Speaker 1: Hey, everyone, Welcome to another episode of the Market Disruptor Show,
Speaker 1: and today I am joined by John Wallace. He is
Speaker 1: the host of the Bitcoin Rapid Fire podcast. He is
Speaker 1: a deep thinker, he's an educator. He's he read a
Speaker 1: lot of a lot of literature, helping other people discover
Speaker 1: that literature. Um, I'm excited to have this conversation to day. John,
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for joining. Alright, it's great to be here.
Speaker 1: I'm looking forward to this. So. Yeah, I know you
Speaker 1: put out a lot of content and for those paying attention,
Speaker 1: they start to kind of get an idea of your
Speaker 1: viewpoints and whatnot. But for those of that are new
Speaker 1: to you at this point, um, why don't you just
Speaker 1: give us a little bit of background on, um, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of what you're focusing on and what you're doing. Sure,
Speaker 1: very briefly, I started my career in wealth management. I
Speaker 1: lived in China for a decade, in Shanghai and Beijing,
Speaker 1: and uh really did not enjoy the incentives there. You know,
Speaker 1: it was very the how the the legacy system had
Speaker 1: degraded and decayed and kind of broken was very apparent
Speaker 1: to me. And I had always been you know, kind
Speaker 1: of unsettled by the state of the world. It looked
Speaker 1: to be going in the wrong direction to me, and
Speaker 1: being in the belly of the beast as it were,
Speaker 1: you know, just kind of proved that out to me
Speaker 1: even more. Hey, guys, let me just interrupt this interview
Speaker 1: real quick, just to plug the show sponsor, and that
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Speaker 1: you know, I wandered for a while, try to learn,
Speaker 1: try to figure out, you know, you know, what could
Speaker 1: resolve the world's issues. And then you know, around thirteen fourteen,
Speaker 1: I came across bitcoin. I started going down the rabbit hole,
Speaker 1: touched it a few times before it really clicked. And then,
Speaker 1: you know, like many of us, uh, it's been a
Speaker 1: never ending journey ever since. And and conviction and interest
Speaker 1: just continues to increase as I learn more about both
Speaker 1: bitcoin and all the different things that it touches and
Speaker 1: the implications that it's going to have on society. And so,
Speaker 1: you know, my focus these days is not so much
Speaker 1: building the case for bitcoin and discussing, you know, where
Speaker 1: it sits in the economic and financial paradigm of the
Speaker 1: world and investing all that is really interesting and I
Speaker 1: think you know, um, there's a lot of great acommendators,
Speaker 1: including yourself, that that really delve into those topics, and
Speaker 1: I really appreciate your insights as we're discussing before we
Speaker 1: fired this up. My main interest is looking at what
Speaker 1: are going to be the implications of having this form
Speaker 1: of money emerged on the world. What are the characteristics
Speaker 1: of the parallel system that is emerging as you know
Speaker 1: that that is the bitcoin culture, let's say, and how
Speaker 1: it's changing people, you know. That's that's my big thing
Speaker 1: is nothing matters unless it changes behavior, right, That's why
Speaker 1: things are interesting, That's why things are important. That's why
Speaker 1: tools are relevant and useful because they allow a certain
Speaker 1: form of novel behavior or they improve upon a behavior
Speaker 1: that was you know, that existed before and so for me,
Speaker 1: the interesting question is is what does this thing mean
Speaker 1: for changes in human behavior and interaction? And I think
Speaker 1: if you're in the bitcoin quote unquote community, if you're
Speaker 1: mixing it up on Twitter, if you're paying attention, you're
Speaker 1: starting to notice that a unique culture is emerging with
Speaker 1: certain principles and certain values, and certain forms of communication
Speaker 1: and certain ideas and certain methods of interacting. And that's
Speaker 1: what I really like delving into. And uh, it's it's
Speaker 1: been a real honor and a privilege to be able
Speaker 1: to do so yeah, yeah, it is. It is awesome,
Speaker 1: and I want to dig into that. Um uh, well,
Speaker 1: we'll position that towards the end. I want to. I
Speaker 1: want to I want to start by kind of setting
Speaker 1: a stage a little bit kind of for where we're
Speaker 1: at right now, and then uh, really I want to
Speaker 1: kind of dive into, um, you know, more actionable stuff
Speaker 1: like what we can set up the stage with some
Speaker 1: of the problems that we see and maybe some underlying reasons,
Speaker 1: and then we'll dig into maybe some actionable stuff and
Speaker 1: we'll talk about this parallel system that's being built. As
Speaker 1: as you said, this whole culture of people is kind
Speaker 1: of congregating and doing real things that I that I
Speaker 1: think brings a lot of hope if people were to
Speaker 1: learn about that. But UM, if we start kind of
Speaker 1: at the beginning, um, or I should say a present day, Um, obviously,
Speaker 1: the world is in a state of uh, I don't
Speaker 1: know what you want to call it, the disrepair. I
Speaker 1: mean that people, everybody knows there's something going wrong, and
Speaker 1: it seems like tensions are boiling high. Um, all across
Speaker 1: the world. I know you're in you know, we're in
Speaker 1: different countries, but we're all still seeing the same things. UM.
Speaker 1: Kind of give us a I mean, I guess you
Speaker 1: studied a lot of like history, right, so a lot
Speaker 1: of these books and they've kind of foretold a lot
Speaker 1: of it. But now we seem to be learning some
Speaker 1: of these same lessons that our forefathers warned us about.
Speaker 1: So what what do you think is happening right now
Speaker 1: in the world that maybe could have been avoided or
Speaker 1: we were warned about that that we're that we're all
Speaker 1: staring at right now. Well that's the sixty four million
Speaker 1: dollar question, isn't it. But you know, I think down yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean they say history doesn't repeat, but it rhymes,
Speaker 1: and that I think is one of the reasons why
Speaker 1: we continue to make the same mistakes, because the circumstances
Speaker 1: of history are always different, the players, the times, all
Speaker 1: that kind of stuff. But the let's say, the psychological
Speaker 1: processes that underpinned the thinking and the decision making are,
Speaker 1: you know, are very similar, you know so, and I
Speaker 1: know some people will find this extreme, but lately I've
Speaker 1: been digging, digging into nineteen thirties Germany, right because I
Speaker 1: I wanted to see or I want to try to
Speaker 1: understand better what psychological processes, what assumptions, what biases, what
Speaker 1: you know, what was going on in the cultural zeitgeist
Speaker 1: at the time that allowed that circumstance to unfold the
Speaker 1: way that it did, because I reject the the simplistic
Speaker 1: explanation that either everyone was scared of that out of
Speaker 1: their boots and they just act yes too, you know,
Speaker 1: a tyrannical leader, or that they were you know, somehow
Speaker 1: corrupted and they were all evil and they were uniquely
Speaker 1: evil for example, and that couldn't happen to other people
Speaker 1: because you know, for whatever reason. I mean, the fact
Speaker 1: is is that we're all human beings, and so the
Speaker 1: behavior of any one human being exists and is every
Speaker 1: human being is capable of the same behavior. The question
Speaker 1: is is what circumstances draw that out? What what psychological
Speaker 1: processes allow that to occur? And um, you know, so
Speaker 1: that the times we're in right now are really concerning
Speaker 1: for me, because, um, I see a lot of delusion
Speaker 1: in the world. I see a lot of dishonesty. I
Speaker 1: see a lot of I see this the strength of
Speaker 1: ideology in the world. I see the corrupting effect of
Speaker 1: the cultural zeitgeist that causes people not to see things
Speaker 1: clearly and not even want to see things clearly. So,
Speaker 1: you know, that's all extremely concerning. And what I think
Speaker 1: is different this time, you know, to be honest, and
Speaker 1: to bring it back to bitcoin, is that Bitcoin I
Speaker 1: think is a genuinely unique thing or element that that
Speaker 1: we can interact with that really changes, um some of
Speaker 1: the changes that the dynamic in a way that might
Speaker 1: allow us to not make the same mistakes that we've
Speaker 1: made in the past. Now, you know, will it, will
Speaker 1: it catch on quick enough? Will enough people get it?
