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Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways is not supported by carnivorous butterflies. Instead, it's

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Speaker 1: supported by the generous donations of our listeners on Patreon.

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Speaker 1: Visit patreon dot com slash thinking sideways to learn more

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Speaker 1: and thanks Thinking Sideways. I don't understand you never know

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Speaker 1: stories of things we simply don't know the answer too. Well.

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Speaker 1: Hello there, welcome again to another episode of Thinking Sideways.

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Speaker 1: I'm Joe, joined as always by my co hosts Devin

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Speaker 1: and Steve. So you guys ready to talk about a mystery? Yeah? Sweet? Yeah, yes,

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Speaker 1: we haven't done in a while. Yeah you like this

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Speaker 1: one's got lots of it. It's been literally days, has

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Speaker 1: been hasn't been a week now? Yeah? Okay, Well, so

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Speaker 1: this week we haven't done a nice bloody one for

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Speaker 1: a while, so you're gonna make us do a bloody one.

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Speaker 1: We're going to talk about the Atlanta Ripper, uh serial

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Speaker 1: killer in the early twentieth century that probably most of

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Speaker 1: you have not heard about. I hadn't beforehand. I didn't

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Speaker 1: hear about this until pretty recently. Actually, how did you

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Speaker 1: hear about it? I don't remember. Look a like mysteries

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Speaker 1: that will make you like poop your pants, probably something

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Speaker 1: like that. I was doing some random googling, just looking

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Speaker 1: for fund new mysteries, and I don't I don't remember

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Speaker 1: to tell you the truth exactly where I stumbled across

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Speaker 1: this one somewhere, but yeah, that was kind of interesting. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so the Atlanta Ripper, um, the Atlanta Ripper murdered a

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Speaker 1: bunch of people, actually young women, uh in the year's

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Speaker 1: nineteen ten. Some say through nineteen twelve. Others say through

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Speaker 1: late nineteen eleven. He killed more people than Jack the Ripper,

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Speaker 1: but Jack gets all the glory. Everybody knows who Jack

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Speaker 1: the Ripper is. We did an episode on Jack the Ripper.

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Speaker 1: We actually did. Yeah, it eventually got big enough to

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Speaker 1: make the national news. The New York Times May twelfth,

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Speaker 1: nineteen twelve said, quote Jack the Ripper and quote claimed

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Speaker 1: his twentieth woman victim Atlanta sometime last night. The Blacks,

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Speaker 1: who are in a state of terror and try to

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Speaker 1: keep their women off the street at night, have offered

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Speaker 1: a large reward for the arrest of the murderer. I

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Speaker 1: didn't mention this. The Ripper only killed black women, so

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Speaker 1: they called him Jack the Ripper, even in Atlanta, and

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Speaker 1: they did. They did go and Jack the ripper. Yeah. Interesting, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and eventually got one that all this national attention started happening. Um, eventually,

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Speaker 1: you know a lot of the city's leading leading commerce

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Speaker 1: leaders and politicians and everything started pressuring the mayor, who

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Speaker 1: started pressuring the police to actually get serious about this

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Speaker 1: because apparently the Atlanta police, I mean, it's not like

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Speaker 1: they didn't investigate, but you know, I kind of doubt

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Speaker 1: they were working as hard as if it had been

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Speaker 1: white women who have been getting killed. Probably gonna say,

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Speaker 1: this is nineteen eleven. Yeah, it's a very racially segregated

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Speaker 1: area and not even just nared just a time in

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Speaker 1: this country, and so their priorities were very reflective of that. Well,

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Speaker 1: not to like spark up political debate, I'm just gonna

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Speaker 1: like one off say, even now in America, oftentimes crimes

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Speaker 1: against minorities are not as investigated as crimes against white people.

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Speaker 1: There is a different effort level. It does appear, sometimes

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Speaker 1: not always, but the fact that that still remains as

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Speaker 1: testament to how how incredible it must have been, you know,

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Speaker 1: in the early ninets. I and I that also makes

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Speaker 1: me want to point something out to our listeners, because

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Speaker 1: I know that there are some quotes as we're going

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Speaker 1: to go through this, and some of that stuff is

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Speaker 1: very reflective at the times. So please, if we're we'll

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Speaker 1: tell you when we're quoting something, but just be aware

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Speaker 1: of that we're different us. Don't worry. Yeah, alright, here's

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Speaker 1: what's known about the Ripper, at least if you go

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Speaker 1: out and look up the Ripper on the web. He

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Speaker 1: killed his victims every Saturday night like clockwork, and there

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Speaker 1: he bashed him over the head, and then he would

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Speaker 1: drag them into the book and cut their throats and

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Speaker 1: then he would from yeah, from ear to ear, and

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Speaker 1: then he would eviscerate and cut cutting out their lady parts. Like. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was hard, right, because all of the articles from

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Speaker 1: the time are very polite. Yeah, none of them ever

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Speaker 1: say anything explicitly, So they say, you know, cutting out parts,

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Speaker 1: and you're like, what does I don't know what that means.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Yeah, yeah, well, actually I think I know

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Speaker 1: what I'm supposed to infer from that, but I don't know. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: but you know, actually, it turns out the Atlanta Ripper

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Speaker 1: didn't slice up on his victim and take organs out. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he just bashed them over the head with a rock

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Speaker 1: or a brick and then would slit their throats. In

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Speaker 1: one case, this is the last really confirmed victim, he

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Speaker 1: did actually remove the victim's heart. Yeah, yeah, but it

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Speaker 1: was the last case, right, probably the last case, so

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Speaker 1: likely the highest escalation that we will have seen. Probably. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: And we don't actually know how many women he killed.

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Speaker 1: And besides that, one other thing that's not true is

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Speaker 1: that killings actually did not happen on Saturdays most of

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Speaker 1: the time. And actually it's it's really hard to say

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Speaker 1: exactly when some of them did happen because in some

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Speaker 1: cases the body was not actually found for a few days,

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Speaker 1: and back in those days of the state of medical

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Speaker 1: science was not such as it is today, you know,

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Speaker 1: they really and even today it's kind of vague sometimes. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: if a body has been sitting out for several days,

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Speaker 1: it makes it a little more difficult to pin down

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Speaker 1: an exact time of death, especially especially in a hot

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Speaker 1: place like Atlanta pace. Yeah. Yeah, uh so we don't

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Speaker 1: really know that all of them were killed on Saturdays. Again,

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Speaker 1: we don't know how many women that the ripper murdered.

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Speaker 1: What's the what's the there's a number here. I know

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Speaker 1: that there's there's a range that are believed to be

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Speaker 1: committed by the Atlanta Ripper. Yeah, if you talk to

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Speaker 1: if you read the papers, there's something between nineteen and

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Speaker 1: twenty one. Okay, because I remember being like hugely high

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Speaker 1: and I was, how how have we not heard this? Yeah? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's a lot more than Jack the Ripper. You know,

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Speaker 1: of course Jack the Ripper was killing white people, so

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Speaker 1: maybe that's why you know, it's still a well known thing.

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Speaker 1: And also there actually is more documentation about Jack the

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Speaker 1: Ripper than there is about this guy. That didn't really

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Speaker 1: surprise me that much. Yes, yeah, so I guess our

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Speaker 1: mystery here as well, Who was the Ripper? How many

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Speaker 1: people did he really kill? And he actually even exist?

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Speaker 1: Because at the time the killings were happening, this is

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Speaker 1: between late nineteen ten and mid nineteen twelve, a lot

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Speaker 1: of people in Atlanta didn't think there actually was a

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Speaker 1: serial killer and all this head bashing and throat slashing

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Speaker 1: was just random murders happening. Well, and there was a

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Speaker 1: there was a number of cases that were attributed as

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Speaker 1: being Ripper cases that it was really There was a

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Speaker 1: lot of assumptions made to say that the m O

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Speaker 1: was the same. Yeah, I think that I think that

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Speaker 1: usually connected, is what I'm trying to say. Yeah, the press,

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Speaker 1: I think the Atlanta press, I think started going back

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Speaker 1: and adding sort of adding people in to really juice

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Speaker 1: up the story. And a lot of a lot of

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Speaker 1: these nineteen one victims were victims of gunshot wounds, uh

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Speaker 1: and stuff like that, and so there was stabbings. There

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Speaker 1: was stabbings, but not throat slidding and all that. So

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Speaker 1: it doesn't necessarily mean it wasn't him. I mean, maybe

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Speaker 1: you'd like to mix up his m O a little bit.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. But at the same time, a big

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Speaker 1: city like Atlanta, murders are going to happen anyway, even

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Speaker 1: you don't even if you don't have a ripper on

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Speaker 1: the loose. So anyway, I talked to a guy named

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Speaker 1: Vance McLoughlin, retired professor of Criminal Justice, and he he

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Speaker 1: wrote a paper on the ripper with Robert being the

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Speaker 1: third And you guys have seen that paper, right, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I guess, like, yeah, no, that was that study was

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Speaker 1: actually really really well done. It was, yeah, it was.

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Speaker 1: He's he's pretty thorough guy. But anyway, he and being

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Speaker 1: looked at the nineteen victims and because they're one when

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Speaker 1: we're referring to one the most. Most of the papers

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Speaker 1: even think that the murders ended in mid nineteen twelve,

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Speaker 1: but there are some people who claim that there was

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Speaker 1: another murder in nineteen thirteen and another one in nineteen fourteen,

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Speaker 1: So that's where generally believe those were just on. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so we're gonna start at the number nineteen. They went

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Speaker 1: to all the information they went to like newspaper archives,

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Speaker 1: looked at death certificates and all that, and they managed

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Speaker 1: to remove all the eight from the list, although there's

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Speaker 1: one of them. I'm questioning a little bit. I was.

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Speaker 1: I was thinking I might add it back in, but

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Speaker 1: I'm not really sure. It's got on defense about that

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Speaker 1: it might be a copycat killing. In fact, there's probably

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Speaker 1: a good good I was gonna say this, this case,

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Speaker 1: because of the publicity, lended itself to have a lot

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Speaker 1: of copycasts. But not at first. Well, I'm talking about

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Speaker 1: it in the in the in the height of it,

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Speaker 1: you know, from from midway on it was would have

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Speaker 1: been such an easy situation for somebody to just do

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Speaker 1: what they thought it was going to be, and it

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Speaker 1: just gets lumped in. Yeah, but yeah, we've got And

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Speaker 1: there was one person I'm going to talk about a

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Speaker 1: little later on who actually had the clever idea to

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Speaker 1: go murder arrival. She she she kind of got busted

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Speaker 1: and didn't succeed in her crime. But I'll tell you

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Speaker 1: about that. Yeah. Uh. Also getting back to Professor Mittal

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Speaker 1: Offlin again. Um, he writes and researches about his story

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Speaker 1: and obscure serial killers, and he's done a lot of

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Speaker 1: research in the Atlanta Ripper, I think more than anybody really.

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Speaker 1: I managed to track him down and I gave him

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Speaker 1: a call, and mostly because I wanted to confirm myke

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Speaker 1: my claim that the Ripper didn't mutilate his victims and

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Speaker 1: the Saturday night thing too, and he and he did

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Speaker 1: confirm that, Yeah, there was no mutilation and it wasn't

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Speaker 1: like clockwork or anything like that. That sometimes there would

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Speaker 1: be months in between killings, and there was a period

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Speaker 1: in mid nineteen eleven where there was for about four

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Speaker 1: murders came along about once a week. That's and that's

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Speaker 1: where it's every Saturday Night I think came because it

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Speaker 1: was about a week apart. Yeah. Anyway, Yeah, the Professor

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Speaker 1: was a was a real nice guy. And we had

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Speaker 1: a nice talk because we don't we both like to

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Speaker 1: talk about murdering Mayhem. Yeah, he was friends and influencing people.

