WEBVTT - Faux Meat's Next Chapter 0:00:01.800 --> 0:00:04.440 This is Bloomberg Business Week. I'm Carol Masser and I'm 0:00:04.480 --> 0:00:07.280 Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stanovk. We're here every day bringing 0:00:07.320 --> 0:00:09.840 you the latest news from the world to business and finance, 0:00:09.840 --> 0:00:13.640 plus technology, politics, economics, all purnising the power of Business 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:17.160 Week reporters and editors, not to mention our journalists and 0:00:17.160 --> 0:00:20.000 analyst in more than one twenty countries. You can download 0:00:20.000 --> 0:00:23.239 Bloomberg Business Week and iTunes, SoundCloud, or Bloomberg dot Com. 0:00:23.400 --> 0:00:25.200 You can also listen to our radio show at two 0:00:25.200 --> 0:00:27.760 pm Eastern Time on the Bloomberg Radio or watch us 0:00:27.760 --> 0:00:31.080 on YouTube search Bloomberg clovel News. I just want to 0:00:31.120 --> 0:00:33.640 bring you one COVID headline, White House Chief Medical Advisor 0:00:33.680 --> 0:00:37.040 Andthony Fauci saying it a briefing earlier that the dynamics 0:00:37.120 --> 0:00:39.200 of the COVID nineteen outbreak in the US are pointing 0:00:39.280 --> 0:00:41.880 sharply downward. That's a trend line we'd like to see. Yeah, 0:00:41.880 --> 0:00:44.000 we're not seeing it just here in New York City, 0:00:44.040 --> 0:00:46.000 but throughout the United States as well. Let's get into 0:00:46.040 --> 0:00:48.760 it with Michael Dowling, President and CEO at north Well Health. 0:00:48.800 --> 0:00:51.880 He joins us on the phone from Long Island. Uh. Michael, 0:00:51.880 --> 0:00:54.440 it's great to have you back with us. Uh. You 0:00:54.600 --> 0:00:57.480 run New York's largest health system. Give us an idea 0:00:57.480 --> 0:01:01.000 of how things are looking inside north Well Health right now. Oh, 0:01:01.120 --> 0:01:04.760 things are looking very very well. Indeed, we are definitely 0:01:04.800 --> 0:01:10.040 on the exit ramp of of COVID and consistent we went. 0:01:10.160 --> 0:01:14.120 Dr Fauci indicated we only have about five hundred COVID 0:01:14.200 --> 0:01:18.280 patients in our facilities today and it is dropping each day, 0:01:18.520 --> 0:01:22.040 So we're in a good place. Um, we're moving back 0:01:22.080 --> 0:01:26.520 to a normality. Um, and which is I think we've 0:01:26.560 --> 0:01:29.800 all got to stop beginning to do now, even though 0:01:29.880 --> 0:01:32.480 COVID will always be hanging around for quite a while, 0:01:33.040 --> 0:01:35.840 but the devise civility is much much less, and things 0:01:35.880 --> 0:01:38.440 that things are looking very very positive. Indeed, you know, Michael, 0:01:38.440 --> 0:01:40.320 we know it wasn't easy, and I'm sure I can't 0:01:40.319 --> 0:01:43.839 even imagine the stresses as you guys went through it. Um, 0:01:43.920 --> 0:01:46.240 And we're just kind of looking in and hearing what 0:01:46.319 --> 0:01:48.400 was going on in healthcare systems like your own. My 0:01:48.520 --> 0:01:50.840 understanding is you kind of threw the budget out the window. 0:01:51.320 --> 0:01:53.200 How do you do that? Because you do have to 0:01:53.280 --> 0:01:55.520 ultimately think about the top and bottom line, and there 0:01:55.600 --> 0:01:58.520 was government assistance in some cases, but how do you 0:01:58.680 --> 0:02:01.920 do that or do you have it's it's it's a 0:02:02.000 --> 0:02:04.640 standard thing with us because we've had this situation with 0:02:04.760 --> 0:02:08.440 Hurricane and Sandy, Hurricane Irene, and ever so often bad 0:02:08.480 --> 0:02:10.160 things happened to you and you've got to be able 0:02:10.240 --> 0:02:13.040 to react, and especially when the community is in danger, 0:02:14.360 --> 0:02:16.720 either from a hurricane and or bad or or things 0:02:16.800 --> 0:02:19.240 like COVID. You can't be going around each and every 0:02:19.320 --> 0:02:21.799 day warning about the budget because you will you will 0:02:21.800 --> 0:02:24.000 not be innovative, you will not be creative, and you 0:02:24.040 --> 0:02:26.600 will not respond to what is needed to be responded to. 