WEBVTT - Liz Lange 0:00:03.400 --> 0:00:07.040 I'm Sam Edis and I'm Amy Nelson. Welcome to What's 0:00:07.040 --> 0:00:09.640 Her Story? With Sam and Amy. This is a show 0:00:09.720 --> 0:00:15.440 about the world's most remarkable women, their professional and personal journeys. Together, 0:00:15.520 --> 0:00:19.239 we'll hear from gold medalists, best selling authors, and leaders 0:00:19.280 --> 0:00:22.919 of the world's most iconic brands. Listen every Thursday, or 0:00:23.000 --> 0:00:27.960 join the conversation anytime on Instagram at What's Her Story Podcast. 0:00:30.560 --> 0:00:33.600 Liz Lang is the founder of Liz Lang Maternity. She's 0:00:33.640 --> 0:00:36.560 widely credited with putting fashion maternity wear on the map. 0:00:37.040 --> 0:00:39.559 She is now the creative director and CEO of the 0:00:39.560 --> 0:00:43.200 fashion brand Big. Since two thousand two, Target has carried 0:00:43.240 --> 0:00:47.320 Liz Lang for Target, the retailer's soul offering in maternity apparel. 0:00:47.720 --> 0:00:50.920 She's also the star of the popular Sony podcast The 0:00:51.080 --> 0:00:58.279 Just Enough Family. I think most people can't imagine what 0:00:58.440 --> 0:01:01.920 it was like to grow up in one of the 0:01:02.000 --> 0:01:05.320 wealthiest families in the world. When you put it that way, 0:01:05.440 --> 0:01:08.640 it sounds like like it sounds like I just like 0:01:08.680 --> 0:01:11.400 I've been bragging. Thats up. I wanted to start by saying, 0:01:11.480 --> 0:01:14.880 spoiler alert, we lost the money, so like it's not 0:01:15.680 --> 0:01:18.920 like it's not it's because I just can't have people 0:01:18.920 --> 0:01:21.400 think that I'm just see around like yes, yes, Sam 0:01:21.440 --> 0:01:25.840 and Amy, it's incredible to me. This rich so but 0:01:26.000 --> 0:01:28.880 all right, but going back, so, you know, it was 0:01:29.280 --> 0:01:31.000 like I think that that the thing that you expected 0:01:31.040 --> 0:01:34.000 thing to say is like, oh, money, campering, happiness and 0:01:34.040 --> 0:01:36.080 money is hard. But you know, there were things about 0:01:36.120 --> 0:01:38.760 it that that were hard. You know that the public 0:01:38.800 --> 0:01:42.080 aspect of it was strange and hard, but there was 0:01:42.120 --> 0:01:44.640 a lot about it obviously that was really fun and 0:01:44.959 --> 0:01:46.720 really great. Like looking back on it, I feel like 0:01:46.800 --> 0:01:50.080 I was privy to a very wild ride that is 0:01:50.160 --> 0:01:54.560 unusual and that I look back on with fondness. You 0:01:54.600 --> 0:01:56.600 know that that like, it's a lot. I got to 0:01:56.640 --> 0:01:58.680 do a lot. I saw a lot of experience that 0:01:58.800 --> 0:02:01.720 you know, isn't tip of call, Well, give our listeners 0:02:01.880 --> 0:02:04.880 a day in the life, you know, just example of 0:02:04.920 --> 0:02:08.600 a Saturday in your childhood. So when I was growing up, 0:02:08.639 --> 0:02:10.360 one of my favorite things to do, and this was 0:02:10.400 --> 0:02:11.960 like getting into when I was a little older, like 0:02:12.000 --> 0:02:15.320 in high school, would be that my parents would typically 0:02:15.360 --> 0:02:19.120 my parents were big consumers and I love that about them, 0:02:19.200 --> 0:02:22.919 a k a. Shoppers shoppers, shoppers, and I have too, 0:02:23.080 --> 0:02:25.079 and I think that's what makes the economy go around. 0:02:25.080 --> 0:02:28.359 And I encourage, like I always encourage people, especially having 0:02:28.440 --> 0:02:30.960 been in retailer myself, Like I think that people that 0:02:31.040 --> 0:02:33.680 have the money to spend should spend it because that 0:02:33.760 --> 0:02:36.360 helps other people. Actually, I mean in addition to charity 0:02:36.360 --> 0:02:39.000 and all sorts of other stuff. So my I used 0:02:39.000 --> 0:02:41.080 to like to go with my parents, say would we 0:02:41.120 --> 0:02:43.000 lived very close to Madison Avenue. We lived on a 0:02:43.120 --> 0:02:46.360 seventy fifth and fifth, so we would walk down Madison Avenue. 