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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. Hello,

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Speaker 1: welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my

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Speaker 1: name is Noel. I am Ben. You are you? And

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Speaker 1: that makes this stuff they don't want you to know. However,

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Speaker 1: ladies and gentlemen, this is a very special episode of

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Speaker 1: the show because we are honored to have a returning

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Speaker 1: special guests. Uh close friend of ours on close friend

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Speaker 1: of the show, writer and host for How Stuff Works,

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Speaker 1: stuff to blow your mind, forward thinking brain stuff. I

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Speaker 1: could go on, but I won't in the interests of time,

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Speaker 1: ladies and gentlemen. Joe McCormick, Hey, everybody, it is fun

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Speaker 1: to be back. I think the last time I was

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Speaker 1: on this show we were talking about shills on the internet. Oh, yes,

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Speaker 1: we got we got deep on that subject. We shot

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Speaker 1: some fun things for video. If you have not seen

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Speaker 1: that video, check it out please. And that's one of

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Speaker 1: that that's one of the podcasts that we really enjoyed

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Speaker 1: making two and it got a lot of feedback. Uh, guys,

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Speaker 1: you were likely largely from sock puppets we hope so

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Speaker 1: that one person making a lot of email accounts. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that's one where we were all four of us were

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Speaker 1: accused routinely for several months and sometimes still in the

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Speaker 1: common thread of being uh, anti Russian spies or something.

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Speaker 1: I can't remember. The conspiracy and the threat that was

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Speaker 1: very strange. I didn't mean to promote any anti Russian message,

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Speaker 1: but I think some people were sensitive about that. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: And you know, the thing that we have to deal

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Speaker 1: with when we delve into those kinds of topics is

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Speaker 1: that it may appear that we are looking at one

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Speaker 1: case obsessively, or that we are somehow seeing ling out

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Speaker 1: one country organization. But it goes back to the sources

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Speaker 1: we can find, right just talking about the thing we

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Speaker 1: know the most about. Yeah, and it it sure did appear. Look,

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Speaker 1: I'm not saying that Russia was doing a terrible job,

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Speaker 1: but it was way easier to find examples of their

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Speaker 1: sock puppetry than many other places. Uh. And speaking of

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Speaker 1: fantastic segues, let's get to uh, let's get to something

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Speaker 1: that that is fascinating and a little bit of background

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Speaker 1: for everybody. Okay, So, in the past, listeners, you have

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Speaker 1: asked Matt and Nolan. I a question that haunts me still.

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Speaker 1: What is the world's oldest conspiracy theory? You may you

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Speaker 1: may notice on our videos in the intros, at least

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Speaker 1: the older intros, you see something that says it starts here.

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Speaker 1: And we've we've wanted to know where does it start? Right? Where? When? What? Why? How?

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Speaker 1: All of the all of the big journalistic questions. And

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Speaker 1: it's a game that we have played for years now.

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Speaker 1: It's a rough game because, as you're going to see

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Speaker 1: quite quickly past a certain point, ancient history is Um,

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Speaker 1: I'm not gonna curse on the show, so I'll say

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Speaker 1: it's a freaking roar shack. People see what they want

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Speaker 1: to see in it. They draw what is convenient to them.

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Speaker 1: There are people phantom history enthusiasts, for instance, who believe

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Speaker 1: that we are still in the Medieval or Middle Ages.

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Speaker 1: Uh wait, what what's the argument there? Oh? Is that

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Speaker 1: the is that the missing era theory where they believe

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Speaker 1: there are a couple of hundred years that didn't actually happen.

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Speaker 1: Charlemagne's made up. Uh interesting, Yeah, We we did have

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Speaker 1: a video on it, and I think we did an

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Speaker 1: audio episode on it. If we haven't, we should, we will,

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Speaker 1: or maybe that was just in the missing years so

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Speaker 1: we got to something different. It's not it's probably not

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Speaker 1: the oldest or the first conspiracy theory. Well, according to

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Speaker 1: its adherents, it may well be. We're talking about one

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Speaker 1: of the oldest stay conspiracy theories in Western history, and

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Speaker 1: it's one that cast out not just like on one

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Speaker 1: aspect of the world right, but on the entirety of

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Speaker 1: reality itself. We're talking about a war for the soul

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Speaker 1: of Christianity, a war for the fate of human beings,

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Speaker 1: a war for reality. Uh. The line we use in

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Speaker 1: the video is a cosmic cover up leading to things

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Speaker 1: that literally literally cannot be imagined. So we're talking about gnosticism. Uh.

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Speaker 1: This is a topic I've wanted to talk about on

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Speaker 1: a podcast for a long time, and I hope I

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Speaker 1: get to revisit it eventually, because unfortunately it is one

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Speaker 1: of those subjects that is so fascinating and so rich.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry to say this, but we will not be

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Speaker 1: able to talk about everything that's interesting to talk about.

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Speaker 1: We're we're barely going to be able to scratch the

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Speaker 1: surface today. But we want to give you a little

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Speaker 1: bit of a flavor of what gnosticism is, how it

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Speaker 1: was lost to history and then partially regained, what we

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Speaker 1: can know about it, why it's so mysterious, and why

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Speaker 1: it proposes such a mysterious view of our place in

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Speaker 1: the cosmos. And one of the most interesting facts about

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Speaker 1: this mystery, as you alluded to, is the fact that

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Speaker 1: it sort of is a conspiracy theory. It is a

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Speaker 1: cosmic conspiracy theory about the role of creation of human

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Speaker 1: beings of the gods, and how it's all a vast

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Speaker 1: cover up. Yeah, and the encounter with the divine. Now,

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Speaker 1: as we do in any episode that touches on religion,

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Speaker 1: we want to have a little bit of a of

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Speaker 1: a disclaimer, right, Uh, yeah, I would say that for

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Speaker 1: my part here, we're not here to evaluate the I

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Speaker 1: don't know theological merits of one religion versus another we

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Speaker 1: or anything like that. We just want to talk about

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Speaker 1: the history, what people believed in the past, where these

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Speaker 1: ideas came from, and how they played into ancient societies

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Speaker 1: and still do today. And they're a very strange stories

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Speaker 1: of early Christianity. Personally, I am personally, I'm a little

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Speaker 1: bit I'm a little bit bummed that We're not going

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Speaker 1: to be able to cover some of the other offshoots

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Speaker 1: or sects, but this is a big one. This is

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Speaker 1: one of the um more mysterious and influential, and we

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Speaker 1: can always come back to. Uh, we can always come

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Speaker 1: back to other some of my other favorite offshoots. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So can I put you guys in a scenario? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: perfect for y'all game. Okay, So I want to I

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Speaker 1: want to take you back into the past and have

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Speaker 1: you imagined that you are a Christian living somewhere in

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Speaker 1: the Roman Empire about the year one eight? You know

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Speaker 1: you specifically imagining. Okay, So maybe you're in Gaul, you're

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Speaker 1: up in France, and and you're part of a small

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Speaker 1: Christian community in a town that meets regularly, and you

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Speaker 1: do the Christian rituals. You celebrate the Lord's Supper, you

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Speaker 1: practice baptisms, you worship Jesus Christ, and you believe Jesus

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Speaker 1: Christ to be the one true savior of humankind. So

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Speaker 1: what's your life like? One thing I would say is

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Speaker 1: that the pagan locals probably don't like you a whole lot.

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Speaker 1: They spread lies about your beliefs and religious practices. For example,

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Speaker 1: they might say that you guys practice incestual orgies and

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Speaker 1: feast on the flesh of sacrificed infants. That's not true,

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Speaker 1: but that's what they say about you. When disasters happen.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes people blame you and call you atheists because you

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Speaker 1: won't sacrifice to the pagan gods of Rome or to

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Speaker 1: the Roman emperor to keep everything in order. You're not

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Speaker 1: carrying your weight, right, Yeah, you're not doing your job

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Speaker 1: as a citizen of this empire, or I guess you

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Speaker 1: probably wouldn't whether or not your citizens. You're not doing

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Speaker 1: your job as somebody living in in uh, in this

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Speaker 1: community to keep the gods happy and keep us out

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Speaker 1: of harm's way. But otherwise things probably aren't too bad

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Speaker 1: unless you're living during one of the few periods of

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Speaker 1: sporadic persecution. So one day, after a good sermon in

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Speaker 1: your church, there's there's one member of your kind, bgregation

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Speaker 1: who comes up to you and says, uh, hey, buddy,

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Speaker 1: did you like that sermon today about the resurrection and

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Speaker 1: you know, immortality and all that. Yeah, that was pretty good. Well,

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Speaker 1: maybe you should join my private study group. We can

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Speaker 1: we can learn more about the true knowledge of God.

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Speaker 1: So no, you're gonna You're gonna follow this guy to

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Speaker 1: his Bible study group, and it meets at his house.

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Speaker 1: And at first everything sounds pretty normal. You know, they're

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Speaker 1: talking about the same kind of stuff you're hearing about

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Speaker 1: in church. They're talking about salvation and knowledge of God

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Speaker 1: and eternal life. But over time you start hearing maybe

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Speaker 1: some weirder concepts that maybe aren't quite so familiar from

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Speaker 1: what you're used to at church, Like how the creation

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Speaker 1: story you've always been told in the Book of Genesis

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Speaker 1: is really just a cover story, and that Noah's flood

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Speaker 1: was a false flag operation, and that, of course Judas

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Speaker 1: is really a misunderstood hero, not the betrayer of Christ. Wait, wait, wait, wait,

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Speaker 1: I want to interject real quick. Who are these guys? Well,

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Speaker 1: it sounds to me like nol you have encountered some

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Speaker 1: adherents of the Gnostic school of thought. I'm intrigued. Tell

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Speaker 1: me more. Well, the Gnostics were a group of early Christians,

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Speaker 1: and and the Gnostic way of thinking, we do believe

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Speaker 1: extends beyond Christianity, so they were there were probably Gnostics

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Speaker 1: who weren't exactly Christians, like there might have been hermetic

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Speaker 1: Gnostic traditions that had to do with some version of

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Speaker 1: the God Hermes. But there was nastic Christianity, and so

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Speaker 1: when people talk about gnosticism, most of the time what

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Speaker 1: they're talking about is Nastic Christianity. And it was a

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Speaker 1: system of beliefs within early Christianity that uh, that was

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Speaker 1: eventually not the dominant one, uh, the strain of thinking

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Speaker 1: that eventually became the dominant one in early Christianity and

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Speaker 1: then turned into the Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Church and

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Speaker 1: subsequently also the Protestant Church since that broke away from

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Speaker 1: the Catholic Church, is often referred to by scholars as

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Speaker 1: proto Orthodox. So in a very loose way, this just

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Speaker 1: means something like Catholics before there was a Catholic Church. Um. Though,

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Speaker 1: if if you get all the way into the muddy

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Speaker 1: waters of early Christian history, that's not exactly That is

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Speaker 1: not an unproblematic concept. People have challenged the validity of

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Speaker 1: the idea of a proto Orthodox Church, but I think

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Speaker 1: it's it's okay enough for our purposes today. And we

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Speaker 1: read we read a fantastic book and a great course.

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Speaker 1: Coincidentally that that's the name of the series, but it

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Speaker 1: is also a great course I'm gonna be honest, I

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Speaker 1: haven't finished the book yet, but I like what I've read,

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Speaker 1: and I did check out the Great course. So we

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Speaker 1: have we have some quotations from an author that I

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Speaker 1: don't know. I think we're both fans of. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: this guy was my main source on gnosticism. Uh, and

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Speaker 1: he's He is an Ohio State University history professor History

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Speaker 1: of Christianity professor named David Brackie, and Bracki said as

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Speaker 1: this in his book on the Gnostics, he says, most

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Speaker 1: scholars agreed that there was no single church in the

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Speaker 1: first and second centuries, but a multitude of competing groups,

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Speaker 1: one of which began to emerge in the third centuries.

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Speaker 1: So that be the two hundreds as the dominant one,

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Speaker 1: and so can be called proto orthodoxy. So these are

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Speaker 1: the guys who eventually become the major dominant players, and

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Speaker 1: they are contrasted with what we would think of as

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Speaker 1: as the heresies, basically the early systems of thought in

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Speaker 1: Christianity that did not become the winners in the battle

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Speaker 1: of ideas. Yes, I have I have a great idea

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Speaker 1: for this one comparison. Okay, everybody, So the more we

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Speaker 1: learn about the evolution of man. The more we're learning

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Speaker 1: that it was not a single linear thing, right, that

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Speaker 1: there were other close like versions of people of humanity.

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Speaker 1: So that's how we find that there is d N

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Speaker 1: a uh Neanderthal Denisovan DNA in modern humanity today. So

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Speaker 1: les competing um, these competing types I don't want to

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Speaker 1: say brands, but competing types of early man still ended

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Speaker 1: up with us today in a kind of uh. I

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Speaker 1: mean d N a reproduction is already kind of a

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Speaker 1: religious syncretism or similar to it. Right, So this this

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Speaker 1: analogy for um for people who maybe are not too

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Speaker 1: familiar with the early days of religion, that's a good

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Speaker 1: way to look at it. Is that fair? Do you think? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I think that's a really good one in that I think,

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Speaker 1: based on what I've read, the most uh, the most

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Speaker 1: accurate way to look at the development of of Theology

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Speaker 1: and Christianity are really probably any religion, but especially in

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Speaker 1: Christianity based on what we know is that it's not

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Speaker 1: a unity into diversity system, and it's not a diversity

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Speaker 1: into unity system, but it's a diverse into diversity system.

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Speaker 1: There are lots of competing ideas and they get uh,

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Speaker 1: sort of go through recombination over the years into various

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Speaker 1: different strains. But you start with diversity and then you

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Speaker 1: end with diversity. So where did gnosticism come from? Well,

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Speaker 1: that's a difficult question to answer because we don't know

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Speaker 1: exactly where or when it came from. Was it a

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Speaker 1: variation that emerged from early Christianity? So did you have

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Speaker 1: Christians who started taking on ideas other ideas from the culture,

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Speaker 1: maybe from neo Platonism, which is the thing we can

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Speaker 1: talk about in a little bit, Uh, and and turn

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Speaker 1: into gnostics. Or did it originally come from Judaism. Was

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Speaker 1: there a kind of Jewish gnosticism that became Christian gnosticism,

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Speaker 1: or did it come from paganism and secular philosophy and

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Speaker 1: then incorporate Christian ideas. Uh. We don't really know the

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Speaker 1: answer to that question because we don't know when or

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Speaker 1: where it first showed up. There's some guesses, like some

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Speaker 1: people think maybe nasticism started in the city of Alexandria

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Speaker 1: in Egypt, but they're all just kind of circumstantial guesses.

