WEBVTT - Viva Clay SZN! 0:00:13.280 --> 0:00:15.760 One, two, one two. Okay, Hi everyone, welcome to the 0:00:15.760 --> 0:00:19.520 Rennae Stubbs Tennis Podcast. We are in freezing, cold, rainy, 0:00:19.840 --> 0:00:24.400 miserable spring in New York right now, Hi, Caitlin. 0:00:24.200 --> 0:00:26.720 This is why I don't recognize spring as a season. 0:00:27.880 --> 0:00:30.920 Because it's the only thing it's springing is your depression. 0:00:31.040 --> 0:00:34.040 Yeah, it's a betrayal. Every year you get one seventy 0:00:34.080 --> 0:00:35.760 degree day, the one seventy degree day. 0:00:35.800 --> 0:00:35.959 Yeah. 0:00:36.000 --> 0:00:38.919 Last week I played tennis outside, rode my bike around, wore the cutest 0:00:39.320 --> 0:00:44.320 tennis outfit. I was like, finally I'm back, baby. 0:00:44.400 --> 0:00:44.840 And then. 0:00:46.320 --> 0:00:48.000 The one thing I will say about the spring that 0:00:48.040 --> 0:00:52.760 I really like, yes, clay court season on my TV. 0:00:53.040 --> 0:00:57.319 I know you love it. Listen. I love watching clay 0:00:57.400 --> 0:00:59.880 court tennis as well. You know. The great thing about 0:01:00.080 --> 0:01:02.960 tennis in general is like, you know, when you play 0:01:03.000 --> 0:01:06.120 basketball or soccer or whatever, you know, do you pick 0:01:06.200 --> 0:01:08.240 one of the great sports of the world. And let's 0:01:08.280 --> 0:01:10.480 say soccer is one of the if not the biggest, right, 0:01:10.640 --> 0:01:13.600 biggest playing on the same thing, right, the only difference 0:01:13.680 --> 0:01:20.080 is AstroTurf to grass. Tennis is literally played on multiple surfaces. Cool, 0:01:20.240 --> 0:01:23.840 So to be great, you have to be great flexible. 0:01:24.160 --> 0:01:25.440 You've got to be able to slide. You've got to 0:01:25.440 --> 0:01:27.160 be able to be patient. On clay, you have to 0:01:27.160 --> 0:01:30.920 be able to be methodic. Methodical on hardcourt, you've got 0:01:30.959 --> 0:01:32.840 to be a little bit more explosive. Your body takes 0:01:32.880 --> 0:01:34.680 a bit more of a beating. On grass, you've got 0:01:34.720 --> 0:01:36.360 to be sort of selective when you come to the 0:01:36.400 --> 0:01:39.360 net or being aggressive, or you can't be patient, you 0:01:39.440 --> 0:01:42.360 have to be aggressive. Like every single surface lends itself 0:01:42.360 --> 0:01:43.520 to a different way of playing. 0:01:43.640 --> 0:01:45.840 I like it so much because I like the different 0:01:45.920 --> 0:01:49.280 stories that it gives us, not only in terms of 0:01:49.320 --> 0:01:53.840 which players surge and which players sort of recede from 0:01:54.360 --> 0:01:58.000 the main conversation, because as you noted, the best players 0:01:58.240 --> 0:01:59.920 are at the front of the line on all this, sir, 0:02:00.360 --> 0:02:02.640 because they've figured out how to do everything in the 0:02:02.640 --> 0:02:05.120 toolkit that is required of it's great, but for me, 0:02:05.200 --> 0:02:08.840 I just really like the various stories. This clay is 0:02:08.880 --> 0:02:11.079 a little slippier than that clay, which we'll get into 0:02:11.160 --> 0:02:13.560 because we were just watching some Charleston highlights and as 0:02:13.560 --> 0:02:17.760 you noted, the clay of Charleston, which is made with a 0:02:18.280 --> 0:02:25.040 mined clay from nearby South Carolina is slipperier than like, 0:02:25.120 --> 0:02:28.079 sort of the sticky, muddier red clay, right, And I'm 0:02:28.160 --> 0:02:30.040 willing to bet I have not played it on red 0:02:30.040 --> 0:02:31.880 clay in Houston, but I'm willing to bet that their 0:02:31.880 --> 0:02:34.919 clay is a little different than what you would find in. 0:02:35.080 --> 0:02:37.560 Europe MonteCarlo. Yes, very different. 0:02:37.720 --> 0:02:39.520 The tournament we were just watching in Romania, or the 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:43.320 one I spent a lot of time watching, which was Marrakesh. 0:02:44.400 --> 0:02:45.440 You love Marrakesh. 