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Speaker 1: Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain, where As of

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Speaker 1: this recording, we're still tied for the lead and the

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Speaker 1: Welcome to the March Madness Party bracket, and we expect

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Speaker 1: we will be in the lead until the final buzzer sounds.

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Speaker 1: Of course, if we don't win, you'll never know, because

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Speaker 1: we sure won't.

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Speaker 2: Be telling you. It's Tuesday, March twenty fourth.

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Speaker 1: Then on today's show, we're pulling up a few extra

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Speaker 1: chairs to get the gang back together. The gang being

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Speaker 1: the Langham Four, the group of journalists who camped out

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Speaker 1: outside the WNBACBA negotiations to bring us updates, street side picks,

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Speaker 1: and eventually news of a deal. Front Office Sports Annie Costable,

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Speaker 1: the AP's Doug Feinberg, ESPN's Alexa Philippoo and the Nines

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Speaker 1: Jackie Powell, who all joined me to share their stories

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Speaker 1: from the trenches and their biggest takeaways of the new CBA.

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Speaker 1: Plus we're seeing red the bench isn't always a bad

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Speaker 1: place to be and on Guard, the sword fight and

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Speaker 1: Irish make History.

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Speaker 3: It's all coming up right after this welcome back slices.

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Speaker 1: Here's what you need to know today, Starting with college

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Speaker 1: hoops were just like that there are only sixteen teams

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Speaker 1: left in the running for the national title. On Sunday night,

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Speaker 1: the last game of the night was a thriller as

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Speaker 1: number three seed TCU squeaked past number six seed Washington

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Speaker 1: sixty two to fifty nine in ot Washington led twenty

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Speaker 1: seven to nineteen at the half after holding the horn

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Speaker 1: Frogs to just six points in the second quarter, their

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Speaker 1: lowest scoring quarter of the season, but TCU rallied in

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Speaker 1: the fourth, and standout senior guard Olivia Miles even had

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Speaker 1: a clean look to win it in regulation, a fade

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Speaker 1: away three for all the glory, but it was no good.

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Speaker 1: Miles redeemed herself with flashes of brilliance in overtime and

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Speaker 1: led the team with a double double in the win,

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Speaker 1: putting up eighteen points, ten rebounds, and some very clutch

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Speaker 1: passes Miles magic.

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Speaker 2: During March Madness.

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Speaker 1: Say Less a few days ago, Miles talked about her

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Speaker 1: decision to transfer from Notre Dame to TCU last summer

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Speaker 1: and use her fifth year of eligibility despite being a

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Speaker 1: projected top lottery.

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Speaker 2: Pick in last year's WNBA draft.

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Speaker 1: She said she didn't blame the critics for doubting her

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Speaker 1: choice quote what I left on the table seems stupid

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Speaker 1: and seemed like what is she doing that? I knew

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Speaker 1: deep in my heart that I needed one more year

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Speaker 1: to be ready. This year has paid off for me

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Speaker 1: in ways that I can't even describe.

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Speaker 2: End quote.

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Speaker 1: Entering the draft after a potentially deep run with the

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Speaker 1: Horned Frogs and with the new CBA in place, Miles

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Speaker 1: is looking real smart. Now to Monday, where the madness

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Speaker 1: continued with a second day of second round games, highlighted

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Speaker 1: by an early wild one Number three Louisville beating number

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Speaker 1: six Alabama sixty nine sixty eight in a tight game

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Speaker 1: that saw.

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Speaker 2: Eighteen lead changes.

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Speaker 1: We're recording this ahead of the final games of the day,

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Speaker 1: including all three matchups featuring number one seeded teams, so

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Speaker 1: we'll link to the full bracket and results in the

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Speaker 1: show notes. And if you're now living in a reality

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Speaker 1: where Yukon, Texas and South Carolina are out of the tournament,

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Speaker 1: I fear the apocalypse grows near.

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Speaker 2: And at this point, honestly.

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Speaker 1: We'll take it to the NWSL and this and Diego

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Speaker 1: waves two to one win over the Utah Royals Sunday night,

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Speaker 1: a game that featured yet another red card. We're actually

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Speaker 1: considering renaming the NWSL the Nasty Women's Soccer League. Games

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Speaker 1: are off to a feisty start, that's for sure, and

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Speaker 1: unlike that rain Thorns match on Friday that saw two

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Speaker 1: red cards, this time the card actually played a key role.

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Speaker 1: The score was tied one to one when UTA's tATu

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Speaker 1: Mulazo was sent off with the card in the eighty

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Speaker 1: second minute, opening the door for San Diego to get ahead.

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Speaker 2: In the final ten minutes.

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Speaker 1: Rookie Leah Godfree found the back of the net for

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Speaker 1: the Wave in the eighty seventh minute, her first ever

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Speaker 1: NWSL goal, and it secured the win. Now, as for

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Speaker 1: all the red cards, if you're thinking they're popping up

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Speaker 1: a whole lot so far this season, you're not wrong.

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Speaker 1: According to The Women's Game Sam Muis's Soccer podcast, in

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Speaker 1: just the first two weekends of the twenty twenty six season,

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Speaker 1: there have already been six red cards handed out. That's

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Speaker 1: more than half the number issued during the entire twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty five season, which saw eleven total.

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Speaker 2: Now, it may be a little too early.

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Speaker 1: To tell if the high tally is due to aggressive

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Speaker 1: officiating or aggressive gameplay, but something's definitely in the air

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Speaker 1: more soccer and a new coaching role coming down from FIFA.

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Speaker 1: Starting later this year, every team in FIFA's women's tournaments

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Speaker 1: must have at least two female staff on the bench

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Speaker 1: at every match, and one of those two staffers must

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Speaker 1: be an assistant coach or the head coach. The decision

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Speaker 1: was made at the FIFA Council last week and applies

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Speaker 1: to all women's youth and senior tournaments, whether they feature

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Speaker 1: clubs or national teams.

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Speaker 2: FIFA's Chief Football Officer.

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Speaker 1: And former US women's national team head coach Jill Ellis said, quote,

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Speaker 1: there are simply not enough women in coaching today. We

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Speaker 1: must do more to accelerate change by creating clearer pathways,

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Speaker 1: expanding opportunities, and increasing the visibility for women on our sidelines.

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Speaker 2: End quote.

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Speaker 1: That's a really important point and it's a great thing

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Speaker 1: to get more coaching and management opportunities for women, but

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Speaker 1: we'd love to see a push for more women's coaches

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Speaker 1: on the men's side too.

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Speaker 2: To the track team, USA.

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Speaker 1: Is coming home from Poland and the World Athletics Indoor

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Speaker 1: Championships with US athletes when in metal in seven women's events,

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Speaker 1: a few highlights to share. On Sunday front of the show,

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Speaker 1: Nikki Hilts kept things cool, calm and collected in the

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Speaker 1: fifteen hundred meter final, staying in the back and middle

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Speaker 1: of the pack throughout the majority of the race, but

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Speaker 1: then they closed with a blazing final lap, moving from

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Speaker 1: fifth to third and finishing in an indoor personal best

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Speaker 1: of three point fifty nine sixty eight. They landed on

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Speaker 1: the podium for the second time in three years. Great

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Speaker 1: Britain's Georgia Hunter Bell won that race, with Australia's Jess

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Speaker 1: Hall claiming silver. Another Front of the show, Anna Hall

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Speaker 1: also made the podium, taking silver in the pentathlon on

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Speaker 1: Sunday with four eight hundred and sixty points, just twenty

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Speaker 1: eight points behind winner Sophie Doctor of the Netherlands.

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Speaker 2: Hall closed the five event contest.

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Speaker 1: With the championship record two six thirty two in the

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Speaker 1: eight hundred meter and in the four x four hundred

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Speaker 1: meter relay, the US women came away with gold. In

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Speaker 1: the second leg, rosy E Fiong got the team into

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Speaker 1: first place position that they never let go of, ultimately

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Speaker 1: winning their second straight indoor four by four hundred meter

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Speaker 1: relay title. Right after the men's relay team did the same.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk last weekend in the PWHL. On Sunday, the

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Speaker 1: league's Takeover Tour paid a visit to the Canada Life

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Speaker 1: Center in Winnipeg for a Montreal Victoire versus Ottawa Charge matchup.

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Speaker 1: Charge came out on top two to one after Rebecca

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Speaker 1: Leslie's league leading third overtime winner of the season. It

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Speaker 1: was the first time the PWHL had gone to Manitoba's

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Speaker 1: provincial capital, and they got a great turnout. It was

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Speaker 1: a sold out crowd of fifteen two hundred and twenty

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Speaker 1: five fans, and there was a fun moment pregame when

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Speaker 1: Winnipeg native Jothly and the Rocks teammates celebrated the trip

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Speaker 1: to her hometown by wearing custom shirts with her name and.

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Speaker 2: Face on them.

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Speaker 1: We've got more hockey Tonight in Boston, the Fleet will

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Speaker 1: host the Vancouver Goldeneyzed at seven pm Eastern, and then

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Speaker 1: tomorrow night, Chicago hosts its second Takeover Tour game of

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Speaker 1: the season, with New York and Seattle face and off

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Speaker 1: at All State Arena.

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Speaker 2: Hopefully I'll see some of youse slices there.

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Speaker 1: Finally, to fencing, Notre Dame won the first NCAA women's

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Speaker 1: team title in nearly forty years over the weekend, beating

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Speaker 1: Columbia one O two ninety nine. You remember last week

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Speaker 1: we told you this was the first time since nineteen

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Speaker 1: eighty nine that the NCAA sponsored separate national championships for

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Speaker 1: women's and men's programs. Since nineteen eighty nine, college fencing's

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Speaker 1: top men and women have dueled for a single combined

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Speaker 1: NCUBA team title, but that all changed this year. Congrats

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Speaker 1: to the Fighting Irish for making history all right, Selica's

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Speaker 1: quick congrats go out to two folks. First, WNBA superstar

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Speaker 1: Rika Agunbowalle, who posted that she tied the knot with

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Speaker 1: her Boo la la rene in late February.

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Speaker 2: Congrats you too.

