1 00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:08,080 Speaker 1: On this episode of Newts World. The twenty twenty four 2 00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:13,520 Speaker 1: Republican presidential primary debates will begin on Wednesday in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. 3 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:17,279 Speaker 1: The location is significant because it's where the Republican Party 4 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:21,400 Speaker 1: will hold its national convention next July. Brett Baer and 5 00:00:21,440 --> 00:00:25,520 Speaker 1: Martha McCallum of Fox News will host the debate. All 6 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:29,040 Speaker 1: the major Republican candidates will be there except the front runner, 7 00:00:29,440 --> 00:00:32,519 Speaker 1: former President Donald J. Trump. Although the bay will be 8 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:35,920 Speaker 1: less exciting and less watched without Trump, it is still 9 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:40,640 Speaker 1: an important milestone in the evolving presidential nomination campaign of 10 00:00:40,720 --> 00:00:43,240 Speaker 1: twenty twenty four. And Callista and I will be sitting 11 00:00:43,320 --> 00:01:01,560 Speaker 1: right there watching the debate this podcast by giving you 12 00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:04,200 Speaker 1: my take on each candidate. You have a lot of 13 00:01:04,240 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 1: candidates out there who are ambitious, eager, smart, hardworking. They 14 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:12,320 Speaker 1: all would like to be the alternative to Trump. And 15 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:16,760 Speaker 1: so what they're doing Wednesday night is they're auditioning to 16 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:20,320 Speaker 1: see whether or not they're the one who emerges. Going 17 00:01:20,360 --> 00:01:23,399 Speaker 1: into this six months ago, we would all have expected 18 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:26,479 Speaker 1: that it was Governor Ron DeSantis of Florida, who'd been 19 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: a very successful governor. Turns out, running for presidents a 20 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 1: lot harder than running for governor, he may not quite 21 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:37,600 Speaker 1: be ready to hit major league pitching, which, since he 22 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:40,759 Speaker 1: was the captain of the IL baseball team, I think 23 00:01:40,840 --> 00:01:44,120 Speaker 1: is an almost funny parallel. And as a result, he 24 00:01:44,200 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 1: has shrunk substantially from the position of being the clear 25 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:52,200 Speaker 1: alternative to being the leader among several possible alternatives. So 26 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:57,320 Speaker 1: a lot of people practicing, preparing thinking about this, each 27 00:01:57,360 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 1: of them in their own mind thinking I could be 28 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:03,240 Speaker 1: the one that lightning strikes. I could have an opportunity. Listen, 29 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:06,200 Speaker 1: I'm going to watch the debate in Milwaukee, and we're 30 00:02:06,240 --> 00:02:10,680 Speaker 1: looking for certain things. I think in Dessanus's case, Kenny 31 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: come across as friendly, Kenny come across as relatively happy. 32 00:02:15,720 --> 00:02:18,680 Speaker 1: Can he focus his fire on Trump rather than on 33 00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:21,679 Speaker 1: the other candidates? Ultimately that's the person he's going to 34 00:02:21,720 --> 00:02:24,799 Speaker 1: have to beat yet denomination. But in addition, can he 35 00:02:24,880 --> 00:02:28,840 Speaker 1: communicate a positive vision of an American future that makes 36 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:31,080 Speaker 1: people want to vote for him to take us to 37 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:34,079 Speaker 1: a better place than we are right now. I think 38 00:02:34,120 --> 00:02:38,760 Speaker 1: that Vice President Pence has to be calmly, steady, and positive, 39 00:02:39,280 --> 00:02:42,360 Speaker 1: and to the degree he can do it, avoid picking 40 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:45,560 Speaker 1: a fight with Donald Trump. Pence was a very loyal 41 00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:48,080 Speaker 1: vice President. He did a very good job for Trump 42 00:02:48,120 --> 00:02:51,080 Speaker 1: up until the very end, and he said over and 43 00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:54,080 Speaker 1: over again what a great administration was. And in a sense, 44 00:02:54,080 --> 00:02:56,959 Speaker 1: he has a hard time attacking Trump too hard because 45 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:01,280 Speaker 1: he's attacking his own administration. In the case of Nikki Haley, 46 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:04,399 Speaker 1: it's as important that she focused on the great job 47 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:07,680 Speaker 1: she did as a reform governor as that she focused 48 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:10,960 Speaker 1: on being ambassadors at the United Nations. And again, I 49 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:14,079 Speaker 1: think she can focus on China. She can focus on 50 00:03:14,160 --> 00:03:17,360 Speaker 1: fixing Washington and not spend a whole lot of time 51 00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 1: either attacking DeSantis or attacking Trump. The vek Ramaswami, I 52 00:03:22,560 --> 00:03:27,680 Speaker 1: think has two missions. One to proving take aupun. Somebody 53 00:03:27,720 --> 00:03:29,800 Speaker 1: there is going to go at him. There's no doubt 54 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:34,480 Speaker 1: in my mind, somebody, maybe the sledgehammer that the Desanta's 55 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: memo talked about. What he's got to show, like Reagan, 56 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:41,080 Speaker 1: is that he can relax, take the hit and keep 57 00:03:41,160 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 1: his feet and stay focused on being positive. Second, he 58 00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:47,320 Speaker 1: has to show that he knows enough. I mean, he's 59 00:03:47,320 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 1: thirty eight years old, he's a brilliant entrepreneur. We've done 60 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 1: three podcasts with him. I have great respect for him, 61 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: but he's got to show people that you could trust 62 00:03:56,720 --> 00:03:59,320 Speaker 1: a thirty eight year old entrepreneur who's never been in 63 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 1: politics with being commander in chief of the most powerful 64 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:05,880 Speaker 1: nation in the world. Now, if he crosses that and 65 00:04:05,920 --> 00:04:08,160 Speaker 1: people start saying, you know, he could really do the job, 66 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 1: then I think he could emerge as the primary alternative 67 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:16,960 Speaker 1: to Trump. Tim Scott is a wonderful human being, has 68 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:20,159 Speaker 1: been a very effective senator before that, a congressman before that, 69 00:04:20,200 --> 00:04:25,000 Speaker 1: accounty commissioner. Everybody agrees he's a very nice man, but 70 00:04:25,080 --> 00:04:27,800 Speaker 1: people always say that he's not tough enough. You know, 71 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:30,760 Speaker 1: being president, you've got to be pretty tough. And I 72 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:33,279 Speaker 1: think this will be an interesting moment to see. Can 73 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 1: he define himself, not necessarily by attacking any of those guys, 74 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:41,440 Speaker 1: probably by attacking the Biden administration. Can he define himself 75 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 1: as a guy tough enough to be president. I think 76 00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:47,920 Speaker 1: Chris Christie is virtually hopeless. He is running primarily because 77 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:51,159 Speaker 1: he's so bitter at Trump and angry at Trump. You know, 78 00:04:51,200 --> 00:04:54,200 Speaker 1: that's a pretty thin base for a presidential campaign. It'll 79 00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:57,120 Speaker 1: be interesting to see how that works out. But I 80 00:04:57,160 --> 00:04:59,719 Speaker 1: think that Christie's in the end not going to last 81 00:04:59,800 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 1: very long because people aren't going to be into an 82 00:05:02,560 --> 00:05:07,000 Speaker 1: entirely negative ani Trump candidate. I think Asa Hutchison candidly, 83 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 1: I can't figure out why he's running, but we have 84 00:05:09,240 --> 00:05:11,200 Speaker 1: seen see if he can give us a good explanation. 