WEBVTT - Patton Oswalt Runs at Love 0:00:02.360 --> 0:00:05.440 I'm Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing 0:00:05.840 --> 0:00:10.240 from My Heart Radio. My friend Lorne Michael's told me 0:00:10.280 --> 0:00:13.560 that back in the nineteen seventies when he launched Saturday 0:00:13.640 --> 0:00:16.840 Night Live, there were only a handful of comedy clubs 0:00:16.880 --> 0:00:21.040 in the United States. Today there are hundreds of comedy clubs, 0:00:21.480 --> 0:00:25.919 and Americans have available to them an ocean of sitcom's, 0:00:26.239 --> 0:00:31.320 late night talk shows and streaming comedy specials. To distinguish 0:00:31.360 --> 0:00:34.720 yourself in that world of comedy is a very difficult 0:00:34.760 --> 0:00:39.239 thing to do. My guest today has succeeded at just that. 0:00:39.960 --> 0:00:44.960 Actor writer comedian Patton Oswald has appeared in many sitcoms, 0:00:45.000 --> 0:00:49.760 including The King of Queens, ap Bio, The Goldberg's Veep, Reno, 0:00:51.040 --> 0:00:55.560 Parks and Wreck, and Brooklyn Nine. He's written two books, 0:00:55.960 --> 0:01:00.920 including a memoir, Silver Screen Fiend, about his of of movies, 0:01:01.240 --> 0:01:04.720 and he does a lot of voiceover work, from My 0:01:04.800 --> 0:01:09.360 Little Pony and Word Girl to Archer and bow Jack, Horsemen, and, 0:01:09.560 --> 0:01:15.160 perhaps most memorably, as Remy in Pixar's Rattatui. First of all, 0:01:15.200 --> 0:01:22.680 I'm a rat, which means life is hard. A second, 0:01:24.000 --> 0:01:30.040 I have a highly developed sense of taste and smell flour, eggs, sugar, 0:01:31.120 --> 0:01:36.600 vanilla bean, oh Small Twisdom. Patton Oswald has released three 0:01:36.840 --> 0:01:41.559 Netflix comedy specials, including last year's I Love Everything, where 0:01:41.560 --> 0:01:46.440 he riffs on parenting, home ownership, and turning fifty. If 0:01:46.480 --> 0:01:49.040 you were to fly a helicopter low over the earth, 0:01:49.040 --> 0:01:52.160 you know what you would see. You'd see people in 0:01:52.200 --> 0:01:57.440 their twenties gobbling drugs, eating delicious food, having sex, People 0:01:57.440 --> 0:01:59.840 in their thirties with actual jobs making the world run, 0:02:00.920 --> 0:02:04.400 People in their forties trying to fund the twenty year olds, 0:02:07.720 --> 0:02:12.440 and then us, the gentle surrendered fifty year olds. We've 0:02:12.480 --> 0:02:18.600 got our earbuds in listening to podcasts what You're done 0:02:18.600 --> 0:02:25.160 by twenty year olds that nobody wants to fuck. In 0:02:25.280 --> 0:02:29.600 April two thousand sixteen, Patton Oswald suffered a great loss 0:02:30.000 --> 0:02:33.200 the sudden death of his first wife, true crime writer 0:02:33.320 --> 0:02:37.919 Michelle McNamara. She was forty six. She left behind patent 0:02:38.080 --> 0:02:42.519 and there then seven year old daughter Alice. My absolute 0:02:42.520 --> 0:02:46.200 first thought was, why isn't it me? She should be here. 0:02:46.360 --> 0:02:49.440 She's doing, in my opinion, the more important work and 0:02:50.240 --> 0:02:53.160 has the better bond with and it would be a 0:02:53.200 --> 0:02:56.280 better example for to raise our daughter with not not 0:02:56.360 --> 0:02:59.760 to I don't believe in you know, um false modesty. 0:02:59.840 --> 0:03:03.560 But if you're going to choose a person to emulate you, 0:03:03.720 --> 0:03:09.160 oh yeah, have do do Michelle more than yeah? Exactly mother. 