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Speaker 1: Now here's a highlight from Coast to Coast AM on

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Speaker 1: iHeartRadio and.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to Coast to Coast George Nori with you.

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Speaker 2: Author Chris Lee, his book is called The Night People,

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Speaker 2: has on a graduate degree in secondary education and a

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Speaker 2: master's in community counseling from the University of Alabama. His

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Speaker 2: love for horror movies and ex creatures developed at a

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Speaker 2: very young age. Chris, Welcome to the program.

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Speaker 3: Hello George, this is a dream come true. I've been

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Speaker 3: listening to this show for so many years.

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Speaker 2: Well looking forward to it. And what a great background

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Speaker 2: you have. How did you get into this?

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Speaker 3: Oh, well, I've always been interested in cryptozoology and bigfoot.

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Speaker 3: It goes back to when I was a small child.

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Speaker 3: When I was about seven years old. It was in

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Speaker 3: nineteen seventy seven. My parents and I went to a

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Speaker 3: small art show that was set up in the middle

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Speaker 3: of the local mall, and right in front of everything

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Speaker 3: was a painting of a lady that was sitting on

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Speaker 3: the ground at night in the forest. She was clutching

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Speaker 3: a small knife and it looked like she was trying

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Speaker 3: to protect some kind of small rabbit or a small

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Speaker 3: lamb or something and standing right there in the background

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Speaker 3: was a giant Bigfoot with big scary teeth.

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Speaker 2: Okay.

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Speaker 3: Well, as a seven year old, that really got my attention.

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Speaker 3: And the picture didn't really make any sense to me

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Speaker 3: because I'd never seen any kind of depiction of Bigfoot before,

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Speaker 3: and I had to ask my dad what it was.

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Speaker 1: Now.

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Speaker 3: My dad had run into a friend of his from work,

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Speaker 3: and this guy decided to mess with me a little

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Speaker 3: and he said, oh, you better watch out. Bigfoot's a

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Speaker 3: giant creature with big pointed teeth that roams around in

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Speaker 3: the forest of America. And you know, he told me

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Speaker 3: I needed to be really careful if I decided to

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Speaker 3: go on a height through the woods. Well, you know,

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Speaker 3: when you're seven years old, you believe every thing, and

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Speaker 3: I was kind of I'll admit I was kind of

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Speaker 3: a spirited child. And as I started getting scared, my

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Speaker 3: dad came to the rescue and he said, hold on,

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Speaker 3: there's no such thing as Bigfoot. You're okay, It's perfectly

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Speaker 3: safe to go in the woods. And you know, reminded me,

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Speaker 3: you're you're safe in the woods as long as you

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Speaker 3: stay near an adult. Okay, But we were about to

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Speaker 3: go on a father son camp out, and I guess

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Speaker 3: he was nervous. I was about to back out of it.

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Speaker 3: So once he said that, nothing else was really said

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Speaker 3: on the subject. So that was the end of our conversation.

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Speaker 3: But I started it stayed with me. I started thinking

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Speaker 3: about the possibility that something was out there, And of

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Speaker 3: course I was seeing the trailers on TV for the

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Speaker 3: movie Sasquatch, and of course I believed everything that I

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Speaker 3: saw on TV, because you know, I was seven or

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Speaker 3: eight years old, and so I remained fascinating with that

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Speaker 3: idea that there might be some kind of big, large,

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Speaker 3: hairy human like creature wandering around in the woods. Well,

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Speaker 3: about three years later, when I was in the fifth grade,

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Speaker 3: the class took a school took a little trip to

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Speaker 3: the school library one morning, and we did this once

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Speaker 3: a week. And we had a school library and who

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Speaker 3: was absolutely wonderful. Her name was missus Malone. She would

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Speaker 3: always read us a story and then we were allowed

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Speaker 3: to check out a book from the stacks and take

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Speaker 3: it home, and you know, we could keep it for

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Speaker 3: the week. So while my classmates were picking out books

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Speaker 3: about the Hardy Boys and Nancy drew Encyclopedia Brown, all

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Speaker 3: the cool stuff that kids read in the seventies. I

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Speaker 3: found this book about Bigfoot, and I got very excited

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Speaker 3: and I checked it out. You know, I had questions,

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Speaker 3: I wanted answers, and I especially wanted to know more

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Speaker 3: about Bigfoot before I went on any more cap outs.

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Speaker 3: Yeahs probvious reasons. Well, about fifteen or twenty minutes later,

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Speaker 3: when everyone in the class had chosen their book, we

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Speaker 3: run around. We went around the room, and we always

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Speaker 3: had an opportunity to show everyone the book that we'd

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Speaker 3: picked out. Well, it was my turn. I proudly held

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Speaker 3: up the book and you know, the whole room started

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Speaker 3: laughing their heads off. They thought it was crazy that

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Speaker 3: I would choose a book about such a ridiculous topic.

