1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:02,960 Speaker 1: Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve Camray. 2 00:00:03,160 --> 00:00:08,840 Speaker 1: It's ready. Are you get in touch with technology with 3 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:18,200 Speaker 1: tech Stuff from how stuff dot com. Hello, welcome to 4 00:00:18,360 --> 00:00:20,319 Speaker 1: tech Stuff. My name is Chris Poulette and I am 5 00:00:20,360 --> 00:00:23,360 Speaker 1: an editor at how stuff works dot com. Sitting across 6 00:00:23,360 --> 00:00:26,720 Speaker 1: from me as always senior writer Jonathan Strickland. If you 7 00:00:26,760 --> 00:00:28,640 Speaker 1: really want to hear about it, the first thing you'll 8 00:00:28,640 --> 00:00:30,479 Speaker 1: probably want to know is where I was born and 9 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:33,440 Speaker 1: what my lousy childhood was like, and how my parents 10 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:36,239 Speaker 1: were occupied and all before they had me and all 11 00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:38,720 Speaker 1: that David Copperfield kind of crap. But I don't feel 12 00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:40,360 Speaker 1: like going into it if you want to know the truth, 13 00:00:41,479 --> 00:00:44,400 Speaker 1: good because we didn't want Oh that was a quote. Yes, 14 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:47,159 Speaker 1: that that does not that was not mine. That was 15 00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:50,320 Speaker 1: a quote. Um, yeah, it's a quote. And here's a 16 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:52,080 Speaker 1: hard thing to believe. It's a quote from a book 17 00:00:52,120 --> 00:00:56,080 Speaker 1: I have never read, and it is a classic. But 18 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:58,600 Speaker 1: I was never it was never part of my curriculum 19 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 1: growing up, and so one of these days I'm gonna 20 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:03,480 Speaker 1: have to fix that. Anyway, So today we're going to 21 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:07,040 Speaker 1: talk about an interesting piece of technology that was very 22 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:11,120 Speaker 1: influential early on in the era of personal computers. That's 23 00:01:11,200 --> 00:01:13,720 Speaker 1: the truth. And UM, of course we've we've talked on 24 00:01:14,319 --> 00:01:19,440 Speaker 1: its sibling later or earlier earlier, earlier in our podcast history, 25 00:01:20,040 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 1: UM and Jonathan really wanted to get into a bit 26 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:25,479 Speaker 1: of the history of the company today. So well, we'll 27 00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 1: talk about the history of this particular machine, but uh 28 00:01:28,640 --> 00:01:32,080 Speaker 1: sort of in a the greater context of the company itself. 29 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 1: And it starts with a guy who was born in Europe, Yeah, 30 00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:40,399 Speaker 1: Polish immigrant named Jack Tramiel. Uh. He actually had a 31 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 1: very very traumatic early experience because he was he was 32 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 1: one of the uh Jews who were rounded up by 33 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:53,080 Speaker 1: Germany and put into a concentration camp. Um. Now, fortunately 34 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:57,720 Speaker 1: he survived that ordeal. Eventually moved to North America, originally 35 00:01:57,760 --> 00:02:01,320 Speaker 1: New York City, became part of the U. S. Army, 36 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:06,080 Speaker 1: and actually began to learn how to repair typewriters. What 37 00:02:06,360 --> 00:02:11,559 Speaker 1: typewriter He was loving that, Okay, kids, back in the day, 38 00:02:11,800 --> 00:02:16,000 Speaker 1: typewriters were these devices that would print directly to paper. UM. 39 00:02:16,160 --> 00:02:19,480 Speaker 1: So yeah, it was he was a typewriter repairman and 40 00:02:19,680 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 1: uh he started to he found an opportunity to create 41 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 1: a company h in Toronto, Ontario, Canada. And so he 42 00:02:29,160 --> 00:02:33,480 Speaker 1: moved to Toronto, and in nineteen fifty four he founded 43 00:02:33,480 --> 00:02:39,160 Speaker 1: a company called the Commodore Portable Typewriter Company. And Uh, 44 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:42,320 Speaker 1: just so you know, I've got some other interesting things 45 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:44,880 Speaker 1: that happened in nineteen fifty four, just to give context 46 00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:47,120 Speaker 1: to what else is going on in the world. I 47 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:48,880 Speaker 1: just thought this would be kind of cool. I I 48 00:02:49,000 --> 00:02:51,240 Speaker 1: kind of want to do this from here on out 49 00:02:51,320 --> 00:02:54,360 Speaker 1: to kind of give context to historical events happened. So 50 00:02:55,400 --> 00:02:57,640 Speaker 1: in nineteen fifty four, that was also the year the 51 00:02:57,720 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 1: first nuclear powered submarine was unveiled. That was the USS Nautilus. 52 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:08,880 Speaker 1: That the hydrogen bomb was tested at Bikini Atoll, which 53 00:03:08,919 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 1: just makes me think of Beanie and Cecil because they 54 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 1: had the island no Bikini at all. And then, uh, 55 00:03:17,240 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 1: there's a According to True Knowledge, which is an artificial 56 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:25,760 Speaker 1: intelligence program created by William Tunstulpedo. April eleventh, nineteen fifty four, 57 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:28,800 Speaker 1: was officially the most boring day in the twentieth century 58 00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:34,160 Speaker 1: because nothing of any real consequence happened that day. Uh. 59 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 1: Brown versus Board of Education happened in nineteen fifty four 60 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:40,880 Speaker 1: that ended segregation in public schools in the United States. 61 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:45,160 Speaker 1: The first issue ever of Sports Illustrated Magazine published that 62 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 1: year Laura the Flies published that year. Actually, now that 63 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 1: I think about it, I should have used that as 64 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:54,200 Speaker 1: the quote for the beginning of this podcast. Uh. Texas 65 00:03:54,280 --> 00:03:57,760 Speaker 1: Instruments announced the development of the first transistor radio in 66 00:03:57,840 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 1: nineteen fifty four, and Texas Instruments is going to play 67 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:04,920 Speaker 1: a part in this discussion as well. And one of 68 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:08,920 Speaker 1: the most pivotal events in nineteen fifty four, the very 69 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:15,800 Speaker 1: first gud Zella movie premieres. So Uh. In nineteen fifty five, 70 00:04:16,520 --> 00:04:22,799 Speaker 1: the company officially incorporates and becomes Commodore Business Machines, Incorporated. Uh. Sorry, 71 00:04:22,839 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 1: you were going to say, no, I was going to 72 00:04:24,480 --> 00:04:27,280 Speaker 1: add that the the Commodore history that I've pulled up 73 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:31,760 Speaker 1: UM suggests that part of the reason that that Jack 74 00:04:31,760 --> 00:04:37,080 Speaker 1: Tremille decided to get into business manufacturing his own equipment 75 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:41,320 Speaker 1: was because, um, the the machines, the typewriters that were 76 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:46,200 Speaker 1: coming in from overseas were much more inexpensive, and uh, 77 00:04:46,240 --> 00:04:48,599 Speaker 1: you know, his his repair business was sort of he 78 00:04:48,680 --> 00:04:50,320 Speaker 1: realized that he wasn't going to have much of a 79 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:53,000 Speaker 1: future in that, so he decided to get in on 80 00:04:53,000 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 1: on his own thing. Yeah, which was a smart deal 81 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 1: for him. It worked out, Yeah, it worked out. In 82 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:00,280 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty two, the company was listed in New York 83 00:05:00,320 --> 00:05:04,159 Speaker 1: Stock Exchange as Commodore International Limited. Uh. And then in 84 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:07,800 Speaker 1: the nineties seventies, Commodore began the transition to get into 85 00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:13,040 Speaker 1: the business of manufacturing calculators, including scientific calculators. And they 86 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:14,720 Speaker 1: were I think, like we've talked about some people who 87 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 1: have manufactured calculators. Yeah, yeah, well they met with early success. 