Speaker 1: A warning. This episode contains depictions of violence and conversations
Speaker 1: about suicide that may be disturbing and triggering for some listeners.
Speaker 1: If you are struggling with suicidal thoughts, please fast forward
Speaker 1: to the end of this episode to find out where
Speaker 1: help is available. Two couples meet up the night of
Speaker 1: October twenty second, nineteen ninety seven. The next morning, eighteen
Speaker 1: year old Anastasia Whitbolsfugen is found murdered. Two days later,
Speaker 1: her boyfriend, twenty year old Justin Bruton, is found dead,
Speaker 1: having taken his own life. The investigation into what happened
Speaker 1: to these two young people is now entering its third week.
Speaker 2: Well, have you talked to anybody that might be had
Speaker 2: some credible information.
Speaker 1: And it's taking detectives down some unexpected roads.
Speaker 3: It's all I feel is that the same we'll give
Speaker 3: it a name, We'll call it a demon. Same demon
Speaker 3: killed on a stage that killed Justine. The same energy
Speaker 3: was present. That's what I feel, and that's not what
Speaker 3: you want.
Speaker 4: I know.
Speaker 1: Well, the investigation gained some traction or will someone threaten
Speaker 1: to derail it? I'm Leah Rothman. This is the real Killer.
Speaker 1: Episode three? How do you sleep at night. On November seventh,
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety seven, two weeks after Anastasia was killed, Lee
Speaker 1: Detective Sergeant Gary Kilgore gets a call from eighteen year
Speaker 1: old Byron Case. He's one half of the other couple
Speaker 1: who had been out with Anastasia and Justin the night
Speaker 1: of October twenty. Second Sergeant Kilgore writes in a report
Speaker 1: that Byron says he's calling on behalf of himself and
Speaker 1: some other friends who are concerned and wondering if anything
Speaker 1: new has been uncovered about Anastasia's death. Kil Gore says
Speaker 1: not really, then takes the opportunity to ask Byron if
Speaker 1: he's heard anything about the murder. Byron says he heard
Speaker 1: Anastasia was shot twice in the head with a handgun,
Speaker 1: and he's heard rumors there was a suicide pact between him,
Speaker 1: his girlfriend Kelly Moffatt, Justin, and Anastasia, but he says
Speaker 1: that isn't true, and Byron says he doesn't believe Justin
Speaker 1: killed Anastasia. Kil Gore asks if either he or Kelly
Speaker 1: were present when Anastasia was killed. Byron says no, neither
Speaker 1: of them were present. About a week later, Anastasia's stepmom,
Speaker 1: Diane Marshall calls Sergeant Kilgore. It was Diane who dropped
Speaker 1: Anastasia off that night at Mount Washington Cemetery to meet
Speaker 1: up with Justin and friends. Diane shares with Sergeant Kilgore
Speaker 1: one theory she has about what might have happened that night.
Speaker 1: You will hear a few beeps during their recorded call and.
Speaker 5: After a few after a short while of living with
Speaker 5: Antasia this summer, I think Justin discovered a big gap
Speaker 5: between the reality and the fantasy of their relationship.
Speaker 4: What that leads me to is that.
Speaker 5: He got more into drops. I just have to make
Speaker 5: that assumption, and it's further away from reality. And I
Speaker 5: think somehow he must have patched an idea. I'm just
Speaker 5: telling you my speculations, but he must attached an idea
Speaker 5: of himself an Anastasia in an ideal act life. So
Speaker 5: there's this fantasy idea.
Speaker 1: Diane wonders, what if Justin might have lured Anastasia out
Speaker 1: with the idea that if they both committed suicide, they
Speaker 1: could be together eternally.
Speaker 5: There's a reference in one of her letters him about
Speaker 5: how he's mentioned her away where.
Speaker 6: They can meet together forever.
Speaker 5: And I think she is that pie compared. I think
Speaker 5: he was at far off base that he right now.
Speaker 1: Of course you know there's But what Diane says she
Speaker 1: doesn't understand is how or why Anastasia ended up in
Speaker 1: Lincoln Cemetery, the cemetery where she was eventually found dead,
Speaker 1: not Mount Washington Cemetery where Diane dropped her off.
Speaker 5: Not a walk, not a hiker. He was not a
Speaker 5: person that one with nature she was, she would not have.
Speaker 5: I mean there's no street line since there anything. She
Speaker 5: was not the kind of person.
Speaker 7: Would boldly go into.
Speaker 5: Natural wooded surrounding.
Speaker 1: Sergeant Kilgore asks Diane what Anastasia was wearing when she
Speaker 1: dropped her off at Mount Washington Cemetery. Diane says she
Speaker 1: remembers she was wearing a tan corduroy jacket and assumes
Speaker 1: she was dressed as she usually was, meaning black jeans,
Speaker 1: But Diane says she can't remember that specifically, so it
Speaker 1: seems no new or concrete information is learned from Diane.
Speaker 1: When the files from Justin and Anastasia's computer's hard drives
Speaker 1: are in, Kilgore notes in a report, the only one
Speaker 1: that appeared to be of any value. On Justin's drive
Speaker 1: is an unnamed document, possibly written by Anastasia. Data says
Speaker 1: it was created on October twentieth and last saved on
Speaker 1: the twenty first. Those are the two days leading up
Speaker 1: to the night in question. The document is one long paragraph,
Speaker 1: which in part says quote, I may annoy you, you
Speaker 1: annoy me. It's a match made in hell. I want
Speaker 1: you to love me. I want you to feel pain
Speaker 1: if I ever leave you. It goes on to say,
Speaker 1: I don't care what Byron thinks of me. I never
Speaker 1: cared what anyone thought of me until I loved you.
Speaker 1: Then I only cared what you thought of me. Byron
Speaker 1: can go fuck himself for all I care. I wish
Speaker 1: I could kill myself. I wanted to do it before,
Speaker 1: but I couldn't because I firmly believed that you would
Speaker 1: come back to me. The only person's opinion I care
Speaker 1: about is yours. So fuck me. You and Byron deserve
Speaker 1: each other because that seems to be the one you want,
Speaker 1: someone who shares your brain and your thinking, and so
Speaker 1: fuck me. So that's the only noteworthy thing found on
Speaker 1: Justin's computer. On Anastasia's there's a bit more like some emails.
Speaker 1: There's one email she wrote to a friend dated April
Speaker 1: twenty sixth, nineteen ninety seven, where she talks about how
Speaker 1: Justin wouldn't take her to prom so Byron was going
Speaker 1: to take her. In another email, dated May tenth, she
Speaker 1: wrote that some guy was talking all sorts of crap
Speaker 1: about Byron and she felt like beating him senseless. She
Speaker 1: told the guy to shut the fuck up and that
Speaker 1: he doesn't even really know Byron, so he shouldn't be talking,
Speaker 1: especially when the person he's talking about is one of
Speaker 1: her best friends. On October eighteenth, four days before the
Speaker 1: night she was murdered, Anastasia wrote an email that says,
Speaker 1: a quote from Gabrielle Garcia Marquez, the only regret I
Speaker 1: will have in dying is if it's not for love,
Speaker 1: would you die for love? On November fourteenth, Sergeant Kilgore
Speaker 1: and Anastasia's dad, Bob Whitplesfugen, speak over the phone. Bob
Speaker 1: says he wants to share something he remembered. Anastesia told
Speaker 1: him their conversation is recording.
Speaker 8: Okay, now, I recall a conversation with my daughter about
Speaker 8: just having a gun, purchasing it for three hundred and
Speaker 8: fifty dollars and only got one hundred and twenty five
Speaker 8: dollars for when he sold it, and she said that
Speaker 8: Byron took care of the sale. Only she didn't believe
Speaker 8: Byron actually sold it. She thinks Byron kept it.
Speaker 4: Why would she take that or did you ask?
Speaker 9: I didn't ask.
Speaker 8: I was more concerned about whether there was still a
Speaker 8: gun in their position.
Speaker 7: She mentioned that.
Speaker 8: That just look angry at Byron for only getting a
Speaker 8: hundred twenty five dollars for it, and she felt that
Speaker 8: Byron's base is not honest, samful about having even sold
Speaker 8: a gun because he only came up with one hundred
Speaker 8: and twenty five dollars for MY quick query to her
Speaker 8: was come he thinks he only got one hundred and
Speaker 8: twenty five for it? She answered once that she didn't
Speaker 8: think Byron actually sold as she saw that Byron just
Speaker 8: gave Justin one hundred and twenty five dollars to keep quiet.
Speaker 1: But I am did Byron secretly keep Justin's gun and
Speaker 1: not tell anyone about it? So far it's just conjecture,
Speaker 1: but investigators are able to get the ATF transaction record
Speaker 1: for the gun. It seems Justin purchased it on September
Speaker 1: twenty seventh, less than a month before Anastasia's murder. The
Speaker 1: gun was a Remington twelve gage shotgun model eight seventy
Speaker 1: and he bought it at a Walmart in Kansas City.
