WEBVTT - Building a New Future Against Legacy System | John Vallis 0:00:13.600 --> 0:00:16.320 Hey, everyone, Welcome to another episode of the Market Disruptor Show, 0:00:16.320 --> 0:00:18.439 and today I am joined by John Wallace. He is 0:00:18.480 --> 0:00:21.840 the host of the Bitcoin Rapid Fire podcast. He is 0:00:21.880 --> 0:00:24.880 a deep thinker, he's an educator. He's he read a 0:00:24.880 --> 0:00:27.120 lot of a lot of literature, helping other people discover 0:00:27.160 --> 0:00:29.880 that literature. Um, I'm excited to have this conversation to day. John, 0:00:29.880 --> 0:00:32.440 Thanks so much for joining. Alright, it's great to be here. 0:00:32.440 --> 0:00:34.960 I'm looking forward to this. So. Yeah, I know you 0:00:34.960 --> 0:00:37.400 put out a lot of content and for those paying attention, 0:00:37.440 --> 0:00:39.120 they start to kind of get an idea of your 0:00:39.159 --> 0:00:41.680 viewpoints and whatnot. But for those of that are new 0:00:41.720 --> 0:00:43.159 to you at this point, um, why don't you just 0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:45.199 give us a little bit of background on, um, you know, 0:00:45.280 --> 0:00:48.800 kind of what you're focusing on and what you're doing. Sure, 0:00:49.640 --> 0:00:52.240 very briefly, I started my career in wealth management. I 0:00:52.600 --> 0:00:55.640 lived in China for a decade, in Shanghai and Beijing, 0:00:55.920 --> 0:01:00.680 and uh really did not enjoy the incentives there. You know, 0:01:00.720 --> 0:01:04.559 it was very the how the the legacy system had 0:01:04.800 --> 0:01:07.760 degraded and decayed and kind of broken was very apparent 0:01:07.840 --> 0:01:10.679 to me. And I had always been you know, kind 0:01:10.720 --> 0:01:12.880 of unsettled by the state of the world. It looked 0:01:12.880 --> 0:01:14.320 to be going in the wrong direction to me, and 0:01:14.680 --> 0:01:16.520 being in the belly of the beast as it were, 0:01:16.760 --> 0:01:18.240 you know, just kind of proved that out to me 0:01:18.319 --> 0:01:21.760 even more. Hey, guys, let me just interrupt this interview 0:01:21.800 --> 0:01:24.280 real quick, just to plug the show sponsor, and that 0:01:24.480 --> 0:01:27.800 is block Fi. Now. Block five is doing amazing things 0:01:27.840 --> 0:01:30.480 in the bitcoin finance space. As a matter of fact, 0:01:30.480 --> 0:01:32.640 they've cracked some really big news by bringing on the 0:01:32.880 --> 0:01:36.759 x cftc UM chair Chris gian Carlo Um and they 0:01:36.800 --> 0:01:40.600 are one of the most transparent, most heavily regulated UM 0:01:40.680 --> 0:01:42.800 companies inside the United States, which gives me a lot 0:01:42.840 --> 0:01:45.680 of trust into what the services are. Now. I've recently 0:01:45.720 --> 0:01:48.960 did a video talking about how to retire off bitcoin 0:01:49.240 --> 0:01:52.080 and you can do that by leveraging debt and interest 0:01:52.120 --> 0:01:56.080 against bitcoin. And Block five is the number one company 0:01:56.120 --> 0:01:57.960 in the United States or maybe in the world to 0:01:58.120 --> 0:02:00.800 go to and use UM. They are leading the charges 0:02:00.960 --> 0:02:02.760 or paying interest on your bitcoin if you park it 0:02:02.800 --> 0:02:05.080 with him, or you can borrow against it. Now, as 0:02:05.080 --> 0:02:07.360 I broke down in that video, you can borrow against 0:02:07.360 --> 0:02:10.280 your bitcoin, and when you take debt against it, it's 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:12.600 not taxable. It's not taxable. Event you can use that 0:02:12.639 --> 0:02:14.799 debt for anything that you want, including to live off of, 0:02:15.000 --> 0:02:16.960 to leverage up and buy more, or roll it into 0:02:17.000 --> 0:02:19.960 another asset. Um you can do something like I've done recently, 0:02:20.040 --> 0:02:22.520 like sell some real estate put that money into bitcoin. 