WEBVTT - What is nuclear forensics? 0:00:00.480 --> 0:00:04.120 Hello Seattle, Hello, Portland's We're coming out to see you 0:00:04.240 --> 0:00:09.640 this January. Love. That's right, one of the dates, my friend, January. 0:00:10.119 --> 0:00:11.879 We're going to be at the More Theater in Seattle 0:00:12.080 --> 0:00:14.760 on January six. We're gonna be a revolution Hall again 0:00:14.800 --> 0:00:17.759 in Portland. That's right. Tickets are being snapped up fast everyone, 0:00:17.800 --> 0:00:19.800 because you love us out there and we love you 0:00:19.880 --> 0:00:22.000 right back. So just go to s y s K 0:00:22.200 --> 0:00:25.239 live dot com for all ticket details. We can't wait 0:00:25.280 --> 0:00:29.800 to see you. Welcome to Stuff you Should Know from 0:00:29.800 --> 0:00:38.479 how Stuff Works dot com. Hey, and welcome to the podcast. 0:00:38.560 --> 0:00:41.120 I'm Josh Clark, There's Charles W. Chuck Bryant, and there's 0:00:41.240 --> 0:00:45.040 Jerry Rowland and it's us Stuff you should Know, the 0:00:45.200 --> 0:00:50.800 Nuclear Investigators. I thought this was really neat. I did too, 0:00:51.640 --> 0:00:53.560 and I did. I had a silly title. I thought, 0:00:54.040 --> 0:00:56.640 how good is this gonna be? But then you and 0:00:56.840 --> 0:00:58.560 our article was good enough, But then you found that 0:00:58.600 --> 0:01:03.520 great article from econom Economists. Yeah, man, that was good. Yes, yeah, 0:01:03.520 --> 0:01:05.959 our article was written by Robert william and it was great. 0:01:06.080 --> 0:01:10.280 But it gets even better. Yeah, like people should I 0:01:10.280 --> 0:01:12.760 think this is one of those like take twenty minutes 0:01:12.760 --> 0:01:16.640 out of your day and read the new detectives from 0:01:16.680 --> 0:01:19.480 the Economist just good like and we'll give you a 0:01:19.480 --> 0:01:22.200 good over here. But it just gets knowledge to have, 0:01:22.400 --> 0:01:25.520 you know, yeah, because you don't really think about this. 0:01:25.600 --> 0:01:32.039 But there is, in my opinion, thankfully, a an international 0:01:32.520 --> 0:01:38.840 network of people who are dedicated to preventing people from 0:01:38.880 --> 0:01:43.720 getting nukes. Who should who who who shouldn't have it? 0:01:44.080 --> 0:01:46.839 Depending on who you are, right, Like, there's a there's 0:01:46.840 --> 0:01:51.120 a whole um. I looked up at this question like 0:01:51.120 --> 0:01:54.280 like is it the right of any sovereign nation to 0:01:54.400 --> 0:01:58.880 have whatever nuclear technology it wants? And I saw, um, 0:01:58.920 --> 0:02:01.000 that's actually apparently the like you know those sites like 0:02:01.040 --> 0:02:04.360 debate dot org and like debate prep sites or something, 0:02:04.400 --> 0:02:08.000 they'll have like a bunch of different brain teasers. Yeah, 0:02:08.080 --> 0:02:11.400 something like that. Um. And that seems to be mostly 0:02:11.400 --> 0:02:13.200 where it lives. But I found this one guy on 0:02:13.280 --> 0:02:16.880 Forbes who argued that is not the case that if 0:02:16.919 --> 0:02:21.520 you have not demonstrated a um uh like an allegiance 0:02:21.600 --> 0:02:28.079 to liberal democratic principles and freedom uh and that you're 0:02:28.120 --> 0:02:29.840 just looking out for your people at your role as 0:02:29.840 --> 0:02:32.320 the government. That is to say, like, if you're an 0:02:32.320 --> 0:02:37.600 autocratic government, you haven't you don't have enough sovereign cred 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:41.720 two to enjoy the right to new because this is 0:02:41.760 --> 0:02:44.440 how this guy was arguing against, like North Korea having 0:02:44.960 --> 0:02:48.800 the right to a nuclear program, right, But my thing is, 0:02:49.040 --> 0:02:51.440 I think it goes even further than that. I think 0:02:51.480 --> 0:02:53.720 that that assumes because he was also saying at the 0:02:53.760 --> 0:02:57.840 same time, if you are a friendly nation and you 0:02:57.960 --> 0:03:02.480 are liberal democracy, um, you kind of should have the 0:03:02.600 --> 0:03:09.320 right to a military nuclear program. But like liberal democracies 0:03:09.320 --> 0:03:12.600 can change over time, the nukes are going to remain. 