1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,800 Speaker 1: We have a celebrity guest to talk about the homeless issue. 2 00:00:02,840 --> 00:00:08,280 Speaker 1: It's Armstrong and Getty's extra large because four hours simply enough, 3 00:00:09,160 --> 00:00:13,480 Speaker 1: this is Armstrong and Getty extra large. So does that 4 00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:17,079 Speaker 1: mean this is in very longer than our usual podcasts. 5 00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:19,120 Speaker 1: Is that the theory on that? I don't know. It's 6 00:00:19,120 --> 00:00:22,759 Speaker 1: a long form interview. Uh so. Dr Drew Pinski is 7 00:00:22,760 --> 00:00:25,599 Speaker 1: indeed a well known fellow from the media, but he 8 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:29,520 Speaker 1: is an internist addiction medicine specialist UM and has been 9 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:32,519 Speaker 1: dealing with folks with substance abuse problems for decades and 10 00:00:32,680 --> 00:00:37,960 Speaker 1: is absolutely, uh not only dead serious about the bums 11 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:39,879 Speaker 1: and junkies problem, the homeless problem, if you want to 12 00:00:39,880 --> 00:00:43,199 Speaker 1: call it that, but it's really crusading and trying to 13 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:46,919 Speaker 1: get people to see it for what it really really is. 14 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:49,880 Speaker 1: Dr Drew, this is a pleasure. We really appreciate you 15 00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:53,520 Speaker 1: joining us. How are you? And we definitely have three 16 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:55,920 Speaker 1: people here that are in the category of don't get 17 00:00:55,960 --> 00:01:00,600 Speaker 1: us started on the homeless situation. Yeah, yeah, I'm afraid 18 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 1: of how when you When when I get going, I'm 19 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:05,240 Speaker 1: afraid of where I go. I'm the same way too, 20 00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:08,880 Speaker 1: be part partially because I had a personal situation with 21 00:01:08,880 --> 00:01:12,400 Speaker 1: my family where an aggressive bum got in our faces 22 00:01:12,520 --> 00:01:16,280 Speaker 1: threatened to murder and rape my family. Uh, in front 23 00:01:16,319 --> 00:01:18,800 Speaker 1: of me. I had to intervene physically with the dude. 24 00:01:18,840 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 1: Cops are called the guys now in prison. I I 25 00:01:21,319 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 1: hated the homeless situation before that, but since then I 26 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:26,800 Speaker 1: really do. Yeah. So listen, why don't we start with 27 00:01:27,800 --> 00:01:33,160 Speaker 1: what it's not, the the giant homeless explosion in particularly 28 00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 1: the West. Let me jump in right there. I'll tell 29 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,480 Speaker 1: you the guy that threatened to kill my family, he 30 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:39,960 Speaker 1: was not a guy who couldn't afford his apartment, right, 31 00:01:40,080 --> 00:01:42,640 Speaker 1: That is not what he was. It's not a guy 32 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,720 Speaker 1: for whom four walls is going to help. It's not 33 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:48,840 Speaker 1: going to help him to push him in a room 34 00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:54,600 Speaker 1: of his own. He needs serious mental health treatment long term. 35 00:01:54,640 --> 00:01:59,680 Speaker 1: And the conflation, the conflating of the real problem of 36 00:01:59,720 --> 00:02:02,440 Speaker 1: a act of affordable housing, I would a couple weeks 37 00:02:02,440 --> 00:02:06,680 Speaker 1: ago at the Schwarzenegger Foundation meeting he held, and at 38 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 1: that meeting there was absolute consensus that the lack of 39 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: affordable housing was a self created problem by the extraordinary 40 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:17,720 Speaker 1: regulations in the state of California. Therefore, we could undo 41 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:20,839 Speaker 1: that if we had the will. That's one problem. Now, 42 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:23,120 Speaker 1: the lack of affordable housing, I would argue, is not 43 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:27,120 Speaker 1: that acute. If we in Los Angeles could absorb one 44 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:32,120 Speaker 1: point five million undocumented workers in the last two years 45 00:02:32,360 --> 00:02:34,560 Speaker 1: and none of them are on the street, they're not 46 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,200 Speaker 1: on the street, how bad could the housing? Probably I 47 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:40,640 Speaker 1: wanted to have million people found housing, all right, But okay, 48 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 1: we all agree there's a shortage of affordable housing. That 49 00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: is a separate and distinct issue from homelessness. Homelessness is 50 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:52,239 Speaker 1: the result of the dismantling of the mental health system 51 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:56,480 Speaker 1: of the state that resulted in the patients pouring out 52 00:02:56,560 --> 00:02:59,440 Speaker 1: onto the streets, the prisons and the nursing homes. We 53 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:01,800 Speaker 1: have now wish them out of the prisons, they're on 54 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:04,959 Speaker 1: the streets. And then we've made the problem more acute 55 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 1: by legalizing drugs and drug trafficking, So all the other 56 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:11,440 Speaker 1: addicts in the country are homeless. Headed it all way, 57 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:15,320 Speaker 1: that's homelessness, and it is killing justin l A county 58 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:20,079 Speaker 1: three people a day. Would you would you body count 59 00:03:20,120 --> 00:03:23,280 Speaker 1: need to be everybody before we do something about this? Right? 