Speaker 1: how far you could go. You you kept pressing the

725
00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 1: envelope because you thought you were bigger than the established.

726
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:40,480
Speaker 1: And you could say slavery was a choice and you

727
00:36:40,520 --> 00:36:43,400
Speaker 1: didn't get in trouble. You could say George Floyd died

728
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:47,120
Speaker 1: of of a It wasn't it was fitting all overdose.

729
00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:49,000
Speaker 1: It wasn't that someone set on his neck for nine

730
00:36:49,040 --> 00:36:51,080
Speaker 1: plus minutes. You could say all of that right and

731
00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:54,480
Speaker 1: still live and he does not care. Right, that's the trap,

732
00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:58,520
Speaker 1: But Lindsey, I can not care. That's the trap. But

733
00:36:59,320 --> 00:37:01,680
Speaker 1: keep going and see where the real power and the

734
00:37:01,760 --> 00:37:05,919
Speaker 1: money is and you realize at the end of the day,

735
00:37:07,920 --> 00:37:11,600
Speaker 1: the the complexity, but also at the same time, the

736
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:14,400
Speaker 1: suplicity of it all is sickening because you can do

737
00:37:14,600 --> 00:37:18,600
Speaker 1: those things because anti blackness is so normalized. God, it's

738
00:37:18,640 --> 00:37:22,440
Speaker 1: so normalized. It's so normally you can say and do

739
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,600
Speaker 1: all these things, and homies are still gonna buy yez

740
00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:28,520
Speaker 1: easies and and all of these types of things because

741
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:30,759
Speaker 1: we've been conditioned to think that's just what it is.

742
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:35,640
Speaker 1: There's such a trauma response. We numb our trauma. I

743
00:37:35,840 --> 00:37:40,440
Speaker 1: was reading the other day a post about what we

744
00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:43,840
Speaker 1: do as black people to be complicit, like we should

745
00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:46,719
Speaker 1: have really been, Like enouse enough with slavery was a

746
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:50,080
Speaker 1: choice we should have You're done right now, sir, enouse

747
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:53,360
Speaker 1: enough with George Floyd died of a fitting all overdose,

748
00:37:53,760 --> 00:37:56,279
Speaker 1: like the culture should have said. The community should have said,

749
00:37:57,560 --> 00:38:00,759
Speaker 1: you're done, loud and proud. But what we do We

750
00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:03,120
Speaker 1: find ourselves caught in this position where we don't I know,

751
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:06,080
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't actually criticize my black man publicly

752
00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:10,400
Speaker 1: because you have to save the world. Definitely, Yeah, But

753
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,880
Speaker 1: when do we say enough enough? When do we defend

754
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:19,040
Speaker 1: our people by sacrificing one of our people? I mean,

755
00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:21,759
Speaker 1: I don't know, To be completely honest, I think that

756
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 1: I think that we have to unlearned so much to

757
00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:28,200
Speaker 1: first be in the place to act. And that on

758
00:38:28,360 --> 00:38:31,839
Speaker 1: learning what comes with the awareness that what is going

759
00:38:31,880 --> 00:38:34,440
Speaker 1: on is not okay, and none of this is normal,

760
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:38,120
Speaker 1: and none of all that we've been conditioned to accept

761
00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:40,840
Speaker 1: should have ever been accepted in the first place. And

762
00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:45,200
Speaker 1: that starts with just spreading awareness, having real conversations, pushing

763
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:47,880
Speaker 1: back on people that we love and our homies, you

764
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:51,399
Speaker 1: know who say something like I wasn't even all that bad,

765
00:38:51,600 --> 00:38:55,640
Speaker 1: or they missed quoting like like standing firm. You know what.

766
00:38:55,719 --> 00:38:57,319
Speaker 1: I'm not saying that you need to bark at your

767
00:38:57,360 --> 00:38:59,800
Speaker 1: loved ones or anything, but like standing firm, like this

768
00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:02,000
Speaker 1: is what happened, This is a fact, This isn't an opinion,

769
00:39:02,680 --> 00:39:05,520
Speaker 1: and this isn't right, and I'm not gonna let it rock.

770
00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:08,719
Speaker 1: And the more people that do that, the more people

771
00:39:08,760 --> 00:39:11,680
Speaker 1: will catch on and say, Okay, maybe this isn't okay.

772
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:14,680
Speaker 1: Maybe it's not worth wearing these shoes that are connected

773
00:39:14,719 --> 00:39:17,719
Speaker 1: to this individual who doesn't stand for what I stand for.

774
00:39:18,200 --> 00:39:20,320
Speaker 1: But going back to what you said before, carry about

775
00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:23,960
Speaker 1: being in the room with with people, non black folks

776
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:26,360
Speaker 1: and white folks who are saying certain things that you

777
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:28,920
Speaker 1: know aren't aligned with with who we are and what

778
00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:32,560
Speaker 1: we feel. With black Buck, I felt as though I

779
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:39,640
Speaker 1: received two primary responses from black folks. One was, YO,

780
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:42,000
Speaker 1: that could never be me. I what a caught a body?