0:02:27.080 --> 0:02:31.120 So my message was do what is right, do everything 0:02:31.160 --> 0:02:35.040 we possibly can to help people, save people, protect people's lives, 0:02:35.040 --> 0:02:37.120 and we'll figure out the budget and the mechanics that 0:02:37.240 --> 0:02:42.160 it later, because otherwise you're you're going to be constraining 0:02:42.320 --> 0:02:46.040 your your activities. So during the height of COVID that 0:02:46.200 --> 0:02:49.799 the beginning in twenty our revenue dropped oh well over 0:02:49.840 --> 0:02:52.880 the billion and a half and it was scary moments, 0:02:53.120 --> 0:02:55.320 but we know that you're going to We wouldn't we 0:02:55.400 --> 0:02:57.200 knew that we had the attitude we're going to win 0:02:57.320 --> 0:03:00.280 against this virus. The virus is not going to beat this. 0:03:00.360 --> 0:03:02.239 We're gonna win. And then we had to come back 0:03:02.280 --> 0:03:05.679 and rebuild. Um, this is what you're doing the crisis. 0:03:05.960 --> 0:03:08.120 Where are you, Michael in terms of rebuilding? Now? How 0:03:08.120 --> 0:03:09.840 do you? How do you get back that lost time? 0:03:10.040 --> 0:03:12.280 And I believe we will come out this year. We 0:03:12.320 --> 0:03:15.040 will come out positive from a financial point of view. 0:03:15.040 --> 0:03:19.200 Are the end of the feral help? Just mentioned the 0:03:19.240 --> 0:03:23.359 subtle assistants help, but we stopped it too, uh to 0:03:24.080 --> 0:03:26.880 kind of pivot for bringing back regular business. You know, 0:03:26.919 --> 0:03:28.920 a couple of months after the height of the COVID 0:03:28.960 --> 0:03:32.480 crisis and in the spring of quinty. You know, one thing, 0:03:32.600 --> 0:03:34.720 I'm curious and we were all talking our planning call 0:03:34.800 --> 0:03:39.800 this morning about the business of running a healthcare system. 0:03:39.840 --> 0:03:41.800 And I was having a conversation with a doctor earlier 0:03:41.800 --> 0:03:45.680 in the week about just how slim the margins can 0:03:45.720 --> 0:03:49.640 be in terms of a hospital running efficiently and as 0:03:49.640 --> 0:03:52.080 it's supposed to all of a sudden the system being 0:03:52.160 --> 0:03:56.320 maxed and strained. How tight is it? It's very, very tight. 0:03:56.680 --> 0:03:59.520 But we had a fifteen in the fifteen points were 0:03:59.680 --> 0:04:03.280 Billy in dollar entity and we're not just hospitalizis you 0:04:03.360 --> 0:04:06.640 know very well, we have huge ambulatory occations and heart care, 0:04:06.720 --> 0:04:09.840 all of that, plus academics and research, but we run 0:04:09.880 --> 0:04:12.720 at the bottom one to one and a half cent Martin. 0:04:13.480 --> 0:04:16.360 It's tight. So you've got to be very efficient. You've 0:04:16.360 --> 0:04:18.800 got to be quite productive. You've got to be very 0:04:18.880 --> 0:04:21.840 very careful of how you operated. But you've got to 0:04:21.880 --> 0:04:23.840 move forward each and every day with a great sense 0:04:23.880 --> 0:04:28.279 of optimism. Um uh. And and still they do everything 0:04:28.320 --> 0:04:31.040 you possibly can to make sure we serve the community 0:04:31.080 --> 0:04:33.839 the best of all ability. It's not hard to make 0:04:33.839 --> 0:04:36.560 a margin. If you decide, for example, sit back and 0:04:36.600 --> 0:04:42.120 eliminate those services that you lose money on, those things 0:04:42.120 --> 0:04:44.000 that you do you get no money at all for, 0:04:44.839 --> 0:04:46.920 then you can come back and say, oh, we don't 0:04:46.920 --> 0:04:49.760 create we have a huge margin. But that's not in 0:04:49.800 --> 0:04:52.919 my view, that's not why we're here. We're here to 0:04:52.960 --> 0:04:56.720 do well, and we're here to do good. And um uh, 0:04:57.000 --> 0:04:59.560 we were if we have a margin strong enough to 0:04:59.640 --> 0:05:03.000 be a to you know, feedo balance sheet, commit to 0:05:03.040 --> 0:05:06.120 the investments we need to make in technology, in people, 0:05:06.360 --> 0:05:11.520 and in infrastructure, and then show a one to one 0:05:11.560 --> 0:05:13.680 and a half maybe up to two percent at the end, 0:05:14.640 --> 0:05:17.760 we're we're we're doing well. Um now not as well. 0:05:17.880 --> 0:05:20.560 We're in New York is a much more expensive place 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:23.520 to be. We have unionized staff, which is more expensive. 