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Speaker 1: When I was five, or even thirty, or even thirty five,

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Speaker 1: If you asked me what was more likely, would you

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Speaker 1: be a rabbi or would you walk on the moon?

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Speaker 1: I would have said walk on the moon because I

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Speaker 1: had no inclination to be a rabbi. I had no

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Speaker 1: desire to be a rabbi, and it just was this

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Speaker 1: path that I started on. I had no concept, probably

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Speaker 1: for the first of the journey that I was on

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Speaker 1: a journey. It's a total surprise. Careers often take surprising turns.

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Speaker 1: Before j schue Back became a rabbi, he sold life

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Speaker 1: insurance and worked as a psychologist, and before all that

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Speaker 1: he was almost a professional actor. Now he's been a

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Speaker 1: rabbi in Central organ for the past eighteen years, by

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Speaker 1: far his steadiest job. On this edition of On the Job,

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Speaker 1: brought to you by Express Employment Professionals, we'll hear his

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Speaker 1: story of finding meaningful work in the last place he

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Speaker 1: would have thought to look. I'm your host, Steve Mencher.

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Speaker 1: If you want to find your next job, or if

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Speaker 1: you're a company hoping to grow your workforce, Express Employment

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Speaker 1: Professionals is for you. Find more information at express pros

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Speaker 1: dot com. Now among those surprised by j Schupak's decision

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Speaker 1: to become a rabbi, his son, producer Joel Shupac, who

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Speaker 1: brings us this story. It's Friday afternoon, just before sunset,

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Speaker 1: and I'm running down a quiet street in Bend, Oregon

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Speaker 1: with Jay, my father. Why are we running? We're running,

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Speaker 1: We're not interviewing seventy have to count my steps. This

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Speaker 1: is new. He's always been a serious walker. He walks

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Speaker 1: every day for at least an hour. But now running,

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Speaker 1: that's good. Earlier in his office, I did notice a

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Speaker 1: small sign on his desk that my mom must have painted.

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Speaker 1: She's an artist. It read Jay can run. Why Why

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Speaker 1: did I make you that sign? Because I asked her.

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Speaker 1: I wanted an affirmation that says Jay can run because

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Speaker 1: I was always told I couldn't run when I was little.

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Speaker 1: When my dad was a kid, he had asthma that

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Speaker 1: was so severe he really couldn't run. On the other hand,

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Speaker 1: if you tell J. Shoepack there's something he can't do,

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Speaker 1: there's a good chance will make a special effort to

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Speaker 1: prove you wrong, even if it takes fifty years. It

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Speaker 1: doesn't say how far. On the side steps at least

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Speaker 1: After the short run, we're back to walking off of

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Speaker 1: the neighborhood streets and into a park, although it's less

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Speaker 1: of a park and more of a sliver of undeveloped

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Speaker 1: land full of juniper trees, sage brush, and craggy volcanic

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Speaker 1: rock outcroppings. Is this always where you write your sermons

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Speaker 1: when you're walking? Um? Ever since I got a smartphone? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: if I wasn't there walking with him, my dad would

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Speaker 1: certainly be talking to himself. It's a trade I've picked

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Speaker 1: up too. He uses this time alone to compose his thoughts,

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Speaker 1: speaking them into his phone. When he comes up with

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Speaker 1: something good, I just hit record and there it is,

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Speaker 1: and it automatically saves it into a file. He shows

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Speaker 1: me an example of the sermon he's working on, and

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Speaker 1: God says, come, I will take your hand, and we

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Speaker 1: won't go together to see. So this is kindness taking

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Speaker 1: my hand. Right. But long before Rabbi j was talking

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Speaker 1: to himself in a tiny stretch of wilderness, he was

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Speaker 1: a boy, a boy who was told he couldn't run.

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Speaker 1: I was born in Berwick, Pennsylvania, and we lived on

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Speaker 1: a nice little street, very middle class. Berwick is a

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Speaker 1: small town on the Susquehanna River. A few years after

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Speaker 1: he was born, they moved up to Kingston, Pennsylvania, about

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Speaker 1: thirty miles upriver. His father, my grandfather, Charlie, had his

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Speaker 1: own business. He was good with numbers, and he was

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Speaker 1: good with people, and he was persistent, and he worked

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Speaker 1: hard and and he made a living. He didn't make

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Speaker 1: a great living, but he made a living. And that

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Speaker 1: work ethic really made an impression on my dad. It

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Speaker 1: was a particularly entrepreneurial work ethoic that you that you

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Speaker 1: created something out of nothing, that you saw an opportunity,

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Speaker 1: or you risked your time and your money to multiply both.