Speaker 1: And are we correct in our assumption about what it is?
Speaker 1: But you know, I don't have to explain to you
Speaker 1: but just you know, for your audience, the corruption of
Speaker 1: the money has been one of the repeating problems throughout history,
Speaker 1: you know, whether we're talking about Roman times or whether
Speaker 1: we're talking about the modern nation state, and of course
Speaker 1: the regime that we're under globally right now since nine
Speaker 1: the powers that be, whoever they are, and and to
Speaker 1: be honest, I think most of the time well intended,
Speaker 1: you know. I I don't ascribe so easily to you know,
Speaker 1: the notion that we have evil overlords that are you know,
Speaker 1: intentionally enslaving us. I think a lot of the time
Speaker 1: it's incompetence and ignorance, not malice. But nevertheless, the process
Speaker 1: that unfolds is that the money is corrupted and we
Speaker 1: lose a tether to any sense of reality and in
Speaker 1: the creation of our money, and as a result, a
Speaker 1: world of illusion emerges on top of that. And it's
Speaker 1: it's almost, you know, poetically correct that if you if
Speaker 1: the value underpinning the society is an illusion, is created
Speaker 1: out of nothing, then why would you expect the perception
Speaker 1: of the society at large to be anything different? And
Speaker 1: that's that's all. That's that's a lot of good stuff.
Speaker 1: I want to unpack some of that stuff for it
Speaker 1: for just a minute. So, UM, A couple of things
Speaker 1: that you said, and I think it's important for everyone
Speaker 1: to pay attention to you, is that you know a
Speaker 1: lot of times people who want to just focus on
Speaker 1: the money and like Mark, I just subscribed you just
Speaker 1: to hear about money and economics and what the FED
Speaker 1: is doing. But like all of this is intertwined, right,
Speaker 1: So you have to understand like, you know, human you
Speaker 1: know humanity, as you said, like humans are somewhat predictable. Um,
Speaker 1: you know we have we all have human nature. Basically,
Speaker 1: humans are motivated by two things, right, Uh, moving towards
Speaker 1: pleasure moving away from pain. Um. And so we're kind
Speaker 1: of like on this bumper ride, like moving between that. UM.
Speaker 1: So you have to kind of understand human nature. You
Speaker 1: have to understand societal stuff, um to to really get
Speaker 1: that and and kind of what you were talking about,
Speaker 1: I think if I have this right, but if you
Speaker 1: look at um, you were looking at nineteen thirties Germany
Speaker 1: and obviously that was a time of great turmoil that
Speaker 1: led to the whole world going into a war. Um.
Speaker 1: It was almost like society is always like a push pull, right,
Speaker 1: like when it's a cause and an effect, so like
Speaker 1: when this type of environment happens, then this is kind
Speaker 1: of the outcome. So I guess are you seeing when
Speaker 1: you're back in nineteen thirties, are you seeing like these
Speaker 1: certain factors were apparent in the world or in Germany
Speaker 1: at that time, which was then led to that outcome,
Speaker 1: And then maybe we see those same type of factors
Speaker 1: setting up today that could potentially lead to the same
Speaker 1: type of outcome. The simple answer is yes. I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm not going to pretend to understand all the different
Speaker 1: variables that went into the psychology of your middle class
Speaker 1: German citizen in the early nineteen thirties, but broadly speaking,
Speaker 1: what I think is happening is that people are being
Speaker 1: led astray by ideology and there's not enough of a
Speaker 1: commitment to developing a perception based on clarity and truth. Right,
Speaker 1: There's not enough, uh, dedication to that. And if there isn't,
Speaker 1: I think it's easy to be led astray by fear,
Speaker 1: by ideology, by a charismatic leader, by the you know,
Speaker 1: by the different delusions that emerge as a result of
Speaker 1: how the government spends money, creates money, all that kind
Speaker 1: of stuff. So you know, broadly speaking, one of the
Speaker 1: thing it troubles me the most, and the thing that
Speaker 1: I guess I try to articulate is don't you know,
Speaker 1: make up your own mind, critic your own critical thinking
Speaker 1: is of the utmost important here and never stop refining
Speaker 1: your perspectives because that's what That's how we give away
Speaker 1: our freedom far before we're locked into a cage or
Speaker 1: a country or what have you, is we we delegate
Speaker 1: our perception to somebody else. We allow somebody else to
Speaker 1: construct it for us. And there's many reasons for that,
Speaker 1: and there's there's reasons of incentive and in fear and
Speaker 1: that those kind of things. But I think if we
Speaker 1: need to get back to a place where we trust
Speaker 1: ourselves more than anybody, and if you're going to trust yourself,
Speaker 1: you have to put in the work. You have to
Speaker 1: educate yourself. And you know, again, in today's society, most
Speaker 1: people rely on outside sources, uh for their education. I mean,
Speaker 1: most people take the nightly news and they read maybe
Speaker 1: the newspaper and a couple of people that they follow
Speaker 1: online and they feel like they've got to grasp on
Speaker 1: on what's going on in the world. And um, I
Speaker 1: also think there's we're so deep into the let's say
Speaker 1: late stage Fiat big government dynamic, um, that it seems
Speaker 1: so natural and normal to people. And again you could
Speaker 1: you could probably easily make a parallel to nineteen thirties
Speaker 1: Germany that things the status quo is very intoxicating. It
Speaker 1: can feel normal, like you emerge in a world and
Speaker 1: you think, well, it's always kind of been this way,
Speaker 1: so this is the way that it should be. Exactly.
Speaker 1: These are the defenders of the status quo. This is
Speaker 1: basically the crux of their argument. Whereas I think we
Speaker 1: would come from the perspective of looking at things from
Speaker 1: first principles and saying, is this the way things should be?