0:02:22.960 --> 0:02:25.240 Now as that bitcoin price has risen, I'm able to 0:02:25.280 --> 0:02:27.440 borrow against it and go back and buy the same 0:02:27.440 --> 0:02:30.359 real estate or something similar. And I still own the bitcoin, 0:02:30.600 --> 0:02:33.560 and I also owned the new asset as well. Lots 0:02:33.560 --> 0:02:35.679 of ways you can do this um. And block five 0:02:35.840 --> 0:02:38.640 is the company that I recommend. Down in the description, 0:02:38.680 --> 0:02:40.280 I have a link that you can click on. If 0:02:40.280 --> 0:02:41.680 you choose to use that link, you can earn up 0:02:41.680 --> 0:02:44.160 the two h fifty dollars in bitcoin just for using 0:02:44.200 --> 0:02:46.560 that link. So check out block fine now. And so 0:02:46.720 --> 0:02:48.920 you know, I wandered for a while, try to learn, 0:02:49.000 --> 0:02:52.000 try to figure out, you know, you know, what could 0:02:52.200 --> 0:02:56.360 resolve the world's issues. And then you know, around thirteen fourteen, 0:02:56.400 --> 0:02:59.679 I came across bitcoin. I started going down the rabbit hole, 0:03:00.200 --> 0:03:02.600 touched it a few times before it really clicked. And then, 0:03:02.840 --> 0:03:05.000 you know, like many of us, uh, it's been a 0:03:05.040 --> 0:03:08.000 never ending journey ever since. And and conviction and interest 0:03:08.080 --> 0:03:11.080 just continues to increase as I learn more about both 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:13.679 bitcoin and all the different things that it touches and 0:03:13.720 --> 0:03:16.640 the implications that it's going to have on society. And so, 0:03:16.960 --> 0:03:19.640 you know, my focus these days is not so much 0:03:20.160 --> 0:03:24.360 building the case for bitcoin and discussing, you know, where 0:03:24.400 --> 0:03:27.639 it sits in the economic and financial paradigm of the 0:03:27.680 --> 0:03:30.440 world and investing all that is really interesting and I 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:33.160 think you know, um, there's a lot of great acommendators, 0:03:33.200 --> 0:03:35.760 including yourself, that that really delve into those topics, and 0:03:35.800 --> 0:03:38.840 I really appreciate your insights as we're discussing before we 0:03:38.880 --> 0:03:43.040 fired this up. My main interest is looking at what 0:03:43.240 --> 0:03:45.720 are going to be the implications of having this form 0:03:45.760 --> 0:03:49.080 of money emerged on the world. What are the characteristics 0:03:49.120 --> 0:03:51.720 of the parallel system that is emerging as you know 0:03:51.880 --> 0:03:56.760 that that is the bitcoin culture, let's say, and how 0:03:56.760 --> 0:03:59.520 it's changing people, you know. That's that's my big thing 0:03:59.600 --> 0:04:03.840 is nothing matters unless it changes behavior, right, That's why 0:04:04.000 --> 0:04:06.840 things are interesting, That's why things are important. That's why 0:04:06.960 --> 0:04:10.920 tools are relevant and useful because they allow a certain 0:04:10.920 --> 0:04:14.240 form of novel behavior or they improve upon a behavior 0:04:14.480 --> 0:04:17.560 that was you know, that existed before and so for me, 0:04:17.640 --> 0:04:20.760 the interesting question is is what does this thing mean 0:04:21.480 --> 0:04:26.000 for changes in human behavior and interaction? And I think 0:04:26.040 --> 0:04:29.320 if you're in the bitcoin quote unquote community, if you're 0:04:29.360 --> 0:04:32.080 mixing it up on Twitter, if you're paying attention, you're 0:04:32.080 --> 0:04:37.680 starting to notice that a unique culture is emerging with 0:04:37.760 --> 0:04:41.200 certain principles and certain values, and certain forms of communication 0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:45.039 and certain ideas and certain methods of interacting. And that's 0:04:45.040 --> 0:04:47.800 what I really like delving into. And uh, it's it's 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:49.680 been a real honor and a privilege to be able 0:04:49.720 --> 0:04:52.640 to do so yeah, yeah, it is. It is awesome, 0:04:52.680 --> 0:04:56.120 and I want to dig into that. Um uh, well, 0:04:56.279 --> 0:04:57.760 we'll position that towards the end. I want to. I 0:04:57.800 --> 0:04:59.320 want to I want to start by kind of setting 0:04:59.320 --> 0:05:00.960 a stage a little bit kind of for where we're 0:05:01.000 --> 0:05:03.240 at right now, and then uh, really I want to 0:05:03.320 --> 0:05:06.960 kind