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Speaker 1: making every moment more during Super Bowl fifty seven, all right,
Speaker 1: time for instant reaction. Sean Payton headed to the Denver Broncos.
Speaker 1: So this has been a long back and fourth between
Speaker 1: Sean Payton and Denver. So I talked to Sean after
Speaker 1: he was on my show yesterday. So usually I talked
Speaker 1: to Sean for about five or six minutes when he's
Speaker 1: off FS one with me, and we've been talking about this,
Speaker 1: private conversations about where he's going, where he's not. And
Speaker 1: so I went to dinner with Sean, spent about four
Speaker 1: and a half hours with him. A couple of weeks ago,
Speaker 1: he very much liked the Broncos ownership His concerns were
Speaker 1: lack of cap flexibility and Russell Wilson's process a little
Speaker 1: disconnected from younger players. He was concerned about it. I
Speaker 1: shared that with you when you get into a situation
Speaker 1: like this. These new owners were going to reset the
Speaker 1: coaching salary market. So Sean Payton liked Fox. Sean Payton
Speaker 1: would have stayed at Fox, and Sean and I talked
Speaker 1: a lot about this. In fact, we talked about this
Speaker 1: after the show Monday. The things he worried about were
Speaker 1: always the same, cat flexibility and let's get Russell Wilson
Speaker 1: to get back to playing Russell Wilson style, which is
Speaker 1: almost basketball style quarterback move the pocket move a lot instinctive.
Speaker 1: He's one of the better guys that we've ever seen
Speaker 1: do that right. So I'm not going to go into
Speaker 1: the Adam Schefter Ian Rappaport space. They're going back and
Speaker 1: forth on whose job this was and whose job it wasn't.
Speaker 1: I was told very early that Denver really liked Sean
Speaker 1: and it was Sean's job to lose. Now, money is
Speaker 1: a big component to any great job. The more risk,
Speaker 1: the more money any coach would want. I do not
Speaker 1: think and I said this before. I think you need
Speaker 1: an offensive coach in Denver. I don't think Tamiko Ryan's
Speaker 1: as talent as he is. You got to figure out
Speaker 1: the Russell Wilson piece. I thought Harball was a good fit,
Speaker 1: and I thought Sean Payton was a good fit. I
Speaker 1: thought you needed, after Hackett, a proven commodity at head
Speaker 1: coach and an offensive commodity at head coach. So Harball
Speaker 1: Peyton were really good choices. So you know, when I
Speaker 1: had talked to Sean over the course of the last
Speaker 1: several weeks, he was always interested, always thought it was great.
Speaker 1: But there are gambles here. It's not simple. Everybody in
Speaker 1: the internet wants to make everything simple. Let me tell
Speaker 1: you something. When you start talking about the salary involved
Speaker 1: here and the components in place, it's complicated. Big time agents,
Speaker 1: billionaire owners. Sean Payton's high profile had a lot of leverage.
Speaker 1: I love Jim Harbaugh, but he's a lot and wants
Speaker 1: a lot of control, and Sean doesn't necessarily need that
Speaker 1: personnel control would like an opinion, doesn't need as much control.
Speaker 1: So what I was told is the Bronco owners like
Speaker 1: that very much, but jobs like this are complicated. Initially
Speaker 1: I thought it was Sean's and I do think Denver's
Speaker 1: job when you consider all the other openings, is the
Speaker 1: best because of good roster in key spots and Russell
Speaker 1: Wilson's talented. You know, Carolina, I think that's an interesting job,
Speaker 1: but it's hard to find quarterbacks. College football only gives
Speaker 1: you about one to two a year. So Carolina's job
Speaker 1: has a chance to be great. But what if they
Speaker 1: don't land Derek Carr or Garoppolo and they miss on
Speaker 1: their next two quarterback draft picks. I mean Arizona missed
Speaker 1: on one, went on another. Thought they got a hit
Speaker 1: with Kyler Murray. Now they may have a miss. He
Speaker 1: won't be available this year for much of it, and
Speaker 1: he's struggling to get along with people. So this was
Speaker 1: always really complicated. But what I talked to Sean after
Speaker 1: Monday show, in fact, he had just changed his avatar
Speaker 1: to Fox Sports. It wasn't that it was a coaching avatar.
Speaker 1: He just changed it to a broadcast asting avatar, and
Speaker 1: now he's taking the Broncos job. This went back and forth.
Speaker 1: In fact, one of the tells with this is the
Speaker 1: Jim Harbaugh resurfacing rumors. Well, what does that tell you?
Speaker 1: It tells you that they wanted Sean Payton. They weren't
Speaker 1: agreeing on the number, and so suddenly stories get out
Speaker 1: when somebody launts them out, Harbaugh's name surfaces to negotiating ploy.
Speaker 1: In the end, there were two coaches where this can work,
Speaker 1: Harbor Sean Payton. There's a lot of things I like
Speaker 1: about it. There are other reasons where it's not an
Speaker 1: easy job. If this was an easy job, Sean Payton
Speaker 1: would have taken this thing three weeks ago. It's not.
Speaker 1: The Russell piece is going to take work. The offensive
Speaker 1: line needs fixing, lack of cap flexibility. You've got a
Speaker 1: hit on several draft picks, and they just gave up
Speaker 1: several to the Saints to get Sean Payton. So it's complicated.
Speaker 1: But this stuff goes back and forth all the time.