Speaker 1: It's the same make and model as the one he
Speaker 1: bought the morning of October twenty third. That gun was
Speaker 1: found lying next to him. But investigators don't know what
Speaker 1: happened to the gun justin bod in September. There doesn't
Speaker 1: seem to be any record of him selling it back
Speaker 1: to Bob and Sergeant Kilgore's phone call but h.
Speaker 8: And then my wife remarked this morning that.
Speaker 10: You may be having some difficulty getting a hold of Byron.
Speaker 10: So I haven't had any problems getting back with him
Speaker 10: on that kit. Did you locate Patrick Rock's phone number here?
Speaker 9: Yeah, and I can recall it right now.
Speaker 4: It's three two one to.
Speaker 1: Patrick Rock. That's a name you haven't heard so far.
Speaker 1: He's a close friend of the Whipple's Fugen family. As
Speaker 1: a way to honor Anastasia, Patrick starts a memorial website.
Speaker 1: Included on the website are photos of Anastasia, who was
Speaker 1: really beautiful. She had reddish brown hair and hazel eyes.
Speaker 1: There's also some of her poetry and artwork. There's mention
Speaker 1: of the music she was into, like the Beatles, the
Speaker 1: Cure and Soussi and the Banshees, and her interests like
Speaker 1: Star Trek conventions, public radio fundraisers, causes like free speech
Speaker 1: on the web, and organizations like Amnesty International. The website
Speaker 1: is updated often adding tributes to Anastasia, links to media coverage,
Speaker 1: the announcement of a ten thousand dollars reward, which will
Speaker 1: eventually be increased to fifteen thousand dollars, and criticism of
Speaker 1: the Jackson County Sheriff's departments handling of the investigation. The
Speaker 1: large file I received from the Sheriff's Department includes dozens
Speaker 1: of printed pages from this website. They must have printed
Speaker 1: them every time it was updated. Reading about Anastasia and
Speaker 1: what she was into makes me really sad. We liked
Speaker 1: some of the same music and were interested in some
Speaker 1: of the same causes. Although I never got the chance
Speaker 1: to know her, There's something about Anastasia I identify with
Speaker 1: that feels familiar. Her young young life was cut short,
Speaker 1: so brutally and so unnecessarily, But me describing Anastasia based
Speaker 1: off her emails and a website can't compare to hearing
Speaker 1: about who she really was from her own family. Here
Speaker 1: is her father, Bob. His audios not great.
Speaker 11: The activities she was building, individual and thoughtful. She had
Speaker 11: triends to attending the University of Sitting in the Surrey back.
Speaker 11: She had the role there during the summer of ninety seven.
Speaker 11: Many times I start heading and she only laughter. And
Speaker 11: she was also sullen and salty and needing individuals to
Speaker 11: confuy them. She did explore different activities she had justin
Speaker 11: to do that with and you have to ask a
Speaker 11: sister fan for more specific instant. I was just a dad.
Speaker 1: I reached out to Anastasia's sisters, Francesca who goes by
Speaker 1: Friend and Emma to see if they would be willing
Speaker 1: to share some of their memories of Anastasia with me. Reluctantly,
Speaker 1: yet graciously, they agreed. Sadly, Friend was fifteen when Anastasia
Speaker 1: was killed. Emma was only four. I first asked them
Speaker 1: to tell me a little bit about Anastasia. Friend begins,
Speaker 1: then Emma jumps in.
Speaker 12: She was super intelligent, so I think she could carry
Speaker 12: a conversation with anybody. She could be really funny. I
Speaker 12: guess maybe in a Marsery broad Way. Yeah, I can
Speaker 12: imagine that she carried herself, you know, publicly, like in
Speaker 12: a way that she.
Speaker 13: Might have been a drama queen.
Speaker 1: Was that passed down from your mom, from your dad
Speaker 1: or was it just being a teenager?
Speaker 13: It was just who she was at that point, Probably
Speaker 13: just being a teenager.
Speaker 8: I don't know.
Speaker 14: There was We could get into our parents and just
Speaker 14: you know, emotional ball little stuff, but I don't like
Speaker 14: to think that it was that.
Speaker 12: I think, you know, she was just similar to our
Speaker 12: dad though, like stubborn. I think that short temper to
Speaker 12: a degree. Yeah, oh yeah, that's where I get it from.
Speaker 13: You're you're unique. Don't worry about.
Speaker 1: What kind of stuff was Annestatian two.
Speaker 14: I think she was like interest stood in Amnesty International
Speaker 14: and human rights and didn't rights. She studied Latin in
Speaker 14: school and wrote poetry, and she was the best Vietnam.
Speaker 12: Yeah, she did drama club, drama class, and she wanted
Speaker 12: to travel the world.
Speaker 14: So I wanted to go to Italy and stuff, and yeah,
Speaker 14: I liked the cure and other golf stuff. Some Green
Speaker 14: Day some Sussi and the ban Cheese.
Speaker 7: I don't know.
Speaker 13: Can you think of others like Pearlin, Nirvana, a lot
Speaker 13: of nineties alternative music.
Speaker 14: She liked Pinky and the Brain. And did she like
Speaker 14: Wallace and Gromit. Huh yeah, okay, so I watched that
Speaker 14: sort of stuff. Yeah, growing up too, we had the
Speaker 14: v VHS's.
Speaker 1: And what movie were you into for a while.
Speaker 14: Oh, Anastasia, I was. I couldn't really tell you exactly why,
Speaker 14: but probably some part of me wanted to imagine my
Speaker 14: sister because I mean, she wasn't there anymore by the
Speaker 14: time that I started really having memories, and so I'd
Speaker 14: like to imagine her as a princess or whatever, you know,
Speaker 14: a fantastical tale. And that movie was intensely popular around
Speaker 14: that time, but it had her name.
Speaker 1: Was she like a typical oldest sister or was she
Speaker 1: like protective of the other girls? Just sort of describe
Speaker 1: an stage in terms of her being a sister.
Speaker 12: She's definitely the big sister. I wouldn't say she was
Speaker 12: overly protective of us. She is pretty independent when it
Speaker 12: came to herself. I guess living with her in my
Speaker 12: dad's house and going to Lincoln together for high schochool.
Speaker 13: She was pretty protective of me.
Speaker 12: She would welcome me at some degree to hang out
Speaker 12: with her and a few of her friends, and then
Speaker 12: other points like definitely when it came to Byron, she
Speaker 12: kept me at an arm's length, like she didn't. She
Speaker 12: was very protective of me, I think in terms of
Speaker 12: she knew that he wasn't someone she wanted around her
Speaker 12: little sister, So I definitely see that as her being protective.
Speaker 13: In a way.
Speaker 12: She was definitely vocal to me about Kelly and Byron's
Speaker 12: age difference.
Speaker 13: Whether she didn't like Kelly, she did not like that
Speaker 13: relationship at all.
Speaker 12: She did not like them basically moving into Justin's place
Speaker 12: is what the way she made it sound to me,
Speaker 12: like they were always there.
Speaker 13: She probably had her reasons for, you know, keeping me.
Speaker 13: I didn't.
Speaker 5: I don't.
Speaker 12: I met Byron only a couple times, like in real life,
Speaker 12: and she was friends with him since middle school. So
Speaker 12: I remember hearing, you know, their phone conversations when they
Speaker 12: were in middle school and just thinking like this guy
Speaker 12: has like got something wrong with him, like he's you know,
Speaker 12: getting in trouble going to psychiatric words in juvenile hall
Speaker 12: and breaking into relatives' houses, could go.
Speaker 13: To Lincoln get it, Yeah, getting kicked out of Lincoln.
Speaker 12: Things like that, Like, I you know, he piqued my curiosity,
Speaker 12: but also I think spoke to Anastasia that she would
Speaker 12: be friends with somebody that maybe didn't have a lot
Speaker 12: of friends and that was kind of hard to love.
Speaker 13: She didn't give up on him.
Speaker 1: I then ask Fran what she remembers about Anastasia and
Speaker 1: Justin's relationship.
Speaker 12: I just remember like thinking about it, like that's I mean,
Speaker 12: they didn't know each other that long before, you know,
Speaker 12: she was thinking they were going to be together forever.
Speaker 12: I think she believed they would get married. So when
Speaker 12: they started to have problems, she was not willing to accept.
Speaker 12: I guess that's part of her personality too, is she
Speaker 12: is very headstrong and stubborn, so she wasn't willing to
Speaker 12: scept that it was going to be over. On his terms,
Speaker 12: she had told me he suffered from depression, so he
Speaker 12: was a little bit more standoffish and quiet, and he
Speaker 12: was polite. Yeah, I think my sister was kind of jealous.
