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Speaker 1: Native LAMB Pod is the production of iHeartRadio in partnership

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Speaker 1: with Reason Choice Media.

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Speaker 2: Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome, Welcome.

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Speaker 1: Welcome home, y'all is Mini pod Day, and I'm thrilled

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Speaker 1: because we have very special guests joining us Doctor Joy

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Speaker 1: Hard and Bradford. She's a licensed psychologist, a speaker, and

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Speaker 1: host of the wildly popular mental health podcast Therapy for

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Speaker 1: Black Girls. I've been a guest on her show before

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Speaker 1: and turned it into my own personal therapy session.

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Speaker 3: I got a free bee.

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Speaker 4: Out of her.

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Speaker 1: But we love doctor Joy. It's such a delight to

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Speaker 1: have you on the show. I was so thrill and

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Speaker 1: Angela said you would be our guest this week.

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Speaker 2: So welcome home, Welcome you, Thank you, touch and to

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Speaker 2: join you all.

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Speaker 3: Even your voice is so soothing. I love hearing you.

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Speaker 5: Might put me out right exactly.

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Speaker 1: But there's a reason, Angela, you wanted to have doctor

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Speaker 1: Joy on the show. I have my own personal therapy

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Speaker 1: questions I'll be getting to later, But what was your reason.

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Speaker 6: Well, there's a clip that keeps circulating online. It's been

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Speaker 6: viral a few times, and I just want to play

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Speaker 6: that clip. The clip is of a mother who has

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Speaker 6: clearly sounded like she's sobbing as she moves around a

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Speaker 6: very destroyed house. They say that this was seventy thousand

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Speaker 6: dollars in damage done to her home by her twelve

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Speaker 6: year old son because she simply took his device away.

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Speaker 6: We regularly talk about on this show how these devices

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Speaker 6: are all consuming. We see children getting into them much younger.

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Speaker 6: I have a good friend of mine whose daughter. I

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Speaker 6: was watching her daughter when she was two, and this

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Speaker 6: was several years ago, and I had a book I

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Speaker 6: was reading to her and the baby was swiping the

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Speaker 6: page instead of turning the page. So you know, even

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Speaker 6: even that, like, there are so many ways in which

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Speaker 6: we begin to rely on these devices.

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Speaker 4: For parents.

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Speaker 6: Sometimes it's a necessary very mental health reprieve to give

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Speaker 6: the child something to do. And then you also see

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Speaker 6: kids whose minds are not developed enough to be able

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Speaker 6: to hold devices, and when they're taken away, they flip out.

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Speaker 6: I have never seen something online where a child flips

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Speaker 6: out and causes this much damage. Or refrigerator was tipped

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Speaker 6: over in here, every TV screen had a hole in

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Speaker 6: it or was broken in some way. Dresser's furniture completely destroyed. Again,

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Speaker 6: they said it was seventy thousand dollars worth of damage.

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Speaker 6: So before you answer, doctor Joy, I want to go

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Speaker 6: to my co host one who muttered under his breath.

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Speaker 6: I have three options that I would have provided this child,

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Speaker 6: and I want to see if my three options are

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Speaker 6: aligned with my co host Andrew as you shake your

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Speaker 6: head in person, all, oh.

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Speaker 5: I'm not because I'm embarrassed with the doc here to

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Speaker 5: say my reaction, I.

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Speaker 4: Think you should say your reaction.

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Speaker 5: Well, i'd said, you know, was the video was taking

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Speaker 5: it in, I'd kick his ass, But I do not physically,

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Speaker 5: of course, uh harm my children. Of course we have

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Speaker 5: a stern talking to and I don't believe that would

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Speaker 5: be in their their set of options to do when

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Speaker 5: their devices are taken at all.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, Tiff, how did you feel watching that with you?

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Speaker 6: If this was your child, or a niece or nephew,

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Speaker 6: a child's friend, what do you feel like your response

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Speaker 6: would be to something like that?

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Speaker 1: Well, you know, I I have an issue with kids

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Speaker 1: on phones like that, and when I was watching it,

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Speaker 1: I'm like, this is an addiction, clear and simple, and

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Speaker 1: I think, you know, I don't want to blame parents,

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Speaker 1: but I do. I look at that and think the

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Speaker 1: parent has some responsibility because so often parents will make

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Speaker 1: these devices the babysitter and put you know, the iPad

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Speaker 1: down or give a phone down, and not only is

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Speaker 1: that detrimental to their mental development and their health, but

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Speaker 1: a study came out, I think last year or from

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Speaker 1: jama that looked at data more than four thousand kids

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Speaker 1: and linked addiction to social media, mobile phones, and video

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Speaker 1: games the higher risk of suicidal thoughts and behavior. So

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Speaker 1: when I see something like that, I think there is

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Speaker 1: no more clear example that this is a real problem.

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Speaker 1: That kid has some serious challenges that derived from the phone,

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Speaker 1: but also perhaps not the most attentive home life and

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Speaker 1: not getting enough mental stimulation elsewhere.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, I definitely agree with both of y'all. I'm gonna

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Speaker 6: say my first thing was like, oh, somebody getting an

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Speaker 6: ass beat. And I don't even believe in whipping kids,

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Speaker 6: but it's like, at this point, you chose violence.

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Speaker 4: I'm choosing violence.

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Speaker 6: I don't know whose child you are, but you going

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Speaker 6: to whoever child you are because you're not my child

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Speaker 6: doing those stuff like this like this is beyond. And

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Speaker 6: the other thing that I thought about my mom used

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Speaker 6: to cheat tease me when we were little. There was

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Speaker 6: like some you know, Chitlin circuit play that came through Seattle,

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Speaker 6: and the lady got on there and she would say

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Speaker 6: I will kill you and tell God you died to

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Speaker 6: her child. And my mom used to say that to

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Speaker 6: me all the time, and that's the first thing I

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Speaker 6: thought of here.

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Speaker 4: I was like, Oh, my God, you're going to meet

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Speaker 4: your maker. So God, did Joy, please tell us why

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Speaker 4: we're wrong?

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Speaker 6: And if this is ever listen to this show what

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Speaker 6: you would advise her to do with this child that

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Speaker 6: clearly has an addiction and some clear detrimental, destructive anger

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Speaker 6: management issues.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So you know, when I watched, I had not seen

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Speaker 2: this video before before you all shared it, and I

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Speaker 2: was also struck by like the level of destruction in

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Speaker 2: the home. And my first thought was, this is not

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Speaker 2: just about the phone, right, Like I think the phones

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Speaker 2: and devices feel like very easy places for us to blame,

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Speaker 2: like what's happening. But my guess is that stuff has

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Speaker 2: been building up long before the phone was taking it away.

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Speaker 2: And I think it's also interesting I saw a lot

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Speaker 2: of people in the comments talking about, you know, similar

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Speaker 2: reactions like oh he needs to be beat, or people

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Speaker 2: talked about like getting police involved in all of these things,

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Speaker 2: all of which I do not think would be helpful.

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Speaker 2: You know, so much of parenting is really about regulating

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Speaker 2: ourselves so that we can then also help our children

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Speaker 2: to regulate. And what I am seeing is just a

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Speaker 2: complete lack of regulation. It feels like and maybe even

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Speaker 2: more right, like there may be some addiction things related

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Speaker 2: to the device, but also maybe some distress tolerance, some

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Speaker 2: impulse control. Like it feels like there are a host

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Speaker 2: of things that may be going on that were happening

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Speaker 2: even before the phone was taken away.

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Speaker 3: Doctor Joy, Can I ask.

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Speaker 5: You know because you made me think that's that's you're

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Speaker 5: right about?

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Speaker 7: Right.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to ask you because I don't think this

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Speaker 1: is a problem specific to children. I sit at tables

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Speaker 1: sometimes with people and they're looking down. I'm just out

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Speaker 1: of respect for myself and my words and what I

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Speaker 1: have to offer. When I'm not being listened to, I

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Speaker 1: don't speak, I won't contribute to the conversation. If you're

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Speaker 1: on your phone, then that has your attention. I'm not

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Speaker 1: going to weigh in, but I notice when I'm at

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Speaker 1: brunch and I'm looking at people and you have a

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Speaker 1: table full of people and they're all looking down like this.

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Speaker 1: And it's not that it just I think people don't

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Speaker 1: have social grace anymore, like they have no idea. We

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Speaker 1: talk on this show a lot about speaker phone. It

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Speaker 1: drives me crazy.

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Speaker 3: On the train.