Speaker 1: I had been in contact with people upstairs at my
Speaker 1: company with Sean Payton. It was a very respectful conversation.
Speaker 1: I thought Sean did a great job to keep me
Speaker 1: in the loop on it, and I congratulate. I think
Speaker 1: it was Schefter that broke the story. Good for him,
Speaker 1: that's what he does and does well. You know, I
Speaker 1: guess apparently I haven't followed it, but Ian Rappaport and
Speaker 1: Schefter have a disagreement on social media about who was
Speaker 1: a lead candidate who wasn't a lead candidate. I don't
Speaker 1: think this job is a good job for a first
Speaker 1: time head coach on the defensive side of the ball.
Speaker 1: I don't. I think it's going to be a lot
Speaker 1: of work to get this right. Also, something Sean and
Speaker 1: I talked about at dinner. You know, Sean's a smart guy.
Speaker 1: He thought about everything, and he said, listen, Mahomes twice
Speaker 1: a year and Herbert twice a year. What if Brady
Speaker 1: goes to the Raiders twice a year? Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: there's a lot of there's a lot of things at
Speaker 1: play here. It was never easy. It went back and forth.
Speaker 1: Teams leak this and coaches age in sleep this, and
Speaker 1: that's the game. We've been talking about this. There were
Speaker 1: a bunch of job openings, and about four or five
Speaker 1: days ago we were all saying, why aren't they getting filled,
Speaker 1: because I believe everybody was waiting for Sean Payton. Then
Speaker 1: Sean gave Carolina kind of the word, I'm not taking
Speaker 1: that job. So they go to Frank c Reich. He
Speaker 1: interviewed with Arizona, he interviewed with Houston, and he told
Speaker 1: me about all these or at least the Houston won.
Speaker 1: We went into some detail on that. It's private. I'm
Speaker 1: not getting into it. It was unique, but this is
Speaker 1: not simple. The division's tough. Mahomes is amazing. Herbert now
Speaker 1: has a really good offensive coordinator, I think in Kellen Moore.
Speaker 1: I don't think winning is going to be easy, but
Speaker 1: I think in the end, the Broncos had to hit
Speaker 1: a number for Sean to take the job. And Sean
Speaker 1: loved working at Fox, loved it. When I talked to
Speaker 1: him after the show, I thought he was going to
Speaker 1: stay at Fox. Then all of a sudden, you get
Speaker 1: hard boss stuff out there. It's fascinating, though, isn't it.
Speaker 1: Sean Payton's just too good not to be coaching. I
Speaker 1: don't think I've ever learned more from a guest than
Speaker 1: what I've learned from Sean Payton. And all the years
Speaker 1: I've been doing this twenty five thirty years, I don't
Speaker 1: think I've ever learned more. There are so many parts
Speaker 1: to coaching. Some of it's not even personnel and play
Speaker 1: calling and scheming. There's a lot of personalities you have
Speaker 1: to deal with, and he had such a good fit
Speaker 1: with Gail Benson and Mickey Loomis and Jeff Ireland with
Speaker 1: the Saints that it's going to be virtually impossible to
Speaker 1: recreate that in Denver. But what Sean wants to make
Speaker 1: sure of is, Okay, this is not going to be easy,
Speaker 1: and this is very important. This is not going to
Speaker 1: be easy. You have to commit to me, Yeah, to
Speaker 1: commit long term resources. What should pay me? Why it's
Speaker 1: much easier to move off a coach Cliff Kingsbury salaries smaller.
Speaker 1: You got this cornerback, he's young, in his prime. Russell's
Speaker 1: not in his prime, didn't look like he's in his prime.
Speaker 1: You can't move him for about three years minimum, so
Speaker 1: it could take a lot of work. It's not easy.
Speaker 1: There are things though about this job that are you know, listen,
Speaker 1: that are really that sound great? A young running back
Speaker 1: who can be a star, left tackle, nice receivers, capable
Speaker 1: tight ends, really really high end corners. This is not
Speaker 1: a rebuild. You got to fix the offensive line and
Speaker 1: you got to make Russell Wilson work, But it's not
Speaker 1: a rebuild. There was Also, I'll be interested to hear
Speaker 1: about the staff, the defensive coordinator, the offensive coordinator. Sean
Speaker 1: and I have discussed that at length. I'm gonna let
Speaker 1: that come out over the next probably seventy two hours.
Speaker 1: There's a couple of names out there that have been
Speaker 1: connected to jobs but are not official. This could end
Speaker 1: up being a really, really strong staff. I'll leave it
Speaker 1: at that, but I'm happy for him, smart guy. The
Speaker 1: league is pivoted to offense. This was a job for
Speaker 1: an offensive head coach. Absolutely, Harbon Peyton. It will be
Speaker 1: a lift some really good pieces. But you know, Russell
Speaker 1: is a unique personality. A lot of people took shots
Speaker 1: at him when he left Seattle. You don't see a
Speaker 1: lot of that with star quarterbacks. And then he played
Speaker 1: a little better at the end of the year when
Speaker 1: Hackett was gone. That's encouraging. Jerry Judy, I think it
Speaker 1: was stuck up for him in the Denver locker room.
Speaker 1: That was encouraging. So I can't wait to watch it.