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Speaker 1: I know, I know, I know. I he was like

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Speaker 1: telling me about this this crime that some crimer or other.

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Speaker 1: I can't remember even not what the crime was. It's

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Speaker 1: not the Atlanta Ripper. And and then that reminded me

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Speaker 1: of Jeremy Bamber. So I was like, I was like, hey,

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Speaker 1: have you ever heard of Jeremy bamber case. He said, no,

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Speaker 1: tell me about it, you know. So I told him

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Speaker 1: about that. I think he's probably gonna check it out,

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Speaker 1: that that's the juicy case. Yeah. Yeah, And we would

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Speaker 1: just going that baton mysteries back and forth like that.

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Speaker 1: But I also wanted to mention the professor's written two books.

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Speaker 1: I told him he didn't ask you too, but I

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Speaker 1: told him I would give him a plug for his book. So,

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Speaker 1: oh yeah for the healthy gave Yeah, yeah yeah, and

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Speaker 1: uh so as two books are about serial killers. One

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Speaker 1: is called The Postcard Killer. He's about about a pedophile

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Speaker 1: and serial killer named j. Frank Hickey Um and he

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Speaker 1: was finally arrested in nineteen twelve died in prison in

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Speaker 1: ninety two and why he didn't get strung up. It's

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Speaker 1: kind of a mystery to me because the guy's crimes.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if you've read about this guy. Yeah, yeah, yea.

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Speaker 1: The criming got caught for is uh he lured a

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Speaker 1: seven year old boy with promises of going to a

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Speaker 1: candy store, took him to an outhoud. Is gonna be heinous, Oh,

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Speaker 1: it's heinous. It's gonna gets more heinous. Well, he so

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Speaker 1: he rapes a little boy, strangles him, stuff them down

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Speaker 1: in the outhouse, and then eighteen days later, the chief

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Speaker 1: of police in this town gets a postcard basically saying

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Speaker 1: where you can find the body, and he sends he

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Speaker 1: sends two cops around to check the outhouse. Oh, I

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Speaker 1: forgot to mention. After he murdered the little boy, he

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Speaker 1: went into the saloon and started drinking. That's palsy um.

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Speaker 1: So anyway, the cops did not see the body down there.

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Speaker 1: Apparently some other people who come along go figure eighteen

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Speaker 1: days later and the body was covered with something. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: body didn't get fine found until like a year later. Well,

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Speaker 1: so many time the boys, the little boys still missing.

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Speaker 1: His parents are of course, are quite anguished about it.

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Speaker 1: He started sending postcards to to the parents, taunting them.

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Speaker 1: It's a common sentiment with psychopaths. Yeah, well, actually there's

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Speaker 1: I can't think of a single case where somebody has

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Speaker 1: sent postcards to the family of their victims. There a

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Speaker 1: number of things that I've read about where people have

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Speaker 1: been sending stuff to the families. It's a terrible, terrible thing.

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Speaker 1: I don't understand why he didn't get the death penal

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Speaker 1: team that. Anyway. That book is The Postcard Killer, and

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Speaker 1: the other book that he's written is called The Mail

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Speaker 1: Order Serial Killer, and then about it's about a guy

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Speaker 1: named Harry Powers who it is thought to have killed

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Speaker 1: as many as fifty people. And he did get strung up.

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Speaker 1: He was let's see when it was. I think it

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Speaker 1: was caught in nineteen late nineteen one and put on trial,

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Speaker 1: and he was strung up about six seven months later

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Speaker 1: in early nine two. A fair and speedy trial. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: they didn't waste a lot of time back in those days.

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Speaker 1: Uh So, Anyways, enough of that. I haven't read the

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Speaker 1: books yet. They get good reviews on Amazon, except for

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Speaker 1: one guy is one guy who ordered The Postcard Killer.

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Speaker 1: And there's another book out there called The post Killers

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Speaker 1: by James Patterson. You know that guy who writes a

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Speaker 1: lot of crime novels. Yeah, I guess, I guess he

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Speaker 1: was wanting to get that book he actually done ordered

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Speaker 1: The Postcard Killer. He ordered this one instead, and he

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Speaker 1: posted a one star review because he was so he

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Speaker 1: was because he got the wrong book because he ordered

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Speaker 1: because it's like, yeah, this is a bone head. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: The other reviews are five star reviews. Okay, yeah, yeah, anyway,

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Speaker 1: I back back to our our Atlantic killings. H. McLoughlin

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Speaker 1: and being took two of the victims off the list

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Speaker 1: because they died of gunshot wounds. Yeah not really. One was.

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Speaker 1: Their throat was slashed, but she was thrown into the

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Speaker 1: river afterwards, and so that one I didn't match. It

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Speaker 1: doesn't quite match. CMO was to bash him in the head,

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Speaker 1: cut their drag him somewhere secluded, and then cut their throats.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, another victim and added her skull crush, but

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Speaker 1: her throat was not slit. Another one was stabbed in

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Speaker 1: the throat and um for those were eliminated because someone

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Speaker 1: other than the ripper had been convicted for killing them.

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Speaker 1: Two more were eliminated because they were probable suspects, and

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Speaker 1: but one of them is the one that I was

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Speaker 1: thinking maybe possibly should be on the list. But that

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Speaker 1: could also be the copycat killing that I was talking about.

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Speaker 1: So anyway, they neared a way down to a still

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Speaker 1: still a pretty decent amount of people. It's still quite

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Speaker 1: a number of people for one person say it's more

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Speaker 1: than I plan on killing. I was just saying I

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Speaker 1: haven't gotten a killing yet, not me neither. Yeah, despite

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Speaker 1: all of your hard work, you know how hard it

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Speaker 1: is to kill people from my office chair. It's really difficult.

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Speaker 1: I don't lift a finger and they don't die, and

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Speaker 1: it's really sith. Yeah, this is there's no working out.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, but the problem is is with with committing

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Speaker 1: murders unless you go out and the totally randomly kill somebody,

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Speaker 1: if you kill somebody because you're highly motivated to murder them,

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Speaker 1: and that's kind of points a finger back at you. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: so probably never gonna kill anybody. So I don't like blood.

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Speaker 1: So I also mentioned, didn't mention this one person saw

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Speaker 1: the ripper and lived to tell the tale. Yeah that

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Speaker 1: was Emma Lou Sharp. She described him as a tall

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Speaker 1: black man with broad shoulders, wearing a black suit and

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Speaker 1: a wide brimmed hat. Uh. There was one other account

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Speaker 1: that I read said another woman named Mary Adell had

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Speaker 1: met the ripper. She left her employer's lists and went

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Speaker 1: out in the alley and she saw a tall black man.

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Speaker 1: I think this was right after the reports in the

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Speaker 1: newspapers from Emily Lou Sharp seeing a tall black man.

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Speaker 1: She goes out of the alley, sees a tall black

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Speaker 1: man and runs back inside and tells her employer. He

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Speaker 1: goes out and confronts the guy. The guy just left,

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Speaker 1: but he had a gun. The the employer went out

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Speaker 1: with a gun. Well, yeah, and just because he was

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Speaker 1: tall and black doesn't really make him the ripper. When

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Speaker 1: you see somebody run into the where I think he

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Speaker 1: was in an alleyway, right, Yeah, run into the alleyway

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Speaker 1: brandishing a firearm. I'm gonna leave. I'm gonna leave it

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Speaker 1: as well. Yeah. So you know, Emma Lose the only

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Speaker 1: one who saw him and lived to tell. But because

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Speaker 1: she got attacked, she did get attacked. Yeah, she got

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Speaker 1: stabbed in the stabbed in the back. Yeah. Yeah. So

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Speaker 1: I'll talk about that in a minute here, just in

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Speaker 1: in chronological order. We'll talk about the murders. First one

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Speaker 1: was October three, nineteen ten. That was Maggie Brooks, Stage

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Speaker 1: twenty three, walking home from work one night and somebody

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Speaker 1: bashed her on the head and and slit her throughout.

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Speaker 1: And then months later rose a Trice her body was

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Speaker 1: found really close to her house, like about seventy five

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Speaker 1: yards away. This is but three or two months later,

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Speaker 1: So yeah, January nineteen eleven, two months Yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I'll tell you. Let's see, and I say, bore more

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Speaker 1: like three and a half months, but you know whatever.

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Speaker 1: Her husband was arrested for this. He was released for

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Speaker 1: lack of evidence. Um and that it does fit the

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Speaker 1: m O pretty well. Next up, Made seven, nineteen eleven,

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Speaker 1: Mary Walker, age unknown. Her body was actually found in

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Speaker 1: the rear of her home. She had left her job

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Speaker 1: as a cook the previous night, and I'm guessing that

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Speaker 1: the ripper followed her home. And people say, I'm not

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Speaker 1: sure what these accounts mean, that she was actually in

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Speaker 1: her home or in the yard behind her home. I'm

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Speaker 1: not totally sure. Every time I read it, I got

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Speaker 1: the impression that she was outside. Yeah, it never I

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Speaker 1: never got the idea that the ripper was killing people

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Speaker 1: inside of their home. Yeah, I don't think so. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't think. I don't think. I don't think so.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a heck of a lot more work

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Speaker 1: than he was up for. Yeah, I think so. Uh So. Anyway,

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Speaker 1: still at this time, there's still months going by, but

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Speaker 1: now it's sped up a little bit. Next one was

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Speaker 1: June nineteen eleven, so you know a little over two

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Speaker 1: weeks later. That was Addie Watts and she'd been hit

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Speaker 1: with a brick instead of a rock and then dragged

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Speaker 1: into the bushes and her throat was cut. Next up, June,

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Speaker 1: only nine days later, Lizzie Watkins SMMO she was hit

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Speaker 1: with a rock row cut. And then came Lena Sharp.

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Speaker 1: That's Emma Lou Sharp's mother mother. Yeah. There are two

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Speaker 1: versions of this. The version, the version you hear the

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Speaker 1: most is that Lena had gone to the store and

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Speaker 1: when she hadn't come back in about an hour, Emma

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Speaker 1: Lou got worried and went looking for and went to

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Speaker 1: the store and she hadn't been to the store. So

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Speaker 1: she's walking back home. We're frantically worried about her mother.

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Speaker 1: And this runs into this black guy, tall, black guy,

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Speaker 1: broad shoulders and all that stuff, and and he said

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Speaker 1: to her, how are you feeling tonight? And she said

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Speaker 1: she was feeling fine, and she tried to walk past him,

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Speaker 1: and he says, don't be afraid. I never hurt girls

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Speaker 1: like you, and then stabbed her in the back and

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Speaker 1: laugh was a great joke. Yeah, I don't think that's

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Speaker 1: a joke at all. Yeah, it's sick. Yeah. Yeah. And

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Speaker 1: and of course the body of her mother was found

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Speaker 1: not too much longer after that. The second the second version,

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Speaker 1: I forgot to mention, by the way, that first story

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Speaker 1: was from the Atlantic Constitution, and there were several papers

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Speaker 1: in Atlanta at the time. Yeah. Yeah, the ex version

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Speaker 1: is from the Atlanta Journal. And this version of it,

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Speaker 1: Lena and Emily were out walking and then he together, yeah, together,

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Speaker 1: and he jumped out of the bushes. He hits Lena

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Speaker 1: on the head with a brick, and then she's she's

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Speaker 1: knocked unconscious. So he starts slashing at Emma lou who

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Speaker 1: screams and runs but faints from blood loss because apparently

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Speaker 1: he did connect a few times and then and then

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Speaker 1: she ran off. The ripper cuts Lena's throat and then

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Speaker 1: follows Emma lou She wakes up and finds him standing

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Speaker 1: over her with a knife. But then the sounds of

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Speaker 1: people running, footsteps and everything. People came running, and so

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Speaker 1: he took off into the darkness. So one of two stories,

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Speaker 1: you know, I'm inclined to believe the first one. The

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Speaker 1: second one sounds like it's from a John Gresham novel.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's just just it's just perfect. Oh that

375
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Speaker 1: the high tension of it all, Like it just sounds

376
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Speaker 1: like he is a reporter running off his little deal.