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Speaker 1: I take the train a lot between DC and New York,

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Speaker 1: and people will just be there watching shows on speaker

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Speaker 1: and I am the annoying person. It's like, excuse me,

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Speaker 1: you need headphones on the train. Like I say it

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Speaker 1: to everybody all the time in my workspace, I'm like, please,

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Speaker 1: you can't be on speaker. But it just feels like

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Speaker 1: we're so disconnected from each other, and these phones feel

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Speaker 1: detrimental to our social health, our mental development as grown

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Speaker 1: men and women. People don't know how to engage anymore.

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Speaker 1: It's frustrating for me. I leave my phone downstairs. I'm

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Speaker 1: intentional about not being on my phone all the time.

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Speaker 3: What advice or.

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Speaker 1: What would you say to not just children but adults, Like,

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Speaker 1: what are some practices we can employ to be more

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Speaker 1: connected and get off these devices.

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Speaker 3: I mean, it's really ruining us. It annoys me, that's

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Speaker 3: how much I think it's ruining us.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but look at how all of the energy that

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Speaker 2: you have related to this tiffany a lot, And I

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Speaker 2: think that that just speaks but it speaks to the

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Speaker 2: power that the devices often have over us. And so

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Speaker 2: when you think about as adults, we often struggle with

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Speaker 2: putting the phone down and being more attended and being

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Speaker 2: more engaging, you can only imagine what the young people

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Speaker 2: in our lives struggle with, right, Like, their brains aren't

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Speaker 2: even fully developed, so of course they struggle with setting

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Speaker 2: limits around it. And so a lot of it is

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Speaker 2: modeling for the young people in our lives. How do

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Speaker 2: we take breaks from our devices? How do we actually

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Speaker 2: engage with one another? I completely agree with you. I

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Speaker 2: think that there is a lot of a lot of

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Speaker 2: social graces that are just not being cultivated anymore. And

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Speaker 2: I think we also have to think about the fact

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Speaker 2: that many people also use their devices as a way

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Speaker 2: to manage anxiety. So if you are like waiting for

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Speaker 2: a friend to show up and you're like not wanting

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Speaker 2: to have small talk, what do you do when you're scrolling?

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Speaker 3: Maybe, right?

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Speaker 2: And so I think that that's something else that people

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Speaker 2: aren't always tapped into, is that many of us are

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Speaker 2: using devices as a way to kind of regulate ourselves

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Speaker 2: and to manage any anxiety that we might be feeling.

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Speaker 2: So in terms of some tips you've already shared, like

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Speaker 2: having some distance between yourself and the device, so especially

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Speaker 2: at nighttime, right, Like there's all this research that talks

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Speaker 2: about the blue lights and like how our brains continue

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Speaker 2: to be engaged even when we are thinking the phone

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Speaker 2: is down. So if you can sleep with it in

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Speaker 2: a different room, that is incredibly helpful both to your

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Speaker 2: mental health but also for your sleep. There are all

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Speaker 2: these apps that you can also add to your devices

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Speaker 2: that turn certain apps off, right, So if you don't

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Speaker 2: want to be on the social media channels, or you

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Speaker 2: only want to be able to check your email, like

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Speaker 2: those kinds of things I think can also be really helpful.

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Speaker 2: But also making sure that you're getting enough physical activity,

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Speaker 2: So are you doing enough other things in your life

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Speaker 2: life to stimulate you so that there isn't necessarily the

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Speaker 2: need for the phone. But I do think it's important

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Speaker 2: to think about, Like the way that we're talking about

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Speaker 2: this is in a lot of ways the same ways

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Speaker 2: we talk about like managing addictions, right, Like all these

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Speaker 2: things we have to add to our lives to be

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Speaker 2: able to put distance between ourselves and these devices. And

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Speaker 2: it's meant to be that way, right, Like, there are

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Speaker 2: tons of people who are hired by these companies who

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Speaker 2: are their entire time is spant trying to figure out

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Speaker 2: how to keep us on our devices. So I want

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Speaker 2: people not to be ashamed by this, Like this is

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Speaker 2: something that has kind of come into our lives and

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Speaker 2: taken off, I think, much quicker than anybody anticipated. And

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Speaker 2: so it really is important for us to think about

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Speaker 2: how do we stay connected to our humanity, both for

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Speaker 2: ourselves and with one another.

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Speaker 5: It's perfect your piece around the addiction piece. I mean,

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Speaker 5: I relate to that like strongly, just that people are

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Speaker 5: spending their paid big dollars to keep us right with

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Speaker 5: those devices. Now. Unlike Tiffany, I am not intentional about

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Speaker 5: the distance from my devices. I'm just distant from my devices.

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Speaker 5: I don't respond they yeah, they'd be another room sometimes

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Speaker 5: in other states, uh, Tiffany h Sometimes in the car

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Speaker 5: leave I left the last weekend, left it in the

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Speaker 5: caught a whole weekend because I had to keep my

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Speaker 5: attention on some sleepover and my three children. But the

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Speaker 5: of course, the problem he creates is that it creates

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Speaker 5: the expectation for everyone else that when they send you

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Speaker 5: a thing, that you're right there to get it in

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Speaker 5: the moment and then respond. And I say to people,

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Speaker 5: and anyone knows me already knows it, knows it. I

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Speaker 5: don't have to say it. If if I'm not physically

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Speaker 5: holding that device when it comes in the message, I

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Speaker 5: might not see that thing until I'm really trying to

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Speaker 5: waste time, you know, standing in a line or something,

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Speaker 5: and I may go back and revisit what that list

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Speaker 5: is like. But our society has now created this unbearable

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Speaker 5: expectation of instant everything, instant access, instant gratification, instant you know,

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Speaker 5: da da, da, da da. And the Surgeon General last

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Speaker 5: year issued a about these social media sites and sell

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Speaker 5: phones particular, and gave advice for parents. And I'm parents

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Speaker 5: of now these kids who are about to be teenagers

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Speaker 5: in two years middle school is nonetheless who all their

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Speaker 5: friends have them, And I told them, you're not getting one.

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Speaker 5: And if you have to get it, it's being recommended

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Speaker 5: that you're not by your children smartphones. That you get

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Speaker 5: them phones for safety and access to you, by and large,

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Speaker 5: but not to everything else in the world out there

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Speaker 5: that they're literally being guinea pigs for being experimented on.

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Speaker 5: As to what the effects are, we don't know the

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Speaker 5: effects yet because there's not been a generation brought up

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Speaker 5: under this culture. So I just appreciate you there and

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Speaker 5: want to echo again the regulation part of this, and

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Speaker 5: that we as parents also are modeling, you know, to

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Speaker 5: our children and those who are looking after us, what

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Speaker 5: it's like to be responsible with the devices.

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Speaker 2: And I am joining you in that middle school struggle, Andrew.

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Speaker 2: I also have an eleven year old and holding off

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Speaker 2: on a phone for as long as we possibly can.

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Speaker 2: But it is really hard, right like when all of

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Speaker 2: the friends have and it's like, oh, this makes me

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Speaker 2: feel disconnected, but you know, knowing what I know, I

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Speaker 2: feel like I am trying to hold off as much

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Speaker 2: as long as I can.

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Speaker 6: And friends, I want to ask for the parents who

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Speaker 6: have children who are battling cell phone addictions and are

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Speaker 6: afraid to take away devices because they're concerned. Maybe it

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Speaker 6: wouldn't be at this level, but they're afraid of the

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Speaker 6: type of destruction or the ways they engage, you know,

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Speaker 6: their children around devices. They maybe even feel some guilt,

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Speaker 6: Doctor Joy, like, how can I take away the thing

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Speaker 6: that I gave.

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Speaker 4: To you that you're now relying upon.

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Speaker 6: What is some advice that you have for parents who

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Speaker 6: are figuring out how to wean their kids off of

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Speaker 6: a device where the reliance on it now may be

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Speaker 6: a little too heavy.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it is really important to get a

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Speaker 2: professional involved, because as we are using this addiction language,

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Speaker 2: you know, like we if we are not trained, we

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Speaker 2: don't just stage interventions for people in our lives who

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Speaker 2: are addicted to other things, right, And so we need

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Speaker 2: to bring in trained professor about how do we talk

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Speaker 2: with our young people about these devices and what are

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Speaker 2: the steps to actually wean them, so to speak, from

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Speaker 2: these devices. I don't think for most people, cold turkey

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Speaker 2: is like you don't do that with other substances, and

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Speaker 2: so with a device you probably would not do that

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Speaker 2: as well. But I also think it's important for us

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Speaker 2: to be able to apologize and say like, hey, you know,

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Speaker 2: I gave you this device and I thought that it

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Speaker 2: was fine. But the more I learn and the more

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Speaker 2: I'm reading and the more things I see, I think

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Speaker 2: that this may be an issue for us. And I

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Speaker 2: want to backtrack, right, like it's okay to say oops,

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Speaker 2: I messed up, and again that's great modeling for the

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Speaker 2: young people in our lives that we can always go

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Speaker 2: back on the decision and we learn more information, we

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Speaker 2: can make a different decision. So I think getting a

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Speaker 2: professional involved and also just acknowledging, like, hey, I know

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Speaker 2: different things now and I want to make some different

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Speaker 2: decisions for our family. But I also think, you know,

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Speaker 2: to our earlier conversation, we have to look at our

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Speaker 2: own interactions with our devices, right, So we can't say

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Speaker 2: we want the young people to be their devices and

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Speaker 2: then every time they see us we have our head

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Speaker 2: buried in our phone, Like it doesn't work that way.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, doctor Joy, I want to ask a personal therapy question.

