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Speaker 1: Native Lampod is the production of iHeartRadio in partnership with

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Speaker 1: Reason Choice Media.

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Speaker 2: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome.

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Speaker 1: Okay, welcome to the Mini Pod. Today we got a

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Speaker 1: great viewer question asking us about supporting black elected who

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Speaker 1: might not support us. But I don't want to butcher

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Speaker 1: his words. He can say it much better than I

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Speaker 1: can take a Listen, Hey.

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Speaker 3: Native Lampod, this is Councilman Efao luclaytor of Shaker Heights, Ohio.

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Speaker 3: Welcome Bakari to the Native Welcome home, Baccary to the

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Speaker 3: Native lamp Pod. I wanted to ask you all. We're

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Speaker 3: in the season, a lot of us are trying to

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Speaker 3: root for everybody black, but when it comes to voting

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Speaker 3: and recognizing that there are black electives who maybe haven't

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Speaker 3: supported policies that support black communities and black Democrats even

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Speaker 3: that maybe our supporting policies aren't beneficial black communities, particularly

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Speaker 3: doing things completely opposite of what our activists, brothers and

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Speaker 3: sisters might be wanting us to do. I'm curious about

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Speaker 3: how you thread that need on how you hold black

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Speaker 3: colletin's accountable and they're running for higher office, and especially

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Speaker 3: when they've done when they support some policies that ultimately

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Speaker 3: will be harmful towards black communities.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, Thank you Counselman for that question and for

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Speaker 1: taking the time to weigh in. Who wants to jump

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Speaker 1: at that one?

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Speaker 4: I think.

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Speaker 2: No, no, I just I double down agree that that.

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Speaker 2: First of all, I do want to champion everything black,

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Speaker 2: but not at the cost of things that are black

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Speaker 2: and that are good for communities and good for good

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Speaker 2: you know, good for us, good for communities. And I'm

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Speaker 2: I'm frankly looking at something similar in my own city

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Speaker 2: where where some of the black council persons are not,

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Speaker 2: in my opinion, acting in the best intelligence or interest

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Speaker 2: or with an acknowledgment of the history that's just easily

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Speaker 2: available to us in their decision making. And it's and

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Speaker 2: it is a far gone conclusion as far as I'm concerned,

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Speaker 2: that some of that decision making is going to result

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Speaker 2: and bad impacts for our community, not just for black folks,

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Speaker 2: but for our community writ large. And so, you know, Mkara,

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Speaker 2: be interested in your perspective on this, because I know

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Speaker 2: we have both had to balance these things as elected officials.

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Speaker 2: But I think I think, in the spirit of the

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Speaker 2: last comment that was made. We have to interrogate everything,

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Speaker 2: and that all skin folks and kinfolk are Everybody who

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Speaker 2: stands up black and says that they'refore us is in

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Speaker 2: there necessarily acting in our interests. I think people largely

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Speaker 2: acting their interest and their interests are not always our interests.

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Speaker 2: You hope that as an elected official their interest is

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Speaker 2: in advancing their communities. But who knows what's gotten in

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Speaker 2: the mix. Who knows what's in that equation, Which is

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Speaker 2: why it's incumbent upon all of us to interrogate everything,

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Speaker 2: ask the tough questions, ask the why, and deal with

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Speaker 2: the fallout from it later. But if you're interested in

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Speaker 2: protecting your home, your community, your family, you damn well

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Speaker 2: but asked the questions and the right ones, or you

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Speaker 2: may find yourself on the wrong side of the impact.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: No, I think that's important because accountability is a two

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Speaker 5: way street. And I think that it goes to a

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Speaker 5: comment that I made on a previous episode about the

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Speaker 5: stagnant nature of our black leadership and our black institutions

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Speaker 5: and our black foundations. I mean, the best example is

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Speaker 5: even black elected officials really don't even show up in

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Speaker 5: our communities. This is a harsh over generalization until after

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Speaker 5: Labor Day and they do the same old thing. Let's

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Speaker 5: have a fish fry, let's go to the football game,

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Speaker 5: let's come to church, and then we expect people to

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Speaker 5: come out. I think that we have to have an

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Speaker 5: age old mantra, but a new way of doing it,

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Speaker 5: which is the meet voters where they are. And I

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Speaker 5: think that I find my greatest disappointment maybe because of

