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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff you should know, a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh and Chuck

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Speaker 2: is with me too, and we're just a couple of

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Speaker 2: intrepid explorers sitting around in tiny rooms. I don't know

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Speaker 2: what we're exploring, but we're exploring something freezing to death. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I'm a little warm. Actually, I'm kind of sweaty.

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Speaker 1: Maybe scurvy, I don't know, pneumonia.

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Speaker 2: Blood poisoning.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a lot of bad things that happened about

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Speaker 2: this expedition that we're going to talk about. The Franklin Expedition,

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Speaker 2: very very famous. I guess polar No, it wasn't a

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Speaker 2: polar expedition. It is an arctic expedition from the middle

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Speaker 2: of the nineteenth century. And if you've ever seen that

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Speaker 2: show on AMC, The Terror, Did you ever watch that?

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Speaker 1: No? I wonder be recommending that a while ago though.

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Speaker 2: It's so good, Chuck. So there's two seasons, two totally

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Speaker 2: different stories. I'm recommending the one because it's all about

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Speaker 2: like a speculative fiction about.

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Speaker 1: This, about this very thing, no believe.

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Speaker 2: It or no. The second season is about a Japanese

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Speaker 2: family in a tournament camp during World War Two.

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Speaker 1: That sounds equally uplifting.

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Speaker 2: Totally different. But the first season is really amazing and

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Speaker 2: it is all about this. All the characters in that

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Speaker 2: season are based on actually people from this expedition. It's

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Speaker 2: really neat.

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Speaker 1: Well, now it all hits home.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there you go. So even before AMC came along

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Speaker 2: and did it, this is probably one of the most

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Speaker 2: famous expeditions in history, mainly because it was such a

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Speaker 2: colossal catastrophe. There are one hundred and twenty nine crew members,

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Speaker 2: including the captain, the expedition leader, all the officers, and

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Speaker 2: all the crew, and not one survived. All of the

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Speaker 2: crew was lost. That's really rare, even for Arctic exploration

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Speaker 2: back in the day. And then on top of that,

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Speaker 2: for a very long time, we had no real clue

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Speaker 2: what happened to them. Well we did, we just ignored

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Speaker 2: the clues, but it was a mystery. They just vanished. Basically.

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Speaker 2: The last time they were seen was by a couple

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Speaker 2: of whaling ships at the very beginning of their voyage,

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Speaker 2: and that was it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, there's lots of ways to disappear, especially

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Speaker 1: in the Arctic. Yeah, in the Arctic in that time,

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Speaker 1: of in the nineteenth century, very easy to happen.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but at the same time, this was remarkable. Even

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Speaker 2: at the time, it was weird that, like these guys,

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Speaker 2: this expedition just went so colossally bad. And then one

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Speaker 2: of the reasons, like I was saying that it's been

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Speaker 2: such an enduring mysteries because we never really knew. We

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Speaker 2: never had much evidence, and then we had scant evidence

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Speaker 2: over time, and the little evidence that we did collect

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Speaker 2: didn't really just explain everything. There were lots of question marks,

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Speaker 2: and even today, with all the stuff we found and

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Speaker 2: discovered along the way, we don't really know why this

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Speaker 2: whole thing went so pair shaped so quickly.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure.

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Speaker 2: But we're going to talk about whatever we do know.

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Speaker 2: I think that's our task today. Are you prepared for

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Speaker 2: this task?

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Speaker 1: Sounds like a very not thought out name that our

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Speaker 1: show could have been called.

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Speaker 2: Our task is to explain this today.

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Speaker 1: No, everything we do know instead of stuff you should know? Okay,

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Speaker 1: should we talk about the Northwest Passage?

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Speaker 2: I would love to because it's kind of important.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Well, it's funny, it kind of is, and it

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Speaker 1: kind of isn't. I think that they thought it was

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Speaker 1: going to be really really, really important back in the

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Speaker 1: day when they were like, hey, listen, we got to

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Speaker 1: find a route to sail basically straight from the Atlantic

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Speaker 1: to the Pacific. And as it turns out, it didn't

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Speaker 1: end up being a big, heavily used passage. There's a

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Speaker 1: problem with the Northwest Passage and that is it's really

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Speaker 1: hard to get through. Yeah, there are a lot of

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Speaker 1: Arctic islands up there north of Canada and there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of ice. That ice moves around a lot. You

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Speaker 1: can never exactly predict where you're going to find that

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Speaker 1: ice or where it's going to recede, and even when

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Speaker 1: you're out there, it's going to be moving around. So

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Speaker 1: it's almost like playing a game of Frogger. Sometimes when

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Speaker 1: you're to the forget the car part, like the highway,

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Speaker 1: like when you get to the river, because you're like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you know, I got a passage now because I see

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Speaker 1: it in front of me, but I might not have

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Speaker 1: it in an hour because the ice moves. So it's

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Speaker 1: a very tricky thing to get through. A lot of

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Speaker 1: people and a lot of expeditions went tried to get

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Speaker 1: through it, charted, you know, great deals of it, and

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Speaker 1: as we'll see in the end, John Franklin and his

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Speaker 1: crew was tasked with basically about three hundred miles of

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Speaker 1: you know, sort of figuring it out, charting it and

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Speaker 1: that was sort of the last bit. And even had

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Speaker 1: it been all charted, it's still not like an easy

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Speaker 1: thing to get through.

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Speaker 2: No, but just charting it was a huge mission for

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Speaker 2: the Royal Navy because at the time, the middle of

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Speaker 2: the nineteenth century, the British Royal Navy was the greatest

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Speaker 2: sea power in the world, and in their backyard, the Arctic,

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Speaker 2: there was an entire piece of the globe that was

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Speaker 2: just a blank question mark. I saw a really great

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Speaker 2: documentary on Nova and they showed a map of the

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Speaker 2: world as they understood it in the mid nineteenth century,

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Speaker 2: and everything else had been charted except for the spot

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Speaker 2: in the middle of the Arctic they actually did. They

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Speaker 2: had a blank space and a question more amazing, it

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Speaker 2: was like the Riddler had done that photography. But it

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Speaker 2: was like a blemish on the reputation of the British

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Speaker 2: Navy that they still hadn't been able to chart it

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Speaker 2: despite trying for hundreds of years to at the very

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Speaker 2: least chart it, if not make it through. So it

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Speaker 2: was a big deal and that they really wanted to

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Speaker 2: do this.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, And like I said, a lot of people. You

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Speaker 1: can't like point to a single person and say like

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Speaker 1: they discovered this passage kind of for some of the

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Speaker 1: reasons we've been talking about the thirty thousand islands in

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Speaker 1: the ice and people getting bits and pieces together a

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Speaker 1: little bit at a time. But a lot of people

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Speaker 1: take credit. There are a lot of people that are

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Speaker 1: given credit for different parts of it. There was one

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Speaker 1: guy named Robert McLure from the Royal Navy, of course,

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Speaker 1: and he's credited as the first complete transit. Part of

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Speaker 1: that was on land. And then there's a guy, a

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Speaker 1: Norwegian named Roald Amundsen who was like, all right, now,

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Speaker 1: this is the first guy who did it all by sea.

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Speaker 1: And this was like what fifty plus years after McClure

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Speaker 1: had done it partially on land. So it's like a

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Speaker 1: lot of time is passing, and this is at a

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Speaker 1: time when the advances of sailing and getting through passages

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Speaker 1: like this was sort of at its peak.

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Speaker 2: Yes, and by the way, rolled Mundson he was also

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Speaker 2: the guy who was the first to make it to

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Speaker 2: the South Pole, so he was quite a show off.

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Speaker 2: As far as explorers go, look at him. So yeah,

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Speaker 2: it wasn't until the twentieth century that somebody actually made

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Speaker 2: it all the way through by ship. So it kind

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Speaker 2: of goes to show you that, like, they weren't really

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Speaker 2: successful this Franklin expedition and even after the expedition. But

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Speaker 2: what's interesting about it is Ed helped us out with this,

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Speaker 2: and he made a point that there were a lot

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Speaker 2: of rescue missions to go find the lost Franklin expedition,

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Speaker 2: and while they were there they charted stuff that had

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Speaker 2: been uncharted. So Ed makes the point that by getting lost,

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Speaker 2: Franklin actually contributed more to the charting of this unknown

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Speaker 2: part of the Arctic than he did while he was

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Speaker 2: actually alive, because he didn't actually make it very far

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Speaker 2: and his crew made it kind of far. But by

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Speaker 2: the time they made it to where they were going,

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Speaker 2: they couldn't have cared less about charting. They were just

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Speaker 2: trying to stay alive unsuccessfully, as we'll see.

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Speaker 1: Well, there you have it.