60 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:27,360 Speaker 1: Would you agree that it's useless to discuss homelessness unless 61 00:03:27,400 --> 00:03:32,520 Speaker 1: we start breaking down percentages of the drug addicted, the 62 00:03:32,560 --> 00:03:35,920 Speaker 1: mentally ill, the mentally ill, and drug drug addicted guys 63 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:38,800 Speaker 1: who are just bums, they're just dropouts, they'd rather not work, 64 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:43,920 Speaker 1: et cetera. There are probably that latter category is about 65 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:48,080 Speaker 1: ten percent, and even those a majority of probably taking math. 66 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:50,400 Speaker 1: So it is. You know. Look, I was up in 67 00:03:50,440 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 1: Sacramento about a month ago. I went on the streets, 68 00:03:53,080 --> 00:03:54,640 Speaker 1: I went around with the cops. I talked to all 69 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:57,000 Speaker 1: the homeless, and they all told me the exact same thing. 70 00:03:57,360 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 1: The cops and the homeless using mess on a regular basis. 71 00:04:05,360 --> 00:04:10,440 Speaker 1: And these were unprompted ad hockey interviews with homeless and cops, 72 00:04:10,680 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 1: and they, you know, on the streets of Sacramento, they 73 00:04:13,640 --> 00:04:15,080 Speaker 1: all said the same thing. When I go out in 74 00:04:15,080 --> 00:04:18,039 Speaker 1: the Los Angeles, I asked what percentage you're doing drugs, 75 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:23,240 Speaker 1: they'll say somewhere between six. You go downtown in downtown 76 00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:25,560 Speaker 1: on skit Row, and it's higher and the mental health 77 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:30,200 Speaker 1: issues are much more acute. This is unconscionable. No other 78 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:34,320 Speaker 1: country on Earth doesn't take care of people with brain diseases. 79 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:37,080 Speaker 1: It's too much, it's too much. I can't even believe 80 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:39,560 Speaker 1: what I'm seeing. This is a population I served for 81 00:04:39,640 --> 00:04:42,479 Speaker 1: thirty years. I know exactly what's going on. I know 82 00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:44,479 Speaker 1: exactly what can be done for them, and I know 83 00:04:44,560 --> 00:04:46,920 Speaker 1: exactly how well they can do. And I know those 84 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:50,280 Speaker 1: that need chronic custodial care. We have to get realistic 85 00:04:50,279 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 1: about this well, and I just did. I became aware 86 00:04:53,400 --> 00:04:56,040 Speaker 1: of this for the first time just a couple of 87 00:04:56,040 --> 00:05:01,760 Speaker 1: months ago. The trends, the almost crazes in mental health 88 00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: care that happened during the twentieth century, including zyra calls 89 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 1: late fifties, early sixties, that there was this this craze 90 00:05:09,920 --> 00:05:14,440 Speaker 1: that the community mental health centers could take care of 91 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:17,960 Speaker 1: the mentally If you want to read it, that's exactly 92 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:19,920 Speaker 1: where we went off the rail. It was in It 93 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:23,200 Speaker 1: was a guy named Robert Felix, an unelected official, who 94 00:05:23,240 --> 00:05:26,520 Speaker 1: got the ear of President Kennedy and got him to 95 00:05:26,560 --> 00:05:29,839 Speaker 1: sign the Community Mental Health Hack, which was designed to 96 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:33,680 Speaker 1: eliminate institutions for the care of the mentally ill, because 97 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:37,880 Speaker 1: in the mind of these social engineer whack jobs, there 98 00:05:37,920 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 1: were three psychiatrists that ran the National Student Mental Health 99 00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:43,920 Speaker 1: for forty years, non elected officials. None of them had 100 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:46,120 Speaker 1: ever been in One of them only had been in 101 00:05:46,160 --> 00:05:48,400 Speaker 1: a state mental hospital, none of none of them had 102 00:05:48,440 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 1: ever been in it. The rest of them watched One 103 00:05:51,240 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 1: Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest and thought they were watching 104 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:57,359 Speaker 1: a freaking documentary. They were not. And they decided to 105 00:05:57,440 --> 00:06:00,200 Speaker 1: dismantle the system, and that their goal was to create 106 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:03,479 Speaker 1: these community mental health centers who were going to quote, 107 00:06:03,760 --> 00:06:07,280 Speaker 1: prevent mental illness. So no provisions for what to do 108 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:10,120 Speaker 1: with those pouring out of the state hospital, some ill 109 00:06:10,160 --> 00:06:12,359 Speaker 1: conceived plan which we still