0:03:12.720 --> 0:03:15.400 So what was once a friendly nation may not be 0:03:15.880 --> 0:03:18.280 thirty or fifty years from now, but they're still going 0:03:18.320 --> 0:03:21.960 to have a nuclear stockpile. Or some governments dissolved. Look 0:03:21.960 --> 0:03:27.320 at the USSR, they had one of the the world's 0:03:27.400 --> 0:03:31.079 largest nuclear arsenals, still do, but then the government just 0:03:31.160 --> 0:03:36.119 disintegrated and it turned into the Russian Federation, which has 0:03:36.240 --> 0:03:40.280 arguably much looser control over the nuclear stockpile. And we 0:03:40.360 --> 0:03:42.400 talked about this, then how easy is it to steal 0:03:42.400 --> 0:03:44.840 a nuclear bomb that episode we did. Yeah, I think 0:03:44.880 --> 0:03:50.200 after after the Soviet Union dissolved, that was that was 0:03:50.240 --> 0:03:53.160 a really scary time and continues we continue to see 0:03:53.200 --> 0:03:56.040 the ball out from that as far as the black 0:03:56.120 --> 0:04:04.040 market trade on nuclear either weapons or the technology or 0:04:04.080 --> 0:04:09.360 the information or the pieces parts the mouth parts right, 0:04:09.480 --> 0:04:12.800 as we like to say around here. And luckily, like 0:04:12.840 --> 0:04:17.440 you said, there's a field called nuclear forensics. And as 0:04:17.560 --> 0:04:20.920 Robert astutely points out, they have sort of a three 0:04:20.960 --> 0:04:25.880 track uh challenge on their hands, which is a what 0:04:25.920 --> 0:04:32.120 they do is a monitor places and countries, um and organizations. Uh, 0:04:32.320 --> 0:04:36.680 so they can basically stop them from developing nuclear arms 0:04:36.720 --> 0:04:39.359 if they're not supposed to be people on the on 0:04:39.440 --> 0:04:44.279 the no no list. Then they track extremist groups and 0:04:44.320 --> 0:04:47.560 smugglers and try to find out where these You know, 0:04:47.560 --> 0:04:48.960 there's a lot of we'll get to it later, but 0:04:49.080 --> 0:04:52.320 a lot of stuff goes missing, which is super scary. Yeah. 0:04:52.440 --> 0:04:54.520 Can I just interject here for a second. In two 0:04:54.440 --> 0:04:58.279 thou eleven, the US the United States announced that it 0:04:58.360 --> 0:05:04.120 could not account for fifty pounds of weapons usable nuclear 0:05:04.160 --> 0:05:06.919 material that it had previously shipped around in the world 0:05:07.640 --> 0:05:10.359 and that's just gone. They said it was enough for 0:05:10.560 --> 0:05:15.360 dozens of nuclear warheads. And then finally, the third thing 0:05:15.360 --> 0:05:17.640 that you will do as a nuclear detective or in 0:05:17.680 --> 0:05:21.159 the field of nuclear forensics is if something does happen, 0:05:21.640 --> 0:05:24.200 if there is a radiological attack or a nuclear bomb 0:05:24.600 --> 0:05:27.760 that goes off or is launched. They are the ones 0:05:27.760 --> 0:05:31.039 who will investigate the scene just like you would any 0:05:31.040 --> 0:05:34.640 crime scene exactly. Yeah, So that's the those are like 0:05:34.760 --> 0:05:37.680 kind of the three things that in a nuclear forensic 0:05:38.320 --> 0:05:41.040 detective I guess, if is the best way to put it, 0:05:41.600 --> 0:05:44.120 UM would be involved in doing. And there's a lot 0:05:44.200 --> 0:05:46.839 of other signs around it and research around it too, 0:05:47.680 --> 0:05:50.320 which is why you're you very rarely find somebody who 0:05:50.440 --> 0:05:52.359 is a full time at least in the u S 0:05:52.400 --> 0:05:57.000 I should say, is a full time nuclear forensics expert. 0:05:57.600 --> 0:06:00.560 Most of the time they're doing the sign ants that's 0:06:00.600 --> 0:06:05.599 helping the field, right. So, like there's there's a project 0:06:05.640 --> 0:06:11.120 that UM Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory to identify the the 0:06:11.440 --> 0:06:18.520 um elemental signature of the uranium that comes from all 0:06:18.680 --> 0:06:21.640 one hundred and fifty uranium minds that have ever existed 0:06:21.680 --> 0:06:24.400 on planet Earth. Right, So if you come across the 0:06:24.440 --> 0:06:29.000 sample of uranium um, you can you can trace it 0:06:29.000 --> 0:06:32.200 back to its point of origin. That's something that you 0:06:32.200 --> 0:06:35.520 would do if you were a nuclear forensics expert. When 0:06:35.520 --> 0:06:39.400 you're not actually like say investigating a case or UM 0:06:39.440 --> 0:06:43.599 carrying out a routine inspection of a non military nuclear state. 