of dive into, um, you know, more actionable stuff 0:05:07.000 --> 0:05:08.720 like what we can set up the stage with some 0:05:08.760 --> 0:05:10.919 of the problems that we see and maybe some underlying reasons, 0:05:10.920 --> 0:05:13.200 and then we'll dig into maybe some actionable stuff and 0:05:13.400 --> 0:05:15.640 we'll talk about this parallel system that's being built. As 0:05:15.800 --> 0:05:17.720 as you said, this whole culture of people is kind 0:05:17.760 --> 0:05:20.120 of congregating and doing real things that I that I 0:05:20.120 --> 0:05:21.520 think brings a lot of hope if people were to 0:05:21.600 --> 0:05:24.160 learn about that. But UM, if we start kind of 0:05:24.200 --> 0:05:28.000 at the beginning, um, or I should say a present day, Um, obviously, 0:05:28.000 --> 0:05:30.560 the world is in a state of uh, I don't 0:05:30.560 --> 0:05:32.200 know what you want to call it, the disrepair. I 0:05:32.200 --> 0:05:35.080 mean that people, everybody knows there's something going wrong, and 0:05:35.120 --> 0:05:38.359 it seems like tensions are boiling high. Um, all across 0:05:38.400 --> 0:05:39.760 the world. I know you're in you know, we're in 0:05:39.760 --> 0:05:44.080 different countries, but we're all still seeing the same things. UM. 0:05:44.320 --> 0:05:46.480 Kind of give us a I mean, I guess you 0:05:46.560 --> 0:05:48.640 studied a lot of like history, right, so a lot 0:05:48.680 --> 0:05:50.320 of these books and they've kind of foretold a lot 0:05:50.400 --> 0:05:52.120 of it. But now we seem to be learning some 0:05:52.200 --> 0:05:55.000 of these same lessons that our forefathers warned us about. 0:05:55.000 --> 0:05:57.039 So what what do you think is happening right now 0:05:57.080 --> 0:05:59.040 in the world that maybe could have been avoided or 0:05:59.080 --> 0:06:01.040 we were warned about that that we're that we're all 0:06:01.040 --> 0:06:04.200 staring at right now. Well that's the sixty four million 0:06:04.200 --> 0:06:08.200 dollar question, isn't it. But you know, I think down yeah, yeah, 0:06:08.360 --> 0:06:11.120 I mean they say history doesn't repeat, but it rhymes, 0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:13.400 and that I think is one of the reasons why 0:06:13.440 --> 0:06:16.480 we continue to make the same mistakes, because the circumstances 0:06:16.520 --> 0:06:19.600 of history are always different, the players, the times, all 0:06:19.640 --> 0:06:22.760 that kind of stuff. But the let's say, the psychological 0:06:22.839 --> 0:06:26.280 processes that underpinned the thinking and the decision making are, 0:06:26.640 --> 0:06:29.560 you know, are very similar, you know so, and I 0:06:29.600 --> 0:06:31.760 know some people will find this extreme, but lately I've 0:06:31.760 --> 0:06:35.800 been digging, digging into nineteen thirties Germany, right because I 0:06:35.880 --> 0:06:38.719 I wanted to see or I want to try to 0:06:38.760 --> 0:06:44.240 understand better what psychological processes, what assumptions, what biases, what 0:06:44.560 --> 0:06:47.960 you know, what was going on in the cultural zeitgeist 0:06:47.960 --> 0:06:51.320 at the time that allowed that circumstance to unfold the 0:06:51.360 --> 0:06:55.120 way that it did, because I reject the the simplistic 0:06:55.240 --> 0:06:58.720 explanation that either everyone was scared of that out of 0:06:58.760 --> 0:07:01.080 their boots and they just act yes too, you know, 0:07:01.120 --> 0:07:04.920 a tyrannical leader, or that they were you know, somehow 0:07:04.920 --> 0:07:08.120 corrupted and they were all evil and they were uniquely 0:07:08.240 --> 0:07:11.239 evil for example, and that couldn't happen to other people 0:07:11.320 --> 0:07:13.920 because you know, for whatever reason. I mean, the fact 0:07:14.000 --> 0:07:17.680 is is that we're all human beings, and so the 0:07:17.760 --> 0:07:21.840 behavior of any one human being exists and is every 0:07:21.920 --> 0:07:25.000 human being is capable of the same behavior. The question 0:07:25.080 --> 0:07:28.320 is is what circumstances draw that out? What what psychological 0:07:28.360 --> 0:07:32.480 processes allow that to occur? And um, you know, so 0:07:32.560 --> 