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Speaker 1: We don't really know. One thing we can do, however,

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Speaker 1: is disprove some earlier theories, because before a very very

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Speaker 1: important point in comparatively recent history. Uh, Gnasticism was the

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Speaker 1: subject of a lot of wild speculation, So we can't

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Speaker 1: it sort of invites that, doesn't it. Once we actually

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Speaker 1: talk about the Gnostic myth, I think you're gonna understand

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Speaker 1: a little more like why this is, why, why this

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Speaker 1: invites some really weird literature and and speculation. I just

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Speaker 1: have to jump in here and say the the kind

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Speaker 1: of creation myth and the Adam and Eve myths Nasticism

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Speaker 1: fascinate me, and I really like them. I think I

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Speaker 1: might be converting, like while we're sitting here, Okay, Okay, Well,

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Speaker 1: we'll check in with you in a little bit, okay,

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Speaker 1: because I want to hear I want to hear what

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Speaker 1: you think once we get to Yaldabo. Oh yeah, you're

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Speaker 1: gonna love them. You're gonna love with the kids kind

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Speaker 1: of kind of like a buddy God in some version. No,

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Speaker 1: not at all, I know, I know. Let me just

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Speaker 1: have this one, Joe. Okay. Well, anyway, point being, point being,

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Speaker 1: uh that we know, for instance, the earlier belief that

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Speaker 1: Gnosticism originated in Eastern traditions such as Buddhism is fairly

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Speaker 1: easy to dismiss yeah, it's probably not correct. That's probably

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Speaker 1: not correct, which I know sounds like waffling a little bit,

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Speaker 1: but again, it's ancient history. It's all you can do

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Speaker 1: is waffle there. There's almost nothing certain in ancient history.

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Speaker 1: And then to add to the problem before again a

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Speaker 1: very important moment in this story. Uh, the little documentation

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Speaker 1: that we did have about Gnostic belief systems came often

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Speaker 1: from its critics. They yeah, almost entirely from its critics, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: So for the longest time, almost everything we knew about

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Speaker 1: the Gnostics came from heresiologists, from members of this group

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Speaker 1: you might call proto Orthodox people who who were trying

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Speaker 1: to identify bad, aberrant strains of thinking in in their opinion,

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Speaker 1: and and teach people how to recognize them and how

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Speaker 1: to get rid of them, get them out of your church.

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Speaker 1: You know, you don't want these bad ideas running around

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Speaker 1: almost like skeptics for the religion or for the belief,

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Speaker 1: the system of belief. Well, to bring it, yeah, to

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Speaker 1: bring it into another thing, you always have to consider

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Speaker 1: a source, ladies and gentlemen. So if we were just

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Speaker 1: to look at some modern analogies, what we're saying is

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Speaker 1: you wouldn't trust Coca Cola's review of a new pepsi product.

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Speaker 1: You wouldn't if someone works at Chevy, you wouldn't expect

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Speaker 1: them to say, you know what, you know, those toyotas

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Speaker 1: are badass, you know you. Instead, you would expect the opposite.

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Speaker 1: You would expect for them to have problems. You're never

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Speaker 1: going to see even an olive garden ads singing the

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Speaker 1: praises of a night out at Applebee's. That's just not

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Speaker 1: how people or ideas work. Well. Our olive Garden in

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Speaker 1: this case, is going to be a second century church

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Speaker 1: father named Ireneus of Leone. Do you know what do

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Speaker 1: y'all know about Ireneus? Well? I know that he is

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Speaker 1: great at parties. Uh, from what I remember, Well, he

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Speaker 1: was pretty much an an enemy of the Gnostic belief,

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Speaker 1: to the point of maybe being an alarmist. Well, yeah,

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Speaker 1: he he wrote a whole book about this pretty much.

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Speaker 1: It's a for sure. It's called Against the Heresies. But

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Speaker 1: the real title of this treatise Ireneus wrote is on

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Speaker 1: the Detection and Overthrow of the so called Nosis, or

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Speaker 1: on the Detection and Overthrow of knowledge falsely so called Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and he uses the phrase so called. Yeah, so frequently, Well,

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Speaker 1: what does what does this term gnosis mean? Well, gnosis

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Speaker 1: refers to sort of the key concept of not sticism,

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Speaker 1: and it's it's the idea of knowledge. Now, all Christians

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Speaker 1: would probably incorporate the idea of knowledge of God, right

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Speaker 1: if you want, if you want to be a member

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Speaker 1: of the true religion, you're gonna have to know what

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Speaker 1: God is like. But the Gnostics emphasized their special type

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Speaker 1: of knowledge, that that it was a knowledge that was

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Speaker 1: better than the kind of knowledge other people had, because

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Speaker 1: it was a more direct, more true, more intimate knowledge

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Speaker 1: of the real reality of what God. Yeah, it also

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Speaker 1: focused on knowledge from within as well. Correct, That's that

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Speaker 1: was one of the big ideas is that many much

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Speaker 1: of the true knowledge that you are getting actually comes

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Speaker 1: from within. Yeah. That, well, that there is a that

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Speaker 1: there's this there's a true nature inside of you that

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Speaker 1: wants to uh, to realize the true almost as more

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Speaker 1: of like an enlightened state, like I like something that

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Speaker 1: you would read about in philosophy as opposed to a

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Speaker 1: religious text. That's very much. That's very true in some ways,

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Speaker 1: except that there also is a ton of complicated mythology. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that you'd have to incorporate. But yeah, So this guy

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Speaker 1: iron Ace of Leone who wants to talk about the

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Speaker 1: overthrow of knowledge falsely so called he he was warning

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Speaker 1: his congregation about the dangers of all these interpretations of

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Speaker 1: Christianity other than his own, and um and and so

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Speaker 1: he talked about what the Gnostics believed. He talked about

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Speaker 1: how they were wolves in sheep's clothing. They'd come preaching

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Speaker 1: a message that that sounds kind of like what you

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Speaker 1: would hear in your church. You would be like, Okay, yeah,

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Speaker 1: they're talking about eternal life and salvation and knowledge of God.

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Speaker 1: So I think that's all right. But then he says,

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Speaker 1: once you dig down deeper into what they're teaching, it's

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Speaker 1: this crazy, aberrant, horrible thing that's going to lead people

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Speaker 1: astray and straight into damnation. In night Shamalan twist, it

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Speaker 1: sort of is, Yes, it's the it's the end of

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Speaker 1: the village. But for your religion, no spoilers. No, I

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Speaker 1: would never I would think that's a spoiler. Kidding. I

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Speaker 1: would never tell your listeners that at the end of Lost,

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Speaker 1: everybody is in a dream of a lawnmower, in the

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Speaker 1: dream of the sentient lawnmower. Come on, when was that

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Speaker 1: show over? What's the statute of limitations on spoilers? Anyway? Uh,

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Speaker 1: this goes guys, this goes into another conversation that the

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Speaker 1: fact that everybody is a dream of a sentient lawnmower

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Speaker 1: is more like the Gnostic myth than it is what's

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Speaker 1: in lost. Um. So, the other other things that Irony

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Speaker 1: has said is that Irony has had this idea we

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Speaker 1: talked about in a minute ago. A minute ago is

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Speaker 1: saying something that we were saying is probably not true.

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Speaker 1: He had this idea that Christianity began as a single,

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Speaker 1: unified tradition, everybody is on the same page, and then

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Speaker 1: later it split off into all these bad interpretations on

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Speaker 1: this rock. I found my church, and then eventually people

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Speaker 1: lost their way. Yeah, but most scholars today of of

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Speaker 1: ancient history and of early Christian history just wouldn't agree

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Speaker 1: with that picture. They'd see it's probably started very diverse. Um.

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Speaker 1: The He also basically said the Gnostics they're immoral, and

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Speaker 1: this is these are David Brackie's words, immoral and theologically stupid,

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Speaker 1: so both both bad people and dents. And also you

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Speaker 1: can tell that he would completely believe and support rumors

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Speaker 1: of like strange orgies baby eating you know what I mean. Though,

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Speaker 1: it's funny because people said that about his type of Christians,

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Speaker 1: even though it probably wasn't true. I mean, baby eater

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Speaker 1: was a fairly common Uh it was. It was a

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Speaker 1: fairly common insult in the public discourse. Pretty good, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean it's it was. Our version of it now

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Speaker 1: is un American. I've called two of the three of

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Speaker 1: you baby eaters before. Yeah, but I respect you because

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Speaker 1: you said it to me and not about me, and

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Speaker 1: I appreciate you excluding me from that, and to be fair,

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Speaker 1: then you were sort of going on a baby Look, guys, guys,

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Speaker 1: this isn't about me or or any any allegations. Let's

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Speaker 1: move on because we're getting to um Matt's new favorite character. Right.

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Speaker 1: So one of the other things Irone has talked about

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Speaker 1: is he explained the mythology and theology of the Gnostic

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Speaker 1: school of thought as he understood it, which one of

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Speaker 1: the main takeaways is, uh, this might come as a

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Speaker 1: surprise to some people, but these Christians believe that the

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Speaker 1: God of the Book of Genesis is actually a horrible,

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Speaker 1: false sort of devil figure called Yaldabo, and until much

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Speaker 1: more recently, pretty much all we had was these these heresiologists,

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Speaker 1: these people writing about gnosticism from an unsympathetic viewpoint pieces,

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Speaker 1: so we didn't get their own story, like what they

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Speaker 1: would have said about themselves. That is until one day

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Speaker 1: in Egypt in nineteen when a couple of guys were

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Speaker 1: digging for fertilizer at the base of the Gibal Altarif

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Speaker 1: cliff near a city on the Nile called dog Hammadi.

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Speaker 1: They took up thirteen ancient code disease. They were crazy,

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Speaker 1: they were awesome, they were sealed in earthenware. But these

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Speaker 1: dudes were afraid, right, yeah, well, uh so Codices are

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Speaker 1: basically it means books. It means not scrolls. There are

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Speaker 1: the things you pick up when you're wandering around and

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Speaker 1: role playing games, and they tell you about the world. Yes,

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Speaker 1: a codex, so so like the codex. You might often

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Speaker 1: hear about ancient books called codex something, Codex mallificus, codex

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Speaker 1: I don't know it's Codex mallifica as the one. It's

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Speaker 1: got to be. It sure sounds like it's up there

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Speaker 1: in a necronomicon air. It just means a bound book. Right,

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Speaker 1: and you see these in Mesoamerica as well. Right, And now, okay,

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Speaker 1: here's the thing. So at first, these guys don't want

399
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Speaker 1: to open the container because and I love them for this,

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Speaker 1: I respect them for this. I hate it when I

401
00:23:56,640 --> 00:24:01,919
Speaker 1: see people acting uh and acting cartoonish and horror movies.

402
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Speaker 1: So if this were a horror movie, they would dig

403
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Speaker 1: up the jar, they would open it. It would be

404
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:13,760
Speaker 1: Pandora's jar or something or in some terrible terrible would

405
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Speaker 1: melt off, right, or their faces would melt off. That's

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Speaker 1: an excellent example. So right, So the thing is, Um,

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Speaker 1: what I like about this is if you dig up

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Speaker 1: a clearly ancient sealed container from who knows how many

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Speaker 1: years past. We do, but they didn't at the time,

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Speaker 1: you're not just gonna jump in and pop the top

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Speaker 1: and see if it happens to be drinkable wine or

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Speaker 1: something like that. The guys who discovered this legitimately feared

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Speaker 1: it might contain a gin. I hadn't heard that detail. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that was so they initially hesitated, and then they when

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Speaker 1: they brought them, when they transported them back to uh, well,

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Speaker 1: longtime listeners, you know, a gin is something made from

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Speaker 1: juniper berries. Right, it's and it works. Uh A revolutionized

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Speaker 1: the cotton industry. Uh No A A jin d j

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Speaker 1: i n In or just j i in In is

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Speaker 1: a third creation of God in Islam, a third species,

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Speaker 1: if you will, not necessarily demons or angels. We've talked

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Speaker 1: about and in the past discussion. I think I had

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Speaker 1: had the misconception previously that it was always exclusively an evil,

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00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 1: malevolent spirit, and you corrected me. But I believe in

425
00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:33,680
Speaker 1: this situation that was likely the one they were expecting

426
00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:36,680
Speaker 1: to pop out, That was the fear. Yes, yeah, I've

427
00:25:36,720 --> 00:25:39,439
Speaker 1: always heard about it as a wilderness dwelling spirit of

428
00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:43,840
Speaker 1: some kind. Right, there are different classes of Oh man, Okay, guys,

429
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:45,760
Speaker 1: We're just gonna have to do with gin episode one

430
00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:48,280
Speaker 1: day because I'm too fascinated with it anyway, So that

431
00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:53,280
Speaker 1: detail is allegedly what happens. And now as we know, guys,

432
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:59,320
Speaker 1: the non Commodity Library became very very close to uh

433
00:25:59,480 --> 00:26:03,679
Speaker 1: extinct ship within just a few like days or weeks

434
00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:07,920
Speaker 1: discovery because originally I think that one of the people

435
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 1: came home to the house after they brought it home

436
00:26:11,600 --> 00:26:14,679
Speaker 1: and found that somebody in the house had tried to

437
00:26:14,720 --> 00:26:19,400
Speaker 1: start an oven with some of the papers on the Codesseas,

438
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:23,680
Speaker 1: and so we we lost part of what the library

439
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:26,480
Speaker 1: originally was. But I think that just out of necessity

440
00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 1: or were they did they the documents? I think they

441
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:33,439
Speaker 1: didn't realize what they were. Yeah, but anyway, so they

442
00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:35,960
Speaker 1: eventually it passed hands a few times. I think first

443
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:38,320
Speaker 1: they showed it to a local priest and then eventually

444
00:26:38,320 --> 00:26:41,480
Speaker 1: it came to the attention of scholars. But once scholars

445
00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:46,200
Speaker 1: became aware of these ancient documents, these Codesseas, uh, they

446
00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:49,480
Speaker 1: realized they had something very valuable and very interesting on

447
00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:52,640
Speaker 1: their hands. So it was a big collection of texts

448
00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:57,320
Speaker 1: that were written in Coptic, which is an ancient Egyptian language.

449
00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:59,320
Speaker 1: Is sort of the the last stage in the evolution

450
00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:03,480
Speaker 1: of the Egyptian language over the over the centuries. Uh,

451
00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:06,080
Speaker 1: you know, came from down the line from hieroglyphics, but

452
00:27:06,119 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 1: written in Greek Greek script. It was a translation, right, Yeah,

453
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:14,600
Speaker 1: it was a translation from so the originals. These were copies,

454
00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:17,720
Speaker 1: so they weren't original documents, but they were copies of

455
00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:21,320
Speaker 1: documents that scholars could tell were originally written in Greek

456
00:27:21,400 --> 00:27:24,119
Speaker 1: because sometimes there'd be just the Greek word taken straight

457
00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:26,120
Speaker 1: over when there wasn't a good coptic word to fill

458
00:27:26,119 --> 00:27:30,400
Speaker 1: in for it. And nobody knows for sure exactly when

459
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 1: the originals of all the texts in this library were composed.

