Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your guide to
Speaker 1: the White Tail Woods, presented by first Light, creating proven
Speaker 1: versatile hunting apparel for the stand, saddle or blind. First
Speaker 1: Light Go Farther, Stay Longer, and now your host Mark Kenyon.
Speaker 2: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. This week in
Speaker 2: the show, I'm running Alabama public Land deer hunter Michael
Speaker 2: Perry through the what would you do? Gauntlet to find
Speaker 2: out exactly how he'd handle some of the most interesting
Speaker 2: and tricky deer hunting scenarios I can throw.
Speaker 3: Out of here.
Speaker 4: All right, welcome back.
Speaker 2: To the Wired Hunt podcast, brought to you by Moultrie.
Speaker 2: This week on the show, we are kicking off one
Speaker 2: of our favorite mini series that we do every single
Speaker 2: year now for maybe six seven years, something like that,
Speaker 2: called what.
Speaker 4: Would you Do? This is the what would you Do?
Speaker 2: Gauntlet, in which we run a deer hunter through a
Speaker 2: series of very specific hypothetical deer hunting scenarios to see
Speaker 2: how they would tackle them, how they would think through
Speaker 2: this challenge, what they would actually.
Speaker 4: Do, and why they would do that.
Speaker 2: It's a unique and very helpful way to learn about
Speaker 2: somebody's deer hunting approach, at least that I've found. We've
Speaker 2: ran many, many different hunters through this gauntlet, many different
Speaker 2: styles of hunters. We've gotten you know, private land big
Speaker 2: buck managers in the Midwest, we've had diy Midwest public land,
Speaker 2: you know diehards, and today we've got someone from the South.
Speaker 2: We've got Michael Perry. He is a deer hunting fanatic
Speaker 2: from Alabama, hunting big woods, hunting big chunks of public
Speaker 2: land in low deer density places where it's not easy
Speaker 2: to find mature bucks. It's not easy to kill big bucks.
Speaker 2: But Michael Perry is doing it at a level that
Speaker 2: not many people are. He has a state record Muzzloder buck,
Speaker 2: he has many book bucks under his belt and simply
Speaker 2: is doing it in a hard to do kind of
Speaker 2: way that is very impressive. It's very interesting. He's the
Speaker 2: perfect kind of guy for the what would you do? Gauntlet?
Speaker 2: So today that's the game plan. We're going to find
Speaker 2: out exactly how Michael would think through some of the toughest,
Speaker 2: you know, scouting scenarios, off season prep scenarios, and in
Speaker 2: season hunting decisions that many of us have faced. And
Speaker 2: whether you are in the Northeast, the Midwest, the South,
Speaker 2: wherever you're at. I think there's something you can take
Speaker 2: away from this conversation. So without any further ado, let's
Speaker 2: get to What would You Do? Gauntlet with mister Michael Parry.
Speaker 2: All right, joining me now on the line is Michael Perry. Michael,
Speaker 2: thanks for joining me.
Speaker 3: Hey, I appreciate you. How's our bye? Doing? This is awesome?
Speaker 2: Hey, I'm doing good. I'm excited for this. This is
Speaker 2: you know, as I kind of told you off air,
Speaker 2: this What Would You Do? Series is something that we
Speaker 2: do every year.
Speaker 4: This is maybe the.
Speaker 2: Fifth or sixth, there's maybe seventh year in a row
Speaker 2: we've done this, and it's always leading up to opening dates.
Speaker 2: It's just before the fall. Everybody's getting fired up. So
Speaker 2: I know that when I'm about to have an episode
Speaker 2: like this, I know good things are just ahead.
Speaker 4: So I'm a I'm a happy camper knowing that.
Speaker 3: It is coming. It's coming.
Speaker 4: Based Yeah, do you feel ready?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 4: I never do either.
Speaker 5: You don't never feel ready until you're up in the
Speaker 5: tray and you're hoping you're ready land you know.
Speaker 2: So true, so true, And that's kind of a perfect
Speaker 2: segue into how I want to kick this thing off
Speaker 2: to Michael, because as I as I told you, as
Speaker 2: you know, the plan for today is to walk.
Speaker 4: You through what we call the what would you do? Gauntlet.
Speaker 2: I'm going to run you through a bunch of different,
Speaker 2: you know, interesting, sometimes trickier, challenging, dear hunting scenarios to
Speaker 2: try to, you know, understand how you would tackle these things.
Speaker 2: So I want to start with preseason. I want to
Speaker 2: walk you through a scenario in the off season, and
Speaker 2: then we'll kind of work our way through the year
Speaker 2: into the actual hunting season. So I'll paint a picture
Speaker 2: for you, a hypothetical scenario, and then if you could
Speaker 2: just kind of talk me through what you would do,
Speaker 2: how you would do it, why you would do it,
Speaker 2: you know what you would be thinking through throughout that
Speaker 2: whole process. I think that would, at least for me,
Speaker 2: it always helps me understand how a different deer hunter
Speaker 2: would approach things in a brand new way. That has
Speaker 2: just helped me maybe more than any other kind of
Speaker 2: podcast format or learning format I've tried yet.
Speaker 4: So does that game plan sound good?
Speaker 3: Sounds challenging? Yeah, let's do it all right.
Speaker 2: So let's rewind the clock a little bit. Let's say
Speaker 2: it's March. It's March. You're down in your neck of
Speaker 2: the woods and you're out doing some postseason scout. While
Speaker 2: you're out walking around this big piece of public land,
Speaker 2: you run across a big set of tracks. This is
Speaker 2: a set of tracks that's big enough to stop you
Speaker 2: in your tracks and look at it and be like, huh,
Speaker 2: this is interesting. Tell me this How big would those
Speaker 2: tracks have to be to stop you in place? And
Speaker 2: then what would you do in the following minutes or
Speaker 2: hours after coming across these like show stopping tracks. Walk
Speaker 2: me through the Michael Perry thought process when you find
Speaker 2: this big set of tracks in the dirt and you're
Speaker 2: trying to figure out, okay, what does this mean?
Speaker 4: Where do I go from here? Can you walk me
Speaker 4: through that process?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 5: Sure, uh, you know down here in the south. You know,
Speaker 5: mainly it is where I hunted it. So a three
Speaker 5: finger track or more is you know, it's something very
Speaker 5: impressive and if I walk up on a track like that,
Speaker 5: automatically stop. You know, of course you're looking at your track.
Speaker 5: I'm thinking about saying, all right, why is that track air?
Speaker 5: When they put that track air, they put it there
Speaker 5: for a reason, you know, say February March is you know,
Speaker 5: is postseason, so they're back in their home ranges generally,
Speaker 5: so you stop looking there and I'm trying to figure out,
Speaker 5: all right, he come from that way or he's going
Speaker 5: this way. If I can, I'll try to backtrack. First off,
Speaker 5: I'm gonna market you know, with my with my phone,
Speaker 5: so my app, you know, just trying to save that spot.
Speaker 5: You know, if I'm on where I can look at
Speaker 5: it on something online, I'll kind of look at the
Speaker 5: train and the timber changes or whatever with it, or
Speaker 5: is any thickets on one side, or for some kind
Speaker 5: of food source from where it is coming from or
Speaker 5: going trying to try to put a start building a
Speaker 5: you know on the puzzle pieces, because you know, when
Speaker 5: you're looking at that track, you know which way it's going,
Speaker 5: which way it's.
Speaker 3: Coming from, but generally you're not going to know where.
Speaker 5: It's coming from or why, or where it's going to
Speaker 5: and why without either trying to figure out backtracking them
Speaker 5: using your app or maps you know, arrow footage not
Speaker 5: that to kind of look at it and just get
Speaker 5: a general plan or start tracking it if you can
Speaker 5: track it, you know, if if I can with generally
Speaker 5: all will I'll try to walk it, I figure, you know,
Speaker 5: because you know, bucks like using different trains if they're
Speaker 5: coming down from something, if they're crossing the creek, or
Speaker 5: if they're going up you know, so you can kind
Speaker 5: of look for secondary points or some kind of cover,
Speaker 5: you know, or if it's a food source, go to that.
Speaker 5: See what's that? See what's a reason behind that? If
Speaker 5: it's just a spring specific food source.
Speaker 3: Or what so.
Speaker 5: And then if you can find the bed coming associated
Speaker 5: with it, would be would be interesting not breath taking,
Speaker 5: you know, to me.
Speaker 3: But because that can change a little bit.