Speaker 1: I'm not sure what it's going to look like, and
Speaker 1: that's to me, the best stories. I'm not exactly sure
Speaker 1: what it's going to look like. I think suddenly, unless
Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers goes to the Jets, Denver will be the
Speaker 1: most interesting team in the NFL this year. Now, if
Speaker 1: Aaron goes to the Jets, that's going to be fascinating.
Speaker 1: But Russell Wilson and Sean Payton, because you know, Sean
Speaker 1: Payton has definitive views on how to run a football operation,
Speaker 1: and Russell Wilson going to have to make some changes.
Speaker 1: How easily does he make those changes? I'm not sure.
Speaker 1: Things I like about the job, things I don't love
Speaker 1: about the job. Anyway, instant reaction Sean Payton, Denver Broncos
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Speaker 1: Gamble Dot in West Virginia. All right, we bring in
Speaker 1: Mike Silver, host of open Mic on the volume long Time,
Speaker 1: well sourced, hyper Connected NFL Ryder. So you know, Mike,
Speaker 1: I spent five hours one night with Sean Payton a
Speaker 1: couple of weeks ago. And you and I. You're a
Speaker 1: real reporter. I occasionally have relationships, but I'm not in
Speaker 1: the story of breaking business. It's what you do, and
Speaker 1: do it very very well. But we sat down and um,
Speaker 1: you know, Sean and I talked about everything, the Russell
Speaker 1: Wilson piece, the owner piece, the mahomes Herbert four times
Speaker 1: a year piece, and the hard bought piece. And in
Speaker 1: our relationships with coaches, I'm I always feel like a
Speaker 1: responsibility to tell the audience as much as I can,
Speaker 1: and I will hear not everything. There are some things
Speaker 1: I want to protect my relationship with Sean. I don't
Speaker 1: want to get into the whizzing match between Ian Rappaport
Speaker 1: and Adam Schefter. But I felt when I had dinner
Speaker 1: with Sean very strongly that he was the coach that
Speaker 1: he knew there were obstacles, and I felt, but this
Speaker 1: is my takeaway that you're gonna have to pay for
Speaker 1: Sean because this job is not easy. There's some good stuff,
Speaker 1: it's not a rebuild, but the Russell Wilson thing is real.
Speaker 1: Is that? Is that how you viewed this situation, that
Speaker 1: the price point. I mean, that's why I talked to
Speaker 1: Sean Monday after my show. I thought he was a
Speaker 1: Fox employee. I think this thing came down to Denver
Speaker 1: making a financial commitment to Sean, letting him know, Hey,
Speaker 1: we know it's not easy. We're going to take the
Speaker 1: pay scale to a different level. Is that your interpretation, Well,
Speaker 1: I think there's a couple of things. First of all,
Speaker 1: it's a leap of faith on both sides for whoever
Speaker 1: was going to take that job. You've got at least
Speaker 1: a year with Russell Wilson, and you pray it doesn't
Speaker 1: look like it did this last year, possibly two years,
Speaker 1: because it really does impact your cap You've lost a
Speaker 1: lot of draft capital because of that trade as well.
Speaker 1: And you are in that division with Mahomes and Herbert,
Speaker 1: and you know that's kind of a you know, something
Speaker 1: that would give a candidate with options pause, even possibly
Speaker 1: to mke o Ryan's. He may have had his other
Speaker 1: reasons for wanting Houston, or he may have had the
Speaker 1: choice made for him and just read the tea leaves.
Speaker 1: But that was one thing. If you're looking to hire
Speaker 1: Sean Payton, you know the price tag is high. You
Speaker 1: have to give up draft capital. That's especially sensitive if
Speaker 1: you're the Broncos because you just gave up all that
Speaker 1: draft capital for Russell. You got the one back for Chub.
Speaker 1: You're giving that away now. If you're the Texans, you
Speaker 1: could say, yeah, we've got draft capital, We've got all
Speaker 1: that Deshaun Watson loot. But you are necessarily, you know,
Speaker 1: weakening yourself. So you're giving up draft capital. You're giving
Speaker 1: up money. Now. That was a strength of the Broncos job.
Speaker 1: They do have lots of money. They do have Russell issue.
Speaker 1: You know, George Peyton is a very very well liked GM.
Speaker 1: If Sean was going to come in somewhere and turn
Speaker 1: the GM into essentially a director of player personnel, you know,
Speaker 1: George is someone that you could see that relationship working out,
Speaker 1: at least in the short term. He's super well liked
Speaker 1: he goes with the flow. But you know, my read
Speaker 1: on the Broncos from Afar is that they knew that
Speaker 1: Sean was expensive, both in terms of draft capital and money,
Speaker 1: and they knew that he came in with a little swag.
Speaker 1: He wasn't kissing the ring of the Walmart and oh wow,
Speaker 1: I just wanted you know, he's basically saying you should
Speaker 1: hire me because I'm awesome. So you also had to
Speaker 1: go down parallel paths before you decided whether you're going
Speaker 1: to do that, And it just seemed to me that
Speaker 1: at least the public facing side of it. Remember, these
Speaker 1: are the richest people you know there are, and they're
Speaker 1: not used to really being criticized, like say, NFL owners
Speaker 1: normally get criticized, and people are looking at it going, well,
Speaker 1: you asked Harbaugh, he said no, you flew off to
Speaker 1: see him again. He still said no, Dan Quinn dropped out,
Speaker 1: and Damiko Ryan's chose the Texans over you. So whether
Speaker 1: that's an accurate assessment, because I think there were a
Speaker 1: lot of moving parts. Also, by the way, someone leaked
Speaker 1: that David Shaw was the favorite. So now it really
Speaker 1: looks like four different people that you either couldn't get
Speaker 1: or didn't want, and now you're like, well, how are
Speaker 1: we gonna not look like these you know, bumbling billionaires.