85 00:05:11,480 --> 00:05:13,880 Speaker 1: I mean, he certainly had a good career. He certainly 86 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:17,080 Speaker 1: could focus with knowledge on the border and on the 87 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:19,880 Speaker 1: drug crisis that we have. And if he does that, 88 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:22,520 Speaker 1: he may penetrate to some extent that he's the guy 89 00:05:22,520 --> 00:05:25,160 Speaker 1: who could fix the border and knows the most about 90 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:28,719 Speaker 1: fixing the border. Governor Bergham of North Dakota, I frankly 91 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 1: don't know. He'll be the least known person getting on 92 00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:35,560 Speaker 1: that stage. He is a billionaire, he has very strong views. 93 00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:38,760 Speaker 1: I think if he focuses on communicating what he would 94 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 1: do to change Washington and what he would do to 95 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:45,040 Speaker 1: help America, he'll get much further down the road than 96 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:49,120 Speaker 1: if he focuses on either attacking his opponents orn't attacking Trump. 97 00:05:50,080 --> 00:05:53,320 Speaker 1: Each person has a different mission, a different assignment, and 98 00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:55,360 Speaker 1: it's going to be fascinating to see how it works out. 99 00:05:56,320 --> 00:05:59,680 Speaker 1: Trump said on true social quote, the public knows who 100 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 1: I am em and what a successful presidency I had. 101 00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:05,440 Speaker 1: I will therefore not be doing the debates, and he's 102 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:09,080 Speaker 1: expected to have an interview with former Fox News host 103 00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:12,320 Speaker 1: Tucker Carlson on X, which was formerly known as Twitter, 104 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:15,160 Speaker 1: and I have to confess, I do not understand why 105 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 1: Elon Musk has switched it t X, and I don't 106 00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 1: know what he gains by that. There's a leaked memo 107 00:06:20,800 --> 00:06:24,159 Speaker 1: that supposedly was drafted by the heads of the pro 108 00:06:24,279 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 1: Ron de Santis super Pac never backed down, which talks 109 00:06:28,080 --> 00:06:32,520 Speaker 1: about how they think the governor should attack businessman Vivek Ramaswami. 110 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:36,320 Speaker 1: They call for Dessanas to take a sledgehammer to his 111 00:06:36,440 --> 00:06:40,600 Speaker 1: GOP rival. Ramaswami, of course, has been really delighted to 112 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:43,080 Speaker 1: have that kind of recognition and has been sending out 113 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: all sorts of emails at requesting financial support so he 114 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:50,280 Speaker 1: can survive the sledgehammer. It's candidate a little hard for 115 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 1: me to believe that that memo is real. I guess 116 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:57,480 Speaker 1: it is, but it's so stupid. If DeSantis' future requires 117 00:06:57,520 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 1: attacking Vivike Ramaswami, it tells you how bad the Disanta's 118 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:04,080 Speaker 1: campaign is doing, because in theory, he should be so 119 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:07,480 Speaker 1: far ahead as the number two choice after Trump, that 120 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:12,000 Speaker 1: he couldn't care about vivik Ramasami. Instead, as Dasanas has decayed, 121 00:07:12,400 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 1: Ramaswami and others have gained ground, and the result is 122 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:18,680 Speaker 1: that there are now five or six candidates who are 123 00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:22,280 Speaker 1: legitimately fighting to be the number two choice after Trump, 124 00:07:22,760 --> 00:07:26,720 Speaker 1: and of course the establishment is desperate to have most 125 00:07:26,720 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 1: of them drop out, because the establishment understands that a 126 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:34,200 Speaker 1: multi candidate field absolutely helps Trump because Trump has a 127 00:07:34,280 --> 00:07:37,600 Speaker 1: base that is huge. That base is not going to 128 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 1: go for anybody else. So he's sitting there. Let's say 129 00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 1: he's in a state where he has forty three or 130 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:44,920 Speaker 1: forty five percent, not enough to be a majority in 131 00:07:44,960 --> 00:07:48,240 Speaker 1: a two person race, but if the other fifty percent 132 00:07:48,840 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 1: is split up among five or six or seven candidates, 133 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:54,280 Speaker 1: Trump's going to look like a giant, and they're all 134 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:57,440 Speaker 1: going to look like they're very small. So it's fascinating. 135 00:07:57,480 --> 00:08:01,440 Speaker 1: And remember the number one goal of the debate Wednesday 136 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:05,080 Speaker 1: night is to do well enough that you have cracked 137 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:07,920 Speaker 1: enough supporters that you begin to be seen as the 138 00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:12,000 Speaker 1: logical alternative to Trump. The Democrats, of course, are having 139 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:14,800 Speaker 1: lots of fun with all this. I think that well, 140 00:08:14,840 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 1: you have to recognize is kind of where we are 141 00:08:17,840 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 1: in the Des Moines Register poll conducted by Jay Ann Seltzer, 142 00:08:23,200 --> 00:08:27,120 Speaker 1: who's a very famous, very traditional Iowa fixture in polling. 143 00:08:27,640 --> 00:08:32,320 Speaker 1: Trump's at forty two, Santas is at nineteen, Scott's at nine, 144 00:08:32,559 --> 00:08:36,120 Speaker 1: Nikki Haley's at six, Mike Pence is at six, Chris 145 00:08:36,200 --> 00:08:40,360 Speaker 1: Christie's at five, and VV Ramaswami's at four. According to 146 00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 1: a CBSU Gov pole, nationally, Trump's in the lead with 147 00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:51,439 Speaker 1: sixty two percent, with Dissanas at sixteen, Ramaswami seven, Pence five, 148 00:08:51,800 --> 00:09:07,160 Speaker 1: Scott three, Hally two, Christy two. That's nationally. Hi, this 149 00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:09,560 Speaker 1: is newt. In my new book, March the Majority, The 150 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:13,040 Speaker 1: Real Story of the Republican Revolution, I offer strategies and 151 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:16,920 Speaker 1: insights for everyday citizens and for season politicians. It's both 152 00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:20,400 Speaker 1: a guide for political success and for winning back the Majority. 