WEBVTT - John Hiatt and Jerry Douglas 0:00:15.436 --> 0:00:30.196 Pushkin. John Hyatt is a Nashville based singer songwriter whose 0:00:30.196 --> 0:00:33.436 songs have been covered by a wide range of popular artists, 0:00:33.836 --> 0:00:39.236 including Iggy Pop, Paula Duel and Jimmy Buffett, Missus Sip 0:00:39.236 --> 0:00:49.716 of Bone Boom, and A Middle of the Night Bugs, 0:00:49.756 --> 0:00:56.716 Flying every Well, Crazy Against Stage Online. Hyatt signed his 0:00:56.756 --> 0:00:59.676 first record deal in nineteen seventy four, and in the 0:00:59.756 --> 0:01:05.076 years since he's released twenty four albums. His latest Leftover Feelings, 0:01:05.276 --> 0:01:09.516 he recorded with the Jerry Douglas band. Douglas, who's feigned 0:01:09.516 --> 0:01:13.076 producer and session musician, as one fourteen Grammys for solo 0:01:13.116 --> 0:01:17.396 work and collaborations that they slew of successful musicians. He's 0:01:17.396 --> 0:01:19.676 also known as one of the foremost masters of the 0:01:19.756 --> 0:01:24.276 dough bro an instrument similar to the lapsteal guitar. On 0:01:24.356 --> 0:01:28.156 today's episode, John Hyatt and Jerry Douglas performed three songs 0:01:28.196 --> 0:01:30.516 off their new album and talk to Bruce Head them 0:01:30.556 --> 0:01:33.156 about how they came together to record that album and 0:01:33.236 --> 0:01:36.276 the studio that's known as the birthplace of the Nashville Sad. 0:01:37.596 --> 0:01:40.276 John Hyatt also explains how one of his new songs 0:01:40.636 --> 0:01:43.476 helped him forgive the horrific abuse he endor from his 0:01:43.516 --> 0:01:49.916 older brother when he was growing up. This is broken 0:01:49.916 --> 0:01:53.156 record liner notes for the digital age. I'm justin Richmond. 0:01:58.316 --> 0:02:01.436 Here's Bruce Head them with John Hyatt and Jerry Douglas. 0:02:02.196 --> 0:02:04.836 Tell me a bit about you hadn't worked together. I 0:02:04.836 --> 0:02:07.876 don't think he'd worked directly together before. How did it 0:02:07.996 --> 0:02:11.556 even come about that you were working together? Jerry? How 0:02:11.636 --> 0:02:14.396 in the hell did we wind up with each other? Well, 0:02:14.236 --> 0:02:19.236 we're both suddenly under the same managerial umbrella. Our managers 0:02:19.236 --> 0:02:21.316 got together and talked and said, well, why don't those 0:02:21.316 --> 0:02:24.036 guys do a record together? They know each other, Why 0:02:24.076 --> 0:02:27.236 haven't they ever recorded together? And we actually have recorded 0:02:27.276 --> 0:02:32.556 together on the second circle be Unbroken Record. I was 0:02:32.596 --> 0:02:35.636 in the house band that played every day and John 0:02:35.676 --> 0:02:38.996 came through with Roseanne Cash. We did a song for 0:02:39.076 --> 0:02:42.636 that and Jerry was, yeah, Jerry played with everybody. Yeah, 0:02:42.676 --> 0:02:46.036 so we were We did do that, and we've done 0:02:46.036 --> 0:02:48.516 each other for a long time and had some great conversations. 0:02:48.836 --> 0:02:50.956 When it came up, I thought, yeah, that'd be great man. 0:02:50.956 --> 0:02:53.796 Who wouldn't want to do it? Record with John Hyatt anyway? 0:02:53.836 --> 0:02:56.556 So I felt the same way. I was excited about 0:02:56.556 --> 0:03:00.516 the ideas idea of playing with you know the man 0:03:00.756 --> 0:03:06.636 who was the logical next prince of the Dobroud Taylor 0:03:06.756 --> 0:03:12.076 to Older and Josh Grays, and then you have Jerry 0:03:12.116 --> 0:03:16.316 Douglas Boom. Now did you come in with all the 0:03:16.356 --> 0:03:19.436 songs ready to go or was it were you picking 0:03:19.436 --> 0:03:23.036 through songs and looking through files? And I sent Jerry 0:03:23.196 --> 0:03:27.636 about fifteen tunes, a couple of older ones, one of 0:03:27.676 --> 0:03:29.916 which we did on the record, a song called Little 0:03:29.956 --> 0:03:32.196 good Night, which I wrote when my thirty three year 0:03:32.236 --> 0:03:34.996 old daughter was born, but I had never recorded it, 0:03:35.156 --> 0:03:37.196 so that was kind of fun. And then we redid 0:03:37.676 --> 0:03:40.036 a song All the Lilacs in Ohio, which was on 0:03:40.036 --> 0:03:42.716 a record I put out in two thousand and three. 