0:02:45.720 --> 0:02:48.040 I was just really I just really like the idea 0:02:48.080 --> 0:02:51.800 of looking at something beautiful and sunny, especially on a 0:02:51.840 --> 0:02:54.360 day like two day, when it is forty degrees and rainy. 0:02:54.480 --> 0:02:57.320 I thought that would actually put you more into a depression. 0:02:57.520 --> 0:02:59.760 No, I just am projecting that I'm there to go. 0:03:00.000 --> 0:03:01.919 Wow, look at me. I could be there and not here. 0:03:03.040 --> 0:03:06.480 So let's get into some of the results. We got 0:03:06.520 --> 0:03:09.959 to talk about. Jessica Pegula jpeg. Hey clay court specialists. 0:03:09.960 --> 0:03:10.400 Look at her. 0:03:10.520 --> 0:03:14.919 I'm so impressed not only with her title run in 0:03:15.000 --> 0:03:20.200 Charleston and the difficult draw she had to get there, 0:03:20.800 --> 0:03:23.920 but also she just got to the finals of Miami. 0:03:24.040 --> 0:03:26.440 Yeah yeah, and the two for is tough. I mean 0:03:26.480 --> 0:03:29.960 Daniel Collins did it last year when she won both tournaments. Yeah, Miami, 0:03:31.320 --> 0:03:34.720 JPEG fell a little short against Aryna Sabalenka. No, no, no, 0:03:35.440 --> 0:03:38.400 you know, no small thing, Sabalenka is buy and away the 0:03:38.400 --> 0:03:41.000 best player in the world right now. But to get 0:03:41.040 --> 0:03:43.520 a final in Miami and then to win against a 0:03:43.560 --> 0:03:46.360 pretty incredible field in Charleston was awesome to see. 0:03:46.480 --> 0:03:50.000 Yeah, I mean, listen, I think it's funny when I 0:03:50.040 --> 0:03:53.520 did see that Jess was going and playing in Charleston, 0:03:53.800 --> 0:03:55.480 and she always is going to because she loves it 0:03:55.520 --> 0:03:56.760 there and a lot of players, and I can tell 0:03:56.800 --> 0:03:58.360 you it is truly one of the best tournaments to 0:03:58.440 --> 0:04:02.120 play form a players perspective. They take care of you, 0:04:02.120 --> 0:04:06.880 you know, a Bob and eleanor and the team there 0:04:07.200 --> 0:04:09.200 in Charleston really take care of their players so well. 0:04:09.200 --> 0:04:13.360 They're always giving little gifts. And the hotel's beautiful. Charleston's great. 0:04:13.400 --> 0:04:15.480 It's one of my favorite cities in the in the country, 0:04:16.080 --> 0:04:18.120 so it's it really is a great place to go to. 0:04:18.320 --> 0:04:20.040 The only thing that sometimes can get you there is 0:04:20.080 --> 0:04:22.280 the weather. But they had good weather, so that was 0:04:22.760 --> 0:04:24.440 always a good thing. But you know what for me, 0:04:24.680 --> 0:04:29.440 it's it's to show up to a tournament that you 0:04:29.520 --> 0:04:31.760 have told you're going to go to, when you've gotten 0:04:31.760 --> 0:04:34.200 to a final, like Danielle Collins did the previous year. 0:04:34.560 --> 0:04:36.760 Like that's testament to Jessica as well to like turn 0:04:36.839 --> 0:04:39.440 up and not only turn up, but actually play such 0:04:39.440 --> 0:04:42.800 good tennis. I mean, beating Danielle Collins in the quarterfinals, 0:04:42.800 --> 0:04:45.920 defending champion, and then you know, to see her win 0:04:46.000 --> 0:04:50.320 against in a final. Yeah, it was a good match. 0:04:50.520 --> 0:04:52.480 Kennan really should have taken it into the third set. 0:04:52.520 --> 0:04:55.039 It would have been interesting to see how they both 0:04:55.080 --> 0:04:58.119 reacted in the third Very different circumstances when you're playing 0:04:58.120 --> 0:05:00.640 for a title with one one set up on the line. 0:05:01.240 --> 0:05:04.040 But you know, jess came back from being down five 0:05:04.120 --> 0:05:06.560 to two, and that was a little bit surprising that 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:08.920 Sophia Kenin sort of get the job done to get 0:05:08.920 --> 0:05:11.839 into her third set. But just you know, a really 0:05:11.880 --> 0:05:15.680 really great tournament for American tennis as well Amanda Annisimova. 