Speaker 1: What is up? Mets fans, Welcome to the live watch
Speaker 1: along of the EC three podcast. Yes, you are seeing
Speaker 1: Eric Schavez his face on our screen. He has dropped
Speaker 1: a podcast, didn't even though he had one. Good for him.
Speaker 1: I guess he's jobless right now, so he's got to
Speaker 1: do the podcast circuit. He is talking about the Mets
Speaker 1: and he's airing the dirty laundry. May have seen some
Speaker 1: clips on Twitter. You may have seen some stuff on
Speaker 1: foul Territory. Eric Schava has been running his mouth recently
Speaker 1: because the Mets are in free fall, and I'm sure
Speaker 1: he feels pretty good about it, considering he was fired
Speaker 1: at the end of last season. We're going to live
Speaker 1: watch this. We're gonna pause, make comments, critiques. I think, James,
Speaker 1: you've seen a little bit more than me. A lot
Speaker 1: of this is gonna be first time rip for me.
Speaker 1: I saw the first ten minutes yesterday when I was like,
Speaker 1: wait a second, I just want to save this and
Speaker 1: do this pure So this would just be a fun
Speaker 1: idea for our third episode this week. So I'm sure
Speaker 1: not that many people still at the end of the
Speaker 1: day are running to watch the full flow length ECS podcast,
Speaker 1: right No, I don't think so. But you'll now watch
Speaker 1: Mark and James of the metsup podcast, watch the EC
Speaker 1: three podcast. I'm not linking in the description. That's one
Speaker 1: thing I'm not doing. You can go find it yourself
Speaker 1: if you want to. But uh, subscribe to our channel
Speaker 1: mets up. Yeah, bat further ado, I mean, here we go,
Speaker 1: Here we go, Eric Chavez, gotta start off with the vertical.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, this TikTok is so you need to start
Speaker 1: with a TikTok, which is good. Yeah, all right, here
Speaker 1: we go.
Speaker 2: So the met let me rephrase that, so surns besides
Speaker 2: to fire Mendoza, why not the whole stets promo. Well,
Speaker 2: he's he's already used that bullet in the chamber, right,
Speaker 2: he's running out of bullets.
Speaker 1: What are these? What are these?
Speaker 2: Me? This was inevitable, This was the next step. But
Speaker 2: Carlos wasn't a problem.
Speaker 1: Who's editing this? Who edited this? Who? There's so much
Speaker 1: there's so many breaks in this that its driving me insane.
Speaker 1: It could be so much more concise. Also, at the
Speaker 1: same time, again, I don't know why the conversation and
Speaker 1: has become by a lot of people that Carlos Mendoza
Speaker 1: wasn't the problem. He for sure was part of the problem. Also,
Speaker 1: why are those so many people? Was Carlos Mendoza versus
Speaker 1: David Stearn's I don't think it was ever really like that.
Speaker 1: And I just have to commend Derek Travis. I don't
Speaker 1: think I've ever heard the podcast use the word bullets
Speaker 1: twice in the first nine seconds. Yes, he's he's really
Speaker 1: uh's talking about bullets. He's using all his bullets early
Speaker 1: on check out the Phoenix Country Club. I think he
Speaker 1: spent a lot of time there last year. Right, he
Speaker 1: did break found him on Instagram.
Speaker 2: And I've said it before, Right, none of the moves
Speaker 2: that he's made where's this usage or have made have
Speaker 2: worked out? They just haven't.
Speaker 1: It's so loud. We need to break this down on the American.
Speaker 2: Podcast three podcasts. Yes, don't miss it.
Speaker 1: Good grasp, it's gonna be hard hit.
Speaker 2: Carlo's wasn't the problem. Right, We're back here with the
Speaker 2: first time we've done. This is an emergency episode of
Speaker 2: the podcast with six Times Gold Glover, Eric Chavez and
Speaker 2: Shaby Love.
Speaker 1: The introduc show six Times Gold Glover, Eric Schavaz to
Speaker 1: the podcast that he is his. I need to find
Speaker 1: out who's Chris Hamblin?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Can we get a little Chris Hamblin background check real quick,
Speaker 1: just so we know where this guy's coming from. I
Speaker 1: know where he's gonna be, you know, glazing chavas the
Speaker 1: entire time. The first one that popped up my LinkedIn
Speaker 1: is the head women's soccer coach at Harvard. Don't think
Speaker 1: that can imagine that's this guysover. The next one absolutely not.
Speaker 1: Next one. The next one sets up drag shows. Not himy,
Speaker 1: they're gonna go out on them. It's not him. I
Speaker 1: hope it too. So I guess I don't know who'
Speaker 1: Chris Hamblin is Probably a friend?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Probably? All right, here we go.
Speaker 2: We do emergency podcast on this show very rarely, but
Speaker 2: after what has taken place with the New York Mets
Speaker 2: and your experience in.
Speaker 1: New York, it's an interesting move.
Speaker 2: And then your initial reaction that you posted on social
Speaker 2: media yesterday, I wanted.
Speaker 1: To are these guys in the same room and split
Speaker 1: screening because it looks like this is the same room
Speaker 1: they are. The back window looks the same but slightly disjointed,
Speaker 1: and it feels like we're just on a wide table
Speaker 1: and we brought together for a close table. Oh, they
Speaker 1: are in the same room and they've decided to do
Speaker 1: a split screen, which is also a choice, a split
Speaker 1: screen without actually splitting the screen. They just they just
Speaker 1: made it look more confusing. Okay, yeah, that's that's enough
Speaker 1: of the low blow shots. Let's now take actual shots
Speaker 1: at their shot.
Speaker 2: Come in and just let you kind of give us
Speaker 2: your thoughts on what's been going on, right first and
Speaker 2: foremost your reaction. Then, I always when these things happen,
Speaker 2: I always just hate to have just the dump, right,
Speaker 2: and you said something great this morning, like, then I
Speaker 2: want to have a plan, like here's my plan would
Speaker 2: be moving forward. So the Carlos Mendoza at the two
Speaker 2: X speed and you have a very unique perspective as
Speaker 2: to the regime that's in power now and the regime
Speaker 2: that you worked for. You've worked for both of them.
Speaker 1: So in twenty Chabez looks bored. Schabez looks bored. I'm
Speaker 1: bored already. I'm gonna say this. Yes, he does have
Speaker 1: a unique position on this regime. He was not hired
Speaker 1: by this regime. He was fired by this regime. So
Speaker 1: I got to assume that Eric Shabaz is not gonna
Speaker 1: like what was going on. It's just an idea, and
Speaker 1: two of his very good friends in the industry are
Speaker 1: also both fired.
Speaker 2: By the year he's twenty two. You were the hitting
Speaker 2: coach for the Mets. In twenty twenty three, you were
Speaker 2: promoted to bench coach under Buck Show Walter Shoe Walter
Speaker 2: gets Run Eppler as well. At the end of that
Speaker 2: season and the offseason gets run and the decision that
Speaker 2: you make, you're able. When Carlos Mendoza comes in to
Speaker 2: have a really had a relationship with him. You stayed
Speaker 2: on board, right, And that's when the Stearns regime comes in,
Speaker 2: and that that first year you guys go to the NLCS.
Speaker 1: If you lose meat this option, I don't.
Speaker 2: I'll let you get into it. And then twenty twenty five,
Speaker 2: so funny about no playoffs staff turnover, and that gets
Speaker 2: us to twenty twenty six, where before the All Star break,
Speaker 2: more staff turnover and as you put it on your post,
Speaker 2: someone's running out of bullets. Yeah, and loves that. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I don't even know. Let's just start at the beginning. Carlos,
Speaker 2: we have a history giving Yankees organization. I love Carlos.
Speaker 2: When he came over, we interviewed, we talked.
Speaker 1: It feels like we don't need to start at the beating.
Speaker 1: By the way, I don't want to hear about anything
Speaker 1: about Carlsmonoz with the Yankees, in your relationship with him
Speaker 1: when he worked with the Yankees. Literally get to the
Speaker 1: fucking point. I think you should do expeed this to
Speaker 1: X speed through and then when we get to a
Speaker 1: hot shot, then we can put it back down. I think, right,
Speaker 1: we're so what's from preamble? Right now, we're three minutes
Speaker 1: nothing said. Three minutes in, we're through half a baseball game.
Speaker 1: I thank god he was an extremely talented baseball player.
Speaker 2: This is this is I already knew.
Speaker 1: I would that's too fast, that's too fast, that's too fast,
Speaker 1: too too fast? Uh one to five, I'll try one five.
Speaker 2: I would like the man I knew working under boone
Speaker 2: for all those years as the as the band coach,
Speaker 2: learning from him. Who I really respect. The way Aaron
Speaker 2: bon goes about his business. I respect, you know, even Kashman.
Speaker 2: The whole Yankee organization I think is extremely well run,
Speaker 2: and I think every organization should you know, look to
Speaker 2: them as is how to do it right right Cashrom's
Speaker 2: been there for thirty.
Speaker 1: Okay, I'm going to interject real quick because one of
Speaker 1: the clips I saw was from Foul Territory as well
Speaker 1: as from this podcast of Eric Schabas saying he's over analytics,
Speaker 1: that you shouldn't be using analytics to run your team, James,
Speaker 1: real quick, it's a big thing that the Yankees used
Speaker 1: to run their their organization. They have one of the
Speaker 1: most robust analytics departments in all of baseball and now
Speaker 1: honestly earlier to most other teams as well. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: just just making sure we definitely haven't seen like clips
Speaker 1: of Clint Fraser and other guys talking about how analytics
Speaker 1: have been ruining the Yankees. But now because Eric Schabaz
Speaker 1: was not fired from the Yankees, he does love the
Speaker 1: way that their organization is being run. Was he not
Speaker 1: fired from the Yankees? No? I think we just oh
Speaker 1: we took him, Yeah we took him.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we poshed him plus years whatever, multiple series, they
Speaker 2: go to playoffs, every year, they develop players, they drop well,
Speaker 2: they just do it right, you know, And I think
Speaker 2: every organization should look at this. I instantly I knew.
Speaker 2: I wanted to say with Carlos, we hit it off
Speaker 2: right away, you know, we make that run. You know,
Speaker 2: Carlos was the right guy, you know, in a tough
Speaker 2: obviously in a tough city. Being bench coach, going a manager,
Speaker 2: that's completely different seat. But he he's a good baseball man.
Speaker 2: He's just a great individual. There's no reason why, you know,
Speaker 2: he wasn't capable of being the leader. He took us
Speaker 2: to the alcs and a hundred percent.
Speaker 1: And I think that's what a lot of the criticism
Speaker 1: for the firing of Mendoza has been is that he's
Speaker 1: a great, great dude. And I don't baseball man, baseball guy.
Speaker 1: I don't think that there's anything against that. Nothing has
Speaker 1: show us that Carls Mendoza isn't a good person, that
Speaker 1: he isn't a baseball life for all this kind of
Speaker 1: stuff opposite, opposite, if anything, the managerial stuff in game
Speaker 1: decision making, actual things that matters, wins and losses. I
Speaker 1: don't think that you can see what he's done and
Speaker 1: say he's done a great job. No, actually quite the opposite.
Speaker 1: And again, both of these things can be true. You
Speaker 1: could be bad tactically, but you could also be really
Speaker 1: good guy. Yes, and I think both things are true,
Speaker 1: and it seems like people are having a hard time
Speaker 1: separating those two things, which we're going back to one
Speaker 1: point speed now because now they're actually talking Carlos. Let's go.
Speaker 2: So, yeah, he has the he has the pedigree, he
Speaker 2: knows the game, he knows how to deal with people.
Speaker 2: And this was the wrong fire why why yeah we
Speaker 2: can I'm just let's just get right to it immediately.
Speaker 2: Serns was the wrong hire. And I think why we
Speaker 2: can kind of dive into you know, you know, his
Speaker 2: huge contract five years, fifty million dollars with really and
Speaker 2: we've talked about this before about you know, climbing the
Speaker 2: total pole and achieving certain things and kind of earning
Speaker 2: your way to the top. You know, he came from Milwaukee,
Speaker 2: built a great farm system, didn't really accomplish anything, you know,
Speaker 2: And I want to know who who told Steve Cohen
Speaker 2: that this guy was the next guy?
Speaker 1: Okay, Gota we gotta address a little bit like listen, again,
Speaker 1: this is not gonna be like a glazing David Stearns fest.
