Speaker 1: This is Ed Helms and I played Andy Bernard on
Speaker 1: The Office. Hello everybody, welcome back. This is the Office
Speaker 1: Deep Dive. In case you clicked on the wrong podcast,
Speaker 1: I'm your host Brian baum Gartner. Today I am delighted
Speaker 1: to bring you my conversation with America's banjo playing sweetheart
Speaker 1: Ed Helms. Um. Now, a lot of people don't know this.
Speaker 1: Ed and I knew each other very well, I mean
Speaker 1: very well. We went to the same high school. We
Speaker 1: went to the Westminster Schools in Atlanta, Georgia. We were
Speaker 1: in the same ensemble choir I think, or corral or
Speaker 1: something anyway where we sang back when I pretended to sing.
Speaker 1: He still sings, but I don't. I don't think so
Speaker 1: much anymore. But we had a bond and we're not
Speaker 1: just Georgians or Atlanta's. We are those things, but we
Speaker 1: are from the same high school in the same area
Speaker 1: and grew up with the same people. So our history
Speaker 1: is very very shared. And Ed and I lost. We
Speaker 1: weren't in touch for a number of years. He was
Speaker 1: doing stand up comedy and was on the Daily Show
Speaker 1: in New York and I was traveling around doing theater,
Speaker 1: and eventually landed in Los Angeles and when we were
Speaker 1: shooting the webisodes, this would have been the summer of
Speaker 1: two thousand and six, and uh, I was shooting a
Speaker 1: talking head and suddenly, right behind the camera, I see
Speaker 1: Greg Daniels walked by, followed by Ed Helms, and all
Speaker 1: I I can't even I don't even think at that moment, Oh,
Speaker 1: that's actor Ed Helms or that's Daily Show correspondent Ed Helms.
Speaker 1: My mind goes, that's why is Ed Helms here? My
Speaker 1: friend from high school? Like that's all. Like he didn't
Speaker 1: call and tell me he was coming. And uh, of
Speaker 1: course he was in the middle of an interview and
Speaker 1: tour with Greg Daniels, who he was meeting with about
Speaker 1: about coming on the Office starting in season three. So
Speaker 1: that was the first time I had seen him in
Speaker 1: a a long time. But oh man, if you ever
Speaker 1: get a chance to spend in the evening with Ed Helms,
Speaker 1: you will not be disappointed. He is joyful above all else,
Speaker 1: more than anyone else who was on the show, or
Speaker 1: maybe anyone that I've ever met. He is a joyful,
Speaker 1: soul fulful person, soulful. I'm having trouble saying the word soulful,
Speaker 1: but I think I got it the second time. I
Speaker 1: don't know. Here is ed Helms, Bubble and squeak I
Speaker 1: love it. Bubble and squeak on Bubble and squeaker cookie
Speaker 1: every month left over from the NAT before. Hey, dude,
Speaker 1: are you wonderful? Oh my god, it's so good to
Speaker 1: see you too. You look so much older. Okay, alright, alright,
Speaker 1: here's your ginger snaps? What is That's so funny? I
Speaker 1: don't know why that's there. May be there for your assistant. Um,
Speaker 1: she just started a week and a half ago, and
Speaker 1: you're not like I've never had a conversation with her
Speaker 1: about ginger snaps. So do you like ginger snaps? Well? Sure,
Speaker 1: who doesn't like ginger snaps? I know, but it's that
Speaker 1: like a thing that you ask for it when you
Speaker 1: go to work. Never, never, ever, have I ever asked
Speaker 1: for ginger snaps. Yeah, I don't know. How are you?
Speaker 1: When was the last time you were back in Atlanta?
Speaker 1: I haven't been to Atlanta and way too long I did. Uh,
Speaker 1: I did three movies there over the last few years.
Speaker 1: But um, I am getting a little homesick for Atlanta,
Speaker 1: which I never thought i'd say, I'm very happy to
Speaker 1: be not living there, but but I do like it
Speaker 1: when I go back now. Right, my last three years,
Speaker 1: I've shot movies in North Carolina, Mexico, and Columbus Georgia.