88 00:05:18,400 --> 00:05:20,760 Speaker 1: But then Texas Instruments got into the game. And of 89 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 1: course their thing was creating affordable calculators for for consumers. 90 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:31,159 Speaker 1: Plus they had to compete with Hewlett Packard of course 91 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:34,400 Speaker 1: they were they were looking more at high end business machines. 92 00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 1: So Texas Instruments starts to hone in on this calculator business, 93 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:44,000 Speaker 1: and that's when the by the mid seventies, mid to 94 00:05:44,080 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: late seventies, that's when the the concept of the personal 95 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:51,080 Speaker 1: computer as we consider them today, that's when it's really 96 00:05:51,080 --> 00:05:54,240 Speaker 1: started to take hold. And so Tramuel thought, this is 97 00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:56,680 Speaker 1: really where it's at. We should get into this because 98 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:59,320 Speaker 1: the calculator business is starting to get a little too crowded, 99 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 1: and they hired an engineer by the name of Chuck Pedal, 100 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:11,120 Speaker 1: who actually joined a division of Commodore called MS Technology Incorporated. 101 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:16,800 Speaker 1: So this is a subsidiary essentially a Commodore and MS 102 00:06:16,839 --> 00:06:22,160 Speaker 1: Technology is the company that created well, they manufactured semiconductors. Yes, 103 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:27,640 Speaker 1: and he Pedal created a processor chip which was sort 104 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 1: of similar to a chip that Motorola had made previously, 105 00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:35,520 Speaker 1: but it was called the six five zero X series. 106 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:38,839 Speaker 1: So six zero two being one of the most famous 107 00:06:38,839 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 1: and six five one zero being another. And we'll talk 108 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 1: about those in a little bit as famous as you 109 00:06:44,680 --> 00:06:48,360 Speaker 1: know chips get yeah, yeah, or at least gotten those days, right, 110 00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:51,720 Speaker 1: So these are processors that were very, very influential early on. 111 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 1: So nineteen seventies six, Commodore International Limited relocates to west Chester, Pennsylvania, 112 00:07:00,160 --> 00:07:02,560 Speaker 1: a place I'm actually really familiar with. I've been to 113 00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 1: Westchester many many times. In nineteen seventy seven, Commodore then 114 00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:14,800 Speaker 1: unveiled the Personal Electronic Transactor or PET, the Commodore PET. Yeah, 115 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:17,080 Speaker 1: the Commodore PET was one of the well, that was 116 00:07:17,120 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 1: the first computer the Commodore created, and they unveiled it 117 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:25,080 Speaker 1: at in nineteen seventy seven at CS in Chicago. Yeah, 118 00:07:25,080 --> 00:07:27,720 Speaker 1: if you listen, to our CES podcast. You remember we 119 00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:31,880 Speaker 1: talked about how you know, they experiment with different cities, 120 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 1: including Chicago for a while. Well, the PET was really 121 00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:39,720 Speaker 1: popular in education in schools, but it wasn't a It 122 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:42,400 Speaker 1: wasn't a success in the home market at all. Had 123 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 1: a very industrial looks made out of metal, and it 124 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:49,400 Speaker 1: was pretty expensive, but it did feature the MS six 125 00:07:49,440 --> 00:07:54,480 Speaker 1: five zero two processor. Now, in nineteen eighty, Commodore announced 126 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:58,440 Speaker 1: the VIC twenty and I remember the VIC twenty very well. Yeah, 127 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:02,600 Speaker 1: it actually went on saye in one and originally the 128 00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 1: sales price was two dollars, which was incredible. I mean, 129 00:08:08,360 --> 00:08:10,920 Speaker 1: it was undercutting all the other personal computers that were 130 00:08:10,920 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 1: on the market at the time. By the way, in 131 00:08:13,160 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 1: today's dollars, that's about seven hundred and eight bucks. So 132 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:20,920 Speaker 1: this was the first PC to sell over a million units. 133 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 1: It was the first really popular home PC. Yeah. Now, 134 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:27,240 Speaker 1: the the VIC twenty was sort of unusual in another 135 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:31,200 Speaker 1: way to UM because you know, by today's standards, it 136 00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 1: wouldn't be as unusual UM, but at this point it's 137 00:08:35,880 --> 00:08:39,679 Speaker 1: a machine that didn't have its own monitor, UM, and 138 00:08:39,920 --> 00:08:42,319 Speaker 1: it really didn't have a monitor that you got with it. 139 00:08:42,600 --> 00:08:45,160 Speaker 1: You were really most people I knew that had VIC 140 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:47,840 Speaker 1: twenties just took him up to a TV UM. But 141 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:50,040 Speaker 1: that was part of its appeal was it was for 142 00:08:50,080 --> 00:08:53,240 Speaker 1: people who wanted to mess around with computers. And at 143 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:55,559 Speaker 1: that point, if you had a home computer, you were 144 00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 1: somebody who wanted to mess around with computers. UM. This 145 00:08:58,520 --> 00:09:01,720 Speaker 1: wasn't something that you did because you wanted to log 146 00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:04,679 Speaker 1: into bulletin boards or because you you know, uh needed 147 00:09:04,720 --> 00:09:07,640 Speaker 1: the Internet for school or something like that. You didn't 148 00:09:08,880 --> 00:09:11,440 Speaker 1: why would you want a computer in your house? You know, 149 00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 1: because I like computers. I want to learn more about computers. 