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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg Markets Podcast. I'm Paul Sweeney, alongside

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Speaker 1: my co host Matt Miller. Every business day we bring

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Speaker 1: you interviews from CEOs, market crows, and Bloomberg experts, along

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Speaker 1: with essential market moving news. Find the Bloomberg Markets Podcast

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Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts, and

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Speaker 1: at Bloomberg dot com slash podcast. All right, let's get

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Speaker 1: to our Big Take story today talks about commodities. And

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Speaker 1: you put up the g l c O screen on

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Speaker 1: the Bloomberg Terminolts of Global Commodities page and there's just

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Speaker 1: a lot of green on their commodities on a year.

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Speaker 1: Today basis up a big time. Not just oil, We're

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Speaker 1: talking all kinds of commodities. Megan Derris and Albury, agricultural

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Speaker 1: reporter for Bloomberg News, joins us with a big take

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Speaker 1: story today talking about the global market for grain, corn

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Speaker 1: and other commodities amid the Ukraine war. Boy, it seems

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Speaker 1: like the Ukraine situation is really exacerbating what had already

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Speaker 1: been kind of a commodity inflation story. What do you have, Megan, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's right. Um, So, you know, ever since freshest attack

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Speaker 1: began on Ukraine, it supports have been effectively shut. UM.

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Speaker 1: That's where most of its grain would exit, loaded on

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Speaker 1: big targo ships headed for Asia, Europe and elsewhere. UM. Now,

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Speaker 1: as the top of our story shows, you know, they

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Speaker 1: they've resorted to transporting some of those crops out by rail.

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Speaker 1: So it's kind of you know, carving routes that we

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Speaker 1: haven't seen in the past. UM. But granted that's you know,

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Speaker 1: pretty slow going, it's expensive, the volumes are much lower

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Speaker 1: than normal, and even at the border with the EU. UM.

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Speaker 1: You know, the train trucks are different sizes, so between

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Speaker 1: Ukraine and Romania, for example, So it causes a lot

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Speaker 1: of um challenges for exporters. How fungible is wheat? UM?

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Speaker 1: I mean we I assume farm more than enough wheat

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Speaker 1: and corn in this country, UM, not to have to

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Speaker 1: worry about any kind of imports from Ukraine halfway across

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Speaker 1: across the world. UM. How come we're seeing huge jumps

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Speaker 1: here for wheat as well. Yeah, so that would be

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Speaker 1: true for the U S certainly. You know they're they're

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Speaker 1: pretty self sufficient in grains. UM. But you know, these

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Speaker 1: really are our global markets and a country UM like

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Speaker 1: the U S or UM like the U EU are

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Speaker 1: you know exporters So um, if if Ukraine is effectively

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Speaker 1: gone or mostly gone from the world markets, um, there's

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Speaker 1: going to need to be alternative origins stepping up. Um.

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Speaker 1: As our story shows, you know, we're already seeing some

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Speaker 1: non traditional players enter the fray as well. UM. For example, India,

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Speaker 1: which typically isn't a very big wheat exporter at all,

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Speaker 1: is now selling record volumes all across Asia. Um. Their

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Speaker 1: their prices are usually uh, kind of too high, their

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Speaker 1: their government set prices. But now that the global market

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Speaker 1: has rallied so much, they've become competitive and are joining

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Speaker 1: the fray. To what can the American farmer do? Well?

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Speaker 1: What are we seeing from the American and farmer? They

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Speaker 1: changing the way they operate these days? Are they planning differently?

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Speaker 1: Are they stepping up production? What are we seeing there?

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Speaker 1: And by the way, Megan, she's a sparty Yes, I know.