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Speaker 1: I'm trying to get into freebie, a freebie session. Yes, uh,

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Speaker 1: you know what so much going on? Angela and I

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Speaker 1: have certainly had some emotional episodes on this show where

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Speaker 1: you know, things that we're going through personally, but also

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Speaker 1: things that we're going through in this country. And I

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Speaker 1: know sometimes for me, like the sadness seems so overwhelming,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's just compounding we are I'm writing about

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Speaker 1: this now, about navigating our own internal trauma while experiencing

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Speaker 1: external trauma. I'm just curious your thoughts. You know, when

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Speaker 1: you wake up and you face the monstrosities of the day,

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Speaker 1: you are greeted by images of starving, murdered or starving

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Speaker 1: or murdered children in the Congo and Palestine. In Sudan.

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Speaker 1: You are greeted by images of children being ripped apart

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Speaker 1: screaming for their parents right here in America because ice

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Speaker 1: is you know, disappearing their parents. You're greeted with the

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Speaker 1: images of animals being returned to overcrowded shelters because their

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Speaker 1: humans got deported. And then there are the things in

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Speaker 1: your own life. You know, maybe you had an ugly

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Speaker 1: conversation with your mom, or maybe everybody in the family

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Speaker 1: asked you to brow two hundred dollars that day. Maybe

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Speaker 1: your mother is in chemo, you know, like real seriously

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Speaker 1: heavy things. I have been employing different practices on how

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Speaker 1: to stay afloat, on how to keep putting one foot

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Speaker 1: in front of the next. But for a lot of

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Speaker 1: people out there, it's not that they feel you know,

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Speaker 1: it's not as dire like they feel suicidal. They might

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Speaker 1: not feel like they need to be committed, but they

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Speaker 1: just need help managing life. Right now, And I'm just

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Speaker 1: curious any advice you can offer all of us who

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Speaker 1: need help managing life right now.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that as much as possible, you really

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Speaker 2: have to try to disconnect from those images, Tiffany. And

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Speaker 2: I know it's hard given what y'all do, right, And

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Speaker 2: my heart often bleeds for you because I know this

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Speaker 2: is your work, right, Like, this is kind of what

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Speaker 2: you have been called to do, and it often feels

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Speaker 2: difficult to like, how do I not bear witness to

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Speaker 2: all of these awful things that are happening. But when

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Speaker 2: you think about like just human psychology, our brains cannot

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Speaker 2: often detect whether something is an image like a storybook

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Speaker 2: or a movie or a news clip versus you being

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Speaker 2: there in real life. And so what that means is

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Speaker 2: that you are often experiencing what we call vicarious trauma,

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Speaker 2: which is as if you were in the middle of

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Speaker 2: the war or on the scene of this awful thing happening.

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Speaker 2: And so you can start to experience things like PTSD symptoms,

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Speaker 2: you know, difficulty sleeping, difficulty regulating your emotions, and so

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Speaker 2: I think it is really important, even though there are

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Speaker 2: so many awful things happening, even if you read about

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Speaker 2: things that is a little less activating for us than

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Speaker 2: watching images, because the images really do stay with us.

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Speaker 2: And so I think as much as possible, really disconnecting

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Speaker 2: from images, not watching triggering videos again, making sure that

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Speaker 2: you're paying attention to your sleep, and also, you know,

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Speaker 2: infusing your life with other things that you are grateful for,

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Speaker 2: right so, you know, maybe spending time with your animals

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Speaker 2: or with family members you love, or taking girls trips

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Speaker 2: or you know, what kinds of things can you add

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Speaker 2: as a buffer, because your life can't be all this,

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Speaker 2: right Like, even though it is incredibly important and your

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Speaker 2: work is so important, it can't be everything. You also

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Speaker 2: have to build a life around those things as well.

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Speaker 8: Yeah, free Well, speaking of trauma, Angela.

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Speaker 6: So on this doctor Joy, you mentioned it when you

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Speaker 6: talked about kind of the articles are reading and vicarious trauma.

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Speaker 6: There's also some epide genetic trauma that we have, the

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Speaker 6: things that we carry in our physical bodies ancestrally.

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Speaker 4: That sometimes it just feels like white folks don't understand.

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Speaker 6: So on that there is a moment that Serena Williams

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Speaker 6: had recently in her on her hotel, and she brought

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Speaker 6: us into that if we can roll that clip, all right.

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Speaker 3: Everyone, how do we feel about cotton as decoration? Personally?

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Speaker 5: For me, it doesn't feel great.

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Speaker 4: So actually it feels like no polish.

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Speaker 9: Means for cotton natural.

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Speaker 6: So before you get to this, I want to play

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Speaker 6: a clip from Megan Kelly where she responded very cluelessly

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Speaker 6: to what it means to have ancestral trauma.

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Speaker 10: Serena Williams is in the news. Why because she was

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Speaker 10: in New York to support her friend Kim Kardashian with

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Speaker 10: some things she's doing with Nike, and Serena will Siams

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Speaker 10: was in town to attend to it. And she's in

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Speaker 10: some hotel. We do not know which hotel she was staying,

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Speaker 10: and she did not publicize that. But Serena Williams, who

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Speaker 10: is one of the richest Americans alive, was triggered.

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Speaker 4: By something Maureen.

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Speaker 10: And so at the end of that video, she's plucked

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Speaker 10: one of the cotton balls off of the plant and

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Speaker 10: she's using it to buff her nails, and then she

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Speaker 10: she does the hand gesture of like ew, like where

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Speaker 10: you shake your hands like eh, gross, and she drops it. Now,

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Speaker 10: Serena Williams is triggered by cotton.

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Speaker 4: I guess because.

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Speaker 10: It used to be picked by slaves, and she's a

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Speaker 10: black American.

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Speaker 3: It's twenty twenty five.

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Speaker 10: Serena Williams is estimated by Forbes to be worth three

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Speaker 10: hundred and fifty million dollars. She's married to a very,

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Speaker 10: very rich man too. She hung up her racket in

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Speaker 10: twenty twenty two, ending a career in which she earned

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Speaker 10: ninety five million in prize money, more prize money than

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Speaker 10: any female athlete in history. She has endorsement deals to

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Speaker 10: this day with more than a dozen brands. She's active

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Speaker 10: as an investor in her own venture capital firm. She's

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Speaker 10: got a licensing deal with a beauty line. She's launched

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Speaker 10: a multimedia company. She owns part of the Miami Dolphins.

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Speaker 10: But she is an oppressed direct descendant of slaves. I guess,

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Speaker 10: And that's how she sees herself to this day, because

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Speaker 10: I guess. Generational trauma.

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Speaker 6: Okay, so I want to play that for a couple reasons.

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Speaker 6: Let me just tell you two points that triggered me.

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Speaker 6: She said she was with her friend Kim Kardashian to

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Speaker 6: attend to it, not to attend the event, to attend

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Speaker 6: to it, which also I don't even know if Megan

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Speaker 6: understands that she is leaning into where her.

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Speaker 4: Ancestors probably were to attend to it.

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Speaker 6: And then she said that Serena Williams one of the

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Speaker 6: most accomplished athletes of our time, not black women athletes,

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Speaker 6: not black athletes, one of the most accomplished athletes of

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Speaker 6: our time. One prize money. When else did we hear

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Speaker 6: prize money, y'all? When they had the Battle Royals and

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Speaker 6: they made enslave people fight. So she's leaning into some

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Speaker 6: of her own ancestral nonsense.

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Speaker 4: So yes, I'm triggered.

440
00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:17,320
Speaker 6: I actually I want to I want to tell you

441
00:22:17,359 --> 00:22:18,919
Speaker 6: guys this really quick, and then I am gonna yo,

442
00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:23,360
Speaker 6: doctor Joy. When I see cotton fields, I get nauseous.

443
00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:26,800
Speaker 6: I get nauseous. Every time I called my mom and

444
00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:30,080
Speaker 6: I was like, Mommy, what happens to you when you

445
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:32,960
Speaker 6: see cotton fields? And she said it makes me sick.