150 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:17,640 Speaker 1: So you know, this is this is an affordable way 151 00:09:17,640 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: for people to get on in on the ground floor 152 00:09:19,720 --> 00:09:23,320 Speaker 1: and fool around with computers. UM. Now, it wasn't exactly 153 00:09:23,520 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 1: a powerful machine. Five kilobytes of Braham, yeah, and only 154 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 1: three and a half kilobytes were available once you booted 155 00:09:31,920 --> 00:09:34,240 Speaker 1: it up. The other one and a half that that 156 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:38,600 Speaker 1: was dedicated to the startup process and running the the 157 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: the back end of the machine, So you only had 158 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:45,440 Speaker 1: three and a half kilobytes of RAM to work with. UM. 159 00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:47,800 Speaker 1: And it was cartridge based, but it also you could 160 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 1: also get a cassette tape drive that we could connect 161 00:09:50,480 --> 00:09:53,160 Speaker 1: to it. Um. And one of the advantages of hooking 162 00:09:53,160 --> 00:09:55,440 Speaker 1: it up to your television was that if you have 163 00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:58,080 Speaker 1: a color TV, you have a color monitor, whereas if 164 00:09:58,080 --> 00:09:59,840 Speaker 1: you look at the other computers on the market at 165 00:09:59,840 --> 00:10:03,560 Speaker 1: that time, they were monochromatic monitors. So that was a 166 00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:08,320 Speaker 1: big advantage. Now, these these advantages still if you look 167 00:10:08,360 --> 00:10:12,120 Speaker 1: at the power of the VIC twenty, that was that 168 00:10:12,280 --> 00:10:14,440 Speaker 1: was the biggest criticism as direct at the VIC twenty 169 00:10:14,520 --> 00:10:18,520 Speaker 1: was that it was underpowered. So, uh, Commodore had a 170 00:10:18,520 --> 00:10:22,720 Speaker 1: response to that, which brings us to the real subject 171 00:10:22,840 --> 00:10:28,040 Speaker 1: of this podcast. In nine two, Commodore introduced the Commodore 172 00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:32,040 Speaker 1: sixty four and they introduced it at C E s YEP. 173 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:35,960 Speaker 1: Now this, uh, both of these machines have essentially the 174 00:10:36,000 --> 00:10:38,720 Speaker 1: same form factor. UM. And if you look at it 175 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:41,080 Speaker 1: now go back and if you've never seen one, and 176 00:10:41,080 --> 00:10:42,840 Speaker 1: you go back and look at photos of this, it 177 00:10:42,880 --> 00:10:45,320 Speaker 1: looks sort of like it's just the keyboard. Um. It 178 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:47,439 Speaker 1: was sort of an all in one, but it wasn't 179 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:49,720 Speaker 1: like we think of it today. And in terms of 180 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:52,560 Speaker 1: you know, some of the machines that that come out 181 00:10:52,559 --> 00:10:54,800 Speaker 1: that are all in one where they have the monitor 182 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:57,400 Speaker 1: with the computer in it. This was the keyboard with 183 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:01,000 Speaker 1: the computer in it. Um. And uh, yeah, those keys 184 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:07,760 Speaker 1: were very clicky, but I mean absolutely solid machines, solid 185 00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:09,800 Speaker 1: to the point of if you if you were to 186 00:11:09,880 --> 00:11:13,559 Speaker 1: drop one on your foot, you might need medical attention. Well, 187 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:18,600 Speaker 1: Commodore believed in making these machines tough. Um. But yeah, 188 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:21,199 Speaker 1: I mean it's it's not exactly a glamour queen of 189 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:24,440 Speaker 1: a machine, but you know, but how do it work? 190 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:29,959 Speaker 1: And very versatile. Uh. It originally cost five hundred dollars, 191 00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:33,679 Speaker 1: which in today's dollars one three d twenty six bucks. 192 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:38,280 Speaker 1: And still at five that's still very affordable compared to 193 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:41,520 Speaker 1: the other personal computers, especially the Apple. To the two 194 00:11:41,559 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: main competitors against Commodore at this time, we're really a 195 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:50,160 Speaker 1: tari An Apple Texas Instruments to a slightly lesser degree 196 00:11:50,280 --> 00:11:55,080 Speaker 1: and Tandy to a much lesser degree. Um. But yeah, 197 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:59,120 Speaker 1: the five price point was very attractive. And the reason 198 00:11:59,160 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 1: why it's called the sixty four is that had sixty 199 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:05,120 Speaker 1: four kilobytes of RAM. Commodore was always looking for those 200 00:12:05,160 --> 00:12:10,240 Speaker 1: fancy names. Yeah. Uh. The The design team included Robert Russell, 201 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:14,640 Speaker 1: Bob Jannis, and David ZIMBECKI. Um, they were the ones 202 00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:18,160 Speaker 1: who kind of were the brains behind the original development, 203 00:12:18,160 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 1: although there were other people who were also very heavily 204 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:23,600 Speaker 1: involved in creating this this computer. And I have the 205 00:12:23,679 --> 00:12:26,640 Speaker 1: first paragraph of the user manual if you would like 206 00:12:26,679 --> 00:12:30,440 Speaker 1: to hear it. Absolutely, let's go with that. Your new 207 00:12:30,520 --> 00:12:33,720 Speaker 1: Commodore sixty four is the best home computer available today. 208 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 1: You can use your Commodore sixty four for everything from 209 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:40,120 Speaker 1: business applications to household paperwork to exciting games. The sixty 210 00:12:40,160 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 1: four offers you lots of memory six yes, lots of 211 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:49,599 Speaker 1: color sixteen different colors, lots of sound, music and zund effects, 212 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 1: and lots of fun and practical uses. You can use 213 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:55,320 Speaker 1: prepackaged software or you can write your own programs and 214 00:12:55,480 --> 00:12:59,959 Speaker 1: easy to learn Basic. Well, their version of easy to 215 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:04,040 Speaker 1: learned Basic apparently wasn't easy to learn for everyone, because 216 00:13:04,040 --> 00:13:08,640 Speaker 1: I've seen some criticism leveled at it. However, UM, what 217 00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:11,400 Speaker 1: what's funny is that this machine was It's not funny 218 00:13:11,400 --> 00:13:16,320 Speaker 1: that this machine took off. UM. People had many many 219 00:13:16,360 --> 00:13:19,800 Speaker 1: people owned a VIC twenty, a Commodore sixty four or both. 220 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 1: UM and the power of this machine was not in 221 00:13:25,040 --> 00:13:30,280 Speaker 1: its processing power or its speed, but it was in 222 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:33,680 Speaker 1: its ability to reach people with the idea of having 223 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:37,080 Speaker 1: a computer at home. And it did have some other 224 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:40,280 Speaker 1: features that made it very attractive. Um, it had eight 225 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:43,360 Speaker 1: bit graphics, which put it on par with the the 226 00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:46,160 Speaker 1: home video game systems that were coming out, so there 227 00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:49,839 Speaker 1: was a an appeal to video game enthusiasts, and there 228 00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:51,120 Speaker 1: were a lot of games that came out for the 229 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:53,760 Speaker 1: Common War sixty four that were that ended up being 230 00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 1: incredibly popular. Uh. And then there was the fact that 231 00:13:57,480 --> 00:14:01,960 Speaker 1: it also allowed you to program in languages like Pascal, Logo, 232 00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:06,319 Speaker 1: fourth and Fortran. One of the big things about the 233 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:08,240 Speaker 1: Comparse sixty four. One of the things that was most 234 00:14:08,240 --> 00:14:10,280 Speaker 1: attractive to a lot of users was the fact that 235 00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:15,520 Speaker 1: it had a sound interface device sound chip or SID chip. Yes. Now, 236 00:14:16,160 --> 00:14:19,160 Speaker 1: the SID chip was developed by Bob Yannis, who he 237 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:22,240 Speaker 1: mentioned earlier, and he actually would later on go on 238 00:14:22,400 --> 00:14:26,600 Speaker 1: to found a synthesizer company, so he knew a thing 239 00:14:26,680 --> 00:14:29,640 Speaker 1: or two. He actually knew a lot about about sound 240 00:14:29,640 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: design music, and he wanted to be able to create 241 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:36,560 Speaker 1: a device that could represent some a pretty broad array 