Speaker 1: And now.
Speaker 2: Watch move my mic back. You're like that journal time
Speaker 2: strike borders with waters from head borders behind him and
Speaker 2: the border.
Speaker 1: If you're just tuning in the civic actor, I'm your host, Ramses.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I am today and probably through the weekend, going
Speaker 3: to be referred.
Speaker 1: To as Keyward weekend. Be sure to stick around. We
Speaker 1: got a letter from a listener that we're going to
Speaker 1: get to and we have our way Black History fact.
Speaker 1: But first some notes from doctor Westernberg on the.
Speaker 4: Heels of what you have just said. The Equal Rights
Speaker 4: Amendment means that first you have to recognize that you
Speaker 4: have the Supreme Court, the people who are there for life.
Speaker 4: Number one, they are there for life unless they resign
Speaker 4: or die, and you see the type of decisions that
Speaker 4: they are making. The only way that you're going to
Speaker 4: get what you want is to get in the game
Speaker 4: and vote. You're going to have to vote the people
Speaker 4: in your local government and in your national government who
Speaker 4: will just saying just saying, we will advocate for you
Speaker 4: for those rights. And unless you do that, I don't
Speaker 4: know that we'll see a change. You got to get
Speaker 4: in the mix, that's all I gotta say.
Speaker 1: That's all right, I'm sorry. Well, it's time for us
Speaker 1: to move on to becoming a better ally BA BA,
Speaker 1: So we're going to give a quick shout out to
Speaker 1: one individual, Jodie Sweeten aka Stephanie Tanner. Don't know if
Speaker 1: you saw the on TMZ or really everywhere now or
Speaker 1: if you're a fan of Full House and you know
Speaker 1: that name, but she's an actress that we all grew
Speaker 1: up with. She played on a show called Full House
Speaker 1: Again and she was out protesting.
Speaker 5: She had been got pushed over by the police, and
Speaker 5: you know, people are like, man, I didn't realize that
Speaker 5: she was out there getting busy, but she was suited
Speaker 5: and booted and making it happen and actually, you know,
Speaker 5: experiencing it.
Speaker 1: So that's our example of becoming a better ally for
Speaker 1: this week. Of course, she lives a privileged life relative
Speaker 1: to most people, and she's still out there making happen.
Speaker 1: Another thing I want to run by you is a
Speaker 1: game plan to vote. I'm pulling this from the Political
Speaker 1: Action Committee from the NAACP in Maricopa County, but something
Speaker 1: to keep in mind in your own state is to
Speaker 1: check your voting status. There's a website where you can
Speaker 1: do that. Check that status vote in your primary elections
Speaker 1: and vote in your general elections. That is what we
Speaker 1: need to do now, up and down the ballot. That means,
Speaker 1: if you vote Democrat, make sure you vote all the
Speaker 1: way down Democrat. Now we have to discuss now a
Speaker 1: letter from a listener. So que had a strong reaction
Speaker 1: when we first got this letter, or when you when
Speaker 1: you when you first read my response to the letter,
Speaker 1: So let's talk let's talk about that a little bit.
Speaker 3: Well, the strength of my response was, well, the strength
Speaker 3: of my reaction was more to the letter than your response.
Speaker 3: I was more blown away by your response because it
Speaker 3: was the necessary response. It was what I think all
Speaker 3: of us wish we would have said, how all of us,
Speaker 3: all of us wish we would react when faced with
Speaker 3: those type of I won't even call it pushback. I
Speaker 3: think the person was being authentic. I think he was
Speaker 3: being insightful. But it came from a place that sometimes
Speaker 3: catches me a bit off guard, because the really strange
Speaker 3: thing about our show is, if you've listened to more
Speaker 3: than one episode, you realize that I picked fun at
Speaker 3: Ramses for being hopelessly and optimistically naive. He has a
Speaker 3: point of view that really sees us reaching this utopia,
Speaker 3: sees us reaching this place where we are all seen
Speaker 3: as equal and we are all treated as equal, and
Speaker 3: I think that that's a bit unrealistic just because of
Speaker 3: the thousands of years of evidence that I have. I'm
Speaker 3: strange that way, and in cases where people because I
Speaker 3: got a DM the other day that I didn't share
Speaker 3: with my colleagues here at the show, a you know,
Speaker 3: decade long friend of mine pushing back on me being
Speaker 3: upset about, you know, what just transpired in our Supreme Court.