Speaker 12: The only like, one of the only memories I have
Speaker 12: of going out with them together was to the young
Speaker 12: Casey bookstore and some.
Speaker 13: Bookstore employee college girl.
Speaker 12: Was talking to him, and Anastasia got a little jealous,
Speaker 12: and I remember thinking, like, pastilly, that was or whatever.
Speaker 14: But those are the memories you have.
Speaker 6: I know.
Speaker 13: It's kind of like, oh that's and.
Speaker 12: I think they were joking about it, like in some
Speaker 12: ways Anastasia was insecure with herself, maybe so that she
Speaker 12: she believed or she thought maybe justin what might be
Speaker 12: too good for her kind of dynamic, especially because his
Speaker 12: family did come from money, was the impression that he gave.
Speaker 15: So they worked at the bookstore together or not the
Speaker 15: bookstore store a store on the plaza, a store of
Speaker 15: knowledge on the plaza for very long.
Speaker 14: No, well, none of this was for very long.
Speaker 13: Yeah, it is such.
Speaker 1: An interesting friend. Emma and I talked some more than
Speaker 1: Emma reminds me of what's at stake.
Speaker 13: You have immense power in your hands.
Speaker 1: It's it's a very big responsibility, and I don't take
Speaker 1: it lately because ultimately it's about your sister. So sorry,
Speaker 1: I'm getting all tripped up, but yeah, and and yeah,
Speaker 1: so thank you, thank you too. Sorry I'm a mess. Okay,
Speaker 1: thank you. Have a good rest of your evening after.
Speaker 1: I am incredibly thankful to Fran and Emma for sharing
Speaker 1: some of their memories of Anastasia with me. You will
Speaker 1: hear more from them down the line. I also reached
Speaker 1: out to Justin's sister to see if she and or
Speaker 1: her mom might be open to talking with me, but
Speaker 1: she never responded. From the photos I've seen, Justin was
Speaker 1: a good looking kid, tall, brown hair, brown eyes, and
Speaker 1: he wore wire rimmed glasses. It seems he was in
Speaker 1: his second year at the University of Missouri at Kansas City,
Speaker 1: studying journalism, although I think he had stopped going to
Speaker 1: classes that fall. Justin loved animals. He and Anastasia had
Speaker 1: a black cat together named Pagan, and from all accounts,
Speaker 1: Justin was a very kind and gentle soul. On November twentieth,
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety seven, fifteen year old Kelly Moffatt, Byron's girlfriend,
Speaker 1: meets with Sergeant Kilgore at the Dairy Queen where they
Speaker 1: picked Anastasia up that night. Although kil Gore has already
Speaker 1: interviewed Kelly, he wants her now to show him exactly
Speaker 1: where they went and what they did leading up to
Speaker 1: Anastasia getting out of Justin's car. Kelly is accompanied by
Speaker 1: her mom, Deborah Moffatt, who chimes in later.
Speaker 4: Yah, I have a couple of questions before we get started.
Speaker 4: Have you ever known Byron to own again any gain
Speaker 4: at all?
Speaker 6: Not that I've seen him.
Speaker 4: Okay, has he ever had one? In his position?
Speaker 6: Justin was only one that had bought the gun at
Speaker 6: wal Wine.
Speaker 4: Do you know where that particular gun is? Had you
Speaker 4: ever seen again? Wait?
Speaker 16: Yeah, actually I saw it at his condo, But I
Speaker 16: mean I've never seen him fire or anything because him
Speaker 16: and Byron are everybody's like that stupid it cost too
Speaker 16: much and it's like just like a big toy.
Speaker 4: Okay. Do you know if Byron disposed of the weapon
Speaker 4: for him?
Speaker 6: No? But I know all I knew was that Justin
Speaker 6: didn't have the gun anymore.
Speaker 4: Okay. On the the night that you, you and Byron
Speaker 4: and Justin picked up Anastasia, you're here at this dairy, queen,
Speaker 4: it is Crand Okay, what time did Justin and Byron
Speaker 4: first get over to your house.
Speaker 6: After m h It was probably fivety no, or maybe
Speaker 6: even a little bit earlier.
Speaker 4: And when you guys left there, where did you go?
Speaker 6: There's a I don't know.
Speaker 16: There's a gas station by my house if we went there,
Speaker 16: so that they could get something to drink in this
Speaker 16: gas Oh and also Justin called Anastasia from there because
Speaker 16: their plans have been all screwed up. She can't right up.
Speaker 6: Probably right after they picked me up, So like five forty.
Speaker 4: Five or so, we called her from this gas station.
Speaker 16: Yeah, from the paphone there because he she like left
Speaker 16: weird messages on his answering machine, so just to like
Speaker 16: find out what happened, he called her. How she wasn't there,
Speaker 16: pushes r Frian goes, well, she got an end up
Speaker 16: to at wash and he goes, well, I told her
Speaker 16: that I couldn't go, and she canted the plans with
Speaker 16: an and so then he's like, well, great, we better
Speaker 16: get back to Westport so that I can.
Speaker 6: Take my answering machine.
Speaker 16: Because he didn't know where she was, but once he
Speaker 16: found out she was here, then he just wanted to
Speaker 16: build here.
Speaker 1: Kelly just shared a new detail that after Byron and
Speaker 1: Justin picked her up, they went to a nearby gas
Speaker 1: station in Lenexa, Kansas, near where she lives, and that's
Speaker 1: where Justin was when he called Anastasia's house, which seems
Speaker 1: to track because Francesca in her interview told Kilgore about
Speaker 1: twenty minutes after Anastasia left, Justin called and said he
Speaker 1: was in Lenexa, Kansas. But this is different than what
Speaker 1: Byron said in his first interview, which is that after
Speaker 1: they picked Kelly up, they went directly to Justin's condo.
Speaker 1: There Justin played a message Anastasia left him saying she
Speaker 1: got a ride to meet him at Mount Washington Cemetery.
Speaker 1: After all, Justin then called Anastasia's house and that's when
Speaker 1: he spoke with her sister friend, who told him that
Speaker 1: Anastasia was at Mount Washington Cemetery. Okay, back to Kelly
Speaker 1: and Kilgore.
Speaker 4: And so after the gas station, then he went back
Speaker 4: to Justin's department about what, Tom, did you get there?
Speaker 6: Six six thirty probably six thirty?
Speaker 4: When did you leave there?
Speaker 16: Probably like twenty minutes later, so like seven seven, Because
Speaker 16: first she had to check all his answering, like he's
Speaker 16: answering Washington. And then Anastasia called from a pay for
Speaker 16: propaty and she's like get up here, I'm Cole blah
Speaker 16: blah blah.
Speaker 4: And they're like That's when I started following. Okay, so
Speaker 4: you left Justin's apartment at about seven o'clock.
Speaker 16: Yeah, probably a little bit after. Yeah, oh the way
Speaker 16: we left early she would go to the yeah, probably
Speaker 16: like seven okay, and you.
Speaker 1: Went to where Kelly says after they left Justin's house
Speaker 1: they stop at a smoke shop. This is also a
Speaker 1: new detail.
Speaker 4: And then from there you went where here to this
Speaker 4: dairy queen. Do you remember about what time you got here?
Speaker 6: I'll probably say seven now, probably seven forty five or
Speaker 6: was my doll? She was mad and I just laughed.
Speaker 6: She's like, I just want to get out of here.
Speaker 6: This place is so annoying.
Speaker 4: Did she said that? And from that point, where.
Speaker 11: Did you go?
Speaker 4: For?
Speaker 16: Well, she still wanted to go to Mount Washington tenthill
Speaker 16: we went in there, Okay, did you?
Speaker 1: Kelly's timeline is important. Kil Gore needs to make sure
Speaker 1: it's consistent with what she said in her first interview,
Speaker 1: and how does it match up with what other witnesses
Speaker 1: have said. Kil Gore, Kelly and Kelly's mom, Deborah leave
Speaker 1: the Dairy Queen and drive across the street to Mountain
Speaker 1: Washington Cemetery. Again, not the same cemetery where Anastasia's body
Speaker 1: was found. That was Lincoln Cemetery.
Speaker 4: Y'all just driving like this or in a hurry or anything.
Speaker 16: No, no, not hurry, just kind of looking for Amaza limbs.
Speaker 16: That's where Anna Stays wanted to like sit on the
Speaker 16: stoves and talk because she wanted on them to be alone.
Speaker 16: And then Justin was gonna give me and Byron like
Speaker 16: the car like to go drive off someplace else, well,
Speaker 16: just like a little bit away and go talk to Zannasa,
Speaker 16: just like ask.
Speaker 6: Talk to a line.
Speaker 4: Do you know why she needed to talk to him alone.
Speaker 6: She was, well, she was mad at him.
Speaker 16: I know that they had like broken up before, and
Speaker 16: she was kind of I remember her saying, so she's.