446
00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:36,879
Speaker 6: There was an ancestor that we have, they said, was

447
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:38,480
Speaker 6: allergic to cotton.

448
00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:41,160
Speaker 4: These are not things that you make up.

449
00:22:41,240 --> 00:22:46,120
Speaker 6: This is there is something called epigenetics that Megan should google.

450
00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:49,320
Speaker 6: These are things that we actually carry in our bloodline.

451
00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:52,800
Speaker 6: So imagine if you are a descendant of an enslaved person,

452
00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:53,640
Speaker 6: You actually.

453
00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:55,520
Speaker 4: Do carry some of that trauma.

454
00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:58,480
Speaker 6: We also carry the you know, the victory, the resilience,

455
00:22:58,480 --> 00:22:59,960
Speaker 6: but we do carry that trauma anyway.

456
00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:02,160
Speaker 4: I just wanted to point that out. The cotton one

457
00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:04,720
Speaker 4: particularly pricked me because I know my experience with cotton.

458
00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was really struck by how like trite she was,

459
00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:12,720
Speaker 2: as if like, this couldn't possibly be an issue for

460
00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:16,960
Speaker 2: Serena because money and wealth does not act as a

461
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:21,840
Speaker 2: buffer against racism and oppression, especially for somebody like Serena

462
00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:24,879
Speaker 2: who has been so forthcoming about almost dying in the

463
00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:28,879
Speaker 2: hospital because of medical discrimination, right, and so you know,

464
00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:32,440
Speaker 2: that doesn't buffer her from experiences related to the things

465
00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:35,400
Speaker 2: that her ancestors that have experienced the things she's likely

466
00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:38,240
Speaker 2: learned and read about and maybe had family talk with

467
00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:41,040
Speaker 2: her about, you know. So I think it's a very

468
00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:45,320
Speaker 2: natural response, Like and I thought that, like the designer

469
00:23:45,359 --> 00:23:48,440
Speaker 2: world had kind of come further along than to decorate

470
00:23:48,480 --> 00:23:51,400
Speaker 2: with complaints anymore. Like it feels a bit outdated anyway,

471
00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:54,360
Speaker 2: But of course I think a lot of us react

472
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:57,200
Speaker 2: to that because it's just so jarring, right, and it

473
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,880
Speaker 2: instantly puts us in the minds of what our ancestors

474
00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:03,440
Speaker 2: had to do to survive, and so I was really

475
00:24:03,480 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 2: strugg though not because this is kind of who Megan

476
00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:09,120
Speaker 2: Kelly is and how she shows up right, but really

477
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:11,520
Speaker 2: struck by the way she kind of, you know, brushed

478
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:15,000
Speaker 2: it off, as if this reaction was being dramatic, and

479
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:18,040
Speaker 2: because Serena is wealthy, she should not react this way.

480
00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:24,639
Speaker 5: I wish I was less connected to these, but I

481
00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,400
Speaker 5: see them. You know, I'm in Florida. I'm in North Florida.

482
00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:31,000
Speaker 5: My house is thirty minutes from South Georgia over the

483
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:36,440
Speaker 5: state line. In fact, one of the most regrettable things

484
00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:39,080
Speaker 5: that my mom, who listens faithfully, is we'll probably hear

485
00:24:39,119 --> 00:24:40,720
Speaker 5: this for the first time. But one of the reasons

486
00:24:40,760 --> 00:24:42,560
Speaker 5: I have a hard time driving to her house and

487
00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:44,560
Speaker 5: always want her to come to mind is because you

488
00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:49,280
Speaker 5: spend a significant amount of the drive passing by these

489
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:53,119
Speaker 5: cotton fields that are still bloom right. I mean, you

490
00:24:53,160 --> 00:24:55,719
Speaker 5: go in the right season, it's just a sea of white,

491
00:24:56,520 --> 00:25:00,680
Speaker 5: and it bothers me so badly, means to my space.

492
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:02,879
Speaker 5: I mean, my kids have caught me crying, you know,

493
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:05,320
Speaker 5: sometimes when they're in the backseat and we're driving through this,

494
00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,160
Speaker 5: and I'm thinking about my grandparents, and you know, my

495
00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:12,240
Speaker 5: mom's parents who were actually born en slay into slavery.

496
00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:17,879
Speaker 5: And you wouldn't think that given our ages, but my grandpa,

497
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:20,760
Speaker 5: my mom's parents were much older than my father's parents.

498
00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:25,640
Speaker 5: My mom's the the the what seventeenth child of her parents,

499
00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:29,480
Speaker 5: so her mother was laid into early fifty fifty one.

500
00:25:29,560 --> 00:25:32,440
Speaker 5: I think it was when my mother came. So it was,

501
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:37,160
Speaker 5: it was, it is. It's everywhere you go to a gala,

502
00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:39,600
Speaker 5: you go to a wedding, you go into a hotel.

503
00:25:40,040 --> 00:25:42,480
Speaker 5: This is the decoration of choice. It hasn't always been

504
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:44,359
Speaker 5: this way, but it's like it's made it as a revival,

505
00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:48,000
Speaker 5: and you know, a lot of it for us, I

506
00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:49,760
Speaker 5: think a lot of black folks in the South is

507
00:25:50,359 --> 00:25:56,160
Speaker 5: we have to steal ourselves nearly every day. And it's

508
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:58,920
Speaker 5: probably true for black people everywhere, but I know, particularly here,

509
00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 5: you literally are sitting desk to desk with someone who

510
00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:05,480
Speaker 5: you've read their Facebook posts and you know they don't

511
00:26:05,560 --> 00:26:07,919
Speaker 5: like you, not you the person, but your people who

512
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:11,040
Speaker 5: you are. They resent you in every way, shape or form.

513
00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:14,240
Speaker 5: But yet you generate these niceties, these exchanges that you

514
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,920
Speaker 5: have to have compulsory almost you know, every single day.

515
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:21,480
Speaker 5: So this trauma piece is really what Megan's simple minded.

516
00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 5: I don't expect her to understand anything as complex as

517
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:28,000
Speaker 5: generational trauma. In fact, where she comes from is probably

518
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 5: the belief that money solves all problems. And that ought

519
00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:35,399
Speaker 5: to tell you enough about the type of type of

520
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:37,720
Speaker 5: stock that she comes from. But for the rest of us,

521
00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:40,960
Speaker 5: we can be as wealthy, as situated, as positioned as

522
00:26:41,040 --> 00:26:44,680
Speaker 5: anything and still be visited. And the truth of it

523
00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:48,720
Speaker 5: is is they know what they are visiting upon us.

524
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:50,960
Speaker 5: They know when they put that Confederate flag up in

525
00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:55,480
Speaker 5: the back of the truck driving and all through the city,

526
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:58,640
Speaker 5: they know what they're symbolizing to us. So the feigning

527
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:03,680
Speaker 5: of ignorance is also extremely offensive because they act like

528
00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:06,159
Speaker 5: they don't know with the message that they're sending you.

529
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,200
Speaker 5: And so I appreciated your feedback on that. And if

530
00:27:09,240 --> 00:27:11,359
Speaker 5: there are others for those of us who live this

531
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:16,359
Speaker 5: thing every day, where this is decoration common place, like

532
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:21,919
Speaker 5: the navigating of that without losing your damn mind.

533
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 1: Doctor Joey, I wanted to because Angela and I were

534
00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:29,679
Speaker 1: having this discussion. So first off, the idea of intergenerational trauma.

535
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:32,240
Speaker 1: It's actually, as I'm sure you know, being in this

536
00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:35,440
Speaker 1: your profession, a newly explored study, we're only five to

537
00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:39,760
Speaker 1: six generations from the horrors of enslavement. However, the psychological

538
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:42,880
Speaker 1: and emotional injuries we inherited, as Angela just talked about,

539
00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:45,720
Speaker 1: as Andrew just spoke about, past two generations, and the

540
00:27:45,760 --> 00:27:48,439
Speaker 1: impact it can have on us is even on a

541
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:53,160
Speaker 1: molecular level, waiting our biology and influencing our loarnged behaviors.