Speaker 5: So But but anyway, no one that that track is there,
Speaker 5: and it's there for a reason, and then you know,
Speaker 5: markting it, looking at it and then coming back maybe
Speaker 5: later if you can tie some rubs or scrapes into
Speaker 5: it with that area, you know, that might give you
Speaker 5: a plan for the root part. But that uh but gentally,
Speaker 5: no one that suckers there is giving you the name
Speaker 5: starting point.
Speaker 3: That's the thing.
Speaker 5: If it's a big track, you got a starting point,
Speaker 5: So you got a way to come back and check
Speaker 5: you out, you know, maybe hang a camera that that.
Speaker 3: Depends on if you can or not.
Speaker 5: So, but just I mean a very good starting point,
Speaker 5: because you always got to have a starting point, and
Speaker 5: a big track is a number one thing besides seeing
Speaker 5: him standing in it, you know, to me, it is.
Speaker 2: Very important in your In your book, you wrote that
Speaker 2: the second most important thing after a big track to
Speaker 2: help you identify if for big bucks in the area
Speaker 2: other than cameras, was big droppings. Right, how often is
Speaker 2: that something you're still looking at now? And how do
Speaker 2: you actually determine, Oh, yeah, that's a big it's a
Speaker 2: big turd, that's big enough.
Speaker 4: For a big bucket.
Speaker 2: Walk me through a little more detail there about how
Speaker 2: you're able to actually make that determination.
Speaker 5: Well, you can tell, I mean through experience generally small
Speaker 5: pellets versus big pellets for big clumps, you know, you know,
Speaker 5: sometimes a big clump is you know, associated with it's
Speaker 5: close to the beds and getting up it's been laying
Speaker 5: there a while, That could make it compacted, but that's
Speaker 5: not always the case. So you know, another thing determining
Speaker 5: that is if it's dry or if it's shiny and slick,
Speaker 5: being new fresh. So just but the bigger size, you know,
Speaker 5: you can look at them and tail by just the
Speaker 5: pellets first, a little bit small pellets big to determine
Speaker 5: it's a bigger deer. So yeah, I mean that's a
Speaker 5: key that's as a key thing to find or key
Speaker 5: piece of sign to find.
Speaker 2: Some all right, Uh for someone who's newer, give me,
Speaker 2: give me like some kind of reference point. Are we
Speaker 2: talking like minem size or are we talking peanut minem
Speaker 2: size or or.
Speaker 5: Between the size or bigger so yeah, or it might
Speaker 5: be hershy kissing side.
Speaker 2: That's that's a real big one, all right. So okay,
Speaker 2: so let's let's build this out a little bit further
Speaker 2: than Let's imagine you're out doing this scouting trip, you
Speaker 2: found your big tracks. You you kind of started asking
Speaker 2: why you found some big droppings. You follow these these tracks.
Speaker 2: Let's say you can backtrack. You go back and you
Speaker 2: do find a bed like you mentioned. And in that bed,
Speaker 2: I'm going to say, this is like a little knob
Speaker 2: pushing out of a ridge, kind of a just a
Speaker 2: picture perfect buck betting location. He's off this knob, he
Speaker 2: can see down to a little draw beneath him, and
Speaker 2: up on this spot where you find this bed, there
Speaker 2: is a match set of sheds and this is a
Speaker 2: jumbo buck this is a buck that you look at
Speaker 2: and you say, oh wow, Like, this could be this
Speaker 2: buck this coming year, could be like in the same
Speaker 2: neighborhood as your you know, state record buck. Like this
Speaker 2: is a jaw dropper when you come across that, walk
Speaker 2: me through what you do the rest of that day.
Speaker 2: So you've already found some tracks, you've found some droppings,
Speaker 2: you've walked him back to the bed, you've found his sheds,
Speaker 2: there's still some daylight. How do you make the most
Speaker 2: of this next couple hours after you've found this, you know,
Speaker 2: kind of jaw dropping set of sign.
Speaker 3: Well, that's that's a good question, yo.
Speaker 5: Something you know on a bed and they come, I've
Speaker 5: never found this set of shed in a bed anyway.
Speaker 5: I mean that that's wuld be showing up next level.
Speaker 5: But getting there out of that bed, looking at that
Speaker 5: bed and standing in it, or some people lay in them.
Speaker 5: I don't like leaving no scent in them if I
Speaker 5: can help it. You know, I'm not extra sent anyway.
Speaker 5: It's just looking and see what he's looking at, Okay,
Speaker 5: see what he's observing, you know, because you can generally
Speaker 5: figure out he's got some kind of back cover. Okay,
Speaker 5: see what of deserving because chances you coming in that
Speaker 5: way on them is impossible, you know, and the chances
Speaker 5: you beat, you gotta figure out a way either beat.
Speaker 3: Them back or catch them coming out.
Speaker 5: And it's very like for my hunting process, I don't
Speaker 5: never try to beat one back to the.
Speaker 3: Bed because that's early season is.
Speaker 5: Your best opportunity at that and it's very hard to
Speaker 5: do that in the South, in my opinion. So my
Speaker 5: second scenario, or the better scenario was trying to figure
Speaker 5: out how he be he leaving that okay, because generally
Speaker 5: when they come back to a bed, they're gonna do
Speaker 5: some kind of jayhook or some kind of circle to
Speaker 5: make sure their area safe and all that stuff. So
Speaker 5: you for you get set up for that unless you're
Speaker 5: outside of it in the morning and know exactly how
Speaker 5: he's coming back, which most bucks don't never come back
Speaker 5: the same way consistently, So figuring out pour that is
Speaker 5: how hard, you know, So him exiting the bed is well,
Speaker 5: I'm gonna try to figure out how would he leave,
Speaker 5: where is he going to and why? So so I'll
Speaker 5: generally there's two ways of doing that. It's the one
Speaker 5: you're trying to get up on the same plane with them,
Speaker 5: because generally they walk that plane late in the evening,
Speaker 5: right before they come down, they're observing slowly what's blowing, watching,
Speaker 5: waiting on some kind of thermal shift or something like that,
Speaker 5: or or keeping their nose in the wind before they
Speaker 5: even go down. If they go down, that's another thing.
Speaker 5: They might not go down, they might parallel, they might
Speaker 5: go up, depends on what they're looking for, if it's
Speaker 5: you know, acrens or dropping whatever. So trying to figure
Speaker 5: that out what plane and you can kind of you know,
Speaker 5: I love keeping rubber gloves with me, peel back some leaves,
Speaker 5: trying to find a track in a direction going away
Speaker 5: from that bed.
Speaker 3: Then then you're looking you know, of course you've.
Speaker 5: Got ther spot saved, and you're looking at maps, hopefully
Speaker 5: if you can look at maps on your phone, trying
Speaker 5: to find out why or where he would be going
Speaker 5: to and find some kind of edge or some kind
Speaker 5: of short pinch to catch him that would make him
Speaker 5: come by you when he's leaving that way.
Speaker 3: So that's I mean, you can spend hours. I mean,
Speaker 3: you might have to spend.
Speaker 5: Days doing that if you because it's that's a hard one.
Speaker 5: Of the hardest things that are to figure out how
Speaker 5: he would leave that bed, and and then you got
Speaker 5: to guess because if it's gonna go down, if he's
Speaker 5: gonna parallel or go up.
Speaker 3: It's just so.
Speaker 5: But trying to find some kind of short pinch is
Speaker 5: generally the best option for me. And then you know,
Speaker 5: I'll spend a few evenings you know, I'm trying to
Speaker 5: catch him coming out of that.
Speaker 3: But after that, it's it's.
Speaker 5: That is So that's one of the toughest things to do,
Speaker 5: especially in the south of the hunt of bed buck.
Speaker 5: So it's just they'll figure you out so fast. And
Speaker 5: because there's no way to get in there to me
Speaker 5: without in a couple.
Speaker 3: Days that I'm knowing it. So it's just then you
Speaker 3: just gotta change up.
Speaker 2: So let's say you have this you have this day
Speaker 2: where you just you just did the things you mentioned.
Speaker 2: You try to kind of find some of these first
Speaker 2: additional sets of information, some edges a short pinch looking
Speaker 2: more for those tracks. What about the rest of the year,
Speaker 2: So walk me through kind of like a couple more
Speaker 2: of those key projects here to get to try your
Speaker 2: key goals you're going to try to achieve before opening day.
Speaker 2: Given the fact that hey, this is a special buck,
Speaker 2: I've got some really important things already figured out about them.