Speaker 1: And Columbus Georgia was far the hottest. Well, the hard
Speaker 1: part about hot weather in the South, and I really
Speaker 1: hope we can stick with weather as a subject. Sorry,
Speaker 1: but I love it. No, honestly, it's fun to talk
Speaker 1: about Georgia. I know, I know, I know both from there,
Speaker 1: but it's it does there's no reprieve like in l
Speaker 1: A or in in desert climates, or or like even
Speaker 1: in the Northeast it cools off at night, whereas in
Speaker 1: the South there's no escape, Like if you're in the shade,
Speaker 1: you're still muggy and hot, and then when night comes,
Speaker 1: it's just a hot night. It's not like a cool
Speaker 1: like the temperature does not go down. Autumn, Yeah, Halloween
Speaker 1: is when I miss miss Atlanta because that the autumn's
Speaker 1: there so long. They're so it's so protracted, the trees
Speaker 1: are changing forever. That's when I get Missy for right,
Speaker 1: So you moved out of Atlanta, you went to the Northeast, Now,
Speaker 1: what were you doing right before you came onto the Office.
Speaker 1: I was on the Daily Show. Yeah. Yeah, I've been
Speaker 1: on the Daily Show for four and a half years.
Speaker 1: And I had done a pilot for NBC for Kevin Riley.
Speaker 1: It was really fun. It was a multi camera pilot
Speaker 1: that I that the Daily Show let me kind of
Speaker 1: sneak away to do it. It It was just a few
Speaker 1: weeks of work and it did not get picked up,
Speaker 1: but it was a ton of fun. And then it
Speaker 1: went really well, and Kevin Riley was I guess he
Speaker 1: liked he liked me, so he so he made a
Speaker 1: talent deal with me at NBC. It's funny. I you know,
Speaker 1: I remember I remember being at the Daily Show and
Speaker 1: and and I knew Steve from the Daily Show. You
Speaker 1: worked with him? Yeah, we we overlapped, not very much,
Speaker 1: but enough that you know that we were acquaintances. Uh.
Speaker 1: We overlapped probably five or six months or something. And
Speaker 1: then I just remember getting word that he was gonna
Speaker 1: do the Office and just thinking like that is so perfect,
Speaker 1: that is going to be so good. So you knew
Speaker 1: the British version of it? Oh, I yes, for sure. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, I you know, I'm I'm a comedy nerd
Speaker 1: and was very much in the comedy universe. And uh,
Speaker 1: and so then the idea of I mean, Steve's character
Speaker 1: on the on the Daily Show was at its best
Speaker 1: when he was of sort of a version of Michael Scott,
Speaker 1: like not self aware, kind of usually less informed than
Speaker 1: everyone around him. Um, he was brilliant on The Daily
Speaker 1: Show because he really kind of pioneered the form of
Speaker 1: Daily Show segments in which the correspondent is the butt
Speaker 1: of the jokes as opposed to really just making fun
Speaker 1: of somebody else. Yeah, which is which is easy and
Speaker 1: means spirited. Usually it's kind of shooting fish in a
Speaker 1: bucket and it's not as interesting. But Steve kind of
Speaker 1: really shifted that and found this way of being kind
Speaker 1: of an idiot news porter, and that was so funny
Speaker 1: and fresh and and still able to get great satire
Speaker 1: into the pieces. Um, that's true. Often he played like
Speaker 1: the pseudo expert or the you know, the teacher in
Speaker 1: a way that then became yeah, just confident about the
Speaker 1: wrong things, right. And and so that's why when I
Speaker 1: heard he was going to do The Office, I just
Speaker 1: was like that, I mean, yes, Ricky Gervais is a genius.
Speaker 1: This version will also be great. Uh And then it was.
Speaker 1: And what's crazy, I think I told you this recently too,
Speaker 1: is that was so around that time, I was just
Speaker 1: sort of looking for my exit strategy from the Daily Show.
Speaker 1: I I loved working there, but I knew that I
Speaker 1: had to just shake things up because I was really
Speaker 1: starting to feel like in a rut. So I was
Speaker 1: auditioning for a lot of things, and I did. I got.