don't know how to do 110 00:06:12,440 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 1: to this day prevent mental illness. They were going to 111 00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:18,160 Speaker 1: be social engineers. The excesses of psychiatry in the fifties 112 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:21,120 Speaker 1: and sixties on that side and what they did to 113 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:24,920 Speaker 1: the patients that were in institutions unconscionable. So laws were 114 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 1: put in place in the sixties and seventies that were 115 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 1: a backlash to that. Those laws are approaching one hundred 116 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:33,680 Speaker 1: years of age, they are at least sixty or seventy 117 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 1: years old, they're anachronistic, and they're the barrier to the 118 00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:41,280 Speaker 1: ability to treat the patients today. It was a reaction. 119 00:06:41,320 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 1: I get it. I'm not apologizing or excusing the excesses, 120 00:06:44,680 --> 00:06:48,200 Speaker 1: but those laws are the barrier right now, and they're 121 00:06:48,480 --> 00:06:51,920 Speaker 1: they're they're approaching a century old. We've learned a little 122 00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:54,000 Speaker 1: bit about how brains work and how to treat them, 123 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 1: and that's sixty seventy years. It's time we changed the 124 00:06:58,000 --> 00:07:02,240 Speaker 1: laws that's going to be necessary to address this problem. 125 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:04,480 Speaker 1: Why does it seem I mean, we're talking about the 126 00:07:04,880 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 1: seventies when a lot of these laws were passed, and 127 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:09,920 Speaker 1: they were reaction to the cruelty of some of the 128 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 1: first half of the twentieth century mental health care. But 129 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:14,360 Speaker 1: why is it seems so much worse on the streets 130 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 1: in the last ten years. That is that is right. 131 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:21,720 Speaker 1: First of all, there's Newton people in mental illness every day. 132 00:07:21,920 --> 00:07:26,680 Speaker 1: They gradually strangulated the definition of gravely disabled. So so 133 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:29,679 Speaker 1: you can't bring people into a facility for treatment unless 134 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 1: they say they're going to kill themselves or kill somebody else. 135 00:07:32,240 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 1: And if on the way in they go I was 136 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:36,360 Speaker 1: just kidding, they can. They're only allowed to ask two questions. 137 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:38,080 Speaker 1: You know where to get food? Yeah, there's an Arby's 138 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 1: over there. You know where you're gonna live? Yeah, I've 139 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 1: got a tent at the underpass on Highland. That's it. 140 00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:44,680 Speaker 1: You have to let them go at that point. So 141 00:07:44,760 --> 00:07:47,920 Speaker 1: the notion of assembly being gravely disabled, having losing their 142 00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 1: legs from infection, lying in the street, you can't touch them. 143 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:53,040 Speaker 1: They they not only do you not touch them, you 144 00:07:53,040 --> 00:07:55,440 Speaker 1: can't touch their belonging. So one of the one of 145 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:59,440 Speaker 1: the phenomenon of the chronically psychotic patients is they will 146 00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:03,440 Speaker 1: hold their duels and urine. Can't touch that, can't touch anything. 147 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:06,040 Speaker 1: They're intended to do whatever they want, man, and that 148 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:09,720 Speaker 1: is killing people. It is ridiculous that we don't have 149 00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:13,800 Speaker 1: gravely disabled anymore. There's a bill in Sacramento, s B sixty. 150 00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:19,200 Speaker 1: State Senator Um Morlock has brought families up there by 151 00:08:19,200 --> 00:08:21,880 Speaker 1: the dozen saying, please help us. We are loved ones 152 00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 1: on the street. We have resources, we have doctors, we 153 00:08:23,960 --> 00:08:25,680 Speaker 1: have a bed to put them and will nourish them. 154 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:28,440 Speaker 1: Help us get these people home. They're told to take 155 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:33,079 Speaker 1: a hike. It's it's morally reprehensible what our legislator is 156 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:36,120 Speaker 1: doing in Sacramenty. It's truly reprehensible. We got a heartbreaking 157 00:08:36,200 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 1: letter from a listener with a son in exactly that 158 00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:44,800 Speaker 1: position today. Yeah, hey, listen, you mentioned California's Prop forty seven, 159 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:46,240 Speaker 1: And I know from reading some of this have you 160 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:49,679 Speaker 1: written you're as staunchly critical of it as us. Why 161 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:51,600 Speaker 1: don't she explain for folks what it was and why 162 00:08:51,640 --> 00:08:55,320 Speaker 1: you think it relates to our problem. I'm actually probably 163 00:08:55,360 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 1: not as critical of you, because I'm very sympathetic to 164 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 1: the idea that these people do not belong in prison. 