781
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 1: I have a lot of people who tell that to me,

782
00:39:44,239 --> 00:39:46,080
Speaker 1: like that could never be me in the startup? And

783
00:39:46,160 --> 00:39:48,640
Speaker 1: what A caught a body? Real quick? With these people

784
00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:51,320
Speaker 1: if they were talking to crazy and then other people,

785
00:39:52,239 --> 00:39:54,600
Speaker 1: well then there's but But I feel like a lot

786
00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:56,759
Speaker 1: of these people who are saying that haven't really been

787
00:39:56,840 --> 00:40:00,200
Speaker 1: in some of these involved They haven't moved through that role,

788
00:40:00,280 --> 00:40:03,040
Speaker 1: that haven't been enticed by the let me let me

789
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:07,280
Speaker 1: talk to you about the temptation, the temptation to be accepted,

790
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:10,400
Speaker 1: temptation to have resources, to have money, to have ability

791
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:16,200
Speaker 1: to have access. Those are those temptations, those are qualities,

792
00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:18,919
Speaker 1: Those are things that people desire, and once you find

793
00:40:18,960 --> 00:40:21,200
Speaker 1: yourself on the precipice of having any of those things

794
00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:25,640
Speaker 1: they're the compromising is unheard of. It is disgusting, and

795
00:40:25,719 --> 00:40:28,040
Speaker 1: you see it happen in real time. So I they

796
00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:30,800
Speaker 1: haven't had the opportunity to be in that room to

797
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:35,840
Speaker 1: make that decision. But but also sometimes there's that, and

798
00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:38,480
Speaker 1: then there's the inverse when you're just the odd person

799
00:40:38,560 --> 00:40:42,160
Speaker 1: out right, So the second camp of people, right, the

800
00:40:42,239 --> 00:40:45,600
Speaker 1: second camp of people are a little bit quieter, and

801
00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:48,080
Speaker 1: these are the people who will DM me or email

802
00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 1: me and they'll say, you know, that was me. I've

803
00:40:52,239 --> 00:40:56,239
Speaker 1: been in those rooms and I've remained silent and talking

804
00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:59,000
Speaker 1: about Lebron. Right, sometimes I bring up Lebron and Michael

805
00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:03,120
Speaker 1: Jordan's and Lebron for me why he's such an incredible

806
00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:06,920
Speaker 1: individual as he stands for something beyond basketball. Michael Jordan's

807
00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:08,960
Speaker 1: really just wanted to focus on his game and do

808
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:11,640
Speaker 1: all of that. Right, not yet too political. It's not

809
00:41:11,840 --> 00:41:16,600
Speaker 1: on me, I believe, to really judge if someone is

810
00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:18,279
Speaker 1: going to be in the room and say something or

811
00:41:18,320 --> 00:41:21,839
Speaker 1: not say something, because for some people, if not all

812
00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:26,120
Speaker 1: of us, it's a matter of survival. However, if you

813
00:41:26,239 --> 00:41:30,239
Speaker 1: have the capacity in you, if you're ready to really fight,

814
00:41:30,880 --> 00:41:33,400
Speaker 1: then we need you to fight. But I'm also not

815
00:41:33,440 --> 00:41:36,160
Speaker 1: gonna put down the people who because if if people

816
00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:38,080
Speaker 1: have been in these scenarios, and I know you understand

817
00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:41,480
Speaker 1: this feeling when certain things are said or done, you're paralyzed,

818
00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:47,720
Speaker 1: You're like, wait what You're like? Yo? And Raven Lalani

819
00:41:47,800 --> 00:41:50,920
Speaker 1: writes about it in her book Luster. She says, sometimes

820
00:41:51,080 --> 00:41:55,400
Speaker 1: racism is so innocuous and so mundane that you're like, yo,

821
00:41:55,520 --> 00:41:57,880
Speaker 1: did did that even happen? And if you dare to

822
00:41:57,960 --> 00:42:00,759
Speaker 1: ask that question and you're the odd person, now you're

823
00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:04,080
Speaker 1: gonna have X amount of people five, t fift, twenty,

824
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:06,320
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. It could be three, it could be three hundred.

825
00:42:06,440 --> 00:42:09,200
Speaker 1: Who are gonna be like, it's just a joke. Don't

826
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:12,960
Speaker 1: be so sensitive out you're gonna make the thing. Yeah

827
00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:17,320
Speaker 1: I am. I am actually because of the way in

828
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:18,920
Speaker 1: which I show up in this world, in the way

829
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:20,279
Speaker 1: in which I live in this world. So I am.

