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Speaker 1: You're listening to Seahawks Stories, teaking you behind the scenes

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Speaker 1: with your favorite Seahawks set.

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Speaker 2: Back to Bey and Zorn, who's back to pass as

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Speaker 2: time looks for the left sideline, throws a bomb down there.

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Speaker 2: He's got a man in front. He makes to grab

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Speaker 2: a travel It's a thirty down to the twenty.

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Speaker 3: They'll never get him. He scores touched.

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Speaker 1: Down Seahawks powered by Seahawks Dot Com.

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Speaker 2: And Zorn later in perfectly a Rabel who goes in

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Speaker 2: to score on an eighty yard pass and run play.

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Speaker 3: Now here's your host, the voice of the Seahawks, Steve

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Speaker 3: Raeball and Seahawks legend Jim Zorn. Let's always remember that friends,

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Speaker 3: Seahawks legend Jim Zorn.

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Speaker 1: And the big voice of Steve.

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Speaker 4: That's right.

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Speaker 3: I hope everybody's doing okay out there. Seahawks Stories time

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Speaker 3: and we welcome in listen. One of the really great,

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Speaker 3: not only great players going back in the day, all

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Speaker 3: the way back to nineteen seventy eight in fact on

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Speaker 3: the Seahawks team, but really one of the great guys

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Speaker 3: and turned into as Jim Zorn did, one of the

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Speaker 3: terrific coaches in this national football League. Keith Butler is

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Speaker 3: joining us today. But's how you doing good?

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Speaker 4: Rage? How you doing?

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Speaker 2: Man?

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Speaker 4: Good to hear from both us.

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Speaker 3: We're we're doing terrifically. I get to see you, or

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Speaker 3: at least I used to once in a blue moon

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Speaker 3: when we'd play the Steelers. But we're gonna start talking

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Speaker 3: about the old days. And I gotta think I was

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Speaker 3: thinking about this last night that when you came to

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Speaker 3: the Seahawks in nineteen seventy eight, it must have been

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Speaker 3: quite a thrill to be on a team with guys

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Speaker 3: like me and.

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Speaker 1: Jim, especially listening to that opener, that's right. I'm sure

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Speaker 1: he got real emotional about.

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Speaker 4: You offensive guys always.

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Speaker 1: Hey, Ray, did you ever get upset when we would

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Speaker 1: go three and out and you had to come back

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Speaker 1: on the field or was that just the way it was?

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Speaker 1: Because I know we got upset, We got upset with

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Speaker 1: long Drive against us having Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Uh. The only thing up said me, was when

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Speaker 4: we were able to win or couldn't win, And that

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Speaker 4: wasn't a whole lot we you know, we went nine

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Speaker 4: and seven a few times and then uh ended up

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Speaker 4: going to the playoffs and all that. But but uh,

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Speaker 4: I had a lot of fun, a lot of guys,

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Speaker 4: good guys on the on the Seahawks team, great people

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Speaker 4: and uh, great teammates and George Keith.

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Speaker 1: When you came in and played, who were the three

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Speaker 1: guys you know, there's usually three linebackers, uh, starting and

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Speaker 1: playing together, especially on early downs. Who were the guys

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Speaker 1: that you played with early? And how did that? How

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Speaker 1: did that change over the years?

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Speaker 4: Uh, Sammy, it was Sam Green, Sammy Green, Yeah, and

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Speaker 4: Beason Terry Oh so okay?

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Speaker 1: And Cherry played the middle and you played on the

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Speaker 1: strong side.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, well I played I played right outside linebacker, right

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Speaker 4: played left outside.

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Speaker 1: So so you sometimes would have a tight end on

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Speaker 1: you and then other times.

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Speaker 4: Not Yes, yes, huh as outside linebackers then and then

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Speaker 4: uh lay on down the line. When Chuck Knox came in,

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Speaker 4: they changed it to thirty four defense, and then I

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Speaker 4: moved into inside linebacker. In thirty four defense.

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Speaker 1: Did you ever have to call the the defense you

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Speaker 1: guys wanted to play? Or did Sammy Green or Terry

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Speaker 1: Beeson call it? Call the defense?

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Speaker 4: Uh? Terry, Terry called the defense for the most part. Okay,

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Speaker 4: Well we got to the thirty four defense, I called it.

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Speaker 1: Okay, inside.

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Speaker 4: I was an inside linebacker then.

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Speaker 3: But what do you remember about those those defenses in

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Speaker 3: those early days, Remember, we had a we had a

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Speaker 3: head coach in Jack Pitterra, who was a defensive based coach,

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Speaker 3: coach the Purple pep Leaders coach, the fearsome Forsome in

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Speaker 3: LA defensive lines. What do you remember about those days?

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Speaker 4: I thought it was uh uh, it gave us a

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Speaker 4: chance to win for the most part in terms of

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Speaker 4: in the four to three defenses. The guys that you

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Speaker 4: got to have, I think are the guys up front

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Speaker 4: and uh meaning that those guys have got to handle

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Speaker 4: a lot of things, different things, whether it's rushing the

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Speaker 4: past or stopping to run wherever it may be. And

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Speaker 4: I really enjoyed playing with those guys up front. They

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Speaker 4: did it. They did a good job. And Terry did

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Speaker 4: a good job too. He did a good job. And

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Speaker 4: so with Sammy, Sammy wasn't say much. You know, Sammy

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Speaker 4: wasn't talking very much. He was trying to lift the board.

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Speaker 4: He want to do everything else. So, uh, it was

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Speaker 4: a lot of good guys to play with, good guys

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Speaker 4: in the secondary and stuff like that. So we had

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Speaker 4: we had a lot of fun and uh uh, you know,

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Speaker 4: try to get in the playoffs as much we could. Uh.

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Speaker 4: When we get in the playoffs, I think it was

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Speaker 4: my third year were there.

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Speaker 3: I think it was nineteen eighty three. I believe was

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Speaker 3: the first player.

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Speaker 4: I was five years. Yeah, we went to uh we

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Speaker 4: went to didn we go to anty Championship?

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Speaker 3: Yes?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? We lost to the Raidars in LA.

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Speaker 3: Beat him twice that year. Couldn't beat him a thirty

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Speaker 3: You know what happened?

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Speaker 4: Rags? Uh? Uh? Well, because we we we got here

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Speaker 4: and okay, we got to there and then and then

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Speaker 4: I called my parents to get you to get ready

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Speaker 4: to get your tickets to go to the super Bowl

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Speaker 4: because we beat them twice. Sure, and they're out of

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Speaker 4: the vision. So uh, me thinking, oh, we ought to

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Speaker 4: beat them anyway, so we didn't. They end up beating

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Speaker 4: us and win the whole thing.

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Speaker 3: I'm glad to know that after all these years, we

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Speaker 3: can blame it directly on you, but that.

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Speaker 1: It was Hey, Keith, when you uh, when you played, Uh,

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Speaker 1: did you find it easy to make a transition from

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Speaker 1: playing to coaching and did you change, like did you

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Speaker 1: change philosophy of being around both for so many years

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Speaker 1: with the Steelers, or how did that happen for you?

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Speaker 1: Were you or did you want to play defense like

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Speaker 1: you did in Seattle?

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Speaker 4: Well? Uh uh, the thing I enjoyed about the whole

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Speaker 4: thing is uh, guys learning and what what was it?

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Speaker 4: What was I trying to teach? Was big for me.

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Speaker 4: And I really started thinking more and more about linebackers

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Speaker 4: being like a quarterback on offense. Why because they had

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Speaker 4: to know what what what's going on in the back

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Speaker 4: end and and what's going on in front of them.

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Speaker 4: In other words, they had know what everybody on the

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Speaker 4: field was doing each and every defense that you called.

