Speaker 1: Welcome back to another episode of Cutting the Distance podcast.
Speaker 1: I'm your host to day, Dirk Durham, and I've got
Speaker 1: a really special friend with me today Bradley Damn Rman
Speaker 1: here and Bradley messaged me on Instagram a few years
Speaker 1: ago and said, hey, would you like to go mountain
Speaker 1: lion hunting? And I said, boy would I. So we
Speaker 1: put together a plan and we come up here in
Speaker 1: the dead of winter and went cat hunting. And if
Speaker 1: you guys haven't watched it, it's on the Phelps YouTube channel.
Speaker 1: The thumbnails a picture of me holding the big old
Speaker 1: mountain lion. We had a heck of a time with
Speaker 1: Jason Katz with dogs, and I've always said if you
Speaker 1: can spend five or ten days in the mountains with
Speaker 1: somebody and still like them at the end of that
Speaker 1: five or ten days, then that's a pretty special person.
Speaker 1: Immediately I found that with Bradley. He was easy to
Speaker 1: be around. He is like we were old friends. He
Speaker 1: owns and operates a guiding business called Idaho Whitetail Guides,
Speaker 1: which is kind of a misnomer for the business because
Speaker 1: he runs a lot of mountain lion hunts. It runs
Speaker 1: a lot of bear hunts lots of elk hunts and
Speaker 1: deer hunts too, and maybe deer hunting would be maybe
Speaker 1: not even your biggest draw. Really, Probably some of your
Speaker 1: other stuff is a bigger draw, wouldn't you say?
Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure, I would say elk probably the biggest one.
Speaker 2: It was. I had purchased the business and the name
Speaker 2: was Idaho Whitetael Guides, and then I had a lot
Speaker 2: of things added, you know, elk and bear and everything
Speaker 2: added throughout the years, and I just didn't go through
Speaker 2: the name change. I just kept it the same. But
Speaker 2: it's worked out.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, you us stay real busy ever fall.
Speaker 1: But anyway, thanks for coming on today. As i've I
Speaker 1: get to know Bradley a little bit more, I've known
Speaker 1: him and I know a lot of the same people
Speaker 1: you know through you know, it's a small world, and
Speaker 1: it seems like every time we get to talk and
Speaker 1: we know all these different people. And one thing I've
Speaker 1: always I've always heard about Bradley is what an elk
Speaker 1: hunting machine he is. And unfortunately he don't get to
Speaker 1: hunt much for himself, but he had an elk hunt
Speaker 1: here a couple of years ago, two falls ago. You
Speaker 1: finally were able to get out for yourself. You normally
Speaker 1: guiding clients, you had an opportunity to go with your
Speaker 1: your father in law, and you guys went out and
Speaker 1: chased some big bulls around and you got a just
Speaker 1: a dandy, just a giant, an Idaho giant.
Speaker 2: Yes, yes, that was well needed. Yeah, I really enjoy watching,
Speaker 2: you know, whether it's a first timer, you know, kill
Speaker 2: his first elk, you know, it's really fun. But every
Speaker 2: once in a while, you know, I got to get
Speaker 2: out there and do a little hunting for myself. And
Speaker 2: that was a good opportunity to spend time with my
Speaker 2: father in law. And heck, we're still talking even, you know,
Speaker 2: after that long.
Speaker 1: Back to if you can spend some time in the
Speaker 1: mountains with somebody and still like him.
Speaker 2: Yes, exactly, and we're still getting along. So that's good.
Speaker 2: That's good. No, that was a fun hunt and one
Speaker 2: on one I'll never forget for sure. Yeah, And luckily
Speaker 2: I would have probably killed just about any bowl. You know,
Speaker 2: I wasn't gonna be picky. I didn't have a lot
Speaker 2: of time, but I was fortunate enough to get a
Speaker 2: really nice public ground bowl.
Speaker 1: So yeah, and you guys kind of videoed that and
Speaker 1: it's on outdoor of the Core YouTube channel.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, you can watch it there. And I used
Speaker 2: kind of a go pro in my cell phone, so
Speaker 2: it ain't it ain't no dirt DRM video or anything
Speaker 2: of it. Yeah, it still gets the point out there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, it was. That was good. I enjoyed watching it.
Speaker 1: You know what a lot of people don't know about
Speaker 1: Bradley is, Well, I'll tell you this right now. He's
Speaker 1: not ever gonna brag about himself, so I'm gonna brag
Speaker 1: abou him a little bit. He's the real deal. He's
Speaker 1: grown up right here in the heart of Elk Deer
Speaker 1: Bear Mountain, Lion country. Like we're at his place right now,
Speaker 1: and it's it's absolutely beautiful here. And he grew up
Speaker 1: in the same house that he lives in. He went
Speaker 1: right out his back door as a kid, you know,
Speaker 1: with grandpa, with his dad, chasing chasing hound dogs for
Speaker 1: bears and cats. And how old were you when you
Speaker 1: first when you went out on your own and got
Speaker 1: your first bear with dogs.
Speaker 2: I'll start with the lion hunt, just because I can
Speaker 2: remember that one. That okay, but the best I was
Speaker 2: about ten or eleven and my dad was working and
Speaker 2: we got two inches of fresh snow, and I begged
Speaker 2: my mom, you know, my poor mom. You know, I
Speaker 2: had this old yellow Yamaha three wheeler that got gave
Speaker 2: to me, you know, and I had I actually built
Speaker 2: a platform on the back of it to haul two dogs.
Speaker 2: Believe it or not, a three wheeler that sounds safe.
Speaker 2: Huh yeah, yeah, definitely definitely no helmets or anything like.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Anyways, I begged mom, you know, to take the dogs out.
Speaker 2: So I actually didn't load him up. Then I just
Speaker 2: jumped on the four wheeler and I drove up the
Speaker 2: canyon here, up the drainage here by my house, and
Speaker 2: found a lion track and I knew it was fresh
Speaker 2: because the snow, you know, it snowed in the middle
Speaker 2: of the night. And so I come back and I
Speaker 2: got these two plot dogs that I had out here
Speaker 2: that you know, we're basically my dad's, but I kind
Speaker 2: of claimed them as mine, you know, but my dad
Speaker 2: trained them and stuff. Baron Jack were the two dogs
Speaker 2: I grabbed and I went out there. I drove out
Speaker 2: there and this this three wheeler I got so real, peach,
Speaker 2: you know, I mean, I had this the throttle on it,
Speaker 2: you know, it broke, so I had to I just
Speaker 2: had to wire tied to a piece of stick, you know,
Speaker 2: and I was kind of pulling nut stick and driving.
Speaker 2: I had the two plot dogs on the back and anyways,
Speaker 2: and I know my mom was just worried to death
Speaker 2: about me. You know, it's cold and everything else. But anyways,
Speaker 2: I got out there and uh put them on the
Speaker 2: track and they they went right out of hearing, you know, barking,
Speaker 2: and I was a little new nervious. You know, back
Speaker 2: then we don't have we didn't have near the logging
Speaker 2: roads and stuff like we do now, you know. So
Speaker 2: so I started going on foot, you know, behind the
Speaker 2: dog tracks. I couldn't hear them anymore. And anyways, walk
Speaker 2: quite a ways and there was my first you know,
Speaker 2: I'd been to Lyon Trees with my dad and grandpa,
Speaker 2: like you said, but there I had my first lion
Speaker 2: treed by myself, with with my two dogs, my dad's dogs,
Speaker 2: whatever you want to say. I had it treed there.
Speaker 2: And I'll never forget that because that was a real
Speaker 2: special moment for me as a hound guy, you know.
Speaker 2: And I thought to my my first thoughts was nobody's
Speaker 2: gonna believe me, you know. So I went back and
Speaker 2: got my mom and she bundled up. I just left
Speaker 2: the dogs. You know, we didn't have wolves to worry
Speaker 2: about that anither, you know, there wasn't wolves around here.
Speaker 2: So I just left the dog's tree and on the
Speaker 2: cat come back and drove all the way back here
Speaker 2: and got my mom and loaded her up, and I'm like, Mom,
Speaker 2: you gotta walk in. Nobody's gonna believe me. I got
Speaker 2: one tree and I hauled my poor mom. I'm all
Speaker 2: the way in there. So I had proof that I
Speaker 2: actually caught one, So that's awesome.
Speaker 1: And then mom.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and where I grew up, you know, my dad,
Speaker 2: he was pretty he's a lot. I'm nervous wreck, you know,
Speaker 2: with my kids out there on four wheelers and pickups
Speaker 2: and everything. But I actually was driving a pick up
Speaker 2: up the canyon here a way earlier, and I should
Speaker 2: have before I had the driver's license. Oh yeah, So
Speaker 2: I had. I had the hounds out and and hunt
Speaker 2: hunted a lot at a really young age. You know.
Speaker 2: I hunted with my dad and grandpa. But if if
Speaker 2: they weren't going, I my dad was fine with me
Speaker 2: loading them up and going. And hounds are definitely a
Speaker 2: big passion of mine. I mean, I'm glad to have them,
Speaker 2: and it's it's a lot of fun and it's necessary.
Speaker 2: It's a good way to you know, manage the predators too.
Speaker 2: And I'm not a big killer. I let a lot
Speaker 2: of stuff go, you know, but I do manage him.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 2: It's a good managing tool. And yeah, hounds are important.
Speaker 1: Yeah. How many how many days a year do you
Speaker 1: hunt your dogs?
Speaker 2: Oh? Man, I at least at least one hundred and fifty,
Speaker 2: probably pushing you know, one hundred and eighty, closer to
Speaker 2: two hundred days, depend on the year, depending on the year.
Speaker 2: But you know, I hunt. You know, I'll start hunting
Speaker 2: here at the end of the November here and I'll
Speaker 2: be hunting clear till March. You know, I'll go to
Speaker 2: a show or two, but other than that, I'll be
Speaker 2: hunting every day pretty much. And then you know, we
Speaker 2: have a I do every once in a while in
Speaker 2: false the fall season. Even last fall, I I bear hunted.
Speaker 2: We have a good fall September season here. But that's
Speaker 2: always been a tough one for me because you got
Speaker 2: bugle and bulls or listening to the hounds. But I
Speaker 2: try to do both, you know, all all hunt a
Speaker 2: week or so sometimes if I'm lucky and September, you know,
Speaker 2: if the bugle is slow or something and one of
Speaker 2: my clients want to go on a bear hunt or something,
Speaker 2: I'll do that. And then but and then in the
Speaker 2: spring and summer, you know, I'm hunting. I'm hunting from
Speaker 2: around April fifteenth or May first, somewhere right in there,
Speaker 2: you know, depending on what unit's open. I'm clear till
Speaker 2: the end of July.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So and I mean I don't miss too many days.
Speaker 2: Yeah in between so yeah, well they rack up pretty fast.