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Speaker 2: I guess I spoil after having already said that not

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Speaker 2: one of the one hundred and shine Men survived.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you're like, no, wait, I spoiled it. In the

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Speaker 1: first thirty seconds, not just now exactly. All right, well,

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Speaker 1: let's talk a little bit about Franklin. John Franklin, that

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Speaker 1: is not Benjamin, of course, sure he hated boats. John

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Speaker 1: Franklin was born in seventeen eighty six and he was

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Speaker 1: not a rich guy. He did not come from some

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Speaker 1: noble family. But he did end up getting a lot

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Speaker 1: of seafaring experience in the Navy, a lot of combat experience,

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Speaker 1: Like he knew his way around a ship. So in

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Speaker 1: eighteen nineteen he saw that the British Navy was downsizing

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Speaker 1: some and the writing was kind of on the wall

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Speaker 1: for at least he felt the writing was on the

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Speaker 1: wall for him, and he said, all right, what I

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Speaker 1: should do if I want to, you know, continue at sea.

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Speaker 1: And you know, I kind of like this life is

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Speaker 1: I got to get out of the military and become

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Speaker 1: an explorer, become an Arctic explorer, because that was like

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Speaker 1: a path post some military that you could do. You

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Speaker 1: could become an adventurer.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and he was still part of the British Royal Navy,

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Speaker 2: he was a captain in it, but he wasn't engaging

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Speaker 2: in warfareries engaging in explorations. So it was almost like

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Speaker 2: they had two prongs. He could either go like Discovery

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Speaker 2: Corps or you know, the core of death and destruction.

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Speaker 1: Sounds like both leads to death.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, in this case, Discovery cor didn't pan out very I.

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Speaker 1: Just want to spoil it again.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, we'll just everybody just forget that. Everyone dies.

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Speaker 2: We're working up to that, apparently.

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Speaker 1: So he got to work on his discovery path. He

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Speaker 1: was doing pretty well. He commanded some expeditions here and there.

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Speaker 1: One ended up being a big failure on the north

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Speaker 1: coast of Canada, exploring near the Coppermine River, and half

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Speaker 1: of the men died. The reason that this is noteworthy

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Speaker 1: is because that even though it was a big failure,

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Speaker 1: he gained a lot of notoriety because he survived grim

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Speaker 1: conditions and very famously ate his boots to survive, ate

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Speaker 1: the leather from his boots, which is a thing that

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Speaker 1: happened on alone on that TV show. I watched that

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Speaker 1: some guy ate part of his belt.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, how did it go down?

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Speaker 1: It didn't go down.

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Speaker 2: Well, I can't imagine it would, man, I don't think.

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Speaker 1: I think the idea when you boil leather like that

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Speaker 1: is that it's just you know, some of the fat

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Speaker 1: will come off, and it's it might give you a

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Speaker 1: little bit of caloric intake, but it's it's not a

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Speaker 1: great plan for success long term. But Franklin earned a

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Speaker 1: lot of notoriety by eating his boots and wrote a

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Speaker 1: big best selling book about it, and was knighted even

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Speaker 1: though it was a failure.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, because they kind of saw it as you know,

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Speaker 2: he had sacrificed that much in the name of exploration,

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Speaker 2: so sure, why not nightem? You know, it's better than

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Speaker 2: like throwing rawen tomatoes at him upon his return. The

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Speaker 2: guy had to eat his boots for Pete's sake, you know, Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 2: So that was one of his two initial expeditions. The

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Speaker 2: one that we're talking about today was his third. The

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Speaker 2: other one was pretty catastrophic too, nothing like the first

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Speaker 2: one and nothing like the third one, but still noteworthy

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Speaker 2: enough that it was not successful. They got lost, and

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Speaker 2: both of those first expeditions, Franklin and his crew were

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Speaker 2: bailed out by Inuit who basically made sure that they

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Speaker 2: stayed alive. He probably wouldn't have survived that first expedition

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Speaker 2: had it not been helped from the Inuit who made

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Speaker 2: sure that they made it back and were fed and

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Speaker 2: all that stuff. And that's a big recurring theme that

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Speaker 2: we're going to run into, is the Inuit were in

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Speaker 2: the background. Like back in England, people knew they were there.

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Speaker 2: They called them Eskimo, spelled like it would if you

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Speaker 2: were in New Orleans or something with the aux at

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Speaker 2: the end. Oh really, yeah, that's what they did. They

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Speaker 2: were not thought very highly of. And yet the whole time,

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Speaker 2: as we'll see, like the Inuit were just witnesses to

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Speaker 2: this history, had an extensive and detailed oral history, knew

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Speaker 2: exactly what happened, where everybody was and what went down when.

231
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Speaker 2: And yet the British and other European explorers just would

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Speaker 2: not listen to them. And when they did listen to

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Speaker 2: them and they tried to explain it to England, England

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Speaker 2: shouted that person down and told them they were a

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Speaker 2: fool for listening to the chattering of these these eskimaux.

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Speaker 2: So that's just kind of a common theme as we'll

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Speaker 2: see that the Inuit played a huge outsize role that

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Speaker 2: were only now starting to kind of like acknowledge or recognize.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. They also there was a common theme that if

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Speaker 1: you were smart enough to listen to them while you

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Speaker 1: were there. Then you fared much better than if you

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Speaker 1: did things your own.

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Speaker 2: Way, definitely. But the problem was is like that was

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Speaker 2: not something you would want to do back in the

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Speaker 2: mid nineteenth century in front of your crew. Usually, Yeah,

246
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Speaker 2: you could very quickly, like your crew could lose confidence

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Speaker 2: in you because you were doing something totally out of

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Speaker 2: the norm and probably out of the bounds of respectable

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Speaker 2: behavior by following the lead of you know, an Inuit

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Speaker 2: at the time, or I'm sorry, an inook. Something I

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Speaker 2: learned is Inuit is the plural, inook is the singular.

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Speaker 2: So if you're talking to you wouldn't say I'm talking

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Speaker 2: to Americans, say I'm talking to an American, and in

254
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Speaker 2: the same way say I'm talking to an Inuk who's

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Speaker 2: a member of the Inuit.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. What they would were smart to do would be

257
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Speaker 1: to take an inook around behind a big block of

258
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Speaker 1: ice and very quietly say, listen, old boy, if you

259
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Speaker 1: have any advice, please just let me know quietly, cappy

260
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Speaker 1: to follow.

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Speaker 2: Can you draw it where we should go in the snow?

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Speaker 1: Right? And then yes, yeah, and then erase it very

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Speaker 1: quickly and with pe say face yeah, with your urine.

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Speaker 1: So or no, no, no, wait, erase it with urine or

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Speaker 1: spell it out in urine.

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Speaker 2: You would erase it with urine. You could do both,

267
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Speaker 2: but the spelling it out with urine would would be

268
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Speaker 2: too permanent. You would want to pee all over it

269
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Speaker 2: and it would melt out the instructions once you committed

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Speaker 2: them to memory, and everybody in your crew would have thought,

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Speaker 2: you just want behind the ice block to pee.

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Speaker 1: Well, that's why they have the slogan as the sharpie

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Speaker 1: of snow riting.

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Speaker 2: What does P? Yeah, okay, I didn't know it. I

275
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Speaker 2: didn't know P had its own slogan.

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Speaker 1: It did. I really circumnavigated at like a big ice

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Speaker 1: flow that was nice, clumsily somewhat breaking through with my

278
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Speaker 1: iron force.

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Speaker 2: There were a couple of bumps in there.

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Speaker 1: Sure, all right? So where are we? He as he

281
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Speaker 1: had the second expedition that he said wasn't as bad

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Speaker 1: as the first, and third still not great. Right, He's

283
00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:38,400
Speaker 1: kind of thinking about hanging up his half eaten boiled boots.

284
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Speaker 1: At this point. He's in his fifties, and in eighteen

285
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Speaker 1: thirty seven they said, no, why don't you take this

286
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Speaker 1: appointment as the Lieutenant governor Van Demon's Land, which we

287
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Speaker 1: now know as Tasmania, and that only lasted a few years.

288
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Speaker 1: And his wife Jane said, you know what you should

289
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Speaker 1: really do is finished strong, you're getting old. You got

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Speaker 1: one morning. You just to sort of save the family

291
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Speaker 1: name one more Arctic expedition that might really be great

292
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Speaker 1: and cement you as a victor. And he said, I

293
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Speaker 1: guess I'll try if they'll.

294
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Speaker 2: Have me, he said, Roger Roger. Yeah, so he did, well,

295
00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:18,520
Speaker 2: she did, I should say he kind of just went

296
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Speaker 2: along with it. But lady Jane Franklin really worked behind

297
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Speaker 2: the scenes to get her husband appointed to the head

298
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Speaker 2: of an Arctic expedition, and in particular this one that

299
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Speaker 2: was considered potentially the last one to map the Northwest

300
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Speaker 2: Passage because there was only that three hundred miles of

301
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Speaker 2: uncharted territory.

302
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Speaker 1: So I got a question, though, was this a situation

303
00:15:40,120 --> 00:15:44,120
Speaker 1: where they gave it to this older guy because no

304
00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:46,400
Speaker 1: one wanted to do it because it was so dangerous,

305
00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:49,440
Speaker 1: or like I saw that the you know, younger captains

306
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Speaker 1: you know, declined to take the position. Is it because

307
00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:53,800
Speaker 1: it was just so fraught?