542
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:57,520
Speaker 1: Research from the NIH, the National Institute of Health, suggests

543
00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:01,280
Speaker 1: that trauma can affect a person's DNA and potentially leave

544
00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:05,120
Speaker 1: an imprint on the health of future generations far removed

545
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,879
Speaker 1: from the traumatic event itself. So trauma around this in

546
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:11,840
Speaker 1: some way is in our genetic code. But where Angela

547
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,399
Speaker 1: and I differed is we discussed like should we play

548
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:20,760
Speaker 1: the Megan Kelly portion of this? And so Angela the

549
00:28:20,800 --> 00:28:23,360
Speaker 1: point was, I think people want to know, like what

550
00:28:23,400 --> 00:28:26,119
Speaker 1: do you say when someone says this kind of ridiculous

551
00:28:26,160 --> 00:28:29,040
Speaker 1: and ignorance, Like how do you respond? And my thought

552
00:28:29,160 --> 00:28:31,560
Speaker 1: is even to see her face and to hear her

553
00:28:31,640 --> 00:28:35,600
Speaker 1: voice is triggering. You know, I'm more of the mind

554
00:28:35,880 --> 00:28:38,480
Speaker 1: of you know, I don't want to promote her podcast

555
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:41,120
Speaker 1: or what she has to say, and I don't want

556
00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:44,719
Speaker 1: to give her that attention. I think this is an

557
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,400
Speaker 1: interesting question for you because as black people, we are

558
00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:49,840
Speaker 1: so often put in that position where we got point

559
00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 1: two seconds to decide. So I know, and I know

560
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:55,160
Speaker 1: Angela has been where you're in a space where somebody

561
00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 1: has said something to you and you have to decide.

562
00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:00,880
Speaker 1: Am I going to just elevate past this and ignore you?

563
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,800
Speaker 1: Or am I about to go spider monkey on your

564
00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:07,120
Speaker 1: ass and give you the righteous tongue lashing that you deserve.

565
00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:10,400
Speaker 1: Sometimes I don't make the right choice. Sometimes I you know,

566
00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:13,400
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go for I got time today. Other Times

567
00:29:13,440 --> 00:29:16,160
Speaker 1: I try to elevate above it. So I told angel

568
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:17,640
Speaker 1: I'm like, let's play it so then we can at

569
00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 1: least have a discussion about, like should we what kind

570
00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:22,880
Speaker 1: of attention we should give these things for the people

571
00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:24,560
Speaker 1: navigating those decisions.

572
00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:26,520
Speaker 4: I'm curious what doctor Joy.

573
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:28,840
Speaker 1: Was saying to do if it maybe that was in

574
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:31,800
Speaker 1: your face saying that, like how do you respond?

575
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:32,720
Speaker 11: Now?

576
00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:36,280
Speaker 6: This is Tip's second free point of advice, But doctor Jordan,

577
00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 6: we would love.

578
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:37,120
Speaker 4: To hear it.

579
00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:41,840
Speaker 2: That's a hard one because I feel like you tiff,

580
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:44,800
Speaker 2: like it could go either way, right, depending on the

581
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:46,840
Speaker 2: kind of day you're having. And I think that that's

582
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:49,960
Speaker 2: the point that there are always so many things that

583
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:52,480
Speaker 2: we are trying to calculate, right like who else is here?

584
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 2: Why am I in this experience? Who else is gonna

585
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:57,760
Speaker 2: be seeing? This is somebody filming? Right Like, they're all

586
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:00,760
Speaker 2: these decisions we're trying to calculate within two seconds, like

587
00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 2: you mentioned. And so I don't know that there is

588
00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 2: necessarily a right way. It is just what you choose

589
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:07,040
Speaker 2: at the moment. Right, So if you feel like, you

590
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:08,920
Speaker 2: know what, I don't even have time for this today.

591
00:30:09,120 --> 00:30:11,120
Speaker 2: I don't think it's wrong to just say, Okay, this

592
00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:13,360
Speaker 2: is ignorant, I'm not even going to give this any attention.

593
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:15,600
Speaker 2: But I also think that it is okay to put

594
00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 2: people in their place sometimes if you feel like that

595
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:20,480
Speaker 2: is something that you want to do now and to

596
00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 2: think about like the consequences, right, Like, well, the consequences

597
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:26,240
Speaker 2: be more detrimental than you just moving on, But sometimes

598
00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 2: you just got to let folks know. And so I

599
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 2: don't think that it is a wrong way to do anything.

600
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:32,760
Speaker 2: I think it really is about what do you have

601
00:30:32,840 --> 00:30:35,720
Speaker 2: the bandwidth for that day? And thinking about okay, what

602
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:37,640
Speaker 2: could be the potential consequences of this?

603
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:40,000
Speaker 5: Yeah?

604
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:44,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think our audience when we play these things,

605
00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:45,760
Speaker 1: I think our audience actually likes it.

606
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:46,880
Speaker 3: I think our audience likes to.

607
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:50,000
Speaker 1: Hear, you know, Angelo's response to some of these people,

608
00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:51,640
Speaker 1: because I think there are probably people all across the

609
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:53,960
Speaker 1: country who are like, I'm going to respond like that,

610
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:56,200
Speaker 1: so you know, I.

611
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:59,600
Speaker 3: Think people Yeah, sorry, Jeff, go ahead.

612
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:03,040
Speaker 6: No, I didn't mean to do that, because we heard

613
00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:05,240
Speaker 6: about that on a survey too. I just it just

614
00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:08,600
Speaker 6: sparked something in me, just to say people have to

615
00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:12,360
Speaker 6: deal with these micro and macro aggressions every single day

616
00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 6: and are just like, I want the tools.

617
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:14,720
Speaker 4: What do I say?

618
00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 6: And I think in this moment, all we can hope

619
00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:20,680
Speaker 6: for is that at some point people will find their

620
00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:23,880
Speaker 6: compassion for humanity. And so if they have been so

621
00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:27,880
Speaker 6: closed minded, so closed off, so restricted by who, by

622
00:31:27,880 --> 00:31:30,120
Speaker 6: the company they keep, by the books they read, by

623
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:32,959
Speaker 6: the shows they listen to, by the people they entertain,

624
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:35,440
Speaker 6: that allow us to bring you into our experience.

625
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:36,880
Speaker 4: I got an issue with cotton.

626
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:40,880
Speaker 6: So does Andrew right, Like that's not happenstand, we don't know, Serena,

627
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 6: you know, like that's not happenstance.

628
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:43,840
Speaker 7: I don't know.

629
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:44,160
Speaker 3: Tip.

630
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:46,240
Speaker 4: You didn't say if you have one or not. Doctor Joy,

631
00:31:46,240 --> 00:31:47,400
Speaker 4: I don't know if you have one or not.

632
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:50,360
Speaker 6: But there are some folks that have visceral reactions to

633
00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:53,560
Speaker 6: seeing certain types of crops being in certain parts of

634
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 6: the country, you know, talking to a person with a

635
00:31:56,680 --> 00:32:00,800
Speaker 6: certain type of accent. It just just can cause different issues.

636
00:32:00,880 --> 00:32:03,800
Speaker 6: And so I see it as a teachable moment, even

637
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:06,760
Speaker 6: when it is ignorant. I would love to wipe the

638
00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:09,800
Speaker 6: smug look off a face. But if I can do

639
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:11,840
Speaker 6: that with facts and not hands, I would take that

640
00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:12,360
Speaker 6: any day.

641
00:32:12,600 --> 00:32:14,560
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I do. I do have.

642
00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:17,480
Speaker 1: I carry generational trauma in different ways.

643
00:32:17,480 --> 00:32:18,280
Speaker 3: I think we all do.

644
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:19,880
Speaker 4: I think.

645
00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:23,640
Speaker 3: Even who we are in life is so often.

646
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 1: I interviewed this woman this week from my book, and

647
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 1: she talks about she was eight years old and saw

648
00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 1: a woman, a black woman in the black section of

649
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:38,360
Speaker 1: the hospital die, an elderly woman who's gasping for air,

650
00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:40,000
Speaker 1: and none of the doctors would treat her because they

651
00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:42,080
Speaker 1: had to see the white patients first. And she decided,

652
00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:44,040
Speaker 1: at eight years old she was going to become a doctor,

653
00:32:44,480 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 1: and it made me. I'm writing about probing ourselves and

654
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:50,959
Speaker 1: even our aspirations in life. Even who we become is

655
00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:54,120
Speaker 1: in response to, or determined by some level of white

656
00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:57,080
Speaker 1: supremacy in this life. I write about this Andrew on

657
00:32:57,120 --> 00:33:00,160
Speaker 1: the heels of writing about our conversation we had about imagination,

658
00:33:01,200 --> 00:33:04,160
Speaker 1: and so yes, I think we are all impacted by it,

659
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:08,520
Speaker 1: and it can weigh weigh me down. And so I

660
00:33:08,720 --> 00:33:12,120
Speaker 1: dare to imagine who am I and what does my

661
00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:14,800
Speaker 1: life look like? We're white people not at the center.