0:07:35.280 that the times we're in right now are really concerning 0:07:35.280 --> 0:07:39.640 for me, because, um, I see a lot of delusion 0:07:39.920 --> 0:07:42.880 in the world. I see a lot of dishonesty. I 0:07:42.920 --> 0:07:45.160 see a lot of I see this the strength of 0:07:45.200 --> 0:07:49.680 ideology in the world. I see the corrupting effect of 0:07:49.800 --> 0:07:52.880 the cultural zeitgeist that causes people not to see things 0:07:52.920 --> 0:07:56.520 clearly and not even want to see things clearly. So, 0:07:56.800 --> 0:08:01.360 you know, that's all extremely concerning. And what I think 0:08:01.440 --> 0:08:03.640 is different this time, you know, to be honest, and 0:08:03.680 --> 0:08:07.200 to bring it back to bitcoin, is that Bitcoin I 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:14.840 think is a genuinely unique thing or element that that 0:08:14.920 --> 0:08:19.280 we can interact with that really changes, um some of 0:08:19.320 --> 0:08:22.600 the changes that the dynamic in a way that might 0:08:22.640 --> 0:08:26.280 allow us to not make the same mistakes that we've 0:08:26.280 --> 0:08:29.440 made in the past. Now, you know, will it, will 0:08:29.480 --> 0:08:32.680 it catch on quick enough? Will enough people get it? 0:08:32.760 --> 0:08:35.160 And are we correct in our assumption about what it is? 0:08:35.200 --> 0:08:37.640 But you know, I don't have to explain to you 0:08:37.679 --> 0:08:40.560 but just you know, for your audience, the corruption of 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:45.720 the money has been one of the repeating problems throughout history, 0:08:45.880 --> 0:08:48.000 you know, whether we're talking about Roman times or whether 0:08:48.040 --> 0:08:50.480 we're talking about the modern nation state, and of course 0:08:50.559 --> 0:08:52.880 the regime that we're under globally right now since nine 0:08:54.520 --> 0:08:57.000 the powers that be, whoever they are, and and to 0:08:57.040 --> 0:09:00.720 be honest, I think most of the time well intended, 0:09:01.160 --> 0:09:04.920 you know. I I don't ascribe so easily to you know, 0:09:05.080 --> 0:09:08.440 the notion that we have evil overlords that are you know, 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:12.680 intentionally enslaving us. I think a lot of the time 0:09:12.720 --> 0:09:16.920 it's incompetence and ignorance, not malice. But nevertheless, the process 0:09:16.920 --> 0:09:19.679 that unfolds is that the money is corrupted and we 0:09:19.760 --> 0:09:24.160 lose a tether to any sense of reality and in 0:09:24.200 --> 0:09:26.840 the creation of our money, and as a result, a 0:09:26.960 --> 0:09:30.520 world of illusion emerges on top of that. And it's 0:09:30.600 --> 0:09:33.840 it's almost, you know, poetically correct that if you if 0:09:33.880 --> 0:09:39.079 the value underpinning the society is an illusion, is created 0:09:39.080 --> 0:09:42.800 out of nothing, then why would you expect the perception 0:09:42.840 --> 0:09:46.679 of the society at large to be anything different? And 0:09:48.520 --> 0:09:50.200 that's that's all. That's that's a lot of good stuff. 0:09:50.240 --> 0:09:52.040 I want to unpack some of that stuff for it 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:54.160 for just a minute. So, UM, A couple of things 0:09:54.160 --> 0:09:56.120 that you said, and I think it's important for everyone 0:09:56.160 --> 0:09:57.880 to pay attention to you, is that you know a 0:09:57.920 --> 0:09:59.440 lot of times people who want to just focus on 0:09:59.480 --> 0:10:01.840 the money and like Mark, I just subscribed you just 0:10:01.880 --> 0:10:03.640 to hear about money and economics and what the FED 0:10:03.720 --> 0:10:06.360 is doing. But like all of this is intertwined, right, 0:10:06.360 --> 0:10:09.640 So you have to understand like, you know, human you 0:10:09.640 --> 0:10:13.240 know humanity, as you said, like humans are somewhat predictable. Um, 0:10:13.320 --> 0:10:15.760 you know we have we all have human nature. Basically, 0:10:15.800 --> 0:10:18.520 humans are motivated by two things, right, Uh, moving towards 0:10:18.559 --> 0:10:21.000 pleasure moving away from pain. Um. And