460
00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:38,399
Speaker 1: But they think that the copies that they had in

461
00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:42,800
Speaker 1: these jars or in the jar came from somewhere between

462
00:27:42,880 --> 00:27:46,720
Speaker 1: maybe three fifty to four. But they could have been

463
00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 1: copies of much earlier works, we don't know. And they

464
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:50,920
Speaker 1: had all kinds of things in them. They had the

465
00:27:51,119 --> 00:27:54,320
Speaker 1: Christian literature, They had some writings of Plato. They had

466
00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:57,679
Speaker 1: like Plato's Republic, uh, sort of I think, annotated to

467
00:27:57,720 --> 00:28:01,480
Speaker 1: be a little bit more gnostic friendly. Yeah. What else

468
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:04,639
Speaker 1: did they have? They will they have? They had some

469
00:28:04,680 --> 00:28:09,679
Speaker 1: Hermitic literature, Yeah, which we'll see Alistair Crowley claimed to

470
00:28:09,800 --> 00:28:13,680
Speaker 1: have an intimate knowledge of. However, this this is important

471
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:17,320
Speaker 1: because because let's look back again at the the unbelievable

472
00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 1: circumstance and and the one of the questions that we

473
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,920
Speaker 1: will never be able to answer, which is, why did

474
00:28:24,480 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 1: someone put these jar and bury them at this cliff

475
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 1: or did they bury them on purpose? It sounds like

476
00:28:30,600 --> 00:28:33,479
Speaker 1: they did because it was sealed. And then another question,

477
00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:35,800
Speaker 1: who was that person. Yeah, we don't know for sure.

478
00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:39,920
Speaker 1: We probably the documents don't identify who their author was.

479
00:28:40,600 --> 00:28:43,120
Speaker 1: I think one thing that's often speculated is it was

480
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:47,920
Speaker 1: likely either like a monastery or somebody wealthy, because these

481
00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:50,560
Speaker 1: are bound books and those were not available to people

482
00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:53,240
Speaker 1: who didn't have a decent amount of money. So it

483
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:55,720
Speaker 1: was either like an institution that had some money to

484
00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:59,440
Speaker 1: spend on these documents, or it was a wealthy person. Probably.

485
00:29:00,280 --> 00:29:02,480
Speaker 1: Why were they buried there? I don't know. Were they

486
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:06,680
Speaker 1: buried for protection one to the persecution? Yeah, it could

487
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:10,360
Speaker 1: be that somebody valued these books and the theology they

488
00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 1: contained and said, well, you know, the Church is not

489
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:16,920
Speaker 1: so into people having copies of these documents anymore, so

490
00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:19,440
Speaker 1: they were hidden there. That's a possibility, But we really

491
00:29:19,480 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: just don't know and what But what we do know

492
00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:27,640
Speaker 1: is that this fundamentally shook the foundations of religious study

493
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:30,600
Speaker 1: in the West. Yeah, because now we had primary access

494
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:34,520
Speaker 1: to not what the gnostics enemies said about them, but

495
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:38,520
Speaker 1: what the Gnostics said about themselves. But we got we

496
00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 1: got their own literature. But here's the thing. What their

497
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 1: enemies said about them wasn't always wrong. Oh no, I

498
00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 1: mean they in some cases were basically the picture painted

499
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:53,920
Speaker 1: by Irony s Uh writing in the year one eighty

500
00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:57,320
Speaker 1: about the Gnostics he was aware of is not super

501
00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:01,320
Speaker 1: off base, it's just very unsympathetic. So he offers kind

502
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:05,600
Speaker 1: of a kind of a dense, unfriendly reading, offering, you know,

503
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:09,960
Speaker 1: not a generous portrayal of their understanding of things, do

504
00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:13,720
Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Not generous, but not entirely inaccurate. Yeah.

505
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:16,480
Speaker 1: He didn't lie, or at least as far as I know,

506
00:30:16,560 --> 00:30:19,760
Speaker 1: he didn't lie very much about what they taught. Yeah,

507
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:21,440
Speaker 1: he would just say, here's what they believe, here's why

508
00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:25,400
Speaker 1: they're immoral and intellectually inferior and wrong. Yeah, because it

509
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:30,080
Speaker 1: was contextualized within his beliefs, right right, Yeah, So what

510
00:30:30,160 --> 00:30:33,560
Speaker 1: are the core Gnostic beliefs? Like what makes somebody a Gnostic?

511
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:37,280
Speaker 1: And and how is it different than other Christians of

512
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:39,960
Speaker 1: the time or or just other people in general. And

513
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:43,160
Speaker 1: while we talk about this, listeners, just just a note here,

514
00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:47,600
Speaker 1: think about where you might have seen a similar philosophy

515
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:50,680
Speaker 1: turn up in other places. I think it'll be interesting

516
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: for people to find that. Yeah, sort of a Debbie

517
00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:59,240
Speaker 1: Downer worldview here, he asked me. Not necessarily this is

518
00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:03,479
Speaker 1: an interestinging that that that scholar I mentioned earlier, David Brackie.

519
00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:04,640
Speaker 1: A lot of, as I said, a lot of my

520
00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:06,720
Speaker 1: information here is going to come from him, and I

521
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:09,000
Speaker 1: kind of like his take on it because he says,

522
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:11,720
Speaker 1: you know, it sounds like a downer world view to us,

523
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:15,000
Speaker 1: but it also has very positive points, in some ways,

524
00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:19,280
Speaker 1: more positive than than some ways of looking at religions

525
00:31:19,280 --> 00:31:23,400
Speaker 1: that do exist. So so hang with me here for

526
00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 1: a second and we'll see how much of a downer

527
00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,959
Speaker 1: it really is. But it it's certainly if you're not

528
00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:32,640
Speaker 1: familiar with it, gonna sound weird as heck. First of all,

529
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:38,320
Speaker 1: coronostic belief number one, the whole material world, including our bodies,

530
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:42,760
Speaker 1: is just awful. The entire material universe. Yeah, yeah, the

531
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:46,120
Speaker 1: material universe. That yeah, I mean that by world, everything

532
00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:50,760
Speaker 1: made of stuff just sucks. It's just awful. It's flawed,

533
00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:55,000
Speaker 1: gross and wicked, and this world is not our true home.

534
00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:57,440
Speaker 1: They would not have looked fondly upon the Madonna So

535
00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:00,560
Speaker 1: Long material girl, No, no, they would. That is the

536
00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:04,240
Speaker 1: antithesis of narcissism in many ways. Yeah, except that it

537
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:08,000
Speaker 1: might articulate it pretty well. Gnostic theology from the other

538
00:32:08,120 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 1: end saying like, well, you know, I'm fine being a being,

539
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:16,760
Speaker 1: a confused, befuddled creature of material existence who doesn't know

540
00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 1: my true inner light. But why is this so flawed? Well,

541
00:32:20,760 --> 00:32:24,520
Speaker 1: the world is incredibly flawed because, and I mentioned this earlier,

542
00:32:24,880 --> 00:32:28,920
Speaker 1: the God who created this world is not the true God,

543
00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:35,120
Speaker 1: but a dumb, cruel, feeble wanna be god called yalled

544
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:39,960
Speaker 1: about oath or also also parallel with this idea, or

545
00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:43,480
Speaker 1: sometimes known as the demi urge right, and in some

546
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:47,760
Speaker 1: schools of nastissism, also called the craftsman. Yeah, which I

547
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:50,840
Speaker 1: think is what demi urge means. Yeah, exactly. In the etymology,

548
00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:54,760
Speaker 1: it's the it's the great artifice or one who who

549
00:32:54,800 --> 00:33:00,040
Speaker 1: builds or creates this world. So in a way, this,

550
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:05,040
Speaker 1: this creator is the source of the imperfection defining the

551
00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 1: material world. And in some cases, yelled the boss, this

552
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:15,160
Speaker 1: demi orts, this scratsman is not aware that a higher

553
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:18,720
Speaker 1: plane exists. Yeah, he's kind of fumbling, or he might

554
00:33:18,760 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 1: be sort of aware. It's just this is just not

555
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:24,680
Speaker 1: a good God. And you can see pretty immediately why

556
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:29,080
Speaker 1: this made Christians mad and they didn't like this, this

557
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 1: alternate theology. So as humanity just sort of a tragic,

558
00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:35,560
Speaker 1: silly accident. No, I'll get to that in the creation

559
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:39,280
Speaker 1: myth and a bit. But they well, it's it's a

560
00:33:39,360 --> 00:33:43,560
Speaker 1: sort of humanity is a way of rectifying a tragic,

561
00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:49,600
Speaker 1: silly accident. But our material bodies are no good. Material

562
00:33:49,760 --> 00:33:54,720
Speaker 1: is garbage, right, This this is a a reality, and

563
00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:57,320
Speaker 1: transition is maybe a way to put it. Oh, I

564
00:33:57,400 --> 00:34:00,600
Speaker 1: like that. I like that very much. Yeah. So another

565
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:04,280
Speaker 1: core tenant, it's that our our material bodies, as we've said,

566
00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,080
Speaker 1: materials are bad, and so our material bodies are not

567
00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 1: who we really are. We come from a spiritual plane

568
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 1: of existence, which is the plane of the true God, uh,

569
00:34:13,760 --> 00:34:18,560
Speaker 1: not the inferior creator of this disgusting, horrible material world.

570
00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:25,840
Speaker 1: And this true God is largely indefinable, unknowable, incomprehensible. Yeah.

571
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 1: And then and then finally, one of the other maintenance

572
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:35,840
Speaker 1: is that you can find salvation in achieving correct knowledge,

573
00:34:35,920 --> 00:34:39,919
Speaker 1: and achieving knowledge of your true origins and the true

574
00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:42,880
Speaker 1: origins of the universe, the true origins and nature of

575
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:47,319
Speaker 1: human beings, and discovering them through participation in these very

576
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:50,560
Speaker 1: complicated myths. Okay, so now I think it's time to

577
00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:54,319
Speaker 1: actually do a case study in Gnostic mythology and look

578
00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:57,319
Speaker 1: at the gnostic myth as presented by one of their

579
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:01,240
Speaker 1: scriptures that was discovered in the Nakamati Library. But before

580
00:35:01,239 --> 00:35:03,759
Speaker 1: we do that, we need to take a listen from

581
00:35:03,760 --> 00:35:12,920
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583
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593
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594
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Speaker 1: Plus dot Com slash Conspiracy here's where it gets crazy. Okay,

617
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:24,960
Speaker 1: now we're gonna look at what's in the Secret Book.

618
00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:27,680
Speaker 1: According to John, it was one of these texts contained

619
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:30,800
Speaker 1: in the Nagamadi Library. It's one of the cortex of

620
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:34,839
Speaker 1: of this uh, of this Gnostic school of thought. And

621
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:36,919
Speaker 1: I want to present it. I want to give credit

622
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:39,640
Speaker 1: where credit is you. I'm presenting it as summarized by

623
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:42,480
Speaker 1: the scholar I mentioned earlier, David Bracky, because he has

624
00:37:42,520 --> 00:37:45,080
Speaker 1: a really great summary and explanation of it actually in

625
00:37:45,280 --> 00:37:49,440
Speaker 1: his Great Courses series on Gnosticism, which I highly recommend

626
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:52,120
Speaker 1: checking out. So he's my main source on on what

627
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,759
Speaker 1: I'm about to tell you. But this is what you

628
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:57,439
Speaker 1: get if you read the Secret Book according to John,

629
00:37:57,560 --> 00:38:00,520
Speaker 1: which you can read online as well. Ah. Yeah, So,

630
00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:03,200
Speaker 1: first of all, authors unknown, We don't know who actually

631
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:05,399
Speaker 1: wrote it. Claims to be written by the apostle John,

632
00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:08,840
Speaker 1: but you know, it probably wasn't uh. It was written

633
00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:12,120
Speaker 1: probably sometime between like a hundred and a hundred and

634
00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:14,840
Speaker 1: fifty c e. We don't know for sure. But it

635
00:38:14,960 --> 00:38:18,279
Speaker 1: is an apocalypse and this is a very popular form

636
00:38:18,320 --> 00:38:20,160
Speaker 1: of religious writing for the time. In fact, there are

637
00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:23,640
Speaker 1: there are apocalypse is in the Christian Bible. There is

638
00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:29,120
Speaker 1: the Book of Revelation. That's the that's the Apocalypse of John.

639
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:32,440
Speaker 1: What what revelation there is just the it's the translation

640
00:38:32,480 --> 00:38:35,360
Speaker 1: of the word apocalypse. It means an unveiling or a

641
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:38,239
Speaker 1: revelation of things. Right. We've explored that point on this

642
00:38:38,239 --> 00:38:42,800
Speaker 1: show before, because nowadays, in modern US usage or English usage,

643
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:47,239
Speaker 1: it's often conflated to mean just a disastrous into the

644
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:50,080
Speaker 1: world or something, and really it's just it's a it's

645
00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 1: a an enlightenment of sorts. Yeah. I think it comes

646
00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:57,760
Speaker 1: from the fact that that often these revelations did reveal

647
00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:00,040
Speaker 1: things about the end of the world, but the it

648
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:04,800
Speaker 1: originally apocalypse just meant revelation. And though it is certainly

649
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 1: true that a very popular thing for the gods to

650
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:10,319
Speaker 1: reveal was something about the end of the world, right,

651
00:39:10,719 --> 00:39:13,839
Speaker 1: it's not gonna who's gonna win the next game? Right? Yeah?

652
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:15,839
Speaker 1: You have to be able to scare people in order

653
00:39:15,840 --> 00:39:19,879
Speaker 1: to believing in what you're telling them, right, Okay, Okay,

654
00:39:19,920 --> 00:39:23,280
Speaker 1: So the Secret Book, according to John, this apocalypse revealed

655
00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:26,600
Speaker 1: to the disciple John. The Savior appears to John after

656
00:39:26,640 --> 00:39:29,840
Speaker 1: he's already resurrected, and he comes back He's like, listen,

657
00:39:29,960 --> 00:39:32,399
Speaker 1: I'm gonna tell you the true story about everything. Now

658
00:39:33,920 --> 00:39:36,319
Speaker 1: this is gonna yeah, time for the real story. So

659
00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 1: are you guys already buckle up? I've been trolling you

660
00:39:39,120 --> 00:39:45,440
Speaker 1: for thirty three years. Um, So here it is. The

661
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:48,920
Speaker 1: true God is not the God of the Bible. The

662
00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:52,320
Speaker 1: God of the Bible is a fake god. The true

663
00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:57,440
Speaker 1: God is in fact, this abstract, huge mind. It's like

664
00:39:57,480 --> 00:40:02,440
Speaker 1: a Brackie's words are a vast intellect, and this huge

665
00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:07,520
Speaker 1: mind fundamentally cannot be known or understood by human beings.