Speaker 6: Like, well, this is the last while you know, I'm freezing.
Speaker 6: You know, we've already broken up and you can't even
Speaker 6: come like pick me up all the time. I know,
Speaker 6: there's like a big kind of church looking thing. It's
Speaker 6: not that one, like I think it's up that way,
Speaker 6: but I'm not sure. We went past there.
Speaker 16: Yeah, we went here, and we're going to stop the
Speaker 16: card and get out, But there was like a load
Speaker 16: of like teenagers over.
Speaker 4: There, and they were, Okah, when you pull in front
Speaker 4: of this, did you stop?
Speaker 6: Yeah, like just.
Speaker 16: Kind of in the middle of the road, and we
Speaker 16: were we kind of stopped here and it was just
Speaker 16: like some teenagers and stuff getting out and then uh,
Speaker 16: right over by the steps. They were parked over her
Speaker 16: by there. Then we saw a car. It was like,
Speaker 16: I mean, it wasn't like a kid's car pull up
Speaker 16: and they started to leave. So we kind of guessed
Speaker 16: that it was the caretaker and we're like, well, we
Speaker 16: better go because it followed us till we left the car.
Speaker 4: Did what about the other car load of kids.
Speaker 16: Just like left too because they saw the caretaker, but
Speaker 16: they went out this way and the caretaker followed us
Speaker 16: out that way.
Speaker 1: Kilgore then asks about Anastasia's clothes.
Speaker 4: Remember what she was wearing that?
Speaker 16: Yeah, because I told her that her shirt was she
Speaker 16: had on like she always wore black Janie's mostly black
Speaker 16: shoes and it was like maybe blue or greenee shirt.
Speaker 4: That.
Speaker 16: Yeah, she had on like a big floppy I think
Speaker 16: it was brown, like weird coat.
Speaker 4: I might have any corn or have a purse.
Speaker 6: Wallet.
Speaker 1: Though this is close to what Francesca and her stepmom
Speaker 1: Diane said, Anastasia was wearing that night, but different than
Speaker 1: what Dairy Queen worker don Wright said. She said Anastasia
Speaker 1: was wearing blue jeans, sandals with socks, and she was
Speaker 1: carrying a brown purse. I wonder could the wallet and
Speaker 1: the purse be the same thing anyway? Kelly says after
Speaker 1: they left Mount Washington, they decided they'd all go back
Speaker 1: to Justin's where he and Anastasia could talk.
Speaker 4: Just did Anastasia agree with that?
Speaker 6: Yeah, that's fine.
Speaker 16: She's like, just as long as I'm not cold on
Speaker 16: the guitar, Yeah, this way right, because I remember passing by,
Speaker 16: like over that solders.
Speaker 4: When you got on to Truman Road. Did that they
Speaker 4: continue what they're arguing? And do you remember anything at all?
Speaker 4: It was said, Oh, man, I.
Speaker 6: Was like just the same old stump.
Speaker 16: She's like, was mad that he broke up with her,
Speaker 16: and she was like, you know, you're showy responsible.
Speaker 6: You can't even come pick me up all the time.
Speaker 6: We always made plants and.
Speaker 4: Break up and stuff like that. Is that true?
Speaker 6: Well? I don't know to an extent sometimes, but she
Speaker 6: usually wanted to see him, like every day, and he
Speaker 6: kind of get mad.
Speaker 16: He'd be like, no, look you know, I promised, like
Speaker 16: Byron that I do something.
Speaker 4: Look up.
Speaker 16: And he also had this girl in Ashley that he
Speaker 16: was wrapped with and she didn't like that.
Speaker 6: I think she also brought that up.
Speaker 4: That's all this familiar.
Speaker 16: Yeah, this is where they got like really bad stuff.
Speaker 16: She's just like, look, just take me back to my house.
Speaker 16: She was like, I want to talk the top. I
Speaker 16: didn't waste like gas when he come out here for
Speaker 16: like you to be a brat. So they kept like
Speaker 16: fighting and she was like take me home, cra so
Speaker 16: up at this stop light, that was when he had
Speaker 16: to stop and she got out. She's like He's like,
Speaker 16: don't get out of the car, being like a baby.
Speaker 16: And then she's like, look there's two gas and she's
Speaker 16: under that I can't be.
Speaker 6: Around right now.
Speaker 4: And did he stop at the light right down? Yeah?
Speaker 6: I think he was in this line because she got out,
Speaker 6: stepped onto that.
Speaker 4: Little like famous and this is where she got out.
Speaker 16: Yeah, right at the fun I think he was thinking
Speaker 16: about like turning around, like to go back and get her.
Speaker 6: But there was I mean, there really wasn't anyway because
Speaker 6: there's like traffic and he's just like, well, screw it.
Speaker 16: You know, there's a gas station night by there, and
Speaker 16: she was also like was like, well, you know, she
Speaker 16: won't even get back in the car if.
Speaker 4: You go back to get her. And he's like, we'll
Speaker 4: find And about what time was that? Do you remember
Speaker 4: we got back.
Speaker 16: To yeah, Justin's condo like eight fifteen, eight twenty something
Speaker 16: like that, because we left I remember by eight thirty
Speaker 16: because Abraham called and wanted us to pick up some
Speaker 16: stuff of Tarras, and so Baron's like, well, if you
Speaker 16: have to be back by you no, nine, nine fifteens
Speaker 16: that are gone now.
Speaker 6: So we played video games.
Speaker 4: For from the Left, And so at what time did
Speaker 4: you get home at?
Speaker 6: Probably? Yeah, well I remember looking and we were like, well,
Speaker 6: right on time. Probably it was either a little bit
Speaker 6: before nine or a little bit after a little bit after.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think I told her she had to be
Speaker 4: home by nine and she got hop. Yeah, it's like
Speaker 4: nine ten all together from the time that she picked
Speaker 4: up Anastasia Derek Plaine in the time that she got
Speaker 4: out bank. Barry Truman of four thirty five, About how
Speaker 4: much time do you think last?
Speaker 6: I don't well, it probably only liked.
Speaker 16: Like turn fifteen minutes because well, maybe a little bit
Speaker 16: longer that because we know around the cemetery for quite
Speaker 16: while because Justin was like all lost and everything.
Speaker 4: But I don't it wasn't that long. And after that
Speaker 4: you didn't see Anastasia.
Speaker 6: Again and didn't even talk.
Speaker 16: Why are we both were just kind of like, well,
Speaker 16: she got out of the car to say me else,
Speaker 16: slamming door.
Speaker 1: Kelly says she never saw or talked to Anastasia or
Speaker 1: Justin after that night. She did speak with Byron though,
Speaker 1: sometime between eleven PM and midnight.
Speaker 4: To you paid him and he called you back at
Speaker 4: your house. Where was he at?
Speaker 16: Because I remember he was talking about how we had
Speaker 16: to get off off online to call me.
Speaker 4: Back and what did you environ talk about that?
Speaker 16: So we just kind of blunt it between like normal
Speaker 16: commerciations and then we'd, like, you know, talk about like
Speaker 16: the whole situation with that.
Speaker 1: The tape runs out. I don't have the audio for
Speaker 1: the second side, but I have the transcript. Kelly goes
Speaker 1: on to say she doesn't think there was a suicide pact,
Speaker 1: and she doesn't think Justin killed Anastasia. She says, Anastasia
Speaker 1: annoyed Justin, but that was about it, and she can't
Speaker 1: imagine some random person grabbing her. When asked if there
Speaker 1: was anything else she could share, Kelly says, quote, I
Speaker 1: mean Anastasia was like really mad. I'd never seen her
Speaker 1: this mad. Two significant things happen on November twenty first,
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety seven. One kil Gore calls Justin's dad, John Bruton,
Speaker 1: to brief him on the investigation. It's now been about
Speaker 1: twenty seven days since Justin was found dead. In kil
Speaker 1: Gore's report, he writes that he asked John what Byron
Speaker 1: told him about the night Anastasia got out of Justin's car.
Speaker 1: John Bruton says the only specific thing that Byron told
Speaker 1: him was when they got to the stoplight, Anastasia supposedly said,
Speaker 1: I don't know why you don't love me. I don't
Speaker 1: know why you don't want to be with me, and
Speaker 1: Justin replied, I'm sorry, I don't either, but I just don't.
Speaker 1: The other significant thing that happens on November twenty first
Speaker 1: is Bob, Anastasia's dad, and kil Gore speak over the phone,
Speaker 1: warning the audios not.
Speaker 9: Great, and I was just curious, as true.
Speaker 10: How much contact you've had with Justice's father I have
Speaker 10: quite a bit of contact.
Speaker 8: Okay, how's he doing with his uh death? You're kindly
Speaker 8: not satisfied with a with a suicide as.