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Speaker 1: I mean that's the idea. When Jay was quite young,

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Speaker 1: he took that spirit and started selling TV guides throughout

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Speaker 1: the neighborhood. He could buy them in bulk for thirteen

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Speaker 1: cents apiece and sell them for a quarter. Was that

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Speaker 1: your first job. It wasn't a job, it was a business.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's the difference, you see. Because I was

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Speaker 1: responsible for ordering them, and I was responsible for they

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Speaker 1: would deliver them once a week to my house, and

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Speaker 1: I had to count them and make sure if I

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Speaker 1: ordered twenty seven, I got twenty seven and let's say

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Speaker 1: two of the covers were ripped. I had to get

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Speaker 1: credit and then I would deliver them, and then I'd

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Speaker 1: have to collect at the end of the month. I

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Speaker 1: had to keep records. I had to keep track. I hadn't.

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Speaker 1: I had to understand, you know, the profit and laws.

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Speaker 1: Now these are very small numbers. You understand a TV

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Speaker 1: guy was a quarter. But it's the same exact idea.

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Speaker 1: You just add a few zeros and you got a

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Speaker 1: real business. You know. So, how old were you when

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Speaker 1: you were doing that? I think I was eight. Later

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Speaker 1: he mowed lawns, old flowers. I worked at restaurants. I

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Speaker 1: was scrubbing pots and dishes, and you know, I did

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Speaker 1: bus boying where I would clear the tables and scrape

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Speaker 1: all the food they didn't eat. I worked in a

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Speaker 1: shoe store for a while. Um, and then I ran

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Speaker 1: the bowling alley at the j c C for a while.

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Speaker 1: These were all just summer jobs that he did up

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Speaker 1: through high school, a way to make some spending money,

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Speaker 1: but nothing he was ever very excited about. But then

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Speaker 1: in his senior year he tried something new. He went

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Speaker 1: out for the school play Fiddler on the Roof. You know,

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Speaker 1: I almost didn't go into that play because they were

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Speaker 1: going to do tryouts or something. I couldn't. I didn't

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Speaker 1: know where they were, you know, they were, they were

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Speaker 1: like downstairs. All the other doors were locked except one

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Speaker 1: door was opened in the whole high school. And I

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Speaker 1: almost went home, and I wouldn't have been in the play,

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Speaker 1: but I just like went. I tried one more door

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Speaker 1: and it was open, and I walked in and I

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Speaker 1: heard voices, and there they were, and you know, he

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Speaker 1: found the audition and got himself apart very little. Nowadays,

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Speaker 1: my dad has a saying, the most securely locked door

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Speaker 1: is the one you don't even try to open. Good advice.

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Speaker 1: I couldn't have a big part. I didn't want more

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Speaker 1: than a few lines because I didn't have time to

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Speaker 1: learn it and I wouldn't be able to reheard. He

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Speaker 1: was on the gymnastics team and their practice was at

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Speaker 1: the same time as the play rehearsal. So I had

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Speaker 1: the smallest part, which is the Rabbi. That's right, the Rabbi.

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Speaker 1: He only had a handful of lines, all of them

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Speaker 1: comic relief. In the opening scene, someone asked the Rabbi

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Speaker 1: if there's a proper blessing for the Czar, the ruler

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Speaker 1: of Russia, who was certainly no friend of the Jews.

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Speaker 1: The rabbi says, of course, make God bless and keep

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Speaker 1: the tzar far far away from us. The rabbi role

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Speaker 1: is a very minor role, so that could go like

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Speaker 1: from the gym, and I could run down the hall

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Speaker 1: and you know, jump on stage and do my little

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Speaker 1: thing and then run back to the gym. I mean

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Speaker 1: when you when you talk about father on the roof

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Speaker 1: when I was a kid, you talked about it like

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Speaker 1: you were you were like, you stole the show. I

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Speaker 1: think it's a strong statement to say I stole the

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Speaker 1: show because there was some wonderful actors, but I was special.

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Speaker 1: I had a special presence. Um. You know how in

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Speaker 1: everyone comes out for the for the final bow, and

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Speaker 1: everybody comes on to stage and and there was a

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Speaker 1: very very significant rise in the level of applause when

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Speaker 1: I came out. You know, that was that's for sure.

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Speaker 1: And then when people wanted my autograph, that was a

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Speaker 1: big deal because I was like, what are you kidding? Autograph?