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Speaker 4: And I still I still think that, I still believe that,

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Speaker 4: and that's what I've tried to do with all my players,

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Speaker 4: all my guys I've coached, uh that you know, they

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Speaker 4: they've got to know what everybody in front of them

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Speaker 4: is doing, but everybody's back back of them is doing,

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Speaker 4: so they can use their help for the most part,

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Speaker 4: you know. And for for for defensive to be a

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Speaker 4: good defense, I think you got it. You have to

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Speaker 4: stop the run and make people throw the football, make

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Speaker 4: them throw the football, know when they're going to throw

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Speaker 4: the football, and then get after them when they throw

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Speaker 4: the football. Now, if if they can run the ball

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Speaker 4: on you, then play action is a big problem.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, for the defensively, so.

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Speaker 4: And that's that's one of the reasons I always believe

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Speaker 4: that if you can stop the run, you gotta worry

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Speaker 4: about play action because they ain't gonna play action, They're

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Speaker 4: gonna drop back and throw the ball. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I feel like I'm in your I'm in your linebacker

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Speaker 1: meeting room right now. And that's that's it. That's exactly right. So, Uh,

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Speaker 1: did you change that philosophy from being a player or

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Speaker 1: did you have the same philosophy when you were a player.

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Speaker 1: Did you kind of feel like you were the quarterback

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Speaker 1: on the.

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Speaker 4: Defense and that we had to make the calls. Yes,

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Speaker 4: uh zee, yeah, we we you know, we had to

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Speaker 4: make calls. We had to say at the front, we

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Speaker 4: had to change the coverage if we had a double calls,

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Speaker 4: stuff like that. So, uh, those guys were, uh, those guys,

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Speaker 4: the linebackers were the guys who had to change change

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Speaker 4: the calls and make sure everybody's on the same page

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Speaker 4: in terms of what defense that you're now playing after

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Speaker 4: you've changed the call. So that's that's that's big because

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Speaker 4: if you mess it up once or twice, man, nobody trusts.

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Speaker 1: You, no, and it's it's really gap control that you're

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Speaker 1: calling right when you call a different defense, were also

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Speaker 1: different gap controls and uh, things like that, coverage, coverage responsibilities.

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Speaker 3: And hey, but that changes since since we've been out

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Speaker 3: here in Seattle for obviously for Zee and I have

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Speaker 3: been here forever. But in the last what thirteen years,

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Speaker 3: I guess, since Pete and John have been a part

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Speaker 3: of this organization, the stability here in Seattle has been

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Speaker 3: one of the things that I think has meant this

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Speaker 3: franchise has continued to win over the years. The example

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Speaker 3: of Pittsburgh is maybe no greater example of stability in

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Speaker 3: the National Football League. What was it like to be

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Speaker 3: a part of that organization for so many years? You

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Speaker 3: worked with Mike Tomlin, the family ownership. Guys were just

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Speaker 3: they'd come there, they'd stay there, they'd retire there like you.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, uh, rage I had. I had a lot of opportunities.

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Speaker 4: Uh when I went there and we started winning and uh,

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Speaker 4: you know, going to to the playoffs and then getting

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Speaker 4: in the Super Bowl and we went to three Super

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Speaker 4: Bowls when I when I coached there and won two.

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Speaker 1: Of them, and I remember one you won.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, oh yeah, super Bowl forty.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I can't even believe you're you're even talking

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Speaker 1: about that as though you won that game.

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Speaker 4: Yes, yeah we did. But uh uh, win of those,

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Speaker 4: win of those was a lot of fun to me.

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Speaker 4: I mean I really enjoyed uh uh those games and

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Speaker 4: the competition of it. The competition was huge, and uh

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Speaker 4: and and teaching the guys and having the guys that

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Speaker 4: that played for you do what you ask them to do,

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Speaker 4: and uh uh when they got it down and played

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Speaker 4: good defense and everybody played together, that was probably the

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Speaker 4: most rewarding thing. Yeah, that that, you know, when in

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Speaker 4: the Super Bowl, getting a couple of rings forty was

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Speaker 4: big for us. It was big for me, you know,

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Speaker 4: it was big for me and all my all my guys,

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Speaker 4: all my players knew it, you know. Uh And and

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Speaker 4: they played they played well, and I was I was

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Speaker 4: proud of them and really thankful for those guys that

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Speaker 4: I was able to coach.

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Speaker 1: It was a great game. Did you when you get

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Speaker 1: to the playoffs in the National Football League, did you

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Speaker 1: feel like coaching was easier because those players took it

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Speaker 1: themselves and knew what you know what they needed to do. Uh,

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Speaker 1: Whereas before that, trying to win and trying to get

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Speaker 1: them to do what you ask them to do was harder.

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Speaker 1: Did you feel it was easier in the playoffs?

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Speaker 4: Uh? It was in that you didn't have to sell

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Speaker 4: them on anything. They know what works and what don't work,

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Speaker 4: you know what I mean, And they trust you and

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Speaker 4: they start they start trusting you as the coach. And

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Speaker 4: then you know, they listened every every word that came

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Speaker 4: out of your mouth because you know, evidently you wouldn't

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Speaker 4: have you wouldn't have gotten the playoffs unless what you

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Speaker 4: would telling them was true.

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Speaker 1: Ye, that's right, that's.

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Speaker 4: You know, those guys, those guys learned to trust you.

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Speaker 4: When they learned trust you and do all that, I mean,

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Speaker 4: it's a it's a to me, it's it makes the

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Speaker 4: game a lot of fun nowt there is. To me,

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Speaker 4: there's a lot more pressure, uh when you when you

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Speaker 4: advance into the playoffs and all the way to the

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Speaker 4: super Bowl. You know, and everybody says, well, you got

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Speaker 4: this far, you got this far. Yeah, that's fine, but

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Speaker 4: are you going to win the super Bowl or not?

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Speaker 4: I mean, that's that's what we're all. That's what we're

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Speaker 4: all in it for. That's what we're all. We're in

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Speaker 4: it for. Both of y'all played. That's what y'all wanted

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Speaker 4: to do, and both of us. I mean, you know,

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Speaker 4: me playing with y'all wanted to do that at Seattle

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Speaker 4: as a player. You know, we got we got to

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Speaker 4: the AFC Championship. We you know, I was kind of

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Speaker 4: hoping that we would go long after that and maybe

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Speaker 4: a year after that or so we we get into

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Speaker 4: the super Bowl, you know, because we got that far already.

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Speaker 1: But can you remember back on some of the best

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Speaker 1: best like best talent that you played against when you

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Speaker 1: were with the Hawks. Any any players come to mind

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Speaker 1: on offense that you had a runningbacks? Oh?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, running backs. I always thought about running backs and

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Speaker 4: who so many great great Earl Campbell, I mean all

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Speaker 4: of them, I mean the they It seemed like everybody

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Speaker 4: had good, good running backs. Yeah. I think everybody, everybody

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Speaker 4: you know they had a franchise, had a good running back.

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Speaker 4: And they're always hard to stop. I mean, uh, they're

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Speaker 4: not just them, I mean the quarterback to the quarterback

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Speaker 4: for the two the two guys that I was concerned

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Speaker 4: about as a linebacker more than anything else. With the

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Speaker 4: quarterback and uh and the running back. Obviously wide receivers

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Speaker 4: I didn't have to cover them, but I didn't have

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Speaker 4: to cover backs and tight ends, you know, and you

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Speaker 4: try to stay away from mismatches like wide receivers and

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Speaker 4: stuff they tried to do we did and all that,

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Speaker 4: but uh, it was always a lot of fun. I

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Speaker 4: felt like to see the game plan come together and

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Speaker 4: you know what coverage your playing and how hell we

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Speaker 4: are you doing that? But up front you're playing the

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Speaker 4: gap control like you talked about Z, it was mildly

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Speaker 4: important and putting those together in terms of you know what,

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Speaker 4: what kind of defense are coverage? You're going to play

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Speaker 4: cover three. Obviously it's an eight man front, so you

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Speaker 4: want to make sure you gap down and you win

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Speaker 4: the running game. You should win the running game when

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Speaker 4: you're doing that. And too deep is probably uh, you

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Speaker 4: don't want to be in too deep when people are

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Speaker 4: running the ball, so all the all the stuff is

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Speaker 4: not accounted for. You know, you got you've got seven

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Speaker 4: gaps accounted for, not eight, and so that makes makes

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Speaker 4: it a little bit tough.