Speaker 4: Any Well, I don't think he has anything a question
Speaker 4: about suicide on his son, or.
Speaker 1: It seems Bob is wondering if Justin's death might not
Speaker 1: actually have been self inflicted. He then asks if Kilgore
Speaker 1: has taken Justin's answering machine into evidence.
Speaker 4: Oh, he did not retrieve that.
Speaker 8: A lot of people that try to call Justin that
Speaker 8: day or that evening, that Wednesday evening and all day Thursday.
Speaker 8: My understanding is that Justin's father arrived at the apartment
Speaker 8: late Thursday night, where a lot of messages on that
Speaker 8: that the tape, and I just wonder why if he
Speaker 8: had it, why he don't have that.
Speaker 4: I can't answer that, Okay.
Speaker 8: Would it be possible if he had spoken over the
Speaker 8: top messages that you might be able to retrieve.
Speaker 4: Something out of that. Would I don't believe there's a
Speaker 4: technology to do that.
Speaker 8: Okay, Well, he might just talk Justine's father about that
Speaker 8: audio tape.
Speaker 1: More on that in a moment. It's now been a
Speaker 1: month since Anastasia was killed and Bob is desperate for answers.
Speaker 1: On November twenty fourth, he contacts Sergeant Kilgore and tells
Speaker 1: him that he spoke with John Bruten, Justin's dad, who
Speaker 1: is now not so sure his son committed suicide. So
Speaker 1: kill Gore calls John Bruce himself, and John relays the
Speaker 1: conversation he had with Bob. Kil Gore writes in his
Speaker 1: report that Bob told John that Byron was quote bisexual
Speaker 1: and was infatuated with Justin. John stated he didn't believe
Speaker 1: his son was gay. Bob told John he believes Byron
Speaker 1: and another guy named Alex might have been involved in
Speaker 1: the murder of Justin. Bob also told John that Kelly
Speaker 1: Moffatt had been quote addicted to heroin and that she
Speaker 1: was a prostitute and that she sold herself and used
Speaker 1: the money for drugs. By the way, these prostitution claims
Speaker 1: are unsubstantiated. John tells Kilgore he is now not completely
Speaker 1: convinced Justin's death was a suicide, but John says he
Speaker 1: hired a private investigator and the PI said everything appeared
Speaker 1: to be quote cut and dry, that Anastasia's death was
Speaker 1: a homicide and Justin's was a suicide. Kil Gore asks
Speaker 1: John to send him Justin's answering machine. A few days later,
Speaker 1: it arrives.
Speaker 4: Back you have thirteenth full necagers.
Speaker 1: It's noted in a report that there are thirteen messages
Speaker 1: on the machine, including the one Kilgore left for Justin
Speaker 1: on October twenty third. The tape is very poor quality,
Speaker 1: but there is a transcript of the messages, which begin
Speaker 1: in the early afternoon of Thursday the twenty third, the
Speaker 1: day Ona Stage's body was found, and go through Saturday
Speaker 1: the twenty fifth, the day Justin's body was found. The
Speaker 1: callers include Sergeant Kilgore, Justin's friends Byron, Paige and Abraham,
Speaker 1: Justin's mom and dad, and a few other people, all
Speaker 1: basically asking Justin to call them back. So where are
Speaker 1: the messages from the night of the twenty second and
Speaker 1: the morning of the twenty third. Anastasia was murdered sometime
Speaker 1: within that window. Remember. Bob says he left a message
Speaker 1: for Justin around nine thirty ten the night of the
Speaker 1: twenty second, and Justin called him back sometime after ten.
Speaker 1: Bob also says he called and left a message for
Speaker 1: Justin the next morning. Neither of those messages are on
Speaker 1: the machine. Also not on the machine is the message
Speaker 1: Anastasia supposedly left Justin saying she got a ride after all,
Speaker 1: and that she was at the dairy Queen. Sergeant Kilgore
Speaker 1: contacts the FBI for help on retrieving the messages. He
Speaker 1: also contacts the Sony Corporation, the maker of the answering machine.
Speaker 1: They tell him that erased or recorded over messages are
Speaker 1: not recoverable. December first, we're now six weeks into the investigation,
Speaker 1: and Bob calls Sergeant Kilgore again. He suggests a new
Speaker 1: theory about Anastasia's murder that somehow involves Justin's dad John
Speaker 1: as an accessory.
Speaker 16: After the fact.
Speaker 1: After the call, kil Gore writes in his report, mister
Speaker 1: Whipples Fugen is quote rambling nearly every contact I have
Speaker 1: with him. He says, mister Whipples Fugen's comments, etc. Are
Speaker 1: making little sense. On December fifth, Sergeant Kilgore interviews a
Speaker 1: friend of Anastasia's whose name has come up during the investigation.
Speaker 4: Sake an answer, ale Xavier Strange.
Speaker 6: Growth.
Speaker 1: That's Alex the Alex that Bob thinks might have had
Speaker 1: a hand in killing Justin. My guess is that kil
Speaker 1: Gore thought that theory was ridiculous, so he doesn't even
Speaker 1: ask Alex about it. Alex says in the two and
Speaker 1: a half months set he knew Anastasia, she talked a
Speaker 1: lot about the ups and downs of her relationship with Justin,
Speaker 1: and the last time he spoke with Anastasia he told
Speaker 1: her he found her attractive.
Speaker 3: I mean, I barely knew out of stage or she
Speaker 3: just turned it right as I was getting to know,
Speaker 3: I thought out I really liked her, and then I
Speaker 3: lost her, and so I am in. You know, I'm
Speaker 3: in a bit of pain about that. It's like things
Speaker 3: I don't like to have happened to me, and so,
Speaker 3: you know, it's it's confusing. But I'm not an expert.
Speaker 3: I'm not I'm not someone that was close enough to
Speaker 3: maybe know what was going on.
Speaker 4: I would like to know what was going on. I'm
Speaker 4: trying to use my intuition.
Speaker 2: Well, have you have you talked to anybody that you
Speaker 2: might be I had some incredible information about how she died.
Speaker 3: No, I wish I had, because I would be following
Speaker 3: them around. I would be keeping closer eye.
Speaker 2: Are you aware of any type of a suicide pack
Speaker 2: or anything.
Speaker 3: I was waiting for the death cult stuff. No, I
Speaker 3: do not believe there's any kind of a cult or
Speaker 3: any kind of a pact. I don't know where that
Speaker 3: concept came from.
Speaker 6: Justin.
Speaker 3: And on a stage, it weren't even in the mode
Speaker 3: of what you would call industrial.
Speaker 4: Gothy or whatever.
Speaker 3: They didn't wear all black, they weren't depressed all the time.
Speaker 3: Justin's kind of wre s forty light outfits and on
Speaker 3: a stage are bounced back before trains some darker outfits
Speaker 3: to some lighter outfits, and it's just.
Speaker 4: Like, I've never heard of anything like that. But then again,
Speaker 4: you know, no, I couldn't.
Speaker 3: I can't see any of those goop calls being involved
Speaker 3: in anything like that. So and on a stage and
Speaker 3: Justin just barely even listening to even the darker music
Speaker 3: it was in the quite a variety of music had
Speaker 3: that was a lot happier, or it went through moods
Speaker 3: like like on a stage of like The Cure, which
Speaker 3: can't be considered kind of depressing, but it's it's romantic
Speaker 3: on a stage was more romantic.
Speaker 4: Because I don't know about Justin, Like I said.
Speaker 1: Honest, Kilgore asks when was the last time he saw Byron,
Speaker 1: Alex says, at Anastasia's funeral, he just he always.
Speaker 3: Seems nervous to me always, so his demeanor at the
Speaker 3: funeral was the same level of nervousness that I would
Speaker 3: expect from him at any time. She was just talking
Speaker 3: about the investigation, talking about how he, I mean, he felt,
Speaker 3: talking about how he felt accused of it.
Speaker 4: He was being shocked about that.
Speaker 11: That was his whole thing.
Speaker 3: It's like, I can't believe, you know, the injustice is
Speaker 3: going on here and the fact that they're trying to
Speaker 3: accuse us of it, And that was the main gist
Speaker 3: of everything that he was saying.
Speaker 4: Did Anastagia ever speak of her family line? He was
Speaker 4: actually talking to me.
Speaker 3: Some about the family, And all I knew is that
Speaker 3: she was looking for a place out. She cannot stay
Speaker 3: at her where her she was residing. Her dad didn't
Speaker 3: want to them.
Speaker 4: It was her dad.
Speaker 3: It was her dad that didn't want to it. But
Speaker 3: I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't because of his wife.
Speaker 1: He means, Diane, Bob's wife, Anastasia's stepmom. Kilgore then asks
Speaker 1: Alex if he knows of anything else that might assist
Speaker 1: him in the investigation. Alex says he does not.