666
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:13,560
Speaker 1: It's this vast, complicated but at the same time completely simple,

667
00:40:14,760 --> 00:40:22,200
Speaker 1: at rest, at peace, incorruptible, perfect spirit of thought. Well, originally,

668
00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:24,839
Speaker 1: originally you are you? Are you with me? So far?

669
00:40:25,560 --> 00:40:29,280
Speaker 1: Also to me like a giant quantum computer the size

670
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:32,960
Speaker 1: of several universes and maybe a giant single thought. Well,

671
00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:36,640
Speaker 1: actually it's everything there is. So originally it's everything there is.

672
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:40,759
Speaker 1: It's ultimate, eternal and at peace. Uh. And this thing

673
00:40:41,080 --> 00:40:44,880
Speaker 1: is called in in Brackie's words because it the invisible spirit.

674
00:40:45,239 --> 00:40:50,000
Speaker 1: That's actually what the Genesis song Invisible touches about. Is

675
00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:53,759
Speaker 1: that true? I'm not I'm not a genet wanted I

676
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:56,600
Speaker 1: wanted to be true. Well, let's see, maybe they are

677
00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:59,640
Speaker 1: listening to the show, So right in, guys, right in,

678
00:40:59,680 --> 00:41:03,320
Speaker 1: and let right Well, there is something about this invisible

679
00:41:03,360 --> 00:41:06,000
Speaker 1: spirit that figures into that because he wants to touch

680
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:08,920
Speaker 1: the light, the heat in our eyes. And he begins

681
00:41:09,200 --> 00:41:12,640
Speaker 1: to think, So I said he, but actually it's more

682
00:41:12,719 --> 00:41:16,719
Speaker 1: likely to say it. So the invisible spirit, it begins

683
00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:20,880
Speaker 1: to think. And when it begins to think, the thinking

684
00:41:21,160 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 1: produces an entity of thoughts. So it has a thought,

685
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:28,279
Speaker 1: and that thought is the first created thing known as

686
00:41:28,400 --> 00:41:34,000
Speaker 1: forethought Greek pro noia. That is a reflection of the

687
00:41:34,040 --> 00:41:37,160
Speaker 1: invisible spirit itself, because if it's all that exists, what

688
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:40,760
Speaker 1: does the invisible spirit have to think about except itself?

689
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 1: So it thinks about itself, and then that thought becomes

690
00:41:44,680 --> 00:41:48,560
Speaker 1: sort of a copy of itself. So the forethought is

691
00:41:48,840 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 1: a divine thought that is also known as an eon

692
00:41:53,040 --> 00:41:56,399
Speaker 1: like self awareness. Yeah uh, And these thoughts are all

693
00:41:56,440 --> 00:42:00,440
Speaker 1: known as eons or emanations from the great invisible Spirit.

694
00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 1: Are you with me so far? Oh yeah, We're about

695
00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:05,480
Speaker 1: to go into the deep water. Okay. Fourth forethought is

696
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:09,560
Speaker 1: also known as barblo, a word that we can't translate.

697
00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:12,120
Speaker 1: We don't know where it comes from. The first time

698
00:42:12,160 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 1: I heard it actually I as a child that was

699
00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:19,160
Speaker 1: watching uh animated film called Vampire Hunter D. And there's

700
00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:22,560
Speaker 1: a character named Barbara barblo or are they pronounced a

701
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:25,480
Speaker 1: barbelow as well, and I think it's a character or

702
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 1: a place, and so I checked it out. I did

703
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:33,399
Speaker 1: some research at the library and that that's actually how

704
00:42:33,400 --> 00:42:36,600
Speaker 1: I learned about narcissism at a young age. Yes, from

705
00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:40,319
Speaker 1: Vampire Hunters. To thank you, Vampire Hunter D. That's an

706
00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:42,520
Speaker 1: important thing you point out, you say character or a place,

707
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:46,640
Speaker 1: because I think with these divine with these divine beings,

708
00:42:46,640 --> 00:42:50,160
Speaker 1: in the Gnostic mythology, the line between place and person

709
00:42:50,320 --> 00:42:54,239
Speaker 1: is kind of blurred. Something like the invisible spirit could

710
00:42:54,239 --> 00:42:57,720
Speaker 1: be referred to as a as an entity that acts

711
00:42:57,760 --> 00:43:00,160
Speaker 1: like a person, but it can also be thought as

712
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:04,520
Speaker 1: like a place you can go. So the invisible spirit

713
00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:09,279
Speaker 1: thinks the eon forethought or barbailo and uh. And then

714
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:12,960
Speaker 1: when God has thought of as a collection of AONs

715
00:43:13,080 --> 00:43:16,640
Speaker 1: or eons, he starts thinking all these thoughts um and

716
00:43:16,840 --> 00:43:21,279
Speaker 1: this whole collection of thought eons is known as the

717
00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:25,840
Speaker 1: entirety or the fullness. And they and they use a

718
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:28,759
Speaker 1: buddy system too, that's exactly right. So each eon has

719
00:43:28,760 --> 00:43:31,759
Speaker 1: a counterpart of the opposite sex, making it this kind

720
00:43:31,760 --> 00:43:35,360
Speaker 1: of male female partnership. So it's not just an eon,

721
00:43:35,719 --> 00:43:39,359
Speaker 1: but there's like the eon of wisdom, which has the

722
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:42,560
Speaker 1: female main part of wisdom, but then also the male

723
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:49,120
Speaker 1: counterpart two wisdom. Okay with me so far. Maybe then

724
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:54,560
Speaker 1: the invisible spirit looks upon the barbelo and this act

725
00:43:54,719 --> 00:43:58,640
Speaker 1: creates a spark called the auto jenn a s or

726
00:43:58,719 --> 00:44:02,239
Speaker 1: the divine self origin. It is the English term brack

727
00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:05,319
Speaker 1: he uses. It's also known as the anointed One or

728
00:44:05,440 --> 00:44:09,880
Speaker 1: the Christ. So it's something kind of like sexual procreation

729
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:13,440
Speaker 1: between the abstract and invisible spirit and the Barbelo that

730
00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 1: produces the Christ. And you can see how fundamentally offensive

731
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:22,200
Speaker 1: this would be to the proto orthodoxy of the time.

732
00:44:22,320 --> 00:44:26,080
Speaker 1: And perhaps listeners to to some of you now, and

733
00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:29,160
Speaker 1: you keep in mind, we are not preaching this. We're

734
00:44:29,840 --> 00:44:35,160
Speaker 1: attempting to shine light upon this fast cover up theory. Yeah, okay,

735
00:44:35,200 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 1: so so I just have to start really fast. So okay,

736
00:44:38,320 --> 00:44:43,319
Speaker 1: So the Barbelo, which is a thought from the the

737
00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:46,640
Speaker 1: insible invisible spirit it thinks, I thought, it creates kind

738
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:49,200
Speaker 1: of a mirror image type thing of itself. Then when

739
00:44:49,440 --> 00:44:52,640
Speaker 1: the invisible spirit looks at the mirror image of itself again,

740
00:44:52,920 --> 00:44:55,680
Speaker 1: it sort of has sex with it spirit whatever it

741
00:44:55,719 --> 00:44:57,880
Speaker 1: does to it to create a second thing from it.

742
00:44:58,200 --> 00:45:02,000
Speaker 1: So it's a spiritual union. It imanates has a co emanation. Yeah, okay,

743
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:06,720
Speaker 1: And how are these these uh, these various elements personified?

744
00:45:07,000 --> 00:45:08,520
Speaker 1: Like if you had to animate them, if you were

745
00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:11,760
Speaker 1: going to make like an instructional cartoon about these various parts,

746
00:45:11,800 --> 00:45:14,360
Speaker 1: what would they look like? Pure white light extending forever

747
00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:17,120
Speaker 1: into the universe. No, I'm just kidding. I just made

748
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:18,799
Speaker 1: that up. But it's something like, I mean, I think

749
00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:21,480
Speaker 1: that they don't have you can you can They're not

750
00:45:21,560 --> 00:45:24,319
Speaker 1: like angels. They don't have like a corporeal No, we're

751
00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 1: not to that yet. These these things are more like

752
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:32,120
Speaker 1: sinchion concepts. But we're getting there. We're getting to the creatures. Okay.

753
00:45:32,760 --> 00:45:38,400
Speaker 1: So uh this leads so after the there's this barbelo

754
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:41,880
Speaker 1: uh invisible spirit union here, this leads to the emanation

755
00:45:41,920 --> 00:45:44,719
Speaker 1: of twelve more eons. So they're just creating thoughts all

756
00:45:44,719 --> 00:45:47,880
Speaker 1: over the place. Eons that are separated into four groups

757
00:45:48,280 --> 00:45:51,480
Speaker 1: led by beings called the Luminaries. That serve the divine

758
00:45:51,480 --> 00:45:54,080
Speaker 1: self original and I don't get into all their names

759
00:45:54,080 --> 00:45:57,480
Speaker 1: and everything, but ultimately here's where we get to how

760
00:45:57,520 --> 00:46:00,480
Speaker 1: all the trouble started. So you remember I mentioned to

761
00:46:00,520 --> 00:46:02,720
Speaker 1: go a minute ago how they all have male female

762
00:46:02,800 --> 00:46:08,439
Speaker 1: counter counterparts. Well, there's one eon called Wisdom or Sophia, uh.

763
00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:11,759
Speaker 1: And Wisdom is the lowest eon yet created, and she

764
00:46:11,920 --> 00:46:16,080
Speaker 1: is female, and she decides that she wants to think

765
00:46:16,120 --> 00:46:19,839
Speaker 1: her own thought without the help of a male counterpart

766
00:46:19,920 --> 00:46:22,160
Speaker 1: of the mail was So she she essentially wants to

767
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:27,200
Speaker 1: reproduce a sexually, so to speak. And this is a mistake,

768
00:46:27,360 --> 00:46:30,320
Speaker 1: a huge mistake. It is it is the ultimate huge

769
00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:33,640
Speaker 1: mistake uh. And the eon so she does it. She

770
00:46:33,760 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 1: manages to reproduce a sexually, but the eon she produces

771
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:42,160
Speaker 1: by this comes out seriously flawed, messed up, deformed, and

772
00:46:42,200 --> 00:46:47,680
Speaker 1: it's this misshapen progeny that's called all the bows. So

773
00:46:47,760 --> 00:46:50,640
Speaker 1: even in this mythology, the female is the one that

774
00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:54,120
Speaker 1: screws everything up, uh sort of, But she's also she

775
00:46:54,200 --> 00:46:56,640
Speaker 1: also ends up trying to set things right right. This

776
00:46:56,719 --> 00:47:00,640
Speaker 1: is kind of a hero's journey for Sophia. In fact,

777
00:47:00,880 --> 00:47:03,359
Speaker 1: this is an interesting question people have looked into, like,

778
00:47:03,680 --> 00:47:08,880
Speaker 1: is gnosticism more more feminist friendly than than other ancient religions,

779
00:47:08,960 --> 00:47:11,400
Speaker 1: And some people have said, well, yeah, it is for X, Y,

780
00:47:11,480 --> 00:47:13,600
Speaker 1: and Z reasons, And then other people have said, well, no,

781
00:47:13,719 --> 00:47:16,319
Speaker 1: it's not really for these other reasons. I think it's

782
00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:18,600
Speaker 1: kind of a wash. It has it has some more

783
00:47:18,640 --> 00:47:22,320
Speaker 1: female friendly ideas and it has some less female friendly ideas.

784
00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:26,240
Speaker 1: But but to Knowl's point, it is, it is true

785
00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:30,839
Speaker 1: that it has that that Pandora moment, that moment which

786
00:47:30,880 --> 00:47:34,719
Speaker 1: is very common in Western religions. Yeah, yeah, I mean

787
00:47:35,000 --> 00:47:36,719
Speaker 1: a lot. Let's face it. I mean a lot of

788
00:47:36,760 --> 00:47:39,360
Speaker 1: the people controlling these ancient religions were men, and a

789
00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:41,600
Speaker 1: lot of them didn't think very highly of women. Right,

790
00:47:41,719 --> 00:47:45,400
Speaker 1: it's true the gender politics which can continue the gender

791
00:47:45,400 --> 00:47:50,160
Speaker 1: politics you hear about today. We're much much different earlier

792
00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:53,799
Speaker 1: on the point of spiritual beliefs. So so we got

793
00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:57,200
Speaker 1: youlda both on our hands. Well, obviously, you aldo oath

794
00:47:57,239 --> 00:48:01,279
Speaker 1: has no place in the entirety. So where's he gonna go. Well,

795
00:48:01,320 --> 00:48:04,359
Speaker 1: they gotta cast him out, So they cast out y'all

796
00:48:04,400 --> 00:48:08,279
Speaker 1: the both. He's out of the heavenly realms satan. Right, No,

797
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:10,960
Speaker 1: he's not quite well. I mean to them, he might,

798
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:13,279
Speaker 1: but they don't use these terms what I'm saying. In

799
00:48:13,280 --> 00:48:16,760
Speaker 1: in the mythology, he is a stand infestation saying that commonality. Yeah,

800
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:19,920
Speaker 1: a bad figure who's cast out the differences. He's a

801
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:23,359
Speaker 1: bad seed instead of a rebellious force. He's just not

802
00:48:23,600 --> 00:48:27,680
Speaker 1: perfect this world of perfect thought and wasn't wasn't one

803
00:48:27,680 --> 00:48:30,040
Speaker 1: of the concepts that Sofia was actually trying to kind

804
00:48:30,040 --> 00:48:33,520
Speaker 1: of cover up, like her mistake, Like she was like, uh, yes,

805
00:48:34,080 --> 00:48:36,719
Speaker 1: see you, yes, exactly, She's trying to hide it. So

806
00:48:36,800 --> 00:48:39,520
Speaker 1: she throws them out into exile. And one more parallel,

807
00:48:39,880 --> 00:48:42,560
Speaker 1: remember in the Greek and Roman tradition, Vulcan and he

808
00:48:42,719 --> 00:48:46,760
Speaker 1: Festus throw him from Mount Olympus, uh, and becoming lame,

809
00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:51,239
Speaker 1: so becoming the artificer of that pantheon. Ah, that's a

810
00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:54,560
Speaker 1: very interesting parallel. Okay, So we got y'all the both

811
00:48:54,719 --> 00:48:59,000
Speaker 1: cast out, Bye bye to the entirety. But when he goes, unfortunately,

812
00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:04,239
Speaker 1: he takes some of the power of the entirety with him. Promethean. Yes,

813
00:49:04,360 --> 00:49:06,319
Speaker 1: and then what once he's out there, what's he gonna do.