so we're kind 0:10:21.000 --> 0:10:23.800 of like on this bumper ride, like moving between that. UM. 0:10:23.840 --> 0:10:25.480 So you have to kind of understand human nature. You 0:10:25.520 --> 0:10:28.600 have to understand societal stuff, um to to really get 0:10:28.600 --> 0:10:31.640 that and and kind of what you were talking about, 0:10:31.640 --> 0:10:33.520 I think if I have this right, but if you 0:10:33.559 --> 0:10:36.679 look at um, you were looking at nineteen thirties Germany 0:10:36.760 --> 0:10:39.400 and obviously that was a time of great turmoil that 0:10:39.480 --> 0:10:42.800 led to the whole world going into a war. Um. 0:10:42.800 --> 0:10:45.960 It was almost like society is always like a push pull, right, 0:10:46.160 --> 0:10:48.440 like when it's a cause and an effect, so like 0:10:48.480 --> 0:10:52.000 when this type of environment happens, then this is kind 0:10:52.000 --> 0:10:54.640 of the outcome. So I guess are you seeing when 0:10:54.679 --> 0:10:56.920 you're back in nineteen thirties, are you seeing like these 0:10:56.920 --> 0:11:00.360 certain factors were apparent in the world or in Germany 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:03.440 at that time, which was then led to that outcome, 0:11:03.480 --> 0:11:05.520 And then maybe we see those same type of factors 0:11:05.520 --> 0:11:07.680 setting up today that could potentially lead to the same 0:11:07.720 --> 0:11:11.719 type of outcome. The simple answer is yes. I mean, 0:11:11.720 --> 0:11:14.040 I'm not going to pretend to understand all the different 0:11:14.080 --> 0:11:17.720 variables that went into the psychology of your middle class 0:11:17.720 --> 0:11:21.840 German citizen in the early nineteen thirties, but broadly speaking, 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:24.600 what I think is happening is that people are being 0:11:24.720 --> 0:11:28.120 led astray by ideology and there's not enough of a 0:11:28.160 --> 0:11:34.080 commitment to developing a perception based on clarity and truth. Right, 0:11:34.120 --> 0:11:38.800 There's not enough, uh, dedication to that. And if there isn't, 0:11:39.160 --> 0:11:42.120 I think it's easy to be led astray by fear, 0:11:42.440 --> 0:11:49.200 by ideology, by a charismatic leader, by the you know, 0:11:49.440 --> 0:11:53.240 by the different delusions that emerge as a result of 0:11:53.240 --> 0:11:56.199 how the government spends money, creates money, all that kind 0:11:56.200 --> 0:11:59.720 of stuff. So you know, broadly speaking, one of the 0:11:59.760 --> 0:12:01.680 thing it troubles me the most, and the thing that 0:12:01.720 --> 0:12:06.720 I guess I try to articulate is don't you know, 0:12:07.120 --> 0:12:09.600 make up your own mind, critic your own critical thinking 0:12:09.840 --> 0:12:13.239 is of the utmost important here and never stop refining 0:12:13.240 --> 0:12:16.920 your perspectives because that's what That's how we give away 0:12:16.920 --> 0:12:19.640 our freedom far before we're locked into a cage or 0:12:19.640 --> 0:12:22.880 a country or what have you, is we we delegate 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:26.960 our perception to somebody else. We allow somebody else to 0:12:27.000 --> 0:12:29.520 construct it for us. And there's many reasons for that, 0:12:29.559 --> 0:12:32.040 and there's there's reasons of incentive and in fear and 0:12:32.080 --> 0:12:35.120 that those kind of things. But I think if we 0:12:35.200 --> 0:12:37.360 need to get back to a place where we trust 0:12:37.360 --> 0:12:40.640 ourselves more than anybody, and if you're going to trust yourself, 0:12:40.960 --> 0:12:42.800 you have to put in the work. You have to 0:12:42.920 --> 0:12:47.600 educate yourself. And you know, again, in today's society, most 0:12:47.640 --> 0:12:51.880 people rely on outside sources, uh for their education. I mean, 0:12:52.520 --> 0:12:55.320 most people take the nightly news and they read maybe 0:12:55.360 --> 0:12:57.400 the newspaper and a couple of people that they follow 0:12:57.480 --> 0:13:00.280 online and they feel like they've got to grasp on 0:13:00.280 --> 0:13:02.880 on what's going on in the world. And um, I 0:13:02.920 --> 