1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:05,120 Speaker 1: Ben Higgins, and Ashley. I bring you Infamous. Sometimes roses 2 00:00:05,280 --> 00:00:06,320 Speaker 1: are red flags. 3 00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:11,440 Speaker 2: Welcome to Infamous, because sometimes roses are red flags. Our 4 00:00:11,480 --> 00:00:14,920 Speaker 2: story continues today with Clayton Eckert. You know him from 5 00:00:15,000 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 2: Michelle Young season and from his time as the Bachelor. Clayton, 6 00:00:20,360 --> 00:00:21,440 Speaker 2: Welcome to the podcast. 7 00:00:22,040 --> 00:00:24,319 Speaker 1: Thanks for having you, guys. This is a new little 8 00:00:24,320 --> 00:00:25,960 Speaker 1: thing that you got going. Huh. 9 00:00:26,160 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 3: It is so Clayton. We have talked to you many 10 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:33,800 Speaker 3: times about all the Fantasy Suite drama right the I 11 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:34,960 Speaker 3: slept with all of you, or I. 12 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 1: Was into it with all of you. I love all 13 00:00:37,440 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 1: of you. 14 00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 3: But we're going to start today the beginning of your 15 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:45,479 Speaker 3: season because there was a very well known villain on 16 00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:50,840 Speaker 3: your season, Shane. She had pushed Elizabeth during an obstacle course, 17 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:56,160 Speaker 3: she called Elizabeth's ADHD diagnosis fake, and then there was 18 00:00:56,280 --> 00:01:00,920 Speaker 3: shrimp Gate. But you kept Shane along for quite some time. 19 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:06,280 Speaker 3: Were you What was your opinion of her in the house? 20 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:08,040 Speaker 3: Was it true to what we saw on TV? 21 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:08,400 Speaker 1: Yeah? 22 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:10,319 Speaker 4: I mean, to be honest with you, it was such 23 00:01:10,319 --> 00:01:14,360 Speaker 4: a small part of my story and my experience. I 24 00:01:14,400 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 4: didn't even know half of that stuff was going on 25 00:01:17,280 --> 00:01:19,720 Speaker 4: because I was so focused on the other women in 26 00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:22,399 Speaker 4: my connections with them. That Like when it first got 27 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:24,160 Speaker 4: brought up, I just said, okay, I thought it was 28 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:29,400 Speaker 4: a one off thing. And you know we all understand that. Well, 29 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:33,360 Speaker 4: each episode, it's two hours long on TV, comprises I 30 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:35,400 Speaker 4: think four days of filming at sixteen hours a day 31 00:01:35,440 --> 00:01:37,080 Speaker 4: of filming, so do the math, you know. 32 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:38,280 Speaker 1: It was at sixty four hours. 33 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:42,760 Speaker 4: It made it seem the edit because again it's all 34 00:01:42,800 --> 00:01:45,680 Speaker 4: people tune in for the entertainment, for the drama, so 35 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:48,000 Speaker 4: it made it seem as though that was a massive 36 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:52,080 Speaker 4: storyline and it wasn't. To me like the experience I had, 37 00:01:52,120 --> 00:01:55,280 Speaker 4: it was like it was like Ohne's side comment by 38 00:01:55,280 --> 00:01:58,280 Speaker 4: the way, she's SE's created some drama. So like when 39 00:01:58,320 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 4: I watched the show, I was like, whoa, this was 40 00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:02,600 Speaker 4: acting like this is the main plot line. Like I 41 00:02:02,720 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 4: this was hardly a narrative. But you know, again, like 42 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:08,200 Speaker 4: the show is creating an entertaining TV show, All that 43 00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:11,200 Speaker 4: stuff was happening. It just wasn't like the main focus, 44 00:02:11,440 --> 00:02:13,880 Speaker 4: you know, But that's what the editay made it seem. 45 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:17,119 Speaker 2: It's always the big question, and I think from my standpoint, 46 00:02:17,120 --> 00:02:20,200 Speaker 2: I agree with Clayton from the lead. You don't see 47 00:02:20,240 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 2: all this stuff already know it's all happening, but it's 48 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:25,960 Speaker 2: a story that's going on, and the longer they can 49 00:02:26,080 --> 00:02:28,440 Speaker 2: let it happen without you knowing it, the more content 50 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:32,360 Speaker 2: they get to show. Clayton, you've said recently to us 51 00:02:32,520 --> 00:02:34,800 Speaker 2: that you have a better relationship. I don't know if 52 00:02:34,840 --> 00:02:38,119 Speaker 2: you've exactly defined it as good, but a better relationship 53 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:42,440 Speaker 2: with production today, and I that's a little bit confusing 54 00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 2: to me. I think you said this before the mass 55 00:02:44,480 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 2: layoffs that have happened. Right over two hundred people are 56 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:49,679 Speaker 2: now no longer working on the show. The whole new 57 00:02:50,120 --> 00:02:53,840 Speaker 2: team is in place. Ashley and myself, we know nobody 58 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:56,920 Speaker 2: other than one of this that still works on the 59 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:00,360 Speaker 2: show from our time, and that's probably similar to your situation. 60 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:03,920 Speaker 2: So my question, I guess, is help us understand is 61 00:03:03,960 --> 00:03:07,920 Speaker 2: this a good relationship with production of old or have 62 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:10,440 Speaker 2: you already spoken to the whole new team and they 63 00:03:10,760 --> 00:03:12,800 Speaker 2: got your back and you guys are ready to rock 64 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 2: and roll. 65 00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:14,400 Speaker 1: No. 66 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 4: So I was at after the final Rows recently, and 67 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:20,959 Speaker 4: I would say there was about six or eight familiar 68 00:03:20,960 --> 00:03:27,040 Speaker 4: faces that came in, executive producers, handlers, just people that 69 00:03:27,080 --> 00:03:27,760 Speaker 4: were a part. 70 00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:30,519 Speaker 1: Of my when I was the Bachelor that were around. 71 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:33,240 Speaker 4: So I again, I didn't see how much of the 72 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:34,880 Speaker 4: rest of the team was there. I didn't get to 73 00:03:35,000 --> 00:03:37,000 Speaker 4: talk to the cameramen and women. Honestly, I was kind 74 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 4: of more so taking in all these other things. But 75 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:41,720 Speaker 4: there was enough familiar faces and they had come and 76 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:44,840 Speaker 4: checked in with me and we had good conversations. But 77 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:47,160 Speaker 4: I'm more so saying that, like I guess, yeah, more 78 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:51,040 Speaker 4: of a blanket statement. I'm more so in good graces 79 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:54,880 Speaker 4: with like the production element of or maybe and who 80 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:57,720 Speaker 4: knows how they view me, but like I'm okay with 81 00:03:57,960 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 4: everything that happened. Because Matthew McConaughey's green Light said that 82 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:04,880 Speaker 4: book really resonated with me. I just loved his voice, 83 00:04:04,880 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 4: for one, but I listened to his audiobook and on 84 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 4: it he said it's not personal, it's business when referencing Hollywood, 85 00:04:10,480 --> 00:04:12,640 Speaker 4: and I think that just I realized. I was like, 86 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 4: they had to create a TV show, and you gave 87 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:17,680 Speaker 4: them a lot of stuff to put out there, so 88 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:21,239 Speaker 4: it's not like they're you know, they just did their job, 89 00:04:21,440 --> 00:04:24,119 Speaker 4: which was put out an entertaining a show. 90 00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:26,599 Speaker 1: So with that, I'm like it's not personal, you know, 91 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:29,200 Speaker 1: I can't. These people aren't monsters, They're just they have 92 00:04:29,240 --> 00:04:30,960 Speaker 1: a job to do, and you signed up for it. 93 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:32,520 Speaker 1: You just weren't really aware of what all it was 94 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 1: going to. 95 00:04:32,880 --> 00:04:37,200 Speaker 3: Entail when you're watching the show back. Was there one 96 00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:41,560 Speaker 3: time besides like before Fantasy Sweet Drama where you were like, 97 00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:45,039 Speaker 3: holy crap, like that surprised me, like I can't believe 98 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:48,279 Speaker 3: that happened, or that is not the way that happened. 