Speaker 1: What is wrong here? And what is wrong based on
Speaker 1: perhaps moral principles, what is wrong based on you know, uh,
Speaker 1: previous outcomes in the past that we can glean insights
Speaker 1: from and apply them to what's happening currently. Um, And
Speaker 1: there just seems to be not enough of that going on,
Speaker 1: and I think that's partially why we're we're going down
Speaker 1: the wrong road in many cases. Yeah, um, it's interesting.
Speaker 1: You know, you were talking about kind of this education
Speaker 1: and people are differing their education or relying on relying
Speaker 1: on so called experts today rather than trying to figure
Speaker 1: things out for themselves. And it's interesting, right, it starts
Speaker 1: with consuming information and then thinking through that, and then
Speaker 1: you're thinking changes your actions. You had talked earlier about right,
Speaker 1: we have to change actions. Um. But but you know
Speaker 1: it's interesting if we look back through history, we can
Speaker 1: see that many times. Let's say, you know, before the
Speaker 1: separation of church and state, right, the church was the
Speaker 1: state for so long, and the people didn't have the information.
Speaker 1: They didn't have the Bible, so they relied on the
Speaker 1: Church to tell them what the Bible said, and they
Speaker 1: just whatever the Church says, that's what the Bible says. Right.
Speaker 1: But once that was decentralized and everybody had it, they
Speaker 1: could all read it for themselves, and it was that
Speaker 1: education process that freed them. I think we could see again, um,
Speaker 1: the Roman Empire seven years of you know, an amazing republic,
Speaker 1: and it fell, we went to the dark ages. They
Speaker 1: lost all the education, and then the Renaissance people got
Speaker 1: the information again and boom um, and and we might
Speaker 1: almost see the same thing happening today. To your point,
Speaker 1: where all these people don't want to educate themselves. Um,
Speaker 1: but maybe that tide is changing. Maybe, as you said,
Speaker 1: there's a whole group of people that are are starting
Speaker 1: to pull out those whole books, dust them off. Maybe
Speaker 1: there's another renaissance coming from that education. Yeah, what do
Speaker 1: you think? Undeniably? You know that the the Internet and
Speaker 1: you know again this show, my show, all the amazing
Speaker 1: content coming out is at least creating a free market
Speaker 1: and information. The incumbents still have a lot of influence.
Speaker 1: There's you know, a lot of ingrained behavior and network
Speaker 1: effects of that kind of stuff. But I think that
Speaker 1: is changing. And the reason why bitcoin is so useful
Speaker 1: in that regard is because you know, some people may
Speaker 1: not be that compelled to learn or enhance their perspective
Speaker 1: for just for that reason. But when there's greed involved,
Speaker 1: when there's money involved, people are far there's a star
Speaker 1: far stronger pull. And so what I find interesting about
Speaker 1: what's happening in bitcoin is a lot of people may
Speaker 1: come for the gains, right, come for your portfolio diversification,
Speaker 1: come for your inflation resistance, whatever, but you wind up
Speaker 1: in this community that is really has a tremendous appetite
Speaker 1: for learning about all the different ways that this thing
Speaker 1: is relevant and meaningful, and so yes, that means in
Speaker 1: the economic, financial, and investing realm, but also means in
Speaker 1: the social. It also means in the historical. It also
Speaker 1: means in the psychological. That also means in the philosophical
Speaker 1: and even the spiritual. And we're still figuring out what
Speaker 1: all that means. But the point is is that these
Speaker 1: people are it's kind of a revivification of their intellectual
Speaker 1: curiosity where I think a lot of people you get
Speaker 1: put through the meat grinder of of you know, formal education.
Speaker 1: You know, you come out of your KG well school,
Speaker 1: you're going to university, a path is kind of set
Speaker 1: for you. You put your blinders on, you work, you
Speaker 1: try to enhance your your life and achieve the things
Speaker 1: you want to achieve, and your your intellectual curiosity gets
Speaker 1: dialed down dramatically because you have to focus. I think
Speaker 1: what bitcoin is doing is is turning that back up,
Speaker 1: and because it's it's kind of proposing to people like, hey,
Speaker 1: there's a new world emerging here, there's a new paradigm
Speaker 1: emerging here, and it's going to change a lot of
Speaker 1: things very radically, and you know, it behooves you to
Speaker 1: learn about what's going on and what those changes might be.
Speaker 1: And also, hey, look, I think at least from my
Speaker 1: perspective and a lot of people I speak to, it
Speaker 1: reminds you how fun it is to learn about something
Speaker 1: that's both interesting and meaningful. Right, It's not just an
Speaker 1: intellectual you know, uh exercise, it's actually relevant learning. And
Speaker 1: that's a that's a blessing. Yeah, yeah, that's that's a
Speaker 1: great point that you just brought up. And I think, um,
Speaker 1: you know, if you look at like an art, so
Speaker 1: martial arts or painting or any type of art, it's
Speaker 1: really like it's a lifelong journey. Right, you don't ever
Speaker 1: achieve that the pinnacle of that. And if anybody's done
Speaker 1: a sport or a martial art or even just working
Speaker 1: out or whatever, like you love up those gains like
Speaker 1: oh I learned this new move, I can't wait to
Speaker 1: try it again, And and there's fulfillment in like getting
Speaker 1: better at that craft. And I think education could be
Speaker 1: the same way. Like, um, you take that red pill
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden you have this new world
Speaker 1: and now there's this curiosity and each time you learn something,
Speaker 1: you realize how much more there is to learned. And
Speaker 1: so maybe it's kind of like that flywheel. I like that. Um,
Speaker 1: now you said something earlier that you said, uh, you know,
Speaker 1: you don't know how there's the world of illusion. Um,
Speaker 1: you don't know how much was well intended versus evil.
Speaker 1: I'm curious, you know, it seems like it seems like
Speaker 1: I would agree with that. We have generations now that
Speaker 1: have been taught wrong information and so I guess they're
Speaker 1: just naive or they're ignorant or whatever. However, if we
Speaker 1: go back, we could almost see that there was like
Speaker 1: a uh, intentional takeover of the education system to change it.
Speaker 1: So maybe it was like intended, uh you know, fifty
Speaker 1: years ago, sixty years ago, and now today it's just
Speaker 1: what people thinking they're doing well intentions. Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: I think there's almost always agendas, right, But I think
Speaker 1: very very few people consider themselves to be evil, right,
Speaker 1: I guess. And it's a it's a matter of where
Speaker 1: you stand. It's a matter of perspective. Right, one person
Speaker 1: executing on their agenda and their incentives might be construed
Speaker 1: as opposing the incentives and the agenda of another person,
Speaker 1: and maybe they characterize that as evil. But is that
Speaker 1: like outright evil, like a desire to do ill in
Speaker 1: the world. Probably not, um, although you can make a
Speaker 1: case that it's always subjective. But my point is just
Speaker 1: that I think most people are playing to their incentives
Speaker 1: and doing what they think is best for themselves, and
Speaker 1: maybe there is often not enough consideration for the greater
Speaker 1: good or the people that those actions might impact. You know,
Speaker 1: that's definitely the case, especially in the current regime money
Speaker 1: regime that we exist in today. But um, the point
Speaker 1: for me is it doesn't matter, like if you're a
Speaker 1: type of conspiracy type, like I don't think you're ever
Speaker 1: going to be able to discern the truth, right you
Speaker 1: You might have clues of what's going on or whose agenda,
Speaker 1: what agenda might be operating, but I just don't think
Speaker 1: that stuff can never be discerned with any degree of certainty.