830
00:42:20,360 --> 00:42:22,640
Speaker 1: You're not black, you can't relate, So yes, I am sensitive,

831
00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:27,759
Speaker 1: Thank you. Every champion and carry champion is to be

832
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:31,200
Speaker 1: a champion of champion and carry chappion and carry chappion

833
00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:34,920
Speaker 1: a champion and carry CHAPPI and and carry Chappi and sports,

834
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:42,360
Speaker 1: and then the team making make it work. Every chappion

835
00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:45,080
Speaker 1: and carry Chappion is to be a champion. A champion

836
00:42:45,160 --> 00:42:48,840
Speaker 1: they carry Chappi and the champion they carry Chappi and

837
00:42:48,880 --> 00:42:51,719
Speaker 1: they carry Chappi Sports, and then the team make and

838
00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:56,360
Speaker 1: make it work. Why'd you title it black Buck? So

839
00:42:56,520 --> 00:43:00,920
Speaker 1: this was the This was the thing with Al al

840
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:06,879
Speaker 1: Roker because when when Jenna announced the book last year,

841
00:43:07,600 --> 00:43:10,040
Speaker 1: um on TV, that was before I ever rolled up.

842
00:43:10,080 --> 00:43:13,040
Speaker 1: She was just announcing her pick and she said, you know,

843
00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:17,040
Speaker 1: our pick for January's black Buck, and I see on

844
00:43:17,160 --> 00:43:20,359
Speaker 1: the camera, I see Al's face, and Al was looking

845
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:24,399
Speaker 1: a little like, what what do you mean? And me, right, Al,

846
00:43:24,560 --> 00:43:26,279
Speaker 1: that was the first time you've ever heard of me? Right,

847
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:28,040
Speaker 1: of course I knew who Al Roker was. You gotta

848
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:31,240
Speaker 1: pushing te rapping about Al, I predicts, No, Al Roker,

849
00:43:31,320 --> 00:43:33,880
Speaker 1: if you know, you know, you know. But um, but

850
00:43:34,000 --> 00:43:36,400
Speaker 1: I remember I took a little screenshot of that and

851
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:38,680
Speaker 1: I posted it to my Instagram stories and I said,

852
00:43:38,880 --> 00:43:46,000
Speaker 1: Al Rokers not want black Buck, y'all. And then I

853
00:43:46,120 --> 00:43:48,719
Speaker 1: was just making a joke because of his face. Yeah,

854
00:43:48,760 --> 00:43:50,319
Speaker 1: it was just a joke because of how his face

855
00:43:50,400 --> 00:43:52,360
Speaker 1: looked and when she said it right, and I was like,

856
00:43:52,440 --> 00:43:55,520
Speaker 1: I was not feeling this. And I also already knew

857
00:43:56,080 --> 00:43:58,880
Speaker 1: the reaction that some people had to the title, especially

858
00:43:59,000 --> 00:44:01,360
Speaker 1: like older black Book run the note, you know, So

859
00:44:02,200 --> 00:44:05,759
Speaker 1: I made that joke. And then many months later, Al

860
00:44:05,920 --> 00:44:09,080
Speaker 1: posted the book on his Instagram, and you know, he

861
00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:11,600
Speaker 1: thanked Jenna and he said that it was riveting. So

862
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:15,560
Speaker 1: now when I roll up to the studio yesterday and

863
00:44:15,640 --> 00:44:17,840
Speaker 1: we're having a conversation, Alice telling me how much you

864
00:44:17,920 --> 00:44:19,360
Speaker 1: liked the book. Craig is telling me how much you

865
00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:22,720
Speaker 1: liked the book. We did our we did our segment,

866
00:44:23,400 --> 00:44:25,640
Speaker 1: and then I say goodbye to everyone. I hug Al.

867
00:44:25,719 --> 00:44:27,879
Speaker 1: He embraces me, and then I'm in this like little

868
00:44:27,920 --> 00:44:29,600
Speaker 1: waiting area. I don't even know the names for these

869
00:44:29,680 --> 00:44:32,120
Speaker 1: little chambers, right, you would know, But I'm in this

870
00:44:32,520 --> 00:44:35,200
Speaker 1: chamber talking with two producers and out comes in. He's

871
00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:37,759
Speaker 1: just got a pepinist step. He's looking fly in this

872
00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:41,600
Speaker 1: three piece suit. My god, and we're talking. I was like,

873
00:44:41,680 --> 00:44:43,960
Speaker 1: you know, Al, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna front man.

874
00:44:44,080 --> 00:44:46,239
Speaker 1: Like when I saw the segment last year and I

875
00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:49,320
Speaker 1: saw your face, I thought you weren't really messing with this.

876
00:44:50,000 --> 00:44:51,759
Speaker 1: And he said, I don't even know if I should

877
00:44:51,760 --> 00:44:53,120
Speaker 1: be saying this right now, because this is like a

878
00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:55,960
Speaker 1: type of conversation today. But but in so many in

879
00:44:56,040 --> 00:44:59,040
Speaker 1: so many words, he said, he said, Matteo, I heard

880
00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:01,080
Speaker 1: the title, and I was just like, what's going on?