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Speaker 1: Alls I can tell you, Alls I can tell you

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Speaker 1: is too deep was hard to read when you had

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Speaker 1: Troy Polamalu in Oh yeah, either the strong side a

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Speaker 1: gap or the other side, and then he and he

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Speaker 1: would be the deep half safety. I have to snap

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Speaker 1: of the ball, okay.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, run it back there.

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Speaker 3: But in fact that that leads me to my question.

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Speaker 3: The This is probably like saying, Okay, who is your

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Speaker 3: favorite child? But give me the name of the guy

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Speaker 3: maybe if even if not the most talented, but maybe

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Speaker 3: the best football player that you coached in your long career.

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Speaker 4: Oh boy, I coach a couple. Uh uh. James Ferrier,

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Speaker 4: I'd have to say him. He comes to mind. I

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Speaker 4: coached the inside and outside linebackers at UH, at Pittsburgh

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Speaker 4: and UH. In terms of inside linebackers, James was was

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Speaker 4: the quarterback of the off of our of our defense

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Speaker 4: in terms of making the checks and stuff like that

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Speaker 4: and still being a real good football player in his

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Speaker 4: gap all the time, making sure he did his job

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Speaker 4: first and then he helped his buddy. You know, that

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Speaker 4: was big for me in terms of I tried to teach,

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Speaker 4: make sure you do your job first and then then

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Speaker 4: help you buddy if you can, you know, but take

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Speaker 4: care of your responsibility. And he did a great job

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Speaker 4: of that. Uh. Uh I had some good outside linebackers.

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Speaker 4: James Harrison was a good outside linebacker. Uh Jeordy Porter

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Speaker 4: was a good outside linebacker. Lamar Woodley. Uh those guys

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Speaker 4: were good players. Uh I had had that and a

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Speaker 4: lot of good inside guys to both and uh I

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Speaker 4: really appreciate those guys and why they played. You know,

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Speaker 4: like I said earlier, Raves, if you if you're successful

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Speaker 4: in what you're telling them, they'll listen to you, you know.

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Speaker 4: And and I can't blame them. I was the same

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Speaker 4: way as the player and so and ravees.

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Speaker 1: When Buttz is talking about this, you know, as a

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Speaker 1: coach uh on other staffs getting ready for the Steelers, Uh,

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Speaker 1: he's he's giving us names that we had to contend

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Speaker 1: with from the offensive side. Are we going to chip him?

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Speaker 1: Are we gonna chip? If you don't chip James Harrison,

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Speaker 1: you are not going to block him with one guy

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Speaker 1: the whole game or rarely even in a quarter, You're

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Speaker 1: he's going to get free. And so, yeah, we would

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Speaker 1: have to prepare for these kinds of guys. These are

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Speaker 1: these are some of the top players.

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Speaker 3: Those are extra those are extra meeting guys, right, oh yeah,

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Speaker 3: for the coach, for the coaching staff.

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Speaker 4: Yah.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: And but when you're when as you were talking and

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Speaker 3: you were talking about those great players that you coached,

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Speaker 3: and and Ze and I and you to a certain extent,

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Speaker 3: you're a little younger than we are. But we can

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Speaker 3: go back to the days when we played Pittsburgh back

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Speaker 3: in the seventies, when they had guys like Andy Russell

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Speaker 3: and Jack Lambard in the middle, and uh, they just

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Speaker 3: had some some of the best well they had best

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Speaker 3: the best defenses around for so many years back there

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Speaker 3: in Pittsburgh. So that tradition continued under coach Kawer and

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Speaker 3: UH under coach Tomlin now and and in no large,

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Speaker 3: no small part to you, but because of what you

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Speaker 3: did and the coaching that you brought to those guys.

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Speaker 1: And you know, Jack Lambert had such a big name,

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Speaker 1: but he was not a big guy. He was a

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Speaker 1: small guy. And I'll never forget looking on the other side.

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Speaker 1: You know, he's he's on the other side, and he

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Speaker 1: is right there in front of me. And when he smiled,

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Speaker 1: he had teeth that he would take out during the

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Speaker 1: you know, before the game, he would leave his teeth,

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Speaker 1: especially as two front ones in the locker room. Sure,

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Speaker 1: and then we come out and give give you that

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Speaker 1: big smile, and he had those wild eyes, and I just,

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Speaker 1: you know, it's almost distracting, you almost crack up. Wait,

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Speaker 1: where are your teeth?

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Speaker 3: My man? All right, here's my Jack Lamb, here's my

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Speaker 3: Jack Lambert story. We were playing back there in Pittsburgh.

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Speaker 3: It was either seventy eight or seventy nine. And I

353
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Speaker 3: obviously the all of that, the steel curtain, all those

354
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Speaker 3: guys just to melt blunt. I mean, you know, the

355
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Speaker 3: great Super Bowl teams. So we run. I don't know

356
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Speaker 3: what the heck the play was, but I was in

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Speaker 3: the slot, you know, in for the tight end, and

358
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Speaker 3: I was running a shallow crossing route, probably trying to

359
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Speaker 3: pull people away from Largin on a crossing route behind me.

360
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Speaker 3: But that goes without.

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Speaker 1: Saying, right, So, but I was looking.

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Speaker 3: For you first, Sure you were. So I'm running across

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Speaker 3: the middle, and I can see Lambert, you know, in

364
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Speaker 3: his middle linebacker spot, and I don't think he sees me.

365
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Speaker 3: So I figured, man, I might just pop out the

366
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Speaker 3: other side here, I can get the ball turn up field.

367
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Speaker 3: I might be able to run for a while just

368
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Speaker 3: about the time I got behind him. All I remember

369
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Speaker 3: next was this this flipper, this arm swinging back and

370
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Speaker 3: hitting me right in the throat as I was running

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Speaker 3: behind him. And I mean he just dropped me like

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Speaker 3: a sack of dirt. I mean, I was he hit

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Speaker 3: me so hard on the throw. I mean I couldn't breathe,

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Speaker 3: I couldn't talk. And my folks, my parents were at

375
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Speaker 3: that game in Pittsford. After the game and we ended

376
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Speaker 3: up losing, unfortunately. But after the game, you know, my

377
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Speaker 3: dad I kept, you know, saying, well, what did you

378
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Speaker 3: think of the game? And he said, man, that Jack Lambert,

379
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Speaker 3: he's a great football lyrist. He said, Daddy almost tore

380
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Speaker 3: my Larnux out.

381
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Speaker 4: But I'll.

382
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Speaker 3: But that's the way you could play.

383
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Speaker 4: Then.

384
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Speaker 3: That was the game there, my lord. And you know,

385
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Speaker 3: I'm sure that was I was just one of many people.

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Speaker 1: He didn't even look at you. You didn't think he saw.

387
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Speaker 3: You, no, And he just threw that right arm back

388
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Speaker 3: and he always had it.

389
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Speaker 1: There was a steel play.

390
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Speaker 4: Yeah.

391
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Speaker 1: He had those big, big padded forearm things.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, four arm pass.

393
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Speaker 1: Yeah, he was there's one of the greatest football posters

394
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Speaker 1: I think ever. Is kind of a cartoon drawing of

395
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Speaker 1: Jack Lambert with this this wild glare in his eye

396
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Speaker 1: and with no teeth, you know, smiling and you know,

397
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Speaker 1: dirt and sweat and coming off him. Oh my gosh.

398
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Speaker 1: But he he loved to play. He really did love

399
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Speaker 1: to play, and that that great.

400
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Speaker 4: But he had some you know what he was He

401
00:21:03,240 --> 00:21:05,560
Speaker 4: was a good player, but he had some guys in

402
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Speaker 4: front of him too. The yeah, and that makes it,

403
00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:11,600
Speaker 4: that makes a difference to Acker.

404
00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:16,680
Speaker 3: I remember Wyman, you know, my broadcast partner always talks about.