0:05:15.720 --> 0:05:17.680 Of course we know what happened there with her having 0:05:17.680 --> 0:05:19.760 to pull out against Kenin. That was a bummer because 0:05:19.760 --> 0:05:21.480 I kind of wanted to see that match. I wanted 0:05:21.520 --> 0:05:22.440 to see those two go out. 0:05:22.560 --> 0:05:27.120 Actually, yeah, those two peak performance. Also hip injury is 0:05:27.360 --> 0:05:30.640 no bueno, Yeah, no point we pulled out of during 0:05:30.640 --> 0:05:31.200 the first set. 0:05:31.400 --> 0:05:35.800 We need Sophia Kenin sorry, we need Amanda Anissimova to stay healthy. Yeah, 0:05:35.880 --> 0:05:37.400 I mean that's been her big issue. 0:05:37.240 --> 0:05:37.840 Big issue. 0:05:38.080 --> 0:05:41.120 Obviously, she took a lot of time away from tennis 0:05:40.640 --> 0:05:44.360 for her mental health, just to sort of reevaluate her 0:05:44.720 --> 0:05:46.799 her life and what she want to do and tennis. 0:05:46.839 --> 0:05:49.479 And you know, we forget about Amanda Anissimova, who lost 0:05:49.480 --> 0:05:52.080 her father not that long ago, you know, probably about 0:05:52.080 --> 0:05:54.480 five years ago now, but you know, he was a 0:05:54.520 --> 0:05:58.000 tremendous he was her coach. So, you know, battling back 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:00.760 from getting away from the sport now now having to 0:06:00.760 --> 0:06:03.560 deal with these injuries, that's just it's not great. I mean, 0:06:03.800 --> 0:06:06.520 clearly she played a great Miami, but then you know, 0:06:06.680 --> 0:06:10.960 I ran into a sleep deprived to person the next 0:06:11.040 --> 0:06:14.400 day herself. So but but really really great to see 0:06:14.839 --> 0:06:16.960 all these American players doing really, really well. 0:06:17.040 --> 0:06:20.080 Yeah, which actually gives us a nice segue into Houston, 0:06:20.279 --> 0:06:25.280 which had an all American Semis lineup, which was you know, 0:06:25.560 --> 0:06:28.479 clay is not typically the even if it's on you know, 0:06:28.560 --> 0:06:31.560 sort of home soil, no pun intended, is not typically 0:06:31.600 --> 0:06:35.440 something you see Americans, especially the men, succeed on. But 0:06:35.480 --> 0:06:38.160 I have to say, you know, Tommy Paul, Francis Tiafoe, 0:06:39.640 --> 0:06:42.600 Jenson Brooksby, grants to Jenson Brooksby and Brandon Nakashima making 0:06:42.640 --> 0:06:45.919 the semifinals of Houston on red clay was really really 0:06:45.920 --> 0:06:48.240 cool to see and I think really exciting for a 0:06:48.240 --> 0:06:50.880 lot of people who, you know, maybe tune out a 0:06:50.920 --> 0:06:53.040 little bit if they're fans of American men's tennis during 0:06:53.040 --> 0:06:55.240 this time of the year. Okay, well maybe not. Maybe 0:06:55.800 --> 0:06:57.320 there's a reason to set up and pay attention. 0:06:57.600 --> 0:07:00.000 Well, you know, Francis has played while there in the 0:07:00.080 --> 0:07:03.599 past clearly, and he certainly can play on clay. He 0:07:03.640 --> 0:07:06.760 can move on clay. A lot of how do people 0:07:06.839 --> 0:07:09.000 do well on clay and why don't they and why 0:07:09.080 --> 0:07:11.240 some do, etc. Etc. Look a lot of it has 0:07:11.240 --> 0:07:14.200 to do with movement, how you can slide on clay, 0:07:14.240 --> 0:07:18.080 how you can slide in and out of shots. You 0:07:18.120 --> 0:07:21.320 see some people play on clay, whether it be green 0:07:21.320 --> 0:07:23.280 clay or red clay, and they look like they're sort 0:07:23.280 --> 0:07:25.320 of running on ice, and they're just like, well, whoa, 0:07:25.320 --> 0:07:27.800 whoa whoa, whoa, you know, instead of like sliding into 0:07:27.840 --> 0:07:29.440 the shot, being able to hit the shot and then 0:07:29.440 --> 0:07:32.880 get back immediately after that. And I always said to people, 0:07:32.880 --> 0:07:35.440 whether I was coaching or playing, I was like, if 0:07:35.480 --> 0:07:37.480 you see somebody that can't slide to the ball, just 0:07:37.560 --> 0:07:40.880 hit drop shots all day long. So that's just a 0:07:40.880 --> 0:07:44.160 little tip for everybody out there that plays on green clay, 0:07:44.560 --> 0:07:47.400 especially in America or on clay in general. If you 0:07:47.440 --> 0:07:50.200 see somebody not being able to slide, they cannot you 0:07:50.800 --> 0:07:53.440 hit angles, so they're running off the court and then 0:07:53.480 --> 0:07:55.400 they have to take four steps after the shot to 0:07:55.440 --> 0:07:58.600 get back, or you hit drop shots. I love hitting it. 0:07:58.720 --> 0:08:00.360 I love sliding. 