Speaker 3: And this person dove in the same way that most
Speaker 3: dms that I get when it comes to me being
Speaker 3: outspoken about politics, they kind of all start the same way,
Speaker 3: well Trump, Like they start right off with their defense
Speaker 3: of Donald Trump in particular, And I've often argued that
Speaker 3: I don't think these people are defending him. I think
Speaker 3: they're defending themselves. I think it's something that they see
Speaker 3: something of themselves that they see in him and in
Speaker 3: that party that they feel like, well, I'm a decent person,
Speaker 3: so they must be. And I think that that's what
Speaker 3: they're defending, because he's kind of indefensible, Like, I don't
Speaker 3: understand how you've been paying attention for five minutes and
Speaker 3: could reach out to me specifically in defense of Donald
Speaker 3: Trump on any topic. So anytime if somebody does it,
Speaker 3: I almost stopped listening. Yeah, And in the same way,
Speaker 3: if this wasn't from you, I wouldn't have finished reading
Speaker 3: this letter. As soon as you give me some statistics
Speaker 3: about how much better life was for black people under
Speaker 3: Donald Trump, I don't even want to hear or read
Speaker 3: what you're talking about anymore. Sure, So, I'm so glad
Speaker 3: that you received this letter and not me, because it
Speaker 3: wouldn't have gotten not just the response it deserved, because
Speaker 3: he deserved a well thought out, thoughtful, empathetic response, but
Speaker 3: so did we, so did people who are on the
Speaker 3: same side of it as you, right, because it could
Speaker 3: be a bit of an echo chamber if I respond
Speaker 3: angry and upset and what are you talking about?
Speaker 1: And dismissive.
Speaker 3: I think the way that you received it, sat with it,
Speaker 3: thought about it, and responded to it was something that
Speaker 3: no matter what side of the discussion or the argument
Speaker 3: you're on, that you could benefit from it.
Speaker 1: So this is a strange thing that happens now in
Speaker 1: our lives. Again, we are DJs. We come from hip
Speaker 1: hop radio. That's where we come from, you know, and
Speaker 1: prior to that, we've worked in entertainment spaces doing and
Speaker 1: I know you were the tour manager for Earthquake for
Speaker 1: many years. I know you've worked with Reebok, a lot
Speaker 1: of athletes, you know, that sort of stuff. And you know,
Speaker 1: this is just kind of who we've been. And now
Speaker 1: we have to be responsible for every word that we say.
Speaker 1: And that's okay because somebody has to say it. And
Speaker 1: we are here. So the universe or God or whatever
Speaker 1: it is that you believe in, not even what we
Speaker 1: believe in. Whatever you believe in has kind of ordered
Speaker 1: our steps and here we are, and it does get frustrating.
Speaker 1: It is difficult, and it is challenging because we have
Speaker 1: to kind of walk in tiptoe around certain issues. But
Speaker 1: in this in doing it this way, I believe that
Speaker 1: we show the most kindness and I think that we
Speaker 1: have to be examples of what we're hoping for other
Speaker 1: people to be right. It's a strategy. It sounds I
Speaker 1: get how I I know how I sound. I saw
Speaker 1: your crazy person, But.
Speaker 3: It's just which we had evidence that it worked, because
Speaker 3: we have none.
Speaker 1: But doing the opposite, I can't conceive of that working ever,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean.
Speaker 3: So well, the thing is, we don't have much evidence
Speaker 3: of us ever doing the opposite.
Speaker 1: But I'm just saying I can't see it.
Speaker 3: You know, the version of us that hits the streets
Speaker 3: and seeks our revenge, We've never done it. I know
Speaker 3: people fear that we will someday when we say overcome,
Speaker 3: that's not what we're talking about. We just want to live,
Speaker 3: that's it. We have not sought revenge for the way
Speaker 3: this country has treated us for our entire existence, fair point,
Speaker 3: Just let us exist, that's it.