0:02:46.400 --> 0:02:49.040 I walked down madisonal with my parents and we would 0:02:49.080 --> 0:02:52.680 basically stop and you know, most stores at the time, 0:02:52.680 --> 0:02:55.160 I mean this was you know, the eighties, so like 0:02:55.160 --> 0:02:57.359 our Money was a big store. So we would, you know, 0:02:57.400 --> 0:02:59.160 we would stop in our money and everywhere we went. 0:02:59.360 --> 0:03:02.200 This all sudden, so crazy, now what every and you know, 0:03:02.240 --> 0:03:04.880 the sales people, of course knew my parents, and so 0:03:04.919 --> 0:03:08.080 we have treated very well, whisp into back rooms like 0:03:08.080 --> 0:03:09.520 what can we show you? What can we show you? 0:03:09.600 --> 0:03:13.160 Like bringing in merchandise. And I think the funniest part 0:03:13.760 --> 0:03:16.200 is that the jewelery store was called Fred Layton and 0:03:16.240 --> 0:03:19.320 the owner himself is actually his name was Murray Munshine, 0:03:19.480 --> 0:03:21.760 but he had changed his name to Fred Layton, you know, 0:03:21.760 --> 0:03:24.440 because there's more glamorous name for the jewelry store then, 0:03:24.600 --> 0:03:27.000 but we uh right, but we still called him Murray 0:03:27.280 --> 0:03:29.400 and we would go there and it was small, and 0:03:29.440 --> 0:03:32.320 today people are very like people say to me like, oh, 0:03:32.360 --> 0:03:34.639 I'm so intimidated even to walk in there. But to me, 0:03:34.720 --> 0:03:36.840 that was just a place where we would stop in 0:03:37.320 --> 0:03:39.920 at around lunch time. We go to the back and 0:03:40.000 --> 0:03:44.240 often Murray would have you know, smoked salmon bagels like 0:03:44.240 --> 0:03:46.120 a lunch, kind of a lunch. So that would often 0:03:46.200 --> 0:03:50.000 be lunch at Fred Layton, which again like, of course, 0:03:50.040 --> 0:03:52.320 I mean, I'm so naive that I think everyone does it, 0:03:52.400 --> 0:03:55.840 but it didn't seem unusual to me at that time 0:03:56.000 --> 0:03:58.000 at all. We were close to Murray. It made a 0:03:58.000 --> 0:04:00.000 ton of sense and that was kind of the after 0:04:00.000 --> 0:04:01.960 to do and we walked around the shopped. To me, again, 0:04:02.040 --> 0:04:03.680 I think that my parents, if they're listening to this, 0:04:03.680 --> 0:04:05.800 because they've certainly said it to me offline, will be 0:04:05.840 --> 0:04:08.960 like we went to museums. We were cultural and they 0:04:09.040 --> 0:04:14.200 were they were like like, like a hundred percent were are. 0:04:14.920 --> 0:04:16.800 I'm just talking about the part that I liked. If 0:04:16.839 --> 0:04:18.600 they were going to a gallery, I wasn't really all 0:04:18.640 --> 0:04:20.920 that interested in joining, but if they wanted to walk 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:24.040 Madison Avenue and stop at fred Layton and Our Money 0:04:24.120 --> 0:04:27.280 and everywhere else Burg Doors, that was fun, so I 0:04:27.279 --> 0:04:29.200 would come along. So that was Saturday. What do you 0:04:29.240 --> 0:04:31.800 remember about the work about their company? Like? What do 0:04:31.839 --> 0:04:33.600 you remember about that as a child? I mean, I'll 0:04:33.600 --> 0:04:35.720 say a couple of things. One is and this like 0:04:35.839 --> 0:04:37.400 is that I always say, and I actually just said 0:04:37.400 --> 0:04:39.479 it to a group last night when people are always debating, 0:04:39.560 --> 0:04:42.159 like my family did nothing illegal, so that there's no 0:04:42.240 --> 0:04:45.640 comparison there at all. But I always say that when 0:04:45.680 --> 0:04:47.720 I heard like people always like, do you think Ruth 0:04:47.800 --> 0:04:49.560 made Off knew? You know? They always said do you 0:04:49.600 --> 0:04:51.680 think she knew? And I always say to people like, 0:04:51.839 --> 0:04:54.039 you don't understand how easy it is. I have no 0:04:54.080 --> 0:04:55.520 idea if she know what didn't know? And I