0:05:24.480 --> 0:05:26.479 So you will see places around the country that are 0:05:26.560 --> 0:05:29.480 much higher margins. I'm not worried about them. I worried 0:05:29.480 --> 0:05:32.560 about what we do, and I think we focused on 0:05:32.720 --> 0:05:36.280 mission and as well as making sure we try to 0:05:36.440 --> 0:05:40.080 we make a margin to sustain an ongoing business. Well, Michael, 0:05:40.200 --> 0:05:42.080 that's why we're That's why we're here. What are the 0:05:42.320 --> 0:05:44.560 permanent shifts that you see in your business on the 0:05:44.640 --> 0:05:46.840 other side of COVID, we are the permanent changes you 0:05:46.920 --> 0:05:50.840 have made at north Well Health Well, um, let me. 0:05:50.960 --> 0:05:54.080 It accelerates a lot of what we were doing. Okay, 0:05:54.240 --> 0:05:57.560 not not a complete shift, but an acceleration. So, for example, 0:05:57.960 --> 0:06:03.360 COVID demonstrated the unbelievable benefit of having large, large ambulatory 0:06:03.440 --> 0:06:07.520 outpatient entities because they actually treated an awful lot of COVID. 0:06:07.560 --> 0:06:10.440 If you didn't have those should be in trouble. Trouble, um. 0:06:10.680 --> 0:06:15.040 It accelerated the use of harm care. It dramatically accelerated 0:06:15.080 --> 0:06:17.720 the use of technology. So we will never again be 0:06:17.800 --> 0:06:20.640 exactly the same and call me to me was a 0:06:20.760 --> 0:06:24.400 phenomenal learning experience. Capitalists of Change. It's one of them 0:06:24.480 --> 0:06:25.880 many ways, I would say it's one of the best 0:06:25.920 --> 0:06:28.440 things that has ever happened. Now, it's difficult to say 0:06:28.520 --> 0:06:33.960 because of all of the you know, well, Michael just 0:06:34.160 --> 0:06:36.280 just got about twenty seconds. If there's one thing that 0:06:36.360 --> 0:06:39.680 has changed dramatically and for the better, Uh, what is it? 0:06:40.200 --> 0:06:41.800 Because of what we learned during the panic and just 0:06:41.920 --> 0:06:44.920 quickly if you could they it proved to us that 0:06:45.040 --> 0:06:49.720 we can be a remarkably agile and and flexible And 0:06:49.839 --> 0:06:52.960 if we can continue to maintain that culture of innovation, 0:06:53.080 --> 0:06:57.280 creativity and be able to change quickly and build it 0:06:57.320 --> 0:07:00.920 into our culture, then there is nothing that we can Well. 0:07:01.000 --> 0:07:03.440 Good luck in the future and thanks for finding time 0:07:03.520 --> 0:07:06.240 once again. Michael Daly, President and CEO at Northwhile Health, 0:07:06.680 --> 0:07:08.320 author of the book Leading Through a Pandemic. He was 0:07:08.400 --> 0:07:11.320 named to Modern Healthcare's magazines a hundred most Influential People 0:07:11.320 --> 0:07:15.160 in Healthcare, ranked number three overall. This is Bloomberg. You're 0:07:15.240 --> 0:07:19.200 listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Masser and Bloomberg 0:07:19.280 --> 0:07:23.160 Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. Among our most 0:07:23.200 --> 0:07:25.720 read on the Bloomberg Today. It's a Bloomberger exclusive and 0:07:25.720 --> 0:07:28.800 it's about Morgan Stanley's role in reinvigorating a federal probe 0:07:28.880 --> 0:07:32.600 examining regularities in a very look at a market for 0:07:32.640 --> 0:07:35.320 Wall Street. We're talking about block trades. Yeah, raj on 0:07:35.400 --> 0:07:37.840 his finance reporter for Bloomberg News. He's with us in 0:07:37.880 --> 0:07:42.160 the Bloomberg Interactive Broker Studio. Let's get some definitions, Sree, 0:07:42.800 --> 0:07:44.400 just out of the way here first. What is a 0:07:44.440 --> 0:07:48.280 block trade? Large junks of stock that you need to 0:07:48.360 --> 0:07:51.160 sell and it has to be privately negotiated. You can 0:07:51.280 --> 0:07:53.000 just dribble them out, because if you do that over 0:07:53.040 --> 0:07:54.680 a long time, it will take a while and you 0:07:54.720 --> 0:07:57.280 will have advance price action. You might as well figure 0:07:57.320 --> 0:07:58.960 out the right price at which you can sell off, 0:07:59.280 --> 0:08:01.560 usually at a discount to where the stock is trading. 