Speaker 1: Well, So we do get responses from folks, and usually
Speaker 1: it's just on social media. It's like, hey, great show today, guys,
Speaker 1: or hey, you know, you guys said the statistic and
Speaker 1: that didn't really sound right. So you know, here's what
Speaker 1: I got and these sorts of things. But we've gotten
Speaker 1: worse than that, yeah, we have, but you know, usually
Speaker 1: it's kind of in that arena. What we got this
Speaker 1: past week was a much more substantial response, and I
Speaker 1: want to share it with you now. Again, this comes
Speaker 1: from Philip. We won't share his last name because we
Speaker 1: want to make sure he stays private, but but yeah,
Speaker 1: so Ramses, I heard your show advertised while listening to
Speaker 1: Clay and Buck. I listened to at least one episode
Speaker 1: a week. While you have a great radio voice, I
Speaker 1: appreciate that I am finding it harder to stay a
Speaker 1: listener as most of what I hear is Trump bashing
Speaker 1: and the like. For instance, black unemployment was very low
Speaker 1: under President Trump. I can tell you know this, but
Speaker 1: you don't share it with when the but you don't
Speaker 1: share it when the data applies to your conversation. I
Speaker 1: can also hear it in your voice that you know
Speaker 1: what a real insurrection is versus a riot, and again
Speaker 1: misleading your audience. I don't understand the need to hide
Speaker 1: or slant the truth. I don't know your Phoenix work,
Speaker 1: only what I hear on bi IN. For those who
Speaker 1: don't know, bi IN stands for Black Information Network. This
Speaker 1: is where my daily podcast lies, and you're more than
Speaker 1: welcome and check that out. I stand by every word
Speaker 1: over there as well. To me, it is black people
Speaker 1: like you who can share with others the achievements you
Speaker 1: have had that, while not perfect and far better than
Speaker 1: other places, this country has allowed you to work hard
Speaker 1: and get to the point where you are, including national listenership,
Speaker 1: including national listenership, and even when you have had a
Speaker 1: good idea that others don't see, you still persevere forward.
Speaker 1: I will never know what it is like to live
Speaker 1: in your shoes. That's that's empathy. That's the beginnings of empathy.
Speaker 1: This is why he deserved a response, a good respect game,
Speaker 1: minimum and listen. I call this man my brother, and
Speaker 1: I stand by that. Okay, I will never know what
Speaker 1: it's like to live in your shoes. That's that's accounting
Speaker 1: for the fact that there's a gap. You know, I
Speaker 1: don't see it from your perspective, but I realize that
Speaker 1: I can't see it from sure, I don't I would
Speaker 1: never know what it's like to live in your shoes
Speaker 1: as I am just a nobody. I don't think that's true.
Speaker 1: I think definitely. As I am just a nobody and
Speaker 1: you are a radio and TV guy who has had
Speaker 1: a decent amount of success, you could write a book
Speaker 1: success while being black. Thank you. Maybe I will write
Speaker 1: that book one day. Anyway, back to your bi in show,
Speaker 1: I have decided to stop listening to the Weekly Recap.
Speaker 1: I can't take the negativity. I will for now listen
Speaker 1: to some of your other daily shows. While a weekly
Speaker 1: black conservative guest on your bi in show would be
Speaker 1: a welcome edition and would give your audience a wider
Speaker 1: spek victrum to think about. You ultimately have to decide
Speaker 1: what is better, what is best for drawing people like
Speaker 1: me in and converting them from once a week listener
Speaker 1: to daily listener. This wasn't supposed to be this long.