377
00:19:58,240 --> 00:20:00,600
Speaker 1: I don't know, you don't think that him say don't worry,

378
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Speaker 1: I never hurt girls like you, and then stabbing her

379
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Speaker 1: in the back and laughing. That's not out of a

380
00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:10,200
Speaker 1: John Grisham novel. Like that's not so you think that's

381
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Speaker 1: more believable. I do, really dicer Manson saying that as

382
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Speaker 1: he walked by you on the street. I mean, I

383
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Speaker 1: just think this the second one sounds more like his

384
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Speaker 1: m O. You know that he like passed her over

385
00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:24,480
Speaker 1: the head and then was standing over her, and she

386
00:20:24,560 --> 00:20:28,520
Speaker 1: happened to come to, but he never attacked a pair

387
00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:31,840
Speaker 1: of all of the cases that of the that we

388
00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:35,520
Speaker 1: there are, this this central core eight murders that are

389
00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:39,720
Speaker 1: believed that he attributing they're always alone, so this is

390
00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:43,480
Speaker 1: a real jump. She was alone too, You mean it's

391
00:20:43,520 --> 00:20:47,639
Speaker 1: just single a night by themselves, one at a time,

392
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Speaker 1: alone walking down the street. I don't know she was

393
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Speaker 1: alone walking down the street. No, No, it was her

394
00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:58,880
Speaker 1: and her mother walking together in the second version version, Yeah,

395
00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:01,480
Speaker 1: which is the one you're saying that you find more plausible.

396
00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:05,760
Speaker 1: But I don't know. I just I think the m

397
00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:09,800
Speaker 1: O of that second one sounds more plausible. Well but

398
00:21:09,800 --> 00:21:12,119
Speaker 1: but okay, so, but so why not keep in mind

399
00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:14,919
Speaker 1: why not both keep in mind that Emma lou is

400
00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:18,600
Speaker 1: the mother, correct, was the daughter? Okay, so it's Lena.

401
00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:22,320
Speaker 1: Lena was hit in the head with a rock, and

402
00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:25,800
Speaker 1: she did have her slow or her throat slit, and

403
00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:28,880
Speaker 1: she was drug away from where it appears she was hit.

404
00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:32,600
Speaker 1: So that's consistent with the m O, right, I think that. Yeah.

405
00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:34,320
Speaker 1: The other thing about it is is I don't think

406
00:21:34,359 --> 00:21:37,439
Speaker 1: he would have stuck around to slit Lena's throats. If

407
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:40,120
Speaker 1: Emma los running away there's a witness. Yeah, you gotta

408
00:21:40,160 --> 00:21:42,320
Speaker 1: go catch her and bash her head in and then

409
00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:46,240
Speaker 1: you're gonna do all the throat slit and part of that. Yeah.

410
00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:48,920
Speaker 1: But anyway, after that, after Lena's or sees Me, after

411
00:21:48,960 --> 00:21:51,600
Speaker 1: Emma Lose account hit the papers and everybody had heard

412
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Speaker 1: of the description of the killer, we had our first

413
00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:58,440
Speaker 1: confirmed attempt at a copycat killing. Yeah. Yeah, it's somebody

414
00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:02,680
Speaker 1: named Katie Cochrane. Um. She wanted to murder her husband's girlfriend.

415
00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:06,280
Speaker 1: Who doesn't Yeah, I know, I know. Her name was

416
00:22:06,320 --> 00:22:10,560
Speaker 1: Maddie Alexander. So Mrs Cochrane was tall, so she figured

417
00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:12,359
Speaker 1: she could pass herself off as a ripper. So she

418
00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:14,720
Speaker 1: dressed herself up in a black suit and a wide brim,

419
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:17,719
Speaker 1: stets and hat and then over yeah, and then went

420
00:22:17,760 --> 00:22:20,679
Speaker 1: over to Maddie's house with a straight razor. And by

421
00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:22,800
Speaker 1: the way, you know, the whole thing about about him

422
00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:24,680
Speaker 1: boring a black suit and the why white brim had

423
00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:27,360
Speaker 1: he probably didn't necessarily wear the same costume every time,

424
00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:29,680
Speaker 1: you know, all the one person saw him one time.

425
00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:31,440
Speaker 1: I mean, he might have mixed up his boardrobe a

426
00:22:31,480 --> 00:22:36,119
Speaker 1: little bit. So anyway, he goes over to Maddie's. It

427
00:22:36,119 --> 00:22:39,480
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. Yeah, it doesn't matter. Okay, Now what I

428
00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:42,359
Speaker 1: was just gonna say, Like in the early it's not

429
00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:45,680
Speaker 1: as though people had like extensive wardrobes, clothes where it's

430
00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:48,080
Speaker 1: not as though you had a closet full of clothes.

431
00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:50,160
Speaker 1: You had different I mean there was a thing. There

432
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:52,159
Speaker 1: was such a thing as having different collar pieces. You

433
00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:54,560
Speaker 1: were replaced the collar on your shirt because that was

434
00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:57,080
Speaker 1: what would get dirty and sweaty. You would wear the

435
00:22:57,080 --> 00:23:00,200
Speaker 1: same shirt, the same suit jacket, the same pants really

436
00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,720
Speaker 1: as long as you could. So it's not reasonable to

437
00:23:03,800 --> 00:23:06,399
Speaker 1: think that he might have had something the same or

438
00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:10,280
Speaker 1: even very similar. That we're all interchangeable. Well, any other

439
00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:13,879
Speaker 1: reason to wear dark clothes is that night blood doesn't

440
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,560
Speaker 1: show up on them. Well, they just don't show dirt

441
00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:19,760
Speaker 1: as much. Yeah, probably just thinking about the blood in general,

442
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:24,159
Speaker 1: and then you want to wear red probably yead, I

443
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:29,800
Speaker 1: mean black is probably better blood and Deadpool obviously joke

444
00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:32,040
Speaker 1: is coming from I have not seen Deadpool yet. I

445
00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:33,920
Speaker 1: want to see it. I can tell you, as a

446
00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:35,840
Speaker 1: lady who has to deal with blood on a fairy

447
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:40,280
Speaker 1: regular basis, black is the colors. Yeah, but we were

448
00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:44,040
Speaker 1: talking about the confrontation between Katie Cochrane and Maddie Alexander.

449
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:45,960
Speaker 1: So he goes over to a house with a straight

450
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:48,520
Speaker 1: razor and her idea was to lure out of the

451
00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:51,560
Speaker 1: house and then can kill her. Maddie answered the door,

452
00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,720
Speaker 1: but not surprisingly, refused to leave her house because yeah,

453
00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:57,360
Speaker 1: well because you know, it was out. It was out,

454
00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:00,000
Speaker 1: it was out in the news. And maybe Katie cochrane

455
00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:04,960
Speaker 1: shouldn't have telegraphed her intentions by dressing up like the Ripper. Yeah.

456
00:24:05,320 --> 00:24:07,600
Speaker 1: She made also made the mistake of talking about this

457
00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:10,760
Speaker 1: to a couple of women, one of whom ratting around. Yeah,

458
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:12,760
Speaker 1: I love that. You know what I think I'm gonna

459
00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:15,560
Speaker 1: do tonight. I think I'm going to be the Atlanta Ripper. Yeah,

460
00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,240
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna go murder somebody, kill somebody. I just

461
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:20,200
Speaker 1: don't like her very much. I'm gonna kill her. She's

462
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,240
Speaker 1: screwing around with my husband. I'm gonna go slit her through.

463
00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:27,640
Speaker 1: So she got thirty days in jail for that one days. Well,

464
00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:29,639
Speaker 1: I mean she didn't actually attempt the murder. She I

465
00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:32,080
Speaker 1: mean she she kind of attempted the murder she was

466
00:24:32,080 --> 00:24:38,960
Speaker 1: planning on. She didn't do anything. She didn't actually, you know,

467
00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:42,280
Speaker 1: there's a lot of rulings that are around this case

468
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:47,560
Speaker 1: that are so twenty seven days in jail, what why?

469
00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:52,160
Speaker 1: But today that would be a five year sentence. Yeah,

470
00:24:52,160 --> 00:24:54,119
Speaker 1: there was some guy who was arrested and tried for

471
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:57,120
Speaker 1: next We're gonna talk about him in a second anyway,

472
00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:00,080
Speaker 1: all right here he is, Yeah, nineteen July nineteen and

473
00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:03,240
Speaker 1: right around the same time, a guy named Jim Murphy

474
00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:06,119
Speaker 1: was put on trial. It wasn't it wasn't like the

475
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:09,120
Speaker 1: trial of the century because his his crime was threatening

476
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:12,120
Speaker 1: to cut his wife's throat. So it's a threat. Yeah,

477
00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:14,600
Speaker 1: it was a threat. Apparently it was. It was motivated

478
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:16,840
Speaker 1: by jealousy, and so he wanted to cut a throat.

479
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:21,080
Speaker 1: And at trial somebody mentioned the possibility that Jim Murphy

480
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:23,639
Speaker 1: might actually be the ripper. Uh, this is one of

481
00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:25,639
Speaker 1: the guys who was one of the doubters. A judge

482
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 1: at the trial, again named and Are Broyles, said, and

483
00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:31,480
Speaker 1: I'm quoting here, quote, there is no such thing in

484
00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:35,159
Speaker 1: Atlanta as a negro jack the ripper unquote. And he

485
00:25:35,240 --> 00:25:37,400
Speaker 1: didn't want on to say, quote there are at least

486
00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:40,600
Speaker 1: one thousand negro men in Atlanta today who stand ready

487
00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:43,760
Speaker 1: to cut the throats of their wives at the slightest provocation.

488
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 1: I feel like you could like edit that to say

489
00:25:46,119 --> 00:25:49,040
Speaker 1: there are at least ten thousand men in Atlanta today

490
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:51,520
Speaker 1: who stand ready to cut their throats of their wife. Yeah,

491
00:25:51,640 --> 00:25:55,960
Speaker 1: I mean right, yeah, this guy's got Anyway, this guy

492
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:57,960
Speaker 1: was you know, didn't we say it wasn't that a

493
00:25:58,040 --> 00:26:00,520
Speaker 1: quote that we had recently that was like the only

494
00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 1: thing that makes you a murderer's matrimony? That it was

495
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 1: some months ago. There was something about that that sounds

496
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:13,359
Speaker 1: vaguely familiar. Yeah. So anyway, he was kind of a

497
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:16,399
Speaker 1: skeptic about this, uh, and appears a lot of the

498
00:26:16,400 --> 00:26:18,960
Speaker 1: white population of Atlanta. I thought that this was just

499
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 1: a case of black people doing what black people do, which,

500
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,639
Speaker 1: in their opinion, was just killing each other, which is

501
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 1: kind of a shame. Yeah, it is. It is Julia Wallace.

