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Speaker 1: Hey, everybody, Jamie and Caitlin here, we just wanted to

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Speaker 1: give a quick content warning. At the top of this episode.

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Speaker 1: We are talking about promising young woman today, UM, and

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Speaker 1: so there's gonna be a content warning for UM sexual abuse.

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Speaker 1: There is uh we which we tried our best, but

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Speaker 1: there are obviously some descriptions UM that take place within

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Speaker 1: the movie. And we just want everyone to take care

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Speaker 1: of themselves. Yes. Indeed, on the Bell Cast, the questions

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Speaker 1: asked if movies have women in them, are all their

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Speaker 1: discussions just boyfriends and husbands or do they have individualism

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Speaker 1: the patriarchy zef in best start changing it with the

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Speaker 1: Bedel Cast. Hello and welcome to the Bechtel Cast. My

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Speaker 1: name is Caitlin Durante. My name's Jamie Loftus, and this

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Speaker 1: is our podcast where we discuss movies that you won't

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Speaker 1: stop asking us to cover from an intersectional lens and

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Speaker 1: then sometimes movies the you know, in the case of

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Speaker 1: the Human Centipede, for example, that um no one asked

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Speaker 1: us to cover. Are you sure about that? I would

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Speaker 1: check the numbers and I think there was a good

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Speaker 1: to three hundred to three hundred thousand. Yes. Our listenership

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Speaker 1: is just astronomical and just really wanted to know how

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Speaker 1: we felt about um feminism in The Human Centipede spoiler alert,

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Speaker 1: it's perfect. So it's a feminist masterpieces, as you heard

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Speaker 1: on that episode. But today today's movie falls into the

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Speaker 1: category of um. Our listeners were relentless to the point

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Speaker 1: where I was like, I don't want to do it,

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Speaker 1: and then it was like, well, we we're doing it.

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Speaker 1: We're doing it here, we are the Betel cast, and

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Speaker 1: and and so we we um. We analyze movies using

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Speaker 1: an intersectional feminist lend, jumping off from the Bechdel test.

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Speaker 1: But what is that, Caitlin and Way, Well, gee whiz,

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Speaker 1: I'm happy to tell you. It is a media metric

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Speaker 1: created by queer cartoonist Alison Becktel, sometimes called the Bechtel

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Speaker 1: Wallace Test, that, for our purposes are little version of

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Speaker 1: the test um. Two people of a marginalized gender have

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Speaker 1: to have names, and they have to speak to each

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Speaker 1: other about something other than a man for a meaningful

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Speaker 1: conversation is what we're going with these days. Sure, so

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Speaker 1: some movies do it with ease. Others simply have never

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Speaker 1: thought of the concept of women of people talking to

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Speaker 1: each other I'm sick to even think about it really truly.

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Speaker 1: So yes, that is that's the show. Um. Today's episode

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Speaker 1: is Promising Young Woman, which I understand why we got

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Speaker 1: so many requests. Yes, a lot to discuss, yes, but

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Speaker 1: also I'm mad at all of you. It's it's a

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Speaker 1: very challenging movie. Um. And we have a guest joining

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Speaker 1: us that we're delighted to have. She is a comedian

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Speaker 1: actor writer. She voices a couple of characters in Riyah

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Speaker 1: in the Last Dragon. She's a writer on Close Enough

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Speaker 1: on HBO Max. It's Sierra Coudo. Hello, Hey, thanks for

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Speaker 1: having me. We're excited to be here. We are so

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Speaker 1: excited to have you. So normally we do like, what's

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Speaker 1: your like history with this movie, but since it's such

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Speaker 1: a new release, I guess tell us you're just kind

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Speaker 1: of like general notion of the movie, general thoughts and

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Speaker 1: feelings surrounding it. Sure. Yeah, I mean I think I

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Speaker 1: I really liked it. I had just watched it, like

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Speaker 1: without knowing anything about it, which was, you know, kay

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Speaker 1: of a lot to take in obviously, because it's like

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Speaker 1: if you don't know the cover that the cover of

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Speaker 1: the movie is like girl with like kind of pastel colors,

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Speaker 1: and I don't know, you know, I was just like, Okay, interesting,

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Speaker 1: I wonder what this is gonna be about. But like

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Speaker 1: Carrie Mulligan and like the fact that, you know, it

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Speaker 1: seems to be nominated for a lot of stuff that's good. Um.

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Speaker 1: So then I watched it, and then I watched it

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Speaker 1: again almost like the next day, because I was so

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Speaker 1: um yeah, I was just like so intrigued by it

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Speaker 1: and the fact that, um, you know, I guess movies

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Speaker 1: with those heavy topics sometimes you've got to watch it

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Speaker 1: again just to be like, oh wait, I gotta catch

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Speaker 1: what everything, you know, what was going on? Because now

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Speaker 1: I know what it's actually about. So so yeah, nice,

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Speaker 1: um Jamie, what about what about you? This was this

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Speaker 1: is honestly, this was a tough movie for for me.

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Speaker 1: Not because I think it's not good. I think it's

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Speaker 1: very good. Um, and I really enjoyed, uh well enjoyed

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Speaker 1: maybe isn't. I didn't enjoy watching this movie either time

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Speaker 1: I watched did. I had a really horrible time. I

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Speaker 1: just uh, yeah, I I this is like a movie

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Speaker 1: that hits very close to home for me in a

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Speaker 1: way that is like just tough I don't know. I

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Speaker 1: tried to kind of prepare myself going into it and

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Speaker 1: made sure I had like a clearish idea of um

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Speaker 1: of what was going on, but it was, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: The first time I saw this movie, it was at

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Speaker 1: a drive in for some reason. I mean the reason

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Speaker 1: was COVID but also horrible movie to see you to

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Speaker 1: drive in. Uh. And and it just like it truly

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Speaker 1: did like trigger a lot in me. I I don't

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Speaker 1: really want to get too too into it, but I

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Speaker 1: like had an experience with campus assault that is not

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Speaker 1: identical to promising young woman in any way, but but

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Speaker 1: a lot of the dynamics at play were very similar,

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Speaker 1: and it seems to have happened around a similar time

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Speaker 1: ish that the reference thing. It just the specificity with

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Speaker 1: which it it just it was really hard. H So

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Speaker 1: by the first I finished watching the movie, I honestly

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Speaker 1: had no idea if I liked it, didn't like it

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Speaker 1: or anything. I just was like really affected by it,

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Speaker 1: and it like really fucked me up. And I texted you, Caitlin,

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Speaker 1: and I said, I do not want to cover this

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Speaker 1: movie on the show. Like it just was so I

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Speaker 1: don't know, like, and I it's even I don't I

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Speaker 1: still have this like tiny edge lord inside of me

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Speaker 1: that is like, don't say triggered, But that was the response.

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Speaker 1: It was like it just sucked me up for two

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Speaker 1: days seeing this movie and just brought up all these

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Speaker 1: um old bad feelings, you know. And but but after

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Speaker 1: a while it was like, you know, I've I think

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Speaker 1: it's been like two months ish since I first I

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Speaker 1: saw it, like pretty close to when it was released,

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Speaker 1: and I, you know, it just like seems like, okay,

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Speaker 1: you know what, the requests aren't going to stop coming.

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Speaker 1: It is Uh, it is an important movie, you know,

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Speaker 1: an important current movie, I think, and um, Sierra is

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Speaker 1: like I couldn't think of a better guest to talk

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Speaker 1: about it with. And so yeah, going back through it

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Speaker 1: this time, UM, I feel like I experienced it as

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Speaker 1: a as a viewer and not as like a person

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Speaker 1: trying to keep their brain in check. And yeah, I

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Speaker 1: have a lot of thoughts. I will say that if

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Speaker 1: you haven't seen this movie and this is like a

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Speaker 1: triggering topic for you, like definitely tread lightly. I kind

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Speaker 1: of wish I knew a little more going into the

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Speaker 1: first thing, or I wouldn't have For example, seen it

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Speaker 1: at a drive in or even seen it with another person.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's it is very sensitive stuff. And if

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Speaker 1: this is like a topic that is particularly difficult for you,

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Speaker 1: take care of yourself. I wish I had taken a

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Speaker 1: little better care of myself the first time. Yeah, but

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Speaker 1: there's so much to talk about, Caitlin, What's what's your experiences? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I had a similar kind of reaction to the movie

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Speaker 1: in the sense that I did not enjoy myself while

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Speaker 1: I was watching it. I recognize that it's a good

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Speaker 1: movie that is like well crafted and tackles a lot

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Speaker 1: of important things worth tackling, But I I just I

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Speaker 1: was very challenged by it regarding like some of the

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Speaker 1: things that happened in the story. I also found it triggering,

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Speaker 1: and I I don't want to watch it again. I'll

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Speaker 1: say that that's a trick. Yeah, It's like the kind

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Speaker 1: of movie where it's like, I love it, it's important.

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Speaker 1: I never want to look at it ever again. Um,

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Speaker 1: but I would. I would hope that just based on

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Speaker 1: what I've you know, gathered about um Emerald Vanelle question,

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Speaker 1: we may never know, shrug, But based on what I've gathered,

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Speaker 1: like around her interviews, that does seem like something she

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Speaker 1: wouldn't have a problem with. I don't know, Like, I

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Speaker 1: think she's so cool and like so gutsy and brave

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Speaker 1: for having made a movie like this, and the performances

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Speaker 1: are incredible, Like I really really like it, but I

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Speaker 1: never want to watch it again because just one of

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Speaker 1: those things. I'll listen to the soundtrack, great soundtrack, got

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Speaker 1: a good great soundtrack track. Yeah, I feel like I

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Speaker 1: I listened to a few interviews about it with her,

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Speaker 1: and um, I think that was also helpful because it

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Speaker 1: kind of was like, you know, certain decisions that they

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Speaker 1: that she made honestly like her talking about it. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think was like, oh, this is a good way

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Speaker 1: to like unpack this without having to like relive through

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Speaker 1: the scenes or any of that totally. And like, so

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Speaker 1: this movie is. It was originally supposed to be theatrically

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Speaker 1: released in I think April, which obviously we got quite

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Speaker 1: about this movie years ago. I remember I was talking

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Speaker 1: about this like late, like it's going to be good,

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Speaker 1: and I like I had seen the trailer like what

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Speaker 1: felt like dozens of times, and I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: like this is going to be so good and I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna love it and I don't. I don't. I don't

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Speaker 1: know exactly what I was expecting, but it didn't quite

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Speaker 1: match up with what the movie ended up being. Caitlin. Okay,

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Speaker 1: a huge spoiler alert if you haven't seen the movie,

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Speaker 1: but like, did you not expect perhaps for the protagonist

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Speaker 1: to be brutally murdered at the end of the movie,

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Speaker 1: Because I certainly did not expect that. I will say

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Speaker 1: I did not expect that, And again that's not even

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Speaker 1: a criticism. I think that that is like an incredibly

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Speaker 1: like not cool, you know, all things considered filmmaking choice.

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Speaker 1: But it was like I was expecting, like revenge movie

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Speaker 1: where where she wins. I was also expecting that, you know,

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Speaker 1: one of those I actually, well, okay, like does that

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Speaker 1: is a tough word like that to know. But I

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Speaker 1: think what I appreciated about that ending, and I think

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Speaker 1: this is something I also appreciated more when I heard

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Speaker 1: Um the director talk about it, is that it made

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Speaker 1: because because it is just so sad, it feels the

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Speaker 1: most realistic, just from my own perspective that it's like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: sure I would love to I don't know, I guess

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Speaker 1: have revenge in these situations, but I just don't do

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Speaker 1: that because I out of safety, you know. And then

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Speaker 1: I think that like sometimes when the revenge does happen,

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Speaker 1: that makes me almost feel worse because I'm like, well, god,

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Speaker 1: I guess I should just do that, you know. But

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Speaker 1: then obviously this kind of clarifies like, Okay, I think

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Speaker 1: we're doing this out of survival if we're letting it

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Speaker 1: go or not even letting it go. But you know

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Speaker 1: what I mean, Like I think it did show that,

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Speaker 1: like this is kind of another way that these outcomes

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Speaker 1: can happen in movies hopefully, right, um, But yeah, so

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Speaker 1: I don't know if it almost kind of like presented

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Speaker 1: another way. I guess also speaking from a survivor's perspective myself,

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Speaker 1: I guess it does feel like, you know, the relationship

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Speaker 1: that I have with that is like, well, I guess

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Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe I could have done more to

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Speaker 1: prevent this, right, And so then I think that kind

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Speaker 1: of was like okay, or or that could end very badly.

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Speaker 1: We don't have a lot of choices, you know, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we don't have a lot of like options here. So

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Speaker 1: I kind of appreciated it for that, even though totally brutal,

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Speaker 1: what actually went down in the scene right just like whoa, um, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I I totally hear you. And it's it's one of

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Speaker 1: those endings where in the movie Parallel, I'm coming up

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Speaker 1: with I really hope that someone could think of a

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Speaker 1: better one. But um, just a movie in which, like

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Speaker 1: there is this quest that like an oppressed characters on

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Speaker 1: and at the end they lose. It doesn't necessarily mean

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Speaker 1: that that is like not it may it may not

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Speaker 1: mean it's an empowering story, but it doesn't mean it's

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Speaker 1: not an important or impactful story. And fortunately, when I'm

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Speaker 1: thinking of as Rosemary's baby, and that's not great, but

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Speaker 1: that that you know, if you think about like Rosemary's

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Speaker 1: quest to overcome this, she's met with only obstacles, and

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Speaker 1: at the end she fails in that quest, and it's

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Speaker 1: like she is crushed under the pressure that she's been

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Speaker 1: you know, pushing against, and that I feel like it's

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Speaker 1: like a similar thing that happens to to Cassie. She

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Speaker 1: does everything she possibly could do and it's just it's

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Speaker 1: too much, like it's too much for one person. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the movie I kept coming back to is like a

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Speaker 1: comparison was Thelman Louise, let's go with that. But I

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Speaker 1: don't think your example is bad. I think like they're

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Speaker 1: major similarities between all of these types. But it also

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Speaker 1: just goes to show that we need more stories about

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Speaker 1: this that explore different coping mechanisms, different outcomes, different ways

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Speaker 1: in which trauma is dealt with, and so that we

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Speaker 1: just see a wide variety of possibilities, because I think

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Speaker 1: there's there's like a tendency to assume, oh, well, if

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Speaker 1: this has happened to you, if you're a survivor, here's

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Speaker 1: the way to do it, here's the way to deal

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Speaker 1: with it. So and it's never just a like one

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Speaker 1: path that anyone's going to take, you know. So the

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Speaker 1: more and again, I don't necessarily want to watch all

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Speaker 1: of these movies all the time. Here's the twelve movies

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Speaker 1: you asked for, Kalin, but there is a need for,

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Speaker 1: you know, just different explorations of this story. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: so that was that, and I know I know this,

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Speaker 1: we're we're structuring this episode slightly differently, but it's just

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Speaker 1: there's so much heavy ship even before we talk about

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Speaker 1: what happens in the movie. Um, something that was like

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Speaker 1: sticking out to me and the way that this movie

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Speaker 1: was reviewed was there was a lot of speculation on

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Speaker 1: like whether the protagonist Cassie, who is on this you know,

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Speaker 1: perhaps disorganized revenge mission, but like, but but this protagonist Cassie,

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Speaker 1: um if like is she a good person or not?