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening, Philip. Now let me say this. Let
Speaker 1: me say this, this is important. I got it in
Speaker 1: my inbox, you know, so I was the person that
Speaker 1: got it. And I one of the things Philip and
Speaker 1: everyone else listening, one of the things that I've had
Speaker 1: to live through to learn is that there is a
Speaker 1: responsibility that comes with this. Before doing this show, I
Speaker 1: would just say what I would say. That would be
Speaker 1: the end of it. I'm the supreme ruler and commander
Speaker 1: in my life and of course of my timeline. My
Speaker 1: block button works great, and I don't have to hear
Speaker 1: none of that stuff, right, But when I'm talking, it's
Speaker 1: in front of a microphone, and I have a satellite dish,
Speaker 1: and it goes to a whole city. And now it
Speaker 1: goes to a bunch of cities around a whole country,
Speaker 1: the third largest country on Earth. This is so there's
Speaker 1: a responsibility that comes with that. And maybe there's just
Speaker 1: a difference of opinion, you know, But my opinion goes further,
Speaker 1: and other people I have to account for the fact
Speaker 1: that they, as he mentioned, cannot know what a separate
Speaker 1: reality is like, right, And so I believe that he
Speaker 1: approached this with kindness even if he hadn't. I realize
Speaker 1: there's an opportunity here to talk to a human being. Okay,
Speaker 1: if I change the impression for one human being or
Speaker 1: you know, scores of human beings with this microphone, then
Speaker 1: this is the path that I'm on, and that's my objective. Right.
Speaker 1: But but I didn't feel that he was being unkind.
Speaker 1: If he was, I wouldn't have answered in kind. But
Speaker 1: he wasn't being unkind. So there's no way that I
Speaker 1: would even conceive of being unkind. I wouldn't ignore it
Speaker 1: because it was there's some dignity here. He stands on
Speaker 1: an opinion that I do not believe to be true
Speaker 1: a series of them, right, But he's a valid person
Speaker 1: with a valid path through life. It's different from mine
Speaker 1: and my job as a human and as a person
Speaker 1: with this platform is to share with him and hopefully
Speaker 1: we can find some common ground. And obviously I would
Speaker 1: think he would end up more on my side of things,
Speaker 1: but his perspective is necessary for me. I need to
Speaker 1: know this because I need to know who I'm talking to,
Speaker 1: potentially because there's more opportunity here than talking with people
Speaker 1: that agree with me one. So my response, Philip, I
Speaker 1: want to start by saying that I truly appreciate your feedback.
Speaker 1: It was capital Truly, I truly appreciate your feedback, my brother.
Speaker 1: I'm not perfect, and I doubt I'll ever get there,
Speaker 1: but it seems as though I have an opportunity to
Speaker 1: share my thoughts, and so I try to be as
Speaker 1: responsible as I know how. I never expected to do
Speaker 1: political commentary since my background has always been in hip
Speaker 1: hop broadcasting, but here I am learning as I go.
Speaker 1: With that said, feedback like this is very important for me.
Speaker 1: I'm not sure what your beliefs are, but assuming that
Speaker 1: you are a Trump supporting conservative, if so, you are
Speaker 1: still my brother, and I want what's best for you too.
Speaker 1: I try not to be unfair, and I often acknowledge
Speaker 1: my bias, but the spirit in which I do. My
Speaker 1: show is oriented around forging a path forward based in fellowship, empathy,
Speaker 1: and understanding. I'm not a fan of Donald Trump. I
Speaker 1: learned many years before he decided to run for the
Speaker 1: presidency about some of the racist things said and done
Speaker 1: by him and his father in New York City. Afterwards,
Speaker 1: the way he engaged Barack Obama further left a bad impression,
Speaker 1: since he insisted that he was an illegitimate president who
Speaker 1: was foreign born. The receipts for Donald Trump go on forever,
Speaker 1: from the P word grabbing to the s whole countries,
Speaker 1: to the way he emboldened the ugliest parts of America,
Speaker 1: to everything about his proposed monument to racism, his border wall.
Speaker 1: The man could have all the best numbers in history,
Speaker 1: but he made many folks who don't look like him
Speaker 1: feel very unsafe for a very long time. Having to
Speaker 1: carry that feeling for four years was a weight that
Speaker 1: I wouldn't wish on anyone. With that said, numbers are
Speaker 1: all in how you look at them. Was Donald Trump
Speaker 1: specifically to blame for black unemployment rates? My view is
Speaker 1: that many on the rights say so, but many others
Speaker 1: point to other factors. Unfortunately, I don't believe that Donald
Speaker 1: Trump had anyone but himself in mind as he enacted
Speaker 1: many of his policies. There are lots of shows who
Speaker 1: celebrate the man, but I could never in good conscience
Speaker 1: give him even the benefit of the doubt. As far
Speaker 1: as the insurrection, it is defined as a violent uprising
Speaker 1: against the government. A riot is a violent disturbance of
Speaker 1: the peace by a crowd. In my belief, the events
Speaker 1: of January sixth qualified as both. After seeing the January
Speaker 1: sixth hearings, I have no doubt that the events happened
Speaker 1: as a direct result of Donald Trump's instructions, coaxing, and influence.