don't 0:04:55.520 --> 0:04:58.000 know Ruth Madeoff or the Madeoffs, don't know them. But 0:04:58.240 --> 0:04:59.880 I always say, well, I know what it's like to 0:05:00.080 --> 0:05:02.000 like spend a lot of time like at a business 0:05:02.000 --> 0:05:04.080 and have it be your family business and actually have 0:05:04.160 --> 0:05:06.279 no idea really what they do. They're like, I could 0:05:06.360 --> 0:05:09.680 totally see that, Like if someone said, well, actually, no 0:05:09.960 --> 0:05:13.159 reliance group holdings was just like a Ponzi scheme. I'd 0:05:13.160 --> 0:05:16.279 be like, oh, I didn't know. Often as I got older, 0:05:16.360 --> 0:05:19.400 especially after I graduated from college, I was working at 0:05:19.480 --> 0:05:22.960 Vogue with The offices were nearby to my family's, uh 0:05:23.040 --> 0:05:25.160 my family business, you know where my dad and my 0:05:25.240 --> 0:05:27.320 uncle where their offices were. So I would often go 0:05:27.400 --> 0:05:29.800 there for lunch and it was fun. You know. They 0:05:29.839 --> 0:05:31.240 had a private dining room and then my dad my 0:05:31.320 --> 0:05:33.080 uncle had a private dining room with in the private 0:05:33.080 --> 0:05:35.760 dining room where I would sit with them and it 0:05:35.839 --> 0:05:38.080 was like, But I think what people are responding to 0:05:38.120 --> 0:05:40.200 about the podcast is there's a lot about it where 0:05:40.240 --> 0:05:42.480 the details are different, like just like like the way 0:05:42.600 --> 0:05:45.200 when we watch the Sopranos, like you know, the details 0:05:45.240 --> 0:05:47.400 were different. Um, I don't come from a mob family. 0:05:47.400 --> 0:05:49.200 But I was like, oh, I get it, like they've 0:05:49.240 --> 0:05:51.719 got to you know, Tony has issues with his business 0:05:51.720 --> 0:05:54.160 partner's issues with his wife. His children are giving him 0:05:54.160 --> 0:05:55.679 a hard time. It's kind of like in my family, 0:05:55.720 --> 0:05:56.960 the same thing. I would sit with my dad and 0:05:57.000 --> 0:05:58.800 my uncle and what would we talk about? They usually 0:05:58.800 --> 0:06:01.160 I was in my twenties. When you getting married, who 0:06:01.160 --> 0:06:03.080 are you dating. Can we introduce you to this one. 0:06:03.279 --> 0:06:05.520 It wasn't like we were sitting around talking about you know, 0:06:05.760 --> 0:06:08.080 money and business and power. It was really fun. It 0:06:08.120 --> 0:06:10.440 was very comfortable. It was there was something very mooring 0:06:10.480 --> 0:06:13.280 about it, like when I walked into those beautiful offices, 0:06:13.400 --> 0:06:15.880 I knew that you know, it felt I mean again 0:06:15.920 --> 0:06:18.680 ironic given the ending, but it felt very protected, like 0:06:19.080 --> 0:06:22.400 that my life was very very set and that things, 0:06:23.040 --> 0:06:25.360 you know, to a certain degree, a huge safety net 0:06:25.400 --> 0:06:27.200 that things just couldn't really go wrong. It was like 0:06:27.440 --> 0:06:31.440 teams of people that we're helping and there and worked 0:06:31.480 --> 0:06:34.800 for the family. It just it felt something kind of 0:06:34.880 --> 0:06:37.640 fun about it. Jonathan Adler, who is one of your 0:06:37.680 --> 0:06:42.039 dearest friends, the designer Jonathan Adler, had said, you know, 0:06:42.200 --> 0:06:45.120 Liz Steinberg was the last person you would ever expect 0:06:45.480 --> 0:06:47.800 to have a full time job, and basically it was 0:06:47.800 --> 0:06:50.719 like pf let alone an empire. Right, So how did 0:06:50.800 --> 0:06:57.720 you end up becoming this pioneer in the fashion maternity 0:06:57.720 --> 0:07:01.240 wear category? He's right, of course, I would say that 0:07:01.520 --> 0:07:04.520 I thought to myself that I was going to work 0:07:04.600 --> 0:07:08.920 like everyone else I knew, and then possibly get married. Hopefully. 