1 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:06,080 Speaker 1: Soon. 2 00:00:08,720 --> 00:00:14,200 Speaker 2: Welcome to the Ozone Podcast with Jaguars senior writer John Osher. 3 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:17,640 Speaker 2: All Right, welcome into this week's Ozone podcast, and I 4 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:19,680 Speaker 2: think it's going to be a special one for people 5 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:24,919 Speaker 2: who are on the internet on social media probably hearing that. 6 00:00:25,600 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 2: Our guest today, Jeff Howe, who's the national insider for 7 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:32,319 Speaker 2: The Athletic, has written an outstanding story on Jaguars head 8 00:00:32,360 --> 00:00:35,760 Speaker 2: coach Liam Cohen and has been a lot written about Liam, 9 00:00:35,800 --> 00:00:39,120 Speaker 2: but this one was special. Goes into his relationship with 10 00:00:39,159 --> 00:00:41,600 Speaker 2: his late mother Beth, his father Tim, who's around the 11 00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:46,200 Speaker 2: Jaguars a lot, and specifically it's the first time Liam 12 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:49,319 Speaker 2: has really talked about the death of his mother by 13 00:00:49,360 --> 00:00:52,400 Speaker 2: suicide in two thousand and six. I believe it was 14 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 2: after dealing with pretty devastating effects of lime disease, and 15 00:00:59,120 --> 00:01:01,480 Speaker 2: I think I've got the details of that right. Jeff, 16 00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:07,280 Speaker 2: first of all, appreciate you doing this, and you told 17 00:01:07,280 --> 00:01:09,920 Speaker 2: me right before we started this you've known Liam, you 18 00:01:09,959 --> 00:01:12,560 Speaker 2: went to UMass with Liam and have known him for 19 00:01:12,600 --> 00:01:14,920 Speaker 2: a long time and said it was a really special 20 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:20,559 Speaker 2: story to do. And again, of congratulations is the right word, 21 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:22,319 Speaker 2: but outstanding job on the story. 22 00:01:22,800 --> 00:01:24,840 Speaker 1: I appreciate that. Thank you, Yeah, and I have. 23 00:01:25,000 --> 00:01:29,759 Speaker 3: I've known Liam for twenty years and our paths continue 24 00:01:29,760 --> 00:01:34,120 Speaker 3: to intersect, but it's you know, personally and professionally. But 25 00:01:34,160 --> 00:01:37,160 Speaker 3: we've had a personal relationship for about twenty years, and 26 00:01:37,880 --> 00:01:41,520 Speaker 3: it started professionally is a loose term because he was 27 00:01:41,560 --> 00:01:43,760 Speaker 3: a college quarterback and I was a college reporter, but 28 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:46,640 Speaker 3: you know, I covered the U. Mass football team for 29 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 3: the UMass or the Massachusetts Daily Collegian, and I still 30 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:53,040 Speaker 3: remember his first appearance. Tim Day was the U Mass 31 00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:55,880 Speaker 3: starting quarterback at the time, and Tim got hurt, and 32 00:01:55,920 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 3: Tim is Ryan Day's brother, Ryan Day. The Ohio State 33 00:01:59,800 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 3: had coach and Liam comes in and they had a 34 00:02:02,880 --> 00:02:06,640 Speaker 3: really really good roster and you just needed good, smart 35 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:09,880 Speaker 3: quarterback play and you got a red shirt freshman coming 36 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:11,720 Speaker 3: in and you weren't sure what was going to happen, 37 00:02:11,800 --> 00:02:14,480 Speaker 3: and the next thing you know, the guy's playing phenomenal, 38 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:19,080 Speaker 3: phenomenal football, and it's just sort of took off from there. 39 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:21,760 Speaker 3: But somebody that I grew close to just you know, 40 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:25,040 Speaker 3: from a coverage perspective, the quarterback is obviously. 41 00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:25,880 Speaker 1: Going to be somebody you want to talk to. 42 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:29,600 Speaker 3: But yeah, really started to get a good relationship with 43 00:02:29,639 --> 00:02:32,040 Speaker 3: Liam and a lot of players and Don Brown and 44 00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:34,280 Speaker 3: the coaches with that program at the time. I mean, 45 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:36,440 Speaker 3: you know, it's UMass football. At the time, they were 46 00:02:36,440 --> 00:02:38,120 Speaker 3: in one Double A. So it's not like there was 47 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:40,760 Speaker 3: a lot of media around, even when they had that 48 00:02:40,880 --> 00:02:44,320 Speaker 3: national championship run to the one Double A finals a 49 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:47,519 Speaker 3: year later. You know, there's there's only so many reporters 50 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:52,120 Speaker 3: who were around, and certainly so many who care. So 51 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:54,280 Speaker 3: it was easy to kind of realize that we were 52 00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:56,120 Speaker 3: like minded people. I mean, there were a bunch of 53 00:02:56,200 --> 00:03:00,720 Speaker 3: days that I spent in the football offices just talking 54 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 3: with the guys, learning about learning the game. I mean, 55 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:06,320 Speaker 3: I just I've said it a bunch of times publicly privately, 56 00:03:06,520 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 3: you know, to these people like Don Brown has taught 57 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:11,919 Speaker 3: me more about football than anybody