Speaker 1: Again we've talked about on the podcast, and yet there
Speaker 1: are still comments that don't seem to understand what we
Speaker 1: are saying. David Stearns the last year and a half
Speaker 1: has been an absolute mess. Almost every decision that he's
Speaker 1: made has not gone right. Since the trade deadline, It's
Speaker 1: been a complete disaster on acquisitions and players in and
Speaker 1: team performance. There's no doubt about it. But I do
Speaker 1: think that we're probably gonna see some goalposts moving here
Speaker 1: by Eric Schavas in terms of what makes a successful
Speaker 1: GM and President of Baseball Ops. Well, that's what I'm saying,
Speaker 1: that not accomplish anything, not accomplish anything. So does that mean,
Speaker 1: I guess impossibly, in Eric Shav's mind the only accomplishments
Speaker 1: are pendance and World Series, and that could possibly be true.
Speaker 1: I could definitely see a lot of play people from
Speaker 1: the former player ranks feeling that way. But then you can't.
Speaker 1: Sometimes you just can't hire guys who have World Series
Speaker 1: ranks because they're not leaving their current situations. And David
Speaker 1: Stearns had multiple divisions and playoff runs and went to
Speaker 1: the NLCS Game seven multiple times lost to the Dodgers.
Speaker 1: Even before David Stearns was the Brewers, he was with
Speaker 1: the Astros. He was an understudy in this organization that
Speaker 1: was actually turning go over world serious championship. So if
Speaker 1: wherever you moved the goalposts again, whether you could say
Speaker 1: he was possibly anointed too far, that could be fair,
Speaker 1: but at the same time say he didn't accomplish anything.
Speaker 1: It's really a reductive view of someone who's a successful
Speaker 1: executive before taking that same job. Here, I also feel like,
Speaker 1: you know Andrew Friedman Dodgers, he was with the Rays.
Speaker 1: They didn't win anything. They didn't they didn't win a
Speaker 1: World Series. Under Andrew Friedman, they were successful similarly to
Speaker 1: that of Stern. So it is interesting. I feel like
Speaker 1: in baseball there's very few hires that I can remember
Speaker 1: that run organizations now that had prior success, because, like
Speaker 1: you said, you don't leave when you have that success,
Speaker 1: and usually when those guys leave it's because they're done
Speaker 1: with the job. They retire like theo. Epstein's kind of
Speaker 1: the last big one that I and I guess Dombrowski
Speaker 1: too now, but like Epstein was a big one going
Speaker 1: from the Red Sox to the Cubs with the lineage
Speaker 1: of winning, like Cashman's not leaving all the all the
Speaker 1: guys that have been winning don't typically leave.
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Speaker 1: And that's also the other part that gets missed in
Speaker 1: these conversations about Davis Serines, the Metskysic, theowebscene. Dave don
Speaker 1: Browski is like a big part of that job is
Speaker 1: to build the organizational processes, and we're not inside enough
Speaker 1: to know how successful those have been. With David Stearns,
Speaker 1: we're assuming they're better because they were so bad. Well
Speaker 1: here the last few regime regimes yet, but well these
Speaker 1: are stuff wall come out. So it's like you can't
Speaker 1: it's hard to hop this job time over time over
Speaker 1: time and expect good results process wise from your organization. Yes,
Speaker 1: so I don't know. I'm sure, Eric Shav Eric Schabas,
Speaker 1: by the way, has he won anything? Just quick check
Speaker 1: for me. I don't think so. Was he bench player
Speaker 1: two thousand and yekes? He surely won a World series
Speaker 1: if he is talking about success and using that as
Speaker 1: a benchmark as to how you get your jobs. Eric
Speaker 1: Shavis six time goal Glove, one time Silver Slugger, zero
Speaker 1: time All Star, Okay, got it? Cool?
Speaker 2: Yeah, just make it right without even accomplishing anything. And
Speaker 2: I think that's where we kind of fault. We come
Speaker 2: up a little short in baseball. As we award players,
Speaker 2: you know, the greatest whatever. We're quick to jump the
Speaker 2: gun on people without having them be proven. And you're
Speaker 2: seeing a lot of this in the game, whether you're who.
Speaker 1: Who do we jump the gun on without being proven?
Speaker 1: By the way Carls Mendoza, if we do want to
Speaker 1: talk about proven he had he was a first time manager.
Speaker 1: There was not anything that he has done successful in
Speaker 1: his life in terms of managerial success. So it's again
Speaker 1: it's a crazy goalpost being moved. There's also and this
Speaker 1: is something that's become a broader conversation. It's come from
Speaker 1: Eric Shava has been a big conversation baseball the last
Speaker 1: two days. Like we said the podcast, he hatually a
Speaker 1: huge conversation basketball for the last whole week about analytics
Speaker 1: versus like former players front office roles. I feel like
Speaker 1: there's this idea of these guys who like climb the
Speaker 1: mountain top athletically physically, of like gatekeeping the games. Yes,
Speaker 1: where you could be good at playing and bad at managing,
Speaker 1: good at managing, bad at playing and I think that
Speaker 1: there's this kind of like insecurity sometimes of these guys
Speaker 1: that there's other people come in and able to run
Speaker 1: these teams and organize organizations in a way that they
Speaker 1: don't think makes sense to them, and they need to
Speaker 1: take their shots at Well, we'll get into more of
Speaker 1: this as we keep moving. I can conceptually understand. Again,
Speaker 1: this is gonna be the nice thing I say about
Speaker 1: Shavaz the entire time, he was a very good baseball player.
Speaker 1: He was. He was awesome with the A's and like
Speaker 1: the no All Star shot, no world seriously, like those
Speaker 1: loos weren't really in his control. He was a phenomenal
Speaker 1: third baseman, great hitter in Oakland. He had a successful
Speaker 1: baseball career. Similarly, it's like when you're really good at
Speaker 1: your job and you have someone who couldn't do your
Speaker 1: job telling you how your job should be done. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a total mind fuck for these guys. They have
Speaker 1: no idea, especially the old garb have no clue how
Speaker 1: to handle it. And Eric Chavs was someone who actually
Speaker 1: kind of I think benefited from analytics in terms just
Speaker 1: a little bit, but like in terms of like evaluating
Speaker 1: a player because Eric Schavaz He was like a two
Speaker 1: sixty two eighty hitter with like a good on base percentage,
Speaker 1: like some power get a good couple of thirty homer
Speaker 1: seasons close to it in his prime, but fantastic defense
Speaker 1: at third. Basic he's a guy who put up for
Speaker 1: the war. And you're like, oh, this actually was a
Speaker 1: really good player. Yeah he also I thought he was
Speaker 1: a fantastic player. Ah, yes, of course, but this is
Speaker 1: just it is funny again the goalpost movement that is
Speaker 1: going to I think continue to happen here.
Speaker 2: Yeah, which is there managers that have zero experience or
Speaker 2: you know, never can a big league dugout. We've kind
Speaker 2: of jumped the gun on awarding people before they even
Speaker 2: accomplished anything. So was that mentality like okay, so you're
Speaker 2: you're on the staff, this guy comes in. Is that
Speaker 2: what you're thinking immediately when they give him this title
Speaker 2: that's never been created with the Mets before they put
Speaker 2: him in a position that I mean, there was some
Speaker 2: overlap between Eppler and Stearns, right, so you have the
Speaker 2: overlap situation. So take me to when this is all
Speaker 2: going down, what everybody's thinking, like, this is going to
Speaker 2: go horribly wrong or maybe this guy knows what he's doing.
Speaker 2: Was it bad from the get you know? Yeah, I
Speaker 2: mean Cohen had the right guy, he had Eppler, you know,
Speaker 2: if he would still be there. There was an inside
Speaker 2: hit job that got Billy fired. Yeah, complete bs situation.
Speaker 2: I'm not going to dive into that, but yes, so
Speaker 2: when you say a hit job, right, like, there were
Speaker 2: people actively playing politics behind the scenes to run him
Speaker 2: out and was it Sterns that likely was the puppet
Speaker 2: master of that now and he could get all the
Speaker 2: control all okay, not at all. He came into a
Speaker 2: situation that was a fire was lit prior to him
Speaker 2: getting there. You know, I think, Steve, how funny is that?
Speaker 1: So carl Eric Schabas mentions that there was an inside
Speaker 1: hit job to get Billy Eppler out, well, because that
Speaker 1: was the whole thing with the guys and the injurl
Speaker 1: lists who weren't on the injured list, and he was
Speaker 1: under investigation. He wounded up being let go when he
Speaker 1: was allegedly going to remain at general manager and I
Speaker 1: think he actually will have I think Billy Eppler, truthfully,
Speaker 1: looking back, probably is a good foil for a guy
Speaker 1: like David Stearns, because he has a hands on he
Speaker 1: comes more from the scathing world, and like he's a
Speaker 1: member of the Brewers organization now and he has been
Speaker 1: for two years working as a special advisor to Matt Arnold.
Speaker 1: So I'm sure that I'm honestly sure that maybe Stern's
Speaker 1: even helping in a word for him there, Like yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean I am confused about just the direction of
Speaker 1: where we're going still, because it's anti David Stearns. Billy
Speaker 1: Upper was the guy Stearns didn't force him out, though
Speaker 1: it was somebody else from the inside. But the problem
Speaker 1: is all David Stearns. That's not connecting. That comment really
Speaker 1: helps me with Eric schab Is, you know, like reputability
Speaker 1: in this whole podcast, it's like you get another chance
Speaker 1: to dump on Sterns. No one really, I mean some
Speaker 1: people who worked in the metal work in twenty twenty
Speaker 1: three could corroborated that against him. But like that's so
Speaker 1: the fact that someone else out there with a hit
Speaker 1: job by Billy Elp is incredible. That is insane. Poor
Speaker 1: Billy Eppler, he's doing good.
Speaker 2: You know that he wanted to go with Sterns. That
Speaker 2: was a well documented grew up in New York's met fans.
Speaker 2: I don't know why that would even matter. They don't
Speaker 2: have the grace of love and winning. Yeah, sure it's equation.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I was because I didn't know David. I
Speaker 2: had some people talk to me about him. There was
Speaker 2: some good, some bad. But I was optimistic. I think
Speaker 2: anytime you start something new, and everything was kind of fresh.
Speaker 2: Carlos was hired, David was coming in. You're you're optimistic,
Speaker 2: you know, and when you have an owner like Steve Cohen,
Speaker 2: And by the way, can we stop with the Steve
Speaker 2: Cohen needs to go? Not that is every team should
Speaker 2: want to know. He's willing to spend the money to win.
Speaker 2: He just he's emotionally involved. He he really wants this
Speaker 2: team to win. And that might be a problem.
Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe we don't want emotionally emotionally involved. I want
Speaker 1: him financially involved. Now, I want him emotionally wanting winning,
Speaker 1: intrigued on winning. I think he is. He's very said
Speaker 1: fast how badly he wants to win. But maybe we
Speaker 1: don't really know what's going on the edges between decision making.
Speaker 1: But this, this is this is a strange diet tribe,
Speaker 1: even for Eric Chovas. So I do want to like,
Speaker 1: can we get to the fucking point.
Speaker 2: He's going to get there at some point, you know.
Speaker 2: Like I said, I just don't know where he got
Speaker 2: the advice that that Stearns was going to be the guy.
Speaker 2: It's plain and simple. He's not. He's made a lot
Speaker 2: of mistakes, right from from day one, you know. Last year.
Speaker 2: I'll go back to this a little bit, and I've
Speaker 2: hint on it before.
Speaker 1: Here we go.
Speaker 2: We didn't make the right moves to get us into
Speaker 2: the playoffs, right. We had struggled mightily in the beginning. Offensively,
Speaker 2: pitchers were great, Yeah, they were probably over forming at
Speaker 2: the time, and the offense picked up towards the end
Speaker 2: of the year. The offense was rolling. The pitching really
Speaker 2: really was hurting. The moves, the right moves the starting pitching,
Speaker 2: the two or three right moves weren't made, and that's
Speaker 2: why we kind of didn't make the playoffs and we
Speaker 2: kind of burnt out at the end. I really firmly
Speaker 2: believe in my heart that if that team had gotten
Speaker 2: into the playoffs, it was going to be I'm not
Speaker 2: saying we were gone all the way, but God, we
Speaker 2: would have been dangerous with the right moves made. What
Speaker 2: were the moves that needed to be made. We need
Speaker 2: and we needed some bullpen arms.
Speaker 1: Okay, two starting pitchers. The best starting pitcher that was
Speaker 1: moved on the deadline last year was Merril Kelly. Merrill
Speaker 1: Kelly sunk the Ranger season. He was horrible. Any chance
Speaker 1: that they had of getting hot in the second half,
Speaker 1: Meryl Kelly absolutely demolished that. So the Mets could have
Speaker 1: either trade for Merril Kelly or was Flairty moved again
Speaker 1: last deadline or no he wasn't. No, he stuck with
Speaker 1: tadlines ago. So yeah, I think this is something that
Speaker 1: we've said too. I wish we could have magically found
Speaker 1: whoever the starting pitchers that were going to be traded
Speaker 1: were and had him on the Mets. There was nobody moved.