405
00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:19,600
Speaker 3: He said, there was nothing more made me feel more

406
00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:22,399
Speaker 3: confident as one of those inside backers than looking up

407
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Speaker 3: front and seeing the big butt of Cortes cancer right

408
00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:28,040
Speaker 3: in front of me, because he knew that Tes was

409
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Speaker 3: always going to take up at least two guys and

410
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Speaker 3: that he would be free to make play run. And

411
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Speaker 3: as a as a guy who then ended up playing

412
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Speaker 3: inside for part of your career too, I'm sure you

413
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Speaker 3: had to believe that as well.

414
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Speaker 4: But oh yeah, big time. Yeah, yeah, somebody get in

415
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Speaker 4: front of you, man, you can gives you a chance

416
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:51,600
Speaker 4: to play. And uh, Joe Nash for me, uh huh

417
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Speaker 4: was a guy for me. He was a guy that

418
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Speaker 4: if he played well, I played well. And if he's

419
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Speaker 4: the guy that could use two guys up because he

420
00:22:00,359 --> 00:22:02,439
Speaker 4: was a nose guard for us. You know, we had

421
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Speaker 4: Jacob Green, we had Jeff Bryant, bullet, Jeff Bright and

422
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Speaker 4: then and then uh you know, those those guys helped

423
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Speaker 4: us quite a bit. I mean they, I mean, uh

424
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Speaker 4: they they did a great job. I thought Joe Nash

425
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Speaker 4: did it. Probably was a little bit more stable than

426
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Speaker 4: anybody else up there.

427
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Speaker 1: And uh yeah, for a guy that was always for

428
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Speaker 1: a guy that was as wide as he was, he

429
00:22:29,280 --> 00:22:32,919
Speaker 1: could get real skinny in those gaps, you know, he

430
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Speaker 1: couldn't get slide.

431
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Speaker 3: And an undrafted free agent with first round picks on

432
00:22:37,960 --> 00:22:40,639
Speaker 3: either side of him, and those three guys playing together

433
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Speaker 3: and they we were talking to Jacob not long ago.

434
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Speaker 3: He played. Yeah, he played like eighty five percent. Those

435
00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:49,840
Speaker 3: guys played like eighty five percent of the plays in

436
00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:51,560
Speaker 3: the game. You couldn't get him out of the game.

437
00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:55,120
Speaker 3: In fact, and now the whole idea is rotation, right.

438
00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:57,640
Speaker 1: Nichol plus Nickel and dime.

439
00:22:57,960 --> 00:22:58,520
Speaker 3: That changes.

440
00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:01,320
Speaker 4: Now, did you get him on third down? Get get

441
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:02,520
Speaker 4: the rushers on third down?

442
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:05,200
Speaker 1: Yeah? Did you have to come out on third down?

443
00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:07,560
Speaker 1: Or did you stay on on third down? Did they

444
00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:09,040
Speaker 1: bring a nickelback in for you?

445
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:12,399
Speaker 4: I did late in my career, not early.

446
00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:15,119
Speaker 1: Okay, you know, because you had, like you said, you

447
00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,120
Speaker 1: had to cover backs and or tight.

448
00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:20,199
Speaker 4: Ends, right right. Those were the guys you had to

449
00:23:20,240 --> 00:23:23,320
Speaker 4: match up against and if you if you couldn't you know,

450
00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:26,240
Speaker 4: they tried to. Yeah, you know, Bulleyhead got a chance

451
00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:28,399
Speaker 4: to take and play on third down. He got to

452
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:35,520
Speaker 4: play the linebacker because he could run. Yeah, Greg games,

453
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:38,760
Speaker 4: you know, and I call him Bullehead all the time.

454
00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:41,560
Speaker 4: So I see him. I see him from time to time.

455
00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:45,119
Speaker 4: He was he was, he was down here. Steve was

456
00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:49,919
Speaker 4: you know, Steven uh and Uh. Sherman Sherman was down here.

457
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:52,199
Speaker 4: Yeah right, So we got a chance to go out

458
00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,240
Speaker 4: and meet with him and spend some time with him.

459
00:23:54,400 --> 00:23:55,960
Speaker 4: So we had a good time.

460
00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:59,119
Speaker 3: We saw Smitty when he was up here for something.

461
00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:01,640
Speaker 3: Was it the alumni weekend? I think it was that

462
00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:05,600
Speaker 3: Smithy was up here. I don't you know. I say

463
00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 3: this about all you guys that I had a chance

464
00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:09,639
Speaker 3: to play with over the course of the years. But

465
00:24:09,720 --> 00:24:12,960
Speaker 3: if there's a better person than Sherman Smith, I don't

466
00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 3: you know. I know I'm sitting across from one, and

467
00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:16,879
Speaker 3: we got one on the phone here. But I'm telling you,

468
00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:18,600
Speaker 3: Sherman Smith is one of the true.

469
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:19,480
Speaker 4: Quality people and.

470
00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:25,359
Speaker 3: Great coach, great teacher. What is it about it? Mike

471
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:28,439
Speaker 3: Holmer and your old boss used to say this all

472
00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:30,320
Speaker 3: the time. If I wasn't a coach, I'd have been

473
00:24:30,320 --> 00:24:32,880
Speaker 3: a high school teacher. And he thought the best coaches

474
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,560
Speaker 3: were those guys who were teachers. Not necessarily the guys

475
00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:39,560
Speaker 3: that obviously were screamers or yellers or found a way

476
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:42,680
Speaker 3: to get the guys fired up, but guys who could communicate,

477
00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:45,600
Speaker 3: who could teach and could make it understandable to those

478
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:47,840
Speaker 3: guys who were playing, right, That's that's what you guys

479
00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:48,320
Speaker 3: really are.

480
00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:51,800
Speaker 4: But ye, yeah, I mean a lot of people call

481
00:24:51,840 --> 00:24:54,359
Speaker 4: it teaching congressions. Knowing what you want to teach first,

482
00:24:54,359 --> 00:24:56,920
Speaker 4: and how you teach it, and what do you start with?

483
00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:00,680
Speaker 4: You know, whate of these guys to me was always

484
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:03,800
Speaker 4: what are you looking at and where you Those are

485
00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:06,280
Speaker 4: the two biggest things. I always trying to teach my

486
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,080
Speaker 4: guys and then knowing what everybody else is doing around

487
00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:15,720
Speaker 4: and using that that stuff. But uh, you know, I've

488
00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 4: had a very fortunate life. I think in that that Uh. Uh,

489
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:22,879
Speaker 4: I got to play. I got to play all my

490
00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 4: life for a living. Yeah you know what I mean. Yeah,

491
00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:27,600
Speaker 4: I mean I didn't have to the only time I've

492
00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:32,560
Speaker 4: ever worked is when I was failing hay cutting brass

493
00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:36,040
Speaker 4: and sometime back, you know, when I'm sixteen seventeen years old. Yeah,

494
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:39,360
Speaker 4: I mean other than that, man, you know, I coached football.

495
00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:42,920
Speaker 4: Coaching football beat the heck out of working for a living.

496
00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 1: Ie. Hey, uh, did you you when now you're retired,

497
00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:50,080
Speaker 1: You've you've quit the Pittsburgh Steelers.

498
00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:50,800
Speaker 4: Uh.

499
00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:54,200
Speaker 1: They probably still want you back, but you've you've you've

500
00:25:54,200 --> 00:25:55,080
Speaker 1: gone on your way.

501
00:25:55,520 --> 00:25:55,720
Speaker 4: Uh.

502
00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:59,000
Speaker 1: You didn't settle in Seattle? Had you always planned on

503
00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 1: settling in Tennessee? Or like what I tell you?

504
00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:07,760
Speaker 4: What? Yeah? See, I tell you. Uh. The biggest thing

505
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 4: for me is, you know, I was born in North Alabama,

506
00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:13,760
Speaker 4: a place called Huntsville. And by the way, Huntsville was

507
00:26:13,840 --> 00:26:17,120
Speaker 4: named the best place uh in the in the United States.

508
00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:21,200
Speaker 1: You live in you but I really appreciate that information.