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Speaker 5: my level of expectation to be with black elected officials

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Speaker 5: not white ones. And the reason being is because I

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Speaker 5: don't necessarily have that same level of hope or expectation

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Speaker 5: that you're going to care for our community as I

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Speaker 5: would for black elected officials. And maybe that's a maybe

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Speaker 5: that's a downfall on my part, but I also think

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Speaker 5: it's incumbent upon our black ministers, our black small business owners,

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Speaker 5: our leadership in our communities to ensure that they are

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Speaker 5: holding these people accountable, Like we have to show up

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Speaker 5: at school board meetings, Andrew, we have to show up

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Speaker 5: at city council meetings. Like I would challenge our viewers

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Speaker 5: and listeners right now, like when was the last school

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Speaker 5: board meeting you went to? When was the last city

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Speaker 5: council meeting you went to, and not just you know,

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Speaker 5: tuning in to Fox or MSNBC or CNN to watch

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Speaker 5: what's happening at sixteen hundred Pennsylvania. Truly understanding what's happening

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Speaker 5: in our local communities is so important. So I think

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Speaker 5: that is a two way street. One they owe us.

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Speaker 5: They being our elected officials, owe us the discernment of

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Speaker 5: putting our interests first. Second, we owe them showing up

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Speaker 5: and showing out, listening and be a part of the democracy,

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Speaker 5: because democracy is participatory. And the best example I could

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Speaker 5: give you is when I was serving Andrew, the group

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Speaker 5: of people I paid the most attention to was AARP.

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Speaker 5: Why because they they vote and they showed up every

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Speaker 5: time every issue. AARP was right there in my doorstep.

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Speaker 5: Now a lot of them were black, a lot of

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Speaker 5: them were older black folks. But I'm with you one

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Speaker 5: hundred and fifty percent.

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Speaker 6: Can I just say here, and I just told you

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Speaker 6: if I didn't want all of us to say something

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Speaker 6: on every question, but I just want to say on

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Speaker 6: this one part. ARP is a model to look at,

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Speaker 6: and the reason for that is ARP does not expect

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Speaker 6: the elected officials to carry their agenda without telling them,

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Speaker 6: requiring out of them, demanding them to do so. And

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Speaker 6: for whatever reason, we think that when someone in office

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Speaker 6: looks like us, that they're automatically going to be carrying

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Speaker 6: our water.

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Speaker 4: And I think it is a big mistake.

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Speaker 6: I think that we really have to make sure that

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Speaker 6: we're clear, Yes, we can celebrate your ascension, but we

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Speaker 6: are also going to demand and require that you meet

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Speaker 6: our needs the same way with anybody else. It is

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Speaker 6: our seat, it is not just yours, and that means

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Speaker 6: that you have to ensure that you're representing our best

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Speaker 6: interests the last thing I'll say, and I think that

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Speaker 6: this is something across the board that we need to

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Speaker 6: deal with. There's a purity test that we expect people

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Speaker 6: to pass, whether they are in leadership somewhere at work,

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Speaker 6: in office, wherever, that we would not be able to

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Speaker 6: pass ourselves. It hurt my heart to see how people

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Speaker 6: who look like us cannibalize Jasmine right after her announcement

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Speaker 6: last week, cannibalized, you know, there are all these things

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Speaker 6: that they don't think she's gonna be able to do,

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Speaker 6: that she can't do, that she's not on the right

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Speaker 6: side of the issue. For I think it's fine to say,

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Speaker 6: I would like to see you pivot here or in

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Speaker 6: this way, but damn, you don't think.

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Speaker 4: She's gonna be better than John Cordon.

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Speaker 6: I mean, like, I'm sorry, so I wanted to be

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Speaker 6: able to hold both.

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Speaker 2: I didn't. I didn't hear that I didn't. I'm fortunate

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Speaker 2: to get to observe the keble.

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Speaker 1: Give us some examples.

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Speaker 6: I'm happy to so, and I'm happy to also send

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Speaker 6: you guys clips if that's helpful.

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Speaker 4: Jason's going to join us next week.