0:08:00.560 --> 0:08:02.520 Yeah, it's the one thing I could do really well 0:08:02.560 --> 0:08:04.720 on play. It's like it's slide for days. 0:08:04.800 --> 0:08:06.400 It's really really fun. As a matter of fact, my 0:08:06.440 --> 0:08:09.160 favorite tennis court in New York City is red clay, 0:08:09.680 --> 0:08:11.720 and you can slide decently well. They've maintained it really well. 0:08:11.760 --> 0:08:14.480 It's beautiful and you know, but yes, you're right, where. 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:17.720 Is that the ninety six street courts up on Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, 0:08:17.760 --> 0:08:18.640 of course we're. 0:08:18.440 --> 0:08:20.520 It's a little bit tucked away and out of and 0:08:20.560 --> 0:08:24.239 out of I say it so yeah, I thought the 0:08:24.280 --> 0:08:29.440 tragedy of Tommy Paul, Oh my god, up the third 0:08:29.520 --> 0:08:33.920 set on Jenson Brooksby in the semi finals, serving for the match 0:08:34.520 --> 0:08:35.360 at five four. 0:08:35.800 --> 0:08:37.880 Well, let's go back a little bit because Jensen was 0:08:37.880 --> 0:08:40.600 actually up in that set for one good point, right, 0:08:40.679 --> 0:08:43.120 So you could arguably say, well, Jensen Brooksby should have 0:08:43.120 --> 0:08:45.440 won six, one, six and the third earlier, but he 0:08:45.480 --> 0:08:48.200 didn't because clearly he wasn't expected to beat Tommy. And 0:08:48.240 --> 0:08:50.480 then Tommy comes back and six five up in the 0:08:50.480 --> 0:08:51.840 third and you're like, oh, of course this is how 0:08:51.840 --> 0:08:53.160 it's going to end. He's going to serve it out, 0:08:53.440 --> 0:08:55.440 doesn't serve it out, Oh no, no, no, ok, god, 0:08:55.520 --> 0:08:57.320 we're going in a tide break, okay, match point, and 0:08:57.320 --> 0:08:59.200 then he loses that match point. It's kind of like, 0:08:59.520 --> 0:09:00.880 oh my god. It was a long day. There was 0:09:00.920 --> 0:09:02.560 a lot of rain there. They had to you know, 0:09:02.600 --> 0:09:05.200 they went from day to night playing that match. But 0:09:05.920 --> 0:09:10.280 Jenson Brooksby going not only and beating Tommy Paul, but 0:09:10.320 --> 0:09:12.960 then going and beating Francis Tiafoe again. He was up 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:15.280 quite large in the first set. It looked like Francis 0:09:15.320 --> 0:09:17.120 was going to come back, and then he ends up 0:09:17.120 --> 0:09:19.840 serving the setout and then winning the match. But I 0:09:19.840 --> 0:09:22.000 got to give the kid a lot of credit. This 0:09:22.040 --> 0:09:24.920 is somebody who was suspended because he missed his drug 0:09:25.000 --> 0:09:28.920 tests and not only that in that time, and a 0:09:29.000 --> 0:09:32.160 lot of that's an unfortunate thing. Yes, he has to 0:09:32.200 --> 0:09:34.400 be better at obviously being at the places he's supposed 0:09:34.400 --> 0:09:37.800 to be for his drug tests, but you know, look, 0:09:37.840 --> 0:09:40.440 I had to miss drug tests as well myself one time, 0:09:40.480 --> 0:09:42.880 and if I had missed another one just because I forgot, 0:09:42.960 --> 0:09:46.000 I mean I was very diligent after getting the second 0:09:46.280 --> 0:09:50.320 missed where I was supposed to be drug test, So 0:09:50.400 --> 0:09:51.760 he should have been a little bit better with all 0:09:51.840 --> 0:09:53.840 