Speaker 1: I auditioned for the The Office, like the original cast
Speaker 1: of the Office, And you auditioned Jim. Is that right? Yes,
Speaker 1: I'm almost positive. Then I auditioned for Jim. Yeah. And
Speaker 1: you know, obviously it would have been a better show
Speaker 1: if I were Jim, clearly, Um, but this wasn't you
Speaker 1: were in New York because in New York City, and
Speaker 1: and you know, I went to thirty Rock at the
Speaker 1: casting office there, and I forget the casting director's name.
Speaker 1: It was the head of casting for NBC in New York.
Speaker 1: In New York, Yeah, and I just went in. It
Speaker 1: was I was. I was excited about it because I
Speaker 1: knew the British version, but I wasn't super optimistic or anything.
Speaker 1: And I don't remember it being an especially good or
Speaker 1: bad audition. I just kind of went in and I'd
Speaker 1: love to see the tape. I don't know if it's
Speaker 1: so so great. I know that, but like, yeah, Rain
Speaker 1: and Jenna's and I've seen a few of them out there,
Speaker 1: but that's so crazy, that funny. I'll ask Allison Jones, Um,
Speaker 1: so okay. So then so you don't get Jim. Don't
Speaker 1: get Jim. It's just sort of back to business as
Speaker 1: usual at the Daily Show. I'm trying to cultivate some
Speaker 1: ideas to bring back to NBC, maybe just you know,
Speaker 1: on the off chance that they take a shot on
Speaker 1: developing a real show with me. And I was out
Speaker 1: here for some reason and word came down, why don't
Speaker 1: you meet with Greg and just have a chat. And
Speaker 1: so I went in and we had a chat and
Speaker 1: it was great. I remember Greg had seen this short
Speaker 1: that I did with my friend Nick Poppy called Zombie American,
Speaker 1: and it was it was basically a mockumentary about a
Speaker 1: zombie just trying to get out on the dating scene
Speaker 1: and all the sort of um, all the it falls
Speaker 1: of being like why being a zombie is like the problem.
Speaker 1: It's a liability on the on the dating scene. And uh,
Speaker 1: it was you know, tiny little short with no budget,
Speaker 1: but we spent all the money on the zombie makeup,
Speaker 1: so it was like a hard commitment to full on
Speaker 1: press thattic zombie, which made it super funny because I
Speaker 1: the character was just a guy talking to the camera
Speaker 1: and you know, talking about how like it's awkward on
Speaker 1: a date when your finger falls off or or um
Speaker 1: or when people you show up for a blind date
Speaker 1: and they see you from afar and turn and walk
Speaker 1: away and and and it was like a this really poignant,
Speaker 1: very real but also obviously very silly piece and it's
Speaker 1: it was like a ten minute short and Greg had
Speaker 1: seen that. I don't know how it was not out there,
Speaker 1: but um he got in his hands on it. That
Speaker 1: I think was probably my best foot forward as an
Speaker 1: office character, because it was talking heads to the camera,
Speaker 1: it was small performance, it was very it was just
Speaker 1: totally in the same family as the office. So that
Speaker 1: was part of the conversation. And then they then he
Speaker 1: and Paul Paul Liebersteon came in and he started talking
Speaker 1: about this character Andy Connecticut Yacht Club spoiled and obviously
Speaker 1: we're not from Connecticut. We're not from yacht clubs, but
Speaker 1: we're from you know, we went to prep school in
Speaker 1: Atlanta with I think kids that are totally analogous to
Speaker 1: Andy Bernard, and so it was a type that I
Speaker 1: understood immediately, white white belt with the yeah, just like
Speaker 1: yeah loafers upbraided white belt and polos and that. So yeah,
Speaker 1: we just started talking about it and it and it
Speaker 1: was making us laugh and pitching kind of like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: he probably took sailing lessons, but uh, never passed the
Speaker 1: test that allows you to actually take sailboats out from
Speaker 1: the yacht club because he just wasn't good at I
Speaker 1: don't know, just like dumb fun stuff that when we
Speaker 1: were laughing about it, and then I went back to
Speaker 1: work at the Daily Show and got the call that hey,
Speaker 1: we're gonna do a couple of episodes, you know in
Speaker 1: this Scranton off I mean in the Stanford Stanford office,
Speaker 1: and I was told it would be two months of work.