Speaker 1: What are we gonna do. Let's swing big baby, because
Speaker 1: money is a strength. And you know that them Sean Payton,
Speaker 1: whenever they paid Sean Payton is like you and I,
Speaker 1: you know, exchanging a burger basically. Well, and here's the thing,
Speaker 1: there are parts of the job that are really good.
Speaker 1: Like in the NFL, you've got a talented quarterback, a
Speaker 1: starting left tackle, pretty good perimeter weapons, a young running
Speaker 1: back who was hurt but people really like, yeah, some
Speaker 1: of the best corners in the sport. And you've got
Speaker 1: some defensive personnel that can you know, that can move
Speaker 1: around you. Also, it's a big brand and you can,
Speaker 1: as you know, you can get draft capital pretty quickly,
Speaker 1: move people here there. You can. But I I said
Speaker 1: this in my ten minute ramble before you if this
Speaker 1: was if this was an easy job, Sean would have
Speaker 1: taken it a month ago or three weeks ago. I
Speaker 1: think the Russell piece scares people, but I also think
Speaker 1: there's a part of show like okay, so I used
Speaker 1: this one the forty nights traded for Christian McCaffrey. I
Speaker 1: had to write a column immediately for the chronicle, and
Speaker 1: I led with something the effect of this was a
Speaker 1: move based on or born of arrogance. And I say
Speaker 1: that lovingly, by the way, as a fellow, that was
Speaker 1: a great call. But I mean, like, I know what
Speaker 1: it's like. I believe in my abilities, you know, probably
Speaker 1: to a ridiculous degree at times. And if you're Kyle Shanahan,
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, man, I know it costs a lot.
Speaker 1: But if I get Christian McCaffrey and I put him
Speaker 1: in my offense, and I like, it's gonna be insane.
Speaker 1: So you I think you want your coach to have
Speaker 1: that streak. So look, I've known Sean Payton since the
Speaker 1: early days and I love him, and one reason I
Speaker 1: do is because he believes that Sean Payton is really,
Speaker 1: really good at this. So in a way, I think
Speaker 1: you're like, yeah, I could do that. And by the way,
Speaker 1: like there might be more attractiveness because everyone thinks it's
Speaker 1: a bad job and everyone thinks for us, so can't
Speaker 1: be salvaged. And if you have struggled at first, people
Speaker 1: might give you a little bit of elite, you know,
Speaker 1: a little bit of leeway there. But if you don't
Speaker 1: and you come in and you know, make the playoffs
Speaker 1: next year, people are gonna go Sean Payton, Man, look
Speaker 1: what he did, you know, and dun Peterson just kind
Speaker 1: of did it. He had an easy division. But you know,
Speaker 1: Sean Payton is one of the absolute best of the
Speaker 1: world at what he does, and he knows it and
Speaker 1: his knowledge of that is part of what makes him
Speaker 1: who he is, and that's what you're paying. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: I felt I said this early that I thought this
Speaker 1: was a job for an offensive coach. An example, I
Speaker 1: think Brian Flores is kind of a fascinating hire in Arizona.
Speaker 1: Special team's defense in Miami got good in a week.
Speaker 1: And he's an ass kicker. He won't take he's an alpha,
Speaker 1: he won't take any Kyler's stuff. Right, But Mike and
Speaker 1: I've been on this for a year and it's tedious
Speaker 1: to the audience. But the league is changing. Belichick struggling now.
Speaker 1: Andy Reid is the new Belichick, and this job, the
Speaker 1: defense is so talented. You can get a good coordinator.
Speaker 1: I think you got a massage the Russell piece. I
Speaker 1: think it needed. And this is not a shot at Demiko.
Speaker 1: I think it needed a veteran offensive coach who was
Speaker 1: dealt with drama, with quarterbacks, with coordinators. This is a
Speaker 1: solvable job, but Mike, it's a hard job, right, Yeah.
Speaker 1: And going back to the Flores thing, Okay, So first
Speaker 1: of all, you and I have talked about this publicly
Speaker 1: and privately. Brian Flores did not get fired because he
Speaker 1: was not doing a good job as a coach. He
Speaker 1: got fired because of interpersonal yes, abrasiveness really, and he
Speaker 1: was not getting along with a lot of people, including
Speaker 1: first and foremost is incumbent backs who we saw it
Speaker 1: with a little love this year and yeah, Gobatock brilliance
Speaker 1: was a lot different. So I'm a little scared when
Speaker 1: you say that. I yet why And look, first of all,
Speaker 1: I want Brian Floys to get another job at some point.
Speaker 1: I do believe there's system of racism and hiring practices,
Speaker 1: and you know he had the guts to to you know, Sue,
Speaker 1: and I hope that that is not factricked to whether
Speaker 1: it gets another job. I'd be happy for him. On
Speaker 1: the other hand, man, it's the same thing. It's like
Speaker 1: the Broncos can't just say we goofed on Russell goodbye. Yeah,
Speaker 1: at least the Cardinals can't do that with Kyler, and
Speaker 1: given Brian Floor's track record with two like, I agree,
Speaker 1: you want to draw the line and start changing the paradigm.