502
00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:32,000
Speaker 1: Julia Wallace from a similar time period. In fact, yes,

503
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:35,800
Speaker 1: that was right about that time now before nineteen fifty.

504
00:26:36,000 --> 00:26:38,920
Speaker 1: That's all the same time period, right between eighteen fifty

505
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,080
Speaker 1: and nineteen fifty. Well, according to some people, that era

506
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:45,000
Speaker 1: in time was made up, So I don't know if

507
00:26:45,000 --> 00:26:51,119
Speaker 1: it was that particular, It wasn't that. Yeah, that's a

508
00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: different episode. Yeah, we'll talk about that. That's kind of

509
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:57,560
Speaker 1: an interesting theory. Yeah, Anyway, most people thought this was

510
00:26:57,720 --> 00:26:59,639
Speaker 1: most of the white population kind of thought it was

511
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:01,760
Speaker 1: a hoax. Time. No, I wouldn't even say most, but

512
00:27:01,800 --> 00:27:04,720
Speaker 1: there was a substantial the people who maybe you wouldn't

513
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:06,560
Speaker 1: want to think it was a hoax, like judges and

514
00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:09,520
Speaker 1: police officers and sheriffs and stuff. Well, if if not

515
00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 1: a hoax, it wasn't connected, so you know, it wasn't

516
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,880
Speaker 1: one guy doing at all. It just happened to be

517
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:22,159
Speaker 1: a bunch of murders that happened to look similar that

518
00:27:22,880 --> 00:27:27,240
Speaker 1: we're not, according to the authorities, done by the same person. Yeah,

519
00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:30,240
Speaker 1: you gotta like kind of like smiley face murders. Yeah,

520
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:33,280
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, I mean it's like it's it's entirely possible.

521
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:35,679
Speaker 1: I think it's unlikely, but it's entirely possible. If these

522
00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:38,720
Speaker 1: were all just random murders, it could be. I doubted.

523
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 1: Another theory that was out there was a local chriff

524
00:27:41,359 --> 00:27:44,240
Speaker 1: named Plenty Minors actually said that the killings were probably

525
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:49,560
Speaker 1: jealous wives knocking off their husband's girlfriends. Just maybe he

526
00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:52,439
Speaker 1: was inspired by Katie Cocker And I don't know. Uh,

527
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:54,879
Speaker 1: And of course we should remember it. Back in those days,

528
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:57,560
Speaker 1: the whole phrase serial killer had not yet been invented.

529
00:27:57,760 --> 00:28:00,400
Speaker 1: And maybe some people just couldn't wrap them. It's around

530
00:28:00,400 --> 00:28:03,360
Speaker 1: the idea that a single person would go around murdering

531
00:28:03,440 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 1: random people. Well, it took serial killers who were quite

532
00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:14,160
Speaker 1: prolific to be busted and have very concrete evidence brought

533
00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:18,560
Speaker 1: forward before I think that people just would actually accept

534
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:21,600
Speaker 1: It's like, no, there's no way that that guy killed

535
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:24,560
Speaker 1: all those people and stuffed him in his basement and

536
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:26,879
Speaker 1: then they called them all out of his basement. They go, oh,

537
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:30,399
Speaker 1: that's weird. That's a weird thing. Maybe we should like

538
00:28:30,560 --> 00:28:34,800
Speaker 1: investigate at some point, what did did this thing not

539
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:38,040
Speaker 1: exist before this time? Was it way less prevalent or

540
00:28:38,160 --> 00:28:41,720
Speaker 1: was it just not the concept of a serial killer?

541
00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:44,959
Speaker 1: Not the concept? Did people just you know, in like

542
00:28:45,080 --> 00:28:49,280
Speaker 1: seventeen hundreds, did people were there not serial killers? Actually?

543
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 1: I mean I would assume there had to have been,

544
00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:54,000
Speaker 1: But were there not as many because there weren't as

545
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,520
Speaker 1: many people? Or like, that's an interesting question to me

546
00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 1: again for another episode. All there. I actually now that

547
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,120
Speaker 1: you imagined that. I heard a very interesting theory regarding that,

548
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 1: and that is that serial killers have always been with us,

549
00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:11,960
Speaker 1: and that is actually quite possibly the genesis of a

550
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,160
Speaker 1: lot of our monster tals, things like the werewolves and

551
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:18,840
Speaker 1: vampires and things like that. A lot of those superstitions

552
00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:22,880
Speaker 1: might be from these weird killings that were happening, you know, thousands,

553
00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:25,440
Speaker 1: thousands of years ago. People in the village was showing

554
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:28,640
Speaker 1: up and disemboweled and cut into pieces and stuff like that,

555
00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:32,600
Speaker 1: and so people admitted monsters. So maybe it's it's an

556
00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:35,120
Speaker 1: interesting theory, it is, and it's kind of hard to

557
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:37,320
Speaker 1: check out if it's true or not without getting in

558
00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:40,040
Speaker 1: the way back machine. At this time, of course, in

559
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 1: black in Atlanta, you can imagine black folks, uh mostly

560
00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 1: believed in the Ripper's existence because I mean, he was

561
00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:49,000
Speaker 1: killing them. Yeah, it was a scary time. A lot

562
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:51,240
Speaker 1: of people started spending a whole lot more time at home,

563
00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:54,640
Speaker 1: believe it or not, especially at night, which probably you know,

564
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:56,920
Speaker 1: escalated the killing because oh my god, I'm around my

565
00:29:56,960 --> 00:30:03,880
Speaker 1: family all the time. Yeah, yeah know that feel yeah

566
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:06,400
Speaker 1: uh yeah. Anyway that they were Black women were afraid

567
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:08,200
Speaker 1: to be murdered and black men were afraid of getting

568
00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:12,480
Speaker 1: arrested and accused of being the Ripper because especially after

569
00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:16,280
Speaker 1: the after total climate yeah well yeah, definitely, and you know,

570
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 1: after the started putting pressure on the police. You could

571
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:22,120
Speaker 1: see why how the cops might just decide to paint

572
00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 1: it on somebody, which they did. Yeah, a couple of times.

573
00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:28,360
Speaker 1: They at least tried. They arrested some people for it.

574
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:30,560
Speaker 1: Let's go back to our victim list. So we're almost

575
00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:32,480
Speaker 1: done with that. The next murder, number seven was on

576
00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:36,200
Speaker 1: July tenth, nineteen eleven. That was Sadie Holly. Her body

577
00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:38,080
Speaker 1: was found by some workmen. She'd been bashed in the

578
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:40,760
Speaker 1: head with a large stone which was found nearby, and

579
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:42,640
Speaker 1: that she was dragged off in her throat was cut

580
00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:44,760
Speaker 1: and in this case, her shoes had been cut off

581
00:30:44,760 --> 00:30:47,160
Speaker 1: her feet, which was kind of an interesting things. And

582
00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:50,720
Speaker 1: that was not nor that was not indicative of I

583
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 1: don't think so. Now, Okay, it's it's indicative. It's indicative

584
00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:58,160
Speaker 1: of the weird psychology of a serial killer, right, but

585
00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:00,720
Speaker 1: it's not something that we had seen in the Pritor

586
00:31:00,840 --> 00:31:03,520
Speaker 1: six cases that we know of. Her shoes had been

587
00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:06,280
Speaker 1: cut off her feet, her feet hadn't be correct. Yeah,

588
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:11,800
Speaker 1: my brain is yeah, I'm sorry, my brain interpreted that

589
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:15,920
Speaker 1: the wrong way. Yeah, her shoes were caught were her

590
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:18,760
Speaker 1: shoes found close to her body? Pretty close they were,

591
00:31:18,800 --> 00:31:21,120
Speaker 1: but they were found. They were found, so it wasn't

592
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:23,040
Speaker 1: as though they were taken as a souvenir. No, No,

593
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:25,960
Speaker 1: they weren't. When the next murder I'm going to talk

594
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,400
Speaker 1: about this is the one that might be real or

595
00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,720
Speaker 1: it might be a copycat. This is one of the

596
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 1: ones that McLoughlin and being took off their list. But

597
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:34,960
Speaker 1: I'm gonna put it back on at least for a second.

598
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,680
Speaker 1: Here her her shoes were also removed. Uh. And other

599
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:40,440
Speaker 1: than that, it was the usual m O except for

600
00:31:40,480 --> 00:31:43,280
Speaker 1: one of the things. This was many wise by the way,

601
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:46,920
Speaker 1: and her right index finger had been hackedocked off at

602
00:31:46,920 --> 00:31:49,640
Speaker 1: the middle joint. Was a little change up in the

603
00:31:49,760 --> 00:31:51,479
Speaker 1: m O. And I had no idea why that happened.

604
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,160
Speaker 1: There's no real earthly reason for it that I can

605
00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:56,920
Speaker 1: think of, although maybe again just some escalation or it

606
00:31:56,960 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 1: was a defensive maybe seen him coming and put up

607
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:04,840
Speaker 1: her hand and he took a swipe badder and happened

608
00:32:04,880 --> 00:32:07,000
Speaker 1: to catch fingers what I had to have been a

609
00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:12,000
Speaker 1: woll sharp knife cut through a fingerbone. Some of these,

610
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:15,600
Speaker 1: some of these attacks, they are the bodies are described

611
00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:20,280
Speaker 1: as the heads nearly being taken off. Okay, but so

612
00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:22,920
Speaker 1: like just in terms of like the physics of cutting

613
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:28,400
Speaker 1: a finger off. He would have to hit it perfectly.

614
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:31,240
Speaker 1: It would have had to been super sharp and super

615
00:32:31,840 --> 00:32:34,719
Speaker 1: on target. I get the but I'm just saying that,

616
00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 1: you know, so like, but that's a different thing for me. Like,

617
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:41,239
Speaker 1: it's pretty easy if you're sorry for the morbidity of this,

618
00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:44,360
Speaker 1: But if if a victim is laying, you know, on

619
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:47,280
Speaker 1: their back on the ground, it's not so hard to

620
00:32:47,520 --> 00:32:51,440
Speaker 1: shove a sharp knife in and pull it across to

621
00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:55,200
Speaker 1: almost sever ahead versus like in the air, my hands

622
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:59,280
Speaker 1: are up. I think he probably deliberately took it off.

623
00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 1: It would have to have been like she was laying there,

624
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:06,600
Speaker 1: and it's not so hard to just something off if

625
00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:10,040
Speaker 1: it's against solid ground. That's why we use cutting boards.

626
00:33:10,200 --> 00:33:12,480
Speaker 1: That's why we don't like cut carrots in the air.

627
00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:17,640
Speaker 1: Point right. I've actually heard that apparently fingers are similar

628
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 1: to carrots that you're talking about flavor or what in

629
00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:26,720
Speaker 1: ease of cutting. Okay, that's what I would think they'd

630
00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:29,640
Speaker 1: be tougher, because I would think that that would be

631
00:33:29,640 --> 00:33:32,440
Speaker 1: the case, But apparently it's I mean, carrots, you know,

632
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:34,880
Speaker 1: like they really thick ones. They can be pretty hard

633
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:39,840
Speaker 1: to cut through suppose, Yeah, especially we will how you

634
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:43,720
Speaker 1: cut fingers off? Whoa okay after after the shows that

635
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:46,120
Speaker 1: we're done recording, or we're gonna rosembo and pick one

636
00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:49,440
Speaker 1: person to be rooms all over again. Right, it's a

637
00:33:49,560 --> 00:33:54,480
Speaker 1: lighter Yeah, I haven't seen that one. You don't know? Yeah, okay,

638
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:59,719
Speaker 1: what was it talking about? Many Wise? Yeah? Many Wise?