153 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:23,600 Speaker 1: In twenty twenty four, March to the Majority outlines the 154 00:09:23,679 --> 00:09:28,040 Speaker 1: sixteen year campaign to write the Contract with America. Explains 155 00:09:28,080 --> 00:09:31,880 Speaker 1: how we elected the first Republican House majority in forty years, 156 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 1: in how we worked with President Bill Clinton to pass 157 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:40,280 Speaker 1: major reforms, including four consecutive balance budgets. March to the 158 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 1: Majority tells the behind the scenes story of how we 159 00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 1: got it done. Go to ginglishtree sixty dot com slash 160 00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:50,120 Speaker 1: book and order your copy now. Order it today at 161 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:57,000 Speaker 1: gingishtree sixty dot com slash book. Let me share with 162 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:00,880 Speaker 1: you a little bit of my own experiences. Well, it 163 00:10:01,040 --> 00:10:04,200 Speaker 1: is true that when we were faced with our first 164 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:07,760 Speaker 1: big debate, Clise than I decided to relax. It was 165 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:10,600 Speaker 1: an evening debate. We were in Iowa, so we went 166 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:14,720 Speaker 1: to our motel room and we watched Bridesmaids and we 167 00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:18,440 Speaker 1: laughed and had a die coke. And my theory was 168 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:21,720 Speaker 1: that by the time you get to a presidential debate, 169 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 1: you should know what you believe first of all, and 170 00:10:24,559 --> 00:10:27,319 Speaker 1: you should know enough facts that you don't need to 171 00:10:27,320 --> 00:10:30,640 Speaker 1: sit around and cram and Frank cramming is bad because 172 00:10:30,679 --> 00:10:34,160 Speaker 1: then you start trying to remember things. The number one 173 00:10:34,400 --> 00:10:38,839 Speaker 1: characteristic of winning a debate is authenticity. And I think 174 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:42,479 Speaker 1: it's very important to understand that if you feel authentic, 175 00:10:43,200 --> 00:10:46,439 Speaker 1: if people feel they're seeing the real person, you can 176 00:10:46,480 --> 00:10:48,559 Speaker 1: be a real liberal, you can be a real conservative 177 00:10:48,880 --> 00:10:50,880 Speaker 1: as long as you have this sense and yeah, that's 178 00:10:50,880 --> 00:10:54,800 Speaker 1: who that person really is. Second is to be likable. 179 00:10:55,679 --> 00:10:59,800 Speaker 1: Lesson I learned frankly from James Carville, the great Democratic consultant, 180 00:11:00,080 --> 00:11:03,080 Speaker 1: used to go and give speeches together. We'd have dinner afterwards, 181 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 1: and he said to me one night, almost all the 182 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:08,200 Speaker 1: audiences that can afford to hire him a Republican. So 183 00:11:08,280 --> 00:11:11,400 Speaker 1: he knows they're not going to love him. That's not 184 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:14,480 Speaker 1: how it's going to happen. But he's not going to 185 00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:18,080 Speaker 1: change their view on policy because they believe what they believe. 186 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 1: What he can do is change the review of him. 187 00:11:22,240 --> 00:11:25,720 Speaker 1: And so Carlo used lots of humor and was very relaxed, 188 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:27,600 Speaker 1: and people generally came away with thinking, no, he's not 189 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:30,160 Speaker 1: a bad guy. And I learned from that. When I 190 00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:33,200 Speaker 1: was preparing to debate, I really started with the idea, 191 00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:36,880 Speaker 1: I want to be relaxed, I want to look approachable, 192 00:11:37,559 --> 00:11:39,720 Speaker 1: I want to be happy. It's something I learned from Reagan. 193 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:43,480 Speaker 1: Remember when Reagan's attacked by Carter, he smiles and says, 194 00:11:43,559 --> 00:11:46,679 Speaker 1: there you go again. When he's attacked about his age, 195 00:11:46,679 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 1: he smiles and tells a story. He doesn't get uptight, 196 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:54,679 Speaker 1: he doesn't get angry. So we felt that watching Bride'smaids, 197 00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:56,800 Speaker 1: which we hadn't seen but all of our friends had 198 00:11:56,800 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 1: told us was hilarious having a diet coke, relaxing and 199 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:05,120 Speaker 1: then going on stage when you debate. I believe what 200 00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:07,160 Speaker 1: you're really looking for is, first of all, don't make 201 00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:10,680 Speaker 1: a major mistake. Gerald Ford once said in a debate 202 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:14,720 Speaker 1: with Carter that the United States did not recognize Soviet 203 00:12:14,760 --> 00:12:18,200 Speaker 1: control over Poland. Well, that was translated by the press 204 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:21,560 Speaker 1: to mean this guy's stupid and doesn't realize that Poland's 205 00:12:21,600 --> 00:12:24,120 Speaker 1: inside the Soviet Empire. That's not what he's saying. What 206 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:27,319 Speaker 1: he actually said was technically right. The United States did 207 00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:32,480 Speaker 1: not recognize that Polish sovereignty had been superseded by the 208 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:35,760 Speaker 1: Soviet Empire, which is exactly the position we had taken 209 00:12:35,800 --> 00:12:38,800 Speaker 1: since World War Two. But because the press had already 210 00:12:38,800 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 1: decided that gerald Ford was clumsy and stupid, they interpret 211 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:45,000 Speaker 1: in a factually false way. But it was devastating for 212 00:12:45,000 --> 00:12:47,559 Speaker 1: four or five days. He finally had to issue a 213 00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:50,680 Speaker 1: statement saying to clear it up. So you want to 214 00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 1: avoid that. You don't want to make a mistake which 215 00:12:53,600 --> 00:12:57,479 Speaker 1: knocks you out of the race or which significantly weakens you. Second, 216 00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:00,719 Speaker 1: you want to figure out are the one or two, 217 00:13:01,040 --> 00:13:04,760 Speaker 1: at most three, never more than three places where you 218 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:09,679 Speaker 1: can be sufficiently interesting and sufficiently vivid that they will 219 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:11,280 Speaker 1: catch it, pick it up. It'll be in the media 220 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:14,319 Speaker 1: the next day. I would say for these candidates, if 221 00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:17,720 Speaker 1: they say something so good that it makes Fox News 222 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:19,960 Speaker 1: the next day and it runs all day on Fox, 223 00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:23,000 Speaker 1: they've had a good debate. And so you're looking for 224 00:13:23,040 --> 00:13:27,240 Speaker 1: that one or two or three moments, not more. In addition, 225 00:13:27,840 --> 00:13:30,640 Speaker 1: if you have a chance, particularly to take on a 226 00:13:30,679 --> 00:13:33,640 Speaker 1: primary opponent that you think you have to get past, 227 00:13:34,320 --> 00:13:36,839 Speaker 1: if you have a chance to go straight at them 228 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:40,120 Speaker 1: and a way which puts them on defense and where 229 00:13:40,120 --> 00:13:42,600 Speaker 1: the audience will applaud you. You don't want to attack 230 00:13:42,640 --> 00:13:45,400 Speaker 1: somebody in a way that the audience sides with the 231 00:13:45,400 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 1: person you're attacking. You will to attack on a way 232 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:52,640 Speaker 1: that feels clever, feels interesting that somehow people say, yeah, 233 00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 1: that's a great point. I actually had one of my greatest, 234 00:13:55,360 --> 00:13:58,959 Speaker 1: most fun debating moments was at Oxford Union, which is 235 00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:03,359 Speaker 1: a very famous debating stage in Britain at the Oxford University. 