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Speaker 1: Also to New York prep hooper Croatia national team member

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Speaker 1: and Yukon commit Olivia Vukosa, who was named the Gatorade

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Speaker 1: National Player of the Year last week, her second straight

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Speaker 1: year winning the award. And the coolest part, she was

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Speaker 1: surprised by none other than Diana Tarassi waiting in her

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Speaker 1: high school gym to hander the trophy.

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Speaker 4: So cool.

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Speaker 1: We got to take a break when we come back

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Speaker 1: we find out what it was really like for reporters

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Speaker 1: burning the midnight oil as the WNBACBA negotiations went on

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Speaker 1: and on and on, and what do they think of

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Speaker 1: the deal that ended up getting made.

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Speaker 2: Stick around.

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Speaker 1: For the first time in Good Game with Sarah spain History.

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Speaker 1: I'm joined by four guests. If you count me in,

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Speaker 1: we can field one genuinely washed hoop squad. First, she

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Speaker 1: covers college basketball on the WNBA for ESPN.

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Speaker 2: She's a Stanford alum.

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Speaker 1: She loves a pancake, and she's been spotted loitering around

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Speaker 1: Fifth Avenue. In thirty seventh, it's Alexa Philippoo joining her.

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Speaker 1: She covers women's sports for Front Office Sports. She's in

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Speaker 1: Iowa grad. She loves a good thrift store find, and

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Speaker 1: she's been known to lurk on the street with a

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Speaker 1: slice of Dominoes in each hand.

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Speaker 2: It's Santy Costable joining them.

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Speaker 1: He's an AP basketball writer who's covered the women's game

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Speaker 1: for nearly twenty years. He's a member of the US

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Speaker 1: Basketball Writer's Association Hall of Fame Class of twenty twenty five,

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Speaker 1: and he spends his nights at hotels, but he never

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Speaker 1: has a room.

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Speaker 2: It's Doug Feinberg.

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Speaker 1: And finally, she's a women's hoops writer and podcast host

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Speaker 1: for the Nine Sports. She loves a full send on Halloween,

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Speaker 1: and she gets paid to be a Stage five clinger.

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Speaker 2: It's Jackie Powell.

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Speaker 1: Hi, guys together, they're the Langham Four, so named for

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Speaker 1: the nights they spent together outside the Langham Hotel in

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Speaker 1: New York, staked out and waiting for the WNBA and

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Speaker 1: Players Association to come to terms on a new collective

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Speaker 1: bargaining agreement. They put sleep, Social life insanity on hold

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Speaker 1: to bring the people the.

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Speaker 2: News they were waiting for. The deal is done. Thanks

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Speaker 2: for joining.

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Speaker 4: Us, Thanks for having us.

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Speaker 2: Excited to talk to y'all.

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Speaker 1: Alexa, can you explain the origin of the nickname the

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Speaker 1: Langham Four.

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Speaker 5: Honestly, I don't want to totally take credit, but I

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Speaker 5: do believe it was I was the one who like.

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Speaker 6: Renamed our group chat the Langham Four.

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Speaker 5: But really it became that because the beginning and the

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Speaker 5: end of this whole journey, when we were staking out

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Speaker 5: these CVA meetings, we were at this very nice hotel

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Speaker 5: called the Langham Hotel on Fifth Avenue, and it was

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Speaker 5: really full circle that that's where the CBA got determined,

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Speaker 5: and it was where we started.

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Speaker 2: And now you've got merch. One piece of merch.

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Speaker 5: And now we've got merch courtesy of Doug and Doug's friend.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Doug tell us about the merch.

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Speaker 7: I thought, we have something to capitalize on our time together.

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Speaker 7: Is my friend is really good at making things, says

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Speaker 7: that for a business, And I said, hey, could you

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Speaker 7: do something that she goes, let me make a jumbler

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Speaker 7: for you guys, And sure enough this came to be

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Speaker 7: so forever memorialized the time we spent together at the Langham.

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Speaker 1: We got a water bottle that says the Langham for

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Speaker 1: custom only for an existence.

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Speaker 2: You can't have one because you weren't there. You know.

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Speaker 1: The final negotiations leading up to the deal got done

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Speaker 1: in about eight straight days, one hundred plus hours. Jackie,

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Speaker 1: At what point did you start your stakeout?

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Speaker 8: I think it was early Tuesday evening, so I will

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Speaker 8: admit I got to the party a little bit later

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Speaker 8: than my three compadres. But they welcomed me with open arms.

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Speaker 1: Yes, they made the street look so inviting you just

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Speaker 1: couldn't resist joining them. Doug was this coordinated effort the

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Speaker 1: three of you at the beginning, or did you all

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Speaker 1: independently decide to sit street side for the negotiations.

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Speaker 7: It was Sarah, I mean, Annie was nice enough to

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Speaker 7: stake out the Union headquarters. Alex and I were in

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Speaker 7: the NBA headquarters to trip where we're going, and sure

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Speaker 7: enough one of us got a tip that hey, this

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Speaker 7: can meet the Langham Hotel, and then we all hustled

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Speaker 7: down there as Alexa is doing some spots on ESPN,

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Speaker 7: and we all got together at the lovely time on

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Speaker 7: the streets of New York City.

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Speaker 2: Alexa, what's the HEADSHAKEE for?

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Speaker 5: I literally got on the Metro North train that Tuesday,

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Speaker 5: not knowing where the meeting was. And I've told this story,

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Speaker 5: but I thought I was going back that day.

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Speaker 6: I thought this was like a four hour meeting.

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Speaker 5: I told my dog, I'll see you later, and lo

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Speaker 5: and behold, it took ten days almost.

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Speaker 6: For me to get home. So I was not prepared.

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Speaker 2: Oh my gosh.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, Well, at least it was New York where

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Speaker 1: there's no rats and they don't put the garbage on

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Speaker 1: the street for you each day.

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Speaker 2: Oh I'm so sorry. I was thinking of Chicago. Just kidding.

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Speaker 1: We definitely have rats, but we don't put our garbage

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Speaker 1: on the street because we're a civilized population. Annie, speaking

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Speaker 1: of Chicago and people who left it for darker and

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Speaker 1: uglier pastures. When you were out there on day one

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Speaker 1: of the stakeout, how many days did you actually expect

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Speaker 1: to be there? Oh?

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Speaker 9: My god, I thought we were going to be there,

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Speaker 9: maybe forty eight hours. Like I thought this would be

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Speaker 9: a two day thing. Max, I had no idea one

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Speaker 9: hundred hours later we would still be waiting to get news.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and so, Alexa, sounds like you said you didn't

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Speaker 1: see your dog for several days, other than I heard

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Speaker 1: on another podcast that your boyfriend brought your dog by

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Speaker 1: to say hi, which is nice.

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Speaker 2: You got some visiting.

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Speaker 1: Privileges, But did all of y'all find hotels nearby or

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Speaker 1: actually sleep on the street or go home and come back?

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Speaker 2: Like, what was the situation for each of you?

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Speaker 7: Doug Well, I was the luckiest, I guess I live

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Speaker 7: about fifteen minutes from all three spots that we went too,

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Speaker 7: so perfect. We spent time in the hotel. Alexa was

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Speaker 7: kind of enough to get through her company, and we

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Speaker 7: spent some time there, but actually could go home and

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Speaker 7: sleep in my own bed or once every evening.

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Speaker 1: Right, okay, Alexis so the Worldwide Leader sprung for a room.

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Speaker 1: I believe you put a post note and said Langham

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Speaker 1: for headquarters on that door Media HQ, because you know.

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Speaker 5: The Union and the League had their respective HQs and

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Speaker 5: this was our HQ. But so yeah, I so the

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Speaker 5: first night was basically.

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Speaker 6: An all night or so that didn't really even count.

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Speaker 5: But yeah, basically I was in hotels, and I would

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Speaker 5: switch hotels based off where we were meeting, so I

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Speaker 5: wasn't in I think I was in the Langham twice

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Speaker 5: in a row thanks to a very special corporate rate

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Speaker 5: that we got, But yeah, I was hopping hotels.

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Speaker 2: So Jackie and Annie, did you kind of go home

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Speaker 2: in between?

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Speaker 4: Yeah?

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Speaker 9: We both actually live in the same neighborhood in Brooklyn,

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Speaker 9: so we after the first night headed back our way.

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Speaker 9: And then one night my company ended up springing for

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Speaker 9: a hotel room at Langham and we didn't get the

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Speaker 9: corporate discount.

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Speaker 4: So I do have to shout them out because.

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Speaker 9: That was a huge un Yeah, a huge investment by them.

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Speaker 5: Oh, just to c clarify too, before Jackie goes, the

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Speaker 5: reason why we needed a room in the hotel was

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Speaker 5: because we couldn't stay in the lot because we weren't

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Speaker 5: guessed and eventually the weather turned and so it was

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Speaker 5: not actually nice enough to really be outside.

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Speaker 6: And so that's where it became.

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Speaker 5: Very clutch to have the rooms like that perspective companies, Yeah, Jackie.

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Speaker 8: So Annie and I ubered home together maybe once or twice,

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Speaker 8: and each time we went back home to where we

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Speaker 8: live in Brooklyn, we were always carrying a lot of

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Speaker 8: stuff because it was like it was like our work stuff.

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Speaker 8: It was like these chairs, it was extra food that

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Speaker 8: certain godparents got for us, and so it was just

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Speaker 8: there was a lot of stuff. I mean, we used

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Speaker 8: Alexa's multiple hotel rooms as sort of I mean it

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Speaker 8: was an h Q. It was a space where we

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Speaker 8: could sort of put all the gear, all the stakeout

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Speaker 8: gear that we needed.

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Speaker 9: You know.

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Speaker 2: It was like a survival yes past, Yes, this is

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Speaker 2: just a fun one for all of you. Just yell.

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Speaker 1: I if you had any friends, family, or loved ones

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Speaker 1: reaching out with actual concern about lack of sleep or

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Speaker 1: hanging out on the street, a great they all had

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Speaker 1: people who care about them that were worried about their

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Speaker 1: their sanity and well being on the street. You also

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Speaker 1: had pizza, You had snacks delivered. There were a lot

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Speaker 1: of benefactors. So tell me about like some of the

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Speaker 1: deliveries that you got, Doug, while you were staked out.

