WEBVTT - 1-800-FLOWERS.COM Thrived Amid Need For Human Connection 0:00:01.360 --> 0:00:04.120 Welcome to the Bloomberg Markets Podcast. I'm Paul Sweeney, along 0:00:04.120 --> 0:00:06.200 with my co host of Bonnie Quinn. Every business day 0:00:06.240 --> 0:00:10.360 we bring you interviews from ceo, market pros, and Bloomberg experts, 0:00:10.400 --> 0:00:13.600 along with essential market moving news. Find the Bloomberg Markets 0:00:13.600 --> 0:00:17.000 Podcast on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts, 0:00:17.000 --> 0:00:20.960 and on Bloomberg dot com. Alright, it is five days 0:00:21.040 --> 0:00:25.520 and counting to Valentine's Day. Crunch time for gift givers. 0:00:25.600 --> 0:00:28.000 Coming up, we have Chris McMahon. He is the president's 0:00:28.000 --> 0:00:30.600 CEO of one eight hundred flowers dot com. That is 0:00:30.640 --> 0:00:35.199 a NASTAC listed stock uh F l w S. I'm 0:00:35.240 --> 0:00:37.720 looking at the stock up a hundred and twenty one 0:00:38.280 --> 0:00:41.559 on a trailing twelve month basis, So up, the business 0:00:41.640 --> 0:00:43.960 of selling flowers and gifts seems to be in good shape. 0:00:44.000 --> 0:00:45.640 Let's check in with Chris. Chris, thanks so much for 0:00:45.720 --> 0:00:49.519 joining us here again five days and counting to Valentine's Day. 0:00:49.560 --> 0:00:53.120 Talk to us about your business and Valentine's Day. How 0:00:53.120 --> 0:00:56.200 big is that? So? Valentine's Day is a very important 0:00:56.200 --> 0:00:58.880 part about business, and I appreciate you asking and having 0:00:58.880 --> 0:01:01.840 me on the show. The time of year, it's uh, 0:01:01.920 --> 0:01:05.160 it's actually our third busiest holiday because of our expansion 0:01:05.160 --> 0:01:08.399 into the golome food category with brands like Harry and David, 0:01:08.959 --> 0:01:14.080 or most recent acquisition into personalized products with personalization mall 0:01:14.200 --> 0:01:18.760 dot com, the Flower brand, which is all about Valentine's Day. 0:01:18.800 --> 0:01:21.200 This really makes you know. The other brands make the 0:01:21.360 --> 0:01:25.160 holiday season the busiest season for us, Mother's Day second, 0:01:25.240 --> 0:01:28.920 Valentine's third. But more importantly, this is so important for 0:01:28.920 --> 0:01:31.360 our customers and it's so important for them at this 0:01:31.400 --> 0:01:33.840 point in time to really reach out and express themselves 0:01:33.880 --> 0:01:37.280 to each other. So what tell us what kinds of 0:01:37.280 --> 0:01:39.880 flowers people tend to ask for? Is it all roses 0:01:39.920 --> 0:01:42.440 around this time year? Oh? Funny, of course, it is 0:01:42.760 --> 0:01:46.520 also about twenty two million stems this year of flowers, 0:01:46.959 --> 0:01:49.600 fourteen million of those will be roses, not all the 0:01:49.720 --> 0:01:52.440 roses of all different colors. But when you really want 0:01:52.480 --> 0:01:55.480 to say I love you and really express yourself, nothing 0:01:55.480 --> 0:01:59.120 does it like roses, Just on that I need to 0:01:59.120 --> 0:02:01.480 know what I mean at all red flowers? And how 0:02:01.480 --> 0:02:05.320 do you how do you tailor? You know, if you 0:02:05.360 --> 0:02:07.640 think demand is going to be like mostly red flowers, 0:02:07.680 --> 0:02:10.320 how do you tailor your orders? For that. We look 0:02:10.360 --> 0:02:13.600 all the time. We're constantly doing data analytics to understand 0:02:13.600 --> 0:02:16.840 what consumer trends are, what we sold last year, working 0:02:16.880 --> 0:02:18.880 with our growers to make sure we have the supply. 0:02:19.440 --> 0:02:22.760 And besides red, which is a coarse staple, we're seeing 0:02:22.800 --> 0:02:26.639 lots of pinks and pastel colored roses, so so it 0:02:26.720 --> 0:02:29.480 runs the gamut and people looking for something yellow roses 0:02:29.520 --> 0:02:32.280 are very comics. They really expressed friendship at this time 0:02:32.280 --> 0:02:35.639 of year and the Valentine's Day. It's not always about love, 0:02:35.680 --> 0:02:38.480 it's just recognizing the people who are important in our lives. 0:02:39.600 --> 0:02:42.440 Chris talked to us about your business and the pandemic. 