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Speaker 1: Which I feel like is not something that we ask

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Speaker 1: of like male revenge protagonists. And so there were I

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Speaker 1: I have a few quotes that I can bring up

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Speaker 1: later in the episode because I just don't care to

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Speaker 1: scroll at this moment. But but yeah, just a lot

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Speaker 1: of speculation on like well, like in this revenge movie,

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Speaker 1: you know, she's not like a perfect you know, she's

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Speaker 1: not the perfect person. And it's like, yeah, when have

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Speaker 1: you have you ever said that about like a movie?

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Speaker 1: Like what do you just even? I don't know. It's

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Speaker 1: it's so interesting too because it's like this movie he

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Speaker 1: literally just came out and you still see those like

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Speaker 1: to me, they just like feel like bizarre questions to

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Speaker 1: be asking, and they're a little pointed and like, oh,

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Speaker 1: this person seek revenge is not completely pure and but

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Speaker 1: so fucking what like since when is that the promise

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Speaker 1: of a movie like this? Like it's just such a

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Speaker 1: bizarre even like premise. I don't know truly, Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: hadn't seen those and then well, I mean this is

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Speaker 1: something we can also talk about. But you know, there

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Speaker 1: was that critic who deservedly got a lot of backlash

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Speaker 1: for who like wrote that review in Variety being like, well,

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Speaker 1: Carrie Mulligan wasn't pretty enough to play this character, and

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Speaker 1: like for that to be criticism in a major publication

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Speaker 1: that is happening in the years draft that you get

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Speaker 1: rid of, sir, Like, that's that's not a publishable thing

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Speaker 1: to say. Oh god, um, people's reactions. Uh still need

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Speaker 1: work things, so um anyway should I I'm going to

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Speaker 1: do a kind of shorter, less detailed, more condensed version

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Speaker 1: of the recap just in the interest of keeping things

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Speaker 1: kind of tight. Um, we just don't want to like

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Speaker 1: talk about this movie for two and a half hours.

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Speaker 1: We could, but in the interest of everyone's mental health,

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Speaker 1: we're not going to wait. Jamie Pitch, remember how we

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Speaker 1: did a nearly three hour episode on the Santa Claus three. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't see why we can't do the same thing

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Speaker 1: for that. Here's my other I've just got, Uh, Santa

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Speaker 1: Claus three is good for your mental health? What about

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Speaker 1: that two hour episode on Flubber? What about that three episode? Wait,

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Speaker 1: Santa Claus three? Is that the one with Jack Frost

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Speaker 1: that you are correct? Thank god? So scared I was

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Speaker 1: gonna get that wrong. Um, then of course you gotta

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Speaker 1: do at least an hour and a half on that

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Speaker 1: Jack Frost. Good, then your get Okay, So here's the recap,

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Speaker 1: and um, just trigger warning for this recap as well

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Speaker 1: as what I imagine will be a large chunk of

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Speaker 1: the discussion. Trigger warning of rape and sexual assault. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So we meet Cassie. That's Carrie Mulligan, who routinely does

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Speaker 1: a thing where she goes to a nightclub pretending to

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Speaker 1: be very drunk. She waits for a man to come

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Speaker 1: over to her under the pretense of helping her. Um brody,

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Speaker 1: but yeah, we warrant dating. It is Seth Cohen. When

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Speaker 1: he inevitably takes her home and tries to take advantage

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Speaker 1: of her, Cassie drops the act of her pretending to

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Speaker 1: be drunk and teaches him a lesson. We see her

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Speaker 1: do this with a few different characters throughout the movie. Um.

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Speaker 1: Early on, she bumps into Ryan played by Bo Burnham,

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Speaker 1: a former classmate of hers from med school, which we

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Speaker 1: learned she dropped out of. He asks her out. They

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Speaker 1: go on a couple of dates. He brings up Med school.

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Speaker 1: He wants to know why she dropped out. He mentions

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Speaker 1: a couple students that they used to be classmates with,

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Speaker 1: including Madison McPhee and al Monroe. Thus begins Cassie Kathy

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Speaker 1: Mulligan carrying out Cassi. Cassie Mulligan first simplus City Cathy

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Speaker 1: Mulligan her carrying out a revenge plot cassying out Cassi.

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Speaker 1: It's okay, we all make mistakes. Um. What had happened

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Speaker 1: is that Cassie's best friend Nina was raped in med

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Speaker 1: school by Al Monroe, which led to her dropping out,

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Speaker 1: which led to Cassie dropping out, and which eventually led

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Speaker 1: to Nina's death right which we don't fully know yet. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we don't fully know. So this revenge plot includes Cassie

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Speaker 1: teaching a lesson to Madison UM, who's played by Alison Bree.

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Speaker 1: She didn't and still does not believe, you know, the

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Speaker 1: circumstances of what happened. She didn't believe Nino when she

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Speaker 1: came to Madison for help. Cassie then teaches a lesson

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Speaker 1: to the dean of the Med School Baby Connie Britten.

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Speaker 1: Character actors are out in this movie also a lot

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Speaker 1: of comedians or comedic actors especially, and like the guys

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Speaker 1: who were played or who were cast to play like

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Speaker 1: the creepy men. Yeah, I mean Sam Richardson fedor Sam Richardson,

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Speaker 1: what a moment? What a moment? Indeed Coke adult Christopher

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Speaker 1: Min's plassy, Oh yeah, make oven. How's a scene of

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Speaker 1: like it's almost like I always wonder if I wonder

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Speaker 1: if she's spoken to this. It almost seems like Emerald

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Speaker 1: Vanelle like cast all these familiar feeling faces in all

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Speaker 1: these roles of like people that you knew from like

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Speaker 1: the two thousands and early two thousand tents, and you're like, oh,

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Speaker 1: I know this person, I trust this person, and then

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Speaker 1: it's like, guess what they are horrible. Um Cassie teaches

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Speaker 1: a lesson to Dean Walker, who had dismissed Nina when

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Speaker 1: she reported the crime to her. Um. Cassie also goes

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Speaker 1: to the lawyer played by Jamie It's Al for Molina,

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Speaker 1: al f Molina. His scene is two minutes long, but

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Speaker 1: the impact is I'm like, was he on set for

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Speaker 1: three hours, We don't know. Probably we can imagine it

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Speaker 1: was maybe a day or two. Um, but his impact,

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Speaker 1: you know, as always, I mean, honestly I have opinions

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Speaker 1: on the way his characters treated, but but you in

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Speaker 1: terms of was the performance there, the pathos he's on

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Speaker 1: his knees, honestly, Okay, if there, If I had no

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Speaker 1: context for what this movie is about, seeing Alfred Blena

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Speaker 1: open that door and be like, I've been expecting you

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Speaker 1: is a dream I've had. I want you to someday

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Speaker 1: knock on his door and he opens it, and you say, Alfred,

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Speaker 1: it's your day of reckoning, which just means that it's

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Speaker 1: just the beginning of your and his romantic relationship. And

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Speaker 1: he says, I've been expecting you, and it's like, oh

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Speaker 1: my god, this is great. And then once inside it

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Speaker 1: goes much differently. Yeah, of course. Anyway, so this lawyer

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Speaker 1: is the one who defended al Monroe and who bullied

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Speaker 1: Nina until she dropped her case. And Cassie's goal with

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Speaker 1: all of these things is to get these people to

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Speaker 1: reframe their thinking regarding assault and victim blaming and believing women. Meanwhile,

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Speaker 1: Cassie and Ryan are getting closer and falling in love.

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Speaker 1: There's a Paris Hilton stars are blind song about it,

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Speaker 1: which I almost forgot existed, but we but it's important

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Speaker 1: that we don't forget. And so I'm glad I was there.

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Speaker 1: I mean I was glad to be reminded of it. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Then Madison comes back and gives Cassie a phone with

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Speaker 1: a video on it of Nina being assaulted um something

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Speaker 1: that had been sent around to the various like med

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Speaker 1: school classmates. After this assault took place, Cassie discovers that

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Speaker 1: her boyfriend Ryan was one of the people watching this

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Speaker 1: take place. She basically blackmails him to get information on

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Speaker 1: where Alman rose bachelor party is, which she goes to

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Speaker 1: to enact the final piece of her revenge plot, where

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Speaker 1: she confronts al Monroe for what he did to Nina

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Speaker 1: and him not wanting his reputation and life to be

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Speaker 1: ruined by this, he attacks and suffocates Cassie to death.

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Speaker 1: He and his friend a k a. Max Greenfield get

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Speaker 1: rid of the body together, but Cassie anticipated something like

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Speaker 1: this might happen to her, so she had arranged for

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Speaker 1: the evidence that she had to be sent to Alfred

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Speaker 1: Molina's character to report it to the police, which leads

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Speaker 1: to al Monroe being arrested for Cassie's murder. And that

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Speaker 1: is how the movie ends. So let's take a quick

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Speaker 1: break and we will come back to discuss and we're back. Um, Sierra,

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Speaker 1: is there anything in particular you would like to start

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Speaker 1: with or we can we can kind of jump in

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Speaker 1: from any which angle. Oh um m m oh. I know,

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Speaker 1: maybe we could talk about like the sort of easter

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Speaker 1: eggs along the way of knowing that maybe Brian was

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Speaker 1: not this good guy, or just talking about the concept

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Speaker 1: of like the good guy that they kind of played

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Speaker 1: with in this movie. Oh my god, I that was

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Speaker 1: like one of the things I liked the most about

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00:25:31,800 --> 00:25:35,639
Speaker 1: this movie was like the deconstruction and sometimes it's a

402
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Speaker 1: little heavy handed, but like the deconstruction of the of

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Speaker 1: the nice guy is not something you see very often.

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Speaker 1: I don't think this is the first time we've seen it,

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Speaker 1: but it's it's definitely not something that happens often in

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Speaker 1: a movie that gets a ton of like acclaim and

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Speaker 1: and like is given a lot of positive attention. And

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Speaker 1: we've talked about this on the show a lot of

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Speaker 1: how like when when um, I don't know, but I

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Speaker 1: mean there's like two things that play here. The first

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Speaker 1: is like when there is an assault on a woman

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Speaker 1: in a movie, you know, very often it's by this

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Speaker 1: like it's a stranger, it's stranger danger, or it's like

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Speaker 1: someone who is like who in an average male viewer

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Speaker 1: will definitely not see themselves in. And it's like the

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Speaker 1: whole like twisty mustache, like pure evil villain that is

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Speaker 1: like unrecognizable to anyone, or just like huge musclely guy

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Speaker 1: that's like a henchman or whatever it is, right, and

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Speaker 1: then and then also the fact that the woman is

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Speaker 1: assaulted becomes her like the only thing about her. But

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Speaker 1: what I what I like about this movie a lot

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Speaker 1: is it takes a lot of different like very like

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Speaker 1: specific examples that are like, oh, god, of of guys

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Speaker 1: that think they're nice and have been conditioned to think

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Speaker 1: they're and I but have also been conditioned to mistreat

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Speaker 1: women and you know, assault them and do different degrees

427
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:13,840
Speaker 1: of abuse and manipulation and exerting their authority over women

428
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:17,960
Speaker 1: while still thinking they're nice guys. Like it's so frustrating,

429
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:21,280
Speaker 1: but it's so well written. I thought, Yeah, I have

430
00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 1: to say that the first time I watched it, I

431
00:27:24,160 --> 00:27:28,320
Speaker 1: did not see Ryan like the reveal that he is

432
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:31,679
Speaker 1: an absolute piece of shit. I do not see it coming.

433
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:34,720
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, and maybe it's just because I

434
00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:38,800
Speaker 1: like bo burn him a lot, But I was like, no, boh,

435
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:42,280
Speaker 1: don't be like that, which I think that just means

436
00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 1: that that character was handled really effectively. Um, because like

437
00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 1: Jamie you were saying, and we we have talked about

438
00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:52,520
Speaker 1: this a lot on the show, although I think we

439
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:56,520
Speaker 1: it comes up more in our like Matreon Patreon episodes

440
00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:00,360
Speaker 1: than in the main feed. But um, there is this

441
00:28:00,560 --> 00:28:08,200
Speaker 1: tendency to paint characters who are abusers and predators as

442
00:28:08,280 --> 00:28:13,200
Speaker 1: being so cartoonishly evil that no one could possibly recognize

443
00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:17,480
Speaker 1: them or see themselves in them. So when you present

444
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:22,680
Speaker 1: a character like Ryan who is like goofy and funny

445
00:28:22,760 --> 00:28:28,959
Speaker 1: and endearing, then you're not expecting him to end up

446
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:33,160
Speaker 1: being like a rape apologist. UM. So I thought that

447
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:36,240
Speaker 1: was effective the way that character was handled. But then,

448
00:28:36,280 --> 00:28:38,720
Speaker 1: like you said, Sia, in terms of like those little

449
00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:41,240
Speaker 1: easter eggs, those little hints to get planted along the way,

450
00:28:41,360 --> 00:28:44,719
Speaker 1: I honestly like did not fully notice them until I

451
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,920
Speaker 1: rewatched the movie, and I was like, Oh, he's kind

452
00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 1: of stalking her. He's not taking no for an answer,

453
00:28:51,560 --> 00:28:55,600
Speaker 1: he's wearing her down. And he's also like constantly anytime

454
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,160
Speaker 1: these guys come up, are like they're not that bad,

455
00:28:58,480 --> 00:29:01,000
Speaker 1: like which I that was like her really stuck classic

456
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:05,200
Speaker 1: al right right, Like and anytime al comes up, it's

457
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:08,200
Speaker 1: like this. I don't even know if there's a word

458
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:11,240
Speaker 1: for it or a phrase for it, but it's like, oh, yeah,

459
00:29:11,280 --> 00:29:13,720
Speaker 1: that's not great, but also it's not that bad, like

460
00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:18,200
Speaker 1: this weird like wishy washy, Like I don't want to

461
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:20,440
Speaker 1: deal with this, I don't want to have the conversation,

462
00:29:20,520 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 1: so let's just move on. Anytime they come up, Yeah,

463
00:29:23,440 --> 00:29:25,400
Speaker 1: that that really stuck out to me. On a second

464
00:29:25,400 --> 00:29:28,680
Speaker 1: watch too, it's like, oh, yeah, he doesn't like he

465
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:32,720
Speaker 1: doesn't think anything of how these these guys act. Yeah,

466
00:29:32,920 --> 00:29:36,760
Speaker 1: even like him saying even the way he addresses it too,

467
00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:39,600
Speaker 1: it's almost like he does kind of um, he knows

468
00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:41,480
Speaker 1: something's going to come up, so he gets ahead of it,

469
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 1: you know, he's kind of like, oh yeah, I mean,

470
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:45,320
Speaker 1: those guys can't get rid of him. It's almost like

471
00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:48,040
Speaker 1: he has to apologize for just like hanging around them,

472
00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:50,400
Speaker 1: so you know something's wrong, but it's like it's the

473
00:29:50,440 --> 00:29:53,800
Speaker 1: way that oftentimes guys talk about their problematic friends. You know,

474
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:56,880
Speaker 1: it's like they know something's up, but there yeah, like

475
00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:59,360
Speaker 1: you said, not willing to deal with it, so getting

476
00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:02,120
Speaker 1: ahead of it by sort of minimizing it right away

477
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:06,200
Speaker 1: and then being like, but you know that's him or whatever. Yeah,

478
00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 1: it's it's so like, I don't know. The second watch

479
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:11,240
Speaker 1: of this movie was, I mean, you really start to