that sort of stuff. But having said that, you know, 0:09:53.880 --> 0:09:56.320 it's really great to see him back and playing so well, 0:09:56.360 --> 0:09:58.800 Like you know, he was playing so well when he 0:09:58.840 --> 0:10:00.880 got that suspension, and and to come back and do 0:10:00.960 --> 0:10:03.560 what he did and win this tournament. That's that's credit 0:10:03.559 --> 0:10:06.559 to young man who also came out and told everyone 0:10:06.720 --> 0:10:09.560 not only that he was on the spectrum, that he 0:10:09.600 --> 0:10:13.000 had autism, and it's like wow, to see him doing 0:10:13.040 --> 0:10:14.520 this is really amazing. 0:10:14.720 --> 0:10:18.920 I think it's it for me humanized him a lot 0:10:19.000 --> 0:10:24.400 and made what beforehand I didn't really understand and behavior 0:10:24.800 --> 0:10:27.920 maybe some sportsmanship issues. It made a little bit more 0:10:27.920 --> 0:10:30.360 contextualized for me where I was like, oh, I see 0:10:30.400 --> 0:10:33.880 he's neurodivergent. That's actually really helpful to be able to 0:10:33.960 --> 0:10:37.640 understand that. You know, his on court behavior doesn't necessarily 0:10:37.679 --> 0:10:42.920 look like deliberately Yeah, it doesn't feel like maybe he's 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:49.520 being deliberately you know, unsporting. So I feel like, yeah, no, 0:10:49.559 --> 0:10:53.160 you're right. And again it's a testament to like having 0:10:53.679 --> 0:10:56.400 some transparency and vulnerability to talk about something. But also 0:10:56.440 --> 0:10:58.199 then it allows us to celebrate him and be like, 0:10:58.240 --> 0:11:02.040 oh wow, in spite of being neurodivergent, it is something 0:11:02.040 --> 0:11:03.640 that he has had to overcome, and now it makes 0:11:03.640 --> 0:11:05.360 it a little easier to root for this guy. Yeah, 0:11:05.360 --> 0:11:07.600 you know, because like with all these professional athletes, you know, 0:11:07.600 --> 0:11:12.120 the tennis is elite. You know, obviously day in and 0:11:12.200 --> 0:11:14.000 day out, you know, people have their ups and downs. 0:11:14.120 --> 0:11:16.080 But I think in general, if there's a player who 0:11:16.720 --> 0:11:19.240 can let us in on something like that, it becomes 0:11:19.240 --> 0:11:22.280 a little bit more you know, it becomes sort of 0:11:22.320 --> 0:11:26.680 like the rich tapestry of the tennis ecosystem as opposed 0:11:26.679 --> 0:11:28.080 to like, oh I don't like this guy yeah. 0:11:28.120 --> 0:11:31.640 I mean, look, Madison Key is talking about going to 0:11:31.720 --> 0:11:34.680 therapy and not just sports therapy, actually going to therapy 0:11:34.679 --> 0:11:37.200 to figure out why it was that she wasn't loving 0:11:37.320 --> 0:11:40.199 and had a good relationship with tennis, and her being 0:11:40.200 --> 0:11:42.160 able to work on that and figure that out made 0:11:42.160 --> 0:11:45.679 it made her understand how her feelings were affecting her 0:11:45.720 --> 0:11:48.120 on the court. And that's that's what we're talking about. 0:11:48.120 --> 0:11:50.080 When players are a little bit more open about how 0:11:50.120 --> 0:11:53.040 they feel and why they do the things they do, 0:11:53.400 --> 0:11:55.880 that's a great thing. So I think Jensen has opened 0:11:55.960 --> 0:11:57.880 up a lot of I have to say, I think 0:11:57.880 --> 0:12:00.440 it's a lot of windows to a lot and for 0:12:00.559 --> 0:12:01.520 a lot of kids out. 0:12:01.400 --> 0:12:03.840 There, I hope, So I hope we continue. Somebody else 0:12:04.280 --> 0:12:07.200 who we should celebrate on this podcast, who was also 0:12:07.240 --> 0:12:11.200 playing in Charleston and who's been very open about, you know, 0:12:11.240 --> 0:12:13.240 so the direction her life has taken and so much 0:12:13.240 --> 0:12:16.800 so that she's created an incredibly entertaining and fun vlag 0:12:16.920 --> 0:12:20.000 out of it. Is Daria Kasatikina, who is your new 0:12:20.120 --> 0:12:20.839 country woman. 