0:08:01.640 --> 0:08:03.400 Say you want a big jung of apple and it's 0:08:03.440 --> 0:08:08.720 trading at you negotiate a deal and it's usually at 0:08:08.760 --> 0:08:10.240 a discount, so you probably sell it to the best, 0:08:10.280 --> 0:08:12.720 better nine and then they hope to parcel it off 0:08:12.760 --> 0:08:15.240 to other people. So I remember years ago where we 0:08:15.280 --> 0:08:18.160 would Las Laborini was really into block trades and money 0:08:18.240 --> 0:08:21.680 flow and we would track the big moves by institutional 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:24.120 investors when they sell the block and watch the money flows, 0:08:24.120 --> 0:08:26.200 because it was usual an indication of where stock was going. 0:08:26.760 --> 0:08:28.560 We've gotten away from that big time, like through the 0:08:28.600 --> 0:08:31.680 tech the tech crisis and run up if you will. 0:08:32.360 --> 0:08:33.959 What is it that's at stake or what is it 0:08:34.000 --> 0:08:35.719 that investigators have been looking at when it comes to 0:08:35.760 --> 0:08:38.800 block trades? Effectively, if some people have been blurring the 0:08:38.880 --> 0:08:41.439 lines and going from the grid of the black what 0:08:41.600 --> 0:08:44.199 they're really trying to figure out is when banks get 0:08:44.400 --> 0:08:47.240 mandates for some of these block trades, are they tipping 0:08:47.320 --> 0:08:50.960 their friends in the hedge fund world? Are they front 0:08:51.080 --> 0:08:54.479 running some of that information so that they can preposition themselves, 0:08:54.960 --> 0:08:57.439 possibly by shorting the stock, because you know, when a 0:08:57.480 --> 0:09:00.079 block trade hits the tape, the stock is going to 0:09:00.160 --> 0:09:02.439 trade down because a large amount of stock is coming 0:09:02.559 --> 0:09:04.600 down the bike and that will drive the price down. 0:09:04.640 --> 0:09:07.000 So if you're short to stock, you're bound to make money. 0:09:07.360 --> 0:09:10.200 So is there some willing and dealing going on where 0:09:10.320 --> 0:09:13.360 some of their clients are short in the stock so 0:09:13.480 --> 0:09:16.240 that when the block actually comes through, the bank can 0:09:17.120 --> 0:09:18.959 tap on their shoulders and get them to buy that. 0:09:19.240 --> 0:09:21.959 So both sides are happy, clients are in a way 0:09:21.960 --> 0:09:24.000 behold into the bank, and the clients are making some 0:09:24.080 --> 0:09:28.320 money that is obviously not good. Remember that a lot 0:09:28.400 --> 0:09:31.079 of this operates in the gray area. It is murky 0:09:31.640 --> 0:09:34.720 when you're bringing your block trade. What is the hypothetical 0:09:34.800 --> 0:09:39.040 conversation you're having. Is it really illegal confidence conversation or 0:09:39.080 --> 0:09:42.000 even a confidential conversation if you don't have the mandate yet. 0:09:42.360 --> 0:09:45.199 These are some of the things we imagine that regulators 0:09:45.280 --> 0:09:47.839 prosecutors will have to wrestle with and it won't be 0:09:47.960 --> 0:09:50.800 easy to solve. And that might be one reason that 0:09:50.920 --> 0:09:53.240 might be giving faith and belief to a lot of 0:09:53.280 --> 0:09:56.280 the defendants that and when I say defendants, I'm just 0:09:56.360 --> 0:09:58.720 talking about the people who have sought information from right 0:09:58.720 --> 0:10:01.640 now because they haven't even charged anyone. But that's the 0:10:01.760 --> 0:10:03.360 kind of thing that they would have to solve for 0:10:03.480 --> 0:10:05.440 and figure out if they have a real case. Here, 0:10:05.640 --> 0:10:07.880 we'll take us back about a year ago to Arks 0:10:07.920 --> 0:10:11.760 and the blow up there and how this current version 0:10:12.040 --> 0:10:15.960 of an inquiry into block trades was really set off 0:10:16.000 --> 0:10:18.640 by that. I'll take you further back then, because this 0:10:19.480 --> 0:10:22.800 investigation into block trades really started off around twenty eighteen. 