881
00:45:01,920 --> 00:45:03,920
Speaker 1: You know. He's like, I heard the title and I

882
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:06,080
Speaker 1: was like, what's going on here? And then he's like,

883
00:45:06,120 --> 00:45:07,879
Speaker 1: eventually I picked up your book and I got into

884
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:10,960
Speaker 1: it and I loved it. So this is all to say, Carrie. Um.

885
00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:14,640
Speaker 1: When I was writing the book, the original title was

886
00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:18,320
Speaker 1: fixing the Game, and there was there was two meanings

887
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:20,480
Speaker 1: of it. You know, that people had fixed the game

888
00:45:20,560 --> 00:45:22,520
Speaker 1: and it was rigged, and then that this character of

889
00:45:22,600 --> 00:45:25,520
Speaker 1: Darren was going to like unrigg it um or rigg

890
00:45:25,600 --> 00:45:28,040
Speaker 1: it in our favor. Then as we were going on,

891
00:45:28,440 --> 00:45:31,600
Speaker 1: you know, I got an agent eventually, Um, before we

892
00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:34,240
Speaker 1: sold it to a publisher, I was thinking about the title.

893
00:45:34,520 --> 00:45:36,200
Speaker 1: I was like, this really isn't doing what I wanted

894
00:45:36,239 --> 00:45:39,360
Speaker 1: to do. Darren in the book had already assumed the

895
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:42,200
Speaker 1: nickname of Buck. They they give it to him, and

896
00:45:42,280 --> 00:45:44,680
Speaker 1: then he reclaims it later on, and I was like, okay,

897
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:47,680
Speaker 1: maybe I'm just gonna call it as you said, as

898
00:45:47,719 --> 00:45:51,200
Speaker 1: a young buck. How did he assume it? Well, so

899
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:54,480
Speaker 1: so they call him buck and it right, some white

900
00:45:54,560 --> 00:45:57,440
Speaker 1: kid names him buck and you don't really know why.

901
00:45:57,480 --> 00:45:59,600
Speaker 1: And the white kid justifies his name is Clyde. He's

902
00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:02,360
Speaker 1: he's Aaron's boss at the company. He justifies it by

903
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:04,600
Speaker 1: saying because he's all gonna make us a million bucks.

904
00:46:04,680 --> 00:46:07,239
Speaker 1: But you know there's subtext there, and I'm playing with

905
00:46:07,320 --> 00:46:09,719
Speaker 1: that subtext in the novel because there's even one point

906
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:12,480
Speaker 1: when this young not young man, I mean, yeah, a

907
00:46:12,520 --> 00:46:15,960
Speaker 1: man Clyde breaks down, Darren, and I'm writing like a

908
00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:18,920
Speaker 1: broken buck. Right, I'm talking about it in this in

909
00:46:19,040 --> 00:46:21,919
Speaker 1: this way of the historical context and what it means.

910
00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:24,719
Speaker 1: So as I was thinking about these titles and I'm like, okay,

911
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:26,719
Speaker 1: maybe I call it buck, I said, you know what, No,

912
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:29,960
Speaker 1: I'm gonna call it black buck because this is the

913
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:32,239
Speaker 1: energy that he's coming with, right, and we and we know,

914
00:46:32,440 --> 00:46:34,600
Speaker 1: but for the listeners out there, Houarren and the no.

915
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:38,080
Speaker 1: Black Buck was the term that the white endslavers referred

916
00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:42,240
Speaker 1: to the male enslaved people as um because they believed

917
00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:44,799
Speaker 1: that they were going to burn down the plantation, steal

918
00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:47,759
Speaker 1: the women, steal the piggies, and they were unterrible. So

919
00:46:48,040 --> 00:46:50,440
Speaker 1: when I'm thinking about the title, I said, I'm not

920
00:46:50,520 --> 00:46:54,160
Speaker 1: gonna make it the title to unnecessarily provoke people, but

921
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:56,440
Speaker 1: I'm gonna reclaim it in this way because Darren is

922
00:46:56,480 --> 00:46:59,759
Speaker 1: not burning down these workplaces physically, but he's burning them

923
00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:01,480
Speaker 1: down own in the ways that they symbolize and what

924
00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:04,400
Speaker 1: they symbolize. So that's why I went with the title.

925
00:47:04,760 --> 00:47:06,560
Speaker 1: Now it's been almost two years of the book has

926
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:09,640
Speaker 1: come out, so you best believe that I've had many conversations.

927
00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:13,359
Speaker 1: I've had many older black books be like mateo, um,

928
00:47:13,760 --> 00:47:15,880
Speaker 1: I loved your book. But when I first heard the title,

929
00:47:15,960 --> 00:47:19,000
Speaker 1: I was like, nah, I'm not reading this. And then

930
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:22,120
Speaker 1: other people thought that there was a sexual connotation to

931
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:24,160
Speaker 1: the title, when that there was there was none of that.

932
00:47:24,320 --> 00:47:27,440
Speaker 1: But yeah, so that's where the title came from. Okay.