0:12:20.960 --> 0:12:23.880 Yes this, I have to say, I was in Indian 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:27.479 Wells and there's a man that works for Tennis Australia 0:12:27.920 --> 0:12:31.680 quite senior up in tennis Australia was I saw him 0:12:31.920 --> 0:12:35.800 talking to John Morris and who is Daria Kasatkina's agent? 0:12:36.320 --> 0:12:40.160 And they were having a very you know, intimate conversation 0:12:40.400 --> 0:12:42.000 and I was like, what's going on over there? And 0:12:42.000 --> 0:12:45.080 then I was like, wait a second, is she like 0:12:45.360 --> 0:12:48.600 talking and thinking about becoming Australian? Sorry? 0:12:48.600 --> 0:12:48.840 Did you just solve a case detective? 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:53.360 Yes? Life, I swear my life and Daria, we'll prove 0:12:53.360 --> 0:12:56.440 it because I saw her a couple of minutes later 0:12:56.480 --> 0:12:59.040 and I said to her, were recruiting you, We're recruiting you, 0:12:59.080 --> 0:13:02.240 and she goes maybe, and then sure enough what it 0:13:02.280 --> 0:13:04.760 was like a week after Indian wells, Yeah, it gets 0:13:04.760 --> 0:13:07.360 announced and I was like, oh my god, I was right. 0:13:07.600 --> 0:13:11.280 But a classic so great obviously for anybody who does 0:13:11.320 --> 0:13:13.120 not know or not does not listen to this podcast 0:13:13.120 --> 0:13:18.920 area because how can I Russian origin? Yes, openly gay, yes, 0:13:19.600 --> 0:13:22.600 and in a relationship with her girlfriend and they do 0:13:22.640 --> 0:13:24.480 have vlog and she's you know, I think one of 0:13:24.520 --> 0:13:27.199 the tour's most delightful players. She's fun to watch, She's 0:13:27.200 --> 0:13:29.599 got a lot of tools, she's obviously a great athlete, 0:13:30.200 --> 0:13:32.040 and I think she's a fan favorite for a lot 0:13:32.040 --> 0:13:36.280 of reasons, you know, being gay, in Vladimir Putin's Russia 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:38.000 well and speaking up about it. Bad news. She has 0:13:38.040 --> 0:13:40.520 spoken up about it and being you know, very very 0:13:40.520 --> 0:13:42.319 overtly political, you know, but this is one of the 0:13:42.360 --> 0:13:44.439 countries that has like outlawed homosexuality. 0:13:45.760 --> 0:13:50.200 G'day mate. So of course I texted her immediately when 0:13:50.200 --> 0:13:51.960 I saw it, and I said I knew it. And 0:13:51.960 --> 0:13:57.240 by the way, that yeah, so look, Daria Saville, Daria 0:13:57.679 --> 0:14:02.080 Gavrilova former Gavrilova, is one of Daria's best friends. So 0:14:02.120 --> 0:14:04.480 I can imagine the conversation has been had by them 0:14:04.559 --> 0:14:07.000 over the months. I haven't spoken to Dasha about it, but 0:14:07.320 --> 0:14:10.480 I would imagine that they had talked quite extensively about 0:14:10.480 --> 0:14:13.400 living in Australia, about moving to Australia. 0:14:14.000 --> 0:14:19.080 And how old was she? Quite young, she was sort 0:14:19.080 --> 0:14:21.280 of converted, I guess from Russia. 0:14:21.440 --> 0:14:26.120 Yeah, I believe in her early twenties. But she I'd 0:14:26.200 --> 0:14:28.640 have to think about it. But look, she's she's been 0:14:28.680 --> 0:14:30.760 a part of the Australian tapestry of tennis for so 0:14:30.840 --> 0:14:34.160 long now, I would say a decade, and of course 0:14:34.280 --> 0:14:37.080 married her husband, Luke Saville, who's in Australia. He's an 0:14:37.080 --> 0:14:40.760 Australian tennis player, just retired and so look they live 0:14:40.760 --> 0:14:46.560 in Melbourne. They you know, Dasha Gavrilova is or Saville 0:14:46.640 --> 0:14:50.520 is very Australian, represents Australia in the Olympics and fed 0:14:50.560 --> 0:14:53.440 Cup and you know, her Australian accent is pretty good now, 0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:57.600 you know. So it's nice to see this from a standpoint. 