0:06:44.200 --> 0:06:47.480 That kind of thing. Yeah, they're like football referees kind 0:06:47.520 --> 0:06:51.680 of right. And it's pretty cool that these guys even exist, right, 0:06:51.760 --> 0:06:53.600 that the idea that there are people out there who 0:06:53.640 --> 0:06:58.920 are inspecting states, um and by states of men countries. Obviously, 0:06:58.960 --> 0:07:03.599 I'm using it in like the the security kind of way, right, Um, 0:07:03.920 --> 0:07:07.400 people out there whose job it is is to say, um, 0:07:07.600 --> 0:07:10.320 you are not holding up to international standards. We think 0:07:10.360 --> 0:07:13.120 that you are going down the road toward a military 0:07:13.200 --> 0:07:17.360 nuclear program that's not allowed. We're going to tell yeah. 0:07:17.400 --> 0:07:20.960 And Robert has a neat little way to put We 0:07:21.040 --> 0:07:24.960 talked about mutually assured destruction many years ago, I think 0:07:25.400 --> 0:07:30.280 in a show and in nations signed the Treaty on 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:33.600 the Non Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons a k A MPT. 0:07:34.840 --> 0:07:37.760 Is that confusing a K A MPT. I think that's 0:07:37.800 --> 0:07:43.000 like the the acronyms, the abbreviation of the Non Proliferation Treaty. 0:07:43.040 --> 0:07:46.880 That's right, I think. But he talks about mutually assured 0:07:46.880 --> 0:07:51.840 destruction like this like a movie standoff where and I 0:07:51.880 --> 0:07:54.920 always equate this with reservoir dogs, like two people and 0:07:55.160 --> 0:07:58.760 a gun or three people aiming a gun at one another. Um, 0:07:58.800 --> 0:08:01.040 if you are all three aiming the gun at one another, 0:08:01.120 --> 0:08:04.280 then there is a likelihood that no one will fire 0:08:04.720 --> 0:08:07.000 because you could all die, and maybe you will just 0:08:07.080 --> 0:08:09.520 lower your guns. And that's sort of the idea with 0:08:10.160 --> 0:08:13.160 mutually assured destruction if we all have not all, but 0:08:13.600 --> 0:08:16.640 if these nations have nuclear weapons, they know that just 0:08:16.800 --> 0:08:20.840 exchanging nuke fire. Everyone's seen war games. Uh, you can't win, 0:08:21.560 --> 0:08:25.119 so I can't win. The trick comes in when someone 0:08:25.160 --> 0:08:28.160 else comes into that room, like in Reservoir Dogs, when 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:31.080 Lawrence Tierney comes in at the very end and they're 0:08:31.080 --> 0:08:33.520 already pointing their guns, and then you've got a new 0:08:33.520 --> 0:08:36.920 gun on the scene, and that's when everybody dies, right, 0:08:37.120 --> 0:08:42.080 or I guess probably an even better analogy is that 0:08:42.160 --> 0:08:47.680 with the Non Proliferation Treaty, if somebody came in, if 0:08:47.720 --> 0:08:50.600 if say Barber strikes in came into the standoff and 0:08:50.640 --> 0:08:54.160 Reservoir Dogs and a complete surprise twist in the director's 0:08:54.160 --> 0:08:58.080 cut of the movie and said, everybody, everybody calmed down, 0:08:58.240 --> 0:09:01.240 lower your guns. Here's a little her from Yental, right, 0:09:01.559 --> 0:09:03.720 and she does her little number, and it just charms 0:09:03.760 --> 0:09:06.559 everybody into forgetting their troubles and they put their guns up. 0:09:07.120 --> 0:09:11.120 And that's that. That's the aim of the Nuclear Non 0:09:11.120 --> 0:09:15.200 Proliferation Treaty. It goes even further than that. Imagine if 0:09:15.240 --> 0:09:18.400 Babs as she was walking around doing her number from 0:09:18.520 --> 0:09:22.199 yental Um, she was like taking everybody's guns up too, 0:09:22.640 --> 0:09:25.880 and then maybe disassembling them quickly with a little jazzy 0:09:25.960 --> 0:09:29.600 number going. And um, that was that. So not only 0:09:29.720 --> 0:09:35.080 is there the non Proliferation Treaty, it was it was saying, everybody, 0:09:35.120 --> 0:09:37.960 calm down. That's mutual is sure destruction. I guess the 0:09:38.000 --> 0:09:40.640 Non Proliferation Treaty comes in and says, not only are 0:09:40.679 --> 0:09:42.679 you gonna calm down, let's get rid of some of 0:09:42.720 --> 0:09:46.360 these nuclear weapons to us disassemble them, right, But when 0:09:46.400 --> 0:09:48.840 Lawrence Tyrney or Barber Stress and walk in with a 0:09:48.880 --> 0:09:54.360 gun a k A m P T a k A 0:09:54.480 --> 0:09:58.080 having another another nuclear player, all of a sudden, that 0:09:58.200 --> 0:10:04.000 disrupts the weird balance that is mutually assure destruction. It does, 0:10:04.200 --> 0:10:06.640 for sure. But that which is why a lot I 0:10:06.640 --> 0:10:11.160 think a hundred and ninety nations ratified the Nuclear nonp 0:10:11.360 --> 0:10:16.000 non Proliferation Treaty UM, which says, yes, all of you guys, 0:10:16.040 --> 0:10:18.600 with all of your big nukes and everything. Get rid 0:10:18.640 --> 0:10:20.439 of some of those. We don't like them being here 0:10:20.480 --> 0:10:23.720 on planet Earth. And the problem with that is is 0:10:23.760 --> 0:10:28.000 that the the organization that was created to oversee this, 0:10:28.200 --> 0:10:34.520 the International Atomic Energy Agency. I think they're basically they 0:10:34.559 --> 0:10:40.680 amount to nuclear accountants, right. Their whole jam is that 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:44.720 they are UM. They go in and they say, the 0:10:44.760 --> 0:10:51.720 international community says that you can have this UM. You 0:10:51.720 --> 0:10:56.160 can have nuclear capabilities for peaceful purposes, for the power 0:10:56.200 --> 0:10:59.640 generation or for your hospitals or whatever, but you can't 0:11:00.160 --> 0:11:03.120 have it. You can't have a military program. And and 0:11:03.200 --> 0:11:07.880 there you it's not hard once you have one to 0:11:07.880 --> 0:11:11.400 to have the other. Right, once you have a peaceful 0:11:11.440 --> 0:11:14.600 program down, it would not be very hard to translate 0:11:14.679 --> 0:11:17.440 that into a military program. The i a e A 0:11:18.160 --> 0:11:22.200 Is tasked with coming to your country, coming behind your 0:11:22.200 --> 0:11:26.640 borders and looking at your your program and making sure 0:11:26.720 --> 0:11:30.360 that it's non military. And if everything checks off, they 0:11:30.360 --> 0:11:32.680 can turn around and say to the rest of the world, 0:11:32.679 --> 0:11:35.960 this country is keeping their promise and all they have 0:11:36.120 --> 0:11:40.120 is a peaceful program. Everybody can be friends with this guy. 0:11:40.280 --> 0:11:42.360 Or if they find that there is evidence of a 0:11:42.360 --> 0:11:46.760 military program, they say, guys, um, you're gonna want to 0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:50.400 hear about this. North Korea over here is secretly working 0:11:50.440 --> 0:11:54.240 on a nuclear program and we've done our jobs. Now 0:11:54.240 --> 0:11:56.400 it's up to the international community to figure out what 0:11:56.440 --> 0:11:59.320 to do about it. Right. But here's the thing is, 0:12:00.120 --> 0:12:04.160 you know there a U N organization, So these are 0:12:04.200 --> 0:12:07.040 the above board. Let me come and knock on your 0:12:07.040 --> 0:12:09.400 door and get an invitation to come in and inspect 0:12:09.400 --> 0:12:12.079 your stuff. I got all my machines, all my gear. 0:12:12.559 --> 0:12:17.000 They can sniff out radiation, and you you allow me 0:12:17.080 --> 0:12:19.599 in or you don't allow me in. This isn't the 0:12:19.600 --> 0:12:25.559 the clandestine uh FBI and and spy agencies that very 0:12:25.640 --> 0:12:28.960 much also do the same thing from satellites and you know, 0:12:28.960 --> 0:12:31.080 in all kinds of other ways on the ground. But 0:12:31.440 --> 0:12:34.560 the I A e A. It