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Speaker 5: I dropped the chat. I dropped the whole article in

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Speaker 5: the group chat that we have about the elected officials. Now,

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Speaker 5: by the way, they would democrats to collected officials, and

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Speaker 5: they ain't put their name on it, but there was

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Speaker 5: a whole political article about those individuals who were mad

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Speaker 5: at Jasmine, who were in the House caucus for running.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, that's true too, but because they think that she

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Speaker 6: is not going to win, and that means that she

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Speaker 6: would not hold her seat. Because so when she announces

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Speaker 6: for Senate, she automatically has to not she won't be

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Speaker 6: in the House, and to be fair, she could lose

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Speaker 6: the House seat too because of how they we've redrawn

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Speaker 6: the districts in Texas, right. I don't think that's the case,

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Speaker 6: but that could be the case. So she announces for

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Speaker 6: Senate people think there are a lot of our elders

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Speaker 6: that think you should wait your turn. So there's that

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Speaker 6: thing happening. And then there's also a lot of folks

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Speaker 6: who felt like she was wrong on the Israel Gaza piece.

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Speaker 6: And so the things that have been said have almost

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Speaker 6: been like she's not said that she stands with Palestinian

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Speaker 6: people that she like they've they've just taken, they've taken.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think that's part of the accountability piece

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Speaker 2: that we're all arguing for.

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Speaker 6: Its wowow should it be effective?

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Speaker 2: Well, let me just say this. I think, first of all,

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Speaker 2: Democrats are the worst at negotiating against themselves before the

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Speaker 2: other side throws their terms out. We have already whittled

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Speaker 2: down the options of where we can go by just

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Speaker 2: debating amongst ourselves of what's possible and what is impossible.

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Speaker 2: And as far as I'm concerned, every person who has

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Speaker 2: ever broken any record over the history of time has

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Speaker 2: heard that this isn't your time, that you're not the

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Speaker 2: right one, that your profile isn't the right one to

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Speaker 2: get us to where it is that we're going. Well,

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Speaker 2: let me tell you if it worked for Beto, a

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Speaker 2: Congress member who quite frankly, at the time of his

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Speaker 2: running for the US and it had an undistinguishable record

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Speaker 2: as a member of Congress from a legislative standpoint, if

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Speaker 2: we were able to rally there and get a ninth

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Speaker 2: hour endorsement from beyonce An, a rallying cry from Democrats

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Speaker 2: across the country, by God, you surely can hang in

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Speaker 2: there for a woman who has gone out on the ledge,

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Speaker 2: put her reputation and service on the line, and service

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Speaker 2: to the best of us. So don't get me started

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Speaker 2: about the negotiating against ourselves. She is as right for

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Speaker 2: this moment as any other name that you might throw

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Speaker 2: out there, as far as I'm concerned, And let her

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Speaker 2: go through the contested process of determining whether or not

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Speaker 2: she ought to be the nominee, and from that go forward.

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Speaker 2: But the truth is that the Democrats, they're going to

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Speaker 2: be the first one's bed wedding, and the first one

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Speaker 2: is talking about what's not possible, what we can't do,

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Speaker 2: what records you absolutely have to have in order you're

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Speaker 2: going to compete in a state like Texas. And by

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Speaker 2: the way, everybody else who is never built in a

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Speaker 2: record has heard that same thing before they broke the record.

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Speaker 4: That's right.

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Speaker 5: Let me chime in SIMPLI and also say that it's

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Speaker 5: a really healthy primary in Texas. I mean a really

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Speaker 5: healthy primary. I know we're uplifting Jasmine as we should often,

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Speaker 5: but the Tarorleco fella ain't bad himself, and I think

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Speaker 5: the Jasmine. Look, whoever wins that primary is going to

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Speaker 5: be better for it. And I think that watching both

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Speaker 5: of them run this race is going to be something

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Speaker 5: that Democrats need more of. I mean, you know, instead

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Speaker 5: of crowning it or on the flip side with Andrew's

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Speaker 5: talking about saying who ain't qualified when they announce it's

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Speaker 5: because of X y Z. This is what people want

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Speaker 5: to see, a very very healthy primary. Let them get out.

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Speaker 4: Hold people to the same standard.

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Speaker 5: That's what I was about to say, Like, we also

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Speaker 5: need to put the Terry lecos his record of helping

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Speaker 5: black folk or not helping black folk up in the

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Speaker 5: light because I don't know, but you know, a state

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Speaker 5: house record don't have that many wards. But can me

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Speaker 5: and Andrew can put it up in the light and

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Speaker 5: see where it stands. But we need to go through

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Speaker 5: that process with him, just as we're like the same.