0:03:09.200 --> 0:03:11.679 You can't replace them right now? No, No, what was 0:03:11.720 --> 0:03:14.320 that like for you in those early stages of managing that, 0:03:15.200 --> 0:03:19.840 not just your grief but your single parenthood you you know, 0:03:19.919 --> 0:03:22.080 I didn't think about this aspect of a part of 0:03:22.120 --> 0:03:26.040 being a dad. At least part of my process is 0:03:27.200 --> 0:03:30.320 going off and having some solitude to be with my 0:03:30.440 --> 0:03:34.320 thoughts and then be there because I was hardwired with 0:03:34.400 --> 0:03:38.400 that old patriarchal model of I'm the one who goes 0:03:38.440 --> 0:03:42.680 out into the wild and gathers up the firewood and 0:03:42.760 --> 0:03:45.360 that kills the meat and brings it all back, and 0:03:45.400 --> 0:03:48.680 then when I'm home I relaxed while they all prepare us. 0:03:48.680 --> 0:03:50.520 And then I had to do I had to still 0:03:50.560 --> 0:03:53.320 go out and get the sustenance, but then be there 0:03:53.400 --> 0:03:55.920 and be the parents. So there was about a year 0:03:55.960 --> 0:04:00.240 of kind of adjusting two. I very early on stop 0:04:00.320 --> 0:04:03.200 judging myself for maybe not being the most dynamic, but 0:04:03.280 --> 0:04:06.360 I was going I'm here, though I'm physically here, when 0:04:06.360 --> 0:04:09.360 I'm home and she's home. I'm here, and I just 0:04:09.440 --> 0:04:12.160 and you find out that if you want to, you 0:04:12.160 --> 0:04:15.120 can adjust your schedule to go, Okay, well, she's in 0:04:15.120 --> 0:04:16.920 school for these hours, so this is when I will 0:04:16.920 --> 0:04:19.320 do work, and this is when I will get stuff 0:04:19.320 --> 0:04:21.919 done in the minute she's done work has got to 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:23.960 know that I'm not available now and I want to 0:04:23.960 --> 0:04:25.680 go pick her up at school and come home with 0:04:25.720 --> 0:04:28.200 her and just be with her. And that was that 0:04:28.320 --> 0:04:29.920 was how it was for a while. That's where were 0:04:30.000 --> 0:04:33.880 That's where we're recording at this time. Because my two 0:04:33.960 --> 0:04:36.279 youngest boys, not the baby, but the two middle boys, 0:04:36.360 --> 0:04:38.479 they take a nap, right people, I mean, when are 0:04:38.560 --> 0:04:41.040 we recording the podcast? I go one o'clock, it's naptime. 0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:43.160 And when they when they nap, Yeah, the only time 0:04:43.160 --> 0:04:47.599 the house is quiet enough to record. Yeah, exactly a 0:04:47.600 --> 0:04:50.000 lot of times, what what you learn is when my 0:04:50.040 --> 0:04:52.160 daughter was talking to me, I had to get over 0:04:52.279 --> 0:04:55.200 my impulse to go, well, what is the action thing 0:04:55.200 --> 0:04:57.080 we can do to solve this. A lot of times 0:04:57.279 --> 0:05:00.520 she wasn't looking for the action solutions. She just let's 0:05:00.520 --> 0:05:02.560 just talk this out and look at it. We don't 0:05:02.600 --> 0:05:05.680 need a solution right now. I just want someone to 0:05:05.880 --> 0:05:08.360 hear me and then to say back, oh, yeah, that 0:05:08.560 --> 0:05:11.400 is really bad and I don't actually have an answer 0:05:11.480 --> 0:05:13.680 right now. Like that, in a weird way, that was 0:05:13.720 --> 0:05:18.840 more reassuring, because coming back with an immediate action solution 0:05:19.360 --> 0:05:22.800 almost feels to that person, especially to my daughter. Sometimes 0:05:22.880 --> 0:05:25.119 I think it felt like I don't think he really 0:05:25.200 --> 0:05:27.400 was listening to me. I think he just wanted to 0:05:27.480 --> 0:05:30.599 jump to the solution. And it seems like men want 0:05:30.600 --> 0:05:33.680 to jump right to the solution, and women are so 0:05:33.760 --> 0:05:38.080 much more patient and and confident in going let we 0:05:38.120 --> 0:05:40.599 don't need to have us let's just keep let's look 0:05:40.600 --> 0:05:44.840 at this exactly, you know, and menally, no, we solve 0:05:44.880 --> 0:05:48.680 it right now. But but there's and nothing makes a 0:05:48.720 --> 0:05:53.039 man panic more than you don't have the answer, where 0:05:53.080 --> 0:05:55.680 there's not only do not have an answer, but when 0:05:55.680 --> 0:05:59.080 you realize the answer is there is not an immediate solution. 