0:02:42.520 --> 0:02:45.400 So many businesses we've seen I've been really really disrupted 0:02:45.400 --> 0:02:48.320 and upbended. Um tell us about how the gift giving 0:02:48.800 --> 0:02:52.640 business has kind of, you know, reacted to the world 0:02:52.639 --> 0:02:54.800 we're living in now. Yes, Paul, I think you know, 0:02:54.840 --> 0:02:57.399 as we look at how we reacted to the pandemic. 0:02:57.440 --> 0:02:59.800 When the first hit, no one knew what was exactly 0:02:59.840 --> 0:03:02.400 what is going to happen, But we saw early on 0:03:02.480 --> 0:03:06.800 from our customers that they recognized the need to maintain relationships, 0:03:06.840 --> 0:03:09.320 to build reach out and connect to the import people 0:03:09.320 --> 0:03:12.000 in their lives. And as a company whose vision is 0:03:12.040 --> 0:03:15.920 to inspire human expression, connection and celebration, we were so 0:03:16.000 --> 0:03:19.440 well positioned for that. So while many businesses have been 0:03:19.480 --> 0:03:23.560 really dramatically hampered by this pandemic, it's been a pivotabal 0:03:23.800 --> 0:03:27.560 pivotal moment for our company as we've embraced and leaned 0:03:27.600 --> 0:03:31.280 into the sentiments of the consumer to shift from offline 0:03:31.320 --> 0:03:33.880 sales to online sales that were so well positioned for 0:03:34.560 --> 0:03:38.720 the trend of nesting, where we see companies like Personalization 0:03:38.760 --> 0:03:42.040 Mall just doing really, really well. So for us, we 0:03:42.040 --> 0:03:44.640 were accelerating our revenue for the past couple of years. 0:03:44.960 --> 0:03:47.880 It's accelerated more on now as we've gone into the pandemic, 0:03:48.360 --> 0:03:51.040 and we're just so honored that customers turned to us 0:03:51.400 --> 0:03:54.480 to help us help to help them express and connect 0:03:54.520 --> 0:03:57.120 with the important people in their lives. Sure, did your 0:03:57.200 --> 0:04:01.240 growers have trouble getting enough people to pick their flowers? 0:04:01.880 --> 0:04:04.240 There were there any kind of bottlenecks like that? I 0:04:04.320 --> 0:04:08.160 think overall retail and supply chains, we've all had our challenges, 0:04:08.240 --> 0:04:10.960 but luckily we've been able to work together in partnership 0:04:10.960 --> 0:04:13.520 and really overcome those challenges, whether it's working with the 0:04:13.600 --> 0:04:16.520 growers here in the United States or in other parts 0:04:16.520 --> 0:04:19.040 of the world where some of our product comes from. 0:04:19.080 --> 0:04:22.520 So we've been able to do collaborative partnership. We've been 0:04:22.560 --> 0:04:25.159 able to overcome many of those challenges and not really 0:04:25.200 --> 0:04:28.880 be to be uh disrupted in the industry. So one 0:04:28.880 --> 0:04:33.280 eight flowers dot Com. That brand has been around uh forever, Chris. 0:04:33.320 --> 0:04:36.200 But you guys are also really diversified into simply chocolate, 0:04:36.240 --> 0:04:40.480 Sherry's berries, the popcorn factory. What's the next avenue of 0:04:40.520 --> 0:04:44.160 growth for your company? Well, again, I think well, as 0:04:44.200 --> 0:04:46.720 we look to say what we're really about, people look 0:04:46.720 --> 0:04:48.640 at this as a gifting company. But what we're really 0:04:48.680 --> 0:04:51.760 about a company to help you express and connecting to celebrate. 0:04:52.160 --> 0:04:54.440 So our most recent acquisition that we did in the 0:04:54.440 --> 0:04:57.360 midst of this pandemic, believe it or not, was a 0:04:57.560 --> 0:05:01.479 large att acquisition ever personalization all uh, and that brought 0:05:01.560 --> 0:05:03.640 us into a whole new product, Candor, because that's a 0:05:03.680 --> 0:05:07.359 trend we saw developing people looking to personalize everything with 0:05:07.839 --> 0:05:11.760 being able to put their photographs on things, personalize the message, etcetera. 