0:07:09.000 --> 0:07:10.880 I was hoping to get married have children. I wasn't. 0:07:11.040 --> 0:07:13.400 I mean, this is so much has changed even since 0:07:13.480 --> 0:07:17.080 I graduated from college in nine to today. So you know, 0:07:17.120 --> 0:07:20.040 again just understand this for what the time period it was. 0:07:20.520 --> 0:07:22.920 It wasn't a dent a short thing that I thought 0:07:22.960 --> 0:07:24.520 I was going to work my whole life. I thought 0:07:24.600 --> 0:07:27.120 I might just raised my children, and you know, I 0:07:27.120 --> 0:07:28.680 don't know what else I would do. I hadn't really 0:07:28.680 --> 0:07:31.920 thought it out, but um lo and behold, I ended 0:07:32.040 --> 0:07:34.760 up like so many entrepreneurs, and I didn't know. I 0:07:34.920 --> 0:07:37.559 only know this looking back that after you know, working 0:07:37.560 --> 0:07:39.800 at Vogue and then working with the struggling young designer 0:07:39.920 --> 0:07:43.480 getting this idea to start a line of attorney clothing 0:07:43.520 --> 0:07:46.200 that looked more like regular maternity clothing, I had that 0:07:46.240 --> 0:07:49.280 thing that happens to entrepreneurs like I couldn't stop thinking 0:07:49.320 --> 0:07:52.480 about the idea of making maternity clothing. It was. It 0:07:52.520 --> 0:07:54.560 was crazy. I hadn't even had children at myself, although 0:07:54.560 --> 0:07:57.080 I was newly married and you know, getting pregnant was 0:07:57.120 --> 0:07:59.040 on my mind. But I felt like I was up 0:07:59.080 --> 0:08:01.360 at night thinking about it. I was obsessed with it, 0:08:01.480 --> 0:08:04.040 and I felt that if I didn't start this, like 0:08:04.080 --> 0:08:06.320 I wouldn't be able to forgive myself if somebody else 0:08:06.400 --> 0:08:09.960 did for some reason. So even then, though, even then, 0:08:10.040 --> 0:08:12.480 I started it without a business plan, without an idea 0:08:12.520 --> 0:08:14.680 that this is. Maybe I'm saying too much, but today 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:17.720 everyone's an entrepreneur. I mean, we're all entrepreneurs, right. Everybody 0:08:17.760 --> 0:08:21.840 sees white space, everyone's disrupting something, everyone's everyone's everything. I 0:08:21.840 --> 0:08:23.400 mean again, I don't want to offend either of you, 0:08:23.480 --> 0:08:25.720 but everyone's women power and what's it like to be 0:08:25.760 --> 0:08:28.480 a woman, and it's so hard. None of this crossed 0:08:28.520 --> 0:08:30.520 my mind. It wasn't whilom a woman, so I can't 0:08:30.520 --> 0:08:32.520 do this. It wasn't that I saw white space. No, 0:08:32.960 --> 0:08:34.480 I had this whole idea. I thought I would do 0:08:34.520 --> 0:08:36.240 it for a little while, see what happened. I didn't 0:08:36.240 --> 0:08:39.240 expect big things to happen. Lo and behold, it took 0:08:39.240 --> 0:08:43.360 off beyond my wildest expectations. And it's not crazy, I mean, 0:08:43.360 --> 0:08:45.080 as funny as it is. I mean, obviously I started 0:08:45.080 --> 0:08:47.640 to do something that was resonating, that was bringing me 0:08:47.840 --> 0:08:51.560 an enormous amount of I don't know, satisfaction. It was 0:08:51.600 --> 0:08:54.280 all of a sudden, like I had started something that 0:08:54.360 --> 0:08:57.440 was big and I loved it, and I became obsessed 0:08:57.440 --> 0:08:59.600 and I've worked around the clock and I've never really 0:08:59.600 --> 0:09:03.880 stopped loving that, Like it just bit me. What was 0:09:03.920 --> 0:09:07.240 the first step you took to start the business? Because 0:09:07.280 --> 0:09:10.480 I think even a lot of our listeners would say, well, okay, 0:09:10.480 --> 0:09:12.400 that's great that you just decided to start it, but 0:09:12.440 --> 0:09:14.559 what does that mean you rented space or what was 0:09:14.600 --> 0:09:16.720 the first move? All right, Well, it took a year 0:09:16.880 --> 0:09:18.640 from the time I thought the thought of the idea 0:09:18.679 --> 0:09:21.520 to start it, partially because I was so paralyzed with 0:09:21.600 --> 0:09:24.720 fear about starting it, and also again