WEBVTT - All the President's Men (Archive) 0:00:03.840 --> 0:00:05.960 What kind of a show you guys putting. 0:00:05.680 --> 0:00:06.280 On here today? 0:00:06.400 --> 0:00:07.520 You're not interested in art? 0:00:07.680 --> 0:00:07.840 Now? 0:00:08.039 --> 0:00:09.319 No, look, we're going to do this thing. 0:00:09.360 --> 0:00:11.080 We're going to have a conversation. 0:00:13.160 --> 0:00:15.920 Out of Robert Redford on our minds, of course, with 0:00:16.000 --> 0:00:21.120 his recent passing and the top five Robert Redford movies 0:00:21.720 --> 0:00:25.400 lists that we're both working on for our upcoming show. 0:00:25.920 --> 0:00:29.960 Fair to say, All the President's Men is a lock 0:00:30.560 --> 0:00:33.080 for that list. It's definitely not one we have to 0:00:33.080 --> 0:00:36.680 do homework on because we recently talked about it on 0:00:36.760 --> 0:00:39.440 the show. Just a couple of years ago. We did 0:00:40.040 --> 0:00:42.519 in All the President's Men review as part of our 0:00:42.560 --> 0:00:46.519 seven from seventy six Best Year Ever series. 0:00:47.040 --> 0:00:49.080 And it happens to be one of those movies that 0:00:49.200 --> 0:00:52.120 even for that review, I may not have needed to 0:00:52.159 --> 0:00:55.320 rewatch it because I probably have seen it about one 0:00:55.360 --> 0:00:57.800 hundred times, or certainly scenes from it. I love the 0:00:57.840 --> 0:01:01.200 movie that much. But I do remember rewatching it for 0:01:01.360 --> 0:01:04.240 that conversation, because of course I would, and like all 0:01:04.280 --> 0:01:08.280 of those sacred cow conversations, any kind of revisit, you 0:01:08.360 --> 0:01:12.000 see new things every time, and I remember digging into 0:01:12.200 --> 0:01:17.120 some scenes in particular. It was a very rewarding rewatch 0:01:17.160 --> 0:01:20.720 hopefully it was a rewarding listen then and will be now. 0:01:20.760 --> 0:01:23.720 That seven from seventy six series was a good one. 0:01:23.760 --> 0:01:27.240 We talked about Taxi Driver Network, Rocky. We saw a 0:01:27.240 --> 0:01:30.040 movie that I think we both watched for the first time, 0:01:30.280 --> 0:01:34.720 car Wash Barbara Coppoles Harlan County, USA, was one that 0:01:34.840 --> 0:01:38.120 I had seen many times before, or at least multiple times, 0:01:38.400 --> 0:01:40.640 but we had to include it in another new one. 0:01:40.840 --> 0:01:43.880 Shantel Ackerman's News from Home. So a great series, and 0:01:43.920 --> 0:01:47.760 All the President's Men was a cornerstone of it. We 0:01:47.800 --> 0:01:51.160 hope you enjoy this conversation, and we remind you that 0:01:51.600 --> 0:01:54.400 the Film Spotting Archive access to it is just one 0:01:54.440 --> 0:01:56.320 of the benefits you get as a member of the 0:01:56.320 --> 0:01:59.080 film Spotting Family. You can learn more about that at 0:01:59.080 --> 0:02:03.080 film Spotting family dot com. From February twenty twenty one, 0:02:03.240 --> 0:02:06.160 here is That's seven from seventy sixth review of All 0:02:06.160 --> 0:02:07.080 the President's. 0:02:06.760 --> 0:02:10.079 Men, Hi, Adam and Josh. This is Amy from Germantown 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:13.400 with a few rambling thoughts about All the President's Men. 0:02:14.560 --> 0:02:16.960 When Merk Peltz died in two thousand and eight, and 0:02:17.000 --> 0:02:20.239 everyone said deep Throat died, but for me, the death 0:02:20.280 --> 0:02:23.240 of Deep throat was just last month with the passing 0:02:23.280 --> 0:02:26.359 of Hal Holbrook. I'm always thinking of him. In that 0:02:26.520 --> 0:02:30.800 dimly led cigarette, Smokey look tensely trying to keep Robert 0:02:30.840 --> 0:02:31.600 Redford focus. 0:02:32.160 --> 0:02:36.640 Si Gritty said, don concentrate on sigrette. You'll miss the overall. 0:02:39.280 --> 0:02:43.000 The letter, the letter that destroyed the muskie candidates, the 0:02:43.040 --> 0:02:45.640 conneclar Did that come from inside the work? You're missing 0:02:45.720 --> 0:02:47.040 the overall? 