0:05:59.560 --> 0:06:03.159 Like there's friend drama um at school and I and 0:06:03.240 --> 0:06:05.560 I had to go I guess you have to go 0:06:05.640 --> 0:06:09.920 back tomorrow and talk to her, or like like there 0:06:10.040 --> 0:06:12.719 wasn't this specific I wanted to do that, like the 0:06:12.720 --> 0:06:14.800 Good Fellas thing of like if someone was being mean 0:06:14.839 --> 0:06:16.680 to her at school, like grab her and put her 0:06:16.720 --> 0:06:20.520 head in a pizza of and go. You know that's 0:06:20.520 --> 0:06:22.559 not doesn't work that way. When I say to my daughters, 0:06:22.560 --> 0:06:24.640 I'm like, I don't say this, but she'll be like, 0:06:24.720 --> 0:06:26.320 she'll be crying and should be like, you know, Amanda 0:06:26.360 --> 0:06:28.560 would mean to me it was mean to be on 0:06:28.680 --> 0:06:32.760 a zoom call like, and my wife is so the 0:06:32.800 --> 0:06:36.400 process and the you know, and I'm like, why don't 0:06:36.400 --> 0:06:40.960 you just tell Amanda to go fund herself? You know, 0:06:41.200 --> 0:06:45.560 like maybe I should go talk to a man. You know, 0:06:45.720 --> 0:06:48.960 you don't need to go into the school angry sixth 0:06:49.000 --> 0:06:51.000 year old man yelling at an eight year old your 0:06:51.080 --> 0:06:54.320 your Your wife was a writer her entire career. She was, yeah, 0:06:54.360 --> 0:06:57.120 I mean she started as a writer in college. She 0:06:57.200 --> 0:07:01.520 taught writing at Michigan and and started it was weird. 0:07:01.600 --> 0:07:06.000 She started writing TV shows and screenplays in Hollywood. They 0:07:06.000 --> 0:07:09.120 were comedies, but they were crime adjacent. And then as 0:07:09.160 --> 0:07:12.560 she wrote them, she even, if you're writing a comedy 0:07:12.600 --> 0:07:15.120 about a crime, you have to at least know the 0:07:15.160 --> 0:07:17.440 crime has got to make sense or it doesn't. You know, 0:07:17.480 --> 0:07:21.040 the comedy falls apart. So in researching the crime aspects 0:07:21.080 --> 0:07:23.360 of it, she started realizing oh no, I really like 0:07:23.400 --> 0:07:25.760 the crime way better. I don't want to write comedy. 0:07:25.760 --> 0:07:28.360 I want actually, I don't want to write Springtime for Dahmer, 0:07:28.520 --> 0:07:32.679 you know, I don't want none of that for me. Yeah. 0:07:32.920 --> 0:07:35.720 So she worked as an assistant for a private eye 0:07:35.720 --> 0:07:38.680 for a while, like, did cases with him, and and 0:07:38.800 --> 0:07:41.360 just that became her thing. And then she when we 0:07:41.400 --> 0:07:43.920 got together, you know, she would tell me that just 0:07:44.000 --> 0:07:47.840 the Labrinthian details of these cases that she would just 0:07:47.880 --> 0:07:49.960 research online. And I was like, why don't you just 0:07:50.000 --> 0:07:51.640 because I had a web master, I had a web 0:07:51.640 --> 0:07:53.720 page for my shows. I'm like, I'll just pay me 0:07:53.720 --> 0:07:55.720 a little lecture. Let's get do you have a website? 0:07:55.760 --> 0:07:58.040 Just write this stuff out. And she started writing it, 0:07:58.080 --> 0:08:01.160 and she was starting to put these crimes together just 0:08:01.320 --> 0:08:03.800 on This is like in the you know, the early 0:08:03.840 --> 0:08:07.480 stages of the internet, and now there's a million crime 0:08:07.480 --> 0:08:10.240 blogs and crime podcasts. Um. She was one of the 0:08:10.240 --> 0:08:12.640 first that was doing it and was getting calls. She 0:08:12.720 --> 0:08:16.160 got a call from Dateline. They hired her as a 0:08:16.160 --> 0:08:18.640 consultant because she had put together a case they weren't 0:08:18.680 --> 0:08:20.920 able to crack. And the reason they weren't able to 0:08:20.920 --> 0:08:22.640 crack it was because when they would go to the 0:08:22.640 --> 0:08:24.280 family and talk to him, it's like, oh, this is 0:08:24.320 --> 0:08:27.240 the news. They would clam up. But some girl on 0:08:27.280 --> 0:08:30.040 the internet, yeah I'll say anything that who cares? And 0:08:30.080 --> 0:08:33.400 they told her everything. It was amazing. So the documentary, 0:08:33.400 --> 0:08:35.400 which is the same name as the that's a six 0:08:35.480 --> 0:08:38.680 part documentary. It's an on HBO. Yes, I'll Be Gone 0:08:38.679 --> 0:08:40.920 in the Dark. It's yeah, they all six episodes are 0:08:40.920 --> 0:08:43.719 out there now. Oh my god. And obviously did you 0:08:44.040 --> 0:08:46.400 did you have any involvement with that at all? Were you? 0:08:46.640 --> 0:08:49.679 I you know, it's a documentary about an extraordinary woman 0:08:49.720 --> 0:08:52.680 that was made by an extraordinary woman. I love Liz 0:08:52.720 --> 0:08:59.920 Garbas Liz Garbage, Oh my god, woman and so prolific. 