really depends on these 0:12:34.760 --> 0:12:39.760 UN mandates and cooperation from the country. So, for instance, 0:12:39.800 --> 0:12:43.959 and two thousand two and two thousand seven, North Korea said, um, 0:12:44.200 --> 0:12:48.360 kindly leave our country, and they had to do so. Yes, 0:12:48.520 --> 0:12:50.120 you know, it's not like they draw a gun then 0:12:50.160 --> 0:12:52.840 and say no, we're here to inspect your stuff, don't 0:12:52.880 --> 0:12:55.960 you get it, right? But what they do is basically 0:12:56.000 --> 0:12:59.199 go tell the people with the guns. Right, So that's 0:12:59.240 --> 0:13:02.760 that's like a real red flag to not let the 0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:06.280 I a e A access to you look everywhere but 0:13:06.640 --> 0:13:10.280 in this room, rights, oh yeah, or to kick them 0:13:10.280 --> 0:13:12.760 out like that. That really raises red flags and it 0:13:12.800 --> 0:13:16.240 did in that in those instances to right. So, yes, 0:13:16.320 --> 0:13:18.240 they are toothless. I mean it is after all a 0:13:18.360 --> 0:13:22.560 U N body, but they are backed up by the 0:13:22.720 --> 0:13:30.120 collective might of the nuclear military Nations UM, who say, basically, 0:13:30.160 --> 0:13:31.960 this is the state the sat is quote of the world. 0:13:32.320 --> 0:13:35.560 There's eight countries that have a nuclear program. Most of 0:13:35.600 --> 0:13:41.000 them are allies UM, and they are tasked. Those allies 0:13:41.040 --> 0:13:44.400 have taken it upon themselves to say, no one else 0:13:44.440 --> 0:13:46.920 can have a nuclear program. You're not supposed to have 0:13:46.920 --> 0:13:49.559 a nuclear program. You're not supposed to be building nukes. 0:13:49.679 --> 0:13:52.559 We say, if you can have a military nuclear program, 0:13:52.720 --> 0:13:55.200 and we say no. And every once in a while 0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:59.040 a state that is not part of that group comes 0:13:59.120 --> 0:14:03.640 up on their own with their own military nuclear program. 0:14:03.720 --> 0:14:06.680 And when they do, the other countries have to decide 0:14:06.679 --> 0:14:08.800 what to do about it. Yeah, and they you know, 0:14:08.840 --> 0:14:11.680 the I a e A does very good work. Uh, 0:14:11.720 --> 0:14:13.959 it works to a certain degree. Like in two thousand 0:14:14.000 --> 0:14:17.280 three when they said, hey Libya, hey Iran, we have 0:14:17.360 --> 0:14:21.520 evidence now that you have a military program going. And 0:14:21.560 --> 0:14:23.680 so Libya said, all right, I'm gonna give that up. 0:14:23.920 --> 0:14:27.640 Iran at least gave up their suppliers in Pakistan, yeah, 0:14:27.680 --> 0:14:30.920 a Q Khan, Yeah, and they do good work. They 0:14:30.920 --> 0:14:33.680 want a Nobel Peace Prize in two thousand five. However, 0:14:33.760 --> 0:14:38.000 depending on who you ask, um, like the United States 0:14:38.080 --> 0:14:40.960 may say you guys are being too nice and too lenient. Uh. 0:14:41.080 --> 0:14:44.000 Countries that are getting inspected say, well, I think you're 0:14:44.040 --> 0:14:47.280 actually being a little bit too nosy. So it's definitely 0:14:47.280 --> 0:14:51.040 the above board approach you in style to getting this 0:14:51.360 --> 0:14:55.880 curved right there. Um, there are a lot of other 0:14:55.960 --> 0:14:59.800 ways to like look into whether or not somebody has 0:14:59.840 --> 0:15:02.280 an military program. We'll take a little break and we'll 0:15:02.280 --> 0:15:28.160 talk about those. How about that, So, Chuckers, we were 0:15:28.200 --> 0:15:31.640 talking about the above boards way where the UN politely 0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:35.040 knocks on your door and does some inspections. And there's 0:15:35.040 --> 0:15:36.960 some cool stuff that they have going on, right, Like 0:15:37.000 --> 0:15:42.240 they install digital cameras in the facilities and they they're 0:15:42.280 --> 0:15:48.040 like set and program to take pictures if there's movement 0:15:48.200 --> 0:15:53.160 near likes uh A a piece of equipment that could 0:15:53.200 --> 0:15:58.360 turn this peaceful nuclear program into a military program, and 0:15:58.400 --> 0:16:01.360 then they're all time stamped and data and ordered sequentially, 0:16:01.440 --> 0:16:04.000 so if there's any missing, some software will catch the 0:16:04.040 --> 0:16:07.800 fact that a picture has been deleted, and now all 0:16:07.840 --> 0:16:11.400 of a sudden, you've got an international incident. Right um. 