0:03:43.276 --> 0:03:46.236 Everything else was relatively new, About five or six of 0:03:46.276 --> 0:03:49.476 them I wrote, I'd call them pandemic songs. We were 0:03:49.516 --> 0:03:52.956 both ready to do the record and everything, and one 0:03:52.956 --> 0:03:55.676 of the cool things, especially for me, is we were 0:03:55.676 --> 0:03:58.356 going to use my band is going to be on 0:03:58.396 --> 0:04:01.836 the tour and did all the recording as well with John, 0:04:02.396 --> 0:04:05.516 so it just gave him a completely a different twist 0:04:05.796 --> 0:04:07.676 on John Hyatt. We didn't know what it was gonna 0:04:07.676 --> 0:04:10.196 sound like either, which I was very excited about. Of course, 0:04:10.196 --> 0:04:12.556 we never do really, but I'm interested when you did 0:04:12.676 --> 0:04:14.956 you Know all the Lilacs, which is, as you said, 0:04:15.116 --> 0:04:17.556 a song about almost twenty years old. I mean, who 0:04:17.596 --> 0:04:20.156 said we got to do that song and put it 0:04:20.196 --> 0:04:22.476 in a very different It's still fast, it's still got 0:04:22.476 --> 0:04:25.516 a lot of energy, but it's very different setting. Well. 0:04:25.556 --> 0:04:27.356 I sent it to Jeried because I talked with him 0:04:27.356 --> 0:04:30.356 in his band, you know, fiddle and upright bass and dobro, 0:04:30.596 --> 0:04:33.276 that it would really lend itself to the song. And 0:04:33.316 --> 0:04:35.676 I felt like the song, although I thought it was 0:04:35.756 --> 0:04:38.596 a successful recording for what it was, but I felt 0:04:38.596 --> 0:04:40.676 like the story in the song it might have gotten 0:04:40.676 --> 0:04:43.316 a little lost. This to me, is a little more 0:04:43.356 --> 0:04:45.996 focused in terms of being able to follow this story, 0:04:46.036 --> 0:04:49.036 which was basically an idea I stole from one of 0:04:49.116 --> 0:04:52.396 my favorite movies, Lost Weekend, and it was actually a 0:04:52.436 --> 0:04:55.636 line in the movie Ray in the land talking to 0:04:55.876 --> 0:04:59.116 Sam and the bartender telling him. Ray plays a drunk 0:04:59.276 --> 0:05:02.956 who wants to write weren't we all? And don't we 0:05:02.996 --> 0:05:07.116 all want to? We've been through that part too. Yeah. 0:05:07.276 --> 0:05:09.796 He talks about this girl he's just met. They're in 0:05:09.796 --> 0:05:12.156 New York City and he says, you know, I go 0:05:12.236 --> 0:05:15.316 to see her and the sunlight hits the gray of 0:05:15.356 --> 0:05:18.196 the drain pipe on her building. And then she can't 0:05:18.276 --> 0:05:20.676 meet me at the assigned time, but she sends a 0:05:20.756 --> 0:05:23.436 note down to be given to me by the doorman, 0:05:23.596 --> 0:05:25.796 and I opened it and it smells like all the 0:05:25.876 --> 0:05:28.356 lilacs in Ohio? Is that right? Is that what that 0:05:28.436 --> 0:05:31.756 came from? Yeah? I didn't do that. Oh that's it's 0:05:31.796 --> 0:05:35.276 so beautiful. It's a beautiful story. And I'm from Ohio 0:05:35.316 --> 0:05:38.036 and I never saw any lilacs in Ohio, so I 0:05:38.116 --> 0:05:42.196 really was concerned. Yeah, you should just be stealing songs 0:05:42.316 --> 0:05:44.516 from old movies, because like those old kind of tough 0:05:44.556 --> 0:05:49.756 guy ben Hecked dialogue. Listen, I'll steal from anywhere, any 0:05:49.796 --> 0:05:53.516 idea there's laying about. So when you heard the songs, Jerry, 0:05:53.596 --> 0:05:56.236 now you've produced a lot of records, But what did 0:05:56.276 --> 0:05:57.476 you think, said? I mean, you knew it was going 0:05:57.516 --> 0:05:59.796 to be your band, But did a certain sound, at 0:05:59.836 --> 0:06:02.076 a kind of atmosphere come to mind when you were 