Speaker 1: The January sixth Committee has made this point for the
Speaker 1: American people, and this comes from a much higher level
Speaker 1: than my show. As a result, I believe this is
Speaker 1: simply a matter of fact. I have not slanted or
Speaker 1: hidden the truth. It is public record. As far as
Speaker 1: the negativity that you hear on my VII in show,
Speaker 1: I will say that negativity is part and parcel to
Speaker 1: black life in America. There is a shared trauma that
Speaker 1: I try to process by discussing it and hoping that
Speaker 1: a path forward it will reveal itself. In conversations with
Speaker 1: informed and empowered people. Thanks again, doctor Westenburg for being here.
Speaker 1: But to pretend that every facet of black life is
Speaker 1: positive would be to mislead my audience. We've established that
Speaker 1: it is not my attempt to do that. Furthermore, I
Speaker 1: don't think it would resonate, and it would seem inauthentic.
Speaker 1: Beyond that, your words are kind and thoughtful. Yes, I
Speaker 1: am very fortunate, but many folks who look like me
Speaker 1: are not so fortunate. This is why I am so
Speaker 1: committed to being responsible with this opportunity and platform. Again,
Speaker 1: I appreciate your message and your advice. I have considered
Speaker 1: bringing on some conservative voices, as it brings some balance
Speaker 1: to the conversation, but so far it's been a matter
Speaker 1: of deciding if people need more bickering, or if people
Speaker 1: need to be informed in a way that creates a
Speaker 1: bit more empathy and provide some instructional framework so that
Speaker 1: our tomorrows might be a bit better than our today's.
Speaker 1: I don't have all of the right answers, but for
Speaker 1: you to even listen to these shows means a lot
Speaker 1: to me. Almost every conservative that I know only gets
Speaker 1: their news from Fox News or else from newer, less
Speaker 1: reputable and further right leaning sources. Again, you taking the
Speaker 1: time to listen matters. I want a better world for
Speaker 1: you too. Maybe these aren't the things that I can
Speaker 1: move on, but now I know there is a listener
Speaker 1: out there who is monitoring how fair things sound. Perhaps
Speaker 1: that will impact the tone of the shows for the better.
Speaker 1: I appreciate a long letter. I would appreciate more letters
Speaker 1: from you. I will continue to do my best, Philip
Speaker 1: in solidarity Ramses. So it's important to say that because
Speaker 1: I recognize that a lot of people, maybe not a lot,
Speaker 1: but there are some people out there who might feel
Speaker 1: the way that Philip feels. And Philip articulated it in
Speaker 1: a way and sent it over, which meant that he
Speaker 1: took time out of his day to share some thoughts
Speaker 1: with us. That's not nothing. Tens of millions of people
Speaker 1: qualify as a lot. You can say that you gotta
Speaker 1: you don't have to soften it. Fifty sixty million people
Speaker 1: feel that way, sure, but you know, to feel that
Speaker 1: way about our show and to share it with us,
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Again, there's not often times
Speaker 1: enough in the way of content with responses like this
Speaker 1: for us to formulate a response that is as significant
Speaker 1: as this one. But I think that in this moment,
Speaker 1: what I would like to do is reaffirm our commitment
Speaker 1: to broadcasting the balance and defending the discourse. We make
Speaker 1: a black show that is approachable by non black people.
Speaker 1: We want to create better allies. We want to This
Speaker 1: show is on in many hip hop stations in many
Speaker 1: cities around this country, and all of those hip hop
Speaker 1: stations have a majority non black listenership. We learned from
Speaker 1: the protests in twenty twenty that there are people who
Speaker 1: don't look like us who want to support us. Radical
Speaker 1: love for justice means by any means with love. And
Speaker 1: I know that a lot of this stuff sounds super.