933
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:31,000
Speaker 1: So so first of all, this is turning into such

934
00:47:31,000 --> 00:47:33,640
Speaker 1: a beautiful conversation because we start off with today show,

935
00:47:33,719 --> 00:47:38,200
Speaker 1: we're weaving in and out. Um, what I believe for

936
00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:42,000
Speaker 1: anyone who writes right, because we people the art of

937
00:47:42,080 --> 00:47:44,360
Speaker 1: reading and writing is so so lost and it's so

938
00:47:44,440 --> 00:47:47,240
Speaker 1: beautiful and it should be as an English major should

939
00:47:47,239 --> 00:47:50,239
Speaker 1: be honored. Um. So it's beautiful to have you here

940
00:47:51,080 --> 00:47:54,520
Speaker 1: and and to honor what you do in the in

941
00:47:54,640 --> 00:47:58,040
Speaker 1: the day and age of of of shorthand w y

942
00:47:58,160 --> 00:48:03,279
Speaker 1: A and ELM and l M K and l O

943
00:48:03,600 --> 00:48:09,239
Speaker 1: or whatever it is. We don't even write full sentences anymore. R. Yeah,

944
00:48:09,360 --> 00:48:14,520
Speaker 1: shake my head. Yeah. So it's beautiful to see your

945
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:18,719
Speaker 1: experience because if I was a writer virtually not necessarily

946
00:48:18,800 --> 00:48:21,160
Speaker 1: known to the world, and now my book is being

947
00:48:21,280 --> 00:48:24,239
Speaker 1: chosen as the one on the Today Show, America's number

948
00:48:24,239 --> 00:48:27,240
Speaker 1: one program, right battling with g m A sometimes speaking

949
00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:33,880
Speaker 1: of initials, um he it is um a real significant

950
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:38,680
Speaker 1: moment in your career. Oftentimes when we're on the treadmill

951
00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:41,880
Speaker 1: of life and and getting after it, very similar to

952
00:48:42,160 --> 00:48:44,759
Speaker 1: what Darren is dealing with. You don't get to take

953
00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:47,600
Speaker 1: these moments and absorb them and drink it in, right,

954
00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:50,400
Speaker 1: So I hope that you are drinking in this moment

955
00:48:51,000 --> 00:48:55,640
Speaker 1: um and understanding that it is rare because I have friends.

956
00:48:56,239 --> 00:48:57,640
Speaker 1: I run in a circle where every single one of

957
00:48:57,680 --> 00:48:59,680
Speaker 1: my friends has written a book except for me, and

958
00:48:59,760 --> 00:49:02,080
Speaker 1: they don't have that opportunity to sit on today's show

959
00:49:02,160 --> 00:49:04,800
Speaker 1: and shoot the Chanelle and I broke er in create,

960
00:49:05,280 --> 00:49:07,480
Speaker 1: you know what I mean. And they especially don't have

961
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:13,600
Speaker 1: the opportunity to talk about their life experiences, not even

962
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:16,719
Speaker 1: loosely based every now case, but the struggle of being

963
00:49:16,880 --> 00:49:20,080
Speaker 1: black in this being marginalized in this world, and still

964
00:49:20,160 --> 00:49:23,400
Speaker 1: being seen. None of that is no matter how far

965
00:49:23,520 --> 00:49:25,719
Speaker 1: we've come, none of that is lost on me that

966
00:49:25,920 --> 00:49:29,560
Speaker 1: you've had this opportunity. So now that you have this

967
00:49:29,840 --> 00:49:33,360
Speaker 1: message that you are sharing with the people and reminding

968
00:49:33,480 --> 00:49:37,840
Speaker 1: them that I understand that you're not alone. It happens

969
00:49:37,880 --> 00:49:40,000
Speaker 1: to everybody, even the best of us, even the most

970
00:49:40,120 --> 00:49:43,640
Speaker 1: well intentioned, even the black andy black black Black, I'm

971
00:49:43,680 --> 00:49:45,840
Speaker 1: coming here, I got my top, I'm aware of AFRO

972
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:48,640
Speaker 1: pick to work. I'm black and I'm strong, and I'm

973
00:49:48,719 --> 00:49:52,319
Speaker 1: telling you now, it happens to the best of us.

974
00:49:52,400 --> 00:49:55,759
Speaker 1: And you see it. Old Kanye would be surprised at

975
00:49:55,840 --> 00:49:58,200
Speaker 1: New Kanye, and he has a lyric that says, what

976
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:01,080
Speaker 1: happened to Lauren? I miss old Laura, we miss oh Kanye,

977
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:08,880
Speaker 1: we missed wired jaw shut Kanye, right, we missed that Kanye.