Speaker 4: I do not know for back to to kill Landstein,
Speaker 4: no I wish.
Speaker 1: December twelfth, Anastasia's dad, Bob contacts Sergeant Ron Kellogg. Sergeant
Speaker 1: Kellogg was hands on in the early days of the investigation.
Speaker 1: Since then, it's pretty much just been Sergeant Kilgore on
Speaker 1: the case. Bob tells Sergeant Kellogg he hasn't heard from
Speaker 1: Sergeant kil Gore since quote this past Monday, Kellogg writes
Speaker 1: in his report, quote he stated to me that as
Speaker 1: the leader of this unit, that I had better find
Speaker 1: out something about the investigation by the end of the
Speaker 1: day and get back with him. Kellogg continues, quote, this
Speaker 1: caller's voice showed a sign of threatening that I had
Speaker 1: better get this information or else. On December twenty first,
Speaker 1: an interesting email exchange begins, not between Bob and sergeant's
Speaker 1: kill Gore or Ca, but between Bob and Byron and
Speaker 1: Bob's friend Patrick Rock. Remember he's the one who started
Speaker 1: and is maintaining the Anastasia memorial website, and it seems
Speaker 1: the first email comes from Byron. He writes to Patrick
Speaker 1: after he sees some stuff on the website that doesn't
Speaker 1: sit well with him. The subject line of the email
Speaker 1: is character assault. Byron writes that he has cooperated with
Speaker 1: police and to insinuate that he knows anything more as ridiculous.
Speaker 1: He asks for them to stop with the accusations. Patrick
Speaker 1: writes back, in part, quote you were her friend for
Speaker 1: many years, Byron, you took her to the prom if
Speaker 1: nothing else, why did you fail to stop Justin from
Speaker 1: driving away? Byron and Patrick go back and forth a
Speaker 1: couple of times, then Bob jumps in. On Christmas Eve,
Speaker 1: Bob writes that the website is quote intentionally provocative because
Speaker 1: of the web of silence that still exists sixty days
Speaker 1: after the tragedy. Bob continues to Byron, your characterization of
Speaker 1: yourself and of the events that occurred that night are
Speaker 1: incompatible and therefore illogical. That same day, Christmas Eve, Byron's
Speaker 1: father dies unexpectedly, a day before his fiftieth birthday. On
Speaker 1: December twenty sixth, Bob writes Byron, sending his condolences. He
Speaker 1: goes on to say that for all the losses he's experienced,
Speaker 1: nothing compares to the loss of a child, especially quote
Speaker 1: a murdered child whose memory will never rest in peace
Speaker 1: until justice is done. If you, now, in the pain
Speaker 1: of familiarity with death, characterize my correspondence with you as
Speaker 1: hate mail, then I pity you.
Speaker 4: Byron.
Speaker 1: For months, the back and forth of emails between Bob
Speaker 1: and Pat and Byron continue. Bob and Pat ask Byron questions.
Speaker 1: Byron's tone is quite testy at times, but he answers
Speaker 1: their questions. Then, in early March, Bob invites Byron to
Speaker 1: go play pool and grab food, after Byron responds quote, well,
Speaker 1: I'm not much for pool, but I have been considering
Speaker 1: meeting with you and or Patrick to more easily discuss things.
Speaker 1: You two have a lot of questions, and email, as
Speaker 1: handy as it may be, isn't exactly the best way
Speaker 1: to go about answering them. I think in person there
Speaker 1: would be less of a chance of misunderstandings flaring up.
Speaker 1: It seems they never do meet. The emails start up
Speaker 1: again in May, and on May second, Byron writes Patrick
Speaker 1: in part, quote, I realized long ago that I was
Speaker 1: not being ruled out as a suspect that bothers me,
Speaker 1: but because there is no way to prove to the police,
Speaker 1: that I am innocent. I have to just deal with that.
Speaker 1: Sergeant Kilgore is merely doing his job and following procedure,
Speaker 1: and I am in no position to dispute logic. I
Speaker 1: can't help but feel that if this were the Dark Ages,
Speaker 1: Anastasia's family would have had me burned at the stake
Speaker 1: out of sheer suspicion. That is what bothers me, not
Speaker 1: that the police haven't ruled me out, but that the
Speaker 1: family is convinced that I had a hand in Stassia's murder.
Speaker 1: Even if I was perverted enough to murder someone, I
Speaker 1: doubt I'd be such a sick fuck as to bring
Speaker 1: my girlfriend along for the ride. That doesn't exactly make
Speaker 1: a good impression on one's beloved. What the hell do
Speaker 1: you take me for? Those are some of the emails
Speaker 1: between Bob, Patrick Rock and Byron that run from December
Speaker 1: of nineteen ninety seven through May of nineteen ninety eight,
Speaker 1: but rewinding four months to January TEWOD of nineteen ninety eight,
Speaker 1: Bob writes an email to Sergeant Kilgore that may make
Speaker 1: a monumental difference in the case, subject line blue jeens.
Speaker 1: On January TEWOD nineteen ninety eight, Anastasia's father, Bob Whitbolsfugen,
Speaker 1: writes what might be a bombshell of an email to
Speaker 1: Sergeant Kilgore. It says, in part quote, I don't remember
Speaker 1: if I ever told you. A couple of days after
Speaker 1: her death, I opened the washing machine and inside was
Speaker 1: a single pair of blue jeans. It was nothing unusual
Speaker 1: because I frequently do laundry and often found that the
Speaker 1: girls had unfinished stuff in the wash. Bob goes on
Speaker 1: to write, also in the wash basin in the basement
Speaker 1: next to the washing machine was a pair of her
Speaker 1: underwear soaking. About a week later, Bob sends another email
Speaker 1: along with a photo of a brown purse. He writes,
Speaker 1: is this possibly the purse that Don Wright said Anastasia
Speaker 1: reportedly had at the DQ. By the way, I'm going
Speaker 1: to post to the photo of the purse on the
Speaker 1: Real Killer podcast on Instagram. Okay, So do Bob's emails
Speaker 1: corroborate what Dawn Wright, the dairy queen worker said Anastasia
Speaker 1: was wearing that night blue jeans and carrying a brown purse.
Speaker 1: And we know Anastasia got her period while she was there,
Speaker 1: So the fact that Bob found her blue jeans and
Speaker 1: the washing machine and her underwear soaking. Does all of
Speaker 1: this together mean she actually went home at some point?
Speaker 1: And if she did go home and change her clothes,
Speaker 1: why did she go back out? Where did she go
Speaker 1: and how did she get there?
Speaker 16: And who was she with?
Speaker 1: While Kilgore is busy with the official investigation Anastasia's father,
Speaker 1: Bob continues with his own. He goes to the coffeehouses
Speaker 1: where Anastasia, Justin, Byron, and Kelly used to hang out,
Speaker 1: and he interviews her friends. Bob sends Kilgore emails and
Speaker 1: faxes about what he learns from these interviews and shares
Speaker 1: all the new theories he's working on, like, for instance,
Speaker 1: how he suspects a sheriff's deputy might be involved in
Speaker 1: Anastasia's murder somehow. It's now January twenty second, nineteen ninety eight,
Speaker 1: three months into the investigation, Sergeant Kilgore calls Bob at
Speaker 1: work to follow up on some of his emails. The
Speaker 1: audio is not great, so i'll sum up the important part,
Speaker 1: Bob says. One day, when he was out putting up
Speaker 1: reward posters, he spoke with Don Rand at the Amico station.
Speaker 1: Remember night mechanic Don Rand said he saw Anastasia walking
Speaker 1: east on Truman Road around eight thirty the night of
Speaker 1: the twenty second Bob tells Kilgore after talking with Don Rand,
Speaker 1: he then went next door to the Phillips sixty six
Speaker 1: gas station and spoke with a father and daughter who
Speaker 1: may have been the owners. They told him they also
Speaker 1: saw a young woman that night and she used the
Speaker 1: payful This could be huge. Are there now two more
Speaker 1: witnesses who saw Anastasia that night on Truman Road? And
Speaker 1: if Anastasia did in fact use the payphone, who did
Speaker 1: she call? Were they her ride home or her ride
Speaker 1: to Lincoln Cemetery? On April first, Bob and Sergeant kill
Speaker 1: Gore speak again. Kil Gore writes in his report that
Speaker 1: during the call, Bob asks if he's a suspect in
Speaker 1: the case. Kil Gore tells him no, one's been ruled
Speaker 1: out yet. Bob then says if kill Gore didn't believe him,
Speaker 1: then he would have a problem. Kil Gore writes, quote,
Speaker 1: I perceived this comment as a threat, and I cautioned
Speaker 1: him about making threats towards me. Threat or no threat.