0:06:02.116 --> 0:06:05.476 going through the songs? Well, yeah, I always thought of 0:06:05.556 --> 0:06:08.516 us the band as an electric band. I mean, I 0:06:08.556 --> 0:06:11.396 didn't take away. We're making a record with John Hyatt, 0:06:11.436 --> 0:06:14.716 We're gonna sound like John Hyatt. You know, we're just 0:06:14.756 --> 0:06:18.876 gonna be chameleons and tap into whatever it is that 0:06:18.916 --> 0:06:22.676 he's hearing here, and we're just gonna give it legs. 0:06:23.076 --> 0:06:27.156 The song All the Lilacs in Ohio. I've heard it 0:06:27.236 --> 0:06:30.396 as like a sing along for a lot of people 0:06:30.676 --> 0:06:33.036 in an audience, you know, when it gets to the 0:06:33.076 --> 0:06:36.996 line all the Lilacs in Ohio, and it's a real 0:06:37.116 --> 0:06:39.756 easy thing for people to pick up and attach themselves 0:06:39.796 --> 0:06:41.996 to sing it, you know, sing it loud. I love 0:06:42.036 --> 0:06:44.556 to be a great live concert kind of song. I 0:06:44.596 --> 0:06:48.156 always kind of try to imagine us on stage playing 0:06:48.236 --> 0:06:52.316 songs for somebody. Well, that's interesting because it's pretty much 0:06:52.356 --> 0:06:55.436 all we did in the studio. Well, they were live performances. 0:06:55.756 --> 0:06:58.356 I played and sang live. What you what I played 0:06:58.396 --> 0:07:00.836 is what you got. Yeah. The studio that we recorded 0:07:00.916 --> 0:07:03.916 in our CEA studio Beat was one of the first 0:07:04.036 --> 0:07:07.716 real recording studios in Nashville. It's owned by the Country 0:07:07.796 --> 0:07:09.876 Music Hall of Fame and let us go in there 0:07:09.916 --> 0:07:13.196 and record there, And people don't usually record in there anymore. 0:07:13.396 --> 0:07:16.316 They run tourists through there. So we got in during COVID, 0:07:16.356 --> 0:07:18.676 so there were no tourists, so nobody to bother us, 0:07:18.676 --> 0:07:20.556 and we didn't have to tear down or anything. And 0:07:20.596 --> 0:07:24.436 so we just set up and recorded. But like nine 0:07:24.476 --> 0:07:28.356 months after we were supposed to. They gave us four days. 0:07:29.036 --> 0:07:31.556 We made the record in four days, did a few 0:07:31.596 --> 0:07:35.036 overdubs later, but the basic records was done, afforded. Is 0:07:35.076 --> 0:07:37.476 that the fastest you've ever done a record, It's tied 0:07:37.836 --> 0:07:40.476 Bring the Family was four days. It's a really good 0:07:40.476 --> 0:07:43.156 way to do it. That's a good omen. So you 0:07:43.156 --> 0:07:45.836 don't have time to overthink anything, that's for sure. Yeah. 0:07:45.956 --> 0:07:47.956 Well you did the last one, Bring the Family. You 0:07:47.996 --> 0:07:52.636 did with Nicolo, who's famous for not overthinking things. Yeah, No, 0:07:52.796 --> 0:07:59.236 he's no overthinker. Yeah, he's an underthinker. That could be 0:07:59.676 --> 0:08:04.516 his next album, could be Nicolo the Underthinker. Yeah. Yeah, 0:08:04.556 --> 0:08:06.916 that was where he got his nickname, the Basher. His 0:08:07.156 --> 0:08:10.116 motto was bash it down, tarted up. That's how he 0:08:10.196 --> 0:08:13.036 made record, bash it down, tarted up. But you didn't 0:08:13.076 --> 0:08:15.396 tart this one up. You just bashed it down. Now 0:08:15.436 --> 0:08:17.316 we bashed it down pretty much, well, Jerry. They did 0:08:17.356 --> 0:08:21.476 a bit of tarting. They did Christian Stellemer and Daniel 0:08:22.316 --> 0:08:25.916 and put a little string section. These guys what blows 0:08:25.956 --> 0:08:28.076 my mind on Jerry's band is these guys. These are 0:08:28.156 --> 0:08:33.116 young guys who are schooled musicians, and they can play anything. 