0:02:47.080 --> 0:02:47.840 What overall? 0:02:48.400 --> 0:02:50.840 They were riding a musket Look who got destroyed. 0:02:51.480 --> 0:02:54.400 It's such a great performance in a film that's jam 0:02:54.440 --> 0:02:57.560 packed with them. Can't asked how much do I have 0:02:57.639 --> 0:03:00.799 to know about Watergate? And I said none, because it's 0:03:00.800 --> 0:03:03.360 not a movie about water Date. It's a movie about 0:03:03.440 --> 0:03:08.160 journalism and grit and the grind and oh oh boy 0:03:08.200 --> 0:03:11.840 to Woodward and Bernstein, grind, I mean the newsroom is 0:03:11.960 --> 0:03:17.720 noisy and conversations are convoluted and truth is elusive. And 0:03:17.760 --> 0:03:22.440 I am mesmerized by Hoffmann and Medford. I mean we 0:03:22.480 --> 0:03:25.800 sort of accidentally trip into their story and they trip 0:03:25.840 --> 0:03:29.160 into their partnership, and we root for them. We want 0:03:29.200 --> 0:03:31.760 them to find something, We want them to find anything, 0:03:32.240 --> 0:03:35.560 and we empathize as they drive and make phone calls 0:03:35.800 --> 0:03:39.160 and call and drive. I mean they feel like they 0:03:39.240 --> 0:03:42.360 really relive in those cluttered desks and that they're really 0:03:42.440 --> 0:03:46.400 irritated by the noise. From that first bang of the 0:03:46.440 --> 0:03:50.920 typewriter keys to the final drone of the teletype, you 0:03:51.080 --> 0:03:54.520 just know you're watching something special. Thanks for letting your 0:03:54.560 --> 0:03:55.560 ramble in. 0:03:55.640 --> 0:03:59.080 Bye, Thank you, Amy. Josh My prompt to you about 0:03:59.080 --> 0:04:02.360 the sixth highest Growl film with seventy six, which also 0:04:02.480 --> 0:04:05.800 earned eight Oscar nominations, including Best Picture, winning four of them, 0:04:06.080 --> 0:04:08.640 and did for journalism school what Top Gun would do 0:04:08.720 --> 0:04:11.680 ten years later for naval recruits. My prompt to you 0:04:11.800 --> 0:04:14.440 was going to be simply to challenge you to spot 0:04:14.480 --> 0:04:17.120 the lie. Give me one part of Amy's litany of 0:04:17.160 --> 0:04:19.960 praise that you take issue with. But I do have 0:04:20.160 --> 0:04:23.000 one other thing on my mind. Eight months ago, we 0:04:23.120 --> 0:04:25.680 discussed a classic movie on this show that came out 0:04:25.720 --> 0:04:29.000 ten months prior to Alan Pocula's All the President's Men 0:04:29.120 --> 0:04:33.720 and also garnered a Best Picture nomination, Steven Spielberg's Jaws. 0:04:33.800 --> 0:04:36.880 The review was due to Jaws celebrating its forty fifth anniversary, 0:04:37.120 --> 0:04:39.880 but we had no idea going in just how relevant 0:04:39.880 --> 0:04:43.440 the killer shark movie featuring a dangerous huckster mayor and 0:04:43.600 --> 0:04:47.359 citizens who almost literally on Fourth of July weekend, choose 0:04:47.440 --> 0:04:50.440 liberty over the warnings of experts, would turn out to 0:04:50.440 --> 0:04:54.240 be in June twenty twenty, in contrast, we decided to 0:04:54.279 --> 0:04:56.200 start this seven from seventy six series with All the 0:04:56.200 --> 0:04:59.520 President's Men precisely because of its timeliness. A movie about 0:04:59.560 --> 0:05:01.960 the investmentgation and cover up that led to a president 0:05:02.000 --> 0:05:04.880 resigning in disgrace seemed all too perfect to consider the 0:05:04.920 --> 0:05:06.760 same week the Senate is about to take up an 0:05:06.760 --> 0:05:10.320 impeachment trial. Sadly, we're also talking about All the Presidents Men. 0:05:10.360 --> 0:05:12.880 The same week we learned of the passing of How Hulbrook, 0:05:13.040 --> 0:05:17.799 who plays Bob Woodwards, connected contact known as Deep Throat Jaws, 0:05:18.080 --> 0:05:21.120 one of the most well made thrillers ever, didn't seem timely, 0:05:21.360 --> 0:05:26.039 and terrifyingly was All the President's Men couldn't be more timely? Yet, 0:05:26.560 --> 0:05:28.839 I don't have a single comment or reflection in my 0:05:28.920 --> 0:05:32.760 notes that could be construed as political, only comments about 0:05:32.760 --> 0:05:34.440 the craft. What about you? 0:05:35.360 --> 0:05:38.560 Oh well, let me fill in the gap at him. Okay, No, 0:05:38.720 --> 0:05:41.000 I mean I'm not going to make this as political 0:05:41.040 --> 0:05:43.520 as Jaws. Wow, was that a cathartic review that was 0:05:43.600 --> 0:05:47.880 so much fun? I think it's because, yeah, as watching it, 0:05:48.040 --> 0:05:52.080 All the President's Men largely takes place in a different 0:05:52.120 --> 0:05:55.600 timeframe from where we're at right now. You know, all 0:05:55.600 --> 0:05:57.960 the stuff we're about to get into in real life 0:05:58.720 --> 0:06:01.480 in the next week or so comes after the movie, 0:06:01.560 --> 0:06:04.640 after the credits roll. This is kind of the lead 0:06:04.760 --> 0:06:07.120 up to it is what we're seeing here. And also 0:06:08.160 --> 0:06:12.880 they're very different scandals. You know, they're very different atrocities, 0:06:13.240 --> 0:06:16.800 let's say, committed against democracy. So I don't think there 0:06:16.839 --> 0:06:19.159 are quite as many one to one comparisons. At the 0:06:19.160 --> 0:06:23.040 same time, watching it, you know, you do realize in 0:06:23.080 --> 0:06:28.080 both cases the levels of obfuscation that are at play 0:06:28.440 --> 0:06:36.320 in something like this where you recognize that the malfeasance 0:06:36.520 --> 0:06:40.279 starts at the very top and is directed from the 0:06:40.400 --> 0:06:45.279 very top, but how many layers of protection there are 0:06:45.279 --> 0:06:49.279 put in place? Maybe more so in the time of 0:06:49.560 --> 0:06:51.400 All the President's Men. That's what they have to kind 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:53.880 of investigate their way through, right, is to get to 0:06:53.920 --> 0:06:58.640 the top and maybe the you know, the maddening thing 0:06:58.680 --> 0:07:02.200 about our current situation is that it's so clearly coming 0:07:02.240 --> 0:07:05.480 from the top down. I mean, there is video recorded. 0:07:06.200 --> 0:07:09.000 Anytime you say to an insurrectionist, we love you, I 0:07:09.000 --> 0:07:12.200 think you've got your evidence. So there's a distinction there 0:07:12.680 --> 0:07:14.920 as well. So yeah, I think this isn't quite as 0:07:15.000 --> 0:07:18.200 one to one politically. Maybe the phrase the scene that 0:07:18.240 --> 0:07:20.880 we started out with also has some resonance not very 0:07:20.880 --> 0:07:23.200 bright guys at the top of the show. I mean, 0:07:23.240 --> 0:07:26.440 anytime Adam, the remaining member of your cabinet is the 0:07:26.480 --> 0:07:30.320 my pillow guy, I think we can also say, yeah, 0:07:30.440 --> 0:07:34.440 not very bright guys. But sure, here's another point of 0:07:34.440 --> 0:07:37.720 comparison between the two eras. There are very bright enablers, 0:07:38.280 --> 0:07:43.320 and that is what is scarier than you know, clearly 0:07:43.360 --> 0:07:47.800 scarier than my pillow. Goofball, and you see that this 0:07:47.960 --> 0:07:51.280 is something else that Woodward and Bernstein have to investigate 0:07:51.320 --> 0:07:55.680 their way through, implicate and prove the participation of are 0:07:55.720 --> 0:08:00.960 the enablers, and that we've seen has also a factor 0:08:01.080 --> 0:08:04.600 of our current situation. So yeah, I think there are 0:08:04.640 --> 0:08:07.240 some parallels, inevitably, maybe not as strong as we thought, 0:08:07.280 --> 0:08:10.720 probably not as strong as Jaws. It's not what I 0:08:10.760 --> 0:08:15.200 came away from this movie with, for sure. The first 0:08:15.200 --> 0:08:18.880 thing I came away from this revisit was just a high, 0:08:18.920 --> 0:08:23.120 as you said, Adam, about journalism, just like a giddy 0:08:23.240 --> 0:08:28.640 high about the craft that is that work, the work 0:08:28.680 --> 0:08:31.880 of journalism, and the craft of all the President's men 0:08:32.440 --> 0:08:33.840 to depict and capture it. 0:08:34.120 --> 0:08:34.440 Yeah. 0:08:34.600 --> 0:08:39.280 I had that same giddy high, though less about journalism 0:08:39.559 --> 0:08:43.920 and more about filmmaking. This is just one of those movies. 