different times. So 0:09:24.760 --> 0:09:26.560 today I think the first step is you're right up 0:09:26.559 --> 0:09:28.880 a businessman. You go out and raise millions of dollars. No. 0:09:29.720 --> 0:09:32.280 I told my father that I wanted to do this, 0:09:32.840 --> 0:09:35.280 and he said, I will help you a little bit 0:09:35.280 --> 0:09:37.760 at the beginning, but it has to make money pretty 0:09:37.760 --> 0:09:39.599 because also my dad was a businessman, So it was like, 0:09:39.640 --> 0:09:41.680 so it has to make money pretty quickly, because it 0:09:41.679 --> 0:09:44.280 doesn't make money quickly. It's just a hobby and I'm 0:09:44.280 --> 0:09:47.440 not funding your hobby. So I had no delusions that 0:09:47.480 --> 0:09:49.280 I was just going to be like money was gonna 0:09:49.280 --> 0:09:50.600 be thrown at me. So I just want your listeners 0:09:50.640 --> 0:09:53.640 to know despite my background. I wasn't doing this with 0:09:53.840 --> 0:09:56.679 like the backing of my family. I was doing it 0:09:56.679 --> 0:09:58.280 was at the end, I think I've said this, I 0:09:58.360 --> 0:10:01.200 think my dad. In the end, it ultimately give me 0:10:01.240 --> 0:10:05.560 about over time paying different bills dollars, which wasn't nothing 0:10:05.600 --> 0:10:08.079 at all, and much more than many have, but kind 0:10:08.120 --> 0:10:10.840 of nothing. So the first thing I did was I 0:10:10.880 --> 0:10:14.000 pounded the pavement. No internet, found a factory. You know, 0:10:14.000 --> 0:10:16.360 there was no internet back there. Found a factory that 0:10:16.400 --> 0:10:18.559 was willing to make sort of one off samples for me. 0:10:18.600 --> 0:10:20.560 I mean, this is pretty granular, so I didn't have 0:10:20.600 --> 0:10:23.160 to invest in a lot of inventory. Found a mill 0:10:23.320 --> 0:10:25.400 in Italy. I knew some of this from working with 0:10:25.440 --> 0:10:27.560 a young designer that I've been working with prior, so 0:10:27.600 --> 0:10:29.960 I knew how to find factories and I knew how 0:10:30.000 --> 0:10:32.959 to find um fabric mills. Again, the world just changed. 0:10:33.160 --> 0:10:36.400 So I contacted this fabric mill, I ordered some fabric. 0:10:36.600 --> 0:10:40.080 I sent it to this factory. I noticed that across 0:10:40.120 --> 0:10:42.160 the street for me, I lived on sixty first Street 0:10:42.400 --> 0:10:45.480 between Park and Madison in our little small one bedroom apartment, 0:10:45.800 --> 0:10:48.200 and across the street from me was a tiny building 0:10:48.200 --> 0:10:50.000 and I had to foresay, like a for rent sign 0:10:50.280 --> 0:10:52.800 and I found an office in there did not face 0:10:52.800 --> 0:10:55.040 the street, had nothing to do with normal retail, little 0:10:55.040 --> 0:10:56.920 office in the back on like the third floor. I 0:10:56.960 --> 0:10:59.760 rented that space. It was extraordinarily inexpensive. Right now, I 0:10:59.800 --> 0:11:01.440 can't think of the rent, but it could have been 0:11:01.480 --> 0:11:05.280 like dollars a month. I mean, you know, small space. 0:11:05.600 --> 0:11:07.960 I bought a little rack. I had some samples made, 0:11:08.000 --> 0:11:10.720 like one of each of my designs, and I thought 0:11:10.760 --> 0:11:13.040 that I would just start at a telephone, at a 0:11:13.080 --> 0:11:16.679 fax machine. And I thought I'll start seeing customers by 0:11:16.720 --> 0:11:19.080 appointment only. And the only way I could find customers 0:11:19.120 --> 0:11:21.000 was my friends, who have to be pregnant. But I 0:11:21.040 --> 0:11:24.120 had this theory having been recently married, and I knew 0:11:24.120 --> 0:11:26.079 what that was like, where you're like networking like crazy. 0:11:26.120 --> 0:11:28.680 You're asking everybody everything, like oh, who is your band? 0:11:28.720 --> 0:11:31.400 Who did your flowers? You're reading, You're just hyper focused. 