0:05:12.200 --> 0:05:15.159 So we will be continuing to grow into that category 0:05:15.560 --> 0:05:17.520 and then just looking for why it else helps you 0:05:17.560 --> 0:05:20.640 to say something to someone who is important to you, 0:05:21.440 --> 0:05:24.039 whether it be something for free, whether it be something 0:05:24.080 --> 0:05:26.840 that costs five dollars like Cheryl's cookie cards, where you 0:05:26.839 --> 0:05:30.800 could send a personalized box with a single cookie, and 0:05:30.800 --> 0:05:34.080 it's just the same thinking of you. So our emission, 0:05:34.160 --> 0:05:36.679 our vision is to just keep people connecting and find 0:05:36.720 --> 0:05:38.760 more and more ways to make that easy for them. 0:05:39.360 --> 0:05:41.599 So many things on the personalization mall that I have 0:05:41.680 --> 0:05:44.520 ideas for Chris, I'll be in touch, Thank you so much. 0:05:44.920 --> 0:05:47.840 That is Chris mcan And of course if you are 0:05:48.000 --> 0:05:51.720 ordering flowers or something more personalized for any of your 0:05:51.760 --> 0:05:57.400 loved ones, to call one eight hundred flowers before Valentine's Day. 0:05:56.279 --> 0:06:00.240 We have a Secretary of State now. Is name is 0:06:00.240 --> 0:06:03.880 Anthony Lincoln, and one of the first things that he 0:06:04.080 --> 0:06:08.200 is doing is trying to end the war in Yemen. 0:06:08.360 --> 0:06:11.880 He says it's priority and that the humanitarian crisis is 0:06:11.920 --> 0:06:15.600 no longer just palatable, which it hasn't been for a 0:06:15.600 --> 0:06:18.039 long long time. So the U s planning to provoke 0:06:18.200 --> 0:06:22.280 terrorist designations on Yemen, Yemen's hoodie rebels. Let's bring in 0:06:22.320 --> 0:06:24.279 somebody who knows a lot more about this and about 0:06:24.440 --> 0:06:27.520 what Biden's foreign policy is likely to look like more broadly. 0:06:27.839 --> 0:06:30.880 Ariel Cohen is senior fellow at the Atlantic Council and 0:06:30.960 --> 0:06:34.440 from a founding principle of international market analysis. Ariel, thank 0:06:34.480 --> 0:06:38.279 you so much for joining. Obviously, Lincoln feels very strongly 0:06:38.279 --> 0:06:41.120 about Yemen, which is great because it's been ignored for many, many, 0:06:41.120 --> 0:06:45.039 many months. What happens here does he be? Is he 0:06:45.120 --> 0:06:47.680 successful in trying to end Yemen's war? Or is this 0:06:47.680 --> 0:06:49.560 the case of the U. S Getting involved where it 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:57.839 shouldn't um. The Yemen war is a humanitarian disaster. What 0:06:58.240 --> 0:07:02.360 is important to remember is that Iran is projecting power 0:07:02.440 --> 0:07:08.080 to Yemen UH and mobilizing, arming, training, equipping UH the 0:07:08.279 --> 0:07:16.960 Houthi rebels. These are pretty um uh, pretty underdeveloped folks 0:07:17.360 --> 0:07:22.280 UH in the Yemen who never ever had their own missiles. 0:07:22.320 --> 0:07:26.520 So now the Hoothies are shooting the Iranian missiles into 0:07:26.560 --> 0:07:30.200 Saudi Arabia. And whether you like them or don't like them, 0:07:30.200 --> 0:07:33.600 there's a lot of things we dislike about Saudi There 0:07:33.600 --> 0:07:38.880 our allies, and they have been our allicense. When President 0:07:38.960 --> 0:07:44.640 Roosevelt and the founding King of Saudi Arabia, Um Belazi 0:07:44.960 --> 0:07:50.400 abdelaziz Um agreed on a strategic partnership. So to just 0:07:51.040 --> 0:07:53.880 um say we're going to stop the war in Yemen 0:07:54.040 --> 0:07:57.760 is great, but you need a commitment from the Hoosies 0:07:58.160 --> 0:08:02.880 to stop firing missiles, add the Saudis to stop attacking 0:08:02.960 --> 0:08:07.920 their um oil fields. And for the from the Iranians 0:08:07.960 --> 0:08:13.560 who supposedly want to join rejoin the Nuclear Agreement j 0:08:13.720 --> 0:08:15.920 c p o A with the United States and the 0:08:16.000 --> 0:08:20.400 others to commit to pull out of Yemen and stop 0:08:20.440 --> 0:08:25.040 supporting the Hooties. If these elements are in uh, kudos 0:08:25.040 --> 0:08:27.960 to the State Department, to Tony B. Lincoln, to President 0:08:28.000 --> 0:08:33.520 Biden for resolving a bloody and horrible conflict in the Yemen. 