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Speaker 7: We had a lot of fairy god parents, is how

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Speaker 7: we'd like to phrase it, that were nice enough to

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Speaker 7: give us coffee, cookies, donuts, pizza. Although as an aid

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Speaker 7: in New Yorker, I'll say it, I was insulted at Dominoes.

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Speaker 7: Will we get That's what I said, Dominoes. You're in

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Speaker 7: New York. Find something that's good, right, what.

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Speaker 2: Are we doing?

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Speaker 9: I literally I was like, Doug, we should just be

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Speaker 9: grateful we're getting something. Like Doug was really throwing a

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Speaker 9: fit about this, and I'm like, we're getting food, Like,

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Speaker 9: just be grateful.

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Speaker 2: I mean, to be fair, Dominoes is fine. It'll do

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Speaker 2: in a pinch.

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Speaker 1: That being said, you were in New York, and I

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Speaker 1: feel like you could grab a slice from somewhere better,

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Speaker 1: almost anywhere nearby. But to whoever delivered the Dominoes, whether

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Speaker 1: that be Dominoes or a godparent, We're still grateful.

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Speaker 2: We're still grateful next time.

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Speaker 1: You know, like the CBA that promises better benefits and

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Speaker 1: higher pay, let's also improve the pizza for our future CBA.

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Speaker 1: You guys are out there for so many hours together

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Speaker 1: just shooting the shit. I can only imagine some of

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Speaker 1: the conversations that you had to keep each other company.

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Speaker 1: I want to hear one surprising thing that you learned

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Speaker 1: about someone else in the wee hours of the morning

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Speaker 1: on the sidewalk, Jackie.

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Speaker 8: I learned that Annie is a huge Leonardo DiCaprio fan,

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Speaker 8: so to know. On Sunday night, it was sort of

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Speaker 8: like we were watching it was like Selection Sunday and

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Speaker 8: the Oscars back to back. You know, we see Leonardo

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Speaker 8: DiCaprio lose to Michael B. Jordan, and Annie just goes

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Speaker 8: on this rant about, you know, Leonardo DiCaprio deserves more

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Speaker 8: Oscars than just his one.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think that's a good argument, Alexa,

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Speaker 1: what's something you learned about someone else?

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Speaker 5: I really enjoyed getting to see everyone's individual styles and

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Speaker 5: like how they and how they work and how they

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Speaker 5: approach the job, because I obviously have worked alongside all

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Speaker 5: of them for years. But to spend literally like one

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Speaker 5: hundred plus hours with them over a week plus, you

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Speaker 5: really get to see how they think about things, how

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Speaker 5: they operate, and then you know, there's some similarities, there's

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Speaker 5: some differences, but I think it's a kind of a

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Speaker 5: beautiful thing that like you can have your own style

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Speaker 5: in this job and still you know, like be able

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Speaker 5: to make your mark.

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Speaker 6: And so it was really cool to see that over

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Speaker 6: the course of the week.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and sometimes you pick up little tips from people

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Speaker 1: just from being like, oh, that's how you do that,

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Speaker 1: or that's the appy use for that, Like that's that's nice,

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Speaker 1: Doug what it's something that you learned about someone else.

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Speaker 7: I learned that the year three the best in the

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Speaker 7: business that I get to work with for eight days

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Speaker 7: and hang out with. And it sounds sappy and such,

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Speaker 7: but I'll be honest. I mean I've known all of them,

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Speaker 7: are worked with all of them.

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Speaker 2: But the future is bright. I'm the old old man

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Speaker 2: in the room, so to.

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Speaker 7: Speak, and to know what they've did and to be

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Speaker 7: with them and to see what they can do. I

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Speaker 7: have complete faith that the future of Women's basketbel Media

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Speaker 7: and the President Women's Bastal Media is really bright because

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Speaker 7: of these three.

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Speaker 2: Oh, oh, that's so nice.

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00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:22,359
Speaker 1: That's tough to follow, Annie, that you learned way to

401
00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:23,160
Speaker 1: put the pressure on.

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00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:24,679
Speaker 7: Me dog always trying.

403
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Speaker 9: Oh I'm just I learned everyone's coffee orders or caffeine orders.

404
00:18:30,000 --> 00:18:34,920
Speaker 9: And I also learned that Alexa loves strawberry hogandas, which

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Speaker 9: I too learned that about myself.

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Speaker 4: By way of Alexa because I was eating her strawberry

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Speaker 4: ice cream.

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Speaker 5: So that was a real bonding moment, Like we shared

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Speaker 5: a carton, like I started it and Nanny finished it.

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Speaker 1: I feel like that was a real bonding moment for us,

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Speaker 1: real lady in the tramp situation.

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Speaker 9: From competitors to shared ice cream eaters.

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Speaker 2: I love it, Alexa.

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Speaker 1: When did you realize that the players and the stakeholders

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Speaker 1: inside the hotel knew about you guys sitting outside?

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Speaker 5: Oh the first night we could see them like looking

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Speaker 5: down at us, and we waved back at them.

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Speaker 6: It was so funny.

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Speaker 5: And then the next day when we were sitting outside,

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Speaker 5: was when Alicia Clark and bri Turner walked by and

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Speaker 5: bre Turner showed us the photo that she toughly was

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Speaker 5: like the bird's eye view aerial photo that she eventually

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Speaker 5: did post on social media and we just were dying.

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Speaker 5: It was like the funniest thing. I have to know

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Speaker 5: that they were actually actively they know we're here.

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Speaker 6: That's great.

427
00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:34,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, Uh, Doug, I heard Annie talking about having like

428
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Speaker 1: a little bit of a breakdown on Sunday due to delirium,

429
00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:39,800
Speaker 1: impatience wanting the deal to get done. Would you say

430
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Speaker 1: that Annie was the one who broke first in the

431
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Speaker 1: Langham four or did somebody else have a breakdown previous

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Speaker 1: to hers?

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00:19:46,080 --> 00:19:48,399
Speaker 7: Well, in Annie's defense, she wasn't feeling well and she

434
00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:50,639
Speaker 7: was sick the next night, so I think it was

435
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Speaker 7: the start of that coming on what happens in the

436
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Speaker 7: Langham Hotel stays in the Langham Hotel. I would say

437
00:19:56,080 --> 00:19:59,040
Speaker 7: that Annie probably used the first to potentially break, but

438
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Speaker 7: I'll give her the benefit that she wasn't feeling great

439
00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:03,639
Speaker 7: and that's probably why. But I would trust her to

440
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Speaker 7: be there and last a long time as far as

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Speaker 7: stakeouts go, if she's one hundred percent healthy.

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00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:10,800
Speaker 4: Sarah, I broke, I broke hard.

443
00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:13,720
Speaker 8: I mean, it's no shame, it's understandable.

444
00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:16,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, it is under especially if you're not feeling well

445
00:20:16,200 --> 00:20:18,280
Speaker 1: and it's cold and you're like just get it done,

446
00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:21,879
Speaker 1: come on, And also like, Annie, I know you the

447
00:20:21,880 --> 00:20:25,879
Speaker 1: best of this quartet, and I was really interested thinking

448
00:20:25,880 --> 00:20:29,000
Speaker 1: about how you were approaching sort of the scoop of

449
00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:31,720
Speaker 1: it all. How did you handle the desire to quote

450
00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:34,760
Speaker 1: unquote when the story while also understanding that it was

451
00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:37,239
Speaker 1: way better to be going through this with friends than

452
00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:39,960
Speaker 1: if you were sitting outside the hotel by yourself right days.

453
00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:44,800
Speaker 9: Yeah, I really appreciate that question because it's I think

454
00:20:44,920 --> 00:20:48,240
Speaker 9: it's something that I sometimes feel misunderstood in and that

455
00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:52,560
Speaker 9: I am, by nature like very competitive, and I don't

456
00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:56,280
Speaker 9: feel like we should hide that, especially as women like

457
00:20:56,359 --> 00:20:59,000
Speaker 9: I like to fully embrace it and almost kind of

458
00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:03,320
Speaker 9: amp it up more to just exemplify like we can

459
00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:06,239
Speaker 9: be competitive with each other and still be friends. And

460
00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:11,119
Speaker 9: so when we came into this, obviously that starting point

461
00:21:11,240 --> 00:21:14,160
Speaker 9: it was so interesting because to Doug's point, we were

462
00:21:14,280 --> 00:21:16,159
Speaker 9: trying to figure out where the meeting was. And I

463
00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:18,680
Speaker 9: remember even at that point I called a colleague back

464
00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:21,000
Speaker 9: in Chicago and I was like, dude, this is so

465
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:23,119
Speaker 9: hard because we're going to be in this together, but

466
00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:25,479
Speaker 9: we're competitors, Like, how do I handle this? And he

467
00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:28,600
Speaker 9: was like, listen, this is a CBA negotiation and you

468
00:21:28,680 --> 00:21:33,000
Speaker 9: guys are going to go through this whatever happens together.

469
00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:36,280
Speaker 4: He's like, so you don't embrace that, and.

470
00:21:36,240 --> 00:21:41,240
Speaker 9: I did, But I also am not a good liar

471
00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:44,840
Speaker 9: in this sense of like I couldn't I couldn't pretend

472
00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:46,000
Speaker 9: like I didn't want to win.

473
00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:47,840
Speaker 4: I couldn't pretend like.

474
00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:51,480
Speaker 9: I wasn't in it to try to to the best

475
00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:53,719
Speaker 9: of my ability to get the ultimate scoop.

476
00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:56,560
Speaker 4: And again, out of love.

477
00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:59,159
Speaker 9: And respect for these three who I consider friends, I'm like,

478
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:00,879
Speaker 9: I just got to be transparent about that.

479
00:22:01,040 --> 00:22:01,280
Speaker 2: Yeah.

480
00:22:01,359 --> 00:22:02,760
Speaker 4: I remember at one point.

481
00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:04,480
Speaker 9: I broke and I was like, you guys, like, what

482
00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:06,320
Speaker 9: are we doing at the end of this someone who's

483
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:08,440
Speaker 9: going to get the breaking news? Like do we really

484
00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:09,720
Speaker 9: all think we're all going to get it at the

485
00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:12,600
Speaker 9: same time? And so I just yeah, it was hard,

486
00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:15,919
Speaker 9: and I really appreciate these three for seeing me and

487
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:19,840
Speaker 9: understanding me and not thinking less of me because of

488
00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:21,320
Speaker 9: my like competitive style.