Speaker 2: But what are those next most important steps as you
Speaker 2: try to build a plan for that buck given those
Speaker 2: challenges you just mentioned.
Speaker 5: Yeah, gently, you know, I'm a big creek crossing fans,
Speaker 5: so you can kind of associate that with, you know,
Speaker 5: with buck betting. If you can find where he's crossed
Speaker 5: or creek you know, or something like that, of course,
Speaker 5: then Eden you got to figure out how to get
Speaker 5: there and do that to play the thermal part of that.
Speaker 3: You know, they're tim and on that real keys.
Speaker 5: So but after when it started getting the pre rut ruts,
Speaker 5: so they're gonna start expanding, you know, they're gonna start
Speaker 5: laying scrape lines and all that stuff.
Speaker 3: So looking at the overall picture, and this is my
Speaker 3: favorite way.
Speaker 5: To hunt, you know, is rot hunting is looking at
Speaker 5: the big picture, you know, learning your area where all
Speaker 5: the food sources at all worth, all the dough groups,
Speaker 5: is that, where doe bedding is that at different times
Speaker 5: because they change up, you know, associated with food sources,
Speaker 5: or if you have some kind of timber chain cutovers
Speaker 5: or you know, pine beetle kills stuff like that, so
Speaker 5: so uh, trying to figure out how he would travel,
Speaker 5: you know, to get to these areas to look for dose,
Speaker 5: check for dose, make scrape lines and stuff like that,
Speaker 5: and associate that with some kind of funnel edge, pinch,
Speaker 5: timber chain, you know, timber chains a uh, you know
Speaker 5: upper I really like the upper parts of stuff when
Speaker 5: I'm doing that above draining, just you know, something that
Speaker 5: we're there for coming through there. They're gonna have to
Speaker 5: manipulate their way through there, and then pick a tree
Speaker 5: and make sure you can access it to this place,
Speaker 5: mark all that stuff. And you don't find different areas
Speaker 5: because there's because you've got to have.
Speaker 3: More than one place.
Speaker 5: But do the wind and do to your access or
Speaker 5: if somebody else figures it out or you don't have
Speaker 5: multiple plans on that, but trying to learn your area
Speaker 5: and how the dose and everything manipulate their areas, and
Speaker 5: then you try to figure out how bucks you know,
Speaker 5: more than one is what I generally try to figure
Speaker 5: out is how more than one buck we travel through
Speaker 5: that area through the pants to go check those or
Speaker 5: go check their areas or go.
Speaker 3: On them, meet up at night and spar and all
Speaker 3: that stuff.
Speaker 5: Just there's different things you got to kind of look at,
Speaker 5: just trying to figure out how land learn it, how
Speaker 5: they use it, and how they're gonna use it, and
Speaker 5: also kind of pay attention.
Speaker 3: To how things might change over.
Speaker 5: The years as far as so we're big woods hunters
Speaker 5: down here, so you got some kind of mass crop change,
Speaker 5: drought stuff like that, how that's gonna affect what the
Speaker 5: area gonna be in.
Speaker 2: So how many different you know, setups would you want
Speaker 2: to have for that kind of scenario you mentioned you
Speaker 2: want to have these different options because things are changing.
Speaker 2: Best case scenario, how many spots or setups would you
Speaker 2: want to have kind of preset or at least in
Speaker 2: mind and prepared to kind of tackle this this opportunity.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so that's another thing.
Speaker 5: And me and my wife are generally hunting together most
Speaker 5: of the time, so we gotta have I gotta have
Speaker 5: two of each. So and our general plan is, you know,
Speaker 5: we're kind of tag team, and you know, if we're
Speaker 5: looking at a ridge system or something, you know, something,
Speaker 5: where how can I place her around me in this?
Speaker 5: And hopefully if he one of these two ways, if
Speaker 5: he's coming through this area that we can get a
Speaker 5: better opportunity at him. So so you're going to have,
Speaker 5: you know, generally side of the root areas that we
Speaker 5: hunt because we kind of move around different chasing the root.
Speaker 5: He's got a two week plan for each area, so
Speaker 5: so I can spend if nobody's messing with anything, we
Speaker 5: can spend three to four days and one spot, you know,
Speaker 5: just because you know, generally they don't.
Speaker 3: Just come every day.
Speaker 5: So you got tom especially down here in the morning
Speaker 5: main area with hunts, it's a Lord Dear density, so
Speaker 5: they got bigger travel routes.
Speaker 3: It might take them three days to come back through
Speaker 3: checking something.
Speaker 5: So it's just so I was playing, I'll spend three
Speaker 5: days to four days and one tree, you know, you
Speaker 5: know if it's morning generally, because she don't gonna hunt
Speaker 5: mornings during the rough.
Speaker 3: And I'm I'll have a different place where I'll hunted
Speaker 3: in the evening.
Speaker 5: So I pick out, say four spots per area per
Speaker 5: for a week, and then have another different general area
Speaker 5: I hold another five miles away, whatever it is, and
Speaker 5: then we'll have four spots in them area so that
Speaker 5: we can tag teams. So try to do that and
Speaker 5: then every spring I'm always we're always looking for something new,
Speaker 5: So I run trail cameras for a year ahead plan.
Speaker 5: So it's always trying to look for something new as
Speaker 5: far as that parts.
Speaker 2: Uh, when you're doing the scouting back to the back
Speaker 2: to like uh, you know, you're figuring out one of
Speaker 2: these cour zones and trying to trying to find these
Speaker 2: four spots and trying to find out the why and
Speaker 2: the how.
Speaker 4: How often?
Speaker 2: How many times can you go into a spot like
Speaker 2: that in the off season trying to scout and figure
Speaker 2: it out before you start worrying about spooking this buck
Speaker 2: messing things up for the future.
Speaker 3: Is it?
Speaker 4: Could you could you go in.
Speaker 2: There every weekend for months on end or are you
Speaker 2: much more concernedly, Hey, I've got I've got a couple
Speaker 2: of visits and then I got to stay out of
Speaker 2: there till the season.
Speaker 3: Yeah. I can do whatever I want to mostly like
Speaker 3: in a couple of days.
Speaker 5: So sometimes one day in the area because and what
Speaker 5: I do, and you know, with these cameras and stuff,
Speaker 5: and this is contradict some people, is I'll put a
Speaker 5: camera where I want to hunt, so I kind of
Speaker 5: figure out whey to put a camera with a deer
Speaker 5: won't notice it in some kind of pints and having
Speaker 5: a tree already picked out and a way to access
Speaker 5: without any kind of interference or minimum interference, and then
Speaker 5: you know, while then that's it.
Speaker 3: I don't. I don't. I don't plumb around anywhere else
Speaker 3: kind of looking there for that, and I just that's it.
Speaker 5: So so finding that one little key spot and then
Speaker 5: don't mess around doing anything else, you know, bedding stuff.
Speaker 5: You know, I say, all right, I'm pretty sure that's
Speaker 5: started there. I found something some kind of sign there.
Speaker 5: I don't film getting into them areas very minimum. If
Speaker 5: I walk through on that one time one day, that's
Speaker 5: it out. Don't ever go back through there until after
Speaker 5: the next season, because I want to keep all.
Speaker 3: That intrusion very minimal.
Speaker 2: So so I want to I want to kind of
Speaker 2: build further off of this. Let's imagine that you are now,
Speaker 2: I guess, let me let me shift my thoughts here.
Speaker 2: Let's put you somewhere else. You're on a new piece
Speaker 2: of public land you've never been to before, and you
Speaker 2: are hiking out there. You spent a couple of hours,
Speaker 2: you're year an hour three and you come across something
Speaker 2: that looks like I've referred to you, I've heard you
Speaker 2: refer to it as a junction, like a very high
Speaker 2: potential junction. There's a bunch of different ridges all coming together,
Speaker 2: and each one of these ridges has a different cover type.
Speaker 2: So one's got some pines, one's got some mixed hardwoods,
Speaker 2: maybe one's kind of a cutover. It's all coming together
Speaker 2: here in one relatively small zone. How what would you
Speaker 2: do to make sense of that? How would you how
Speaker 2: would you analyze this kind of setup? How would you
Speaker 2: learn as much as you possibly could in this little
Speaker 2: bit of time you have there? And then how would
Speaker 2: you think of setting up on a spot like that
Speaker 2: and feel free to fill in the gaps with some
Speaker 2: other hypothetical information, you know, to make it make sense
Speaker 2: to well, you.