0:10:23.080 --> 0:10:25.880 As early as twenty eighteen is our understanding. But since 0:10:25.960 --> 0:10:28.000 then it waxed and wained a little bit and never 0:10:28.240 --> 0:10:31.160 really seemed to gather a steam. Then what happened last 0:10:31.240 --> 0:10:35.280 year Archagos, Bill Huong's famed family office that had the surprise, 0:10:35.360 --> 0:10:40.040 spectacular run up and even even more shocking collapse. The 0:10:40.280 --> 0:10:43.520 unwind happened because a lot of the banks, worried about 0:10:43.520 --> 0:10:47.680 the positions that Archagos held, moved quickly to dump their holdings, 0:10:48.000 --> 0:10:51.199 and that meant large blocks and across a variety of 0:10:51.320 --> 0:10:54.480 names hit the market. So when investigators a few months 0:10:54.520 --> 0:10:58.040 down the line started investigating what happened with Archas you know, 0:10:58.240 --> 0:11:00.320 we know that there are inquiries looking into whether there 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:04.080 was market manipulation, whether banks are concluding in the sale process. 0:11:04.280 --> 0:11:06.400 Along the way, they also started looking at some of 0:11:06.440 --> 0:11:08.880 these blocked trades, and that seems to have breathed new 0:11:09.040 --> 0:11:11.840 life into this probe that has looked at this lucrative 0:11:11.880 --> 0:11:14.040 block trade activity and from there it seems to have 0:11:14.120 --> 0:11:16.480 expanded to other traits. That Morgan Stanley, the bank we're 0:11:16.480 --> 0:11:18.079 looking at that seems to be the center of all 0:11:18.160 --> 0:11:21.520 this uh is they're looking at the trades that they 0:11:21.600 --> 0:11:24.839 bought to market and whether there is more wrongdoing, and 0:11:24.960 --> 0:11:27.679 some executives at the film are under the gun right now, 0:11:27.720 --> 0:11:29.559 and I think that's what caught our attention. It's like, okay, 0:11:29.640 --> 0:11:32.200 so where's Morgan Stanley and all of this, So they're 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:35.559 being investigated to or there's no charge, Like where what 0:11:35.800 --> 0:11:37.200 is it? How do we need to look at this firm? 0:11:37.800 --> 0:11:40.280 They certainly seems central to whatever process is going on 0:11:40.520 --> 0:11:42.400 right now. There seems to be a lot of information 0:11:42.480 --> 0:11:45.840 gathering from the SDN, Y, the SEC and other people. 0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:49.400 A lot of the threads, based on our reporting so far, 0:11:49.720 --> 0:11:52.679 tie back to Morgan Stanley. Back in November, we had 0:11:52.720 --> 0:11:55.520 reported that there had a syndicated recent to get desk 0:11:55.720 --> 0:11:57.800 power and Pussy was put on leave. It wasn't quite 0:11:57.920 --> 0:12:01.560 clear why. But now it's become much more apparent than 0:12:01.679 --> 0:12:04.480 it was tied to this entire block trading probe. And 0:12:04.520 --> 0:12:06.120 now they're looking at some of his clients, some of 0:12:06.160 --> 0:12:09.480 the conversations he's had, some of his colleagues. So it's 0:12:09.480 --> 0:12:11.400 going to be interesting few weeks and months ahead as 0:12:11.520 --> 0:12:13.480 they try and figure out whether they can build a 0:12:13.520 --> 0:12:15.920 real case. I mean, ultimately we could get regulators to 0:12:16.080 --> 0:12:19.920 rule right on this. But you said it's murky regulators, prosecutors, 0:12:20.040 --> 0:12:22.199 if if if if we if they have what we 0:12:22.280 --> 0:12:24.480 think they have in terms of evidence, in terms of 0:12:24.559 --> 0:12:28.360 being tracking them for a while. It's really it's really 0:12:28.440 --> 0:12:30.520 hard for anyone on the outside to be able to 0:12:30.559 --> 0:12:34.040 definitively tell you which way this goes, because I can 0:12:34.120 --> 0:12:36.280 guarantee you there's someone at the SD and why sitting 0:12:36.280 --> 0:12:38.280 in an evidence room looking at a pile of stuff. 