0:08:33.756 --> 0:08:36.956 I mean, Jerry hasn't playing jazz We're goodness say, but 0:08:37.036 --> 0:08:41.556 they can play songs, and that's to me, that's a 0:08:41.676 --> 0:08:45.596 rare combination. They come from a country music background, you know, 0:08:46.036 --> 0:08:50.636 sort of so they've played with country musicians. In country 0:08:50.676 --> 0:08:53.956 musicians sort of backup vocals in a different way than 0:08:54.996 --> 0:08:57.356 in a rock and roll tune or you know, any 0:08:57.356 --> 0:08:59.876 other kind of music. You really listen to the singer 0:08:59.876 --> 0:09:03.196 and you try to emote as the singer does and 0:09:03.956 --> 0:09:09.756 try to accent the phrases that are really important in 0:09:09.796 --> 0:09:13.596 the line. And you know, there're just some some unwritten 0:09:13.676 --> 0:09:17.676 rules about how we do that here, especially internationale. Yeah, 0:09:17.716 --> 0:09:20.476 it's true, it's very true. And that's what happened. I mean, 0:09:20.716 --> 0:09:22.916 I felt like I was playing with a group of 0:09:22.956 --> 0:09:26.636 singers or just painting around him. Well, that's that's interesting 0:09:26.636 --> 0:09:30.116 because when I think of you're playing, Jerry, you know, 0:09:30.236 --> 0:09:34.036 you are this virtuoso. You're the world's best best known 0:09:34.556 --> 0:09:38.116 dobro player. You're not to the dobro with like Eric 0:09:38.156 --> 0:09:40.596 Clapton is to the guitar. You're not going off on 0:09:40.636 --> 0:09:42.676 your own, or maybe you do and I just don't 0:09:42.756 --> 0:09:45.476 haven't heard it, but I almost feel like I think 0:09:45.516 --> 0:09:47.556 I remember. I can remember the first song I heard 0:09:47.596 --> 0:09:49.356 you play on. It was I don't Believe I've Met 0:09:49.396 --> 0:09:51.716 my Baby with Alison Kraus, and I can still remember 0:09:51.756 --> 0:09:53.596 that solo. If I could sing, I could sing it 0:09:53.636 --> 0:09:56.236 for you. But you have this very kind of melodic 0:09:56.796 --> 0:09:59.996 it's not background. But how do you compliment what's the 0:09:59.996 --> 0:10:04.396 singers doing with your and not overpower the singer with 0:10:04.596 --> 0:10:07.956 what you're doing. I'll tell you he had ten thousand 0:10:07.956 --> 0:10:12.236 hours of schooling in the Nashville session tradition. It's a discipline, 0:10:12.676 --> 0:10:15.876 it is, actually yeah, yeah, there are you know, don't 0:10:15.916 --> 0:10:18.596 step on the singer, you know, stay stay out of 0:10:18.596 --> 0:10:22.996 the singer's range. You know, don't detract. So there's this thing, 0:10:23.076 --> 0:10:26.036 you know, that this sound spectrum that you don't want 0:10:26.076 --> 0:10:28.076 to cancel anything out, so you don't want to get 0:10:28.156 --> 0:10:30.436 up in the singer's range. You kind of stay away 0:10:30.436 --> 0:10:34.876 from the singer and stay around the singer and sometimes 0:10:34.956 --> 0:10:39.756 playing nothing, playing and playing nothing can can speak volumes, 0:10:39.916 --> 0:10:42.836 you know, instead of playing notes. So when you say 0:10:43.036 --> 0:10:45.916 his range. You literally mean his vocal range. You stay 0:10:45.916 --> 0:10:48.356 out of the vocal range. Yeah, oh, I didn't. I've 0:10:48.436 --> 0:10:51.116 never heard that. You play above a blow. Where I 0:10:51.236 --> 0:10:55.076 learned that was from Brian or Hearne, who produced Emmy 0:10:55.116 --> 0:10:58.676 Lou Harris's first records, and I was doing an overdub 0:10:58.756 --> 0:11:01.916 for Brian and he said, that's all great, except he said, 0:11:01.996 --> 0:11:04.756 stay out of her range because you know, you get 0:11:04.836 --> 0:11:06.916 up there, we don't know which one of you it is, 0:11:07.036 --> 0:11:09.796 you know, and you might cancel out at or something 0:11:09.836 --> 0:11:13.596 that she sings, and so stay away from that little 0:11:13.636 --> 0:11:18.636 box that she's in and it works. Wow, I'd never 0:11:18.676 --> 0:11:22.396 heard that. That's completely fascinating. He's brilliant. I mean, Brian 0:11:22.476 --> 0:11:28.636 or hearn Canadian Toronto guy and just amazing producer. But 0:11:28.996 --> 0:11:31.556 after the Emmy Lou stuff pretty much he's kind of 0:11:31.556 --> 0:11:34.636 stopped producing. He was amazing and I learned a lot 0:11:34.676 --> 0:11:37.876 from him. Ricky Skaggs, did Rodney kraw all of the 0:11:37.916 --> 0:11:39.996 guys that surrounded, you know, in the Emmy Lou Harris 0:11:40.356 --> 0:11:45.276 or but we all learned how to make records from Brian. Yeah, 0:11:45.276 --> 0:11:47.996 he's just a genius. I just feel that you've given 0:11:47.996 --> 0:11:51.116 me some secret that should be locked up somewhere. It 0:11:51.196 --> 0:11:54.236 seems like everybody kind of knows it, but it's unseid. 