480
00:30:11,480 --> 00:30:16,960
Speaker 1: not like Ryan very much. He is like and it's

481
00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:19,760
Speaker 1: it's frustrating because I mean but I think like he

482
00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:23,200
Speaker 1: is like as funny, like not funny because they are

483
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:26,520
Speaker 1: like being really sexually aggressive, but in terms of like

484
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 1: the specificity and the humor of like the Adam Brody

485
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 1: character and the mcloven character who we see earlier in

486
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:36,640
Speaker 1: the movie being kind of like these just pompous asshole

487
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:40,680
Speaker 1: guys who feel entitled to having sex with a girl

488
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:43,880
Speaker 1: that they don't think is going to remember. Um, which

489
00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:46,840
Speaker 1: is you know, like I mean that very much fits

490
00:30:46,840 --> 00:30:50,800
Speaker 1: into this um this narrative. But in Ryan, you see

491
00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 1: like someone who yeah, like the movie fully gets you

492
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:56,520
Speaker 1: to to root for. I mean, I fee like the

493
00:30:56,520 --> 00:30:59,400
Speaker 1: bow burn of casting that was really smart because you're like, oh,

494
00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:03,160
Speaker 1: he's it's both Burnham, they're falling in love. And also

495
00:31:03,240 --> 00:31:06,600
Speaker 1: like you want I mean that's like one of the

496
00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:10,240
Speaker 1: really like gut wrenching things about this movie. For me,

497
00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:13,920
Speaker 1: it's like you you want Cassie to have that, and

498
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:19,200
Speaker 1: like you like, oh, it's so awful when it's like

499
00:31:19,840 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 1: it kind of like on on this watch was like, oh,

500
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:26,400
Speaker 1: I guess, like ultimately I don't know exactly what the

501
00:31:26,440 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 1: movie is saying. I don't like whatever I but but

502
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:36,880
Speaker 1: like the fact that you know, Cassie very clearly deserves,

503
00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:41,600
Speaker 1: you know, to have a you know, fulfilling connection with somebody,

504
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:45,240
Speaker 1: and and then when she does become vulnerable, and when

505
00:31:45,280 --> 00:31:48,960
Speaker 1: she does trust herself with someone, it turns out to

506
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 1: like reinforce her original viewpoint of the world, which was

507
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 1: that you shouldn't trust anybody, and that like there there

508
00:31:57,680 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 1: is just such a wide degree of complet a city

509
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,800
Speaker 1: that no one is safe no matter how much you

510
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:11,600
Speaker 1: want that connection, and it's such a like it's weak. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah,

511
00:32:12,000 --> 00:32:17,400
Speaker 1: gets start fast, yeah, because Cassie is engaging in some

512
00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 1: pretty self destructive behaviors. She's you know, consumed by the guilt,

513
00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:31,720
Speaker 1: she feels the trauma that was inflicted upon her friend.

514
00:32:32,280 --> 00:32:35,680
Speaker 1: She's bearing the brunt of some of that trauma. I mean,

515
00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:39,640
Speaker 1: obviously this movie has an agenda. You know, it's a

516
00:32:39,720 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 1: condemnation of rape culture. It's it's commentary on victim blaming.

517
00:32:45,520 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 1: Like these things are all clear, But then the takeaway,

518
00:32:50,440 --> 00:32:55,000
Speaker 1: I know, I'm similarly like, well, I guess it's like,

519
00:32:55,080 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 1: you can you can stand up and fight the abusers

520
00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:04,840
Speaker 1: and the rapists and like the larger rape culture and lose.

521
00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 1: There's a good chance you'll lose. Well that, yeah, but

522
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:13,280
Speaker 1: you did get him legally apprehended, I suppose, so I

523
00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:15,200
Speaker 1: saw that as a win a little bit even the

524
00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:19,480
Speaker 1: justice was served, but at the expense of the lives

525
00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:23,239
Speaker 1: of two women, which doesn't feel great to me, right

526
00:33:23,360 --> 00:33:26,720
Speaker 1: right sure. And also it's like, once a guy like

527
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 1: al is in custody, is he really going to be

528
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:32,680
Speaker 1: prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. Of course not,

529
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:35,240
Speaker 1: We've seen how those trials play out. Yeah, he's a

530
00:33:35,320 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 1: rich white guy. He's gonna be like, he will probably

531
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 1: go to you know, probably he'll probably be incarcerated for

532
00:33:41,360 --> 00:33:44,240
Speaker 1: for a while. But will he you know, learn anything

533
00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:48,040
Speaker 1: or be held to held to task for real. No,

534
00:33:49,000 --> 00:33:52,480
Speaker 1: that like the I mean, but also I think that

535
00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:54,560
Speaker 1: it is like kind of an like when I say that,

536
00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 1: I don't know what the takeaway of the movie is,

537
00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:00,000
Speaker 1: that's an unreasonable expectation coming from me, is like why

538
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:04,080
Speaker 1: didn't Emerald Fanelle, one person give me the solution to

539
00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:09,360
Speaker 1: conquering rape culture? Doesn't have that? None of us fucking

540
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:13,319
Speaker 1: have that. And so I I, Sarah, like referring back

541
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,799
Speaker 1: to what you were saying earlier about like how unfortunately,

542
00:34:16,840 --> 00:34:20,360
Speaker 1: like what happens to Cassie is like a realistic outcome.

543
00:34:20,400 --> 00:34:23,719
Speaker 1: It's not cathartic, but it is you know, like it

544
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:27,640
Speaker 1: was clearly a very likely possibility to the point where

545
00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:31,080
Speaker 1: she recognized that and had planned for that, which also

546
00:34:31,239 --> 00:34:35,120
Speaker 1: was just like such an oblique thing that she went

547
00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:38,319
Speaker 1: into this knowing like pretty good chance. I don't get

548
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 1: out of this alive. I mean, And and maybe that

549
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:47,279
Speaker 1: is the point is like you know, it's not a

550
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:51,319
Speaker 1: one person job. It just isn't. And there's not like

551
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:58,080
Speaker 1: one brave hero who is going to kill rape culture. True,

552
00:34:58,280 --> 00:35:01,239
Speaker 1: it's just I mean, yeah, it was just not I

553
00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:03,840
Speaker 1: think for me, it's like it's more of just like

554
00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:08,480
Speaker 1: a personal preference thing than anything else, in the sense

555
00:35:08,560 --> 00:35:14,360
Speaker 1: that I think I just have such like negative, dark

556
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:19,520
Speaker 1: thoughts and feelings thanks to my depression and anxiety that

557
00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:22,480
Speaker 1: I just really struggle with with movies that have such

558
00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:26,799
Speaker 1: a bleak ending, and I, um, I think it's just

559
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:29,040
Speaker 1: it's like, I'm glad this movie exists. I think it

560
00:35:29,040 --> 00:35:32,200
Speaker 1: does a net positive for the world, but I'm like,

561
00:35:32,320 --> 00:35:35,920
Speaker 1: I don't know if this is this is not for me.

562
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:38,399
Speaker 1: I don't need to see I don't I already know

563
00:35:38,760 --> 00:35:42,120
Speaker 1: this stuff. So it's like I want men to watch this.

564
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:45,160
Speaker 1: I want like I would argue that this movie is

565
00:35:45,640 --> 00:35:47,880
Speaker 1: you know, is good and I'm glad that I watched it,

566
00:35:47,920 --> 00:35:50,560
Speaker 1: but like it's it's it's kind of frustrating because I

567
00:35:50,560 --> 00:35:53,480
Speaker 1: feel like like we are made to be the target

568
00:35:53,520 --> 00:35:55,840
Speaker 1: audience of a movie like this when it's like, no,

569
00:35:56,080 --> 00:36:00,160
Speaker 1: this is like love it, but like I know know,

570
00:36:00,360 --> 00:36:04,160
Speaker 1: like it's like people who who don't know it should

571
00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:07,040
Speaker 1: should be the you know, the target audience for that movie.

572
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:10,320
Speaker 1: But also you know, people who are not the target

573
00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:13,120
Speaker 1: audience are notoriously difficult to get to watch the movie,

574
00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:18,719
Speaker 1: but difficult conundrum I totally agree with you, Like I,

575
00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:22,680
Speaker 1: you know, I think that for this movie to have,

576
00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:25,000
Speaker 1: you know, the like to really act out the the

577
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:28,239
Speaker 1: agenda that it very clearly has, It's like, yeah, the

578
00:36:28,360 --> 00:36:31,920
Speaker 1: Micklovin's of the world have to watch it, you know,

579
00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:36,640
Speaker 1: and like be made uncomfortable by the behaviors they see

580
00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:39,600
Speaker 1: in themselves that are reflected in these characters, and like

581
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:42,400
Speaker 1: and in the Ryans of the world, like I'm an

582
00:36:42,400 --> 00:36:45,960
Speaker 1: amazing guy. I have grown as a person. But also

583
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:49,600
Speaker 1: like how do you reckon with your past? And that's

584
00:36:49,640 --> 00:36:52,440
Speaker 1: like something I really appreciate about this movie. And and

585
00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:55,239
Speaker 1: also like I don't dislike the bleak ending. It like

586
00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:59,279
Speaker 1: makes me fucking so sad, but I don't dislike it

587
00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:03,759
Speaker 1: um and I like how many for the most part,

588
00:37:04,040 --> 00:37:07,960
Speaker 1: I do like in terms of like how this is

589
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:11,839
Speaker 1: kind of targeting a very particular area of rape culture too,

590
00:37:12,000 --> 00:37:14,560
Speaker 1: which is also like, I don't know, I feel like

591
00:37:14,560 --> 00:37:17,000
Speaker 1: anytime there's a movie like this that comes out around

592
00:37:17,040 --> 00:37:21,240
Speaker 1: a large, pernicious issue that is never discussed in movies

593
00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:24,560
Speaker 1: like rape culture, it's like this one movie has to

594
00:37:24,600 --> 00:37:28,720
Speaker 1: speak for all of it, which is impossible. This movie

595
00:37:28,800 --> 00:37:32,359
Speaker 1: is like very much in the like subcategory of like

596
00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:39,040
Speaker 1: campus rape culture, and and I do appreciate the different

597
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:45,880
Speaker 1: perspectives it explores around that specific area of rape culture

598
00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:48,880
Speaker 1: of you know, like in through Ryan and Madison, you

599
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:52,560
Speaker 1: have people who are viewed as like generally good people.

600
00:37:52,640 --> 00:37:57,840
Speaker 1: They're not supervillains. They're navigating the world, you know, normally,

601
00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:01,560
Speaker 1: but they were okay with this. They didn't do anything

602
00:38:01,600 --> 00:38:04,640
Speaker 1: when they had a chance. And what is an appropriate

603
00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:07,920
Speaker 1: punishment for that? What does an appropriate penance like? I

604
00:38:07,920 --> 00:38:11,200
Speaker 1: don't have that answer. And then with Connie Britten, you

605
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:16,160
Speaker 1: have like these escalating crimes of Like with Connie Britten's

606
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:20,400
Speaker 1: Dean character, you have like someone who was in a

607
00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 1: position to do something about it and didn't because she

608
00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:27,919
Speaker 1: wanted to be quote unquote fair and she had internalized

609
00:38:27,960 --> 00:38:32,680
Speaker 1: misogyny and all this boomer lady baggage that we see

610
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:35,960
Speaker 1: in her. And then we get up to Alfred, and honestly,

611
00:38:36,680 --> 00:38:39,520
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I feel like I'm talking I just with Alfred.

612
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:42,960
Speaker 1: I feel like he gets off a little easy in

613
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:45,760
Speaker 1: this movie because he has he is at the top

614
00:38:45,840 --> 00:38:50,120
Speaker 1: of the crime thing. It's like the whatever, I mean,

615
00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:52,080
Speaker 1: you can feel anyway about it. I don't know how

616
00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:54,200
Speaker 1: we feel about it. But it's like Cassie very much

617
00:38:54,239 --> 00:38:59,080
Speaker 1: does approach anyone who negatively affected this situation as equally

618
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:04,040
Speaker 1: deserving of punishment, regardless of the severity. But Alfred Molina,

619
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:06,320
Speaker 1: I feel like it's clearly the worst of the bunch,

620
00:39:06,400 --> 00:39:10,960
Speaker 1: Like he was the lawyer who got al off at

621
00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:16,440
Speaker 1: the expense of aggressively pursuing to like take down Nina,

622
00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:19,399
Speaker 1: Like that is such a huge trauma, and yeah, like

623
00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:24,000
Speaker 1: an adult man's bullying like a teenager or a young

624
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:28,520
Speaker 1: woman who had been assaulted, Like there are levels here

625
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,600
Speaker 1: at play where it's like no one wants to say

626
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:33,840
Speaker 1: that they were the bystander that did nothing in the

627
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:38,680
Speaker 1: way that Madison knew and like clearly knew and did nothing.

628
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:42,680
Speaker 1: But then you have Alfa Molina who profited off of

629
00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:48,439
Speaker 1: aggressively doing something, And I don't, Yeah, I guess it's

630
00:39:48,440 --> 00:39:52,600
Speaker 1: I'm still kind of processing that of Like it's tough. Yeah,

631
00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:56,960
Speaker 1: the movie frames that where he's so wrecked with guilt

632
00:39:57,560 --> 00:40:01,160
Speaker 1: to the point where like he can't work anymore. But

633
00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:04,000
Speaker 1: it's like and like begs for forgiveness. He feels bad

634
00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:07,279
Speaker 1: so and then she grants him forgiveness, and I'm like,

635
00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:11,160
Speaker 1: I don't really care if you feel bad. Yeah. I

636
00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:14,520
Speaker 1: also don't believe that that kind of person would feel bad, sure,

637
00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:18,560
Speaker 1: because it was like multiple cases that he supposedly, you know,

638
00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:22,320
Speaker 1: his law firm did right right, like in the past

639
00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:23,920
Speaker 1: two even when he was like, we used to have

640
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:26,120
Speaker 1: to dig through the trash, No, we just have to

641
00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:28,279
Speaker 1: find a drunk photo and social It's like, so you

642
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 1: were pre social media doing this like for decades, like Jesus, yeah,

643
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:38,839
Speaker 1: you should feel bad, you should feel really bad, right yeah. Yeah, yeah.