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Speaker 3: It was by Ian Thorne, and I later learned that

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Speaker 3: her pen name was Julian May. That was one of

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Speaker 3: her many pen names, and the title of the book

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Speaker 3: was simply Bigfoot. But George, I enjoyed that book. There

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Speaker 3: were several stories in there, and it all sounded very believable,

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Speaker 3: and they were all entertaining. I couldn't put it down,

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Speaker 3: and I believe that is when I started to become

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Speaker 3: a believer in Bigfoot and believed that something was out there.

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Speaker 3: Not long after that, I also found a book about

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Speaker 3: the Locknous Monster, and I found that book fascinating as well.

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Speaker 3: Most of the evidence in that book, now this is

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Speaker 3: the seventies, and most of the evidence in that book

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Speaker 3: centered around the surgeons photo, which has sadly been found

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Speaker 3: to be a fake. But again, you know, I enjoyed

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Speaker 3: the book, and the other stories in the book sounded believable,

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Speaker 3: and it was fascinating to me to think that a

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Speaker 3: modern dinosaur could still be out there. And then the

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Speaker 3: third incident that got my attention. I think it was

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Speaker 3: right around nineteen eighty that there were news reports that

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Speaker 3: there might be a large Bronosaurus type creature living in

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Speaker 3: the river basin of the Congo that was called the

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Speaker 3: Mochili Mobembe, and I saw two news reports on the

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Speaker 3: sighting when I was ten. Expected an announcement any day

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Speaker 3: that they had found the creature at last, But well,

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Speaker 3: unfortunately that still hasn't happened, but the legend persists.

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Speaker 2: Well, you really were into these creatures, weren't you.

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Speaker 3: I was. I was just fascinated by it, and I

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Speaker 3: think where it comes from. We want to believe that

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Speaker 3: there's still something out there to discover that we haven't

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Speaker 3: found everything.

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Speaker 1: Well, we will hopefully, hopefully.

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Speaker 2: When did you realize that Bigfoot was not vicious?

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Speaker 3: Well, to me, I think, I think that the creatures

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Speaker 3: are intelligent enough to where they have different personalities, so

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Speaker 3: some might be a little meaner than others. But the

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Speaker 3: way I portrayed the animals for the creatures in my novel, basically,

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Speaker 3: they'll leave you alone if you leave them alone, you know.

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Speaker 3: And it was really reading those stories. They didn't sound

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Speaker 3: necessarily vicious towards people, but curious and definitely kind of wary.

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Speaker 2: You also got into Godzilla movies and King Kong. I did,

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Speaker 2: I did.

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Speaker 3: I found those movies fascinating as well. Uh, the fascinating

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Speaker 3: the fascination with King Kong came from the interest in Bigfoot.

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Speaker 3: King Kong is similar to the Bigfoot legend. You have

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Speaker 3: an unknown ape living ape like creature living in a

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Speaker 3: remote place. And of course my introduction to King Kong

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Speaker 3: was the old movie by Marion Cooper when I was

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Speaker 3: about seven or eight years years old. Of course, the

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Speaker 3: Dino de la Reentis nineteen seventy six remake was out.

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Speaker 3: Mom didn't think I was quite ready to see that one,

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Speaker 3: but she was okay with me seeing the earlier one,

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Speaker 3: and I was allowed to see it on TV. And

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Speaker 3: I loved that movie from the beginning. It was the

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Speaker 3: first black and white movie that I ever liked, and

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Speaker 3: I thought the special effects were fantastic.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 3: But you know, George, I've always hated the ending where

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Speaker 3: Kong falls to his death. Honestly, I never thought that

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Speaker 3: Kong was the antagonist. I felt like the crew who

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Speaker 3: took him off the island were the bad guys. When

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Speaker 3: he was turned loose in New York, he naturally wreaked havoc.

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Speaker 3: But what did they expect, you know?

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Speaker 2: And Godzilla was Japanese, wasn't he.

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Speaker 3: That's right, That's right with Godzilla. I think, like all

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Speaker 3: kids in the seven, the fascination came from an interest

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Speaker 3: in dinosaurs. I think most kids have a fascination with dinosaurs.

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Speaker 3: I was no different, and I became interested. And when

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Speaker 3: I came became interested in Godzilla, it was in the

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Speaker 3: later era when he was portrayed as protector and not

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Speaker 3: an antagonist trying to kill people. Yeah, the movies from

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Speaker 3: that era were kind of campy, but kids never care

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Speaker 3: about that. You know, they just love a good good

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Speaker 3: guy bad guy fight. And I also love the creature

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Speaker 3: feature television shows that Godzilla inspired, like Specter Man and

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Speaker 3: Space Giants. That was can't miss television when I was

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Speaker 3: a kid, because otherwise you'll be lost in the conversation

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Speaker 3: the next day at lunch.