662
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:17,720
Speaker 1: Even when I did my show on MSNBC. You know,

663
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:20,000
Speaker 1: black older black folks always pull me aside, like babe,

664
00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 1: we worried about you, like be careful. But I dare

665
00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:26,400
Speaker 1: to imagine what would this show be if I got

666
00:33:26,520 --> 00:33:29,040
Speaker 1: to be free, if I got to speak freely, if

667
00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:31,000
Speaker 1: I got to make cultural references the same way to

668
00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:33,200
Speaker 1: white folks get to make cultural references. Maybe I don't

669
00:33:33,200 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 1: get theirs, they don't get mine. If you ain't get

670
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:37,160
Speaker 1: it, it wasn't for you to get you know, who would

671
00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:40,960
Speaker 1: we be if we got to talk in our own vernacular?

672
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:43,360
Speaker 1: It didn't have the code switch for their comfort. So

673
00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:46,080
Speaker 1: and I think that's kind of the point for this

674
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 1: conversation I'll tell you about later, doctor Joy that Andrew

675
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:51,440
Speaker 1: was making at one point saying that in some ways

676
00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:55,800
Speaker 1: white folks have taken our imagination and I'm daring to

677
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:57,760
Speaker 1: reclaim that at least.

678
00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:01,640
Speaker 5: And parts because of the way we have to calculate

679
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:04,520
Speaker 5: our movements. I mean, you you mentioned this in part

680
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:08,880
Speaker 5: doc and your response just who's who's watching? What calculus

681
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 5: must you include around consequence for you doing that thing?

682
00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:17,440
Speaker 5: And I talk about it a lot in the in

683
00:34:17,480 --> 00:34:20,319
Speaker 5: the form of voting. How you know, Obama didn't become

684
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:21,640
Speaker 5: a thing until a lot of us in this South

685
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:23,799
Speaker 5: saw that white people were willing to get behind him

686
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:26,920
Speaker 5: and and huge fashion, and it changed the math. It's

687
00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:28,520
Speaker 5: not because we didn't like him and didn't want to

688
00:34:28,520 --> 00:34:32,560
Speaker 5: support him, but we're also we also calculate, and we

689
00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:34,879
Speaker 5: don't want to throw votes away because we know how

690
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:37,640
Speaker 5: hard thought they are, and and and we have to

691
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:41,520
Speaker 5: negotiate our power from from from moment to moment, election

692
00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:45,160
Speaker 5: to election. But I my agitation a lot of times,

693
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:48,239
Speaker 5: certainly here in the South, is that mostly and I

694
00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:51,080
Speaker 5: find this a lot with conversations with white men, is

695
00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:55,799
Speaker 5: They use a lot of these painful instances in some

696
00:34:55,880 --> 00:35:00,839
Speaker 5: of these sort of gas lit yuh experiences they want

697
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:03,040
Speaker 5: to call up, like black on black crime and why

698
00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:05,759
Speaker 5: isn't that there aren't marches when when a black You know,

699
00:35:06,280 --> 00:35:08,760
Speaker 5: these sort of things that I find to be really

700
00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:12,440
Speaker 5: intended to be provocative to sort of get their opinion

701
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:17,719
Speaker 5: out there under the guise of curiosity. And it ain't curious.

702
00:35:17,840 --> 00:35:21,920
Speaker 5: It's largely judgmental. It's mostly meant to poke and mostly

703
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:25,120
Speaker 5: meant to try to serve as it an opportunity for

704
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:28,080
Speaker 5: them to indoctrina you and to believe in a subscribing

705
00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:29,759
Speaker 5: to what it is that that that they believe in,

706
00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:32,759
Speaker 5: not really hearing the fact that I don't say, why

707
00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:34,479
Speaker 5: don't white crime even though that's the majority of crimes

708
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:36,319
Speaker 5: that take place in this country. No one says why

709
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 5: don't white crime? Not news, not people, So why don't

710
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:41,000
Speaker 5: we say that?

711
00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 7: Right?

712
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:43,760
Speaker 5: I could return that, but I always find I often

713
00:35:43,800 --> 00:35:47,320
Speaker 5: find that it's meant to poke, to pride, to provoke,

714
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,440
Speaker 5: And so if I if I deny you a response,

715
00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:55,360
Speaker 5: it's because I'm not going to entertain you. My choice

716
00:35:55,360 --> 00:35:56,160
Speaker 5: is not to entertain you.

717
00:35:56,239 --> 00:36:03,600
Speaker 3: That's it. You have time about that?

718
00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 1: Why, like, listen, if you want to book a session

719
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:07,920
Speaker 1: with me, the book a session with me?

720
00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:12,759
Speaker 6: But I'm not hearing any question. Wait and she like,

721
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:14,960
Speaker 6: am my roster fold? So y'all go way on the

722
00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:19,480
Speaker 6: wait list. I love it, she said, She said, do

723
00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:20,520
Speaker 6: you have any thoughts about this?

724
00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 4: I dress said about.

725
00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:25,920
Speaker 2: I did, but I did want to go back to

726
00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:31,760
Speaker 2: your your comment Tiffany around like how imagination gets stolen?

727
00:36:32,560 --> 00:36:34,719
Speaker 2: And I think about this a lot as a parent, right,

728
00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 2: like how do I create a world from my kids

729
00:36:37,600 --> 00:36:39,680
Speaker 2: where they can just be who they are? But the

730
00:36:39,719 --> 00:36:41,880
Speaker 2: truth is that they're black boys, and so there is

731
00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:45,439
Speaker 2: some reality that I have to infuse and it does

732
00:36:45,560 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 2: often make me feel bad in some ways that I

733
00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:52,120
Speaker 2: am like stripping this imagination from them. But I also,

734
00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:54,319
Speaker 2: like I said, I think that's why spaces like this

735
00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:56,799
Speaker 2: are important, right, that you don't have to do the

736
00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:59,399
Speaker 2: code switching in their cultural references, that you can make

737
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:02,520
Speaker 2: that are ore and that we get it right because

738
00:37:02,520 --> 00:37:05,120
Speaker 2: it is a spaceman for us, you know. So I

739
00:37:05,120 --> 00:37:07,839
Speaker 2: think that that is something really important to highlight, that

740
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:10,759
Speaker 2: we can also create our own spaces where there is

741
00:37:10,840 --> 00:37:13,319
Speaker 2: maybe more an ability to play with our imagination.

742
00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:15,400
Speaker 5: Yeah, I love that.

743
00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 1: We had an interesting conversation as well. We were broadcasting

744
00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:31,200
Speaker 1: live from the Congressional Black Cocus Foundation's Annual Legislative Conference

745
00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:36,239
Speaker 1: and Roland Martin, our brother Rowe uncle Roe joined us

746
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:41,560
Speaker 1: and he had some admonishing words about gen X.

747
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:43,560
Speaker 3: So you can take a listen to that.

748
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:45,080
Speaker 7: There were a group of people.

749
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:49,760
Speaker 12: They were the ones who sustained us from King's assassination

750
00:37:50,440 --> 00:37:54,439
Speaker 12: to present day. They were the ones who knew who

751
00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:58,640
Speaker 12: didn't vote. They did precinct walks, They showed up at

752
00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:02,400
Speaker 12: city council, county govern meant state government. I guess my

753
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:05,919
Speaker 12: parents seventy eight, just like Eddie Rai, and we guess

754
00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:09,320
Speaker 12: what those people are retiring or in some many cases

755
00:38:09,320 --> 00:38:12,920
Speaker 12: they passed away. So there's a generation that did not

756
00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 12: replace those people.

757
00:38:14,320 --> 00:38:14,480
Speaker 11: Yea.

758
00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:18,280
Speaker 12: So what we've done is we've become so technical where

759
00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:23,360
Speaker 12: we think that social media, text messchien, phone calls replaces

760
00:38:23,400 --> 00:38:27,239
Speaker 12: that on the ground infrastructure. And that's what's missing if

761
00:38:27,280 --> 00:38:29,840
Speaker 12: you go to place all around the country. That group,

762
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:34,439
Speaker 12: dudey gen X did not step up.

763
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:39,719
Speaker 1: So one of our viewers actually weighed in with their thoughts,

764
00:38:40,200 --> 00:38:43,000
Speaker 1: and I think, you know, Roe's pointing around gen X,

765
00:38:43,120 --> 00:38:47,120
Speaker 1: you know, not meeting the moment and maybe failing resonated

766
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:49,440
Speaker 1: with some people. One of our viewers took great offense

767
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:53,080
Speaker 1: to it, so he sent in a comment, I want

768
00:38:53,120 --> 00:38:55,240
Speaker 1: you to take a listen. And on the other side,

769
00:38:55,440 --> 00:38:59,120
Speaker 1: of course, Roe had time, and so Roe responded to

770
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 1: the viewers, Well, let's first hear from the viewer.