236 00:14:03,920 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 1: It's a student run a couple times a year they 237 00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:11,000 Speaker 1: bring in sort of better known celebrity types. So they 238 00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:14,040 Speaker 1: invited me in the late eighties to come and debate 239 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 1: the vice President of Nicaragua and the question of whether 240 00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:19,280 Speaker 1: or not the US policy opposing communism and so forth 241 00:14:19,360 --> 00:14:21,920 Speaker 1: America was the right policy, and of course he was 242 00:14:21,960 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 1: going to come and defend communism. Well, that was too 243 00:14:24,880 --> 00:14:27,680 Speaker 1: good an opportunity, and it's such a famous place as 244 00:14:27,680 --> 00:14:30,600 Speaker 1: a historian to be able to go and debate in 245 00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:33,840 Speaker 1: one of the great debating centers of the world. So 246 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:37,480 Speaker 1: I agreed to go over and in order to do that, 247 00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:40,560 Speaker 1: I went to see Chester Gibson, who had been an 248 00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:44,720 Speaker 1: extraordinarily good debate coach and West Georgia College. This is 249 00:14:44,760 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 1: a good example of preparation, I said, I'm going to 250 00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:49,560 Speaker 1: be in Britain. He said, the number one thing you 251 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:53,640 Speaker 1: need to understand the British don't care about facts. The 252 00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 1: British care about humor. So if you go in there 253 00:14:57,480 --> 00:14:59,640 Speaker 1: and you're deadly serious and you have lots of facts, 254 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:02,720 Speaker 1: you're going to bore them. But if you figure out 255 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:07,480 Speaker 1: a moment to be very funny, you will win the audience, 256 00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:11,040 Speaker 1: very different than the American style. So we get over 257 00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:13,520 Speaker 1: there and the ground rule is if you're speaking, we're 258 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:15,680 Speaker 1: sitting across from each other with a table in between. 259 00:15:16,400 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 1: And if you're speaking. We had I guess twelve hundred 260 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 1: people watching or something, and the other person stands up. 261 00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:25,360 Speaker 1: Then you have to sit down and allow them to 262 00:15:25,720 --> 00:15:30,560 Speaker 1: propound a question. Well, they had this really terrific young 263 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:33,400 Speaker 1: debate or a student. And I should say, by the way, 264 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:37,840 Speaker 1: that when I debated there, we had several people. Frank Lunz, 265 00:15:38,240 --> 00:15:40,200 Speaker 1: who was on my debate team, he was a student 266 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:43,400 Speaker 1: at the time, and Boris Johnson was a graduate student 267 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:45,640 Speaker 1: in the audience at the time. We talked about it later. 268 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:50,640 Speaker 1: So we're debating and this really attractive, bright young guy 269 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 1: gets up and starts giving a talk, and he's talking 270 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:57,640 Speaker 1: about how he'd been to America. He knew America. America 271 00:15:57,800 --> 00:16:01,480 Speaker 1: was greater than its current policy, he knew America was 272 00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:06,840 Speaker 1: about wonderful values. America was more than apple pie or 273 00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 1: baseball or wet T shirt contest. Well, the second he 274 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,880 Speaker 1: said that, I just knew there was an opening. So 275 00:16:13,960 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 1: I stood up and he stares at me because he's 276 00:16:16,720 --> 00:16:19,120 Speaker 1: a student that I'm a principal, and he didn't expect 277 00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 1: to have, you know, somebody who's a national figure suddenly 278 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:26,160 Speaker 1: asking him a question. And the audience starts to giggle 279 00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:29,160 Speaker 1: and he has to sit down under the rules. I 280 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:32,880 Speaker 1: was very slow, deliberately, and I said, you know, you're 281 00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:37,120 Speaker 1: a very very smart debater. I'm very impressed, and you're 282 00:16:37,400 --> 00:16:41,960 Speaker 1: very good looking. The audience now is giggling. I said, so, 283 00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 1: I'm very curious if you think America is not about 284 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:51,840 Speaker 1: wet t shirt contests. How old were you when you 285 00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:56,200 Speaker 1: were in America? Well, he's totally flustered. The audience starts 286 00:16:56,240 --> 00:16:59,920 Speaker 1: to chant answer. Answer. It didn't matter what he said. 287 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:05,320 Speaker 1: He'd lost, and in fact, for an American defending American 288 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:08,240 Speaker 1: policy in Central America, I actually did pretty well against 289 00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:11,399 Speaker 1: the Nicaraguo vice president. People thought it was quite an 290 00:17:11,400 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 1: interesting event. So using that approach, I once accused Mitt 291 00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:20,159 Speaker 1: Romney on one of our debates of pious and boloney. 292 00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:22,440 Speaker 1: But I think you'll find it more interesting if I 293 00:17:22,560 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: just played the debate scene from January eighth in New Hampshire. 294 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:29,080 Speaker 1: I realized the red light doesn't mean anything to you 295 00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:37,320 Speaker 1: because you're the front runner. But can we drop a 296 00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:40,399 Speaker 1: little bit of the pious maloney. The fact is you 297 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:42,480 Speaker 1: ran in ninety four and lost. That's why you weren't 298 00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:46,359 Speaker 1: serving the center with Rick Santour. The fact is you 299 00:17:46,400 --> 00:17:49,520 Speaker 1: had a very bad reelection rating. You dropped out of office. 300 00:17:49,520 --> 00:17:50,960 Speaker 1: You had been out of state for something like two 301 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:53,520 Speaker 1: hundred days preparing to run for president. You didn't have 302 00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:56,639 Speaker 1: this interlude a puff citizenship while you thought about what 303 00:17:56,720 --> 00:17:58,840 Speaker 1: to do. You were running for president, while you were 304 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 1: a governor, you were going on all over the country. 