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Speaker 1: So she's from the Great Midwest. And I mean, you know,

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Speaker 1: is there an American farmer? Ohio is the gateway to

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Speaker 1: the West, think the heart of it all? Is there

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Speaker 1: an American farmer? Or is it just like large corporations? Oh,

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Speaker 1: there's there's certainly an American farm or two. And just

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Speaker 1: to just to clarify, I from Michigan from wild I'm

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Speaker 1: from the great State of Okay. Great, but I appreciate

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Speaker 1: you as a Sparta because we both hate you have

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Speaker 1: m that's true U. So, um, yes, there certainly is,

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Speaker 1: you know, American farmers. And the one challenge with wheat is,

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Speaker 1: you know, um, pretty much in across the northern hemisphere.

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Speaker 1: So here in Europe where I am, and also in

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Speaker 1: the US, most of the wheat is sewn in autumn.

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Speaker 1: Um they plant it, it goes dormant for the winter

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Speaker 1: and starts growing again in the spring. So there's not

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Speaker 1: too much of a chance to really boost wheat plantings

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Speaker 1: at this stage. UM. Besides in the southern hemisphere, UM,

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Speaker 1: but in the U s as well. You know, one

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Speaker 1: of the challenges is input costs are really high. Costs

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Speaker 1: for fertilizer have been rising. We saw a usc A

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Speaker 1: plantings report last week that showed UM, US farmers are

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Speaker 1: actually going to cut back on corn plantings in favor

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Speaker 1: of of soybeans. UM. And the extent was kind of

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Speaker 1: a surprise to the market and has has kept grain

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Speaker 1: prices supported here going forward. So uh, you know there

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Speaker 1: there is rising crop prices, but farmers are facing challenges

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Speaker 1: on the input side as well. So what is the

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Speaker 1: expectation the market megan about any output from Ukraine? Is it?

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Speaker 1: Are we assuming zero? Are we assuming kind of how

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Speaker 1: we're thinking about that? Um, you know, analysts rangers are

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Speaker 1: are pretty wide at this point. Uh, it's unlikely to

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Speaker 1: be zero. You know. For example, UM, the CEO of

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Speaker 1: Colonel was on bloom TV earlier today. He was expecting

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Speaker 1: that Ukraine would produce something like a maximum of sixty

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Speaker 1: million tons of grains and oils this year. But that

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Speaker 1: compares to a record over a hundred million tons last year.

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Speaker 1: So it is a significant cutback. But the supply you know,

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Speaker 1: could still be there. Um, the challenges you know that

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Speaker 1: there's still obviously, uh, a lot of difficulties. I mean

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Speaker 1: that the country is at war, there's um challenges securing diesel,

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Speaker 1: um fertilizer, you know, with with occupied land and UM.

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Speaker 1: Even depending on what they can harvest this season, the

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Speaker 1: challenge will still be what can they export? Um. You know,

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Speaker 1: Ukraine and in Russian wheat exports typically accelerate in the

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Speaker 1: middle of the year when the next wheat harvest come

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Speaker 1: in um if they can't do that as usual, that's

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Speaker 1: as our stories had from one analyst, that's kind of

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Speaker 1: when the world's wheat shortfalls could come more into focus. Alright, Megan,

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Speaker 1: really good stuff. We appreciate that. Megan Derison Albury, agricultural

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Speaker 1: purporter for Bloomberg News. The Big Take story talking about

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Speaker 1: the global market for grain, corns and other commodities amid

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Speaker 1: the Ukraine wore a big, big issue. You can read

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Speaker 1: more Bloomberg Big Take stories at Bloomberg dot com slash

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Speaker 1: Big Take or on the terminal and I Big Take go.

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Speaker 1: All right, let's talk about this market here. If you've

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Speaker 1: got some fresh money, what are you doing today? Yes,

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Speaker 1: a shot, I'll carry equity. Analyst of Brutuman Asset Management

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Speaker 1: joins us. Actually, thanks so much for taking the time here.

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Speaker 1: If I got some fresh equity, maybe I got a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a stimmy check that I haven't spent.