0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:48.280 No matter how many times I see it, I recognize 0:08:48.320 --> 0:08:50.440 how much I love deep in my bones. And it 0:08:50.480 --> 0:08:53.679 has nothing to do with nostalgia. This isn't about when 0:08:53.760 --> 0:08:55.959 I saw this movie or how I saw it. It's 0:08:56.000 --> 0:08:59.120 not about my relationship really even to the subject matter. 0:08:59.160 --> 0:09:03.120 I'm not talking about an almost famous type situation here. 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:07.199 For me, I am just so pleased with the storytelling, 0:09:07.440 --> 0:09:11.680 which in this case is synonymous with the filmmaking, to 0:09:11.720 --> 0:09:14.559 the point where I almost literally can't keep a smile 0:09:14.640 --> 0:09:18.040 off my face, and I feel a charge because of 0:09:18.200 --> 0:09:21.000 every choice that is being made. And I'll give one 0:09:21.040 --> 0:09:24.000 other example real quick. You know this, I've tweeted about 0:09:24.000 --> 0:09:27.040 it before. It just seems that once a year I'll 0:09:27.120 --> 0:09:29.320 end up putting the Departed on a movie I really 0:09:29.360 --> 0:09:31.400 loved and I think I had as the second best 0:09:31.440 --> 0:09:34.160 movie of that year. But it wasn't necessarily a movie 0:09:34.200 --> 0:09:35.680 I saw at the time and said, oh, this is, 0:09:35.920 --> 0:09:40.080 you know, Pantheon level Scorsese. But there it is on Netflix, 0:09:40.160 --> 0:09:42.240 and Josh, whenever I just kind of need a movie 0:09:42.240 --> 0:09:44.000 on in the background, I just kind of want something 0:09:44.000 --> 0:09:47.080 to distract me maybe occasionally, to take my mind off 0:09:47.080 --> 0:09:49.320 whatever I'm working on. And inevitably with that movie, I 0:09:49.360 --> 0:09:52.160 do get lost in it. And I had that moment 0:09:52.240 --> 0:09:55.960 with The Departed just this past Saturday, and every time 0:09:56.000 --> 0:09:59.320 it happens, annually Sarah will walk in the room and 0:09:59.360 --> 0:10:01.839 she'll shake her because I look like an idiot sitting 0:10:01.840 --> 0:10:04.720 there with a goofy grin plastered on my face and 0:10:05.120 --> 0:10:07.840 a quick sidebar. Anybody who bemoans that movie winning Best 0:10:07.840 --> 0:10:10.920 Picture like it was a lifetime achievement for Scorsese. Sorry, 0:10:11.040 --> 0:10:15.480 couldn't disagree more. Nevertheless, All the President's Men, despite being 0:10:15.480 --> 0:10:20.760 the antithesis of The Departed in so many ways, except 0:10:20.800 --> 0:10:23.559 it is, Josh, if you think about it, a movie 0:10:23.600 --> 0:10:27.520 as well that's about organized crime and corruption. It's obviously 0:10:27.520 --> 0:10:30.200 the way less ostentatious and in your face, it's way more. 0:10:30.280 --> 0:10:33.120 All the Resident Men is deliberately paced. There's no use 0:10:33.160 --> 0:10:37.160 of music or similar use of music on the soundtrack, 0:10:37.360 --> 0:10:39.680 but it's the exact same experience for me. I love 0:10:39.800 --> 0:10:43.679 every single moment of the writing, of the performances, and 0:10:43.720 --> 0:10:45.960 of the direction. And of course this is where the 0:10:46.000 --> 0:10:50.560 filmmaking then crosses over into journalism. This is the ultimate 0:10:50.920 --> 0:10:54.400 procedural procedural in the truest sense. This is a movie 0:10:54.640 --> 0:10:58.400 that is just about the work, and there are so 0:10:58.440 --> 0:11:01.080 many examples we could list. But even going back to 0:11:01.320 --> 0:11:05.160 your political comparison, we don't really get to ever know 0:11:05.520 --> 0:11:09.080 or really even see Richard Nixon as a character in 0:11:09.160 --> 0:11:11.960 this movie. Right except for that very beginning, which I 0:11:12.000 --> 