242 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 1: of sounds, and the Converse sixty four had a much 243 00:14:38,920 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 1: more sophisticated sound system than almost any other device on 244 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:45,920 Speaker 1: the market at that time. So you still have people 245 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:48,800 Speaker 1: who are very much fans of the old Common War 246 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:53,800 Speaker 1: sixty four when it comes to creating music today. And 247 00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:58,720 Speaker 1: you can still find lots of sixty four out there. Um. 248 00:14:58,760 --> 00:15:02,360 Speaker 1: There's a site that's dedicated to the C sixty four 249 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:05,600 Speaker 1: uh C sixty four dot com, which is pretty interesting 250 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:07,800 Speaker 1: if you like to play around with that. But UM, 251 00:15:07,840 --> 00:15:11,040 Speaker 1: one of the I remember back when I was a 252 00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:13,920 Speaker 1: kid and people had the Vick twenties and sixty four. 253 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:18,000 Speaker 1: A lot of the magazines out there, UM, you know, 254 00:15:18,040 --> 00:15:22,600 Speaker 1: the computing magazines liked to offer a program um in 255 00:15:22,680 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 1: the back of the magazine, so you'd read about you know, 256 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:28,960 Speaker 1: it was sort of like the PC worlds of the day, 257 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:33,080 Speaker 1: but it was you know, magazines like Compute um had 258 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:37,640 Speaker 1: uh you read about peripherals and and cool things you 259 00:15:37,640 --> 00:15:39,280 Speaker 1: could do with your computer, and then the back of 260 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:42,360 Speaker 1: the the thing it would tell you about how to program, 261 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:44,000 Speaker 1: and it would have a program in there that you 262 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:46,760 Speaker 1: could enter in yourself. UM. And I think that was 263 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:48,280 Speaker 1: that was sort of a beautiful thing. A friend of 264 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:51,520 Speaker 1: mine and I uh sort of dabbled in that. Uh, 265 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:53,880 Speaker 1: you know, working on trying to to come up with 266 00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:56,600 Speaker 1: uh or try to play some of the games that 267 00:15:56,640 --> 00:15:58,920 Speaker 1: they had written in there. And it was really kind 268 00:15:58,920 --> 00:16:03,160 Speaker 1: of cool because it gave you this perception that programming 269 00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:08,200 Speaker 1: something yourself it wasn't really all that hard. Um. You know, 270 00:16:08,280 --> 00:16:10,720 Speaker 1: it's it's sort of daunting in a way to to 271 00:16:11,000 --> 00:16:15,400 Speaker 1: pop in um DVD now or you know, download something 272 00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:18,000 Speaker 1: from the internet and you play these games with these 273 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:22,080 Speaker 1: amazing graphics today and and sound you know, uh, surround 274 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:25,440 Speaker 1: sound and and uh you know, millions of colors, but 275 00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 1: you know, you have to get down to the hood, 276 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:30,760 Speaker 1: you to actually look at the code that that seems 277 00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:33,000 Speaker 1: kind of and and you know, for some people it 278 00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:35,760 Speaker 1: can be really daunting, I think for most people, because 279 00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 1: I didn't want to make it sound like you know 280 00:16:38,360 --> 00:16:42,000 Speaker 1: everyone that way. But back and back when the Cover 281 00:16:42,240 --> 00:16:45,600 Speaker 1: sixty four launched, it was completely feasible for a single 282 00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 1: person to create a game from start to finish. Everything 283 00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:53,600 Speaker 1: from the graphics to the sound, to the gameplay itself, 284 00:16:53,760 --> 00:16:56,480 Speaker 1: the story, whatever you want to call it, all of 285 00:16:56,480 --> 00:16:59,680 Speaker 1: that was completely feasible for one or maybe maybe a 286 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:02,760 Speaker 1: mall team of people like two or three to put 287 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:06,919 Speaker 1: it all together. And of course today to create games 288 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 1: that compete at at the standard level. It's entire divisions 289 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:15,439 Speaker 1: of companies that build games. Now, that doesn't mean that 290 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:18,320 Speaker 1: there aren't still people out there who take it upon 291 00:17:18,359 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 1: themselves to create a game all by themselves. And there's 292 00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:23,800 Speaker 1: some really popular and compelling games out there. They're made 293 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: by a single person. But that's the exception, not the rule, 294 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:29,159 Speaker 1: as opposed to the other way around. Back in the 295 00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:32,480 Speaker 1: Commodore sixty four premiered, and it was sort of a 296 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:36,960 Speaker 1: basic platform. That's kind of a pun but unintended, but 297 00:17:37,040 --> 00:17:39,200 Speaker 1: it was. It was a platform for people to learn 298 00:17:39,280 --> 00:17:43,240 Speaker 1: the foundations for computer programming, and so it was a 299 00:17:43,320 --> 00:17:46,240 Speaker 1: very popular device, especially I mean, if you talk to 300 00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:50,479 Speaker 1: people who are a well established computer scientists today, a 301 00:17:50,520 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 1: lot of them have fond memories of the Commodore sixty 302 00:17:53,720 --> 00:17:56,240 Speaker 1: four because that was the machine that got them into 303 00:17:56,640 --> 00:18:00,200 Speaker 1: computer science. And I had read too that one of 304 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:03,880 Speaker 1: the benefits, one of the detriments of the sixty four 305 00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 1: led to one of the uh real strengths of the 306 00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:10,520 Speaker 1: sixty four, which was, um, it really didn't have a 307 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:13,040 Speaker 1: lot of uh didn't have a lot of memory. You 308 00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:15,399 Speaker 1: didn't have a lot of room to play with code. 309 00:18:15,840 --> 00:18:18,439 Speaker 1: So the people who learned a program learned to do 310 00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:21,919 Speaker 1: that very efficiently because they didn't have a lot of 311 00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:24,879 Speaker 1: room for error um, and a lot of room for 312 00:18:24,880 --> 00:18:28,600 Speaker 1: extraneous stuff in their code. Now. UM, I don't know 313 00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:31,360 Speaker 1: if you knew this or not, but they they may. 314 00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:34,800 Speaker 1: For a while, Commodore actually considered the possibility of doing 315 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:38,080 Speaker 1: something else before they released the sixty four. In fact, 316 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:41,920 Speaker 1: they heard an overture from some people at a budding 317 00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:46,280 Speaker 1: brand new computer company. Um, but they turned him down. 318 00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:49,560 Speaker 1: A couple of guys named Steve who had approached who 319 00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:52,679 Speaker 1: had approached Commodore with the idea of, hey, wouldn't you 320 00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:57,400 Speaker 1: like to buy this computer design we have in mind? Um. 321 00:18:57,440 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 1: And as it turns out, Commodore passed on the idea 322 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:04,639 