Speaker 1: Yeah right, and your dogs show it. I mean they
Speaker 1: get hunted a lot. They're they're just they're they're in
Speaker 1: good shape. They know what to do. I had the
Speaker 1: pleasure to go and cat hunt with you, and then
Speaker 1: Phelps came out and we went bear hunting that time,
Speaker 1: and I really wanted Jason to get to shoot the bear,
Speaker 1: and the bear kept running over into into area the
Speaker 1: he couldn't hunt because he was a non resident, but
Speaker 1: I could since I was a resident because of licensing
Speaker 1: and stuff hound hunting licensing. But anyway, that was funny
Speaker 1: because you know, yeah, Jason and I'm like, I'm I
Speaker 1: hope you get the bear, but in the end I
Speaker 1: got the bear. Yeah, so you got the red star. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that was pretty fun.
Speaker 2: That was fun. I enjoyed meeting Jason and hunting with
Speaker 2: him as well. And you guys are a lot of
Speaker 2: fun fun to be around just at camp even Yep.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we we even videoed that one, So if you
Speaker 1: guys check out the Phelps YouTube channel, that one's on
Speaker 1: there too. But the real reason I brought Bradley on
Speaker 1: today is I wanted to kind of go over some
Speaker 1: some common mistakes made by elk hunters. Every year, he
Speaker 1: has a lot of folks he brings hunting. Every year,
Speaker 1: he sees a lot of people come through the door.
Speaker 1: He's been he's been guiding a lot of years, and
Speaker 1: you know, some of the things that people could do
Speaker 1: to help their success maybe before they get here and
Speaker 1: while they're here on hunting, whether whether you're on a
Speaker 1: guided hunter, a di y, I mean, this is all
Speaker 1: applicable stuff. So I kind of I thought, you know,
Speaker 1: I always have my ideas of mistakes people make, but
Speaker 1: that's usually I'm like looking inward at my own mistakes.
Speaker 1: So as as someone that's taken lots of people hunting
Speaker 1: every year, you probably see a few things that like
Speaker 1: people that may not think about before they ever come hunting.
Speaker 1: And it'd be really good for our listeners to hear
Speaker 1: those those problems and and and mistakes and maybe find
Speaker 1: a way to avoid those before they come hunting.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, for sure, that's important stuff. And I think
Speaker 2: UH the most common probably the number one thing it
Speaker 2: seems obvious on an elk cut, you know, And this
Speaker 2: definitely depends on the hunt you're going on. But we're
Speaker 2: talking elk here is UH is being in shape. You know,
Speaker 2: I take a lot of and I and I'm careful
Speaker 2: when I say that because I do take a lot
Speaker 2: of older people and stuff and so so you don't
Speaker 2: have to be a elk shape guy, you know, I
Speaker 2: mean one hundred percent, you know, But any kind of
Speaker 2: exercise that you can do, you know, talk to your
Speaker 2: outfitter that you choose, you know, kind of figure out
Speaker 2: you know what kind of walk it, how many miles
Speaker 2: a day and try to every day just walk it
Speaker 2: at home, you know, for a couple of months before
Speaker 2: your hunt. Any little bit helps helps up your odds
Speaker 2: and helps us as a guide, you know, because we
Speaker 2: can only go where you can go. And so that's
Speaker 2: probably the number one thing that I see is just
Speaker 2: people man, I should I should have exercised more, right, Yeah,
Speaker 2: I should have been a little more prepared physically for
Speaker 2: this hunt. I see that a lot, So it'd be
Speaker 2: number one.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I talked about this before on another podcast earlier
Speaker 1: this year about getting ready for elk season and stuff.
Speaker 1: And you know, no matter what your physical condition is,
Speaker 1: when you art getting in shape, like you know, you
Speaker 1: can do it, like maybe maybe get do an exercise
Speaker 1: for you is walking around the block at home once
Speaker 1: a day because you have a sedentary job, or maybe
Speaker 1: you just you don't get out much, and you know,
Speaker 1: you got to start somewhere, right, If you can walk
Speaker 1: around the block every day for a month and then
Speaker 1: make it two blocks three months, you know, you just
Speaker 1: build upon that. By the time it's time to go
Speaker 1: up hunting, you're gonna have You're gonna feel better than
Speaker 1: just going from a sedentary you know, maybe a desk
Speaker 1: job or something to immediately jumping into the mountains, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe hiking roads and trails and off road or off
Speaker 1: trailing through some steep stuff, you know, And I always said, too,
Speaker 1: put put a backpack on, because you're probably gonna, you know,
Speaker 1: be wearing a backpack with you, you know, and man,
Speaker 1: your your old shoulders in your back. If you're not
Speaker 1: used to carrying a backpack around, your shoulders and back
Speaker 1: kind of can get sore after day one and by
Speaker 1: the time the end of the hunt comes around, you're
Speaker 1: about into shape. Carrying a backpack seems like for me
Speaker 1: it is at least, But if I can, if I
Speaker 1: can start carrying backpack a month before season as I'm
Speaker 1: walking and doing my other exercise, you know, put a
Speaker 1: little bit of weight in itto it. And if you're
Speaker 1: doing this for a two month spread, by the time
Speaker 1: elk season comes, maybe have forty pounds in your pack.
Speaker 1: And that way, when you get out here in the mountains,
Speaker 1: whether you're on a guided hunter of DIY, you know,
Speaker 1: your back and your shoulders feel pretty good. You're not
Speaker 1: going to be like, ah, this is I'm sore every
Speaker 1: morning when I get up and I put my pack on,
Speaker 1: and it's difficult. Now your mind's off task. Your mind's
Speaker 1: thinking about your aching back or your legs that are
Speaker 1: they're sore instead of thinking about elk hunting.
Speaker 2: Yes, you nailed it there, so yeah, definitely use it
Speaker 2: as an extentive to get in shape. You know, I'm
Speaker 2: going on this hunting trip.
Speaker 3: Man.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you don't have to be an elite elite athlete,
Speaker 1: which is awesome if you can get that way, but
Speaker 1: you know, getting better shape than you were before, and
Speaker 1: you know it'll help absolutely.
Speaker 2: Yeah, just any little bit helps. Like I said, any
Speaker 2: little bit so very important that you take that serious.
Speaker 2: But and then I would say something that seems obvious,
Speaker 2: but I bump into it a lot. Is people show
Speaker 2: up here with their brand new boots still in the box. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I've ran out of band aids putting it on blisters.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, guys, break your boots in. And I know
Speaker 2: this is most people probably do know this, but I
Speaker 2: see it a lot, again on depending on the hunt
Speaker 2: you're on. If you're if you're going on a white
Speaker 2: tail hunt somewhere and you're going to be setting in
Speaker 2: a blind or a stand, you know, well, you you're
Speaker 2: probably not doing a lot of walking, so you know
Speaker 2: you could probably bring your boots brand new.
Speaker 1: Men, but.
Speaker 2: Put those boots on, break them in. However, you'd want
Speaker 2: to wear them a lot, you know before where you
Speaker 2: come on a hunt very important because you you don't
Speaker 2: want to go, you know, hunt the first day and
Speaker 2: then be kind of lamed up and sore and just
Speaker 2: kind of miserable the rest of the trip, you know,
Speaker 2: and and a lot of the places you might be
Speaker 2: going with an outfit or you know, there might not
Speaker 2: be a store real handy to go get a different pair,
Speaker 2: try a different pair or whatever. So make sure they're
Speaker 2: gonna work for your feet. And that's uh, I just
Speaker 2: you it's just amazing how much I see that, you know, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and yeah, and try to incorporate that in your
Speaker 1: exercise rou team. So yep, you know, two months before
Speaker 1: the hunt, you know, start breaking those boots in. You know,
Speaker 1: wear them every day on your hike, wear them around town,
Speaker 1: wear them shop, and wear them to work whatever where
Speaker 1: I'm doing chores in the yard, maybe mowing your lawn
Speaker 1: or whatever. But yeah, a blister, it's so funny to me,
Speaker 1: Like a blister, It's such a little thing. It's a
Speaker 1: little part of your body, but it can just wreck
Speaker 1: your day. You can wreck your hunt by having that
Speaker 1: painful blister. Back there. It's like it'll stop you if
Speaker 1: they get really bad, they'll stop you in your tracks
Speaker 1: and you may have to take a couple of days
Speaker 1: off to try to heal up before he could walk anymore.
Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. Yeah, I've seen people just not go out. Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, it's crippled. They've paid for a hunt and
Speaker 2: they're just like, I'm not I'm gonna hold back my
Speaker 2: feet or sore. I'm kind of miserable, you know. And
Speaker 2: I'll usually adjust for that, you know, as a guide,
Speaker 2: you know, I we're kind of We've got lots of
Speaker 2: places to hunt, so we're okay, well, he's pretty lamed up.
Speaker 2: We need to take him over here, maybe set him.
Speaker 2: You know, we'll work around it obviously, but you know,
Speaker 2: it's just keep him in the moment. It's gonna put
Speaker 2: a damper on your hunt.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and bring in another thing about that point,
Speaker 1: bring some I mean, Bradley said he've ran out of
Speaker 1: some band aids. But bring some of your own stuff
Speaker 1: to keep him in your pack. I like Luco tape.
Speaker 1: You can get it on Amazon. Luco tape. It's like
Speaker 1: a medical tape and this stuff, once you get it
Speaker 1: stuck on it almost won't come off. You have to
Speaker 1: like take it off, get it like soak in the
Speaker 1: bathtub to get this stuff to come off. And it's
Speaker 1: great for blisters. It's not bulky, it's real thin. It
Speaker 1: almost looks like the tape that's on a rubber or
Speaker 1: that's on a band aid. But it's like super sticky,
Speaker 1: super tough. And you'll let's say you get a blister
Speaker 1: on day one, you put you start getting a hot spot.
Speaker 1: You put that over the hot spot and the blister
Speaker 1: and get it stuck on there and that thing may
Speaker 1: be on your foot at the end of the week,
Speaker 1: like it will stay on there really good. So highly
Speaker 1: recommend that stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah I'll have to get some of that and stick
Speaker 2: in these cabins.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, hunters will be happy for it.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Okay, something else I see a lot and uh, it's
Speaker 2: not too big of an issue, but it's something to
Speaker 2: think about, in my opinion, choosing your hunting partner. Like
Speaker 2: now I'm talking about a guided hunt here. You know,
Speaker 2: so we sell two on one, we sell one on
Speaker 2: one hunts or two on one hunts, right, which a
Speaker 2: two on one is is two hunters and one guide.
Speaker 2: If you're not sure what that means. But uh, what
Speaker 2: I see a lot as a guide is I'll I'll
Speaker 2: get two buddies that'll that'll show up on a two
Speaker 2: on one hunt. One of them is in shape and
Speaker 2: one of them is not. And so kind of you know,
Speaker 2: maybe if you can, you know, pair up with somebody
Speaker 2: that's similar condition that you're in, if that makes sense,
Speaker 2: because you know, it's a two on one hunt. So
Speaker 2: I'm hunting you both. A lot of times we're walking
Speaker 2: together in the morning, you know, in the evenings and stuff.