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Speaker 1: Where do I put it in the market? Thank you

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Speaker 1: guys for having me on. I mean definitely, you know,

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Speaker 1: we still recommend putting your money in the equity markets,

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Speaker 1: and for us, your long term investors, we're looking at,

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Speaker 1: you know, if there's a sell off you want to

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Speaker 1: look for high quality names, and you know, and those

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Speaker 1: kind of names that have high earning visibility and strong

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Speaker 1: underlying secular growth and a lot of uncertain times, be

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Speaker 1: like opportunities and healthcare especially like those ones that have

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Speaker 1: really strong underlying secular growth in women's help, so an

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Speaker 1: organ On which is a pharmaceutical company that was found

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Speaker 1: off on Mark or pro Jenny which is a fertility

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Speaker 1: benefits manager, and as well as managed healthcare which is

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Speaker 1: United Healthcare that has a large scale and a lot

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Speaker 1: of population involvements into their medical advantage. Pray, can I

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Speaker 1: ask you about the midterm elections? Phil Orlando yesterday from

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Speaker 1: Federated Hermy was just telling us that you know, they

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Speaker 1: expect a good for the Market's not not a political commentary,

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Speaker 1: but a good outcome from the midterm elections in that

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Speaker 1: we won't see much Um. Uh, well, we'll see the

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Speaker 1: government set up so that they can't really do anything.

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Speaker 1: Gridlock is good, um, although maybe it's bad for society.

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Speaker 1: But uh is that does that play into it? All? Um?

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Speaker 1: Your picks? Because it strikes me that depending on the outcome,

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Speaker 1: you could have a very different um expectation for managed

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Speaker 1: healthcare I mean for us just like the population dynamics too.

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Speaker 1: You know, more and more people are getting older. You're

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Speaker 1: looking at more people moving into the sixty five plus

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Speaker 1: buckets UM and those people are going to be starting

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Speaker 1: to the eligible for their Medicare, Medicaid programs and all

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Speaker 1: those different features. So managed healthcare in general we see

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Speaker 1: a pickup on that end of you know, the the

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Speaker 1: hired spending for senior sixty five plus UM as they

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Speaker 1: started to get enrolled into these programs. UM that that

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Speaker 1: top line growth is going to pick up for managed

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Speaker 1: healthcare companies, and specifically large ones like Healthcare has that scale,

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Speaker 1: especially with a ship towards value based care to really

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Speaker 1: take advantage of the large scale that it has to

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Speaker 1: reduce this cost over a large number of people that

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Speaker 1: are coming into into the even rollness overall, we've got

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Speaker 1: earnings coming up. How much does corporate American need to

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Speaker 1: really deliver on the earnings front? What are you gonna

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Speaker 1: pay pay attention to? I mean, yes, do you want earning?

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Speaker 1: Summing up? You know, companies are able to maintain that

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Speaker 1: growth and their hard margins are really going to be

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Speaker 1: more in focus. You know, current effacts that Q one

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Speaker 1: twenty two estimated earnings growths around four point seven percent.

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Speaker 1: And but what we've seen is like, if you know

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Speaker 1: those are the you know, we're looking at the similar factors,

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Speaker 1: are they able to maintain um you know, their their

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Speaker 1: growth and their margins in general. And we've seen that

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Speaker 1: earning estimates really have been quite resilient despite a number

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Speaker 1: of astro headwinds that we've seen and based recently. Is

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Speaker 1: there a huge number of them, the inflation and geo

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Speaker 1: political risks and whatnot. But earning estimates combined with dividingde

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Speaker 1: of the stocks by plants, do uh doing a lot

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Speaker 1: of room for positive returns even if there's some level

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Speaker 1: of multiple contractions due to some risks here. UM So

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Speaker 1: for us, our long term view on the SMP five

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Speaker 1: hundreds remain strong with above average return potential and we

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Speaker 1: see through what do you think about the big tech companies,

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Speaker 1: the mega cap tech companies so widely held these days.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you know, we've seen here some

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Speaker 1: talking about procession risks coming up with inverdi via cars.