0:12:38.960 --> 0:12:41.040 Very well, good know all the answers well, and just 0:12:41.240 --> 0:12:43.400 got about twenty seconds or fift I mean black trades. 0:12:43.480 --> 0:12:46.320 It's a part of how Wall Street works, right, It's 0:12:46.360 --> 0:12:48.480 a part of how Wall Street works. It was made 0:12:48.559 --> 0:12:50.920 famous by the legendary Ghostly we fifty years ago and 0:12:51.040 --> 0:12:53.880 still a very lucrative part of the market. Well, incredible reporting, 0:12:53.880 --> 0:12:56.000 and we set a Bloomberg exclusive animals right tree not 0:12:56.080 --> 0:12:58.360 a Raja, And thank you so much, finance reporter at Bloomberg. 0:12:58.640 --> 0:13:01.680 This is Bloomberg is do this week with Carol Messer 0:13:01.920 --> 0:13:06.440 and Bloomberg Quick Takes Tim Stinovic on Bloomberg Radio. After 0:13:06.600 --> 0:13:11.160 surging we're sales plant based meats in the meat departments 0:13:11.200 --> 0:13:13.760 of grocery stores increased only just a smidge in one 0:13:13.800 --> 0:13:16.520 percent last year. Tim, It's remarkable to read that in 0:13:16.800 --> 0:13:20.240 Dina Shanker's latest article in the upcoming double issue of 0:13:20.280 --> 0:13:24.079 Bloomberg business Week magazine. She's consumer reporter for Bloomberg Knew. 0:13:24.080 --> 0:13:25.480 She joined us now on the phone from New York City. 0:13:25.480 --> 0:13:28.160 Also with us as Joel Webber, editor at Bloomberg business Week. 0:13:28.200 --> 0:13:30.440 He's with us in the Bloomberg INTERACTI Broker studio. Joel, 0:13:30.679 --> 0:13:32.959 I think back to where we were about two years ago. 0:13:33.080 --> 0:13:34.920 I was going to the grocery store every two or 0:13:35.000 --> 0:13:38.240 three weeks, okay, because that's where I wasn't in pandemic mode, 0:13:38.679 --> 0:13:42.360 using two shopping carts, okay. And I was at the 0:13:42.440 --> 0:13:44.560 grocery store. I think it was a Wegman's, and there 0:13:44.640 --> 0:13:48.160 was like this whole section of beyond me that was 0:13:48.400 --> 0:13:51.640 on sale there and beyond meat stock. It actually at 0:13:51.679 --> 0:13:54.360 the time was doing pretty well. Yeah, And you know, 0:13:54.520 --> 0:13:57.600 I think, um, uh, you haven't gone to the grocery 0:13:57.600 --> 0:13:59.679 store since I'm guessing no, I have gone to the 0:13:59.720 --> 0:14:02.080 grocery first. You know what taken up with the team 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:05.079 during the pandemic. We do a lot of delivery these days, right, Well, 0:14:05.120 --> 0:14:12.040 grocery delivery. So the enthusiasm among investors and certain consumers 0:14:12.280 --> 0:14:16.599 was incredibly high. Um. For uh, you know this the 0:14:16.920 --> 0:14:19.440 foe meat fake meat stuff when it came to market, 0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:23.600 and we've seen it um reflected in I'm looking at 0:14:23.720 --> 0:14:28.200 beyond share price, which has come down pretty substantially since 0:14:28.360 --> 0:14:30.600 that moment that you were at Wigman's all those months 0:14:30.640 --> 0:14:34.440 ago and then before times. Um. But as Dina writes 0:14:34.480 --> 0:14:36.600 in this latest issue, which I found this to be 0:14:36.680 --> 0:14:40.000 really interesting, the companies are starting to attack and think 0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:43.280 of themselves maybe not as always being the main event, 0:14:43.760 --> 0:14:46.480 into something more like an ingredient. So so Dina walk 0:14:46.560 --> 0:14:51.120 us through the strategy and how it's playing out. Hi. Thanks. 0:14:51.680 --> 0:14:56.960 So basically what you have is these companies are no 0:14:57.160 --> 0:15:01.400 longer getting all the attention from consumer from people like 0:15:01.600 --> 0:15:03.360 me in the media, although I do give them a 0:15:03.400 --> 0:15:06.800 lot of attention. Um. People are are getting a little 0:15:06.960 --> 0:15:10.640 bored with the novelty of a burger made from something 0:15:10.720 --> 0:15:13.600 other than meat, or sausage made from something other than pork. 0:15:13.960 --> 0:15:16.520 They're also getting maybe you guys can relate, getting a 0:15:16.520 --> 0:15:19.880 little tired of