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Speaker 1: What I'm I'm Frank Sinatra. All of a sudden, you

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Speaker 1: know what is that? He thought that theater could really

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Speaker 1: be something to pursue. Well, I really like theater. I

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Speaker 1: mean it was it was great. I could learn lines

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Speaker 1: really well. It wasn't a problem for me. I'm good

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Speaker 1: with my voice, you know. So I after we graduated

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Speaker 1: from high school, he saw an opportunity and he took it.

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Speaker 1: There was a traveling Shakespearean company that they would once

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Speaker 1: a year, they'd come through. They'd go through all the

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Speaker 1: little towns and they'd look for talent. They came to

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Speaker 1: Wikesparian and they had to try out at the y

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Speaker 1: m c A. And I went there and I tried out.

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Speaker 1: I sang something for them, and I did a little

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Speaker 1: monologue thing, and they said, great, you know you're in.

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Speaker 1: We'd like you to come back to New York. But

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Speaker 1: his acting ambitions were about to collide with one of

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Speaker 1: the biggest natural disasters of the time. And then I

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Speaker 1: drove home and it might have been nine o'clock at night,

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Speaker 1: and my tires got wet on the Pure Street bridge.

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Speaker 1: His tires got wet because the Susquehanna River had risen

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Speaker 1: to the height of the bridge. It was Hurricane Agnes,

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Speaker 1: which was flooding much of the East coast. That night,

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Speaker 1: the river continued to rise, and the next morning Pinky

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Speaker 1: shim Will came over and knocked on our door very

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Speaker 1: loudly to wake us up and to tell us that

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Speaker 1: we had to evacuate, that we were being evacuated. And

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Speaker 1: then we went to Hazelton, which is where my parents

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Speaker 1: are from, and we had a place to stay there,

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Speaker 1: and we lived in Hazelton for three months until we

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Speaker 1: could go back home. Yeah, the destruction of his town

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Speaker 1: was severe. We had twenty one of water on my

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Speaker 1: street and and there was someone else's if was on

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Speaker 1: our front yard when we came home, and our garage

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Speaker 1: had floated and turned around so that we're used to

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Speaker 1: drive into it was now you know, a wall you

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Speaker 1: could I mean, it was uninhabitable and we had to

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Speaker 1: clean everything out, wet carpet with six inches of mud

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Speaker 1: on it. Everything was ruined. It was a biblical end

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Speaker 1: to his acting career. Instead of moving to New York

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Speaker 1: and joining the Shakespeare Troupe, he stayed home with his

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Speaker 1: family and helped them rebuild their lives. He never got

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Speaker 1: back into theater. This was also a time he grew

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Speaker 1: further away from the religion. He grew up with. You know,

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Speaker 1: I was raised very Orthodox, and then I really went

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Speaker 1: very far away from it. You know, I didn't really

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Speaker 1: want much to do with it. I didn't go to

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Speaker 1: services for a long, long, long time. Despite that, he

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Speaker 1: did have a strong connection to Israel and lived there

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Speaker 1: in his early twenties. Then he met my mom in California.

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Speaker 1: They got married and moved to Israel together, where my

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Speaker 1: dad worked as a psychologist and I did. I was

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Speaker 1: licensed there as a psychologist, but then it didn't it

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Speaker 1: just wasn't that fulfilling and it didn't pay very well.

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Speaker 1: I made like three a month. Then we came back

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Speaker 1: to America. I didn't really have a path. I didn't

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Speaker 1: really I want to be a you know, fill in

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Speaker 1: the blank. I didn't want to be as something. I

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Speaker 1: never really wanted to be as something. Then what what

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Speaker 1: motivated you? What do you mean what drove you? If

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Speaker 1: you didn't have some passion to be something, then what

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Speaker 1: was motivating you? Um? So my motivation was money, I guess.

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Speaker 1: In other words, I had to pay for things had

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Speaker 1: I had a wife and a kid and we had

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Speaker 1: basically no money. So I had to find a job.

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Speaker 1: So I I joined this thing called Haldane, and they

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Speaker 1: taught you how to find a job, how to network

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Speaker 1: that you write letters, you tell people. I understand you

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Speaker 1: don't have anything for me, but I'd like to come

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Speaker 1: in and show you what I'm trying to do, and

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Speaker 1: maybe you'll know someone who might or maybe you could

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Speaker 1: prefer me. It was this whole referral network thing, and

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Speaker 1: I borrowed money to do it. That was like three

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Speaker 1: thousand dollars in two That was a lot of money

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Speaker 1: for us. And one thing led to one thing led

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Speaker 1: to one thing, and I got into the insurance business

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Speaker 1: at Northwestern Mutual. All these insurance agencies will hire anybody

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Speaker 1: because if you work out with them, then they make

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Speaker 1: money from you. And if you don't make commissions, you're

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Speaker 1: gonna quit and they don't care. They it's a mill.