165 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:04,400 Speaker 1: Drug addicts don't belong in prison. They belong in mandated 166 00:09:04,440 --> 00:09:08,440 Speaker 1: treatment that is not prison, that is life saving intervention. 167 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:11,400 Speaker 1: Drop for seven was an attempt to deal with the 168 00:09:11,440 --> 00:09:16,079 Speaker 1: excessive uh imprisonment of the drug addicts. Instead, they made 169 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:19,600 Speaker 1: drug use and drug trafficking essentially a misdemeanor. And you 170 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,360 Speaker 1: give drug addict a misdemeanor citation, are you ever going 171 00:09:22,400 --> 00:09:24,880 Speaker 1: to see them again? No? So it's a zero. It's 172 00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:27,760 Speaker 1: a zero. You're also allowed in Prop. Fifty seven to 173 00:09:27,800 --> 00:09:31,440 Speaker 1: steal nifty dollars a day misdemeanor, so they can traffic 174 00:09:31,520 --> 00:09:34,160 Speaker 1: their drugs, use their drugs, steal the support the habit, 175 00:09:34,520 --> 00:09:37,880 Speaker 1: unencumbered by law enforcement who have just given up. They 176 00:09:37,920 --> 00:09:40,439 Speaker 1: don't even You just watch it at a target that 177 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:44,000 Speaker 1: someday and watch people walk right past the cashier. It 178 00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 1: happens all day long because law enforcement can do nothing. 179 00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:51,120 Speaker 1: Citing them does nothing, So we have to create some 180 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:55,480 Speaker 1: kind of mandated treatment system. Otherwise you are murdering these people. 181 00:09:55,679 --> 00:09:58,320 Speaker 1: These are make no mistake about it. People that defend 182 00:09:58,320 --> 00:10:01,240 Speaker 1: Prop for seven are murderer. I've been dealing with drug 183 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 1: addicts for thirty years. This is active killing of drug addicts. 184 00:10:06,160 --> 00:10:09,040 Speaker 1: You can't allow an addict to use unencumbered and not 185 00:10:09,120 --> 00:10:12,760 Speaker 1: expect them to die. It's a fatal illness. We know that. 186 00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:17,040 Speaker 1: So anyone that defends the status quo is a murderer period. 187 00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 1: Just because we're acting as enablers as a society, it's 188 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:26,080 Speaker 1: worth an enabling it's it's actually an active encouragement of 189 00:10:26,120 --> 00:10:30,840 Speaker 1: the progression of a fatal illness rather than intervening in 190 00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: a way that and by the way, if they wanted 191 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:35,080 Speaker 1: to say, hey, you know what we're gonna do. We're 192 00:10:35,120 --> 00:10:38,680 Speaker 1: gonna create nursing homes where nurses administer the heroine and 193 00:10:38,679 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 1: the amphetamine all day long, we keep them safe. If 194 00:10:41,600 --> 00:10:43,959 Speaker 1: they want to do that, fine, go do that. I 195 00:10:44,200 --> 00:10:47,040 Speaker 1: wouldn't even object to that. But if you're just letting 196 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:50,120 Speaker 1: addicts run unencumbered, they die. So if you have to 197 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:51,400 Speaker 1: do one or the other. You have to all the 198 00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:54,160 Speaker 1: way and start administering the substance to them in a 199 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:57,679 Speaker 1: controlled environment, or you have to intervene. And trust me, 200 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:02,320 Speaker 1: having dealt with thousands homeless drug addicts, they're way happier 201 00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:04,520 Speaker 1: when you get them so their way, they and they 202 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:06,800 Speaker 1: can be great. In fact, I have people in the 203 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 1: Department of Justice that I'm working with right now who 204 00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:12,840 Speaker 1: are recovering homeless drug addicts. It's not that unusual. It happened. 205 00:11:13,120 --> 00:11:15,439 Speaker 1: It's tough, it's time consuming, it takes a lot of resource, 206 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:17,760 Speaker 1: and a lot of structure, and a lot of a 207 00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:20,800 Speaker 1: lot of sort of damocles over their head all the time. 208 00:11:21,320 --> 00:11:24,480 Speaker 1: But they do fine. So for God's sakes, everybody, let's 209 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:27,560 Speaker 1: let's let's get realistic here and where. Why aren't they 210 00:11:27,559 --> 00:11:30,920 Speaker 1: listening to clinicians. This is the mystery of me that 211 00:11:31,160 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 1: you have a mental health and open air asylum and 212 00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 1: then refuse to consult with people that work with them 213 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:41,199 Speaker 1: too much. So I don't I've never understood this completely. 214 00:11:41,200 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: There's there's mental illness like my son's got um, you know, 215 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:48,120 Speaker 1: just it's it's something that happens that you didn't make 216 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:50,319 Speaker 1: any life choices that brought this on your or whatever. 