0:13:08.079 also think there's we're so deep into the let's say 0:13:08.160 --> 0:13:12.800 late stage Fiat big government dynamic, um, that it seems 0:13:12.840 --> 0:13:15.600 so natural and normal to people. And again you could 0:13:15.600 --> 0:13:18.040 you could probably easily make a parallel to nineteen thirties 0:13:18.040 --> 0:13:22.199 Germany that things the status quo is very intoxicating. It 0:13:22.520 --> 0:13:25.440 can feel normal, like you emerge in a world and 0:13:25.440 --> 0:13:27.440 you think, well, it's always kind of been this way, 0:13:27.480 --> 0:13:31.319 so this is the way that it should be. Exactly. 0:13:31.400 --> 0:13:33.840 These are the defenders of the status quo. This is 0:13:33.880 --> 0:13:36.280 basically the crux of their argument. Whereas I think we 0:13:36.320 --> 0:13:38.280 would come from the perspective of looking at things from 0:13:38.320 --> 0:13:42.000 first principles and saying, is this the way things should be? 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:45.199 What is wrong here? And what is wrong based on 0:13:45.760 --> 0:13:49.880 perhaps moral principles, what is wrong based on you know, uh, 0:13:50.200 --> 0:13:53.000 previous outcomes in the past that we can glean insights 0:13:53.040 --> 0:13:55.800 from and apply them to what's happening currently. Um, And 0:13:55.800 --> 0:13:58.640 there just seems to be not enough of that going on, 0:13:58.720 --> 0:14:00.559 and I think that's partially why we're we're going down 0:14:00.600 --> 0:14:04.000 the wrong road in many cases. Yeah, um, it's interesting. 0:14:04.120 --> 0:14:06.600 You know, you were talking about kind of this education 0:14:06.679 --> 0:14:09.840 and people are differing their education or relying on relying 0:14:09.880 --> 0:14:11.959 on so called experts today rather than trying to figure 0:14:11.960 --> 0:14:16.320 things out for themselves. And it's interesting, right, it starts 0:14:16.360 --> 0:14:19.880 with consuming information and then thinking through that, and then 0:14:19.880 --> 0:14:22.440 you're thinking changes your actions. You had talked earlier about right, 0:14:22.480 --> 0:14:25.200 we have to change actions. Um. But but you know 0:14:25.240 --> 0:14:27.360 it's interesting if we look back through history, we can 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:30.240 see that many times. Let's say, you know, before the 0:14:30.280 --> 0:14:32.880 separation of church and state, right, the church was the 0:14:32.920 --> 0:14:35.800 state for so long, and the people didn't have the information. 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:37.840 They didn't have the Bible, so they relied on the 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:39.920 Church to tell them what the Bible said, and they 0:14:40.000 --> 0:14:42.480 just whatever the Church says, that's what the Bible says. Right. 0:14:42.600 --> 0:14:45.560 But once that was decentralized and everybody had it, they 0:14:45.560 --> 0:14:47.480 could all read it for themselves, and it was that 0:14:47.640 --> 0:14:51.600 education process that freed them. I think we could see again, um, 0:14:51.960 --> 0:14:55.000 the Roman Empire seven years of you know, an amazing republic, 0:14:55.000 --> 0:14:56.720 and it fell, we went to the dark ages. They 0:14:56.800 --> 0:15:00.240 lost all the education, and then the Renaissance people got 0:15:00.240 --> 0:15:03.640 the information again and boom um, and and we might 0:15:03.680 --> 0:15:05.960 almost see the same thing happening today. To your point, 0:15:06.040 --> 0:15:09.160 where all these people don't want to educate themselves. Um, 0:15:09.200 --> 0:15:12.120 but maybe that tide is changing. Maybe, as you said, 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:14.320 there's a whole group of people that are are starting 0:15:14.360 --> 0:15:16.920 to pull out those whole books, dust them off. Maybe 0:15:16.960 --> 0:15:20.320 there's another renaissance coming from that education. Yeah, what do 0:15:20.360 --> 0:15:25.360 you think? Undeniably? You know that the the Internet and 0:15:25.440 --> 0:15:28.160 you know again this show, my show, all the amazing 0:15:28.200 --> 0:15:32.240 content coming out is at least creating a free market 0:15:32.360 --> 0:15:35.640 and information. The incumbents still have a lot of influence. 