644
00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:40,800
Speaker 1: It's like a just not believing that somebody in that

645
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:44,759
Speaker 1: profession would even have a compassion or feel anything. Sorry,

646
00:40:44,840 --> 00:40:47,120
Speaker 1: not not law lawyers at large, but just like in

647
00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:51,560
Speaker 1: his specific case. Um. And then also I guess like, yeah,

648
00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:55,880
Speaker 1: maybe her her revenge. I mean thing, it did seem

649
00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:58,359
Speaker 1: like she was very forgiving overall, you know, I think

650
00:40:58,400 --> 00:41:01,040
Speaker 1: she it was the miss directive like whoa, is she

651
00:41:01,160 --> 00:41:05,080
Speaker 1: like doing something really really bad to these people or Okay,

652
00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:06,760
Speaker 1: But then we slowly find out, oh, she just wants

653
00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:09,319
Speaker 1: like regret and like that's all she's asking for. That's

654
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:13,239
Speaker 1: pretty low stakes, you know, yeah, totally. And it's like,

655
00:41:13,280 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 1: but if you don't demonstrate that regret she's going to

656
00:41:16,239 --> 00:41:21,840
Speaker 1: have you assaulted, like the I mean the like I

657
00:41:21,880 --> 00:41:24,359
Speaker 1: saw some critics kind of like being like but her

658
00:41:24,400 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 1: practices are bad, which is, you know, not untrue. But

659
00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:30,200
Speaker 1: I don't even really want to touch that here. I

660
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:34,200
Speaker 1: just in general in terms of the clear I mean,

661
00:41:34,320 --> 00:41:38,080
Speaker 1: they're literally there's five people like kill Bill Style who

662
00:41:38,080 --> 00:41:43,040
Speaker 1: are on her list of people that she particularly thinks

663
00:41:43,040 --> 00:41:47,960
Speaker 1: had a negative impact on on Nina's case. And yeah,

664
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:50,400
Speaker 1: I mean it's I guess, I don't I don't dislike it,

665
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:54,040
Speaker 1: but they they're I don't know, I don't know that

666
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:58,240
Speaker 1: Alison briefing was tricky for me on the first watch,

667
00:41:58,320 --> 00:42:00,560
Speaker 1: But I think that that is also kind of personal

668
00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:06,640
Speaker 1: where I don't like, that's the sort of thing where

669
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:08,759
Speaker 1: I feel like it's it is a kind of survivor

670
00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:13,280
Speaker 1: to survivor situation, where like I had friends and people

671
00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:17,000
Speaker 1: in my life who did not were not inclined to

672
00:42:17,080 --> 00:42:19,680
Speaker 1: believe me or help me in any way when things

673
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:22,319
Speaker 1: were going on that over time I was able to

674
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:29,239
Speaker 1: find some empathy for and some forgiveness for. But that's

675
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:33,200
Speaker 1: also not everybody's situation. And then also it's like you

676
00:42:33,239 --> 00:42:35,440
Speaker 1: have to keep in mind that this is not Nina

677
00:42:35,600 --> 00:42:41,240
Speaker 1: enacting revenge. This is Cassie enacting revenge on behalf of Nina,

678
00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:44,040
Speaker 1: which which is why I kind of I liked that

679
00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:47,080
Speaker 1: at first in the like the Molly Shannon character, which

680
00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:50,480
Speaker 1: is like, there's another comedian in this movie who plays

681
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:53,320
Speaker 1: Nina's mom who you know, kind of tells like Cassie,

682
00:42:53,400 --> 00:42:57,200
Speaker 1: like you need to move on, like this isn't helping me,

683
00:42:57,480 --> 00:43:00,320
Speaker 1: It isn't helping Nina. You're you're just kind of acting

684
00:43:00,320 --> 00:43:05,080
Speaker 1: in this really self destructive way and like please move on,

685
00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:08,160
Speaker 1: which is like, well, that's the point where you need to,

686
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:11,840
Speaker 1: like her mother told you to kind of you know,

687
00:43:11,960 --> 00:43:16,880
Speaker 1: and I don't know. I mean, that's that's like the tragedy, right,

688
00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:19,480
Speaker 1: is you don't know what Nina would want in this situation.

689
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:21,560
Speaker 1: She's not there to tell you, and so Cassie's kind

690
00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:25,920
Speaker 1: of guessing what she might want. But a lot of

691
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:29,759
Speaker 1: that is enmeshed in her own guilt, in her own problems,

692
00:43:29,880 --> 00:43:33,799
Speaker 1: and and so any of the revenge enacted is kind

693
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:36,160
Speaker 1: of like there's all these levels to it because it's

694
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:39,560
Speaker 1: not like this happened to me and I want revenge

695
00:43:39,600 --> 00:43:42,200
Speaker 1: for it. It's like this happened to my friend. This

696
00:43:42,280 --> 00:43:44,520
Speaker 1: is what I am guessing she would want, and also

697
00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:48,720
Speaker 1: I would want for it. It's just like it's so

698
00:43:49,440 --> 00:43:52,759
Speaker 1: messy and complicated when you get the sense that like

699
00:43:52,960 --> 00:43:57,640
Speaker 1: she was just going to kind of target random men

700
00:43:58,600 --> 00:44:01,640
Speaker 1: for like maybe for who knows how long, but her

701
00:44:01,680 --> 00:44:06,000
Speaker 1: until until Jennifer Coolidge kicked her out of the house,

702
00:44:07,480 --> 00:44:10,239
Speaker 1: until she filled up her notebook with tally marks. Yeah,

703
00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:13,880
Speaker 1: She's like, well, my notebook is full, so I've my

704
00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:16,480
Speaker 1: job here is done. Um. And it's not until she

705
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:20,320
Speaker 1: learns that al Monroe has moved back to the area

706
00:44:21,040 --> 00:44:25,759
Speaker 1: that she starts this more targeted revenge plot to the

707
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 1: people who she feels need to be, you know, brought

708
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:36,280
Speaker 1: to justice. And yeah, I struggled with some of that

709
00:44:36,760 --> 00:44:40,480
Speaker 1: in terms of, like because the movie kind of tricks

710
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:43,719
Speaker 1: you into thinking, oh, is she like killing these men

711
00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:47,319
Speaker 1: that she meets at the nightclub? Is she did she

712
00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:53,200
Speaker 1: actually arrange for Madison to be assaulted so that she'll

713
00:44:53,320 --> 00:44:57,799
Speaker 1: learn her lesson? Did she actually abduct Dean Walker's teenage

714
00:44:57,880 --> 00:45:01,520
Speaker 1: girl to teach the d a lesson? You know? It's

715
00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:07,000
Speaker 1: all really and so it's but like I just I

716
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:10,520
Speaker 1: don't know, I mean, maybe that's just like the effectiveness

717
00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:12,960
Speaker 1: of that storytelling. But I was just I just found

718
00:45:13,000 --> 00:45:17,719
Speaker 1: all of that kind of unsettling. What I really take

719
00:45:17,760 --> 00:45:24,400
Speaker 1: issue with is there are a couple scenes where Cassie

720
00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:29,320
Speaker 1: is being assaulted, and I feel like we we saw

721
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:35,040
Speaker 1: more than we needed to see that we were like

722
00:45:35,120 --> 00:45:38,480
Speaker 1: kind of lingering on that. I don't know, it was

723
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:42,840
Speaker 1: just like do we do this need to be on screen?

724
00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 1: Kind of disagree with that. I I feel like that

725
00:45:47,120 --> 00:45:52,120
Speaker 1: depends on who the target audience of this movie ultimately is.

726
00:45:52,400 --> 00:45:55,520
Speaker 1: I think if it is, like you know, like for

727
00:45:56,080 --> 00:45:58,239
Speaker 1: people who have experienced that or who have felt like

728
00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:01,680
Speaker 1: that is a looming threat over them all the time, Like, yeah,

729
00:46:01,840 --> 00:46:06,279
Speaker 1: showing an assault is not really responsible filmmaking choice. But

730
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:10,160
Speaker 1: I think that if you're if your target audience is

731
00:46:10,239 --> 00:46:15,440
Speaker 1: like men generally who have displayed these behaviors, who need

732
00:46:15,760 --> 00:46:19,000
Speaker 1: who need to see it? Like, I don't know, I mean,

733
00:46:19,080 --> 00:46:22,279
Speaker 1: there's definitely a bunch of different perspectives there. I think

734
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:25,600
Speaker 1: that in terms of like a man who might see

735
00:46:25,719 --> 00:46:28,520
Speaker 1: himself in kind of this goofy way of like, oh yeah,

736
00:46:28,640 --> 00:46:32,080
Speaker 1: I I kind of act like mclovin and blah blah blah,

737
00:46:32,120 --> 00:46:35,719
Speaker 1: and then seeing that escalation I think could actually have

738
00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:39,200
Speaker 1: like an effect on like, oh shit, like have I

739
00:46:39,320 --> 00:46:41,839
Speaker 1: done something like that? Is that an instinct I would have?

740
00:46:41,880 --> 00:46:44,759
Speaker 1: I think that there is like it felt like it

741
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:47,560
Speaker 1: didn't feel like throw away at least it felt intentional.

742
00:46:48,320 --> 00:46:52,319
Speaker 1: But I also, you know, it is like triggering as well.

743
00:46:52,640 --> 00:46:55,720
Speaker 1: It's yeah, it's definitely there's like a lot of sides,

744
00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:01,560
Speaker 1: especially when it comes to like killing Cassie. You know,

745
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 1: it's like that's a long drawn out moment. I thought

746
00:47:06,320 --> 00:47:09,200
Speaker 1: for sure, like I couldn't believe it. I mean, of

747
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:13,160
Speaker 1: course anytime a main character is killed. I think I

748
00:47:13,200 --> 00:47:15,680
Speaker 1: was just like really waiting for like that next twist

749
00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:21,520
Speaker 1: of like she she's making it. Yeah, yeah, she's gonna

750
00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:25,120
Speaker 1: do the thing. And it was like maybe just I

751
00:47:25,160 --> 00:47:27,120
Speaker 1: think I remember going over my head like it maybe

752
00:47:28,239 --> 00:47:30,520
Speaker 1: there's somehow and then you know it just I guess

753
00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:33,920
Speaker 1: gave time to be like, oh, there's just no way

754
00:47:34,000 --> 00:47:38,359
Speaker 1: I guess this happened, like I don't know, but yeah, yeah,

755
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:42,880
Speaker 1: and I did feel like that, like I mean, it's again,

756
00:47:42,920 --> 00:47:46,440
Speaker 1: it's like it's not a Rewodgable seed. It's like no

757
00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:48,640
Speaker 1: one wants to see that scene happen over and over

758
00:47:48,680 --> 00:47:53,800
Speaker 1: and over, but it did feel intentional that like, especially

759
00:47:53,880 --> 00:47:58,239
Speaker 1: with a female director who I believe is a survivor

760
00:47:58,280 --> 00:48:04,560
Speaker 1: as well, and you know it it's like, I don't know,

761
00:48:04,640 --> 00:48:07,200
Speaker 1: it's like it's not going to be for everyone, but

762
00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:10,239
Speaker 1: especially it's like I don't know if she wants me

763
00:48:10,280 --> 00:48:13,759
Speaker 1: to sit with it for this viewing. Okay, it's going

764
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:15,960
Speaker 1: to feel like ship, but it's supposed to feel like ship,

765
00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:18,760
Speaker 1: and it sounds like that reaction that we all had

766
00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:22,279
Speaker 1: to be like, no, she can't be dead like this,

767
00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:28,279
Speaker 1: like super motivated revenge character that never dies can't be dead,

768
00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:32,960
Speaker 1: and like, but she is, and that is so affecting.

769
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:35,719
Speaker 1: And you see her like go down fighting and just

770
00:48:35,880 --> 00:48:39,320
Speaker 1: all this stuff and I don't know, it's I didn't

771
00:48:39,960 --> 00:48:43,160
Speaker 1: I didn't enjoy it, but I did. I did feel

772
00:48:43,160 --> 00:48:49,520
Speaker 1: it was effective. I don't know. Let's take another quick

773
00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:55,319
Speaker 1: break and just just for us this time, just this

774
00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:59,200
Speaker 1: is for us, and will come back to discuss more

775
00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:09,440
Speaker 1: and we're back. Where do we go from here? I

776
00:49:09,520 --> 00:49:17,520
Speaker 1: think something worth discussing is, yes, this is a movie

777
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:24,920
Speaker 1: centering on like women's empowerment and condemning this larger victim

778
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:29,759
Speaker 1: blaming rape culture we live in. But it still centers

779
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:36,319
Speaker 1: a sis, middle class, able bodied white woman, And not

780
00:49:36,440 --> 00:49:40,840
Speaker 1: that those stories are not worth telling, but that demographic

781
00:49:41,360 --> 00:49:45,720
Speaker 1: has been who most of the stories of this nature

782
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:50,160
Speaker 1: have been focused on, not only in like movies and TV,

783
00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:55,000
Speaker 1: but you know, real life news. So this just kind

784
00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:59,680
Speaker 1: of adds that's just another tally mark to the that

785
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:04,399
Speaker 1: of story about that demographic. And again, not that this

786
00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:08,160
Speaker 1: movie shouldn't exist because it's about a blonde, white woman,

787
00:50:08,320 --> 00:50:12,240
Speaker 1: but there it just speaks to the need for other

788
00:50:13,280 --> 00:50:17,600
Speaker 1: people to have their stories told. It is still a

789
00:50:17,680 --> 00:50:23,120
Speaker 1: largely white cast. We have Gail, who is played by

790
00:50:23,239 --> 00:50:26,720
Speaker 1: Laverne Cox, who is of course a black trans woman,

791
00:50:27,600 --> 00:50:30,160
Speaker 1: but she has no I mean, she has no story

792
00:50:30,280 --> 00:50:33,919
Speaker 1: outside of her relation to Cassie, which is this movie

793
00:50:33,920 --> 00:50:36,680
Speaker 1: came out in one How are we still having like

794
00:50:36,840 --> 00:50:41,360
Speaker 1: one of the only non white characters be a best

795
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:45,280
Speaker 1: friend we know nothing about outside of relation to protagonist

796
00:50:45,640 --> 00:50:48,840
Speaker 1: kind of you know deal, Yeah, I was. I was

797
00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:52,879
Speaker 1: disappointed in that, especially because Laverne Cox like really makes

798
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:57,080
Speaker 1: a meal of what she's given, Like she's so funny,

799
00:50:57,440 --> 00:51:01,560
Speaker 1: and they're like, why could her character being more actively

800
00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:03,960
Speaker 1: involved in this story? Why couldn't we know more about her.

801
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:07,359
Speaker 1: Could we have maybe like cut a random character who

802
00:51:07,440 --> 00:51:11,839
Speaker 1: appears for one scene and Kevin Laverne Cox in arc Like, Yeah,

803
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:13,640
Speaker 1: I was that that was like one of the more

804
00:51:13,680 --> 00:51:17,680
Speaker 1: disappointing parts of the movie for for me. Yeah, I

805
00:51:17,719 --> 00:51:20,840
Speaker 1: think she's only I didn't like time it out exactly,

806
00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:24,560
Speaker 1: but I would guess that she's only in the movie

807
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:29,040
Speaker 1: for a total of like a couple of scenes five minutes,

808
00:51:29,200 --> 00:51:32,880
Speaker 1: five to seven minutes in an almost two hour movie.