978
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:11,840
Speaker 1: And it happens to the best of us. It happens

979
00:50:11,920 --> 00:50:14,040
Speaker 1: to a lot of people with attention who get money

980
00:50:14,600 --> 00:50:16,919
Speaker 1: he makes and it's and it happens so quickly because

981
00:50:16,960 --> 00:50:21,279
Speaker 1: you make these small increments in terms of your compromising,

982
00:50:21,360 --> 00:50:25,759
Speaker 1: they're small, start to compromise and you wake up and

983
00:50:25,800 --> 00:50:29,000
Speaker 1: you're like, damn, I'm compromised all the way, you know

984
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:32,960
Speaker 1: what I mean. Now I'm yeah, yeah, I'm way over

985
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:35,479
Speaker 1: the line. And now I'm terrified to speak my truth

986
00:50:35,600 --> 00:50:43,040
Speaker 1: because all of this will go away. Woof. That's that's very,

987
00:50:43,360 --> 00:50:45,800
Speaker 1: very real, the fear of it all going away. Do

988
00:50:45,920 --> 00:50:51,800
Speaker 1: you feel that now? No, Um, to be completely honest,

989
00:50:51,840 --> 00:50:54,160
Speaker 1: like for me. So, first of all, you know, I

990
00:50:54,239 --> 00:50:57,440
Speaker 1: want to thank you for everything that you acknowledge. UM.

991
00:50:58,600 --> 00:51:01,560
Speaker 1: I am grateful every day for being in this position,

992
00:51:02,400 --> 00:51:05,959
Speaker 1: not only being able to do what I love full

993
00:51:06,040 --> 00:51:11,200
Speaker 1: time and spread information and empower others, um, but also

994
00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:14,520
Speaker 1: how spoiled I am in a way of of of

995
00:51:14,680 --> 00:51:16,560
Speaker 1: my experience as a writer. You know, this is my

996
00:51:16,680 --> 00:51:19,719
Speaker 1: first book and all of these things have happened. There's

997
00:51:19,719 --> 00:51:22,600
Speaker 1: a reason why they've happened, right, there's business reasons from

998
00:51:22,600 --> 00:51:25,680
Speaker 1: a publisher's perspective, I'm saying where they said, you know,

999
00:51:25,800 --> 00:51:28,520
Speaker 1: let's bet on this one, um, and then and then

1000
00:51:28,560 --> 00:51:31,480
Speaker 1: there's other reasons and that I didn't give up, right,

1001
00:51:31,920 --> 00:51:33,680
Speaker 1: and then there are so many things out of our

1002
00:51:33,800 --> 00:51:37,520
Speaker 1: hands that that is just guiding us and guiding our

1003
00:51:37,600 --> 00:51:43,400
Speaker 1: work and creating these great opportunities. Um. But I've also

1004
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:49,680
Speaker 1: found that one of my greatest assets is being able

1005
00:51:49,760 --> 00:51:54,400
Speaker 1: to be my authentic self. I found that authenticity in

1006
00:51:54,520 --> 00:51:59,280
Speaker 1: this day and age is rare, and that what people

1007
00:51:59,480 --> 00:52:01,680
Speaker 1: and those those are the ones that I want to

1008
00:52:01,719 --> 00:52:05,240
Speaker 1: connect with most of the people, right, Having writer friends cool,

1009
00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:08,160
Speaker 1: chopping it up with Alan Craig and and all of

1010
00:52:08,239 --> 00:52:12,839
Speaker 1: them cool. Right, But I'm very clear on who I'm

1011
00:52:12,920 --> 00:52:17,479
Speaker 1: writing for and what the actual work is. The work

1012
00:52:17,800 --> 00:52:21,319
Speaker 1: isn't me sitting in front of a camera having fun.

1013
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:24,439
Speaker 1: That's a byproduct. The work is me sitting in front

1014
00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:27,839
Speaker 1: of a blank word document and trying to get these

1015
00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:32,560
Speaker 1: this this emotion out through these pages. Right. Um. But again,

1016
00:52:32,800 --> 00:52:36,320
Speaker 1: in terms of being in a public facing individual, I

1017
00:52:36,400 --> 00:52:39,560
Speaker 1: found that authenticity, uh, could be one of could be

1018
00:52:39,600 --> 00:52:43,759
Speaker 1: one of your greatest advantages. So there's the super's the superpower.

1019
00:52:43,960 --> 00:52:46,480
Speaker 1: Every day I'm trying to just become less of what

1020
00:52:46,600 --> 00:52:49,360
Speaker 1: I'm not and more of who I am while embracing change.

1021
00:52:51,560 --> 00:52:53,239
Speaker 1: By way of the background, you told me that your

1022
00:52:53,280 --> 00:52:56,640
Speaker 1: mom's you're making your dad is Iranian. And when you

1023
00:52:56,719 --> 00:53:01,680
Speaker 1: meet people who create such beautiful stories and have such

1024
00:53:01,719 --> 00:53:05,839
Speaker 1: a beautiful insight on life, you wonder how they were made,

1025
00:53:06,120 --> 00:53:08,640
Speaker 1: and not just the physical aspect of how you were made,

1026
00:53:09,520 --> 00:53:12,040
Speaker 1: but how did you grow up? Which led to this moment?

1027
00:53:12,640 --> 00:53:21,840
Speaker 1: Do you believe um? And my parents, UM are extremely

1028
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:25,320
Speaker 1: hard workers, Like we know this story. Your parents are grinding,

1029
00:53:25,920 --> 00:53:28,719
Speaker 1: you know, to create a better life for you. UM.