0:11:54.316 --> 0:11:56.756 And when you say it out loud, you know, stay 0:11:56.756 --> 0:11:59.356 out of the singer's range. You used to listen to 0:11:59.436 --> 0:12:02.156 records and you hear that. You know, that's why you 0:12:02.156 --> 0:12:04.996 can hear what the singer is saying. As a singer 0:12:04.996 --> 0:12:07.436 and songwriter, from my point of view, I can tell 0:12:07.476 --> 0:12:10.476 you that there's plenty of me musicians who do not 0:12:10.676 --> 0:12:16.236 go And as Jerry was big, and I was thinking, 0:12:16.276 --> 0:12:19.396 you know, it's not like he doesn't hit a note 0:12:19.436 --> 0:12:21.516 that I've sang at some point in a song, it's 0:12:21.556 --> 0:12:24.636 just where he does it. Do you guys want to 0:12:24.676 --> 0:12:26.676 play a song now? And then we'll keep talking. Does 0:12:26.676 --> 0:12:30.196 that make a great idea? We'll play your song. Here's 0:12:30.916 --> 0:12:35.156 the lilac, the famous lilacs from Ohio that aren't in Ohio. 0:12:52.316 --> 0:12:56.036 You man her there on a New York City stre 0:12:56.436 --> 0:13:01.436 you were throw lean upon your shoe, trying to write 0:13:01.516 --> 0:13:04.876 the great book, but it really had you shoot with 0:13:05.036 --> 0:13:09.916 a bad case of win a time blue. You drank 0:13:09.916 --> 0:13:14.516 her down to the ragged samtime share the taxi to 0:13:14.836 --> 0:13:20.276 carry her home, and she left her handkerchief there beside 0:13:20.316 --> 0:13:23.396 you on the seat, as if to emphasize that you 0:13:23.436 --> 0:13:28.156 were all alone, smelled like springtime, and you were just 0:13:28.316 --> 0:13:34.716 a boy, and all the lilac sino Hi, All the 0:13:34.996 --> 0:13:40.036 lilac sino hi. There you go in the city streets, 0:13:40.036 --> 0:13:46.476 in the thirty winter snow, all the lilacs sino Hi, hil. 0:13:47.476 --> 0:13:51.796 She is the love story you speak up when you 0:13:51.996 --> 0:13:57.756 talk to Sam at the bar, But it's in the details. 0:13:58.036 --> 0:14:02.556 Your story always fails me. Your close but no cigar, 0:14:04.156 --> 0:14:07.396 And you might see your own ass in a double 0:14:07.476 --> 0:14:13.716 whiskey glass, but cannot erase her smile. And you'll never 0:14:13.836 --> 0:14:17.316 write it down, never find her in this town the 0:14:17.516 --> 0:14:23.316 fanom dreams and fingernail fires. It was springtime and you 0:14:23.396 --> 0:14:27.796 are just a boy. And all the lilacs seen, or 0:14:28.116 --> 0:14:35.396 how all the lights seen, nor how in the city 0:14:35.516 --> 0:14:40.036 streets and the dirt and winter slow, all the lilacs 0:14:40.076 --> 0:15:03.076 see RhI. So you beIN her handkerchief till clean white 0:15:03.116 --> 0:15:08.716 linen shoots, and you want make your beIN crawling you 0:15:09.116 --> 0:15:13.436 imagining her there, and you're tangled in her hair, and 0:15:13.596 --> 0:15:19.996 she smells like flowers, and it's springtime, and you are 0:15:20.196 --> 0:15:26.956 just a boy. And how the Lilacs FINOHI? How the 0:15:27.156 --> 0:15:32.436 lilaxino Hi? There you go in the city streets and 0:15:32.476 --> 0:15:59.396 a doted winter snow. How the lilaxino Hi? Hi. That's 0:15:59.476 --> 0:16:02.516 John Hyatt and Jerry Douglas with All the Lilacs in 0:16:02.556 --> 0:16:06.516 Ohio from their new album Left Over Feelings. We'll be 0:16:06.516 --> 0:16:13.236 back with more after a quick break. We're back with 0:16:13.316 --> 0:16:16.716 more from John Hyatt and Jerry