Speaker 1: And by the way, Sean Payton's gonna do the same
Speaker 1: thing with Russell. John's gonna be I can't rust that
Speaker 1: sixth person team that follows you around the facility. They're gone, buddy.
Speaker 1: And you know how, you have a bigger office than
Speaker 1: I do. Let's either switch or I'm giving that office
Speaker 1: to you know whoever. So that's going to happen. But
Speaker 1: I mean, I think Sean has great people skills and
Speaker 1: will get that done. And Russell will have, you know,
Speaker 1: the emotional intelligence to take it in the spirit it's intended.
Speaker 1: If Bryan Flores comes in and starts, you know, treating
Speaker 1: Kyler like dirt, that look you paid Kyler. You tried
Speaker 1: to put a close in his contract that made him
Speaker 1: look like a twelve year old and then actually backed
Speaker 1: off even worse, you acknowledge that he doesn't study enough.
Speaker 1: In your eyes, Then it looked terrible because you tried
Speaker 1: to put it in the contract. And then you're like fine, fine,
Speaker 1: don't even study, but here's all the money. He's injured
Speaker 1: and speed is part of what makes him great. And
Speaker 1: you know, now you're gonna bring in someone who's like, hey, Kyler, man,
Speaker 1: we don't like your act at all, and you either
Speaker 1: get with it or that might not be the best
Speaker 1: thing organizationally either. I think the Cardinals have to treat
Speaker 1: Kyler unfortunately for them, the way the Broncos have to
Speaker 1: treat Russell right now. Make it work in the short term.
Speaker 1: And if you're Sean Payton, you have the credibility to
Speaker 1: get Russell to buy in. If you are Brian Flores
Speaker 1: and Kyler's not Russell either, I think that that scares
Speaker 1: me a little bit. And again I'm not saying Brian
Speaker 1: Flores is a really good head coach. Hope he gets
Speaker 1: another job. They'll deserve it. That particular one scares me
Speaker 1: a little. So one of the things that is a
Speaker 1: reality and I've pushed against, and maybe because I haven't
Speaker 1: been offered this level of money, but sometimes you just
Speaker 1: get offered money you can't say no to. And I
Speaker 1: you know, we've seen coaches take jobs, and I've seen
Speaker 1: actors do movies. I'm like this is absurd. What are you?
Speaker 1: And then you see the you see the price tag
Speaker 1: and you're like, Okay, I get it, I understand it.
Speaker 1: Um so I believe that what the Broncos page Sean Payton,
Speaker 1: and this is why Harbaugh came in again. I think
Speaker 1: I think Sean liked working in television and new next year,
Speaker 1: you've got two great college quarterbacks who are both guys
Speaker 1: that can start I think in the end, and it
Speaker 1: won't come out maybe for a while. Could this just
Speaker 1: have been you know, twenty five million a year. I'll
Speaker 1: figure it out, right, I mean that, you know there's
Speaker 1: always a number for sure, and um yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: I don't know exactly how it played out again because
Speaker 1: we saw we saw the public phase part of it,
Speaker 1: and the owners, the new owners were looking like amateurs.
Speaker 1: They have some It's a it's a less attractive job
Speaker 1: in some ways, along with the fact that it gets
Speaker 1: even less attractive if you have to give up a
Speaker 1: one and a two when you're already strapped to hire
Speaker 1: this specific person. What is their strength that they could offer.
Speaker 1: We are so rich that when you hear the numbers
Speaker 1: like that, what we hear is, yeah, I'll take fries
Speaker 1: with that go back to my Burger analogy. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's just not the way that you know, a norrable
Speaker 1: human would think of it. Now, we saw Temper do
Speaker 1: that in North Carolina, and you know that ruffled the
Speaker 1: feathers of the billionaires club, he was joining whatever. But
Speaker 1: I think the problem is that he did it with
Speaker 1: Matt Rule, who it turned out, was not a you know,
Speaker 1: a guy who could come into the NFL, snap his
Speaker 1: fingers and make an awesome But Sean Payton's as close
Speaker 1: to that as what we have right He's as close
Speaker 1: to you could put him in an NFL context and
Speaker 1: have a very strong belief that he's going to succeed. So,
Speaker 1: you know, the Bay Area, you cover the Niners. So
Speaker 1: I said, there's a tipping point for everybody. You can
Speaker 1: be a patient person in your life, but snap eventually
Speaker 1: if you're pushed too far. You can be a giving
Speaker 1: person and then feel at some point you're being taken
Speaker 1: advantage of and ask for something. I believe there was
Speaker 1: a moment in the third quarter when or whenever it
Speaker 1: was that Josh Johnson got hurt pretty with second quarter
Speaker 1: first driving the quarter, okay, and I thought to myself,
Speaker 1: wait a minute, because I always thought Brady to the
Speaker 1: Niners was a bridge too far. His kids were in Miami. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I thought Shanahan sitting there thinking Treilanswert, Garoppolo, hurt, pretty, hurt,
Speaker 1: Josh Johnson, I'm snapping the ball to a running back.
Speaker 1: And I could see Kyle thinking, I love the pretty story.