809
00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:37,000
Speaker 1: That was disappointing. And I mean I think that it's

810
00:51:37,360 --> 00:51:40,120
Speaker 1: like in these kinds of stories, that's like you always

811
00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:46,120
Speaker 1: see a story around like a social issue centered around

812
00:51:46,200 --> 00:51:50,440
Speaker 1: a white character first, and that is like it may

813
00:51:50,480 --> 00:51:53,239
Speaker 1: be a very good movie, it may be an effectively

814
00:51:53,280 --> 00:51:55,480
Speaker 1: told movie, but it's that like I feel like we

815
00:51:55,560 --> 00:51:57,279
Speaker 1: come up against movies like that quite a bit on

816
00:51:57,320 --> 00:51:59,920
Speaker 1: this show, where it's like, oh, like this movie was

817
00:52:00,000 --> 00:52:02,280
Speaker 1: a step forward of like this is not a commonly

818
00:52:02,320 --> 00:52:07,160
Speaker 1: discussed film topic, but when it finally is able to

819
00:52:07,200 --> 00:52:11,239
Speaker 1: get made and able to get seen, it's done in

820
00:52:11,280 --> 00:52:14,280
Speaker 1: a way that feels very like Hollywood safe of like, well,

821
00:52:14,280 --> 00:52:17,160
Speaker 1: but it's about Carrie Mulligan, so like you know, and

822
00:52:17,400 --> 00:52:21,160
Speaker 1: it is still centered around like as siss White character. Yeah,

823
00:52:21,200 --> 00:52:24,200
Speaker 1: I totally see what you're saying. Yeah, I wish I

824
00:52:24,480 --> 00:52:27,919
Speaker 1: thought more of the like well missed opportunities but also

825
00:52:28,040 --> 00:52:31,239
Speaker 1: kind of unbelievable thing would be that like if Cassie's

826
00:52:31,320 --> 00:52:33,960
Speaker 1: character and Gil is supposed to be like her best

827
00:52:34,160 --> 00:52:37,080
Speaker 1: new best friend in her new life, which isn't attached

828
00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:39,520
Speaker 1: to her med school life, which I guess she's trying

829
00:52:39,520 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 1: to get rid of, so like wouldn't she lup heer

830
00:52:41,080 --> 00:52:44,360
Speaker 1: into into like at least something more. But their relationship

831
00:52:44,440 --> 00:52:48,480
Speaker 1: is really like nothing, Like it's like what is scale

832
00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:52,480
Speaker 1: think Cassie does. Yeah, Gail doesn't know much about her, yeah,

833
00:52:52,600 --> 00:52:55,719
Speaker 1: like other than work there. But yeah, I mean it

834
00:52:55,800 --> 00:52:59,520
Speaker 1: was very I guess kind of stock BFF coming into

835
00:52:59,560 --> 00:53:03,200
Speaker 1: like if you know, which also is like a story Yeah,

836
00:53:03,239 --> 00:53:07,399
Speaker 1: like you're saying, that's a missed storytelling opportunity of like

837
00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:11,040
Speaker 1: this is her only I mean word to believe, her

838
00:53:11,120 --> 00:53:15,120
Speaker 1: only friend, but her only friend doesn't know anything about

839
00:53:15,160 --> 00:53:17,440
Speaker 1: her and they just like kind of communicated and he's like,

840
00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:22,120
Speaker 1: what are the dating right now? Like cute boy, and

841
00:53:22,200 --> 00:53:26,359
Speaker 1: it's like, come on you you have Laverne Cox, Like yeah,

842
00:53:26,840 --> 00:53:30,440
Speaker 1: almost all of her lines have to do with Ryan,

843
00:53:31,239 --> 00:53:33,960
Speaker 1: like she's another I mean, yeah, we've we've talked about

844
00:53:33,960 --> 00:53:36,320
Speaker 1: this a number of times recently, where like there's a

845
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:40,960
Speaker 1: character who is just like a queer character specifically who

846
00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:45,640
Speaker 1: is present to like just wonder what's going on in

847
00:53:45,680 --> 00:53:51,319
Speaker 1: the romantic lives of straight people. So yeah, it's like

848
00:53:51,440 --> 00:53:55,400
Speaker 1: it's so it's like a trope that is so easily

849
00:53:55,440 --> 00:53:59,000
Speaker 1: identifiable that I am truly, like so frustrated and shocked

850
00:53:59,000 --> 00:54:01,719
Speaker 1: when it still ends up in a mainstream, popular movie.

851
00:54:01,800 --> 00:54:05,000
Speaker 1: It's like, how how many times does it need to

852
00:54:05,000 --> 00:54:10,360
Speaker 1: be said? That was? Yeah, that was super super frustrating. Yeah,

853
00:54:11,040 --> 00:54:15,200
Speaker 1: let's let's see. There's there's other stuff here. Oh. I did,

854
00:54:15,400 --> 00:54:17,880
Speaker 1: like just in terms of I mean in general, I

855
00:54:17,920 --> 00:54:21,520
Speaker 1: guess this is like a genre saying where I feel

856
00:54:21,560 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 1: like in the revenge genre, and correct me if I'm

857
00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:28,200
Speaker 1: like completely off here, because this is not like my genre, right,

858
00:54:28,719 --> 00:54:31,800
Speaker 1: but like I feel like the person seeking revenge sometimes

859
00:54:31,840 --> 00:54:34,319
Speaker 1: you kind of don't know that much about them, and

860
00:54:34,360 --> 00:54:36,680
Speaker 1: I always find that so frustrating, and I also found

861
00:54:36,719 --> 00:54:39,000
Speaker 1: that frustrating in this movie. But I think that's just

862
00:54:39,080 --> 00:54:42,400
Speaker 1: the genre where it's like mad Max my daughter and

863
00:54:42,440 --> 00:54:44,759
Speaker 1: then you don't know anything else about him, like kill

864
00:54:44,840 --> 00:54:48,200
Speaker 1: Bill my daughter, and then you don't find out anything

865
00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:52,080
Speaker 1: else about her. Taken my daughter, my daughter, Like it's

866
00:54:52,200 --> 00:54:55,719
Speaker 1: very often or is it like John Wick is like

867
00:54:55,760 --> 00:54:58,760
Speaker 1: my dog or something, or is that my wife? Um,

868
00:54:58,800 --> 00:55:03,200
Speaker 1: it's it's my dog. But he's also said about his wife. Okay,

869
00:55:03,239 --> 00:55:05,320
Speaker 1: so it's like this is this is this doctor And

870
00:55:06,400 --> 00:55:10,319
Speaker 1: for Cassie it's like my best friend and you don't

871
00:55:10,320 --> 00:55:14,200
Speaker 1: know much about her outside of it. I just I mean,

872
00:55:14,280 --> 00:55:16,720
Speaker 1: maybe this is just like me chafing with this genre,

873
00:55:16,800 --> 00:55:18,879
Speaker 1: but I'm like, but I would have liked to know

874
00:55:18,960 --> 00:55:22,239
Speaker 1: a little more about her and like what her because

875
00:55:22,320 --> 00:55:27,000
Speaker 1: I do like that they, you know, build out a

876
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:30,719
Speaker 1: life for her, and you get the feeling of like, oh,

877
00:55:30,840 --> 00:55:33,680
Speaker 1: here her parents, they have no fucking clue what to

878
00:55:33,760 --> 00:55:36,799
Speaker 1: do even though they love her, which plays out and

879
00:55:37,360 --> 00:55:40,720
Speaker 1: I thought, like Cassie and Jennifer Coolidge there was so

880
00:55:41,400 --> 00:55:45,040
Speaker 1: great and she is like the perfect mom who does

881
00:55:45,080 --> 00:55:48,240
Speaker 1: not know what to do for generations and she she's

882
00:55:48,280 --> 00:55:51,439
Speaker 1: great and and I like that this world is built

883
00:55:51,480 --> 00:55:54,200
Speaker 1: out for her, and you also kind of understand for

884
00:55:54,239 --> 00:55:57,520
Speaker 1: the most part of like the only I mean, it's

885
00:55:57,560 --> 00:56:01,080
Speaker 1: like the only reason that Cassie is able to live

886
00:56:01,160 --> 00:56:06,520
Speaker 1: this revenge life is because of like her own privilege.

887
00:56:06,560 --> 00:56:09,280
Speaker 1: Like if she actually had to like work to live

888
00:56:09,440 --> 00:56:12,600
Speaker 1: and didn't have the ability to stay with her parents

889
00:56:12,920 --> 00:56:18,560
Speaker 1: and plan revenges, then her life might look really different.

890
00:56:18,600 --> 00:56:21,200
Speaker 1: And that didn't even like hit with me remotely in

891
00:56:21,239 --> 00:56:22,839
Speaker 1: the first one. I was like, Oh yeah, if she

892
00:56:22,840 --> 00:56:26,279
Speaker 1: didn't have like this niceass house to hang out with

893
00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:29,320
Speaker 1: with her parents and like plenty of space to conceal

894
00:56:29,440 --> 00:56:33,880
Speaker 1: her secrets, her life would just look really different. That's

895
00:56:33,880 --> 00:56:36,040
Speaker 1: not here nor there. I was just like, oh, wow,

896
00:56:36,200 --> 00:56:38,840
Speaker 1: you just you can't just live that revenge life. You know,

897
00:56:38,880 --> 00:56:42,360
Speaker 1: someone has to be bankrolling that revenge life because you

898
00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:45,800
Speaker 1: can't really live that revenge life on a barista income.

899
00:56:46,200 --> 00:56:51,279
Speaker 1: Speaking for personal experience right by the way her like

900
00:56:51,320 --> 00:56:53,919
Speaker 1: we said her mom who is Jennifer Coolidge, and her

901
00:56:54,080 --> 00:56:58,960
Speaker 1: dad who is Clancy Brown, who is most famous for

902
00:56:59,080 --> 00:57:03,520
Speaker 1: being one of the Sachman in Flubber, his best known role.

903
00:57:03,960 --> 00:57:06,760
Speaker 1: I didn't take that connection. And I love I really

904
00:57:06,800 --> 00:57:11,279
Speaker 1: did like the parents in this movie. I feel like

905
00:57:11,280 --> 00:57:14,879
Speaker 1: they really give they really that scene where her dad

906
00:57:15,000 --> 00:57:18,000
Speaker 1: is like, we really miss Nina, but we really miss

907
00:57:18,080 --> 00:57:23,760
Speaker 1: you and you're like, that's so I did appreciate, Like

908
00:57:23,800 --> 00:57:26,120
Speaker 1: there are little things that happened in this movie that

909
00:57:26,280 --> 00:57:32,320
Speaker 1: like speak to survivors experience or survivor's guilt that were

910
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:36,360
Speaker 1: like really specific in a way that was like yeah,

911
00:57:36,360 --> 00:57:38,520
Speaker 1: I mean certain things. And and of course it's like

912
00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:41,280
Speaker 1: it is written in a kind of campy way at

913
00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:45,560
Speaker 1: times where like Carrie Mulligan, she gets quippy in some scenes.

914
00:57:45,680 --> 00:57:47,760
Speaker 1: You know she's not firing off things you would know

915
00:57:47,840 --> 00:57:49,280
Speaker 1: off the top of your head, but like who gives

916
00:57:49,280 --> 00:57:53,200
Speaker 1: a ship? I love that um. But like the knee

917
00:57:53,240 --> 00:57:56,840
Speaker 1: jerk defenses that you hear from from the Dean, the

918
00:57:56,880 --> 00:58:01,160
Speaker 1: knee jerk defenses you hear from Ryan's, especially when Ryan

919
00:58:01,280 --> 00:58:04,400
Speaker 1: is backed into a corner. The way he suddenly behaves

920
00:58:04,480 --> 00:58:08,000
Speaker 1: is like, oh, there you are. You know, there's who

921
00:58:08,080 --> 00:58:14,080
Speaker 1: you actually are. And then with her parents like you

922
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:17,160
Speaker 1: you like, I feel like something this movie does do

923
00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:22,720
Speaker 1: effectively is shows that when an assault that barely affects

924
00:58:22,760 --> 00:58:26,800
Speaker 1: the life of someone like al the ripple effects are huge.

925
00:58:27,040 --> 00:58:30,479
Speaker 1: I mean it's it's completely altered the course of Cassie's life,

926
00:58:30,680 --> 00:58:33,680
Speaker 1: but it's also like, you know, affecting her family and

927
00:58:33,760 --> 00:58:37,640
Speaker 1: affecting you know, it just it ripples out so far

928
00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:42,680
Speaker 1: and there's never space made for that for sure. Yeah.

929
00:58:42,680 --> 00:58:46,000
Speaker 1: I think one of those things this movie does effectively

930
00:58:46,040 --> 00:58:50,000
Speaker 1: that I haven't seen a lot in other kind of

931
00:58:50,040 --> 00:58:55,920
Speaker 1: similar movies or movies that tackle similar subject matter, is

932
00:58:56,240 --> 00:59:02,919
Speaker 1: it shows that the perpetrator of the assault is not

933
00:59:03,160 --> 00:59:07,720
Speaker 1: the only villain in this scenario. There are enablers, There

934
00:59:07,760 --> 00:59:13,000
Speaker 1: are cheerleaders, There are by standards who did nothing to intervene.

935
00:59:13,520 --> 00:59:17,520
Speaker 1: There are authority figures who gave the abuser the benefit

936
00:59:17,560 --> 00:59:22,240
Speaker 1: of the doubt. There are you know, peers who didn't

937
00:59:22,240 --> 00:59:25,800
Speaker 1: believe the victim because she had a certain reputation. You know,

938
00:59:25,840 --> 00:59:28,400
Speaker 1: there's there's all these people that, I think it that

939
00:59:28,440 --> 00:59:32,000
Speaker 1: tend to get overlooked in other stories of this nature

940
00:59:32,040 --> 00:59:37,160
Speaker 1: that I did really appreciate about this movie. Yeah, I know,

941
00:59:37,440 --> 00:59:42,120
Speaker 1: one interview with the director was she actually described, I

942
00:59:42,160 --> 00:59:45,120
Speaker 1: think the characters as like good people who are doing

943
00:59:45,160 --> 00:59:48,720
Speaker 1: bad things, which I was really fascinated with, even like

944
00:59:48,880 --> 00:59:51,760
Speaker 1: she would say Ryan or you know some of the

945
00:59:51,800 --> 00:59:55,760
Speaker 1: other like characters that were like, oh, that's a bad person.

946
00:59:55,840 --> 00:59:58,200
Speaker 1: Like I think that's what she was trying to convey here,

947
00:59:58,240 --> 01:00:00,600
Speaker 1: which you know, as we said with the casting and stuff,

948
01:00:00,640 --> 01:00:02,320
Speaker 1: did a really good job because we trusted these people

949
01:00:02,320 --> 01:00:04,240
Speaker 1: and like some of these people seem like they could

950
01:00:04,240 --> 01:00:06,840
Speaker 1: be your buddy, you know, um, and so yeah, I

951
01:00:06,840 --> 01:00:11,240
Speaker 1: think that was well yeah, actually your buddy, our best friend.

952
01:00:11,720 --> 01:00:15,640
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, I mean a true knock on his door,

953
01:00:15,640 --> 01:00:17,480
Speaker 1: you know, we know the drill. But yeah, it is

954
01:00:17,520 --> 01:00:21,080
Speaker 1: really like I think that's what was so unique because

955
01:00:21,120 --> 01:00:24,320
Speaker 1: it's like, of course we know rapists equal bad, like

956
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:27,439
Speaker 1: we got that hopefully if we don't. If you don't

957
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:30,760
Speaker 1: know that, then like lost, cause who cares, don't watch movies. Um,

958
01:00:30,800 --> 01:00:33,240
Speaker 1: But like you know, I think this was like more

959
01:00:33,600 --> 01:00:36,800
Speaker 1: of the like, yeah, the enablers of people around that

960
01:00:36,840 --> 01:00:39,880
Speaker 1: and then being like examined your own actions are people

961
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:42,960
Speaker 1: close to you, because that's going to be much more

962
01:00:43,120 --> 01:00:45,760
Speaker 1: possible that you might be that person instead of the

963
01:00:45,920 --> 01:00:51,080
Speaker 1: al monrope but like you might be Madison McPhee or whoever. Yeah,

964
01:00:51,120 --> 01:00:54,840
Speaker 1: the Madison McFee character in particular, Like some some of

965
01:00:54,840 --> 01:00:58,960
Speaker 1: my viewers are having an issue with her, but I

966
01:00:58,960 --> 01:01:00,760
Speaker 1: I mean I think that that is I mean that

967
01:01:00,960 --> 01:01:05,959
Speaker 1: is the case for women watching this movie of like

968
01:01:06,080 --> 01:01:09,000
Speaker 1: there is that internalized misogyny and also the way that

969
01:01:09,120 --> 01:01:13,960
Speaker 1: Cassie speaks with her, because they're talking about an assault

970
01:01:13,960 --> 01:01:16,520
Speaker 1: that took place seven or eight years ago, but it's

971
01:01:16,520 --> 01:01:19,320
Speaker 1: been a seven or eight years where the conversation around

972
01:01:19,560 --> 01:01:24,520
Speaker 1: campus assault has completely changed, like from two thousand and thirteen.