Douglas. On a previous 0:16:16.756 --> 0:16:22.036 show that Malcolm and Rip did with Jack White, Jack 0:16:22.076 --> 0:16:25.996 White said you could never you could never write a 0:16:25.996 --> 0:16:32.796 good song about a tesla old contrary, Jackie, Well, then 0:16:32.876 --> 0:16:34.756 you always had to write about Oh you know, why 0:16:34.836 --> 0:16:37.756 is it we have to write about old technology? But 0:16:37.796 --> 0:16:41.476 then you wrote the first the first song on this album, 0:16:41.476 --> 0:16:44.556 which is Dynamite, isn't about an electric Cadillac. Maybe because 0:16:44.556 --> 0:16:47.156 it's not a tesla, it's a Cadillac. What made you 0:16:47.156 --> 0:16:49.796 want to write a song about an electric car? Well, 0:16:49.836 --> 0:16:52.156 first off, writing in a song about a Cadillac is 0:16:52.156 --> 0:16:55.756 sort of in my dna. I guess I've probably written 0:16:55.756 --> 0:16:58.716 a couple it's dreaming. You know who who wouldn't want 0:16:58.756 --> 0:17:02.116 an electric Cadillac that goes a thousand miles between charges. 0:17:02.516 --> 0:17:06.436 Bring it on, you know, I'll order one if you know. 0:17:06.476 --> 0:17:08.796 If I got the dough, I want an old one 0:17:08.836 --> 0:17:12.036 with an electric motor. World. Sure we can retro fit. 0:17:12.596 --> 0:17:15.676 I'm thinking about it now. Jack whites it. He's from Detroit. 0:17:15.676 --> 0:17:18.756 He shouldn't even say the word tesla. That's probably well, 0:17:18.796 --> 0:17:21.556 I mean point taken and Jack Jack, I get it. 0:17:21.596 --> 0:17:23.996 I get what he's saying absolutely. But it is true 0:17:24.036 --> 0:17:25.836 that a lot of the technology, like you know, there's 0:17:25.836 --> 0:17:28.476 still trained songs because people used to tell the time 0:17:29.156 --> 0:17:32.716 before they watches by the trains. They still sing train songs. 0:17:32.716 --> 0:17:34.916 But everybody's got to watch now. In fact, nobody has 0:17:34.916 --> 0:17:36.996 to watch because everybody has a phone. And I can't 0:17:37.036 --> 0:17:39.076 think of a good country song about a cell phone 0:17:39.676 --> 0:17:42.676 that's interesting. You'd bring up trains. When I first came 0:17:42.716 --> 0:17:45.916 here in nineteen seventy, I lived on Music Row. In 0:17:45.956 --> 0:17:48.676 those days it was a much more humble business, and 0:17:49.036 --> 0:17:52.316 all the publishing companies, all the riot songwriters houses were 0:17:52.596 --> 0:17:55.156 next door to the publishing companies, which were in houses, 0:17:55.236 --> 0:17:58.116 and a lot of the studios were in houses. Coming 0:17:58.156 --> 0:18:00.716 from Indianapolis, I had had no clue what a country, 0:18:00.796 --> 0:18:02.716 how to write a country song, or even what you know. 0:18:02.796 --> 0:18:04.476 I mean, I knew about Hank Williams, and I was 0:18:04.476 --> 0:18:06.916 about it. But I got a deal with a publishing 0:18:06.916 --> 0:18:09.276 company and I was in a house full of young, 0:18:10.156 --> 0:18:13.716 hopeful songwriters and I remember asking this kid from Birmingham. 0:18:13.756 --> 0:18:16.756 I said, so, how do you write a country song? 0:18:16.796 --> 0:18:19.636 Because he was you know, that was his thing. And 0:18:19.716 --> 0:18:26.116 he said, well, you're gonna need a train song, train song, 0:18:26.236 --> 0:18:29.396 a murder ballad, something to do with the fire. Did 0:18:29.396 --> 0:18:31.716 you write a train song? Then? I did train to 0:18:31.716 --> 0:18:34.116 Birmingham and I wrote it when I was nineteen. You know, 0:18:34.156 --> 0:18:36.276 it's really because of this guy, Richard, I can't think 0:18:36.276 --> 0:18:38.396 of his last name. Why did you show up to 0:18:38.476 --> 0:18:40.236 Nashville to be a songwriter if you couldn't write a 0:18:40.236 --> 0:18:43.436 country song? I had met a guy named Bob Frank 0:18:43.716 --> 0:18:46.716 who was in Nashville, but he was from Memphis and 0:18:46.756 --> 0:18:48.676 he was a folk