217 00:11:50,360 --> 00:11:52,800 Speaker 1: And then there's ruining your brain from drug use. Can 218 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:54,920 Speaker 1: you fix somebody's brain who's ruined it from drug use? 219 00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:57,199 Speaker 1: Are they just an award of the taxpayer at that 220 00:11:57,240 --> 00:11:59,280 Speaker 1: point or what do we do with them? It's a 221 00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:02,320 Speaker 1: great question. So that it's let me answer your question, 222 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:04,199 Speaker 1: and then I'm going to give you a corollary issue. 223 00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:10,160 Speaker 1: One is about three quarters of the time the even 224 00:12:10,200 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 1: the psychotic drug user will reconstitute. There was some crazy 225 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 1: data that just came out, however, that shows if your 226 00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:22,560 Speaker 1: psycho psychosis was induced by either cannabis or methamphetamine, you're 227 00:12:22,600 --> 00:12:26,719 Speaker 1: actually more likely to stay and remain psychotic from cannabis 228 00:12:27,280 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 1: then amphetamine. This was shocking data to me. So both 229 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:34,400 Speaker 1: drugs are inducing psychosis, but one actually is more likely 230 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:38,440 Speaker 1: to be a long term problem. Now, the issue of 231 00:12:38,880 --> 00:12:42,320 Speaker 1: a spontaneous mental illness, which are about one percent of 232 00:12:42,320 --> 00:12:45,000 Speaker 1: the general population, We're always going to have this. It 233 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:47,800 Speaker 1: is a phenomenon. It just a brain gets sick, just 234 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:52,040 Speaker 1: like hearts. And when that happens and we don't treat it, 235 00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:55,440 Speaker 1: you can lose people forever. If you treat it early 236 00:12:55,520 --> 00:12:58,720 Speaker 1: and aggressively, they can do very well and actually return 237 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:02,680 Speaker 1: to a product of life. Weirdly, in this in the 238 00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:06,120 Speaker 1: state of California, if somebody has a dementia and as 239 00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:10,360 Speaker 1: confusion and hears voices and is delusional and you don't intervene, 240 00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:14,240 Speaker 1: you're guilty of abhuse with schizophrenia with the same exact 241 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:17,080 Speaker 1: symptom complex or you can't touch them, You're not allowed 242 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:20,120 Speaker 1: to touch or go near them. And the schizophrenia is 243 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:22,559 Speaker 1: the circumstance in which you can change the course of 244 00:13:22,640 --> 00:13:26,959 Speaker 1: the illness by intervening. Dementia intervening does nothing, and yet 245 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:29,960 Speaker 1: that's the one that we have to intervene on. It's insane. 246 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:34,520 Speaker 1: It's insane from a clinical perspective. And and look, listen, 247 00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:38,320 Speaker 1: you you hear what the case I'm building here. People 248 00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:43,640 Speaker 1: that defend the status quo are defending ruining lives and 249 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:47,840 Speaker 1: killing people. It's a genocide and these people are defending it. 250 00:13:47,840 --> 00:13:51,439 Speaker 1: It's too much. I wake up every day beside myself 251 00:13:51,480 --> 00:13:54,120 Speaker 1: thinking about this because I know during the day three 252 00:13:54,160 --> 00:13:57,400 Speaker 1: more will die, justin l A County. Well, the case 253 00:13:57,440 --> 00:14:00,680 Speaker 1: you just built, the comparison between schizophrenia and UH and 254 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:03,480 Speaker 1: dementia is incredibly powerful. Who are you? Who are you 255 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:06,400 Speaker 1: pushing against who is saying no, Drew, You're wrong on that, 256 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:10,720 Speaker 1: or is anybody just The only person that really is 257 00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:14,959 Speaker 1: listening is Ben Carson, and he's he's coming, He's coming. Uh. 258 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:17,600 Speaker 1: Some of the immediate advisers to the President who listened 259 00:14:17,679 --> 00:14:20,040 Speaker 1: very carefully, and they're looking for ways to pull levers 260 00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 1: to try to make things better. Catherine Barger, Eli County 261 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:26,840 Speaker 1: Boarder Supervisor chair here in southern California, listening carefully and 262 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:32,000 Speaker 1: taking a deliberate action. Everybody else, well, even when they 263 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 1: start to talk about mental health with I'm I'm happy 264 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 1: that meyr Steinberg and Sacramento has begun to talk about 265 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:42,800 Speaker 1: it well, then mention it and back into a conversation 266 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:45,920 Speaker 1: about affordable housing, and that to me, I just I 267 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:47,840 Speaker 1: jumped out of my skin. I can't stand even to 268 00:14:47,880 --> 00:14:49,960 Speaker 1: listen to it when I hear that, because yes, go 269 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:54,720 Speaker 1: go deal with affordable housing. Do not contaminate that topic 270 00:14:55,040 --> 00:14:58,560 Speaker 1: with the topic of homelessness. It's a contamination and it's 271 00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:01,880 Speaker 1: reprehensible for them to do it. It's clearly a moral 272 00:15:02,000 --> 00:15:05,960 Speaker 1: failing on their part, and they need to change or 273 00:15:06,120 --> 00:15:08,240 Speaker 1: this problem is not getting better. So let me tell 274 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:11,120 Speaker 1: you what we gotta do. Are you ready all right? 