814
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:08,480
Speaker 1: He's just out there in the void. He's out he's

815
00:49:08,560 --> 00:49:11,120
Speaker 1: outside of the entirety. So he's like, well, I'm gonna

816
00:49:11,160 --> 00:49:14,440
Speaker 1: make a copy of the entirety. Duh, that's what I

817
00:49:14,440 --> 00:49:17,279
Speaker 1: gotta do. I gotta make another one of those that

818
00:49:17,360 --> 00:49:22,080
Speaker 1: I came from. But because he's dumb and uh mean

819
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,759
Speaker 1: and not very good, he just flawed in pretty much

820
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:28,200
Speaker 1: every way, he doesn't do a good job, and instead

821
00:49:28,280 --> 00:49:33,440
Speaker 1: he makes this horrible world. He's trying to copy the

822
00:49:33,480 --> 00:49:37,400
Speaker 1: invisible spirits emanation of the eons, So you know, the

823
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:41,879
Speaker 1: invisible spirit thinks thoughts and they become companions these other beings, y'all.

824
00:49:41,920 --> 00:49:45,360
Speaker 1: The bath instead makes a bunch of godlike beings to

825
00:49:45,440 --> 00:49:47,919
Speaker 1: be in his court that are known as the Rulers.

826
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:51,040
Speaker 1: And these are these evil figures that are sort of

827
00:49:51,080 --> 00:49:55,040
Speaker 1: God's helpers and the bad God's helpers. And I just

828
00:49:55,120 --> 00:49:57,960
Speaker 1: want to say, far be it to like humanize this

829
00:49:58,080 --> 00:50:02,760
Speaker 1: abstract concept. But it's understandable thing on an individual level

830
00:50:03,080 --> 00:50:07,719
Speaker 1: to want to recreate a whole. But he's uh kind

831
00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:09,759
Speaker 1: of a dick about it. I just have to say,

832
00:50:09,840 --> 00:50:12,480
Speaker 1: Yeldebo doesn't think he's a bad guy in the scenario

833
00:50:12,600 --> 00:50:15,480
Speaker 1: at all. Yeldebo just is doing what he or she

834
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:20,160
Speaker 1: or it thinks it wants think they're a bad guy. Yeah,

835
00:50:20,239 --> 00:50:22,600
Speaker 1: Hans Gruber just wanted to sit on a beach with

836
00:50:22,960 --> 00:50:27,000
Speaker 1: you know Earn right right, Well, that's you know, that's

837
00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:30,400
Speaker 1: a that's a a point that we explore here. But

838
00:50:30,520 --> 00:50:33,440
Speaker 1: here's why I say that, you know, and being crassed

839
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:35,200
Speaker 1: when I say he's being a dick or whatever. But

840
00:50:35,520 --> 00:50:40,560
Speaker 1: he lies to his creations. He does. So He's created

841
00:50:40,600 --> 00:50:43,239
Speaker 1: these rulers and he tells them that there are no

842
00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:46,640
Speaker 1: other gods except for him, and he demands loyalty from

843
00:50:46,680 --> 00:50:49,640
Speaker 1: his eons. And this is this is bad news. The

844
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:53,000
Speaker 1: entirety gets wind of this and they don't like it. Uh.

845
00:50:53,160 --> 00:50:56,319
Speaker 1: So there is some some fixing that needs to be

846
00:50:56,360 --> 00:50:58,560
Speaker 1: done there, There is a there is an act of

847
00:50:58,680 --> 00:51:01,920
Speaker 1: repair that must be carried out. And who does that

848
00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:04,480
Speaker 1: fault to? Well, really it falls to Wisdom because it's

849
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:06,640
Speaker 1: her fault for creating yelled to bo Oath in the

850
00:51:06,640 --> 00:51:10,520
Speaker 1: first place. Alright, So so Wisdom's gotta fix things. Uh.

851
00:51:10,520 --> 00:51:12,920
Speaker 1: And so what she does is she temporarily comes. She

852
00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:17,680
Speaker 1: temporarily comes together with the eon known as Afterthought, and

853
00:51:17,840 --> 00:51:21,480
Speaker 1: this pairing along with the Barbelo. So there's some some

854
00:51:21,560 --> 00:51:26,320
Speaker 1: teamwork here. Uh. They try to reclaim the power that

855
00:51:26,440 --> 00:51:29,520
Speaker 1: ydo Oath stole from the spiritual realm of the entirety

856
00:51:29,520 --> 00:51:32,880
Speaker 1: when he left. And they kick things off by saying,

857
00:51:33,120 --> 00:51:37,719
Speaker 1: let's have y'all to Boath make some humans. So by

858
00:51:37,800 --> 00:51:41,040
Speaker 1: influencing Yelda both secretly yeah yeah, they send an image

859
00:51:41,080 --> 00:51:44,239
Speaker 1: of light in the form of a human and in

860
00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:47,240
Speaker 1: actually the form of the entirety down to yealda Boath

861
00:51:47,719 --> 00:51:51,560
Speaker 1: and this tricks yelled to bo Oath into creating the

862
00:51:51,600 --> 00:51:53,960
Speaker 1: form of a spiritual human. So they make a human,

863
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:57,560
Speaker 1: but it won't become animated. But this is a bear

864
00:51:57,600 --> 00:51:59,200
Speaker 1: in mind, this is not a human with a body.

865
00:51:59,320 --> 00:52:02,359
Speaker 1: It's for the spirit of a human. Uh So, then

866
00:52:02,440 --> 00:52:06,239
Speaker 1: wisdom and the Barbelo trick yelled the Boath into breathing

867
00:52:06,480 --> 00:52:09,759
Speaker 1: his spirit into the newly created human forms. Yelled the

868
00:52:09,800 --> 00:52:12,120
Speaker 1: Boath does it. But this was a bad idea for

869
00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:14,839
Speaker 1: him because in doing so, he passes the power of

870
00:52:14,880 --> 00:52:17,960
Speaker 1: the entirety that he took when he was exiled into

871
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:21,759
Speaker 1: these created beings um and and this means humans are

872
00:52:21,760 --> 00:52:24,120
Speaker 1: going to be more powerful than ye all, the Bath

873
00:52:24,200 --> 00:52:27,080
Speaker 1: and the rulers, and that's no good. So they gotta

874
00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:29,480
Speaker 1: scramble to cover up the mess. And what they do

875
00:52:29,600 --> 00:52:33,480
Speaker 1: is they quickly cram the newly created human spirits into

876
00:52:33,600 --> 00:52:36,640
Speaker 1: bodies made from the matter of the universe. That the

877
00:52:36,719 --> 00:52:40,560
Speaker 1: yell the Boath created bodies made of earth. And this

878
00:52:40,640 --> 00:52:44,480
Speaker 1: helps keep humans bogged down, just kind of feeling baffled

879
00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:47,800
Speaker 1: and unable to think clearly. It also limits their power

880
00:52:47,880 --> 00:52:50,479
Speaker 1: by by chaining them to this rock and a way

881
00:52:50,520 --> 00:52:53,560
Speaker 1: by gravity. Yeah, yeah, that would be an interesting way

882
00:52:53,560 --> 00:52:56,000
Speaker 1: of thinking about it. Like that, We're just we're just stuck.

883
00:52:56,360 --> 00:53:00,560
Speaker 1: We're just stuck in this nasty mire of material stuff off.

884
00:53:00,920 --> 00:53:03,080
Speaker 1: Uh So, now what are Wisdom and the Barbelo are

885
00:53:03,080 --> 00:53:06,719
Speaker 1: gonna do? While they get another plan? They send Wisdom

886
00:53:06,800 --> 00:53:10,760
Speaker 1: down in the form of afterthought to hide inside humans

887
00:53:11,160 --> 00:53:13,759
Speaker 1: and try to steer them back to knowledge of the

888
00:53:13,800 --> 00:53:17,800
Speaker 1: spiritual realm, knowledge of the entirety and so the great

889
00:53:17,920 --> 00:53:23,000
Speaker 1: the huge Salvation conflict and gnosticism uh allah. The revelation

890
00:53:23,040 --> 00:53:25,840
Speaker 1: of John is that Wisdom and the Barbelo are trying

891
00:53:25,840 --> 00:53:29,600
Speaker 1: to bring the power of the entirety uh present in

892
00:53:29,719 --> 00:53:33,600
Speaker 1: human beings back to the spiritual plane. Meanwhile, y'all, the

893
00:53:33,719 --> 00:53:36,520
Speaker 1: Oath and the evil rulers want to prevent humans from

894
00:53:36,560 --> 00:53:39,520
Speaker 1: figuring out their true nature, figuring out their power, and

895
00:53:39,600 --> 00:53:43,000
Speaker 1: prevent them from getting knowledge of the invisible spirit and

896
00:53:43,080 --> 00:53:45,479
Speaker 1: of where they came from. So it's a battle over

897
00:53:45,640 --> 00:53:49,440
Speaker 1: revelation of secret knowledge. The good guys want us to

898
00:53:49,600 --> 00:53:52,360
Speaker 1: figure out the truth about where we came from, and

899
00:53:52,400 --> 00:53:56,120
Speaker 1: the bad guys want to perpetuate the conspiracy. Right, Yeah,

900
00:53:56,400 --> 00:53:58,279
Speaker 1: that and the cover up. Yeah, and the cover up.

901
00:53:58,280 --> 00:54:00,520
Speaker 1: I'm glad. I'm glad you mentioned that. So that the

902
00:54:00,600 --> 00:54:03,279
Speaker 1: cover up it comes in the form of we get

903
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:06,279
Speaker 1: these false stories. So what the Gnostics said about the

904
00:54:06,320 --> 00:54:08,719
Speaker 1: Bible that the other Christians believed in that, you know,

905
00:54:08,760 --> 00:54:11,960
Speaker 1: the Jewish text that that they adopted from the Torah,

906
00:54:12,120 --> 00:54:15,320
Speaker 1: the Book of Genesis. The Gnostics would say, yeah that,

907
00:54:15,480 --> 00:54:17,640
Speaker 1: I mean, that's all pretty much true as it goes,

908
00:54:17,760 --> 00:54:20,880
Speaker 1: but it gets some things wrong because they believed Moses

909
00:54:20,920 --> 00:54:23,480
Speaker 1: wrote it, and they believed Moses was working from the

910
00:54:23,600 --> 00:54:28,680
Speaker 1: incorrect assumption that Yalda Boath was the true God. But

911
00:54:28,800 --> 00:54:31,960
Speaker 1: in fact Yealda Both was Yalda Both not the true God.

912
00:54:32,040 --> 00:54:35,719
Speaker 1: So it's full of just mistakes and stuff that the

913
00:54:35,719 --> 00:54:40,759
Speaker 1: Gnostics tried to correct. So a part of this secret revelation, uh,

914
00:54:40,880 --> 00:54:46,400
Speaker 1: According to John is that he he retells the Genesis story,

915
00:54:46,440 --> 00:54:50,160
Speaker 1: but he fixes the parts that Moses got wrong and said, actually,

916
00:54:50,239 --> 00:54:54,359
Speaker 1: what happened here, for example, uh, in Noah's flood is

917
00:54:54,480 --> 00:54:56,680
Speaker 1: that you know, Yalda both wanted to kill all the

918
00:54:56,760 --> 00:55:00,480
Speaker 1: humans to snuff out the invisible spirit, but in stead,

919
00:55:00,520 --> 00:55:03,239
Speaker 1: the spirit of wisdom came down and gave us some

920
00:55:03,480 --> 00:55:06,120
Speaker 1: you know, and and preach to Noah and revealed things.

921
00:55:06,160 --> 00:55:08,120
Speaker 1: And then Noah I was able to save some people

922
00:55:08,200 --> 00:55:11,719
Speaker 1: and preserve the spirit of truth like he fixes. I hope,

923
00:55:12,040 --> 00:55:14,360
Speaker 1: I hope listeners that you all hear the air quotes

924
00:55:14,400 --> 00:55:18,320
Speaker 1: around fixes right, that that that idea is so fascinating

925
00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:23,600
Speaker 1: to me, that you know, instead of in the biblical

926
00:55:23,760 --> 00:55:26,120
Speaker 1: recollections of what occurred when the a story that there

927
00:55:26,120 --> 00:55:29,560
Speaker 1: are actually two gods or two forms of gods who

928
00:55:29,640 --> 00:55:33,279
Speaker 1: are very dying, yeah, for to save them but then

929
00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:36,000
Speaker 1: also destroy them. And it gives like a reasoning behind

930
00:55:36,040 --> 00:55:39,480
Speaker 1: wanting to flood the world. That's really interesting. Yeah, so

931
00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:44,160
Speaker 1: you can imagine. I mean, this probably sounded as ridiculous

932
00:55:44,480 --> 00:55:47,440
Speaker 1: to ancient Christians who are not part of the Gnostics

933
00:55:47,440 --> 00:55:50,520
Speaker 1: school thought as it does to people who aren't familiar

934
00:55:50,560 --> 00:55:52,480
Speaker 1: with it. Today is just like, what is all this

935
00:55:52,640 --> 00:55:56,480
Speaker 1: complicated stuff? Where do they get this from? So in

936
00:55:56,520 --> 00:55:59,040
Speaker 1: a way though, right before you get to the end,

937
00:55:59,640 --> 00:56:03,120
Speaker 1: this is sort of a prequel to Christianity, yes, But

938
00:56:03,200 --> 00:56:06,359
Speaker 1: then also there are Gnostic texts that, in the same

939
00:56:06,360 --> 00:56:08,400
Speaker 1: way that this sort of rewrites the story of what

940
00:56:08,480 --> 00:56:11,200
Speaker 1: happened in the Book of Genesis, there are also Gnostic

941
00:56:11,200 --> 00:56:14,600
Speaker 1: texts that rewrite or at least offer a different version

942
00:56:14,640 --> 00:56:17,080
Speaker 1: of the story we get in the canonical Gospels. So

943
00:56:17,080 --> 00:56:19,440
Speaker 1: if you read Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, there's some

944
00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:22,040
Speaker 1: differences between them, but they present a you know, sort

945
00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:26,439
Speaker 1: of basically similar theology about who Jesus was um and

946
00:56:26,800 --> 00:56:31,000
Speaker 1: what's going on there. The Gnostic scriptures are very different. Uh.

947
00:56:31,080 --> 00:56:34,080
Speaker 1: For example, there's the Gnostic Gospel of Judas. It's a

948
00:56:34,160 --> 00:56:37,800
Speaker 1: retelling of the Gospel stories. This one was not found

949
00:56:37,800 --> 00:56:41,200
Speaker 1: in na Commodity. Is a different Gnostic scripture Discovery, but

950
00:56:41,520 --> 00:56:45,480
Speaker 1: just some brief features of this Judas. Judas is scary

951
00:56:45,520 --> 00:56:47,480
Speaker 1: at the one who in the old story is the

952
00:56:47,560 --> 00:56:50,480
Speaker 1: betrayer of Jesus now is not the bad guy but

953
00:56:50,520 --> 00:56:53,560
Speaker 1: the hero. And so this story is not so much

954
00:56:53,600 --> 00:56:56,319
Speaker 1: concerned with the works or deeds of Jesus, but with

955
00:56:56,400 --> 00:57:00,040
Speaker 1: his revelations, So Jesus reveals all the secret history of

956
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:02,920
Speaker 1: the universe and his plan of salvation to Judas himself

957
00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:06,320
Speaker 1: and the other disciples don't get it. And then Judas

958
00:57:06,320 --> 00:57:10,240
Speaker 1: helps Jesus slough off this you know, worthless material body

959
00:57:10,280 --> 00:57:13,319
Speaker 1: and ascend to the higher plane and and further his

960
00:57:13,400 --> 00:57:16,800
Speaker 1: message of of you know, revelation of the true knowledge.