Speaker 2: Yo.
Speaker 1: Rams is Tripp and he's like rainbow's and unicorns and
Speaker 1: that sort of stuff, And I am, that's me. What
Speaker 1: are you gonna do? Right? I'm I'm grown and I've
Speaker 1: accomplished everything I need to accomplish. I can just be
Speaker 1: me now. So yeah, rainbows and unicorns, that's the direction
Speaker 1: we're going in. If anybody wants to go with me,
Speaker 1: that's where I'm headed, right, And I'm taking Philip with me. Man,
Speaker 1: you know, he's that's a bold move. I just I
Speaker 1: think it's a bold move and it deserves it deserves
Speaker 1: its time and the sun. And if you feel the
Speaker 1: same way as Philip, I hope that I've given you something.
Speaker 1: If you know people in your life that feel the
Speaker 1: way that Philip feels, hopefully I've given you something here.
Speaker 1: I know that you have a couple of more things
Speaker 1: that you wanted to contribute. I mean, not really, there's
Speaker 1: a you spoke that we need that perspective. I don't
Speaker 1: think that perspective is nuanced. You didn't give us something
Speaker 1: kind and thoughtful and not meaning angry. I'll give him that,
Speaker 1: but not nuanced.
Speaker 3: That's that's kind of the opposite of what we do,
Speaker 3: you know, he said claym Buck. He was listening to
Speaker 3: So you listened to Limbaugh, clam Buck and Civic Cipher.
Speaker 1: Some people they look for that balance.
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you're looking for balance, sure, but to come
Speaker 3: to listen to us and tell us to be more
Speaker 3: like them, you know, thanks for being nice, right, but
Speaker 3: you know how we should just appreciate this.
Speaker 1: We're able to live and work in the good old
Speaker 1: us of a I know, and you know you know
Speaker 1: what I mean, Like you were politely, were respectful, Philip,
Speaker 1: and we'll get that back to you. It wasn't necessary
Speaker 1: to rip apart everything that he said. And you know,
Speaker 1: there's there's there's so much in that letter that deserves
Speaker 1: to be unpacked, and obviously I wrote a much longer response,
Speaker 1: but you know that's where we ended, and hopefully we
Speaker 1: just leave everyone with an appreciation for those who want
Speaker 1: to learn from us. Unfortunately, it's time to move on,
Speaker 1: so let's get into the Way Black History Fact. This
Speaker 1: is a producer's note from Maggie aka Maggie Noe. School's
Speaker 1: out are getting ready for the summer. When it comes
Speaker 1: to each one, teaching one, seeing a new place, space,
Speaker 1: and meeting new people helps us to better understand one
Speaker 1: another and continue to build for the greater, emphasizing our
Speaker 1: interconnectedness and abilities to flourish and brother and sisterhood, love
Speaker 1: and community. Now Today's Way Black History Fact comes from
Speaker 1: Town and Country Magazine. The title is Meet the original
Speaker 1: Black travel Influencer. Starting in the nineteen fifties, Jet Magazines
Speaker 1: longtime society editor Jerry Major wrote dispatches from glamorous locales
Speaker 1: around the globe. Her not so secret plan get her
Speaker 1: African American readers to come join the fun. Preparing for
Speaker 1: an international trip was a familiar routine for Jerry Major.
Speaker 1: She had crisscrossed the Atlantic so many times that her
Speaker 1: friends and colleagues had taken to calling her Jerry go Round.