308
00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:58,760
Speaker 2: I don't know, I honestly don't know. It's possible but

309
00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:00,880
Speaker 2: that seems like that would lie in the face of

310
00:16:00,960 --> 00:16:04,360
Speaker 2: like the Royal Navy and their attitude at the time,

311
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Speaker 2: like you would step up and be like, yes, I'll

312
00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:08,840
Speaker 2: be the one to die, rather than be like I

313
00:16:08,880 --> 00:16:11,800
Speaker 2: don't want that, you know. So I'm not sure exactly

314
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Speaker 2: why I'll have to go back and watch the Terror again.

315
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Speaker 1: Is it like how historically accurate? Is it?

316
00:16:17,640 --> 00:16:20,120
Speaker 2: Extremely? But at the same time it also veers off

317
00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:22,160
Speaker 2: into like just wild speculation.

318
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Speaker 1: Okay, I gotta see it now.

319
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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's I can't really get across how good it is.

320
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Speaker 2: And it's one of those ones where you know when

321
00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:31,360
Speaker 2: somebody talks something up and you go in expecting high

322
00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:34,600
Speaker 2: hopes or with high hopes and you're invariably let down.

323
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Speaker 2: You will not be let down. All right, that's how

324
00:16:38,200 --> 00:16:40,640
Speaker 2: great it is. I expect texts from you every like

325
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Speaker 2: couple hours while you're watching it.

326
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Speaker 1: Should we take a break? Yeah, all right, let's take

327
00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:47,800
Speaker 1: a break. We've got it set up in that he

328
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Speaker 1: is going to take this final voyage to restore his

329
00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:54,040
Speaker 1: name and we'll be back right after this. I'll let

330
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Speaker 1: you know what happened.

331
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Speaker 2: Okay, So, Lady Jane Franklin has successfully secured the appointment

332
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Speaker 2: as head of this expedition in eighteen forty six. I

333
00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:28,840
Speaker 2: believe in eighteen forty six expedition to the Arctic to

334
00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:33,000
Speaker 2: uncharted territory, largely because no one else would accept it,

335
00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:35,760
Speaker 2: but also because she maneuvered. I don't think. I think

336
00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:39,399
Speaker 2: without her wrangling he still might not have gotten it.

337
00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:41,639
Speaker 2: Even though no one else wanted it. He was ready

338
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Speaker 2: to go out to pasture, and the Royal Navy was

339
00:17:44,080 --> 00:17:46,440
Speaker 2: more than willing to let him go. Lady James Franklin

340
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Speaker 2: said no, meet my sheer will, and they did, and

341
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Speaker 2: so he became head. And it's not like he was

342
00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:57,200
Speaker 2: just some hapless boob or something like that. He wasn't

343
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Speaker 2: the finest captain in the Royal Navy. He wasn't the

344
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:03,760
Speaker 2: worst either. He was just you know, average, and his

345
00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:06,040
Speaker 2: track record wasn't so great, and there were plenty of

346
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Speaker 2: other captains in the Royal Navy that had far better

347
00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:12,680
Speaker 2: track records than him. But again, I don't want to

348
00:18:12,680 --> 00:18:15,560
Speaker 2: get across like he was the wrong man for the job.

349
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Speaker 2: He just wasn't necessarily the best man for the job.

350
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Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. I was trying to make up a funny

351
00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:23,639
Speaker 1: name for the worst captain in the Royal Navy.

352
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Speaker 2: But stop I got I got nothing either.

353
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Speaker 1: Yeah.

354
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Speaker 2: No matter how I try, I guarantee it won't be good.

355
00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:37,359
Speaker 1: Like, uh, oh, what's something funny about someone who can't sail?

356
00:18:39,560 --> 00:18:40,920
Speaker 2: They have lead feet?

357
00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:43,840
Speaker 1: About lead foot Mick can't swim?

358
00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:48,639
Speaker 2: Oh boy, that's not a good sailor right there? Or

359
00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:51,000
Speaker 2: James Francis can't steer?

360
00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:56,359
Speaker 1: Right? Yeah? I love it. Should we speaking of steering?

361
00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:57,560
Speaker 1: Should we talk about these boats?

362
00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:00,840
Speaker 2: Uh? Yeah, let's because they're kind of important too.

363
00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:04,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, very important. One, as I guess, is named for

364
00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:07,320
Speaker 1: the TV show The Terror or vice versa. Yeah, and

365
00:19:07,400 --> 00:19:09,439
Speaker 1: the Arabis. What also said it was named after the

366
00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:14,520
Speaker 1: TV show and the Arabis. These were previous to this outing.

367
00:19:14,600 --> 00:19:18,800
Speaker 1: They were they were warships, but they were ships that didn't,

368
00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:20,960
Speaker 1: you know, have like cannons up and down the sides.

369
00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:25,840
Speaker 1: They were delivering big mortar rounds close to shore, so

370
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,960
Speaker 1: they were they were squatty, and they were super strong,

371
00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:33,159
Speaker 1: and they were sailing ships. But they were retrofitted for

372
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Speaker 1: this adventure. I keep calling you an adventure.

373
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Speaker 2: It was an adventure. I think that's yeah.

374
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Speaker 1: For a while at least they were retrofitted in a

375
00:19:40,440 --> 00:19:42,959
Speaker 1: bunch of ways. First of all, adding these iron plates

376
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Speaker 1: to the front to you know, break through the ice.

377
00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:48,280
Speaker 1: But then they also added a steam engine to this

378
00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:52,600
Speaker 1: sailing vessel, not to just use full time, but you know,

379
00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:55,000
Speaker 1: because you require too much coal, you can't do something

380
00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:58,480
Speaker 1: like that, but to get you through, like like I

381
00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:00,280
Speaker 1: was talking about that moving ice. If they were like,

382
00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:01,920
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, we need to get over there quick

383
00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:05,000
Speaker 1: because I see a channel that's closing, they could kick

384
00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:07,439
Speaker 1: in that steam and get over there faster. That's just

385
00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:09,960
Speaker 1: like one ways that they would use the steam engine.

386
00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:12,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, like if you were playing Frogger, you wanted your

387
00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:16,680
Speaker 2: steam engines going exactly. So they also figured out how

388
00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:20,119
Speaker 2: to use the steam as basically central heating. This was

389
00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:22,760
Speaker 2: like a cool state of the art. We're talking like

390
00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:26,240
Speaker 2: the late eighteen forties here, and these guys were going

391
00:20:26,280 --> 00:20:28,399
Speaker 2: on an Arctic expedition and I think they may have

392
00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:31,240
Speaker 2: been the first crew ever to sail into the Arctic

393
00:20:31,320 --> 00:20:35,840
Speaker 2: with central heat. So that was an enormous luxury. And

394
00:20:35,920 --> 00:20:40,800
Speaker 2: they also used the steam system as a water distillation system,

395
00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:43,320
Speaker 2: so they had all the fresh water they needed, but

396
00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:47,800
Speaker 2: they could desalinate it, they could decontaminate it. It was

397
00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:50,920
Speaker 2: just a really ingenious system, all kind of built into one.

398
00:20:51,480 --> 00:20:55,040
Speaker 1: Yeah. And if you're wondering about the propellers, sure being

399
00:20:55,040 --> 00:20:58,240
Speaker 1: a problem with the ice. They actually retracted back into

400
00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:01,800
Speaker 1: the hole when they were in shallow water and icy water.

401
00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:05,640
Speaker 1: So for the eighteen forties, this felt like a very

402
00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:06,480
Speaker 1: modern operation.

403
00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:10,760
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, for sure. So it's important to remember though

404
00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:12,560
Speaker 2: that the steam was meant to just kind of give

405
00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:15,320
Speaker 2: them a boost. They were still sailing ships, that's yes.

406
00:21:15,400 --> 00:21:17,359
Speaker 2: Mostly how they moved was through sale.

407
00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, and they brought a lot of stuff. We always

408
00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:23,040
Speaker 1: like to talk about, oh boy, the load of any

409
00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:25,720
Speaker 1: expedition and what they kind of carried, because it's usually

410
00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:29,359
Speaker 1: a precursor too. They didn't either have enough or they

411
00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:33,160
Speaker 1: had the wrong stuff. They had thirty two thousand pounds

412
00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:37,480
Speaker 1: of beef, thirty three pounds of tinned meat, which will

413
00:21:38,000 --> 00:21:39,760
Speaker 1: very much come into play. We'll get to that later.

414
00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:43,520
Speaker 1: They had fresh veggies, they had livestock. They had live

415
00:21:43,560 --> 00:21:44,760
Speaker 1: animals on board, right.

416
00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:49,520
Speaker 2: They had cattle, sheep, pigs, hens. Sure, all meant to

417
00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:53,480
Speaker 2: probably not last very long, and then eating was good

418
00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:57,000
Speaker 2: at first, exactly. They also had pets to chuck. There

419
00:21:57,000 --> 00:21:59,480
Speaker 2: were three pets there was a monkey that Lady Jane

420
00:21:59,520 --> 00:22:02,359
Speaker 2: Franklin gave to the ship as a president, and I

421
00:22:02,359 --> 00:22:05,919
Speaker 2: guess was kind of Captain Franklin's pet. Yeah, and they

422
00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:08,280
Speaker 2: apparently used to steal stuff a lot, but it was

423
00:22:08,560 --> 00:22:11,600
Speaker 2: a super cute monkey, so everybody forgave him every time. Yeah.