0:09:00.040 --> 0:09:02.280 I mean, she did I'll Be Gone in the Dark, 0:09:02.360 --> 0:09:05.640 then did all In Then now she's like she just 0:09:05.880 --> 0:09:09.280 is able to capture the essence and the absolute right 0:09:09.360 --> 0:09:13.800 angle of attack for these stories. It's incredible. It's as 0:09:13.840 --> 0:09:17.280 much a tribute to Liz and her crew as it 0:09:17.360 --> 0:09:20.800 is to Michelle and the people around her. And again, 0:09:21.240 --> 0:09:24.199 just like I was with Michelle, I'm just the mediator. 0:09:24.480 --> 0:09:26.000 I guess that the one thing I can give myself 0:09:26.040 --> 0:09:27.960 credit for was knowing when to step the hell back 0:09:28.200 --> 0:09:30.640 and let people do their work. And both times I 0:09:30.679 --> 0:09:33.960 had the wherewithal to do that, Thank God. You know, 0:09:34.280 --> 0:09:37.600 for me as a kid, TV was something that you. 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:39.280 I mean, I'm a bit older than you, and TV 0:09:39.480 --> 0:09:41.680 was something that you sat down and you did what 0:09:41.760 --> 0:09:44.640 I called I This might not be the most apt phrase, 0:09:44.679 --> 0:09:47.040 but you would do back then in the sixties and seventies, 0:09:47.400 --> 0:09:50.880 when I referred to as I are vedic listening, you know, 0:09:50.960 --> 0:09:54.680 you did the most intense listening known to man. You'd 0:09:54.720 --> 0:09:56.760 watch one episode of a show or a movie and 0:09:56.800 --> 0:10:00.199 you remember every line because you literally got into a 0:10:00.240 --> 0:10:04.880 mirrorlogical electromagnetic field with the TV and it was going 0:10:04.920 --> 0:10:07.680 into your brain and being chiseled into your brain. And 0:10:07.720 --> 0:10:10.920 I remembered all the words to the show watching it 0:10:11.000 --> 0:10:13.360 one time, because that's all you had. There was no VCR, 0:10:13.559 --> 0:10:16.000 it wasn't coming back nothing. You watched it then and 0:10:16.040 --> 0:10:19.920 that was it. So I would watch Herman Munster, I 0:10:20.000 --> 0:10:23.439 watched Gilligan's Island, f Troop. I watched all the TV 0:10:24.040 --> 0:10:29.080 from when I was a kid. Family Affair. It's weird 0:10:29.160 --> 0:10:32.120 you you just mentioned the air vetic listening for shows 0:10:32.160 --> 0:10:35.560 like Family Affair and Bewitched and and igree Ma Genie 0:10:35.559 --> 0:10:39.239 and stuff like that. Do you think that that informed 0:10:39.880 --> 0:10:44.400 your characterization of Jack Donneghee on thirty Rock only because 0:10:44.800 --> 0:10:48.720 now that I'm thinking about it, he was an evangelical 0:10:48.800 --> 0:10:53.400 salesman for that kind of sitcom hypnotism because he didn't 0:10:53.400 --> 0:10:56.000 give a crap about the content of the shows. He 0:10:56.120 --> 0:10:58.640 loved the fact that it got people into a state 0:10:58.640 --> 0:11:02.000 where he could sell ducts, and it was why he 0:11:02.080 --> 0:11:06.120 was so good at mimicking those rhythms on other people. 0:11:06.480 --> 0:11:08.319 Was that like a subconscious thing that got drilled into 0:11:08.400 --> 0:11:11.679 your brain and you didn't realize you had it? Probably subconscious, Yeah, 0:11:11.760 --> 0:11:14.480 because you've done a lot of very like rough You 0:11:14.480 --> 0:11:17.240 know that the mammt the you know, Miami Blue is 0:11:17.320 --> 0:11:21.200 way more naturalistic stuff, and you very easily fell into 0:11:21.679 --> 0:11:24.720 those kind of inhuman rhythms that you realize when you 0:11:24.760 --> 0:11:26.640 listen to it. But that is kind of how we 0:11:26.679 --> 0:11:30.880 talk because we've been programmed by the TV. It's really 0:11:30.960 --> 0:11:36.040 weird that that happened a your vedic listening. What was 0:11:36.080 --> 0:11:39.400 that background for you grew up where I grew up 0:11:39.480 --> 0:11:46.160 in the very very bland suburbs of northern Virginia, Sterling Virginia. 