0:15:35.720 --> 0:15:39.520 There's you know, a lot of ingrained behavior and network 0:15:39.560 --> 0:15:41.360 effects of that kind of stuff. But I think that 0:15:41.480 --> 0:15:45.760 is changing. And the reason why bitcoin is so useful 0:15:45.800 --> 0:15:49.200 in that regard is because you know, some people may 0:15:49.240 --> 0:15:53.720 not be that compelled to learn or enhance their perspective 0:15:54.160 --> 0:15:57.400 for just for that reason. But when there's greed involved, 0:15:57.400 --> 0:15:59.920 when there's money involved, people are far there's a star 0:16:00.160 --> 0:16:02.720 far stronger pull. And so what I find interesting about 0:16:02.720 --> 0:16:05.040 what's happening in bitcoin is a lot of people may 0:16:05.080 --> 0:16:08.280 come for the gains, right, come for your portfolio diversification, 0:16:08.360 --> 0:16:11.360 come for your inflation resistance, whatever, but you wind up 0:16:11.360 --> 0:16:16.120 in this community that is really has a tremendous appetite 0:16:16.280 --> 0:16:19.040 for learning about all the different ways that this thing 0:16:19.200 --> 0:16:21.760 is relevant and meaningful, and so yes, that means in 0:16:21.800 --> 0:16:24.640 the economic, financial, and investing realm, but also means in 0:16:24.640 --> 0:16:26.760 the social. It also means in the historical. It also 0:16:26.800 --> 0:16:29.239 means in the psychological. That also means in the philosophical 0:16:29.240 --> 0:16:32.200 and even the spiritual. And we're still figuring out what 0:16:32.240 --> 0:16:34.840 all that means. But the point is is that these 0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:38.400 people are it's kind of a revivification of their intellectual 0:16:38.480 --> 0:16:41.800 curiosity where I think a lot of people you get 0:16:41.800 --> 0:16:45.200 put through the meat grinder of of you know, formal education. 0:16:45.400 --> 0:16:47.120 You know, you come out of your KG well school, 0:16:47.200 --> 0:16:49.560 you're going to university, a path is kind of set 0:16:49.640 --> 0:16:51.480 for you. You put your blinders on, you work, you 0:16:51.520 --> 0:16:54.480 try to enhance your your life and achieve the things 0:16:54.480 --> 0:16:58.400 you want to achieve, and your your intellectual curiosity gets 0:16:58.400 --> 0:17:01.080 dialed down dramatically because you have to focus. I think 0:17:01.120 --> 0:17:03.640 what bitcoin is doing is is turning that back up, 0:17:04.000 --> 0:17:07.600 and because it's it's kind of proposing to people like, hey, 0:17:08.080 --> 0:17:10.720 there's a new world emerging here, there's a new paradigm 0:17:10.760 --> 0:17:13.000 emerging here, and it's going to change a lot of 0:17:13.040 --> 0:17:17.080 things very radically, and you know, it behooves you to 0:17:17.280 --> 0:17:20.400 learn about what's going on and what those changes might be. 0:17:20.680 --> 0:17:23.520 And also, hey, look, I think at least from my 0:17:23.760 --> 0:17:25.840 perspective and a lot of people I speak to, it 0:17:25.920 --> 0:17:28.280 reminds you how fun it is to learn about something 0:17:28.320 --> 0:17:31.440 that's both interesting and meaningful. Right, It's not just an 0:17:31.480 --> 0:17:36.280 intellectual you know, uh exercise, it's actually relevant learning. And 0:17:36.320 --> 0:17:40.320 that's a that's a blessing. Yeah, yeah, that's that's a 0:17:40.320 --> 0:17:42.760 great point that you just brought up. And I think, um, 0:17:42.800 --> 0:17:45.520 you know, if you look at like an art, so 0:17:45.640 --> 0:17:48.720 martial arts or painting or any type of art, it's 0:17:48.720 --> 0:17:51.480 really like it's a lifelong journey. Right, you don't ever 0:17:51.560 --> 0:17:55.199 achieve that the pinnacle of that. And if anybody's done 0:17:55.240 --> 0:17:58.000 a sport or a martial art or even just working 0:17:58.000 --> 0:18:00.840 out or whatever, like you love up those gains like 0:18:00.840 --> 0:18:02.679 oh I learned this new move, I can't wait to 0:18:02.680 --> 0:18:05.800 try it again, And and