424
00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:14,680
Speaker 2: Much more popular was a dog named Neptune and Newfoundland.

425
00:22:15,320 --> 00:22:17,760
Speaker 2: I mean, come on, it gotta have a dog on board.

426
00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:19,680
Speaker 2: And then there was a cat that may or may

427
00:22:19,720 --> 00:22:21,800
Speaker 2: not have had a name, because I think I got

428
00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:25,840
Speaker 2: this information from a historian named John Geiger, who was

429
00:22:25,880 --> 00:22:30,919
Speaker 2: basically dedicated as a career to the Franklin expedition, and

430
00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:33,320
Speaker 2: he does not name this cat, and the fact that

431
00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:35,400
Speaker 2: he didn't makes me think that cat didn't have a name.

432
00:22:35,720 --> 00:22:37,800
Speaker 2: It was just the cat.

433
00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:39,960
Speaker 1: I don't think they named cats for a while.

434
00:22:40,320 --> 00:22:40,720
Speaker 2: Yeah.

435
00:22:40,960 --> 00:22:43,879
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've seen a lot of historical stories where there

436
00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:45,840
Speaker 1: was like a cat they just called cat.

437
00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:50,440
Speaker 2: So like mister Sphinx didn't come around until like the seventies. Maybe,

438
00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:54,040
Speaker 2: I don't know, we'll find out. What's the short stuff

439
00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:55,359
Speaker 2: just waiting to happen.

440
00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:58,959
Speaker 1: I totally They also had thousands of pounds of sugar,

441
00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:02,480
Speaker 1: had ton of spices. I mentioned the veggies they had.

442
00:23:03,119 --> 00:23:05,680
Speaker 1: You gotta have tobacco. They had about seven thousand plus

443
00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:10,119
Speaker 1: pounds of tobacco, tons of booze, four thousand gallons of

444
00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:15,199
Speaker 1: either rum or wine, close to three thousand pounds of

445
00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:18,560
Speaker 1: candles so they could see because you know, it gets

446
00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:21,240
Speaker 1: during the winter there, it's dark for long, long periods

447
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:21,600
Speaker 1: of time.

448
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:22,119
Speaker 2: For sure.

449
00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:24,240
Speaker 1: Lemon juice, lots of lemon.

450
00:23:24,119 --> 00:23:26,320
Speaker 2: Juice, that's a big one. They had nine hundred and

451
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:29,680
Speaker 2: thirty gallons of lemon juice to stave off scurvy, and

452
00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:34,120
Speaker 2: every crew member got an ounce a day, and unfortunately

453
00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:36,320
Speaker 2: it didn't work for a lot of people. A lot

454
00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:38,880
Speaker 2: of guys seemed to have gotten scurvy. Their teeth fell out,

455
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:41,640
Speaker 2: and they were fatigued, and all sorts of terrible things

456
00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:45,439
Speaker 2: happened because of a vitamin C deficiency. And yet they

457
00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:49,960
Speaker 2: had enough lemon And apparently historians think that the lemon

458
00:23:50,040 --> 00:23:53,440
Speaker 2: juice may have started to ferment, and so to kill

459
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:56,639
Speaker 2: off those that bacteria, they may have boiled the lemon

460
00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:59,359
Speaker 2: juice to get kind of recharge it, and in doing

461
00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:02,320
Speaker 2: so I would render the ascorbic acid, the vitamin C

462
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:06,159
Speaker 2: totally ineffective, inert. Basically and so they could have been

463
00:24:06,200 --> 00:24:08,240
Speaker 2: drinking lemon juice all day long and they still would

464
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:11,840
Speaker 2: have gotten scurvy. So that's a great theory. I don't

465
00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:14,199
Speaker 2: know how accurate it is, but it's the best one

466
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:16,119
Speaker 2: i've heard. It's also the only one I've heard, but

467
00:24:16,119 --> 00:24:17,320
Speaker 2: it's still pretty good.

468
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:20,199
Speaker 1: And how about we set up the first part of

469
00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:25,439
Speaker 1: this tinned food thing and then we'll reveal what happened later. Yeah,

470
00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 1: but he you know, it was sort of a new thing.

471
00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:31,359
Speaker 1: Usually you would take dry goods like salted pork and

472
00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:33,280
Speaker 1: stuff like that if you wanted to eat well on

473
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:35,760
Speaker 1: a ship. But Franklin said, no, let's do this a

474
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:41,760
Speaker 1: little better. Tinning technology is new. I'm in a contract

475
00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:45,919
Speaker 1: with this guy's named Stephen Goldener, and he's well, I

476
00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:47,439
Speaker 1: was about to say the best at this, but he

477
00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:51,760
Speaker 1: was doing this and they said, give us whatever you

478
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:55,119
Speaker 1: can get us on time. We need eight tins of food,

479
00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:59,120
Speaker 1: cooked beef, cooked pork, preserve meat, all soup even.

480
00:24:59,280 --> 00:24:59,800
Speaker 2: Don't forget that.

481
00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,080
Speaker 1: Oh well, what is pemmican? I've heard of that.

482
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 2: It's uh, it's it's I saw it described as paste

483
00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:11,919
Speaker 2: of dried and pounded meat mixed with fat and spices.

484
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,840
Speaker 2: I saw it compared to oily beef jerkey, and then

485
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:18,880
Speaker 2: some people like I guess keto, people like we'll add

486
00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:21,040
Speaker 2: like maybe some fruit or something to it, just for

487
00:25:21,119 --> 00:25:23,960
Speaker 2: a little bit of carbs. Okay, But it was a

488
00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:26,920
Speaker 2: very popular staple in the Arctic because it was fatty

489
00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:29,480
Speaker 2: and full of protein and that's what you needed. Those

490
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 2: are good things, yeah.

491
00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:34,199
Speaker 1: For sure. And Goldener was like, all right, uh, this

492
00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:36,360
Speaker 1: stuff is gonna be great. It'll last you a few

493
00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:39,440
Speaker 1: years and I need to get to work though, because

494
00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:43,720
Speaker 1: I have a short timeline. But delivered those tins and

495
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:45,320
Speaker 1: that's where we're gonna leave it for now.

496
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:49,440
Speaker 2: Yeah. So they they took on all these supplies I

497
00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:56,880
Speaker 2: think after they passed Scotland in Disco Bay d s KO. Yeah. Yeah,

498
00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:01,160
Speaker 2: they do not dance in Disco Bay. That's in Greenland

499
00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:03,640
Speaker 2: on the west coast of Greenland. That's where they took

500
00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:07,560
Speaker 2: on supplies. And then also really interestingly, they left behind

501
00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:10,280
Speaker 2: five guys. There were originally one hundred and thirty four

502
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:13,600
Speaker 2: crew members, but five of them were left behind in

503
00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:17,200
Speaker 2: Greenland because they were basically booted off the ship by Franklin.

504
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:20,920
Speaker 2: The only explanation I saw is that they had run

505
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:24,359
Speaker 2: a foul of his bands on swearing and drunkenness, so

506
00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:28,800
Speaker 2: they actually managed to avoid this grim fate by cursing

507
00:26:28,840 --> 00:26:34,360
Speaker 2: and being drunk essentially. So yeah, for sure. So they

508
00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:36,640
Speaker 2: took on all of these supplies. They took on the coal,

509
00:26:36,680 --> 00:26:39,480
Speaker 2: they took on all the tin meat and all that,

510
00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:44,000
Speaker 2: and they started sailing toward baff And Bay. Not the

511
00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:46,040
Speaker 2: one in Texas. This one is up in the Arctic.

512
00:26:46,640 --> 00:26:50,040
Speaker 2: And they were about to enter Lancaster Sound, or they did.

513
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:53,600
Speaker 2: Right before they did, they were sighted by a couple

514
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:56,440
Speaker 2: of whaling ships, the Enterprise and the Prince of Wales.

515
00:26:57,040 --> 00:27:00,280
Speaker 2: And it's really disappointing. They didn't spell the Prince of

516
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:02,920
Speaker 2: Whales like a whale. They build it like the country.

517
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:04,640
Speaker 2: It's a whaling chip.

518
00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:07,600
Speaker 1: Come on, yeah, I mean, and boat names are supposed

519
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 1: to be buns.

520
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:12,880
Speaker 2: For sure, for sure. Like, oh man, I can't think

521
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 2: of one right now.

522
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:15,080
Speaker 1: I can't either.

523
00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:17,760
Speaker 2: All of them are, though, aren't they. Yeah, at least

524
00:27:17,760 --> 00:27:20,800
Speaker 2: the one's in Florida, and you know California, like San Diego.

525
00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:22,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're very funny usually.

526
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:25,320
Speaker 2: Okay, So these whaling ships hung out with them. Apparently

527
00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:27,240
Speaker 2: they boarded and like looked around and they were like,

528
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:29,800
Speaker 2: oh my god, central heat. When they took their leave

529
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:33,119
Speaker 2: of the Arabis and the terror, they were the last people.