Speaker 1: They had in mind eight episodes, I think. So I
Speaker 1: went to my ep at the Daily Show and I said, look,
Speaker 1: this is Steve's show, it's in the family. What do
Speaker 1: you say. Can I go and do this? It's two months.
Speaker 1: It's a long time. This was also right around the
Speaker 1: time that Colbert had left to do the Colbert Report.
Speaker 1: It just was kind of a fraud time for correspondence
Speaker 1: at the Daily Show. Um, and they were very skittish
Speaker 1: about it, and they were like, I just we don't
Speaker 1: think we can let you go. You know, it's there's
Speaker 1: a lot going on in the world and we just
Speaker 1: need And I was very I was very disappointed, but
Speaker 1: you know, tried to kind of understand that, and it
Speaker 1: put me in this bind where I was like, I
Speaker 1: can either resign from the Daily Show for two months
Speaker 1: of work or turned down The Office. And my analysis was, well,
Speaker 1: I've been on the Daily Show for four and a
Speaker 1: half years. There's nothing I can do on this show
Speaker 1: now that's gonna like change how I'm perceived out there.
Speaker 1: I'll get better and better and do hopefully do funnier
Speaker 1: and funnier stuff, but it's not no one's gonna see
Speaker 1: that I can act. No one's gonna see that I
Speaker 1: can do other stuff. And The Office was not a
Speaker 1: hit at this point either. Like it was it was.
Speaker 1: It was like a very show that I loved, but
Speaker 1: it was by no means like a sure thing to
Speaker 1: jump into, but I just decided it was worth the
Speaker 1: risk and I had to. I had like, even if
Speaker 1: I only worked for those eight weeks, I would have
Speaker 1: a really good new thing. So I took the plunge,
Speaker 1: and the rest is history, as they say. So, Greg
Speaker 1: talked to me about the idea of Andy and Stanford
Speaker 1: as being basically to Jim Dwight in Scranton, but with
Speaker 1: a whole different demeanor, right, like you talked about preppy
Speaker 1: East Coast waspy, little ivy but incompetent and idiot, but
Speaker 1: in a totally different way than the trans am heavy
Speaker 1: metal engines and dragon weird nerd in in Scranton. Right,
Speaker 1: Were you aware of that? I don't think I understood
Speaker 1: at that time exactly how analogous Stanford was supposed to
Speaker 1: be to Scranton, and I didn't think too hard about
Speaker 1: it because it was really interesting because this we shot obviously,
Speaker 1: all of our stuff was on the on another set,
Speaker 1: and we didn't interact with you guys much at all
Speaker 1: during that time, just by virtue of the fact that
Speaker 1: we were shooting on separate stages at different times and
Speaker 1: different stories and all that stuff. So I really felt
Speaker 1: like we were in our own show, Like we were
Speaker 1: kind of doing our own thing. Um, And it was
Speaker 1: instantly the most fun thing I've ever done. Like it
Speaker 1: was instantly, it just was so joyful. Rashida and I
Speaker 1: were kind of the new kids, like we we were
Speaker 1: a little click that kind of had each other's back.
Speaker 1: The rights were clearly having fun with our characters, which
Speaker 1: is the best. I mean, that's when it's you're really
Speaker 1: having fun. The writers were showing up to set and
Speaker 1: joking around with us, and John was I mean John,
Speaker 1: he obviously was such a stalwart of the show at
Speaker 1: that and and central character, so his disposition towards us
Speaker 1: really mattered, I think to us and to our kind
Speaker 1: of like self esteem coming into this, And he could
Speaker 1: not have been more warm and fun and playful, and
Speaker 1: but like having the confidence of somebody who had been
Speaker 1: there a couple of years or you know, it was
Speaker 1: really just a year, two seasons. Um, we just jelled
Speaker 1: and were instantly having fun and making each other laugh
Speaker 1: um a lot. It just felt great. Yeah, I never
Speaker 1: thought about this before until you started talking that. It's
Speaker 1: almost as the John in the middle of doing a
Speaker 1: show basically had a spin off that then was still
Speaker 1: a part of the same show, right, like a spin office,
Speaker 1: taking a character and going and creating another show around
Speaker 1: that character in a different environment. And in a way,
Speaker 1: that's what was happening. I think looking back, I I mean,
Speaker 1: I think that that was a test of us about
Speaker 1: an actual spinoff. But I don't I mean, I'm not
Speaker 1: in Greg's head. I don't know the answer that. I've
Speaker 1: never asked him that, but I years later, looking back,
Speaker 1: it just seemed like it was just like a set
Speaker 1: up for a spin It's it's the way sit coomes
Speaker 1: at that time. We're spinning shows off, like you put
Speaker 1: someone in a new environment and all of a sudden
Speaker 1: introduced new characters that all of a sudden like they're
Speaker 1: in a new Times line. Um. But but I don't
Speaker 1: know that. I don't know if it's two or not.