305 00:18:01,160 --> 00:18:03,879 Speaker 1: You were out of state consistently. You then promptly re 306 00:18:04,040 --> 00:18:06,600 Speaker 1: entered politics. You happen to lose to McCain, as you 307 00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:09,000 Speaker 1: had lost to Kennedy. Now you're back running. You've been 308 00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 1: running consistently for years and years and years. So this 309 00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:15,520 Speaker 1: idea that suddenly citizenships showed up in your mind just 310 00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 1: level with the American people. You've been running for so 311 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:24,480 Speaker 1: least since the nineteen nineties. So, as you can see, 312 00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:28,760 Speaker 1: I was taking Romney apart, but I started with something funny, 313 00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:32,400 Speaker 1: pious maloney. So the audience is applauding, and they're giving 314 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:36,520 Speaker 1: me permission to keep going. One of my yes best 315 00:18:36,600 --> 00:18:41,480 Speaker 1: known debate moments in twenty twelve was with John King, 316 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:46,080 Speaker 1: who opens a debate in a very aggressive and very 317 00:18:46,119 --> 00:18:51,240 Speaker 1: hostile way, and the audience reacts with enormous intensity against him, 318 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:53,800 Speaker 1: not against me. So I want you to listen to 319 00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:57,760 Speaker 1: the entire exchange, because at the time it was quite historic, 320 00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:01,000 Speaker 1: made a huge impact and helped me carry the South 321 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:02,000 Speaker 1: Carolina primary. 322 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 2: As you know, your ex wife gave an interview to 323 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:07,159 Speaker 2: ABC News and another interview at the Washington Post, and 324 00:19:07,200 --> 00:19:09,919 Speaker 2: this story has now gone viral on the internet. In it, 325 00:19:10,000 --> 00:19:12,440 Speaker 2: she says that you came to her in nineteen ninety 326 00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:14,520 Speaker 2: nine at a time when you were having an affair. 327 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:17,800 Speaker 2: She says you asked her, sir to enter into an 328 00:19:17,800 --> 00:19:19,879 Speaker 2: open marriage. Would you like to take some time to 329 00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:20,560 Speaker 2: respond to that. 330 00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:37,760 Speaker 1: No, but I will. I think the destructive, vicious, negative 331 00:19:37,920 --> 00:19:41,439 Speaker 1: nature of much of the news media makes it harder 332 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:44,399 Speaker 1: to govern this country, harder to attract decent people to 333 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:47,679 Speaker 1: run for public office. And I am appalled that you 334 00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:51,080 Speaker 1: would begin a presidential debate on a topic like that. 335 00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:10,159 Speaker 1: All you want to say, you've been past. Every person 336 00:20:10,200 --> 00:20:15,080 Speaker 1: in here knows personal pain. Every person in here has 337 00:20:15,119 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 1: had someone close to them go through painful things. To 338 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 1: take an ex wife and make it two days before 339 00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:29,679 Speaker 1: the primary a significant question in a presidential campaign is 340 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:34,000 Speaker 1: as close to despicable as anything I can imagine. However, 341 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:37,400 Speaker 1: I would say that the debate moment I'm happiest about 342 00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:42,720 Speaker 1: was again in South Carolina at Myrtle Beach. Three thousand 343 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:48,000 Speaker 1: people are in the audience. It's an amphitheator. It literally 344 00:20:48,119 --> 00:20:50,919 Speaker 1: ramps up and you're looking up at the top and 345 00:20:50,960 --> 00:20:56,199 Speaker 1: hear all these people, and Juan Williams gets into an 346 00:20:56,280 --> 00:20:59,040 Speaker 1: argument with me about having people worked. I had made 347 00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:03,040 Speaker 1: the comment, which I believe actually, that in poor neighborhoods, 348 00:21:03,080 --> 00:21:06,200 Speaker 1: in places like New York, we would be better off 349 00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:10,000 Speaker 1: if teenagers were paid to help clean up their schools 350 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:12,679 Speaker 1: so that they learned the work ethic and so they 351 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:15,080 Speaker 1: had money after If you're poor, one of the reasons 352 00:21:15,119 --> 00:21:17,760 Speaker 1: you're poorst of money. And if you don't have the 353 00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:20,480 Speaker 1: habit of going to work, you're not going to get money. 354 00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:24,040 Speaker 1: So all of this comes together, and one just went 355 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:27,439 Speaker 1: at me. They thought it was terrible, and instead of 356 00:21:27,520 --> 00:21:30,200 Speaker 1: backing off, I expanded it and came back at him 357 00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:34,399 Speaker 1: and I said, you know, I really believe in work, 358 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:37,280 Speaker 1: and I think it's important for people to work. 359 00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:43,520 Speaker 3: Speaker gangersh you recently said black Americans should demand jobs. 360 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:44,880 Speaker 1: Not food stamps. 361 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:48,560 Speaker 3: You also said poor kids lack a strong work ethic 362 00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:52,400 Speaker 3: and proposed having them work as janitors in their schools. 363 00:21:53,200 --> 00:21:56,560 Speaker 3: Can't you see that this is viewed at a minimum 364 00:21:56,800 --> 00:22:01,359 Speaker 3: as insulting to all Americans, but particularly to black Americans. 365 00:22:02,400 --> 00:22:15,720 Speaker 1: No, I don't see that. My daughter Jackie, who's sitting 366 00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 1: back there, Jackie Cushman, reminded me that her first job 367 00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:24,400 Speaker 1: was the first Baptist church in Carrollton, Georgia, doing janitorial 368 00:22:24,440 --> 00:22:28,919 Speaker 1: work at thirteen, and she liked earning the money. She 369 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 1: liked learning that if you worked, you got paid. She 370 00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,200 Speaker 1: liked being in charge of her own and she thought 371 00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:37,280 Speaker 1: it was a good start. Well, at that point, all 372 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 1: of a sudden, starting at the very back, we got 373 00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:47,240 Speaker 1: a standing ovation from three thousand people. It was to 374 00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:51,960 Speaker 1: me one of the most amazing moments that I could imagine. 375 00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:56,080 Speaker 1: I really think there was something that reminded everybody that 376 00:22:56,480 --> 00:23:01,520 Speaker 1: the fact is that we have, without any question, a 377 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:21,720 Speaker 1: deep American commitment to work ethic. You know, modern presidential debating, 378 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:26,120 Speaker 1: which really is coincidental with the rise of television, goes 379 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:29,679 Speaker 1: back to nineteen sixty Richard Nixon and John F. Kennedy. 