639
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:02,400
Speaker 1: Because the finger, I'm thinking she also had a husband.

640
00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:04,120
Speaker 1: Do you have a husband? But I was sticking with

641
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:05,640
Speaker 1: a finger. I was sticking. I wonder if she had

642
00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:07,600
Speaker 1: a ring on that finger, and it just didn't want

643
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:11,720
Speaker 1: to come off. But yeah, well, anyway, she her husband.

644
00:34:11,840 --> 00:34:14,480
Speaker 1: His name was Bud Wise. I think it's a cool name. Yeah.

645
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:18,120
Speaker 1: I like that he was arrested. Apparently she was jealous

646
00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:20,759
Speaker 1: of her. Apparently she was was jealous of he was

647
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 1: jealous of her. Yeah, she was apparently sort of interested,

648
00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:26,040
Speaker 1: I don't know, seriously or not in some other guy,

649
00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:30,160
Speaker 1: and he had threatened to kill her, and the detectives

650
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:33,240
Speaker 1: in this case felt like he was just taking advantage

651
00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:35,719
Speaker 1: of the whole Ripper thing to camouflogeist on murder and

652
00:34:35,760 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 1: that it was, you know, actually a copycat murder. But

653
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:42,120
Speaker 1: which is something Joe thinks about a lot. Yeah, exactly,

654
00:34:42,160 --> 00:34:46,200
Speaker 1: you know, you know, well, yeah, I mean aware if

655
00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:48,920
Speaker 1: if a serial killer ever comes to light in Oregon,

656
00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:51,040
Speaker 1: I'm going and hiding from Yeah, I know, I know

657
00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:53,799
Speaker 1: exactly because my name. Time time to kill Devan and

658
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:57,800
Speaker 1: replace her with somebody else. Yeah, just hiding his gun closet.

659
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:04,920
Speaker 1: She doesn't have the combination. Yeah, and I come in here.

660
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:08,680
Speaker 1: You'll be safe. Yeah. And it's possible this is a

661
00:35:08,719 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 1: copycat killing. As possible. A few of the other ones

662
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:13,960
Speaker 1: were copycat killings because this is a great time to

663
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:16,279
Speaker 1: go settle the score. You just want to be really

664
00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:17,920
Speaker 1: careful not to get arrested. You know, you got to

665
00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:19,880
Speaker 1: kill just one person and they all get picked on you,

666
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:22,359
Speaker 1: so that wouldn't be so good. And that's that's why

667
00:35:22,760 --> 00:35:25,280
Speaker 1: so many people, I think, I feel like so many

668
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:30,000
Speaker 1: deaths were attributed to the Atlanta Ripper because people were like,

669
00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:34,480
Speaker 1: somebody's out there killing women. I really hate that. Broad

670
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:38,319
Speaker 1: perfect opportunity and just you know, kill her in some

671
00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 1: fashion that you know it has something to do with

672
00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 1: cutting the neck, and then it gets lumped on like

673
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:47,000
Speaker 1: that's why I feel like the number was so was it?

674
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:51,440
Speaker 1: Eighteen was the nineteen or something. It was just ya,

675
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:54,920
Speaker 1: Can we just pause to say that that really upsets me?

676
00:35:55,400 --> 00:35:57,960
Speaker 1: What's that? Just the fact that there are so many

677
00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:01,799
Speaker 1: dudes out there in this like in that supposition, right,

678
00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:06,080
Speaker 1: there's so many dudes out there in Atlanta who are like,

679
00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:10,440
Speaker 1: I really hate this lady. I'm going a killer within

680
00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:15,680
Speaker 1: like a year's two year span. But a lot of

681
00:36:15,719 --> 00:36:18,279
Speaker 1: women out there thinking, what's her name? Who got in

682
00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:21,480
Speaker 1: trouble for dressing? I'm sorry, let me amend that there

683
00:36:21,520 --> 00:36:25,480
Speaker 1: are that many people out there like that's actually very

684
00:36:25,560 --> 00:36:27,959
Speaker 1: upsetting to me. I am more comforted by the fact

685
00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:31,400
Speaker 1: that it's one single psychopath who's just like killing people

686
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:34,279
Speaker 1: at will than it is that there are twenty or

687
00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:37,120
Speaker 1: thirty people who are like, you know what, this person,

688
00:36:37,239 --> 00:36:39,920
Speaker 1: I don't like them very much. There's a serial killer

689
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:42,600
Speaker 1: out there. I'm just gonna kill this person. Somebody else

690
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:45,879
Speaker 1: will get the credit. That's fine. I have no more

691
00:36:45,920 --> 00:36:48,200
Speaker 1: a quandary with that at all. That is way more

692
00:36:48,320 --> 00:36:50,600
Speaker 1: upsetting to me than a serial killer who might have

693
00:36:50,719 --> 00:36:58,359
Speaker 1: killed twenty people. Way more upsetting. That's the thing. I guess.

694
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:00,520
Speaker 1: This is why I don't like people in rule as

695
00:37:00,520 --> 00:37:03,200
Speaker 1: a rule. That's why my like I'm I'm much happier

696
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:05,919
Speaker 1: with the theories of like it was one person. It's fine. Yeah,

697
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:08,040
Speaker 1: well if it makes you feel any better though, as

698
00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:12,640
Speaker 1: overall trend murders murder was going down, it's been going Yes,

699
00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:14,879
Speaker 1: that does make me feel better. I have not yet

700
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:19,280
Speaker 1: been murdered that you haven't not yet, so that's good.

701
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:29,719
Speaker 1: So next victim, Yeah, what are we talking about? Oh yeah,

702
00:37:29,719 --> 00:37:32,840
Speaker 1: we're our last victim, at least according to the professor.

703
00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:36,600
Speaker 1: And I was writing partner Murder number eight, Mary Putnam.

704
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:40,080
Speaker 1: This is the one that was different. Her body was

705
00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:41,840
Speaker 1: found in a ditch and it had been covered with

706
00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:46,240
Speaker 1: some loose dirt and her heart to bury it. Yeah,

707
00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:48,359
Speaker 1: I wasn't a serious attempt. It's just like kicking dirt

708
00:37:48,400 --> 00:37:50,600
Speaker 1: over it, I think, you know. Yeah, but any attempt

709
00:37:50,640 --> 00:37:53,439
Speaker 1: to bury it shows some remorse, right, that's the typical Like,

710
00:37:53,800 --> 00:37:55,920
Speaker 1: that's how people is that. I'm sorry. You guys are

711
00:37:55,920 --> 00:37:59,040
Speaker 1: both looking at me like the brand new concept to you.

712
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:02,040
Speaker 1: I don't take that as remorse. I take that as

713
00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:06,320
Speaker 1: I normally hide it in the bushes, and there's no bushes.

714
00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:09,839
Speaker 1: How do I hide it so I can get away?

715
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:11,799
Speaker 1: So that's probably it was what it was. But this

716
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:13,840
Speaker 1: was different than that her heart was cut out. It

717
00:38:13,920 --> 00:38:17,520
Speaker 1: was laying next to her. So yeah, that's a deviation. Yeah,

718
00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:21,239
Speaker 1: and usually you don't see that kind of escalation at

719
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:26,120
Speaker 1: the very right the that kind of escalation continues usually

720
00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:29,719
Speaker 1: unless that person is caught. That's the thing is that, like,

721
00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:33,800
Speaker 1: as far as we know, the ripper wasn't caught. Again,

722
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:37,480
Speaker 1: it's just like the the British Jack the Ripper, just

723
00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:41,279
Speaker 1: this is it. But I mean with the British the

724
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 1: peak and then it just goes away. With the British

725
00:38:43,080 --> 00:38:45,000
Speaker 1: Jack the Ripper. I feel like there was a natural

726
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:47,959
Speaker 1: peak of like that's about the worst thing you could

727
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:51,480
Speaker 1: do to a body, kind of again, we're okay, we're

728
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 1: gonna go down the same rabbit holes and then it

729
00:38:53,680 --> 00:38:56,880
Speaker 1: stopped right. But but I mean like that the thing

730
00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:58,960
Speaker 1: for me is like, okay, so like if the escalation

731
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:02,880
Speaker 1: of the ever psychosis that's going on is this is

732
00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 1: literally the worst thing you could do to the body.

733
00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:06,080
Speaker 1: The worst thing you could do to body is like

734
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 1: kind of cut a heart out and leave it next

735
00:39:08,040 --> 00:39:12,439
Speaker 1: to it. Like that's not true. There's so much more

736
00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:16,719
Speaker 1: so you would I for me, as a total armchair

737
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:19,239
Speaker 1: person who I guess has a couple of years of

738
00:39:19,280 --> 00:39:21,920
Speaker 1: experience of reading about cases like this. At this point,

739
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:26,280
Speaker 1: I would expect that if this person were free, that

740
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 1: that there would be that escalation, unless we're going to

741
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,680
Speaker 1: go to Joe's de facto explanation of there was one

742
00:39:31,719 --> 00:39:33,960
Speaker 1: person in the mix that was the intended target and

743
00:39:34,000 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 1: everybody else was just like to cover up the rest

744
00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:38,879
Speaker 1: of it. Yeah, there is always that, I think though,

745
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:41,160
Speaker 1: if there that this had been somebody just wanted to

746
00:39:41,239 --> 00:39:43,960
Speaker 1: kill one person. Non't need to kill eight people or

747
00:39:44,040 --> 00:39:47,319
Speaker 1: nine or whatever. K. Yeah, So can we go back

748
00:39:47,320 --> 00:39:49,440
Speaker 1: and re record the Jackie the Ripper episode because they

749
00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:54,080
Speaker 1: feel like that was the argument with Jackie? Right? And

750
00:39:54,200 --> 00:39:56,440
Speaker 1: I mean, am I crazy that? Like? Did you not

751
00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:58,799
Speaker 1: make that argument there? Yeah? Well, that that's the thing

752
00:39:58,800 --> 00:40:01,320
Speaker 1: about it. You know, jack the Ripper murdered five women.

753
00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:04,520
Speaker 1: No need to murder five women. Just the question is

754
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:06,440
Speaker 1: is like, is like up to the point he started

755
00:40:06,480 --> 00:40:08,640
Speaker 1: murdering them, why wasn't he murdering them before? And why

756
00:40:08,719 --> 00:40:11,680
Speaker 1: wasn't he murdering them afterwards? You know? Why? Yeah? Well,

757
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:14,560
Speaker 1: I mean I think that the general assumption is that

758
00:40:15,000 --> 00:40:18,880
Speaker 1: you read about people who are serial killers who have

759
00:40:18,920 --> 00:40:21,359
Speaker 1: been caught and their parents are people who are close

760
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:23,239
Speaker 1: to them say yeah, they were like it was weird.

761
00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:26,239
Speaker 1: They were mulated squirrels all over the place, or like

762
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:29,000
Speaker 1: he beat the dog up and then suddenly he was

763
00:40:29,040 --> 00:40:33,160
Speaker 1: big enough to take it into human realm and then

764
00:40:33,160 --> 00:40:36,000
Speaker 1: he was caught, or the escalation finished, or he moved

765
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:39,800
Speaker 1: out of that area, yeah or she? I mean, serial

766
00:40:39,840 --> 00:40:42,960
Speaker 1: killers are by a large male, but there are some females,

767
00:40:43,680 --> 00:40:46,439
Speaker 1: So I just default to the male pronoun. I apologize.