530
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:37,399
Speaker 2: They were the last Europeans to see these people alive.

531
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: That's right.

532
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:40,639
Speaker 2: And one of the other things I just want to

533
00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:44,960
Speaker 2: say about Lancaster Sound chuck from baff And Bay. If

534
00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:47,119
Speaker 2: you look at it on a map and they don't

535
00:27:47,160 --> 00:27:49,280
Speaker 2: map out the sea ice, it is a You could

536
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 2: shoot an arrow from baff And Bay to the Arctic Ocean,

537
00:27:52,560 --> 00:27:56,120
Speaker 2: which would eventually take you to the Pacific, just straight

538
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 2: through Lancaster Sound. And yet because of the ice, it

539
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:03,560
Speaker 2: was so bad they couldn't go anywhere near across Lancaster Sound.

540
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:05,480
Speaker 2: They had to immediately start to go south.

541
00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, boy, go south. Indeed, I guess we should talk

542
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:13,080
Speaker 1: a little bit about sort of how you navigate through

543
00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:16,399
Speaker 1: this ice. We did mention that that had, you know,

544
00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:18,880
Speaker 1: iron on the front of their ships, and any any

545
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,280
Speaker 1: sort of ice ship or fishing ship that's in icy

546
00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:25,560
Speaker 1: waters will have a reinforced hull because you know, you

547
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 1: can break through some of this stuff. If you ever

548
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:30,760
Speaker 1: watch you know, Deadliest Catch. They do that kind of

549
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:33,480
Speaker 1: thing here and there. But if you really get sort

550
00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:36,640
Speaker 1: of in a position where you you know the ice

551
00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:39,160
Speaker 1: is too thick, and you know this ice is continually

552
00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:42,960
Speaker 1: being just smashed against the shore until you have like

553
00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:46,000
Speaker 1: ice mountains along the shoreline and it just it just

554
00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,520
Speaker 1: stacks up on each other. So eventually, if you get

555
00:28:48,520 --> 00:28:51,280
Speaker 1: to a place where you really can't get through, there

556
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:53,000
Speaker 1: are a couple of things you can do. You can

557
00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:55,960
Speaker 1: wait for summer and like cross your fingers that it'll melt,

558
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:58,520
Speaker 1: because it may not even melt then. Or you can

559
00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:03,000
Speaker 1: use a process called warp, which is when you basically

560
00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:06,960
Speaker 1: inch yourself along little by little by If there's land nearby,

561
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 1: you could like tie yourself to something strong on land

562
00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:13,840
Speaker 1: and winch yourself by little by little. If there's no

563
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:16,320
Speaker 1: land around, you can put your anchor in a dinghy

564
00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:19,480
Speaker 1: and send somebody out, probably not a dingy, a little

565
00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:24,040
Speaker 1: bit bigger boat, drop the anchor, and then wind yourself

566
00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:27,920
Speaker 1: toward that anchor. But it is extremely slow going if

567
00:29:27,960 --> 00:29:30,080
Speaker 1: you can even get through at that point. I think

568
00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:33,800
Speaker 1: Edie's one example of a rescue expedition that was trying

569
00:29:33,840 --> 00:29:37,640
Speaker 1: to find Franklin that spent nine hours basically going the

570
00:29:37,720 --> 00:29:39,680
Speaker 1: length of their ship like an inch at a time,

571
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:44,920
Speaker 1: So it's not fun. It is, but it's like that

572
00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 1: may be your only chance at survival sometimes because you can,

573
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,320
Speaker 1: you could get stuck in ice forever and die for sure.

574
00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 2: And that's actually what the Franklin Expedition found themselves in

575
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:58,040
Speaker 2: that situation. Now, at first they were doing fine. They

576
00:29:59,080 --> 00:30:05,200
Speaker 2: wintered Ichy Island, which is not very far past where

577
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:09,160
Speaker 2: they entered from baff And Bay, because I think they

578
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:15,400
Speaker 2: set sail on May nineteenth, and winter comes quickly, right exactly,

579
00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:20,440
Speaker 2: They finally oh sorry, they finally left Disco Bay in

580
00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:23,600
Speaker 2: July of eighteen forty five. So yeah, winter comes way

581
00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:26,280
Speaker 2: earlier up there than it does here. So they wintered

582
00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:30,240
Speaker 2: pretty quickly and they were successful that first winter. I

583
00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:32,880
Speaker 2: started to melt and they started to do some cool

584
00:30:32,920 --> 00:30:38,560
Speaker 2: little navigating and apparently doing U turns and all sorts

585
00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:42,040
Speaker 2: of stuff that will never probably know exactly what they did. Yeah,

586
00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:44,400
Speaker 2: but that first winter and summer went fine.

587
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:49,239
Speaker 1: Yeah, but three guys did die of basically kind of

588
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:51,400
Speaker 1: how you die back then in those conditions. Could have

589
00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:54,160
Speaker 1: been pneumonia, it could have been I mean, he knows

590
00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:55,840
Speaker 1: what kind of helped some of these guys are in

591
00:30:55,920 --> 00:30:59,200
Speaker 1: but it wasn't anything like super unusual. They just lost

592
00:30:59,240 --> 00:30:59,680
Speaker 1: three guys.

593
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:04,840
Speaker 2: Yes, but that supposedly was not a good record, even

594
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:08,080
Speaker 2: for an Arctic expedition, losing three guys that quickly. Yeah,

595
00:31:08,480 --> 00:31:11,760
Speaker 2: So aside from the three deaths, fine, things went pretty

596
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:16,160
Speaker 2: well compared to the rest of the expedition. That was great, right, Sure,

597
00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:19,560
Speaker 2: So the first winter comes and goes, the first summer

598
00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:21,719
Speaker 2: comes and goes, and now they've made it to the

599
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:26,720
Speaker 2: northwest corner of King William Island and they get they

600
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:29,800
Speaker 2: get iced in for the winter. And again, this is

601
00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:32,760
Speaker 2: what they're expecting. They had three years worth of supplies.

602
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:35,920
Speaker 2: They figured it would take that long to circumnavigate all

603
00:31:35,920 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 2: of this, you know, this ice flow and throughout these seasons.

604
00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:44,040
Speaker 2: So they're not worried yet. When they start to worry

605
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:47,040
Speaker 2: is when the next summer comes and the ice doesn't

606
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:48,520
Speaker 2: melt right.

607
00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 1: And that's what I mentioned earlier by crossing your fingers.

608
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:54,280
Speaker 1: You know, it sometimes it melts, sometimes it doesn't. It

609
00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 1: all depends on the conditions at the time. At this point,

610
00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:00,320
Speaker 1: they had been there for a while, like you said,

611
00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:03,160
Speaker 1: we're surviving and they were even sending guys ashore that

612
00:32:03,240 --> 00:32:08,680
Speaker 1: were you charting their location, and nothing was really out

613
00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:11,360
Speaker 1: of the ordinary, like you said, until they were like,

614
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:15,480
Speaker 1: well we're still stuck, and that's when it got fairly scary.

615
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:19,560
Speaker 1: This is I guess spring or what would be spring.

616
00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 1: I don't even know what you would call may in

617
00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:26,440
Speaker 1: that area in eighteen forty seven Winter part two, maybe sure,

618
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:30,720
Speaker 1: there was a team that went to leave. They had

619
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:34,200
Speaker 1: this method for leaving messages. They would use these Royal

620
00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:38,840
Speaker 1: Navy forms, basically like they should have just had letterhead

621
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:40,360
Speaker 1: because they would have had more room to write, but

622
00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:43,240
Speaker 1: instead they would write in the margins of these Royal

623
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:45,400
Speaker 1: Navy forms, just to make sure people knew it was them,

624
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:49,680
Speaker 1: and they would leave them in sealed canisters in various places.

625
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:53,320
Speaker 1: This one was under a cairn that someone else had

626
00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:57,720
Speaker 1: built before them, and it was a pretty brief note.

627
00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:02,400
Speaker 1: Things were okay, nothing out of the ordinary to report

628
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,960
Speaker 1: at that time. These people came back to the ship

629
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:09,239
Speaker 1: from you know, delivering this note and making sure it

630
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,600
Speaker 1: was safe to be found later. And Franklin had died

631
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:14,880
Speaker 1: while they were gone on June eleventh.

632
00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:19,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, they even said in the note Franklin commanding and

633
00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:23,760
Speaker 2: then all as far as we know, right, So that's

634
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:26,000
Speaker 2: I mean that's kind of a big deal. I mean,

635
00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 2: the leader of the expedition dies, it's not like, well,

636
00:33:31,360 --> 00:33:32,800
Speaker 2: what do we do now? I Mean there was a

637
00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:37,400
Speaker 2: second in command, a guy named Francis Krozer, and then

638
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 2: a third in command named James Fitzjames, so there was

639
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:43,800
Speaker 2: like a clear chain of command of able captains and leaders.

640
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,360
Speaker 2: Right sure, but it's still I mean, at the very least,

641
00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:49,000
Speaker 2: that's just seems like bad juju when you're up on

642
00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 2: an Arctic expedition and you've been snowed in through summer, right.