Speaker 1: Bob continues with his investigation. Three months later, on July eighth,
Speaker 1: Bob speaks with kil Gore, this time at the Jackson
Speaker 1: County Sheriff's Department, and this time it's about something Bob
Speaker 1: has never brought up in the nine months since he's
Speaker 1: been communicating with kil Gore. It's about cars. Cars, Bob
Speaker 1: says he saw the night of the twenty second when
Speaker 1: he went out searching for Anastasia. Bob says around eleven
Speaker 1: thirty that night, he parked at the south gate to
Speaker 1: Mount Washington Cemetery and watched a caravan of thirty one
Speaker 1: cars go by. Bob believes the drivers of these cars
Speaker 1: either know what happened to Anastasia or may have been
Speaker 1: directly involved in her death. Bob tells Kilgore he got
Speaker 1: license plate numbers, makes and models, as well as descriptions
Speaker 1: of some of the drivers.
Speaker 9: I did the best I could.
Speaker 4: How long were you staying in there?
Speaker 17: I figured somewhere between ten and fifteen minutes? And you know,
Speaker 17: live the thirty one car, Yeah, so you saw him
Speaker 17: at fifteen minutes.
Speaker 4: Let me answer your question. Are the the list that
Speaker 4: we're looking at are using the order as you saw
Speaker 4: them coming down? Truman wrote I.
Speaker 17: Tried to make them as close to it as as
Speaker 17: my memory as I did on that thing.
Speaker 1: They go through the first twelve cars, then move on
Speaker 1: to number thirteen, the white Pontiac six thousand with a
Speaker 1: big dent in the front bumper and bumper stickers all
Speaker 1: over the rear panel of the car. License plate morbid
Speaker 1: is number thirteen.
Speaker 13: Let me number thirteen.
Speaker 17: There it is identified by all sorts of memorable things
Speaker 17: about this vehicle. Have some tire prints, got a close
Speaker 17: up of the decal which essentially, as all this guests later,
Speaker 17: are not that significance anymore, and that I remember them
Speaker 17: that night.
Speaker 4: This blocked to Byron Tool.
Speaker 13: I presume that it does.
Speaker 11: It's in his position.
Speaker 4: We did think we remember seeing that car that life
Speaker 4: has played went ran down Truman Road when you were
Speaker 4: standing at the entrance to not.
Speaker 17: Wasting vividly, vividly remember how about occupant occupant? As I
Speaker 17: could determine there was only one occupant in this car
Speaker 17: identified that fact very early on when I saw that
Speaker 17: car round in the bend. I had been looking in
Speaker 17: cars trying to see how many people were driving in
Speaker 17: these vehicles, and had slim luck and seeing guy. But
Speaker 17: I saw the drive around this car far away, and
Speaker 17: it was the silliest thing because his face glowed like white,
Speaker 17: you know light. And I said, well, there's at least
Speaker 17: one occupant in that driver, and he looks like the ghost.
Speaker 4: By god, he must have come out of that come
Speaker 4: out of the cemetery scared.
Speaker 11: Why does the sheet coming down the hill?
Speaker 4: What's the matter with you? You?
Speaker 11: Independ It's got.
Speaker 1: Bob calls the driver of this car Independence goth Independence
Speaker 1: is the name of the town nearby and where the
Speaker 1: Whippos Fugens live.
Speaker 17: Have you ever met Byron case before that, I had
Speaker 17: occasion to have dinner with him, probably with Anastas and
Speaker 17: justin at Gojo's April February April, that area.
Speaker 4: The night that you saw the vehicle, did you recognize
Speaker 4: the occupant?
Speaker 17: No, no, it didn't occur to me at all. All
Speaker 17: I saw was that there was somebody that looked like like,
Speaker 17: you know, like the ghost.
Speaker 4: Sure th share license.
Speaker 1: Late Kilgore learns that Byron drives a white nineteen eighty
Speaker 1: six Pontiac six thousand l E with Kansas license plates
Speaker 1: that read morbid. The question is, did Bob actually see
Speaker 1: Byron out that night? In the meantime, Bob's emails and
Speaker 1: facts is to kill Gore continue. He still shares his
Speaker 1: theories and what he learns while out investigating, but Bob
Speaker 1: also starts zeroing in more on Byron, sending Kilgore photos
Speaker 1: of Byron, Byron's car, close up of his tires, descriptions
Speaker 1: of Byron's sightings, his new haircut, and links to Byron's
Speaker 1: web page, and Bob starts sometimes emailing and factxing Kilgore
Speaker 1: the same thing multiple times within minutes of each other.
Speaker 1: At times, the tone is aggressive, like on July twenty third,
Speaker 1: when Bob writes, quote, nine months later, and you still
Speaker 1: haven't done anything. How do you sleep at night? On
Speaker 1: August twenty first, nineteen ninety eight, kil Gore sends Bob
Speaker 1: a letter. It reads, in part, quote stop harassing me,
Speaker 1: both directly and indirectly. Stop harassing me at my residence.
Speaker 1: Do not communicate with me at my residence or try
Speaker 1: to contact me at my residence in any way. He
Speaker 1: goes on to say, quote, I believe that your harassment
Speaker 1: of me has caused irreparable damage to me personally and professionally.
Speaker 1: I believe this was your intention, despite what you have
Speaker 1: done to me personally and professionally. I am still optimistic
Speaker 1: that the information and or evidence needed to solve the
Speaker 1: case will eventually surface and the truth will be known.
Speaker 1: On August twenty second, ten months after Anastasia was murdered,
Speaker 1: Kelly Moffatt is back at the Jackson County Sheriff's Department
Speaker 1: to answer more of Sergeant Kilgore's questions. This time, she's
Speaker 1: accompanied by both of her parents. I have the transcript,
Speaker 1: but not the audio from this interview, so I will
Speaker 1: summarize some of what is discussed. Kelly says she and
Speaker 1: Byron are still dating, but they've been fighting lately and
Speaker 1: she thinks he may know more than he's sang. Kelly
Speaker 1: now wonders if there might have been a suicide pack
Speaker 1: that night after all. Kelly says, maybe Justin and Byron
Speaker 1: freaked out after they saw Anastasia kill herself and they
Speaker 1: backed out of the pact. Kilgore asks when this might
Speaker 1: have happened, and Kelly says maybe after they dropped her off.
Speaker 1: She says, quote, I don't think that it was really
Speaker 1: a murder situation, and she says she didn't see a
Speaker 1: gun with them that night. Kilgore asks about Byron's car.
Speaker 1: Kelly says Byron wasn't driving it around that time because
Speaker 1: she remembers he was getting a lot of rides from
Speaker 1: Justin and her parents were pissy about always having to
Speaker 1: take her to meet him. Kelly says Byron feels like
Speaker 1: he's being harassed by Anastasia's father, Bob, and because Byron's
Speaker 1: on probation for stealing back in nineteen ninety six, he
Speaker 1: doesn't want to speak with police. He's suspicious they may
Speaker 1: t try and trick him and falsely accuse him of
Speaker 1: Anastasia's murder. At the end of the interview, Kelly agrees
Speaker 1: to a computer voice stress analysis, something similar to a
Speaker 1: light detector test. Some of the questions Kelly's asked are
Speaker 1: did Byron kill Anastasia? Were you with Anastasia when she
Speaker 1: was killed? And do you know of anybody that might
Speaker 1: have some information about this suicide pact. In Kilgore's report
Speaker 1: after the interview, he writes, quote, due to a machine malfunction,
Speaker 1: the results of the test were void. After this interview
Speaker 1: with Kelly, Sergeant Kilgore wants to speak with Byron again
Speaker 1: about the night in question and about his car. Byron
Speaker 1: now has legal representation, so his attorney tells Kilgore Byron
Speaker 1: won't be giving another interview at this time. But about
Speaker 1: a week later, Byron actually does call kil Gore. Here's
Speaker 1: some of that recorded phone conversation from August twenty ninth,
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety eight.
Speaker 4: And what chance are you coming out swing sit down
Speaker 4: and talk again? Can I ask what? For example, just
Speaker 4: to go over what we've already gone over, to see
Speaker 4: if there's been in new developments in your life because
Speaker 4: of this, to see if maybe you come up with
Speaker 4: any additional information I might be able to spring off
Speaker 4: of just.
Speaker 7: Well, I mean nothing, I mean there's nothing that's changed, right,
Speaker 7: I mean.
Speaker 4: I'd still like to just in person degree interview.
Speaker 7: Well, I mean I really want statements. I mean you
Speaker 7: still have that, right, Oh?
Speaker 4: Absolutely?
Speaker 7: Well, I mean yeah, nothing's changed from that. I mean, well,
Speaker 7: is actually I had to be a problem and you're
Speaker 7: doing this for me. Well, I'm really busy. I understand
Speaker 7: that my uh, you know, I mean my dad passed
Speaker 7: away in December, and trying to keep the top of
Speaker 7: your skat.
Speaker 4: All of that.