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Speaker 2: And Godzilla was the Japanese way of saying nuclear radiation

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Speaker 2: and followed could affect us.

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Speaker 3: That's right, that's right. I recently read the novella's Godzilla

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Speaker 3: and Godzilla Godzilla Raids again. I'm glad to see that

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Speaker 3: they've been finally translated into English for the first time

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Speaker 3: after so many years. I found them both an interesting read,

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Speaker 3: and it was interesting to read the author's note in

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Speaker 3: the beginning where he puts it all in perspective. Godzilla

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Speaker 3: Ism was originally a metaphor for nuclear destruction, and Kayama

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Speaker 3: makes that clear from the very beginning. It does put

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Speaker 3: the story in a different light. In that original story

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Speaker 3: of Godzilla, his whole existence is a consequence of nuclear

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Speaker 3: testing and nuclear radiation, and you have to keep in

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Speaker 3: mind this was not long after the bombings of Hiroshima Nagasaki,

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Speaker 3: and there was also the Lucky Dragon five incident, where

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Speaker 3: the Japanese fishing boat with twenty three crewmen aboard, were

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Speaker 3: contaminated by the nuclear fallout created by that Thermo nuclear

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Speaker 3: bomb test at the Bikinia Tall March of fifty four,

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Speaker 3: and I believe one of them later died.

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Speaker 2: You saw a lead night movie on Frankenstein and freaked

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Speaker 2: out as a kid, then new.

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Speaker 3: I sure did. It was Son of Frankenstein. Now how

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Speaker 3: that came about. Let's see, it was ten thirty on

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Speaker 3: a Saturday night. I was in the third grade, and

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Speaker 3: normally on Saturday nights, ten thirty was my bedtime. You know,

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Speaker 3: normally it was a little earlier on the school night,

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Speaker 3: but you know, I was allowed to stay up till

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Speaker 3: ten thirty. So at the end of the news broadcast,

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Speaker 3: I was fully expecting, you know, my dad to send

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Speaker 3: me off to bed. But then the local I believe

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Speaker 3: it was the local ABC affiliate, announced it was time

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Speaker 3: for their horror movie feature on Saturday Night. It was

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Speaker 3: like they didn't even want to try to compete with

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Speaker 3: NBC and Saturday Night Live. But anyway, but I didn't care.

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Speaker 3: I was excited and I just beg my dad, can

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Speaker 3: I see this movie?

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Speaker 1: Son?

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Speaker 3: Of Frankenstein and he said, okay, yeah, we'll watch it.

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Speaker 3: So I was very excited. I had read a book

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Speaker 3: about Frankenstein again by Ian Thorn at the library, and

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Speaker 3: I wanted to see a movie so bad. And of course,

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Speaker 3: in those days, we didn't have on demand television. It

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Speaker 3: existed with LaserDiscs and Beta Max, but most homes didn't

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Speaker 3: have that. We didn't, and so it was pretty exciting

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Speaker 3: to me to be watching TV and this Frankenstein movie

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Speaker 3: comes on. So we proceed to watch it. And when

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Speaker 3: you got to the part of the movie where Boris

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Speaker 3: Karloff is the months, he is walking up behind Basil Rathbohm,

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Speaker 3: who is doctor Frankenstein, I got scared. I was scared

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Speaker 3: out of my mind. I started screaming at the TV.

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Speaker 3: He's behind you, He's behind you. You better look. I

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Speaker 3: started crying. Well, my dad put a stop to that immediately.

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Speaker 3: He said, okay, hold on, it's just a movie. It

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Speaker 3: can't hurt you. If you don't calm down, I'm gonna

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Speaker 3: make you go to bed. Okay. So I wanted to

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Speaker 3: see the end of that movie. So I'm manned up

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Speaker 3: and I sat there watch the rest of the movie.

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Speaker 3: And I haven't been scared by a horror movie ever since.

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Speaker 2: And you were influenced by the writer and radio host

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Speaker 2: Frank Edwards.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely, yeah. Frank Edwards was a pioneer broadcaster. He started

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Speaker 3: out back in nineteen twenty three. How that started. Our

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Speaker 3: local library here in Tuscaloosa has a used booksell and

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Speaker 3: one day I found I was in there looking for

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Speaker 3: the old ian Thorn monster books, but you never can't

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Speaker 3: find them, but I do find other things, And one

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Speaker 3: day I found a book called Stranger Than Science. It

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Speaker 3: had several brief but fascinating stories about strange occurrences that

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Speaker 3: could not be easily explained. And I don't believe the

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Speaker 3: word paranormal was used much during Frank Edward's time, but

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Speaker 3: he called his story Stranger than Science. And I enjoyed

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Speaker 3: the book so much that I decided to look into

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Speaker 3: who he was, since at the time I'd never heard

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Speaker 3: of him, but he had a radio show called Strangers

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Speaker 3: of All And what I liked about reading his stories

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Speaker 3: he wasn't afraid to delve into topics that couldn't be

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Speaker 3: easily explained. I think while other people in the news

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Speaker 3: media at the time would try to avoid stories like that.