Speaker 1: for the Apple too. Um what what is now? Apple 323 00:19:05,000 --> 00:19:09,359 Speaker 1: could have been Commodore in a way. But in in 324 00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:11,960 Speaker 1: doing so, we actually ended up with two great machines 325 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:13,639 Speaker 1: because we ended up with the sixty four and the 326 00:19:13,680 --> 00:19:17,600 Speaker 1: Apple two, which ended up being competitors. Um. But it's 327 00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:19,639 Speaker 1: kind of funny. I I had no idea. Now I 328 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:24,040 Speaker 1: knew about the ties with them with Atari, of course, um, 329 00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:27,280 Speaker 1: since they were at engineers. But yeah, and that's gonna 330 00:19:27,280 --> 00:19:30,000 Speaker 1: get even more complicated in a minute to Uh. Yeah, 331 00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:35,320 Speaker 1: the the and the sixty four used cartridges just like 332 00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:38,960 Speaker 1: the VIC twenty did. Also could use cassettes, but it 333 00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 1: also had an optional floppy drive five and a quarter 334 00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:47,960 Speaker 1: inch floppy drive five and a quarter inch discs still 335 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:50,159 Speaker 1: have some and yeah, I think I do too, but 336 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:53,520 Speaker 1: they're all for the Apple to ye two. But they 337 00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:56,439 Speaker 1: but the floppy disk. I think the drive cost a 338 00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:59,440 Speaker 1: thousand dollars, so it was actually more expensive than the 339 00:19:59,600 --> 00:20:02,399 Speaker 1: compute or itself. Uh. And it was an add on 340 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:06,240 Speaker 1: that you could get and plug into your Commodore sixty 341 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:10,600 Speaker 1: four to give it additional functionality. Yeah, and the cartridges 342 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:13,919 Speaker 1: could allow you to get better performance out of your 343 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:16,640 Speaker 1: Commodore sixty four. It wasn't just like a video game 344 00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:19,439 Speaker 1: console where a cartridge game is on the cartridge itself. 345 00:20:19,480 --> 00:20:23,680 Speaker 1: In fact, the the addition of the floppy drive was 346 00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 1: kind of interesting because that introduced a new concept in computers, 347 00:20:29,359 --> 00:20:33,800 Speaker 1: which was piracy, because you know, with cartridges, you had 348 00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:37,160 Speaker 1: them hard coded on you know, the programs were hard 349 00:20:37,200 --> 00:20:40,840 Speaker 1: coded on the cartridge itself. Yeah, you had a rom 350 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:44,040 Speaker 1: on this chip. There's no way that you could really 351 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:47,800 Speaker 1: manufacture one of your own. You could, but you'd have 352 00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:49,960 Speaker 1: to know how to burn the chips, and it's it's 353 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:51,919 Speaker 1: not something that people have the hardware for. Yeah, you 354 00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:55,360 Speaker 1: couldn't really do it at home. Whereas whereas with disks, 355 00:20:55,520 --> 00:20:58,679 Speaker 1: it was it suddenly became feasible to be able to 356 00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:02,400 Speaker 1: copy programs from one disk to another, and that's when 357 00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:05,399 Speaker 1: you started seeing things like copy protection being added on 358 00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:07,520 Speaker 1: into disks, and then you started seeing things like people 359 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:10,399 Speaker 1: figuring out how to get around copy protection. Well, that 360 00:21:10,520 --> 00:21:14,200 Speaker 1: all kind of started with the Commodore sixty four, also 361 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:16,720 Speaker 1: in nineteen eight six, so a few years after it 362 00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:20,240 Speaker 1: had debuted, you started to see a new operating system 363 00:21:20,240 --> 00:21:23,680 Speaker 1: appear on Commodore sixty four called GEOS, which is Graphic 364 00:21:23,920 --> 00:21:27,960 Speaker 1: Environment Operating System, so it was a graphic user interface. 365 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:32,000 Speaker 1: Now keep in mind that the the mac OS, which 366 00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:36,399 Speaker 1: was the first operating system to popular popularize the g 367 00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:39,119 Speaker 1: U I in n four, it had been out for 368 00:21:39,160 --> 00:21:42,960 Speaker 1: a couple of years, so it wasn't like Commodore sixty 369 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:44,960 Speaker 1: four was breaking new ground. They were kind of going 370 00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:47,119 Speaker 1: the same direction that that Apple was going in at 371 00:21:47,119 --> 00:21:49,880 Speaker 1: that time. And of course, before anyone writes in yes, 372 00:21:49,920 --> 00:21:54,080 Speaker 1: We're aware Xerox Park had developed the the g U 373 00:21:54,240 --> 00:21:59,159 Speaker 1: I years before. That's why he said popularize and home computers. 374 00:21:59,160 --> 00:22:01,919 Speaker 1: Those are two important parts of that discussion. Yeah, when 375 00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:04,359 Speaker 1: you were using an Apple two or a Commodore sixty 376 00:22:04,359 --> 00:22:09,399 Speaker 1: four VIC twenty UM, the Atari four eight hundred UM, 377 00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:14,119 Speaker 1: the early IBM PCs, you know, we're we're talking a 378 00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:18,520 Speaker 1: text based operating system primarily UM to get started with, 379 00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:21,560 Speaker 1: and then you know things things changed in the mid eighties. 380 00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:25,520 Speaker 1: But uh yeah, yeah, so we're not talking keyboard and mouse, 381 00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 1: we're talking keyboard and keyboard keyboard. Yeah, the and and 382 00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:34,159 Speaker 1: common Wood chose a pretty interesting way to market the 383 00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:36,840 Speaker 1: sixty four. Not only was it a cheaper computer than 384 00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:40,240 Speaker 1: all of its competitors, they decided to try and get 385 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:44,720 Speaker 1: the sixty four into retail stores, not just electronics stores. Yes, 386 00:22:44,840 --> 00:22:46,879 Speaker 1: so you can actually find a Commodore sixty four at 387 00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:51,159 Speaker 1: like a toy store, yeah, or a major retailer, And 388 00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 1: so they were you know, the idea was try and 389 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:56,919 Speaker 1: get this device in front of as many average consumers 390 00:22:56,960 --> 00:23:00,000 Speaker 1: as possible as opposed to throwing them in an elector 391 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:02,280 Speaker 1: ronic store where you really had more of a hobbyist 392 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:06,280 Speaker 1: kind of mentality, right, I mean, you don't. The average 393 00:23:06,280 --> 00:23:09,480 Speaker 1: consumer just wasn't necessarily walking into an electronics store on 394 00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:13,240 Speaker 1: a fairly regular basis. So that helped really push the 395 00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:15,480 Speaker 1: popularity of the common Wore sixty four. And in fact, 396 00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,640 Speaker 1: according to almost every source I could find, Uh, there 397 00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 1: was a point in some part of the discussion of 398 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 1: the Commover sixty four about it being the most popular 399 00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:30,080 Speaker 1: personal computer model ever. Yeah, that's kind of hard to 400 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:33,720 Speaker 1: quantify realistically, right, but but when you but if you 401 