771
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:03,759
Speaker 9: Greeting's native lampard.

772
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:05,440
Speaker 5: Hi, this is Keith from DC.

773
00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:06,600
Speaker 11: What's going on?

774
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:10,279
Speaker 9: Andrew, Angela and Tiffany. This is a private message for

775
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:10,880
Speaker 9: you guys.

776
00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:13,480
Speaker 11: I checked out your town hall the other day that

777
00:39:13,560 --> 00:39:16,600
Speaker 11: you had with Roland Martin, and it was a statement

778
00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:20,520
Speaker 11: that he made that really inflated me or inflamed them.

779
00:39:21,080 --> 00:39:23,080
Speaker 11: Say it was a statement that he made that gen

780
00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:25,680
Speaker 11: X failed us. Well, I have a problem with that

781
00:39:25,840 --> 00:39:31,680
Speaker 11: because I'm a gen xer. You are gen xers. Roland

782
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:35,040
Speaker 11: himself is a gen xer. Wes Moore, the person you

783
00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:37,880
Speaker 11: had on your town hall is a gener xer. Corey

784
00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:41,440
Speaker 11: Booker who made that longest speech and whatever, is a

785
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:42,080
Speaker 11: gen xer.

786
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:44,960
Speaker 9: I participated in the two thousand and eight and twenty

787
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:46,600
Speaker 9: twelve bought.

788
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:47,920
Speaker 11: President Obama and Biden election.

789
00:39:48,560 --> 00:39:51,080
Speaker 9: I particiate in every election thereof.

790
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:55,200
Speaker 11: I have camp famous, I have done the phone banks,

791
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:57,200
Speaker 11: I have replaced and removed signs.

792
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:02,799
Speaker 9: I've done don dore have participants participant in the elections

793
00:40:02,880 --> 00:40:05,439
Speaker 9: from whenever I was able to do set up. I'm

794
00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 9: a gen xer and the fact that he said the

795
00:40:07,200 --> 00:40:09,440
Speaker 9: gen X has failed us is an insult to me.

796
00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:12,960
Speaker 9: And if Martin needs to reach out to me, y'all

797
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:17,479
Speaker 9: have my information again, this is Keith. I'm a gen xer.

798
00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:27,600
Speaker 9: Put some respect on that name. Gen X fore a baby.

799
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 1: If this is private by the time our audiences, we

800
00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:33,160
Speaker 1: will blur his face.

801
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:36,359
Speaker 3: He put on a video, but we'll get clarity from him.

802
00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:37,080
Speaker 3: So if you're.

803
00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:38,799
Speaker 4: Watching videos all the time, but.

804
00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:39,759
Speaker 3: He may not want that.

805
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:42,160
Speaker 1: So if you see his face clearly, then we reached

806
00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:44,800
Speaker 1: out to him and got clarity. If we are blurring

807
00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:46,640
Speaker 1: his face, we will cut out his name so people

808
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:51,080
Speaker 1: don't know, so that will explain whatever we'll we'll cut

809
00:40:51,080 --> 00:40:54,239
Speaker 1: out all audio that references him. However, I did send

810
00:40:54,239 --> 00:40:57,880
Speaker 1: this to Roland uh and Roro had time to respond.

811
00:40:57,880 --> 00:40:59,880
Speaker 3: So let's take a listen to that, right, ro.

812
00:41:00,440 --> 00:41:03,239
Speaker 7: Okay, listen up. I'm gonna need all your people who

813
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:07,240
Speaker 7: are caught up in your feelings about my comments regarding

814
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:12,160
Speaker 7: gen X to pay attention. I know that there are

815
00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:15,759
Speaker 7: gen X people who have run for office, but I

816
00:41:15,800 --> 00:41:20,280
Speaker 7: was very specific in my criticism. I was talking about

817
00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:25,640
Speaker 7: the infrastructure that exist in order for us to turn

818
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:29,839
Speaker 7: out the vote. I'm talking about the people who were

819
00:41:29,920 --> 00:41:33,920
Speaker 7: pre seen captains, who were block captains, the people who

820
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:38,399
Speaker 7: have been involved on the ground, the people who run

821
00:41:38,600 --> 00:41:43,200
Speaker 7: NAACP chapters, the people who are running community organizations who

822
00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:47,960
Speaker 7: are on the ground. Yes there are grassroots organizations. I'm

823
00:41:48,000 --> 00:41:52,280
Speaker 7: talking about the people who work elections, who are poll workers.

824
00:41:52,640 --> 00:41:56,080
Speaker 7: I'm saying that was this massive infrastructure, that it's not

825
00:41:56,160 --> 00:42:01,000
Speaker 7: being replaced. It's a fact. Okay, So you planning, what

826
00:42:01,120 --> 00:42:05,600
Speaker 7: you should be asking is where's the infrastructure. Not the

827
00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:09,520
Speaker 7: running for office, but the regular ordinary people who do

828
00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:13,719
Speaker 7: the work to drive our community engagement every single day.

829
00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:18,240
Speaker 7: And I'm telling you all across black communities across the country,

830
00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:22,680
Speaker 7: we're losing that because they are retiring or becoming ancestors.

831
00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:27,759
Speaker 7: So don't get in your feelings, focus and fix the

832
00:42:27,840 --> 00:42:30,800
Speaker 7: issue because that's our problem.

833
00:42:31,000 --> 00:42:31,160
Speaker 8: Yo.

834
00:42:32,960 --> 00:42:35,480
Speaker 6: Wait a minute, the fact that Roland got up in

835
00:42:35,520 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 6: the morning and recorded this, that you could tell Roland

836
00:42:39,040 --> 00:42:44,280
Speaker 6: just woke up. Then Okay, Tiffany was the provocatory.

837
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:55,680
Speaker 4: And whyonding?

838
00:42:57,040 --> 00:42:59,520
Speaker 5: So Doc, who won? Who won the bat?

839
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:00,760
Speaker 10: Oh?

840
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:06,320
Speaker 5: Why have I get in? And how did I get it? Exactly?

841
00:43:07,560 --> 00:43:07,719
Speaker 11: Well?

842
00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:10,400
Speaker 1: There is a question though, of generations and how generations

843
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:13,920
Speaker 1: have changed, even us, you know, talking about kids on

844
00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:16,640
Speaker 1: their phones and Andrew talking about his kids because you know,

845
00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:19,160
Speaker 1: we don't really know the impact because they haven't come

846
00:43:19,160 --> 00:43:19,919
Speaker 1: of age yet.

847
00:43:20,239 --> 00:43:20,359
Speaker 11: Uh.

848
00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:23,399
Speaker 1: And I find myself slowly morphing into that get off

849
00:43:23,440 --> 00:43:25,799
Speaker 1: my lawn, oh theer person, like you kids, put down

850
00:43:25,840 --> 00:43:28,040
Speaker 1: your phones and pick up your pants and get into something.

851
00:43:28,080 --> 00:43:30,880
Speaker 1: And I feel like maybe we do. I feel like

852
00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:31,479
Speaker 1: maybe we do.

853
00:43:31,440 --> 00:43:32,120
Speaker 3: Sound like that.

854
00:43:32,760 --> 00:43:35,480
Speaker 1: And so as the generations come of age, and I

855
00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:38,200
Speaker 1: think he made a legitimate point about the infrastructure that

856
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:40,960
Speaker 1: we built as black people. Are we a little bit

857
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:45,399
Speaker 1: disaggregated these days? Even this idea when we were saying,

858
00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:48,040
Speaker 1: you know, I'd beat that kid's ass or whatever, A

859
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:50,520
Speaker 1: lot of that is narrative, Like there really isn't any

860
00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:53,680
Speaker 1: evidence that this. You know, people would tell me on

861
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:55,840
Speaker 1: growing up, like if I did something wrong.

862
00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 3: Then the neighbor would beat me.

863
00:43:57,080 --> 00:43:58,680
Speaker 1: And then when I got home, my mom would beat

864
00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:01,759
Speaker 1: me too, Like there's no evidence this like collective neighborhood

865
00:44:01,840 --> 00:44:06,399
Speaker 1: beating who like form kids into perfect human beings who

866
00:44:06,480 --> 00:44:09,359
Speaker 1: never misbehaved anymore. So I do here when I hear

867
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:12,080
Speaker 1: the generations like we knew how to do it and

868
00:44:12,120 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 1: you guys didn't, I am a little bit struck about

869
00:44:15,000 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 1: what that means for us, specifically as a black community,

870
00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:20,239
Speaker 1: because our community is the very thing that made us

871
00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:24,040
Speaker 1: survive this four hundred year nightmare. So I do wonder

872
00:44:24,280 --> 00:44:27,759
Speaker 1: what your thoughts are as you know, you're raising a

873
00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:30,160
Speaker 1: new generation of black boys, you're from a different generation.