Speaker 5: Know, most of time like traveling new areas, you know,
Speaker 5: especially out of state. You know, I'm starting to do
Speaker 5: that more now. It's it's home, will say, easy. But
Speaker 5: it's easier than here because they're more so food oriented
Speaker 5: and more visible, you know, So so finding a junction
Speaker 5: of you know, because they i'd say, I'd say Kansas
Speaker 5: or are I or something like that. You got a
Speaker 5: real diverse way that they're going to bed anywhere. For
Speaker 5: the crpe stuff, cedars and all that, you can kind
Speaker 5: of see them and you can kind of see the
Speaker 5: crops and then you can see fingers or drawers or.
Speaker 3: Points and stuff going to that stuff. So just finding a.
Speaker 5: Pinch or edge how they're getting it, getting it done
Speaker 5: in two places and then kind of been a little
Speaker 5: patient makes that a little bit simpler.
Speaker 3: And of course you need fresh sign for that.
Speaker 5: So that's so when I'm generally going to a new place,
Speaker 5: you know, fresh tracks, fresh dropping deer, in visible deer.
Speaker 3: You know sometimes you know, uh what you call.
Speaker 5: Observation sets or glassing or something like that, because you know,
Speaker 5: scouting is very important going into a new area in
Speaker 5: season scouting it's a whole different thing. So you've got
Speaker 5: to find the exact fresh sign associated with deer or
Speaker 5: the deer you want right then. So you can be
Speaker 5: a little bit more like I guess say intrus to
Speaker 5: that point. But but you gotta most of times I
Speaker 5: do that when I find I wanting to my hunting
Speaker 5: right then. So so it's kind of I mean, I
Speaker 5: love doing that. Now you going that west and stuff,
Speaker 5: it's just finding the freshest sign. You know, betting is
Speaker 5: a little bit easier to figure out, and then the
Speaker 5: food is definitely easier to figure out.
Speaker 2: So okay, so let's actually let's let's continue on that line.
Speaker 2: Let's say you've got all right, I'm going to give
Speaker 2: you an option here. Would you rather play this game
Speaker 2: in Alabama or a random Midwest.
Speaker 3: State that's easy? Around on Midwest state? Easy? Okay, Obama?
Speaker 5: The place is the public land down in Alabama or
Speaker 5: most of it, you know, some of it's easier. Some
Speaker 5: of us got more cuts, you know, in a higher
Speaker 5: deer population that that means a lot.
Speaker 3: But you know, of course the Midwest.
Speaker 5: You know, they're just there's less woods, one thing, and
Speaker 5: the daylight activity is ten thousand times more than Alabama.
Speaker 5: And in my opinion, now, I mean, we got places
Speaker 5: we can see playing there. But saying a big old
Speaker 5: Buck on around daylight all the time, or multiple big
Speaker 5: Bucks in Alabama, no, I mean, well, let's say, for instance,
Speaker 5: last year I was in Iowa, Asty and I've seen
Speaker 5: two of the biggest Bucks I've ever seen in my life.
Speaker 5: And then in a ten days period and ten day
Speaker 5: period in the daylight and it takes me fifty years
Speaker 5: in Alabama.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, so it's just and that's so exciting
Speaker 3: doing that.
Speaker 5: And so it's it's almost again I almost say easy,
Speaker 5: but it's definitely easier to see daylight movement.
Speaker 3: So so and then make a plan. Is a lot
Speaker 3: easier to me, weather not.
Speaker 2: So so, So imagine this. Then imagine that I'm going
Speaker 2: to give you this dream scenario. I'm gonna let you
Speaker 2: go to Iowa, Okay, but I'm giving you only twenty
Speaker 2: four hours or you're you're gonna get dropped off just
Speaker 2: before daylight in the morning, and you have that that
Speaker 2: you have till dark at the end of the day
Speaker 2: to do any scouting you want, any set up you want,
Speaker 2: in any hunting you want.
Speaker 4: How would you use this?
Speaker 3: You know?
Speaker 2: I mean, and we're gonna say this is in season,
Speaker 2: you know, let's let's put you in the rut. So
Speaker 2: you've got maybe like twelve hours of daylight, thirteen hours
Speaker 2: of daylight something like that. Walk me through how you
Speaker 2: would use those hours to find a spot, to set
Speaker 2: up a spot, to hunt a spot. Are you gonna
Speaker 2: go and just look at a map before daylight and
Speaker 2: pick a spot and go in and hunt all twelve
Speaker 2: of those hours or are you going to go scout
Speaker 2: the first half of the day walking around Walk me
Speaker 2: through this hypothetic.
Speaker 4: What would you do.
Speaker 5: I'm definitely not walking in anywhere in the dark and
Speaker 5: climbing up. That's very rare for me to do. I
Speaker 5: want to see something in the daylight first, so kind
Speaker 5: of looking at me, have some fining edges, you know,
Speaker 5: see rphs and cedar edge and stuff associated with some
Speaker 5: kind of food in that area. Corn is the biggest
Speaker 5: thing for me. I'm going out in places corns even
Speaker 5: standing corn over the beans to me.
Speaker 3: And then as soon as I can get to the in.
Speaker 5: Place and walk walk corners, low spots and all that,
Speaker 5: trying to find a big track coming out, and then
Speaker 5: it won't take you know, really long for me to
Speaker 5: figure out the way to where I'm gonna set up
Speaker 5: at and then spend that time in edge and corners.
Speaker 3: Associated with see it rpeers, cedars.
Speaker 5: Coming out to corn and then you know, and hoping
Speaker 5: that the butt's gonna be running the et C RP
Speaker 5: edges or the cedar edges you know associated with the corn,
Speaker 5: you know, checking for dover the chection dough. So it's
Speaker 5: just tying them maybe three things together, finding some good corners,
Speaker 5: low spots, and then finding me a thing tree.
Speaker 2: So what if I what if I pulled pulled your
Speaker 2: lucky four leaf clover out of there, and you couldn't
Speaker 2: be an islands anymore and instead you gotta be back
Speaker 2: in Alabama. So the same rules, same scenario, but now
Speaker 2: it's a new piece of public land in Alabama. What
Speaker 2: would be different anything?
Speaker 3: Well, no, well we don't have that the corner or anything.
Speaker 5: So just you know, associating pine, if I can find pine,
Speaker 5: associate pines, you don't see a smz's you know, associated
Speaker 5: with pines and then cut over cut over the key, so.
Speaker 3: You know that's it's it's gonna make it harder. And
Speaker 3: i'bamine I know that.
Speaker 5: So we going looking at the map stuff and then
Speaker 5: then been trying to find you know, guessing only if
Speaker 5: it's wide oaks or for th red oaks, you know
Speaker 5: if that or if it's just gonna be brows dove bed,
Speaker 5: and you know, figuring out if it's what wind is
Speaker 5: the wind is on the cutover, and how you would
Speaker 5: hunt a card over on that wind. By that day,
Speaker 5: I mean you're going to look at that, so it's
Speaker 5: just and then maybe uh, that's you know again upper
Speaker 5: I love upper elevation on that stuff, so tying into
Speaker 5: elevation with that to to hunt him, and then of
Speaker 5: course fresh track and trailer jumping there. I mean sometimes
Speaker 5: you just walk looking there as you jump there and
Speaker 5: then kind of figure out a plan that you know
Speaker 5: they're right there in that area.
Speaker 2: So you talked earlier about creek crossings, how you really
Speaker 2: like to focus on creek crossings? Can can you maybe
Speaker 2: break that down a little bit further? Imagine let's put
Speaker 2: you last week of October and you're kind of in
Speaker 2: a scenario like we're talking about here.
Speaker 4: It's a new spot.
Speaker 2: You're hiking along, doing some scouting as you go in season,
Speaker 2: and you come across this really nice looking creek bottom.
Speaker 2: Let's say it's a relatively narrow bottom, but there's a
Speaker 2: beaten down trail crossing the creek there, and it's the
Speaker 2: best concentration of deer sign you've seen yet throughout your
Speaker 2: day of exploring this new spot. Just just pounded down
Speaker 2: tracks and let's say there's one big rub right down
Speaker 2: the bottom.
Speaker 4: So that's what you've got to work with here.
Speaker 2: How would you determine if this is a spot worth hunting,
Speaker 2: and then how would you set up in a location
Speaker 2: like that?