99 00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:55,400 Speaker 4: Uh, yeah, I would say, I'm trying to think what 100 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 4: came up. 101 00:04:56,880 --> 00:05:01,200 Speaker 1: My one thought was there was there was. 102 00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 4: There was a point where we had like a psychotherapy 103 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 4: date or and uh at the end of it, the 104 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:13,719 Speaker 4: psychotherapist was like, hey, I had a great time getting 105 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:15,680 Speaker 4: to know you all today, but there's someone here that's 106 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:17,280 Speaker 4: not here for the right reasons or they d something 107 00:05:17,320 --> 00:05:18,080 Speaker 4: along those lines. 108 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,720 Speaker 1: And she says that, and then they turned. 109 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:24,520 Speaker 4: She turns to me, and I just look at her 110 00:05:24,600 --> 00:05:27,880 Speaker 4: and I go all right, well, I'm not really sure 111 00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:29,240 Speaker 4: what that's about, but let's just go ahead and go 112 00:05:29,279 --> 00:05:33,320 Speaker 4: to the after party or whatever. And then the show 113 00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:38,240 Speaker 4: was like hold on, stop, Clayton, that's it, And I 114 00:05:38,279 --> 00:05:40,760 Speaker 4: was like, I'm not really gonna put much weight into that. Guys, like, 115 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:42,800 Speaker 4: I'm not really too concerned about it. I don't I 116 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:45,839 Speaker 4: don't agree with what her assessment. They're like, no, you 117 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:49,040 Speaker 4: gotta like there's something amiss. I was like, no, like, 118 00:05:49,600 --> 00:05:51,360 Speaker 4: and so it was just like that's what I came 119 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:53,160 Speaker 4: up when you asked me that question. Was like it 120 00:05:53,279 --> 00:05:55,800 Speaker 4: was like, I'm like, they're like, no, you have to be, 121 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 4: you know, more bothered by this than you are. And 122 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 4: there was multiple times, I guess throughout the experience where 123 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:05,400 Speaker 4: I was like, Guys, I also understand that I want 124 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:07,719 Speaker 4: to show and like people may be playing up some 125 00:06:07,839 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 4: drama and like, I just can't fake this. I'm not 126 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:15,159 Speaker 4: an actor, so whatever, like this seems petty. So I 127 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:17,240 Speaker 4: guess that would be an example of like a time 128 00:06:17,279 --> 00:06:19,279 Speaker 4: where it just didn't seem like a big deal. But 129 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:23,280 Speaker 4: it led to a situation where it was Sarah that 130 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:26,040 Speaker 4: was she was telling the other girls that I was 131 00:06:26,080 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 4: going to choose her from the very beginning, and then 132 00:06:28,680 --> 00:06:31,080 Speaker 4: those girls approached me because they were like, hey, she's 133 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:32,800 Speaker 4: saying these things and I'm like, I don't believe it 134 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:35,279 Speaker 4: unless like the women tell me. And so then I 135 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:36,680 Speaker 4: had a few women that came up to me that 136 00:06:36,720 --> 00:06:38,719 Speaker 4: I trusted that were like, yeah, she's been saying this 137 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:40,880 Speaker 4: all along. We almost left the house, and I was like, whoa, whoa, 138 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:43,680 Speaker 4: whoa whoa, Like y'all were about to leave, and so 139 00:06:43,760 --> 00:06:45,280 Speaker 4: at that point then I was like, what's going on, 140 00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:48,360 Speaker 4: Like there's all this stuff that's happening behind the scenes 141 00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:50,760 Speaker 4: that like I'm not privy to, and you're telling me that. 142 00:06:50,839 --> 00:06:53,120 Speaker 4: Like four of the top you know ten you know 143 00:06:53,160 --> 00:06:55,000 Speaker 4: women that were in my top ten or whatever, four 144 00:06:55,000 --> 00:06:56,640 Speaker 4: of them were said they were about to leave multiple 145 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 4: times about the show. 146 00:06:57,360 --> 00:06:59,560 Speaker 1: Because of what Sarah was saying, I was like, what 147 00:06:59,680 --> 00:06:59,920 Speaker 1: is going on? 148 00:07:00,440 --> 00:07:04,320 Speaker 4: Like why am I not being informed about this? So, yeah, 149 00:07:04,360 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 4: it was stuff like that. There was like always I 150 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:08,560 Speaker 4: started to realize later in the show, I'm like, stuff 151 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:11,200 Speaker 4: is happening and I'm not being told, like because I 152 00:07:11,200 --> 00:07:13,160 Speaker 4: guess I'm not there, so technically I shouldn't be told, 153 00:07:13,200 --> 00:07:15,760 Speaker 4: but like, also, I feel like I need to know 154 00:07:15,760 --> 00:07:16,800 Speaker 4: if someone's about to leave. 155 00:07:17,600 --> 00:07:21,600 Speaker 2: Clayton, there's a and your season doesn't get credit for it, 156 00:07:21,680 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 2: but I feel like there was a big storyline coming 157 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:30,360 Speaker 2: out of your season around sex that wasn't as discussed 158 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:33,280 Speaker 2: as maybe other seasons that we think of when we 159 00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:40,880 Speaker 2: think of physical intimacy. There there was criticism based on 160 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:43,880 Speaker 2: how defensive you seemed, and watching it back, you did 161 00:07:43,880 --> 00:07:44,720 Speaker 2: seem defensive. 162 00:07:44,800 --> 00:07:45,160 Speaker 1: I don't know. 163 00:07:45,200 --> 00:07:46,760 Speaker 2: You could argue with me and say you weren't or 164 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:48,800 Speaker 2: it didn't seem like that. But from the show standpoint, 165 00:07:48,800 --> 00:07:51,520 Speaker 2: it did seem like it. When Susie was talking about 166 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:57,800 Speaker 2: her boundaries, it was criticized publicly. Now watching it back 167 00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 2: and now being removed from it, were you defensive? Was 168 00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:03,400 Speaker 2: that just what the show made it seem like? What 169 00:08:03,480 --> 00:08:05,520 Speaker 2: was your thoughts at the time as you sat I 170 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:06,600 Speaker 2: think it was at a dinner table. 171 00:08:07,000 --> 00:08:09,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think what you saw is what 172 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:10,920 Speaker 1: you saw. That was my reaction. 173 00:08:12,200 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 4: That was my reaction, though, four hours into a conversation, 174 00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:17,240 Speaker 4: and it was in the last five minutes, you know, 175 00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:19,760 Speaker 4: when I realized They're like, we gotta go, you guys, 176 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:23,200 Speaker 4: got to wrap this conversation up. And so as my 177 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:25,240 Speaker 4: back felt against the wall and everything felt like it 178 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 4: was falling apart, and I started to question, if you know, 179 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:30,960 Speaker 4: if Susie was you had all to your motives and 180 00:08:31,600 --> 00:08:33,640 Speaker 4: I started basically getting in my head. And so those 181 00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:36,480 Speaker 4: final five to ten minutes. I was like, I, you know, 182 00:08:36,640 --> 00:08:38,679 Speaker 4: I don't even know what I'm looking at anymore. I 183 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:39,960 Speaker 4: don't know who you are, and I didn't want to 184 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 4: hear anything else. I was like, it's over. Like I 185 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 4: didn't want to have that conversation on camera, but I 186 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 4: didn't have a choice. It was like I begged for 187 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:49,640 Speaker 4: us to take the fantasy suites and then have that 188 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 4: conversation in private, and was not able to happen. So 189 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 4: at that point I was like, okay, So I started 190 00:08:57,880 --> 00:08:59,880 Speaker 4: telling her in the best way that I could, this 191 00:09:00,160 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 4: is what you know, what happens, And then once I 192 00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:06,560 Speaker 4: said it on camera, it was like it's out there, right, 193 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:08,600 Speaker 4: you know. Now I have to go tell the other 194 00:09:08,640 --> 00:09:11,360 Speaker 4: women it's it's it's that's just there's no other way about. 195 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 4: You can sit here and say, well, he shouldn't said 196 00:09:13,080 --> 00:09:15,440 Speaker 4: anything until you know the show aired. I'm like, why 197 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:17,240 Speaker 4: would I do that, you know, move forward with one 198 00:09:17,240 --> 00:09:18,679 Speaker 4: of the other two women and then go, oh, hey, 199 00:09:18,679 --> 00:09:20,439 Speaker 4: by the way, we're together. Now something happened too and 200 00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 4: a half weeks so that you need to know about. 