0:11:31.400 --> 0:11:33.360 And again, things may have changed the stuff, but this 0:11:33.400 --> 0:11:36.480 is the way I felt in so I um. I 0:11:36.520 --> 0:11:38.480 thought women would be great networkers, and I thought my 0:11:38.480 --> 0:11:41.520 friends would tell other friends. What started to happen was 0:11:41.920 --> 0:11:44.400 I got suppressed. I did not have a PR agency, 0:11:44.640 --> 0:11:46.960 but I started to get suppressed. And then I started 0:11:47.000 --> 0:11:49.920 to get celebrities, and then things just started to snowball 0:11:49.920 --> 0:11:52.520 in a way that was almost inexplicable. During the years 0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:55.520 you're building this a lot of really hard things happened 0:11:55.520 --> 0:11:59.720 to you. You had cancer, your family business and bankrupt 0:12:00.320 --> 0:12:05.680 got divorced. How did you find a way to keep 0:12:05.760 --> 0:12:09.400 running and growing this business while these things were happening. Again, 0:12:09.440 --> 0:12:12.640 it's all in hindsight. I think part of my personality 0:12:12.679 --> 0:12:15.760 that made me a good entrepreneur also made me able 0:12:16.080 --> 0:12:18.120 to handle all these things. And what I mean by 0:12:18.160 --> 0:12:21.800 that is maybe it's almost like it's almost possibly too much. 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:24.600 But I'm bizarrely optimistic, which I think you kind of 0:12:24.640 --> 0:12:26.439 need to be to be an opt to be an entrepreneur. 0:12:26.440 --> 0:12:29.160 So I'm bizarrely optimistic, like I always think everything will 0:12:29.160 --> 0:12:31.360 work out. It's very very hard to bring me down, 0:12:31.360 --> 0:12:36.040 almost impossible. So and I'm I'm able to compartmentalized, like 0:12:36.240 --> 0:12:40.080 to a really bizarre degree. So I just decided everything 0:12:40.120 --> 0:12:41.440 that was going out of my life, no matter was. 0:12:41.480 --> 0:12:43.320 It was like, let's take the cancer. Like when I 0:12:43.320 --> 0:12:45.480 had cancer, I had to do I was in the 0:12:45.520 --> 0:12:48.280 hospital for two weeks for like a radicalist direct to me, 0:12:48.400 --> 0:12:50.680 I went through chemotherapy and radiation at the same time, 0:12:50.679 --> 0:12:52.640 I was exhausted. I'm not complaining, I'm saying that's what 0:12:52.679 --> 0:12:54.760 it was like. I had two young children under the 0:12:54.800 --> 0:12:57.280 age of three. But I made this decision that I 0:12:57.320 --> 0:12:59.560 wasn't really going to tell anyone, and I wasn't going 0:12:59.600 --> 0:13:02.400 to tell my employees. I told like one senior person 0:13:02.400 --> 0:13:04.880 because I needed them to know, but because I felt 0:13:04.880 --> 0:13:07.679 like if I didn't sort of tell anyone, and I 0:13:07.720 --> 0:13:10.320 was lucky obviously I didn't have the kind of cancer 0:13:10.400 --> 0:13:13.160 that was I mean, I was terrified, but it wasn't 0:13:13.200 --> 0:13:15.200 meant to be a death sentence. Anything to go wrong, 0:13:15.200 --> 0:13:17.520 But it wasn't meant to be. But I mean, I 0:13:17.520 --> 0:13:19.920 didn't lose my hair, so I so not losing your hair, 0:13:20.040 --> 0:13:22.840 which makes it easier to um sort of not, you know, 0:13:22.880 --> 0:13:24.760 to not tell people. I realized that's not an option 0:13:24.800 --> 0:13:28.080 for many, so I I sei work through it. I 0:13:28.120 --> 0:13:30.280 didn't tell people. I felt that it kept me going 0:13:30.320 --> 0:13:32.080 to not have to be talking about it to my 0:13:32.120 --> 0:13:34.280 friends and at the office that I had something. That's 0:13:34.280 --> 0:13:35.840 the weird part of me. I felt kind of lucky 0:13:35.920 --> 0:13:37.960 that I had this major distraction in my business, like 0:13:37.960 --> 0:13:40.120 the business couldn't stop. Like one of the things I've 0:13:40.160 --> 0:13:42.440 talked about is that at the same time that I 0:13:42.440 --> 0:13:45.240 had cancer, I was sort of trying to talk to 0:13:45.240 --> 0:13:48.000 Target about signing a licensing deal. But of course I 0:13:48.000 --> 0:13:50.080 didn't want to