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Speaker 3: He tackled subjects like the abominable Snowman, sea serpents, Bigfoot, ghosts,

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Speaker 3: people communicating from the great beyond. He was fearless in

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Speaker 3: what he was willing to investigate and report. And I

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Speaker 3: admired that he was on.

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Speaker 2: The Tonight Show once with Johnny Carson, with Steve Lawrence

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Speaker 2: and Edie Gomery filling in for Johnny.

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Speaker 1: Yes.

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Speaker 3: Yes, he was a fascinating man. And if he had

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Speaker 3: a logical explanation for a phenomenon, then he would offer it.

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Speaker 3: For instance, he attributed the sea serpent sightings to the

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Speaker 3: giant oarfish. But more often than not he would give

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Speaker 3: you the evidence and let you draw your own conclusions.

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Speaker 2: So he died way too early too, didn't he?

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Speaker 1: He did?

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Speaker 3: He did. I think he passed away around sixty eight,

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Speaker 3: you know, right in the sixties.

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Speaker 2: Are Yeah, he was only fifty seven years old or

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Speaker 2: something like that.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I believe.

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Speaker 2: So what a great person for the mind, wasn't he?

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Speaker 3: He was? And in regards to Bigfoot, he pointed out

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Speaker 3: that the Pacific Northwest would be a good place for

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Speaker 3: them to hide because of all the expansive forests, and

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Speaker 3: one of his stories called the search for the Harry Giants,

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Speaker 3: he recounted several instances of people having Bigfoot encounters, and

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Speaker 3: he ended that story by saying, there seems to be

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Speaker 3: little question that Bigfoot and his family are in there.

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Speaker 3: How to get him out, preferably alive? Is the next question?

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Speaker 2: Are you a believer that Bigfoot's real?

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Speaker 3: Well, that's a good question.

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Speaker 2: I'll say this.

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Speaker 3: I'm not an anthropologist or a biologist or any kind

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Speaker 3: of animal expert. I am working on a doctorate in education.

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Speaker 3: I do consider myself to be a social scientist in training,

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Speaker 3: So my interest in Bigfoot is examining the social aspect

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Speaker 3: and the numerous accounts that are out there. But you know,

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Speaker 3: when a researcher is examining the research that has been

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Speaker 3: completed on a topic, you shouldn't go into the project

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Speaker 3: with an agenda. In other words, you shouldn't examine only

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Speaker 3: the people who agree with you and ignore those who don't. So,

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Speaker 3: you know, when you take an objective look at Bigfoot,

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Speaker 3: you have to consider the arguments against. First, they say

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Speaker 3: there's no way there could only be one. That's logical,

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Speaker 3: there would have to be a breeding population, and there

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Speaker 3: would have to be plenty of evidence of that if

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Speaker 3: there was a North American ape. Second, they are supposedly

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Speaker 3: so big that they would be impossible to miss, and

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Speaker 3: that sounds plausible. And other theories are that's a mountain

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Speaker 3: man dressed in bear skin, or probably a diseased bear.

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Speaker 3: But you look at the other side of it, and

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Speaker 3: this is really where my belief that there is possibly

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Speaker 3: a strong possibility there's North American ape out there. We

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Speaker 3: have numerous accounts from the Native American populations going back

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Speaker 3: for centuries, and I am generally supportive of anecdotal or

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Speaker 3: qualitative evidence from numerous places, from numerous people over many years.

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Speaker 3: Plus there is the research done by highly educated researchers

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Speaker 3: like Grover Krantz and Jeff Meldrum who have collected and

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Speaker 3: analyzed numerous casts. So although I'm still considered a fringe science,

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Speaker 3: taking it all into account, I'm convinced the creatures do exist.

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Speaker 3: I think where there's this much smoke, there is fire.

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Speaker 2: Why can't we find one? Chris, Oh, that's a good question.

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Speaker 3: Well, first, I believe they are primarily nocturnal, just only

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Speaker 3: coming out at night, whether they were always that way

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Speaker 3: or they became that way. Trying to avoid human beings.

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Speaker 3: I don't know, but I believe they're nocturnal, and I

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Speaker 3: think they generally hunt and gather at night. To me,

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Speaker 3: that would explain why they are rarely seen. Yes, you

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Speaker 3: sometimes see one during the day, but I believe they're

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Speaker 3: primarily night creatures, and I think they have figured out

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Speaker 3: that they need to stay away from us.

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Speaker 1: Listen to more Coast to Coast AM every weeknight at

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