Speaker 1: But on one particular spring day in nineteen fifty three,
Speaker 1: she was especially in her element. She wrote, along she
Speaker 1: wore a long sleeve black dressed, white gloves and on
Speaker 1: trend black pillbox pillock's hat as she strode to Gay
Speaker 1: nine at New York's International Airport. Major was headed to
Speaker 1: London to cover the coronation of Queen Elizabeth II for
Speaker 1: Jet Magazine, where she worked as the society editor. The
Speaker 1: agent handed her a ticket met that moment, one of
Speaker 1: Major's companions snapped a picture. That image, which ran a
Speaker 1: few weeks later in Jet, would become a kind of
Speaker 1: calling card for Major on her future adventurous adventures, and
Speaker 1: a beacon to growing, a beacon to a growing fan
Speaker 1: base of similarly intrepid African American travelers for whom Major
Speaker 1: had become an inspiration. The coronation was a plumb assignment
Speaker 1: for journalist lucky enough to receive press credentials. From the
Speaker 1: British government. Back then, as now, the world was obsessed
Speaker 1: with royal news, but for Major it was an opportunity
Speaker 1: to focus on black travelers who attended the event. Quote
Speaker 1: there were twenty West African chiefs and tribal officials watching
Speaker 1: the ceremonies. In quote she recalled in her book Black
Speaker 1: Society had been in. Prince and his companion from the
Speaker 1: Gold Coast stopped London traffic and their eye catching native
Speaker 1: dress with umbrellas that later created a truly international atmosphere
Speaker 1: at the Queen's Garden party. Major would pay special attention
Speaker 1: to the comings and goings of prominent African Americans. Quote.
Speaker 1: Two members of Harlem's Smart brigetts Ida may King and
Speaker 1: Alberta Osborne, arrived in London by the ss Vernum for
Speaker 1: the coronation weekend and a tour of France and Italy.
Speaker 1: Along with their itineraries, she described their social calendars. Doctor
Speaker 1: Gertrude Curtis thomasin of Los Angeles came in from Paris
Speaker 1: the day after the coronation. She said she hates crowds.
Speaker 1: Her hostess was Adell Hall, who was appearing at the
Speaker 1: Seville Theater in Love from Judy. The doctor was loaded
Speaker 1: down with fine leather goods which she had picked up
Speaker 1: in Italy. African Americans began traveling internationally in earnest after
Speaker 1: World War Two, some inspired by descriptions from returning gis
Speaker 1: of less segregated conditions in European capitals, but there were
Speaker 1: other motivations, including the combination of a constant fear of
Speaker 1: racial aggression at home, which pushed African Americans across national borders,
Speaker 1: and the poll of European nations that were actively encouraging
Speaker 1: black travelers to visit, believing that the tourism revenue would
Speaker 1: help me build their war ravaged cities. Quote. For the
Speaker 1: small select group that did not have the means to
Speaker 1: indulge in leisure, the international space was most appealing because
Speaker 1: it was the only place where they felt they could
Speaker 1: truly be a leisured body, said Wretch Rutgers University history
Speaker 1: professor Tiffany MGill in a recent conversation. Quote it started
Speaker 1: with a wave of black women in the thirties who
Speaker 1: could use their occupations to permit travel end Quote. Dancers
Speaker 1: like Josephine Baker and aid A bricktop Smith, and visual
Speaker 1: artists such as Augustus Savage used their arts as a
Speaker 1: means to see the world. Others, like Juanita Harrison, found
Speaker 1: alternative ways to make it happen. She started traveling abroad
Speaker 1: when she was thirteen, hiring herself as a maid and
Speaker 1: doing other odd jobs to cover her expenses. She chronicled
Speaker 1: her expenses in a nineteen thirty six memoir, My Great, Wide,
Speaker 1: Beautiful World. Major took most of her early trips by herself,
Speaker 1: which presented its own sort of challenges. As a woman
Speaker 1: of fair complexion, she could pass for Latin American or
Speaker 1: South Asian. Black Americans often used a veil of passing
Speaker 1: to guard their safety and to increase their mobility. Steamships
Speaker 1: were Major's primary mode of transport during those first adventures,
Speaker 1: and two factors in black women's ability to travel on them.