Speaker 1: There wasn't a starting picture to get no, and that's
Speaker 1: why it was a unique and historic deadline for relief pitchers,
Speaker 1: which we tried to do that we got all of them.
Speaker 1: One of the most consistent relief pitchers, consistent and dominant
Speaker 1: relief pitchers and all of baseball over the last five years,
Speaker 1: and he just completely failed. Shane Bieber was the other
Speaker 1: starting pitcher was moved last year and he was still
Speaker 1: in the injury list for three weeks after that happened.
Speaker 1: And it's like it's it was just not a deadline
Speaker 1: for starting pitchers and moves. But that's like today, Yeah,
Speaker 1: Dustin May which was a complete disaster. And to bring
Speaker 1: up like a couple of bullpen arms, they grabbed a
Speaker 1: bunch of bullpen arms. They got Hellsley, they got Tyler Rogers,
Speaker 1: David when got Gregorrisoto a little bit earlier, right before
Speaker 1: the deadline. So like, yep, everything was relatively addressed except
Speaker 1: the starting pitch. Now we can tell yes, yeah, cool,
Speaker 1: we could add zactly tell Like if that's what Eric
Speaker 1: Schabas is saying the Mets needed to make the playoffs, lash,
Speaker 1: you're Merrill Kelly's actly tell? Okay, Like shade us for
Speaker 1: not thinking that these bad pictures would have been guys
Speaker 1: that we needed to go get. Meryl Kelly's not bad,
Speaker 1: but he was terrible in that sense. Also say this,
Speaker 1: like to think about how them as acted after the
Speaker 1: trade deadline. About two and a half weeks later, Nolan
Speaker 1: McClain was on the team. Yah if he was swung
Speaker 1: two or three of these deals for the veterans, and
Speaker 1: then maybe Nolal mclin doesn't come up and he was
Speaker 1: better than any of those guys could have been at all.
Speaker 1: So maybe that was I'm sure something the front office
Speaker 1: considered as well. I mean, of course, with sprote, Tong
Speaker 1: and mclan all getting their chances after the trade deadline,
Speaker 1: they were like, are we giving up assets to get
Speaker 1: something that's even better than what we actually have here
Speaker 1: right now? And it doesn't seem like it. And I
Speaker 1: do think again, a lot of these things can be true.
Speaker 1: David Searns made moves. The moves did not work, and
Speaker 1: at the time, I think any met fan who thought
Speaker 1: that that was going to be the case, again, you
Speaker 1: were lying or you just had a predisposed bias that
Speaker 1: you didn't want to like these moves no matter what
Speaker 1: they were, because on paper, they were all good trades
Speaker 1: without a doubt. And just like a third of the
Speaker 1: way through the EC three podcast right now, I think
Speaker 1: Early Takes is sour grapes. Sour grapes shocker. The guy
Speaker 1: who got fired by the President of Baseball Operations doesn't
Speaker 1: love the way that the President of Baseball Operations, does
Speaker 1: his job and then a hitchob done on one of
Speaker 1: his best friends in the industry. Yes, as well, both
Speaker 1: of his best friends. It seems like he loves Billyupler,
Speaker 1: he loves Carlos Mendoza.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Don't listen to what Eric Schabas said though about prior
Speaker 1: experience and pedigree, because that doesn't apply to Carls Mendoz
Speaker 1: being the manager or Billy Elpler being the GM.
Speaker 2: The ones, the players that were brought in, whether it
Speaker 2: was you know, they weren't the right fit for New York,
Speaker 2: which you got to do your homework on these guys
Speaker 2: if you're gonna bring him to a big town like this,
Speaker 2: the right pieces just didn't perform. They hadn't worked out.
Speaker 1: How could you do homework to know if someone is
Speaker 1: right for New York? It's could you ask Brian Helsley,
Speaker 1: can you handle the bright lights? And I was gonna
Speaker 1: say no, Yeah, he says no, Definitely don't get him
Speaker 1: then like he's gonna pull the Zach Grankey where Granky's like,
Speaker 1: I can't pitch for the Yankees. Yeah, Like David Bednar
Speaker 1: is from Pittsburgh, he handles New York. Well, yeah, I
Speaker 1: feel like that we know they didn't handle it well,
Speaker 1: but I don't know how we could have known that better.
Speaker 1: There possibly could have been so ways to suss this out,
Speaker 1: like maybe speaking to friends in the industry about how
Speaker 1: these guys short themselves. But begat Helsley's the main one
Speaker 1: there where Secha Amalin sucked, who's gonna suck them a
Speaker 1: otther what Tyler Rogers was solid? Who's gonna be solid
Speaker 1: on oyther Wise? Gregory's house sucked? Yeah, well now he
Speaker 1: was okay again. Ryan Helsley was the breaking point last year.
Speaker 1: It's just broke very much.
Speaker 2: You know, he tried. You know.
Speaker 1: By the way, what were some of Billy Eppler's trade
Speaker 1: deadline acquisitions that worked out really really well? Just for
Speaker 1: people at home. I finally remember Mets fans looking back
Speaker 1: to twenty twenty two trade deadline really being a fan.
Speaker 1: Tyler and Aquin, Yes it's my brother ain damn picture
Speaker 1: back picture Darren Ruff.
Speaker 2: And I think another huge fault of it was we
Speaker 2: had young players that you can't hold on to all
Speaker 2: of them. Right. We had a great farm system Billy
Speaker 2: put together and started rebuilding the farm system, and we
Speaker 2: had jumped out to I think number one in the
Speaker 2: farm system, at least the top five. And you hold
Speaker 2: on to some of these guys too long and they're value.
Speaker 2: They're not all going to pan out right, and you
Speaker 2: made trade a guy or two who goes to another organization.
Speaker 2: But if you move a couple of those pieces and
Speaker 2: you get a starting pitcher back for two or three
Speaker 2: years or whatever it is, and you help us bolster
Speaker 2: the bullpen and a bullpen and the starting rotation, you're
Speaker 2: looking at a whole different team last year.
Speaker 1: So it seems like he's saying the messiting on Fiano's baby,
Speaker 1: I think that crew, Yeah that crew, while also at
Speaker 1: the same time saying that you should have gotten somebody
Speaker 1: that didn't exist on the market. Yeah, you want he
Speaker 1: wanted the starting pitchers, wanted Sandy or Joe Ryan, and
Speaker 1: those guys weren't moved. Yeah, he wanted good pictures with
Speaker 1: two or three years of control. And also, like again
Speaker 1: Revision's history, you couldn't have traded Brett Bay the deadline
Speaker 1: last year. He was one of the best players on
Speaker 1: your team. He feels crazy evening now. And maybe they
Speaker 1: wanted to trade Vieno's but Vientos is playing so poorly.
Speaker 1: I don't know what they could have gotten for him.
Speaker 1: The only big Fianta's rumor was the hymn for Louise Robert,
Speaker 1: and it was like that would That's not exactly what
Speaker 1: talking about either. He's not talking about center feel. He
Speaker 1: was talk about starting pitching. Yeah, and you know, like
Speaker 1: just like he wanted these starting pitchers that didn't exist
Speaker 1: on the trade market, being these multiple year frontline starters.
Speaker 1: I want to be six foot five and play shortstop
Speaker 1: for the New York Mets. It will be nice. I
Speaker 1: also be talking about not holding out too many of
Speaker 1: these prospects for sure. Yes, they also did trade a
Speaker 1: lot of them in the last year. Yeah, it's they are,
Speaker 1: and a lot of the ones that they traded, it's
Speaker 1: like it was kind of good move, Like Blade did
Speaker 1: well and Drew Gilbert don't seem to be particularly impactful
Speaker 1: players at all right now. No, he's his bias has
Speaker 1: gotten kind of stuck with the Cardinals. Jose Bunto had
Speaker 1: the major injury and wasn't particularly good. Yeah, it just
Speaker 1: feels like a lot of the trades, again, process wise,
Speaker 1: weren't too bad. Luisan helocunya can't stinks. Yeah. So process wise, again,
Speaker 1: a lot of those trades actually did work out philosophically,
Speaker 1: like shops.
Speaker 2: Wanted, I would have went to the playoffs and made
Speaker 2: some noise. So from that standpoint, there was tons of
Speaker 2: mistakes made that didn't pan out. Sure, it's like, okay,
Speaker 2: are you are you building a winner? And every year
Speaker 2: if you got a chance, you got to go, especially
Speaker 2: in New York. Maybe you talked about the White Sox
Speaker 2: and they're having there a year or two early on
Speaker 2: the winning you don't fall in last, but work in
Speaker 2: the big cities, you go for it, especially with an
Speaker 2: owner who is willing to spend money. You is this
Speaker 2: a teardown? Is this a rebuild? Like are we looking
Speaker 2: to the future? Yeah? The moves that were made this
Speaker 2: off you get rid of your core. Okay, this is
Speaker 2: another big red flag. So me, who's the core? Yeah?
Speaker 2: And I talked about this is offseason when he made
Speaker 2: these moves, I go, this is not the way I
Speaker 2: would know about it. Right, Because of all the winning
Speaker 2: teams and players and organizations that have been you always
Speaker 2: have a core, right, you have two or three really
Speaker 2: good starting pitchers, like a one in a two and
Speaker 2: then you have you know, a couple of threes and
Speaker 2: fours whatever it does, and then you have a core
Speaker 2: three or four players. And they had that, they had
Speaker 2: all of this right, maybe lack.
Speaker 1: Yeah, he said, all these good baseball teams, you know,
Speaker 1: they have a core of one or two really good
Speaker 1: study pitchers. And then at three and a four he
Speaker 1: just did, good baseball teams have rotations. Yeah, like he
Speaker 1: just whatever the way he's describing the makeup of a
Speaker 1: good team. Also, why is he not take any player's
Speaker 1: names right now? It's driving me insane that like shout
Speaker 1: out Chris Hamblin. He's trying to get answers out of shops.
Speaker 1: He is talking in fucking circles. It's driving me insane. Which,
Speaker 1: if this is any of the way like he coached,
Speaker 1: I can imagine why the Mets hitters looked so fucking
Speaker 1: confused at times last year. We're getting to a crazy
Speaker 1: point about coaching soon. This is we're not far from
Speaker 1: where I cut myself off yesterday. And he says something
Speaker 1: that didn't make out of social media. It is jarring. Okay,
Speaker 1: so should shud press player? Should we talk a little
Speaker 1: bit more about the cores A. You're gonna keep going now, press.
Speaker 2: Playing and starting rotation where we needed some some big
Speaker 2: dogs to come in. But that's where you trade some
Speaker 2: of the young prospects to bring those guys in, right
Speaker 2: and so did Yeah, yeah, they trade you know, they
Speaker 2: get rid of Alonso, which hurt Nemo and trade them. McNeil.
Speaker 2: You let Diaz kind of walk and go to the Dodgers.
Speaker 2: You get out bid by the Dodgers. You know, this
Speaker 2: whole off season was a disaster, so you could see
Speaker 2: this this was coming. Yeah, because you can't one You
Speaker 2: can't just spend money and buy a winning team.
Speaker 1: Did you guys just hear what he said? And have
Speaker 1: you heard what he said before? Okay, offseason in retrospect disaster,
Speaker 1: we know it. Peter A, Lonzo being on this team
Speaker 1: and brand Nemo would be positive. So there's no doubt
Speaker 1: about it. We would love to have them instead of
Speaker 1: some of the guys that we have right now. We don't.
Speaker 1: Mets are still not a playoff team with those guys
Speaker 1: because they weren't a playoff team with those guys last year.
Speaker 1: Jeff McNeal is about to be defaed by the Athletics.
Speaker 1: He is having one of the worst seasons in baseball,
Speaker 1: Edwin Diaz hasn't pitched in months.
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Speaker 1: And then he just said, yeah, you can't just spend
Speaker 1: a lot of money and make a good baseball team.
Speaker 1: But which four guys? Yeah, he did say that you
Speaker 1: have an owner who will spend as much money as
Speaker 1: you need to build a winning team. And the advocate
Speaker 1: for getting these guys back in the mess was to
Speaker 1: spend a lot of money to do so. Yes, So
Speaker 1: it's interesting. It's interesting how it works talking out both
Speaker 1: sides of your mouth. There shefis, guy, can't.
Speaker 2: You have to? We've talked about everything, but there's the
Speaker 2: pieces that fit together that make the team what it
Speaker 2: should be. And it's funny because the fans will be like, well,
Speaker 2: they didn't win anything and not there's only one team
Speaker 2: that does it every year, right, and so you have
Speaker 2: twenty nine other teams that didn't get it done or
Speaker 2: whatever you want to say. But really, what you're looking
Speaker 2: for is an organization is an opportunity to go to
Speaker 2: the playoffs every single year, right, Because but.