Speaker 1: And I don't think it matters, right like I think
Speaker 1: whether it's some grand conspiracy to enslave you, or whether
Speaker 1: it's a an issue right at the basis of the
Speaker 1: system that creates all these bad incentives that allows people
Speaker 1: to take advantage of them everywhere, all the way up
Speaker 1: the ladder, I don't think it matters in terms of
Speaker 1: what solution is best. Right. So, as we were discussing before,
Speaker 1: we came on to me, Bitcoin is the greatest force
Speaker 1: for positive change to the world has ever seen. And
Speaker 1: so I'm just gonna lean into that as hard as
Speaker 1: I can, rather than trying to specifically identify the source
Speaker 1: of all the different problems. And I think it's good
Speaker 1: to be educated about, uh, what's going wrong because that
Speaker 1: can be a motivating force about how much you you know,
Speaker 1: the energy you bring to finding a solution. So I
Speaker 1: think there's a an element of identifying what's going wrong,
Speaker 1: but maybe not all the way into knowing exactly why
Speaker 1: that is because I think that the most important thing
Speaker 1: is is a solution available, is a solution in front
Speaker 1: of you? If the answer is yes, then learn as
Speaker 1: much and engage as much as you can about and
Speaker 1: into that. And I think that's the way the best
Speaker 1: way to resolve things. Yeah, I actually really like that.
Speaker 1: I agree with that. I think, um, it's important, it's
Speaker 1: important to understand what the problem is because then we
Speaker 1: need to make sure we have the right cure for that.
Speaker 1: But we don't have to know, you know, we are
Speaker 1: where we are and we don't have to like, was
Speaker 1: it intentional was a conspiration, doesn't really matter. We are
Speaker 1: where we are and and the understand that situation and
Speaker 1: to make a plan for that. Um. That's why I've
Speaker 1: always really tried to focus my content on why why
Speaker 1: is bitcoin even important? And you have to start to
Speaker 1: understand what those problems are in order to understand how
Speaker 1: bitcoin can start to solve that. Um. So let's let's
Speaker 1: transition into that a little bit. So, UM, you know,
Speaker 1: we are where we are, as we just said, uh,
Speaker 1: we're in We're in this world that has gone increasingly
Speaker 1: towards centralization and globalization and all those types of things. Um,
Speaker 1: we've also seen I think the Internet allowed, you know,
Speaker 1: the rise of centralization. So Google took over, right, Kids
Speaker 1: in first grade are starting with Google grown books like
Speaker 1: that's all they know, right, and so, uh, you know,
Speaker 1: the Internet has allowed that rise of centralization. But what
Speaker 1: we've also seen is that this manipulation, I like to
Speaker 1: say manipulation always leads to I'm sorry, centralization always leads
Speaker 1: to manipulation. And so Facebook still in the data and
Speaker 1: well as Fargo is putting fake bank accounts on and
Speaker 1: the government's doing whatever, right, and so we've kind of
Speaker 1: got to this point where like all these institutions maybe education, healthcare, finance,
Speaker 1: and media, I mean they're corrupted. And that's uh, there's
Speaker 1: in my opinion, I don't think there's any going and
Speaker 1: saving that system. But as you're saying, we have a
Speaker 1: tool now, UM to actually just allow us to go
Speaker 1: build this alternative system. Hey, sorry to interrupt this video
Speaker 1: just one more time. I'm not running Google ads. So
Speaker 1: it's actually way less interruption than I normally would have
Speaker 1: on a video. UM. And that's because it's sponsored by
Speaker 1: block five. UM. They are opening up the world of
Speaker 1: bitcoin and financial products, offering to pay you interest on
Speaker 1: your bitcoin UM. Better than own in a rental property
Speaker 1: that you have to manage and control and have the risks.
Speaker 1: You can just earn interest on it or you can
Speaker 1: leverage against it. Now, I plan to hold my bitcoin
Speaker 1: forever and literally never sell my bitcoin. So how do
Speaker 1: you do that? Well, if I need money, I don't
Speaker 1: want to sell that bitcoin. I'm gonna pay tax on
Speaker 1: it all right, I'm gonna end up with less and
Speaker 1: I don't have the bitcoin anymore. So a better way
Speaker 1: to do it is to borrow against the bitcoin. So
Speaker 1: I've put all my money into bitcoin. If I want
Speaker 1: to buy a car, or I want to buy a house,
Speaker 1: I can borrow against it at very very low competitive rates.
Speaker 1: Get my house, get my car, whatever that may be,
Speaker 1: and get to keep the bitcoin. I've done a whole
Speaker 1: video on this. You can find it. I'll link it
Speaker 1: down to the description below, how to retire off a
Speaker 1: bitcoin without paying taxes, and you can do that with
Speaker 1: Block five Services' link to the video down below. I'm
Speaker 1: also going to put a link to block Fight. If
Speaker 1: you choose to click on that link to check them out,
Speaker 1: you can earn up to two fifty dollars in free
Speaker 1: bitcoin just for using that link. And that's it. Let's
Speaker 1: go ahead and get back to the interview. And it's
Speaker 1: kind of like, uh, like the book Atlas Shrugged, or
Speaker 1: if you if you watch the movie Outlas Shrug, but
Speaker 1: all the people, all the productive people in society just
Speaker 1: for leaving to go create this new society. And uh,
Speaker 1: I think there's some parallels to that we're seeing today. Yeah. Absolutely,
Speaker 1: And you know one of the points a couple of
Speaker 1: minutes ago we were talking about this kind of reinvigorating
Speaker 1: effect that bitcoin is having. I think a huge part
Speaker 1: of that is also the hope element, you know, Like
Speaker 1: I was saying, I when I was younger, in my
Speaker 1: early twenties, Um, you know, I looked out at the world,
Speaker 1: I did my best to understand how it all worked,
Speaker 1: and I came away with a fairly despondent attitude because
Speaker 1: I was like, you know, there's, of course, there's beauty
Speaker 1: in the world, and you can have a good time
Speaker 1: and all that kind of stuff, but large scale things
Speaker 1: seem to be going, you know, very much in the
Speaker 1: wrong direction. I didn't see how that could be turned around.