0:11:14.840 had actually somehow forgotten about. I could have sworn all 0:11:14.840 --> 0:11:16.920 the presidents meant, which I just saw in the past year. 0:11:17.000 --> 0:11:19.760 Actually with my kids, I could have sworn it open 0:11:19.920 --> 0:11:22.040 just with the heist, you know, the lights going on, 0:11:22.120 --> 0:11:24.280 the cop finding the door. But we do get that 0:11:24.320 --> 0:11:29.120 little prelude with Nixon giving the State of the Union address, 0:11:29.200 --> 0:11:32.480 But otherwise we only get Nixon information as it relates 0:11:32.520 --> 0:11:35.240 to the post, as it relates to this story these 0:11:35.320 --> 0:11:39.720 journalists are following. There's no real wider philosophical conversations about 0:11:39.760 --> 0:11:43.840 politics or the media, and if there are any conversations 0:11:43.840 --> 0:11:46.280 that skew close to it. It's always in the context 0:11:46.280 --> 0:11:48.560 of what the post is doing and how it affects 0:11:48.559 --> 0:11:51.600 them and the choices they're making, and even that opening 0:11:51.679 --> 0:11:56.679 proper the burglars just going about their work methodically. It's 0:11:56.720 --> 0:12:00.240 all rendered very pragmatically, right. I Pakula doesn't lean into 0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:02.440 the suspense or kind of the coolness of the heightst 0:12:02.559 --> 0:12:05.559 like so many movies do. Here again, there's no music 0:12:05.960 --> 0:12:08.559 underneath it to live in it up even the way 0:12:08.600 --> 0:12:11.480 it's foiled. That security guard just doing his job just 0:12:11.520 --> 0:12:14.080 happens to walk in the door, notices a door is unlocked, 0:12:14.360 --> 0:12:16.920 finds it suspicious that there's some tape over it. And 0:12:17.400 --> 0:12:20.120 I like even that the cops who ultimately arrest the 0:12:20.160 --> 0:12:23.560 burglars don't want to do it, like they're off going 0:12:23.600 --> 0:12:26.320 on some other job and they're playing closed detectives, but 0:12:26.840 --> 0:12:29.280 they're closer to the Watergate and they end up doing it. 0:12:29.840 --> 0:12:31.840 This is obvious to say, but just think about how 0:12:31.920 --> 0:12:34.200 much of the running time of all the Presidents Men 0:12:34.400 --> 0:12:38.520 is about doing the work of journalism, chasing leads, chasing threads, 0:12:38.679 --> 0:12:42.040 sitting at desks, making phone call after phone call after 0:12:42.120 --> 0:12:45.240 phone call, being in the car knocking on doors, just 0:12:45.559 --> 0:12:50.400 relentlessly pursuing any bit of information they can and having 0:12:50.480 --> 0:12:54.280 to secure a certain number of confirmations right before they 0:12:54.400 --> 0:12:56.920 can run a story. There's just this process to it all, 0:12:56.960 --> 0:12:59.400 and we'll get more into the actual craft of it 0:12:59.480 --> 0:13:02.880 and Gordon Willis's cinematography later, I think. But the sheer 0:13:03.000 --> 0:13:07.120 number of shots sitting at desks in the newsroom that 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:11.280 showcase the entire newsroom, all the buzzing in the background, 0:13:11.480 --> 0:13:14.880 the chatter amongst reporters and editors, the phone calls, the typing, 0:13:15.320 --> 0:13:18.959 it all reinforces it and finally, Josh, to get back 0:13:18.960 --> 0:13:21.280 to what you were saying. In terms of the enablers, 0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:28.240 there is obvious brilliance in William Goldman's screenplay, and somehow 0:13:28.240 --> 0:13:32.160 it really wasn't until this time that I recognized just 0:13:32.280 --> 0:13:35.800 how simple it is. And Sophie, my daughter, rewatched this 0:13:35.880 --> 0:13:37.560 movie with me. She loves the movie now too, And 0:13:37.600 --> 0:13:39.120 of course she doesn't have as much of a historical 0:13:39.200 --> 0:13:43.120 relationship to Nixon or Watergate or this film. She doesn't 0:13:43.280 --> 0:13:45.640 know who Haldeman is or Erlickman is, and all the 