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Speaker 1: Tech is an interesting place to be in UM your

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Speaker 1: large connegict cap companies, you know, especially ones with a

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Speaker 1: lot of subscription related growth that has that shows that

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Speaker 1: has has some much more visibility. UM like Adobe, for example,

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Speaker 1: intends to have these recurrent revity model that offers that

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Speaker 1: more top line visibility and it makes it easier to

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Speaker 1: trag growth. UM. So that's in Adobe and companies like

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Speaker 1: Amazon have that kind of feature and it's easier to see.

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Speaker 1: So those are still attractive names that we feel so shoddy.

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Speaker 1: We've got w T I cod oil still over hundred

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Speaker 1: dollars about a hundred three dollars, and it's had such

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Speaker 1: a great move. Has the energy play played out eighty again?

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Speaker 1: But it's hard to say, um, you know we have

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Speaker 1: there's verisic high of altility and sharply high you know,

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Speaker 1: higher oil prices. Uh, you know, going into more arms

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Speaker 1: their environment. Energy is probably a difficult sector to be

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Speaker 1: in UM with the level of all totally underlying it. UM.

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Speaker 1: That said, again, it's it's hard to say was exactly

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Speaker 1: gonna be driving it down immediately? But you know, we

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Speaker 1: have seen the fact that you know, these are star

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Speaker 1: part ll prices, you know, but you are continuing to

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Speaker 1: ride and the fact is tightening overall. So what we

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Speaker 1: expect is eventually I supply, you know, supply demand. If

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Speaker 1: you kind of eat up a little bit um that

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Speaker 1: should come back down. Actual, thanks so much for joining

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Speaker 1: us a shadow bell carry their equity analyst at Brewderman

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Speaker 1: Asset Management. Right now, I want to get over to

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Speaker 1: I feel like we're connected in some way. I think

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Speaker 1: so Matt Kramer, um from the National the National Security Leader,

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Speaker 1: Consumer and Retail and advisory partner at KPMG, must be

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Speaker 1: from the great at of Ohio, you know, I mean, Matt,

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Speaker 1: I'm just looking through not only do we have the

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Speaker 1: same first name, but um, I'm just looking through all

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Speaker 1: of your experience and a lot of it centers around

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Speaker 1: the heart of it all after you graduated from uh

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Speaker 1: Miami of Ohio. You have done so much charity work

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Speaker 1: there And I just one question, what is the Furniture

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Speaker 1: Bank of Central Ohio. Yeah it's uh it's no longer

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Speaker 1: a flyover state Ohio is here to stay. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: I um, I was on the board at the Furniture Bank,

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Speaker 1: um and many years and and uh great nonprofit organization

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Speaker 1: that serves people that are in need of furniture. And

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Speaker 1: then also currently at a Big Brothers Big Sisters. So

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Speaker 1: love connecting in the community. So men doing a lot

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Speaker 1: of mentoring then, um, which is which is great? I

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Speaker 1: think that kind of hands on charity work is so rewarding.

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Speaker 1: And a furniture bank, I guess then is like a

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Speaker 1: food bank. So edge a thought. Because you're in finance

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Speaker 1: and you were at the furniture bank, I thought maybe

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Speaker 1: it was like some sort of financial institution. But it's actually,

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Speaker 1: UM doing good. That's fantastic. UM. And you're from Ohio.

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Speaker 1: You must be from Ohio. Absolutely from Ohio. Alright, there's two.

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Speaker 1: It is the Ohio State University. I don't still don't

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Speaker 1: get it. I don't understand that. All right, So mat

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Speaker 1: talk to us about the metaverse? What is it to you?