961
00:57:16,960 --> 00:57:20,440
Speaker 1: And so with this inversion of that of that story,

962
00:57:20,560 --> 00:57:24,360
Speaker 1: for the ultimate human villain of the Bible, even even

963
00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:28,200
Speaker 1: worse than Herod, right, for the ultimate human villain of

964
00:57:28,280 --> 00:57:32,360
Speaker 1: the Bible to actually be the more like uh that

965
00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:37,320
Speaker 1: the Hans Solo. You're all clear, kid, Now, let's blow

966
00:57:37,360 --> 00:57:40,560
Speaker 1: this thing and go, oh yeah, It's absolutely necessary for

967
00:57:40,760 --> 00:57:44,520
Speaker 1: Judas to exist and betray and do what he did

968
00:57:44,600 --> 00:57:47,640
Speaker 1: in order for salvation to occur. So it's always been

969
00:57:47,680 --> 00:57:50,000
Speaker 1: a fascinating thing for me just going back and looking

970
00:57:50,040 --> 00:57:53,160
Speaker 1: at that story and how Judas then becomes vilified and

971
00:57:53,520 --> 00:57:57,240
Speaker 1: is evil for allowing for salvation. As as we'll see,

972
00:57:57,840 --> 00:58:00,520
Speaker 1: the nasty to the earlier point about diverse, the uh

973
00:58:00,680 --> 00:58:05,960
Speaker 1: Gnostics did not well, it's Agnostic traditions did not always

974
00:58:06,000 --> 00:58:10,680
Speaker 1: agree on these points, just as Christian denominations today don't

975
00:58:10,720 --> 00:58:12,760
Speaker 1: agree on points. Yeah, and so that that brings us

976
00:58:12,800 --> 00:58:16,560
Speaker 1: to I mean, there are various schools of so called gnosticism,

977
00:58:16,680 --> 00:58:19,480
Speaker 1: and this is gonna be, uh another point where we

978
00:58:19,480 --> 00:58:22,480
Speaker 1: should introduce some subtlety, because some things that people have

979
00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:26,760
Speaker 1: called gnosticism are things that modern scholars might say, Well,

980
00:58:26,840 --> 00:58:29,640
Speaker 1: I don't know if that should be called gnosticism. Uh,

981
00:58:29,840 --> 00:58:32,320
Speaker 1: you know, is it sufficiently similar to say that it's

982
00:58:32,360 --> 00:58:35,200
Speaker 1: the same thing ironeus is talking about in one eighty

983
00:58:35,280 --> 00:58:37,840
Speaker 1: or is this a different kind of thing? For example,

984
00:58:37,920 --> 00:58:41,480
Speaker 1: there are schools of thought. One of them would be Valentinianism,

985
00:58:41,920 --> 00:58:45,800
Speaker 1: after the religious thinker Valentinus in the second century. Right, right,

986
00:58:45,880 --> 00:58:49,280
Speaker 1: So in this school of thought, Uh, this demiurge yelled

987
00:58:49,320 --> 00:58:54,320
Speaker 1: to off the craftsman, not an inherently bad guy actually

988
00:58:54,480 --> 00:58:58,440
Speaker 1: or bad being actually is working in concert with this

989
00:58:58,760 --> 00:59:02,960
Speaker 1: higher god that in the spirit to bring about salvation.

990
00:59:03,120 --> 00:59:08,280
Speaker 1: So in other words, this is like the employee who

991
00:59:08,400 --> 00:59:12,200
Speaker 1: is at the clean up site yeah of an environmental

992
00:59:12,280 --> 00:59:15,960
Speaker 1: or metaphysical disaster. Huh, Yeah, and so and so valentiniani

993
00:59:16,040 --> 00:59:18,560
Speaker 1: um is one of these. It's like some early heresiologists

994
00:59:18,640 --> 00:59:21,200
Speaker 1: might have lumped it in with Gnosticism, and even some

995
00:59:21,280 --> 00:59:23,920
Speaker 1: recent historians might, but then other historians would say, no,

996
00:59:24,120 --> 00:59:26,880
Speaker 1: Valentinianism we should think about as its own thing, but

997
00:59:27,120 --> 00:59:32,160
Speaker 1: yelled Abatan. This is still flawed and is not always

998
00:59:32,680 --> 00:59:38,160
Speaker 1: helping with consent or knowledge, but instead being secretly influenced

999
00:59:38,880 --> 00:59:42,200
Speaker 1: another another flavor of early Christianity that was, you know,

1000
00:59:42,680 --> 00:59:46,760
Speaker 1: condemned probably by the proto Orthodox, but might also have

1001
00:59:46,840 --> 00:59:49,720
Speaker 1: been different than Gnosticism with which it was lumped in

1002
00:59:49,720 --> 00:59:53,200
Speaker 1: as Thomas Christianity. You may have heard about the Gospel

1003
00:59:53,240 --> 00:59:55,280
Speaker 1: of Thomas, right, this is this is one of these

1004
00:59:55,280 --> 00:59:59,240
Speaker 1: early discoveries of of another gospel that may have even

1005
00:59:59,280 --> 01:00:01,480
Speaker 1: come from the first century. It was an early writing.

1006
01:00:01,520 --> 01:00:03,560
Speaker 1: We don't know exactly when it came from. Oh, actually,

1007
01:00:03,560 --> 01:00:06,880
Speaker 1: we don't know exactly when any of these gospels came from,

1008
01:00:06,920 --> 01:00:10,240
Speaker 1: but we have pretty good ideas about the canonical gospels.

1009
01:00:10,480 --> 01:00:14,240
Speaker 1: Gospel Thomas was probably pretty early, and people used to say, well,

1010
01:00:14,240 --> 01:00:16,840
Speaker 1: this is a gnostic gospel, and now we don't know

1011
01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:20,560
Speaker 1: for sure. Jesus says things in it that sound pretty nastic.

1012
01:00:21,280 --> 01:00:23,720
Speaker 1: But then there are other you know that their their

1013
01:00:23,800 --> 01:00:27,640
Speaker 1: secret knowledge, their secret knowledge revealed only to certain people.

1014
01:00:28,560 --> 01:00:30,320
Speaker 1: But then again, there are other elements that I think

1015
01:00:30,360 --> 01:00:33,000
Speaker 1: scholars would say, no, it needs to have its own category.

1016
01:00:33,600 --> 01:00:40,200
Speaker 1: So here's here's another question. Oh, what happens snosticism. Yeah,

1017
01:00:40,240 --> 01:00:42,640
Speaker 1: this is a good question because I mean, I think

1018
01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:47,200
Speaker 1: the traditional story is well, Nasticism lost control for the

1019
01:00:47,200 --> 01:00:50,920
Speaker 1: battle of Christianity and the Proto Orthodox Church. Eventually the

1020
01:00:50,960 --> 01:00:54,720
Speaker 1: Catholic Church one out and got to dictate what theology

1021
01:00:54,920 --> 01:00:58,040
Speaker 1: was across the Roman Empire, and thus the Gnostics were

1022
01:00:58,080 --> 01:01:01,560
Speaker 1: just sort of eliminated from history. But I think there

1023
01:01:01,800 --> 01:01:05,440
Speaker 1: is now an emerging strand of historical thought that that

1024
01:01:05,720 --> 01:01:08,080
Speaker 1: says that's that's maybe not the case. It's more like

1025
01:01:08,200 --> 01:01:14,560
Speaker 1: gnosticism as a named thing lost power, but it also

1026
01:01:14,880 --> 01:01:19,160
Speaker 1: in a way got to define the path of Christianity

1027
01:01:19,200 --> 01:01:23,040
Speaker 1: in doing so, in the number one Christianity, Proto Orthodox

1028
01:01:23,120 --> 01:01:28,200
Speaker 1: Christianity and early Catholic Christianity would partially define itself in

1029
01:01:28,360 --> 01:01:32,320
Speaker 1: opposition and reaction to Anasticism, So it drive drove some

1030
01:01:32,920 --> 01:01:35,800
Speaker 1: theological statements in those ways, and in other ways you

1031
01:01:35,840 --> 01:01:39,320
Speaker 1: can still see gnostic ideas that seem to be incorporated

1032
01:01:39,360 --> 01:01:43,520
Speaker 1: into the lay theology of existing Christianity today. For example,

1033
01:01:43,600 --> 01:01:46,800
Speaker 1: think about how some Christians today might say that the

1034
01:01:46,880 --> 01:01:49,880
Speaker 1: material world is evil and the only true reality is

1035
01:01:49,880 --> 01:01:53,360
Speaker 1: a spiritual one. I mean that sounds compatible with what

1036
01:01:53,440 --> 01:01:56,320
Speaker 1: people would think of as normal Christianity today, but that

1037
01:01:56,400 --> 01:01:59,480
Speaker 1: also sounds a lot like a Gnostic idea. Now, ladies

1038
01:01:59,480 --> 01:02:02,280
Speaker 1: and gentile, and thank you for joining me. I know

1039
01:02:02,440 --> 01:02:06,520
Speaker 1: a lot of these pews empty because it's Sunday football season.

1040
01:02:07,680 --> 01:02:10,840
Speaker 1: But I'm not going to put on a fancy suit.

1041
01:02:11,640 --> 01:02:14,040
Speaker 1: I don't think the price of the ticket to the

1042
01:02:14,120 --> 01:02:21,080
Speaker 1: football game matters. There's another ticket that's trying to get right. Yeah, yeah, okay, yeah, yeah.

1043
01:02:21,120 --> 01:02:24,480
Speaker 1: I mean, so condemnation of the material world, or how

1044
01:02:24,560 --> 01:02:27,880
Speaker 1: about this is a common thing you'll see in Christianity day,

1045
01:02:28,000 --> 01:02:29,800
Speaker 1: the idea that the world is not the way it

1046
01:02:29,880 --> 01:02:32,920
Speaker 1: was supposed to be. You know, that there's something flawed

1047
01:02:32,920 --> 01:02:35,560
Speaker 1: about the way the world is now. Well, I mean

1048
01:02:35,680 --> 01:02:38,520
Speaker 1: you could say that that seems compatible with what most

1049
01:02:38,640 --> 01:02:41,959
Speaker 1: Christians understand from their modern theology, but at the same

1050
01:02:41,960 --> 01:02:45,640
Speaker 1: time that that sounds pretty similar to some Corognostic teachings.

1051
01:02:45,760 --> 01:02:48,760
Speaker 1: And this is uh, this is a fairly common belief

1052
01:02:48,760 --> 01:02:51,520
Speaker 1: in many other religions. Yeah, and then of course there

1053
01:02:51,560 --> 01:02:54,360
Speaker 1: are other traditions that have continued throughout the years that

1054
01:02:54,480 --> 01:02:58,160
Speaker 1: that do seem to incorporate elements of Gnosticism. So like

1055
01:02:58,240 --> 01:03:02,440
Speaker 1: the Mandans, that's you know, that's a religion that that

1056
01:03:02,560 --> 01:03:06,560
Speaker 1: seems to be in some ways nastic. Yeah, and then okay,

1057
01:03:06,640 --> 01:03:09,720
Speaker 1: here's here's something. We're going a little bit long on

1058
01:03:09,800 --> 01:03:12,920
Speaker 1: this podcast, but we hope you're enjoying it here and

1059
01:03:12,960 --> 01:03:17,440
Speaker 1: we have some good news. This ancient conspiracy goes into

1060
01:03:17,640 --> 01:03:21,080
Speaker 1: the modern day. So although Nasticism and I love the

1061
01:03:21,080 --> 01:03:23,680
Speaker 1: way to say this show is defeated in name by

1062
01:03:23,680 --> 01:03:26,360
Speaker 1: what would become the orthodox of mainstream church, those beliefs

1063
01:03:26,360 --> 01:03:30,680
Speaker 1: and organizations have been revived at several points in history

1064
01:03:31,040 --> 01:03:35,240
Speaker 1: leading to the present day. That's right. No, if you

1065
01:03:35,240 --> 01:03:40,439
Speaker 1: want to be a Gnostic, you could sign up today. Yeah,

1066
01:03:40,520 --> 01:03:42,720
Speaker 1: I've really been. I mean, if you want to show

1067
01:03:42,720 --> 01:03:46,680
Speaker 1: me how Okay. In the eight nine, a French librarian

1068
01:03:46,720 --> 01:03:51,320
Speaker 1: named Jules Donnelle founded UH the In Grace No Stick

1069
01:03:51,560 --> 01:03:54,760
Speaker 1: or the Gnostic Church. Funny story. Eventually he gave up

1070
01:03:54,760 --> 01:03:57,840
Speaker 1: and resigned converted to Catholicism because he fell for an

1071
01:03:57,880 --> 01:04:02,400
Speaker 1: anti Masonic hoax called the Taxil Hoax. Later later he

1072
01:04:02,520 --> 01:04:05,280
Speaker 1: joined UH. He rejoined his own church as a bishop

1073
01:04:05,560 --> 01:04:08,000
Speaker 1: and then this thing for this became a part of

1074
01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:12,400
Speaker 1: a larger entity. That church folded. But don't abandon hope yet, folks.

1075
01:04:12,560 --> 01:04:14,920
Speaker 1: If you want to join up, you can consider the

1076
01:04:15,000 --> 01:04:20,160
Speaker 1: spiritual descendant of this uh, the church the Gnostic Church

1077
01:04:20,280 --> 01:04:24,520
Speaker 1: of Apostles of the English Nasti Post League, founded by

1078
01:04:24,640 --> 01:04:29,280
Speaker 1: Robert Amberlain in Night. That church exists today in France,

1079
01:04:29,760 --> 01:04:35,440
Speaker 1: French territories, in the Ivory Coast in Midwestern America. Uh.

1080
01:04:35,480 --> 01:04:39,480
Speaker 1: And you know, Gnostics also have a tremendous impact on

1081
01:04:39,600 --> 01:04:44,480
Speaker 1: other figures that aren't necessarily like religious figures US. For instance,

1082
01:04:44,480 --> 01:04:50,520
Speaker 1: the Theosophical Society uh, spearheaded by uh Madame Blevotsky, who

1083
01:04:50,600 --> 01:04:53,400
Speaker 1: is not my favorite person, but you know, deserves a mention.

1084
01:04:53,720 --> 01:04:57,280
Speaker 1: What's wrong with Madame Blevatsky? Is just not my favorite person.