489
00:22:21,880 --> 00:22:25,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean that's the job, Alexa. You know you

490
00:22:25,320 --> 00:22:27,879
Speaker 1: work for the Worldwide Leader. I'm still part time at ESPN,

491
00:22:27,880 --> 00:22:29,720
Speaker 1: but I was full time there for like thirteen years.

492
00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:31,840
Speaker 1: I know how much there is a desire to have

493
00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:34,080
Speaker 1: this information that nobody else gets to be the ones

494
00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,800
Speaker 1: who are owning the space. Knowing that you were all

495
00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:39,119
Speaker 1: working for different outlets, how did you sort of handle

496
00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:41,320
Speaker 1: the balance of camaraderie versus competition.

497
00:22:41,720 --> 00:22:42,560
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's interesting.

498
00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:45,919
Speaker 5: I feel like I think this maybe it's just like

499
00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:49,679
Speaker 5: how I tend like obviously we do like have a

500
00:22:49,760 --> 00:22:51,600
Speaker 5: job to do and trying to get the news and

501
00:22:51,640 --> 00:22:54,120
Speaker 5: all that stuff, But like, by nature, I just tend

502
00:22:54,160 --> 00:22:57,840
Speaker 5: to lean very like collaboratively, even though I am competitive,

503
00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:02,600
Speaker 5: and so to me, like I just was so thrilled

504
00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:04,800
Speaker 5: to be there and like go through that whole experience

505
00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:08,480
Speaker 5: with the other three that I like was pretty like

506
00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:11,159
Speaker 5: I'm like, no matter what happens, like that is the

507
00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:12,199
Speaker 5: experience for me.

508
00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:12,800
Speaker 2: Doug.

509
00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:15,000
Speaker 1: If this for the Olympics, you would get the interviews

510
00:23:15,040 --> 00:23:18,200
Speaker 1: first and the scoop because you're a wire service, so

511
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:20,080
Speaker 1: I would have to sit for at least an hour

512
00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:22,040
Speaker 1: after you got to talk to all the people coming

513
00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:24,480
Speaker 1: out before I would get access as a lowly podcast.

514
00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:27,920
Speaker 1: So what did you make of trying to be scooping

515
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:29,760
Speaker 1: versus working together?

516
00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:32,800
Speaker 7: So we talked about Sarah, I mean, the way the

517
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:36,920
Speaker 7: wire works, I can't break news on social media people

518
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:39,359
Speaker 7: pay us, like the Worldwide Leader in other places for

519
00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:41,600
Speaker 7: us to send them stories with the breaking news. So

520
00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:45,320
Speaker 7: we actually had conversations like, hey, you know, if someone

521
00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:47,520
Speaker 7: gets it or we all get it together, they can

522
00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:49,280
Speaker 7: tweet it. I can't because I have to wait for

523
00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:51,840
Speaker 7: actually put a story out. So I kind of knew

524
00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:53,160
Speaker 7: I was never going to be the one to quote

525
00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 7: break the news that way, but I'm used to it.

526
00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:58,399
Speaker 7: I mean, it just gets something out quickly on timely fashion.

527
00:23:58,440 --> 00:24:00,760
Speaker 7: That's what matters more to our customer, to our members

528
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:02,960
Speaker 7: then me putting a tweet out saying hey, a deal

529
00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:05,960
Speaker 7: is done, because I'm not serving our clients that way

530
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:06,400
Speaker 7: to do it.

531
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,080
Speaker 2: Jackie, were you watching people's phones to be like pre

532
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:10,240
Speaker 2: you texting what? Wait?

533
00:24:10,240 --> 00:24:10,280
Speaker 1: What?

534
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:12,600
Speaker 2: Who does message you? What's happening over there?

535
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,040
Speaker 8: I don't think I said that publicly.

536
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:18,480
Speaker 2: Maybe in my head I was thinking, yeah.

537
00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:21,080
Speaker 5: One thing too we did talk about really quick Sarah

538
00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:23,600
Speaker 5: is like we were I think that we actually said

539
00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:26,159
Speaker 5: during it was like if any of us four like

540
00:24:26,359 --> 00:24:29,119
Speaker 5: break the news, like we like respected that because we

541
00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:31,200
Speaker 5: were all like we were the ones that.

542
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:33,520
Speaker 6: Were there, so like yeah, yeah, here.

543
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:35,960
Speaker 5: We know if it came out from anyone before, like

544
00:24:36,080 --> 00:24:37,600
Speaker 5: we got it just you know, as long as it

545
00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:39,320
Speaker 5: was one of the three or four of us, Like,

546
00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:40,800
Speaker 5: that's what we were most happy about.

547
00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 7: Both the league and union did the best they could

548
00:24:42,760 --> 00:24:44,640
Speaker 7: to make sure one of us or all of us

549
00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:46,119
Speaker 7: really wants to get the information first.

550
00:24:46,200 --> 00:24:46,679
Speaker 2: That's great.

551
00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:49,200
Speaker 7: She had discussions about it. Hey, we got to take

552
00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:51,760
Speaker 7: care of the four of the Langham four to make

553
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:54,120
Speaker 7: sure that they are the ones that get the news first,

554
00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:57,080
Speaker 7: which I don't think I've ever heard sides doing before

555
00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:59,639
Speaker 7: because there's always so much competitiveness. But they wanted to

556
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:01,120
Speaker 7: make sure and it probably helped that it was three

557
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:02,879
Speaker 7: in the morning when this broke, but they wanted to

558
00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 7: make sure the four of us were taking care before

559
00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:08,040
Speaker 7: anybody else, which I appreciate it as a reporter of like, hey,

560
00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:10,919
Speaker 7: they recognize what the time we put in for this

561
00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:12,119
Speaker 7: that they want to make sure that we were the

562
00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:13,040
Speaker 7: ones to get the story.

563
00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:15,800
Speaker 1: I replied to Alicia Clark's post where she included a

564
00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:17,359
Speaker 1: photo of y'all, and I was like, I love that

565
00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:19,920
Speaker 1: you included the journals because it was like a massive

566
00:25:20,200 --> 00:25:22,639
Speaker 1: marathon for them too, and not always will they be

567
00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:26,160
Speaker 1: appreciated for that okay, Doug, quick question for you. You've been

568
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:29,360
Speaker 1: reporting on women's basketball for so long, including multiple other CBAS,

569
00:25:29,359 --> 00:25:32,280
Speaker 1: and I wonder how this compares to your previous experience

570
00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:34,320
Speaker 1: in terms of interest and everything else.

571
00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:36,439
Speaker 7: I mean, it was night and day, to be honest

572
00:25:36,480 --> 00:25:39,439
Speaker 7: that the last CBA in twenty twenty, they had it

573
00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:42,000
Speaker 7: done and ratified before they even knew about it. And

574
00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:44,480
Speaker 7: I don't want to say no one cared, because people cared,

575
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:46,680
Speaker 7: but there was not the height and interest that there

576
00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:49,239
Speaker 7: was for this CBA. The standpoint, there was no one

577
00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:51,320
Speaker 7: s taking out the headquarters, no one knew, and it

578
00:25:51,359 --> 00:25:53,639
Speaker 7: was actually done. They kept a secret for three weeks,

579
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:57,200
Speaker 7: so I mean, from that standpoint, it was completely different.

580
00:25:57,400 --> 00:25:59,520
Speaker 1: Jackie, how does the new CBA that the league in

581
00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:03,240
Speaker 1: the union to compare to what you expected? Anything major

582
00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:04,560
Speaker 1: that you were like, Oh, this is not what I

583
00:26:04,600 --> 00:26:05,560
Speaker 1: thought we would end up with.

584
00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:08,840
Speaker 8: I think for me, the one surprise is the revenue

585
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:12,560
Speaker 8: sharing component of this, in that it's not really clear

586
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:15,719
Speaker 8: right now what the system was. I mean, what I

587
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:19,720
Speaker 8: really want to understand is how did we go from

588
00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:25,680
Speaker 8: being so far apart on these very like ideological types

589
00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:29,880
Speaker 8: of differences when it comes to revenue share. How did

590
00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:33,480
Speaker 8: we go from there to coming together here?

591
00:26:34,000 --> 00:26:35,560
Speaker 2: Right? For me, it's pretty obvious.

592
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,159
Speaker 1: It's the NBA as usual pretending like they don't have

593
00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:40,680
Speaker 1: enough money to pay the players, and the players finally

594
00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:43,320
Speaker 1: having enough leverage to be like, screw you, and then

595
00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:45,840
Speaker 1: still somehow going from forty percent down to twenty percent,

596
00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:47,560
Speaker 1: which to me is still a major loss.

597
00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:50,600
Speaker 2: I'm interested in the details of the revenue share.

598
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 1: I know on the NBA side it's technically basketball related income,

599
00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:55,879
Speaker 1: which isn't exactly the same as gross revenue. But the

600
00:26:56,000 --> 00:26:58,879
Speaker 1: NBA players since a nineteen eighty three landmark CBA have

601
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:01,520
Speaker 1: been getting somewhere around fifty percent of a revenue split

602
00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:04,160
Speaker 1: with the league, and somehow, forty years later, we're still

603
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 1: acting like the women don't deserve to share in the

604
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:07,760
Speaker 1: success of their league the same way the men do.

605
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 1: So to me, that was just like the players finally

606
00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:13,119
Speaker 1: being like, we call you on your bullshit. There's absolutely

607
00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:15,879
Speaker 1: no way we're settling for net revenue again, especially with

608
00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 1: the escalators based on things that we can't control, like

609
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:21,640
Speaker 1: last time when COVID just basically wiped them out until

610
00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:23,280
Speaker 1: this very last season when they finally.

611
00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 2: Got a percentage.

612
00:27:23,760 --> 00:27:25,800
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask about that Annie because twenty percent

613
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:28,120
Speaker 1: is better than taking net revenue percentage.

614
00:27:28,119 --> 00:27:29,760
Speaker 2: But I'm still very frustrated by it, and I.

615
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,119
Speaker 1: Wonder if there are any details yet to let us

616
00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:34,320
Speaker 1: know whether it's just a straight twenty percent of gross

617
00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:36,160
Speaker 1: or maybe something more creative.