Speaker 1: Can you give me somebody at sixty four that doesn't
Speaker 1: get hurt? Can you just get me? And here's the thing, Mike,
Speaker 1: as you know, Trent Williams mid thirties, Kittle, Christian McCaffrey,
Speaker 1: an old twenty seven. This defense is young, this offense
Speaker 1: is not. And I if Kittle retired after next year,
Speaker 1: nobody would be surprised. I sat and thought to myself,
Speaker 1: I know they love pretty, but Sean sittinger thinking, can
Speaker 1: you just get me a seventeen game starter? It makes
Speaker 1: me think Brady's a possibility. Now. Well, here's the thing.
Speaker 1: On Sunday morning, he wasn't. And I had reported this,
Speaker 1: but you know, I referenced the great Oakland poet Todd,
Speaker 1: who most people know us too short. It was all
Speaker 1: good just a week ago because I had written it's over.
Speaker 1: We've talked about Brady. They you know that we've talked
Speaker 1: about all sorts of scenarios. It's over. Purdy has shown
Speaker 1: Kyle that, yeah, he's the guy. Trey Lance might stay
Speaker 1: as in a nominal competition, but he'll lose it. They'll
Speaker 1: try and develop him. They'd listen to trades. I don't
Speaker 1: think the trade value be high. Jimmy's gonna go get
Speaker 1: paid somewhere else. But that's what that's it. And Brady's
Speaker 1: not coming. But and here's why that was the plan
Speaker 1: unequivocally because it was a it was a unique situation,
Speaker 1: and that you have a guy on a rookie deal,
Speaker 1: not just a rookie deal, the lowest rookie deal nine
Speaker 1: hundred thousand next year as the two hundred and sixty
Speaker 1: second pick. You're not even eligible to renegotiate with Purdy
Speaker 1: and pay him more till after twenty twenty four. So
Speaker 1: you have two seasons where you pay. And if you're
Speaker 1: backups Trey Lance, he's on a rookie deal, maybe you
Speaker 1: get a veteran. But like, you have so much relative
Speaker 1: cap power that you can pay Nick Bosa what you're
Speaker 1: gonna do. You paid George Kittle You've paid Fred Warner,
Speaker 1: you paid Trey Greenlaw, you paid tre Various Word, You're
Speaker 1: gonna pay Hafanga eventually. You know, Eric Armstead got paid,
Speaker 1: Trent Williams has paid Christian McCaffrey, and you're like, yeah,
Speaker 1: and we're gonna go get some more guys. It's such
Speaker 1: a unique position, and Purdy had shown Kyle so much
Speaker 1: by Kyle standards that it's a rap done. The only
Speaker 1: thing that could have changed it is not like, oh,
Speaker 1: perty broke his ankle. He'll be ready in you know, August,
Speaker 1: because you know he'll be okay. Here he tore the
Speaker 1: older collateral ligament. It Tommy John surgery is on the table,
Speaker 1: so you don't know if it's six months or a year.
Speaker 1: You don't know if after six months or a year
Speaker 1: he slicking it the same way. And you have this team,
Speaker 1: as you said that Hal you shick George Kittle, Trent Williams,
Speaker 1: Pressian McCaffrey by running back standards. You are not young
Speaker 1: and the window is right now. So now you can't
Speaker 1: think that way, even if you still think Brock Purdy's
Speaker 1: your future best case, which they probably do, but you've
Speaker 1: got to go oh Man and by the way, I
Speaker 1: have scar tissue on this. As a young beat writer,
Speaker 1: I covered Joe Montana in nineteen ninety one. His elbow
Speaker 1: felt later to trading camp. It was an older nerve.
Speaker 1: I believe they did surgery. He missed an entire season.
Speaker 1: Steve Young came in won the passing title. The next
Speaker 1: year they were competing in camp, which I think it
Speaker 1: was a real competition. Montana hurt the elbow again. Something
Speaker 1: wasn't right. They had another surgery. He came back to
Speaker 1: the second half of the regular season finale when they'd
Speaker 1: already clutched everything. Steve Young was the about to be
Speaker 1: the MVP. I think back then he'd already been named
Speaker 1: MVP at Joe bata I came up the bed for
Speaker 1: the second half of the cattle Stick Park acted like,
Speaker 1: you know, the Messiah had returned, which he was there,
Speaker 1: and you know, they weren't like booing the MVP, but
Speaker 1: they were like, sweet, the MVP's out. And then Joe
Speaker 1: was Steve's backup by the way in that epic in
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety two championship game, and then he got traded.
Speaker 1: So I think it'll be okay. But and Ben Roethlisberger
Speaker 1: kind of came back from an elbow thing. But I'm
Speaker 1: not one of those people who's like, oh, cool, six months,
Speaker 1: he's gonna be just fine. I hope so. And I
Speaker 1: don't think Ben. I don't think Ben a bigger, stronger body.
Speaker 1: I don't think he was ever quite the same like
Speaker 1: I don't, and you know, and Tommy John really wasn't
Speaker 1: quite the same by the way, the man the surgery
Speaker 1: is named after. I mean, it's gotten better in baseball,
Speaker 1: but you know, you so and party wasn't exactly you know,
Speaker 1: Josh Allen arm strength wise, he's fine but so okay.