cooking all the time. So, uh, the 0:15:20.080 --> 0:15:23.400 sales have dropped precipitously. Um. Oh, and then there's also 0:15:23.480 --> 0:15:25.440 the fact that they can get meat a lot more 0:15:25.560 --> 0:15:28.040 easily than they did during that time when you're taking 0:15:28.080 --> 0:15:33.640 those two supermarket uh cards through the aisles. So all 0:15:33.720 --> 0:15:36.520 of these things are making is that uh people just 0:15:36.720 --> 0:15:40.280 aren't feeling as compelled to try these uh not so 0:15:40.440 --> 0:15:43.280 new products anymore. So what are these companies doing? They're saying, 0:15:43.480 --> 0:15:47.200 but wait, there's more. Okay, we can put our fake 0:15:47.320 --> 0:15:51.320 beef into ravioli, we can put sausage on a pizza, 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:55.320 we can put it in a dumpling. So many ways 0:15:55.400 --> 0:15:57.840 to eat this stuff, and a lot of it doesn't 0:15:57.920 --> 0:16:01.760 even involve cooking, or at least, you know, real cooking. 0:16:01.840 --> 0:16:05.120 You can throw this into a microwave. You can just 0:16:05.280 --> 0:16:07.560 put it in the oven for ten minutes and it'll 0:16:07.600 --> 0:16:12.320 be ready before your next zoom meeting. So it's really simple. 0:16:12.800 --> 0:16:16.800 And hopefully, you know, with all of this melted cheese 0:16:16.880 --> 0:16:20.560 on top, or pasta around it, or what other whatever 0:16:20.680 --> 0:16:23.680 else is dressing it up, you might not even notice 0:16:23.760 --> 0:16:26.680 that it's not the real thing. So I have a theory, Tina, 0:16:26.920 --> 0:16:30.000 and I'm interested if you're reporting bear this our just 0:16:30.120 --> 0:16:33.720 a observation from the Weber household, which is when I've 0:16:33.800 --> 0:16:38.400 cooked with uh, fake meat, it doesn't smell good when 0:16:38.480 --> 0:16:43.040 it's just by itself. Did that come up? You know, 0:16:43.600 --> 0:16:47.800 it did not come up with any of the wrong Definitely, 0:16:48.520 --> 0:16:50.880 it has no note. I was gonna say it's come 0:16:51.000 --> 0:16:55.280 up real human beings, but I talked to um all 0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:59.240 the time. I've noticed it in my house. Other when 0:16:59.280 --> 0:17:01.160 I say real human being, I'm using that term really 0:17:01.200 --> 0:17:03.960 loosely because I'm realizing I'm mostly talking about other reporters. 0:17:04.760 --> 0:17:08.639 But people people have definitely mentioned it to me that 0:17:09.400 --> 0:17:12.119 there's a funny smell, and I noticed it too, Um, 0:17:12.200 --> 0:17:15.600 but it made me wonder actually, like, you know, this 0:17:15.760 --> 0:17:19.040 is actually maybe a brilliant technique because there's so many 0:17:19.119 --> 0:17:22.640 things that meat gets added to, and you know, maybe 0:17:22.680 --> 0:17:24.680 it doesn't need to be meat. It could be fake muting. 0:17:25.000 --> 0:17:27.040 Like this solves the other problem of maybe not having that, 0:17:28.080 --> 0:17:29.720 you know, the smell of jewel cooking in your house. 0:17:31.520 --> 0:17:37.200 I'm coming over. I don't know that I am sodina. 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:42.800 My problem with this plant based food is that I 0:17:42.880 --> 0:17:45.199 don't know that it's definitely healthier. And I guess that's 0:17:45.240 --> 0:17:48.119 what I'm thinking about, that that's where food is ultimately 0:17:48.200 --> 0:17:50.480 moving in terms of direction, does that hold it back 0:17:50.720 --> 0:17:57.159 from growth as well? Definitely? I mean it is you know, 0:17:57.320 --> 0:18:02.360 as a as a category. Um, there's nothing nobody's gonna 0:18:02.400 --> 0:18:05.280 say this category is a health food category. You can 0:18:05.320 --> 0:18:08.280 go a product by product and some will have, you know, 0:18:08.520 --> 0:18:13.600 better nutritional value than others. But um and and that's 0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:18.120 also becoming some A way that the newer companies are 0:18:19.040 --> 0:18:22.520 trying to differentiate themselves is by saying, look, we're only 0:18:22.760 --> 0:18:26.879 