Speaker 1: And so that's all the more reason why you put
Speaker 1: those blinders on. You just try to create, you know,
Speaker 1: the best life you can for yourself and kind of
Speaker 1: ignore everything else. Um Whereas bitcoin, I think that one
Speaker 1: of the reasons why it's invigorated people is because it
Speaker 1: now has changed that perception of the future from not
Speaker 1: such a rosy picture to the rosiest that you know,
Speaker 1: you could ever imagine, you know, the Renaissance times a
Speaker 1: hundred or times a thousand, and so this just awakened
Speaker 1: so many things in us too that maybe we're latent,
Speaker 1: so that we didn't even know existed. To learn and
Speaker 1: to engage and grow and uh, as you say, I
Speaker 1: think a parallel system is emerging, and I think we're
Speaker 1: seeing the initial stages of that. And and there's a
Speaker 1: couple of elements of that. One is people are going
Speaker 1: where you know, there's a there seems to be a
Speaker 1: greater respect for individual freedoms, right, because this is, after all,
Speaker 1: I think, a revolution in individual sovereignty. Bitcoin allows you
Speaker 1: to be self sovereign over your money. And once you
Speaker 1: have that experience of self sovereignty over perhaps the most
Speaker 1: most important thing over which you can can have that,
Speaker 1: I think you that gets juxtaposed to other areas of
Speaker 1: your life, and you say, well, this is such a
Speaker 1: great empowering feeling of being sovereign over my money. What
Speaker 1: would it feel like to be sovereign over my education?
Speaker 1: What would it feel sovereignty over my my living circumstances
Speaker 1: and my food supply and that kind of stuff. And
Speaker 1: I think people are going out and trying to develop
Speaker 1: those solutions. And I also think, what's interesting, and I agree,
Speaker 1: I don't think there's going to be much changing the
Speaker 1: incumbent system. I think we're going to have to build
Speaker 1: something better. And what's what I'm finding really interesting is
Speaker 1: that people with the orange colored glasses on, right, big
Speaker 1: people that kind of took the orange pill, and they're
Speaker 1: seeing the world through a very, in some cases dramatically
Speaker 1: different lens of sound money, of self sovereignty. They're looking
Speaker 1: at these things like education, like the food supply, you know,
Speaker 1: like whatever, whatever, and they're actually reimagining it through that lens.
Speaker 1: And it's really fascinating to see some of the solutions
Speaker 1: that are beginning to emerge as a result of that.
Speaker 1: And I don't think it's a shock. I don't think
Speaker 1: it's a surprise to many people. Because if we're being
Speaker 1: so critical of what's emerged as a result of using
Speaker 1: you know, fiat money, let's say that the mindset that
Speaker 1: emerged from a society using that, then we should expect
Speaker 1: a fairly dramatic perception of mindset to emerge from a
Speaker 1: society that is predicated on a incorruptible sound money. Um.
Speaker 1: And you know, one that that I spoke to some
Speaker 1: people on the podcast recently was this you know, decentralized
Speaker 1: cattle coop, where, uh, these guys are reimagining how to
Speaker 1: raise cattle and they're bringing together people who want to
Speaker 1: ranch investors and landowners and uh, you know, getting ancient
Speaker 1: DNA very resilient cattle to both regenerate kind of a
Speaker 1: permaculture sort of idea where they're regenerating the land, they're
Speaker 1: giving people the opportunity to be self sufficient. UM. And
Speaker 1: it's you know, I won't explain it very well. UM,
Speaker 1: So I refer people to to that podcast with um
Speaker 1: that I had recently. But the point is that people
Speaker 1: are seeing the world differently and they're developing different solutions,
Speaker 1: and we're just at the very beginning of that. And
Speaker 1: I'm super pumped to see because one of the things
Speaker 1: people ask me a lot is, you know, I'm super
Speaker 1: into bitcoin, but I'm an architect or I'm super into
Speaker 1: bitcoin and I you know, make chairs or whatever, and
Speaker 1: I want to be more involved in bitcoin. And so,
Speaker 1: you know, up to this point, it's been like, well,
Speaker 1: you can start a bitcoin company, or you can be
Speaker 1: a podcaster, or you can do it not very many
Speaker 1: different things. And what I think is interesting that we're
Speaker 1: starting to see now is people are realizing that bitcoin
Speaker 1: is money, and money is relative. You know, money touches everything,
Speaker 1: and so whatever it is you do, I suspect that
Speaker 1: when you put on the bitcoin lens, you'll see what
Speaker 1: you do differently, and you'll see an opportunity to do
Speaker 1: what you do but with a bitcoin twist. And I
Speaker 1: think that's what we're starting to see, and that's what's
Speaker 1: going to be the impetus for creating this parallel economy
Speaker 1: that we've been referring to. Yeah, yeah, that's that's a
Speaker 1: that's a great way to put it. I kind of
Speaker 1: look at it like imagine like a giant tree, like
Speaker 1: a giant oak tree, and it's got, you know, I
Speaker 1: don't know, thousands or tens of thousands of leaves on it,
Speaker 1: and like each leave is like representative to like a
Speaker 1: problem in society, right, Uh, the incarceration rate, of the
Speaker 1: divorce rate, or the homelessness rate, or whatever it may be.
Speaker 1: And we can sit there and we can pluck each
Speaker 1: leave and we can discuss it. But at the at
Speaker 1: the base, at the root, that's the money. Right. So
Speaker 1: it's like that's the root of of all those problems
Speaker 1: that we have. And if we you know, we if
Speaker 1: we can fix the money, we can fix the world.
Speaker 1: Um and so um. As you said, I think it
Speaker 1: was a perfect right. You have that orange colored lens
Speaker 1: and so you first take control of that money and
Speaker 1: it just changes the way that you look at the world.
Speaker 1: So it gives you a different time preference all of
Speaker 1: a sudden, Right now you can focus on the future
Speaker 1: instead of you know, taking away some of the uncertainty
Speaker 1: of the of the near term. And what it's doing
Speaker 1: kind of like back to the Atlas shrug, right, it's
Speaker 1: attracting this mind share of of people that are pulled
Speaker 1: together on value. So like society today is trying to
Speaker 1: break people into identities, but like people don't. People don't
Speaker 1: usually group on identities, right, they group on values. And
Speaker 1: so it's pulling this whole group of people that have
Speaker 1: this freedom loving, self sustaining, um, self reliant culture and
Speaker 1: now they're reimagining that world like that that like that
Speaker 1: like that cattle company, which is great. Even even like education,
Speaker 1: I know, I mean you do. You're doing like book clubs, right,
Speaker 1: so you're like pulling people together and like let's look
Speaker 1: at this book and let's study it, let's discuss it.
Speaker 1: And even that is is a different way of doing things.