643
00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:55,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, and a few other people died too, so at

644
00:33:55,200 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 1: this point they've lost, you know, probably close to ten people.

645
00:33:59,160 --> 00:34:02,280
Speaker 2: So from remember eighteen forty six when they first got

646
00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:06,040
Speaker 2: iced in for the second time, this time off the

647
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 2: northwest coast of King William Island, all the way through

648
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:13,879
Speaker 2: eighteen forty eight and actually beyond, they just sat there.

649
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:17,600
Speaker 2: Their ships were iced in. They didn't move. They just

650
00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:19,680
Speaker 2: stayed there. If the ice moved, then the ships moved,

651
00:34:19,680 --> 00:34:21,840
Speaker 2: but that was it. They didn't move within the ice.

652
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:24,640
Speaker 2: And these guys are like living on these ships, kind

653
00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:26,960
Speaker 2: of living on shore. They made camps and then they

654
00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:31,319
Speaker 2: finally abandoned the ships because it was becoming clear that

655
00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:35,319
Speaker 2: I guess Krozier had this gamble to make. He could

656
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:39,080
Speaker 2: either wait to see if the ice melted next summer,

657
00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:43,160
Speaker 2: and in which case they could probably make it through

658
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:45,560
Speaker 2: to safety. They could sail the safety during the summer

659
00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:49,960
Speaker 2: and be saved, but if the ice didn't melt, he

660
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:54,520
Speaker 2: would have wasted several months waiting to see if the

661
00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:57,840
Speaker 2: ice melted when they could have been walking to safety.

662
00:34:58,360 --> 00:35:02,600
Speaker 2: And he chose option B. He said, we need to

663
00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:06,000
Speaker 2: start moving towards safety because I don't think that the

664
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:07,359
Speaker 2: ice is going to melt again.

665
00:35:08,239 --> 00:35:13,719
Speaker 1: Yeah. And the Inuit, uh, the ones who listened to them,

666
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:17,360
Speaker 1: a few dozen of them did make it to mainland Canada.

667
00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:20,280
Speaker 1: But just because you made it to mainland Canada doesn't

668
00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:23,400
Speaker 1: mean like that you're saved. Like they were still in

669
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:29,080
Speaker 1: big trouble. Yeah, obviously at this point, Lady Jane, well,

670
00:35:29,120 --> 00:35:29,960
Speaker 1: should we take a break now?

671
00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 2: Actually, yeah, let's take a break.

672
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, we'll take a break and talk about

673
00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:58,520
Speaker 1: what lady Jane did right for this. All right. So

674
00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:03,080
Speaker 1: at this point, things are going really bad the expedition itself,

675
00:36:03,120 --> 00:36:06,080
Speaker 1: as far as trying to get these last three hundred

676
00:36:06,080 --> 00:36:08,800
Speaker 1: miles that that passage figured out was. I mean, forget

677
00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:10,959
Speaker 1: about that. At this point. These guys are just trying

678
00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:11,840
Speaker 1: to be alive.

679
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:17,760
Speaker 2: They're walking across yeah, frozen sea ice that they're just walking.

680
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:21,160
Speaker 2: It's that much ice that it's just like one continuous

681
00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:22,520
Speaker 2: sheet all the way to Canada.

682
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:26,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, not a healthy prospect for survival.

683
00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:28,520
Speaker 2: No. And one other thing, Chuck, I want to throw in.

684
00:36:28,640 --> 00:36:32,560
Speaker 2: They're not just walking. They're pushing huge ships loaded with supplies.

685
00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:36,279
Speaker 2: They're dragging them and pushing them along this ice and rock.

686
00:36:37,080 --> 00:36:40,719
Speaker 1: Okay, not a fun task, no, exactly. So this is

687
00:36:40,719 --> 00:36:44,920
Speaker 1: where the search period begins, which spanned from eighteen forty

688
00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 1: seven to eighteen fifty nine. All kinds of people went

689
00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:52,560
Speaker 1: out looking. Lady Jane was ringing that bell. The Royal

690
00:36:52,640 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 1: Navy was offering up twenty thousand pounds in eighteen fifty

691
00:36:57,440 --> 00:36:58,080
Speaker 1: ton of money.

692
00:36:58,160 --> 00:36:58,680
Speaker 2: Do you I know.

693
00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:01,480
Speaker 1: Hear it? Was this an American?

694
00:37:01,600 --> 00:37:04,440
Speaker 2: Or I got both, buddy, Well, let's hear it. That

695
00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:06,719
Speaker 2: would be two point two million pounds today or two

696
00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:08,640
Speaker 2: point eight million dollars today.

697
00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:09,840
Speaker 1: What about euros?

698
00:37:10,360 --> 00:37:13,720
Speaker 2: Oh? I didn't do that one. You got me interesting,

699
00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:16,839
Speaker 2: You could have said, what about Drachmas.

700
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:18,680
Speaker 1: You're typically more thorough. But that's fine.

701
00:37:18,920 --> 00:37:21,279
Speaker 2: Sorry, No, that's it, man.

702
00:37:21,320 --> 00:37:24,920
Speaker 1: That's a lot of money enough to attract what eventually

703
00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:31,319
Speaker 1: ended up being over thirty expeditions that were gonna be

704
00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:33,919
Speaker 1: fraught with the same peril, you know. I mean it's

705
00:37:33,920 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 1: not like things had changed and it was now easy,

706
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:40,320
Speaker 1: but it was you know, it's sort of like in Jaws.

707
00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:43,520
Speaker 1: You know, all these all these people had money on

708
00:37:43,560 --> 00:37:45,360
Speaker 1: their mind. They had their mind on their money and

709
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:48,320
Speaker 1: the money on their minds right, and wanted all those pounds,

710
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:51,640
Speaker 1: and it was a big uh, it was a big

711
00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:54,759
Speaker 1: public thing. Like people, people wanted them back, and they

712
00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:56,880
Speaker 1: tried to get them back their hardest.

713
00:37:56,960 --> 00:37:59,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, because you know, one of the reasons why John

714
00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:01,640
Speaker 2: Franklin was known was because he was the man who

715
00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:04,600
Speaker 2: ate his boot, going to get that guy the English public, right,

716
00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:07,239
Speaker 2: and the English public was also very much fascinated with

717
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:12,160
Speaker 2: Arctic exploration. It would be kind of analogous to the

718
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:15,480
Speaker 2: American public being interested in going to the moon in

719
00:38:15,520 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 2: the sixties.

720
00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:19,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, kind of like that. Yeah, not like no, no

721
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:20,480
Speaker 1: one cares, no.

722
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:24,319
Speaker 2: Sadly, hopefully everybody will get reinterested again when we start

723
00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:25,560
Speaker 2: going to the moon again soon.

724
00:38:26,640 --> 00:38:29,440
Speaker 1: One of the big names in the one of these

725
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:33,160
Speaker 1: search parties was a guy named John Ray. He was

726
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:37,239
Speaker 1: He was a guy that sort of well, we'll get

727
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:40,239
Speaker 1: to kind of his big reveal in a second here,

728
00:38:40,320 --> 00:38:44,879
Speaker 1: but he was very noteworthy and proficient guy. He knew

729
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:47,400
Speaker 1: what he was doing. He had been all over the Arctic.

730
00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:49,160
Speaker 1: I think he was one of the guys who listened

731
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:50,120
Speaker 1: to the Inuit, right.

732
00:38:50,480 --> 00:38:53,080
Speaker 2: He was, and he was. He got shouted down as

733
00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:56,799
Speaker 2: a result because he came back from this exploration and

734
00:38:56,960 --> 00:39:00,640
Speaker 2: interviewing a number of Inuit and he said, hey, they

735
00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:05,400
Speaker 2: told me that these guys probably not probably, but definitely

736
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:10,080
Speaker 2: engaged in cannibalism. That's how desperate they became. And that

737
00:39:10,120 --> 00:39:12,839
Speaker 2: did not No, that did not sit well with Lady

738
00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:16,400
Speaker 2: Jane Franklin, and she actually got Charles Dickens to basically

739
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:20,480
Speaker 2: write this diatribe about how terrible a person Ray was

740
00:39:20,520 --> 00:39:24,359
Speaker 2: for listening to the Inuit and how terrible, yeah, how

741
00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:27,520
Speaker 2: terrible the Inuit were. John Geiger says that it was

742
00:39:28,640 --> 00:39:31,319
Speaker 2: just a stain on his reputation that continues today. It

743
00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:34,000
Speaker 2: was very racist, the stuff that he wrote, and he

744
00:39:34,040 --> 00:39:37,360
Speaker 2: did it on behalf of Lady Jane Franklin. To basically say, like,

745
00:39:37,760 --> 00:39:41,759
Speaker 2: you're slandering these heroes, and Dickens even said, if there's

746
00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:44,480
Speaker 2: if they're dead, I'll bet it was the Inuit that

747
00:39:44,560 --> 00:39:49,000
Speaker 2: did this. Anything but the possibility that they actually became

748
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:51,560
Speaker 2: so desperate to engage you cannibalism. And as we'll see,

749
00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:54,720
Speaker 2: it turns out the Inuit who said that this happened

750
00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:57,840
Speaker 2: were actually proven correct, like a century later.