singer. He had a deal with 0:18:48.716 --> 0:18:51.276 Tree Publishing company. I met him the year before I 0:18:51.316 --> 0:18:54.636 moved here, passing through Nashville. He said, man, you got 0:18:54.636 --> 0:18:56.796 to come down here. This is a good place. And 0:18:56.836 --> 0:18:59.556 so I went home and spent the year kind of 0:18:59.556 --> 0:19:03.196 trying to get a little dough together and eighteen. I 0:19:03.276 --> 0:19:06.316 came down to Nashville and a thirty five dollars corvet 0:19:06.676 --> 0:19:09.476 that I bought from a buddy burned five quarts of 0:19:09.556 --> 0:19:12.276 oil on the way down. It's only a three hundred 0:19:12.276 --> 0:19:15.596 mile trip, and check the gas and fill it up 0:19:15.596 --> 0:19:19.156 with oil. That was it. And I came down here 0:19:19.276 --> 0:19:22.436 and I went to different publishing companies the first few days, 0:19:22.476 --> 0:19:25.156 and I made a tape which I thought was my opus, 0:19:25.876 --> 0:19:27.916 you know, where I played all the instruments and we 0:19:28.036 --> 0:19:32.396 bounced them back between two Wallen Sack stereotape recorders I had. 0:19:32.436 --> 0:19:34.796 Buddy had a pair of them, and so I made 0:19:34.836 --> 0:19:37.236 my masterpiece and I brought it to Nashville. But it 0:19:37.276 --> 0:19:40.476 was all these bad songs, terrible songs, trying to kind 0:19:40.476 --> 0:19:42.676 of be a rock guy. I played him for three 0:19:42.716 --> 0:19:46.116 or four companies and struck out, and I saved the 0:19:46.116 --> 0:19:49.516 publishing company that Bob Frank wrote for. I saved it 0:19:49.556 --> 0:19:52.796 till last Tree Tree Publishing, and I called the guy 0:19:53.116 --> 0:19:55.116 and said, you know, I'd like to for you to 0:19:55.636 --> 0:19:57.316 listen to some of my stuff. And he said, do 0:19:57.356 --> 0:19:59.876 you have a tape? And I did, but I lied 0:19:59.916 --> 0:20:01.676 and I said, nope, I don't have a tape because 0:20:01.676 --> 0:20:03.436 it wouldn't get me anywhere. I said, I'll have to 0:20:03.476 --> 0:20:05.676 come in and play him. This turned out to be 0:20:05.916 --> 0:20:08.676 Larry Henley, who was the lead singer for the was 0:20:08.676 --> 0:20:11.076 at the New Beach or the I Like Bread and Butter, 0:20:11.156 --> 0:20:16.236 remember that song I love? Yeah, he worked for Tree, 0:20:16.676 --> 0:20:19.316 So that was the guy that I called. And he said, well, okay, 0:20:19.476 --> 0:20:21.356 it's it. We don't usually do that, but come on in. 0:20:21.916 --> 0:20:24.476 And I sat down and sign him three or four songs. 0:20:24.476 --> 0:20:28.716 And I have no idea why they decided to sign 0:20:28.796 --> 0:20:32.196 me because it was just quirky singer songwriter, weird stuff, 0:20:32.236 --> 0:20:35.036 didn't have anything to do with what's going on in Nashville. 0:20:35.196 --> 0:20:38.276 They were refreshed by that. Apparently, I don't know, but 0:20:38.396 --> 0:20:41.036 it was not good stuff. But God bless him. He 0:20:41.156 --> 0:20:44.156 brought the boss down, Bud. He killed him, and they said, well, 0:20:44.156 --> 0:20:46.636 what do you want? And I remember what Bob was 0:20:46.676 --> 0:20:49.516 getting as an advanced weekly advance, and I said, I 0:20:49.556 --> 0:20:53.676 want twenty five dollars a week. Yeah, I said, They said, okay, 0:20:54.276 --> 0:20:58.996 so I was a professional songwriter. Wow, And I thought 0:20:59.036 --> 0:21:01.476 i'd you know, I thought I'd made it for Christ's sake? 0:21:01.716 --> 0:21:03.956 Was it a good life? Did you like it. It's 0:21:03.996 --> 0:21:07.716 where I learned. I put in what's Malcolm's thing about ten? 0:21:09.116 --> 0:21:11.156 I mean I started the ten Thousand Hours when I 0:21:11.196 --> 0:21:13.796 was eleven, but I was really started working on it 0:21:13.916 --> 0:21:16.156 when I got here. But you probably met a lot 0:21:16.156 --> 0:21:18.876 of people once you got here that turned you onto 0:21:18.956 --> 0:21:21.076 hod It. Oh absolutely. I