Speaker 1: David Start didn't acomplish anything in Milwaukee. No, he did
Speaker 1: not accomplish anything Milwaukee. But all you want to do
Speaker 1: is make the playoffs every year, and that's how you
Speaker 1: know you're a good organization. Cold Post movie is creat
Speaker 1: Did he know what he was gonna say before he
Speaker 1: got into this or he was like he called up
Speaker 1: Chris Hamblin said, come to the garage. I got a
Speaker 1: couple of mics I got, I got golf clubs in
Speaker 1: the back. Yeah, we're gonna talk. We're gonna talk. You're
Speaker 1: gonna ask me questions. I won't answer them, and I
Speaker 1: will completely contradict myself within minutes. Somehow, we're only a
Speaker 1: third of the way through this podcast. By the way, Oh,
Speaker 1: I thought we were way longer. Eleven minutes. I thought
Speaker 1: this twenty nine is for SIS thirty nine, thirty nine
Speaker 1: a crap shoot.
Speaker 2: And it happened like you know, like I really felt
Speaker 2: last year, if we got in anything could have happened,
Speaker 2: we would have made a pretty good run. But you
Speaker 2: kind of tear that down right, and you talk about
Speaker 2: clubhouse culture and you talk about the people like That's
Speaker 2: what's upsetting to me, is like even when you fire
Speaker 2: the whole coaching staff, right and you let go quality
Speaker 2: players that have been there, done that before, that know
Speaker 2: what it's like to walk the fire that help you
Speaker 2: know these players navigate you know, the Since twenty two
Speaker 2: to twenty five, it's not an easy walk in New York.
Speaker 2: The right personalities to help these players kind of navigate
Speaker 2: the season, and you just kind of move on from
Speaker 2: the Core. And one it's like, you know, the fans
Speaker 2: are upset, they're losing their their favorite players, their jerseys.
Speaker 2: You maybe make one or two move, but you don't
Speaker 2: got the whole thing.
Speaker 1: Most fair point he's had, that's probably the biggest oversight
Speaker 1: from David Stearns was that too much change, too much
Speaker 1: change all at once. I think we all are in
Speaker 1: agreement with that. It is also funny though, again mentioning
Speaker 1: make trying to make the playoffs every single year that
Speaker 1: core historically did not make the playoffs and back to
Speaker 1: back years. Yeah, Mets historically an organization, have almost ever
Speaker 1: made the playoffs and back to back years. Yeah, It's like,
Speaker 1: it's crazy, how fews this actually happened for a team
Speaker 1: that's been around as long as them, loved the Core
Speaker 1: when it existed, it did not accomplish anything, especially in
Speaker 1: Eric Schabz his eyes.
Speaker 2: And then expect to go sign some free agents and
Speaker 2: whatever your processes of you know how you're evaluating and
Speaker 2: acquiring pieces to build a team, run prevention to me,
Speaker 2: has been the biggest piece of garbage that have that
Speaker 2: has come out of his mouth. And first of all,
Speaker 2: we've talked about it's called pitching and defense, right.
Speaker 1: Right, So then he's just mad about the semantics. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1: he gets it.
Speaker 2: He gets into that, let's not insult everybody with your
Speaker 2: big words, and you know, we're just gonna and we
Speaker 2: know what you mean, pitching and defense. So run prevention
Speaker 2: became this big thing, and you know, and and that's great,
Speaker 2: Like I I firmly believe to combat how good pitching
Speaker 2: has become is yeah, you need pitching and defense, and
Speaker 2: you need guys that make high contact, but you still
Speaker 2: need guys that that can drive the ball to the
Speaker 2: park and be productive and those Lindor was there. You
Speaker 2: had signed Sodo and this is where I want to
Speaker 2: go to run prevention. And I love Sodo. I think
Speaker 2: he's a top three hitter, Hall of Fame guy, already
Speaker 2: one World Series, great offensive sign. I don't know how
Speaker 2: that fits into run prevention because and this is not
Speaker 2: me knocking him, this is industry numbers telling you that
Speaker 2: he's a well below average outfield. Clearly you can watch,
Speaker 2: you know, So how do we factor that into run prevention.
Speaker 2: And if that is the case, right, if defense is
Speaker 2: a big deal for you, you know, and he's a
Speaker 2: below average outfielder, how do you not have the backbone
Speaker 2: to substitute him late in the games for defense, right,
Speaker 2: because it happens with every other player.
Speaker 1: You can't take one Solo out of the game for defense, dude.
Speaker 1: I mean, if you're up, even if the chance of
Speaker 1: it's again the ball goes over the fence and the
Speaker 1: game becomes tied, you can't take him off the field.
Speaker 1: And I else just want to say, it's kind of amazing,
Speaker 1: but Solo is a zero AA this year. I was
Speaker 1: told he's a horrendous outfielder. I think again, when you
Speaker 1: watch him like the whole time, he's by no means
Speaker 1: good out there, No, no, no, he's he's been adequate
Speaker 1: this year, which again we'll take especially when you're paying
Speaker 1: guy that much money, you probably just want that value.
Speaker 1: And similarly, you just called him Ted Williams and then said,
Speaker 1: how do you not have the bad take field because
Speaker 1: you shouldn't ever take to wat So off the field.
Speaker 1: Doesn't matter Ted Williams. You're gonna take Ted Williams off
Speaker 1: the field. Eric Schoff has just compared him to Ted
Speaker 1: Williams and then said, well that David Stearns doesn't have
Speaker 1: the backbone to take him off the field. So he's
Speaker 1: claiming that David Stearns is making the decisions in game two.
Speaker 1: Now we're a getting some of that next. But remember
Speaker 1: tedl Onan's accomplish anything didn't win the World Series. Oh shit,
Speaker 1: that's a really good point le World series. Telons Din
Speaker 1: accomplish anything has won a World Series, accomplished a lot.
Speaker 2: But are you afraid of, you know, hurting his feelings?
Speaker 2: You know, because if you go all in on something,
Speaker 2: go all in right, put your best defensive team. If
Speaker 2: that's your philosophy, can have think I think that's overplayed
Speaker 2: where they make a defensive substitution late. But if that's
Speaker 2: the way you're going, let's let's do it and make
Speaker 2: your defense better. How much of this is hubrious an
Speaker 2: ego with Sterns thinking that, you know what, when I
Speaker 2: came in, we made it to the NLCS, but that
Speaker 2: wasn't my my squad, that wasn't my deal. Those were
Speaker 2: guys that were here before me. I have my fingerprints
Speaker 2: on that. For me to be successful. I need to
Speaker 2: break this thing all the way down. Why would he
Speaker 2: ever think get rid of everybody and just reinsert my
Speaker 2: people and it's going to be a two or three
Speaker 2: year process.
Speaker 1: Sorry to interrupt, like as much as we are, but
Speaker 1: it is crazy, like to just like Chris Hamblin again,
Speaker 1: I'm not taking shots at this guy, do a great job.
Speaker 1: But he's like, is it Sterns's ego where he's now
Speaker 1: putting in words of like basically telling people this is
Speaker 1: what David Sterns is thinking. He's like, I don't want
Speaker 1: to win with someone else's guys. We have no history
Speaker 1: of that. There's also some oddrovision's history about that twenty
Speaker 1: twenty four Mets team where like I mean, Harrison Bata
Speaker 1: came in a one win player. He was a one
Speaker 1: year deal for Stern. J D Martinez, massive point of leadership,
Speaker 1: great moments with the bat. Not super consistent season, but
Speaker 1: he had a good season. Tyrone Taylor, Jose Glacis combined
Speaker 1: for five war That's crazy. Think to look back and
Speaker 1: think about that for a second. The two of the
Speaker 1: guys who came in on one year deals, Jesse Winker
Speaker 1: as a trade deadline piece, was a huge piece in
Speaker 1: that run. Luis I'm just gonna say Luis Torenz first
Speaker 1: changed the season when Mets made a weird trade for
Speaker 1: him in early June, late May. Sevrino and me and
Speaker 1: I were carrying that team like it was a lot
Speaker 1: of start Remember Regarrett, Yeah, Garrett was awesome. It was
Speaker 1: a lot of his turns, his fingerprints on that team,
Speaker 1: of course, he I mean a lot of it was
Speaker 1: from the team before. The Corps was very good that year,
Speaker 1: between Alonzo Lindor, Nemo Viento's everything. Guys were in the
Speaker 1: organization for a while. But to say that Davidstats had
Speaker 1: no impact on that run is ludicrous. That's ludicrous. And
Speaker 1: I think it's also crazy to be like David Surtin's like, oh,
Speaker 1: I don't want to win with those guys, Like would
Speaker 1: he why would he care how they win? Well, this
Speaker 1: is why Hambling's a good host, because right now he's thrown,
Speaker 1: He's throwing up the soft tossed south. So this is
Speaker 1: what he is telling Shabaz go be crazy.
Speaker 2: I think some of that is just like I'm smarter
Speaker 2: than everybody else. This will work and it's gonna suck,
Speaker 2: but I need people that are bought in to do it.
Speaker 2: That's and that's the biggest fault of educated people is
Speaker 2: they do think they're smarter than you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I remember that line. The biggest fault of educated
Speaker 1: people is they think they're smarter than you. I didn't
Speaker 1: know education was a fault by the way, I didn't
Speaker 1: know being educated was now a negative. That's insane. Take
Speaker 1: away the David sertains, that's an insane conversation to have.
Speaker 1: The anti intellectualism is running rampant right now, is horrific.
Speaker 1: And this is like, I'm excited, and.
Speaker 2: There has to be especially in this game. You know,
Speaker 2: it's built around failure. You have to have a little
Speaker 2: bit of humility there. There's there's nothing wrong with being
Speaker 2: confident in what you do. But when you do walk
Speaker 2: into that room and you kind of are talking to
Speaker 2: people down, you know, about educating them, and just the
Speaker 2: way somebody talks to you, you can kind of feel it.
Speaker 2: Everybody said those experiences, the one yesterday was insane. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it was insane. He uses a word to one of
Speaker 2: these reporters. You people are just like what in the
Speaker 2: hell right, Like, okay, thanks pal, appreciate that.
Speaker 1: We're critiquing now the language that he uses. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I didn't think that press conference on Friday from starts
Speaker 1: of that bad. He could have shown more humility, but
Speaker 1: like I didn't think he was like trying to pretend
Speaker 1: like he seemed like kind of solemn whether he was
Speaker 1: telling the truth or I seemed upset and he seemed
Speaker 1: like honest. I also think that like everyone wants David
Speaker 1: Sturtns to be like, I've done a terrible job. He
Speaker 1: said at the top, Yeah said at the top, so
Speaker 1: that this is not a successful season. I think people
Speaker 1: want the exact words. Again, we're having a lot of
Speaker 1: semantics stocks. It feels like on this EC three podcast
Speaker 1: that they don't like the they literally just mentioned semantics.
Speaker 1: Were like, what does that word even mean? I My
Speaker 1: brain is not pick enough to understand this language. You're
Speaker 1: an asshole. Like we're getting to another story again. Didn't
Speaker 1: make out the social media very soon? Is right when
Speaker 1: I cut it off that I'm excited, And.
Speaker 2: For me, it's like, don't don't bullshit fan with your
Speaker 2: philosophies and you know how you phrase things. Just just
Speaker 2: give a city wins. The city doesn't care about your
Speaker 2: philosophies and your analytics and your try just deliver a
Speaker 2: winning product on the field, right, don't sell them Carl
Speaker 2: salesman pitch and you know, filled with big words and
Speaker 2: all this stuff like just build a winner. Be quiet
Speaker 2: about what you're doing behind doors between you and your team,
Speaker 2: and you need to reevaluate what you guys are doing
Speaker 2: behind closed doors. Whoever is advising him, and maybe nobody is.
Speaker 2: Maybe this is a solo cowboy just riding on his
Speaker 2: horse president. You know, yeah, there's a part of his ego,
Speaker 2: his his brain telling himself that he's smarter than everybody else.
Speaker 2: This is how the direction I'm going to go. And
Speaker 2: you're reinventing the wheel and that that to me, that's
Speaker 2: a baseball issue is we're reinventing the wheel of how
Speaker 2: to play this game.
Speaker 1: It's just so reinventing the wheel of how to play.
Speaker 1: Because David certain said run prevention was something that he
Speaker 1: was interested in, Eric Schabas said, actually, the truth of
Speaker 1: run prevention is pitching and defense, and that's how baseball's
Speaker 1: always been played. So just because he used a different
Speaker 1: word to say pitching in defense with Eric schaba is
Speaker 1: decoded as run prevention. That's that's changing the way the
Speaker 1: game has been played. This is the jock first nerd
Speaker 1: in security. Yes, this is the is Mega.
Speaker 2: It's the same game. It's the same game like it.