275 00:15:11,280 --> 00:15:13,800 Speaker 1: We gotta pass s six forty and re established the 276 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:17,760 Speaker 1: idea of gravely disabled, so we can bring gravely disabled 277 00:15:17,760 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 1: people to care like every other country on Earth. Number one. 278 00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:26,360 Speaker 1: Number two, we need to expand conservative ship are three. 279 00:15:26,480 --> 00:15:30,520 Speaker 1: We need a directive to physicians when there's a psychiatric diagnosis, 280 00:15:30,640 --> 00:15:32,880 Speaker 1: just like we have a directive to physicians when there's 281 00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:36,400 Speaker 1: a medical diagnosis. There are circumstances in which the brain 282 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:40,560 Speaker 1: stops working due to metal or medical or psychiatric conditions. 283 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:43,840 Speaker 1: In medicine, we do it as a matter of professional 284 00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 1: mandate called the pulse form. We need the same thing 285 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:52,640 Speaker 1: for psychiatric care. So when somebody does decompensate, which is 286 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:56,400 Speaker 1: inevitable and most psychiatric illnesses, we are directed to go 287 00:15:56,480 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 1: in and take care of them. We need to build resources, right, 288 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:03,680 Speaker 1: We need these in particular intermediate residential care, not housing 289 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:06,280 Speaker 1: treatment centers. Call it what you will. We used to 290 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:09,240 Speaker 1: call them psychiatric hospitals. Let's call them something different, let's 291 00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:12,000 Speaker 1: call them life centers, whatever you want to call them. 292 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 1: But the the Social Security Administration and Department of Health 293 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:19,080 Speaker 1: are in the way, so it takes years of paperwork 294 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:22,840 Speaker 1: to get past them. Plus sequel the environmental protection laws 295 00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:25,360 Speaker 1: that I don't know how you get around them, maybe 296 00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:28,320 Speaker 1: declaring emergency. They need to be swept aside, and in 297 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 1: a year you can have thousands of events with them 298 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:34,000 Speaker 1: in place. It's going to take may never happen. So 299 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:37,080 Speaker 1: these are some of the things that are simple, simple. 300 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:42,040 Speaker 1: Our legislator legislature in Recramento could do it. Now they're 301 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:45,360 Speaker 1: not doing it. They're not doing it, and it's it's reprehensible. 302 00:16:45,520 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 1: Dr Drew Pinsky and listen, Drew will have links to 303 00:16:48,520 --> 00:16:50,280 Speaker 1: the some of the stuff you've written at Armstrong and 304 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:52,480 Speaker 1: getty dot com. So folks can go over it again 305 00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:55,400 Speaker 1: and get a little more acquainted with it. But keep fighting, 306 00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:58,240 Speaker 1: a good fighting. Let us know how we can help. Huh, 307 00:16:58,360 --> 00:17:01,160 Speaker 1: we're just talking about it. Help and again, don't don't 308 00:17:01,680 --> 00:17:04,800 Speaker 1: don't fall for the rhetoric. The rhetoric is so ill 309 00:17:04,920 --> 00:17:09,240 Speaker 1: placed and so loose base. It's it's about modifying forty seven, 310 00:17:09,240 --> 00:17:13,879 Speaker 1: it's about repealing fifty seven. It's about expanding conservatorships, it's 311 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:17,960 Speaker 1: about six disabled, it's about resources for people that need 312 00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:22,320 Speaker 1: mental illness that we've been ignoring for close to seventy years. 313 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: And it's costing lives on a daily basis. Listen, if 314 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:28,159 Speaker 1: Corona were killing three people in Los Angeles on a 315 00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:31,400 Speaker 1: daily by basis, you don't think we would take action immediately. 316 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:34,680 Speaker 1: Come on, everybody's get with it. Wow, good stuff, Dr 317 00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: Drew Pinsky, Thanks Drew. Good to talk to you. There's 318 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:41,080 Speaker 1: an interesting point in the coronavirus. Yeah, and he's right, which, Yeah, 319 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:42,919 Speaker 1: if three people got it at all, it would be 320 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:45,960 Speaker 1: in the news, let alone dying from it. You know, 321 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:48,320 Speaker 1: I appreciate what he said about the affordable housing thing. 