Target to know that I had cancer 0:13:50.120 --> 0:13:52.240 because I thought, you know, it was very exaggerated in 0:13:52.280 --> 0:13:54.120 my mind as well, because that was part of it. 0:13:54.160 --> 0:13:55.800 Was awful about it. But I thought, well, if they 0:13:55.880 --> 0:13:57.360 knew that, they would never want to do a deal 0:13:57.440 --> 0:13:59.120 with me, that everyone's going to think I'm dying well, 0:13:59.160 --> 0:14:01.760 And to be fair, the company had your name on it, 0:14:01.960 --> 0:14:05.160 so it was so intertwined with you personally, Yes, it 0:14:05.160 --> 0:14:07.240 would it wouldn't have been good for the brand for 0:14:07.280 --> 0:14:10.400 people to think that. I was probably right exactly, But 0:14:10.480 --> 0:14:12.920 I remember that I so I kept putting off. I 0:14:12.960 --> 0:14:14.960 had to go to I had to go to Minneapolis 0:14:15.000 --> 0:14:17.000 in order to talk face to face with Target about 0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:19.880 the idea for this licensing deal. And I couldn't go 0:14:19.920 --> 0:14:21.600 because I had to have radiation every day, so I 0:14:21.640 --> 0:14:24.000 literally couldn't leave New York City. But I couldn't tell 0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:25.800 them that. So I just remember that I kept putting 0:14:25.800 --> 0:14:27.720 it off. I kept putting it off, and then Finally 0:14:27.720 --> 0:14:29.880 I had like a two day break in the radiation 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:32.120 for some reason, they were changing the protocol and I 0:14:32.160 --> 0:14:34.560 went overnight, and it was it was hard. I mean, 0:14:34.600 --> 0:14:37.440 I was always exhausted because of it. I was always exhausted. 0:14:37.440 --> 0:14:39.800 And the same thing was I was launching my new 0:14:39.880 --> 0:14:42.840 license line for Nike, and they gave this really big 0:14:42.880 --> 0:14:44.480 party that I still looked back on, like, I wish 0:14:44.520 --> 0:14:46.480 I could have appreciated it more. I wish that I 0:14:46.520 --> 0:14:48.760 had been healthier at that moment. But they took over 0:14:48.840 --> 0:14:50.920 Michael's Restaurant, which was a big restaurant in New York 0:14:50.920 --> 0:14:53.680 back then, and they invited like a total who's who, 0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:56.040 made this huge deal about it. But I was so 0:14:56.160 --> 0:14:59.680 exhausted on the day of that party that I remember 0:14:59.720 --> 0:15:01.280 I was like I had to sit down in my 0:15:01.320 --> 0:15:03.200 shower in order to wash my hair, like it was 0:15:03.320 --> 0:15:05.880 really like gritting my teeth and getting through it. But 0:15:05.920 --> 0:15:07.520 it was it was the fact that I had all 0:15:07.560 --> 0:15:10.880 these things going on positively, like the business that I 0:15:10.880 --> 0:15:13.360 think really got me through everything else that you asked 0:15:13.360 --> 0:15:18.240 me about. And now a quick break. It was only 0:15:18.440 --> 0:15:22.400 four years after you started Lizzling Maternity that your family 0:15:22.600 --> 0:15:27.640 business fell apart. Your birth family's business fell apart. How 0:15:27.680 --> 0:15:31.320 did that manifest itself in your life? I mean, obviously 0:15:31.400 --> 0:15:34.720 it was extremely stressful. Like people always again, like whenever 0:15:34.760 --> 0:15:37.600 someone's an entrepreneur, people use words like bravery, like it 0:15:37.680 --> 0:15:40.000 was so brave of you to like leave your job 0:15:40.080 --> 0:15:42.960 and start this business, always like it wasn't. First of all, 0:15:43.000 --> 0:15:44.680 I was, you know, twenty nine years old, so I 0:15:44.680 --> 0:15:47.120 didn't know about bravery. You know, you're just not that scared. 