Speaker 5: Well, look at I'm gonna look at the rubs start with,
Speaker 5: and you know, say which direction I come from, hopefully,
Speaker 5: and then kind of figuring out if it's bed in
Speaker 5: which side I would think being associated with foods, If
Speaker 5: it's a real marow bottom of tight creek cross from,
Speaker 5: then where you got extreme elevation? I know automatically, I'm
Speaker 5: not gonna hunt none that I'm closer to that creek
Speaker 5: crossing because the swirl stuff is it's hard to control.
Speaker 5: So so I'm gonna try to find an elevation part
Speaker 5: to that, you know, and the edge, so you know,
Speaker 5: looking how if that rub is fresh, you know, it's
Speaker 5: gonna help me determine a little bit, you know, hoping
Speaker 5: I might see more than one rub that's you know,
Speaker 5: maybe historical rubs associated with that.
Speaker 3: I'm gonna hunt higher up, closer to an edge.
Speaker 5: Or maybe if it looks like some kind of pinch,
Speaker 5: maybe some kind of gap or something, I'm gonna figure
Speaker 5: out a way to hunt higher up on that. You know,
Speaker 5: in fact, trails like you said, beat down and got
Speaker 5: fresh tracks in it. You can tell where the where
Speaker 5: the ground has been cut smooth, you know it's not
Speaker 5: war or kind of faded. Then you know it's a
Speaker 5: hot trail. I'm figuring out way to hunt somehow or other. So,
Speaker 5: you know, and some of this stuff, you know, like
Speaker 5: you know, he's saying dropping in scenarios. If I've got
Speaker 5: time to walk around and drive around whatever. You also,
Speaker 5: I'm gonna look and see how people is affecting some
Speaker 5: of that stuff too, you know, so it's just if
Speaker 5: they're parked or what.
Speaker 3: So you got to kind of play it. And some
Speaker 3: of this stuff you're.
Speaker 2: Doing, you mentioned, you know, if it's a narrow type
Speaker 2: bottom like that, you would try to get off of
Speaker 2: it aways, get higher, get to where the wind's safe.
Speaker 2: Would you still try to be within sight of that
Speaker 2: creek crossing or not?
Speaker 3: Always know?
Speaker 5: Just know that you know that, you know, and I
Speaker 5: use that kind of bake sometimes. Is that's creek crossing.
Speaker 5: I really love tiny end and creek crossing with a
Speaker 5: couple other things. You know, a gap or some kind
Speaker 5: of secondary points or a bunch of secondary points, you know,
Speaker 5: some ridge system, maybe a food source.
Speaker 3: Or maybe a cutover. But how they're why they're crossing there.
Speaker 5: And then the next thing why they're crossing the are
Speaker 5: what they're usually get to that area. So if it's
Speaker 5: a shelf, it's some kind of crazy edge, I mean
Speaker 5: looking for other little funnels, you know, because you know,
Speaker 5: you know, if you go on huntre creek crossing close,
Speaker 5: you know the best time to do it in eatning.
Speaker 5: You don't want the thermos start pulling down, you don't
Speaker 5: you try to stay on the down stream side of
Speaker 5: the trail because of that, what moving water's gonna.
Speaker 3: Pull your scent, so help with that.
Speaker 5: So but and then especially as as the most majority
Speaker 5: of times I'm doing this type of hunting is a
Speaker 5: buff upper elevation.
Speaker 2: How how wide would a bottom have to be for
Speaker 2: you to actually feel comfortable hunting close to it?
Speaker 4: Down in there with it? Are we talking fifty yards wide?
Speaker 4: Five hundred yards wide?
Speaker 2: Like, what's enough for you not to be worried about
Speaker 2: funky swirling winds and stuff like that?
Speaker 5: Going to have to be one hundred yards probably a
Speaker 5: wider or a big creek, you know, a big creek
Speaker 5: will with moving water will help to an extent, you know. So,
Speaker 5: but it's got to be pretty wide and so for
Speaker 5: me to do it in the morning or have some
Speaker 5: kind of crazy high, high moving wind. You know, I
Speaker 5: like wind your days. It's a high constant wind, you know,
Speaker 5: like a front system, you can play.
Speaker 3: It a lot easier.
Speaker 5: And so okay, yeah, you're having them relaxing winds, know
Speaker 5: what I'm saying, relaxing winds, and it just you're saying
Speaker 5: it just flood, it just blows out.
Speaker 2: So yeah, did you meant you said that if it's
Speaker 2: a bigger creek or bigger stream or river you're more comfortable.
Speaker 2: Is that because you've seen the your scent kind of
Speaker 2: go with the current of the of the stream in
Speaker 2: the past. I've seen something like that too, Is that
Speaker 2: what you're saying?
Speaker 5: Yeah, you check up pretty easy with milk way and stuff.
Speaker 5: It's just it's amazing how how moving water and the
Speaker 5: water it is. The more that current something it just pulled,
Speaker 5: the more air, more volume air. When you like standing
Speaker 5: there most time you won't even feel it, but you
Speaker 5: drop some milk way and it's coming down hitting that
Speaker 5: and has gone.
Speaker 2: So yeah, all right, I want to return back to
Speaker 2: this giant buck that you've got the match sets now
Speaker 2: sitting on the shelf in your house, we'll say, and
Speaker 2: you've been looking at that match set day after day
Speaker 2: after day. You went in there, you did that preseason work,
Speaker 2: you found all your spots. You and your wife are
Speaker 2: are set. You guys are gonna you're gonna get this deer.
Speaker 2: But when the season opens, you're about to go head
Speaker 2: in for opening day, let's say, to your spot or
Speaker 2: whenever the first time is that you decide you think
Speaker 2: you've got a good chance of this buck, and you're
Speaker 2: going to head in there. And as you start approaching
Speaker 2: this zone, first trailhead you go by, there's several trucks.
Speaker 2: Now you get to the next trailhead or the next
Speaker 2: parking area close to where you hunt want to hunt,
Speaker 2: there's several trucks, and you end up finding as you
Speaker 2: head into your spot that all of the different access
Speaker 2: points in this zone seem to be you know, multiple people.
Speaker 2: There seems to be more folks than you would typically
Speaker 2: expect in this area, and maybe you start thinking, huh,
Speaker 2: I might not be the only person who knows about
Speaker 2: this buck.
Speaker 3: What do you do?
Speaker 2: Do you just go hunt your plan just as you
Speaker 2: were planning on it, or are you now going to
Speaker 2: have to pivot or rethink what you're gonna do.
Speaker 5: Yeah, genterally, you know, that's part of the postag and stuff.
Speaker 5: I don't the easy spots or the more common spots
Speaker 5: that people would hit, you know, that's I'll kind of
Speaker 5: rule them out automatically, you know, And that's you know experience.
Speaker 5: So well, there's never a time that I'll pull into
Speaker 5: a place in their first five vehicles ten vehicles where
Speaker 5: I won't go ahead and park gently.
Speaker 3: We're gonna be pretty early.
Speaker 5: We only got you know, you only got a certain
Speaker 5: amount of days for these prime hunting days. Okay, So
Speaker 5: I'm not gonna give that up for nobody spot because generally,
Speaker 5: like you know, where we are at a parking area
Speaker 5: that suckers.
Speaker 3: The access is three miles or more of whatever. You
Speaker 3: get huge woods.
Speaker 5: So the chance you walk it up on somebody, yeah
Speaker 5: it's possible, it's kind of slim. So we're gonna get
Speaker 5: out and we're gonna head our head our way, walking
Speaker 5: the iron half whatever it is, two hours before dark.
Speaker 5: If we run into flashlight, I'll never go in front
Speaker 5: of somebody's flashlight.
Speaker 3: I mean, that's I just hope, I hope nobody would
Speaker 3: do me like that.
Speaker 5: But just pull back and go to a different cause
Speaker 5: we'll have back up areas, back up spots in them areas,
Speaker 5: and just move to the next in that spot. And
Speaker 5: I'm not gonna give up that spot because there's four
Speaker 5: vehicles pen or whatever they're because because you got anything
Speaker 5: can happen. The more people sometimes will help you, you know,
Speaker 5: as far as you know, dear movement. So because generally
Speaker 5: you know, I don't know, I don't know exactly where
Speaker 5: you're running out of whatever in the south, you know,
Speaker 5: gently by then them days, the rut, you've already had
Speaker 5: a month of pressure. So the normal walking around like
Speaker 5: nothing's going on, dear movement is very mental, you know,
Speaker 5: because they've already smelt all that stuff, I know, so
Speaker 5: they're in their kind of slafe area. So the rut
Speaker 5: is what you're keying in on. Then, So that kind
Speaker 5: of chasing movement you'll have that. Then you'll have the
Speaker 5: people that walk around that can't stand to sit long
Speaker 5: or they're gonna move around anyway, that opportunity of a
Speaker 5: pushing So I'm never gonna give up an area just
Speaker 5: because whatever bibles apart there.