Speaker 1: With the types of ship in which country's laws govern
Speaker 1: the ship's company quote, they had these very arbitrary segregation laws,
Speaker 1: and quote Bill said, quote it created a great deal
Speaker 1: of uncertainty around whether you would even be able to
Speaker 1: purchase a ticket and gain passage, and quote, it was
Speaker 1: also uncertain how you'd be treated on board. Quote. A
Speaker 1: lot of this had to do with who was on
Speaker 1: board if the white folks would complain about black people
Speaker 1: being there. Unquote, Major did not often address these disparities
Speaker 1: in our writing. Quote I think that was part of
Speaker 1: her mystique. And quote Bill said her goal was to
Speaker 1: show that it was possible for black women to travel. Now,
Speaker 1: I want to just add this that our producer is
Speaker 1: a big fan of traveling, and so this obviously is
Speaker 1: very meaningful for personal reasons, but also we have to
Speaker 1: begin to understand sort of the origins of black women
Speaker 1: in media and black women's mobility in this country. And
Speaker 1: so not only does this work as far as travel
Speaker 1: is concerned, but it also works as far as sort
Speaker 1: of the origins and the first movers and the people
Speaker 1: who have really kind of paved the way for a
Speaker 1: lot of what we see in today's society. So I'm
Speaker 1: grateful that we had a chance to share this story today,
Speaker 1: And of course I'm grateful to you, doctor Westenberger, coming
Speaker 1: up and hanging out with us. I feel like you
Speaker 1: might want to get something else off before you get
Speaker 1: out of here. We've got about a minute left, so
Speaker 1: now's the time.
Speaker 4: No, I just thought your letter and your two prospectives,
Speaker 4: it was very interesting, I suppose, Ramses in any ways,
Speaker 4: I don't believe in your corn too. I go through
Speaker 4: life every day doing little acts unnecessarily where I think
Speaker 4: I might change the way a person proceeds, not just me,
Speaker 4: but people in general, and I think that's just a
Speaker 4: little investment in the process. There were several things though,
Speaker 4: that I thought was interesting. I love that you clarified
Speaker 4: the difference between insurrection and a riot. Sure, I thought
Speaker 4: that was very crucial. But you all make a wonderful duo,
Speaker 4: make a wonderful duo, and you need both of those well.
Speaker 1: To make it happen. We'll take it. So, speaking of
Speaker 1: being a wonderful duo, once again, we appreciate everyone tuning in.
Speaker 1: I'm your host, Ramses joh And that's it for us today,
Speaker 1: so be sure to hit the website download this in
Speaker 1: any previous episodes. If you have any questions, any topics,
Speaker 1: or you know, you can do like Phil and write
Speaker 1: us a letter. We do read that stuff. It does matter.
Speaker 1: This is all of our show and we're doing our
Speaker 1: best with it, so your feedback obviously helps. Please make
Speaker 1: sure to donate if you can. Maggie wanted us to
Speaker 1: put our cash up in here, so it's at Civic Cipher,
Speaker 1: but it's also on the website, so there it's really easy. Also,
Speaker 1: make sure to follow us on all social media. We're
Speaker 1: at Civic Cipher once again, and I just want to
Speaker 1: say thank you to everyone that's kind of riding this
Speaker 1: way with us. This is amazing, this is wonderful and
Speaker 1: hopefully we're doing right by you. So until next week, y'all.
Speaker 5: Pace we handle.
Speaker 2: It's a fabulous our ladies.
Speaker 1: You where vomb travel this world speak.
Speaker 2: Tones from sunlight to move, busting on stage like gonna fight.
Speaker 2: Suppose go my mic back. You're like that journalists with
Speaker 2: journalists too, we can strike back all corver borders with
Speaker 2: waters from head borders behind in them line sides up
Speaker 2: and the borders the press passers. We bring it to
Speaker 2: you as it happens the streets. Love popping from music
Speaker 2: and rapping the street. Compared the slash expander. You're gonna
Speaker 2: fight the slander with the proper propaganda.
Speaker 1: What's happening. It's how you've got a questions.
Speaker 2: To ask introduces just a TV show you're passing and
Speaker 2: this from a white wartime. Journalists headlines, wake up, previews
Speaker 2: and resist like this, like this, like this, like this,
Speaker 2: we get finance, action, sports, sports, politics, new fashion, that
Speaker 2: Warver boots entertainment. When we come to perform, watch and
Speaker 2: the US when the man in the store watch Trick
Speaker 2: Clops video.
Speaker 1: But it can take the TV, that radio, CD or DVD.
Speaker 2: I recite