768
00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 1: Most murders are I apologized all of the female serial

769
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:53,279
Speaker 1: killers out there who were like, hey, what about me?

770
00:40:53,800 --> 00:40:58,360
Speaker 1: I apologize that's last name. I mean, yeah, that's true. No,

771
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:04,960
Speaker 1: I mean that's but that's that's the general slope of escalation.

772
00:41:05,120 --> 00:41:07,120
Speaker 1: What are you going to call that? The general something

773
00:41:07,160 --> 00:41:10,200
Speaker 1: of escalation, general path of escalation. Maybe that's the word

774
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 1: I'm looking so, yeah, I mean, well there wasn't there

775
00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 1: was some escalation here. I mean he cut off a

776
00:41:13,760 --> 00:41:16,640
Speaker 1: finger and the victim number section and then the heart,

777
00:41:16,680 --> 00:41:19,839
Speaker 1: the heart. That's that's a big jump I have to jump. Yeah. Yeah.

778
00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:24,200
Speaker 1: And then if he did stop, why because out of

779
00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:26,520
Speaker 1: the yeah, he moved, he moved out of town. Maybe.

780
00:41:26,560 --> 00:41:29,279
Speaker 1: I mean by this time, it was kind of late

781
00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:32,640
Speaker 1: nineteen eleven and the police were really serious about it

782
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,480
Speaker 1: and everybody was on edge. Maybe he just set the

783
00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:38,480
Speaker 1: decided to just move on. You know, it's hard to say,

784
00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:40,920
Speaker 1: you know what England man, well, you know what tooth

785
00:41:40,960 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 1: that life was more dangerous back then. Maybe somebody murdered him. Yeah,

786
00:41:44,320 --> 00:41:50,120
Speaker 1: you know, you don't know work environment. Yeah yeah, I

787
00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 1: mean we didn't have antibiotics back in those so yeah,

788
00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:54,200
Speaker 1: I mean it's really easy to get done in by

789
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:58,680
Speaker 1: just an internal infection. Yeah, yeah, yeah. According to the papers,

790
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:01,320
Speaker 1: the killings resumed in nineteen twelve, and they were five

791
00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:05,320
Speaker 1: maybe ripper murders that year, and then it ended. I

792
00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:07,080
Speaker 1: did come across one source you claimed that there was

793
00:42:07,080 --> 00:42:09,360
Speaker 1: another one as I mentioned before, in nineteen thirteen, and

794
00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:12,560
Speaker 1: another in nineteen fourteen. This is a guy I don't

795
00:42:12,560 --> 00:42:17,000
Speaker 1: take very seriously because he's one of the people that

796
00:42:17,040 --> 00:42:19,680
Speaker 1: makes the claim that the the Ripper mutilated his victims,

797
00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:22,720
Speaker 1: and as we know, that's not true, and it's based

798
00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:26,360
Speaker 1: on the death certificates that were looked up talking about

799
00:42:26,360 --> 00:42:31,200
Speaker 1: specifically what was done to the body. Yeahs Professor Moriarty. Yeah,

800
00:42:31,239 --> 00:42:35,479
Speaker 1: Professor McLaughlin. Uh. He said that they almost just about

801
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:37,560
Speaker 1: in all cases got ahold of the death certificates. And

802
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:41,960
Speaker 1: so do we believe those five in nineteen twelve? I

803
00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:45,120
Speaker 1: don't think so. So these got the five in nineteen twelve.

804
00:42:45,360 --> 00:42:47,879
Speaker 1: I mean, let me think here, three of them, three

805
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:52,160
Speaker 1: of them were eliminated because somebody was arrested and convicted

806
00:42:52,160 --> 00:42:55,160
Speaker 1: for their murders. Yeah, and then the other two another

807
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:58,080
Speaker 1: one with one of them was stabbed and another one

808
00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 1: that d m O was different. So it's really just

809
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:04,080
Speaker 1: the media sensationalizing these Yeah, I mean, I mean once

810
00:43:04,120 --> 00:43:06,239
Speaker 1: they had this whole, this whole state of killings. You know,

811
00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:09,319
Speaker 1: obviously these weatheren are showing up dead. Obviously the person

812
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:11,360
Speaker 1: in your conclusion you're going to jump to is that

813
00:43:11,560 --> 00:43:13,920
Speaker 1: the horrible thing that happened to you? And this this

814
00:43:13,960 --> 00:43:15,200
Speaker 1: guy too, this guy is I don't know if you

815
00:43:15,239 --> 00:43:17,040
Speaker 1: watched any of that video? Is the link to the

816
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:20,360
Speaker 1: really awful one? Did you want? You? In fact, advised

817
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:23,400
Speaker 1: me to not watch it. I did after watching a

818
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:24,920
Speaker 1: little bit of it, but then I said, if you

819
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:26,560
Speaker 1: were a call, I told you should watch at least

820
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:28,160
Speaker 1: a few minutes like I did. Watch a few minutes

821
00:43:28,400 --> 00:43:30,880
Speaker 1: just to find out how bad that is. Was it

822
00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:33,399
Speaker 1: bad or what? Yeah, I mean it was not good. Now,

823
00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:39,360
Speaker 1: it's hard. There's so many Sometimes I am tempted to say, Steve,

824
00:43:39,480 --> 00:43:41,320
Speaker 1: let's post the link to this thing so that people

825
00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:44,120
Speaker 1: can understand the hardships that we face when we research

826
00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:50,200
Speaker 1: our episode. Yeah, because I can't do that now. This one,

827
00:43:50,320 --> 00:43:52,759
Speaker 1: this one was an hour and a half long interview,

828
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:56,799
Speaker 1: and I suffered through about an hour of it. Right. Yeah,

829
00:43:56,880 --> 00:44:00,279
Speaker 1: it's like her so her on video facing the camp round,

830
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:02,800
Speaker 1: then a picture of the guy, but he was mostly talking,

831
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:04,759
Speaker 1: and so she was kind of bored the whole time. Yeah,

832
00:44:04,800 --> 00:44:07,080
Speaker 1: she would be looking around or just making weird expressions.

833
00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:11,120
Speaker 1: She also was thick, Yeah, and she was had running

834
00:44:11,200 --> 00:44:14,680
Speaker 1: eyes and yeah, watering eyes. But no, I mean so

835
00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:17,680
Speaker 1: that that guy that she was interviewing, uh, claimed to

836
00:44:17,719 --> 00:44:21,080
Speaker 1: be an expert on this and he said another thing, Yeah,

837
00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:23,720
Speaker 1: and he said he also said that black serial killers

838
00:44:23,719 --> 00:44:27,320
Speaker 1: are extremely rare and that all serial killers are almost

839
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:29,759
Speaker 1: all of them are white, which that's offensive. Well, let's

840
00:44:29,760 --> 00:44:33,000
Speaker 1: complete bonk. I mean, actually, the serial killers are are

841
00:44:33,080 --> 00:44:36,400
Speaker 1: very well distributed among the races. I was gonna say,

842
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:38,640
Speaker 1: I'm just I'm sorry, I'm staring, and I know that

843
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:40,480
Speaker 1: you're both looking at like I'm a weirdo, because I'm

844
00:44:40,520 --> 00:44:45,439
Speaker 1: just baffled by that it is. It is not attributed

845
00:44:45,520 --> 00:44:49,760
Speaker 1: to any race, and while it is to one gender

846
00:44:49,800 --> 00:44:53,719
Speaker 1: more than another, it's it's a distributed Oh yeah, that's

847
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:57,560
Speaker 1: I mean in America, obviously it's a majority white country,

848
00:44:57,600 --> 00:44:59,879
Speaker 1: so obviously the majority of sailor killers are gonna be white.

849
00:45:01,200 --> 00:45:09,560
Speaker 1: But but personally, personally percentage maybe accurately, yeah, as as

850
00:45:09,600 --> 00:45:14,160
Speaker 1: a percentage of the population that it's demographic same, about

851
00:45:14,200 --> 00:45:16,080
Speaker 1: the same percentage of each it's going to be roughly

852
00:45:16,120 --> 00:45:18,480
Speaker 1: the same. When you're talking about you know, crazy people

853
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:21,960
Speaker 1: transcend everything, Yeah, pretty much. Yeah, yeah, you know, it

854
00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:24,759
Speaker 1: could be that one particular race. I doubt it is

855
00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:26,719
Speaker 1: more susceptible to this kind of stuff, but I don't

856
00:45:26,719 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 1: think so. I really kind of doubt that because we

857
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:31,719
Speaker 1: hear about this all over the world. Oh yeah, oh yeah,

858
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:34,360
Speaker 1: it does happen everywhere. You just take different forms. I

859
00:45:34,360 --> 00:45:37,200
Speaker 1: mean sometimes, right, you are are extra smart, and so

860
00:45:37,239 --> 00:45:38,759
Speaker 1: you figure out how to say, like, oh, I'm a

861
00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:40,879
Speaker 1: witch doctor, so it's okay that I'm murdering all these

862
00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:44,200
Speaker 1: people right, or oh hey I'm a savior, so it's

863
00:45:44,239 --> 00:45:47,080
Speaker 1: okay that I'm murdering all these people, or oh hey

864
00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:49,799
Speaker 1: I'm the king. You know, it's it just goes on

865
00:45:49,840 --> 00:45:55,400
Speaker 1: and on, but you find them everywhere. Yeah, pretty much theories.

866
00:45:55,480 --> 00:46:00,520
Speaker 1: Yet we're gonna we're gonna start theories. Yeah. Now, we

867
00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:02,200
Speaker 1: usually get to the theories a lot sooner than this

868
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:05,319
Speaker 1: theory is gonna be short. Actually, so our theories are one,

869
00:46:05,400 --> 00:46:08,319
Speaker 1: the Ripper did not exist? Well, I do the way

870
00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:11,480
Speaker 1: this means that every one of these was every unique

871
00:46:11,560 --> 00:46:14,320
Speaker 1: murder was by a unique perpetration, and it just happened

872
00:46:14,360 --> 00:46:17,560
Speaker 1: to be that some of them shared some similarities. Yeah,

873
00:46:17,640 --> 00:46:20,920
Speaker 1: I think it's fair to say that it's possible that

874
00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:23,399
Speaker 1: not every murder attributed to the Ripper was done by him.

875
00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:26,680
Speaker 1: But but I do think especially in middle two thousand

876
00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:31,440
Speaker 1: or nineteen eleven, mid nineteen eleven, do yeah, yeah, I

877
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:35,279
Speaker 1: do lanswer Ripper had a time machine. What do you got?

878
00:46:35,320 --> 00:46:36,600
Speaker 1: But what do you guys think? Do you do buy

879
00:46:36,640 --> 00:46:40,160
Speaker 1: into the whole Ripper didn't exist things? Yeah? So our

880
00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:44,400
Speaker 1: next theory is that this put forth by a plenty

881
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:47,440
Speaker 1: of minors. The sheriff that was black, wives, murdering their

882
00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:50,640
Speaker 1: husband's girlfriends. Please. Yeah, well, I know that there's a

883
00:46:50,640 --> 00:46:53,040
Speaker 1: lot of wives who would like that to be the case.

884
00:46:53,080 --> 00:46:55,440
Speaker 1: I don't think that's I also don't think they are that.