751
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:02,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, by the nineteen hundreds, they had found graves,

752
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 1: they had found corpses, they had found a lot of

753
00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:12,520
Speaker 1: the stuff except for the ships. And remarkably, just oh

754
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:15,520
Speaker 1: how long, not even ten years ago, in twenty fourteen,

755
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:18,480
Speaker 1: and in twenty sixteen they found the Erebus and the

756
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:24,200
Speaker 1: Terror respectively in about thirty feet of water, fairly intact

757
00:40:24,880 --> 00:40:27,719
Speaker 1: considering how long it had been. And this was I

758
00:40:27,760 --> 00:40:30,560
Speaker 1: think Terror was off of King William Island. Arabus was

759
00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:35,160
Speaker 1: a little further south near the Adelaide Peninsula. And they

760
00:40:35,400 --> 00:40:38,399
Speaker 1: just don't know for sure how the Arabis exactly got there,

761
00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:42,279
Speaker 1: whether it was sailed there or moved there, or just

762
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:45,879
Speaker 1: accidentally drifted there some combination of all those.

763
00:40:45,880 --> 00:40:48,480
Speaker 2: Who knows, Yeah, it's possible it drifted like after the

764
00:40:48,520 --> 00:40:51,360
Speaker 2: ice melted some people say maybe the ice moved it

765
00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:53,400
Speaker 2: all the way down there. That wouldn't have happened. It

766
00:40:53,400 --> 00:40:55,920
Speaker 2: would have crushed the boat. It could have very easily

767
00:40:55,960 --> 00:41:00,000
Speaker 2: been sailed. But either way, like finding those ships was annoyed.

768
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:05,760
Speaker 2: And there's really cool Parks Canada videos of scuba divers

769
00:41:05,760 --> 00:41:09,320
Speaker 2: swimming through these ships that are like almost entirely intact.

770
00:41:10,080 --> 00:41:13,200
Speaker 2: There's like still dishes on the shelves and bottles on

771
00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 2: shelves and like desks intact, and they the drawers are closed.

772
00:41:17,600 --> 00:41:20,680
Speaker 2: They think because of the state of the water and

773
00:41:20,719 --> 00:41:24,719
Speaker 2: the anaerobic conditions that there's probably lots of documentation of

774
00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:28,719
Speaker 2: what went on during the expedition in those drawers that

775
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:31,640
Speaker 2: they're going to eventually be able to get to totally.

776
00:41:32,719 --> 00:41:35,640
Speaker 1: As far as why they perished, there were a bunch

777
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:40,040
Speaker 1: of theories sort of you know, three of them can

778
00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:42,560
Speaker 1: be kind of lumped together, and it could happen to

779
00:41:42,680 --> 00:41:46,080
Speaker 1: sort of any expedition, which is, you know, bad luck

780
00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:48,600
Speaker 1: with the weather. You know, those two really bad winters

781
00:41:48,600 --> 00:41:51,920
Speaker 1: in a row, without that summer thaw that they maybe

782
00:41:51,920 --> 00:41:56,680
Speaker 1: were counting on, combined with not being as prepared as

783
00:41:56,680 --> 00:41:59,359
Speaker 1: you should have been. I guess two not three. Even

784
00:41:59,400 --> 00:42:02,120
Speaker 1: though they were prepared, they were heavily stocked. This was

785
00:42:02,160 --> 00:42:05,600
Speaker 1: just really rough territory, and the clothes they had might

786
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:08,239
Speaker 1: not have been perfect. They really held water well, which

787
00:42:08,239 --> 00:42:14,319
Speaker 1: would freeze. The equipment was really heavy. They, like we said,

788
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:17,160
Speaker 1: they weren't listening to the locals about how you should

789
00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:19,680
Speaker 1: really do things. They were doing things their way. So

790
00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:23,799
Speaker 1: that's a kind of underpreparedness. And so those are just

791
00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:26,919
Speaker 1: sort of under the normal ways that one could die

792
00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:28,080
Speaker 1: on an expedition like this.

793
00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:31,160
Speaker 2: Then, and with the bad luck in particular where they

794
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:34,400
Speaker 2: got iced in for that second winter, even the Inuit

795
00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:36,319
Speaker 2: are like, well, you don't really go around there. They

796
00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:39,640
Speaker 2: called it two New Knee, which is back of Beyond,

797
00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:42,000
Speaker 2: which is a terrible name for a place that you're

798
00:42:42,239 --> 00:42:44,640
Speaker 2: iced in in the Arctic. And then on that No

799
00:42:44,920 --> 00:42:48,400
Speaker 2: documentary they took ice core samples and they found that

800
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:51,520
Speaker 2: those winters that they were iced in were two of

801
00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:55,360
Speaker 2: the worst winters in seven hundred years in that area.

802
00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:56,600
Speaker 1: That's called bad luck.

803
00:42:56,640 --> 00:42:58,800
Speaker 2: They had terribly bad luck for sure.

804
00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, slash under prepared because they shouldn't have been there

805
00:43:01,719 --> 00:43:04,960
Speaker 1: to begin with, right, So those are all sort of

806
00:43:05,000 --> 00:43:07,759
Speaker 1: normal ways that you could perish. Like I said, the

807
00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:10,319
Speaker 1: last one that we have to talk about, though, is

808
00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:15,080
Speaker 1: this lead poisoning. We talked about the contract with the

809
00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:18,799
Speaker 1: guy that was innovating with his ten meats. He had

810
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:23,400
Speaker 1: rushed this thing through it apparently leaked lead and you know,

811
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:26,120
Speaker 1: it was lined with lead and that leaked into the food.

812
00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:29,279
Speaker 1: They did lots of studies over the years. The first,

813
00:43:29,360 --> 00:43:32,640
Speaker 1: I believe was nineteen eighty one. There was an anthropologist

814
00:43:32,719 --> 00:43:36,479
Speaker 1: named Owen, doctor Owen Beatty and basically was the first

815
00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:40,680
Speaker 1: person to say, you know, I think this. We literally

816
00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 1: are founding lead in their bones, like at levels that

817
00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:47,279
Speaker 1: we should not see. And it seems pretty obvious that

818
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:51,120
Speaker 1: was lead in the examined corpses. Like it may not

819
00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:53,480
Speaker 1: have been everything, but it definitely had something to do

820
00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:54,840
Speaker 1: with a lot of the deaths.

821
00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:57,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's kind of criticized that he didn't have a

822
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:00,840
Speaker 2: control group, Like it's possible these guys had tons of

823
00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:03,799
Speaker 2: lead in their bodies anyway, just from lifelong exposure to lead,

824
00:44:04,200 --> 00:44:06,640
Speaker 2: and that it's possible their bones released it as they

825
00:44:07,000 --> 00:44:11,440
Speaker 2: started to die. Basically, we don't know because there isn't

826
00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:13,799
Speaker 2: a control group, but it is it's quite possible that

827
00:44:13,880 --> 00:44:16,279
Speaker 2: it had some effect on the expedition if it wasn't

828
00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:20,080
Speaker 2: directly killing people. They also think that the contaminated tins,

829
00:44:20,160 --> 00:44:23,080
Speaker 2: or that the poorly soldered tins may have been contaminated

830
00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:25,080
Speaker 2: with botulism, which would have killed off a lot of

831
00:44:25,080 --> 00:44:30,680
Speaker 2: people too. And then yeah, so's it's just not clear

832
00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:32,880
Speaker 2: a lot like those first three graves that they found

833
00:44:33,120 --> 00:44:35,759
Speaker 2: from the first winter, like you said they were, I

834
00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:41,040
Speaker 2: think they died from pneumonia from tuberculosis, But so few

835
00:44:41,160 --> 00:44:44,040
Speaker 2: people have been found and the state that they've been

836
00:44:44,080 --> 00:44:49,640
Speaker 2: found in hasn't really allowed for forensic anthropology to say

837
00:44:49,719 --> 00:44:51,480
Speaker 2: this is how this guy died, this is how this

838
00:44:51,560 --> 00:44:54,879
Speaker 2: guy died. So it's all left to the imagination. Yeah,

839
00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:56,440
Speaker 2: And I think one of the things that captures my

840
00:44:56,520 --> 00:45:02,040
Speaker 2: imagination the most is that there Inuit reports that in

841
00:45:02,080 --> 00:45:04,799
Speaker 2: the summer of either eighteen fifty one or eighteen fifty two,

842
00:45:05,320 --> 00:45:08,960
Speaker 2: there were still four survivors left from this crew, four

843
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:12,600
Speaker 2: of them and a dog, probably Neptune the Newfoundland, I imagine,

844
00:45:13,120 --> 00:45:15,040
Speaker 2: and that they were the most skilled at hunting, so

845
00:45:15,080 --> 00:45:16,960
Speaker 2: they had survived the longest and they were all that

846
00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:21,560
Speaker 2: was left, and by eighteen fifty one eighteen fifty two

847
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:25,759
Speaker 2: there had already been numerous search expeditions launched, so that

848
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:27,960
Speaker 2: means that there were people searching for them while there

849
00:45:27,960 --> 00:45:31,560
Speaker 2: were still survivors. They just didn't their paths didn't cross.