618
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:40,920
Speaker 9: Those details have been vague about what exactly that system is,

619
00:27:41,040 --> 00:27:43,240
Speaker 9: but what we do know is it's a twenty percent

620
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,080
Speaker 9: average over the life of the deal. You know, I

621
00:27:46,160 --> 00:27:51,119
Speaker 9: think to your point, it's interesting when you consider how

622
00:27:51,760 --> 00:27:56,600
Speaker 9: far the union moved and how little the league moved,

623
00:27:56,760 --> 00:28:01,600
Speaker 9: And you could definitely argue where the the union started was,

624
00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:05,040
Speaker 9: you know, this really lofty goal and so they needed

625
00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:09,240
Speaker 9: to move more. But what I find really interesting about

626
00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:15,160
Speaker 9: this model now, whenever we get the complete details, we'll

627
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:17,600
Speaker 9: be able to talk more about this. But what I

628
00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:22,600
Speaker 9: find really interesting about that comparison to the NBA's percentage

629
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:26,159
Speaker 9: going back to nineteen eighty three is again the ownership

630
00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:29,320
Speaker 9: model of the WNBA. That is the biggest difference between

631
00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:32,640
Speaker 9: the NBA and the WNBA, and I think that's going

632
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:36,719
Speaker 9: to be one of the most fascinating stories as this

633
00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:40,840
Speaker 9: league continues to grow and develop, is how it's owned

634
00:28:41,280 --> 00:28:43,960
Speaker 9: and these three different stakeholders in terms of the NBA,

635
00:28:44,040 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 9: the WNBA, and the sixteen percent, because that just muddles everything.

636
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 9: And just the last thing I have to say about this,

637
00:28:52,800 --> 00:28:57,760
Speaker 9: When you consider a business and the desire to see

638
00:28:57,760 --> 00:29:03,479
Speaker 9: that business come to full fruition, the w is hindered

639
00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 9: in this way.

640
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:06,240
Speaker 1: Right, And I want to get to that because that's

641
00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 1: that was my next point, and I agree with you,

642
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:10,880
Speaker 1: but I think, unfortunately it should not be the players

643
00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:15,680
Speaker 1: who are paid less because the ownership structure splits more

644
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:20,440
Speaker 1: across those three entities. That's them, you know, diluting their

645
00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:24,200
Speaker 1: equity in pursuit of an improved investment at one point.

646
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,360
Speaker 1: That should not be something that the players get a

647
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:28,560
Speaker 1: smaller percentage as a result, because I heard someone say

648
00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 1: to me, oh, the ownership structure is different, and that's why.

649
00:29:30,480 --> 00:29:33,520
Speaker 1: But to me, forty percent wasn't lofty. It was in fact,

650
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 1: the expectation that they would take seventy percent of net

651
00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:39,680
Speaker 1: revenue from the WNBA side that was more insulting that

652
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 1: they needed to move off to.

653
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:43,959
Speaker 8: So Andy brings up a great point, which is the split.

654
00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:47,080
Speaker 8: And I think what we need to remember is that

655
00:29:47,680 --> 00:29:50,640
Speaker 8: not the forty two percent that the WNBA owners have.

656
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:52,959
Speaker 8: But it is the forty two percent of the NBA

657
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:58,040
Speaker 8: ownership that I often question because these are owners in

658
00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:03,280
Speaker 8: that pocket or in that group that still have something

659
00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 8: against the WNBA. And the reason I say this is

660
00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:10,280
Speaker 8: because this infamous New York Post article that came out

661
00:30:10,720 --> 00:30:16,120
Speaker 8: right around the twenty twenty four WNBA Finals, where it

662
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:18,320
Speaker 8: didn't say him by name, but we all knew that

663
00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:22,360
Speaker 8: it was James Dolan complaining about how he was still

664
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:26,800
Speaker 8: losing forty million dollars a year. Because the NBA owns

665
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 8: forty two percent of the WNBA. So what makes this

666
00:30:29,880 --> 00:30:32,680
Speaker 8: even harder is you have owners that still own this

667
00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:35,560
Speaker 8: league that do not believe in it and that still

668
00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:37,000
Speaker 8: consider it to be a burden.

669
00:30:37,280 --> 00:30:38,440
Speaker 2: That's a big part of it for me.

670
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:42,440
Speaker 1: And also the lack of financial transparency prevents the public

671
00:30:42,520 --> 00:30:45,120
Speaker 1: and even the players for much of these negotiations from

672
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:48,840
Speaker 1: truly understanding what their league is doing in terms of revenue.

673
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:51,120
Speaker 1: And to your point, whether it's James Dolan or the

674
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:55,120
Speaker 1: league itself publicly trying to claim loss and cry loss

675
00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:59,800
Speaker 1: while simultaneously hosting multi hundred million dollar bids for expansion

676
00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 1: tea that people are falling all over themselves for, so

677
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:03,600
Speaker 1: tell me which one it is. Is this a terrible

678
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:06,440
Speaker 1: investment in a losing business or is this a ever

679
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:10,440
Speaker 1: growing rocket ship growth that everybody wants in on, you know, Alexa.

680
00:31:10,560 --> 00:31:12,719
Speaker 1: To that point, the TV deal has been touted as

681
00:31:12,720 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 1: this big win for the league.

682
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:14,440
Speaker 2: Two point two.

683
00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:17,040
Speaker 1: Billion is a lot of money, but it's less than

684
00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:20,040
Speaker 1: three percent of the seventy six billion dollar media deal

685
00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:23,120
Speaker 1: that the NBA negotiated. So Adam Silver and Company decided

686
00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:26,120
Speaker 1: the W is deserving of just three percent of that deal,

687
00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:29,920
Speaker 1: despite w's TV viewership accounting for closer to thirteen percent

688
00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:32,080
Speaker 1: of their combined viewership total.

689
00:31:32,440 --> 00:31:34,040
Speaker 2: Can the W actually thrive.

690
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:36,280
Speaker 1: If they remain under the thumb of the NBA, particularly

691
00:31:36,320 --> 00:31:39,280
Speaker 1: when many of us are curious about how finances behind

692
00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:41,880
Speaker 1: the scenes are shuffled to keep reporting the W as

693
00:31:41,880 --> 00:31:44,160
Speaker 1: a loss and send profit toward the NBA.

694
00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:46,080
Speaker 5: I feel like I should probably plead the fifth on

695
00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:48,800
Speaker 5: this one as a technicalism employee of the rights holder.

696
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 2: Someone else want to take this, Okay?

697
00:31:51,640 --> 00:31:53,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, I think the answers no.

698
00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:56,400
Speaker 9: Like we've talked to so many, I think all of

699
00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:58,680
Speaker 9: us can say that we've talked to so many coaches

700
00:31:58,720 --> 00:32:01,200
Speaker 9: and executives over the year who've been in this league

701
00:32:01,240 --> 00:32:04,280
Speaker 9: since the nineties or just who are in the know.

702
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:06,000
Speaker 4: You know, they've.

703
00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:10,000
Speaker 9: Talked about the fact that you know, when you're you're

704
00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:13,080
Speaker 9: a business operating to your point under the thumb of another,

705
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 9: can you reach your full potential?

706
00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 4: And the answer is no. And this is a primetime example.

707
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:22,160
Speaker 9: And again I respect Alexa so much because yes, as

708
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:24,560
Speaker 9: an employee of ESPN totally you.

709
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:25,440
Speaker 4: Got to plead the fifth.

710
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 9: But there's an aspect to that that doesn't make sense

711
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:33,000
Speaker 9: in terms of how that deal was broken down. And

712
00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:38,120
Speaker 9: when you're again considering the business reaching its full potential, well,

713
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:41,719
Speaker 9: why would you negotiate that together? And why would it

714
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:44,960
Speaker 9: equate to only three percent? And again, Adam and the

715
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 9: NBA will I'll argue, well, we did the WNBA a

716
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:48,959
Speaker 9: solid by doing this together.

717
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:53,200
Speaker 4: That'll be their argument. But is that is that true?

718
00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:55,640
Speaker 9: Like, we don't know because they didn't go to market

719
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:56,760
Speaker 9: separately exactly.

720
00:32:56,760 --> 00:32:58,240
Speaker 1: And it's the same thing we saw for years and

721
00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:01,680
Speaker 1: years with the NCAA Women's Tournament, where they hadn't materially

722
00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:03,959
Speaker 1: renegotiated it in decades and they kept looping it in

723
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:05,960
Speaker 1: with all the other championships, and that's still the case.

724
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:08,120
Speaker 1: So even when they get a massive better TV deal

725
00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 1: that they got recently, you're still not ever letting it

726
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 1: go to market to find out what it would do

727
00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:15,440
Speaker 1: for itself without being tied to all the other ones. Yet,

728
00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:17,800
Speaker 1: I think I don't know. I wasn't in a of

729
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:21,240
Speaker 1: the rooms. I wouldn't blame ESPN for however it happened.

730
00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:23,200
Speaker 1: I'm saying the NBA is the one who decided to

731
00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:25,959
Speaker 1: take the deal they made and allocate a certain percentage

732
00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:30,280
Speaker 1: to the league. You know, Doug, Speaking of that financial transparency,

733
00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:32,400
Speaker 1: do we know anything about the league's commitment as a

734
00:33:32,400 --> 00:33:34,640
Speaker 1: result of this new CBA if there is one to

735
00:33:34,720 --> 00:33:37,720
Speaker 1: sharing more of their financials publicly and with players and

736
00:33:37,760 --> 00:33:38,640
Speaker 1: the player side.

737
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:40,920
Speaker 7: I mean, I'll be honest, Sarah, I don't think that

738
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:43,240
Speaker 7: it's going to change much. It hasn't in the past.

739
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:46,280
Speaker 7: They did give their books to the union side at

740
00:33:46,280 --> 00:33:49,760
Speaker 7: some point during the negotiations. The league did not individual teams,

741
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 7: so I think that's as transparent as it will get.

742
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:55,040
Speaker 7: I don't think any league gives out its financial information

743
00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:58,240
Speaker 7: to players to the public, so to speak, so I'd

744
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:00,640
Speaker 7: be surprised if anything changes in the near future for

745
00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:03,200
Speaker 7: the WNBA or any league for that matter.