00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:37,320 Speaker 1: do limit it to saying one computer model, then it 402 00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:39,040 Speaker 1: makes it a little easier because then you're like, oh, 403 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:42,119 Speaker 1: all right, so you know, even though even though Max 404 00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,920 Speaker 1: might be or or Windows based PCs are really incredibly popular, 405 00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:49,120 Speaker 1: if you narrow it down to a single model, then 406 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:51,840 Speaker 1: then the game changes because there's so many different models 407 00:23:51,880 --> 00:23:55,640 Speaker 1: out there. But according to the Center for Computing History, 408 00:23:56,000 --> 00:24:02,640 Speaker 1: between Commodore sold around seventeen million units. That's quite a few. 409 00:24:02,880 --> 00:24:04,879 Speaker 1: That's a lot of a lot of computers, especially in 410 00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:09,680 Speaker 1: an age when computers weren't on everybody's list of things 411 00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:12,879 Speaker 1: to buy, right, and Commodore also took the approach of 412 00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:17,280 Speaker 1: developing the components for its computers itself, which helped keep 413 00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:19,600 Speaker 1: the price down. In fact, that's one of the reasons 414 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:23,320 Speaker 1: why the devices were priced where they were because they 415 00:24:23,359 --> 00:24:27,080 Speaker 1: had this we call it vertical integration. They had their 416 00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:30,920 Speaker 1: own We've mentioned the semiconductor manufacturing plant. Well, that was 417 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,320 Speaker 1: the thing about Commodore was that it was developing these 418 00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:36,000 Speaker 1: pieces itself, so it could keep the cost of manufacturing down, 419 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:40,320 Speaker 1: as opposed to purchasing chip sets from other companies, which 420 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:43,600 Speaker 1: would end up increasing the price of the units. Yeah. 421 00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:46,920 Speaker 1: For example, um, you talk about today's computers, somebody like 422 00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:52,120 Speaker 1: ACER or HP or Apple, they buy processors from Intel 423 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:55,760 Speaker 1: or maybe a m D in some cases, but Commodore 424 00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:59,200 Speaker 1: was building there's themselves, right, So I think I think 425 00:24:59,240 --> 00:25:03,119 Speaker 1: the price for producing a Commodore sixty four was around 426 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:06,000 Speaker 1: a hundred thirty five dollars and then they were selling them, 427 00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:10,240 Speaker 1: so it was a good profit margin for Commodore sixty 428 00:25:10,240 --> 00:25:13,400 Speaker 1: four once they once they started to really get popular 429 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:19,920 Speaker 1: in the market and the It's interesting what happened shortly 430 00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:24,080 Speaker 1: after the premiere of the Commodore sixty four, because there 431 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:27,680 Speaker 1: was a lot of upheaval in the Commodore company itself. 432 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:33,520 Speaker 1: In nineteen three, practically the entire team that developed the 433 00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:37,840 Speaker 1: Commodore sixty four, left Commodore and they started a new 434 00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 1: company called Peripheral Visions, and then that was renamed into 435 00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 1: in Sonic, which later on in the nineties was purchased 436 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 1: by Creative Labs, which makes sound cards, and they're very 437 00:25:49,520 --> 00:25:54,399 Speaker 1: popular sound card manufacturers, and so they're still around. Yes, yes, 438 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:58,560 Speaker 1: and uh, you know, Bob Yannis was one of those people. Um, 439 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,000 Speaker 1: David's Zembecki was one of them. So yeah, there was 440 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:05,040 Speaker 1: a whole bunch of people who were instrumental in the 441 00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:08,840 Speaker 1: development of the Commodore sixty four who by night three 442 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:11,480 Speaker 1: had decided they wanted to try and do their own thing. 443 00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:15,960 Speaker 1: And in nineteen eighty four, the founder of the company, Tramiel, 444 00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:20,360 Speaker 1: he quits Commodore. So this is thirty years after he's 445 00:26:20,359 --> 00:26:24,600 Speaker 1: founded this company originally, he quits and he founds a 446 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:29,960 Speaker 1: company called Trammel Technology. Um that same year, the Commodore 447 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 1: company purchases another company called the Amiga Corporation. So the 448 00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,880 Speaker 1: Mega Corporation was a startup company that was existing primarily 449 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 1: unventure capital and was running out of cash. So Amiga 450 00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:48,200 Speaker 1: Corporation was in some serious trouble. When Commodore comes around, 451 00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:50,280 Speaker 1: and says, all right, we're gonna purchase this company and 452 00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:56,640 Speaker 1: incorporate their technology into our business. Meanwhile, Trammel Technology purchases 453 00:26:56,760 --> 00:27:03,480 Speaker 1: another company called Atari. Now technically they only purchased one 454 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:05,959 Speaker 1: part of Atari, because at this point Atari was in 455 00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:09,119 Speaker 1: serious trouble. Keep in mind, this is so this is 456 00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:14,320 Speaker 1: after the video game Crash, which which decimated Atari. Actually 457 00:27:14,359 --> 00:27:16,680 Speaker 1: shouldn't use the word decimated. That has the whole one 458 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:23,919 Speaker 1: tenth thing. It really undermined ataries and so Travel Technology 459 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:28,679 Speaker 1: purchased Atari's consumer division. So now you've got Trammel Technology, 460 00:27:28,840 --> 00:27:31,720 Speaker 1: headed by Jack Tramiel, who is the founder of Commodore, 461 00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:38,400 Speaker 1: competing directly against Commodore, which is now purchased Amiga. By 462 00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:41,879 Speaker 1: the way, the whole Amiga and Atari stories do not 463 00:27:42,119 --> 00:27:45,440 Speaker 1: have happy endings. Um. And we've talked about the fact 464 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,400 Speaker 1: that Atari's story in particular did not have a happy 465 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:51,000 Speaker 1: ending because that company was broken up into so many 466 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:55,200 Speaker 1: different pieces, all of which kind of met with If 467 00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:59,399 Speaker 1: they met with success, it was very limited success. Now 468 00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:02,359 Speaker 1: they they both were sort of in a position to 469 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:07,320 Speaker 1: do some pretty good things. I mean, the sixty four left, uh, 470 00:28:07,560 --> 00:28:11,600 Speaker 1: Commodore was in a pretty good spot in the marketplace. Um. Yeah, 471 00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:13,840 Speaker 1: they even talked to this this guy named Bill about 472 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:18,200 Speaker 1: incorporating his version of Basic on their machines. Yeah, Gates, 473 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,000 Speaker 1: I feel like whatever happened to that guy? Well, he 474 00:28:21,119 --> 00:28:24,920 Speaker 1: started marketing a kind of shoe called the Conquistador that 475 00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:30,480 Speaker 1: they run pretty