Speaker 2: So all right, what if you win. In you get
Speaker 2: to your spot, you didn't see any flashlights in there.
Speaker 2: It's looking good. Daylight is just kind of arriving. Things
Speaker 2: are shifting from shadows to actual real things that you
Speaker 2: can see. You're feeling great, the wind's perfect, it's a
Speaker 2: nice cool morning.
Speaker 4: And then you hear.
Speaker 2: You're looking over there waiting for that big old buck,
Speaker 2: and then you instead see a hunter. And then hunter
Speaker 2: comes walking in, walks past you and goes on back
Speaker 2: into the good stuff. That's let's let's say that's behind you.
Speaker 2: He keeps on going through, pushing into new country. Does
Speaker 2: that change your plans at all? Or or what do
Speaker 2: you do in that scenario when another hunter comes past
Speaker 2: you and then pushes into untouched country.
Speaker 3: Most of you don't.
Speaker 5: If they're going and interfering where I think there's gonna
Speaker 5: come from whatever, I'm gonna try to whistle that I'm
Speaker 5: gonna crow call them, and then try to stop them
Speaker 5: from going that way. If they don't stop, then they
Speaker 5: go that way. Most of the time, I'm we're hunting
Speaker 5: some kind of multiple hoob things. I'm just gonna just
Speaker 5: deal with it. That day I might make some kind
Speaker 5: of plan to move the next day of that day. Up,
Speaker 5: I'm not gonna let that part interfere with my hunt.
Speaker 5: So I'm just gonna let them go on if they
Speaker 5: do that. So, but I am gonna try to stop them.
Speaker 5: You know, I've had people walk by me several times,
Speaker 5: I mean over the years without them without him knowing
Speaker 5: I'm there as well, they're not interfering more where I'm
Speaker 5: my key area or whatever it is.
Speaker 3: I don't let them know why I'm there because I
Speaker 3: don't want to know I'm there.
Speaker 5: So, but if they're gonna go into the dang bed
Speaker 5: there or go toward a bed in there I think,
Speaker 5: or the actual walk in the trail that I'm thinking
Speaker 5: the deer is gonna come from, I'm gonna try to stop.
Speaker 3: If not, then I'm gonna deal with it that day
Speaker 3: because they could you know, a buck.
Speaker 5: One of the key things about the buck getting jumped,
Speaker 5: he love doubling back, you know, and figuring out how
Speaker 5: somebody come in there.
Speaker 3: So I'm I'm going to deal with it for that day.
Speaker 2: So so when you say deal with that, you mean
Speaker 2: like you're gonna stick it out, You'll stay in that
Speaker 2: place for the rest of that day.
Speaker 4: Okay, so what about the next day? Does that?
Speaker 3: Does it?
Speaker 2: If would you still think, like, if this is your place,
Speaker 2: if you really like this, and you said earlier you
Speaker 2: know you might hunt a spot three days in a row,
Speaker 2: would you just assume he went in there, he probably
Speaker 2: mucked it up. For day two, I'm gonna go to
Speaker 2: option B. Or would you go back and hope he
Speaker 2: doesn't return?
Speaker 5: And most time in these area like this, I know
Speaker 5: how anybody you know you want you know, unless why
Speaker 5: I'm out west or something like that. I know how
Speaker 5: that somebody's gonna get in there and how they gonna
Speaker 5: get out so gently, so I'll have an idea if
Speaker 5: they if they walk in and walk back out, the
Speaker 5: possibility they had a stand or something. But if they
Speaker 5: walk through and you don't see them again, they're just
Speaker 5: doing some kind of walk about, so so that that'll
Speaker 5: give you an evidence on what you want to do.
Speaker 5: And if they walk straight in and they walk and
Speaker 5: they're coming back out at dark or whatever, and then
Speaker 5: I know, well, if somebody's got a stand or something,
Speaker 5: that might change my plan. But if I don't see
Speaker 5: them anymore that day and I know they're just doing
Speaker 5: a circle fluid.
Speaker 3: I don't worry about it.
Speaker 2: So okay, all right, let's imagine then another scenario here.
Speaker 2: Let's let's pivot a little bit. It's it's the rut.
Speaker 2: You're hunting again, one of these WA's somewhere down there
Speaker 2: by you, and you have a plan. You have a
Speaker 2: spot picked out, you and your wife are out there.
Speaker 2: You're tagg team in and you've put in your full
Speaker 2: three days in a location, and you feel all your
Speaker 2: preseason scouting, all the work it made you really strongly
Speaker 2: believe that this is a spot. But you put in
Speaker 2: a full three days there and you saw nothing but
Speaker 2: a few dos and young bucks.
Speaker 4: But this is like the spot.
Speaker 2: Maybe this is like the best zone right near where
Speaker 2: this jumbo buck sign had been found. What are you
Speaker 2: doing at the end of day three when you're trying
Speaker 2: to decide, you know, what do.
Speaker 4: I do next? What's my game plan for day four?
Speaker 2: I've heard you say in the past that you know,
Speaker 2: every day that passes while you're sitting on a good rut,
Speaker 2: funnel or location without seeing a good buck, you feel
Speaker 2: better about your chances coming up. Is that Is that
Speaker 2: still the case when you get to two three days
Speaker 2: in and it's still been slow. What do you do
Speaker 2: in that scenario?
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know again, that's most of these if it's
Speaker 5: on the area that I'm known, you know, you know
Speaker 5: which out west is gonna be a little bit different.
Speaker 5: But in Alabama or somewhere I'm hunting or I'm familiar
Speaker 5: with that land and I'm using trail camera pictured or
Speaker 5: data from the previous season, what action I got these days?
Speaker 5: Kind of figured out when the most movement is coming through,
Speaker 5: I'll give it seven days in a row. I mean,
Speaker 5: without bothering men be I will, you know, being older
Speaker 5: and I guess been more patient now in the years
Speaker 5: I've experienced that I've got or with the area that
Speaker 5: we hunt that I just low my plan and my
Speaker 5: wife's planning our plan that we're not going to deviate
Speaker 5: because making a plan and then changing their mind mid
Speaker 5: season about how you're gonna do something and it don't work,
Speaker 5: you're gonna be show enough matter yourself or not sticking.
Speaker 3: With your plan.
Speaker 5: So if you stick with your plan it didn't work, well,
Speaker 5: I stuck with my planet didn't work. You know, I
Speaker 5: still got the rest of the season because most of
Speaker 5: the time these I want to be moving somewhere else.
Speaker 5: So it's not a guarantee. You know, it's it's hunting,
Speaker 5: it's not shooting. I just could say, and so it's
Speaker 5: just so, But I'm gonna stick with that plan because
Speaker 5: something else could have changed, and something I mean, of
Speaker 5: course you're gonna think of your mind, did some kind
Speaker 5: of food source or something and change and maybe you know,
Speaker 5: make a move. But but I mean generally, there all
Speaker 5: the camera dat of I've been running cameras for since
Speaker 5: back film days and say the last ten years or
Speaker 5: more of me kind of doing a pattern to know
Speaker 5: that most of the daytime buck moved and where I
Speaker 5: hunt at is gonna be over a week or two
Speaker 5: span during the.
Speaker 3: Rut or pre rut, and that after that, you know,
Speaker 3: there's nothing.
Speaker 5: So it's just so, I just I'm gonna spend that
Speaker 5: time in the mirror, stayed with my plan, and if
Speaker 5: I don't see one, I've had my plan. I might
Speaker 5: have been a might have been a holler off when
Speaker 5: it's possible, or just something else outside of my control
Speaker 5: or whatever could have happened. But what I can control
Speaker 5: and my plan I'm gonna stick with. So it's just
Speaker 5: and know that I give my best and not worried
Speaker 5: about that and just be ready to do the plan
Speaker 5: for next season. So, but I don't I don't like
Speaker 5: jumping around a bunch because generally these pinches these edges.
Speaker 3: Sooner or later they might let me be the bucking
Speaker 3: on ship. But you're gonna see something.
Speaker 4: So so generally, what about this?