0:13:45.720 --> 0:13:48.800 names and the different threads these reporters are chasing kind 0:13:48.800 --> 0:13:50.320 of lose her a little bit, and I get it, 0:13:50.679 --> 0:13:53.600 But when you really break it down, this whole movie 0:13:53.679 --> 0:13:57.680 is just about them trying to determine the five names 0:13:57.760 --> 0:14:00.840 who controlled the slush fund, because if they can do that, 0:14:00.960 --> 0:14:03.840 and if one of those five names happens to work 0:14:03.880 --> 0:14:07.360 in the White House, happen to report right to the president, 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:11.800 then that's it. That's that's everything. That's what breaks this 0:14:12.080 --> 0:14:15.000 whole thing wide open, And if you really do follow 0:14:15.000 --> 0:14:17.520 it from start to finish, that's all they're ever doing. 0:14:17.559 --> 0:14:19.640 It's not like they're off on a bunch of different 0:14:19.680 --> 0:14:22.360 tangents trying to take down President Nixon and all of 0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:28.320 his corruption. They're just trying to determine how checks from 0:14:28.320 --> 0:14:30.600 the committee to re elect the president got in the 0:14:30.600 --> 0:14:33.680 hands of Watergate burglars, and it just so happens it 0:14:33.760 --> 0:14:35.000 goes all the way up to the president. 0:14:35.400 --> 0:14:38.240 Yeah. I don't think it's the movie's goal to be 0:14:38.360 --> 0:14:42.440 able to help you trace the line all the way directly. 0:14:43.080 --> 0:14:46.720 This is not a newspaper report. It's a dramatization of 0:14:46.760 --> 0:14:49.400 the report, which seems obvious to say, but I think 0:14:49.680 --> 0:14:53.040 you need to make that distinction because you could come 0:14:53.040 --> 0:14:56.080 away from all the President's men disappointed if you didn't 0:14:56.280 --> 0:14:58.720 have a full understanding of Watergate. I don't think it 0:14:58.760 --> 0:15:01.640 necessarily gives you that. It gives you, as you're saying, 0:15:01.720 --> 0:15:04.200 the broad strokes, the goals of Woodward and Bernstein, and 0:15:04.640 --> 0:15:08.760 crucially how they went about doing their job. I mean 0:15:08.800 --> 0:15:11.320 you could say that Goldman's screenplay kind of you know, 0:15:11.640 --> 0:15:15.600 that last meeting with deep Throat just kind of unravels 0:15:15.640 --> 0:15:18.280 everything for them in a way we don't really see 0:15:18.480 --> 0:15:20.840 right that comes out in all in the montage of 0:15:20.880 --> 0:15:23.880 the ensuing newspaper articles, so we don't see the final 0:15:24.080 --> 0:15:27.400 threads being drawn together. Again, that's not the purpose of 0:15:27.400 --> 0:15:31.080 the movie. So thinking of you smiling while watching this, 0:15:31.840 --> 0:15:36.120 my exact same experience, just sitting there, started smiling very 0:15:36.120 --> 0:15:39.240 soon into it, chuckling at moments. Here's a moment and 0:15:39.240 --> 0:15:40.760 this goes back to how it was sort of a 0:15:40.840 --> 0:15:43.920 journalism high for me. When Woodward is on the phone 0:15:44.400 --> 0:15:46.800 and to my last point, I don't remember exactly who 0:15:46.840 --> 0:15:50.040 this was, but he hears the guy say, I know 0:15:50.080 --> 0:15:51.200 I shouldn't be telling you this. 0:15:51.360 --> 0:15:53.400 That's it, and it's just like it's one of the 0:15:53.440 --> 0:15:54.680 greatest moments. I love movie. 0:15:54.840 --> 0:15:58.040 His face but also just I let out a yeah, 0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:00.480 you know, and that is let me be clear about this, Adam. 0:16:00.600 --> 0:16:04.680 I was never an investigative journalist, okay, but I did 0:16:05.000 --> 0:16:07.320 do my share of real reporting at the beginning of 0:16:07.320 --> 0:16:09.520 my career. Kind of the deal with the devil I 0:16:09.560 --> 0:16:11.640 had to make when I went to my local town 0:16:11.680 --> 0:16:14.880 newspaper said I want to write movie reviews. You don't 0:16:14.920 --> 0:16:17.760 have movie reviews, don't you desperately need movie reviews? And 0:16:17.800 --> 0:16:20.400 the editor was like, yeah, sure, kid, but you know what, 0:16:20.440 --> 0:16:22.480 You're gonna have to go cover the local school board 0:16:22.520 --> 0:16:26.120 for me first, then I'll let you write a movie review. 