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Speaker 1: Just described to our listeners what the metaverse means to

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Speaker 1: you and maybe maybe some of the clients that you

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Speaker 1: deal with. Yeah, it's it's amazing. You know. In my sector,

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Speaker 1: consumer and retail, everybody thought I heard you mentioned omni

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Speaker 1: early being omnipresent, but the omni channel they thought was maximizing,

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Speaker 1: you know, the digital and online mobile channels. But now

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Speaker 1: we've got this whole new um stratosphere, Web three, dot

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Speaker 1: O metaverse. UM, it's actually very exciting. For you know,

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Speaker 1: Brandon marketing enthusiasts, and in this sector creates a whole

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Speaker 1: new opportunity to express your brand. I think for consumers, UM,

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Speaker 1: you actually don't have to be yourself in the metaverse.

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Speaker 1: You can be your alter ego, you can be whoever

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Speaker 1: you want to be. So I think actually it's it's

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Speaker 1: pretty exciting, very broad based, and what companies are trying

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Speaker 1: to figure out now is just how do I engage?

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Speaker 1: But clearly from our survey we surveted thousand consumers, we

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Speaker 1: think that's extremely relevant, is UM. What you're finding is

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Speaker 1: the future generations are most passionate about engaging in the metaverse.

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Speaker 1: We found that of generations UM, gen y and millennials

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Speaker 1: are are very familiar in the mid eight UM and

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Speaker 1: certainly also the people that are that are engaging in

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Speaker 1: the metaverse. Also found that being friends UM in the

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Speaker 1: metaverse is about half of the people thought it was

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Speaker 1: just as good as in person, which kind of shocked me.

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Speaker 1: So we're getting some data that's telling us that this

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Speaker 1: this is probably going to be on a hockey stick.

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Speaker 1: I totally get it. You know, as someone who's played

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Speaker 1: grown up playing video games UM and well, so I

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Speaker 1: moved at a very young age to Berlin, and I

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Speaker 1: had friends who from Ohio who had moved to d

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Speaker 1: C and some who were in Paris. And at the time,

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Speaker 1: the Xbox was a new thing and we couldn't afford

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Speaker 1: to call each other on the phone all the time.

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Speaker 1: So what we did was we all got xboxes and

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Speaker 1: we could play Halo and and talk to each other

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Speaker 1: at the same time. That was my first, I think

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Speaker 1: kind of metaverse experience. But now everybody or many people

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Speaker 1: have a metaverse experience in that you work from home

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Speaker 1: and you live in kind of zoom or next Year

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Speaker 1: or whatever it is. Can we have a broader definition

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Speaker 1: of the metaverse doesn't have to be this kind of

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Speaker 1: thing where you put on VR goggles and you um

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Speaker 1: go and play some fantasy game with wizards and goblins, right, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and that's it's it is the entry point now, I

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Speaker 1: um you know, people are certainly entering through gaming and

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Speaker 1: through movies. UM. I was talking to a CFO the

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Speaker 1: other day and he was it was a wake up

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Speaker 1: call for him when his um college aged son was

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Speaker 1: home and he was spending almost daily time with his

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Speaker 1: roommate who had lived in Chicago and felt like they

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Speaker 1: never left college together. They were engaging on a daily basis.

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Speaker 1: But I also think the categories that are going to

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Speaker 1: start to emerge beyond gaming and movies are really telling

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Speaker 1: in our survey. The next three we're education, fitness, and events.

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Speaker 1: So when you think of training and developing talent through

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Speaker 1: UM using you know, a r VR devices, that's the

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Speaker 1: current mechanism. I don't think that's always going to be

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Speaker 1: the mechanism. Also, just building health and wellness into your culture.

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Speaker 1: I've frequently talked to people who are engaging in the

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Speaker 1: metaversity of fitness, bike riding, and other activities UM. And

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Speaker 1: then employees gathering, you know, company wide meetings UM, certainly

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Speaker 1: heart metal meetings. Does it have to be flying across

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Speaker 1: the country and meeting UH and incurring a lot of

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Speaker 1: costs to do that or can it be as effective

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Speaker 1: to meet in the metaverse? All right, Matt, thanks so

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Speaker 1: much for joining us giving us some thoughts there as

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Speaker 1: people try to get forgere out what the metaverse is,

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Speaker 1: what it means for them and maybe their businesses their

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Speaker 1: day to day. Do you exercise in the metaverse? Right?