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:16.600 They also use laser surveying equipment to survey the layout 0:16:16.960 --> 0:16:21.360 of the um uh the what do they call the 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:25.800 the centrifuges, the piping of the centrifuge, Because so you 0:16:25.840 --> 0:16:30.000 have to have a centrifuge to have a peaceful nuclear program. 0:16:30.240 --> 0:16:34.680 Right like you take um uranium and uranium has like 0:16:34.800 --> 0:16:38.880 points seven percent uranium in a uranium or I should 0:16:38.880 --> 0:16:41.200 say the stuff that you find in nature. Now to 0:16:41.320 --> 0:16:45.880 have like to create nuclear fuel for a nuclear power plant, 0:16:46.320 --> 0:16:50.120 you've gotta you've got to isolate that the uranium two 0:16:50.120 --> 0:16:52.920 thirty five isotope, and you do that by spinning it 0:16:53.320 --> 0:16:56.840 in gas in a vacuum so fast that you're hitting 0:16:56.880 --> 0:17:01.640 like seventy thousand rpm s and it separates the isotopes. 0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:04.240 And then those things are connected. All those all those 0:17:04.240 --> 0:17:07.520 centrifuges are connected by tubes of gas so that the 0:17:07.600 --> 0:17:10.480 isotopes you want all kind of mingle and migrate to 0:17:10.920 --> 0:17:13.520 the place you want them to to where you collect them, 0:17:13.920 --> 0:17:16.600 and then all of a sudden, you have three percent 0:17:16.680 --> 0:17:20.800 concentration of uranium. Now you have UM nuclear fuel that 0:17:20.840 --> 0:17:23.280 you can use for peaceful purposes if you keep it going, 0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:26.880 if you make some upgrades to your whole composition UM 0:17:26.960 --> 0:17:29.280 and rearrange the pipes a little bit here there, and 0:17:29.320 --> 0:17:32.919 you can get that stuff up to UM concentration of 0:17:33.160 --> 0:17:37.159 uranium two thirty five. Now you have weapons grade uranium. 0:17:37.560 --> 0:17:40.320 Now you can build nuclear warheads with that. What the 0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:43.400 i a e A Does with their laser surveys of 0:17:43.440 --> 0:17:48.600 these centrifuge gas pipes is they they survey them, digitize 0:17:48.640 --> 0:17:52.280 that and then do it again when they come a 0:17:52.359 --> 0:17:55.199 year or two years later and see if there's been 0:17:55.240 --> 0:17:58.800 any alterations or modifications to that pipe that it would 0:17:58.800 --> 0:18:03.119 indicate that they're trying to make that uranium uh even 0:18:03.160 --> 0:18:06.840 more enriched. Yeah. So this is this is the i 0:18:07.000 --> 0:18:09.879 a e a s good work that they're doing. Uh. 0:18:09.920 --> 0:18:12.000 And this is when they, you know, like we said, 0:18:12.040 --> 0:18:15.520 go to countries that say come on in. Then there's 0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:21.200 a whole other problem that is UM terrorists and drug 0:18:21.200 --> 0:18:25.919 cartels and basically the black market, uh nuclear black market 0:18:26.960 --> 0:18:28.840 and that's a whole different deal. You can't go knocking 0:18:28.920 --> 0:18:31.159 on their door and they're not gonna say come on in. 0:18:31.280 --> 0:18:33.920 You probably don't even know where their door is, which 0:18:33.920 --> 0:18:36.320 is the whole point. So if you're wondering, like is 0:18:36.400 --> 0:18:38.320 how big of an issue is this? How much should 0:18:38.320 --> 0:18:42.040 we worry? Uh, just go read a little document called 0:18:42.040 --> 0:18:46.200 the i a e. A Illicit Trafficking Database. Um, it's 0:18:46.200 --> 0:18:49.199 a little frightening. So what they will do is they'll 0:18:49.240 --> 