973
01:01:24,600 --> 01:01:30,160
Speaker 1: It's completely different now. And there was no culture of

974
01:01:30,520 --> 01:01:33,880
Speaker 1: believe women then, and there was a lot of like

975
01:01:34,720 --> 01:01:38,240
Speaker 1: and and and and having her present that was like,

976
01:01:39,240 --> 01:01:41,800
Speaker 1: I mean, it was like painful and frustrating because it's

977
01:01:41,800 --> 01:01:45,240
Speaker 1: like behaviors that you recognize in in I don't know,

978
01:01:45,280 --> 01:01:47,680
Speaker 1: like being in school at that time. You're like, oh, yeah,

979
01:01:47,760 --> 01:01:52,720
Speaker 1: that was absolutely like a constant conversation going on. But

980
01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:55,320
Speaker 1: but but then, like we're talking about earlier, for Cassie

981
01:01:55,360 --> 01:01:57,680
Speaker 1: to set the bar so low as to just be like,

982
01:01:58,280 --> 01:02:01,680
Speaker 1: can you demonstrate ro more for how you behaved then,

983
01:02:02,280 --> 01:02:06,160
Speaker 1: and she can't do it. She can't, And it's that

984
01:02:06,360 --> 01:02:08,880
Speaker 1: is like the worst feeling in the world. If like,

985
01:02:09,600 --> 01:02:12,760
Speaker 1: like you're saying, Sierra that, like Emerald was saying in

986
01:02:12,760 --> 01:02:17,000
Speaker 1: an interview that like they're not bad people, but the

987
01:02:17,040 --> 01:02:19,720
Speaker 1: fact that it's like if Madison is not a bad

988
01:02:19,760 --> 01:02:23,400
Speaker 1: person and she is spent eight years sort of in

989
01:02:23,440 --> 01:02:26,160
Speaker 1: the back of her head being like, well, you know,

990
01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:29,760
Speaker 1: these things happen, and like, I mean, that's just like

991
01:02:29,800 --> 01:02:32,520
Speaker 1: a very real thing that exists in the world, and

992
01:02:33,400 --> 01:02:36,800
Speaker 1: it's I don't know, there's there's so much Most of

993
01:02:36,800 --> 01:02:40,320
Speaker 1: the criticism around this movie I sort of received as like,

994
01:02:42,280 --> 01:02:44,800
Speaker 1: you know, how is one filmmaker going to give you

995
01:02:44,840 --> 01:02:48,280
Speaker 1: a definitive answer for this problem? I don't know, Like

996
01:02:48,560 --> 01:02:53,200
Speaker 1: it is such an ambiguous and changing conversation and everyone

997
01:02:53,240 --> 01:02:58,000
Speaker 1: feels different about it for sure. Um to your point

998
01:02:58,040 --> 01:03:02,280
Speaker 1: a little earlier, Jamie, in terms of us not knowing

999
01:03:02,400 --> 01:03:08,760
Speaker 1: a whole lot about Cassie, I think we do get

1000
01:03:08,800 --> 01:03:12,120
Speaker 1: to know her a little bit better than kind of

1001
01:03:12,120 --> 01:03:18,880
Speaker 1: similar characters in similar movies. But what I'm in telling

1002
01:03:19,040 --> 01:03:21,360
Speaker 1: let me know if this is not a fair assessment,

1003
01:03:22,000 --> 01:03:28,040
Speaker 1: But because there is a tendency in narratives like this

1004
01:03:28,360 --> 01:03:35,600
Speaker 1: for like the survivors to be predominantly defined by their trauma,

1005
01:03:36,480 --> 01:03:41,240
Speaker 1: I feel like we were getting traces of that, maybe

1006
01:03:41,320 --> 01:03:44,760
Speaker 1: not to the extent that we've seen in other stories,

1007
01:03:44,920 --> 01:03:50,840
Speaker 1: but with Cassie, like her whole narrative, I mean, her

1008
01:03:50,880 --> 01:03:56,720
Speaker 1: whole goal is like this all consuming this trauma, guilt

1009
01:03:57,480 --> 01:04:02,200
Speaker 1: feelings surrounding this assault that had happened to her friend.

1010
01:04:02,600 --> 01:04:06,360
Speaker 1: And I mean that's also kind of the nature of storytelling.

1011
01:04:06,360 --> 01:04:10,520
Speaker 1: It needs to be focused and specific, and like you know,

1012
01:04:10,560 --> 01:04:13,480
Speaker 1: we've been talking about she she has given more of

1013
01:04:13,520 --> 01:04:18,880
Speaker 1: an interior life than you know, again other similar characters

1014
01:04:18,920 --> 01:04:22,400
Speaker 1: we've seen. And a part of the movie that I like,

1015
01:04:22,920 --> 01:04:25,480
Speaker 1: part of the trajectory of the story that I appreciated

1016
01:04:25,560 --> 01:04:29,479
Speaker 1: and enjoyed, was when she goes to talk to Nina's mom,

1017
01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:34,960
Speaker 1: Molly Shannon, and she's like, Cassie, this is not doing

1018
01:04:35,040 --> 01:04:38,880
Speaker 1: anybody any good. You're acting like a child, and you

1019
01:04:38,960 --> 01:04:42,280
Speaker 1: need to let it go and move on. And it

1020
01:04:42,360 --> 01:04:45,280
Speaker 1: seems like Cassie takes this to heart and that because

1021
01:04:45,320 --> 01:04:48,440
Speaker 1: that's when she starts to get closer and open up

1022
01:04:48,480 --> 01:04:52,160
Speaker 1: a bit more with Ryan, and she like, let's what

1023
01:04:52,360 --> 01:04:56,360
Speaker 1: appears to be a healthy relationship into her life. And

1024
01:04:56,400 --> 01:05:03,160
Speaker 1: it's only until she sees he was a bystander of

1025
01:05:03,200 --> 01:05:07,080
Speaker 1: this assault that she decides to carry out the rest

1026
01:05:07,120 --> 01:05:15,160
Speaker 1: of her plot, her revenge plot. That Yeah, I see

1027
01:05:15,200 --> 01:05:17,200
Speaker 1: what you're saying. And I feel this way about a

1028
01:05:17,200 --> 01:05:19,480
Speaker 1: lot of movies. I it's I don't really feel that

1029
01:05:19,560 --> 01:05:22,440
Speaker 1: I don't know, for the way it struck me was like,

1030
01:05:23,360 --> 01:05:26,600
Speaker 1: and maybe it was not done in the best way

1031
01:05:26,640 --> 01:05:29,560
Speaker 1: possible that you know, whatever, No movie is perfect, but

1032
01:05:29,920 --> 01:05:36,080
Speaker 1: I felt like what Cassie is experiencing is like, it

1033
01:05:36,160 --> 01:05:39,120
Speaker 1: felt like to me, like the how how an event

1034
01:05:39,200 --> 01:05:42,480
Speaker 1: like this takes over, you know, has the potential that

1035
01:05:42,600 --> 01:05:46,320
Speaker 1: just take over your life and yourself, And not in

1036
01:05:46,400 --> 01:05:50,680
Speaker 1: terms of like a bad writing perspective, but in terms of, like,

1037
01:05:51,040 --> 01:05:52,920
Speaker 1: I think that there there are ways that these storylines

1038
01:05:52,960 --> 01:05:55,240
Speaker 1: are written where it's like, oh, yeah, the trauma is

1039
01:05:55,280 --> 01:05:58,360
Speaker 1: the defining woman like moment of this woman's life because

1040
01:05:58,480 --> 01:06:02,120
Speaker 1: plot plot, plot plot plot it whereas like her friend's

1041
01:06:02,360 --> 01:06:05,240
Speaker 1: death was the defining moment of her life. She can't

1042
01:06:05,240 --> 01:06:07,480
Speaker 1: move on, but we do get indications that she might

1043
01:06:07,640 --> 01:06:11,480
Speaker 1: want to through like this potential relationship and through her

1044
01:06:11,920 --> 01:06:14,000
Speaker 1: you know, talking to Molly Shannon and being like, yeah,

1045
01:06:14,160 --> 01:06:18,880
Speaker 1: I'm clearly like but she can't let it go. And

1046
01:06:19,600 --> 01:06:23,960
Speaker 1: I don't know, I've that relatable of like, you know,

1047
01:06:24,000 --> 01:06:27,600
Speaker 1: you're trying to get out of this toxic cycle of behavior,

1048
01:06:27,800 --> 01:06:30,440
Speaker 1: but you just like and you and also I like

1049
01:06:30,600 --> 01:06:32,440
Speaker 1: I agree with you. There is like that moment of

1050
01:06:32,480 --> 01:06:35,120
Speaker 1: Molly shan and she like she knows she's sucking her

1051
01:06:35,160 --> 01:06:37,680
Speaker 1: life up. I don't think she's just like she doesn't

1052
01:06:37,680 --> 01:06:41,160
Speaker 1: think that, but it's like she cannot get there, she

1053
01:06:41,240 --> 01:06:45,280
Speaker 1: can't let it go. And I don't know, like it's

1054
01:06:45,360 --> 01:06:49,360
Speaker 1: it's it's an extreme example, but I there's a part

1055
01:06:49,360 --> 01:06:54,080
Speaker 1: of me that's like, yeah, I get it, you know.

1056
01:06:54,200 --> 01:06:56,120
Speaker 1: I don't think it's bad. I don't think it's bad writing.

1057
01:06:56,680 --> 01:06:59,439
Speaker 1: But like I I and I see what you're saying.

1058
01:06:59,480 --> 01:07:02,120
Speaker 1: I just I don't know, Yeah, it's it's there's moments

1059
01:07:02,120 --> 01:07:04,160
Speaker 1: where I'm like Cassie's like more of a symbol than

1060
01:07:04,200 --> 01:07:08,960
Speaker 1: a character to me at different points where like she

1061
01:07:09,200 --> 01:07:12,360
Speaker 1: is this like symbol of like trying to break past

1062
01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:15,600
Speaker 1: this traumatic event and trying to hold people accountable and

1063
01:07:15,640 --> 01:07:18,920
Speaker 1: it's too much for one person. It's impossible, it's already

1064
01:07:19,000 --> 01:07:23,880
Speaker 1: killed one person, and it's I don't know, like I

1065
01:07:24,960 --> 01:07:26,760
Speaker 1: this is, I don't know what this is for the movie,

1066
01:07:26,800 --> 01:07:28,240
Speaker 1: but I like don't even really think of her as

1067
01:07:28,240 --> 01:07:32,240
Speaker 1: a character as much as like this central symbol for

1068
01:07:32,840 --> 01:07:36,680
Speaker 1: the harmful effect that this is and like the precedent

1069
01:07:36,720 --> 01:07:39,280
Speaker 1: and like what had me just like funked up for

1070
01:07:39,440 --> 01:07:42,120
Speaker 1: days after seeing this movie the first time was like

1071
01:07:43,240 --> 01:07:47,480
Speaker 1: for Nina, right of of like the only way she

1072
01:07:47,640 --> 01:07:51,160
Speaker 1: got justice is to have a friend willing to give

1073
01:07:51,280 --> 01:07:54,680
Speaker 1: up years of her life and die, and it still

1074
01:07:54,840 --> 01:07:59,800
Speaker 1: wasn't enough. You know. It's just like so sad and

1075
01:08:00,120 --> 01:08:06,000
Speaker 1: so frustrating and and not completely untrue. And yeah, so

1076
01:08:06,120 --> 01:08:08,400
Speaker 1: I don't know, I feel like I I think of

1077
01:08:08,480 --> 01:08:11,080
Speaker 1: Cassie almost as like this like symbol of like the

1078
01:08:11,120 --> 01:08:16,320
Speaker 1: impossibility of these of these situations for people, right, Yeah,

1079
01:08:16,600 --> 01:08:20,439
Speaker 1: I see that, Yeah, definitely, Yeah. I think I think

1080
01:08:20,479 --> 01:08:25,000
Speaker 1: also she had been described, you know again referring back

1081
01:08:25,000 --> 01:08:28,120
Speaker 1: to probably and interview something that I some meta dad

1082
01:08:28,160 --> 01:08:31,080
Speaker 1: on the show or whatever like that she kind of

1083
01:08:31,120 --> 01:08:34,439
Speaker 1: had already like her life had already been over by

1084
01:08:34,520 --> 01:08:36,800
Speaker 1: that event. And I think that I wonder like if

1085
01:08:37,960 --> 01:08:40,080
Speaker 1: it's kind of like the way that people, you know,

1086
01:08:40,120 --> 01:08:42,320
Speaker 1: when I mean the whole movie, right, it's called Promising

1087
01:08:42,360 --> 01:08:45,120
Speaker 1: young Woman, because I guess it's a play on you know, well,

1088
01:08:45,120 --> 01:08:47,960
Speaker 1: he's a promising young man. Why ruined his life? And

1089
01:08:48,040 --> 01:08:51,120
Speaker 1: it's like always, oh, well, life has already been ruined?

1090
01:08:51,120 --> 01:08:54,000
Speaker 1: Why didn't we care about that? So I feel like maybe,

1091
01:08:54,439 --> 01:08:56,760
Speaker 1: you know, I kind of mapped that concept onto her.

1092
01:08:56,840 --> 01:09:00,640
Speaker 1: It's like her life has been ruined, and it's not

1093
01:09:00,720 --> 01:09:04,479
Speaker 1: that she's ruining it. It's that he ruined her life

1094
01:09:04,520 --> 01:09:08,320
Speaker 1: and Nina's life obviously, and so then this is the

1095
01:09:08,400 --> 01:09:12,200
Speaker 1: result of that. Um so, you know, and it's it's

1096
01:09:12,400 --> 01:09:15,439
Speaker 1: obviously just awful thinking about it if you're thinking, like

1097
01:09:16,000 --> 01:09:18,800
Speaker 1: what would she have been, right, Like, think of the

1098
01:09:18,840 --> 01:09:21,559
Speaker 1: possibilities if she had if this hadn't if he hadn't

1099
01:09:21,560 --> 01:09:24,280
Speaker 1: done that, and then she had become a doctor and

1100
01:09:24,280 --> 01:09:26,559
Speaker 1: saved a bunch of other people's lives, you know. So

1101
01:09:26,600 --> 01:09:28,679
Speaker 1: I think that's kind of reminded me of like whenever

1102
01:09:28,720 --> 01:09:31,640
Speaker 1: we talk about like I mean not to bring it

1103
01:09:31,680 --> 01:09:34,120
Speaker 1: back to literally something too close to home, but like

1104
01:09:34,720 --> 01:09:38,760
Speaker 1: when people complain about, oh, my favorite dude actor or

1105
01:09:38,760 --> 01:09:40,680
Speaker 1: a comedian or whatever, and now I'm not going to

1106
01:09:40,720 --> 01:09:43,599
Speaker 1: get to see his movies anymore because we're canceling him,

1107
01:09:43,600 --> 01:09:47,120
Speaker 1: And it's like, well, what about the literal like several

1108
01:09:47,400 --> 01:09:51,080
Speaker 1: creative women typically whose lives he ruined, like we didn't

1109
01:09:51,080 --> 01:09:53,760
Speaker 1: get to see their work or whatever, Right, so that's

1110
01:09:53,800 --> 01:09:57,080
Speaker 1: already been sacrificed, apparently, and now we only worry about

1111
01:09:57,200 --> 01:10:00,880
Speaker 1: his future work. But I guess that's sort of like, yeah,

1112
01:10:00,920 --> 01:10:02,800
Speaker 1: she was a she was a symbol in it. It

1113
01:10:02,840 --> 01:10:05,639
Speaker 1: was almost like she wasn't she didn't get to live

1114
01:10:05,760 --> 01:10:09,760
Speaker 1: the character's life because that was already over. Mm hmm. Yeah.