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Speaker 1: I don't know your friends with that famous trainer who

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Speaker 1: shows you how to rid your bike every day. When

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Speaker 1: Sherman gen Sherman there, you are absolutely a big fan,

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Speaker 1: all right. Mack Cramer, National sector leader for Consumer and

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Speaker 1: Retailing as advisory partner partner KPMG, talking to his clients

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Speaker 1: and advising his clients on in the consumer space, in

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Speaker 1: the retail space, how to kind of try to adapt

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Speaker 1: the metaverse UH for their businesses. I'm not sure I

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Speaker 1: necessarily get it, but I agree with Matt that it

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Speaker 1: is what a lot of future generations are looking at.

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Speaker 1: Wendy Thomas, CEO and president of Secure Works, that's a

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Speaker 1: NAZAC tradd stock the tickers sc as in Charlie w X.

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Speaker 1: Wendy joins us. Wendy, give us, just give us your

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Speaker 1: threat assessment, if you will. Kind of the cybersecurity landscape

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Speaker 1: that we live in now, it seems like we haven't

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Speaker 1: had any major breach recently. What's going on absolutely, And

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Speaker 1: you're right, Russia has definitely been more constrained than anticipated,

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Speaker 1: and we haven't seen the kind of widespread, really disruptive

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Speaker 1: attacks outside of Ukraine. And I think we all either

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Speaker 1: expected or feared. Yet what we what we saw was

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Speaker 1: in the days kind of leading up to the physical

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Speaker 1: military invasion. We did definitely see what we call wiper

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Speaker 1: type malware deployed in Ukraine, so so think of malware

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Speaker 1: that wipees data for fast damage versus trying to hold

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Speaker 1: it hostage for a ransom. But none of that malware

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Speaker 1: was particularly sophisticated. Much of it was ployed against a

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Speaker 1: pretty small targeted set of organizations in the Ukraine. UH.

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Speaker 1: And of course there's cyber attacks continue to be directed

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Speaker 1: at the Ukrainian government both UM, with various regional threat

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Speaker 1: groups conducting operations and even some international threat groups including

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Speaker 1: some suspected Chinese groups kind of taking an interest there.

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Speaker 1: But the other piece that we that we thought, if

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Speaker 1: you recall the Conti group, they're a large Russian ransomware

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Speaker 1: gang initially talked about, you know, posted early on that

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Speaker 1: they would seek retribution for sanctions that targeted Russia, but

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Speaker 1: even then, we haven't seen any notable rise in Russian

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Speaker 1: e crime activities in recent weeks. UM. In fact, that

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Speaker 1: Kanti group was disrupted UH pretty significantly when their own

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Speaker 1: chat servers and their malware source code was leaked. So

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Speaker 1: while they're not down and out, they keep posting a

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Speaker 1: list of victims to their name and shame leak site definitely,

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Speaker 1: uh put a put a damper on their activities. Well,

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Speaker 1: but you know, we're still at a point where a

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Speaker 1: lot of people think the war could get worse in

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Speaker 1: terms of the kind of artillery that Russia uses. Talk

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Speaker 1: of the possibility of tactical nukes is terrifying. Is it

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Speaker 1: the same? Is the same true in terms of cyber warfare?