874
00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:32,439
Speaker 3: Just curries your thoughts, mm hmm.

875
00:44:32,880 --> 00:44:33,120
Speaker 5: Yeah.

876
00:44:33,160 --> 00:44:35,359
Speaker 2: So what I think I was most struck by in

877
00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:38,840
Speaker 2: that exchange is that it felt like there wasn't a

878
00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:41,560
Speaker 2: place for feelings, which of course is my thing as

879
00:44:41,600 --> 00:44:43,600
Speaker 2: a psychologist, right, And I think that that is what

880
00:44:43,640 --> 00:44:46,200
Speaker 2: we're often missing, is that we are kind of talking

881
00:44:46,239 --> 00:44:48,759
Speaker 2: at and past one another, as opposed to let me

882
00:44:48,800 --> 00:44:52,080
Speaker 2: actually sit with what you're feeling and what you're telling me, right.

883
00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:56,640
Speaker 2: And so in the listener's response, he's saying, like, what

884
00:44:56,719 --> 00:44:59,120
Speaker 2: I picked up is that he was offended and maybe

885
00:44:59,200 --> 00:45:01,920
Speaker 2: hurt that it felt like he was being blamed for

886
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:04,880
Speaker 2: this thing, and blame and shame is never going to

887
00:45:04,880 --> 00:45:07,279
Speaker 2: be an effective motivator. And so I think when we

888
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:09,600
Speaker 2: are talking to young people, we are often trying to

889
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:12,960
Speaker 2: use some of these shaming tactics and then wondering why

890
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:15,960
Speaker 2: they are not effective, because shame is not effective, right,

891
00:45:16,040 --> 00:45:17,600
Speaker 2: And so I think, if we can actually come to

892
00:45:17,640 --> 00:45:19,680
Speaker 2: the table and then let me actually hear what you're saying,

893
00:45:19,719 --> 00:45:22,840
Speaker 2: and I apologize if I said something that offended you,

894
00:45:22,880 --> 00:45:25,759
Speaker 2: that wasn't my intent, but maybe that's how it happened, right,

895
00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:28,080
Speaker 2: And so can we actually get on a feeling level, right, Like,

896
00:45:28,120 --> 00:45:30,440
Speaker 2: maybe that's what we're missing, is that we're trying to

897
00:45:30,440 --> 00:45:33,840
Speaker 2: brushpast feelings moving to action when we really have to

898
00:45:33,880 --> 00:45:34,959
Speaker 2: deal with the feelings first.

899
00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:41,120
Speaker 6: Okay, good episode should could be called do you know

900
00:45:41,160 --> 00:45:41,799
Speaker 6: what people say?

901
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:46,000
Speaker 4: Get out your feelings? Put in parentheses in get feelings.

902
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:48,600
Speaker 4: I like it. I like it.

903
00:45:48,719 --> 00:45:51,600
Speaker 5: I stay there, and I know why your roster's full.

904
00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:54,680
Speaker 5: I know why you're roster's full. Honestly, you're this is

905
00:45:54,680 --> 00:45:58,240
Speaker 5: really this is not just limited to like this exchange.

906
00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:02,240
Speaker 5: This is in life period. So often we find ourselves

907
00:46:02,280 --> 00:46:05,080
Speaker 5: trying to win our point and we don't hear that.

908
00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:08,000
Speaker 5: The person's like not really debating the marriage of that argument.

909
00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:10,600
Speaker 5: They're like, this is how I felt about what you did.

910
00:46:11,840 --> 00:46:16,480
Speaker 1: But I also find myself in the blame and shame category,

911
00:46:16,640 --> 00:46:18,960
Speaker 1: like I do in my mind. I find it the

912
00:46:18,960 --> 00:46:21,440
Speaker 1: way I speak. Sometimes I find it when I see people,

913
00:46:22,040 --> 00:46:24,920
Speaker 1: you know, I feel it. I filter my thoughts sometimes

914
00:46:24,960 --> 00:46:29,440
Speaker 1: and sometimes I don't. And when I see people, you know,

915
00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:33,520
Speaker 1: disconnected from community or just being disrespectful or like I

916
00:46:33,520 --> 00:46:35,759
Speaker 1: don't care about none of this what's happening, Like I

917
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:36,600
Speaker 1: do find.

918
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:38,600
Speaker 3: Myself not necessarily.

919
00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:41,600
Speaker 1: Somebody who does a great job at reaching people without

920
00:46:41,640 --> 00:46:45,479
Speaker 1: any blame or shame is Latasha Brown. Like she voting

921
00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:47,799
Speaker 1: rights activists who runs Black Voters Matter, and she just

922
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:50,120
Speaker 1: has a way of speaking to people and pulling them in.

923
00:46:51,080 --> 00:46:53,400
Speaker 1: She is an evangelist who can make you a believer

924
00:46:53,520 --> 00:46:56,640
Speaker 1: in whatever she's preaching because she leads with love. And

925
00:46:56,680 --> 00:46:59,160
Speaker 1: so I've tried to learn how to do that. But

926
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:01,399
Speaker 1: even with talking with my family, sometimes I do find

927
00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:05,880
Speaker 1: myself judging, you know, or when they say something, I'm like, what, like,

928
00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:07,960
Speaker 1: what does that even mean? So that's really good advice

929
00:47:08,040 --> 00:47:11,759
Speaker 1: for me and how I present and speak for sure,

930
00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:14,399
Speaker 1: I'll try to practice it at this big old gen

931
00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:17,480
Speaker 1: x age because I think you went over more people

932
00:47:17,640 --> 00:47:20,279
Speaker 1: with honey and not that you're not.

933
00:47:20,200 --> 00:47:22,360
Speaker 5: About to give you another session. I know, I'm just

934
00:47:22,360 --> 00:47:23,800
Speaker 5: thinking I had.

935
00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 3: A question, but I stopped myself. I'm like, I'm not

936
00:47:25,600 --> 00:47:26,200
Speaker 3: asking a question.

937
00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:29,399
Speaker 5: Judgment. You know you sent and you know.

938
00:47:29,400 --> 00:47:31,759
Speaker 3: In therapy like it don't matter what you say. If

939
00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 3: once that forty five fifty minute come up, you could

940
00:47:34,000 --> 00:47:34,680
Speaker 3: be like, you have docs.

941
00:47:34,719 --> 00:47:36,479
Speaker 1: I just had an abortion yesterday and they're like, okay,

942
00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:39,360
Speaker 1: do that up next week.

943
00:47:40,320 --> 00:47:47,920
Speaker 6: I literally said, and on that note, on that note.

944
00:47:45,320 --> 00:47:46,960
Speaker 5: Welcome you got to come back.

945
00:47:47,000 --> 00:47:52,200
Speaker 6: Though, there are so many people our listeners who come

946
00:47:52,239 --> 00:47:55,000
Speaker 6: up to us and say they just relate to wrestling

947
00:47:55,000 --> 00:47:58,279
Speaker 6: with not knowing what to do in this moment, balancing

948
00:47:58,320 --> 00:48:01,319
Speaker 6: micro trauma with macro, you know, from the government to

949
00:48:01,480 --> 00:48:04,640
Speaker 6: what's happening all over the world, you know, really wanting

950
00:48:04,719 --> 00:48:06,920
Speaker 6: a safe place to land. And while we convent with

951
00:48:07,000 --> 00:48:09,239
Speaker 6: them and we can give them calls to action, we

952
00:48:09,320 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 6: can't give them the psychological tools to combat the warfare

953
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:15,840
Speaker 6: they're experiencing on every side. So you know, you're always

954
00:48:15,880 --> 00:48:18,440
Speaker 6: welcome back home, not just to counsel us, but to

955
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:19,920
Speaker 6: also counsel our audience.

956
00:48:19,920 --> 00:48:21,719
Speaker 4: So we thank God for you and really appreciate you

957
00:48:21,800 --> 00:48:22,560
Speaker 4: joining us today.

958
00:48:23,200 --> 00:48:25,239
Speaker 5: You're here. You Welcome home.

959
00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:26,000
Speaker 3: Welcome Home.

960
00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:42,880
Speaker 5: Native lamd Pod is a production of iHeartRadio in partnership

961
00:48:42,880 --> 00:48:46,640
Speaker 5: with reisent Choice Media. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit

962
00:48:46,920 --> 00:48:50,719
Speaker 5: the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen

963
00:48:50,800 --> 00:48:51,720
Speaker 5: to your favorite shows.