0:08:34.280 --> 0:08:36.880 All right, Ariel, let's broaden the foreign policy out a 0:08:36.880 --> 0:08:39.920 little bit here under the Biden administration. Um, here the 0:08:39.920 --> 0:08:42.000 Biden administration and the President said he wants to re 0:08:42.240 --> 0:08:46.360 engage in global diplomacy after four years of Presidents Trump's 0:08:46.520 --> 0:08:52.400 America First Agenda. How do you believe America's will be 0:08:52.440 --> 0:08:56.560 embraced by the world once again as a leading voice 0:08:56.600 --> 0:08:59.600 in global diplomacy or does it have to work to 0:08:59.720 --> 0:09:03.680 get a trust back. Well, first of all, we should 0:09:03.679 --> 0:09:10.280 remember that Trump came as a symptom of the fatigue. 0:09:10.760 --> 0:09:14.480 A lot of folks in this country have with long 0:09:14.600 --> 0:09:18.840 wars commitments in Iraq and Afghanistan that we're going on 0:09:19.000 --> 0:09:22.520 for twenty years. Families law their dear ones. It cost 0:09:22.600 --> 0:09:26.040 us probably trillion dollars to be engaged there. So there 0:09:26.120 --> 0:09:29.360 was a reaction. It didn't happen in an empty space 0:09:29.760 --> 0:09:34.560 just because Donald Trump had very poor, poorly thoughts through 0:09:34.640 --> 0:09:37.280 ideas about the world, which he did. He did. He's 0:09:37.320 --> 0:09:40.720 a nationalist, he's an isolationist. Doesn't work like that. In 0:09:40.760 --> 0:09:46.199 the twenty one century, however, the rise of China and UH, 0:09:46.360 --> 0:09:50.319 the wariness of our European allies to work with us, 0:09:50.320 --> 0:09:53.240 standing up to putin in Russia, standing up to seize 0:09:53.280 --> 0:09:56.040 and pin in China. You see what the Europeans just 0:09:56.160 --> 0:10:01.320 did just before Biden was inaugurated. UH they signed a 0:10:01.520 --> 0:10:06.120 huge UH investment in trade agreement with Europe and the 0:10:06.240 --> 0:10:10.760 Chinese Rush and signed a similar agreement in Asia. So 0:10:10.800 --> 0:10:14.280 this is not Barack Obama's world. This is not the 0:10:14.320 --> 0:10:19.960 world where President than Vice President Biden was hugged by everybody. 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:23.520 We have more challenges, bigger challenges, and we need to have, 0:10:23.679 --> 0:10:28.040 among other things, money UH to confront the rising China 0:10:28.480 --> 0:10:32.160 and other things. And instead what I see is um 0:10:32.200 --> 0:10:36.760 a commitment, almost an hysterical commitment to spend more and 0:10:36.800 --> 0:10:42.120 more money on things that are not directly applicable to 0:10:42.200 --> 0:10:46.120 this conflict with China and to boosting American engagements and 0:10:46.280 --> 0:10:50.240 presents around the world. Money is fungible if we spend 0:10:50.400 --> 0:10:53.760 all this money on let's sake, the COVID package for 0:10:53.920 --> 0:10:58.880 the environmental policies, which are necessary as well. Clearly they're necessary. 0:10:58.920 --> 0:11:02.520 But we need to keep the whole picture um in 0:11:02.640 --> 0:11:06.240 mind and see the huge challenges in front of us 0:11:06.480 --> 0:11:09.480 in terms of international engagement, in terms of how we 0:11:09.640 --> 0:11:14.079 bring back the allies in Asia, India, Japan, the Philippines, 0:11:15.200 --> 0:11:18.440 and in Europe. Yes, we only have a minute left. 0:11:18.920 --> 0:11:22.960 How will Biden approach China? Relations are not good between 0:11:23.000 --> 0:11:26.160 the US and China right now. Well, this is a 0:11:26.200 --> 0:11:29.800 part of a huge systemic challenge to the United States. 0:11:29.840 --> 0:11:33.360 Chinese arising power. China thinks that they're going to become 0:11:33.400 --> 0:11:37.800 the greatest economic power on the planet in this decade 0:11:37.800 --> 0:11:44.360 before and uh spin the Chinese leader is more authoritarian, 0:11:44.440 --> 0:11:49.040 more dictatorial than anybody since Mouth Setong, and he compares 0:11:49.080 --> 0:11:52.880 himself to Mao. He wants to bring Taiwan back by hope, 0:11:53.000 --> 0:11:56.560 by group, either politically or militarily. This is a huge 0:11:56.600 --> 0:11:59.640 challenge for president by Dr Ariel Collen, thank you so 0:11:59.760 --> 0:12:01.959 much for joining us. Dr Errol Cohen, he's a senior 0:12:01.960 --> 0:12:05.600 Fellow at the Atlantic Council, also founding