0:18:51.400 it's it's not very long. They have like a two 0:18:51.440 --> 0:18:54.119 or three page report, and I think the most recent 0:18:54.119 --> 0:18:59.040 one I saw was numbers where they will basically say 0:18:59.080 --> 0:19:05.600 how many incidents of unauthorized um acquisition, possession, used, transfer, 0:19:05.760 --> 0:19:10.679 or disposal of nuclear or radioactive materials were there? And 0:19:10.720 --> 0:19:13.520 there was the good news is it's gone down. There 0:19:13.560 --> 0:19:17.000 was some huge spike in two thousand six. When you 0:19:17.000 --> 0:19:19.000 look at these charts, I have no idea what happened 0:19:19.320 --> 0:19:22.919 in two thousand six, but it's sort of level, and 0:19:22.960 --> 0:19:26.080 then two thousand six it just like ramps up. Like 0:19:26.960 --> 0:19:29.280 I think there were a hundred and thirty something cases 0:19:29.800 --> 0:19:33.000 in two thousand six compared to just over forty and 0:19:33.000 --> 0:19:36.880 two thousand fifteen. Yeah, that's a pretty big spike. It's 0:19:36.880 --> 0:19:39.080 a big spike. And then like the graphs really really 0:19:39.080 --> 0:19:40.720 stand out. So I don't know what's going on then, 0:19:41.200 --> 0:19:44.360 but it's still a little scary to see just how 0:19:44.400 --> 0:19:48.879 many cases there are where things go missing, or things 0:19:48.960 --> 0:19:53.480 are not disposed of, right, or things are are acquired 0:19:53.600 --> 0:19:55.960 or sold on the black market. And this is just 0:19:56.000 --> 0:19:58.600 the stuff they know about. Yeah, this is these are 0:19:58.640 --> 0:20:01.760 just the ones that got caught, right um. And you know, 0:20:01.960 --> 0:20:05.720 that whole non proliferation um is a it's a double 0:20:05.800 --> 0:20:07.960 edged sword as well as far as the nuclear black 0:20:08.000 --> 0:20:11.880 market goes, because yes, you're disassembling nuclear warheads, but then 0:20:11.920 --> 0:20:17.920 that means that nuclear grade plutonium or uranium is now 0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:22.360 being transported somewhere for storage or something like that. Right, 0:20:22.400 --> 0:20:25.720 so it's back in play. I guess. Whereas before you'd 0:20:25.720 --> 0:20:28.199 have to steal the whole nuclear warhead, now you just 0:20:28.280 --> 0:20:31.200 have a big lump of weapons grade uranium that's being 0:20:31.200 --> 0:20:35.080 transported across the Atlantic, you know, So that that represents 0:20:35.280 --> 0:20:38.879 a security um, a change in security too. I wonder 0:20:38.920 --> 0:20:42.000 if there were a bunch of nuclear warheads that were 0:20:42.040 --> 0:20:45.320 disassembled that year, I don't know. I bet someone knows 0:20:45.320 --> 0:20:49.720 the answer though, so like you were saying, like there 0:20:49.800 --> 0:20:53.040 is the whole black market UM that that represents an 0:20:53.160 --> 0:20:57.240 an entirely different UM side to this. And there are 0:20:57.240 --> 0:21:00.840 plenty of UM terrorists, organizations and just what you would 0:21:00.840 --> 0:21:04.440 call bad actors, which is hilarious, but it's also pretty 0:21:04.480 --> 0:21:06.520 sinister if you think about it. Who would just like 0:21:06.600 --> 0:21:09.000 to get their hands on this kind of stuff. Some 0:21:09.080 --> 0:21:12.320 of the people that they're selling it to our representatives 0:21:12.320 --> 0:21:16.160 of countries that want to have their own military program UM, 0:21:16.200 --> 0:21:21.040 like North Korea or Iraq, Um, I should say Soda 0:21:21.160 --> 0:21:25.399 Hussein erra Iraq, which we're both successful in creating nuclear 0:21:25.440 --> 0:21:30.720 programs right under the noses of the international intelligence community. Yeah, 0:21:30.800 --> 0:21:32.600 and you know, well we'll get to that a little 0:21:32.600 --> 0:21:34.359 bit later. Like how some of the ways that they 0:21:34.359 --> 0:21:38.800 can skirt this stuff. But but the good news is 0:21:38.800 --> 0:21:43.840 is that it is Uh. You can't just get uranium 0:21:43.840 --> 0:21:46.320 at the corner store, right, you can only mind for 0:21:46.359 --> 0:21:49.480 it in certain