1030
00:53:29,040 --> 00:53:32,600
Speaker 1: But my mother especially instilled a lot of morals in us.

1031
00:53:32,640 --> 00:53:36,640
Speaker 1: And I was raised by my maternal grandmother, who was

1032
00:53:36,920 --> 00:53:40,400
Speaker 1: an English teacher in Jamaica. My mom also grew up

1033
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:43,920
Speaker 1: in Jamaica and they instilled the love of reading in me.

1034
00:53:44,400 --> 00:53:46,200
Speaker 1: But I also grew up with a lot of energy

1035
00:53:46,440 --> 00:53:50,240
Speaker 1: around because I have four brothers, three older, one younger.

1036
00:53:51,080 --> 00:53:54,480
Speaker 1: And as it goes with having parents who are from

1037
00:53:54,520 --> 00:53:58,200
Speaker 1: other places in your home in the States especially, you

1038
00:53:58,360 --> 00:54:01,080
Speaker 1: have different family come in and out. I had uncle

1039
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:03,600
Speaker 1: staying with us, I had aren't staying with us. You know,

1040
00:54:03,760 --> 00:54:05,840
Speaker 1: you know how it goes. And I would watch my

1041
00:54:05,960 --> 00:54:09,400
Speaker 1: parents and how selfless they were in terms of helping

1042
00:54:09,480 --> 00:54:12,120
Speaker 1: their family, and and my grandma was there as a

1043
00:54:12,160 --> 00:54:15,479
Speaker 1: studying forts and then also in school. You know, after

1044
00:54:15,520 --> 00:54:18,560
Speaker 1: a certain age, because of the sports I was playing,

1045
00:54:19,200 --> 00:54:22,040
Speaker 1: UM and because of where I lived and my my

1046
00:54:22,360 --> 00:54:26,040
Speaker 1: group of friends became less diverse, and because of that,

1047
00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:31,480
Speaker 1: there was a lot of let's call it hostility and

1048
00:54:31,680 --> 00:54:35,359
Speaker 1: just like straight up racism, not just microaggressions, but straight

1049
00:54:35,440 --> 00:54:38,840
Speaker 1: up racism. So what did that do to me? I

1050
00:54:38,920 --> 00:54:42,560
Speaker 1: had a I had a choice, consciously or subconsciously to

1051
00:54:42,680 --> 00:54:46,840
Speaker 1: either shrink and submit or to just be quicker and

1052
00:54:47,000 --> 00:54:49,600
Speaker 1: rise above and to get other people before they got me.

1053
00:54:50,280 --> 00:54:53,160
Speaker 1: So that really activated a lot within me. I knew

1054
00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:54,839
Speaker 1: I had to be quick. I had to be quick

1055
00:54:54,880 --> 00:54:57,319
Speaker 1: on the jokes. I had to be quick on if

1056
00:54:57,360 --> 00:55:00,400
Speaker 1: someone says something deflecting it. I had to hone my

1057
00:55:00,520 --> 00:55:04,120
Speaker 1: intelligence and in some ways, UM, I had to hold

1058
00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:06,560
Speaker 1: onto that. You know, how do I be sharper? How

1059
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:09,719
Speaker 1: do I just be smarter as a defense mechanism? And

1060
00:55:10,400 --> 00:55:14,680
Speaker 1: those things lead me too. I don't want to say overachieve,

1061
00:55:15,360 --> 00:55:19,520
Speaker 1: but to chase success in ways that would be outpaced

1062
00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:22,759
Speaker 1: from other people, in ways where someone could make a

1063
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:25,320
Speaker 1: joke like yo, you this and that and I'm like,

1064
00:55:25,400 --> 00:55:28,040
Speaker 1: oh man, I got a four point oh though, and

1065
00:55:28,120 --> 00:55:30,200
Speaker 1: I'm I'm gonna make bread when I'm this age, and

1066
00:55:30,280 --> 00:55:31,759
Speaker 1: this that and the other. What are you gonna be doing?

1067
00:55:31,800 --> 00:55:35,680
Speaker 1: You know? It's all defense mechanisms, of course. Um. But

1068
00:55:35,800 --> 00:55:40,320
Speaker 1: the one thing I suppose above all other things that

1069
00:55:40,400 --> 00:55:43,080
Speaker 1: were instilled in me from a young age is that

1070
00:55:43,239 --> 00:55:47,279
Speaker 1: our time is but so limited on this earth, and

1071
00:55:47,360 --> 00:55:50,880
Speaker 1: you're either gonna do the most you can do or

1072
00:55:50,920 --> 00:55:53,800
Speaker 1: you're just gonna pass by as a spectator. And I

1073
00:55:53,920 --> 00:55:56,160
Speaker 1: refused to be a spectator. So that's something that's been

1074
00:55:56,239 --> 00:55:58,959
Speaker 1: with me, been within me since I was young. Knowing