Speaker 7: You know, there's just a lot of tid more than
Speaker 7: or to work around your schedule. Well, I mean, I
Speaker 7: can't really offer anything, though.
Speaker 4: I still would like to united sit down and Chuck,
Speaker 4: I'm not I'm not playing any games or there's nothing
Speaker 4: like what that one to take you did with the
Speaker 4: wrong There are no games. I have no intentions for resting.
Speaker 7: You or anything.
Speaker 1: Kilgore is referring to Byron's friend Abraham here. You might
Speaker 1: remember after his interview with Sergeant Kellogg, he was arrested
Speaker 1: on an outstanding traffic warrant.
Speaker 7: You know, I mean, I can't think of anything else
Speaker 7: that I do have, and well, just with me, uh,
Speaker 7: you know, I I think I could better judge that
Speaker 7: as to what I need.
Speaker 4: Okay, what I might be looking for, what you might
Speaker 4: say or something like this that I would really like
Speaker 4: to sit down. Factor, there's no tricks.
Speaker 7: Well, it's just that this was ten months ago.
Speaker 4: Or I'm very well aware of the day, and.
Speaker 7: You know that's all that I know because I can't
Speaker 7: you know, I mean, if I could contribute anything else,
Speaker 7: I would call you. You would contribute a great deal.
Speaker 4: If you say yes, Sergeant.
Speaker 7: Kill well let's get together going talk. Well, I don't
Speaker 7: feel that that would be I mean, I don't see
Speaker 7: how that would give for any value whatsoever. I mean,
Speaker 7: I can't offer any more information.
Speaker 4: You don't even know my questions.
Speaker 7: Well then, I mean I'm on the phone now, right.
Speaker 4: And I'm sure you can can appreciate my situation here
Speaker 4: the nature of the investigation that is not really something
Speaker 4: you would want to get to in depth over the funnel.
Speaker 11: I mean, I personally don't have a.
Speaker 4: Problem with it with interviewing over the phone. Is there
Speaker 4: a transportation problem, Well, first off, I told them to
Speaker 4: have to drive all the way out there, and like
Speaker 4: I said, I mean, there's nothing else that I can
Speaker 4: I can tell you. Well, maybe there is. I really
Speaker 4: appreciate you coming and talking again. Whatever time to day
Speaker 4: is good for you.
Speaker 6: Well, I.
Speaker 7: I really wouldn't. I mean, basically, I just you know,
Speaker 7: I don't see how this is above anything you have
Speaker 7: to take people know about and everything that I said
Speaker 7: you before. I mean, I gave you more than you
Speaker 7: know enough details about anything. I would think that you
Speaker 7: know there would be you know, enough to go on
Speaker 7: from that. I mean, the fact that this hasn't been
Speaker 7: involved is I mean, you know, there's no fault of mine.
Speaker 7: I mean, I told you everything I could, is yes,
Speaker 7: many a problem. I mean, you know that's not the issue,
Speaker 7: you know. I mean, I have more important things to
Speaker 7: do with my time than you know, run around in circles.
Speaker 4: No, no circles.
Speaker 7: I guarantee that in miss case, this is not a
Speaker 7: circle or anything like that.
Speaker 4: I guarantee you that.
Speaker 7: After we talk you can you'll be leaving.
Speaker 4: I'm not trying to drag you in here just to
Speaker 4: make an a risk.
Speaker 6: I was going to do that.
Speaker 4: I was done that a long time ago. I think
Speaker 4: you know that.
Speaker 7: But there are some questions that have came out, and
Speaker 7: I need you to clarify a few things. I like
Speaker 7: I said, I mean, I can't clarify anything because all
Speaker 7: I know is I hold you.
Speaker 4: You know what I do. You have no idea what
Speaker 4: I need you to clarify. So how can you make
Speaker 4: a statement?
Speaker 17: Are you?
Speaker 4: Are you afraid to talk to me? You know?
Speaker 7: I mean it's just that I see absolutely no purpose.
Speaker 7: I mean, I give you all the information that I have,
Speaker 7: but if I come to you, I you know, I'm
Speaker 7: hardly over here anyway. Well, that's not really the issue
Speaker 7: of like where.
Speaker 4: All Well, if it's not a transportation, if it's not
Speaker 4: location if it's not financial then and just not wanting
Speaker 4: to cooperate with me, I'm sorry, just not wanting to
Speaker 4: cooperate with me.
Speaker 7: No, it's it's not that at all. I mean that's
Speaker 7: cooperated as much as I can.
Speaker 4: Well, And and have I have I Have I ever
Speaker 4: asked you or hounded you or anything?
Speaker 7: No, I didn't think so.
Speaker 4: And so I'm now I see that you come in
Speaker 4: talk to me again and clarify a few things that
Speaker 4: came up during the course of this investigation. And I'm
Speaker 4: just merely asking for your cooperation. Well, I will have
Speaker 4: to get back with you, okay. And when could I
Speaker 4: expect you to get back with me?
Speaker 7: Probably sometimes they.
Speaker 4: Not may not be in the office.
Speaker 7: Okay, Well I can leave a leverage okay, thank you.
Speaker 1: I have no documentation that says Byron called kil Gore
Speaker 1: back that day, but there is a report that a
Speaker 1: couple of weeks later, Byron's attorney calls kil Gore with
Speaker 1: some information about Byron's car. He says it was towed
Speaker 1: to Birch Automotive, where it stayed for about two weeks,
Speaker 1: and it was there the night Anastasia was murdered. Byron's
Speaker 1: attorney says Byron's dad paid for the tow by check
Speaker 1: and he banked at Brotherhood Bank. Byron's attorney says, in
Speaker 1: regard to an in person interview, his client is concerned
Speaker 1: investigators are going to try and pin the murder on him,
Speaker 1: so no interview will take place with Byron right now.
Speaker 1: But kil Gore does call Birch Engine Services and speaks
Speaker 1: with the owner, who says he has an invoice that
Speaker 1: shows Byron's vehicle was at his shop to have the
Speaker 1: water pump replaced. The work was completed on October twenty eighth,
Speaker 1: five days after Anastasia was murdered, and the bill was
Speaker 1: paid on the twenty ninth. Says he can't confirm when
Speaker 1: the vehicle was actually brought in and can't recall if
Speaker 1: the car was towed there or not, but he says
Speaker 1: when a vehicle is towed to his shop, they use
Speaker 1: Santa fe Toe service. The owner says he will send
Speaker 1: the invoice for the work he did on Byron's car
Speaker 1: to kilgre So it seems Byron's car was in the
Speaker 1: shop at least on the twenty eighth and twenty ninth,
Speaker 1: but there's still no confirmation Byron's car was there the
Speaker 1: night of the twenty second kil Gore reaches out to
Speaker 1: Santa Fe Toe Service, who says they have no record
Speaker 1: of towing a car for Byron case. I don't know
Speaker 1: if Kilgore ever reached out to Byron's dad's bank to
Speaker 1: see if perhaps another toe company had been used. We're
Speaker 1: now eleven and a half months into the investigation. There's
Speaker 1: still no weapon, no physical evidence or eyewitness testimony pointing
Speaker 1: to any one suspect or suspects. It continues to be
Speaker 1: an investigation fueled by rumors, speculation, and some wild theories.
Speaker 1: But maybe buried in there somewhere lies the truth. Next
Speaker 1: time on the real killer.
Speaker 4: Who do you think killed Anastasia?
Speaker 9: I think there were many individual treasures and I don't
Speaker 9: know who pulled the trigger. I don't think that person
Speaker 9: is alive today.
Speaker 1: Are people being scared into silence?
Speaker 9: Well, I think Virons fearing for his life and that's
Speaker 9: why he's not telling the story.
Speaker 1: The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely
Speaker 1: those of the individuals participating in the podcast. If you
Speaker 1: or someone you know is experiencing suicidal thoughts or a crisis,
Speaker 1: please no help is available, call or text nine to
Speaker 1: eight eight or chat online at the Suicide and Christi
Speaker 1: is Lifeline's website at nine eight eight lifeline dot org.
Speaker 1: To see photos, maps and documents related to this season's story,
Speaker 1: follow The Real Killer podcast on Instagram and at TRK
Speaker 1: podcast on TikTok. The Real Killer is a production of
Speaker 1: AYR Media and iHeartMedia, hosted by me Leah Rothman. Executive
Speaker 1: producers Leah Rothman and Elisa Rosen for AYR Media. Written
Speaker 1: by Leah Rothman, editing and sound design by Cameron Taggi,
Speaker 1: mixed and mastered by Cameron Taggi. Production coordinator Andy Levine,
Speaker 1: Audio engineer Justin Longerbeam studio engineer Graham Gibson, Legal console
Speaker 1: for AYR Media. Johnny Douglas, Executive producer for iHeartMedia. Maya
Speaker 1: Howard