Speaker 2: I'll set you in different spots, but cutting you know,
Speaker 2: you know, we're hiking, you know, in the timber and
Speaker 2: walking along ways, you know, and and uh, you know,
Speaker 2: one guy's like I can't go anymore, you know, and
Speaker 2: the other guy's like he's not even breaking a sweat,
Speaker 2: you know. So I ran into that issue a lot,
Speaker 2: and I and I do understand. Like on the flip
Speaker 2: side of that is, you know, I get a lot
Speaker 2: of father son things, you know, just you know where,
Speaker 2: and a lot of times on those that Dad will
Speaker 2: just go without me, take him, get him an elk,
Speaker 2: you know. But it's something to think about, you know,
Speaker 2: or least be aware of it. You know that your
Speaker 2: partner could slow you down on the guid to two
Speaker 2: on one hunt.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so I see it. Like another thing with hunting
Speaker 1: partners is before your hunt. And I think people kind
Speaker 1: of don't do this a lot because you'll talk to
Speaker 1: I talked to a lot of folks is they don't
Speaker 1: have a real good conversation with their partners. Get let's
Speaker 1: get deep. Let's have a deep conversation with your hunting
Speaker 1: partner and find out what they're expectations of the hunt
Speaker 1: are and what are yours, because sometimes we kind of
Speaker 1: assume what the expectations of the hunt is and then
Speaker 1: when you get there, opinions or expectations collide and one
Speaker 1: person's like, yeah, dude, I just want to go hunt
Speaker 1: the mornings and come back and eat lunch and then
Speaker 1: go hunt the evenings, and one guy's like, I want
Speaker 1: to hunt all day. And if you have two different
Speaker 1: mindsets like that, that can be a clash, and that
Speaker 1: can be a big deal and you might end up
Speaker 1: hating your buddy over the deal. I mean, so you
Speaker 1: have to iron out any of those little bumps before
Speaker 1: you ever go hunting.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So.
Speaker 1: You know, maybe the kind of style you use. You know,
Speaker 1: maybe your friend he's more spot in stock, you know,
Speaker 1: a minimalist when calling. Maybe you're very heavy on calling,
Speaker 1: you want to use your calls a lot. Those two
Speaker 1: people don't usually blend well when you hunt together because
Speaker 1: one is like, geez, I wish that guy would just
Speaker 1: quit calling, shut up, quit calling so much. The other
Speaker 1: guy's like, man, why don't you blowies? Call some We
Speaker 1: need to get these call He's out going. So those
Speaker 1: two different mindsets are just really clash. So if you
Speaker 1: can iron out your all your expectations and your your
Speaker 1: thoughts of the hunt and stuff before you go, you
Speaker 1: can really kind of figure that out, and then you
Speaker 1: can explain to each other and like work that out
Speaker 1: before you ever get there, and then when you get
Speaker 1: there you know what to expect, and then you can
Speaker 1: make you know, you can make it easy for each
Speaker 1: other to have a good time.
Speaker 2: Yes, right, yeah, those are good points for sure. I've definitely, uh,
Speaker 2: I've seen I've actually seen hunting partners show up, you know,
Speaker 2: laugh and having a good time, you know, the first
Speaker 2: couple of days, and then literally at the end of
Speaker 2: the week, drive back to Pennsylvania with a complete stranger
Speaker 2: that was here this week that was close to him. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that they were the hunting partners were so mad at
Speaker 2: each other by the end of the week that they
Speaker 2: didn't even ride home back home together.
Speaker 1: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's pretty that's pretty extreme. But it's kind
Speaker 2: of what you're saying. You know, they just clash too much,
Speaker 2: you know, they one guy wanted to hunt this way,
Speaker 2: the other guy wanted to hunt this way, and by
Speaker 2: the end of the week they were just not real
Speaker 2: happy with each other. So, yes, it's very important to
Speaker 2: think that through. Yeah, yeah, or at least at least
Speaker 2: be aware of it and talk about it.
Speaker 1: Sure, stuff, and it may not be a complete deal killer.
Speaker 1: Let's say you guys are doing your DIY hunt and
Speaker 1: it turns out you want way different things out of
Speaker 1: the hunt. But that doesn't mean you can't go and
Speaker 1: camp together and enjoy each other's time in the evenings
Speaker 1: or whatever. Camp together and then say, okay, but you
Speaker 1: go this way, I'll go that way and i'll see
Speaker 1: you tonight and if I get one, or you help
Speaker 1: me pack it out. And if you get one, I'll
Speaker 1: help you pack it out. You know, there's ways it's
Speaker 1: still you know, it's not a completely deal killer. You
Speaker 1: don't have to hunt maybe with each other side to
Speaker 1: side all the whole time. But you know, there's there's
Speaker 1: solutions to like if you if you enjoy your friend
Speaker 1: or maybe it's a relative and you want to make
Speaker 1: it hat work, there's ways of making it work and
Speaker 1: still go, but not clash as much.
Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, yeah, it's definitely, it's definitely you can definitely
Speaker 2: work it around, especially on it do it yourself. You know,
Speaker 2: a two on one guided hunt. You know you're kind
Speaker 2: of stuck, but I even can work around it some yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, as in like set somebody somewhere and then
Speaker 2: you know, hunt with the hunt with the other guy,
Speaker 2: you know, on foot, and then alternate the next day.
Speaker 2: I've done that, so there there's always ways around stuff.
Speaker 2: But it's tough to think about for sure. Absolutely sure.
Speaker 2: Another thing we want to move on optics and shooting distance.
Speaker 2: That's when I first started outfitting our guidance hunts. You
Speaker 2: know that the scenery around here has changed. You know,
Speaker 2: there's more logging and stuff. You know, I hunted growing up.
Speaker 2: I hunted the timber a lot, you know, and you
Speaker 2: got a hundred yards shot and the timber was rare.
Speaker 2: You know, it just really didn't happen around here, So
Speaker 2: I didn't really shoot that, you know, that far away.
Speaker 2: You know, I'd cite my gun in for one hundred
Speaker 2: yards and go. You know, what I see a lot
Speaker 2: a guided hunt is is uh, you know, they're not
Speaker 2: from around here. A lot of times they might be
Speaker 2: from back east or where wherever they're from. And how
Speaker 2: how uh how hard it is for some of these
Speaker 2: guys to see stuff. I'll see ylk, you know, and
Speaker 2: and I can't get them to see them sometimes, you know,
Speaker 2: and I'm I'm like, you know, trying to explain as
Speaker 2: fast as I can. You know, you see that busted
Speaker 2: off snob over there on the ridge, and they're like
Speaker 2: right below it, a little bit to the right, and
Speaker 2: they just can't see it. And so what I've learned
Speaker 2: is a lot of times, you know, they'll they'll buy
Speaker 2: an expensive hunt, you know, to go on and and
Speaker 2: and be dedicated in a plane ticket or whatever, or
Speaker 2: travel all the way out here, but they'll have a
Speaker 2: forty year old pair of binoculars with them, you know.
Speaker 2: So I think optics are are really important, especially and
Speaker 2: back to what I meant by timber. You know, things
Speaker 2: change around here. We can see so much, you know,
Speaker 2: here in northern Idaho, or at least where I hunt,
Speaker 2: you can see so much further now, you know all
Speaker 2: the logging and stuff, log in and stuff. You can
Speaker 2: glass a thousand yards or two thousand yards now, So
Speaker 2: you don't want to have your chance on a guided
Speaker 2: hunt and the elk walk into the timber. And I've
Speaker 2: had it happen several times and never even laid eyes
Speaker 2: on it. And I and it's even when you're a guy.
Speaker 2: That's a horrible feeling because you think you're looking they're like, well,
Speaker 2: I never seen it. You know, they're looking at you,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, I swear there was a nice five
Speaker 2: point there, I promise, And they're kind of looking at
Speaker 2: you funny. And you're like, okay, we're walking over there.
Speaker 2: I'm showing you tracks. We're walked into the timber right right.
Speaker 2: But so I think, and I'm not saying you have
Speaker 2: to go spend a bunch of money on don't break yourself,
Speaker 2: you know, if it's in your budget, though, you know,
Speaker 2: by a decent pair of you know, ten by forty twos,
Speaker 2: even you know something something better than grandpa's old pair
Speaker 2: of binoculars.
Speaker 1: Anyways, you know, yeah, you don't want grandpa's World War
Speaker 1: two binoculars.
Speaker 2: That's right, I know.
Speaker 1: And and I can say, you know, there's some pretty
Speaker 1: decent binoculars for two three hundred bucks. I mean, they're
Speaker 1: not the best, but they're they're better than twenty years ago. Yes,
Speaker 1: two or three hundred dollars binoculars. They've come a long ways,
Speaker 1: and you know, by the best optics that you could afford.
Speaker 2: There you go for your budget.
Speaker 1: And another thing, this is off topic a little bit,
Speaker 1: but same but but but relative to binoculars, there's nothing
Speaker 1: worse than being hunting and you look up on the
Speaker 1: hill and you see another hunter and they're eyeballing you
Speaker 1: with their rifle scope. They're they're pointing their gun at
Speaker 1: you and they're looking at you with their scope because
Speaker 1: they don't have binoculars. And that's a pretty irving feeling.
Speaker 1: And I feel pretty strongly about that. That's that's kind
Speaker 1: of bs like. But binoculars, I think everybody can afford
Speaker 1: a pair of good enough that you can tell that
Speaker 1: you can scope out look through your bidos at a
Speaker 1: guy or an elk or a deer or something. There's
Speaker 1: no excuse to be throwing your rifle up and eyeballing
Speaker 1: people with your scope.
Speaker 2: So no, absolutely not. Yeah I've had that happen a
Speaker 2: lot to me too.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yes, have a pair of binoculars. Don't use your scope.
Speaker 2: Nobody wants a gun pointed at him, that's for sure. Yeah, distance,
Speaker 2: I think knowing your gun and knowing your bullets is
Speaker 2: extremely important. I don't. I see this a lot where
Speaker 2: either they brought old Grandpa's gun, you know, with a
Speaker 2: again not a very good scope, you know, and they
Speaker 2: can only shoot a hundred yards, you know. And I'm
Speaker 2: not saying I'm a big line long distance shooter, and
Speaker 2: I know some people are into that, some ain't, but
Speaker 2: at least try to be able to shoot three hundred
Speaker 2: yards in my opinion, I mean that's going to up
Speaker 2: your chances so much where I hunt anyways. Well, and
Speaker 2: another thing, I see a lot of people that will
Speaker 2: show up here with the most expensive scope you could
Speaker 2: think of, night Force whatever it might be, you know,
Speaker 2: expensive fancy scopes, a fancy gun, and me and the
Speaker 2: guys are like, hm, I want that guy, you know,
Speaker 2: won't come to find out. He's only good to about
Speaker 2: two hundred and fifty yards, He'll tell you, right, And
Speaker 2: I just I kind of shake my head at that. Well,
Speaker 2: why do you got all this expensive gear? You know?