Speaker 1: And now you're kind of taking on education. Yeah, I mean,
Speaker 1: this is what I love so much about this This
Speaker 1: whole phenomenon. It's like it is about each and every
Speaker 1: one of us changing and developing. Like we kind of
Speaker 1: end up having this idea, at least some of us
Speaker 1: as we grow up, Like we kind of have a
Speaker 1: set image of ourselves, you know, how we fit into
Speaker 1: the world, who we are, that kind of thing. And
Speaker 1: what I love about this is this is I think
Speaker 1: inspiring people to uh reopen that that door, right, and
Speaker 1: the kind of explore who they might be and what
Speaker 1: they might be able to understand and the perspectives they
Speaker 1: might be able to inhabit, and then to feed into
Speaker 1: a culture that values that. And that is all about
Speaker 1: kind of enhancing that and a genuine excitement about what
Speaker 1: it means that we we now have this thing that
Speaker 1: we can coalesce around that is inspiring us to develop
Speaker 1: and grow and allowing us the opportunity to feed into it,
Speaker 1: to to kind of grow the whole. So I think
Speaker 1: it's awesome, and I think your point about how it's
Speaker 1: kind of a magnet bringing people in is is amazing.
Speaker 1: And I think it's so great to see that something
Speaker 1: with the principles that you articulated, you know, something that
Speaker 1: is about freedom, something that is about fairness, something that
Speaker 1: is about personal responsibility, something that is about independence, Like
Speaker 1: these are really good values and principles, right, and to
Speaker 1: see this thing, you know, self selecting, to pluck out
Speaker 1: all those people around the world who are kind of
Speaker 1: on the front the initial stages of embodying or feeling
Speaker 1: or or valuing those things all being pulled into bitcoin
Speaker 1: to make this thing stronger, make this thing more robust,
Speaker 1: make this thing more dynamic, and as a result of
Speaker 1: doing that, they expand the surface area of what this
Speaker 1: thing is. So then the next cohort of people will
Speaker 1: be pulled in as well, you know. So it's it's
Speaker 1: a a brand new culture emerging around I think, far
Speaker 1: better principles than the one we currently have. And it
Speaker 1: has this magnet like effect on picking out the people
Speaker 1: that are closest to those principles already, and then further away,
Speaker 1: and then further away in the further way as it
Speaker 1: expands and it gets bigger, and you know, it's it's
Speaker 1: a genuine paradigm shift and a genuine cultural phenomenon that's underway.
Speaker 1: Something else that's interesting I think is um I think
Speaker 1: if you look at the United States, the founding of
Speaker 1: the United States. And really, I think you know what's
Speaker 1: made the United States great was was a belief in individualism.
Speaker 1: And um, it's the individual that should have the liberty
Speaker 1: and the freedom and and that then adds to the
Speaker 1: collective good. And so what do I mean by that? Well, um,
Speaker 1: you know, you and I were different people and we
Speaker 1: look at the world differently. And that's a good thing
Speaker 1: because I see different problems than you do. And so
Speaker 1: now I can go out and solve those problems, um,
Speaker 1: which you probably wouldn't have seen and you wouldn't have solved.
Speaker 1: And so if we're all we're all the same, If
Speaker 1: we're all you know in a collectivism, U, we're not
Speaker 1: solving all those needs. And then so I think layering
Speaker 1: onto what you've just said, Bitcoin is attracting people who
Speaker 1: are about self reliance, about self responsibility, that are into
Speaker 1: individualism and so they've come together on a shared a
Speaker 1: group of values. But because they're all individuals, Um, it's
Speaker 1: this decentralized method of going out and seeing these problems,
Speaker 1: whether that be getting good meat on a sustainably raised
Speaker 1: land to people, um, of of seeing people that are
Speaker 1: starting like little pods for schools. Right, everyone's being homeschool
Speaker 1: today or a lot of people are, A lot of
Speaker 1: kids are, and so you know, maybe a decentralized way
Speaker 1: to attack um. Education. Obviously finances already being disrupted. Um,
Speaker 1: so we're seeing that and so really all these institutions
Speaker 1: are are being broken down. Um what about government or
Speaker 1: maybe governance? What are you what are your thoughts on that? Yeah,
Speaker 1: well you touch upon something that I think is one
Speaker 1: of the conceits of both our times and times in
Speaker 1: the past when things have gone astray. And because people
Speaker 1: might hear the word individualism and they might disagree, but
Speaker 1: the fact is that there is nothing but individuals acting. Right.
Speaker 1: To assume that there's collective action is a fallacy. It's
Speaker 1: a delusion. It's a bunch of individuals. They may be
Speaker 1: acting together, but it's still individuals acting. And I I
Speaker 1: think that's in our current times, people for ideological reasons
Speaker 1: or otherwise assume that that's not the case. They assume
Speaker 1: that there's like some sort of group uh identity or
Speaker 1: action rather than individuals and as you say, like individuals
Speaker 1: acting and taking responsibility for their actions and then engaging
Speaker 1: with other individuals to achieve whatever ends they may have
Speaker 1: a mind that's the point, and that's the strength of
Speaker 1: individuals interacting on a voluntary basis in a free market.
Speaker 1: That's how you get the best outcomes. But to misconstrue
Speaker 1: that relationship and assume that there are certain groups that
Speaker 1: are kind of destined for ideological reasons to act in
Speaker 1: a certain way, and that those ideologies should or could
Speaker 1: be imposed on others to get them to conform to
Speaker 1: act in a similar way. That is what ultimately leads
Speaker 1: into tyrannical relationships, right of imposing what you think is
Speaker 1: best on somebody else. And that's the that's the problem.
Speaker 1: And I agree that you know, the founding of the
Speaker 1: US and the founding documents of the US were phenomenal ideas,
Speaker 1: and you know, all things considered, they've held up fairly well.
Speaker 1: But you know the problem is is that we've never
Speaker 1: had something that can keep those ideas and the people
Speaker 1: that are meant to steward them in check. You know,
Speaker 1: how how can we stave off the corruption of of
Speaker 1: the individual And I think this is where we get
Speaker 1: into kind of ah esoteric territory with bitcoin, because we
Speaker 1: can make rules and we can all agree to abide
Speaker 1: by them, But what do you do when people cheat?
Speaker 1: And what do you do when people cheat at scale?
Speaker 1: And what do you do when when powerful people cheat?