Speaker 1: So now here we are. So now what's going on
Speaker 1: right now? They're having these discussions internally because it's all
Speaker 1: gonna play out, and these are the discussions. Brady, Well,
Speaker 1: he's forty six, even though he doesn't really get injured
Speaker 1: except for the one ACL, he's forty six. If you
Speaker 1: signed him as you're all in plan at a forty
Speaker 1: six year old gets hurt, shave by you. On the
Speaker 1: other hand, it's Tom Brady. He works really well in
Speaker 1: this way. If you still want to keep the purty
Speaker 1: window alive and try and hope for the best, you
Speaker 1: can tell Tom one year, make it cap friendly. Tom
Speaker 1: will take a cap friendly deal to the relative, and
Speaker 1: so that makes sense. The other thing you're thinking about
Speaker 1: very hard is Aaron Rodgers, and you're like, Okay, we
Speaker 1: tried everything to trade for him two years ago. Even
Speaker 1: after making the trade that they for the pick that
Speaker 1: they used to take trade lads up to the draft
Speaker 1: that night, they were trying to convince the Packers to
Speaker 1: talk to them. He's older, thirty eight, can be thirty nine,
Speaker 1: or maybe I might I might be off. No, I
Speaker 1: think you're right. You're right. Yeah, And you know, not
Speaker 1: everyone plays at a high level till they're forty five.
Speaker 1: That's freakish. Only one person does that. But you could
Speaker 1: presume the way you know the cap charge for Rogers
Speaker 1: with that option pick up, you're gonna hold a lot
Speaker 1: of guarantee, buddy, But the cap charge would only be
Speaker 1: thirty one something million for twenty three. But you're not
Speaker 1: doing that as a one year thing. You're if you
Speaker 1: do Rogers, you're like two three years for sure. And
Speaker 1: you know and and that and both Brady and Rodgers,
Speaker 1: especially Rogers, change your cap calculus now. Yeah, you signed posts,
Speaker 1: of course, and spread it out. But you're making some
Speaker 1: harder decisions, you know, all right? Final topic, Danny Ainge
Speaker 1: made a career Boston and now Utah Jazz finding desperate people,
Speaker 1: the KG to the Brooklyn deal, the Rudy Gobert, the
Speaker 1: t Wolves deal, which got like nine different pieces. Belichick
Speaker 1: in his prime made a lot of deals with the
Speaker 1: Browns and the poorly run Bills and Dolphins who are
Speaker 1: poorly run anymore? Right? Is that, like they always say,
Speaker 1: the best hitters in baseball get a majority of their
Speaker 1: hits up to three and four starters, not the aces, right,
Speaker 1: And so I don't know if Aaron Rodgers is a
Speaker 1: great fit with the Jets, but well run organizations have
Speaker 1: a history of finding desperate trading partners. And I look
Speaker 1: at the very stable Packers with Aaron Rodgers. Robert Sale's
Speaker 1: got to win, Joe Douglas gotta win. The owners have
Speaker 1: a history of reaching and I look at that and
Speaker 1: I think Nathaniel Hackett needs to rebuild his reputation with
Speaker 1: the guy who helped him get the I that's where
Speaker 1: Aaron to the Jets, a stable organization that's ready to
Speaker 1: move off. I can ship him over there. It does
Speaker 1: feel like you could get the I mean, listen, they've
Speaker 1: got some good young players for the Jets. They need
Speaker 1: the left tackle in a quarterback. I can see him
Speaker 1: saying here's a one to two and a one and
Speaker 1: green Bay going that's where that one feels kind of possible.
Speaker 1: And I could I could see all that, and I
Speaker 1: could see Aaron going, uh, like the Niners. So I'm
Speaker 1: sorry that you won't be getting the one two in
Speaker 1: a one, but I will retire if you do not
Speaker 1: stupid trade. But if you trade me to the Niners
Speaker 1: for hold on, let me text John Lynch a three
Speaker 1: and a conditional two if I you know whatever, I
Speaker 1: will make the money right and you'll be able to
Speaker 1: move on rebuild. But yeah, I know you're right. So
Speaker 1: that's what That's what's always fascinating. You know, fans understandably
Speaker 1: live in this fantasy football like reality where it's like,
Speaker 1: why can't we just do that? We'll trade this for this,
Speaker 1: or you know it's like Derek Carr, well, they you
Speaker 1: know they're not going to send them there? Why why
Speaker 1: would they cut them? And we always forget that, you know,
Speaker 1: the muddy and the cap and the players other leverage
Speaker 1: points like I don't like you or I don't want
Speaker 1: to play for you, especially when they're old enough to
Speaker 1: walk away. You know, those are going to factor into
Speaker 1: and as you know, calling these conversations are all going
Speaker 1: on unofficially. You know, there's players are figuring out their markets,
Speaker 1: teams are figuring out what's possible. Agents and coaches and
Speaker 1: general managers and players are all having conversations that will
Speaker 1: coalesce at the combine, if not before, when everyone's in
Speaker 1: person and drinking, and there'll be media people involved as well,
Speaker 1: not not too many of us, A lot of people
Speaker 1: who act like they will, but a few of us
Speaker 1: will actually be in those rooms, and you know we
Speaker 1: might be drinking too. Yeah. So I just think it's something.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't think Aaron wants to retire, but
Speaker 1: when you start talking about it, you're at least considering it.
Speaker 1: I do think Aaron wants to take that last one
Speaker 1: hundred million, and he's still really, really good. I know
Speaker 1: he still is. I contend that Titans make sense because
Speaker 1: he's never had a consistent great defense and a great
Speaker 1: consistent run game, and he'd have both in a wonky division.