380 00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:34,680 Speaker 1: Nixon was the incumbent Vice president with President Eisenawer. Kennedy 381 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:39,160 Speaker 1: was a rising US senator it was really interesting that 382 00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,880 Speaker 1: Nixon agreed because he didn't have to agree to debate Kennedy, 383 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:46,520 Speaker 1: and the result was Nixon, who represented a much weaker 384 00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:51,000 Speaker 1: Republican party coming out of the Great Depression, felt I 385 00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:54,520 Speaker 1: think it had to reach way beyond Republicans. Kennedy had 386 00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:57,639 Speaker 1: enormous confidence in his own abilities and in his ability 387 00:23:57,680 --> 00:24:02,719 Speaker 1: as a debater. Ironically, if you heard the first Nixon 388 00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:05,720 Speaker 1: Kennedy debate in nineteen sixty and you heard it on radio, 389 00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:10,719 Speaker 1: you thought Nixon had won. However, if you saw it 390 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,760 Speaker 1: on television and that was a much bigger audience, you 391 00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:18,280 Speaker 1: thought John F. Kennedy had won. The difference was Kennedy 392 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:21,439 Speaker 1: understood and had friends in the movie industry, and he 393 00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:28,240 Speaker 1: understood how to communicate visually, and so he had makeup. Nixon, 394 00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:31,440 Speaker 1: who had sort of contempt for that stuff and thought 395 00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:33,719 Speaker 1: it was all about being rational and a good debater 396 00:24:33,800 --> 00:24:38,439 Speaker 1: in the classic sense, didn't have makeup. The result was 397 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,959 Speaker 1: that Nixon just looked pale under the television lights, and 398 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,480 Speaker 1: so he looked like he was on defense, even though 399 00:24:45,920 --> 00:24:49,320 Speaker 1: if you just heard the audio version, he clearly sounded 400 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:53,439 Speaker 1: more competent, more in command, had more facts. It's a 401 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:57,880 Speaker 1: fascinating moment. The election was extraordinarily close, and I think 402 00:24:57,880 --> 00:25:01,320 Speaker 1: you could argue that Kennedy's perform rmans in the first 403 00:25:01,320 --> 00:25:05,119 Speaker 1: debate made the difference. Kennedy had become a master of 404 00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 1: using television, and since I was a very young activist 405 00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:11,800 Speaker 1: at that time, the Nixon Lodge campaign was really my 406 00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:17,960 Speaker 1: first personal volunteering. I watched intently how Kennedy used television, 407 00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:21,200 Speaker 1: how he understood it, and how it was very favorable 408 00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:25,360 Speaker 1: to him. Unfortunately for his successor, after Kennedy was assassinated, 409 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:29,800 Speaker 1: Lyndon Johnson didn't understand television, wasn't particularly good at didn't 410 00:25:29,880 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 1: come across well, and the media, which loved John f 411 00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:38,480 Speaker 1: Kennedy thought that they literally were in Camelot, which was 412 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:41,359 Speaker 1: a very popular musical at the time, did not like 413 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:44,600 Speaker 1: Lyndon Johnson, and so Johnson had a much tougher time, 414 00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:48,840 Speaker 1: a more difficult time communicating. We really didn't get around 415 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:55,400 Speaker 1: to big debates again until you had Gerald Ford debating 416 00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:59,080 Speaker 1: Jimmy Carter, and that had a very funny moment because 417 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:02,320 Speaker 1: the equipment broke and for something like ten or twelve 418 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:04,000 Speaker 1: minutes they stood there. I mean, here are the two 419 00:26:04,000 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 1: guys campaigning to be commander in chief of the most 420 00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:10,400 Speaker 1: powerful country in the world, and their hostages on stage 421 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:14,760 Speaker 1: waiting for the technicians to fix the TV stuff so 422 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,840 Speaker 1: that they could communicate with the country. It was a 423 00:26:17,880 --> 00:26:22,119 Speaker 1: remarkable and bizarre moment when you got to the nineteen 424 00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:25,919 Speaker 1: eighty campaign. The fact was that Ronald Reagan only debated 425 00:26:26,000 --> 00:26:29,760 Speaker 1: Jimmy Carter once. It was late in the campaign. Carter 426 00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:33,040 Speaker 1: had a style, which he'd learned as a Georgia populist, 427 00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:37,359 Speaker 1: of grossly exaggerating and then getting you sucked into a 428 00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:41,479 Speaker 1: fight where you're defending against his exaggerations. Reagan knew this, 429 00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:46,119 Speaker 1: and Reagan developed I think one of the most interesting 430 00:26:46,240 --> 00:26:50,280 Speaker 1: and simple responses I'd ever see. Every time Carter would 431 00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:55,120 Speaker 1: lie about Reagan, Reagan would just smile and say, there 432 00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:59,520 Speaker 1: you go again, And it communicated in a pleasant way 433 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:02,280 Speaker 1: to the country, this guy's lying and this is not true. 434 00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:05,240 Speaker 1: They'd been in a very very close race until the 435 00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:09,320 Speaker 1: morning after the debate. After that debate, people concluded that 436 00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:13,200 Speaker 1: Ronald Reagan could be trusted with nuclear weapons, he could 437 00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:16,600 Speaker 1: be trusted to be commander in chief, and that Jimmy 438 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,560 Speaker 1: Carter had a pretty pathetic argument that wasn't true. The 439 00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:24,679 Speaker 1: result was Reagan carried a bigger electoral vote majority against 440 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,080 Speaker 1: an incumbent president than anyone else in history before or since. 441 00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:32,040 Speaker 1: It was an amazing moment in nineteen eighty four, the 442 00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:35,359 Speaker 1: great moment, which I've learned from the people who were 443 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:39,720 Speaker 1: directly involved. Roger Ayles had been brought in Reagan in 444 00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:44,320 Speaker 1: the first debate ended up running short. They'd been talking 445 00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 1: too long and they didn't have enough time. At the 446 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:49,760 Speaker 1: very end, Reagan had prepared for the agreed upon four 447 00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:55,000 Speaker 1: or five minute clothes. They had a brilliant close. Unfortunately 448 00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:58,320 Speaker 1: they only had two minutes each because they'd run over 449 00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:02,080 Speaker 1: with their answers in the earlier question. Reagan, instead of 450 00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:04,920 Speaker 1: making up on the cuff two minutes, which he could 451 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:08,000 Speaker 1: have done, decided he really wanted to add it in 452 00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:12,320 Speaker 1: his own mind while he was talking this brilliant talk, 453 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:15,640 Speaker 1: and he looked like he was clumsy. In fact, all 454 00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:19,000 Speaker 1: of us who now watched Joe Biden can sympathize with this, 455 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:21,520 Speaker 1: because all of a sudden people thought, oh my gosh, 456 00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:24,800 Speaker 1: is he beyond it? Is he got cognitive problems? Is 457 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:29,720 Speaker 1: he over the hill? Well? The Reagan people were very worried. 