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Speaker 1: The guys are gone within a year and a half. Anyways,

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Speaker 1: I made a living selling life insurance for a while.

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Speaker 1: It was hard, you know, it's prospecting and calling people

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Speaker 1: making appointments. Nobody wants to see about life insurance. So

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Speaker 1: I shifted my focus from death benefit to life benefit.

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Speaker 1: In other words, that's why I shifted into pension planning.

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Speaker 1: I started to do pension plans because you were not

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Speaker 1: talking about they didn't have to die to get the benefit.

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Speaker 1: They could live and get their benefit. How much better

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Speaker 1: is that? It would still be over a decade before

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Speaker 1: he would find his true calling. In a moment, you'll

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Speaker 1: hear about one night that sent him on a very

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Speaker 1: different path and what his life sounds like today. After

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Speaker 1: the break, you're listening to independent producer Joel Shupac and

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Speaker 1: his father, Rabbi J. Shupac. On the Job is brought

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Speaker 1: to you by Express Employment Professionals. One company is on

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Speaker 1: a mission to put a million people to work each year.

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Speaker 1: Sounds like a big number, doesn't it not to Express

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Speaker 1: Employment Professionals seeking a skilled labor position or administrative work.

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Speaker 1: Maybe you're an executive looking for a career that fits supporting.

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Speaker 1: We take pride in connecting the right people with the

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Speaker 1: right company. Express Employment Professionals is on a mission to

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Speaker 1: put a million people to work each year. Let us help.

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Speaker 1: We'll open doors for you to go to express pros

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Speaker 1: dot com to find a location near you. And back

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Speaker 1: to Rabbi J. Shupack story of finding meaningful work. When

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Speaker 1: we last heard from him, he was selling life insurance

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Speaker 1: to support his young family. My dad sold life insurance

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Speaker 1: for ten years. At some point during that time he

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Speaker 1: started to fill a poll back to Judaism, the religion

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Speaker 1: of his childhood. I was twenty eight and it was

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Speaker 1: Jung Kipoor and I hadn't been to services maybe in

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Speaker 1: a decade, and I wanted to go to services. Yum

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Speaker 1: Kipoor is one of the most important Jewish holidays. If

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Speaker 1: you're Jewish and not religious, but want to do something,

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Speaker 1: you'll probably go to services on Yom Kipor. Some synagogues

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Speaker 1: even have these removable walls that they open just so

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Speaker 1: they can fit all the people that only come once

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Speaker 1: a year. And Ela is the name of the service

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Speaker 1: that concludes Yum Kipor after a full day of fasting

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Speaker 1: and prayer. It's the final hour of the holiest day

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Speaker 1: on the Jewish calendar. I went from the Eli went

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Speaker 1: for the last hour of film Keyport, the most holy

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Speaker 1: hour of the year, the most powerful hour of the year,

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Speaker 1: and I had a very strong experience. I really felt

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Speaker 1: a connection to God. I felt communicated with In other words,

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Speaker 1: a lot of times you pray, or at least in

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Speaker 1: the tradition, you pray, which means you're sort of talking

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Speaker 1: to God, and that's a one way conversation. That's that's

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Speaker 1: a monologue. And you don't know if you've heard. You

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Speaker 1: don't know what it means, you don't know if there's

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Speaker 1: any connection. You don't know anything. But on that day

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Speaker 1: I felt that I I asked and I got an answer,

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Speaker 1: and I said, you know, God, this is what I

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Speaker 1: need in my life, and I felt I got an answer.

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Speaker 1: Pretty Soon, our whole family was going to services every week,

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Speaker 1: and pretty soon the rabbi there was asking you to

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Speaker 1: take part in the service. After all, he knew how

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Speaker 1: to read Hebrew and had a great singing voice. Even

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Speaker 1: though it had been ten years since he'd been to

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Speaker 1: a service, he still remembered all the songs and prayers.