Speaker 1: But you're you're right, it did. It was kind of
Speaker 1: a classic spinoff move. It just wound up re kind
Speaker 1: of merging back into the into the original show. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I've been thinking a lot about and you hear about
Speaker 1: the office. You think of the Office as being sort
Speaker 1: of in a place of stasis, right that there's the
Speaker 1: bullpen and that's what the office is, and people get
Speaker 1: used to that, and people like that, and they don't
Speaker 1: typically like it when something changes. But I felt like
Speaker 1: what Greg did, he kept, whether it was conscious or not,
Speaker 1: creating sort of a new kinetic energy by disrupting by
Speaker 1: making Jim go to Stanford, by making Pam go to
Speaker 1: art school, you know, And that helped the momentum of
Speaker 1: the show, and I think provided a stark relief for comparison, because,
Speaker 1: like you were saying before, it really was an analog
Speaker 1: Chip as the boss was so different from Michael Scott
Speaker 1: like he was. He was sort of like the cool
Speaker 1: jock bas right, but but problematic for other reasons, you know,
Speaker 1: like wanting to play Call of Duty all the time.
Speaker 1: And and then I my my character being sort of
Speaker 1: like a Dwight analog as you said, but totally different,
Speaker 1: Rashida being romantic competitor. It's all like, yeah, I think
Speaker 1: it it's just served to really heighten all of what
Speaker 1: was great about Scranton. Yeah, so at some point you
Speaker 1: are told that you're going to stick around and now
Speaker 1: you're going to come in and join scrant How was
Speaker 1: that transition? So I can't remember when it became clear
Speaker 1: that I was going to stick around, if it was
Speaker 1: before we did started doing episodes in Scranton or after,
Speaker 1: because I think Andy's departure to Anger Management was sort
Speaker 1: of like the end of my agreed upon time. I
Speaker 1: can't quite remember all that timeline, but I will say this,
Speaker 1: those first few episodes in the Scranton office was like
Speaker 1: it's like a little kid walking into Yankee Stadium. Like
Speaker 1: even though the show wasn't huge, it was huge to me.
Speaker 1: And I loved it, and I loved what everybody was doing,
Speaker 1: and I just thought it was the funniest thing in
Speaker 1: the world. And so to walk in onto that set
Speaker 1: and actually have lines and have like fun stuff to do,
Speaker 1: I just felt like I was in the major leagues
Speaker 1: and uh in it, but not in an intimidating way,
Speaker 1: in a like supported way. And um, you guys, everyone
Speaker 1: was so cool, right. It just was such a great
Speaker 1: group of people. Uh, it was just fun. Well and
Speaker 1: and you know, now hearing more of the specifics of
Speaker 1: your story. Early on, I mean, we were all a
Speaker 1: group of actors that had had minimal to no success
Speaker 1: in television and film at that point, from varying degrees
Speaker 1: like six months before I was doing theater and just
Speaker 1: just starting right. And you know, Steve had done obviously
Speaker 1: the Daily Show, but when even when Steve was on,
Speaker 1: it was kind of before the Daily Show was cool cool,
Speaker 1: it was it was the Bush administration that really I
Speaker 1: think launched it. I mean, Craig Kilborne was great and
Speaker 1: I was a fan from then, but again that's just
Speaker 1: because I'm a comedy nerd. I think in the zeitgeist,
Speaker 1: it really was George Bush that kind of catapulted the
Speaker 1: Daily Show. Um, and so yeah, everybody I think had
Speaker 1: the attitude that they had because no one seemed bigger
Speaker 1: than anybody else. You know, there wasn't the structure that
Speaker 1: exists where there's the star and there's the kind of
Speaker 1: star and there. You know, like everybody was kind of
Speaker 1: figuring it out. And as the show started to pick
Speaker 1: up and we were all sort of a part of
Speaker 1: that together. Yeah, I remember that that year, so I
Speaker 1: got kind of officially brought into the cast and was
Speaker 1: in the regular season after Anger Anger Management, I was
Speaker 1: just there. I was like part of the show. And
Speaker 1: the Emmys were around that time, and that year the
Speaker 1: Daily Show and The Office one Emmys for Best Show
Speaker 1: and I was like, I'm doing something right. This is
Speaker 1: going pretty good. But that was that was really fun.