509
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:22,600
Speaker 1: That's very pregnant.

510
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:30,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, I thought, I tell you. Anyway, Anyway, I lived

511
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:34,159
Speaker 4: there in wins Goood, Memphis, and and my boys. Really,

512
00:26:34,640 --> 00:26:38,439
Speaker 4: my three sons. They were probably the most important uh

513
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:42,399
Speaker 4: factor in where we children are going to live. That

514
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:47,879
Speaker 4: then her dance uh Kim folk and mind Kimfolk. My

515
00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 4: brothers and sisters all lived down in Huntsville. I've lost

516
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 4: my both my parents. I lost my mom back in January,

517
00:26:54,119 --> 00:26:58,440
Speaker 4: and uh uh my brothers and sisters live in Huntsville still,

518
00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:01,120
Speaker 4: so we live in nash She was kind of in between.

519
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:04,480
Speaker 4: I've got a boy. Uh, my middle son is in

520
00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:08,040
Speaker 4: good Virginia. He's a he's a lawyer and he works

521
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:13,240
Speaker 4: in Virginia. And he's got three of my grand children, uh,

522
00:27:13,280 --> 00:27:16,119
Speaker 4: two year olds and a boy. And then I got Blake,

523
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:19,920
Speaker 4: my oldest. Uh, he's working in Memphis. He's a head

524
00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:24,280
Speaker 4: coach at uh Christian uh high school there he called

525
00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:28,119
Speaker 4: Evangelical Christian School. He's the head coach there. And then uh,

526
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:31,560
Speaker 4: he's got three three of my grandsons. And then uh,

527
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:35,520
Speaker 4: I got one that's living uh here in Nashville, and

528
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:40,080
Speaker 4: he's not married. I don't know if nobody anybody Mary Murphy,

529
00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:40,320
Speaker 4: you know.

530
00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:48,080
Speaker 3: Woman, listen, if miss Jane, if Miss Janet married you,

531
00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:51,800
Speaker 3: if Miss Janet married you, there's somebody for everybody, trust me.

532
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:57,280
Speaker 3: How is Janet doing? We used to call her miss Janet.

533
00:27:57,440 --> 00:27:58,119
Speaker 4: She was that.

534
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:02,880
Speaker 1: You didn't cross her. You never crossed her either.

535
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:10,600
Speaker 4: He's been married for forty three years.

536
00:28:11,080 --> 00:28:15,880
Speaker 1: Fight Yeah, no, nobody, nobody.

537
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,439
Speaker 3: Miss Sharon and I we're forty two years this year,

538
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:20,879
Speaker 3: and you know we have a few disagreements, but I

539
00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:22,240
Speaker 3: wouldn't say we've had fights.

540
00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:24,160
Speaker 1: Now.

541
00:28:27,040 --> 00:28:30,920
Speaker 3: Well, kind of we didn't see things quite the same way.

542
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:33,240
Speaker 3: And generally I was wrong and that as long as

543
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:35,879
Speaker 3: you realize that and you admit that you're wrong right away,

544
00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:38,880
Speaker 3: then that's usually that took that took care of it.

545
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:41,880
Speaker 1: Well, you don't tell you you haven't been able to

546
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:45,240
Speaker 1: come to any alumni things or anything like that because

547
00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:48,120
Speaker 1: you've been coaching, because that just takes up so much time.

548
00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:52,120
Speaker 1: You've settled now, you've got family that you're living by

549
00:28:52,280 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 1: and growing growing up with. And uh, but maybe just

550
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:01,400
Speaker 1: maybe as we go along here, uh, you should try

551
00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:05,880
Speaker 1: to prioritize because everybody would love to see you prioritize

552
00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:08,560
Speaker 1: coming out Janet and visiting at least.

553
00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:13,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, I've thought about that. They really started thinking about

554
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:17,080
Speaker 4: that a couple of weeks ago, you know, thinking about

555
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:20,280
Speaker 4: what's going on, and Tys had something going on. I

556
00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:25,760
Speaker 4: think there uh one time and then uh, I haven't

557
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:28,000
Speaker 4: had a chance to Yeah, I haven't had a chance

558
00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:31,240
Speaker 4: to go up there in a long time, and I

559
00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:34,440
Speaker 4: really like to go back because it's beautiful Seattle. Seattle

560
00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:36,800
Speaker 4: was beautiful, y'all know that. I mean it's it's a

561
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:38,080
Speaker 4: beautiful place to live.

562
00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:41,480
Speaker 1: And uh not quite not quite Huntsville though.

563
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:41,720
Speaker 4: I.

564
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:46,680
Speaker 3: Which is the greatest place. We just learned that we.

565
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:50,600
Speaker 4: Don't have uh, we don't have snow capped mountain.

566
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 3: What was what was Pittsburgh like? You were there a

567
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:56,640
Speaker 3: long time? What was Pittsburgh like?

568
00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:59,800
Speaker 4: Yeah? I liked it. I mean it's uh, you know,

569
00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:01,680
Speaker 4: the call it three rivers and all that stuff for

570
00:30:01,720 --> 00:30:05,800
Speaker 4: a good reason. There's uh uh a couple of rivers.

571
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,160
Speaker 4: We're home. We were on one of the rivers there.

572
00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:14,680
Speaker 4: In terms of our our complex, uh the stadium, you know,

573
00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:17,880
Speaker 4: they they've worked that out and changed it a couple

574
00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:22,800
Speaker 4: of times. But it's a nice place. I really enjoyed,

575
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,480
Speaker 4: uh Pittsburgh, you know, you know, uh play golf and

576
00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:30,719
Speaker 4: all seats as much as I could. And uh I

577
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:35,480
Speaker 4: enjoyed uh working from there. You know, everybody's got to

578
00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:43,600
Speaker 4: go to the uh try to prepare for the our

579
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:47,800
Speaker 4: what we call it. They I've been hitting the hands

580
00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 4: on the top. Yeah, yeah, we got your ready the

581
00:30:54,400 --> 00:30:57,160
Speaker 4: draft for all all the time and go to go

582
00:30:57,440 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 4: all over the world. Are they to war guys out.

583
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:06,160
Speaker 4: I didn't miss that a whole lot, but I enjoyed it.

584
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:08,800
Speaker 4: I enjoyed I'm enjoyed it to make sure I knew

585
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:11,760
Speaker 4: who was in the draft and how how could they

586
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:14,280
Speaker 4: affect us and how can they fit on our team

587
00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:17,360
Speaker 4: and stuff like that. That's a lot of work there.

588
00:31:17,480 --> 00:31:20,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, you worked with Dick lebou for I don't know,

589
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:22,800
Speaker 1: for a lot of years. What did you end up

590
00:31:22,840 --> 00:31:28,520
Speaker 1: teaching him? Uh in your career there or maybe vice?

591
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:35,480
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, he was a dB, you know he he

592
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:39,600
Speaker 4: did everything from that point of view, just like you

593
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:43,880
Speaker 4: raves as a wide receiver and you see as a quarterback.

594
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:47,680
Speaker 4: You know, from a teaching standpoint of talking to people

595
00:31:47,760 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 4: about the game from your standpoint really from a position

596
00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:55,400
Speaker 4: you played more so than anything else. And then you know,

597
00:31:55,560 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 4: you you learn from playing with those guys for guys

598
00:32:00,720 --> 00:32:03,040
Speaker 4: what they should be doing or what they're supposed to do,

599
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:07,240
Speaker 4: or what you may think they should do and and

600
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:11,560
Speaker 4: that helps quite a bit. And uh and with Dick Lebow,

601
00:32:12,240 --> 00:32:14,720
Speaker 4: they had been around the game for a long time

602
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:18,240
Speaker 4: and he was a real good secondary coach, had probably

603
00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:20,920
Speaker 4: knew more about it than anything. And the linebackers, he

604
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:23,640
Speaker 4: knew a lot about the linebackers too. He let me

605
00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 4: coach though he he he uh uh he didn't. He

606
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:32,920
Speaker 4: would set out things for us and then he would

607
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:36,240
Speaker 4: ask us, uh, you know, what about this? What about that?