0:11:46.559 --> 0:11:48.680 Was your dad in the government, Yeah, he was. My 0:11:48.760 --> 0:11:51.800 dad was a marine for twenty years and then he 0:11:51.880 --> 0:11:55.120 retired and then he worked at USA today at Genet 0:11:55.600 --> 0:11:59.200 and built all their computer systems. So it was he 0:11:59.240 --> 0:12:01.680 was a tech guy out Silver Spring. And I remember 0:12:01.800 --> 0:12:04.640 him saying he would talk vaguely because he couldn't even 0:12:04.840 --> 0:12:07.360 conceive of it. But he's like, it's all gonna be 0:12:07.480 --> 0:12:11.000 on a computer, like everything, Like I had a manual 0:12:11.080 --> 0:12:14.360 typewriter and I wanted an electric And he said, just 0:12:14.480 --> 0:12:16.920 why don't you just wait? In five years, it's all 0:12:16.920 --> 0:12:18.840 gonna there won't be any typewriters. There won't like, there 0:12:18.840 --> 0:12:21.160 won't be any of that. Just but he couldn't articulate 0:12:21.160 --> 0:12:23.760 it enough. He didn't know exactly what was coming. But 0:12:23.880 --> 0:12:25.719 he had an inkland because he saw what was going on, 0:12:26.120 --> 0:12:29.760 you know, with Business Defense Department here. What did your 0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:33.600 mom do? My mom was a legal secretary in Vienna. 0:12:34.240 --> 0:12:37.199 It was all people the suburbs where I grew up. 0:12:37.600 --> 0:12:40.720 It's all around four and everyone went into the city 0:12:40.720 --> 0:12:42.960 and made money and then came to the suburbs. When 0:12:43.000 --> 0:12:46.280 you're a child, it's the funny in your household and 0:12:46.320 --> 0:12:49.840 everybody's going get up there, Patton. That is so funny? 0:12:49.840 --> 0:12:53.400 Are you like the performing the family I had? I mean, 0:12:53.520 --> 0:12:56.480 I was funny in my family, but I was also 0:12:56.640 --> 0:12:59.880 in you know that the term the class clown, that's 0:12:59.880 --> 0:13:02.920 actually a false term. There's a clown click in every 0:13:03.000 --> 0:13:05.280 high school. It's not. There's never just one. There's a 0:13:05.280 --> 0:13:08.200 group of people, boys and girls who were super into comedy. 0:13:08.240 --> 0:13:10.840 And that was my click. So then, of course in 0:13:10.880 --> 0:13:12.920 my home, you know, I could lift more than everyone 0:13:12.920 --> 0:13:15.160 else because I was hanging out all day with these 0:13:15.240 --> 0:13:17.640 comedy nerds. But then I would come home and my 0:13:17.760 --> 0:13:20.760 dad was you know, he introduced me very early on 0:13:20.880 --> 0:13:24.680 to like Jonathan Winters uh and the mother's brothers and 0:13:24.679 --> 0:13:27.960 stuff like that, and then that led me surreptitiously to 0:13:28.200 --> 0:13:31.720 Richard Pryor and then, weirdly enough to Steve Martin, who 0:13:31.760 --> 0:13:35.400 Steve Martin was my gateway to Monty Python because I 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:37.880 heard Monty Python before Steve Martin. I didn't get it. 0:13:37.880 --> 0:13:40.280 I thought it was stupid. Then I heard Steve Martin 0:13:40.320 --> 0:13:42.160 went oh, I get what they were doing. And then 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:44.000 that led me back into it. And then this whole 0:13:44.000 --> 0:13:46.400 world like kind of opened up. It was great where 0:13:46.520 --> 0:13:48.840 you go to college. I went to William and Mary. 0:13:48.960 --> 0:13:51.400 I went there to study writing. And when I went 0:13:51.440 --> 0:13:53.360 to William and Mary, this is in the late eighties, 0:13:53.360 --> 0:13:55.960 early nineties. They they had a theater department, but