885
00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:58,600
Speaker 1: I don't think that that it's that rampant right that

886
00:46:59,160 --> 00:47:04,120
Speaker 1: husbands kind friends. Yeah. So there's the thing. A lot

887
00:47:04,200 --> 00:47:08,040
Speaker 1: of dudes like to think that they are cool enough

888
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:12,640
Speaker 1: and hot enough and suave enough to get a girlfriend.

889
00:47:13,040 --> 00:47:16,520
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, we're all fat and ugly. The one we

890
00:47:16,680 --> 00:47:21,200
Speaker 1: got lucky with, the one that one now nine percent

891
00:47:21,440 --> 00:47:25,799
Speaker 1: of men can't manage to get to handle to it one.

892
00:47:26,600 --> 00:47:30,120
Speaker 1: It's not it's it's it really is hard to keep

893
00:47:30,120 --> 00:47:33,120
Speaker 1: all your lives straight and everything. But really, yeah, so

894
00:47:33,160 --> 00:47:35,279
Speaker 1: it's better and better just to keep it simple, you know,

895
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:38,719
Speaker 1: it really is. So so what's our next one? Well,

896
00:47:38,760 --> 00:47:42,680
Speaker 1: our next series is that the Ripper did exist. Yeah,

897
00:47:42,840 --> 00:47:45,399
Speaker 1: I think he most likely did. Uh. For one thing,

898
00:47:45,440 --> 00:47:48,360
Speaker 1: throat cutting I think is not a really it's not

899
00:47:48,400 --> 00:47:52,560
Speaker 1: a really typical murder method. It's not. It's also fairly gruesome.

900
00:47:56,040 --> 00:47:58,279
Speaker 1: We're saying, if we were going to go with the

901
00:47:58,360 --> 00:48:01,719
Speaker 1: Ripper was just a bunch of black lives murdering husband's girlfriends. Like,

902
00:48:01,880 --> 00:48:06,399
Speaker 1: that's an intense way to do it. It's also not well,

903
00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:10,120
Speaker 1: I guess bashing someone over the head hard enough to

904
00:48:10,200 --> 00:48:14,640
Speaker 1: knock them out, that sars a significant amount of physical stress.

905
00:48:14,920 --> 00:48:18,320
Speaker 1: And then on top of that, the will or guile

906
00:48:18,520 --> 00:48:22,879
Speaker 1: even to split someone ear to ear intense, you guys,

907
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:25,520
Speaker 1: that's really yeah. I think that most people that get

908
00:48:25,719 --> 00:48:28,799
Speaker 1: killed with knives are usually stabbed. Yes, So I would say,

909
00:48:28,840 --> 00:48:30,480
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, once, right, you do the one

910
00:48:30,520 --> 00:48:33,000
Speaker 1: and you're like, oh god, that was right, But I

911
00:48:33,040 --> 00:48:34,880
Speaker 1: don't have to do it again. I don't have to,

912
00:48:34,960 --> 00:48:37,200
Speaker 1: you know, drag that knife anywhere. So I would say,

913
00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:41,640
Speaker 1: it's one person who And here's a great the thing

914
00:48:41,640 --> 00:48:46,480
Speaker 1: about stabbing them is that if if you stabb somebody,

915
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:48,680
Speaker 1: if you're strong enough and accurate enough that you can

916
00:48:48,760 --> 00:48:51,160
Speaker 1: hit it, hit a vital organ and just you just

917
00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:54,680
Speaker 1: walk away, pull a knife out, and there's not going

918
00:48:54,719 --> 00:48:58,240
Speaker 1: to be that much blood, nothing, nothing at all compared

919
00:48:58,280 --> 00:48:59,719
Speaker 1: to the kind of blood you're gonna get on you

920
00:49:00,120 --> 00:49:03,759
Speaker 1: when you cut somebody's throats. So that's right, you yeah,

921
00:49:03,800 --> 00:49:06,399
Speaker 1: when you like, especially when you split the jugular, yeah,

922
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:10,480
Speaker 1: spread all over the place. Yeah, I know. And of

923
00:49:10,520 --> 00:49:13,279
Speaker 1: course there's always you know, there's always I think if

924
00:49:13,280 --> 00:49:14,839
Speaker 1: this was random people, I think it would be more

925
00:49:14,840 --> 00:49:17,359
Speaker 1: stabbings and shootings and nuts throw cuttings. So I think

926
00:49:17,400 --> 00:49:20,680
Speaker 1: this was truly a serial killer with pop the majority.

927
00:49:20,960 --> 00:49:25,479
Speaker 1: There were some outliers, possibly a copycat in there. But yeah,

928
00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:29,719
Speaker 1: so who was nobody knows. Yeah, nobody knows that where

929
00:49:29,880 --> 00:49:33,760
Speaker 1: some guys arrested. There were suspects, right, there were six guys.

930
00:49:34,200 --> 00:49:36,600
Speaker 1: Thought I saw the names of like five, but they

931
00:49:36,600 --> 00:49:40,480
Speaker 1: always say there were six people. Yeah, well, and that's that,

932
00:49:40,560 --> 00:49:42,759
Speaker 1: that's if you count there were a couple of other

933
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:46,560
Speaker 1: people who were arrested for individual murders. People that were

934
00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:49,439
Speaker 1: that were counted in, they were lumped in with those

935
00:49:49,440 --> 00:49:52,959
Speaker 1: guys and so yeah, so, but but I came across four.

936
00:49:53,680 --> 00:49:56,600
Speaker 1: So there's Todd Henderson. Then he was arrested, but he

937
00:49:56,680 --> 00:49:59,800
Speaker 1: was he was actually in custody when several murders happened

938
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:05,719
Speaker 1: the whole either that, yeah, either that he has some

939
00:50:05,840 --> 00:50:07,520
Speaker 1: really good friends on the outside that went out and

940
00:50:07,560 --> 00:50:09,920
Speaker 1: murdered people just to give him a good alibi. I

941
00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:12,799
Speaker 1: doubt it. Yeah, I kind of doubt that. Another guy

942
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:15,360
Speaker 1: was Henry Huff who was He was arrested for the

943
00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:19,040
Speaker 1: murder of City Holly. But again it appears that one

944
00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:22,200
Speaker 1: more murder happened while he was in custody, and so

945
00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:25,000
Speaker 1: he was also acquitted. Me. Yeah, they were both trying

946
00:50:25,000 --> 00:50:27,960
Speaker 1: and to quitted. Uh. Next up was Henry Brown. He

947
00:50:28,080 --> 00:50:30,319
Speaker 1: was put on trial for the killings, but it turns

948
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:32,640
Speaker 1: out the Atlanta police had beating a confession out of him.

949
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:37,960
Speaker 1: He was acquitted. Yeah, yeah, so yeah, so that it's doubtful.

950
00:50:39,200 --> 00:50:41,759
Speaker 1: And then he said, yeah they figured out once they

951
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:43,880
Speaker 1: figured out that the police had done that, it was

952
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:49,120
Speaker 1: because he was willing to say anything. Basically, Um, you

953
00:50:49,160 --> 00:50:51,440
Speaker 1: want me to say, I have wings. I have wings

954
00:50:51,440 --> 00:50:53,160
Speaker 1: and I flew from the top of a building and

955
00:50:53,280 --> 00:50:56,120
Speaker 1: I got him. Yeah, yeah, is that what you want? Okay, great, no,

956
00:50:56,239 --> 00:51:00,320
Speaker 1: no flinching, don't come near me. That that's House of Yearly.

957
00:51:00,440 --> 00:51:02,480
Speaker 1: They beat this guy. To be honest with you, I

958
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:04,040
Speaker 1: don't think I would have to get beat that hard

959
00:51:04,080 --> 00:51:09,200
Speaker 1: to be in that mindset, you know, with a night stick,

960
00:51:09,239 --> 00:51:11,279
Speaker 1: I'd be like, yes, I will say literally whatever you want.

961
00:51:11,480 --> 00:51:16,160
Speaker 1: Yes I am I'm Russian. But yeah, yeah, never reminds

962
00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:18,959
Speaker 1: me of a joke. But I'll tell you guys later. Yeah. Yeah,

963
00:51:19,120 --> 00:51:24,200
Speaker 1: who else Charlie Owens was considered, but he was arrested

964
00:51:24,239 --> 00:51:26,320
Speaker 1: for the murder of his wife, A Lacey Owens and

965
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:30,560
Speaker 1: nineteen twelve, and I think this was after the murders stopped.

966
00:51:30,560 --> 00:51:34,160
Speaker 1: He was sentenced to life. I'm just not seeing him

967
00:51:34,160 --> 00:51:36,280
Speaker 1: as a suspect because he just had a good motive

968
00:51:36,280 --> 00:51:39,960
Speaker 1: for murdering his wife. Yeah, and not necessarily murdering people

969
00:51:40,040 --> 00:51:42,439
Speaker 1: that he doesn't know. That's a weird way to work

970
00:51:42,520 --> 00:51:49,040
Speaker 1: up to killing your own wife practice maybe, yeah, I guess, Yeah,

971
00:51:49,040 --> 00:51:52,040
Speaker 1: I have a wife. You have a wife. You tell

972
00:51:52,080 --> 00:51:55,040
Speaker 1: me I've been practicing killing her for a while, and yeah,

973
00:51:55,400 --> 00:52:02,160
Speaker 1: she's going to kill you first, know you. Yeah, you

974
00:52:02,200 --> 00:52:04,680
Speaker 1: don't know Steve's wife as well as I do, but

975
00:52:04,840 --> 00:52:10,640
Speaker 1: she's a lot more intense than he is. Yeah, I've

976
00:52:10,719 --> 00:52:14,759
Speaker 1: met her, Yeah, I have met I've met the Mrs Steve. Yeah. Yeah.

977
00:52:15,320 --> 00:52:20,040
Speaker 1: Now that's it for our suspects. Were It's just about

978
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:22,719
Speaker 1: certain we're never going to find out who the ripper was.

979
00:52:22,960 --> 00:52:25,680
Speaker 1: I do believe he existed. The only chance is if

980
00:52:25,719 --> 00:52:29,440
Speaker 1: somebody stumbles across their great great uncle's journal maybe and

981
00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:32,720
Speaker 1: some whole family papers. Chances are good that if somebody

982
00:52:32,760 --> 00:52:37,000
Speaker 1: stumbles across that, they're not gonna probably want to share it.

983
00:52:37,040 --> 00:52:39,799
Speaker 1: I gotta be honest, I wouldn't. I don't know. I'd

984
00:52:39,800 --> 00:52:42,959
Speaker 1: be highly tempted myself. But there's not that much money

985
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:46,200
Speaker 1: in it though, that's true. But yeah, people think, oh wow,

986
00:52:46,239 --> 00:52:50,280
Speaker 1: I've got this great sensational story and one place offers

987
00:52:50,320 --> 00:52:52,960
Speaker 1: you a little bit of cash. It's gonna be a

988
00:52:53,160 --> 00:52:56,480
Speaker 1: cash cown trying to tell the world, and the world

989
00:52:56,520 --> 00:52:58,920
Speaker 1: doesn't care well exactly it. If you came across the

990
00:52:59,320 --> 00:53:01,960
Speaker 1: same thing for after ripper, that's a different story. Yeah,

991
00:53:02,000 --> 00:53:03,799
Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, like even for me though,

992
00:53:03,840 --> 00:53:08,200
Speaker 1: it's it's you know, it's one thing if the cases

993
00:53:08,280 --> 00:53:12,720
Speaker 1: involved are like missing people. If you find a diary

994
00:53:12,800 --> 00:53:15,319
Speaker 1: of your great uncle who says I murdered all of

995
00:53:15,400 --> 00:53:19,120
Speaker 1: these missing kids and the bodies, that's a matter of

996
00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:23,799
Speaker 1: closure for those families, these families, right, These families all

997
00:53:23,880 --> 00:53:28,840
Speaker 1: know their family members were murdered for what reason who knows?