608
00:32:36,360 --> 00:32:38,520
Speaker 4: And morning our opinion about a lot of things. Yeah,

609
00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:41,440
Speaker 4: and uh he used it in that way and he

610
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 4: did a great job, a great job.

611
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 1: I think that's what makes a great staff too, is

612
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:49,360
Speaker 1: trusting the guys that you've hired, not just having to

613
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:51,880
Speaker 1: be one voice and hey, we're going to do it

614
00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: this way, and you guys, you guys have to conform

615
00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:58,840
Speaker 1: to this way, especially if you you have talent. I

616
00:32:58,880 --> 00:33:01,160
Speaker 1: mean you have talent at the line backer position. You

617
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:03,720
Speaker 1: not only played it, but you even coached before you

618
00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:07,360
Speaker 1: got to Pittsburgh. So uh, I mean that speaks a

619
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:10,480
Speaker 1: lot to me to to that you would say, Dick

620
00:33:10,560 --> 00:33:13,480
Speaker 1: Lebo allowed you to coach, allowed you to have input,

621
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:17,320
Speaker 1: asked you is just you know, I'm working the third level.

622
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:20,560
Speaker 1: You're working the second level, Keith, how is this going

623
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:22,800
Speaker 1: to fit with what you what you got going?

624
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:24,800
Speaker 3: Wasn't it sort of the same way for you? I mean,

625
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:28,680
Speaker 3: Mike allowed you to coach your guys and one of

626
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:31,480
Speaker 3: the input when you were his Oh yeah, quarterbacks coach.

627
00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:35,160
Speaker 1: We have to to get him on. But yeah, yeah,

628
00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:37,640
Speaker 1: he allowed me to do my thing. And you know,

629
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 1: I probably he probably looked at me and going, what

630
00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 1: is he doing? But uh, yeah, because I had some

631
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:47,880
Speaker 1: I had some drill work that was interesting, but that

632
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:51,200
Speaker 1: that was a big piece of my you know, my

633
00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:55,640
Speaker 1: skill thinking. And I'm sure but you answered this question too.

634
00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:59,160
Speaker 1: You you actually know what it feels like to be

635
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:01,600
Speaker 1: on the field and play. So you're not going to

636
00:34:01,600 --> 00:34:06,040
Speaker 1: give your linebackers something that just didn't didn't work because

637
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:08,520
Speaker 1: you knew, you know, you knew what could work and

638
00:34:08,560 --> 00:34:09,319
Speaker 1: what couldn't work.

639
00:34:10,200 --> 00:34:12,239
Speaker 4: Right. But dickle Bolt was the same way. I mean

640
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:14,320
Speaker 4: he was he was a dB for a long time

641
00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:17,200
Speaker 4: in the National Football League. Yeah, and he was the

642
00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:21,440
Speaker 4: same way, exactly the same way. And uh he is

643
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:23,319
Speaker 4: a great guy to work with. I mean a great

644
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:26,000
Speaker 4: guy to work with because you know, he knew a

645
00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 4: lot about the game. A ton about the game, but

646
00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:31,120
Speaker 4: he lets you express your thoughts and your feelings in

647
00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 4: terms of what you think your guys could do, you know,

648
00:34:35,239 --> 00:34:37,279
Speaker 4: And that's a that's a tough thing about. If you're

649
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 4: going to be a coordinator, Uh, you got to trust

650
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:42,920
Speaker 4: the guys that are they are coaching and trust that

651
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:45,920
Speaker 4: they know what they guys, their guys do well and

652
00:34:46,000 --> 00:34:49,319
Speaker 4: what they don't do so well. And that's important too,

653
00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 4: and so uh when you're trying to get a game

654
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:56,719
Speaker 4: plan together. That's that's the biggest part of it right there.

655
00:34:56,760 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 4: What do your guys do well? And what do you

656
00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:02,640
Speaker 4: got to take away that the guys you're you're fixing

657
00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:05,120
Speaker 4: the day on play? What do you got to take

658
00:35:05,120 --> 00:35:10,200
Speaker 4: away in order for them to beetle? And Uh, if

659
00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 4: you can figure that mess out, then you can.

660
00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:16,160
Speaker 3: Hey, but you've been you've been out of it now

661
00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:20,759
Speaker 3: for a little bit. Are you still watching it closely

662
00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:23,160
Speaker 3: on TV? Every week? Do you miss it? Do you

663
00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:25,799
Speaker 3: miss being down there on the field? Do you miss

664
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:26,960
Speaker 3: being in the meeting rooms?

665
00:35:28,200 --> 00:35:32,279
Speaker 4: What I what I miss is seeing the secondary That's

666
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 4: what I miss. I can't I can't tell what's going

667
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:37,200
Speaker 4: on unless I know what those safeties are doing.

668
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:41,919
Speaker 3: So you don't miss just the general feeling of being

669
00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:44,960
Speaker 3: in pro football. You miss actually sitting there looking at

670
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:45,879
Speaker 3: the secondary.

671
00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:49,520
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, well yeah, to see what they're doing. I mean,

672
00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:51,560
Speaker 4: at least I know what they're playing, you know what

673
00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:55,240
Speaker 4: I mean. I mean, whether they're playing, whether they're playing

674
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:59,439
Speaker 4: a zero coverage or you know that free coverage or what.

675
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:01,879
Speaker 1: Does that help? Does that help you? Does that help?

676
00:36:01,960 --> 00:36:04,000
Speaker 1: That doesn't help? You know what the linebackers are going

677
00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:06,160
Speaker 1: to do. You just want to see what the secondary

678
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:08,359
Speaker 1: is doing, so you know, well there, you know, because

679
00:36:08,360 --> 00:36:11,840
Speaker 1: if it's zero, there's probably a blitz or you're maybe

680
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 1: you see of I crack up sometimes because I hear announcers,

681
00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:19,520
Speaker 1: not like Steve, Steve's the expert, but I do hear

682
00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:22,279
Speaker 1: announcers saying, oh, he blitzed there, and it'd be a

683
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:26,600
Speaker 1: four man rush, you know, or you know, and you

684
00:36:26,680 --> 00:36:30,359
Speaker 1: just kind of go, no, they know, they who's cover two?

685
00:36:30,680 --> 00:36:32,200
Speaker 1: And then it would be for you know, it would

686
00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:34,840
Speaker 1: be quarters and or six or whatever.

687
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:35,080
Speaker 4: You know.

688
00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:39,319
Speaker 1: So yeah, that's hard. That really is hard. Knowing what

689
00:36:39,400 --> 00:36:42,280
Speaker 1: we know, it's hard to get away. It's hard to

690
00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:46,719
Speaker 1: listen to announcers. That's why you are the best there

691
00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:48,040
Speaker 1: ever ever.

692
00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:50,839
Speaker 3: Bruised from all the pan.

693
00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:53,480
Speaker 1: He does know what's going on.

694
00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:58,040
Speaker 3: And to what you said, truly, the first look when

695
00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:00,279
Speaker 3: I was the analyst for all those years with Heat

696
00:37:00,320 --> 00:37:03,239
Speaker 3: and the guys that I work with after that, my

697
00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:06,040
Speaker 3: first look was always exactly what Jerry always used to

698
00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:08,160
Speaker 3: tell us. You look at the safeties first, and they're

699
00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:10,879
Speaker 3: going to tell you what the defense in rotation, see

700
00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:12,879
Speaker 3: what they're doing. And then once you see that, now

701
00:37:12,920 --> 00:37:15,640
Speaker 3: you have a reason for understanding, well, why was that

702
00:37:15,680 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 3: pass complete or why was there suddenly a big gap

703
00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:20,480
Speaker 3: to run into right there? Well, that safety rotated over

704
00:37:20,480 --> 00:37:23,279
Speaker 3: the top and he completely took himself. So you're right.