Speaker 2: But I think a practice in like if you're from
Speaker 2: back East or somewhere, you know, I know, it's hard
Speaker 2: to find a place to shoot. I know a lot
Speaker 2: of my guys have told me, well, we don't really
Speaker 2: have a spot to shoot three hundred, you know, and
Speaker 2: so that could be a challenge. But practice further than
Speaker 2: you think you're going to shoot, know, practice shooting aways
Speaker 2: I think will up your elk hut a lot here
Speaker 2: where I'm hunting, because anymore, you know, it's we can
Speaker 2: take a four or five hundred yard shot easy anymore,
Speaker 2: you know. And if you can't shoot that far, your
Speaker 2: opportunity might walk into the brush and that might be
Speaker 2: your that might have been your only opportunity for that week.
Speaker 2: So practice practice, you know, shoot even if you're not.
Speaker 2: You know, when you're practicing, you know who cares if
Speaker 2: you miss? You know, I mean, just shoot as far
Speaker 2: as you you possibly want, you know, further than what
Speaker 2: you think you're gonna shoot on the hunt anyways, right,
Speaker 2: and then that helps.
Speaker 1: And I think if if you can't get those long ranges,
Speaker 1: if you can't get like that three hundred yard shot
Speaker 1: at your local range, or you know, maybe broaden your
Speaker 1: views a little bit, you know, search surrounding counties that like,
Speaker 1: well there's that one shooting range over here that they've
Speaker 1: got a really nice one. You they maybe they hauled
Speaker 1: some competitions at them or whatever you may be, can
Speaker 1: reach out to a thousand, but maybe before your hunt
Speaker 1: go over there, just you may have to drive for
Speaker 1: an hour to get to a place to where you
Speaker 1: can shoot a distance. Or if that's just like I've looked,
Speaker 1: I can't find nothing I would recommend, so maybe you
Speaker 1: can shoot two hundred yards one hundred yards instead of
Speaker 1: shooting a large target, make your target very small, make
Speaker 1: the aiming point very smaller your target. So instead of
Speaker 1: having a you know, a two feet by two feet
Speaker 1: big piece of paper to shoot at, maybe now we're
Speaker 1: shooting at a playing card, you know, and now you're
Speaker 1: trying to shoot the diamond on the playing card. That's
Speaker 1: your aiming point, right, and you're not just going to
Speaker 1: sit on the bench at the at the range and
Speaker 1: just shoot that like because typically when you're hunting, that's
Speaker 1: not a shooting from a shooting benches is one hundred
Speaker 1: percent never going to happen when you're on an elk
Speaker 1: hunt or any kind of a unless you're shooting out
Speaker 1: of your backyard. Right, So, shooting awkward positions, you know,
Speaker 1: stand up, lay on the ground, take a knee, you know,
Speaker 1: find yourself getting comfortable shooting those shots, getting those that
Speaker 1: muscle memory down. I don't I'm not a big bipod guy.
Speaker 1: But what I do instead of a bipod is I
Speaker 1: use my hunting pack. I've got a pretty decent sized
Speaker 1: hunting pack, and I get good at like pulling my
Speaker 1: pack off, throwing it on the ground, put getting my
Speaker 1: gun on it, laying down, finding the target, and then
Speaker 1: executing the shot. So those little things will will help
Speaker 1: you immensely. Like getting on target, it's really hard to
Speaker 1: like sometimes find the animal and the scope, especially if
Speaker 1: it's it's moving or something. And like you alluded to,
Speaker 1: it's like the hunters like, I can't see it. I
Speaker 1: can't see it, you know. I've seen this with my
Speaker 1: wife and kids. Before you get them on something, they're like,
Speaker 1: I can't see it. In the scope. I can't see
Speaker 1: in the scope. It's really tough. So just this weekend,
Speaker 1: I have my friend Lee out and he's new to
Speaker 1: deer hunting, and we did some some drills with Instead
Speaker 1: of using the rifle that he's gonna hunt with, we
Speaker 1: used a twenty two, which is a full size twenty
Speaker 1: two rifle with a full sized scope on it, and
Speaker 1: by you know, putting it up quickly, finding the target
Speaker 1: quickly in the scope and shooting and then just doing
Speaker 1: doing that from different positions, standing up, laying down, kneeling,
Speaker 1: all these different finding Maybe we did this with Lee.
Speaker 1: We we there was a tree close by. Okay, let's
Speaker 1: pretend that's the deer over there. You need to get
Speaker 1: to that tree quickly and quietly and then find the
Speaker 1: target leaning against the tree, rest your rifle on it,
Speaker 1: take the shot. And that made that That helped him
Speaker 1: a lot. He's like, Wow, I'm just I'm starting I'm
Speaker 1: starting to get it, you know, I'm starting to feel
Speaker 1: good about this. Then they have confidence in finding, finding
Speaker 1: the animal and the scope and then making that shot.
Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, because I
Speaker 2: that's a big issue you know with people just you know,
Speaker 2: a lot of a lot of my hunters will have
Speaker 2: the scope you know, turn zoomed way in, you know,
Speaker 2: and you know too, and you realize, shoot, they've got
Speaker 2: their their scope turned all the way up high power,
Speaker 2: you know, have that you know, turn turned down and
Speaker 2: then you got a little wider view to to look
Speaker 2: and find it in your scope. But yeah, just uh
Speaker 2: fiant in the scope as major. Yeah, I mean practice
Speaker 2: and that's so easy to practice. Like Dirk said, you know,
Speaker 2: you can. There's lots of things I got, you know,
Speaker 2: we got ground squirrels around here, so my kids, you know,
Speaker 2: and Amy and stuff. You know, that's you know, if
Speaker 2: you have if you you got an opportunity to hunt
Speaker 2: squirrels even you know, it's just good practice to getting
Speaker 2: your gun pulled up and getting on stuff, you know,
Speaker 2: because most of the time, as you know, they're not
Speaker 2: standing there forever, you know, so you've got to be
Speaker 2: quick and that could definitely cost you an ELK.
Speaker 1: Yeah, absofinitely, absolutely So.
Speaker 2: I was not telling your outfitter if you have any
Speaker 2: health issues. It's something I've learned on the fly.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good point.
Speaker 2: It's something you might not think of, you know, something
Speaker 2: I didn't think about when I first started. And I'll
Speaker 2: just I'll tell you what happened to me right out
Speaker 2: of the gate, you know, when I owned the business.
Speaker 2: You know, i've guided, you know since ninety nine something
Speaker 2: like that. So but I've owned the business thirteen fourteen
Speaker 2: years or whatever. But the first year or two, anyways,
Speaker 2: I had a white tail hunter out here and I
Speaker 2: said them, you know, I was setting them and pop
Speaker 2: up blinds and tree stands and stuff. I could tell
Speaker 2: right away this guy was extremely unpatient, which I don't
Speaker 2: judge because I'm not the most patient guy setting in
Speaker 2: a stand either, but he was getting a little frustrated
Speaker 2: setting the stand, not really seeing much. And this guy
Speaker 2: is probably i would say, around fifty early fifties something
Speaker 2: like that. But anyways, I told him, I said, well,
Speaker 2: I uh, why don't we, you know, go for a
Speaker 2: walk and do a little spot and stock and I'll
Speaker 2: bring my rattling horns and grunt tube and we'll see
Speaker 2: if we can maybe rattle one in or just catch
Speaker 2: one out there. You know, he was losing patience. So anyways,
Speaker 2: I drove out somewhere and we started hiking, you know,
Speaker 2: and setting up and rattling and grunt calling and not
Speaker 2: having any luck. So we just kept getting a little
Speaker 2: further further away, you know, and I just kept, you know, hunting.
Speaker 2: I didn't have no reason to be back right away.
Speaker 2: And we were walking through the timber there and he
Speaker 2: tapped me on the back of the shoulder and he says, Brad,
Speaker 2: and I could just see. I just looked at this
Speaker 2: guy's face, and I mean, he just not look right.
Speaker 2: He looks sick. And he says, I need you to
Speaker 2: go back to the pickup and get my back pack.
Speaker 2: I'm diabetic and I'm about to have a blackout.
Speaker 1: Oh my god.
Speaker 2: Well I'm you know, I don't even really know what
Speaker 2: that means at this point. And he's like, I need
Speaker 2: you to hurry. I said, the pickup's like two and
Speaker 2: a half miles away. He says, Brad, I need you
Speaker 2: to get my backpack immediately. And I ran. I about
Speaker 2: killed myself getting back to the truck, yeah, and getting
Speaker 2: this guy's backpack for him and getting getting back getting
Speaker 2: getting it back out. Luckily for this guy, I got,
Speaker 2: I got his backpack out, and I can't remember he
Speaker 2: had some medicine or a candy bar or something whatever
Speaker 2: to help his diabetic. But he told me, you know,
Speaker 2: I've been a diabetic for like thirty five years, and
Speaker 2: he said that was the closest I ever was to
Speaker 2: blacken out. And and I don't know, I don't understand
Speaker 2: the diabetic real well, but what he told me was
Speaker 2: a blackout is you pass out and you never wake
Speaker 2: up if you're a diabat diabetic. So I was like
Speaker 2: extremely close call, Like I was an eye opener for me.
Speaker 2: Another story is anybody that's hunted in September, at least
Speaker 2: around where I'm at Northern in Idaho, the bees can
Speaker 2: be mean. I've I've had guys out there that were
Speaker 2: allergic to bees and get stung and never had their
Speaker 2: Like I said, this is early on in my guidance career.
Speaker 2: You know this stuff I've learned. They never had their
Speaker 2: insulin shot or whatever EpiPen. Sorry, yeah, and with them,
Speaker 2: you know, well that's a big problem. You know, we're
Speaker 2: we're out here a ways. You know, we're we're not
Speaker 2: getting back to the truck anytime soon, even if we're running,
Speaker 2: you know. And I've had some close calls like that
Speaker 2: where people it was pretty scary, so very important I mean,
Speaker 2: if you're not comfortable, you know a lot of times,
Speaker 2: well you know, there'll be five or six clients in
Speaker 2: a week and we're kind of all talking at night.
Speaker 2: And if you're not comfortable blurting that out your health
Speaker 2: issues in front of everybody at camp when you know
Speaker 2: you're there the first night, just just pull your outfitter
Speaker 2: aside and tell him, hey, you know, just so you
Speaker 2: know what, you know, I've got a bad heart or
Speaker 2: you know, I'm allergic to this, and make sure you
Speaker 2: know you know that guy, you know, I don't think
Speaker 2: you know, back to the to the deer hunt. I
Speaker 2: don't think he realized we were going to walk that far,
Speaker 2: and I never really told him, so that was maybe
Speaker 2: kind of my fault, and he knew better. He told
Speaker 2: me he should have had that stuff with him, right,
Speaker 2: but in his mind, we were just going to walk
Speaker 2: out there one hundred yards and sure and come back
Speaker 2: to the truck. So, you know, you can't leave it
Speaker 2: all on your outfitter. If you if you know you
Speaker 2: need that EpiPen or whatever it might be, make sure
Speaker 2: you have it with you and your guide or your
Speaker 2: outfitter is aware of it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's it. It's a really good point. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I would never think of that, but I don't have
Speaker 1: any life threatening issues right now, but I could see
Speaker 1: where that'd be really a big problem.