there's fulfillment in like getting 0:18:05.840 --> 0:18:08.240 better at that craft. And I think education could be 0:18:08.280 --> 0:18:10.960 the same way. Like, um, you take that red pill 0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:13.240 and all of a sudden you have this new world 0:18:13.320 --> 0:18:17.080 and now there's this curiosity and each time you learn something, 0:18:17.200 --> 0:18:19.520 you realize how much more there is to learned. And 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:22.120 so maybe it's kind of like that flywheel. I like that. Um, 0:18:22.160 --> 0:18:25.040 now you said something earlier that you said, uh, you know, 0:18:25.080 --> 0:18:27.840 you don't know how there's the world of illusion. Um, 0:18:27.960 --> 0:18:31.560 you don't know how much was well intended versus evil. 0:18:32.560 --> 0:18:35.120 I'm curious, you know, it seems like it seems like 0:18:35.320 --> 0:18:38.359 I would agree with that. We have generations now that 0:18:38.440 --> 0:18:41.720 have been taught wrong information and so I guess they're 0:18:41.760 --> 0:18:44.399 just naive or they're ignorant or whatever. However, if we 0:18:44.520 --> 0:18:46.679 go back, we could almost see that there was like 0:18:46.760 --> 0:18:52.000 a uh, intentional takeover of the education system to change it. 0:18:52.400 --> 0:18:55.320 So maybe it was like intended, uh you know, fifty 0:18:55.359 --> 0:18:57.600 years ago, sixty years ago, and now today it's just 0:18:58.320 --> 0:19:02.920 what people thinking they're doing well intentions. Yeah, I mean 0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:08.800 I think there's almost always agendas, right, But I think 0:19:09.000 --> 0:19:13.400 very very few people consider themselves to be evil, right, 0:19:13.440 --> 0:19:16.760 I guess. And it's a it's a matter of where 0:19:16.800 --> 0:19:19.399 you stand. It's a matter of perspective. Right, one person 0:19:19.480 --> 0:19:22.720 executing on their agenda and their incentives might be construed 0:19:22.880 --> 0:19:26.439 as opposing the incentives and the agenda of another person, 0:19:26.480 --> 0:19:29.399 and maybe they characterize that as evil. But is that 0:19:29.520 --> 0:19:33.159 like outright evil, like a desire to do ill in 0:19:33.200 --> 0:19:36.760 the world. Probably not, um, although you can make a 0:19:36.800 --> 0:19:38.879 case that it's always subjective. But my point is just 0:19:38.920 --> 0:19:42.880 that I think most people are playing to their incentives 0:19:43.080 --> 0:19:45.399 and doing what they think is best for themselves, and 0:19:45.480 --> 0:19:48.600 maybe there is often not enough consideration for the greater 0:19:48.640 --> 0:19:51.480 good or the people that those actions might impact. You know, 0:19:51.520 --> 0:19:54.800 that's definitely the case, especially in the current regime money 0:19:54.800 --> 0:19:57.640 regime that we exist in today. But um, the point 0:19:57.720 --> 0:20:00.320 for me is it doesn't matter, like if you're a 0:20:00.400 --> 0:20:03.560 type of conspiracy type, like I don't think you're ever 0:20:03.720 --> 0:20:06.640 going to be able to discern the truth, right you 0:20:06.640 --> 0:20:09.640 You might have clues of what's going on or whose agenda, 0:20:09.720 --> 0:20:12.640 what agenda might be operating, but I just don't think 0:20:12.640 --> 0:20:15.640 that stuff can never be discerned with any degree of certainty. 0:20:15.800 --> 0:20:18.200 And I don't think it matters, right like I think 0:20:18.320 --> 0:20:21.960 whether it's some grand conspiracy to enslave you, or whether 0:20:22.440 --> 0:20:25.720 it's a an issue right at the basis of the 0:20:25.760 --> 0:20:28.480 system that creates all these bad incentives that allows people 0:20:28.520 --> 0:20:30.679 to take advantage of them everywhere, all the way up 0:20:30.720 --> 0:20:33.119 the ladder, I don't think it matters in terms of 0:20:33.160 --> 0:20:36.440 what solution is best. Right. So, as we were discussing before, 0:20:36.440 --> 0:20:40.280 we came on to me, Bitcoin is the greatest force 0:20:40.359 --> 0:20:43.119 for positive change to the world has ever seen. And 0:20:43.160 --> 0:20:46.320