tight. Right, So, how many people out 476 00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:34,680 Speaker 1: there remember those ads the Bill Gates Jerry Seinfeld ads 477 00:28:34,720 --> 00:28:38,080 Speaker 1: raising my hand, Yeah, listeners, if you were not familiar 478 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:39,600 Speaker 1: with them, you should go check them out. They were 479 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:42,560 Speaker 1: only on television for like a month and a half, 480 00:28:43,440 --> 00:28:46,640 Speaker 1: and they were the strangest ads, and they weren't really 481 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 1: advertising anything in particular. It was it was very Seinfeld 482 00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:54,080 Speaker 1: ask It was the advertisement about nothing other than conquistadors, 483 00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 1: and they run pretty tight. Yep. But but yeah, Commodore 484 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:01,280 Speaker 1: was in a in a good spot, and uh this 485 00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:03,480 Speaker 1: the purchase of Amiga looked like it was going to 486 00:29:03,560 --> 00:29:07,480 Speaker 1: be a good deal because UM Amiga was next generation 487 00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:11,840 Speaker 1: technology and four thousand, ninety six colors um you know 488 00:29:11,960 --> 00:29:15,080 Speaker 1: that a processor that could run it, you know, like 489 00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:19,400 Speaker 1: hurts Omega hurts. I mean the introduced and they introduced 490 00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:22,360 Speaker 1: the Amiga computer in nineteen eight five, so just the 491 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:24,760 Speaker 1: year after they had purchased the company. The first Amiga 492 00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:29,360 Speaker 1: computer hits store shelves. Yeah, the uh the mac what 493 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:31,840 Speaker 1: is now the Mac Classic, The original Macintosh hit hit 494 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:37,360 Speaker 1: store shelves in four actually, um and uh Atari and 495 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,520 Speaker 1: Commodore right on their heels. Commodore with the the Amiga 496 00:29:40,560 --> 00:29:43,760 Speaker 1: and the ATR ST series, which was also running those 497 00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:47,880 Speaker 1: Motorola processors. Now, again this is a departure because the 498 00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:51,680 Speaker 1: the Amiga used the Motorola processor is its main processor, 499 00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:56,080 Speaker 1: so this is not an MS chip. And um, you 500 00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:58,800 Speaker 1: know this is this is where people who are still 501 00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:03,160 Speaker 1: Amiga fans these day, Um, you go, how did Commodore 502 00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:06,560 Speaker 1: managed to mess this up? Well, we've talked about that 503 00:30:06,600 --> 00:30:09,600 Speaker 1: in a podcast from long ago too. But this was 504 00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:12,600 Speaker 1: sort of the beginning of the end for for Commodore 505 00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:15,480 Speaker 1: because right off the success of the sixty four UM 506 00:30:15,520 --> 00:30:18,360 Speaker 1: they introduced the Amiga series and they sort of went 507 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:23,800 Speaker 1: along for a while, but they also introduced the Commodore one. 508 00:30:24,120 --> 00:30:26,760 Speaker 1: Ah yes, they won twenty was a little larger than 509 00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,960 Speaker 1: sixty four UM at least in and and it was 510 00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:33,320 Speaker 1: probably uh, I guess probably a lot of people would 511 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 1: consider it more attractive and had you know, it had 512 00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:43,600 Speaker 1: a slightly more streamline design. Um and it used an 513 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:47,360 Speaker 1: MS chip, so it was that's going back to commodore 514 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 1: z own chip set. Uh So, but the just didn't 515 00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:57,360 Speaker 1: didn't really, it's moderately successful. Moderately successful. Yeah, it's no 516 00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:00,920 Speaker 1: one really remembers that. Compared to the sixty four. When 517 00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:03,520 Speaker 1: you say Commodore, most people think, oh, Commodore sixty four. 518 00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:07,440 Speaker 1: They don't think Commodore or the Amiga. Frankly, yeah, well yeah, 519 00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:12,160 Speaker 1: Amiga fans love it sure like you. Um. But yeah. 520 00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:16,360 Speaker 1: So the at that point they started meeting with more 521 00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:20,280 Speaker 1: limited success and they started running into other issues and uh. 522 00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:22,400 Speaker 1: Over the course of the next few years, what really 523 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:28,640 Speaker 1: happened was IBM computers IBM either IBM clones. Eventually what 524 00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:32,680 Speaker 1: we just called Windows based PCs started to really take over, 525 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:37,200 Speaker 1: and Commodore just could not compete because at this point 526 00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:40,680 Speaker 1: you had instead of instead of having a single company 527 00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:43,920 Speaker 1: you're competing against or like a major competitor, So Commodore 528 00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:47,120 Speaker 1: and Apple, or even Commodore Apple and Atari, now you 529 00:31:47,240 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 1: had dozens of competitors because the these the approach that 530 00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:56,360 Speaker 1: everyone made with the IBM based PCs was that it 531 00:31:56,440 --> 00:32:01,080 Speaker 1: could be any manufacturer using those processors, and so you 532 00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:04,720 Speaker 1: had all these different companies spring up that We're developing 533 00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:08,200 Speaker 1: various kinds of computers, many of which were at a 534 00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:12,400 Speaker 1: similar price level to Commdoors, and some of them had 535 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:19,440 Speaker 1: richer feature sets. So now you had Commodore competing against uh, well, 536 00:32:19,480 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 1: like I said, dozens of companies, and it ultimately just 537 00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:28,200 Speaker 1: could not keep up. And in fact, in nineteen Commodore 538 00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:31,000 Speaker 1: declared bankruptcy. We went to Chapter eleven and filed for 539 00:32:31,040 --> 00:32:36,280 Speaker 1: bankruptcy protection. A company called s Com bought Commodore in 540 00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:41,680 Speaker 1: n but that did not go so well. Yeah, and 541 00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,920 Speaker 1: s Com had to declare bankruptcy in nineteen and was 542 00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:50,440 Speaker 1: actually liquidated. Nine seven, a Dutch company called Tulip Computers 543 00:32:50,520 --> 00:32:54,320 Speaker 1: in v bought the Commodore brand name, and since then 544 00:32:54,360 --> 00:32:59,880 Speaker 1: the Commodore brand name has continued in limited use. Yeah. 545 00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 1: The the Amiga properties intellectual properties also, they got divested 546 00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:09,600 Speaker 1: in the course of these feelings, and so UM Amiga 547 00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:14,800 Speaker 1: became a separate brand. UM. Actually Gateway purchased Amiga UM 548 00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:19,680 Speaker 1: and it's sort of bounced around UM. Both of them, 549 00:33:19,720 --> 00:33:24,560 Speaker 1: the brand names bounced around UM. The recent acquisition of 550 00:33:25,480 --> 00:33:30,600 Speaker 1: both has reunited the Commodore and Amiga brand names. The 551 00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:36,080 Speaker 1: machines they're making now are are basically windows machines, harkened 552 00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:38,520 Speaker 1: back to the old form factors. Yeah, they they have 553 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:40,920 Speaker 1: one that that actually looks very much like the sixty four. 554 00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:44,600 Speaker 1: It's got a chassis that looks like the sixty four, 555 00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:47,200 Speaker 1: but when you get down into the guts of it, 556 00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:50,120 Speaker 1: it's not a sixty four. No, no, not not technically. 