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Speaker 5: That's what I'm That's what I'm trying to articulate. Not well,

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Speaker 5: the same robust standard that black folks and Democrats are

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Speaker 5: putting Jasmine through the ringer, they need to put Tera

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Speaker 5: Leco through that same ringer. Because I think both of

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Speaker 5: them are good, and I think this process is healthy

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Speaker 5: for both of them.

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Speaker 2: I think a contesting process is always the best period.

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Speaker 2: I was neverdvocating for any of my opponents to be

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Speaker 2: put out of the race. I don't think any of

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Speaker 2: them should be simarily dismissed simply because we had a

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Speaker 2: difference of opinion. I thought we ought to go through

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Speaker 2: the process. And as we're saying here, if you're going

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Speaker 2: to hold me to a standard, just hold them to

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Speaker 2: the same standard. The cheapness by which we are willing

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Speaker 2: to give away our vote in our community simply because

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Speaker 2: a person of a different skin color showed up at

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Speaker 2: the barbecue. They didn't promise that this to anything. They

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Speaker 2: hadn't gotten us anything in the legislative record product to

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Speaker 2: this point, but the showing a face was enough for

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Speaker 2: them to be qualified. I show my face, but it's

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Speaker 2: expected I'm gonna show mine, right, But if they do,

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Speaker 2: you know, the damn star has been hung.

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Speaker 1: I hear you, I hear y'all saying the same thing,

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Speaker 1: but about two different groups. And I'm interested in this, Angela,

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Speaker 1: because we were just talking about this a couple of

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Speaker 1: months ago. So one is the infrastructure of the Democratic Party,

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Speaker 1: like undercutting each other trash.

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Speaker 4: Right.

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Speaker 1: Then there's the other point in Angela, you found yourself

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Speaker 1: in the crosshairs with some people over this, over like

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Speaker 1: holding our elected officials accountable. Like it doesn't mean that

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Speaker 1: you're saying, like we don't want this person, but declaring

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Speaker 1: that we have a right to demand that they live

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Speaker 1: in service to us, Like we elected them. Our salaries

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Speaker 1: pay or our tax dollars pay their salaries. You know

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Speaker 1: what I'm talking about. I'm talking about Gavin. Gavin. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So I don't know. I'm trying to figure out like

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Speaker 1: telling voters like, yes, you can hold them accountable, Yes

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Speaker 1: you can demand of them what you want.

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Speaker 5: There do you have enough gang signs with kay, I'm

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Speaker 5: a gang member on the weekends. But there's also a third.

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Speaker 5: There's also a third thing, which is that we we

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Speaker 5: I touched on a little bit, but I see in

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Speaker 5: my professional career as a lawyer, but we also do

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Speaker 5: it in elected politics, which is what Andrews talking about,

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Speaker 5: which is black folks, we have this theory that their

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Speaker 5: ice is coded than ours. And that's some of y'all niggas,

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Speaker 5: they exactly like I mean, whether or not, it's the collective. Yeah,

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Speaker 5: I mean, I'm just quote somebody had come in my

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Speaker 5: office with a with a criminal case. I'll quote him

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Speaker 5: twenty five thousand dollars, right, and they'll go right down

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Speaker 5: the street to the white person with twenty five thousand

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Speaker 5: dollars and pay it because his ice is coded in ours.

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Speaker 5: And as Andrew was saying, just because James is at

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Speaker 5: the barbecue now, I do want to give him a

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Speaker 5: chance to interrogate his record, but like we just can't

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Speaker 5: say that all of a sudden, he's.

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Speaker 4: Sposed to me a selfie lit the black people.

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Speaker 6: That he like down for the car. It's so annoying,

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Speaker 6: and I think that is it too. It's just like

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Speaker 6: what like I hate that mentality and I hate to

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Speaker 6: go back into Gavin.

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Speaker 4: But just like that he's only he the only one

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Speaker 4: we got. He's fighting. He the best he gets trumped, right, wet.

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Speaker 2: Is that you don't you don't You say these are

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Speaker 2: the last thing enduring elements of racism and white supremacy.