1085
01:04:57,480 --> 01:04:59,240
Speaker 1: That's the nicest thing I can say. Oh wait, no,

1086
01:04:59,440 --> 01:05:03,720
Speaker 1: because al To Crowley is right, Yeah, yeah, he's a

1087
01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:06,560
Speaker 1: he's a swell guy. But he's also inspired by Gnostic

1088
01:05:06,600 --> 01:05:09,120
Speaker 1: thought in a secular way. He had like the sexual

1089
01:05:09,320 --> 01:05:13,200
Speaker 1: magic belief in Gnosticism. Uh. And then Carl Young was

1090
01:05:13,240 --> 01:05:16,280
Speaker 1: fascinated by it. There was even a magazine that ran

1091
01:05:16,400 --> 01:05:19,960
Speaker 1: for short time called gnosis in a burst of creativity,

1092
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:22,360
Speaker 1: That's what they named it, and it was devoted to

1093
01:05:22,440 --> 01:05:26,280
Speaker 1: that esoteric tradition. But it goes further than that. Listeners,

1094
01:05:26,520 --> 01:05:29,560
Speaker 1: if you look at some of your favorite works of fiction,

1095
01:05:29,800 --> 01:05:33,000
Speaker 1: you will see the gnostic belief carrying on today, like

1096
01:05:33,080 --> 01:05:36,600
Speaker 1: Neanderthal DNA and a Homo sapien. Yeah, sometimes I wonder

1097
01:05:37,120 --> 01:05:39,920
Speaker 1: how conscious this even is, Like there are lots of

1098
01:05:40,000 --> 01:05:44,880
Speaker 1: science fiction novels and movies and stuff that have extremely

1099
01:05:45,000 --> 01:05:48,800
Speaker 1: familiar themes if you've read about gnosticism, but you wonder

1100
01:05:48,880 --> 01:05:50,800
Speaker 1: like did the creators do this on purpose? Or is

1101
01:05:51,000 --> 01:05:55,440
Speaker 1: or is this sort of cosmic conspiracy theory just a

1102
01:05:56,000 --> 01:05:58,560
Speaker 1: just does it run deep in our DNA? Yeah? Do do?

1103
01:05:58,640 --> 01:06:01,280
Speaker 1: We do? We naturally go to these places when we're

1104
01:06:01,280 --> 01:06:04,440
Speaker 1: trying to dream up what the truth about a crazy

1105
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:07,440
Speaker 1: world might be like, but examples would be things like

1106
01:06:07,560 --> 01:06:10,840
Speaker 1: a blade runner or the matrix. Well, just sort of

1107
01:06:10,880 --> 01:06:14,120
Speaker 1: like that meta idea of like, this is not the

1108
01:06:14,160 --> 01:06:16,520
Speaker 1: big picture. What we are experiencing here is almost a

1109
01:06:16,560 --> 01:06:19,520
Speaker 1: test or a cruel joke, and um, once we are

1110
01:06:19,560 --> 01:06:23,080
Speaker 1: revealed the bigger picture, our minds were either blown or

1111
01:06:23,200 --> 01:06:26,120
Speaker 1: we are able to you know, transcend to that reality.

1112
01:06:26,280 --> 01:06:30,240
Speaker 1: This is a painful audition in the great cosmic drama.

1113
01:06:30,440 --> 01:06:32,720
Speaker 1: Or I mean they trying to reach it back out

1114
01:06:32,960 --> 01:06:36,320
Speaker 1: to the to us and and give us these truths

1115
01:06:36,320 --> 01:06:39,240
Speaker 1: through our media. They found out that mass media is

1116
01:06:39,280 --> 01:06:42,680
Speaker 1: the way to actually get this knowledge back to everyone. Well, yeah,

1117
01:06:42,880 --> 01:06:45,840
Speaker 1: so there there's definitely this theme about like things being

1118
01:06:45,880 --> 01:06:48,520
Speaker 1: not how they seem. But also how about the theme

1119
01:06:48,600 --> 01:06:52,000
Speaker 1: of creations rebelling against their creator when they find out

1120
01:06:52,040 --> 01:06:55,920
Speaker 1: how flawed and wicked he is. Yes, either if any

1121
01:06:55,960 --> 01:06:59,160
Speaker 1: of you seen um X, yeah, yeah, and that that's

1122
01:06:59,200 --> 01:07:01,520
Speaker 1: a that's a great that's a great film with an

1123
01:07:01,560 --> 01:07:07,520
Speaker 1: ambiguous ending that one I won't yet. Okay, guys, At

1124
01:07:07,520 --> 01:07:12,080
Speaker 1: the end it was all the right and uh ice

1125
01:07:12,160 --> 01:07:16,960
Speaker 1: Cube ends up going like going back, and Samuel L.

1126
01:07:17,080 --> 01:07:20,040
Speaker 1: Jackson is eaten by the shark. Right, and then there's

1127
01:07:20,080 --> 01:07:22,360
Speaker 1: this weird cameo by Tom Waits. I don't know what

1128
01:07:22,400 --> 01:07:24,440
Speaker 1: he was going for, but I liked it anyway. He

1129
01:07:24,520 --> 01:07:26,520
Speaker 1: was the voice of the lawnmower. He was the voice

1130
01:07:26,560 --> 01:07:29,040
Speaker 1: of the lawn more So there there's other stuff, right.

1131
01:07:29,080 --> 01:07:32,240
Speaker 1: Sci fi is often steeped agnostic thought. One of the

1132
01:07:32,640 --> 01:07:34,680
Speaker 1: one of the films I saw him as a kid

1133
01:07:34,680 --> 01:07:39,600
Speaker 1: that blew my mind was Dark City. Remember that it

1134
01:07:39,640 --> 01:07:43,480
Speaker 1: holds up, It holds up, but yeah, it's supernostic. Right, Yeah,

1135
01:07:43,560 --> 01:07:46,880
Speaker 1: there's everybody lives in this Everybody lives in this sort

1136
01:07:46,920 --> 01:07:50,640
Speaker 1: of bewildered dreams stay where they're sort of kept stupid

1137
01:07:50,680 --> 01:07:54,440
Speaker 1: by powers above them, and that there's a revealer figure

1138
01:07:54,440 --> 01:07:57,120
Speaker 1: who wants to bring the light and make people awaken

1139
01:07:57,240 --> 01:08:00,000
Speaker 1: from their stupor and realize where they are and how

1140
01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:02,720
Speaker 1: they came to be there. Yeah, exactly. And then there

1141
01:08:02,720 --> 01:08:05,040
Speaker 1: are there are other films like that, but they're also

1142
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:10,160
Speaker 1: uh comics. Uh we're huge comic fans here at how

1143
01:08:10,200 --> 01:08:12,920
Speaker 1: stuff works and and uh we're if we're not on

1144
01:08:12,960 --> 01:08:15,360
Speaker 1: the air, sometimes we meet up just to trade comics.

1145
01:08:15,920 --> 01:08:19,240
Speaker 1: But one that really I don't know about you guys,

1146
01:08:19,240 --> 01:08:20,880
Speaker 1: but one that really impressed Matt and I was The

1147
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:24,160
Speaker 1: Invisible I've only read the first volume of it because

1148
01:08:24,320 --> 01:08:26,719
Speaker 1: Christian Seger, my co host on Stuff to Blow Your Mind,

1149
01:08:26,840 --> 01:08:29,679
Speaker 1: loved it. But he loaned that to me and I

1150
01:08:29,720 --> 01:08:31,439
Speaker 1: loved it. I've got to read more. I've got the

1151
01:08:31,479 --> 01:08:33,920
Speaker 1: full set if you want to read them. Yeah, yeah, dude.

1152
01:08:34,120 --> 01:08:36,280
Speaker 1: Well okay, so before we go and change this to

1153
01:08:36,280 --> 01:08:39,240
Speaker 1: the comics show. Well, we have to do the following things.

1154
01:08:39,479 --> 01:08:42,120
Speaker 1: We have to. First off, thank you so much Joe

1155
01:08:42,160 --> 01:08:45,880
Speaker 1: for coming onto the show. It's always a pleasure, fascinating. Well,

1156
01:08:46,000 --> 01:08:47,720
Speaker 1: thank you so much for having me. It's been a

1157
01:08:47,720 --> 01:08:50,000
Speaker 1: lot of fun. And as I said at the beginning, unfortunately,

1158
01:08:50,080 --> 01:08:53,120
Speaker 1: I mean a gnosticism is such a huge and fascinating subject.

1159
01:08:53,200 --> 01:08:55,200
Speaker 1: We have only scratched the surface. So if you want

1160
01:08:55,240 --> 01:08:56,960
Speaker 1: to learn more about it, one of the main things

1161
01:08:57,000 --> 01:08:59,320
Speaker 1: I'd recommend is the works of the guy I've mentioned

1162
01:08:59,320 --> 01:09:02,400
Speaker 1: a few times here, David Brackie is a scholar of gnosticism.

1163
01:09:02,560 --> 01:09:06,639
Speaker 1: Very interesting, very careful scholar. Uh and I like his work,

1164
01:09:06,720 --> 01:09:08,600
Speaker 1: So look him up and look at his books or

1165
01:09:08,640 --> 01:09:11,040
Speaker 1: his Great Courses series on it. And that's a good

1166
01:09:11,040 --> 01:09:14,040
Speaker 1: place to start. No, what what was that look you

1167
01:09:14,120 --> 01:09:15,960
Speaker 1: just gave me? Why are you? Why are you making

1168
01:09:15,960 --> 01:09:18,120
Speaker 1: shrimp eyes at me? Man? That's just the way my

1169
01:09:18,160 --> 01:09:21,519
Speaker 1: eyes looked. Okay, I'm sorry, Yeah, man, they're weird. Me.

1170
01:09:21,680 --> 01:09:25,240
Speaker 1: You gotta make them bigger, just like little slits. No, No, okay,

1171
01:09:25,280 --> 01:09:27,920
Speaker 1: look what's going on here, guys? Yeah it doesn't he

1172
01:09:28,000 --> 01:09:30,400
Speaker 1: have kind of I don't want to make this awkward

1173
01:09:30,439 --> 01:09:35,679
Speaker 1: for you, Joe. Okay, but listen, No, you've been You've

1174
01:09:35,720 --> 01:09:39,160
Speaker 1: been alluding to a thing. It's a weird vibe. Are

1175
01:09:39,200 --> 01:09:43,560
Speaker 1: you accusing me of him? And I'm accusing you certainly

1176
01:09:43,680 --> 01:09:48,120
Speaker 1: of being circuitous? But uh, far be it for us

1177
01:09:48,160 --> 01:09:50,840
Speaker 1: to sit around accusing each other. That's not gonna work.

1178
01:09:50,880 --> 01:09:54,400
Speaker 1: But this is a show about uncovering the truth. So

1179
01:09:55,000 --> 01:09:57,519
Speaker 1: lay it on, ut man, what's going on? Yeah, you've

1180
01:09:57,520 --> 01:10:00,320
Speaker 1: alluded to this. What's this Stuff of Life all about?

1181
01:10:00,320 --> 01:10:03,760
Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, you guys, Stuff of Life? Thank you.

1182
01:10:03,800 --> 01:10:05,920
Speaker 1: That's that's my new show that I've been working on.

1183
01:10:06,320 --> 01:10:08,559
Speaker 1: And you're right, I have alluded to it a few times,

1184
01:10:08,600 --> 01:10:11,519
Speaker 1: just talking about things that I've learned, UM in the

1185
01:10:11,560 --> 01:10:15,040
Speaker 1: research that my colleague and our colleague Julie Douglas has

1186
01:10:15,080 --> 01:10:18,439
Speaker 1: done wonderfully. UM as the host of the show. UM.

1187
01:10:18,479 --> 01:10:22,360
Speaker 1: But my part is I am the producer, UM. And

1188
01:10:22,400 --> 01:10:23,840
Speaker 1: you know, I produced a lot of the How Stuff

1189
01:10:23,880 --> 01:10:26,439
Speaker 1: Work shows, But as many of you guys know, that

1190
01:10:26,560 --> 01:10:29,639
Speaker 1: largely consists of folks in the room having conversations. So

1191
01:10:29,960 --> 01:10:32,920
Speaker 1: the extent of my production on many of those is

1192
01:10:33,160 --> 01:10:35,800
Speaker 1: you know, editing and doing you know, sound design here

1193
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:37,960
Speaker 1: and their music cues, and I've done some original music

1194
01:10:38,000 --> 01:10:40,280
Speaker 1: for some shows, but this is a show that's given

1195
01:10:40,320 --> 01:10:42,439
Speaker 1: me the real opportunity to just kind of, you know,

1196
01:10:42,479 --> 01:10:44,840
Speaker 1: stretch my legs a little bit, and I do original

1197
01:10:45,240 --> 01:10:48,040
Speaker 1: music compositions and sound design so to kind of give

1198
01:10:48,320 --> 01:10:50,880
Speaker 1: sort of like an immersive quality to these these of

1199
01:10:50,920 --> 01:10:54,280
Speaker 1: these episodes. Right, yeah, but what is the show about?

1200
01:10:54,400 --> 01:10:56,479
Speaker 1: I'm glad you asked. The show the Stuff of Life

1201
01:10:56,560 --> 01:10:59,799
Speaker 1: is largely it's just about, you know, it can be anything.

1202
01:11:00,120 --> 01:11:02,360
Speaker 1: Like the first episode, the pilot, which is actually going

1203
01:11:02,400 --> 01:11:05,800
Speaker 1: to drop in iTunes on the of this month, which

1204
01:11:05,840 --> 01:11:09,320
Speaker 1: is uh, will be next Wednesday, UM is called the

1205
01:11:09,400 --> 01:11:13,360
Speaker 1: Power of Fear, and UM we talked to experts in

1206
01:11:13,400 --> 01:11:15,800
Speaker 1: addition to folks right here at How Stuff Works. We

1207
01:11:15,840 --> 01:11:18,160
Speaker 1: have sort of a little round table section in every

1208
01:11:18,200 --> 01:11:20,519
Speaker 1: episode where people get to kind of weigh in on

1209
01:11:20,560 --> 01:11:23,360
Speaker 1: the topic and we make some really nice little sound

1210
01:11:23,400 --> 01:11:25,240
Speaker 1: bites and everyone kind of has a chance to sort

1211
01:11:25,240 --> 01:11:27,679
Speaker 1: of give their two cents on what we're talking about.