using um, a handful of ingredients or um, we have 0:18:27.400 --> 0:18:31.400 fewer calories or whatever it is. But compared to uh, 0:18:31.880 --> 0:18:34.760 you know, like the real stuff, I mean kind of 0:18:34.800 --> 0:18:38.680 a wash, you can you can definitely make arguments that, um, listen, 0:18:38.720 --> 0:18:41.280 it doesn't have a cholesterol, but it has a ton 0:18:41.440 --> 0:18:46.480 of sodium. Um and uh, the amount of you know, 0:18:46.600 --> 0:18:51.080 the beef burger can have literally just a single ingredient 0:18:51.320 --> 0:18:54.280 in it, so um, the beef industry will say that's 0:18:54.359 --> 0:18:56.760 really great. But then of course you can make the 0:18:56.840 --> 0:18:59.480 argument that, um, well, sure, hidden in all that beef 0:18:59.640 --> 0:19:02.480 are a whole lot of you know, antibiotics that are 0:19:02.520 --> 0:19:10.800 fed to the animals, said to the animals, um, bring 0:19:10.840 --> 0:19:13.920 it back, you know, I'm wondering if I'm wondering about 0:19:13.960 --> 0:19:16.480 product pipelines here, because for the last couple of years, 0:19:16.560 --> 0:19:18.360 the news from these companies has really been, Hey, we're 0:19:18.359 --> 0:19:20.800 working on this chicken version of chicken. What is the 0:19:20.800 --> 0:19:25.080 product pipeline telling you about their new strategy. Well, when 0:19:25.119 --> 0:19:28.560 I spoke to Dennis Woodside, who's the president at Impossible, 0:19:28.960 --> 0:19:32.040 he said, you know, listen, we're still working on mimicking 0:19:32.240 --> 0:19:37.560 that hole muscle kind of format, which is like a 0:19:37.640 --> 0:19:40.520 chicken breast or steaks. Um. And then he didn't put 0:19:40.560 --> 0:19:43.520 it this way exactly, but essentially what he was saying was, 0:19:43.760 --> 0:19:46.760 but this is so much easier, Like I can just 0:19:46.880 --> 0:19:48.840 take the ground beef we are have and put it 0:19:48.920 --> 0:19:51.520 in a ravioli. All I have to do is, you know, 0:19:51.720 --> 0:19:55.719 make that business deal. And that's not that's a lot 0:19:55.800 --> 0:19:58.680 easier than making a fake chicken breath. All right, Well, 0:19:58.920 --> 0:20:00.920 I want real stuff in my only I'm just gonna 0:20:00.920 --> 0:20:03.560 put it out there. Um. This story in the new 0:20:03.600 --> 0:20:05.920 issue of Bloomberg Business Week magazine. You can find it 0:20:06.160 --> 0:20:10.280 everywhere tomorrow. Bloomberg Business Week getter Joe Weber, who's kind 0:20:10.320 --> 0:20:13.080 of takes maybe some cooking lessons and of course, Tina 0:20:13.119 --> 0:20:18.920 Shankar of Bloomberg News. Yeah, I'll bet you let me drive. No, no, no, 0:20:21.359 --> 0:20:28.800 all right, I want to drive. It's a good question. 0:20:29.440 --> 0:20:38.879 Drive is the drive to the clothes on Bloomberg Radio. 0:20:39.000 --> 0:20:42.240 All right, just about twelve minutes left in today's trading session. 0:20:42.280 --> 0:20:46.040 We've definitely seen our reversal and we are hovering neuro 0:20:46.119 --> 0:20:48.320 best levels of the session. So we've gone from red 0:20:48.359 --> 0:20:50.600 to green when it comes to the equity trade, and 0:20:50.680 --> 0:20:54.639 that is following the latest FED minutes from the Federal Reserve. 0:20:54.680 --> 0:20:56.840 It was at January meeting. I really think the takeaway 0:20:56.880 --> 0:20:58.720 and our our markets live blog has been just great 0:20:58.760 --> 0:21:02.399 on this said. Basically, there was nothing there that made 0:21:02.640 --> 0:21:04.479 investors think that the Fed is going to be more 0:21:04.560 --> 0:21:07.359 hawkish than it was already anticipate. Keep in mind the 0:21:07.400 --> 0:21:10.440 markets already pretty aggressive about what the Fed made more 0:21:10.520 --> 0:21:12.439 hawk issues. I think the key of the Carol right, 0:21:12.520 --> 0:21:14.800 not much new in there in terms of new hawkish 0:21:14.880 --> 0:21:17.000 signs in the Fed minutes. Let's shut all about it. 0:21:17.240 --> 0:21:19.399 That and more with Jimmy Lee, the founder and CEO 0:21:19.560 --> 0:21:22.760 of the Wealth Consulting Group two point seven billion dollars 0:21:22.800 --> 0:21:25.480