they 0:13:56.000 --> 0:13:58.920 really didn't have like a film society or any kind 0:13:58.920 --> 0:14:01.280 of like stay up. They had a couple of improv 0:14:01.360 --> 0:14:04.800 groups and stuff like that. And then now apparently it's 0:14:04.880 --> 0:14:07.480 just it's even more exploded. You know. At the time, 0:14:07.800 --> 0:14:10.960 I think William Mary was more of a feeder school 0:14:11.000 --> 0:14:13.920 for like lawyers, and it was it was that kind 0:14:13.920 --> 0:14:15.920 of thing. They weren't really that focused on the arts. 0:14:15.920 --> 0:14:19.720 They majors exactly. Yeah. I remember I was having problems 0:14:19.720 --> 0:14:22.520 with my senior because I had taken too many courses 0:14:22.520 --> 0:14:25.040 in my major and I didn't have enough credits to 0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:28.600 graduate because I took too many English courses and I 0:14:28.600 --> 0:14:30.720 didn't understand that I was supposed to take some psychology. 0:14:30.800 --> 0:14:33.320 Took a lot of geology and psychology too. But I 0:14:33.320 --> 0:14:38.880 remember I had to petition the committee on degrees and 0:14:38.880 --> 0:14:41.520 and asked them to wave it was just like nine 0:14:41.520 --> 0:14:43.680 credits that I was shy, and I was talking to 0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:46.560 my counsel and I was like, look, I really need 0:14:46.600 --> 0:14:49.520 to graduate like, and he was like, you actually don't 0:14:49.520 --> 0:14:51.280 need to. You can just do a whole other year. 0:14:51.360 --> 0:14:53.560 It's great. You do a whole other year as a 0:14:53.640 --> 0:14:56.440 senior and you only got to take nine credits, will 0:14:56.480 --> 0:14:57.960 be the best year of your life. And I'm like, no, 0:14:58.000 --> 0:15:00.560 you don't understand. Like I have jobs lined because starting 0:15:00.560 --> 0:15:02.600 stopping here, I started actually getting work as a comedian. 0:15:02.600 --> 0:15:04.440 So I'm like, by the time when I was a senior, 0:15:04.680 --> 0:15:07.480 I have jobs lined up. School was in the way. Yeah, 0:15:07.520 --> 0:15:09.440 And and then he was like, oh, what firm, Like 0:15:09.480 --> 0:15:11.720 what firm are you with? Like he in his mind 0:15:11.840 --> 0:15:13.960 I had signed with it. I'm like, oh no, I'm 0:15:14.000 --> 0:15:17.760 doing Charlie Goodnights in um North Carolina. I'm doing their Garvins, 0:15:17.800 --> 0:15:19.600 I'm doing the Comedy Caravan, like I had all these 0:15:19.640 --> 0:15:21.520 gigs lined up. And then he and then he said, 0:15:22.080 --> 0:15:24.000 I don't think William and Marian wants to be known 0:15:24.000 --> 0:15:27.240 for producing comedians like like as a like kind of 0:15:27.360 --> 0:15:29.600 And then I went okay, and then I just like 0:15:29.720 --> 0:15:32.600 I just petitioned so hard and they went fine, just 0:15:32.640 --> 0:15:35.080 get out and they gave me my diploma. But I 0:15:35.120 --> 0:15:39.040 was like ah, and and and then like they William 0:15:39.080 --> 0:15:42.680 and Mary Produced, Michelle Wolf and John Stewart. For God's sakes, 0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:50.240 they should be proud of that. Comedian Patton Oswald. I'm 0:15:50.280 --> 0:15:54.040 Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing. If 0:15:54.080 --> 0:15:58.480 you like conversations with comedians who can also act, check 0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:02.640 out our archives and my conversation with Kristen Wigg, who 0:16:02.680 --> 0:16:06.640 credits her college acting teacher and helping her overcome her 0:16:06.720 --> 0:16:10.640 performance anxiety. It was literally acting one on one that 0:16:10.760 --> 0:16:15.520 was one class one class, and I was terrified to 0:16:15.560 --> 0:16:18.840 take it. But something about this class we learned about 0:16:18.880 --> 0:16:22.480 improv and my teacher was really supportive and at the 0:16:22.560 --> 0:16:24.440 end of the class he was just like, have you 0:16:24.480 --> 0:16:27.720 ever considered doing this? And I was like, oh, yeah, 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:31.480 right was your teacher? Was my teacher? Yeah? Here more 0:16:31.600 --> 0:16:34.960 of my conversation with Kristen Wigg at Here's the Thing 0:16:35.160 --> 0:16:38.720 dot org. After the break, I talked to Patton Oswald 0:16:39.080 --> 0:16:41.720 about his move to San Francisco in the early nine 0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:45.480 nineties and whyatt prompted him to tear up his previous 0:16:45.520 --> 0:16:56.640 material and start all over. I'm Alec Baldwin and you're 0:16:56.680 --> 0:17:00.680 listening to Here's the Thing from My Heart Radio. Patton 0:17:00.760 --> 0:17:03.200 Oswald was a fan of stand up as a kid, 0:17:03.600 --> 0:17:06.280 but he didn't try his hand at it until college. 0:17:07.040 --> 0:17:10.879 It was between junior and sophomore year of college. That 0:17:10.920 --> 0:17:12.600 was that somewhere where I'm like, oh, I better actually 0:17:12.640 --> 0:17:14.480 figure out what I'm gonna do, and I because I 0:17:14.480 --> 0:17:17.200 couldn't really And that was something I tried all these 0:17:17.240 --> 0:17:20.359 different jobs. I started training to be a paralegal. I 0:17:20.400 --> 0:17:23.399 was also working as a party DJ. I was writing 0:17:23.440 --> 0:17:26.160 sports for a local paper under a pseudonym, just like, 0:17:26.400 --> 0:17:28.160 what's one of these things is gonna stick? And then 0:17:28.200 --> 0:17:30.800 I one evening, I went, because I always loved comedy, 0:17:30.840 --> 0:17:32.879 went I'll do an open mic and I looked in 0:17:32.960 --> 0:17:34.920 the paper. There was an open mics place called Garvin's. 0:17:35.440 --> 0:17:38.720 And I went to Garvin's Comedy club that was in 0:17:38.800 --> 0:17:42.520 d C on L Street between thirteen and fourteen Street, 0:17:43.080 --> 0:17:46.240 very super sketchy area. I went on. I went out 0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:49.160 and I went on stage. It did not go well, 0:17:49.720 --> 0:17:52.080 but one thing that I said got like a half 0:17:52.320 --> 0:17:55.680 got that comedian laugh from like that kind of ah 0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:58.640 like that. Also, my first night on stage was also 0:17:58.720 --> 0:18:02.359 Dave Chappelle's first night on age. He was fourteen years 0:18:02.359 --> 0:18:05.359 old and he when he went on. It looked like 0:18:05.400 --> 0:18:08.200 he'd been doing it for thirty years. He was amazing. 0:18:08.200 --> 0:18:11.719 He just like having my god and and I I 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:15.520 was nineteen and it but the one I really loved. 0:18:15.960 --> 0:18:19.120 I loved sitting and watching all the comedians hanging out 0:18:19.560 --> 0:18:22.679 and riffing with each other and building jokes at a 0:18:22.720 --> 0:18:26.080 thin air. And I realized, even though there's no immediate 0:18:26.119 --> 0:18:30.000 reward here for me, I want this life. My roommate 0:18:30.040 --> 0:18:33.679 in college as a comedian named Gary Laser, who I was, 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:37.240 you know, Gary Laser was my my and then he 0:18:37.280 --> 0:18:39.080 and I were roommates. We got in an apartment together 0:18:39.080 --> 0:18:40.280 for a couple of years, lived at him for a 0:18:40.320 --> 0:18:42.119 couple of years. We have Gary was my roommate off 0:18:42.119 --> 0:18:43.720 and on for like four or five years. And Garrett 0:18:44.240 --> 0:18:46.080 I would go to the clubs with him, to the 0:18:46.119 --> 0:18:50.160 Good Times on thirty on thirty of them third or whatever. 0:18:50.160 --> 0:18:54.800 The ben atar was discovered. We got and we go 0:18:54.840 --> 0:18:57.080 to these different clubs with him and his friends and 0:18:57.080 --> 0:18:59.240 they don't get up there and perform. And I remember, 0:19:00.000 --> 0:19:01.320 you know, it was like there's no place else I'd 0:19:01.400 --> 0:19:03.280 rather be, you know, these guys, Gary Leason and going. 