746
00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 1: We got to take a quick break more with the

747
00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:15,319
Speaker 1: Langham crew right after this, you know Alexa. During these negotiations,

748
00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:17,800
Speaker 1: the league claimed they would lose seven hundred million dollars

749
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:20,640
Speaker 1: a year if they gave up thirty percent of gross revenue,

750
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:22,800
Speaker 1: and then when it was twenty seven and a half percent,

751
00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:25,239
Speaker 1: they'd lose like four hundred and sixty million. I tried

752
00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:27,440
Speaker 1: to do the math on twenty percent. I don't know

753
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:29,640
Speaker 1: where they were mathing from, so I didn't know the

754
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:32,080
Speaker 1: number to go from. But let's just say that they

755
00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:35,879
Speaker 1: still would probably claim a massive loss during negotiations when

756
00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,040
Speaker 1: being asked to give up twenty percent of gross revenue.

757
00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 2: But now the negotiations are done.

758
00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:42,480
Speaker 1: Do you think if you ask the league how confident

759
00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:44,960
Speaker 1: they are in their business, whether it's a good investment

760
00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:47,920
Speaker 1: for expansion teams and sponsor, that they would be talking

761
00:34:47,920 --> 00:34:50,000
Speaker 1: about losses or will we not hear about those major

762
00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:52,080
Speaker 1: losses until we're back to negotiations again.

763
00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:56,720
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's interesting because that was a huge back and forth.

764
00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 5: I remember first reporting that in December and one of

765
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:04,680
Speaker 5: the big sticking points about how those losses were calculated

766
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:07,120
Speaker 5: or if you were on the union side saying that

767
00:35:07,160 --> 00:35:11,359
Speaker 5: those were bs was whether or not expansion fees were

768
00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:15,279
Speaker 5: factored in. The league did not consider expansion fees as

769
00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 5: like actual net revenue, and the union was saying, hey,

770
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:22,839
Speaker 5: that's money that's going and owner's pockets. So I that's

771
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:25,120
Speaker 5: a question that like if we were able to talk

772
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:27,399
Speaker 5: with Kathy right now and talk with the union side,

773
00:35:27,400 --> 00:35:29,680
Speaker 5: I think would be really interesting to see like where

774
00:35:29,719 --> 00:35:32,680
Speaker 5: they netted out on that is, like what that twenty

775
00:35:32,760 --> 00:35:36,280
Speaker 5: percent of rev shared, Like does it actually factor and gross?

776
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,799
Speaker 5: Of course, you know I tried to ask, you know,

777
00:35:38,840 --> 00:35:41,240
Speaker 5: this was three am, so it wasn't my most articulate answer.

778
00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:45,280
Speaker 5: Basically when the deal was done, like what it meant

779
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:48,600
Speaker 5: that you know, the partnership of like this deal with

780
00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:50,920
Speaker 5: the league and the players union, and like what it

781
00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:53,759
Speaker 5: meant from like a standpoint of the business. And she

782
00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 5: said it was a fair win win in her awards,

783
00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:59,200
Speaker 5: I don't expect that they would say they expect losses

784
00:35:59,239 --> 00:36:03,359
Speaker 5: at this point, but you know, behind the scenes, what

785
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 5: does this deal showed. Is it showing something more along

786
00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:09,719
Speaker 5: those lines, Is it showing you know the owners are

787
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:11,440
Speaker 5: still at a good place to invest in the business.

788
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:13,359
Speaker 6: I think that all remains to be seen, all.

789
00:36:13,360 --> 00:36:16,200
Speaker 1: Right, Doug speed run on two items, one of our

790
00:36:16,239 --> 00:36:18,399
Speaker 1: slices and a Wolock re up. These elements that I'd

791
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:20,360
Speaker 1: kind of forgotten to dig into, So if you know

792
00:36:20,440 --> 00:36:23,239
Speaker 1: anything about them, any major changes to prioritization.

793
00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:26,680
Speaker 7: They actually haven't said anything about that, so no answer.

794
00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:30,520
Speaker 1: And then did they finalize that mandated college combine idea

795
00:36:30,560 --> 00:36:31,200
Speaker 1: that they wanted.

796
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:34,120
Speaker 7: That's another good question. As we said, we had maybe

797
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:36,840
Speaker 7: fifteen minutes with them after they announced.

798
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:38,600
Speaker 2: It, but the term sheet doesn't seem to show anything

799
00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:38,800
Speaker 2: on that.

800
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:42,040
Speaker 7: Okay, I'm sure they're finalizing it over the next couple

801
00:36:42,239 --> 00:36:44,319
Speaker 7: weeks or so when they actually write the CBA. But

802
00:36:44,680 --> 00:36:46,640
Speaker 7: I'm sure those two things are important to both sides

803
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:49,000
Speaker 7: to get out there when it's actually official.

804
00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 2: Yeah.

805
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:51,920
Speaker 1: A couple more questions for y'all, Jackie, Do you know

806
00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:55,640
Speaker 1: anything about how the reporting might change for this league,

807
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:57,759
Speaker 1: particularly because they were so grateful to you for all

808
00:36:57,800 --> 00:36:58,520
Speaker 1: your coverage here?

809
00:36:58,600 --> 00:37:00,799
Speaker 2: Are they going to improve media access?

810
00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 1: Shoot around every players available full postgame locker room access?

811
00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:09,240
Speaker 8: Sarah, that is a wonderful question that you just asked,

812
00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:12,800
Speaker 8: and to be quite honest, we don't know that for sure.

813
00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:15,319
Speaker 8: But what I will say is that there have been

814
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:22,440
Speaker 8: some conversations about changing the current rules, and I think

815
00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,799
Speaker 8: all of us can really speak about how this experience

816
00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:30,960
Speaker 8: really allowed for us to make these human connections, and

817
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 8: I think that is something that continues to be lost.

818
00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:38,320
Speaker 8: And it's not just the WNBA. I've heard some interesting

819
00:37:38,320 --> 00:37:41,760
Speaker 8: stories on the NWSL side when it comes to media

820
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:45,200
Speaker 8: access and just sort of this lack of understanding about

821
00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 8: what our job is and how it's really important for

822
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:52,000
Speaker 8: us to actually be able to talk to these players, coaches,

823
00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:57,080
Speaker 8: executives as humans and to really build those relationships. You

824
00:37:57,200 --> 00:38:00,399
Speaker 8: can't build them unless you're in the room with them.

825
00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:03,640
Speaker 8: And I think this goes into an interesting story about

826
00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:07,160
Speaker 8: our first night. On Night one, the players sort of

827
00:38:07,239 --> 00:38:10,239
Speaker 8: left out a side door of the Langham Hotel and

828
00:38:10,600 --> 00:38:13,320
Speaker 8: it was a little frustrating for us because we were

829
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:15,800
Speaker 8: we essentially pulled an all nighter. We were up until

830
00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 8: five or maybe five point thirty, almost six, and we

831
00:38:19,239 --> 00:38:21,319
Speaker 8: didn't get to talk to them, and there was a

832
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:25,440
Speaker 8: lot of frustration, and we sort of communicated that frustration

833
00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:33,560
Speaker 8: in a diplomatic way, of course. I mean I was diplomatic,

834
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:38,960
Speaker 8: that's my ability, and I think that message came across.

835
00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:41,800
Speaker 1: I think it's necessary if you're asking for what the

836
00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:44,600
Speaker 1: league wants in terms of media coverage and rights deals,

837
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 1: and if your players demanding that you're treated more professionally,

838
00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:49,080
Speaker 1: then you have to accept that part of that is

839
00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:51,960
Speaker 1: your relationship with the media. And I do think that

840
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:54,560
Speaker 1: the league at this point might be frustrated with some

841
00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 1: of the media, myself included, but the Players Association certainly

842
00:38:57,680 --> 00:38:59,920
Speaker 1: should feel indebted to the work done by the media

843
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:02,279
Speaker 1: to help tell their story, because the players were the

844
00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:05,200
Speaker 1: ones who had the leverage here and were so wrongly

845
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:07,680
Speaker 1: on the side of the previous deals when it comes

846
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:10,759
Speaker 1: to revenue and everything else that if there weren't such

847
00:39:10,840 --> 00:39:12,920
Speaker 1: great coverage of this, it might have been like what

848
00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:15,080
Speaker 1: Doug talked about before, where people aren't paying as much

849
00:39:15,120 --> 00:39:17,560
Speaker 1: attention and they aren't pushing back and they aren't you know,

850
00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:19,560
Speaker 1: the court of public opinion was very powerful for the

851
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 1: players on this one, and the PA did a good

852
00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:22,000
Speaker 1: job of harnessing that.

853
00:39:22,080 --> 00:39:23,520
Speaker 2: But also I think it was so.

854
00:39:23,600 --> 00:39:26,200
Speaker 9: Obvious someone's got to be the bad guy here in

855
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:30,880
Speaker 9: terms of setting the standard within the media ecosystem, and

856
00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:33,880
Speaker 9: no one really wants to be that person that sets

857
00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 9: a standard in terms of who gets locker room access.

858
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:40,840
Speaker 9: This whole idea of tiered access, which as I mean, Sarah,

859
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:43,080
Speaker 9: I can I know you know having covered like Bulls

860
00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:43,440
Speaker 9: games in.

861
00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 4: The NBA, is that you know it's.

862
00:39:45,760 --> 00:39:48,000
Speaker 9: Not easy to get a Bulls credential. You have to

863
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:51,000
Speaker 9: have hit a certain mark, you have to go through

864
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:54,240
Speaker 9: this whole process to get approved, and the w doesn't

865
00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:56,280
Speaker 9: want to do that. And I think that can answer

866
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:59,719
Speaker 9: a lot of questions as to whether locker room accesses

867
00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:01,240
Speaker 9: is in the future.

868
00:40:01,480 --> 00:40:03,800
Speaker 4: Is like someone's got to be the bad guy.

869
00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:05,719
Speaker 9: And someone's got to be like, hey, you only get

870
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:08,920
Speaker 9: locker room access under X, Y and Z circumstances, and

871
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:12,920
Speaker 9: it will be snagged so quick if you don't operate

872
00:40:13,040 --> 00:40:14,320
Speaker 9: at a professional standard.

873
00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:14,680
Speaker 7: Yep.

874
00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:15,360
Speaker 2: Yeah.