705
00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:25,600
Speaker 3: But those are the kinds of those are the kinds

706
00:37:25,640 --> 00:37:28,200
Speaker 3: of things that that we tend to look for these days,

707
00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:31,040
Speaker 3: I guess, I guess the point of my question was

708
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:35,479
Speaker 3: are you are you happy in retirement? Is life good

709
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:36,440
Speaker 3: for you these days?

710
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:42,320
Speaker 4: Uh? You mean do I miss coaching and playing football?

711
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 3: Yeah?

712
00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:47,160
Speaker 4: Yes I did. Yeah, I missed the competition of it,

713
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:52,360
Speaker 4: and I miss I missed uh the uh, the teaching

714
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:55,040
Speaker 4: part of it too. And I think that the probably

715
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:59,319
Speaker 4: the most gratifying thing I had as a coach was uh,

716
00:37:59,640 --> 00:38:02,719
Speaker 4: trying to get a point across and teaching and watch

717
00:38:02,800 --> 00:38:06,759
Speaker 4: your players do it on the field, knowing that yeah,

718
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:10,400
Speaker 4: they got they got so I wouldn't. I wasn't just

719
00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:15,360
Speaker 4: you know, uh talking to be talking. They were, they

720
00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:18,560
Speaker 4: were getting it and that was probably the most gratifying

721
00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:21,800
Speaker 4: thing for me. Uh in terms of being a coach,

722
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:25,439
Speaker 4: watching your guys be successful or what you you tried

723
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,560
Speaker 4: to teach them to do. Uh, that's a lot of fun.

724
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 1: Did you hey, buts did you try to Uh? Did

725
00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:35,920
Speaker 1: you do anything different? Or let me rephrase this question.

726
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:41,680
Speaker 1: When you became a coordinator. Was that bigger Obviously it's

727
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:44,880
Speaker 1: a more responsibility, bigger pressure. But did you like calling

728
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:48,400
Speaker 1: the defense? Or did you would you rather have just

729
00:38:48,480 --> 00:38:51,799
Speaker 1: been a linebacker coach and let somebody else call it?

730
00:38:52,640 --> 00:38:57,920
Speaker 4: I mean, what was the I like calling the defense? Uh?

731
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:03,640
Speaker 4: The because uh I liked the companions of it. Uh.

732
00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:07,600
Speaker 4: Working with Mike Tomlin. Uh and I know Mike for

733
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:11,360
Speaker 4: a long time. Mike, Mike, just to tell you quickly

734
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:15,919
Speaker 4: our relationship, so you'll know how it was when I

735
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:21,120
Speaker 4: worked for him. Uh, when I was coaching at Memphis.

736
00:39:21,320 --> 00:39:24,840
Speaker 4: My first ten years of coaching was coaching in college.

737
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:26,400
Speaker 4: I was coaching in Memphis.

738
00:39:27,040 --> 00:39:27,160
Speaker 2: Uh.

739
00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:29,239
Speaker 4: We had a guy named Rip Sheer who was who

740
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:33,400
Speaker 4: is the head coach? He was the head coach at Memphis,

741
00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:35,960
Speaker 4: and so he hired me. And I already been there,

742
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:40,680
Speaker 4: uh under another guy, but he held me over and

743
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:44,919
Speaker 4: UH I stayed there. Mike. Uh Tomlin was a GA

744
00:39:45,120 --> 00:39:48,040
Speaker 4: for US and Mike Mike had always played wide receiver,

745
00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:53,759
Speaker 4: uh William and Mary and Uh he knew everything a

746
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,799
Speaker 4: lot about offensive stuff that he never he didn't know

747
00:39:56,840 --> 00:40:00,600
Speaker 4: anything about defense. So uh when he came in and

748
00:40:00,840 --> 00:40:03,600
Speaker 4: JA made him go over to the defensive side of

749
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:07,080
Speaker 4: the ball and become help the secondary coach. So he

750
00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:10,680
Speaker 4: Mike would come in my office every day and want

751
00:40:10,719 --> 00:40:13,920
Speaker 4: to talk about the NFL. That's all he wanted to

752
00:40:13,960 --> 00:40:17,040
Speaker 4: talk about was the NFL all the time. And so

753
00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:21,920
Speaker 4: I mean and so he he learned how to coach

754
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:25,279
Speaker 4: the dbs and stuff like that. And then after about

755
00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:27,720
Speaker 4: two years he left and went over to Arkansas State.

756
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:30,960
Speaker 4: And my thought, my whole thought process when I got

757
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:33,640
Speaker 4: into coaching, was I'm going to stay in Memphis and

758
00:40:33,760 --> 00:40:35,879
Speaker 4: raise my boys in Memphis. I'm not going to move

759
00:40:35,920 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 4: around all over the place. Because the worst thing I

760
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:42,640
Speaker 4: hated about coaching was having to move my families. I

761
00:40:42,680 --> 00:40:44,800
Speaker 4: don't want them to have to move all the time.

762
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:49,160
Speaker 4: And so that that year Mike was witness a couple

763
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:51,520
Speaker 4: of years. He goes over to Arkansas State and he

764
00:40:51,560 --> 00:40:55,640
Speaker 4: calls back over to me and uh talks me into

765
00:40:55,719 --> 00:41:00,799
Speaker 4: leaving Memphis. And he's sitting there saying, hey, rip, he said,

766
00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:02,319
Speaker 4: go over his shoulder that you he ain't gonna ever

767
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:08,840
Speaker 4: let you do. So he was. He was trying to

768
00:41:08,880 --> 00:41:10,799
Speaker 4: get me over so he did. He got me over there.

769
00:41:10,840 --> 00:41:12,560
Speaker 4: So I went over for one year and then I

770
00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:14,759
Speaker 4: went to Cleveland after that. I was hired by the

771
00:41:14,760 --> 00:41:18,880
Speaker 4: Cleveland Browns after that, and uh uh Mike went on

772
00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:22,279
Speaker 4: and started coaching with Tony Dungee and all those guys. Yeah,

773
00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:25,879
Speaker 4: and then uh he went to Minnesota, got a got

774
00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:30,720
Speaker 4: the coordinator's job at Minnesota, and then uh, Bill Coward

775
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:35,480
Speaker 4: retires and and and Mike calls me up and says, hey, man,

776
00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:38,319
Speaker 4: they're gonna they're gonna interview me for the head job.

777
00:41:38,640 --> 00:41:40,880
Speaker 4: He said, but I think I'm just a token because

778
00:41:40,920 --> 00:41:43,799
Speaker 4: he's black, you know what I mean? He said, But

779
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:46,520
Speaker 4: I'm pretty sure I'm just a token. I said, Oh no, man,

780
00:41:46,520 --> 00:41:49,359
Speaker 4: you do a good job, they might give you the job.

781
00:41:49,920 --> 00:41:52,800
Speaker 4: So uh, he did a good job and they hired

782
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:58,239
Speaker 4: And when Mike came in as a coordinator, I mean

783
00:41:58,960 --> 00:42:03,080
Speaker 4: when he came in, we had just got through, uh,

784
00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:07,480
Speaker 4: going to the Super Bowl, winning one, okay, And I

785
00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:09,960
Speaker 4: told him at the time, because I knew him so well,

786
00:42:10,680 --> 00:42:12,680
Speaker 4: I said, man, you don't need to make any changes

787
00:42:12,719 --> 00:42:15,080
Speaker 4: on defense. We've been you know, we're going to Super Bowl.

788
00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:18,040
Speaker 4: We still got the same We don't need to change anything.

789
00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:23,160
Speaker 4: And so defensively, so he didn't. He kept everybody and

790
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:26,239
Speaker 4: uh and uh he kind of stayed out of it

791
00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:29,720
Speaker 4: for a while. And I was coaching the uh uh

792
00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:31,799
Speaker 4: after he had been there a couple of years and

793
00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:37,399
Speaker 4: had learned our terminologistuff. Uh during the game, he would

794
00:42:37,480 --> 00:42:41,960
Speaker 4: make calls. He would make defensive calls and boy, just

795
00:42:42,200 --> 00:42:43,319
Speaker 4: this tick will go off.

796
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:49,400
Speaker 1: But he had a gut he had a gut feel.