458 00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:32,800 Speaker 1: I was campaigning for reelection. I was very strongly for Reagan, 459 00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:36,920 Speaker 1: and it was interesting to watch. Nobody actually switched from 460 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:41,000 Speaker 1: Reagan to Walter Mondale because Reagan did badly. They just said, boy, 461 00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:44,360 Speaker 1: we sure hope our team does better next time. When 462 00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:47,200 Speaker 1: you got to the second debate, they brought in Roger 463 00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:50,480 Speaker 1: Ales to help coach Reagan. Ales had coached Nixon in 464 00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:54,680 Speaker 1: the sixties and had a reputation having done the Mike 465 00:28:54,760 --> 00:28:57,840 Speaker 1: Douglas Show. People thought Als was really good with television, 466 00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:02,880 Speaker 1: so they brought Roger in and they said to him, 467 00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:05,640 Speaker 1: we want you to sit in this final preparation for 468 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:10,360 Speaker 1: the debate, but do not raise the age issue. We 469 00:29:10,400 --> 00:29:14,320 Speaker 1: don't want the president to be uncomfortable or nervous. We 470 00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,239 Speaker 1: wanted to feel calm, So get in the meeting. They 471 00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:20,160 Speaker 1: go through all the standard stuff, and at the very end, 472 00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:22,760 Speaker 1: Reagan looks directly at Ales. This says Ales's version, which 473 00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:26,520 Speaker 1: she told me personally, looks directly at Ales and says, well, Roger, 474 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:30,040 Speaker 1: is there anything else I should know? And Ales thought 475 00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:33,360 Speaker 1: to himself, this guy's the president of the United States. 476 00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:37,440 Speaker 1: He deserves to know what the real problem is. So 477 00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:40,240 Speaker 1: they said, well, it's the president. You know, there's one 478 00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:43,840 Speaker 1: question everyone is going to be asking when you walk 479 00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:47,920 Speaker 1: on that stage. And Reagan said, well, what's that? Roger 480 00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:52,320 Speaker 1: Al said, they're going to wonder if you've lost it, 481 00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:55,480 Speaker 1: if you're too old because of the way the last 482 00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:58,680 Speaker 1: debate ended, and Reagan looked at him for a second, 483 00:29:59,120 --> 00:30:02,920 Speaker 1: didn't say anything for about ten seconds, and he had 484 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:05,160 Speaker 1: a big smile. He said, you know, I know exactly 485 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:07,480 Speaker 1: how to handle this. I used to do a shtick 486 00:30:07,520 --> 00:30:10,000 Speaker 1: in Las Vegas. He was there for about two weeks 487 00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:12,360 Speaker 1: doing stand up comedy and decided didn't like it, so 488 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:14,920 Speaker 1: I quit. He said, I know how to handle it. 489 00:30:15,480 --> 00:30:18,800 Speaker 1: Well when chliston. I made the movie Rendezvous Destiny, which 490 00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:21,920 Speaker 1: is the biography of Reagan. We have this scene from 491 00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:26,160 Speaker 1: the second debate. The debate opens. The very first question, 492 00:30:26,240 --> 00:30:30,160 Speaker 1: as you would expect, is you know, mister President, people 493 00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:34,040 Speaker 1: are worried about this age issue. Reagan looks straight into 494 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:35,880 Speaker 1: the camera with the twin cole and he says. 495 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:39,320 Speaker 4: I will not make age an issue of this campaign. 496 00:30:39,440 --> 00:30:43,920 Speaker 4: I am not going to exploit for political purposes my 497 00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:46,080 Speaker 4: opponent's youth and inexperience. 498 00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:00,680 Speaker 1: Well, everybody breaks up, laughing and you see it in 499 00:31:00,760 --> 00:31:04,200 Speaker 1: the film Walter Mondale, and Mondale's standing there and you 500 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:08,360 Speaker 1: can see in his eyes he knows the election just ended. 501 00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:12,560 Speaker 1: Because the Reagan debate answer was so strong. There have 502 00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:15,200 Speaker 1: been moments when debates have met a great deal. I 503 00:31:15,200 --> 00:31:20,840 Speaker 1: would argue that in two thousand and twelve, mid Romney 504 00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:25,240 Speaker 1: had a great opportunity in debating Barack Obama. Obama was 505 00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:29,960 Speaker 1: totally wrong on Russia, and Romney was going right at him, 506 00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:33,080 Speaker 1: but the CNN anchor who was the host of the 507 00:31:33,120 --> 00:31:39,000 Speaker 1: evening disagreed with Romney, insided with Obama. Well, Romney was 508 00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:41,560 Speaker 1: clearly just totally befuddled because he was being a gentleman, 509 00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:47,000 Speaker 1: he was being reasonable, and in effect he just collapsed. Now, 510 00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:50,600 Speaker 1: the reason that was important was had Romney turned to 511 00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:55,120 Speaker 1: her and said, you are not allowed to be in 512 00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:58,840 Speaker 1: the middle of this debate and it's not your place 513 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:03,800 Speaker 1: to describe Russia, he would have won the debate because 514 00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:07,320 Speaker 1: people were second tired of reporters and news media imposing 515 00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 1: their own views. But Romney, whether it was a matter 516 00:32:10,800 --> 00:32:14,840 Speaker 1: of skill or nerve or attitude, he allowed her to dominate. 517 00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:18,280 Speaker 1: The country watched her dominate, and as a result, he 518 00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:21,760 Speaker 1: lost a similar thing had happened actually in nineteen eighty 519 00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:26,160 Speaker 1: when in the New Hampshire debate with the Republicans, Reagan 520 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:29,000 Speaker 1: had wanted all the candidates there. Bush wanted it to 521 00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:31,080 Speaker 1: be one on one. George H. W. Bush was running 522 00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:34,400 Speaker 1: against it, so there's this big fight. Reagan brought all 523 00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:39,000 Speaker 1: the other candidates with him, and the moderator said, well, 524 00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:42,080 Speaker 1: you know, we're only going to have two, and Reagan 525 00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:45,000 Speaker 1: suddenly stood up and he said, mister Green. The guy's 526 00:32:45,040 --> 00:32:47,800 Speaker 1: name was actually Breen, but being Reagan is close. He said, 527 00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:51,840 Speaker 1: mister Green, I paid for this microphone, and we are 528 00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:56,360 Speaker 1: going to have everyone. Well, that decisive moment of leadership, 529 00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:59,320 Speaker 1: that cutting through the Bolgney, that's standing up to the 530 