850
00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:34,879
Speaker 2: They just didn't find one another. And those guys were

851
00:45:34,920 --> 00:45:37,680
Speaker 2: those last four were the last of them, and I

852
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:39,160
Speaker 2: guess they did not go on.

853
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:42,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, I guess we should talk a little bit about

854
00:45:42,280 --> 00:45:45,759
Speaker 1: the cannibalism thing, because that's, you know, that was what

855
00:45:45,920 --> 00:45:50,040
Speaker 1: Ray was sort of brave enough to talk about and was,

856
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:53,280
Speaker 1: you know, like you said he was. He was basically

857
00:45:53,840 --> 00:45:56,640
Speaker 1: shunned because of this. They didn't want to hear anything

858
00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:59,239
Speaker 1: like that, and it turns out that he was. He

859
00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:01,160
Speaker 1: was basically he was right. I mean, there's no other

860
00:46:01,200 --> 00:46:04,200
Speaker 1: way to say it. They found cut marks on bones,

861
00:46:04,960 --> 00:46:09,359
Speaker 1: on leg bones, They found a skull from the same

862
00:46:09,400 --> 00:46:15,800
Speaker 1: person that was intentionally broken. All these like they now

863
00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:21,560
Speaker 1: that we know what cannibal sites look like, it has

864
00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:26,560
Speaker 1: all the markings basically literally, yeah, like intentionally breaking bones,

865
00:46:26,640 --> 00:46:32,400
Speaker 1: cutting bones on purpose. What else they found like clusters clusters.

866
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,200
Speaker 2: Of bones together like they'd just been tossed.

867
00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:37,040
Speaker 1: That weren't like just part of the body dying, Like

868
00:46:37,080 --> 00:46:38,760
Speaker 1: bones that shouldn't be together, were together.

869
00:46:39,120 --> 00:46:41,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, and then a lot of the bones that were

870
00:46:41,080 --> 00:46:44,319
Speaker 2: found were like long bones, so they suspect that they

871
00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:47,640
Speaker 2: had just been like carrying arms and legs. Is portable food.

872
00:46:49,160 --> 00:46:51,279
Speaker 2: It was. It was a bad jam. So there is

873
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:53,960
Speaker 2: it is clear that they did engage in cannibalism, and

874
00:46:54,200 --> 00:46:56,600
Speaker 2: not only was Ray right, they into it who told

875
00:46:56,680 --> 00:46:59,680
Speaker 2: Ray that they had engaged in cannibalism were right. And

876
00:47:00,200 --> 00:47:03,080
Speaker 2: throughout some of these expeditions that came during this what's

877
00:47:03,120 --> 00:47:06,480
Speaker 2: called the Franklin Search period from eighteen fifty seven to

878
00:47:06,480 --> 00:47:10,680
Speaker 2: fifty nine, a lot of Inuit agreed to be interviewed

879
00:47:11,200 --> 00:47:15,319
Speaker 2: with translators with some of these explorers, and they documented

880
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:18,520
Speaker 2: these interviews and it wasn't until like a century later

881
00:47:18,560 --> 00:47:21,600
Speaker 2: that historians like John Geiger went through this stuff and

882
00:47:21,719 --> 00:47:25,400
Speaker 2: was like, oh, the Inuit knew all along exactly what

883
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:28,440
Speaker 2: had happened. Apparently one of them pointed to where the

884
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:31,919
Speaker 2: ship was that I think the Arabis, and they still

885
00:47:31,960 --> 00:47:35,319
Speaker 2: didn't discover it for another century after that. So it's

886
00:47:35,320 --> 00:47:38,360
Speaker 2: a really interesting, just kind of side note that like

887
00:47:39,120 --> 00:47:41,880
Speaker 2: there's this whole group of people were willing to cooperate

888
00:47:41,920 --> 00:47:44,960
Speaker 2: and share their knowledge and they were just totally ignored

889
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:48,120
Speaker 2: and that's what led to the mystery that lasted for

890
00:47:48,200 --> 00:47:49,040
Speaker 2: over a century.

891
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:51,560
Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean, I think if it hadn't been for

892
00:47:51,640 --> 00:47:54,719
Speaker 1: him poking around more, they were quite happy just to

893
00:47:54,920 --> 00:47:57,200
Speaker 1: leave this as it was and that sort of be

894
00:47:57,280 --> 00:47:58,480
Speaker 1: the end of it all.

895
00:47:58,680 --> 00:48:01,319
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess, so, I guess.

896
00:48:01,320 --> 00:48:02,080
Speaker 1: So good stuff.

897
00:48:02,480 --> 00:48:05,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's the Franklin expedition. And now that we

898
00:48:05,560 --> 00:48:08,879
Speaker 2: found the ships, yeah, they are pretty confident they we'll

899
00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:11,160
Speaker 2: have a lot more information soon. So that'll be pretty

900
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:14,040
Speaker 2: cool to look out for. And since I said it's

901
00:48:14,120 --> 00:48:16,400
Speaker 2: cool to look out for. Oh, by the way, if

902
00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:17,920
Speaker 2: you want to know more about this, go check out

903
00:48:17,960 --> 00:48:21,879
Speaker 2: that Nova episode on it. It's really really good. And

904
00:48:22,840 --> 00:48:24,680
Speaker 2: since I said that, it's time for listener now.

905
00:48:27,400 --> 00:48:31,680
Speaker 1: I'm going to call this the shortest short stuff because

906
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:36,840
Speaker 1: this is from Kent and Kent Talks. He's basically sending

907
00:48:36,840 --> 00:48:39,680
Speaker 1: in a short stuff suggestion, but I think says enough

908
00:48:39,680 --> 00:48:41,319
Speaker 1: about the thing that it can just be its own

909
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:44,719
Speaker 1: little episode. Here at the end, Oh, we were talking

910
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:48,480
Speaker 1: about the seventies trucker craze on the trucker episode Long

911
00:48:48,520 --> 00:48:50,960
Speaker 1: Haul Trucking, and he said, we all know truckers have

912
00:48:51,000 --> 00:48:53,000
Speaker 1: their own lingo. But one phrase that has died out

913
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:56,920
Speaker 1: in usage is the mond Fort lane. Have you ever

914
00:48:56,960 --> 00:48:57,359
Speaker 1: heard of this?

915
00:48:57,760 --> 00:48:59,280
Speaker 2: I had until I wrote his email.

916
00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:01,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, the Montfort lane referred to the left lane of

917
00:49:01,920 --> 00:49:05,000
Speaker 1: the interstate. In the early seventies of Colorado, cattle legend

918
00:49:05,080 --> 00:49:09,000
Speaker 1: named Kenny Montfort started shipping meat to the East coast.

919
00:49:09,320 --> 00:49:12,600
Speaker 1: He had a fleet of supposedly triple digit trucks and

920
00:49:12,760 --> 00:49:16,240
Speaker 1: drivers who are not afraid to mash it. They turned

921
00:49:16,280 --> 00:49:19,360
Speaker 1: two trips a week from Colorado to New York City.

922
00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:22,280
Speaker 1: One driver recalled he had twelve hundred dollars in speeding

923
00:49:22,320 --> 00:49:25,160
Speaker 1: fines one year. When these were back when tickets were

924
00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:29,160
Speaker 1: about fifteen bucks and points didn't accumulate on your license.

925
00:49:29,520 --> 00:49:30,320
Speaker 2: It's important.

926
00:49:30,680 --> 00:49:32,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, you just rack them up forever and have the

927
00:49:32,880 --> 00:49:36,360
Speaker 1: company paid for him, I guess. And interestingly, the Monfort

928
00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:39,200
Speaker 1: family is now the principal owners of the Colorado Rockies

929
00:49:39,239 --> 00:49:42,239
Speaker 1: baseball team. That is very interesting, and that is from Kent.

930
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:45,319
Speaker 2: Thanks a lot, Kent, good stuff all around. That was

931
00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:47,319
Speaker 2: the short stuff right there on the end of the

932
00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:51,080
Speaker 2: Franklin Expedition episode. Great if you want to be like,

933
00:49:51,200 --> 00:49:52,040
Speaker 2: what was it, Kent?

934
00:49:52,719 --> 00:49:52,959
Speaker 1: Kent?

935
00:49:53,120 --> 00:49:54,759
Speaker 2: If you want to be like Kent and give us

936
00:49:54,800 --> 00:49:56,520
Speaker 2: a little short stuff that we can add on as

937
00:49:56,520 --> 00:49:58,640
Speaker 2: a listener mail. I think that's a cool new thing.

938
00:49:59,040 --> 00:50:02,000
Speaker 2: Let's give it a shot and you can send that

939
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:09,200
Speaker 2: to Stuff Podcasts at iHeartRadio dot com. Stuff you Should

940
00:50:09,239 --> 00:50:10,839
Speaker 2: Know is a production of iHeartRadio.

941
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:14,520
Speaker 1: For more podcasts my heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

942
00:50:14,719 --> 00:50:17,640
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.