1115
01:10:10,439 --> 01:10:15,280
Speaker 1: It reminded me this is like the like worst observation

1116
01:10:15,320 --> 01:10:18,719
Speaker 1: of my life, especially after Sarah. That was like so

1117
01:10:18,760 --> 01:10:22,120
Speaker 1: well put. And but I I the way I saw

1118
01:10:22,200 --> 01:10:25,000
Speaker 1: this movie ending originally, just as I was watching it

1119
01:10:25,080 --> 01:10:27,920
Speaker 1: unfold and before the second act, fucker he started going

1120
01:10:28,000 --> 01:10:31,200
Speaker 1: and You're like, oh no, I'm hurting this my oh no,

1121
01:10:31,320 --> 01:10:35,640
Speaker 1: my body. Um was I thought it was kind of

1122
01:10:35,640 --> 01:10:38,400
Speaker 1: good to go the way of Teeth, which is one

1123
01:10:38,479 --> 01:10:42,400
Speaker 1: of my favorite vigilante justice movies ever. And at the

1124
01:10:42,600 --> 01:10:46,040
Speaker 1: end of Teeth spoiler alert, everyone should go watch Teeth

1125
01:10:47,080 --> 01:10:51,360
Speaker 1: that you know, like she you know, the the the

1126
01:10:51,439 --> 01:10:56,400
Speaker 1: girl with teeth in her vagina. Um, she does not win,

1127
01:10:56,800 --> 01:11:00,639
Speaker 1: per se, right, but she does survive and she goes

1128
01:11:00,760 --> 01:11:02,720
Speaker 1: on to say, I'm going to enact that. I'm going

1129
01:11:02,760 --> 01:11:06,599
Speaker 1: to continue this vigilante of vagina crime that I've had going.

1130
01:11:06,680 --> 01:11:09,840
Speaker 1: And like it's not it's a very imperfect outcome. It's

1131
01:11:09,840 --> 01:11:12,360
Speaker 1: not like she got what she wanted, but she still is,

1132
01:11:12,520 --> 01:11:15,000
Speaker 1: you know, she has this mission and that's kind of

1133
01:11:15,000 --> 01:11:19,240
Speaker 1: what I saw happening for Cassie and throwing a wrench

1134
01:11:19,280 --> 01:11:24,120
Speaker 1: into that in like very sudden realism was like fuck,

1135
01:11:24,360 --> 01:11:27,840
Speaker 1: I mean, it's it. I don't even know, like at

1136
01:11:27,920 --> 01:11:31,400
Speaker 1: what point I'll be like I've fully processed that filmmaking choice,

1137
01:11:31,720 --> 01:11:35,200
Speaker 1: Like it's it's a lot, but but I'm yeah, that

1138
01:11:35,200 --> 01:11:38,360
Speaker 1: that level of realism. And then they really I mean,

1139
01:11:39,120 --> 01:11:41,960
Speaker 1: Emerald Finnell makes you fucking sit with it. They light

1140
01:11:42,000 --> 01:11:44,760
Speaker 1: her on fire and you see this character that you've

1141
01:11:44,800 --> 01:11:49,479
Speaker 1: built this emotional connection to to like, oh, she was

1142
01:11:49,520 --> 01:11:51,599
Speaker 1: so close to getting some of you know, maybe making

1143
01:11:51,640 --> 01:11:54,320
Speaker 1: some progress in her life, and like maybe this is

1144
01:11:54,360 --> 01:11:56,880
Speaker 1: the last big thing she needs to do and then

1145
01:11:56,920 --> 01:12:00,360
Speaker 1: she can move forward. But but like you were just saying, sire,

1146
01:12:00,479 --> 01:12:03,840
Speaker 1: it's it's there should be space made for for people

1147
01:12:03,920 --> 01:12:06,880
Speaker 1: who who do not get to have that triumphant other

1148
01:12:06,920 --> 01:12:10,880
Speaker 1: side of the story, because there's many people that, through

1149
01:12:11,240 --> 01:12:14,240
Speaker 1: all these different factors, don't get to have that. And

1150
01:12:14,240 --> 01:12:17,160
Speaker 1: then I became a doctor and justice was served, Like

1151
01:12:17,439 --> 01:12:20,400
Speaker 1: that is just not the norm, Like even in I

1152
01:12:20,439 --> 01:12:21,840
Speaker 1: find it, like, I mean, I know they have to

1153
01:12:21,840 --> 01:12:23,880
Speaker 1: wrap up the movie, but a'l getting arrested. I'm like

1154
01:12:23,960 --> 01:12:26,439
Speaker 1: so fucking what, what is actually going to happen to

1155
01:12:26,479 --> 01:12:29,679
Speaker 1: this person? Like, if this is commentary on the brock

1156
01:12:29,720 --> 01:12:32,920
Speaker 1: Turner case, nothing is going to happen to him. If

1157
01:12:32,960 --> 01:12:35,960
Speaker 1: it's commentary on the Bret Kavanaugh case, nothing is going

1158
01:12:36,000 --> 01:12:40,240
Speaker 1: to happen to him. But that's another movie, right, Like

1159
01:12:40,400 --> 01:12:44,920
Speaker 1: that's another series, that's another thing, But it's I don't

1160
01:12:44,920 --> 01:12:49,519
Speaker 1: even know what my point was teeth two things. I

1161
01:12:49,840 --> 01:12:52,800
Speaker 1: just spent the last thirty seconds trying to figure out

1162
01:12:52,960 --> 01:12:59,479
Speaker 1: if vigilante anagrams to vagina something at all, because you

1163
01:12:59,520 --> 01:13:03,000
Speaker 1: did say, like vagina vigilante instead of listening to my

1164
01:13:03,200 --> 01:13:08,200
Speaker 1: incredible Point's interesting, Jamie, I can multitask? I can? I can?

1165
01:13:08,880 --> 01:13:12,120
Speaker 1: I can anagram plus anything? I does it come out

1166
01:13:12,160 --> 01:13:15,240
Speaker 1: to anything? It's it's not quite there's a there's an

1167
01:13:15,320 --> 01:13:18,040
Speaker 1: extra A that we need, but it's let me. I'll

1168
01:13:18,120 --> 01:13:22,120
Speaker 1: keep working on it. Um. The other thing is I

1169
01:13:22,200 --> 01:13:27,240
Speaker 1: read on our favorite scholarly journal Wikipedia that Emerald Finelle

1170
01:13:27,640 --> 01:13:31,720
Speaker 1: originally planned to have the ending of the movie be

1171
01:13:32,439 --> 01:13:37,320
Speaker 1: that Cassie's body, her body is disposed of and she's burned,

1172
01:13:37,960 --> 01:13:42,760
Speaker 1: and that's how the movie ends without any justice being

1173
01:13:42,760 --> 01:13:46,559
Speaker 1: served in terms of al Monroe getting arrested, but that

1174
01:13:46,680 --> 01:13:51,000
Speaker 1: the investors in the film did not want that bleak

1175
01:13:51,040 --> 01:13:55,360
Speaker 1: of an ending um, so she rewrote it to include

1176
01:13:56,120 --> 01:13:58,720
Speaker 1: um the ending that we get. The other ending she

1177
01:13:58,760 --> 01:14:03,360
Speaker 1: had considered was where apparently Cassie does not die, she

1178
01:14:03,520 --> 01:14:07,559
Speaker 1: appears at the wedding and then kills It's just as

1179
01:14:07,680 --> 01:14:16,320
Speaker 1: responsible men so Al Monroe, whoever Ryan Max Greenfield's character.

1180
01:14:16,760 --> 01:14:19,400
Speaker 1: I mean that that would have been the teeth ending, right, Like,

1181
01:14:19,479 --> 01:14:22,360
Speaker 1: that's that's ante ending that you're expecting. I mean, I

1182
01:14:22,600 --> 01:14:24,960
Speaker 1: do kind of like that she subverted that, and I

1183
01:14:25,000 --> 01:14:27,639
Speaker 1: also appreciate that it wasn't the worst thing she could

1184
01:14:27,680 --> 01:14:31,120
Speaker 1: think of. And the reason that she didn't go with

1185
01:14:31,160 --> 01:14:34,320
Speaker 1: that ending of like her just like vigilante killing everyone,

1186
01:14:34,960 --> 01:14:39,240
Speaker 1: was that Emerald Fanelle deemed it unrealistic, which goes back

1187
01:14:39,280 --> 01:14:41,639
Speaker 1: to what we've been talking about, is that it isn't

1188
01:14:41,840 --> 01:14:45,760
Speaker 1: super realistic and the ending that does play out is

1189
01:14:45,840 --> 01:14:50,599
Speaker 1: more aligned with what tends to happen in real life.

1190
01:14:51,000 --> 01:14:54,080
Speaker 1: A fun fact that I found that it's like so dorky,

1191
01:14:54,160 --> 01:14:59,160
Speaker 1: but I was like, interesting, Cassie, is that is a

1192
01:14:59,320 --> 01:15:03,879
Speaker 1: reference to like a Greek myth um. It's a reference

1193
01:15:03,880 --> 01:15:08,479
Speaker 1: to Cassandra, who is the truth teller prophet has who

1194
01:15:08,600 --> 01:15:14,280
Speaker 1: was never believed, And so it turns out that was

1195
01:15:14,320 --> 01:15:17,040
Speaker 1: a very deliberate name choice, and I was like, damn,

1196
01:15:17,439 --> 01:15:21,639
Speaker 1: she's good. Emerald Faneal went to a library. I really

1197
01:15:21,960 --> 01:15:26,719
Speaker 1: did her wikipedias in that knowledge. Is there anything else

1198
01:15:26,800 --> 01:15:32,560
Speaker 1: anyone else wanted to touch on? Um? I'm pretty emotionally exhausted,

1199
01:15:32,680 --> 01:15:37,679
Speaker 1: So I'm that's a yeah. Yeah, we covered all covered

1200
01:15:37,680 --> 01:15:39,679
Speaker 1: all of it, solved all of it. I think, Yeah,

1201
01:15:39,720 --> 01:15:45,040
Speaker 1: I think we really fixed rape culture today. Yeah, we

1202
01:15:45,120 --> 01:15:52,080
Speaker 1: did it. Your move promising to just kidding? Clease the

1203
01:15:52,160 --> 01:15:55,400
Speaker 1: ten part Amazon series, right, yeah, Like, let's make this

1204
01:15:55,880 --> 01:15:59,679
Speaker 1: uh more painful for everybody. I'm very glad this movie exists,

1205
01:16:00,000 --> 01:16:02,320
Speaker 1: but I don't want to see it again. Um, but

1206
01:16:02,400 --> 01:16:05,800
Speaker 1: does it pass the Bechdel test? It does? There are

1207
01:16:06,960 --> 01:16:09,320
Speaker 1: for It's just like, is it even relevant for this movie?

1208
01:16:09,479 --> 01:16:14,080
Speaker 1: But it does. Cassie talks to Gail, her mom, Nina's mom.

1209
01:16:14,120 --> 01:16:17,240
Speaker 1: As far as our nipple scale, where we rate the

1210
01:16:17,240 --> 01:16:22,240
Speaker 1: movie zero to five nipples based on an examination of

1211
01:16:22,360 --> 01:16:31,320
Speaker 1: intersectional feminism, Okay, I guess I'll give this four nipples

1212
01:16:32,160 --> 01:16:36,360
Speaker 1: because I agree it's I'm glad this movie exists. I

1213
01:16:36,439 --> 01:16:39,719
Speaker 1: do think it is a net positive. I think it's

1214
01:16:40,439 --> 01:16:45,360
Speaker 1: and I'm glad more movies are tackling this issue of

1215
01:16:45,520 --> 01:16:51,000
Speaker 1: just this kind of societal ill of rape culture, victim blaming. UM.

1216
01:16:51,000 --> 01:16:53,160
Speaker 1: This movie has a very clear agenda, and I think

1217
01:16:53,240 --> 01:16:57,480
Speaker 1: that for the most part, it handled it all pretty effectively,

1218
01:16:58,400 --> 01:17:01,160
Speaker 1: especially because it's it's handled a way that it is

1219
01:17:01,200 --> 01:17:06,479
Speaker 1: like palatable for a wide audience, which it shouldn't have

1220
01:17:06,600 --> 01:17:11,040
Speaker 1: to be. Movies like about this shouldn't have to be palatable,

1221
01:17:11,160 --> 01:17:14,240
Speaker 1: but it does help. And there are some movies that

1222
01:17:14,640 --> 01:17:18,040
Speaker 1: where there was a movie I saw cited, I'll post

1223
01:17:18,080 --> 01:17:20,720
Speaker 1: it in the in the notes of the episode, but

1224
01:17:20,720 --> 01:17:23,559
Speaker 1: there there are a few movies that have in the

1225
01:17:23,600 --> 01:17:27,280
Speaker 1: past five years I explored campus rape culture, but this

1226
01:17:27,479 --> 01:17:30,240
Speaker 1: is the one that took hold. And I think that

1227
01:17:30,320 --> 01:17:32,200
Speaker 1: it does have to do with what you're saying, Gitlin,

1228
01:17:32,280 --> 01:17:36,560
Speaker 1: with like it being the most palatable star studded attempt

1229
01:17:36,720 --> 01:17:39,680
Speaker 1: to touch on this subject because I know that some

1230
01:17:39,720 --> 01:17:41,720
Speaker 1: of the synopsies I was reading for movies that have

1231
01:17:41,760 --> 01:17:44,599
Speaker 1: come out in the past year about um campus rape culture,

1232
01:17:44,720 --> 01:17:51,360
Speaker 1: we're fucking brutal. Yeah, not bad, but just brutal. So yeah,

1233
01:17:51,479 --> 01:17:56,120
Speaker 1: I think that's helpful, especially that plus it's gotten a

1234
01:17:56,120 --> 01:17:59,080
Speaker 1: lot of attention, a lot of award nominations, which means

1235
01:17:59,080 --> 01:18:02,680
Speaker 1: more people will see it. And I'm I'm glad that

1236
01:18:02,800 --> 01:18:05,080
Speaker 1: is the case, and I'm glad I saw it. But

1237
01:18:05,560 --> 01:18:09,160
Speaker 1: as I've said, I don't want to watch this movie again.