201 00:09:21,679 --> 00:09:24,280 Speaker 4: I'm like, no, everybody needs to be caught up with 202 00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:28,560 Speaker 4: what transpired. So I felt that full transparency was the 203 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:31,200 Speaker 4: way to go. As far as like how I conducted 204 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:34,319 Speaker 4: myself in those final ten minutes, I got scrutinized. Yeah, 205 00:09:34,480 --> 00:09:35,920 Speaker 4: I raised my tone. I even said, you know, hey, 206 00:09:35,920 --> 00:09:37,360 Speaker 4: this is out of character for me. I'm not normally 207 00:09:37,440 --> 00:09:38,559 Speaker 4: you know, I don't normally raise. 208 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:39,000 Speaker 1: My tone like this. 209 00:09:40,360 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 4: You know, I think I got fed to the wolves. 210 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:44,199 Speaker 4: I'm like, I don't think I know people. I'm not 211 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:44,760 Speaker 4: trying to compare. 212 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:46,439 Speaker 1: But at the end of the day, it was a 213 00:09:46,480 --> 00:09:47,360 Speaker 1: four hour conversation. 214 00:09:47,400 --> 00:09:50,320 Speaker 4: The final ten minutes, I lost my cool bit, and 215 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 4: you know, I take accountability for that. People didn't like 216 00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:55,240 Speaker 4: the way I reacted, but that's I felt, you know 217 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:56,720 Speaker 4: that I was my back was against the wall and 218 00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:59,640 Speaker 4: everything was slipping, and I was, you know, grasping at straws, 219 00:09:59,640 --> 00:10:01,679 Speaker 4: and I was in a really uncomfortable spot, and so, 220 00:10:01,960 --> 00:10:05,320 Speaker 4: you know, yeah, I was just trying to say or 221 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:07,559 Speaker 4: do the right thing to keep her around and she 222 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:09,520 Speaker 4: wasn't willing to And at that point I felt like 223 00:10:09,679 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 4: I was in a bad spot. I'm like, I'm going 224 00:10:11,200 --> 00:10:13,080 Speaker 4: to lose her, and then I'm going to lose these 225 00:10:13,120 --> 00:10:15,280 Speaker 4: other women tomorrow when I fill them in on what happened. 226 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:19,280 Speaker 3: It was a four hour conversation. What did the other 227 00:10:19,320 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 3: four hours look like? 228 00:10:21,040 --> 00:10:22,960 Speaker 1: Sound like they were fine? 229 00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:27,600 Speaker 4: I mean they were very cordial, but then things started 230 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:29,880 Speaker 4: to just go sideways where and it wasn't shown, but 231 00:10:29,960 --> 00:10:32,719 Speaker 4: it's like I just wanted I did not want to 232 00:10:32,760 --> 00:10:35,600 Speaker 4: have the conversation that was shown on camera. I was 233 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:39,280 Speaker 4: like begging to do it off camera, and we signed 234 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:41,320 Speaker 4: contracts saying that we are going to put everything on 235 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:44,720 Speaker 4: camera outside of Fantasy Suite, So like I wanted to, 236 00:10:44,920 --> 00:10:46,680 Speaker 4: like because again it was out of respect. I also 237 00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:49,840 Speaker 4: didn't feel comfortable talking about the other women and like 238 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:51,920 Speaker 4: putting it out there, putting their business out there. 239 00:10:52,559 --> 00:10:53,520 Speaker 1: But I didn't have a choice. 240 00:10:53,520 --> 00:10:56,800 Speaker 4: So when I was sorry to realize, like you have 241 00:10:56,840 --> 00:10:58,439 Speaker 4: to have this conversation, I'm like, Okay, I have to 242 00:10:58,520 --> 00:11:00,959 Speaker 4: navigate this and say the thing and every word like 243 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:03,800 Speaker 4: could potentially give up more information than I want. But 244 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 4: she needs to know what happened, because she asked me directly, 245 00:11:06,160 --> 00:11:08,240 Speaker 4: have you expressed feelings lovever been intimate with the other women? 246 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:10,360 Speaker 4: And I was like, well, that's a direct question. I 247 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 4: chanced skirt around this. If I skirt around it, I'm 248 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 4: gonna be lying you know, or a air biomission. Right, 249 00:11:16,120 --> 00:11:18,480 Speaker 4: So I'm like, it's an indirect lie, and I was like, 250 00:11:18,480 --> 00:11:22,079 Speaker 4: you're not a liar, So I was. It was us 251 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:23,760 Speaker 4: going back and forth and trying to see if we 252 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:28,280 Speaker 4: can make it work, and just like between us and yeah, 253 00:11:28,320 --> 00:11:31,200 Speaker 4: I mean after it just then she wasn't willing to 254 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:35,360 Speaker 4: do the overnights and so that's where it was like, guys, 255 00:11:35,400 --> 00:11:37,480 Speaker 4: wrap this up. And that's where I was like, all right, 256 00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:39,400 Speaker 4: here's the final ten minutes. And that was what was shown. 257 00:11:50,120 --> 00:11:55,200 Speaker 2: It felt like watching it, and this infamous series is 258 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:57,800 Speaker 2: a lot about what's the secrets of behind the scenes, 259 00:11:57,880 --> 00:12:00,280 Speaker 2: kind of pulling back the layer and getting to the 260 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:04,400 Speaker 2: real part. It felt like watching your season. It was 261 00:12:04,440 --> 00:12:07,480 Speaker 2: shocking to me that production was able to keep you around. 262 00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:10,760 Speaker 2: I say that because it did feel like everything was 263 00:12:10,800 --> 00:12:15,079 Speaker 2: going okay, and then these last week two weeks like 264 00:12:15,200 --> 00:12:17,800 Speaker 2: it it felt like every place you turned, and I'll 265 00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 2: just be honest, you couldn't make a good decision and 266 00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:23,640 Speaker 2: it was like you were gonna get pounded from every 267 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:27,000 Speaker 2: side and there was no right like you were kind 268 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:32,080 Speaker 2: of saying decision you could make, including a comment Rachel 269 00:12:32,200 --> 00:12:36,840 Speaker 2: made which is a big accusation. It's a big question. 270 00:12:38,040 --> 00:12:39,960 Speaker 2: So I want you to answer kind of respond to 271 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:42,120 Speaker 2: this statement that she made. But then also if you 272 00:12:42,120 --> 00:12:44,719 Speaker 2: can tie it into how is production encouraging you to 273 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 2: even stick around after this kind of thing? As being 274 00:12:46,960 --> 00:12:50,120 Speaker 2: said she said that you kept her around or you 275 00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 2: told her that you were in love with her because 276 00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:57,480 Speaker 2: you wanted to sleep with her. That is a big accusation, 277 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:00,640 Speaker 2: one of the biggest I think, and again talked about 278 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:04,200 Speaker 2: enough on the show that the show's ever had. So 279 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:06,439 Speaker 2: how did production keep you around? And what was your 280 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 2: thoughts when this was being said to you, knowing it 281 00:13:09,040 --> 00:13:11,480 Speaker 2: was going to be aired at some point on national television. 282 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:15,600 Speaker 4: Well, she said that at the live show, I guess so, 283 00:13:17,040 --> 00:13:19,000 Speaker 4: and I was prepped with a You're going to have 284 00:13:19,200 --> 00:13:23,000 Speaker 4: at most fifteen seconds to respond. So when that was 285 00:13:23,040 --> 00:13:26,080 Speaker 4: said to me, I said, no, like, there's literally I 286 00:13:26,120 --> 00:13:27,240 Speaker 4: can't go into detail. 287 00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:30,160 Speaker 1: This is a live show. I have to just deny 288 00:13:30,240 --> 00:13:31,160 Speaker 1: this because. 289 00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:33,840 Speaker 4: It wasn't anyways, But I understand that she was hurt 290 00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:36,880 Speaker 4: and and her and I've talked since then, We've made amend, 291 00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:39,200 Speaker 4: So you know, I'm I'm not going to falter for 292 00:13:39,280 --> 00:13:41,840 Speaker 4: what she said, but I was basically told you of 293 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:44,080 Speaker 4: fifteen seconds for whatever she says. And so when she 294 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:46,280 Speaker 4: said that, my brain was like computing and I'm like, 295 00:13:46,320 --> 00:13:48,720 Speaker 4: there's literally nothing else you can say in this timeframe 296 00:13:49,600 --> 00:13:52,760 Speaker 4: other than no, that's not true. So I said that 297 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 4: and that was it, and you know, it was it 298 00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:57,319 Speaker 4: was very you know, it sucked because then everyone online, 299 00:13:57,400 --> 00:13:58,960 Speaker 4: you know, and this is still the narrative I see 300 00:13:58,960 --> 00:14:01,079 Speaker 4: as like Clayton just said what he needed to say 301 00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:04,760 Speaker 4: to sleep with these women, and that was so false, 302 00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:07,199 Speaker 4: like I didn't have to sleep with any of those women. 