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Speaker 1: Eventually he became what's called a cantor, someone who leads

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Speaker 1: the prayer and song. Meanwhile, he continued to sell life insurance,

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Speaker 1: then got into some other business ventures. Many years passed

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Speaker 1: and one day he was asked to lead a service

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Speaker 1: at a Jewish retirement home and I let it. And

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Speaker 1: then I did another one and another one, and I realized,

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Speaker 1: oh that this is what I want to do. I

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Speaker 1: really like to do this. I don't want to be

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Speaker 1: a cantor so much, which is just someone who sings.

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Speaker 1: Turned to page sixty four. The cantor will now sing law.

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Speaker 1: You know, I didn't want to do that. I wanted

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Speaker 1: to I like being the rabbit. I decided what was

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Speaker 1: in the service, what wasn't in the service, the pace

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Speaker 1: of the service, the jokes, the whole thing, the style,

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Speaker 1: and I wanted to do that. And before then it

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Speaker 1: was just whatever was convenient, whatever worked, whatever I can

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Speaker 1: make a buck at. It didn't matter to me. I'd

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Speaker 1: sell flowers, I'd sell shoes, I'd cleaned pots and pans,

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Speaker 1: i would sell life insurance. I didn't have any passion

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Speaker 1: about any of it, really. But then the rabbi thing

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Speaker 1: was different because it was like, oh, this is what

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Speaker 1: I want to do, this is who I want to be.

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Speaker 1: Because of all of the Jewish education of his childhood,

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Speaker 1: he was able to get into this sort of fast

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Speaker 1: track rabbinical program, and in a few years he was ordained.

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Speaker 1: He started looking for a small town that needed a rabbi,

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Speaker 1: and one of those places was Bend, Oregon. When your

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Speaker 1: dad first showed up the first time, when he interviewed

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Speaker 1: with us, This is Alice Husky. She was part of

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Speaker 1: the synagogue and bend Ah. He and your mom came

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Speaker 1: up and they had a thing that they did at

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Speaker 1: the Sunday school, and so your mom and dad were

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Speaker 1: in my classroom doing a puppet show. It's true. My

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Speaker 1: mom is known to do puppet shows. And I was like,

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Speaker 1: who are these people with puppets? And then I realized,

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Speaker 1: Oh my god, people are fun. This is not the

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Speaker 1: normal rabbi kind of guy you're expecting. I've been Jewish

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Speaker 1: my whole life. When I became about Mitz for the

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Speaker 1: rabbi was this lofty person who you went into his

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Speaker 1: office and you sat across the big desk, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: there was not a whole lot of warmth and connection.

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Speaker 1: Rabbi j he is. He is really truly a good

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Speaker 1: leader in that respect that he's He's a person and

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Speaker 1: a rabbi. I have many rabbis that I loved, but

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Speaker 1: Jay's my rabbi. He took that job eighteen years ago

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Speaker 1: and has been there ever since. What I really like

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Speaker 1: to do is to engage people in song and in

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Speaker 1: prayer and and and a little talk and to and

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Speaker 1: to give people an experience that if I'm really lucky

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Speaker 1: they get to experience what I experienced when I was

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Speaker 1: twenty eight on young poor. And I'm not even sure

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Speaker 1: if the people that come even of any idea that's

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Speaker 1: what they're supposed to get. Some people go just because

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Speaker 1: their father went, or their mother winter, because their friend

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Speaker 1: is there or something else. But I go because I

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Speaker 1: want to create the environment, create the space for people

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Speaker 1: to get what I got so many years ago. And

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Speaker 1: sometimes I succeed at it and sometimes I don't. What

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Speaker 1: Jay has definitely succeeded at is creating a welcoming synagogue

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Speaker 1: without any of the things that drove him away from religion,

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Speaker 1: which repeat flat on the floor from the reach and

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Speaker 1: allow yourself to feel safe. I had memories of that.

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Speaker 1: The rabbis were all about restriction. They were all about boundaries, narrowness,

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Speaker 1: all that stuff that I didn't like. And some things

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Speaker 1: this week we gots on and some things we didn't

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Speaker 1: get time, and we forgive ourselves for what we didn't

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Speaker 1: get done. I mean, we had a service yesterday and

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Speaker 1: we sang songs and we read from Torah and we

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Speaker 1: had a lot of joy. Yeah, and it didn't matter

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Speaker 1: how anybody was dressed Um, they were non Jews too.

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Speaker 1: I mean there's Christians that prey with us. There's non Jews.

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Speaker 1: There's people that aren't sure what they are. They're kind

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Speaker 1: of becoming Jews, they're not sure, they're you know, very

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Speaker 1: interesting people. We have a wonderful cross section. Um, it's joyful,

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Speaker 1: it's humble, it's as they say in Yiddish, it's hamish,

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Speaker 1: it's warm, it's modest, it's not demanding. It's all the

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Speaker 1: things that were not there when I was a boy.