557 00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:54,360 Speaker 1: But um, but it's kind of funny to see it happen. Um, 558 00:33:54,400 --> 00:33:57,040 Speaker 1: but it's it's amazing they're looking back at it. How 559 00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:01,040 Speaker 1: many programmers can say they got their start fiddling around 560 00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:04,440 Speaker 1: with the sixty four, that that their parents got them. Um. 561 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,720 Speaker 1: And some credit the success of the video game industry 562 00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:11,640 Speaker 1: to the Commodore sixty four simply because so many programmers 563 00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:16,040 Speaker 1: were born from the sixty four's ease of use as 564 00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:18,960 Speaker 1: a as a programming machine and or or at least 565 00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:23,560 Speaker 1: it's availability at a reasonable price. Um, you know, and 566 00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:26,640 Speaker 1: and it really sort of spawned the interest in programming 567 00:34:26,640 --> 00:34:30,760 Speaker 1: and programming games specifically, um, you know, for so many people, 568 00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:35,240 Speaker 1: and uh, you know, it's it's it's an amazing success 569 00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:38,320 Speaker 1: story and sort of a not really a one hit wonder, 570 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:41,640 Speaker 1: but kind of almost because it was such a star 571 00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:47,319 Speaker 1: for Commodore amid a very troubled future at that point 572 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:51,640 Speaker 1: for the company, So pretty amazing. Yeah, it was definitely 573 00:34:51,680 --> 00:34:57,080 Speaker 1: an interesting story. Uh. And and again, like I think 574 00:34:57,120 --> 00:34:59,640 Speaker 1: back when Commodore sixty four was at the height of 575 00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:02,080 Speaker 1: its pop pularity, it would have been really difficult to 576 00:35:02,160 --> 00:35:06,480 Speaker 1: imagine Commodore ending up the way it did, right, Like, 577 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,839 Speaker 1: you just wouldn't imagine that company going away. But it's 578 00:35:09,840 --> 00:35:13,279 Speaker 1: a good reminder to all of us that companies that 579 00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:18,680 Speaker 1: seem to be really successful and unstoppable, that's not necessarily 580 00:35:18,719 --> 00:35:21,799 Speaker 1: always going to be the case. So it's a I 581 00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:25,719 Speaker 1: think anyone getting into the computer industry or those who 582 00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:28,360 Speaker 1: are already in it should keep these kind of stories 583 00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:31,279 Speaker 1: in mind to try and avoid the pitfalls that other 584 00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:35,399 Speaker 1: companies have stumbled into. So even companies like Apple, where 585 00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:37,279 Speaker 1: you look at Apple and you think, wow, they've really 586 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:41,160 Speaker 1: got it together. They've got a great aesthetic, they've really 587 00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:45,600 Speaker 1: identified their market. They dominate in the market that they've identified. Um, 588 00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:49,480 Speaker 1: you've got to keep in mind the stories from companies 589 00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:52,160 Speaker 1: like Commodore to make sure that you know, you don't 590 00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:54,400 Speaker 1: just take that for granted. And then next thing, you know, 591 00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:57,759 Speaker 1: two or three years down the road, things start looking 592 00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:03,200 Speaker 1: pretty grim or or vice versa in Apple's case. UM, 593 00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:07,640 Speaker 1: but well, even IBM has gotten out of making personal computers, 594 00:36:08,040 --> 00:36:11,360 Speaker 1: even though they know Commodore sixty four helped popularize the 595 00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:16,760 Speaker 1: idea of home computing, but IBM's decision to allow clones 596 00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:21,960 Speaker 1: UM basically forced it out of the home computer business. 597 00:36:21,960 --> 00:36:25,279 Speaker 1: They got rid of their their home computer line and 598 00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:29,719 Speaker 1: let Lenovo take that UM and now they focus on 599 00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:33,120 Speaker 1: business computing. But it's it's amazing how these things change. 600 00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:35,480 Speaker 1: And they would never have thought that the controversy in 601 00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:38,040 Speaker 1: when it looked like HP was going to get on 602 00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:42,560 Speaker 1: personal computers and then they reverse their decision. And then yeah, 603 00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,080 Speaker 1: if you listen Cutthroat Business, Yeah, if you listen to 604 00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:48,359 Speaker 1: our our multi part episode about HP, you know all 605 00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:51,040 Speaker 1: about that. But yeah, that's one of those things you 606 00:36:51,120 --> 00:36:53,480 Speaker 1: just cannot take it for granted. But I think that's 607 00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:56,440 Speaker 1: a good discussion about the Commodore sixty four, a beloved 608 00:36:56,920 --> 00:37:00,520 Speaker 1: dinosaur in the personal computer history. And if you guys 609 00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:03,319 Speaker 1: have never had a chance to to play with one, UM, 610 00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:05,200 Speaker 1: I do recommend you you look it up. You know, 611 00:37:05,360 --> 00:37:07,360 Speaker 1: look at some photos of it and get an idea 612 00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:09,439 Speaker 1: of what we used to think of as a really 613 00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:14,080 Speaker 1: sophisticated machine back in the day, because folks like Chris 614 00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:17,520 Speaker 1: and myself were that's that's kind of what we we 615 00:37:17,680 --> 00:37:21,080 Speaker 1: identified as a personal computer back when we were kids. Um, 616 00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:23,759 Speaker 1: so take a look at that and then just um 617 00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:27,400 Speaker 1: go and hug your computer. All right. Well, that wraps 618 00:37:27,480 --> 00:37:30,759 Speaker 1: up this discussion. So if you guys want to get 619 00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:33,040 Speaker 1: in touch with us, you can drop us a line 620 00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:36,280 Speaker 1: on Facebook or Twitter. Our handle there is tech Stuff 621 00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:38,759 Speaker 1: h s W. Or you can write an email at 622 00:37:38,760 --> 00:37:43,560 Speaker 1: our brand new email address, tech Stuff at Discovery dot 623 00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:45,800 Speaker 1: com and Chris and I will talk to you again 624 00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:50,680 Speaker 1: really soon. Be sure to check out our new video podcast, 625 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:53,759 Speaker 1: Stuff from the Future. Join How Stuff Work staff as 626 00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:57,520 Speaker 1: we explore the most promising and perplexing possibilities of tomorrow. 627 00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:01,280 Speaker 1: The house Stuff Works I find Out has arrived. 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