Principle of International 0:12:05.679 --> 0:12:12.000 Market Analysis based in Washington, D E. C. Let's get 0:12:12.000 --> 0:12:15.120 to our next guest, who is Austin Carr. He has 0:12:15.160 --> 0:12:17.480 written a great story about Apple being the two point 0:12:17.559 --> 0:12:21.640 three trillion dollar fortress that Tim Cooke built. We know 0:12:21.760 --> 0:12:24.560 that we have a meeting of business leaders with Joe 0:12:24.559 --> 0:12:26.800 Biden today. One of them won't be Tim Coke, not 0:12:26.920 --> 0:12:28.360 this time around, but he did have a meeting with 0:12:28.480 --> 0:12:31.600 Joe Biden back in twelve and that's where Austin's story 0:12:31.720 --> 0:12:35.120 starts out. So Austin, tell us what the sort of 0:12:35.160 --> 0:12:38.320 the the drift of your story is. If you're like, 0:12:38.440 --> 0:12:43.800 what is it about Cooke and Apple that administrations really 0:12:43.840 --> 0:12:46.960 want to talk to? Yeah, I mean one of the 0:12:47.000 --> 0:12:49.480 things that we wanted to focus on with this story, 0:12:49.559 --> 0:12:53.360 which was Tim Cook's diplomacy skills. Um. So much attention 0:12:53.400 --> 0:12:56.040 when it comes to Apple is often centered on their 0:12:56.880 --> 0:12:59.800 products and their design approach. But one of the things 0:12:59.800 --> 0:13:04.800 that him has been incredibly uh depth dad is deflecting 0:13:04.840 --> 0:13:08.080 political pressure. UM. The opening scene, as you just mentioned, 0:13:08.080 --> 0:13:11.319 of the story, is actually a look back at dinner 0:13:11.400 --> 0:13:14.200 between Joe Biden when he was Vice president and Tim 0:13:14.240 --> 0:13:17.959 Cook when he was really pressuring Apple to make the 0:13:18.080 --> 0:13:21.280 iPhone in the US, UM, which for a lot of 0:13:21.280 --> 0:13:23.439 folks might just out a little bit like deja vu, 0:13:23.559 --> 0:13:25.319 because he went through that with four years during the 0:13:25.320 --> 0:13:28.000 Obama administration or eight years I should say, another four 0:13:28.080 --> 0:13:31.120 years with the Trump administration, and just recently Biden has 0:13:31.120 --> 0:13:34.520 been talking yet again about trying to move US manufacturing 0:13:34.800 --> 0:13:37.840 back to the US and what administration seemed to be 0:13:38.360 --> 0:13:41.440 in love with the Apple uh with Apple about and 0:13:41.440 --> 0:13:44.880 and Tim more specifically, it's just the Apple brand. Um. 0:13:44.920 --> 0:13:48.520 They see it as an engine of American innovation, job creator, 0:13:48.760 --> 0:13:51.000 and they want to attach themselves to that. And that's 0:13:51.000 --> 0:13:53.160 one of the things that we sort of dove into 0:13:53.240 --> 0:13:56.480 during the the the Obama era as well as a 0:13:56.520 --> 0:13:59.840 Trump era. Just how Tim Cook navigated that, leaned on 0:14:00.000 --> 0:14:03.120 and his sort of diplomacy skills as well as trading 0:14:03.160 --> 0:14:06.720 optics to get his way when it came to navigating Washington, 0:14:06.800 --> 0:14:11.000 d C. So it's it's interesting. I mean, Tim Cook, 0:14:11.360 --> 0:14:13.040 I'm just looking at the you know, the chart, the 0:14:13.040 --> 0:14:15.200 ten year charts since you know, the end of the 0:14:15.240 --> 0:14:19.120 fiscal UH financial crisis two thousand nine two stocks just 0:14:19.200 --> 0:14:22.440 been extraordinary in terms of returns and out performing the 0:14:22.480 --> 0:14:27.240 market here, Tim Cook, I mean, he's navigated so many 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:30.120 land mines you mentioned, you know a number of them. 0:14:30.160 --> 0:14:33.760 But one of the big issues is the regulatory risk here. 0:14:34.160 --> 0:14:39.360 What's the concern here within the company UM about regulatory 0:14:39.440 --> 0:14:41.960 risk from the United States? Is that a potential big 0:14:42.040 --> 0:14:45.000 risk for this company? I mean, I think definitely so. 0:14:45.120 --> 0:14:48.160 I mean, if you look at the October House UH 0:14:48.760 --> 0:14:53.080 Anti Trust Subcommittee, you know they cited Apple, along with Facebook, Amazon, 0:14:53.760 --> 0:14:57.840 and Google as having monopoly power and regulating regulars UH 