Speaker 2: Don't get too smart, don't ever get too smart. What
Speaker 2: it is is an echo chambers smart. He talked about
Speaker 2: people that aren't good with conflicts, right, your situation when
Speaker 2: with your phone call for people that haven't heard this before,
Speaker 2: You've talked about it on the podcast. But when you
Speaker 2: got let go, and this is I want to get
Speaker 2: this story and then I want to get into what
Speaker 2: was actually going on in the clubhouse and with the staff.
Speaker 2: But tell the story about when you got let go
Speaker 2: by Stearns and how weird in just like awkward it was. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so I'm gonna I'm actually I'm going to build up
Speaker 2: to that first. Okay, cool, let me let me take
Speaker 2: this back to the very beginning. Yeah, so when he
Speaker 2: was high beginning, Carlos decides he wants me on staff.
Speaker 2: He wants me to be a hitting coach. Great, well, whatever,
Speaker 2: this is me after becoming bench coach, right which I
Speaker 2: had aspirations of managing bench coach, where was where I
Speaker 2: really wanted to be your staff. Whatever you need to do,
Speaker 2: let's go.
Speaker 1: What happened to you?
Speaker 2: So Stearns calls me and we're talking about my salary
Speaker 2: and as a bench coach, I had a certain salary
Speaker 2: and he goes, well, he goes, I'm gonna have to
Speaker 2: have you take a pay cut this year because you're
Speaker 2: and I'm going to my to me, that's the first one.
Speaker 2: And we're not talking about like we're talking about thirty
Speaker 2: forty thousand. Right for me, it's not the money for me,
Speaker 2: it's it's the message you're sending, right you You you
Speaker 2: just came off of a fifty million dollars deal, right,
Speaker 2: the Mets aren't struggling for money, and you're gonna ask
Speaker 2: me to take a pay cut. How about just say, hey,
Speaker 2: we're going to keep your salary the same, we're happier
Speaker 2: on staff. Let's go right a handle piece, I.
Speaker 1: Mean dog move. That's a dog move by sterians. Okay,
Speaker 1: Like again he was that he was kind of it
Speaker 1: seems like he might have been pushing him to quit.
Speaker 1: It seemed like he was like, how can I force
Speaker 1: her Shoppas to not actually be on this staff. We're
Speaker 1: gonna demote you to hitting coach. We're also going to
Speaker 1: hire another hitting coach and I'm gonna pay you less money,
Speaker 1: and Eric Shobba take money after your podcast. Also, if
Speaker 1: he felt this fucking wrong about it, why did he
Speaker 1: accept he didn't have to work for the team. It
Speaker 1: seems like he had no interest in being here besides
Speaker 1: working with Carlos Mendoza. I mean, like you said, the
Speaker 1: money wasn't an issue. The money wasn't the issue. The
Speaker 1: hymn evoking Stearns is full salary over five years. Like
Speaker 1: that's that's crazy if that has any impact on how
Speaker 1: much Eric Schaba should getting paid. Also, he did admit
Speaker 1: he got demoted from bench coach to hitting coach, but
Speaker 1: expected to be paid the same Yes, in a lesser job.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that was red flag number one.
Speaker 1: One number two.
Speaker 2: During the next season, we I had players coming up
Speaker 2: from Triple A telling me is the one that the
Speaker 2: hitting coach was telling players that the only way they
Speaker 2: can get to the big leagues is to pull the
Speaker 2: ball in the air and try to hit homers. Right.
Speaker 2: So okay, And the reason why this hit hard for
Speaker 2: me is because the hitting part is a reflection on me. Right,
Speaker 2: So I can't control, you know, what somebody else's thoughts,
Speaker 2: what they're telling our players. And they come up and
Speaker 2: I'm like, no, I don't want that.
Speaker 1: I want the broken I fucking knew it. I fucking
Speaker 1: knew this guy was going against the way that this
Speaker 1: team should.
Speaker 2: Get more hits way for the game winning hit. I
Speaker 2: don't need three run homers and guys, I want the
Speaker 2: broken bat hit to the opposite way for the game
Speaker 2: winning hit. I don't need three run homers and guys
Speaker 2: trying to hit homers where, you know, offensively, and we
Speaker 2: look at the game offensively, it's probably at as lowest
Speaker 2: and there's reasons for that. Sure. Philosophies are a big
Speaker 2: part of that. And so I went and I sent
Speaker 2: an email to the whole minor league staff. I didn't
Speaker 2: address that coach specifically, and I just said, hey, I'm
Speaker 2: hearing from players that this is what we're teaching, and
Speaker 2: I said, I adamantly disagree with this. I think we're
Speaker 2: doing a disjustice to the organization.
Speaker 1: And the players justice.
Speaker 2: And obviously David reads all the emails, so he calls
Speaker 2: me in and he tells me that, you know, what
Speaker 2: did you mean by that? And I went and I
Speaker 2: told him, I said, I I don't agree in that philosophy.
Speaker 2: I want guys to just be good hitters and the
Speaker 2: power will come. Yeah, you talk to any great player.
Speaker 2: None of them talk about hitting home runs. None of
Speaker 2: them talking about pulling the ball right. It's stay up
Speaker 2: the middle, get a good pitch to hit, you know,
Speaker 2: have a consistent path to the ball. And I said
Speaker 2: I disagree with this. He goes, well, I don't, And
Speaker 2: I go, Okay, that's fine. You can have your opinion.
Speaker 2: But I'm telling you every great hitter Hall of Fame,
Speaker 2: you go ask them, had any of them had that philosophy?
Speaker 2: And this is again we're recreating that we're getting too smart, right, No.
Speaker 1: This is the insecurity. This is the jock person there,
Speaker 1: the security against security thing. And it does again. Now
Speaker 1: when you see all the step you're like, oh, the
Speaker 1: Mets actually were trying to freeze Eric Shavas out of
Speaker 1: this organization. He wasn't involved in organization hitting philosophy discussions.
Speaker 1: He wasn't. They disrespected him by they disrespected by Dockney's
Speaker 1: paying Doty's role. The second David Sermons was hired, they
Speaker 1: were like, get out of it. Here, dude, and this
Speaker 1: philosophical things going on that he's not aware of. And
Speaker 1: Eric Schavez takes it upon himself send an email to
Speaker 1: the whole organization. I don't like this. I don't like this.
Speaker 1: Stop doing it. Credit David Starts for calling him in
Speaker 1: being like, let's have a conversation about that. And he
Speaker 1: was like, he was like why, And Eric Schavias is like,
Speaker 1: again anecdotal evidence, not using anything to prove his point.
Speaker 1: No good no good hitters ever said this kind of talk.
Speaker 1: Talk to any Hall of Famer. Yeah, which, by the way,
Speaker 1: I think Ted Williams was a huge proponent of pulling
Speaker 1: the baseball in the air. I think that was like
Speaker 1: a big part of his game.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, talks about a lot. He did call wansto Ted Williams. Yes. Also,
Speaker 1: that was good.
Speaker 2: That was good.
Speaker 1: It didn't make on social media.
Speaker 2: Was great.
Speaker 1: That should be all over it. That's a here's one
Speaker 1: thing I will take from this. There to be negative
Speaker 1: towards David Searts for a second, both sides here. That's
Speaker 1: toxic what he's been doing to Eric Schavis for sure.
Speaker 2: For sure.
Speaker 1: It seemed like they were like, what can we do
Speaker 1: to get rid of this guy without it. And again this
Speaker 1: comes back to that well Sam a point made yesterday.
Speaker 1: I must want to see him pulse. Theyn't want to
Speaker 1: keep looking like as much turno as to quit. Maybe
Speaker 1: they wanted Mendoza to quit. I mean the language was
Speaker 1: part ways, wasn't fired, That's true. It's like I don't
Speaker 1: again if number one critique of David Stearns this person
Speaker 1: the person stuff might not come very naturally to him. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a nice way I can say that, but it's
Speaker 1: too smart what Eric schabb is going about. This is
Speaker 1: very funny. Yeah, it is man so sour grapes. This
Speaker 1: is also super fucking funny how David Surtns handled Eric
Speaker 1: Shavas now because Eric Schabas is an asshole, yes, seems
Speaker 1: and again seems like he didn't want him in that role. Nopee,
Speaker 1: there's your camera. There's the camera, right, so put it back.
Speaker 2: I'll come back. Course, most of the balls that are
Speaker 2: pull our home runs are hit hard on the pool site,
Speaker 2: of course, but that's not the message you're preaching, right,
Speaker 2: There's there's context of how to get to that, and
Speaker 2: we want guys to hit the ball hard in Homer's
Speaker 2: not by telling him to do it right, and there's
Speaker 2: I want to get there, but I don't do it
Speaker 2: that way. And even for me as a hitter, when
Speaker 2: I try to hit homers, it's either a swinging, a
Speaker 2: mess or a pop up.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's you, Eric Shavz, that is you. That is
Speaker 1: your problem. Why are you using your anecdotal evidence to
Speaker 1: cover everybody? He admits that David Stern's process for hitting
Speaker 1: is exactly correct, and then at the exact same time
Speaker 1: says I couldn't do it though, so I would never
Speaker 1: teach it. Also, we're at the same time a full
Speaker 1: scale organizational approach for every single hit. They're probably not
Speaker 1: the best way to fellow play, of course not We
Speaker 1: did talk about it yesterday in the podcast, how the
Speaker 1: Mets do need to have A and B swings. There
Speaker 1: needs to be an adjustment when you have two strikes,
Speaker 1: you need to play the scoreboard a little bit more.
Speaker 1: That's totally true. This also might have been a flipping
Speaker 1: comment from the minor league coach, yes, like being like, oh,
Speaker 1: you guys want to get to the pros, let's let's
Speaker 1: pust fly balls, get the ball over the fence. That
Speaker 1: could just be like a ry rock kind of.
Speaker 2: Thing zero pitch, which which I hardly ever swung at.
Speaker 2: You try to what are you a three zero pitch?
Speaker 2: Everybody wants to go deep and you end up popping
Speaker 2: it up and you know, you get yourself out of
Speaker 2: a at a good count. So anyway, so we disagreed
Speaker 2: on that, and I told him I'm adamantly gonna stick
Speaker 2: by my guns on this. I don't believe in this,
Speaker 2: and we kind of like part of the room and
Speaker 2: coincided with the Triple A analytical hitting guy, right, And
Speaker 2: so that was number two. Number three was when we
Speaker 2: signed One. And I love One, by the way. I
Speaker 2: want will give you the shirt off his back. I
Speaker 2: think he's one of the coolest human beings, just a
Speaker 2: really good person. But he struggled the first two months emotionally, right,
Speaker 2: and I I don't blame him, big move going from
Speaker 2: the Yankees. Maybe had a little bit of buyer's remorse.
Speaker 2: It's all gonna work out. One's going to the Hall
Speaker 2: of Fame. You know. I even tapped him to be
Speaker 2: an m VP type of player, and he's he's going
Speaker 2: on like he's hitting wise, he's unreal. He struggled in
Speaker 2: between seven years into his career. He would run from
Speaker 2: the outfield and go sit on in the batting cage
Speaker 2: on a couch and not being the dugout with the teammate. Right.
Speaker 2: And like I said, I'm not throwing one. This isn't
Speaker 2: a one issue, right, This is this is a leadership,
Speaker 2: lack of leadership, lack of accountability from the top down, not.
Speaker 1: About cols Medoza top down. Who who is above the players?
Speaker 1: Just real quick, it's definitely the manager, the manager. There's
Speaker 1: also a situation where he goes into more of this
Speaker 1: about one not being the dug out, going in the cage.
Speaker 1: One sucked at the beginning of last year. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: could see maybe one him not being super comfortable yet,
Speaker 1: but I think a more likely reason that one Soda
Speaker 1: would have been so strict with his cage work was
Speaker 1: trying to get a swing on track.
Speaker 2: Yes, poor he was, And we had an assistant GM
Speaker 2: who would sit there with him. The assistance team would
Speaker 2: sit there with him and kind of and you know,
Speaker 2: tap him on the shoulder without saying, hey, dude, how
Speaker 2: about getting in the dugout with your teammates? Right? And
Speaker 2: so I brought this up to Scerns and I said,
Speaker 2: this is a huge problem because younger players, who we
Speaker 2: have younger players on the team, they're seeing this and
Speaker 2: you your guys are allowing this. And he goes, well,
Speaker 2: those players need to learn that they're not Won Soda.
Speaker 2: That was the third red flag, and I knew, okay,
Speaker 2: this is this is type of leader.