0:16:26.160 --> 0:16:29.400 So one school board meeting, one movie review. That guy 0:16:29.480 --> 0:16:31.600 his name was rich Parmonar. He's no longer with us, 0:16:31.640 --> 0:16:35.440 but he was like basically the Ben Bradley of weekly 0:16:35.480 --> 0:16:39.120 suburban newspapers. I mean he was so over school, so intense. 0:16:39.320 --> 0:16:42.960 To him, A story about like water rates was Watergate, 0:16:43.040 --> 0:16:45.960 I mean it was it was high stakes in his mind. 0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:49.240 So anyway, that's kind of where I spent a year 0:16:49.320 --> 0:16:52.240 or two doing that stuff, making the phone calls, getting 0:16:52.280 --> 0:16:55.920 hung up on, knocking on enough doors to you know, 0:16:56.320 --> 0:16:59.400 get exactly what you needed. And it was never in 0:16:59.480 --> 0:17:02.080 my block, like I knew how to do that, and 0:17:02.120 --> 0:17:04.439 I could do it. I wasn't as passionate about it 0:17:04.480 --> 0:17:09.040 as I was about movies, obviously, but just remembering those 0:17:09.080 --> 0:17:12.000 experiences and going on to work in larger newsrooms where 0:17:12.000 --> 0:17:15.200 there were real reporters two deaths over and I could 0:17:15.200 --> 0:17:19.840 hear them making those calls to bigger politicians and knowing 0:17:19.880 --> 0:17:22.520 what was going on. It was such a thrill to 0:17:22.600 --> 0:17:24.440 be re immersed in that. And I think a part 0:17:24.480 --> 0:17:26.480 of it is just the fact that and here we 0:17:26.520 --> 0:17:29.840 can move to the craft. It's so tactile, it's so 0:17:30.000 --> 0:17:35.240 carefully observed, it's so knowing, and it's so analog. I mean, 0:17:35.280 --> 0:17:39.359 I think it is crucial that this movie came out 0:17:39.440 --> 0:17:41.879 and is capturing a time that was pre digital for 0:17:41.920 --> 0:17:46.000 the most part, because it really just emphasized not that 0:17:46.080 --> 0:17:49.000 it's necessarily quote unquote easier to do this kind of 0:17:49.040 --> 0:17:53.159 work now, but you've got a lot more tools and 0:17:53.200 --> 0:17:56.600 there are a lot more resources then having to go 0:17:56.640 --> 0:17:58.879 into the you know, here's another thing that I just 0:17:59.040 --> 0:18:01.879 chuckled that when Wood where it has to go down 0:18:01.960 --> 0:18:04.720 to the library and pull out the phone books, the 0:18:04.720 --> 0:18:06.760 actual phone books. 0:18:06.520 --> 0:18:09.000 And I actually said to Sophie, have you ever actually 0:18:09.000 --> 0:18:10.600 even used a phone book exactly? 0:18:11.000 --> 0:18:14.040 And that was part of the work, that was part 0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:17.200 of the job. So yeah, this is just such a 0:18:17.280 --> 0:18:20.600 joy to watch. And speaking of the newsroom, here's where 0:18:21.480 --> 0:18:23.600 you're right in how you describe all the President's men 0:18:23.720 --> 0:18:27.400 as being restrained in terms of filmmaking and not flashy. 0:18:27.680 --> 0:18:31.240 But this is a movie that uses multiple split diopter shots. 0:18:31.320 --> 0:18:33.560 Oh yeah, we're going to get there, and most of. 0:18:33.440 --> 0:18:36.960 Them are of Woodward just working on the phone. I 0:18:37.000 --> 0:18:39.000 think there's one of him in a phone booth as well, 0:18:39.040 --> 0:18:41.640 a payphone booth outside, but most of them are at 0:18:41.680 --> 0:18:44.920 his desk, and then he's in focus in the foreground, 0:18:44.960 --> 0:18:47.720 and then in the background is that newsroom in focus, 0:18:47.800 --> 0:18:51.119 the people, the other phones, the piles of paper on 0:18:51.280 --> 0:18:53.679 the desks. And for me, that not only provided this 0:18:53.760 --> 0:18:57.800 tactile context I'm talking about, but it also captured the 0:18:57.960 --> 0:19:00.680 laser focus you got to have if you're on deadline, 0:19:00.720 --> 0:19:03.240 just absolute laser focus. There might be a bigger story 0:19:03.280 --> 0:19:05.399 going on behind you. And I think there is a 0:19:05.440 --> 0:19:08.800 split diapter shot where I don't remember exactly what it is, 0:19:08.840 --> 0:19:11.320 but everyone else in the newsroom is gathered around a television. 