0:14:57.240 --> 0:15:01.960 From an international competition standpoint. You know, Australia just gained 0:15:02.040 --> 0:15:03.160 another top twenty player. 0:15:03.200 --> 0:15:05.280 Hey, we'll take it. I think there's still a conversation 0:15:05.400 --> 0:15:08.080 if she can represent Australia and when, But it'll be 0:15:08.120 --> 0:15:11.760 really wonderful to see her out there, you know. So 0:15:12.440 --> 0:15:16.600 we've recruited somebody good players Ajla Tomjlanovitch, Yeah, Darius Saville 0:15:17.200 --> 0:15:20.560 of course. Now Kasatkina, so hey, way to go tennis Australia. 0:15:20.600 --> 0:15:24.600 While we're talking about Daria Saville I sort of flagged 0:15:24.640 --> 0:15:27.560 something that I thought was really interesting. Late last week 0:15:27.680 --> 0:15:30.880 she went out on social media to talk about how 0:15:31.840 --> 0:15:38.040 disappointed she found it that brands were keen to sponsor 0:15:38.200 --> 0:15:41.760 the wives and girlfriends of tennis players sort of influencers 0:15:41.760 --> 0:15:43.840 in the tennis space. You would say keen to be 0:15:44.000 --> 0:15:46.200 involved in the tennis world, just not in the tennis 0:15:46.240 --> 0:15:50.720 world way that you would hope, well, she would certainly hope 0:15:50.720 --> 0:15:55.440 that the brands would I think pay female athletes instead 0:15:55.480 --> 0:15:58.000 of paying wives and girlfriends. And the reaction to this 0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:01.560 has been, you know, sort of predictably mixed. I'm curious 0:16:01.600 --> 0:16:05.840 as to your reaction to it, because, yes, players on 0:16:05.920 --> 0:16:09.040 the pro tour, especially women who are maybe not necessarily 0:16:09.040 --> 0:16:10.760 in the top twenty all of those goes for men too, 0:16:12.560 --> 0:16:15.920 don't often enjoy the preponderance of brand deals. And we 0:16:15.960 --> 0:16:18.320 have seen in the last couple of years, especially an 0:16:18.440 --> 0:16:22.520 uptick in brands, and by brands, I mean every brandy, brands, 0:16:22.560 --> 0:16:31.480 liquor brands, media brands, creating a lot of content with influencers, 0:16:31.720 --> 0:16:34.080 some of whom are sort of notable wives and girlfriends, 0:16:34.080 --> 0:16:37.800 and we can talk about who they are and you know, 0:16:37.840 --> 0:16:42.960 how they operate in the ecosystem. But this is relatively 0:16:43.040 --> 0:16:44.720 new to tennis. I think it's probably been in other 0:16:44.720 --> 0:16:47.600 sports for a long time. And I mean, yes, Daria 0:16:47.920 --> 0:16:51.520 was very keen to sort of say, hey, I talked 0:16:51.520 --> 0:16:53.840 to some of my friends who are influencers and I 0:16:53.880 --> 0:16:55.600 asked them if this would be appropriate for me to 0:16:55.960 --> 0:16:58.960 talk about and they said yes. So yeah, I wonder 0:16:59.120 --> 0:17:01.240 she didn't name any names, so it sounded less of 0:17:01.240 --> 0:17:02.960 a personal attack and more of just like a plead 0:17:03.000 --> 0:17:05.000 to brands to work with female athletes. 0:17:05.240 --> 0:17:08.639 Yeah, listen, this is a double edged sword right in 0:17:08.680 --> 0:17:13.400 a lot of ways, because clearly some of the wives, 0:17:13.440 --> 0:17:15.919 in particular Morgan... 0:17:16.000 --> 0:17:24.968 Morgan's not a wife, and Ayan Bloomfield is dating Frances Tiafoe 0:17:24.968 --> 0:17:27.560 and also was a Division one tennis player at UCLA. Yes, 0:17:28.040 --> 0:17:32.119 and Morgan Riddle has probably gotten the most attention in 0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:34.600 the the sort of wives and girlfriends influencer space. She 0:17:34.640 --> 0:17:37.160 is dating Taylor Fritz. Yeah. There's another one, Paige Lorenze, who 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:40.480 is dating Temmy Paul, who's got her own brand. Yeah, 0:17:40.560 --> 0:17:41.800 so there's a there's a handful here. 0:17:41.880 --> 0:17:43.880 Yeah. So so I think, first of all, I want 0:17:43.880 --> 0:17:47.439 to say, look the fact that those particular girlfriends of 0:17:47.480 --> 0:17:50.080 those particular tennis players have gotten a lot of brands. 