797
00:42:50,520 --> 00:42:53,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, he gut feeling. But Mike was Mike was

798
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:55,239
Speaker 4: the ball, so you know, he got his way. He

799
00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:57,800
Speaker 4: could do what he wanted to do. And so uh

800
00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:00,000
Speaker 4: he made some calls with dick and bows the court

801
00:43:00,239 --> 00:43:02,360
Speaker 4: and he made some calls when I was a coordinator.

802
00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:04,759
Speaker 4: You know, sometimes it gets frustrated because you've got in

803
00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:07,280
Speaker 4: your mind what you want to try to do. For instance,

804
00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:09,680
Speaker 4: I give you an example. Uh, A lot of times

805
00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:11,759
Speaker 4: we'll look at on first down, what people do on

806
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:14,359
Speaker 4: first down. If they run the ball first down, they

807
00:43:14,360 --> 00:43:16,600
Speaker 4: get less than three, then then eighty five percent of

808
00:43:16,640 --> 00:43:18,120
Speaker 4: the time they would come back and throw the ball.

809
00:43:18,640 --> 00:43:22,120
Speaker 4: Or if they run the ball and get you know,

810
00:43:22,239 --> 00:43:24,080
Speaker 4: five or moore yards, they're gonna come back and run

811
00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:26,120
Speaker 4: the ball again. So that was a lot of tendencies

812
00:43:26,120 --> 00:43:28,759
Speaker 4: for a lot of different coordinators, the way they call

813
00:43:29,320 --> 00:43:34,879
Speaker 4: stuff offensively, you know. And so uh, we would use

814
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:37,120
Speaker 4: that philosophy quite a bit in terms of what we

815
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:42,200
Speaker 4: were calling, uh, defensively and uh, Mike wasn't cut off

816
00:43:42,800 --> 00:43:45,880
Speaker 4: called up on what we were two. So he started

817
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:48,319
Speaker 4: coming to the defensive and figured out figured all that

818
00:43:48,320 --> 00:43:51,360
Speaker 4: stuff out, and then uh uh made some calls of

819
00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:55,120
Speaker 4: his own, you know, and uh uh and it wasn't

820
00:43:55,360 --> 00:43:56,960
Speaker 4: it was nothing wrong with it because he had come

821
00:43:57,080 --> 00:43:59,560
Speaker 4: and do what he wants to do and all that stuff.

822
00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:03,279
Speaker 4: But Dick would get mad every down. Then he'd say,

823
00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:06,680
Speaker 4: he'd say, okay, but that's your boy.

824
00:44:07,880 --> 00:44:11,000
Speaker 1: Keith, you know, what We've talked to a lot of

825
00:44:11,000 --> 00:44:13,480
Speaker 1: different guys, and we'll continue to talk to a lot

826
00:44:13,520 --> 00:44:18,040
Speaker 1: of guys here on this particular program. And you can

827
00:44:18,120 --> 00:44:22,839
Speaker 1: tell a coach a former player and coach versus a

828
00:44:22,840 --> 00:44:25,799
Speaker 1: former player and somebody who has gone on to do

829
00:44:25,960 --> 00:44:29,440
Speaker 1: other other things because you still, you know, you can

830
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:35,319
Speaker 1: talk the kinds of strategy that actually does go on

831
00:44:35,560 --> 00:44:40,040
Speaker 1: game in and game out, and the preparations, the rewards

832
00:44:40,160 --> 00:44:42,600
Speaker 1: that you get for the hard work that you're doing.

833
00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:46,160
Speaker 1: And so I appreciate that because I've done both like

834
00:44:46,239 --> 00:44:49,560
Speaker 1: you have for a really long time, and you know,

835
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:51,520
Speaker 1: I kind of you get in that, you get it

836
00:44:51,560 --> 00:44:54,839
Speaker 1: in your mind. Oh my gosh, exactly right. And I

837
00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:58,040
Speaker 1: do think you are an evil human being, you know,

838
00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:02,879
Speaker 1: being a defensive coordinator because of how you have tried

839
00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:08,439
Speaker 1: to stop offenses over the years. So you can't be that,

840
00:45:08,719 --> 00:45:14,400
Speaker 1: you know that, Goodie two shoes, I know that. But

841
00:45:14,400 --> 00:45:17,640
Speaker 1: but it has been fun watching your career both and

842
00:45:18,120 --> 00:45:21,200
Speaker 1: it was great that you know, I can have I

843
00:45:21,239 --> 00:45:25,080
Speaker 1: can still call you one of my teammates in the past,

844
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:28,480
Speaker 1: and I'm sure Rapeskins absolutely.

845
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:32,399
Speaker 4: Is that the great how we have with each other.

846
00:45:32,560 --> 00:45:34,919
Speaker 4: Isn't that a great deal, And to me, it is

847
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:37,759
Speaker 4: that's a great deal. You go through something like that

848
00:45:37,840 --> 00:45:41,480
Speaker 4: with a lot of different people and different teams and

849
00:45:41,520 --> 00:45:45,360
Speaker 4: stuff like that, but it's you know, the guys who've

850
00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:48,600
Speaker 4: done it together. You have a little something something that

851
00:45:50,080 --> 00:45:51,279
Speaker 4: maybe the rest of us don't.

852
00:45:51,719 --> 00:45:53,879
Speaker 1: And when you saw my name on the phone call

853
00:45:54,120 --> 00:45:56,440
Speaker 1: to ask you to come on the show, you answered

854
00:45:56,440 --> 00:45:59,719
Speaker 1: the phone, which is you know.

855
00:45:58,920 --> 00:46:00,319
Speaker 3: He wouldn't have done it if it was I.

856
00:46:00,239 --> 00:46:03,440
Speaker 1: Know on the phone because it was a teammate.

857
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:06,319
Speaker 3: What the heck does you must want something I'm not

858
00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:07,640
Speaker 3: going to.

859
00:46:10,200 --> 00:46:13,240
Speaker 4: Well Listen, even though you say you you and Sharon

860
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:13,879
Speaker 4: never get in a.

861
00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:19,640
Speaker 3: Fight, listen, we you know there you are one of

862
00:46:19,640 --> 00:46:21,480
Speaker 3: those guys. And Z and I talked about it when

863
00:46:21,560 --> 00:46:24,080
Speaker 3: when they asked us to do this, uh this podcast

864
00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:26,360
Speaker 3: that we we got to get we gotta get butts

865
00:46:26,680 --> 00:46:29,440
Speaker 3: because A he was one of us. Be He's got

866
00:46:29,480 --> 00:46:32,160
Speaker 3: great stories and had just such a terrific career in

867
00:46:32,200 --> 00:46:35,440
Speaker 3: the NFL and two time Super Bowl champion with the Steelers.

868
00:46:35,719 --> 00:46:38,560
Speaker 3: It's great catching up. Now the next thing is you

869
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:41,080
Speaker 3: and Janet come out here and visit, like on Alumni

870
00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:43,840
Speaker 3: weekend or something that that we can all get together

871
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:46,480
Speaker 3: and uh and share a cup of coffee and uh

872
00:46:46,520 --> 00:46:47,640
Speaker 3: and talk about old times.

873
00:46:47,640 --> 00:46:50,719
Speaker 4: How would that be out a lot of ass, a

874
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:51,839
Speaker 4: lot of We.

875
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:53,400
Speaker 3: Have plenty of them already today.

876
00:46:53,920 --> 00:46:54,759
Speaker 4: Coming on.

877
00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:59,759
Speaker 3: Keith Butler, Oh, thank you Butts. It's great talking to you,

878
00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:02,800
Speaker 3: one the all time greats, not only with the Seahawks

879
00:47:02,800 --> 00:47:05,480
Speaker 3: but in the National Football League as well. But thanks

880
00:47:05,480 --> 00:47:07,439
Speaker 3: for being with us. For all of you folks out there,

881
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:11,040
Speaker 3: thanks for listening. Zee as always a pleasure, brother, and

882
00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:14,920
Speaker 3: we will see you folks on the next time around.