998
00:53:28,920 --> 00:53:32,320
Speaker 1: And by who? Who knows. But I don't think these families,

999
00:53:32,320 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 1: I don't get the sense that these families are searching

1000
00:53:34,120 --> 00:53:37,440
Speaker 1: for some kind of like grandiose closure, right, so that

1001
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:41,439
Speaker 1: like what what what good does it do? At that point. Well,

1002
00:53:41,480 --> 00:53:43,920
Speaker 1: you know, frankly, it's subsidy. It's like us from talking

1003
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:47,640
Speaker 1: about it. Yeah, it's probably a pointless discussion. Realistically, they're

1004
00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:49,959
Speaker 1: not that many idiots like us talking about this, though

1005
00:53:50,800 --> 00:53:54,080
Speaker 1: according to the Internet there is there's a lot of them. Well,

1006
00:53:54,120 --> 00:53:57,520
Speaker 1: I think it's academic because it's very unlikely anybody's going

1007
00:53:57,600 --> 00:54:00,239
Speaker 1: to come across anything. So come across that old, that

1008
00:54:00,280 --> 00:54:02,120
Speaker 1: old journal of your great uncles and you read the

1009
00:54:02,200 --> 00:54:03,759
Speaker 1: three pages of it and you said you're a great

1010
00:54:03,800 --> 00:54:05,800
Speaker 1: uncle was a boring guy, and you stopped reading it,

1011
00:54:05,800 --> 00:54:08,760
Speaker 1: and that's that. And so I don't think it's gonna happen.

1012
00:54:08,840 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 1: We'll never know unless one day we go back in

1013
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:13,200
Speaker 1: the way back machine. We will, Yeah, because I know

1014
00:54:13,360 --> 00:54:15,160
Speaker 1: the thing about it is I know the dates of

1015
00:54:15,200 --> 00:54:18,239
Speaker 1: the murders, and I know the addresses. Yeah, we've got intersections,

1016
00:54:18,520 --> 00:54:21,160
Speaker 1: and we are white people. Yeah, it would be very

1017
00:54:21,160 --> 00:54:26,480
Speaker 1: easy lend right in. Yeah. Yeah, so so much for

1018
00:54:26,520 --> 00:54:29,239
Speaker 1: the Atlanta River. But anyway, folks, now, now you know

1019
00:54:29,280 --> 00:54:31,799
Speaker 1: a little bit more about one more serial killer than

1020
00:54:31,840 --> 00:54:34,400
Speaker 1: you ever heard of. Yeah, it's perfect. That's why you

1021
00:54:34,400 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 1: listen to us, Right, You shouldn't leave your house because

1022
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:40,879
Speaker 1: they're everywhere. Just stay inside and listen to us from home.

1023
00:54:41,680 --> 00:54:46,520
Speaker 1: Don't even work from home. No, there will be no

1024
00:54:46,560 --> 00:54:49,800
Speaker 1: working from home. Just shut yourself in the basement, build

1025
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:53,440
Speaker 1: yourself a little bunker that you can live in, sell

1026
00:54:53,480 --> 00:54:55,400
Speaker 1: the house to other people, live in your bunker in

1027
00:54:55,400 --> 00:54:58,799
Speaker 1: your basement. It sounds good, right, perfect? Yeah, you guys

1028
00:54:58,800 --> 00:55:04,520
Speaker 1: have any more theories? Yeah? Yeah, okay, well let me

1029
00:55:04,600 --> 00:55:08,719
Speaker 1: let me hand out a few useful factoids here. You

1030
00:55:08,800 --> 00:55:10,759
Speaker 1: probably want to like know what our website as well.

1031
00:55:10,760 --> 00:55:14,719
Speaker 1: Our website is thinking Sideways podcast dot com, where you

1032
00:55:14,760 --> 00:55:19,160
Speaker 1: can download episodes, you can leave comments, check our links

1033
00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:22,440
Speaker 1: because we always post links to the various resources for

1034
00:55:22,480 --> 00:55:25,799
Speaker 1: these mysteries. And of course you're probably listening to us

1035
00:55:25,840 --> 00:55:28,440
Speaker 1: on iTunes. If you're not listening to us on iTunes,

1036
00:55:28,560 --> 00:55:31,279
Speaker 1: you can subscribe to us there and also leave us

1037
00:55:31,320 --> 00:55:35,000
Speaker 1: a review, a good review, preferably, And you can stream

1038
00:55:35,080 --> 00:55:39,160
Speaker 1: us from anywhere. I think every website, yeah, not even

1039
00:55:39,200 --> 00:55:44,000
Speaker 1: streaming websites anymore, it's every website. Yeah, you know Huffington Post,

1040
00:55:44,320 --> 00:55:47,040
Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. Yeah. And if you can't stream us, fro

1041
00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:50,080
Speaker 1: Huffington Post and just send them a lot of angry emails,

1042
00:55:50,200 --> 00:55:55,360
Speaker 1: lots of emails. Uh uh. That's we are on Facebook

1043
00:55:55,719 --> 00:55:58,440
Speaker 1: and you can like us and follow us, join the group,

1044
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:01,480
Speaker 1: and there's all kinds of fun in that group. On Twitter,

1045
00:56:01,680 --> 00:56:05,239
Speaker 1: Thinking Sideways we left off the g because we're so

1046
00:56:05,400 --> 00:56:07,440
Speaker 1: hip and there was a character live it too, right

1047
00:56:08,080 --> 00:56:11,040
Speaker 1: yeah yeah, and our email of course Thinking Sideways podcast

1048
00:56:11,120 --> 00:56:14,200
Speaker 1: at gmail dot com. You can communicate with us with

1049
00:56:14,320 --> 00:56:16,120
Speaker 1: us there. We just want to tell us how awesome

1050
00:56:16,160 --> 00:56:19,040
Speaker 1: we are. That's cool, or how not so awesome, or

1051
00:56:19,040 --> 00:56:21,200
Speaker 1: if you have a suggestion those are nice. That's a

1052
00:56:21,200 --> 00:56:24,480
Speaker 1: good place, you know. Uh. I guess I'm just gonna

1053
00:56:24,520 --> 00:56:27,520
Speaker 1: go ahead and say again, uh, leaving us a comment

1054
00:56:27,719 --> 00:56:30,319
Speaker 1: on like iTunes of like why you don't like the

1055
00:56:30,360 --> 00:56:33,799
Speaker 1: show or like the sound quality is bad? Don't Those

1056
00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:36,719
Speaker 1: are all email at well. The problem is a lot

1057
00:56:36,719 --> 00:56:40,120
Speaker 1: of that is episode specific, and that we've been saying

1058
00:56:40,160 --> 00:56:43,320
Speaker 1: that in the last six months. It's in the back catalog,

1059
00:56:43,360 --> 00:56:45,920
Speaker 1: and usually it's folks who have listened to one episode

1060
00:56:45,960 --> 00:56:49,040
Speaker 1: and have made their decision. I just if you have

1061
00:56:49,160 --> 00:56:51,000
Speaker 1: something you want to discuss with us, do it in

1062
00:56:51,040 --> 00:56:52,799
Speaker 1: a format that you can discuss with us, send us

1063
00:56:52,840 --> 00:56:56,200
Speaker 1: an email to meet at us, do it on Facebook.

1064
00:56:56,400 --> 00:56:58,920
Speaker 1: Something that we can interact with you on or reddit.

1065
00:56:59,120 --> 00:57:01,520
Speaker 1: You know, that's supper, and frankly, if it comes to

1066
00:57:01,560 --> 00:57:04,040
Speaker 1: our email account, we're a lot more likely to see it. Yeah,

1067
00:57:04,360 --> 00:57:07,359
Speaker 1: I don't know. I patrol those other ones pretty heavily. Yeah. Well,

1068
00:57:07,360 --> 00:57:09,280
Speaker 1: I mean there's nothing you can do on things like iTunes.

1069
00:57:09,360 --> 00:57:12,280
Speaker 1: That's what you're getting. That's what we can't say anything

1070
00:57:12,280 --> 00:57:15,160
Speaker 1: when iTunes is iTunes and we're done. But if you

1071
00:57:15,239 --> 00:57:17,040
Speaker 1: genuinely don't like us, leave us about a review on

1072
00:57:17,040 --> 00:57:21,760
Speaker 1: iTunes on I prefer you go to the Humpington Post

1073
00:57:21,800 --> 00:57:26,160
Speaker 1: and leave. That's some nasty comments in the comments section.

1074
00:57:26,880 --> 00:57:32,000
Speaker 1: But yeah, whatever, if you have to do that, I guess, uh,

1075
00:57:32,200 --> 00:57:34,680
Speaker 1: we have a subreddit, so go check out the subreddit.

1076
00:57:34,680 --> 00:57:35,840
Speaker 1: I'm not sure. I haven't. I haven't looked at it

1077
00:57:35,840 --> 00:57:39,880
Speaker 1: for a while. Is anything going on out there? It's great? Yeah,

1078
00:57:39,880 --> 00:57:42,440
Speaker 1: that's cool. Okay. Oh and last of all, this is

1079
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:44,560
Speaker 1: a part where the phone start ringing in the background.

1080
00:57:45,040 --> 00:57:47,800
Speaker 1: You can go to patriarch dot com if you want

1081
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:50,920
Speaker 1: to support us. You can actually pledge money, like, you know,

1082
00:57:51,160 --> 00:57:53,360
Speaker 1: a dollar an episode or gud knows what. And if

1083
00:57:53,400 --> 00:58:01,120
Speaker 1: you send an episode, who absolutely stripped the optional folks

1084
00:58:01,160 --> 00:58:03,400
Speaker 1: you don't have to do it at all, but if

1085
00:58:03,400 --> 00:58:05,080
Speaker 1: you feel like it and you want to support us,

1086
00:58:05,080 --> 00:58:07,760
Speaker 1: and you know, that's cool. So that's Patreon dot com

1087
00:58:08,040 --> 00:58:12,360
Speaker 1: slash thinking sideways. And we've also got the PayPal which

1088
00:58:12,400 --> 00:58:14,080
Speaker 1: is also on the website if you just want to

1089
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:16,480
Speaker 1: do it one time, which is awesome. And we've got

1090
00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:20,040
Speaker 1: the merchandise. Got cool merchandise. Yeah, and so yeah, that's

1091
00:58:20,160 --> 00:58:22,880
Speaker 1: a little through the right hand panel on the website. Yeah, yeah,

1092
00:58:23,160 --> 00:58:26,960
Speaker 1: right on. Anyway, that's about it from here. Um uh,

1093
00:58:27,280 --> 00:58:29,479
Speaker 1: you guys have any more thoughts about the line ripper

1094
00:58:29,600 --> 00:58:32,280
Speaker 1: or anything else? Yeah, I just don't. Yeah, I think

1095
00:58:32,320 --> 00:58:39,120
Speaker 1: he's dead by now. Probably doesn't. Yeah, You're logic's quite sounding.

1096
00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:41,920
Speaker 1: I love you. Put it another way as sure as hell.

1097
00:58:42,000 --> 00:58:47,200
Speaker 1: Hope he's dead. Yeah yeah, okay. Anyway, so for this week,

1098
00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:50,479
Speaker 1: I'm signing off to lu by guys by