0:17:50.119 --> 0:17:52.600 Look there, the three of them are beautiful, Let's just 0:17:52.600 --> 0:17:56.960 put it out there, straight up, gorgeous women. They have 0:17:57.040 --> 0:18:03.080 made an effort themselves to do the vlogs, do the instagrams, 0:18:03.840 --> 0:18:08.120 meet the right people, talk to brands themselves. They're putting 0:18:08.160 --> 0:18:10.080 themselves out there and they're doing the work, all right, 0:18:10.160 --> 0:18:12.800 So they're not brands. Aren't just popping in and saying, hey, guys, 0:18:13.080 --> 0:18:15.439 we see that you're the girlfriend of would you do 0:18:15.560 --> 0:18:19.040 this now? Yeah? Sure, they're getting exposure because they're on television, right, 0:18:19.080 --> 0:18:21.320 So when Francis Tiafoe is playing the US Open, or 0:18:21.680 --> 0:18:25.040 Tommy Paul or Taylor Fitz, the wives are getting shown. 0:18:25.200 --> 0:18:28.240 The girlfriends are getting shown on television a lot. Okay, 0:18:28.240 --> 0:18:31.159 so they're getting their own They're getting attention because of 0:18:31.200 --> 0:18:34.119 their boyfriends, for sure, but they have to put in 0:18:34.119 --> 0:18:36.199 the work themselves, and both of them and all of 0:18:36.200 --> 0:18:39.919 those women in particular, and any other influencer. You have 0:18:39.960 --> 0:18:42.119 to put in the work. It's not like you just 0:18:42.200 --> 0:18:44.000 put on the camera and be like blah blah blah. 0:18:44.040 --> 0:18:46.200 They do the dress. I mean, I saw a Yan yesterday. 0:18:46.200 --> 0:18:48.959 She'd put on this dress and she's talking about this, 0:18:49.040 --> 0:18:51.359 and she's talking about her skincare, and people follow them. 0:18:51.760 --> 0:18:55.040 And therefore, if you have a following, it's like when 0:18:55.080 --> 0:18:59.440 you have the demand, you will get brands and so that. 0:19:00.440 --> 0:19:03.160 So if you, as a tennis player, are gonna complain 0:19:03.240 --> 0:19:08.720 about it or agree with Dasha Savile, you have to 0:19:08.720 --> 0:19:10.880 put in the work as well. You have to get 0:19:10.960 --> 0:19:13.000 dressed up, you have to you know. One of the 0:19:13.040 --> 0:19:15.520 things that Dasha was saying, I guess a sweaty, sporty 0:19:15.560 --> 0:19:17.720 woman is not going to get as much love as 0:19:17.760 --> 0:19:20.000 a beautiful woman who's putting on hair and makeup and 0:19:20.040 --> 0:19:25.439 a great outfit. Okay, yes, you know, supply and demand. 0:19:26.280 --> 0:19:29.640 I don't know. I feel like both can be right 0:19:29.760 --> 0:19:31.800 in the situation. That's how I feel about it. 0:19:31.840 --> 0:19:35.400 Yeah, I would sort of add to me. The thing 0:19:35.440 --> 0:19:42.439 that I really admire about the sort of conversation no, 0:19:42.520 --> 0:19:48.359 the wives and girlfriends is that they've figured out as stories. 0:19:48.440 --> 0:19:50.600 I mean, Morgan Riddle by far as the biggest one, 0:19:50.720 --> 0:19:54.840 and she is by far the best storyteller. Yeah, she's 0:19:55.040 --> 0:19:57.600 crafting not only sort of a persona, but also content 0:19:57.640 --> 0:19:59.960 that these brands want. And so, yes, does it hurt 0:20:00.119 --> 0:20:03.240 that these these folks are, you know, in full hair 0:20:03.280 --> 0:20:06.160 and makeup as you mentioned earlier, Obviously they're very attractive 0:20:06.200 --> 0:20:08.960 and there are you know, there are some realities of 0:20:09.000 --> 0:20:09.880 the market that. 0:20:10.560 --> 0:20:13.040 Uh, you know, sadly contour to that. 0:20:13.720 --> 0:20:16.000 Yeah, the contour to that, sure, But I also want 0:20:16.000 --> 0:20:18.760 to call out, like the tremendous amount of work and storytelling. 0:20:18.840 --> 0:20:22.800 And I think when we've seen athletes tell stories, especially 0:20:22.840 --> 0:20:25.119 if it's sort of a continued effort as part of 0:20:25.160 --> 0:20:28.879