1238
01:18:09,720 --> 01:18:13,920
Speaker 1: I've seen it three times now to you know, for yeah,

1239
01:18:14,120 --> 01:18:18,280
Speaker 1: and that I filled my quota for at least ten

1240
01:18:18,680 --> 01:18:26,320
Speaker 1: to twenty years. So but even so four nipples, Um, Yeah,

1241
01:18:26,520 --> 01:18:28,880
Speaker 1: I'm gonna honestly, I'm going to skip rating this. I'm

1242
01:18:28,920 --> 01:18:31,720
Speaker 1: not going to read it because I still don't I

1243
01:18:31,760 --> 01:18:35,519
Speaker 1: feel like I'm still processing it. But I will I

1244
01:18:35,560 --> 01:18:38,680
Speaker 1: will say that I am very glad this movie exists.

1245
01:18:38,880 --> 01:18:41,400
Speaker 1: I think it is like a big step forward in

1246
01:18:41,840 --> 01:18:45,120
Speaker 1: having this discussion in the mainstream. I don't agree with

1247
01:18:45,160 --> 01:18:48,280
Speaker 1: every choice made. We didn't even have time or the

1248
01:18:48,280 --> 01:18:51,920
Speaker 1: emotional energy to get into like the hyper hyper hyper specifics.

1249
01:18:52,479 --> 01:18:54,360
Speaker 1: But I also think that there's a lot of pressure

1250
01:18:54,400 --> 01:18:56,840
Speaker 1: on movies like these to be perfect and to have

1251
01:18:56,880 --> 01:18:59,559
Speaker 1: a message that is palatable to everybody, to have a

1252
01:18:59,600 --> 01:19:03,360
Speaker 1: message that is like meaningful to men who may display

1253
01:19:03,400 --> 01:19:06,000
Speaker 1: these behaviors and also to people who have been on

1254
01:19:06,040 --> 01:19:07,960
Speaker 1: the receiving end of them, Like it is such a

1255
01:19:08,040 --> 01:19:11,719
Speaker 1: huge burdens not the right. It's such a huge topic

1256
01:19:11,800 --> 01:19:15,000
Speaker 1: to take on as a filmmaker and such a huge

1257
01:19:15,040 --> 01:19:17,360
Speaker 1: topic to even get something like this made. And I

1258
01:19:17,360 --> 01:19:19,840
Speaker 1: think that this does kind of fall and and this

1259
01:19:19,920 --> 01:19:23,559
Speaker 1: is not a slam on Emerald Vanilla in any way.

1260
01:19:23,640 --> 01:19:26,519
Speaker 1: She's clearly very talented, but there is, like you know,

1261
01:19:26,560 --> 01:19:31,160
Speaker 1: she we see many or most directors that kind of

1262
01:19:31,200 --> 01:19:36,120
Speaker 1: pop out who are women recently are already established white actresses. Um.

1263
01:19:36,200 --> 01:19:40,240
Speaker 1: And that is that's not fortunately is not exclusively the case,

1264
01:19:40,280 --> 01:19:43,000
Speaker 1: but it is a clear kind of trend of like

1265
01:19:43,320 --> 01:19:45,800
Speaker 1: you have to have already been a successful blonde woman

1266
01:19:45,840 --> 01:19:48,840
Speaker 1: for a decade and then you can be creative, let

1267
01:19:48,880 --> 01:19:52,200
Speaker 1: you direct a movie. It's not the fault of the women,

1268
01:19:52,280 --> 01:19:56,160
Speaker 1: but it bums me the funk out. Um. That's neither

1269
01:19:56,160 --> 01:19:58,160
Speaker 1: here nor there. I'm very glad this movie exists. I

1270
01:19:58,160 --> 01:20:01,160
Speaker 1: think it like challenges a lot of things that are

1271
01:20:01,320 --> 01:20:05,680
Speaker 1: are not challenged at all. And I hope that we

1272
01:20:05,800 --> 01:20:09,519
Speaker 1: can see different takes on this topic. I hope that

1273
01:20:09,560 --> 01:20:13,240
Speaker 1: this is not the rape culture movie. It shouldn't be.

1274
01:20:13,280 --> 01:20:17,640
Speaker 1: There's so many different perspectives and communities and you know,

1275
01:20:17,920 --> 01:20:20,200
Speaker 1: all of that ship It's just sub I mean, this

1276
01:20:20,280 --> 01:20:23,400
Speaker 1: is like a campus rape movie with a particular view.

1277
01:20:23,439 --> 01:20:26,080
Speaker 1: This shouldn't even be the only campus rape movie, you know,

1278
01:20:26,200 --> 01:20:27,960
Speaker 1: and that makes me sad to say out loud too.

1279
01:20:28,040 --> 01:20:32,280
Speaker 1: But I hope, I hope that this movie's success makes

1280
01:20:32,400 --> 01:20:35,680
Speaker 1: room for, like Blaze of the Trail, for other filmmakers

1281
01:20:35,680 --> 01:20:38,640
Speaker 1: to explore similar themes and and be able to do

1282
01:20:38,680 --> 01:20:41,080
Speaker 1: it their way in the way. It seems like Emerald

1283
01:20:41,120 --> 01:20:43,759
Speaker 1: Faneal really did it her way here, which is amazing.

1284
01:20:44,560 --> 01:20:49,880
Speaker 1: So I am not granting nipples at all today and

1285
01:20:50,080 --> 01:20:58,200
Speaker 1: I and the movie is good. Yes, uh Sira final

1286
01:20:58,280 --> 01:21:03,400
Speaker 1: thoughts your you can award nipples or also pass you know,

1287
01:21:03,640 --> 01:21:06,400
Speaker 1: pass on that up to you, because yeah, I mean,

1288
01:21:06,400 --> 01:21:09,880
Speaker 1: I think also good for nipples is a good range

1289
01:21:09,960 --> 01:21:12,960
Speaker 1: for me as well for this movie at large. And

1290
01:21:13,000 --> 01:21:16,360
Speaker 1: I think, um, I've also was thinking about it in

1291
01:21:16,520 --> 01:21:20,880
Speaker 1: the sense of like sort of how rom coms, Like

1292
01:21:20,920 --> 01:21:22,680
Speaker 1: I had a lot of rom com tropes in it.

1293
01:21:22,800 --> 01:21:25,160
Speaker 1: You know, we're talking about like the kind of stock

1294
01:21:25,240 --> 01:21:27,360
Speaker 1: best friend and then you know, and then it flips

1295
01:21:27,400 --> 01:21:31,400
Speaker 1: it on its head of course, with like Ryan esthetically yes, yes,

1296
01:21:31,479 --> 01:21:36,360
Speaker 1: totally music soundtrack. Yeah, the way they just did all

1297
01:21:36,479 --> 01:21:38,880
Speaker 1: the like glances and they look up at each other

1298
01:21:38,920 --> 01:21:41,080
Speaker 1: and all these things. So yeah, I think it was

1299
01:21:41,439 --> 01:21:44,519
Speaker 1: I that was another thing that I think resonated with

1300
01:21:44,560 --> 01:21:48,040
Speaker 1: me as somebody who feels betrayed by all rom coms.

1301
01:21:48,640 --> 01:21:51,679
Speaker 1: Why were they so problematic? But I still like them,

1302
01:21:51,720 --> 01:21:53,840
Speaker 1: but they're always I can't watch them again because they

1303
01:21:53,920 --> 01:21:57,320
Speaker 1: have problems. Um. So I think that kind of was

1304
01:21:57,360 --> 01:22:00,479
Speaker 1: another thing that that I thought was interesting thing about it.

1305
01:22:00,520 --> 01:22:03,559
Speaker 1: Liked about it. Um Yeah, but yeah, I agree, there's like,

1306
01:22:04,720 --> 01:22:07,599
Speaker 1: definitely it feels like sometimes with these topics, these hea

1307
01:22:07,680 --> 01:22:11,080
Speaker 1: your movies, like it's like they almost can only tackle

1308
01:22:11,160 --> 01:22:13,120
Speaker 1: one thing at once, Like we're babies and we have

1309
01:22:13,160 --> 01:22:17,160
Speaker 1: to only do one thing, so they have to Yeah,

1310
01:22:17,200 --> 01:22:19,000
Speaker 1: we can only do this, and it has to be

1311
01:22:19,040 --> 01:22:21,519
Speaker 1: this kind of person with this kind of you know thing,

1312
01:22:21,600 --> 01:22:25,639
Speaker 1: and you know, Okay, so hopefully we'll move past that soon.

1313
01:22:25,760 --> 01:22:30,519
Speaker 1: But but yeah, similar feelings for sure. Yeah, And I

1314
01:22:30,880 --> 01:22:35,800
Speaker 1: mean we've had a really interesting discussion. I'm glad that

1315
01:22:35,840 --> 01:22:39,280
Speaker 1: there are movies like this more and more that generate

1316
01:22:39,479 --> 01:22:44,559
Speaker 1: these deep, thoughtful, amazing discussion. Wow, look at us, we're

1317
01:22:44,720 --> 01:22:52,080
Speaker 1: so amazing, we're so smart. But no, like, I appreciate

1318
01:22:52,120 --> 01:22:55,679
Speaker 1: that this movie challenged me in the ways that it did,

1319
01:22:55,960 --> 01:23:01,240
Speaker 1: so kudos to the movie for that. Sierra, thank you

1320
01:23:01,439 --> 01:23:04,680
Speaker 1: so much for joining us in this discussion. Thank you

1321
01:23:04,760 --> 01:23:08,040
Speaker 1: for having me. Oh so you know we dove right in,

1322
01:23:08,120 --> 01:23:11,320
Speaker 1: you know. So I'm glad. I feel very honored to

1323
01:23:11,360 --> 01:23:14,439
Speaker 1: be here. Yeah, I feel like, let's like, um for

1324
01:23:14,479 --> 01:23:19,440
Speaker 1: a fun decompress. How how have you been house? How things?

1325
01:23:20,840 --> 01:23:25,160
Speaker 1: You know? Yeah, everything's light and fun. Um, so you

1326
01:23:25,240 --> 01:23:27,160
Speaker 1: got that side of me. Um, But yes, for sure,

1327
01:23:27,200 --> 01:23:29,720
Speaker 1: you know, I'll come back for a for a light

1328
01:23:29,800 --> 01:23:32,160
Speaker 1: one some day. But it was good to kind of

1329
01:23:32,200 --> 01:23:35,840
Speaker 1: have this conversation because this movie has kind of been

1330
01:23:35,880 --> 01:23:38,600
Speaker 1: you know, it's a quarantine time. I only got to

1331
01:23:38,600 --> 01:23:41,439
Speaker 1: see it in my lonesome and like stew on it

1332
01:23:41,479 --> 01:23:43,559
Speaker 1: in my own head and maybe read a few articles.

1333
01:23:43,640 --> 01:23:46,439
Speaker 1: But it's good to talk it over with real humans

1334
01:23:46,680 --> 01:23:50,200
Speaker 1: who are also very thoughtful about it. And um, even

1335
01:23:50,240 --> 01:23:53,479
Speaker 1: though it is very heavy and probably will you know,

1336
01:23:53,680 --> 01:23:56,240
Speaker 1: require some I have a little of a little white

1337
01:23:56,240 --> 01:23:58,960
Speaker 1: tea after this, you know, too little self care. Yeah,

1338
01:23:59,000 --> 01:24:02,439
Speaker 1: I'm going to take a bath. Yeah, please take take

1339
01:24:02,479 --> 01:24:07,000
Speaker 1: the take then night yeah, yeah, you guys, let's kick

1340
01:24:07,080 --> 01:24:11,840
Speaker 1: up your feet. Yeah, there you go. Thank you so much.

1341
01:24:11,840 --> 01:24:14,240
Speaker 1: And where where can we where can we find you online?

1342
01:24:14,280 --> 01:24:16,840
Speaker 1: Where can our followers come and come and find you?

1343
01:24:16,960 --> 01:24:19,720
Speaker 1: It's actually really scary. Yeah what where can they duct me?

1344
01:24:21,720 --> 01:24:25,080
Speaker 1: Please do not go and find her, but to follow

1345
01:24:25,680 --> 01:24:29,439
Speaker 1: on the on the yeah, in the digital sense. Um, yeah, thanks.

1346
01:24:29,479 --> 01:24:34,680
Speaker 1: I am on Instagram at Sierra Coto s I E

1347
01:24:34,880 --> 01:24:38,240
Speaker 1: R R A K A t O W Twitter, same thing,

1348
01:24:38,520 --> 01:24:43,240
Speaker 1: that's just my name. And I have a podcast called

1349
01:24:43,439 --> 01:24:48,000
Speaker 1: stay pod Sitive that I have kind of lapsed out

1350
01:24:48,040 --> 01:24:50,839
Speaker 1: a little bit, but you know it exists. There are episodes.

1351
01:24:50,920 --> 01:24:53,360
Speaker 1: Would love to have you both on someday if you

1352
01:24:53,400 --> 01:24:55,559
Speaker 1: would be so open to it. It's you know, it's

1353
01:24:55,680 --> 01:24:59,840
Speaker 1: very um, it's more light, I would say, then promise

1354
01:25:00,040 --> 01:25:03,840
Speaker 1: young woman. But but you know, you know, we talk

1355
01:25:03,920 --> 01:25:09,120
Speaker 1: about just how people keep their heads up in tougher time.

1356
01:25:09,200 --> 01:25:13,640
Speaker 1: Stuff like that. Um. And I am on I'm on

1357
01:25:13,680 --> 01:25:17,599
Speaker 1: TikTok same name as well. I mean I don't do

1358
01:25:17,640 --> 01:25:23,320
Speaker 1: that much, but I love to watch them. That's a videos. Um. Yeah,

1359
01:25:23,439 --> 01:25:27,200
Speaker 1: all that those are the main things. Excellent. Thank you

1360
01:25:27,320 --> 01:25:30,120
Speaker 1: Thank you again for coming on, comeback anytime, you know,

1361
01:25:30,120 --> 01:25:32,240
Speaker 1: if there's a Christmas movie, for example, that you want

1362
01:25:32,280 --> 01:25:36,600
Speaker 1: to talk to us about four hours where four for

1363
01:25:36,840 --> 01:25:41,479
Speaker 1: our podcast, Let's do it? Hell yeah. Um. You can

1364
01:25:41,720 --> 01:25:45,160
Speaker 1: follow us on Twitter and Instagram at pectel Cast. You

1365
01:25:45,200 --> 01:25:50,759
Speaker 1: can check out our Matreon at patreon dot com slash

1366
01:25:50,920 --> 01:25:54,080
Speaker 1: s pectel Cast, which is five dollars a month. It

1367
01:25:54,120 --> 01:25:58,040
Speaker 1: gets you two bonus episodes every month, plus access to

1368
01:25:58,080 --> 01:26:02,160
Speaker 1: the entire back catalog. You know, take a bath, take

1369
01:26:02,160 --> 01:26:04,360
Speaker 1: a nap, you're gonna be You're gonna be fine, drink

1370
01:26:04,360 --> 01:26:09,479
Speaker 1: a tea, you know, and and really practice self care

1371
01:26:10,400 --> 01:26:14,680
Speaker 1: now and always I want. I watched um, the first

1372
01:26:14,800 --> 01:26:17,519
Speaker 1: half hour of My Big Fat Greek Wedding after finishing

1373
01:26:17,560 --> 01:26:19,640
Speaker 1: Promising Young Woman last night because I'm like, we just

1374
01:26:19,720 --> 01:26:25,520
Speaker 1: need a palate lenser, which yeah, it's good, Yeah indeed, Okay,

1375
01:26:25,560 --> 01:26:26,160
Speaker 1: bye bye