875
00:40:15,480 --> 00:40:17,560
Speaker 1: And I think also like there can then be those

876
00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:20,400
Speaker 1: efforts to be made for smaller publications and up and

877
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:23,840
Speaker 1: coming people in specific moments. Instead of just saying nobody

878
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:25,319
Speaker 1: gets it because we don't want to deal with this,

879
00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:28,279
Speaker 1: you still have to have that expectation at the highest level.

880
00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:29,719
Speaker 1: And I think that the media has caught up in

881
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:32,480
Speaker 1: a way that requires it at this point. Yeah, Okay,

882
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:36,040
Speaker 1: last couple of things, Doug. Future of Kathy Engelbert, what.

883
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:36,680
Speaker 2: Do you see?

884
00:40:37,080 --> 00:40:40,080
Speaker 7: I thought she was a winner in this whole negotiation.

885
00:40:40,200 --> 00:40:43,920
Speaker 7: She was one who was actually advocating for the players

886
00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:46,040
Speaker 7: to get what they wanted in a lot of different

887
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:48,879
Speaker 7: areas from what I've heard, So I think she came

888
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:50,799
Speaker 7: into it in a bad spot. Obviously, all the talk

889
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:53,400
Speaker 7: of the players not respecting you or not like your

890
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:56,919
Speaker 7: fees comments from last year. I think Kathy came away

891
00:40:56,920 --> 00:40:58,920
Speaker 7: as a winner. Does that mean she'll keep her job?

892
00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:00,960
Speaker 7: That's up to her and somehow. I'm sure that there'll

893
00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:03,520
Speaker 7: be discussions about it. But I thought she came through

894
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:06,319
Speaker 7: it was a really good situation coming out of a

895
00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:07,440
Speaker 7: really tough negotiation.

896
00:41:07,719 --> 00:41:09,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, couldn't have gone backwards really after that.

897
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:11,680
Speaker 1: And if yous to call your exit interview, Andy, I

898
00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:13,040
Speaker 1: think your face had a different answer.

899
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:14,640
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm less convinced.

900
00:41:14,719 --> 00:41:18,400
Speaker 9: I think that it depends on who you talk to

901
00:41:19,239 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 9: on where Kathy's kind of future in the WMBA stands.

902
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 9: And I think two things can be true at the

903
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:27,400
Speaker 9: same time in terms of her being the person to

904
00:41:27,920 --> 00:41:32,920
Speaker 9: help lead this negotiation and get this deal over the hump,

905
00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:38,680
Speaker 9: while also that accomplishment not negating the fact that players

906
00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:41,399
Speaker 9: are not really on the same page with her, and

907
00:41:41,560 --> 00:41:45,360
Speaker 9: despite a deal getting done, that doesn't really change kind

908
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:48,200
Speaker 9: of the job that she's done up until this point.

909
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:50,399
Speaker 9: And so yeah, I think two things can be true

910
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:54,560
Speaker 9: at this point. I'm less convinced that she's gonna stay

911
00:41:54,800 --> 00:41:55,439
Speaker 9: stay in this.

912
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:56,560
Speaker 2: Job, Alexa.

913
00:41:56,600 --> 00:41:59,120
Speaker 1: Everyone's going to walk out of here project happiness and confidence,

914
00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:01,400
Speaker 1: satisfaction with what they want in the deal, because that's

915
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:02,279
Speaker 1: sort of necessary.

916
00:42:02,600 --> 00:42:03,120
Speaker 2: Do you think the.

917
00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:07,040
Speaker 1: Relationship is stronger because of these long talks or weakened?

918
00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:08,720
Speaker 2: Was more unearthed?

919
00:42:08,760 --> 00:42:11,080
Speaker 1: Does a result of these talks that will cause friction

920
00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:14,520
Speaker 1: or was there more coming together because both sides recognize

921
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:15,680
Speaker 1: each other's perspective better.

922
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:18,520
Speaker 5: Hmmm, that's like a really tough question. I think that

923
00:42:18,560 --> 00:42:21,480
Speaker 5: it remains to be seen a little bit. To me,

924
00:42:21,960 --> 00:42:25,520
Speaker 5: when the dust settles and the weeks, like, you know,

925
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:28,680
Speaker 5: we're still I can only speak for myself. I'm still

926
00:42:28,719 --> 00:42:32,560
Speaker 5: recovering from the negotiations. I'm still I'm sure the players,

927
00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:34,920
Speaker 5: the league and all them, they're still kind of getting

928
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:37,240
Speaker 5: their head back above the water and I'm very curious,

929
00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:40,840
Speaker 5: like now that it's actually more official and formalized, Like

930
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:43,680
Speaker 5: I want to see how they are, you know, are

931
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:46,320
Speaker 5: they doing a joint press conference Terry and Kathy or

932
00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:49,600
Speaker 5: Nekka and Kathy and able to like present this as

933
00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:51,480
Speaker 5: a united front and like pick up on like what

934
00:42:51,520 --> 00:42:54,719
Speaker 5: the vibes are there? So I think it remains to

935
00:42:54,760 --> 00:42:57,280
Speaker 5: be seen and where the dust settles.

936
00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:00,319
Speaker 1: Yeah, okay, last question for you, Annie, Will this deal

937
00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:04,880
Speaker 1: feel current enough in four to five years? Ah?

938
00:43:04,920 --> 00:43:06,279
Speaker 4: I hate to be the hater.

939
00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:09,120
Speaker 2: You know why I asked you, you know, I asked

940
00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:09,640
Speaker 2: you instead of.

941
00:43:09,640 --> 00:43:11,759
Speaker 9: The other I know, I know, and you know what

942
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:16,440
Speaker 9: this isn't to say what was accomplished isn't historic and

943
00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:20,000
Speaker 9: and both like I don't want to disrespect the work

944
00:43:20,040 --> 00:43:23,040
Speaker 9: that went into getting this deal done and how monumental

945
00:43:23,160 --> 00:43:25,720
Speaker 9: it is that there is going to be a seven

946
00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:30,080
Speaker 9: figure super mac salary. But let's be real and four

947
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:32,719
Speaker 9: to five years that one million dollars one point four

948
00:43:32,719 --> 00:43:35,680
Speaker 9: million dollars is going to look like chump change if

949
00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:40,239
Speaker 9: this league continues growing in the way that everyone you

950
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:43,239
Speaker 9: know it expects it, and obviously the salary is going

951
00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:45,200
Speaker 9: to grow with it. So I shouldn't say it's still

952
00:43:45,239 --> 00:43:47,560
Speaker 9: going to be at one point four million dollars dollars.

953
00:43:47,520 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 4: In four to five years.

954
00:43:49,000 --> 00:43:52,840
Speaker 9: But I think that you know this CBA is setting

955
00:43:52,920 --> 00:43:58,080
Speaker 9: up a doozy of a CBA negotiation in six years after.

956
00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:00,000
Speaker 4: They opt out, assuming they opt out.

957
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:00,919
Speaker 2: That's a good point.

958
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:03,360
Speaker 1: We will eventually get more details on exactly how the

959
00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 1: revenue from the previous year impacts the salary cap the

960
00:44:06,000 --> 00:44:08,560
Speaker 1: next year, whether that revenue is part of what goes

961
00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:11,120
Speaker 1: into the revenue share or simply goes into the salaries

962
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:12,760
Speaker 1: and then separately will be revenue shared.

963
00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:14,360
Speaker 2: Some of that is still yet to be determined.

964
00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:16,960
Speaker 1: As we said, the details of that revenue share are

965
00:44:17,000 --> 00:44:20,000
Speaker 1: still not fully fleshed out. I do want to point

966
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:21,839
Speaker 1: out to your point though, that you know I've talked

967
00:44:21,840 --> 00:44:25,160
Speaker 1: about since months ago, that the WNBA and Claudia Golden

968
00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:27,600
Speaker 1: work together using a bunch of data to figure out

969
00:44:27,920 --> 00:44:31,239
Speaker 1: an estimate of what would be a more fair percentage

970
00:44:31,960 --> 00:44:34,920
Speaker 1: in relation to NBA salaries based on attendance all this

971
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:39,279
Speaker 1: other stuff, and she said that WNBA players should be

972
00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:43,160
Speaker 1: making about a quarter of NBA players and instead the

973
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:46,880
Speaker 1: current will be about five percent of the average NBA salary.

974
00:44:47,080 --> 00:44:49,440
Speaker 1: So yes, the numbers are incredible compared to what they

975
00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:53,120
Speaker 1: used to be and also compared to the numbers of viewers,

976
00:44:53,200 --> 00:44:55,080
Speaker 1: tickets sold, merch revenue.

977
00:44:54,760 --> 00:44:55,600
Speaker 2: All the other things.

978
00:44:55,800 --> 00:44:58,000
Speaker 1: It still feels like it's lagging compared to the way

979
00:44:58,000 --> 00:45:00,560
Speaker 1: that we decided to pay men in response the success

980
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:01,239
Speaker 1: that their leagues have.

981
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:03,960
Speaker 8: That is so depressing to hear, but I think it's

982
00:45:04,080 --> 00:45:08,000
Speaker 8: worth trying to think about why that is and how

983
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:12,319
Speaker 8: in women's sports professional leagues, I'll call it, there's a

984
00:45:12,320 --> 00:45:16,640
Speaker 8: lot of trauma in women's pro leagues because they have

985
00:45:16,840 --> 00:45:21,320
Speaker 8: gone through this cycle prior to the present day of oh,

986
00:45:21,400 --> 00:45:24,360
Speaker 8: this is so cool, this is unique, this is a novelty,

987
00:45:24,960 --> 00:45:28,360
Speaker 8: and then once there's an event like the financial crisis

988
00:45:28,360 --> 00:45:32,399
Speaker 8: in two thousand and eight, the novelty wears off and

989
00:45:32,520 --> 00:45:36,800
Speaker 8: the owners are concerned about their pockets and women's sports

990
00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:39,239
Speaker 8: that was the first thing to go. And so I

991
00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:42,880
Speaker 8: think what you're talking about is a direct result of

992
00:45:42,920 --> 00:45:45,800
Speaker 8: all of that up and down and up and down.