Speaker 1: That was and the Emmy's of course, was such a
Speaker 1: fun thing for the cast and everybody just oh man,
Speaker 1: those are those are great, the salad days, the salad days,
Speaker 1: good times. How much do you think the character of
Speaker 1: Andy is like you? Well, I would say that not
Speaker 1: very He's not very much like me, but only because
Speaker 1: I'm I have better editing mechanisms for my own behavior.
Speaker 1: But I think a lot of Andy's impulses and instincts
Speaker 1: are you know, I relate to Um. He's just not
Speaker 1: self aware enough to put a check on them. There
Speaker 1: are things that I actually really envy about Andy that
Speaker 1: I wish I was more like Um. And the Angela storyline, really,
Speaker 1: I think brought that out. That that was a thing
Speaker 1: that made me. I mean, I was kind of loved
Speaker 1: Andy's douche baggery from a comedy standpoint, it's just fun
Speaker 1: and ridiculou liss. But the Angela stuff like just seeing
Speaker 1: him really put his heart on his sleeve. I felt
Speaker 1: that's when I really fell in love with this, this
Speaker 1: character and I and that's something that I I've always
Speaker 1: struggled with maybe it's part of just our southern upbringing,
Speaker 1: but like expressing emotions in real ways and being transparent
Speaker 1: and being you know, just chasing something that you love
Speaker 1: and that means a lot to you. It's that was
Speaker 1: that's hard. That was hard for me. It was hard
Speaker 1: for me to kind of mature in that way. Uh.
Speaker 1: And Andy is just he's the best, Like, that's the
Speaker 1: he's he fell in love with Angela and I was like,
Speaker 1: this is it. I'm all in and I love you,
Speaker 1: and he and everybody knew it, and he was. There
Speaker 1: was no shame, there was no kind of reticence. And
Speaker 1: I think I just always loved that about Andy. And
Speaker 1: I think that his rage was a kind of the
Speaker 1: flip side of that, like he just wasn't able to
Speaker 1: kind of control the expression of his emotions. Uh, and
Speaker 1: sometimes when he should have, and it had beautiful consequences
Speaker 1: in in some of his romantic relationships and then obviously
Speaker 1: devastating consequences and in other ways. Right. But I think
Speaker 1: that that's what you know, Greg and the other writers
Speaker 1: and you obviously in creating that character and and everybody,
Speaker 1: but you know, we talked a lot about I've talked
Speaker 1: a lot about the more specific the characters are drawn,
Speaker 1: the more universal they become. And so you think, oh,
Speaker 1: let's paint in broad strokes, this is generally who this
Speaker 1: guy is, right, and it's the white braided belts and
Speaker 1: the polo shear, right, that's who that guy is. Okay,
Speaker 1: I get Andy, That's that's who Andy is. But no,
Speaker 1: he had one of the biggest hearts on the show
Speaker 1: and was able to express that in a really specific, true,
Speaker 1: genuine way, and that that dichotomy and complexity I feel
Speaker 1: like made him really real and lovable. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: you're you're onto something specificity, which I think a lot
Speaker 1: of comedy writers sometimes shy away from because the the
Speaker 1: the instinct is like the more specific I draw a character,
Speaker 1: the more people won't relate to that character. But it's
Speaker 1: the opposite, Like to your point, it is the exact opposite,
Speaker 1: and I think of like I was just having this
Speaker 1: conversation with a writer the other day about how John
Speaker 1: hughes movies we're you know on paper. John Hughes shot
Speaker 1: all his movies in Glencoe, Illinois, which is one of
Speaker 1: the most affluent suburbs in the country. I mean all mansions,
Speaker 1: all beautiful lawns, everything. You know, it shouldn't be relatable, right,
Speaker 1: that should be that should be alienating to everybody, And
Speaker 1: yet there's so much specificity in those characters, and that's
Speaker 1: what people find themselves in that specificity because audiences say,
Speaker 1: you know, I may not understand how a teenager can
Speaker 1: drive a BMW, but I can understand how that character
Speaker 1: is devastated by that breakup that they're having, or or
Speaker 1: the fact that the way that they're acting out, or
Speaker 1: the way that um, this little passion that they have
Speaker 1: is getting made fun of by their friends or whatever. It's.