Speaker 1: Do you buy the Titans and Aaron at all. I
Speaker 1: think he liked I think Vrabel's his kind of guy
Speaker 1: in a way. Yeah, I could see that one go
Speaker 1: it either way. I mean, look like, you know, if
Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers plays like he did in twenty twenty one
Speaker 1: and twenty twenty, man Bill Belichick would be like, hey,
Speaker 1: you know that you know that podcast you do every
Speaker 1: week with Pat McAfee where you just say whatever you
Speaker 1: want and put a lot of pressure on the organization. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, it's okay, I just keep doing it because
Speaker 1: you're so good. But if you're playing like Aaron Rodgers
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty two, Big Mike Vrabel and a lot
Speaker 1: of other coaches would be like yo yo yo, like
Speaker 1: not like what he says on a podcast is that
Speaker 1: big a deal? Just a just an example. But I
Speaker 1: think you know Aaron is Aaron's gonna be high maintenance.
Speaker 1: Tom in many ways is gonna be high maintenance. And
Speaker 1: I think again, people with strong senses of self attract
Speaker 1: each other. So you would say on paper, with Kyle Shanahan,
Speaker 1: who wants everything to be done his way and Tom Brady,
Speaker 1: who likes a lot of control at the line, or
Speaker 1: Aaron Rodgers, who likes full control at the line possibly
Speaker 1: be able to coexist. They're philosophically so unaligned in terms
Speaker 1: of how they view the way the offense should conduct itself.
Speaker 1: I feel like Kyle Shanahan gets in a room with
Speaker 1: one of those guys that they're both like, dude, I
Speaker 1: you are so amazing to play quarterback. Dude. I love
Speaker 1: the way you call a game, like, we'll figure it
Speaker 1: out and it sometimes that ends up being hard and
Speaker 1: sometimes it doesn't. But I think people with a lot
Speaker 1: of faith in their own abilities are more likely to
Speaker 1: embrace challenges that other people would go, oh, that's too much,
Speaker 1: and they're more likely to want to do it together
Speaker 1: because they you know, they view themselves as rare and
Speaker 1: they're attractive. Yeah, yeah, all right, Mike Silver Open Mike
Speaker 1: at the volume. A lot of stuff today, Sean Payton
Speaker 1: to the Broncos. I will say this years ago, Tony Romo,
Speaker 1: I heard this story about Tony Romo and Jerry Jones,
Speaker 1: like twenty years ago or whenever it was fifteen years
Speaker 1: ago that they were negotiating, and Tony Romo said, listen,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna make you overpay for me, because then I
Speaker 1: know you're committed to me, and I think I think
Speaker 1: that was Sean Payton's one of his really strong hands. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we're going to reset the market because people as rich
Speaker 1: as you, I'm a rounding error if I don't work, Yeah,
Speaker 1: if so, I want it to sting. If you got
Speaker 1: to write one hundred twenty five million dollars check, yeah,
Speaker 1: at least your accountant will call and go reconsider. So
Speaker 1: well yeah, well, I mean that's why jed to his
Speaker 1: credit after Harbaugh has gone, then Tom Seula one and done,
Speaker 1: Chip Kelly won and done when he finally settled, like
Speaker 1: Kyle was like, I'm giving him an Lynch six year deals,
Speaker 1: you know, which is way high for first timers, because
Speaker 1: I'm just making a statement to them, meant to everyone,
Speaker 1: We're done with this one and done thing. By the way, Jerry,
Speaker 1: here's the brilliance of Jerry Jones, or some people would
Speaker 1: say it's not brilliant. I thought it was after TiO
Speaker 1: came to the Cowboys and the infamous push up or
Speaker 1: you know, sitting up the next question and all that.
Speaker 1: But that dispute in Philly was a you're not paying
Speaker 1: me what I'm worth, you know. That's what fueled t
Speaker 1: o's you know, drama, and Jerry Jones is like, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna get his money right, and I'm gonna get the
Speaker 1: best out of this guy, and I'm gonna show him
Speaker 1: that his buddy's right, and you know, in essence, all
Speaker 1: overpay because I I think his psyche will change so much,
Speaker 1: this particular guy, you know. And Jerry overpaid for the
Speaker 1: stadium because he was trying to make a statement to
Speaker 1: the world. He thought the stadium would become an event,
Speaker 1: did it of itself, and if it sounded even more expensive,
Speaker 1: that was a win, you know, and practice facility too,
Speaker 1: so you know, and those of us who don't have
Speaker 1: billions to make statements with, you know, can only theorize
Speaker 1: about these things. But I do agree with you. I
Speaker 1: think you show Sean something and you know you're you're
Speaker 1: betting on a guy who thinks that he's one of
Speaker 1: the few people, if not the old only person who
Speaker 1: could actually fix it. And I get it. That's cool.
Speaker 1: Mike Silver, great stuff, buddy, good seeing you. I appreciate you.
Speaker 1: Stopped by great seeing y'all see you in person very
Speaker 1: soon the volume. Make sure to check out The Draymond
Speaker 1: Green Show. I brought Draymond Green into the Volume because
Speaker 1: one of the more entertaining voices in sports. Unique perspective
Speaker 1: understands behind the rope also chops up with guests like
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