Speaker 2: And this is this is a worst case. But let's
Speaker 2: imagine you stick with your plan. You're you're on one
Speaker 2: of these edges. You put in your time, and and
Speaker 2: that big giant comes through and he does exactly what
Speaker 2: you hoped he would do, and then the wind swirls.
Speaker 2: When he's at fifty yards, he catches you up, he
Speaker 2: boggers out.
Speaker 4: Of there, he's gone out of sight. Yeah, what do
Speaker 4: you do?
Speaker 2: Then let's say it's like late morning, so you still
Speaker 2: have half the day to go. If you were going
Speaker 2: to keep hunting that day, you still have several days
Speaker 2: to hunt on this particular you know, time of vacation
Speaker 2: or trip or whatever it is.
Speaker 4: How do you pivot if at all in that scenario?
Speaker 3: Well, after I got through, cryme, that'd be god. Yeah,
Speaker 3: that would be so tough. Yo.
Speaker 5: Hopefully that that buck coming, you know, if it's the
Speaker 5: the monster man, that would hurt so bad. But I'm
Speaker 5: hoping in my mind that a door or something to
Speaker 5: come through there earlier. I'm not sure you can kind
Speaker 5: of tell how they're acting if they were trailing a
Speaker 5: doe if if not, i might finish that day up there,
Speaker 5: but I'm definitely.
Speaker 3: Not going to be back there the rest of the season.
Speaker 3: It's just because I've my wife.
Speaker 5: Is the only one that I that I know that
Speaker 5: has seen the same big buck twice and that they
Speaker 5: come hunting seeing. You know, I've only seen one time,
Speaker 5: and most of the time, I guess because the way
Speaker 5: we're set up, you know, they figured me out or whatever,
Speaker 5: because I'm always trying to set up close.
Speaker 3: You know, like boat range of everything I'm doing because
Speaker 3: i want that scenario happens. Most of the time.
Speaker 5: I'm hoping I'm set up where if they hit some
Speaker 5: kind of wind, because it has happened when they've hit
Speaker 5: a wind, but I've still been able to kill them
Speaker 5: because they're they're kind of trying to figure out what's
Speaker 5: going on, you know, if it's the buck I'm trying
Speaker 5: to harvest for want I want to harvest, So I'm
Speaker 5: always trying to set up because I'll give up the
Speaker 5: wind in certain places. So but if it's rights there
Speaker 5: where whens at, I generally have a shot. So I
Speaker 5: already had it or already had a shot. So so
Speaker 5: that's but if he gets if he busts me and
Speaker 5: gets out of there, I'm not if I stay there
Speaker 5: that day. But you know, generally if that time frame,
Speaker 5: me and my wife together and so at lunch time
Speaker 5: we're meeting, and I'll go always always hunt somewhere else different.
Speaker 3: In eating so so I won't be back there in
Speaker 3: that spot.
Speaker 5: I just I'll have a different area or a different
Speaker 5: spot in that area that I can you know, hunt
Speaker 5: and feel slightly you know, comfortable.
Speaker 3: That I could see him again.
Speaker 5: But that's boy, it hurts when you do that, because
Speaker 5: they if they figure out you, especially with my chure
Speaker 5: buzz man, that things can change, they can they can
Speaker 5: adjust a little bit, go nocturnal or whatever. But hopefully
Speaker 5: during the up they might still still stay moving. But
Speaker 5: that's it's not it's not a good thing.
Speaker 3: I hate that what I have.
Speaker 2: How far is far enough away for you to be
Speaker 2: able to say, okay, I pivoted enough that there's a
Speaker 2: chance again, are we talking like one hundred yard move
Speaker 2: or like how much?
Speaker 5: That kind of depends a little bit, Like if if
Speaker 5: it was coming from a specific january been there or
Speaker 5: something or something like that, then maybe a hundred yards
Speaker 5: slight movement, a different little edge or something, or it
Speaker 5: could be a quarter mile or something. But it's I'll
Speaker 5: have some kind of a different plan, you know as
Speaker 5: far as that, just but it's got I got kind of.
Speaker 3: Know about what he was doing to do that. So
Speaker 3: it could be a one hundred yard, it could be
Speaker 3: two hundred ard, it could be a quarter mile or more.
Speaker 5: Just it just depends these areas where I hunt at.
Speaker 5: There's ways to do things a quarter mile or more around.
Speaker 5: So it's just and my wife is always it's very
Speaker 5: rare for me and my wife to be closer than
Speaker 5: a quarter mile. It's just because we're trying to do
Speaker 5: the long range plan. You know, we're trying to you know,
Speaker 5: we're trying to. We got pretty strategic about how we
Speaker 5: do it nowadays, so I can adjust and you know,
Speaker 5: a completely different edge or a different triftic trail system
Speaker 5: or different gap system or something like that, or different
Speaker 5: creek crossing systems.
Speaker 2: So let's imagine a slightly different kind of angle on
Speaker 2: this same deal. You're in this spot, perfectly planned, you're
Speaker 2: well positioned. The big guy shows up in sight, but
Speaker 2: he doesn't come right down the pipe to you. He
Speaker 2: takes some slightly different route and he's out of range. Okay,
Speaker 2: so he's now passing by. He's out of range. He's
Speaker 2: probably going to be heading away from you. Now you've
Speaker 2: got a couple options, I guess the first question is
Speaker 2: would you try any kind of calling of any sort
Speaker 2: to try to get him in range, or you're gonna say,
Speaker 2: all right, he's gonna go off his own direction. Then
Speaker 2: I'm gonna adjust. What are you do in that scenario?
Speaker 2: He's coming in, he's not quite there, he's heading away.
Speaker 5: Now what, I'm definitely going to hit a grunt calls,
Speaker 5: start off with, you know, and try to say if
Speaker 5: he can hear me or not. If he hears me
Speaker 5: and he ignores me, I won't do anything else.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 5: If he don't act like you hear me in whatever,
Speaker 5: then I'll pick up some rabbling horns and try to
Speaker 5: do it where the sucker can't see me or something,
Speaker 5: you know, and then just do something. I'll just do
Speaker 5: like a crash, like a like a two bunch of
Speaker 5: hit something and just see if he does.
Speaker 3: Anything of that with that.
Speaker 5: But if he don't, I'm hoping to answer that grunk call.
Speaker 5: I have crawled him back with a grunk call. But
Speaker 5: it's it's if they don't ignore that, I just I don't.
Speaker 5: I don't definitely don't want to learn him to meet.
Speaker 5: So so what I'm saying so I don't push that,
Speaker 5: you know back now, Hung, I've done all kind of
Speaker 5: crazy stuff, so I've learned. Man, just pay attention to
Speaker 5: that body language, you know, because most of time they
Speaker 5: hear you or something that pause, flicker, that tail or
Speaker 5: something like that, or maybe a turn that ear towards you.
Speaker 5: And then if they don't come to you, don't do
Speaker 5: anything else because they don't. They're just not there any
Speaker 5: They're not in that kind of mooding.
Speaker 4: So it's a hard lesson to learn.
Speaker 2: You so badly, you so badly want to keep on
Speaker 2: throwing the kitchen sink at him to desperately get him
Speaker 2: back to you.
Speaker 4: Right, Uh, what about what about this?
Speaker 2: Let's imagine again the same scenario, but this time you
Speaker 2: see two different good bucks, one of them being a
Speaker 2: buck for sure, you would shoot one of them is
Speaker 2: like a maybe, but they pass like well out of range.
Speaker 2: So you see two bucks do the same thing, maybe
Speaker 2: like one hundred and twenty yards out of range. But
Speaker 2: you're in this spot because of these terrain features and
Speaker 2: this cover. All this stuff's coming together just right. We'd
Speaker 2: see in two bucks go in the same place out
Speaker 2: of range. Be enough for you to want to make
Speaker 2: a move at all, or are you? Are you sticking
Speaker 2: to your guns in the spot because you believe in it.
Speaker 2: In that kind of scenario, I'm moving.
Speaker 3: You are two things doing something like that. I'm moving.
Speaker 5: I'm getting closer to that something going on for that happens,
Speaker 5: I'm getting over some behind another right then as soon
Speaker 5: as i can so.
Speaker 3: So I mean, you don't feel safe about it, you know.
Speaker 5: And sometimes even with a with a with one chase
Speaker 5: and a doe if they come from some funky area
Speaker 5: and that that trail or whatever the day we're running
Speaker 5: doing that process, if it's out of my range, whatever,
Speaker 5: just one dough hot, no buck chasing, I'm moving to
Speaker 5: get closer to that because that scent trail is still active,
Speaker 5: you know, I've you know, I've had bucks over the
Speaker 5: next couple of hours come through that trail and sometimes
Speaker 5: a bigger one be the second one coming or whatever.