0:19:11.800 --> 0:19:15.159 That story at that point was probably bigger than the 0:19:15.160 --> 0:19:18.560 one Wouldward was working on. But for him, it doesn't matter. 0:19:18.920 --> 0:19:21.639 Your story, the one that's due in twenty minutes is 0:19:21.720 --> 0:19:24.639 the biggest story of your life. And the split diapter 0:19:24.720 --> 0:19:29.600 shot captures that intensity in just an amazing way that 0:19:29.880 --> 0:19:32.760 is not flashy but so crucial. 0:19:33.240 --> 0:19:33.440 Yeah. 0:19:33.480 --> 0:19:36.119 And I know there are people out there listening right 0:19:36.160 --> 0:19:39.680 now who probably work in newsrooms and are journalists, and 0:19:39.720 --> 0:19:41.679 maybe they will completely contradict me on this, but it 0:19:41.680 --> 0:19:45.000 occurs to me, Josh, that as you talk about the 0:19:45.160 --> 0:19:48.560 analog world of all the President's men, I wonder how 0:19:48.640 --> 0:19:53.600 different the Washington Post newsroom in nineteen seventy two and 0:19:53.680 --> 0:19:58.000 nineteen seventy four was compared to the Washington Post newsroom now, 0:19:58.040 --> 0:20:00.680 a world in which we're all texting all the time, 0:20:00.920 --> 0:20:03.440 in which we're communicating even in the office when we're 0:20:03.480 --> 0:20:07.680 a few feet from each other via Slack some other platform. 0:20:07.760 --> 0:20:10.200 So that all ties back to me to another aspect 0:20:10.240 --> 0:20:13.520 of the craft here, which is how sensory it is 0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:16.359 and the use of sound. And let's go ahead and 0:20:16.359 --> 0:20:18.080 give credit. I didn't know this until I looked it 0:20:18.160 --> 0:20:21.840 up today. It won the Oscar for Best Sound Mixing 0:20:22.160 --> 0:20:25.560 in nineteen seventy seven. Arthur planted do Se Dick. Alexander 0:20:25.640 --> 0:20:31.160 less fresholts, what a remarkable job with this movie, because 0:20:31.600 --> 0:20:35.520 all it does is just kind of hum in the background, 0:20:35.640 --> 0:20:38.720 sometimes more noticeable than others, but it's always there, just 0:20:39.040 --> 0:20:42.680 adding tension. You're leaning in to hear it. Those sounds 0:20:42.760 --> 0:20:45.880 evoke the anxiety the characters are feeling. I'm thinking even 0:20:45.920 --> 0:20:49.919 of like the sounds in the courtroom when Woodward goes 0:20:50.000 --> 0:20:52.560 and he's bugging the guy, the lawyer, who says, it 0:20:52.800 --> 0:20:54.240 just got really there. It's so great. 0:20:54.359 --> 0:20:55.560 Excuse me, what is your name? 0:20:57.720 --> 0:21:01.000 I'm Bob Woodward in the Washington Post. 0:21:01.560 --> 0:21:04.760 Mark them, Markham, mark them. Are you hearing connection with 0:21:04.800 --> 0:21:05.679 the Water Bay burglary? 0:21:07.680 --> 0:21:08.280 I'm not here? 0:21:12.080 --> 0:21:16.760 Okay, well, clearly I am here. 0:21:18.040 --> 0:21:20.400 It only as an individual, were not as the attorney 0:21:20.400 --> 0:21:20.920 of record. 0:21:21.200 --> 0:21:21.680 Who is. 0:21:23.200 --> 0:21:24.000 Mister Starkey? 0:21:25.720 --> 0:21:27.159 Do you have any whatever you. 0:21:27.040 --> 0:21:29.920 Want you don't have to get from him. I have 0:21:30.040 --> 0:21:31.600 nothing more to say. 0:21:32.640 --> 0:21:35.720 The way they shoot the moments when the judge is 0:21:35.760 --> 0:21:39.680 talking and when the burglars come before him is from 0:21:39.880 --> 0:21:42.840 their point of view, so we can't really hear what's 0:21:42.880 --> 0:21:45.680