303 00:14:07,240 --> 00:14:10,040 Speaker 1: And also like, listen, I've never claimed to be a saint. 304 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:13,880 Speaker 4: You know, I have a past, and I would just 305 00:14:13,920 --> 00:14:15,880 Speaker 4: say like I've never you know, it's not like I 306 00:14:15,960 --> 00:14:18,240 Speaker 4: was desperate to finally be intimate with a woman like 307 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:21,400 Speaker 4: I'd never been before. So you know, that was like 308 00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:23,680 Speaker 4: the narrative that got spun was like Clayton saying whatever 309 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 4: you needs to say to get these women in bed, 310 00:14:25,280 --> 00:14:29,160 Speaker 4: and I'm like, that's ridiculous, Like that's stupid. I just 311 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:31,200 Speaker 4: if I was going to actually get engaged at the 312 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:33,160 Speaker 4: end of the show, which I opened my mind up to, 313 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:34,160 Speaker 4: I said, yeah, I'll do it. 314 00:14:34,520 --> 00:14:37,160 Speaker 1: But if I'm going to get engaged, I need to 315 00:14:37,160 --> 00:14:38,480 Speaker 1: make sure that we're sexually compatible. 316 00:14:38,520 --> 00:14:40,440 Speaker 4: That's just that's just if we were going to walk 317 00:14:40,440 --> 00:14:42,960 Speaker 4: out here being boyfriend girlfriend like, then yeah, I don't 318 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:45,440 Speaker 4: need to be intimate. But if I'm actually gonna propose, 319 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:47,120 Speaker 4: and this is serious to me, I don't care TV 320 00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:48,640 Speaker 4: or not, like if I'm going to need to propose 321 00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:50,320 Speaker 4: with a ring, this is serious. 322 00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:52,920 Speaker 1: So I need to make sure there's sexual compatibility. 323 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:55,360 Speaker 4: So second I made that decision that I was ready 324 00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:59,040 Speaker 4: to get down on one knee. That's where I was like, Okay, hey, 325 00:14:59,080 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 4: I'm going to go explore these relationships fully. And each 326 00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:02,640 Speaker 4: of the women said that to me forbadihim, I want 327 00:15:02,680 --> 00:15:06,280 Speaker 4: you to explore the relationships fully as I walked into overnights. 328 00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:08,120 Speaker 4: That was said by every all three of those women 329 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:10,880 Speaker 4: going into that next weekend. So I was like, okay, well, 330 00:15:10,880 --> 00:15:13,680 Speaker 4: you're telling me to explore the relationships fully as I 331 00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:16,600 Speaker 4: walk into overnights, I feel like we're you're without saying it, 332 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,680 Speaker 4: You're telling me what you're okay with. That's the assumption 333 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:22,840 Speaker 4: I made, and I don't know then, based on their responses, 334 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:24,040 Speaker 4: I guess it wasn't. 335 00:15:23,840 --> 00:15:24,880 Speaker 1: You know, I took it the wrong way. 336 00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:27,120 Speaker 4: But if you tell a man man that, I think 337 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:29,880 Speaker 4: he perceives it a bit differently than a woman potentially, 338 00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:30,720 Speaker 4: or at least I did. 339 00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, this is tough stuff, Ben, What is your take? 340 00:15:33,880 --> 00:15:36,360 Speaker 2: I mean, I think, well, one, I want to comment 341 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:40,120 Speaker 2: on the fifteen seconds to respond that is a just 342 00:15:40,600 --> 00:15:43,960 Speaker 2: a spot on scenario that happens on this show. 343 00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:46,520 Speaker 1: Like it just does. Like, Hey, we're going to put 344 00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:47,280 Speaker 1: you on the live show. 345 00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:49,360 Speaker 2: Just want to let you know, like this is going 346 00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 2: to get kind of ugly for a bit and you're 347 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:53,320 Speaker 2: gonna have fifteen seconds to say something to like pretty 348 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:58,160 Speaker 2: much like complete the conversation. You're like, no, that's so. 349 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 2: I just want to make note that for any listener 350 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:02,560 Speaker 2: as we talk about some of the behind the scenes 351 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:06,480 Speaker 2: here without breaking our NBA's like, that is a very 352 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:09,560 Speaker 2: common thing. It means, it's very real. It's not edited 353 00:16:09,600 --> 00:16:11,200 Speaker 2: to make it look like it was only fifteen seconds. 354 00:16:11,200 --> 00:16:14,080 Speaker 2: Though you have fifteen seconds to explain how much you 355 00:16:14,120 --> 00:16:17,280 Speaker 2: actually cared about this person. That's the first thought. 356 00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:17,800 Speaker 1: I think. 357 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:21,680 Speaker 2: My thought as the lead is as a former lead 358 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:26,400 Speaker 2: when it comes to fantasy suites and intimacy, I mean, 359 00:16:26,440 --> 00:16:28,080 Speaker 2: I think Clayton. The only thing I would say was like, 360 00:16:28,120 --> 00:16:31,120 Speaker 2: you should have asked for not for no other reason 361 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:34,440 Speaker 2: than mostly so that what happened at the end of 362 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:36,600 Speaker 2: your show didn't happen like clarity, Like what do you 363 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:39,280 Speaker 2: exactly mean by that? Like, Hey, this is you know, 364 00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 2: very a very like thrown up, Like I'm still kind 365 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:44,920 Speaker 2: of confused, I'm feeling things for all of you. Clarity 366 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:48,480 Speaker 2: probably wouldn't have been helpful there. And that's on you, Like, 367 00:16:48,720 --> 00:16:50,920 Speaker 2: that's not a production thing, that's not an editing thing. 368 00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:53,960 Speaker 2: That's on you as the lead to say, Okay, what 369 00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:55,560 Speaker 2: do you think happens in this situation? 370 00:16:55,680 --> 00:16:57,040 Speaker 1: Right? What are we good about. 371 00:16:56,760 --> 00:17:00,400 Speaker 2: Here as a couple? Yeah, And you didn't, and that's 372 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:04,040 Speaker 2: probably where the mistake was made and why the feelings 373 00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:06,720 Speaker 2: were hurt. I also think, and I goodness, gracious, we 374 00:17:06,840 --> 00:17:10,240 Speaker 2: love Rachel so much on this podcast, I think you 375 00:17:10,480 --> 00:17:14,000 Speaker 2: had three really big personalities at the end of your season, 376 00:17:14,800 --> 00:17:22,640 Speaker 2: really strong, outspoken people women, and I think they were 377 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:24,719 Speaker 2: just going to say what they felt and what they 378 00:17:24,760 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 2: were thinking no matter what, because that's who they are 379 00:17:27,760 --> 00:17:33,120 Speaker 2: as people. And I think you were the common denominating target. 380 00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:35,280 Speaker 2: And I think it was a really hard situation for 381 00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:38,399 Speaker 2: you to go through because you had three great people, 382 00:17:38,440 --> 00:17:42,359 Speaker 2: but three big personalities that were outspoken, and that that's tough. 383 00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:44,399 Speaker 2: It's tough when two of them are going to be 384 00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:45,720 Speaker 2: upset with, like really upset with you. 385 00:17:46,359 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean that's a good I mean, yes, they're 386 00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:50,360 Speaker 4: very powerful personalities, each of them. Each of them are 387 00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:52,399 Speaker 4: doing really well in their own ways, and some of 388 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:54,199 Speaker 4: them are you know, really blowing up in the reality 389 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:57,040 Speaker 4: TV world and some are just making you know, they're 390 00:17:57,080 --> 00:17:58,160 Speaker 4: still doing really great. 391 00:17:57,920 --> 00:17:59,080 Speaker 1: With brand partnerships. 392 00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 4: But yeah, they I mean you see like they're still 393 00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:05,439 Speaker 4: years later, very prominent in their respective fields. 394 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:08,639 Speaker 1: So it's yeah, I mean it's a good spot on assessment. 