mean there was a guy 0:21:21.316 --> 0:21:23.796 Bobby Braddock wrote for Tree at the time. When he wrote, 0:21:24.556 --> 0:21:27.996 you know, he stopped loving d I V O. RC and, 0:21:28.436 --> 0:21:31.236 but he was a character, a lovely guy, and he 0:21:31.276 --> 0:21:33.276 was sort of my little mentor. You know, he sort 0:21:33.276 --> 0:21:35.116 of patted me on the shoulder and you know, kind 0:21:35.116 --> 0:21:36.876 of like, you know, those quirked little songs are right, 0:21:36.956 --> 0:21:40.556 It's okay, just keep riding, keep riding. Yeah, he's been 0:21:40.556 --> 0:21:42.476 on the show two or three times. I think he's like, 0:21:42.836 --> 0:21:45.956 he's pretty amazing. Yeah, incredible guy. I want to talk 0:21:45.996 --> 0:21:48.196 about your next song on that because and I'm gonna 0:21:48.196 --> 0:21:50.156 go through every song, but I thought it was so 0:21:50.236 --> 0:21:53.236 great after long Black Electric Cadillac, that you have a 0:21:53.276 --> 0:21:56.436 song called Mississippi Phone Booth that you know is not 0:21:56.556 --> 0:22:01.076 in the present day, because well, maybe maybe I haven't 0:22:01.076 --> 0:22:02.556 been to the Mississippi. Maybe there are a lot of 0:22:02.556 --> 0:22:04.916 phone booths there still, but I doubt it. I doubt 0:22:04.916 --> 0:22:07.436 there's even one. If there is a place with hass 0:22:07.436 --> 0:22:10.596 phone booths, it's in mississip Tell me about that song, 0:22:10.676 --> 0:22:13.156 how it came about. It was one of those COVID songs. 0:22:13.196 --> 0:22:16.316 I was reflecting as when you hit my age, you 0:22:16.436 --> 0:22:18.836 tend to do. There's more behind you than there is 0:22:18.876 --> 0:22:20.876 in front of you, so they tell me. But anyway, 0:22:20.956 --> 0:22:25.436 I remembered sort of my last my last drunk, which 0:22:25.516 --> 0:22:29.796 was a spree, and I was down south. I had 0:22:29.796 --> 0:22:32.716 come to Nashville, made a record that I don't remember making, 0:22:32.996 --> 0:22:36.876 and then I rented a car. I brought a gal 0:22:37.236 --> 0:22:40.916 over from Holland, who I met, and I said, I'm 0:22:40.956 --> 0:22:43.916 going to show you the South, and we drove around. 0:22:44.156 --> 0:22:46.676 We drove to New Orleans, so we drove to a 0:22:47.316 --> 0:22:51.436 coast of Mississippi, Gulf Coast. I was drinking quartz of 0:22:51.556 --> 0:22:54.636 vodka and twenty four packs of beer, and I had 0:22:54.636 --> 0:22:57.036 eight balls of cocaine being sent to me from my 0:22:57.116 --> 0:23:01.356 dealer in Nashville. And then I couldn't stop or weeping, 0:23:01.516 --> 0:23:04.316 and I couldn't get drunk anymore, and I couldn't get 0:23:04.396 --> 0:23:06.916 high anymore. It was the most amazing thing. It just 0:23:07.356 --> 0:23:09.636 this girls sitting there like, what the hell am I 0:23:09.756 --> 0:23:12.156 even doing it? You know who what swallow this guy? 0:23:12.316 --> 0:23:16.396 And so anyway, I just it culminated at three in 0:23:16.436 --> 0:23:18.916 the morning at a phone booth at a gas station 0:23:19.076 --> 0:23:23.196 with the just just as that opening verse states bugs 0:23:23.236 --> 0:23:28.236 everywhere the gas station light and basically trying to call home. 0:23:28.316 --> 0:23:29.956 I was I was married, it's time for going to 0:23:30.036 --> 0:23:34.996 say it's kind of quality life. I was hurting and time, 0:23:35.076 --> 0:23:37.036 but I called home and said I'm done. I like 0:23:37.156 --> 0:23:39.956 the line where you say tell Jesus I'm out at times. 0:23:41.196 --> 0:23:43.996 That is a great just a great line. And maybe 0:23:44.076 --> 0:23:46.956 this is why songs about modern technology aren't as interesting 0:23:47.036 --> 0:23:49.236 because they don't connect people in the same way you're 0:23:49.236 --> 0:23:53.516 talking to an operator, which I thought, yeah, so lovely. Well, 0:23:53.556 --> 0:23:55.636 you know how how it went on the long distance 0:23:55.676 --> 0:23:57.596