Speaker 1: And you know, there there's answers to that, but there's
Speaker 1: no great answers to that. And I think that is
Speaker 1: why societies have kind of always degraded, or or at
Speaker 1: least they've they've gone away from their founding principles because
Speaker 1: humans are corruptible. And and if bitcoin, I mean the
Speaker 1: the the proposition or the possibility here is that bitcoin
Speaker 1: is somewhat of an incorruptible substance that will allow out
Speaker 1: us to coordinate human interaction, not only in a better
Speaker 1: way than we've ever done before, but in a way
Speaker 1: that maybe cannot be corrupted. And I know that's a
Speaker 1: big statement and time will tell if it's accurate or not,
Speaker 1: but it's on the question of governance. UM, I think
Speaker 1: most of the governance should be in the free market,
Speaker 1: and the free the fundamental, the most important piece of
Speaker 1: the free market is the rails on which it runs,
Speaker 1: and that is the money. So if the money can
Speaker 1: be incorruptible, and if it's fair and the rules are
Speaker 1: the same for everybody, then I think you get a
Speaker 1: market that is far, far less susceptible to corruption, and
Speaker 1: as a result of that, the voluntary interactions of the
Speaker 1: market participants will be will will be self governing. Let's
Speaker 1: say that being said, will human beings still want to
Speaker 1: come together? Um, for you know, collective action that can't
Speaker 1: be facilitated by the market. Probably, But I'm not willing
Speaker 1: to you know, I'm not able to identify right now
Speaker 1: what that will look like when we have a global
Speaker 1: free market, because in principle, I think that if you
Speaker 1: if you want something, and if enough people want it,
Speaker 1: then there's an opportunity there, and the market will provide
Speaker 1: it an absent and ability to corrupt that relationship, you
Speaker 1: should probably get it in the form that you're demanding it.
Speaker 1: So I don't think government or governance will go away entirely,
Speaker 1: but I think most of the governance will be a
Speaker 1: natural manifestation of a market based on incorruptible money. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: that's I think that's a great point. And I think
Speaker 1: you know what, typically what smart people would do is
Speaker 1: they would look for areas that had success and try
Speaker 1: to kind of reverse engineer that success leads clues. I
Speaker 1: always say, so like, wow, this was very successful. What
Speaker 1: were the ingredients that made that successful. So we can
Speaker 1: see examples all over. I mean Hong Kong was a
Speaker 1: good example of that. The United States was a great
Speaker 1: example of that. And uh, the way what's interesting of
Speaker 1: the United States was founded was it was founded on
Speaker 1: a decentralized government. So they came from like this monarchy,
Speaker 1: which is the ultimate centralized government, and they came and
Speaker 1: they created a republic where all the states were to
Speaker 1: be independent of each other. Um. In that type of
Speaker 1: a role, the President of the United States is really
Speaker 1: inconsequential and like the President of the United States, nobody
Speaker 1: even really cares because they don't really have any power
Speaker 1: other than some foreign affairs. UM. But that's trended to
Speaker 1: become more and more centralized. And so looking at where success, right,
Speaker 1: the United States had massive success um for hundreds of
Speaker 1: years based off of that principle. Like I said, Hong Kong,
Speaker 1: we could look at Germany, East and West. I mean
Speaker 1: it's a perfect example. But um, I can see it's decentralized,
Speaker 1: you know, decentralizing more in smaller pockets of government. And
Speaker 1: I would say that, I mean, million people United States
Speaker 1: is just way too many to be under one regime. Right,
Speaker 1: because they don't know that. But back to the point
Speaker 1: you were talking about and laying that found that foundation
Speaker 1: with bitcoin. UM, I'm looking at it like UM, if
Speaker 1: you if you, you know, cleans a lot of things.
Speaker 1: And that's why it's so difficult to understand. UM. There's
Speaker 1: been four technological revolutions in the last two and fifty years,
Speaker 1: and and not new technologies, but revolutions where it literally
Speaker 1: changed human life. Right. So, uh, we had the Industrial
Speaker 1: Revolution bringing people out of farms into factories. That was
Speaker 1: a massive change. We had steam, steam engines and and steal,
Speaker 1: I mean steal that was massive, on and on and on.
Speaker 1: We had automobiles like people had walked for all of
Speaker 1: mankind and now they could ride um. And and if
Speaker 1: you look at that, every fifty years basically is how
Speaker 1: that breaks down. The last one one was the invention
Speaker 1: of the microprocessor, which of course allows us to do
Speaker 1: what we're doing right now. Fifty years from one is
Speaker 1: right now today. And I think we're on another technological
Speaker 1: revolution with this decentralized technology, obviously the bitcoin blockchain UM,
Speaker 1: which will change the way society works forever UM, just
Speaker 1: like the microprocessor did, just like the automobile did as well,
Speaker 1: and so um A lot of times people try to say, oh,
Speaker 1: it's kind of like digital cash. I get that, Sure,
Speaker 1: it's like digital goal Okay, but to your you know,
Speaker 1: the point we're both making, I guess is that, uh,
Speaker 1: moving towards this decentralization and we can see that setting
Speaker 1: up and so whether that's decentralized government or whatever. But yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a it's a technological revolution. I think human humanity
Speaker 1: is going to be forever changed off of that. I
Speaker 1: couldn't agree more. And I think it's really difficult to
Speaker 1: even you know, even get catch a glimpse of of
Speaker 1: what that means and what the implications are. I mean,
Speaker 1: we're we're kind of in the eye of the storm
Speaker 1: of an exponential technology that's going to foster a complete
Speaker 1: paradigm shift. So we have this like tingling in our spine,
Speaker 1: like this is big, but it's so hard to see
Speaker 1: beyond the event horizon that you're just left with, you know,
Speaker 1: kind of contending with what it is now and those
Speaker 1: kind of fleeting you know, images that emerge in your
Speaker 1: mind about what it might be in the future, and
Speaker 1: then you know, we don't want to be led astray
Speaker 1: by our own ambitions or hopes or dreams. So we
Speaker 1: we try to stay grounded into what is right now,
Speaker 1: and we try to poke holes in this thing, and
Speaker 1: we try to we you know, ground it in an
Speaker 1: an objective understanding. But I think what we're dealing with
Speaker 1: here is even stranger than we can suppose. And as
Speaker 1: you say, you know, gold two point oh was a
Speaker 1: nice narrative, you know, sounder money for the world is
Speaker 1: a nice narrative all one per cent of of what's
Speaker 1: actually happening. And I think it's a genuine transformation of people,
Speaker 1: of human beings will be the result of this thing
Speaker 1: being distributed and widely used over what period of time
Speaker 1: I'm not sure. I think, you know, probably even after
Speaker 1: the world is on a bitcoin standard. But I keep
Speaker 1: coming back to what I'm seeing in the people that
Speaker 1: understand are beginning to understand and are beginning to engage
Speaker 1: and use bitcoin, you know, prime early from you know,
Speaker 1: interactions and Twitter and on podcasts and stuff like that.
Speaker 1: I think that gives us the clues to what kind
Speaker 1: of a culture will emerge on top of this thing.
Speaker 1: And I'm amazed at the kind of impact and the
Speaker 1: speed at which that impact changes people, you know. So
Speaker 1: I've I've spoken to people that have been in bitcoins
Speaker 1: since two thousand eleven, and I've spoken to people that
Speaker 1: got in in in mid and just to hear the
Speaker 1: stories of how understanding and engaging this thing has changed
Speaker 1: their perspective radically on so many different things, in a
Speaker 1: manner that the universally deemed is beneficial. And uh, it's
Speaker 1: it's one of the hallmarks is that it's super humbling.