395 00:18:09,119 --> 00:18:12,159 Speaker 4: And they you know, were unapologetically themselves and so when 396 00:18:12,200 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 4: they had the moment, they're like, I'm gonna speak my mind, 397 00:18:14,160 --> 00:18:16,280 Speaker 4: and they did and they had the right to do that. 398 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:17,800 Speaker 1: So but you're spot on. 399 00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:17,919 Speaker 4: You. 400 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:20,280 Speaker 1: I also accountability. I could have always asked more questions 401 00:18:20,280 --> 00:18:23,879 Speaker 1: and I've learned that, So it's good. See you're learning. 402 00:18:24,119 --> 00:18:27,320 Speaker 3: I think that's sometimes the producers know the lead better 403 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:31,560 Speaker 3: than sometimes the lead knows themselves. At this point, and 404 00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:36,840 Speaker 3: they order the last three contestants in a certain way 405 00:18:36,880 --> 00:18:39,679 Speaker 3: when it comes to fantasy Suites, too, really mess with 406 00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:43,400 Speaker 3: your mind. I feel maybe just as a viewer. I'll 407 00:18:43,480 --> 00:18:47,200 Speaker 3: tell me if I'm wrong that, like, inside, you knew 408 00:18:47,200 --> 00:18:49,720 Speaker 3: that it was going to be Susie, and then they 409 00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:52,359 Speaker 3: intentionally made it so that she would be last that 410 00:18:52,440 --> 00:18:55,199 Speaker 3: week to really mess with you, all right. 411 00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:57,359 Speaker 1: I can talk about this part because they did let me. 412 00:18:57,440 --> 00:19:00,000 Speaker 4: I said it on a podcast like two years ago, 413 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 4: and then I was like, you guys can cut that out, 414 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:03,359 Speaker 4: and they left it in and production it cleared it. 415 00:19:03,560 --> 00:19:06,600 Speaker 1: I can say this was switched. 416 00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:12,000 Speaker 4: Susie was supposed to be first, and I said I 417 00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:14,080 Speaker 4: wanted to go first because I was the most in 418 00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:16,480 Speaker 4: love with her, And so I said, hey, I'm pretty 419 00:19:16,480 --> 00:19:19,280 Speaker 4: certain unless she hits me with something political or she 420 00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:21,240 Speaker 4: says something that's like a deal breaker in. 421 00:19:21,480 --> 00:19:22,240 Speaker 1: The fancy suites. 422 00:19:22,280 --> 00:19:23,840 Speaker 4: And I even say, I'm not really even political, but 423 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:26,400 Speaker 4: like if she if there's something she says or does, 424 00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:30,399 Speaker 4: or if we have no sexual compatibility, like then I 425 00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:32,679 Speaker 4: can move forward with the other two women, you know, 426 00:19:32,720 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 4: because it's not meant to be. 427 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,640 Speaker 1: But if all goes well on. 428 00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:40,359 Speaker 4: The overnights, then I will, you know, basically end it 429 00:19:40,480 --> 00:19:43,440 Speaker 4: right there, and so I was, yeah, most in love 430 00:19:43,480 --> 00:19:45,560 Speaker 4: with her, but I had love, you know, and with 431 00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:47,639 Speaker 4: the other women as well, it just wasn't as strong. 432 00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:48,120 Speaker 1: At that point. 433 00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:50,280 Speaker 4: I was like, I'm close to making a decision, but 434 00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 4: I guess I'm still the door is still open if 435 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:53,160 Speaker 4: things go wrong. 436 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:56,399 Speaker 1: On overnights with Susie. And they weren't. They weren't going 437 00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,879 Speaker 1: to have that. They they said, noe, we're we're putting 438 00:19:58,880 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 1: her third. 439 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:02,840 Speaker 4: And so they said, you've kept an open mind, so 440 00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 4: keep an open mind with these women. And I, you know, 441 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:08,480 Speaker 4: I said, well, what happens if she's not okay with 442 00:20:08,680 --> 00:20:10,360 Speaker 4: like what happens in the fantas wet It's like, wow, 443 00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:12,680 Speaker 4: Well they said that you stop woor relationships fully. So 444 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:14,639 Speaker 4: I was like, okay, yeah, that's true. So I was like, 445 00:20:14,680 --> 00:20:16,280 Speaker 4: all right, I'll do it. I'll put her well, we'll 446 00:20:16,280 --> 00:20:19,439 Speaker 4: put her third and then and that's what happens. 447 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:24,439 Speaker 2: See, this is what we've kind of talked about, is 448 00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:27,479 Speaker 2: there is people will argue and we go back and 449 00:20:27,480 --> 00:20:29,760 Speaker 2: forth on how much editing actually exists to make things 450 00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:32,639 Speaker 2: look different than they are. I always said, the manipulation 451 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,760 Speaker 2: or this those that kind of like God scenario that 452 00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:38,440 Speaker 2: production is looking down from a camera up above saying, no, 453 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:40,639 Speaker 2: we're going to move the pufflic puzzle piece here because 454 00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:42,480 Speaker 2: we think this is how this story could play out. 455 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:45,880 Speaker 2: That happens a lot more. Uh, And I actually find 456 00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:49,680 Speaker 2: it fascinating personally. I think it is Uh. It does 457 00:20:49,800 --> 00:20:54,240 Speaker 2: make a is used reference good TV? Is it healthy? 458 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:55,040 Speaker 1: Is it fair? 459 00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:56,960 Speaker 2: All those things we could argue and go back and 460 00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:01,119 Speaker 2: forth on. However, it's the response of the people in 461 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:04,239 Speaker 2: the scenario that kind of make or break if their 462 00:21:04,320 --> 00:21:06,399 Speaker 2: story is going to come out true or not, or 463 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:07,760 Speaker 2: if it's going to come out the way they want 464 00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:13,160 Speaker 2: it to or not. Clayton, you went through this whole process. 465 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:14,120 Speaker 1: You lived it. 466 00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:16,600 Speaker 2: We've talked about, you know, mostly with the final three 467 00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:18,639 Speaker 2: kind of the scenarios that existed, also with Shane a 468 00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 2: little bit at the beginning when you. 469 00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:24,600 Speaker 1: Were in it, was. 470 00:21:24,560 --> 00:21:29,240 Speaker 2: There ever a moment that you thought, oh my goodness, 471 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:32,560 Speaker 2: this is going to be really bad, like I'm going 472 00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:36,720 Speaker 2: to watch this back on national television and this is 473 00:21:36,760 --> 00:21:39,480 Speaker 2: going to be really bad. Or were you in it 474 00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:41,600 Speaker 2: and you're like, this is a beautiful love story coming 475 00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:43,760 Speaker 2: true and every like people are going to love to 476 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:44,159 Speaker 2: watch it. 477 00:21:44,960 --> 00:21:49,760 Speaker 1: Now it flipped when it was okay. 478 00:21:49,800 --> 00:21:51,679 Speaker 4: There was drama, but it wasn't anything I felt like 479 00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:53,879 Speaker 4: I couldn't recover from, or that wasn't going it was 480 00:21:53,960 --> 00:21:57,760 Speaker 4: going to be overwhelming. But at the point when I 481 00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:01,640 Speaker 4: after Gabby and Rachel, met my family and I made 482 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:07,160 Speaker 4: the decision to pursue Susie even though she was gone 483 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:12,280 Speaker 4: at that moment, there was a producer that was off 484 00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:15,240 Speaker 4: camera and they looked at me and said, if you 485 00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 4: do this, you will not be liked by at least 486 00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:21,399 Speaker 4: half the audience. You will be hated like you have 487 00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:24,159 Speaker 4: like we can protect you, We've been able to protect you, 488 00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:26,480 Speaker 4: but at this point, if you make this decision, we 489 00:22:26,560 --> 00:22:29,879 Speaker 4: can no longer protect you. And my response for Baden was, 490 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:33,240 Speaker 4: I don't give a f what people think. I'm doing 491 00:22:33,240 --> 00:22:36,000 Speaker 4: what's best for me, and my heart is telling me 492 00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:38,000 Speaker 4: to follow this. And then they looked at me and said, okay, 493 00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:40,360 Speaker 4: well just know that from that from here on out, 494 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:43,199 Speaker 4: like we cannot protect you. That was that, and I 495 00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:45,359 Speaker 4: knew at that point it was a very tense moment. 