places. You can't. You can't just get 0:21:49.520 --> 0:21:53.000 that uranium and throw it into a hand grenade casing 0:21:53.760 --> 0:21:56.240 and then you have a little tiny nuclear bomb. Well 0:21:56.280 --> 0:21:58.679 that's a dirty bomb at least. Well, yeah, there are 0:21:58.680 --> 0:22:03.040 such things as dirty bombs. But it's it's like nuclear warheads. Um. 0:22:03.160 --> 0:22:05.280 They they have to be made in very special ways 0:22:05.280 --> 0:22:10.080 with very special materials. And it's the good news is 0:22:10.160 --> 0:22:14.159 that is that I won't say it's easy, but it is. 0:22:14.280 --> 0:22:18.520 It is all pretty trackable to a certain degree. On 0:22:19.320 --> 0:22:22.240 like these nuclear forensics teams, they can generally find out 0:22:22.280 --> 0:22:26.960 even by examining, uh, examining the uranium, like where it 0:22:27.000 --> 0:22:32.320 actually came from or where where did this casing come from? 0:22:32.440 --> 0:22:36.160 It can be tracked pretty readily at this point. Yeah, 0:22:36.200 --> 0:22:39.280 and that's where the UM like the where the nuclear 0:22:39.320 --> 0:22:42.520 forensic scientists are also doing, like the day to day 0:22:42.560 --> 0:22:46.800 science to create a database like the signatures of uranium 0:22:46.800 --> 0:22:49.680 from the hundred and fifty minds around the around the world. Right, 0:22:49.720 --> 0:22:51.840 that's where that stuff kind of comes into place. When 0:22:51.840 --> 0:22:55.879 you find something, you know, the dude who's smuggling it, 0:22:56.800 --> 0:22:58.840 he may give up whoever he knows, but that doesn't 0:22:58.880 --> 0:23:02.960 mean it's going to lead anywhere. UM. Actually studying the 0:23:03.000 --> 0:23:07.960 material that he was smuggling is UM, it can frequently 0:23:08.000 --> 0:23:12.240 give up more information than that person even knows, you know, 0:23:12.400 --> 0:23:14.720 yeah for sure. But to do that you have to 0:23:14.800 --> 0:23:18.240 catch the material. UM when it's say coming through your 0:23:18.240 --> 0:23:23.280 border or your port and there are um, well, there's 0:23:23.359 --> 0:23:26.080 there's a number of ways to do this, right yeah. 0:23:26.080 --> 0:23:27.399 I mean you know you can do a lot with 0:23:27.440 --> 0:23:30.679 satellite imagery of course, um, but you can only do 0:23:30.760 --> 0:23:34.000 so much with satellite imagery, like to really to really 0:23:34.040 --> 0:23:36.080 find this stuff. I mean, the good news is radiation 0:23:36.119 --> 0:23:40.520 gives off radiation, so are these these uh uranium and 0:23:40.520 --> 0:23:43.919 stuff like that gives off radiation, But you need to 0:23:43.920 --> 0:23:45.960 be on like ideally you need to be on the 0:23:46.000 --> 0:23:49.520 ground and fairly close to it to read it. Yeah, 0:23:49.560 --> 0:23:53.719 the detectors have gotten way better. Supposedly they need like, um, 0:23:53.760 --> 0:23:56.000 just a fifth of the mass that it used to 0:23:56.000 --> 0:23:59.639 take to set off a reading. Um. But yeah, you 0:23:59.680 --> 0:24:02.840 still have to be I think that the next generation 0:24:02.960 --> 0:24:06.000 will be basically a football field, an American football field 0:24:06.000 --> 0:24:10.359 link yards, yeah, hundred yards roughly a hundred meters um. 0:24:10.440 --> 0:24:13.919 But that means that you have to have a person 0:24:14.720 --> 0:24:18.919 in a hostile nation, you know, walking around with a 0:24:19.000 --> 0:24:22.960 detector within a football field of a nuclear facility. That's 0:24:23.119 --> 0:24:26.240 that's a lot of um. That's that's that's a that's 0:24:26.240 --> 0:24:30.040 a tall order in a lot of cases, right, Um, 0:24:30.080 --> 0:24:34.000 there are detectors that are attached to satellites that can 0:24:34.040 --> 0:24:39.400 detect um radiation into the atmosphere. Yeah, and apparently they've 0:24:39.440 --> 0:24:42.080 gotten a lot better too. But the problem is is 0:24:42.119 --> 0:24:46.840 that radiation there's a couple of things with actual radiation UM. 0:24:46.880 --> 0:24:51.080 It can be shielded relatively easily with a thick layer 0:24:51.080 --> 0:24:56.280