Speaker 1: You know, you're now kind of in the presence of
Speaker 1: a change and a thing that's creating that change that
Speaker 1: you cannot understand, but that you that you know is
Speaker 1: incredibly meaningful and and is a tool to use for
Speaker 1: the improvement of your life and the improvement of broader
Speaker 1: structure of the society that you're in. And that's really humbling.
Speaker 1: And I think that's why there's such a hunger for
Speaker 1: trying to understand it, because you don't want to take
Speaker 1: that arrogant or huboristic position. We're like, Okay, I get it,
Speaker 1: it's goal two point oh, bounce out my portfolio, sharp
Speaker 1: ratio or whatever. You you there's just this sense that
Speaker 1: you're like, this is way bigger than I'm I'm capable
Speaker 1: of comprehending right now. So I want to try to
Speaker 1: push my understanding into as many different looks and crannies
Speaker 1: of this thing as I can. And the only way
Speaker 1: to do that is to talk to people, learn from people,
Speaker 1: read the books, you know, quiet contemplation, whatever your process is,
Speaker 1: to try to get a sense for how meaningful this
Speaker 1: thing is. And and that's why we're so lucky to
Speaker 1: have the great writers that we have in the space,
Speaker 1: and the great speakers and all the great books on
Speaker 1: articles and and stuff like that, because they help us
Speaker 1: gain insight into what this thing actually is, because it's
Speaker 1: still very much ill defined, i think, even in the
Speaker 1: minds of the most convicted you know bulls out there. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I agree, great point and you know, kind of wrap
Speaker 1: it up. But I think that was that was kind
Speaker 1: of a great point to kind of transition to just
Speaker 1: um the hope. Right. So, we obviously started talking about
Speaker 1: a lot of problems and the world's messed up, and
Speaker 1: it's easy to be super scared and and on top
Speaker 1: of that, not just the problems that we have, but
Speaker 1: we have some leaders, you know, the World Economic Forum
Speaker 1: telling us by you'll own nothing and you'll be happy. Right.
Speaker 1: So there's definitely people that have that agenda for us,
Speaker 1: and that's that's very scary and a lot of times,
Speaker 1: you know, maybe people are like an Austris with their
Speaker 1: head in the sand or whatever it may be. But
Speaker 1: the reality is, and I like to just remind people
Speaker 1: that if that's not the future you want, then that's
Speaker 1: not the future you should have, and you should be
Speaker 1: working towards bringing a different future the future you have.
Speaker 1: And uh, now people have a tool, right, So it's
Speaker 1: like it's easy to be frustrated when there's you don't
Speaker 1: see an option. And I'm in America. I'm a set,
Speaker 1: I'm a strong second moment supporter, and I have a
Speaker 1: lot of guns, but I don't ever want to use those.
Speaker 1: That's the last thing I ever want to do. But
Speaker 1: now we actually have a real tool, and so I
Speaker 1: think it's encouraging seeing people coming and and even just
Speaker 1: encouraging knowing there's something actionable that people can do. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm with everyone on the frustrations that the
Speaker 1: current worlds circumstances uh caused me to feel, you know,
Speaker 1: And I've got to remind myself on a daily basis
Speaker 1: not to engage in the frustration, and not to engage
Speaker 1: in the mud slinging, and just to focus on the solution,
Speaker 1: because you know, we we referenced the sovereign individual maybe
Speaker 1: before we started recording, but um, that book kind of
Speaker 1: elucidates the fact that it's the technological changes and the
Speaker 1: technological innovation that emerge on the world that the primary
Speaker 1: cause for the shifts and the structure of governance and
Speaker 1: and the you know, the quote unquote logic of violence
Speaker 1: that basically limits people's degree of freedom right, so instead
Speaker 1: of and and I think a lot of people know
Speaker 1: this in their own lives, Like if you try to
Speaker 1: persuade them of an opinion you hold, that's a very
Speaker 1: difficult thing to do because they're grounded in their own
Speaker 1: perspective and worldview. But if you engage in a solution
Speaker 1: that's positive, that enhances your life, that benefit is apparent
Speaker 1: to people. And I think that's what causes them in
Speaker 1: their own mind to say, what's going on with that
Speaker 1: person over there, Like they seem happy, they seem successful,
Speaker 1: they seem like they're engaged. Like those are things that
Speaker 1: people are attracted to, and I think that they're curious
Speaker 1: about and that's the thing that will lead them to
Speaker 1: place on pause their own you know, perspectives and their
Speaker 1: own opinions and dip their toes in the water and
Speaker 1: see what else might be there. And so, you know,
Speaker 1: I totally agree Bitcoin is a weapon of freedom, um,
Speaker 1: and it's a peaceful weapon of freedom, and it's one
Speaker 1: unlike that we've ever had before that I think, if
Speaker 1: we're right, fixes a lot of the systemic issues that
Speaker 1: a lot of us have been identifying and that frustrate
Speaker 1: a lot of us. So, you know, I think that's
Speaker 1: that's the way forward here. Don't get mired in the
Speaker 1: quicksand of the political arguments do youre or the social problems.
Speaker 1: Engage in what the emerging solution is. Engage that community
Speaker 1: or the people in that community that are thinking in
Speaker 1: a similar way, whose mind is on a hopeful future,
Speaker 1: a positive future, a better future, and do that both
Speaker 1: for the betterment of your own circumstances and for the
Speaker 1: broader picture. And I think if we all take that
Speaker 1: upon ourselves to improve ourselves, engaging things we believe are meaningful, uh,
Speaker 1: and engage with people that you know, we think are
Speaker 1: good and doing good work. If we all do that
Speaker 1: we're gonna wind up with a better world at some
Speaker 1: point in the future, and that's probably the quickest way
Speaker 1: to get there. So you know that, that's what I've
Speaker 1: been doing, and um it seems like that's what you've
Speaker 1: been doing and a lot of other people in the
Speaker 1: bitcoin space, and that's what's so exciting about what's happening
Speaker 1: right Well, that's uh, that's that's a great note to
Speaker 1: end on, a great, great message of hope. So we'll
Speaker 1: go ahead and wrap it up with that. Um, so
Speaker 1: hopefully everybody, uh solve the problem. But now they see
Speaker 1: a solution. And I think, like said, once you once
Speaker 1: you you know, human nature is like we I feel
Speaker 1: like humans need like that goal, just like a carrot
Speaker 1: to chase sort of thing. And so now everyone has
Speaker 1: that that carrot. So great, great time, John, I appreciate
Speaker 1: you taking the time and talking with us today. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna make sure that we're gonna link your podcast in
Speaker 1: the show notes down below because it's great and everyone
Speaker 1: should be paying attention to that and subscribing anything else
Speaker 1: that you want to plug, anything else coming up or
Speaker 1: that you're working on. Uh No, man, I just appreciate
Speaker 1: you having me on. Appreciate the chat, and I look
Speaker 1: forward to doing it again sometime. Cool John, thanks so much,
Speaker 1: appreciate it. I'd probably take care all right,