1212
01:11:27,880 --> 01:11:30,720
Speaker 1: But in the Fear episode, we talked to UM two

1213
01:11:30,840 --> 01:11:34,400
Speaker 1: folks who have a company where they actually train UM

1214
01:11:34,439 --> 01:11:38,320
Speaker 1: office workers for example, or people in retirement communities how

1215
01:11:38,360 --> 01:11:41,360
Speaker 1: to deal with an active shooter scenario. That's actually one

1216
01:11:41,400 --> 01:11:43,040
Speaker 1: of the little details I mentioned when we were talking

1217
01:11:43,040 --> 01:11:46,679
Speaker 1: about crisis actors. Um. This company goes in and does

1218
01:11:46,720 --> 01:11:49,640
Speaker 1: these drills. They do let people know they're happening. And

1219
01:11:49,680 --> 01:11:51,320
Speaker 1: the point that I made in the episode was that,

1220
01:11:51,520 --> 01:11:53,720
Speaker 1: you know, when people do these things without letting people know,

1221
01:11:54,280 --> 01:11:58,080
Speaker 1: that's a you know, good recipe for some lawsuits there. Um,

1222
01:11:58,120 --> 01:12:00,200
Speaker 1: but it's a it's it's a thing that happens. And

1223
01:12:00,439 --> 01:12:02,519
Speaker 1: they had a really interesting perspective on just how to

1224
01:12:02,600 --> 01:12:05,519
Speaker 1: deal with fear, things like tactical breathing, and they talk

1225
01:12:05,560 --> 01:12:08,559
Speaker 1: a little bit about the Centennial Park bombing. That kind

1226
01:12:08,560 --> 01:12:10,960
Speaker 1: of was sort of the impetus for you know, how

1227
01:12:11,240 --> 01:12:13,600
Speaker 1: do we deal with these scenarios and what you know

1228
01:12:13,680 --> 01:12:15,479
Speaker 1: kind of gave them the influence they needed to start

1229
01:12:15,520 --> 01:12:17,880
Speaker 1: this company. Um. But we just sort of kind of

1230
01:12:18,000 --> 01:12:20,679
Speaker 1: crack open stories and sort of look at what's inside

1231
01:12:20,680 --> 01:12:23,280
Speaker 1: and figure out, you know, what makes us tick and

1232
01:12:23,320 --> 01:12:26,080
Speaker 1: why we're such storytelling machines, not in terms of fiction,

1233
01:12:26,200 --> 01:12:28,760
Speaker 1: but just in terms of how we share our experience

1234
01:12:28,840 --> 01:12:31,840
Speaker 1: on this planet. Okay, so this is a story about

1235
01:12:31,840 --> 01:12:33,880
Speaker 1: the human experience. I would say so that's like, it's

1236
01:12:33,880 --> 01:12:35,080
Speaker 1: a good way to put it. Ben, you know, I

1237
01:12:35,080 --> 01:12:37,519
Speaker 1: have to say, I listened to a bit of a

1238
01:12:37,800 --> 01:12:39,599
Speaker 1: I guess a rough cut that you had sent me,

1239
01:12:39,960 --> 01:12:43,840
Speaker 1: and the sound design and the way everything flows together.

1240
01:12:43,920 --> 01:12:46,080
Speaker 1: I hate to make you know, a comparison, but it

1241
01:12:46,160 --> 01:12:49,439
Speaker 1: sounds to me like a radio lab type show that

1242
01:12:49,520 --> 01:12:52,719
Speaker 1: has all of the music flowing into a next segment

1243
01:12:52,720 --> 01:12:55,280
Speaker 1: and then you're somewhere else and then everything changes. It's

1244
01:12:55,320 --> 01:12:57,920
Speaker 1: just beautiful. Mane's also yeah, I've also heard it. I

1245
01:12:58,000 --> 01:13:01,120
Speaker 1: totally a production envy. Uh. And like all the shows

1246
01:13:01,160 --> 01:13:04,639
Speaker 1: we do how stuff works, this is free longtime listeners.

1247
01:13:04,640 --> 01:13:07,839
Speaker 1: Some of you may remember Julie Douglas from her tenure

1248
01:13:08,360 --> 01:13:12,679
Speaker 1: on Joe's show Stuff to Blow Your Mind, And uh,

1249
01:13:12,840 --> 01:13:18,760
Speaker 1: Julie has this fantastic um and this fantastic talent for

1250
01:13:19,680 --> 01:13:24,400
Speaker 1: finding the the spark or the hinge of a story.

1251
01:13:24,960 --> 01:13:28,599
Speaker 1: So when you when you listen to episodes of Stuff

1252
01:13:28,640 --> 01:13:33,599
Speaker 1: of Life, if you like this show, you'll love that show.

1253
01:13:34,080 --> 01:13:37,840
Speaker 1: The same applies to Stuff to Blow your Mind. Absolutely,

1254
01:13:38,000 --> 01:13:39,760
Speaker 1: and just say you guys know, um it is live

1255
01:13:39,800 --> 01:13:42,600
Speaker 1: in the iTunes store already and you can go and

1256
01:13:42,680 --> 01:13:44,800
Speaker 1: pre subscribe if you want to. There is sort of

1257
01:13:44,840 --> 01:13:47,000
Speaker 1: like a little tip trailer, kind of a teaser in there.

1258
01:13:47,080 --> 01:13:50,000
Speaker 1: Right now, I'm pretty short. But then on Monday coming up,

1259
01:13:50,200 --> 01:13:52,920
Speaker 1: we're gonna launch what we're gonna call Episode zero, which

1260
01:13:52,920 --> 01:13:54,519
Speaker 1: will be sort of a more like a four or

1261
01:13:54,560 --> 01:13:56,400
Speaker 1: five minute just kind of run down about how the

1262
01:13:56,439 --> 01:13:58,200
Speaker 1: show works. But I'll go ahead and give you the

1263
01:13:58,200 --> 01:14:00,240
Speaker 1: heads up here. What we're doing is we're to have

1264
01:14:00,240 --> 01:14:02,680
Speaker 1: a show come out every week. Um, you're gonna have

1265
01:14:02,720 --> 01:14:04,599
Speaker 1: it start. The first episode is going to be about

1266
01:14:04,640 --> 01:14:07,640
Speaker 1: thirty forty minute episode um. And then after that there

1267
01:14:07,680 --> 01:14:09,960
Speaker 1: will be like maybe a half a long episode that's

1268
01:14:10,000 --> 01:14:12,280
Speaker 1: a little lighter but sort of a companion piece to

1269
01:14:12,360 --> 01:14:14,320
Speaker 1: the topic that came the week before, and we're going

1270
01:14:14,400 --> 01:14:19,160
Speaker 1: to continue that. Um. And definitely and uh, full disclosure,

1271
01:14:19,840 --> 01:14:22,120
Speaker 1: I was I was hoping it get caught. I'm not

1272
01:14:22,160 --> 01:14:24,519
Speaker 1: sure how the final edit goes, but at some point

1273
01:14:24,520 --> 01:14:27,520
Speaker 1: in the show I did freestyle. It's true and it's glorious.

1274
01:14:28,760 --> 01:14:30,719
Speaker 1: So go ahead and look forward in the iTunes store

1275
01:14:30,840 --> 01:14:33,080
Speaker 1: and I'll subscribe now, and so you can get that

1276
01:14:33,320 --> 01:14:35,759
Speaker 1: episode zero in your feed as soon as it drops.

1277
01:14:35,760 --> 01:14:37,959
Speaker 1: And then the first episode, which comes out on Wednesday,

1278
01:14:38,240 --> 01:14:41,360
Speaker 1: and we've also got some social media stuff going on Facebook.

1279
01:14:41,680 --> 01:14:43,960
Speaker 1: I believe it's just Facebook dot com slash the Stuff

1280
01:14:43,960 --> 01:14:45,680
Speaker 1: of Life, but you can just search for it and

1281
01:14:45,720 --> 01:14:49,719
Speaker 1: definitely find it um and looking forward to hearing some feedback. Yes,

1282
01:14:49,840 --> 01:14:52,840
Speaker 1: Stuff of Life. Stay tuned. You'll never you never know

1283
01:14:53,040 --> 01:14:56,840
Speaker 1: who might pop up on that show. Uh. So there's

1284
01:14:56,920 --> 01:14:58,760
Speaker 1: there's one other, one other thing, Joe, that we have

1285
01:14:58,840 --> 01:15:01,360
Speaker 1: to establish, which is that Stuff to Blow your Mind.

1286
01:15:01,520 --> 01:15:04,559
Speaker 1: One of our pure podcasts, which you host, has a

1287
01:15:04,600 --> 01:15:08,080
Speaker 1: lot of episodes that would be right up the alley

1288
01:15:08,200 --> 01:15:11,679
Speaker 1: of our audience right yes, over on Stuff to Blow

1289
01:15:11,680 --> 01:15:14,519
Speaker 1: your Mind. My co hosts Robert Lamb, Christian Saga and

1290
01:15:14,560 --> 01:15:17,160
Speaker 1: I we explore all kinds of topics. Were primarily a

1291
01:15:17,200 --> 01:15:19,519
Speaker 1: science podcast, but we try to bring a lot of

1292
01:15:19,720 --> 01:15:21,960
Speaker 1: diversity of subject matter and so we end up talking

1293
01:15:22,000 --> 01:15:28,120
Speaker 1: a lot about mythology and religion, uh, philosophy, history, and

1294
01:15:28,200 --> 01:15:30,599
Speaker 1: we just try to keep it weird, to always surprise

1295
01:15:30,640 --> 01:15:34,240
Speaker 1: you with something strange about reality, because reality is pretty strange,

1296
01:15:34,280 --> 01:15:36,840
Speaker 1: isn't it. Yeah, I mean this one who knows about

1297
01:15:36,840 --> 01:15:39,759
Speaker 1: the other one? Right? Yeah, the the the the invisible

1298
01:15:39,760 --> 01:15:42,479
Speaker 1: spirit who knows what lies beyond. But if you want

1299
01:15:42,479 --> 01:15:44,760
Speaker 1: to check out some some stuff they don't want you

1300
01:15:44,800 --> 01:15:48,000
Speaker 1: to know, friendly topics on stuff to blow your mind.

1301
01:15:48,000 --> 01:15:50,400
Speaker 1: You might start with the episodes Christian and I did

1302
01:15:50,439 --> 01:15:53,600
Speaker 1: recently on the Science of the X Files from January

1303
01:15:53,720 --> 01:15:57,599
Speaker 1: of sixteen. Or maybe you could look at the episodes

1304
01:15:57,720 --> 01:16:00,519
Speaker 1: Robert and I did last summer called Techno Religion for

1305
01:16:00,520 --> 01:16:03,000
Speaker 1: the Masses if you're interested in these religious themes, where

1306
01:16:03,040 --> 01:16:07,880
Speaker 1: we talked about intersections of technology and religion, including some

1307
01:16:08,080 --> 01:16:13,080
Speaker 1: fascinating religions that border on some semignostic themes. But that's

1308
01:16:13,080 --> 01:16:15,600
Speaker 1: not your only show. Yes, you can also listen to me.

1309
01:16:15,920 --> 01:16:18,080
Speaker 1: I'm one of the co hosts on the show Forward

1310
01:16:18,120 --> 01:16:21,240
Speaker 1: Thinking with Jonathan Strickland and Lauren Vogelbaum. Or we talk

1311
01:16:21,280 --> 01:16:23,720
Speaker 1: about future technology. So if that's your thing, you can

1312
01:16:23,760 --> 01:16:26,040
Speaker 1: find me there too, And you can find Joe on

1313
01:16:26,080 --> 01:16:28,719
Speaker 1: the Stuff of Life. Yes, that's right, our man Joe

1314
01:16:28,880 --> 01:16:31,599
Speaker 1: is popping up left and right in the podcast world,

1315
01:16:31,640 --> 01:16:35,360
Speaker 1: and it's always a pleasure when our paths intersect. They

1316
01:16:35,360 --> 01:16:37,640
Speaker 1: have a demonic copy of me that they use for

1317
01:16:37,680 --> 01:16:40,760
Speaker 1: half of this stuff. You know, I get some of

1318
01:16:40,800 --> 01:16:47,280
Speaker 1: the same accusations. We're having a moment, right, Yeah, accusations. Yeah, yeah,

1319
01:16:50,920 --> 01:16:54,080
Speaker 1: you were biting on that baby. I saw it happen. Look,

1320
01:16:55,640 --> 01:16:57,760
Speaker 1: you can't go around be it. What are you the

1321
01:16:57,840 --> 01:16:59,719
Speaker 1: king of babies? You're in charge of all the babies.

1322
01:16:59,760 --> 01:17:01,400
Speaker 1: To be fair and all, we did let that baby

1323
01:17:01,439 --> 01:17:05,720
Speaker 1: get way too close. Guys, guys, let's remember that the

1324
01:17:05,720 --> 01:17:08,439
Speaker 1: audience is listening right now. Thank you guys so much

1325
01:17:08,479 --> 01:17:10,599
Speaker 1: for tuning in. If you would like to learn more

1326
01:17:10,800 --> 01:17:15,439
Speaker 1: about nasticism, you can check out our video series. You

1327
01:17:15,479 --> 01:17:18,880
Speaker 1: can uh send us an email because we have a

1328
01:17:18,880 --> 01:17:20,800
Speaker 1: lot of stuff in the course of this that, as

1329
01:17:20,880 --> 01:17:23,960
Speaker 1: Joe said, we couldn't get to at this time, but

1330
01:17:24,040 --> 01:17:27,439
Speaker 1: who knows, we might return to explore more early Christianity.

1331
01:17:27,479 --> 01:17:29,720
Speaker 1: If you want to talk to us directly, you can

1332
01:17:30,040 --> 01:17:32,639
Speaker 1: tweet to us. You can join our Facebook group. Every

1333
01:17:32,760 --> 01:17:35,479
Speaker 1: like gets us a little bit further away from being fired,

1334
01:17:35,760 --> 01:17:39,920
Speaker 1: So check out conspiracy stuff on both of those both

1335
01:17:39,920 --> 01:17:43,600
Speaker 1: of those formats. If you want to hear every podcast

1336
01:17:43,680 --> 01:17:48,040
Speaker 1: we've ever ever done, h including our earlier work with

1337
01:17:48,320 --> 01:17:51,519
Speaker 1: Joe over here, then you can visit our website Stuff

1338
01:17:51,560 --> 01:17:54,679
Speaker 1: they Don't want you to Know dot com the best

1339
01:17:54,760 --> 01:17:57,640
Speaker 1: and longest u r L in the history of mankind.

1340
01:17:57,760 --> 01:18:00,880
Speaker 1: And this, well, I was gonna say realm, but that's fine.

1341
01:18:01,200 --> 01:18:03,120
Speaker 1: You should go there check out all that stuff. And

1342
01:18:03,160 --> 01:18:04,320
Speaker 1: if you don't want to do any of that, or

1343
01:18:04,439 --> 01:18:05,599
Speaker 1: you want to do some of it but not all

1344
01:18:05,600 --> 01:18:07,760
Speaker 1: of it, whatever, we're good with any of it. You

1345
01:18:07,760 --> 01:18:11,240
Speaker 1: can send an email to conspiracy at how stuff works

1346
01:18:11,400 --> 01:18:38,560
Speaker 1: dot com