322 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:51,160 Speaker 1: That is an issue, but it's not this issue. I'll 323 00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:53,199 Speaker 1: never understand that. How do you how do you not 324 00:17:53,359 --> 00:17:55,240 Speaker 1: move if you can't afford to live somewhere? I just 325 00:17:55,240 --> 00:17:57,320 Speaker 1: don't understand how you just don't go somewhere else cheaper. 326 00:17:57,400 --> 00:18:00,520 Speaker 1: And again it's a different question completely to in question 327 00:18:02,400 --> 00:18:04,879 Speaker 1: then the You know, it's obviously a mental health problem. 328 00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:09,400 Speaker 1: Spend Spend ten minutes among the homeless, and you'll understand 329 00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:12,720 Speaker 1: it's a drugs and mental health problem. I just but 330 00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:18,639 Speaker 1: government gets power by passing money through itself. So how 331 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:21,160 Speaker 1: mare's a hell of a lot more money in housing 332 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:23,960 Speaker 1: than there is in fixing a schizophrenic Well, that's what 333 00:18:24,000 --> 00:18:25,679 Speaker 1: I was gonna ask is how much of it is 334 00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:33,080 Speaker 1: just cynical. It can't be as much as I hate Steinberg, 335 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:36,800 Speaker 1: the mayor of Sacramento. Um, he can't be so cynical 336 00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:38,159 Speaker 1: that it's just I just want the money to go 337 00:18:38,200 --> 00:18:42,160 Speaker 1: to my friends. No, I think it's misguided. How could 338 00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:46,359 Speaker 1: you be so misguided? Howegical? Bubbles? How could you possibly 339 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:50,080 Speaker 1: And it seems like it plays into these people's a wheelhouse, 340 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:53,119 Speaker 1: the compassion for drug addicts and everything like that in 341 00:18:53,119 --> 00:18:56,000 Speaker 1: the mentally ill. Why are they making it a housing thing? 342 00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:59,479 Speaker 1: I just I don't get it because that's the conventional wisdom. 343 00:18:59,480 --> 00:19:01,760 Speaker 1: I guess I'm We've been hearing that for years from 344 00:19:02,359 --> 00:19:05,240 Speaker 1: uh and this is awfully California centric. But you know 345 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:08,359 Speaker 1: that's both Drew and us. That's what we're most acquainted with. 346 00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:10,600 Speaker 1: So wherever you are, you can apply this to where 347 00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:13,399 Speaker 1: you are. But um, Jerry Brown was previously the governor, 348 00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:16,160 Speaker 1: was always calling it a housing thing. Gavin Knewsom calls 349 00:19:16,160 --> 00:19:19,000 Speaker 1: at a housing crisis. He admits that it's also mental health. 350 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:21,440 Speaker 1: But um, and and you just hear it all the time. 351 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:23,600 Speaker 1: I don't know why in particular, but it's just time 352 00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:27,000 Speaker 1: to stop, just stop bringing up housing when you're talking 353 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:31,119 Speaker 1: about homelessness, because his Drew put it these people and 354 00:19:31,200 --> 00:19:33,119 Speaker 1: oh he makes it. I I read something he wrote 355 00:19:33,119 --> 00:19:36,439 Speaker 1: that was really interesting. One of the primary symptoms of 356 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:40,000 Speaker 1: some of the psychosis that keeps you from living a 357 00:19:40,000 --> 00:19:42,119 Speaker 1: normal life is that you can't recognize that you have 358 00:19:42,160 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 1: a problem. And then if your standard is this person 359 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:48,840 Speaker 1: has to self report and turn themselves in and or 360 00:19:48,960 --> 00:19:51,960 Speaker 1: kill somebody. I mean, that's just idiotic. Is dementia comparison? 361 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:55,439 Speaker 1: That's what it was about these people. It's he compared 362 00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:57,600 Speaker 1: it to stroke. A lot of times, when you're having 363 00:19:57,600 --> 00:19:59,720 Speaker 1: a stroke, if it knocks out, I think it's the 364 00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:03,320 Speaker 1: right side of your brain. You can't comprehend that you're 365 00:20:03,359 --> 00:20:06,560 Speaker 1: having a stroke, and there's not a doctor in the 366 00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:10,000 Speaker 1: world even as your hand flops in your face, right, 367 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:14,360 Speaker 1: And so doctors know if a patient has those symptoms 368 00:20:14,359 --> 00:20:15,960 Speaker 1: and says no, I don't think I'm having a stroke, 369 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:18,480 Speaker 1: you don't send them home. You say, oh, yeah you are, 370 00:20:18,760 --> 00:20:23,719 Speaker 1: and we're taking care of you. Any problems on the street. 371 00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:27,159 Speaker 1: But literally, in schizophrenia, you don't know that you have 372 00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:30,520 Speaker 1: a problem. And so anyway, well, yeah, the people I 373 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:34,440 Speaker 1: see yelling at the cement wall. They just need an apartment. 