Speaker 1: So, like, I can understand where is coming from that, Like,
Speaker 1: no players should receive special treatment over others in a
Speaker 1: perfect world. That's how you want to exist. Wan Soda
Speaker 1: is gonna get special treatment. Everybody in the organization knows
Speaker 1: Wan So it's gonna get special treatment. He's gotten special
Speaker 1: treatment already, he got in his contract. And again it's
Speaker 1: this does kind of feel like throwing one under the
Speaker 1: bus and Sterns not Mendoza, which I think all of
Speaker 1: them would have been culpable in situation like this, but
Speaker 1: also at the same time, I would kind of like
Speaker 1: more specifics if one was one sitting on a couch
Speaker 1: and is twiddling his thumbs on his phone. Yeah yeah,
Speaker 1: And again he this makes Watso look pretty bad him
Speaker 1: saying this way after the fact. Wants so it was
Speaker 1: very settled in and now is a great leader. Yeah,
Speaker 1: seems to be a great leader. Now. I also think
Speaker 1: at the same time too, this is a shot at Francisco.
Speaker 1: Lindor feels like if he's talking about leadership and that
Speaker 1: there was a lack of one, and again, how can
Speaker 1: there be a lack of leadership and no mention about
Speaker 1: the manager being part of this vacuum where there was
Speaker 1: no leadership.
Speaker 2: He was a good guy though, from a GM all
Speaker 2: the way down, because it trickles down right and right
Speaker 2: then I knew, okay, we had one recovered, had a
Speaker 2: great year forty something homers, one hundred whateverle ye. And
Speaker 2: I watched him this year. He looks like a complete individual.
Speaker 2: He looks like he's getting along with his teammates. You know,
Speaker 2: obviously they're not having a great year, but you.
Speaker 1: Know, I believe.
Speaker 2: Let me go back to further about being accountable and
Speaker 2: about standing up and having a backbone. I remember in
Speaker 2: Oakland there was a double play. I was on first
Speaker 2: and a double play ball routine, and I go to second,
Speaker 2: I veer off and I'm running back into the dugout
Speaker 2: and I'm I'm getting towards It's a long walk in Oakland,
Speaker 2: and I see Billy with Lilly Bean walking down and
Speaker 2: he goes, come here. This is during the game. He
Speaker 2: takes me upstairs, he goes, what the fuck are you doing? Like,
Speaker 2: what are you talking about? He's like, why didn't you
Speaker 2: go hard? In a second, I go, I don't know,
Speaker 2: I just didn't, you know, didn't want to, you know,
Speaker 2: And he goes, you know what, Derek Jeter runs hard
Speaker 2: every single play, every play? Why can't you? And I
Speaker 2: was like, this is crazy, right, So I go back
Speaker 2: and I'm like, you know, of course, on my butt's
Speaker 2: crazy game.
Speaker 1: That's insane. That's fucking call out one of your players,
Speaker 1: one of your best players, in the middle of a
Speaker 1: baseball game, as the GM. That's absolutely nuts to say
Speaker 1: you didn't go hard into second base Billy being any
Speaker 1: World Series for him real quick. No. Also, I mean again,
Speaker 1: I don't believe. I don't disbelieve what he just said
Speaker 1: wasn't a huge hallmark of Billy Bean not watching the games.
Speaker 1: I thought that was like the whole thing of Moneyball.
Speaker 1: Yeah again, and Moneyball, we know left a lot of
Speaker 1: shit out, so probably.
Speaker 2: You know whatever, it's a routine double play. And I'm
Speaker 2: sitting in the game and I'm I'm trying to process this,
Speaker 2: and so I go back up after the game and
Speaker 2: he goes, let me show you some video, and he
Speaker 2: has video ready to go of Derek a routine little
Speaker 2: chopper back to the pic and it just hit home
Speaker 2: with me, right, and I'm like that that's backbone. That's leadership.
Speaker 2: You don't veer away from your top guys. You you
Speaker 2: attack them, you chal them, you build them up, whatever
Speaker 2: it is you need to do. Because that's the example
Speaker 2: that's gonna that's clubhouse culture. That's chemistry. Is when your
Speaker 2: best players do it right. And that's why Derek is
Speaker 2: so revered because he played every single day. He played hard,
Speaker 2: he played the game right, He was a winner, He
Speaker 2: got hits when it mattered, and home with me, you
Speaker 2: know what I mean, it's like and that was.
Speaker 1: What that worked out for shavas he win anything. We
Speaker 1: also say he's upset about he's saying how cool was
Speaker 1: that Billy Bean Show's backbone when the last story he
Speaker 1: gave was David Searns very much showing his backbone and
Speaker 1: telling Eric Schavs, No, this is your organization's hitting philosophy.
Speaker 1: It's just that it just didn't like that. Yeah, he didn't.
Speaker 1: He disagreed with the with the philosophy, so we didn't
Speaker 1: like the backbone. Yeah, if you're going to stand up
Speaker 1: to Eric Shavas, you better agree with him. If you
Speaker 1: have staid up Eric Shavist. No analytics involved, Yeah, absolutely not.
Speaker 1: I want to hear about this pulled fly ball, even
Speaker 1: though seconds later he does say that's what the best
Speaker 1: quality of contact is. No numbers involved, no numbers, just vibes.
Speaker 2: Needed at that moment, right, And he was kind of
Speaker 2: allowed to kind of do his thing. And you know,
Speaker 2: we had players kind of take that same thing during
Speaker 2: the year, and that was kind of the dysfunction that
Speaker 2: was going on, part of the problem. And as as
Speaker 2: as leaders, you have to be you can't be afraid
Speaker 2: of hitting situations on even though you might offend your
Speaker 2: best player. You know, your best pitcher. You gotta challenge
Speaker 2: him a little bit.
Speaker 1: Have a comment. He felt like there was a lack
Speaker 1: of leadership, of challenging. Right, let's take away. Let's just
Speaker 1: say there is no leaders right, you were on that
Speaker 1: coaching staff and you just said this. Sounds like his
Speaker 1: balls got cut off many times, I know. But like so,
Speaker 1: he had a problem with the lack of leadership, but
Speaker 1: Eric Schavaz being the leader, he had decided to also
Speaker 1: then just do nothing. And again, for some reason, this
Speaker 1: should be where the manager has step up and be
Speaker 1: the liaison, be the connector. Yeah, and maybe he Mendoza
Speaker 1: should have taken those things up with starts if they
Speaker 1: felt it was that big of an issue. I also, like,
Speaker 1: I do get it. Theoretically you want one sort of
Speaker 1: to run out every single ball. You want this, you
Speaker 1: want everyone to play hard, and it does start from
Speaker 1: the top down for the players. If you see wan
Speaker 1: So too do it. The younger players might think that definitely,
Speaker 1: But also at the same time, he's getting paideven hundred
Speaker 1: and fifty million dollars. I don't give a fuck. And
Speaker 1: also the same thing where it's like, yeah, if he
Speaker 1: was like running out of the dugout and not being
Speaker 1: in there like the whole free Yeah, that's definitely weird.
Speaker 2: And players that are good at some point in their
Speaker 2: lives have always been met with challenges that they've overcome, right,
Speaker 2: and that's what makes them better. Yeah, that's that's awesome
Speaker 2: because you talk about the Billy bean stuff leadership by example,
Speaker 2: and then you instantly had respect for what he did
Speaker 2: in one situation with you because he had the video
Speaker 2: dialed up. He's like, no, no, I'm not just gonna
Speaker 2: fastise you or come at you there. I'm like, hey see,
Speaker 2: I want to show you what I'm talking about.
Speaker 1: Right, It's true.
Speaker 2: You're instantly like, oh, okay, he's trying to make me better.
Speaker 2: He's trying to teach me lesson that will make me
Speaker 2: a better player. Yeah. And if he's not doing that,
Speaker 2: running hard makes a better player, so to being sitting
Speaker 2: in the cage with an assistant GM is just like
Speaker 2: rules for me and not for everybody else. Yeah, And
Speaker 2: that is a cascade of that happened as people see
Speaker 2: that it's not good. That's exactly right. So confrontation like
Speaker 2: lack of wanting to have those confrontations. That's a perfect example.
Speaker 2: This is it And you've called him out. But so
Speaker 2: at the end, just like everything that you.
Speaker 1: Talk calling out forgot about that, yeah, oh.
Speaker 2: Yeah, when when you get let go, it's the perfect
Speaker 2: back to the encapsulation of all the stuff that you
Speaker 2: just talked about. Yeah, in which I, like I said,
Speaker 2: I knew this was coming, I knew changes were coming.
Speaker 2: I didn't know the whole staff was going to be
Speaker 2: let go yeah, and he calls me, Hey, David, what's up?
Speaker 2: And we talked about this, I think before too, and
Speaker 2: he goes, you know, I'm not having a good day. Okay,
Speaker 2: what's what's crazy? He goes, well, we're going to go
Speaker 2: in a different direction, and I go okay, and he
Speaker 2: goes and he hangs up the phone right and I'm
Speaker 2: thinking to myself like, man, like.
Speaker 1: This did that happen? That's so funny. Not having a
Speaker 1: good day. Let's take go see you it's crazy is
Speaker 1: just low key kind of hilarious. At times. I might
Speaker 1: become a listener to the EC three. It just seems
Speaker 1: like we're gonna hear something that you'd never expect every
Speaker 1: single time. This might be the best advocate for the
Speaker 1: EC three podcast. I have no fucking clue what he's
Speaker 1: gonna say next.
Speaker 2: I can't literally like there's no you know, thanks for
Speaker 2: what you did, Thanks for the hard work, like they
Speaker 2: put in the hours, Like as a coach, I'd never
Speaker 2: been so for yourself as coaching, and just kind of
Speaker 2: the the lack of personal connect gratitude, appreciation for me,
Speaker 2: appreciate you for doing your job. Well, We're just gonna
Speaker 2: move on and it is what it is. Yeah, you
Speaker 2: know that was the four strike for me. You know, like,
Speaker 2: this isn't this isn't the right guy. I don't know
Speaker 2: where it came from. I don't know silt him up.
Speaker 2: You know. I heard a reporter ask him yesterday, have
Speaker 2: you thought about stepping down? And he gave a smirk
Speaker 2: and he's like no, and it's like, well, he stepped
Speaker 2: down before he stepped down in Milwaukee. I don't know
Speaker 2: if people remember this or or knew this. I have
Speaker 2: heard of why. I'm not going to get into it.
Speaker 1: That gun he is. Get into it, Eric, get into it.
Speaker 1: We're here, we're thirty this into the EC three podcast.
Speaker 1: Please get into it. Why you heard he stepped down?
Speaker 1: So like the Brewers are very successful during his time.
Speaker 1: So I don't think that David Stearns was forced out
Speaker 1: because of this bit. It seems like Eric Schapez has
Speaker 1: a scandal that he won't tell anybody. I don't. I
Speaker 1: don't see these smirks. Other people say I don't see
Speaker 1: him either. I just don't. Maybe I don't notice them.
Speaker 1: Maybe he's two rose colored still with David Sterns. But
Speaker 1: I just don't see the smirk. Maybe just a little
Speaker 1: thicker skin than some other people. Like we're like a
Speaker 1: smirk doesn't bother me. No, And again maybe I just
Speaker 1: don't know it. Maybe that's not me missed the smirks. Yeah,
Speaker 1: maybe maybe because we like.
Speaker 2: Stern so it's not beneath him to step away from
Speaker 2: a tough situation. But there's too much money, sure, and
Speaker 2: he's not going anywhere, right, he should be the guy fired,
Speaker 2: but he's not going anywhere. He's protect good by the
Speaker 2: contract that he signed. I'm pretty sure Cohen Cohen after
Speaker 2: the game before they fired, Carlos came in and said,
Speaker 2: I don't know this for sure, but something's got to happen,
Speaker 2: either you go or he goes. And I'm pretty sure
Speaker 2: they talked about it the night before. They woke up
Speaker 2: and they said, okay, is this what we want to do,
Speaker 2: and they decided to do it that morning.
Speaker 1: Should I fire you or him? Yeah, you know what,
Speaker 1: you can let me go?
Speaker 2: Yeah, you're right.
Speaker 1: Also, I'll fall on this with Sopuku. Think about the
Speaker 1: insane mental gymnastics you have to do right now to
Speaker 1: be in Eric Schaviz's shoes and say, here's what I
Speaker 1: think happened on a situation that I truly have no
Speaker 1: idea of anything that's going on. That's what I'm saying
Speaker 1: to this point. The first twenty seven and a half
Speaker 1: minutes of the EC three podcast, it was when Eric
Speaker 1: Shavis was in the Mets organization. The last forty five
Speaker 1: seconds total, hearsay wasn't while he was sitting on his couch,
Speaker 1: probably in Phoenix. It seems like getting ready to go
Speaker 1: hit the lake was kicking, he said. I think what
Speaker 1: probably happened is that the night after the game, Cohen said, sterns,
Speaker 1: it's either you or him, and David Stern said, okay,
Speaker 1: well but a fire Carlos Mendoza. Then they went to
Speaker 1: sleep and woke up and said, all right, let's do it. Also,
Speaker 1: if you think that's the chain of events, you've got
Speaker 1: to be a top five stupid person. I mean, it
Speaker 1: was in the organization for a lot.