496 00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:47,440 Speaker 4: It was a and they yelled at me, and I 497 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:50,840 Speaker 4: yelled back at them, and and it was like all right, 498 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:51,879 Speaker 4: and I made. 499 00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:53,879 Speaker 1: My decision, and that's when I knew. 500 00:22:53,880 --> 00:22:57,000 Speaker 4: I was like, yeah, this is going to probably be bad, 501 00:22:57,200 --> 00:23:00,040 Speaker 4: you know, because it was very tense and at that 502 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:02,560 Speaker 4: point there was not as much communication amongst me and 503 00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:05,320 Speaker 4: the producers. It was the last you know, that was 504 00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 4: what four days left in the season. It was basically like, 505 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:10,680 Speaker 4: let's just get to the finish line. I hate you all, 506 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:12,960 Speaker 4: you don't like me, Let's. 507 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:13,359 Speaker 1: Just finish this. 508 00:23:13,440 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 4: But then I was like, Clayton, the danger is now 509 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,560 Speaker 4: you have pissed them off and you're not on the 510 00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:21,399 Speaker 4: same team anymore. It feels like, and now they can 511 00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:25,080 Speaker 4: go edit a season, So now you're at the mercy 512 00:23:25,080 --> 00:23:26,880 Speaker 4: of whatever they choose to edit and what you've put 513 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:27,320 Speaker 4: out there. 514 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:29,280 Speaker 1: But that, yeah, that moment was that's when I knew 515 00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:30,160 Speaker 1: things were going to go south. 516 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:32,919 Speaker 3: Do you think that the edit could have been romantic? 517 00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:34,520 Speaker 1: Well, put it this way. I mean, and this is 518 00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:35,840 Speaker 1: where again I give them credit. 519 00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:39,560 Speaker 4: Had Susie went first in Fantasy Sweets, let's just say 520 00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:41,800 Speaker 4: I would have chosen her, the show would have been 521 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:45,200 Speaker 4: a boring ass show. Instead, what everyone got was the 522 00:23:45,560 --> 00:23:48,520 Speaker 4: ending that I that was created, which was, like I 523 00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:51,720 Speaker 4: would say, a very entertaining season and was very talked about. 524 00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:53,760 Speaker 1: And yeah I was you know, painted as the villain 525 00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:54,800 Speaker 1: and intact and all that. 526 00:23:55,240 --> 00:23:57,520 Speaker 4: But it made for really interesting television and a lot 527 00:23:57,560 --> 00:24:00,000 Speaker 4: of people talked about it from a from a standpoint 528 00:24:00,200 --> 00:24:02,159 Speaker 4: have like show success. I know the show, you know, 529 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:04,119 Speaker 4: I was told the producers were all high five and 530 00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:05,680 Speaker 4: at the after party at the end of it all 531 00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:08,200 Speaker 4: like we just you know, really put together a spectacle, 532 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:11,040 Speaker 4: and they did so, you know, like they did a 533 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:11,840 Speaker 4: great job. 534 00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:13,240 Speaker 1: And at my expense. 535 00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:15,240 Speaker 4: It's like, yeah, I gotta take some accountability. It's like, 536 00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:17,400 Speaker 4: you I walked on that show, and I was ignorant 537 00:24:17,440 --> 00:24:18,720 Speaker 4: and was just like, oh, I'm just gonna be me, 538 00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:21,919 Speaker 4: you know, and and I was moldible and they easily 539 00:24:21,960 --> 00:24:24,680 Speaker 4: poppeted around at points because I didn't have the confidence 540 00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:27,320 Speaker 4: and self love to put my foot down. So again, 541 00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 4: like I take accountability for that. Ultimately, Yeah, there could 542 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:32,320 Speaker 4: have been a happy ending. I could have been you know, 543 00:24:32,359 --> 00:24:34,320 Speaker 4: I don't. I can't say I would have ever had 544 00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:38,280 Speaker 4: like a golden you know, bachelor at it, Like you know, 545 00:24:38,560 --> 00:24:40,399 Speaker 4: I don't. And people didn't like me from the get go. 546 00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:42,600 Speaker 4: They wondered why I was chosen, but they could have 547 00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:45,479 Speaker 4: absolutely had an ending where if you know, Susie went 548 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:48,520 Speaker 4: first and the fantasy sweets all went well boom, Like 549 00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:49,680 Speaker 4: we could have walked out. 550 00:24:49,520 --> 00:24:51,200 Speaker 1: You know, holding hands, walking off into. 551 00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:52,720 Speaker 4: The sunset and everyone's like, yeah, I don't really love 552 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:54,480 Speaker 4: like them as a bacheler, but whatever, they're happy. 553 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:56,359 Speaker 1: It could have been a completely different outcome. 554 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:09,960 Speaker 3: So you mentioned that you didn't really know you from 555 00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:12,239 Speaker 3: Michelle season, that you were plucked out of obscurity. Do 556 00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:16,119 Speaker 3: you think that there's sometimes in their head, like I thought, oh, 557 00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:19,880 Speaker 3: they can be more malleable, there can be more easily 558 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:24,520 Speaker 3: manipulated because they didn't get further along the bachelorette process 559 00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:27,320 Speaker 3: because there was you, there was Grant, and there was 560 00:25:27,359 --> 00:25:30,160 Speaker 3: Matt James in recent memory, who you were just kind 561 00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:33,760 Speaker 3: of plucked. You had no experience and you know, so 562 00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:35,720 Speaker 3: you're just a playtoy to them. 563 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:38,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I think that was absolutely a part 564 00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:38,520 Speaker 1: of it. 565 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 4: And their decision making was for one, okay, he looks 566 00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:44,680 Speaker 4: the part, you know, and primarily they cast a lead 567 00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:48,159 Speaker 4: of that's usually white and over six foot, so I 568 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:50,919 Speaker 4: hit those markers and then it was like, oh but 569 00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:53,080 Speaker 4: they I mean they psycha evowed me. I mean, they 570 00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:56,120 Speaker 4: did a full psych eval, very very deep criminal background check. 571 00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:57,080 Speaker 1: I mean, they knew me. 572 00:25:57,160 --> 00:25:59,160 Speaker 4: Like you said, at one point earlier, better than I 573 00:25:59,240 --> 00:26:00,240 Speaker 4: likely knew myself. 574 00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 1: And so they knew exactly what they were getting. You know. 575 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:05,280 Speaker 4: They're like, we got a guy that looks the part, 576 00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:09,080 Speaker 4: but we can basically pull him into certain directions and 577 00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:11,159 Speaker 4: scenarios and it's gonna, you know, if we need to, 578 00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:13,960 Speaker 4: we can create chaos. And they did, and like that's 579 00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:15,920 Speaker 4: they I know for a fact, that's half the reason 580 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:18,400 Speaker 4: they chose me. It was because they're like, this guy 581 00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:20,920 Speaker 4: looks strong willed and looks confident and looks the part, 582 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:23,159 Speaker 4: but like we can basically hop in his body and 583 00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:25,320 Speaker 4: control him, and and and. 584 00:26:25,320 --> 00:26:26,399 Speaker 1: You know, and I allowed them to. 585 00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:29,320 Speaker 4: I mean I I basically didn't stand my ground at 586 00:26:29,359 --> 00:26:31,239 Speaker 4: points when I could have, because I was fearful of 587 00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:35,800 Speaker 4: upsetting them, and fearful of losing the role of the bachelor, 588 00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:38,920 Speaker 4: fearful of you