Speaker 2: Yes, it is, for sure. It's yeah, we take that
Speaker 2: pretty serious. And I go over all that, you know,
Speaker 2: with everybody the night they go up, just because, like
Speaker 2: I said, I've learned this through through the years of guiding.
Speaker 2: But definitely definitely let your outfit or know or if
Speaker 2: you're doing it yourself, you know, make sure you have
Speaker 2: all the stuff you might need. Another thing, I see now,
Speaker 2: now this is a this don't I wouldn't say that
Speaker 2: it's every hunt. Well obviously it's not every hunt, but
Speaker 2: if I see it more on my on, like my
Speaker 2: mountain lion hunts are even like a an archery l
Speaker 2: hunt that I'm going to the back hunt and hunting
Speaker 2: pretty hard and maybe even possibly staying a night out
Speaker 2: there too. You know, if you if you've if you've
Speaker 2: dreamed of going on an l count for our ten
Speaker 2: years or whatever, and it's been something your bucket list, deal,
Speaker 2: don't wait too long on pulling the trigger on that
Speaker 2: I've guided. I don't know how many older guys that
Speaker 2: they did their best, and God bless them, you know,
Speaker 2: they they they finally got to a point in their
Speaker 2: life where they could afford it. I guess, you know,
Speaker 2: and show up and go on a hunt. But I
Speaker 2: don't know how many times I've heard these words. I
Speaker 2: should have done this twenty years ago. Man, I'm mad
Speaker 2: at myself. Yeah, why didn't I do this twenty years ago?
Speaker 2: So if it's something you we only live once, right,
Speaker 2: you know, And if it's something you got, and I
Speaker 2: know for like me and my business, I can't speak
Speaker 2: for other outfitters, but like my wife, if it's you know,
Speaker 2: but this might be a do it yourself and you
Speaker 2: just figure it out. But like if you going with
Speaker 2: an outfitter, I know, like Amy's set up, especially with
Speaker 2: some of the younger people you know that have kids
Speaker 2: and a family, and we know how expensive it is
Speaker 2: to to live nowadays. But well, she'll set up payment
Speaker 2: deals for him. It might be a two year deal
Speaker 2: right where they're making payments to pay for the hunt slowly,
Speaker 2: but figure out something if it's on your mind. Don't
Speaker 2: wait too long because time fly is man and we're
Speaker 2: not going to have our youth forever. Yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure, we're not. We're not getting any younger
Speaker 1: every year or so. No. Yeah, that's a good point.
Speaker 2: I think if you if you book with an outfitter,
Speaker 2: you know, and you think you got a good, good
Speaker 2: outfit that you're going with, and you're something bugged you.
Speaker 2: You know, you're there for a week, something bugged you,
Speaker 2: something made you mad. Either the guy you know, maybe
Speaker 2: he wasn't working hard enough, or the outfitter said something
Speaker 2: to make make you mad, or the conditions where you
Speaker 2: were sleeping, whatever it might be, weren't that good eight
Speaker 2: you know. And and this is easy for me to
Speaker 2: say because I'm the outfitter, but I think I highly
Speaker 2: suggest you just go to the outfitter and with your
Speaker 2: issue immediately, immediately and set down. And I know, for
Speaker 2: me and my business, and I still do this. I'll
Speaker 2: have a group of guys in in for the week
Speaker 2: and and hunt them and I'll ask them at the
Speaker 2: end of the week, you know, is there anything that
Speaker 2: I could have done different or or maybe you know,
Speaker 2: put in the cabins or or had you know, different meals,
Speaker 2: or is there anything you can think of I could
Speaker 2: have did different. I'd love to hear it, you know,
Speaker 2: and we appreciate that. You know. So you might have
Speaker 2: an issue that made you mad, But I think going
Speaker 2: to the outfitter and talking to them, they're more like
Speaker 2: more likely. I know, I am. I'm going to try
Speaker 2: to make it right. You know, this is our reputation
Speaker 2: on the line. I want to I want to make
Speaker 2: it right and whatever that might take all I know,
Speaker 2: I'll work with you if you come to me. I
Speaker 2: just don't I don't really think. I really don't. I
Speaker 2: don't really like the guy that you know goes and
Speaker 2: just complains to other people. Right, Oh, this was horrible,
Speaker 2: and this was this, and that might be. I mean,
Speaker 2: I've heard horror stories. But I think if you have
Speaker 2: an issue, it's important to let your guide know because
Speaker 2: then they can work on it and maybe make a
Speaker 2: better hunt for the next guy's coming.
Speaker 1: Sure. Yeah, Like, for instance, let's say the hot water
Speaker 1: tank wasn't working and you just don't know. You don't
Speaker 1: stay in the cabin. You gotta let them know. You
Speaker 1: don't want to sit there all week with cold showers, right,
Speaker 1: and then be mad that you had cold showers. They'd
Speaker 1: be like, the dang hot water tank wasn't working or
Speaker 1: the mattress was lumpy or something. You know, if there's
Speaker 1: something bugging you, like gee whizz, they don't have decaf
Speaker 1: coffee or some little things. Some little things go a
Speaker 1: long way with people. You know, they they're not happy
Speaker 1: with it. And if you mentioned it in early and say, hey,
Speaker 1: do you think we could get some decaff or do
Speaker 1: you think we could get a different mattress? I can't
Speaker 1: sleep a wink. I'm sure you jump through a hoop
Speaker 1: to oh you didn't know. Let's fix that thing up
Speaker 1: and get you going right. Yeah, definitely. You want people
Speaker 1: to be comfortable, Yeah, you.
Speaker 2: Know, we want want you to be comfortable and want
Speaker 2: you to have a good time. So yes, please let
Speaker 2: let them know, you know. Yeah, if they don't know,
Speaker 2: they don't know.
Speaker 1: Or if it's your hunting partner. Let's say you're doing
Speaker 1: a DIY and you're hunting partner's doing something that's really
Speaker 1: great and non you don't stew on it all week,
Speaker 1: just say hey, man, can we have a talk. Say hey,
Speaker 1: you're picking your nose all the time, really bugging me.
Speaker 2: Whatever it is, right, whatever it is, make it too
Speaker 2: much noise.
Speaker 1: You're making too much noise. You can pick up your feet,
Speaker 1: you know, and if you do it with in a
Speaker 1: diplomatic way is to act like a hot head or something.
Speaker 1: Usually the other person's like, oh wow, they didn't know,
Speaker 1: and be happy to you know, work on it, and
Speaker 1: that way everybody's happy. And sometimes, you know, the person
Speaker 1: maybe this complaining should then say was there anything I'm
Speaker 1: doing this bugging you? And they may say, well, now
Speaker 1: that you bring it up, snore like a freaking grizzly bear. Okay,
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I'll try to work on that.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember sleeping in a wall tent with you
Speaker 2: want tell Yeah it was kind of loud.
Speaker 1: Yeah, dang it, Sorry about that.
Speaker 2: I'm sorry about I've held a grudge every since.
Speaker 1: That's surprise you'll talk to me.
Speaker 2: No, But those are definitely good things to go over,
Speaker 2: you know. I mean, you book a hunt with somebody,
Speaker 2: These are things that you don't really think about until
Speaker 2: you're there, you know. So they're small things, but they
Speaker 2: add up, don't they for sure? Okay? Another thing I
Speaker 2: see hunters making a mistake, which is might sound kind
Speaker 2: of weird. And this all depends on the hunt you're
Speaker 2: going on, obviously, as I see hunters with too much
Speaker 2: gear believe it or not. Oh yeah, yeah, it's just
Speaker 2: completely like, what the heck we got going here? I
Speaker 2: don't have room in my pickup for this time right right.
Speaker 2: Which you know most outfitters, I think almost probably all
Speaker 2: of them and I know I do, is we have
Speaker 2: a gear list. You know, we have a gear list.
Speaker 2: This is what you have to have. So if you
Speaker 2: book with an outfitter, make sure you get a gear list,
Speaker 2: and you know, and then I might recommend some stuff
Speaker 2: that you can bring or you don't have to, you know,
Speaker 2: you know, just the basics. But and a lot of
Speaker 2: it depends you know where you're going obviously, you know
Speaker 2: if you're walking or camping or hiking in But my
Speaker 2: style of hunt, you know where I hunt. You know,
Speaker 2: a lot of times we hunt for two three hours
Speaker 2: in the morning and then stuff kind of dies down,
Speaker 2: then we kind of take a break. So what I
Speaker 2: see a lot of these hunters they show up with
Speaker 2: a fifty pound backpack loaded. I'm thinking, man, if we
Speaker 2: have to put a quarter on that thing, I'm really
Speaker 2: going to be heavy. But yeah, they've got more gear
Speaker 2: and then they're in there than they'll ever use. And
Speaker 2: then by the end of the week they're we're hunting,
Speaker 2: and they're all that stuff staying in the pickup and
Speaker 2: they realize they didn't even need it. They brought it
Speaker 2: and it just set in the cabin or whatever, and
Speaker 2: they've lightened up a lot. Yeah, because you know, that's
Speaker 2: another thing that that's going to wear you down, is
Speaker 2: just having too much stuff on you. And nowadays, you know,
Speaker 2: it's kind of normal. You know, even me. It's like
Speaker 2: I remember when I used to you know, grab a
Speaker 2: pocket knife, two extra bullets, and a gun and go,
Speaker 2: you know, pretty much. And now it's range finders and
Speaker 2: radios and cell phones and all this stuff. You know,
Speaker 2: it just adds up. Ye have the right gear, but
Speaker 2: don't have too much of it for the hunt you're
Speaker 2: going on. You just spend a lot of time researching
Speaker 2: and asking a lot of questions and figuring out what
Speaker 2: you're going to need. Do I really need this? Probably not.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna leave it, you know, but I see that
Speaker 2: a lot where guys are just way over overpacked.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a good good point.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Oh, shooting sticks. So this is something I just
Speaker 2: thought i'd i'd bring up. So there there are say
Speaker 2: there's three or four guys, four or five guides, whatever
Speaker 2: I have here for the week. Honestly, it really I
Speaker 2: like shooting sticks. I think I think they're important because
Speaker 2: I see a lot of missus as a guide shooting
Speaker 2: miss But I definitely have better luck with shooting sticks.