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Speaker 2: I mean this is else well, no, but these are

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Speaker 2: the remnants, the last These are the gifts that just

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Speaker 2: keep on giving that white is right, and that if

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Speaker 2: it's not right white, then it deserves all these other

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Speaker 2: layers of conditions that we would never expect it say,

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Speaker 2: I couldn't be more tired because I lived as I

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Speaker 2: lived every week, every day. It seems as an elected

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Speaker 2: official of having to overprove and you know, on every level,

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Speaker 2: because I wasn't white, and I'm running in a community

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Speaker 2: that has never been majority black, in a state that

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Speaker 2: is less than twelve percent of the electric is black.

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Speaker 5: And there's this.

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Speaker 2: But my service has never just been to that by

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Speaker 2: the way it's been to that, and by effect of

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Speaker 2: helping all of us, and you just happen to help

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Speaker 2: those who often find themselves at the bottom of every checklist.

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Speaker 2: And by helping that you lift the boat. I mean truly,

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Speaker 2: you get to lift the condition for everybody else. But

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Speaker 2: that argument was never good enough.

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Speaker 1: Ourselves first, you know, I think that is like healing.

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Speaker 4: That's the period. The foundation tip is.

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Speaker 6: It's so right because at the end of the day,

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Speaker 6: what we keep doing is succumbing to the nature of

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Speaker 6: the abusive, toxic relationship dynamic, and that is what it is.

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Speaker 4: It's like, we don't think we deserve better.

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Speaker 6: If you just acknowledge us, if you just take this

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Speaker 6: picture with us, if you could just wrap that lyric,

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Speaker 6: if you could just do them where my fans at dance,

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Speaker 6: if you could like then all of that is.

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Speaker 4: Like, Oh, he did owt for the cause. Tho what

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Speaker 4: does his policy say?

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Speaker 2: You know?

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Speaker 6: And I think what is interesting Tubacari's point is there

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Speaker 6: was all of this criticism, you know of the folks

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Speaker 6: who critique Gavin, but with Wes Moore, there was a

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Speaker 6: ton of criticism for him saying, no, we've already done

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Speaker 6: the studies.

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Speaker 4: Now it's time for us to do the work.

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Speaker 6: Well, you all know that just this week the state

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Speaker 6: legislature and Maryland over has overridden that veto and now

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Speaker 6: they're going to do a study. And I just would

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Speaker 6: urge the folks in Maryland to consider what you all

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Speaker 6: going to do after the study's back, because that's what I.

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Speaker 4: Want to get to. I'm not mad at the study, though,

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Speaker 4: but how many more studies do we need? And that

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Speaker 4: was Wes's point. It's like we've studied this five times

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Speaker 4: in Maryland.

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Speaker 2: What leads us to studies oftentimes is the fact that

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Speaker 2: our white liberal colleagues, and certainly the white folks on

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Speaker 2: the Republican side, demand that we must have an accounting

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Speaker 2: for every cent, line dollar whatever of the conditions before

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Speaker 2: we can then move to solutions. So we then chase

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Speaker 2: that rabbit, We then get that rabbit, and then a

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Speaker 2: new condition gets set into motion. And I don't envy

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Speaker 2: really any side of this, because the truth is is

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Speaker 2: that the cheese just keeps moving, and it's going to

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Speaker 2: move again after this survey is done. There'll be another

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Speaker 2: condition that must be in place before we can then

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Speaker 2: get to the action, and then there'll be another thing

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Speaker 2: that is imposed on that before we can then again

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Speaker 2: get to the action. This is a cyclical motion that

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Speaker 2: they already know in advance. The delay tactic will always

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Speaker 2: be the demand for the next thing that keeps you

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Speaker 2: from getting to the thing. That's always going to be

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Speaker 2: the condition.

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Speaker 1: I think this is a conversation that Native Land will

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Speaker 1: be revisiting many times, so we're gonna leave it right there.

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Speaker 1: Thank you guys so much for tuning into these mini pods.

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Speaker 1: Remember these drop every Friday, and don't forget to keep

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Speaker 1: sending us here, videos, questions, comments. You never know you

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Speaker 1: may be the subject of our next mini pod. Happy holidays, guys,

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Speaker 1: We'll see you next time.

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Speaker 5: Native Lamb Pod is a production of iHeartRadio and partnership

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