0:14:57.920 --> 0:15:01.240 step in when it comes to their up store, UM 0:15:01.280 --> 0:15:04.360 just because of the dominance of the platform on when 0:15:04.360 --> 0:15:07.000 it comes to mobile software and the sort of control 0:15:07.040 --> 0:15:10.240 it has over software makers. UM. At the same time, 0:15:10.280 --> 0:15:12.600 if you sort of zoom out, I would say Apple 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:16.960 has been less scrutinized versus the other companies out there, 0:15:16.960 --> 0:15:19.160 like Google and Facebook, especially if you saw her the 0:15:19.520 --> 0:15:23.600 testimony UM some months back, a lot of the ire 0:15:23.800 --> 0:15:27.560 from from Congress was focused on Mark Zuckerberg or Sin 0:15:27.680 --> 0:15:30.640 Darpachai rather than Tim Cook. And I think one of 0:15:30.640 --> 0:15:33.240 that reasons is just the narrative he's able to build. UM. 0:15:33.240 --> 0:15:36.120 He's been very public and very vocal and sort of 0:15:36.200 --> 0:15:39.800 not being on the defensive but actually attacking UM. He's 0:15:39.680 --> 0:15:42.960 most recently been counterpunching and saying, uh, you know, just 0:15:43.040 --> 0:15:45.600 that just in in recent weeks that uh, you know, 0:15:45.640 --> 0:15:48.640 the government should be focused on reforming social media companies 0:15:48.640 --> 0:15:51.320 because of their data exploitation, that that's a larger issue 0:15:51.360 --> 0:15:54.680 than perhaps Apple might be with its app store. UM. 0:15:54.760 --> 0:15:57.800 And they're very just clever again about deflecting those politics 0:15:58.000 --> 0:16:00.440 and winning that public messaging war a sent really using 0:16:00.440 --> 0:16:03.720 the Apple marketing that's so famous, but for political issues 0:16:04.280 --> 0:16:07.600 exactly deflecting well. Once I mean, obviously the social media 0:16:07.640 --> 0:16:12.200 companies are in for a few months of toughness, I 0:16:12.200 --> 0:16:15.440 would imagine both here and in Europe. But once that's 0:16:15.600 --> 0:16:18.920 over and sort of the way, we'll be free for 0:16:19.080 --> 0:16:21.600 regulators here and in Europe to to go after Apple 0:16:21.640 --> 0:16:24.080 in a big way on everything from taxes to app 0:16:24.080 --> 0:16:27.920 store to how it treats its customers and competition and 0:16:27.960 --> 0:16:32.040 so on, What are the most vulnerable in well, I mean, 0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:34.000 I think that remains to be seen, just because you know, 0:16:34.080 --> 0:16:36.320 especially in the US, we haven't really gotten a clearer 0:16:36.360 --> 0:16:39.080 picture of how much the Biden administration is going to 0:16:39.120 --> 0:16:43.240 press this issue. He's spoken most vocally about Section two thirty, 0:16:43.240 --> 0:16:45.560 which is an issue that would affect Facebook and Google 0:16:45.600 --> 0:16:48.120 more than it did Apple. But if you look at 0:16:48.440 --> 0:16:51.960 the Trump era for just lessons, um, I mean, just 0:16:51.960 --> 0:16:55.800 just consider how how uniquely vulnerable Apple was during that 0:16:55.800 --> 0:16:58.520 time frame, considering how reliant its supply chain was on 0:16:58.640 --> 0:17:02.920 China and how much Trump administration was going after UH 0:17:02.960 --> 0:17:07.000 that dynamic through trade war pressure, tariff threats, UH and 0:17:07.040 --> 0:17:10.520 so forth that some analysts really thought would blow up 0:17:10.840 --> 0:17:13.240 the company's supply chain and really forced them to have 0:17:13.320 --> 0:17:16.760 to find new geographies to manufacture things, which it could 0:17:16.760 --> 0:17:19.800 not have done overnight, especially amid the COVID nineteen pandemic. 