Speaker 2: But having the right shooting sticks are important to you know,
Speaker 2: if you're going to be setting somewhere and a pop
Speaker 2: up blind or whatever, you know, you might you know,
Speaker 2: choose your shooting stick a little different. I like ones
Speaker 2: that are adjustable, quick, you know, pull the trigger and
Speaker 2: just for the spot and stock, you know, like trigger sticks. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I like those the best for the style of Elkhun
Speaker 2: I do with the rifle. But then I have a
Speaker 2: couple of guides that you know, they'll look at my
Speaker 2: clients and say, break those things in half and throw
Speaker 2: them over the bank because it's actually cost them, you know,
Speaker 2: they're fiddling around with their shooting stick, you know, and
Speaker 2: and and cost them milk. But I'm a firm I'm
Speaker 2: a firm believer in shooting sticks, but they need to
Speaker 2: be quick, you know, on the style elk kind I do.
Speaker 2: Like a lot of times I'll pack the trigger sticks
Speaker 2: for the hunter. Oh and it works out good because
Speaker 2: I'll use it, you know, rest my binoculars on or
Speaker 2: something when i'm yeah, kind of spotting stuff, and then
Speaker 2: if I see something, I can throw it out in
Speaker 2: front of the client real quick and get their gun
Speaker 2: on it. But shooting sticks and the right ones are
Speaker 2: important for sure.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. I always kind of go back and forth,
Speaker 1: like should I get some because my buddy Lee this
Speaker 1: week he's knew a deer hunting, and like, should I
Speaker 1: get some of the shooting sticks for him?
Speaker 2: And should I not?
Speaker 1: And like you say, they're kind of a pain in
Speaker 1: the butt to carry, And I'm thinking I'm gonna get some.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna think I'm gonna get some. Yeah, I think
Speaker 1: you'll like they're good. Yeah, yeah, I might even like
Speaker 1: him for.
Speaker 2: Me, right, And again it goes back to having too
Speaker 2: much gear? How much stuff do you want to be
Speaker 2: fiddling around with too? But one man, Yeah, I know
Speaker 2: I like the Actually for some of my heavier guns,
Speaker 2: I like to arrest them if I can, you know,
Speaker 2: And uh, you know there's different kinds you can go
Speaker 2: with and practice with them. Yeah, you know. I get
Speaker 2: guys here that we go out the first day of
Speaker 2: their hunt and we see something they can't even figure
Speaker 2: out how to unfold their shooting sticks or whatever they
Speaker 2: got right, and so kind of maybe something else you
Speaker 2: could maybe kind of practice with is getting those up
Speaker 2: quick and it's all time, right, I mean, we got
Speaker 2: sometimes you just don't have a lot of it on
Speaker 2: the hunting, so you don't want it to like like
Speaker 2: one of my guides, Travis always says it it's cost
Speaker 2: me more ILK than messing around with their shooting sticks,
Speaker 2: you know.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: But anyways, something to think about.
Speaker 1: If people are looking to book with an outfitter, I
Speaker 1: thought I should ask you, so, what kind of questions
Speaker 1: should you ask an outfitter before you put your money down?
Speaker 1: So I feel like there's probably some questions you need
Speaker 1: to ask. You maybe need to do some checking. What
Speaker 1: do you what do you what do you recommend when
Speaker 1: you're vetting an outfitter?
Speaker 2: Yes, that's the very important ask a lot of questions
Speaker 2: first of all. And don't be scared to If say
Speaker 2: you're at a trading show or something you've walked around
Speaker 2: and kind of looked at, don't be scared to ask questions.
Speaker 2: Don't be nervous. Just start somewhere, walk up to an
Speaker 2: outfitter and start somewhere. Just ask them questions. We're not
Speaker 2: gonna judge anybody, or at least I'm I know, I'm
Speaker 2: not on any questions they asked. Just just get the
Speaker 2: conversation rolling. It'll go into place. But it might not
Speaker 2: be the first question I asked if I go up
Speaker 2: to somebody's an outfitter's booth or something. But one thing
Speaker 2: that you're gonna gonna walk and I think is important
Speaker 2: is references. Yea, and fairly recent references don't have references. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I huntred with them ten years ago, you know, right,
Speaker 2: you know, in the last year or two, get get
Speaker 2: some references. And I know that I when I'm at
Speaker 2: a show, I actually have a list of references, and
Speaker 2: on my references, I actually have people. Obviously, obviously people
Speaker 2: are kind of of course, you're not going to put
Speaker 2: some guy that had a bad hunt on there and
Speaker 2: that and that is true, I mean, you know, to
Speaker 2: an extent. But why I think it's important to ask
Speaker 2: him is well, on my back to mine, it's I
Speaker 2: have people that killed stuff, and I actually have people
Speaker 2: that didn't kill stuff, right with me? I think that's important. Sure,
Speaker 2: you know, if your outfitter doesn't supply the guy you're
Speaker 2: looking to go with. If he doesn't supply like references
Speaker 2: that that didn't kill maybe ask him, you know, like, hey,
Speaker 2: can I have a couple of guys's phone numbers that
Speaker 2: you know weren't successful with you?
Speaker 1: Yeah?
Speaker 2: You know. And and one thing I've learned in this business,
Speaker 2: in any business, I think you could probably agree, Dirk,
Speaker 2: is you're not going to make everybody happy, right, So
Speaker 2: one or two guys that complain about and out I
Speaker 2: wouldn't think too much in it, you know, right, because
Speaker 2: I think any outfitter that's been in business for a
Speaker 2: while is going to probably have a couple guys that
Speaker 2: can find something to complain about.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 2: That's just how it is.
Speaker 1: But it's really hard to make everyone happy out there.
Speaker 1: It is, as as hard as you try, you know,
Speaker 1: it's sometimes just like maybe it's a personality thing. Maybe
Speaker 1: it's maybe they expected way too much out of an
Speaker 1: outfitted hunt.
Speaker 2: It's hard to say, right yep, So definitely check with
Speaker 2: that and that. If he doesn't have any references, I'd
Speaker 2: be a little leary, you know, maybe go on on.
Speaker 2: Like I said, when I'm at a trade show, I
Speaker 2: have him there, and I might not hand them out
Speaker 2: to everybody, But if I'm talking to him and I
Speaker 2: think they're pretty interested in book a hunt with me,
Speaker 2: I'll say, why don't you take some references? And yes,
Speaker 2: And they might be some guys that have hunted with me,
Speaker 2: and I know they're gonna talk highly of me, but
Speaker 2: they might not even just be about me or my
Speaker 2: fan Well it would be too, but it might be
Speaker 2: something that I forget to tell you, Like you could
Speaker 2: ask them, you know, well, how how was the cabins
Speaker 2: you stayed in? How is the food right? You know,
Speaker 2: there's lots of questions that you could ask somebody on
Speaker 2: a reference and kind of you know, were you did
Speaker 2: they run you into the ground? I mean, did you
Speaker 2: have how far did you walk? You know, there's a
Speaker 2: lot of things they can ask them, so so important
Speaker 2: references are important. And I know not every outfitter hands
Speaker 2: those out because I've been at shows where I've handed
Speaker 2: them out and I've had had them come back and say,
Speaker 2: by the way, you're the only outfitter that that handed
Speaker 2: me references.
Speaker 1: Really like, oh, it feels like that'd be kind of standard, really.
Speaker 2: And it would, I would think, But I've had them
Speaker 2: do that, and I'm sure most outfitters do or at
Speaker 2: least have them if the client ask, and they might
Speaker 2: not hand them out unless you ask too, because you know,
Speaker 2: I don't want fifty sixty people call and a guy
Speaker 2: so right, it could.
Speaker 1: Be serious inquiries, Yes, exactly, sure.
Speaker 2: Definitely ask again, lots of questions. How physical is the
Speaker 2: hunt I'm going to be? You know what kind of
Speaker 2: terrain out altitude? You know what am I looking at?
Speaker 2: Because I get a lot of guys here that, you know,
Speaker 2: maybe miscommunication and stuff on their and our mind. Even
Speaker 2: you know, I've learned, I'm learning I'm only human. But
Speaker 2: on I just didn't think it was going to be
Speaker 2: this hard, right, you know, I thought i'd be a
Speaker 2: little more of a challenge, you know, really get detailed
Speaker 2: on that for sure.
Speaker 1: And and maybe you should tell the outfitter explain your expectations.
Speaker 1: This would Here's where a dream old would be to me.
Speaker 1: You know, I wake up every morning about nine am
Speaker 1: to a five star breakfast. I sip coffee for a
Speaker 1: while as I look at the lake and enjoy a
Speaker 1: beautiful view, and then out ten week, get in the
Speaker 1: vehicle and drive around and look for animals and maybe
Speaker 1: take a shot or two, and then we get back
Speaker 1: early and I take a soak in the hot tub,
Speaker 1: and yeah, you know, isn't that that I mean, I'm
Speaker 1: being silly of here, But but you have to like
Speaker 1: find out, like tell the outfit or what your expectations
Speaker 1: are and he might just say, well, that's not really
Speaker 1: the kind of hot we do.
Speaker 2: Yep, we don't.
Speaker 1: This is more what we do. And you know, kind
Speaker 1: of like I feel like that whole expectations versus reality
Speaker 1: thing is what really throws people off sometimes. So if
Speaker 1: you don't tell them that your expectations, you may just
Speaker 1: go there thinking it's something it ain't right if you
Speaker 1: haven't asked the questions, and like you just assume all
Speaker 1: these things.
Speaker 2: Yep, that happens a lot, you know. And I've told people,
Speaker 2: you know, several times, you know that we're detailed about
Speaker 2: that that I'm not sure I'm the guy you're looking for, right,
Speaker 2: you know, I'll recommend I'll recommend a few guys to Yeah,
Speaker 2: but I think you'd you would have a little more
Speaker 2: of an experience with what you want, you know, So yes,
Speaker 2: and and so important to know what you're getting into
Speaker 2: and if you're gonna like it or not? You know.
Speaker 2: Another one is, uh, I hear, you know, I hear
Speaker 2: all the A lot of these guys that hunt with
Speaker 2: me have been hunting other with other outfitters and and
Speaker 2: different places and stuff. And and one I hear the
Speaker 2: hunter's complaining about not not necessarily my setup. I feel
Speaker 2: like I have a decent setup for sleeping. But make
Speaker 2: sure you're asking the outfitter. You know where am I
Speaker 2: sleeping at? You know, like, oh, you know am I? Now?
Speaker 2: Now I know I wouldn't you know, might not bother
Speaker 2: some people, but I wouldn't want to show up on
Speaker 2: a guide to hunt and be stuck with five guys
Speaker 2: sleeping in the same tent or you know that I
Speaker 2: don't know right and that might not you know, I
Speaker 2: would if i'd at least want to know about it,
Speaker 2: you know, like who am I going to get stuck with?
Speaker 2: Am I going to be sleeping with the cook somewhere?
Speaker 2: You know, whatever it might be? You know, have that
Speaker 2: all ironed out, you know, so there's no when you
Speaker 2: get there, it's all about hunting. There's no surprises, you.
Speaker 1: Know, I mean, in a bunk house with eight beds
Speaker 1: and seven guys snoring.