Speaker 2: But I knew this was coming, you know why credit
Speaker 2: he held on to Carlos a really, really long time.
Speaker 2: We saw what the Phillies did. It's not always the
Speaker 2: right or the wrong move. Sometimes a move just has
Speaker 2: to happen. Not gutting everything that's been the biggest mistakes
Speaker 2: that you don't get it. You keep, you do inventory check,
Speaker 2: you you keep the personnel that you that you know
Speaker 2: you need as your core, and you make small moves
Speaker 2: to better your team. You don't have to mortgage the future,
Speaker 2: but you make you make smart moves. And with the
Speaker 2: young players, and I see a lot of teams do
Speaker 2: this like when they're at their peak. You have to
Speaker 2: One you have to trust your evaluating process, right, And
Speaker 2: two you have to be okay with making a mistake. Right.
Speaker 2: If you trade a Mark Vantos and a bait bait
Speaker 2: Brett Batty or Alvarez and they go off and they
Speaker 2: they have great careers, you have to live with that.
Speaker 2: But also understand like that move you made to acquire
Speaker 2: the player to help you get over the hump was
Speaker 2: worth it in the long run, and sometimes you're going
Speaker 2: to get burnt by it. But being able to evaluate
Speaker 2: your own players and then committing to them, yeah right,
Speaker 2: you can't go run prevention. I'm not even gonna say
Speaker 2: that anymore. Pitching in defense and then ask players to
Speaker 2: move around defensively, you can't.
Speaker 1: Well, he's right there, that's totally right. The thing I'm
Speaker 1: worried about is like, why does he keep referencing trading
Speaker 1: the guys who are actually on the major league roster
Speaker 1: to prove the major league roster rather than advocating for
Speaker 1: trading minor leaguers. And then also at the same because
Speaker 1: he definitely doesn't know anything that's going on the minor leagues,
Speaker 1: but also at the same time remembers prospects or suspects
Speaker 1: shout out Buck Showalter cut from Batory with him. But
Speaker 1: like that is probably actually the biggest difference. Where these
Speaker 1: guys who came up had successful major league careers on
Speaker 1: major league coaching staffs, those young players were unestablished. Even
Speaker 1: though they're not consider the prospects technically, especially not by
Speaker 1: us the rankings or anything like that, they still consider
Speaker 1: them very not proven commodities. But those are guys that
Speaker 1: are very much more rarely traded. They also think it's
Speaker 1: super crazy to say how you need to be able
Speaker 1: to live with the mistake of trading of Viento's Baty
Speaker 1: Alvarez any of these young guys. I agree, you do
Speaker 1: have to be able to live with that mistake. Then
Speaker 1: he says you also need to commit to those guys,
Speaker 1: which you can't do both you can't trade them and
Speaker 1: you can't commit them at the same time. And then
Speaker 1: if you do want them to commit, I think there's
Speaker 1: no bigger commitment than forcing Brett Batty to play other positions.
Speaker 1: We like you so much that we're gonna put you
Speaker 1: in weird situations, and I think that was a massive mistake.
Speaker 1: But yeah, it's exactly what he is talking about that
Speaker 1: he wants to see. So it's confusing. Well, the AC
Speaker 1: three podcast is very confounding. It's very complicated. That's why
Speaker 1: we have to focus up.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the rest to go to left field or right field,
Speaker 2: play the outfield, first base, Biento's DH third base, first base, Like,
Speaker 2: that's really hard.
Speaker 1: H is a new position? Are we fucking serious? Old God?
Speaker 1: Of all the position changes he mentioned, Mark Fiento's learning
Speaker 1: how to be a DH. The only thing that he's
Speaker 1: ever been able to do even slightly above average was
Speaker 1: hit And that's the hardest position change he's had to make.
Speaker 2: At this level. And there's like a Kiki Hernandez, right,
Speaker 2: you could put him anywhere and he's going to do well.
Speaker 2: Those guys are really hard to come by, and it's
Speaker 2: a hard thing to do. And then you're trying to
Speaker 2: figure hisself out as a young guy. You're trying to hit,
Speaker 2: you're trying to survive, and it was whatever the philosophy was,
Speaker 2: it's all been wrong and every decision he's made has
Speaker 2: been wrong unfortunately. All Right, So I have two things
Speaker 2: that we could kind of put a cap on this
Speaker 2: emergency pod. What are you hearing from inside the staff right? Like,
Speaker 2: I'm interested, Like you mentioned a second ago, Carlos kind
Speaker 2: of had to have an idea this was possible. You
Speaker 2: still talk to people, don't have to call anybody out
Speaker 2: in like in general, like, what's the mo what was
Speaker 2: the reaction? What's the vibe that you think this team carries. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I've checked in with guys that I'm close with there.
Speaker 2: You know, from the beginning, you know, things have not
Speaker 2: been great. And I said, how you guys doing you
Speaker 2: guys keeping your head up? Yeah? Yeah, we're working hard,
Speaker 2: We're you know, things were always good and positive. I
Speaker 2: think standpoint you always have to have that. You got
Speaker 2: to show up every day with a smile, ready to go,
Speaker 2: regardless of where you've come from. I texted Carlos yesterday
Speaker 2: and I said, keep your head up high. You're you're
Speaker 2: well respected. I respected you. You know, he's just he
Speaker 2: was set up to fail. Like he took. He took
Speaker 2: a team that Billy Eppler had built to the A
Speaker 2: L c S that was on Billy. And that's when
Speaker 2: right and l sorry sorry and.
Speaker 1: Else doesn't even know what league he played it. That's
Speaker 1: why we need handling again.
Speaker 2: So he has the pedigree to to manage and and
Speaker 2: be really good at this game. And he's gonna land
Speaker 2: on his feet. It's just I know, it's hard because
Speaker 2: emotionally you put everything like he los. I know he's
Speaker 2: losing sleep, like you're constantly not thinking about what moves
Speaker 2: and you know, I know people are like, you know,
Speaker 2: he's got to do this. And when you lose, you
Speaker 2: can kind of nippick anything you want, you know, like
Speaker 2: if you're fiery, you can go. He's too fiery. Yeah,
Speaker 2: not firey, go you need more fire, you know you can.
Speaker 2: You're just losing and it's not working. Whatever's happening, it's
Speaker 2: not working.
Speaker 1: Also, I want to refute one thing too, that that
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty four team was built by Billyepler. I'm
Speaker 1: gonna go through the starting line for that team, and
Speaker 1: I want to try and remember where they came from. Sure, yeah,
Speaker 1: Francisco Alvarez not Billy, Billyeppler, Pee Alonzo not Billyeppler, Jeff
Speaker 1: McNeil not Billyeppler, Francisco Lindor not Billyeppler, Mark Fianzos not
Speaker 1: Billy Eppler, Brenda Neimo not Billy Eppler, Harrison Baylor, Billy Eppler,
Speaker 1: Novi Serns, David Serns, Starling, Marte Billy Eeppler. There you go,
Speaker 1: and then let's go rotation. Luis Savarino not Billyeppler, Sean
Speaker 1: and Aya not Billy Eppler, Jose Quintana Billy Eppler, and
Speaker 1: don't forget he had a tumor that broke his bones
Speaker 1: and his trips. Edwin Ds not Billy Eppler. That's those
Speaker 1: are the big pieces there, so very not Billy Eppler
Speaker 1: and lcs almost actually exclusively no Billy Eppler players, Brooks Raley, Yes,
Speaker 1: seven innings, but of all the guys to give credit
Speaker 1: to for that team, that's the one is really difficult too.
Speaker 1: It's creazy like Sandy and Brody get more credited for
Speaker 1: four team in retrospect, much more had his hands much
Speaker 1: more on the miners guys that we're seeing now, definitely,
Speaker 1: and some of the ones that don't work out there.
Speaker 1: I mean yeah, No, his baby was a draft before Alphares,
Speaker 1: was before Dances, before Billy drafted a j Ewing. He
Speaker 1: drafted McLean, He drafted Nolan McLain, Yes, and Jonah Tong
Speaker 1: and Jonah Tong.
Speaker 2: But the real corporate is the guy, the puppet master
Speaker 2: right running the whole show, doing it his way, bringing
Speaker 2: in the players that he thinks, you know, is a
Speaker 2: is a contender, puppet mass I have failed, right, don't
Speaker 2: go as an organization, he said the other day. We're
Speaker 2: looking for a coaches to get the maximum out of
Speaker 2: every player. And first of all, let me take this back.
Speaker 2: As a player that played for a long time, not
Speaker 2: one time that I ever blame anything negative on any coach.
Speaker 2: Was never a hitting coach. When I was wasn't a
Speaker 2: hitting coach. I was in a fielding slump. It was me,
Speaker 2: you got you gotta be take ownership. You got to
Speaker 2: be a pro and understand like these guys are men,
Speaker 2: they're responsible for their own career. I was responsible for
Speaker 2: my own career. Account who I listened to That was
Speaker 2: up to me and that was part of, you know,
Speaker 2: my decision making of my performance. But my performance was
Speaker 2: me right. And I had coaches helped me along the
Speaker 2: way and and all this, but not one coach that
Speaker 2: I ever go, Man, this guy screwed me up. And
Speaker 2: if it screwed you up, that's your fault. If you're
Speaker 2: listening to people that aren't helping you, that's your fault.
Speaker 2: You need to reevaluate your team. And so yeah, it's just, uh,
Speaker 2: I don't know if the coaching staff. They everybody works
Speaker 2: hard like it's it's a it's everybody wants to blame you,
Speaker 2: but when they do well, they don't want to give
Speaker 2: you any credit, which you really like you you're as
Speaker 2: a coach, you're not there. You're not there for credit
Speaker 2: or blame. You just help.
Speaker 1: Wasn't there in person a lot? Yeah, he was in Arizona,
Speaker 1: Arizona to show up and you know.
Speaker 2: You flip balls and you you have you try to
Speaker 2: have conversations with them to you know, mentally kind of
Speaker 2: get them over the hump of a slump.
Speaker 1: But what was he doing last year? It doesn't seem
Speaker 1: like he even he was doing. They really pushed him out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they from the beginning. Again, if I was in Rik
Speaker 1: Shova's shoes, probably would find ways to do less, Yes,
Speaker 1: And if I was sending emails to everyone in the
Speaker 1: organization and challenging the president the philosophy. What's funny is
Speaker 1: Eric Schoffs actually has a leg to stand on about
Speaker 1: the culture of David Stearns with the people beneath him.
Speaker 1: I think that is totally a fair conversation because it
Speaker 1: doesn't seem under Eric Schoff's experience that he was treated
Speaker 1: particularly fairly by David Stearns. Seems actually very unfair. Yeah, So,
Speaker 1: like I think that's where they should have gone. But
Speaker 1: to say he's talking about all the stuff that makes
Speaker 1: all his points feel invalid, which is where it's the
Speaker 1: jock versus nerd argument always, And this funny is the
Speaker 1: thing of that's kind of lost in a lot of
Speaker 1: the public discussions about David Sears. I feel like a
Speaker 1: lot of the things be most critical about him are
Speaker 1: the things that no one talks about, which is again,
Speaker 1: poor person in person relationships, trying to thread the needle
Speaker 1: too much and not I mean sometimes maybe having a
Speaker 1: little bit too much confidence in hubris and some of
Speaker 1: the moves that they may not back not backfilling and
Speaker 1: having plan bs available where it's more of the top
Speaker 1: line stuff that he gets discredited for, and it's like
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff is still kind of like, I
Speaker 1: don't know, Horry Plum getting injured, your propa thoughts could
Speaker 1: chance that happen again? Robert getting injured the Popashett think
Speaker 1: is the bad one.
Speaker 2: But yes, for the most part, you take accountability for
Speaker 2: your performance on the field. Is there any I always
Speaker 2: like this messages of positivity. I've enjoyed the passion of
Speaker 2: the Mets fans over the past forty eight hours. Yeah,
Speaker 2: like the signs at the games, the chants and everything.