Speaker 1: It's those details allow more people to connect. Um. You
Speaker 1: talked about your relationship with with Angela UM and how
Speaker 1: that's how you began to fall in love with Andy UM.
Speaker 1: Do you think that his well, the fact that he
Speaker 1: was a cuckolt like to that begin to him more
Speaker 1: sympathetic to audiences as well. Yeah, for sure. Uh, that
Speaker 1: was a pretty sly move, I think on the on
Speaker 1: Greg's part, I'm trying to kind of tap back into
Speaker 1: my my thoughts at the time. It felt really fun
Speaker 1: to unleash that part of Andy because so much of
Speaker 1: what he did was antagonistic and sort of confrontational or
Speaker 1: passive aggressive, and for him to have to be putting
Speaker 1: positive energy out there, even though it was so misplaced
Speaker 1: or so well it was misapplied to Angela, that was
Speaker 1: so fun and it just it made It's part of
Speaker 1: what I think positive energy makes someone like makes an
Speaker 1: audience like a character. Um, you don't get Angela and
Speaker 1: then Aaron shows up. Talk a little bit about that
Speaker 1: relationship as I didn't remember that you're love for her
Speaker 1: or your initial fascination starts like the first day she's there,
Speaker 1: it's like, oh, well there's there's a new one in
Speaker 1: the office. Let's go for her. We've got no baggage
Speaker 1: with this person. We can write our own story. Let's
Speaker 1: start from scratch. Here we go. Yeah, that's yeah, that's great. Um.
Speaker 1: I think that in thinking about it, that the Andy
Speaker 1: and Aaron storyline becomes, you know, kind of a parallel
Speaker 1: with what was happening, what happened with Jim and Pam earlier.
Speaker 1: It just had a slightly more absurdist bent to it.
Speaker 1: There were still tender moments, there was still that longing
Speaker 1: on both sides. Um, But I think that I don't know,
Speaker 1: talk about that a little bit, if if you recall
Speaker 1: your approach to it, or did the writers talk to
Speaker 1: you about where that relationship was going to go from
Speaker 1: the beginning or know. I don't think so. I don't
Speaker 1: think there was a uh an arc spelled out early on.
Speaker 1: But you know, Aaron's energy was just so funny and
Speaker 1: it felt right for Andy in a way, both of
Speaker 1: them being very left footed socially kind of made them
Speaker 1: perfect for each other, but also like gave them lots
Speaker 1: of stumbling. You know, it's like a pigeon toed person
Speaker 1: dancing with a bow legged person, Like does this it
Speaker 1: looks like an egg beater? Like is this this is weird? Um?
Speaker 1: And I guess, um, it just felt right and fun.
Speaker 1: And then there was a lot of, um obviously, just
Speaker 1: a lot of complication that I think emerged in ways
Speaker 1: that Andy and Aaron sabotaged the relationships and their their
Speaker 1: own relationship in different ways. Um. I loved that chapter.
Speaker 1: I don't I don't remember exactly how it wound down,
Speaker 1: but I remember being a little confused about sort of
Speaker 1: like how how that storyline kind of got wrapped up?