00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:04,440 Speaker 1: reporter ended the New Hampshire primary. Reagan I Bush lost, 531 00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 1: and the rest was history. So these debates can have 532 00:33:08,120 --> 00:33:11,920 Speaker 1: an important and a significant impact. I think in the 533 00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:17,440 Speaker 1: Clinton Trump debate, the key moment when it's clear that 534 00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:20,720 Speaker 1: there'd been a very embarrassing tape released about some of 535 00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:23,520 Speaker 1: the things Trump had said about women. It was clear 536 00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:25,840 Speaker 1: that the press was going to go after him, and 537 00:33:25,920 --> 00:33:29,520 Speaker 1: so for the last debate, he just escalated the risk 538 00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:32,880 Speaker 1: and brought all four of the women who had made 539 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,480 Speaker 1: accusations against Bill Clinton and had a press conference before 540 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:40,040 Speaker 1: the debate with all four women. Of course, at that moment, 541 00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:42,719 Speaker 1: what are the Clinton's going to do? They're not going 542 00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:46,760 Speaker 1: to touch it. And so their whole strategy collapsed. And 543 00:33:46,800 --> 00:33:49,720 Speaker 1: it was an act of both extraordinary courage and extraordinary 544 00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 1: aggressiveness on Trump's part, and it worked. I think part 545 00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:57,280 Speaker 1: of what hurt him in the twenty twenty debates was 546 00:33:57,320 --> 00:33:59,440 Speaker 1: that not only was the press totally on the side 547 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:03,880 Speaker 1: of Biden, not only were fifty one intelligence officials signing 548 00:34:03,880 --> 00:34:06,840 Speaker 1: a letter that was a lie about Hunter Biden's laptop. 549 00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:09,799 Speaker 1: Not only was the debate stage set in such a 550 00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:14,480 Speaker 1: way that Trump was basically contained. Frankly, I think in 551 00:34:14,560 --> 00:34:18,360 Speaker 1: sixteen he would have broken out. But he'd been through COVID, 552 00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:20,960 Speaker 1: he'd been through four years as president. He'd been through 553 00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:23,359 Speaker 1: getting beaten up in a variety of ways that were 554 00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:27,600 Speaker 1: not to be totally false, Russian collusionist example, and I 555 00:34:27,600 --> 00:34:30,520 Speaker 1: think he didn't quite have the energy and the decisiveness 556 00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:34,680 Speaker 1: to cut through. And yet we now know every single 557 00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:37,480 Speaker 1: thing they said was a lie, and that fifty one 558 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:41,600 Speaker 1: intelligence officers in fact were lying. The Hunter Biden laptop 559 00:34:41,840 --> 00:34:45,480 Speaker 1: was real. The things that Trump was charging Biden with 560 00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:48,480 Speaker 1: were true, in fact, to such a degree that recently 561 00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:52,400 Speaker 1: Jake Tapper of CNN said, you know, the fact is 562 00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:56,160 Speaker 1: Trump was right about Biden. Well, that is a staggering 563 00:34:56,200 --> 00:35:00,480 Speaker 1: admission on a network that has been historically totally anti Trump. 564 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:04,080 Speaker 1: So now we come to this year, and I think 565 00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:06,200 Speaker 1: it's important to think about the candidates and what their 566 00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:10,160 Speaker 1: situation is. First of all, the fact that Trump is 567 00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:13,319 Speaker 1: not there is irrelevant, because Trump will be there. Mark 568 00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:16,680 Speaker 1: Alprin and his terrific wide World of News, which I 569 00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:20,239 Speaker 1: recommend everyone the best single newsletter in politics. I read 570 00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:24,000 Speaker 1: it every day, Alprin said. In the entire Meet the 571 00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:29,640 Speaker 1: Press interview Chuck Todd questioning presidential candidate Doug Bergham, who 572 00:35:29,680 --> 00:35:32,799 Speaker 1: is the governor of North Dakota, eight of the nine 573 00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:36,080 Speaker 1: questions were about Trump. Bergham kept saying, I want to 574 00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:39,279 Speaker 1: talk about my ideas. I want to talk about my proposals. 575 00:35:40,120 --> 00:35:42,959 Speaker 1: Chuck Todd just ran straight over it. So even though 576 00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:46,640 Speaker 1: Trump wasn't on the program, on eight out of nine questions, 577 00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:50,160 Speaker 1: Trump was the program. And it'll be very interesting to 578 00:35:50,160 --> 00:35:55,280 Speaker 1: see whether or not Bear and McCallum can resist making 579 00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:58,280 Speaker 1: the entire debate about Trump, and there's certainly enough different 580 00:35:58,320 --> 00:36:00,719 Speaker 1: questions you could make the debate about Trump. I am 581 00:36:00,760 --> 00:36:03,040 Speaker 1: sure that Trump is counting on the fact that he'll 582 00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:05,959 Speaker 1: get a double whib. He won't be there, but he'll 583 00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,319 Speaker 1: come up over and over and over again. Meanwhile, he 584 00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:11,600 Speaker 1: will be off with Tucker Carlson doing a special one 585 00:36:11,640 --> 00:36:13,560 Speaker 1: hour and I'll be interesting to see you what the 586 00:36:13,600 --> 00:36:17,000 Speaker 1: relative ratings of the two are. Of course, that's all 587 00:36:17,040 --> 00:36:20,000 Speaker 1: heightened because Trump is going to go to Fulton County, 588 00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:23,799 Speaker 1: Georgia the next day and apparently have a mug shot 589 00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:27,960 Speaker 1: of me. The district attorney in Fulton County is doing 590 00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:32,759 Speaker 1: everything she can as a radical left wing hack to 591 00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:36,680 Speaker 1: go after Trump, and so again you're going to have 592 00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:41,000 Speaker 1: Trump going to Fulton County will simply drown the debate coverage. 593 00:36:41,200 --> 00:36:48,760 Speaker 1: It's a really strange kind of situation. Thank you for listening. 594 00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:51,960 Speaker 1: You can read my debate commentary at Gingwich three sixty 595 00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:56,480 Speaker 1: dot com. Newtsworld is produced by Gangwich three sixty and iHeartMedia. 596 00:36:57,040 --> 00:37:02,040 Speaker 1: Our executive producer is Guardsy Sloan. Our researcher is Rachel Peterson. 597 00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:05,600 Speaker 1: The artwork for the show was created by Steve Penley. 598 00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:09,399 Speaker 1: Special thanks to the team at Gingrish three sixty. If 599 00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:11,799 Speaker 1: you've been enjoying newts World, I hope you'll go to 600 00:37:11,840 --> 00:37:15,239 Speaker 1: Apple Podcast and both rate us with five stars and 601 00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:18,000 Speaker 1: give us a review so others can learn what it's 602 00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:21,480 Speaker 1: all about. Right now, listeners of Newtsworld consign up for 603 00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:26,319 Speaker 1: my three freeweekly columns at gingrishs three sixty dot com 604 00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:30,320 Speaker 1: slash newsletter. I'm Newt Gingrich. This is Newtsworld.