Speaker 2: Is there any message that you could would want to
Speaker 2: send to the fans as like because this okay, Everything's
Speaker 2: gonna be all right? Like, what message do you have
Speaker 2: for Mets fans that I know have been actively engaging
Speaker 2: with you on social media? Yeah? No, I had first
Speaker 2: hand experience last year and handle and dealt with them. Passion,
Speaker 2: just passion, just you know, continue to show up like
Speaker 2: you have the right owner in place. You can't have
Speaker 2: a better owner. City Field is a gem, you know,
Speaker 2: Queen's in the next five to ten years, that little
Speaker 2: area is going to be fantastic. It's gonna happen. I
Speaker 2: really firmly believe that. Like Cohen, you know, he doesn't
Speaker 2: get to where he's at life without you know, you know,
Speaker 2: some hurdles, and he's had some hurdles in his in
Speaker 2: his career, but he's a winner and he puts the
Speaker 2: money where his mouth is, and you know, he's got
Speaker 2: the energy and the effort for it. Fans keep up
Speaker 2: the passion, like you know, yeah, the team is probably
Speaker 2: not gonna be where you want them to be. And
Speaker 2: we all want winners. We all want to go cheer
Speaker 2: on winners. But I think you know, from the messaging
Speaker 2: from front office ownership to the fans is I think
Speaker 2: they just want accountability, you know, want Ron Washington, one
Speaker 2: of my favorite coaches of all time who probably should
Speaker 2: be managing the Sans Giants right now, and he told me,
Speaker 2: and the way Rosh talks like I don't know if
Speaker 2: you've heard, it's beautiful. I'm not going to try to
Speaker 2: imitate his voice like you told me, just say you
Speaker 2: fucked up. That's nobody can say anything. And I've always
Speaker 2: taken that to the heart when you mess up. Just
Speaker 2: you know what, Listen, the stuff that I've done since
Speaker 2: I've gotten here hasn't worked. We're going to reevaluate our
Speaker 2: process and be different and try to give you guys
Speaker 2: a winner. We failed you, period, and you know what
Speaker 2: the fans would be like, don't sell them bullshit.
Speaker 1: But here's the only thing that I'm going to say. Well,
Speaker 1: and it's not the only thing. I don't know how
Speaker 1: I said that, but like, oops, I went out of
Speaker 1: full screen. They did. They said that the in twenty
Speaker 1: twenty four did not work. We need to change or
Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, my bad did not work. They got
Speaker 1: rid of a lot of it too much. Are we
Speaker 1: know that we know that's the case, but that was
Speaker 1: a blanket statement by David Searns. Didn't work. We're changing
Speaker 1: it up. And when he came out for the press
Speaker 1: conference on Friday, he was like this, seasons of failure. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's on my shoulders. Anything goes wrong with this baseball team,
Speaker 1: in baseball operations, it's on make It's pure accountability. So
Speaker 1: it is interesting how like again, people do hear what
Speaker 1: they want to hear, and we know that with our
Speaker 1: comment section. At times like and we miss and we
Speaker 1: we miss smirks. Yes, we miss smirks. We do miss
Speaker 1: smirks because we want to hear not smirks. But it
Speaker 1: is funny. He's like take accountability and say we're gonna
Speaker 1: change it. They just did this off season. It's just
Speaker 1: that the change didn't work. The change was wrong again,
Speaker 1: and probably gonna make another change next year if I
Speaker 1: had the chance, A guess, and I don't think you
Speaker 1: can particularly make that change. On June twenty ninth, part
Speaker 1: of the change was fired in your buddy, Carlos Mendoza.
Speaker 2: That's roight up there, up there with the smirk, Like
Speaker 2: look them in there and say, this is smirk. I've
Speaker 2: messed up. I'm disappointed. We're gonna re evaluate our process
Speaker 2: and we're going to get this thing right right. Don't
Speaker 2: feed them bullshit. Those fans are just too educated, the
Speaker 2: too to hear the bs. Just shoot them straight there,
Speaker 2: they're you know there, it's a it's a tough town.
Speaker 2: Just give them, give it to them, you know, straight,
Speaker 2: and they'll expect you for it. Anything else, Is there
Speaker 2: anything else you want to get off your chest?
Speaker 1: How?
Speaker 2: How how do we fix this? How do we move forward?
Speaker 2: Manager GM moving forward? What's the next move? Right?
Speaker 1: I can't wait to hear this.
Speaker 2: They're going to clear the house in the off season.
Speaker 2: Well you got to start with one. So who takes
Speaker 2: that job? Like like, okay, so that I mean that,
Speaker 2: that's the thing. So so I've heard, I've heard I
Speaker 2: will take that job. I've heard, uh Baltron. The kind
Speaker 2: of alarming thing for me is Beltron's there. What's Carl's
Speaker 2: doing there? He's like a special assistant, Like he's there,
Speaker 2: Like if you really wanted to move forward with Carlos,
Speaker 2: and maybe maybe Carlos didn't want the job, that's where
Speaker 2: people are like, oh, higher JD. Martinez is or hire
Speaker 2: this guy some Sometimes these guys just don't want to
Speaker 2: do it. And Carlos is there, And if you wanted
Speaker 2: to move forward with Carlos, get him the experience of
Speaker 2: the next let him build a rapport with the players
Speaker 2: and sterns and see how things work. So I'm a
Speaker 2: little surprised that it wasn't Carlos. But if you for me,
Speaker 2: like if you did a combination, are you you need
Speaker 2: a strong personality there one right, and you need if
Speaker 2: your best players want you need a strong personality right
Speaker 2: because these players, right, Dusty Baker was the right fit
Speaker 2: for Barry Bonds and Jeff Cannon, all those guys. Bo
Speaker 2: T was the right fit for you know, Francis like,
Speaker 2: you need a somebody who walks into the room and
Speaker 2: around respect and dignity.
Speaker 1: Now does he hear what he's saying that the next
Speaker 1: manager that the Mets hire needs to have like a
Speaker 1: little bit of confidence, a little bit of a leadership,
Speaker 1: needs to be a loud personality, needs to have leadership ability,
Speaker 1: needs to be able to take accountability. That is kind
Speaker 1: of a back way, backhanded way of also saying that
Speaker 1: Carlsmandoza was not that guy. He doesn't realize he's saying that.
Speaker 1: I don't think he does, but I think he Maybe
Speaker 1: Sam carlsz was, But then he's not there.
Speaker 2: You just know that they're a leader, right, and Albert
Speaker 2: poolholes or a combination with Albert, Yeah, and Beltron or
Speaker 2: Joey Korra walks into that room. Yeah, there's definitely some
Speaker 2: options from the manager side. You gotta get that right
Speaker 2: first of all, put it. Put a leader in there
Speaker 2: who's not afraid to speak his mind, that the players
Speaker 2: are going to respect they may not like always what
Speaker 2: you say, but they're gonna like that conversation I had
Speaker 2: with Billy I didn't maybe he didn't like it at
Speaker 2: the time, but I respected it and it hit home
Speaker 2: with me, and those are those are what leadership leadership.
Speaker 1: She's talking about gms now, not man now, he's not
Speaker 1: talking about managers now, he's talking about gms. But when
Speaker 1: his backhanded saying them and those didn't have these qualities, totally,
Speaker 1: he has no clue he's saying that he doesn't realize
Speaker 1: is that he's completely throwing Mendos under the bus with this.
Speaker 1: And I think a lot of people are watching this
Speaker 1: might not have even picked up on that because it
Speaker 1: wasn't framed in that way. But he's totally saying that
Speaker 1: the Mets didn't have this. I mean, seventy five minutes
Speaker 1: into the EC three, watch along the Mets up, guys, like,
Speaker 1: we're so really going to get into it now. Also
Speaker 1: electric for him to talk about how he respected that
Speaker 1: Billy Bean told him he was wrong, But what David
Speaker 1: Starts told him he was wrong, he was like, oh,
Speaker 1: fuck yourself. Also, if anyone got through this entire part
Speaker 1: with us, with us to this we need to we
Speaker 1: need to set special words for the YouTube comments. Oh
Speaker 1: give me a disjustified that's way too long. That's where
Speaker 1: I can get people. Then what's another one? He keeps
Speaker 1: talking with Billy beans. Canna say beans yap beans?
Speaker 2: Bean leaders do. But the GM side like, for me,
Speaker 2: go back and hire Billy Eppler. You had the right guy.
Speaker 2: It was an inside job. You had the right guy.
Speaker 2: He would have built you a winner. By now, I
Speaker 2: firmly believe that what happened. And if that, if you
Speaker 2: want a wild card, this is what I would. Let's go.
Speaker 2: I've talked about him before the go go open the check.
Speaker 2: Bu dude, I don't think THEO you know what he's
Speaker 2: done with Chicago and Boston. Never really met THEO person.
Speaker 2: I met him walking by whatever. But I have a
Speaker 2: ton of respect for you know, what he's built and
Speaker 2: what he's again accomplished. What it's not you know, uh,
Speaker 2: in the future, I think CEO that has a process. Right,
Speaker 2: he is a proven process, correct? Right? Correct? You've got here.
Speaker 2: Here's the fundamentals of what I believe in and what
Speaker 2: I implement and here's how my structure works. Right, here's
Speaker 2: how I do it. Yeah, and like that's what you're
Speaker 2: talking about. Do you want to go create, Go get
Speaker 2: THEO and and open the check buck and say, come
Speaker 2: build me a winner because he's done it.
Speaker 1: Another great idea too, I think they should dig up
Speaker 1: Yogi Bearro's body and let him manage as well. He's
Speaker 1: a proven winner one hundred.
Speaker 2: Two franchises that was starving for it the third one.
Speaker 2: Like I said, I don't know if that's even possible.
Speaker 2: If THEO wants to do it. I think he's pretty
Speaker 2: happy where he's at. But yeah, there's you know, staying
Speaker 2: pat and kind of running this out. You know. I
Speaker 2: don't know that that's the right decision unless they get
Speaker 2: together as a front office and go, man, we really
Speaker 2: have to change the way we're doing things because it's
Speaker 2: not working. Awesome stuff, man, Emergency Pod, Yes, we got it.
Speaker 2: You can like to subscribe if you like what you
Speaker 2: heard today on YouTube, Spotify, Apple podcasts. We put podcasts
Speaker 2: out Baseball once a week. He is shavy. I'm Chris
Speaker 2: Emergency Pod. Mets in there mess of a situation here before.
Speaker 1: The open invite to Chris Hamblin to ever come on
Speaker 1: the METSU podcast and Eric Svas if Eric Schappas wants
Speaker 1: to come on, I would love to have him on.
Speaker 1: There's no shot he does. He's got to bring handling
Speaker 1: with him. It's a package deal, yes, package deal. One man.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I do want to just let him loose, hambling, hambling,
Speaker 1: let him loose. That was crazy. That was uh. I mean,
Speaker 1: that was third nine minutes of kind of almost nothing
Speaker 1: there was. I mean, the ones that made to social
Speaker 1: media were big. A couple of those stories, like Eric
Speaker 1: shav Is sending the full organizational email at all, some
Speaker 1: of those stuff and then him backhanding saying bunch of
Speaker 1: badge of the bat Mendoz at the end was yeah,
Speaker 1: kind of sad, but also funny, kind of funny at
Speaker 1: the end of the day. It totally comes off with
Speaker 1: sour grapes. It comes off as I have one way
Speaker 1: I wanted to do things. He has his other way.
Speaker 1: We didn't agree, and I think he's wrong, and look,
Speaker 1: he hasn't won, so he is wrong. I'm right. And
Speaker 1: seemingly the biggest story of this whole thing was that
Speaker 1: Shavs was like a black sheep in the organization with
Speaker 1: David Stearns tried to push him out and then seemingly
Speaker 1: kind of gave him like the unplugged in controller you
Speaker 1: give your little cousin while you're playing video game like
Speaker 1: when or you put the kid on like the motorcycle
Speaker 1: at the arcade, but you don't put in the money.
Speaker 1: You're like, Wow, you're doing so good. And whether or
Speaker 1: not you more so agreed with the Mets organizational philosophy
Speaker 1: or shav is his philosophy, it probably was destructive to
Speaker 1: have two people go saying different things to different players
Speaker 1: at different times. Yes, I do think if I am
Speaker 1: going to take any negative on Sterns from this podcast,
Speaker 1: based on what we've heard from Eric Shabaz, it does
Speaker 1: seem like there is a culture issue and that is
Speaker 1: something that probably needs to be addressed better, especially even
Speaker 1: what we talked about how keeping mendos are around completely
Speaker 1: new coaches and knowing that those coaches and Mendoza definitely
Speaker 1: didn't get along very much. A lack of person to
Speaker 1: person understand and that might be the biggest critique I have,
Speaker 1: along with the fact that they're not winning baseball games.
Speaker 1: Gotta win baseball games. And now my camera won't turn on,
Speaker 1: so we gotta call all right, that's it. Thank you
Speaker 1: guys for watching. Let us know if you like to
Speaker 1: watch along. I don't know. It's like an hour and
Speaker 1: twenty minutes. It's a long one, but subscribe to events ever.
Speaker 1: I think it is our longest one ever. Follow us
Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google. You can follow James on
Speaker 1: social media at James Shannon. I'm draftnick Mark. Thank you
Speaker 1: all for watching, Thank you for listening. We'll catch on
Speaker 1: the next one. Shout Eric Shavis, peace out, peace out guys.
Speaker 3: Let's comments, and then lost the loves, and then the
Speaker 3: lo