know, yeah, basically being you know, seen 589 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:41,320 Speaker 4: as a reject in their eyes. I wanted their approval, 590 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:43,280 Speaker 4: like I wanted the girls approval, like I wanted the 591 00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:46,159 Speaker 4: audience's approval. So you know, I did everything in my 592 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:48,000 Speaker 4: power to stay on their good terms, and there are 593 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:49,360 Speaker 4: points where I was like, hey, I don't really want 594 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:49,960 Speaker 4: to do this, but. 595 00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:54,080 Speaker 1: I don't want to piss him off, So you. 596 00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:57,360 Speaker 2: Know, you're it's a good point. Well, I have two 597 00:26:57,400 --> 00:26:59,800 Speaker 2: things say, one as I one hundred percent know or 598 00:26:59,880 --> 00:27:04,280 Speaker 2: I don't know. I believe strongly they know us better 599 00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:07,719 Speaker 2: than we know ourselves. I've been in two scenarios behind 600 00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:11,040 Speaker 2: the scenes in a production room where they have accurately 601 00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:16,360 Speaker 2: predicted somebody's like big life choices spot on that that 602 00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:18,280 Speaker 2: person would have never known they were going to choose 603 00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:21,000 Speaker 2: like two years later, yes, And I was like, oh, 604 00:27:21,000 --> 00:27:22,720 Speaker 2: that can't be true. And then it happens and I'm like, 605 00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:24,640 Speaker 2: how did you guys know this? 606 00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:25,800 Speaker 1: This is very creepy. 607 00:27:26,000 --> 00:27:27,399 Speaker 2: This is probably the part that I don't want to 608 00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:29,960 Speaker 2: think about too much because it gets too Truman Show esque. 609 00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,240 Speaker 4: It's very well watched that and someone said watch it 610 00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:37,560 Speaker 4: high and yeah, that's like my one vice is weed. 611 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:41,560 Speaker 4: So oh I saw my only advice. But I was like, okay, 612 00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,520 Speaker 4: so I watched it. Oh my gosh. I was like 613 00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:47,480 Speaker 4: from that point forward, I was like paranoid. I'm like, yeah, 614 00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 4: freaks out. Am I going to open up my door 615 00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:52,000 Speaker 4: over here and someone's gonna run by, like damn, he 616 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:52,840 Speaker 4: was supposed. 617 00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:54,159 Speaker 1: To open something. 618 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:57,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, this is the deep state that everybody seems to 619 00:27:57,880 --> 00:28:01,440 Speaker 2: be wanting to fight right now. It's the Bachelor World 620 00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:03,800 Speaker 2: and whatever they know about is there is something weird 621 00:28:03,920 --> 00:28:05,640 Speaker 2: that they know somehow, some way. 622 00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:08,560 Speaker 1: Ah, then you're going down They're going down a path. 623 00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:10,520 Speaker 4: But I'm kind of I'm int ai and all that 624 00:28:10,680 --> 00:28:13,040 Speaker 4: nerd and out and all this weird stuffy Let's listen. 625 00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:15,640 Speaker 4: That's a conversation another time. But yeah, there's there's there's 626 00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:18,760 Speaker 4: something something. How did they know that I was going 627 00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:22,119 Speaker 4: to do that? And yeah, you're you're spot on, man. 628 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,040 Speaker 4: They can predict stuff because they psychoanalyzed us with some 629 00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:27,240 Speaker 4: of the best minds in the in the in the business. 630 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:29,640 Speaker 4: They had us, you know, basically talk to them every 631 00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:32,920 Speaker 4: single day. They had me to talk about my journal entries, 632 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:36,200 Speaker 4: I mean everything I shared with them at all points, 633 00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:38,400 Speaker 4: you know, so it's like they knew exactly where I 634 00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,440 Speaker 4: was at. They knew the rankings of the women because 635 00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:43,760 Speaker 4: it was like one to thirty, where do each of 636 00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 4: these girls stand? So you had a little board, you know, 637 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 4: and this boop from six to four It's like. 638 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:53,800 Speaker 2: I had a I had like a little u rolodex 639 00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:56,360 Speaker 2: of their pictures and they'd have me move the pictures 640 00:28:56,400 --> 00:29:00,000 Speaker 2: around and it'der. But they gave me a quarter ward too. Yeah, yeah, 641 00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,280 Speaker 2: with the names on it. Clayton, you are one of 642 00:29:03,360 --> 00:29:05,480 Speaker 2: we have to close here. You were one of four 643 00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,280 Speaker 2: bachelors since my time, no three, So you're one of 644 00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:11,959 Speaker 2: three that did not ask any advice going into your season. 645 00:29:13,400 --> 00:29:14,600 Speaker 1: So I think, what has there been. 646 00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:15,840 Speaker 2: Ten nine of you? 647 00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:17,320 Speaker 3: So ten nine of them? 648 00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:20,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, you are one of three who did not want 649 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:23,040 Speaker 2: any of my help, which is fine. So the question 650 00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:27,280 Speaker 2: is why did you not want maybe my help? But 651 00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:30,800 Speaker 2: that would make sense if you asked other people for insight, 652 00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:32,960 Speaker 2: and then I'd be like, that's great. But either you 653 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:37,080 Speaker 2: asked nobody or you didn't ask me. Uh, And maybe 654 00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 2: we could have prepped you bachelors of the past to say, hey, 655 00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:44,120 Speaker 2: don't be super malleable. Try to stay a foot like 656 00:29:44,160 --> 00:29:46,640 Speaker 2: a step ahead of them. They're going to do this stuff. 657 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:49,760 Speaker 2: You can put your foot down and say no. If 658 00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:52,200 Speaker 2: you find yourself in a situation where all three are, 659 00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:55,400 Speaker 2: you know, in the fantasy suites with you, like, here's 660 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 2: maybe how you navigate it. 661 00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:58,920 Speaker 1: But you did, I mean you did it with me, 662 00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:00,920 Speaker 1: So did you with anybody? And if not? Why? 663 00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:04,040 Speaker 4: No? The only person that I got advice from was 664 00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,840 Speaker 4: Michelle because they brought her on like the first day 665 00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:10,000 Speaker 4: of the show, which they showed on like a YouTube 666 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:12,000 Speaker 4: clip or the channel, but never like I think they'd 667 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:16,080 Speaker 4: never put it on like the actual televised show. And 668 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:18,640 Speaker 4: she came and the advice I think she gave me 669 00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:24,760 Speaker 4: was just basically just be open, like or don't they 670 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:30,240 Speaker 4: take things too seriously and just understand that. Like you're like, 671 00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:32,320 Speaker 4: like it's it's you. I can't really give you advice. 