Speaker 2: Like yep, bulldogs.
Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, so I'll need earplugs yeah, or maybe I
Speaker 1: don't want to. I don't want to do that, all right,
Speaker 1: Who knows.
Speaker 2: I've like I said, I've heard horror stories of mice
Speaker 2: crawling on people and these old shocks have been in
Speaker 2: spiders and all kinds of you. Who knows. You know,
Speaker 2: just be aware where you're gonna be. And I think
Speaker 2: we movie might have touched on this a little bit,
Speaker 2: but uh, you know, ask ask your outfitter how how
Speaker 2: far you're going to be shooting? Very important, and like
Speaker 2: we talked earlier, practice to what what they say? You know,
Speaker 2: if like I usually tell my hunters, I kind of
Speaker 2: I kind of expect or would like you to be
Speaker 2: able to shoot three hundred yards.
Speaker 1: Yeah, so practice to four hundred Yeah, you know that
Speaker 1: way three hundreds of chip shot.
Speaker 2: That's right. So definitely ask him that and then you'll
Speaker 2: have a little bit of an idea.
Speaker 1: Mm hm.
Speaker 2: You kind of already talked about this, but what style
Speaker 2: of hunt and is it gonna is it gonna fit
Speaker 2: you? You know like you were you were just kind of
Speaker 2: brought up, you know, definitely make sure you're gonna if
Speaker 2: you pull the trigger on a hunt, that you're going
Speaker 2: to be happy with it.
Speaker 1: You know what you're getting into.
Speaker 2: And I think if I'm if I'm walking around to
Speaker 2: trade show or something and trying to pick out and
Speaker 2: outfitter and I find one and I'm I'm asking him
Speaker 2: his I'm asking him a lot of questions, you know,
Speaker 2: But I think I'm really going to be trying to
Speaker 2: to to look at this guy and and and see
Speaker 2: is that is hunting really? This is it his passion
Speaker 2: or is this just a way to make really a living?
Speaker 2: And you know, you know, and I might and you
Speaker 2: can you can tell by talking to somebody, you know,
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, really quick, bring up some hunts, like what
Speaker 2: kind of hunts do you like to to go on?
Speaker 2: What's your favorite hunt? You know? And and see if
Speaker 2: you see that spark in their eye, and I think
Speaker 2: that that is I think that I just feel like
Speaker 2: them guys are really gonna really gonna try harder, no
Speaker 2: hunting better. You know, They're gonna they're just gonna be
Speaker 2: a better choice for you, if you can tell, because unfortunately,
Speaker 2: in this business there's there's what I call businessmen, you know,
Speaker 2: and I guess I'm one too, But you know, they're
Speaker 2: they're pushing numbers and and they might not they might
Speaker 2: not even hunt themselves really.
Speaker 1: Right, they just have a crew, guys, they have a crew.
Speaker 2: They might not guide even you know, so so definitely
Speaker 2: try to see what what you think there. Another good
Speaker 2: one is find out how many people are going to
Speaker 2: be in camp? Oh yeah, you know, And I know
Speaker 2: for me, I run a pretty small business. But I
Speaker 2: know if I go somewhere, I don't necessarily want to
Speaker 2: show up and there'll be twenty thirty people in camp
Speaker 2: for the week, right. You know that's a big red
Speaker 2: red flag to me of somebody just either And I
Speaker 2: get you know, we have to as outfitters. We've got
Speaker 2: leases and there's a lot that goes into it, so
Speaker 2: we have to book a certain amount of hunters to
Speaker 2: make it, or we're allocated tags or whatever. But you
Speaker 2: don't want to go to somewhere where they're just flat
Speaker 2: being greedy and they're pumping as many you're just a number, right,
Speaker 2: We're pumping as many hunters a week as we can
Speaker 2: get to go. You know, keep that in mind, you know, right,
Speaker 2: And I'm not saying that you're necessarily going to have
Speaker 2: a bad hunt. I would just keep that in mind, right,
Speaker 2: you know when you're looking.
Speaker 1: Yeah, because some places, you know, they might have a
Speaker 1: like a gigantic vast area of you know that the
Speaker 1: lease or they're hunting on. It's just like you're never
Speaker 1: going to see be close to any but any of
Speaker 1: the other hunters all for a week. You know, you'll
Speaker 1: see them at breakfast and dinner, but that would be it.
Speaker 1: But other places maybe maybe you might be like, oh,
Speaker 1: the glassing across the hillside, though, there's old Joe from
Speaker 1: the breakfast.
Speaker 2: Table that looking to me.
Speaker 1: You know, if it was a place that had a
Speaker 1: lot of hunters in camp, probably better have a very
Speaker 1: vast area to to to take their clients into and
Speaker 1: not be stumbling over each other.
Speaker 2: Yes, right exactly. And when you're and you're walking around
Speaker 2: on the show, same thing, make sure you're you're talking
Speaker 2: to the owner operator, you know, I mean and and
Speaker 2: again I'm not saying that you shouldn't go through a
Speaker 2: booking agency, but at least to be aware of that,
Speaker 2: like ask those questions like are you the owner, are
Speaker 2: you the operator? Are you going to be there? Are
Speaker 2: you going to be guiding, because I've known lots of
Speaker 2: my hunters say, you know, they booked a hunt with
Speaker 2: a guy and he wasn't even there when they showed up,
Speaker 2: you know, and kind of caught him off surprise, you know.
Speaker 2: And and at least if you do go through a
Speaker 2: booking agent, you know, like I said, I don't personally
Speaker 2: use them because I run a small business and I
Speaker 2: want to be more personal. Sure, I want to talk
Speaker 2: to the people that are going to come with me
Speaker 2: and stuff. But if you do go through a booking agent,
Speaker 2: at least you know, ask that booking agency, how can
Speaker 2: I contact the owner you know and get a little
Speaker 2: more detailed and personal with them? Sure, you know, and
Speaker 2: know you know, like okay, are you going to are
Speaker 2: you going to be there? Do you guide? You know?
Speaker 2: If they're not Again, if they're not guiding and not involved,
Speaker 2: you know, it'd probably be a little bit of a
Speaker 2: red flag for me. Oh yeah, yeah sure. And then
Speaker 2: another another question you'd ask him is how much ground
Speaker 2: do you got to hunt? Yeah, if there's f I've
Speaker 2: guys in camp and you've only got eight hundred acres
Speaker 2: to hunt, well that you might want to stay clear
Speaker 2: of that you know and outfitters. I know, Like how
Speaker 2: my my business works is, I'm I've got my own
Speaker 2: outfitting area and I do all public ground hunts, you know.
Speaker 2: But I'm the only outfitter in that area, and I
Speaker 2: have tons of ground and and you know, we're not
Speaker 2: going to run out of spots, you know, I'm confident
Speaker 2: of that. You know, I've got like six hundred square miles,
Speaker 2: you know, but not every outfitter. Some outfitters might have
Speaker 2: more or less, you know. So I think that's an
Speaker 2: important question to ask, you know, like how much ground
Speaker 2: do we have to hunt? And if you don't have
Speaker 2: much ground to hunt, you know, I'm not saying you
Speaker 2: wouldn't be successful, but it's something to it would probably
Speaker 2: raise a little bit of a red flag. Yeah, I
Speaker 2: like breathing room, right, you know, Right, I can't find something,
Speaker 2: some something on this mountain. I want to go to
Speaker 2: another one, right, you know?
Speaker 1: Absolutely?
Speaker 2: How long has our guides been working for them? You know,
Speaker 2: that's that's an important one to ask, I think to
Speaker 2: an extent, so a lot of my guides have been
Speaker 2: I've been lucky. I've had some guides that have worked
Speaker 2: for me from day one. I mean they're excellent hunters,
Speaker 2: and I'm grateful for that, but I think it's important
Speaker 2: to ask. I've been back East at at shows and
Speaker 2: I've had outfitters literally hiring guides from back East to
Speaker 2: come work for him and and Idaho, and I'm thinking,
Speaker 2: Holy cal that there's no way I'd run my business
Speaker 2: like that, right, So you want to you want to
Speaker 2: know who you're getting for a guide, you know, and uh,
Speaker 2: those are important and just because they're you know, guy's
Speaker 2: got to start start somewhere. I just trained one up
Speaker 2: three years ago. Super good, young kid, does a great job,
Speaker 2: and the technology we got just because it's his first year,
Speaker 2: you know, I I kind of explained to him and
Speaker 2: I and I I put way points and stuff on
Speaker 2: his on X or base map or whatever he has,
Speaker 2: and and you know, tell him, you know, guide him
Speaker 2: through like this is how you need to hunt the hunters,
Speaker 2: you know. So he'll be just as we all kind
Speaker 2: of hunt the same style, so he'll be just as
Speaker 2: successful usually, you know. But it's important to know who
Speaker 2: you're going to have for a guide and how experienced
Speaker 2: they are, for sure, Definitely a question i'd be asking.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, that's that's super important because you know,
Speaker 1: if and it might tell you something a little bit
Speaker 1: about the outfit. If if they have a revolving door
Speaker 1: of guides coming and going, maybe there's something else going
Speaker 1: on too, right, But if they've got you know, guides
Speaker 1: that have been with them for a really long time,
Speaker 1: that means, you know something things are getting done right
Speaker 1: around there, and it's been a good experience probably for
Speaker 1: the hunters and the guides to keep coming back every year,
Speaker 1: and a good outfit to work for.
Speaker 2: Absolutely. Yeah. And you know if you do, if you
Speaker 2: do find out you you're getting a newer guide. You
Speaker 2: know it's his first or second year iden. You know,
Speaker 2: try to dig into how long has he been a hunter? Yeah,
Speaker 2: you know, how long has he lived here in Idaho
Speaker 2: or wherever you're hunting? You know, some other things to
Speaker 2: think about.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, he could be a country first year guiding,
Speaker 1: but country boy has been hunting his whole life. And
Speaker 1: you know, you know these knows, these mountains like on
Speaker 1: the back of his hand, right yeah or maybe not?
Speaker 2: Yeah exactly, maybe maybe not.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's important to get a good guide, that's for sure. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: thanks for coming on. That was really great. All those
Speaker 1: points you brought up on the biggest mistakes and the
Speaker 1: had a best vet an outfitter. Whether you're vetting an
Speaker 1: outfitter or maybe you're vetting a hunting partner, those are
Speaker 1: some really good things to think about and conversations to have.
Speaker 1: That way, you have a really good, a really good experience.
Speaker 1: Do you have any closing thoughts? Yeah, I think i'd
Speaker 1: it is is uh.