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Speaker 1: Is it possible that Russia could pull out the big

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Speaker 1: guns when it really when Putin really feels cornered and

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Speaker 1: what would that look like? It is? It is absolutely

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Speaker 1: possible and something that frankly, we've been preparing for. And

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Speaker 1: I think that's why you see so many advisories from

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Speaker 1: the White House right now about advising organizations to be vigilant,

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Speaker 1: because while it's quiet right now, that could absolutely change rapidly,

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Speaker 1: and if you wait until it starts happening to be prepared,

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Speaker 1: it's it's obviously too late. Um. What we have seen

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Speaker 1: is that it could be that that the um the

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Speaker 1: focus right now around activism is really distracting from the

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Speaker 1: sort of US based companies. We certainly have seen a

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Speaker 1: lot of conversation around retaliation attacks potentially focusing on businesses

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Speaker 1: in the US that you know or or NATO affiliated

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Speaker 1: UM country organizations uk US that have either withdrawn from

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Speaker 1: Russia or frankly from activists that have not withdrawn from Russia,

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Speaker 1: and so the the the concern there is not just

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Speaker 1: those organizations, but all of their ecosystem partners, their suppliers

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Speaker 1: that that can access their systems that that you're depending

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Speaker 1: on for your business to run. They can be an

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Speaker 1: easy attack vector for your organization as well. So as

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Speaker 1: as Russia starts to deploy more sophisticated potentially malware for

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Speaker 1: youth e criminal groups tend to pick those up quickly

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Speaker 1: in Russia and then use those for monetary gain against

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Speaker 1: businesses globally. What do you advise your clients to do

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Speaker 1: in terms of which they be how should they be

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Speaker 1: protecting themselves from a cyber perspective. Well, the good news

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Speaker 1: is if you're already pursuing defenses against cyber attacks like

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Speaker 1: ransomware and I we definitely saw a lift in UH

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Speaker 1: business and activity after the Colonial pipeline incident, which just

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Speaker 1: raised awareness again, you're already hardening your infrastructure around the

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Speaker 1: same kind of nation state tradecraft that could fall out

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Speaker 1: from any Russian government cyber actions. So there's a few

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Speaker 1: things that that we um talked to boards and executives

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Speaker 1: about quite a bit um. That is being brilliant at

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Speaker 1: the basics, because the reality is that that the criminals

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Speaker 1: who you is nation state tradecraft. It is all about

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Speaker 1: monetary reward. So if we don't protect ourselves, we keep

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Speaker 1: the cycle going Cryme pays, and it just fuels these

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Speaker 1: cyberganttings to continue the attacks. So we talk about being

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Speaker 1: brilliant at the basics really cross three things. And the

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Speaker 1: first one is really prioritizing the patches on any of

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Speaker 1: your externally facing systems and implementing multi factor authentications, kind

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Speaker 1: of like the doctor tells you to exercise and eat

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Speaker 1: your vegetables. Absolutely need to make sure that that your

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Speaker 1: exposed systems are patched for vulnerabilities. Yeah. The second one,

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Speaker 1: which well, I was just gonna say, people around here

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Speaker 1: talk so much about how much bitcoin has stolen, and somebody,

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Speaker 1: you know, how the story seem like, oh, man, two

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Speaker 1: billion dollars in bitcoin has been stolen, But then I

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Speaker 1: thought she has six hundred billion dollars is stolen from

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Speaker 1: US consumers and just fishing and identity theft attacks last year.

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Speaker 1: So um, you know, dollars to bitcoins is is a

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Speaker 1: much higher rate of death. Unfortunately, Wendy, that's all you

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Speaker 1: have time Force, so I gotta wrap it up, but

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Speaker 1: we'd love to have you back on so I hope

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Speaker 1: you can join us again. Wendy Thomas there, the CEO

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Speaker 1: and president of Secure Works. Thanks for listening to the

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Markets podcast. You can subscribe and listen to interviews

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Speaker 1: with Apple Podcasts or whatever podcast platform you prefer. I'm

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Speaker 1: Matt Miller. I'm on Twitter at Matt Miller three. On

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Speaker 1: Fall Sweeney, I'm on Twitter at pt Sweeney before the podcast.

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Speaker 1: You can always catch us worldwide at Bloomberg Radio