0:15:47.400 --> 0:15:49.680 I wasn't going to start if the business didn't work out. 0:15:49.880 --> 0:15:52.640 My family was very rich. My husband was somewhat success 0:15:52.680 --> 0:15:54.400 and we were young, but you know, he was starting 0:15:54.400 --> 0:15:57.200 out and was somewhat successful. I wasn't risking a lot 0:15:57.520 --> 0:15:59.440 all of a sudden, my family loses its money and 0:15:59.560 --> 0:16:02.120 like our life depends on my business, like that had 0:16:02.200 --> 0:16:04.520 never been part of the deal. I mean, I was 0:16:04.560 --> 0:16:07.240 treating it that way already, thankfully, Like I wasn't. I 0:16:07.280 --> 0:16:09.480 wasn't in it halfway for you at that point, I 0:16:09.480 --> 0:16:11.480 already had the Target deal and the Nike deal and 0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:14.440 my list lying store. So no, but I don't know 0:16:14.480 --> 0:16:16.480 that I would have sold the business. I sold the 0:16:16.520 --> 0:16:19.000 business in two thou seven. I don't know that I 0:16:19.040 --> 0:16:22.960 would have other than I felt a responsibility to monetize 0:16:23.080 --> 0:16:25.840 the success of Liz lying Mattorney for my family, for 0:16:26.000 --> 0:16:28.760 my my my new family, not for my parents. And 0:16:29.400 --> 0:16:30.840 I don't think I would have I would have been 0:16:30.880 --> 0:16:33.200 able to, and that that's something that I am sad about. 0:16:33.240 --> 0:16:36.240 I mean, I'm over it today. But being Liz Laing 0:16:36.280 --> 0:16:38.080 of loz Lin Attorney was very much a part of 0:16:38.120 --> 0:16:41.320 my identity. It was everything, and that was hard and 0:16:41.360 --> 0:16:44.040 I definitely that was one thing that I definitely wouldn't 0:16:44.080 --> 0:16:46.480 have happened. I knew you back then, and I remember 0:16:46.520 --> 0:16:50.280 it being very difficult for you to sort of overnight 0:16:50.400 --> 0:16:54.640 go from having this identity to suddenly having sold it 0:16:54.760 --> 0:16:58.560 and thinking what's next? It was what got you to 0:16:58.720 --> 0:17:01.880 what's next? Well, I was forty years old, which is 0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:05.080 young now looking back, quite young, but I knew that 0:17:05.160 --> 0:17:07.880 I wasn't like retiring and it kind of just fell 0:17:07.960 --> 0:17:11.080 into place. I was lucky in that I knew this 0:17:11.119 --> 0:17:13.520 woman named Mindy Grossman. I knew Mindy because she had 0:17:13.560 --> 0:17:15.560 run women's You probably we've had her on the shot. Oh, 0:17:15.800 --> 0:17:19.359 so you know, Mendy. She's great. Mindy's wonderful, she's the best. 0:17:19.359 --> 0:17:21.359 But I knew Mindy in a very different role. I 0:17:21.400 --> 0:17:26.520 knew Mindy when she ran women's apparel for Nike, and 0:17:26.600 --> 0:17:28.960 she was the one that had approached me and asked 0:17:28.960 --> 0:17:31.080 me if I would do a Liz lang for Swoosh 0:17:31.160 --> 0:17:34.600 maternity athletic apparel line. At that point, just like I mean, 0:17:34.640 --> 0:17:36.960 you guys, I had no idea who Mindy Wasn't Mindy 0:17:37.040 --> 0:17:39.080 yet really and I mean she had a job at 0:17:39.160 --> 0:17:43.680 Nike and lived in um so Um. I met her 0:17:43.680 --> 0:17:45.600 that through that deal. We ended up doing that deal. 0:17:45.640 --> 0:17:47.520 I got to know her. And when I sold Liz 0:17:47.600 --> 0:17:50.400 Lange maternity and I really couldn't do maternity clothing anymore. 0:17:50.440 --> 0:17:52.359 Like that part was I had sold the rights to 0:17:52.400 --> 0:17:55.560 do that. Mindy offered me to come on. She had 0:17:55.600 --> 0:17:57.639 just taken over at HSN. I mean I could have 0:17:57.680 --> 0:17:59.960 the timing wrong, but somewhat like that at Home Shop 0:18:00.040 --> 0:18:02.199 be Network, and she said, why didn't you come on? 0:18:02.240 --> 0:18:04.600 And my friend Stephanie Greenfield, who had owned scooped, she 0:18:04.680 --> 0:18:07.080 was doing a show, so why don't you do, uh, 0:18:07.240 --> 0:18:09.560 do a line of clothing, not maternity, but you know, 0:18:09.600 --> 0:18:12.840 at a target price point for our audience. And I 0:18:12.920 --> 0:18:15.359