1075
00:55:59,080 --> 00:56:01,560
Speaker 1: that lolock in the background. Whether we can hear it

1076
00:56:01,640 --> 00:56:06,080
Speaker 1: or not, it's sticking, Matteo. It's a beautiful moment. I

1077
00:56:06,120 --> 00:56:08,480
Speaker 1: should be there the art of television and snowing when

1078
00:56:08,520 --> 00:56:10,880
Speaker 1: you have a great out. So I appreciate you for

1079
00:56:11,000 --> 00:56:13,800
Speaker 1: coming on my podcast and being so honest and authentic

1080
00:56:14,360 --> 00:56:16,799
Speaker 1: and giving me a conversation that's just a reminder at

1081
00:56:16,840 --> 00:56:19,920
Speaker 1: such a very important point in my life, like this was.

1082
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:22,520
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna give you the background, but this was

1083
00:56:22,719 --> 00:56:26,680
Speaker 1: definitely designed for us to have this top right now.

1084
00:56:26,920 --> 00:56:30,080
Speaker 1: So I'm grateful for you. Everybody check out his book

1085
00:56:31,200 --> 00:56:34,279
Speaker 1: black Buck. I feel like movies coming soon, but that's

1086
00:56:34,320 --> 00:56:39,240
Speaker 1: none of my business. Any any Hollywood folks listening. He's ready,

1087
00:56:39,640 --> 00:56:41,600
Speaker 1: he's ready for it. Take it to the big screen,

1088
00:56:42,640 --> 00:56:48,080
Speaker 1: streaming on Netflix, Prime, whatever something. Do something like that. Um,

1089
00:56:48,880 --> 00:56:52,520
Speaker 1: and keep keep being authentic. Don't let this Hollywood get

1090
00:56:52,600 --> 00:56:56,600
Speaker 1: to you, because it changes people. You know what I mean?

1091
00:56:56,640 --> 00:56:58,799
Speaker 1: Don cart you know? Thank you for being you, thank

1092
00:56:58,840 --> 00:57:01,520
Speaker 1: you for bringing me up. And when I got the invite,

1093
00:57:01,520 --> 00:57:03,000
Speaker 1: I was, you know, I jumped at It was only

1094
00:57:03,000 --> 00:57:04,840
Speaker 1: a couple of days ago. And I just appreciate you

1095
00:57:05,520 --> 00:57:08,880
Speaker 1: bringing your open and authentic self. Thank you for uplifting us,

1096
00:57:09,120 --> 00:57:11,400
Speaker 1: giving us a voice the look we all have to

1097
00:57:11,480 --> 00:57:13,560
Speaker 1: disrupt the way we have to disrupt it. I'm I'm

1098
00:57:13,640 --> 00:57:16,040
Speaker 1: I'm grateful. I'm disgrateful for you being here. This is

1099
00:57:16,160 --> 00:57:19,960
Speaker 1: arguably I've been saying that my last few podcasts, but this, honestly,

1100
00:57:20,080 --> 00:57:22,360
Speaker 1: I have a top five, top five, top five, top

1101
00:57:22,400 --> 00:57:25,920
Speaker 1: five I speak in I speak in sports terms often

1102
00:57:26,080 --> 00:57:31,800
Speaker 1: top five, top five, top five. But thank you for

1103
00:57:31,920 --> 00:57:34,040
Speaker 1: joining us. Un naked, my friend, my friend, my friend,

1104
00:57:34,120 --> 00:57:38,480
Speaker 1: my friend, my friend. Black Buck available anywhere you get books,

1105
00:57:38,800 --> 00:57:41,960
Speaker 1: uh and you know, look called the places. Google it,

1106
00:57:42,120 --> 00:57:45,280
Speaker 1: find out, read about it, go to his website. But

1107
00:57:45,400 --> 00:57:47,320
Speaker 1: the book is a New York Times bestseller. It came

1108
00:57:47,360 --> 00:57:51,120
Speaker 1: out top of January one, still doing well, still receiving

1109
00:57:51,240 --> 00:57:54,320
Speaker 1: lots of attention. And again, it's fiction. But as he

1110
00:57:54,400 --> 00:57:57,439
Speaker 1: said so eloquently, they are bits and pieces. He could say, Yeah,

1111
00:57:57,480 --> 00:58:02,000
Speaker 1: page thirty four is about my life no matter what. Though,

1112
00:58:02,040 --> 00:58:04,560
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, I do believe for

1113
00:58:04,640 --> 00:58:08,040
Speaker 1: any working black person in America you can relate to

1114
00:58:08,160 --> 00:58:11,760
Speaker 1: this book. It's just a fact. It just is. I

1115
00:58:11,840 --> 00:58:14,439
Speaker 1: hope you enjoy it. Thank you for supporting your girl,

1116
00:58:15,000 --> 00:58:17,720
Speaker 1: and follow me next week. We got a new addition

1117
00:58:17,800 --> 00:58:18,760
Speaker 1: to Naked coming up.