Speaker 1: And I think I remember not enjoying the shooting the
Speaker 1: episodes as much where we were in conflict, you know,
Speaker 1: when there was like real bad stuff happening between Andy
Speaker 1: and Aaron, it wasn't as fun like it just but
Speaker 1: I mean, that's that's just an actor complaining. Um, But
Speaker 1: I think there was something so breezy and simple and
Speaker 1: natural about just kind of goofing off with Aaron and
Speaker 1: finding that comedy was very fun. And then later on
Speaker 1: tapping into darker parts of these characters that, like I said,
Speaker 1: they sabotaged the relationship in different ways. It felt a
Speaker 1: little harder to make funny or harder to make silly
Speaker 1: and um but yeah um. In The New York Times,
Speaker 1: Paul said about you and Andy, he had so much
Speaker 1: in common with this character we wanted to create. I
Speaker 1: can't remember when they started merging. He has this undeniable likability.
Speaker 1: When he's at his most awful, you can't help but
Speaker 1: love the guy. I think that's true about me or
Speaker 1: about Andy, Well, I do. I that's a really flattering thing,
Speaker 1: and that's uh, and it speaks to what a sweet
Speaker 1: and wonderful person Paul is. But I that is my
Speaker 1: greatest hope for the character of Andy, that that he
Speaker 1: can be kind of wretched, but in a way that
Speaker 1: you can tell is in spite of himself, and that
Speaker 1: he really does want to be better. You know, That's
Speaker 1: the part I think I connect with the most and
Speaker 1: feel like it's the most I have the most in
Speaker 1: common with. Andy is like I. I I stumble through
Speaker 1: the world socially and in relationships and all of it.
Speaker 1: I think, like most of us, I just I always
Speaker 1: I am frustrated at myself when I screw it up,
Speaker 1: whatever it is, and whether it's a simple social interaction
Speaker 1: or a big meaningful thing in my life, whatever it is.
Speaker 1: I but I want to be better. I just want
Speaker 1: to be better, and I try to be better, and
Speaker 1: I still fail a lot. Um. It's why I'm so
Speaker 1: grateful to everyone in my life who loves me, because
Speaker 1: it's always stumbling through all of it. But um, Andy
Speaker 1: at his core wants to be good. He wants to
Speaker 1: be a good person. He wants to say the right thing,
Speaker 1: and only occasionally does he nail it right. There's times
Speaker 1: where Andy was not just beautiful in his expressions of love,
Speaker 1: but sometimes really tender and like a good listener, right,
Speaker 1: And that's not something we associate with Andy Bernard at all.
Speaker 1: But those are those are moments where I think his
Speaker 1: better angels are really intervening and kind of guiding him
Speaker 1: because but they're they're like his his desire to be better,
Speaker 1: and his instincts are constantly fighting his reactionary impulses. All right,
Speaker 1: we're gonna stop there for now. Sorry. I know Ed
Speaker 1: is amazing to listen to, and what I love is
Speaker 1: the love that he has for Andy Bernard. You know,
Speaker 1: there were a lot of people who didn't love Andy Bernard,
Speaker 1: but Ed Helms loved Andy Bernard. And that is the
Speaker 1: sign of a true artist and great actor. Lesson lesson
Speaker 1: one from me, never ever judge your characters. Just find
Speaker 1: a way to fall in love with them. But we
Speaker 1: are going to hear more from Ed h in an
Speaker 1: upcoming episode, so stay tuned for that. Thank you to
Speaker 1: Ed for joining me for part one, although you'll you'll
Speaker 1: be back for part two. Uh, and thank you all
Speaker 1: for listening. We will see you next week. The Office
Speaker 1: Deep Dive is hosted and executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner,
Speaker 1: alongside our executive producer Langley. Our senior producer is Tessa Kramer.
Speaker 1: Our associate producer is Emily Carr and our assistant editor
Speaker 1: is Diego Tapia. My main man in the booth is
Speaker 1: Alec Moore. Our theme song Bubble and Squeak, performed by
Speaker 1: my great friend Creed Brett, and the episode was mixed
Speaker 1: by Seth olandscape H