672 00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:33,600 Speaker 4: It's kind of what she said. It was like, you're 673 00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:35,880 Speaker 4: just gonna have to your experience will be unique from 674 00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:38,200 Speaker 4: from mine and you're you're your own unique person, and 675 00:30:38,200 --> 00:30:41,680 Speaker 4: your perspective will you know, dictate the outcome of this show. 676 00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:43,920 Speaker 4: And I wanted her to give me, like we'll give 677 00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,120 Speaker 4: me actual line items of things that I need to 678 00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:48,160 Speaker 4: watch out for, and she was like, I really can't 679 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:51,320 Speaker 4: because it could influence you, and you know, basically it 680 00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:54,160 Speaker 4: was like you just got to be you, right and so, 681 00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:57,000 Speaker 4: and she gave me some other advice I can't remember, 682 00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:59,200 Speaker 4: but that was the one that I was like, okay, 683 00:30:59,280 --> 00:31:01,280 Speaker 4: like I that's there's really no like hard and fast 684 00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:03,680 Speaker 4: yet rule number one, don't do this, rule number two. 685 00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:04,000 Speaker 1: Don't do this. 686 00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:07,480 Speaker 4: But then it also came into play that I didn't 687 00:31:07,480 --> 00:31:11,200 Speaker 4: ask other people because I a couple of things. I 688 00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:13,560 Speaker 4: didn't want to be swayed by somebody. I was like, 689 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:16,880 Speaker 4: I want to go into this experience with like no 690 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:19,720 Speaker 4: influence because I thought that, like. 691 00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:22,600 Speaker 2: The producers who would be influencing you from the start, 692 00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:24,440 Speaker 2: the only influence you. 693 00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:28,320 Speaker 4: Wanted it was from the production influenced me as much 694 00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:31,360 Speaker 4: as they did subtly right, Like I wasn't aware of 695 00:31:31,360 --> 00:31:33,040 Speaker 4: it because it was my first I never really watched 696 00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:33,480 Speaker 4: the show. 697 00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:35,280 Speaker 1: I didn't know what it was, but like I didn't 698 00:31:35,280 --> 00:31:36,240 Speaker 1: know the behind the scenes. 699 00:31:36,280 --> 00:31:38,160 Speaker 4: So I was like, I'll be able to, you know, 700 00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:40,480 Speaker 4: you know, navigate this environment, but I don't want any 701 00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:42,400 Speaker 4: type of influence. I didn't know that they were going 702 00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:45,120 Speaker 4: to be stepping in at points which you guys would 703 00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:47,360 Speaker 4: have told me how to ask. All that being said, 704 00:31:48,640 --> 00:31:51,080 Speaker 4: I would I'm glad it went the way that it 705 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,520 Speaker 4: went because it was that was the journey that was 706 00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:56,880 Speaker 4: meant for me. I am glad, happy with who I 707 00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:59,560 Speaker 4: am today. I needed a waking up. I needed to 708 00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:02,160 Speaker 4: real lives that like people will step in and take 709 00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:04,600 Speaker 4: advantage of you, and people like I needed to grow up. 710 00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:06,920 Speaker 4: I needed to wise up, you know, I needed to 711 00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:09,680 Speaker 4: become what I am today. And I wouldn't have become 712 00:32:09,720 --> 00:32:12,480 Speaker 4: that had I had you know, been fed you know, 713 00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:16,680 Speaker 4: an incredible you know experience on a silver platter, right, 714 00:32:16,680 --> 00:32:18,080 Speaker 4: Like if I would have gotten you know, the golden 715 00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:21,280 Speaker 4: boy at it like some bachelors do you know, we're like, 716 00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:23,000 Speaker 4: I'm like, d this is he's the hero. 717 00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:23,520 Speaker 1: Whatever. 718 00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:25,440 Speaker 4: Like if I would have gotten that, then I would 719 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:27,840 Speaker 4: have just kept going with my inc my the things 720 00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:30,280 Speaker 4: that are my weaknesses and my and things that needed improvement. 721 00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:33,400 Speaker 4: It's never addressed. So instead I had all of my 722 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:36,920 Speaker 4: weaknesses and areas improvement put under a microscope and blasted 723 00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:39,239 Speaker 4: out for the entire universe just to critique me on. 724 00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:41,880 Speaker 4: And that's where I was like, cool, Okay, I'm I 725 00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:44,000 Speaker 4: lack emotional intelligence. Okay, well I guess I should go 726 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:46,400 Speaker 4: acquire it. So I went and did that, and I 727 00:32:46,400 --> 00:32:48,720 Speaker 4: did lack of emotional intelligence. I grew up with two brothers, 728 00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:52,040 Speaker 4: no sisters. We never talked about our emotions. In my household, 729 00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:54,240 Speaker 4: it was my dad was old school, love them to death, 730 00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:55,880 Speaker 4: you know, but like we grew up in an old 731 00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:56,640 Speaker 4: school environment. 732 00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:58,800 Speaker 1: So like, I had no emotional intelligence and I had 733 00:32:58,840 --> 00:32:59,480 Speaker 1: one girlfriend. 734 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:02,320 Speaker 4: Iired to that show, so like, I was not well 735 00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:04,600 Speaker 4: versed on how to interact with like women, you know, 736 00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,000 Speaker 4: as much as I wanted to be so like, but 737 00:33:07,040 --> 00:33:09,000 Speaker 4: none of that would have ever come to light had I, 738 00:33:09,080 --> 00:33:11,120 Speaker 4: you know, basically walked out of there and had a 739 00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:12,800 Speaker 4: big old pat on the back and looked like, you know, 740 00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:14,920 Speaker 4: the hero of the show. No, it's like I needed 741 00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:17,320 Speaker 4: to be all that stuff to be highlighted, and it was. 742 00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:19,440 Speaker 4: So I'm glad it went the way that it went. 743 00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:21,200 Speaker 4: I think you would offered me great advice. I I 744 00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:24,760 Speaker 4: just made the decision to not let anyone influence me. 745 00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:27,560 Speaker 2: So I take I take nothing. I just wondered as 746 00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:29,040 Speaker 2: you as you were talking, I was like, you know, 747 00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 2: what could have helped you here? I mean it was 748 00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:34,640 Speaker 2: a nice like Sean low call to say, hey, buddy, like. 749 00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:36,360 Speaker 1: How do I do this? 750 00:33:36,720 --> 00:33:39,240 Speaker 4: You know, most people don't call me for advice, so 751 00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:42,120 Speaker 4: that's that's which is funny, But they do call me 752 00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:44,000 Speaker 4: when things go wrong. That's the funny thing when like 753 00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:45,520 Speaker 4: it's like when you want to go to talk to 754 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:48,120 Speaker 4: somebody about you know, how do I deal with this adversity? 755 00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:49,040 Speaker 1: I'm like, I'm your guy. 756 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:54,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, who's your publicist or management company? Give me the 757 00:33:54,840 --> 00:33:57,600 Speaker 2: name Clayton. We really appreciate you coming on today. Thanks 758 00:33:57,600 --> 00:34:00,200 Speaker 2: for talking about your time on the show and some 759 00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:05,120 Speaker 2: of these big scenarios that were hard to break down. 760 00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:08,640 Speaker 2: Maybe when they're immediate and like right afterwards, you can't 761 00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:10,799 Speaker 2: just say like, yes, this is where my mind was at, 762 00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:12,680 Speaker 2: or maybe this is what I didn't like or like, 763 00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:15,160 Speaker 2: or this is what production was telling me. I think 764 00:34:15,200 --> 00:34:17,960 Speaker 2: it's really good for the listener. Here's the hope that 765 00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:20,120 Speaker 2: the listeners now tune in to the show and know 766 00:34:20,200 --> 00:34:23,360 Speaker 2: it a little better. But as we said, this is 767 00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:25,880 Speaker 2: a whole new production team. We don't know what the 768 00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:27,640 Speaker 2: show is going to look like from here on out. 769 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:31,680 Speaker 2: It might be unrecognizable to all of us, but. 770 00:34:33,239 --> 00:34:35,800 Speaker 1: Wait and see. Hey Clinton, thanks for coming on Infamous. 771 00:34:35,960 --> 00:34:38,560 Speaker 3: Thanks Begs, Clinton, See you in Paradise. 772 00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:39,200 Speaker 2: Bye. 773 00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:43,360 Speaker 4: Follow the Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous podcasts on 774 00:34:43,400 --> 00:34:46,560 Speaker 4: iHeartRadio or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.