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Speaker 1: And in a certain way, it all connects back to

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Speaker 1: the first time he tried on the role of being

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Speaker 1: a rabbi on stage, and it's high school musical. I

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Speaker 1: see the rabbi work as theater. It's a one man show.

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Speaker 1: There's blocking, there's stagecraft, there's props, and there's a script.

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Speaker 1: I mean the script is the seedor the script is

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Speaker 1: the prayer book, creating the theater of communicating with God.

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Speaker 1: And there's a lot of rigamar role. I mean we

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Speaker 1: we we take the tour out, we make a pronouncement

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Speaker 1: and we do a march with the Torah, and there's

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Speaker 1: a certain rhythm and a style about it. And the

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Speaker 1: same thing with when you read from the chart has

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Speaker 1: a certain melody. So so actually it's not just theater,

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Speaker 1: it's actually musical theater. It's it's a musical every time.

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Speaker 1: Did you know that my dad, after high school was

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Speaker 1: going to be an actor. This is Alice Husky Again.

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Speaker 1: That probably doesn't surprise you at all, not at all.

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Speaker 1: Most most rabbis and teachers are frustrated performers. They have

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Speaker 1: a captive audience who have to put up with whatever

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Speaker 1: they do. So I'm pretty sure that's part for the course. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and he could be a terrific actor. I think he

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Speaker 1: did play in Fit around the Roof at some point.

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Speaker 1: You know what his part was, the rabbi? It was

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Speaker 1: it was typecasting or foreshadowing of things to come, I believe. Yeah. So,

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Speaker 1: after all the years and different jobs and businesses, in

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Speaker 1: a certain way, my dad did end up on stage

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Speaker 1: with the only role he'd ever had. But instead of

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Speaker 1: playing the rabbi, he lives it. I've watched people grow up,

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Speaker 1: I've watched people grow old. I've I've buried people's parents,

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Speaker 1: I've aremits for their sons. So there's a lot of

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Speaker 1: deep connection and we get to share and we get

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Speaker 1: to enjoy each other's lives, or you know, we get

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Speaker 1: to cheer and laugh about our successes, and we get

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Speaker 1: to cry and and console each other about our losses

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Speaker 1: and our sadness. So it's very rich. It's a very

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Speaker 1: rich life. Walking is the single best thing you can

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Speaker 1: do for yourself. Three miles four miles a day cuts

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Speaker 1: your mortality in half. Here what turned right? And we're

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Speaker 1: back to where we started walking in the park behind

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Speaker 1: my parents house. And then I read another thing where

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Speaker 1: if you take fifty a fiber a day that cuts mortality.

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Speaker 1: I think it sounds like you're going to live forever

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Speaker 1: if you do well, that's what I'm saying. You're stuck

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Speaker 1: with me for a long time. The place where my

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Speaker 1: dad spends over an hour a day on a meand

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Speaker 1: ring paths that always leads him home. This is where

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Speaker 1: I always say a blessing. Right here, Look at it,

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Speaker 1: Isn't it gorgeous? See that bird just landing there in

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Speaker 1: the tree And the sun's going down. The sun's down already,

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Speaker 1: but there's light in the western sky, and the trees

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Speaker 1: are just you can't even tell they're green anymore, all

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Speaker 1: the colors out of him. It's just so beautiful and

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Speaker 1: I always say a blessing here a show of selling

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Speaker 1: a niflat the one who makes for us wonders. And

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Speaker 1: then I opened my arms wide. I just embraced the

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Speaker 1: whole thing. I just love it so much. I'm so blessed.

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Speaker 1: You've been listening to independent producer Joel Schupack presenting Mozeltov

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Speaker 1: stories from a late in life rabbi. And that's all

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Speaker 1: for this edition of On the Job from Express Employment Professionals.

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Speaker 1: Find out more at Express prose dot com, and you

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00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:10,919
Speaker 1: can listen to every podcast this season at Express prose

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Speaker 1: dot com slash podcast. This podcast is produced by your host,

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Speaker 1: Steve Mencher for Men's Media, I Heart Radio and Red

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Speaker 1: Seat Ventures. You can subscribe on iHeart Radio and iTunes,

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00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 1: where we hope you'll leave a nice review that helps

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00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:28,960
Speaker 1: other folks find us. And of course you can listen

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Speaker 1: and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts. See you next

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Speaker 1: time On the Job