0:17:20.359 --> 0:17:23.520 Um Yet Apple did better than ever. I mean, this 0:17:23.680 --> 0:17:26.600 market cap sor to just past two trillion dollars, and 0:17:26.680 --> 0:17:29.960 that's just a testament to both the operational skill as 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:32.240 well as the political maneuvering. Again that Tim Cook did 0:17:32.280 --> 0:17:35.159 personally with Trump, who was, according to officials, you know, 0:17:35.240 --> 0:17:39.280 constantly meeting in Washington with Trump. Was willing to do 0:17:39.320 --> 0:17:43.240 these big events with him, whether that CEO Summer's summits, 0:17:43.240 --> 0:17:46.320 dinners at the White House, or visits to a factory 0:17:46.320 --> 0:17:49.119 in Texas, which was sort of an infamous scene in 0:17:49.200 --> 0:17:53.600 the story. Um to really just avoid the harshest penalties 0:17:53.680 --> 0:17:58.479 of what could have been a disastrous four years under Trump. Austin, 0:17:58.520 --> 0:18:00.560 thank you so much for this. This story just a 0:18:00.600 --> 0:18:04.840 fascinating story. Austin Carr, Bloomberg Technology reporter. His story Bloomberg 0:18:04.840 --> 0:18:07.720 Business Week Magazine. Apple is a two point three trillion 0:18:07.760 --> 0:18:13.040 dollar fourtress that Tim Cook built. It is time for 0:18:13.080 --> 0:18:17.040 Bloomberg Opinion today. We're joined by Timothy O'Brien, senior calumnists 0:18:17.040 --> 0:18:20.160 for Bloomberg Opinion, coming to us from the foodie capital 0:18:20.480 --> 0:18:24.160 of Montclair, New Jersey. Tim, we've got the impeachment trial 0:18:24.280 --> 0:18:28.719 kicking off today. By all accounts, a conviction is highly unlikely. 0:18:29.240 --> 0:18:33.040 What would constitute a win or a good showing on 0:18:33.080 --> 0:18:36.760 the part of the Democrats. Well, I think I think 0:18:36.880 --> 0:18:40.199 there's still a lot that voters and citizens don't know 0:18:40.359 --> 0:18:43.840 about what occurred on January expects in terms of who 0:18:43.880 --> 0:18:48.119 planned the event prior to it occurring, who coordinated what 0:18:48.160 --> 0:18:51.040 occurred there, did the White House know? How much? Did 0:18:51.080 --> 0:18:54.440 Trump know? What it? What? It is a campaign? No, Uh, 0:18:54.480 --> 0:18:57.439 it would be a useful exercise if this trial got 0:18:57.440 --> 0:19:01.159 at that, because it's vitally important for the law and 0:19:01.640 --> 0:19:05.200 I think the historical record. But political concerns are driving 0:19:05.240 --> 0:19:08.360 this one, obviously, and I don't know. You know, there's 0:19:08.400 --> 0:19:10.840 a lot of debate on that very issue within the 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:14.480 Democratic Party itself. There's some folks pushing for a speedy 0:19:14.560 --> 0:19:17.800 trial and there's others asking for a more deliberative process 0:19:17.840 --> 0:19:21.720 that airs everything. Um. I think the White House seems 0:19:21.760 --> 0:19:24.960 to prefer a speedy trial as well. But again, these 0:19:25.000 --> 0:19:28.040 are political issues that are driving that debate, not not 0:19:28.240 --> 0:19:32.400 the legal values. I think for sure, Tim, if there 0:19:32.400 --> 0:19:35.360 are no witnesses allowed, how would we find out some 0:19:35.440 --> 0:19:39.640 details of the type that you just annunciated. I don't know, 0:19:40.160 --> 0:19:43.720 I frankly don't know. I don't know why witnesses aren't 0:19:43.760 --> 0:19:49.280 being subpoena and uh required to testifying her oath, including 0:19:49.760 --> 0:19:53.240 uh Donald Trump. I don't know why there isn't a 0:19:53.320 --> 0:19:57.399 more aggressive effort to collect that kind of evidence I 0:19:57.400 --> 0:20:00.240 should say, I do know, but I think it's it 0:20:00.560 --> 0:20:04.040 amounts to a travesty that I think historically people will 0:20:04.080 --> 0:20:09.000 look back on this and see it as as Democrats 0:20:09.200 --> 0:20:15.200 once again caving to more savvy and street smart Republicans 0:20:15.200 --> 0:20:19.119 who know how to muscle procedure alogue um at the 0:20:19.160 --> 0:20:23.360 expense I think of better outcomes. Tim, What role, if any, 0:20:23.400 --> 0:20:28.280 is the White House playing in this process? Well, well, 0:20:28.280 --> 0:20:32.320 certainly Biden has sat back and has not had any 0:20:32.359 --> 0:20:36.800 comments about it. But but behind the scenes, UM, there 0:20:36.840 --> 0:20:40.680 certainly has been a lot of indications that the White 0:20:40.680 --> 0:20:45.199 House would prefer that that the trial is expeditious and 0:20:45.240 --> 0:20:49.439 that it doesn't uh gum up the machinery. And I 0:20:49.440 --> 0:20:54.119 think their concerns are it could derail Biden's ability to 0:20:54.200 --> 0:21:00.159 get um more COVID nineteen legislation passed. It would your 0:21:00.160 --> 0:21:03.520 his ability to form his cabinet. Um. It's not clear 0:21:03.560 --> 0:21:05.480 to me that that's actually the case, but there's a 0:21:05.560 --> 0:21:08.920 there's a concern about that in the White House. Will 0:21:09.160 --> 0:21:14.040 Trump's defense be able to, you know, put forward a 0:21:14.080 --> 0:21:17.359 case that will will defeat the case of all of 0:21:17.400 --> 0:21:20.520 the managers. So there's what two four, six, eight nine, 0:21:20.720 --> 0:21:25.240 managers from Jamie Roskin to Madeline Dean, and surely they'll have, 0:21:25.400 --> 0:21:27.760 you know, a good case. Will will the defense be 0:21:27.800 --> 0:21:33.160 able to to knock that case down? Well, I think, 0:21:33.240 --> 0:21:36.679 you know, an acquittal is pretty baked in here now, Vanni. 0:21:36.800 --> 0:21:42.400 The Democrats would need sixty seven votes finding Trump guilty, 0:21:42.920 --> 0:21:45.879 and I don't think there's any possibility they're going to 0:21:45.960 --> 0:21:49.640 get there. It looks now like UM Republicans are going 0:21:49.680 --> 0:21:56.440 to you know, march and lockstep on this one. So unfortunately, 0:21:56.600 --> 0:21:59.399 it looks like whether or not Trump's defense mounts a 0:21:59.440 --> 0:22:02.840 good case, maybe it irrelevant to the outcome, But in 0:22:02.960 --> 0:22:06.480 terms of their raw argument, uh, it is. It is 0:22:06.760 --> 0:22:09.639 a pretty ridiculous one. It's it's founded on two things. 0:22:09.680 --> 0:22:13.000 That a president can't be impeached and I'm sorry, a 0:22:13.080 --> 0:22:16.480 former president can't be impeached, even though Trump was president 0:22:16.600 --> 0:22:19.040 at the time he was impeached. But which makes that 0:22:19.160 --> 0:22:22.880 claim I think irrelevant, And that Trump was merely exercising 0:22:22.960 --> 0:22:26.760 his free speech rights when he uh told marchers in 0:22:26.840 --> 0:22:29.760 Washington and he would lead them down Pennsylvania Avenue and 0:22:29.760 --> 0:22:32.280 they needed to fight to make sure their country wasn't 0:22:32.280 --> 0:22:35.280 taken away from them. UM. Free spool. We all are 0:22:35.320 --> 0:22:37.320 protected by free speech, but no one's allowed to go 0:22:37.440 --> 0:22:40.360 to a movie theater and screened fire. So I think 0:22:40.440 --> 0:22:44.240 on legal grounds, both of those issues aren't very strong, 0:22:45.080 --> 0:22:49.560 but they had to say something because Trump is getting tried. Tim, 0:22:49.600 --> 0:22:52.680 do we know for a fact that no witnesses will 0:22:52.720 --> 0:22:57.320 be called? You know, we won't know, Paul, that's a 0:22:57.320 --> 0:22:59.760 great question. It appears that that's not going to be 0:22:59.840 --> 0:23:04.800 the hat. But but uh, the procedures around this has 0:23:04.840 --> 0:23:07.920 been very murky up until the very moment that we're 0:23:07.920 --> 0:23:10.240 speaking right now. We may see when this launches this 0:23:10.359 --> 0:23:14.600 afternoon that they will begin calling witnesses. Um. You know, 0:23:14.640 --> 0:23:17.240 Lindsey Graham was on Fox saying that if the Democrats 0:23:17.280 --> 0:23:20.919 call witnesses, he's going to make sure that the Republicans 0:23:20.920 --> 0:23:23.520 call lots of witnesses to I think the threat there 0:23:23.600 --> 0:23:26.280 is that he would try that That would then amount 0:23:26.359 --> 0:23:30.280 to slowing the whole thing down. Um, But all indications 0:23:30.280 --> 0:23:33.639 are that witnesses aren't going to be called. We know 0:23:33.760 --> 0:23:35.440 that there's going to be a sort of a four 0:23:35.480 --> 0:23:38.400 hour initial proceeding on the constitutionality of the whole thing, 0:23:38.440 --> 0:23:40.760 and then sort of sixteen hours for both sides to 0:23:40.800 --> 0:23:43.959 present cases and so on. Will this be wrapped up 0:23:44.000 --> 0:23:46.840 extraordinarily faster? You think, Tim will? We will. We know 0:23:46.920 --> 0:23:48.959 most of what we're going to find out by Friday. 0:23:49.000 --> 0:23:53.520