374 00:20:34,760 --> 00:20:38,640 Speaker 1: They're not any position to self diagnose anything. They need 375 00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:42,639 Speaker 1: a tiny home. They're having a very loud conversation in 376 00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 1: which they are in direct opposition, vehemently with the position 377 00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 1: being held. But that cement wall. Yeah, well, I could 378 00:20:49,880 --> 00:20:51,960 Speaker 1: go on and on about um and I wish I 379 00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:53,399 Speaker 1: had in front of me. I gotta grab it. But 380 00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:57,240 Speaker 1: that history of mental health and mental illness care in 381 00:20:57,240 --> 00:21:00,439 Speaker 1: the twentieth century, it reminds me a little bit of 382 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:05,000 Speaker 1: of the crazes that catch hold and education or it's 383 00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:10,080 Speaker 1: it's practically like music or fashion, like clothing. Fashion, In 384 00:21:10,119 --> 00:21:15,680 Speaker 1: that a particular ideology caught hold in the like fifties, 385 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 1: and it swept the nation. All the pros got super 386 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:22,280 Speaker 1: excited about this idea of shut down the hospitals, go 387 00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:25,960 Speaker 1: into the communities and say, look, you're feeling a little stressed, 388 00:21:26,200 --> 00:21:28,520 Speaker 1: here's what you do, and that will prevent people from 389 00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:32,399 Speaker 1: becoming psychotic. It was idiotic. It was based on no data, 390 00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:36,560 Speaker 1: on no sound research. It was just a craze. And 391 00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:39,919 Speaker 1: they convinced Kennedy and his people of it, and and 392 00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:42,200 Speaker 1: they all turn them loose, and Reagan off and gets 393 00:21:42,240 --> 00:21:45,440 Speaker 1: blamed for closing the mental hospitals, but he was pressured 394 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,120 Speaker 1: like crazy from the left to do it, and so yeah, 395 00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:51,560 Speaker 1: and and we ended up with this idiotic system that 396 00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:53,879 Speaker 1: doesn't work, and now people are afraid to deal with it. 397 00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:57,040 Speaker 1: And listen, libertarian types like ourselves were a little cautious 398 00:21:57,080 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 1: about the idea of the government stepping in and locking 399 00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:01,600 Speaker 1: you up for your own good. And oh yeah, I 400 00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:03,639 Speaker 1: think there's gotta be a break as well as gas 401 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:07,119 Speaker 1: pedal on that move back to sanity. But when we 402 00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:09,920 Speaker 1: currently live in a society where the aforementioned Because I 403 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:12,720 Speaker 1: saw this woman the other day yelling at the cement 404 00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:15,720 Speaker 1: wall under the overpass, like just really angry, pointing and 405 00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:17,800 Speaker 1: yelling at this mount wall. What did it do? Don't 406 00:22:17,800 --> 00:22:19,640 Speaker 1: you have to have a society where somebody can pick 407 00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:22,120 Speaker 1: her up and take her and and and incarceraate her 408 00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:25,200 Speaker 1: for that, You're doing her an enormous act of kindness 409 00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:28,000 Speaker 1: if you do. How how is that not a possibility? 410 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:30,040 Speaker 1: Even as a libertarian, You've got to be able to 411 00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:32,520 Speaker 1: look at her and think that person, it's got to 412 00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:36,520 Speaker 1: be put away. They're not capable of making their own decisions. Yeah, 413 00:22:36,520 --> 00:22:38,720 Speaker 1: I don't think it's not safe for that her or me, 414 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:42,280 Speaker 1: right right, Well, you could absolutely make the argument, and 415 00:22:42,320 --> 00:22:44,639 Speaker 1: again you have to be careful with this argument, but 416 00:22:44,760 --> 00:22:47,120 Speaker 1: you can make the argument as Drew did. Dr Drew, 417 00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:50,399 Speaker 1: that it's an incredibly cruel thing to leave her out 418 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:55,000 Speaker 1: to freeze, starve, get raped, self, medicate with math or whatever. 419 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:58,280 Speaker 1: I mean, that's other than, like, you know, putting her 420 00:22:58,320 --> 00:23:00,720 Speaker 1: in some torture chamber and torturing her her to death. 421 00:23:01,040 --> 00:23:04,480 Speaker 1: What could you do worse than than insisting that she 422 00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:09,000 Speaker 1: have that fate. So I don't know. I'm hoping change 423 00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:13,399 Speaker 1: is gonna come. Just stop conflating the homeless thing with 424 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:15,639 Speaker 1: a housing thing. That'd be a big step in the 425 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: right direction. It's two separate issues, for God's sake.