Speaker 2: No matter if you're doing it, do it yourself or
Speaker 2: or guided hunt. Go in with a positive attitude, you know,
Speaker 2: go in You know you might not kill one, that's
Speaker 2: just reality, but go in there. I'm gonna have a
Speaker 2: good time no matter what happens, you know, I'm I'm
Speaker 2: gonna be positive. I'm gonna set a positive tone for
Speaker 2: the whole camp. Yeah. I love those kind of guys
Speaker 2: that they're just they're positive from the day they walk
Speaker 2: in till the day they walk out, and if they
Speaker 2: don't kill kill one, they're still positive. We love those
Speaker 2: type of guys. Just it just really sets the tone
Speaker 2: for the whole camp for the week. And I love it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it sure does, you know, And and an attitude
Speaker 1: is so contagious, whether it's positive or negative. If you're
Speaker 1: if you're exuding positivity and and having a good time
Speaker 1: and people around you are gonna have that same vibe,
Speaker 1: they're all gonna start having that same Maybe they're like
Speaker 1: on the fence whether they want to be positive or not, right,
Speaker 1: it's easy for them to follow follow suit, like, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: that guy, he's kind of uplifting and cheering me up.
Speaker 1: Now I'm positive too, But if you're kind of being
Speaker 1: a poo poo, you know, if you're having a bad attitude,
Speaker 1: then that's also really contagiousness. And it's actually really a
Speaker 1: lot easier to have a bad attitude than it is
Speaker 1: a good attitude. And my buddy Dan Stayton from Elk Shape,
Speaker 1: he always says there's only two things on elk hunting
Speaker 1: that you can control, and that's your attitude and your effort.
Speaker 1: And that's so true.
Speaker 2: That is true.
Speaker 1: I love that. Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And like you said that, the negative attitudes are
Speaker 2: just as intelligents. But I mean I tell all my guides,
Speaker 2: no matter what happens, stay positive, and it really helps
Speaker 2: when the hunter, the actual hunter, is doing it. So yeah,
Speaker 2: that number one positive attitude.
Speaker 1: Absolutely absolutely, And you know guided hunts, I mean they're
Speaker 1: just because you're going on a guided hunt doesn't mean
Speaker 1: it's any less of a hunt than a than a
Speaker 1: do it yourself for I feel like there's this attitude
Speaker 1: out there in the hunting world right now that oh
Speaker 1: it's a guided hunt. Oh oh you drew a tag.
Speaker 1: It wasn't over the counter do it yourself hunt. You know,
Speaker 1: some people kind of turn their nose up at that,
Speaker 1: and that's you know what, that's not right. You know,
Speaker 1: the outfitted hunts is still a hunt. You have to
Speaker 1: show up, you have to work hard, you have to
Speaker 1: you know, you have a guide there helping you. You know.
Speaker 1: So we're all in this together. We shouldn't We shouldn't
Speaker 1: be trying to tear each other down. You know, as
Speaker 1: long as the method someone else chooses to hunt is
Speaker 1: is legal, and you know they're they're observing ethical standards,
Speaker 1: you know, we should support them. You know, we shouldn't
Speaker 1: run them down.
Speaker 2: Yep, don't divide, don't divide.
Speaker 1: We're all in this together. There's too many people trying
Speaker 1: to tear take away their hunting rights and take trying
Speaker 1: to tear down hunting as it is. We don't need
Speaker 1: to do it as as hunters, right yes, and thank
Speaker 1: you for bringing that up about a guided hunt. I
Speaker 1: appreciate that because yes, as a guide, you know, I'm
Speaker 1: still hunting with hunters you know that come with me.
Speaker 2: Oh they're still they're good hunters. They hunt at home,
Speaker 2: they're just not real familiar and you can learn a lot.
Speaker 2: I mean, they can learn a lot if you're I
Speaker 2: take these kids up north here that you know, we're
Speaker 2: really wanting to get into calling and do it themselves.
Speaker 2: And they actually booked a couple hunts with me and
Speaker 2: it's worked out real good. They've learned a lot and
Speaker 2: they're out there calling in Elk now by themselves and stuff.
Speaker 2: I mean, you're there with a good guide for a
Speaker 2: week and you're paying attention, you can learn a ton.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So yeah, you have a seasoned guide that's been
Speaker 1: doing this a long time. You can learn a lot.
Speaker 1: And maybe maybe that's your goal is to someday do
Speaker 1: it do it yourself type hunt or maybe not, or
Speaker 1: or maybe you can go with an outfitter and they
Speaker 1: they can provide a hunt that you would never be
Speaker 1: able to do on your own. You know, maybe they
Speaker 1: own you know, a pack of hound dogs that are
Speaker 1: really well trained and they know the area very well.
Speaker 1: For me, I I can't own a pack of hound
Speaker 1: dogs and train them. I just just I don't have
Speaker 1: the ability or do I have the space to do it,
Speaker 1: and then and then where to do it? You know,
Speaker 1: I can come with Bradley, we can go we can
Speaker 1: go chase cats, or we can go chase bears, and
Speaker 1: it's going to be an experience of a lifetime. So
Speaker 1: you know, maybe it's just buck your buck checking off
Speaker 1: a bucket list thing, or or maybe maybe you've just
Speaker 1: never gone hunting before and you're intimidating just like you know,
Speaker 1: I don't know if I can do this by myself,
Speaker 1: and I want to go with a guide and learn
Speaker 1: everything he knows about elk hunting or deer hunting, whatever
Speaker 1: kind of hunt it is, and then next year I'll
Speaker 1: feel comfortable to do it myself. And that's a great,
Speaker 1: great way. There's no shame in that game. That's a
Speaker 1: great way to do it. That's it's smart actually, So.
Speaker 2: Yep, yeah, definitely, And yeah, i'd thank you for bringing
Speaker 2: the hounds up, you know, just before we go here.
Speaker 2: You know, if you have a chance, I feel like
Speaker 2: hounds are kind of misled a little.
Speaker 1: Bit in a way.
Speaker 2: You know, I know not everybody, but you know, I
Speaker 2: just encourage anybody to go with a Try to find
Speaker 2: somebody with hounds if they're willing to take you and
Speaker 2: and go out there and experience that. You know, there's
Speaker 2: a lot of hard work that goes into that. It's
Speaker 2: not just turn the dogs loose or pulling the trigger
Speaker 2: as you know Dirk Oh so yeah, or you know,
Speaker 2: like Dirk said, you know, you might not have the
Speaker 2: knowledge or or the space or you know, the time
Speaker 2: I am to raise a pack of dogs, but at
Speaker 2: least experience, you know, especially before you judge it. You know,
Speaker 2: definitely try it out. I think just about anybody I
Speaker 2: ever took out for the first time with hounds, I
Speaker 2: pretty much hooked them. Oh yeah, it's fun.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, on social media anytime, like on the Phelps
Speaker 1: page or even on my page or on our YouTube
Speaker 1: videos where we've gone hunting with you and it's like
Speaker 1: cound dog hunting for mountain lions or bears. Immediately immediately
Speaker 1: there'll be somebody naysayer but like, no, thanks, oh, that's
Speaker 1: the lazy man's way or whatever. And they they'll say
Speaker 1: that about bear baiting too. And it blows my mind
Speaker 1: because to me, hunting with hound dogs or baiting that
Speaker 1: is like the opposite of the lazy man's way that
Speaker 1: takes so much time, discipline, effort that I don't have,
Speaker 1: Like I don't have time to deal to have dogs
Speaker 1: and train them in and all that like, and then
Speaker 1: it's not like I just show up and shoot something
Speaker 1: like we hunted all week, you know, and and you
Speaker 1: got to be in the cold, you got to be
Speaker 1: in the hot, you got to hike up in there
Speaker 1: to the tree. I mean, there's more to it than that.
Speaker 1: It's it's in that baiting too. My buddy Cody Wilson
Speaker 1: went bear hunting left spring with him in in Wyoming
Speaker 1: and and baiting. And people will pooh pooh on that.
Speaker 1: They'll say, oh, that's the lazy man's way. If you've
Speaker 1: ever if you've never baited bears, especially legally where you
Speaker 1: have to do it for the law. You can't have
Speaker 1: it next to a stream you can't have but next
Speaker 1: to the road you get you have to do it right.
Speaker 1: That is an astronomical amount of work and bait. And yes,
Speaker 1: it's crazy to me that people can sit there and
Speaker 1: run it down. They obviously have never done it right.
Speaker 1: They just see the maybe the fruits of people's success
Speaker 1: and maybe feel a little jealous or think, oh man,
Speaker 1: that's that must be nice or whatever. That's easy. It
Speaker 1: ain't easy, yep.
Speaker 2: Definitely try it before you judge it.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 2: And it's definitely, I can promise you, not easy. I've
Speaker 2: got my whole life and dedicated to hounds, and I
Speaker 2: know exactly what it takes. And you know, the people
Speaker 2: that think it's easy, you know, go out and train
Speaker 2: a pack of dogs and catch your first cat and
Speaker 2: then we'll talk.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I have a little different pit. Yeah. Well, man,
Speaker 1: I can't tell you how much I appreciate you coming
Speaker 1: on here and sharing all your knowledge and stuff with me.
Speaker 1: And and but I've been trying to get Bradley to
Speaker 1: go elk cunting with me, and we've been kind of
Speaker 1: talking about that and he said, you just wanted me
Speaker 1: to call it an elk for you, which that's true,
Speaker 1: But I want to really call one in for him
Speaker 1: really bad too. So I know one of these days
Speaker 1: we're going to probably put that together and hopefully we'll
Speaker 1: get to film it share it with you guys. I
Speaker 1: think it'll be a probably a head of a lifetime really.
Speaker 2: Oh man, I'll be I definitely want to do that
Speaker 2: and I'll look forward to that. And yeah, I'd love
Speaker 2: for the bugler to call me in a big six awesome,
Speaker 2: even a big spike. I'm not too fill you don't
Speaker 2: want you to have too much pressure. Perfect.
Speaker 1: Perfect, We'll keep our expectations right, Yeah, I will talk
Speaker 1: it over again. Well, thanks again, appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Thank you, Derek. I appreciate this.
Speaker 1: Tell us where people can find you, okay, social and stuff.
Speaker 2: Yeah, so I do have an Instagram page, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm I think three. Well, I started Instagram right about
Speaker 2: the time six seven months before you come about COVID year.
Speaker 2: So I'm not the greatest on it, you know, but
Speaker 2: I'm on there. You can look me up. We have
Speaker 2: a website Idaho whitetailguides dot com and there's a lot
Speaker 2: of information on there, and you know a way to
Speaker 2: contact us, and like I said, if you have any questions,
Speaker 2: I'm I'm happy. You know, a lot of times my
Speaker 2: wife will take the calls and I might be out
Speaker 2: in the field hunting or something, but I will eventually
Speaker 2: get back to you. And even the do it yourselfers.
Speaker 2: Like I said, I if there's anything I could do
Speaker 2: to point you in the right direction or or any
Speaker 2: kind of information you might think you need from me.
Speaker 1: Don't hesitate your call okay, yeah, great, you on Instagram
Speaker 1: your handles, I don't wait tail guides yep, okay, ye,
Speaker 1: all right, well thanks, I appreciate it.
Speaker 3: Yep, thank you, dart huh