0:19:03.400 --> 0:19:05.919 I was married to my first wife, yeah. We were 0:19:05.960 --> 0:19:08.120 together for three years, and that three years went by 0:19:08.160 --> 0:19:16.000 just like many had so many materials. Material I still 0:19:16.040 --> 0:19:19.720 remember his routine and I loved him. And then I 0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:21.320 go and do what I'm doing, and when I come 0:19:21.359 --> 0:19:23.879 back and do thirty Rock, it's like I'm around those 0:19:23.880 --> 0:19:27.399 people again, where like on my best day, I'm not 0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:29.800 as funny as them on their worst day. You know, 0:19:29.920 --> 0:19:33.639 Tina Carlock call them they're so in terms of writing. 0:19:33.640 --> 0:19:37.880 You're not a comedian, you know, they're just so blindingly funny. 0:19:37.960 --> 0:19:41.320 And for you, did you go through a period where 0:19:41.400 --> 0:19:44.119 you're like you're honing, you're working. You said that the 0:19:44.240 --> 0:19:47.400 thing went so and at what point, you know, you're 0:19:47.400 --> 0:19:49.840 here at Garvin's and d C. At what point do 0:19:49.880 --> 0:19:51.600 you sit there and go I think I got this, 0:19:51.880 --> 0:19:54.760 I think that's going well. I really didn't. He Here's 0:19:54.760 --> 0:19:57.720 it was weird. I felt like one of the things 0:19:57.760 --> 0:20:00.399 I like was I'm sitting at the so first of all, 0:20:00.440 --> 0:20:03.320 this material, I'm not hearing joke. Second hand, I'm here 0:20:03.359 --> 0:20:07.119 where they're being created, so I'm upstream. I'm one of 0:20:07.160 --> 0:20:09.720 the people sending it down into the you know culture, 0:20:09.800 --> 0:20:12.760 which that was also really exciting, but very early on 0:20:12.880 --> 0:20:15.880 I learned it's weird how you talked about the air 0:20:15.880 --> 0:20:18.520 of atic listening with with TV. I kind of had 0:20:18.560 --> 0:20:22.000 that with comedy in that I learned the rhythms very 0:20:22.040 --> 0:20:25.440 early on, and I could get away with very very 0:20:25.520 --> 0:20:28.840 mediocre material. But because I had the rhythms, and because 0:20:28.880 --> 0:20:31.359 there was this comedy boom, you could kind of go 0:20:31.440 --> 0:20:33.280 up and talk in those rhythms and people would just 0:20:33.320 --> 0:20:36.200 kind of go, okay, this is comedy. And then as 0:20:36.200 --> 0:20:39.840 I was doing it, I started getting good in that 0:20:40.000 --> 0:20:42.520 I was getting a lot of work. Then I remember 0:20:42.640 --> 0:20:47.480 very very specifically, I moved to San Francisco, and this 0:20:47.520 --> 0:20:49.879 is when the comedy boom was starting to collapse and 0:20:49.920 --> 0:20:51.399 all the clubs were closing, and I went to the 0:20:51.440 --> 0:20:54.320 Holy City Zoo. I'm the new kid in town. I've 0:20:54.320 --> 0:20:56.720 been killing it on the road. I'm gonna do great, 0:20:57.320 --> 0:20:59.400 and and that was I went into this room, Holy 0:20:59.440 --> 0:21:02.000 City Zoo, and on the show was like Greg Proops, 0:21:02.119 --> 0:21:07.240 Margaret Show, Jeanine Garoffalo, Greg Barren, like all these comedians 0:21:07.320 --> 0:21:10.679 doing this stuff that rhythms I'd never heard before. I 0:21:10.720 --> 0:21:14.160 went up with my road rhythms, all my a stuff 0:21:14.160 --> 0:21:17.120 that I thought would kill and it just died. Then 0:21:17.160 --> 0:21:20.280 I watched all of these comedians I'd never seen before, 0:21:20.280 --> 0:21:23.440 who were the best comedians I'd ever seen. I remember 0:21:23.600 --> 0:21:26.080 very specifically, I walked across street from the Holy City 0:21:26.160 --> 0:21:29.119 Zoo to the Taiwan Restaurant on Clement Street, and I 0:21:29.119 --> 0:21:31.280 sat there with my notebook and I tore all the 0:21:31.320 --> 0:21:34.399 pages out of my notebook, all my routines, and I 0:21:34.400 --> 0:21:37.080 wrote it was May five, the tip. And then I 0:21:37.200 --> 0:21:39.280