993
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:48,759
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, I mean, I agree with you, except for

994
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:52,320
Speaker 1: this is almost thirty year league now, and the NBA

995
00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:55,280
Speaker 1: at multiple different points throughout its history when it was younger,

996
00:45:55,320 --> 00:45:57,440
Speaker 1: when it made less money, when there was less of

997
00:45:57,440 --> 00:45:59,840
Speaker 1: a global interest, when there was not streaming, when there

998
00:45:59,920 --> 00:46:02,480
Speaker 1: was fewer items of merch, when there was many fewer

999
00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:06,160
Speaker 1: revenue streams, still always prioritized paying the players as the

1000
00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:08,240
Speaker 1: product in a way that has never happened for women.

1001
00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:11,040
Speaker 1: And the constant belief system that men are paid on

1002
00:46:11,120 --> 00:46:13,880
Speaker 1: potential and women are paid on past performance with an

1003
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:15,080
Speaker 1: eye to that previous.

1004
00:46:14,800 --> 00:46:16,000
Speaker 2: Trauma is picking bullshit.

1005
00:46:16,360 --> 00:46:18,720
Speaker 1: And we have to stop applying different rules to women's

1006
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:21,600
Speaker 1: leagues than men's because we will keep funding the XFL

1007
00:46:21,640 --> 00:46:23,840
Speaker 1: eighty five times over, no matter who gives a flying

1008
00:46:23,880 --> 00:46:27,000
Speaker 1: book about it, while we point to previous women's leagues

1009
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:29,200
Speaker 1: that have failed in the past with zero coverage, zero

1010
00:46:29,320 --> 00:46:32,840
Speaker 1: media investment, zero treatment like a startup, which is what

1011
00:46:32,960 --> 00:46:35,479
Speaker 1: a new league is, so that when they fail, we're like, see,

1012
00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:38,000
Speaker 1: the product was bad. That's never been the problem. So

1013
00:46:38,040 --> 00:46:40,480
Speaker 1: we have to stop reacting to the current leagues, who

1014
00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:42,800
Speaker 1: are built completely differently as if they're going to fail

1015
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:44,760
Speaker 1: in the way of the previous leagues. And the NBA

1016
00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:48,200
Speaker 1: and the WNBA are pounting on us viewing this league

1017
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:50,640
Speaker 1: in this year the same way that we viewed everything before,

1018
00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:52,480
Speaker 1: and it is not the case anymore, and that is

1019
00:46:52,480 --> 00:46:54,640
Speaker 1: why they do end up, in my opinion, with a

1020
00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:56,719
Speaker 1: deal that is fantastic and great and so much better

1021
00:46:56,760 --> 00:46:59,000
Speaker 1: than what it was before, and yet will also in

1022
00:46:59,040 --> 00:47:01,200
Speaker 1: a couple of years something we want to move even

1023
00:47:01,520 --> 00:47:02,120
Speaker 1: further beyond you.

1024
00:47:02,200 --> 00:47:03,280
Speaker 2: You've got a great point.

1025
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 8: You've got a great point.

1026
00:47:04,600 --> 00:47:06,960
Speaker 1: I'm usually not very cynical, so I got on the

1027
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:08,840
Speaker 1: call just just me and Annie over in the corner,

1028
00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:16,359
Speaker 1: like more and more not cynicism, realism. Yeah, you guys

1029
00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:19,120
Speaker 1: are so fantastic. I know you're still sleep deprived. Thank

1030
00:47:19,120 --> 00:47:21,160
Speaker 1: you so much for coming on and talking to us,

1031
00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:23,080
Speaker 1: sharing all your insight. We look forward to all the

1032
00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:26,040
Speaker 1: future reporting as more details come out, and a season

1033
00:47:26,160 --> 00:47:30,680
Speaker 1: where we can actually talk about players and games and basketball.

1034
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:33,960
Speaker 2: But lang them for thank you for your service. I'm

1035
00:47:34,000 --> 00:47:34,719
Speaker 2: saluting you.

1036
00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:36,160
Speaker 4: Langam four forever.

1037
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:42,680
Speaker 2: Hell yeah, Doug make the heart you can do it, Doug, Doug. Yeah.

1038
00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:46,440
Speaker 1: Thanks again to Annie, Alexa, Jackie and Doug for taking

1039
00:47:46,480 --> 00:47:46,839
Speaker 1: the time.

1040
00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:48,360
Speaker 2: We have to take another break.

1041
00:47:48,400 --> 00:47:51,080
Speaker 1: When we return, we put the spotlight on two women's

1042
00:47:51,120 --> 00:48:02,040
Speaker 1: basketball pioneers, Backslices. We love that you're listening, but we

1043
00:48:02,080 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 1: want you to get in the game. Every day too,

1044
00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:05,960
Speaker 1: So here's our good game play of the day. Watch

1045
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:09,399
Speaker 1: the new documentary Breaking Glass, The Pat Summit Story, which

1046
00:48:09,440 --> 00:48:12,280
Speaker 1: chronicles the life and career of the legendary women's basketball

1047
00:48:12,280 --> 00:48:15,160
Speaker 1: coach who led the Tennessee Lady Bowls to eight NCAA

1048
00:48:15,239 --> 00:48:19,360
Speaker 1: Championships and thirty two combined SEC titles from nineteen seventy

1049
00:48:19,400 --> 00:48:21,839
Speaker 1: four to twenty twelve. The doc is co produced by

1050
00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:24,160
Speaker 1: Rock and Robin Productions, that's friend of the show Robin

1051
00:48:24,239 --> 00:48:27,640
Speaker 1: Roberts production House. The film drops tomorrow, March twenty fifth

1052
00:48:27,640 --> 00:48:30,160
Speaker 1: on Hulu, and it'll also air Sunday, March twenty ninth

1053
00:48:30,239 --> 00:48:32,840
Speaker 1: on ESPN two and Sunday April fifth on ESPN.

1054
00:48:33,239 --> 00:48:34,239
Speaker 2: We always love to hear from you.

1055
00:48:34,280 --> 00:48:37,120
Speaker 1: Sit us up on email, good game at wondermedianetwork dot

1056
00:48:37,160 --> 00:48:39,440
Speaker 1: com or leave us a voicemail at eight seven two

1057
00:48:39,560 --> 00:48:41,480
Speaker 1: two oh four fifty seventy and.

1058
00:48:41,440 --> 00:48:43,920
Speaker 2: Don't forget to subscribe, rate and review. Just go do

1059
00:48:43,960 --> 00:48:46,920
Speaker 2: it now, like do it right now. It's so easy.

1060
00:48:47,160 --> 00:48:50,400
Speaker 2: Watch a winner on the court and off of it.

1061
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:54,239
Speaker 1: Rating eighty one years of greatness and no signs of

1062
00:48:54,280 --> 00:48:58,239
Speaker 1: slowing down. Review if you've watched any of the tournament games,

1063
00:48:58,239 --> 00:49:01,360
Speaker 1: featuring the Minnesota Gophers. Know oh the quote unquote Blanket

1064
00:49:01,440 --> 00:49:04,080
Speaker 1: Lady an older woman who runs through the crowd waving

1065
00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:06,680
Speaker 1: a maroon and gold blanket with a Minnesota logo on it,

1066
00:49:06,840 --> 00:49:10,600
Speaker 1: drawing roars from fans. Blanket Lady is eighty one year

1067
00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:13,520
Speaker 1: old PEPs Newman, who grew up loving hoops and finally

1068
00:49:13,520 --> 00:49:15,919
Speaker 1: got her chance to play when she discovered a barnstorming

1069
00:49:15,920 --> 00:49:18,759
Speaker 1: team called the Texas Cowgirls. She ended up playing with

1070
00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:21,520
Speaker 1: different teams until she was forty four years old, once

1071
00:49:21,560 --> 00:49:23,759
Speaker 1: scoring one hundred and eight points in a single game.

1072
00:49:24,040 --> 00:49:26,480
Speaker 1: You can read more about the super hooper turned super

1073
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:29,280
Speaker 1: fan in a great story in The Athletic by Eden Lassie.

1074
00:49:29,640 --> 00:49:32,120
Speaker 1: We'll link to it in the show notes. Newman hasn't

1075
00:49:32,120 --> 00:49:35,359
Speaker 1: missed a Lady Gopher's home game since two thousand and four, but.

1076
00:49:35,360 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 2: Now they're headed on the road for the Sweet sixteen.

1077
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:40,200
Speaker 1: So here's hope in the newfound attention she's gotten during

1078
00:49:40,239 --> 00:49:43,400
Speaker 1: the tourney earns her a trip to Sacramento to waive

1079
00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:46,719
Speaker 1: her team to an even deeper run. Now it's your turn, y'all,

1080
00:49:46,920 --> 00:49:51,040
Speaker 1: rate and review, Thanks for listening, See you tomorrow. Good game,

1081
00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:54,520
Speaker 1: Annie Alexa Jackie and Doug Good Game Alicia Clark for

1082
00:49:54,560 --> 00:49:56,800
Speaker 1: shouting out the hard working reporters.

1083
00:49:56,360 --> 00:49:59,839
Speaker 2: Covering the negotiations youw to the fact that Doug will

1084
00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:00,560
Speaker 2: I ever feel the.

1085
00:50:00,560 --> 00:50:03,319
Speaker 1: Rush of breaking news via a social media post, We

1086
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:10,600
Speaker 1: hate that for you. Doug Good Game with Sarah Spain

1087
00:50:10,680 --> 00:50:13,319
Speaker 1: is an iHeart women's sports production in partnership with Deep

1088
00:50:13,320 --> 00:50:15,800
Speaker 1: Blue Sports and Entertainment. You can find us on the

1089
00:50:15,840 --> 00:50:19,440
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

1090
00:50:19,680 --> 00:50:23,000
Speaker 1: Production by Wonder Media Network, our producers are Alex Azzi

1091
00:50:23,120 --> 00:50:27,040
Speaker 1: and Bianca Hillier. Our executive producers are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz,

1092
00:50:27,080 --> 00:50:30,120
Speaker 1: Jenny Kaplan and Emily Rudder. Our editors are Emily Rutter,

1093
00:50:30,239 --> 00:50:33,759
Speaker 1: Lucy Jones, Britney Martinez and Gianna Palmer. Production assistants from

1094
00:50:33,800 --> 00:50:36,400
Speaker 1: Avery Loftus and I'm Your Host Sarah Spain