Speaker 3: So it's just so I'm moving on that situation. So
Speaker 3: that's that's another hard lesson to learn, so.
Speaker 4: So very true.
Speaker 2: So you would would you go as soon as the
Speaker 2: last deer is out of sight? Or would you wait
Speaker 2: till midday when things slow down a little bit?
Speaker 3: Like?
Speaker 4: How how soon is soon?
Speaker 5: Soon as that sucker's rather out of sight? Soon they're
Speaker 5: out of sight, I'm getting out and getting over I mean.
Speaker 3: You don't.
Speaker 5: You don't bear sitting there in thirty minutes later, an
Speaker 5: hour later than another one come by. So because that
Speaker 5: trail is fresh, get over there.
Speaker 2: So yeah, yeah, that's uh, that's such a tough scenario
Speaker 2: because you you know, the the mid day move or
Speaker 2: the late morning move is always one of those deals
Speaker 2: where you want to get somewhere fast, but and there's
Speaker 2: always that whisper in the back of your mind, like
Speaker 2: as soon as you become vulnerable, like you're halfway down
Speaker 2: your stick, so you're hanging off the back of the tree,
Speaker 2: and then then of course the bucks shows up right
Speaker 2: where you are now or while you're walking to the
Speaker 2: new spot, and then they're there behind you. But but yeah,
Speaker 2: it's probably better to give it a try than not
Speaker 2: and then then watch the big guy go through Buck
Speaker 2: number three.
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, Okay, I want to run you through.
Speaker 2: Just a few more fast, kind of rapid fire type
Speaker 2: questions now, so we're gonna we're gonna step away from
Speaker 2: the what would you do scenarios and instead I've just
Speaker 2: got I think five or six quick hitting just kind
Speaker 2: of give me your first gut reaction to these things,
Speaker 2: like a one word type answer.
Speaker 4: We're gonna run you through this really quick, and then gets.
Speaker 2: You out the door, because because I know there's there's
Speaker 2: a big, old giant buck out there, some are waiting
Speaker 2: for you to put together that final final few steps
Speaker 2: of your game plan, and I don't want to hold
Speaker 2: you back from that, so rapid fire first thing that
Speaker 2: comes to your mind. We're gonna go through these quick. Michael,
Speaker 2: Does the moon matter for deer movement?
Speaker 4: Yes or no?
Speaker 3: No?
Speaker 4: Would you take a fifty yard shot at a white
Speaker 4: tail with your bow? Yes or no?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 2: If you could only have one of these tools for
Speaker 2: the rest of your hunts, the rest of your life?
Speaker 2: Would you take a grunt tube or a set of
Speaker 2: rattling antlers, run tube expandable or fixed blade broadheads? Should
Speaker 2: you stop a walking buck before shooting with a sound
Speaker 2: of some kind?
Speaker 3: Yes? Would you?
Speaker 2: If you had to only pick one season to do
Speaker 2: all of your scouting, you could do it winter, You
Speaker 2: could take summer, or you could take in season.
Speaker 4: Which of those three would you pick?
Speaker 3: Winter?
Speaker 4: All?
Speaker 2: Right, now, this one you can you can expand on this.
Speaker 2: You can give me your explanation. This isn't a one
Speaker 2: word answer. Imagine that I kind of run the country
Speaker 2: and run all the hunting opportunities across the nation, and
Speaker 2: I am going to unfortunately take away your hunting privileges
Speaker 2: for the rest of your life. No more hunting licenses
Speaker 2: for the rest of your life unless you can kill
Speaker 2: a big mature buck this year. So if you kill
Speaker 2: a big mature buck this year, then you can keep
Speaker 2: on hunting. If you do not kill a big mature
Speaker 2: buck this year, you're done. Here's the real bummer, though, Yeah,
Speaker 2: here's the extra bummer. You only have one day to
Speaker 2: get it done. Get one single day. So what I
Speaker 2: want you to do for me, Michael is pick the
Speaker 2: date that you're going to select for this hunt. So
Speaker 2: you get to pick any day in the calendar. Tell
Speaker 2: me the day you want to pick, and then describe
Speaker 2: for me the best possible location that you would sit
Speaker 2: for this one particular day for this very high stakes hunt.
Speaker 2: And this could either be like maybe you have an
Speaker 2: actual spot that you would pick that you know of
Speaker 2: and you can describe that, or you can make up
Speaker 2: the kind of spot that would be perfect for this.
Speaker 2: But but give me the day of the year and
Speaker 2: give me the spot you would go to try to
Speaker 2: kill mature buck in this very important scenario.
Speaker 4: Paint that picture.
Speaker 3: This is gonna be my home stake.
Speaker 4: You can go anywhere you want if it's my home state.
Speaker 3: It's gonna be December. Second.
Speaker 5: I got a creek crossing there that I've seen more
Speaker 5: deer or more chasing going on on that day, So
Speaker 5: I'm heading that that day.
Speaker 3: So and that, I mean, that's already that's the easy
Speaker 3: one for me. So in Alabama, now.
Speaker 2: December two, creek crossing. Uh, just describe the described for
Speaker 2: me the perfect creek crossing. Set up a little bit more.
Speaker 5: This creek crossing is associated with some bluff gap systems
Speaker 5: where when I cross that thing creek, they're in between
Speaker 5: this bluff system. One bluff I can see kind of
Speaker 5: you know, can save it, not really say, but I
Speaker 5: know it's there within fifty yards. You know, if a
Speaker 5: person walked in there, they couldn't really see it. So
Speaker 5: then on down the creek system is a high wall.
Speaker 3: That's they just they just can't do it.
Speaker 5: So they're coming through this area and that's generally in
Speaker 5: boat range. And that's I mean, so and during December
Speaker 5: second sometimes I'll be bow hunting. Sometimes the big gun
Speaker 5: hunt just depends on what type of you know, situation
Speaker 5: going on. But I'm up above that creek crossing, say
Speaker 5: seventy five one hundred yards, and there's some pine system,
Speaker 5: you know, a couple of riding systems over that. They're
Speaker 5: they're coming from that creek crossing going to them dank
Speaker 5: pines or coming from them pines.
Speaker 3: So it's just and that's I've seen more deer and
Speaker 3: heard more deer on that in that area.
Speaker 4: So I'm just just a funnel.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, amazing, all right, Michael, Well, I would never
Speaker 2: do that to you. I won't take away you're hunting rights,
Speaker 2: but I'm but I'm glad that you've got a good
Speaker 2: planning place just in case I and I really do,
Speaker 2: I really do appreciate you taking the time to to
Speaker 2: talk me through all this stuff, walk us through your
Speaker 2: thought process. You are getting the job done in tough places,
Speaker 2: and it's very impressive.
Speaker 4: So so keep on keeping on, Michael. It's been fun
Speaker 4: to watch from afar.
Speaker 3: Well. I appreciate it. I've enjoyed this is really this
Speaker 3: has been this is fun.
Speaker 5: So I enjoyed it so and I appreciate what y'all
Speaker 5: doing and that yall's podcast system and that's right, y'all
Speaker 5: keep up what y'all doing for the outdoors.
Speaker 3: And I mean for us the hunting community, you know.
Speaker 3: So again I appreciate it.
Speaker 5: I appreciate it, and I hope somebody gets something out
Speaker 5: of this, you know, hopefully I wouldn't too out there
Speaker 5: a little bit or or get hung up on anything.
Speaker 5: But so, but we we're all a good community and
Speaker 5: we all know enjoy this, so so kind of think
Speaker 5: outside of the box sometimes and then sometimes I mean
Speaker 5: be like, maybe make a plan, stick with it.
Speaker 4: I think that's that's very sound advice. Michael. Thank you
Speaker 4: for that and Uh, that's the luck this year.
Speaker 3: You totally appreciate it, buddy, all.
Speaker 2: Right, and that's going to do it for us today.
Speaker 2: Thanks for joining me today in the show. If we're
Speaker 2: doing what would You Do? Series, that means the hunting
Speaker 2: season is almost here. So getting that final work, getting
Speaker 2: those reps of the bow, have fun, getting ready for
Speaker 2: the day because it's going to be here before we
Speaker 2: know it, and that's a beautiful thing. So thanks for
Speaker 2: joining me, and until next time, stay wired to Hunt.