I'll ever meet, because 58 00:03:11,919 --> 00:03:14,680 Speaker 3: he always cared to take the time to explain things 59 00:03:14,680 --> 00:03:18,080 Speaker 3: to me. And you know, Liam was very similar. And 60 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:20,240 Speaker 3: you know, I can't even tell you how many times 61 00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:22,800 Speaker 3: I'd be hanging out with Liam in the coach's office 62 00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:26,480 Speaker 3: and Don would step in or vice versa, and you know, 63 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:28,760 Speaker 3: one next thing, you know, you're spending a couple hours 64 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 3: just shooting the breeze with some people down there and 65 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 3: just trying to learn as much as you can. And 66 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:35,560 Speaker 3: here we are twenty years later, and you know I 67 00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:39,880 Speaker 3: brought this too, this magazine that I was the editor 68 00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:44,080 Speaker 3: of The Score, so as the sports editor of the 69 00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:46,800 Speaker 3: student newspaper, I was responsible of putting that out in 70 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 3: the spring of six right before I graduated. We chose 71 00:03:51,520 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 3: Liam as the cover athlete with Brandon Thomas the basketball 72 00:03:54,720 --> 00:03:58,520 Speaker 3: player there and that picture right in the middle of 73 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:00,800 Speaker 3: the campus, right right in front of the Man's Statue 74 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:03,120 Speaker 3: at UMass in a very well traveled area. 75 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 1: I want to say. 76 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:06,320 Speaker 3: It was like a Thursday in the spring on the afternoon, 77 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:08,960 Speaker 3: so you know, there are thousands of kids walking around 78 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:13,040 Speaker 3: going to class, coming from class whatever, and you've got 79 00:04:13,040 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 3: Liam in full football uniform next to the you know, 80 00:04:16,080 --> 00:04:18,560 Speaker 3: the biggest statue on campus. 81 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:21,200 Speaker 1: And it was just it was a really funny site. 82 00:04:21,720 --> 00:04:24,800 Speaker 3: And I know that's a that's a magazine that I 83 00:04:25,120 --> 00:04:28,800 Speaker 3: my friends still have copies of it. I know Liam's 84 00:04:28,880 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 3: family still has copies of it. So it's it's one 85 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 3: of those things that you know, a bunch of us 86 00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:34,840 Speaker 3: will never forget. 87 00:04:34,960 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 2: It's very cool. It's and uh not to labor, you know, 88 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:44,800 Speaker 2: uh from twenty years ago with Liam's mom. But it 89 00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 2: was such a moving story to read. And I guess 90 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:53,840 Speaker 2: having known him and having been talking to him when 91 00:04:53,839 --> 00:04:57,760 Speaker 2: he was discussing this, it sounds like such a cliche question, 92 00:04:57,800 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 2: but what is her memory meant to him and in 93 00:05:02,640 --> 00:05:04,560 Speaker 2: that relationship, because it was special and you did a 94 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:06,000 Speaker 2: great job talking about in the article. 95 00:05:06,640 --> 00:05:10,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, I had no idea about the tattoos, to be honest, 96 00:05:11,800 --> 00:05:14,919 Speaker 3: and so when I asked him about it and he 97 00:05:14,960 --> 00:05:19,200 Speaker 3: immediately showed me his wrist and her signature, I was 98 00:05:19,279 --> 00:05:22,120 Speaker 3: I was really like blown away by that, and just 99 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:25,600 Speaker 3: it's a way for him to of course channel her anytime, 100 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 3: you know, he's able to. And you know another part, 101 00:05:28,440 --> 00:05:31,520 Speaker 3: I saw his wife Ashley tweet that before every home 102 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:34,479 Speaker 3: game so far this season, Butterfly has flown to the 103 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:37,200 Speaker 3: sideline where he's been and they look at that as 104 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:40,120 Speaker 3: Beth coming in to check on him. I mean, just 105 00:05:41,480 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 3: there's something, you know, things like that that happened that 106 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:46,719 Speaker 3: I don't know sure if you want to think to 107 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:49,040 Speaker 3: a higher power or just what have you. You know, 108 00:05:49,520 --> 00:05:51,960 Speaker 3: it's just it's pretty wild to see things like that. 109 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:53,680 Speaker 1: I mean, I know there are signs. 110 00:05:53,279 --> 00:05:57,159 Speaker 3: With people that you know, we've lost in our lives 111 00:05:57,200 --> 00:06:00,240 Speaker 3: and you see stuff like that pop up and you 112 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 3: just have that feeling that that's somebody trying to let 113 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:05,720 Speaker 3: you know that things are going to be okay. But 114 00:06:05,839 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 3: you know, I know, personally, for me, I had spoken 115 00:06:09,440 --> 00:06:12,159 Speaker 3: to Beth. You know, I still remember. I don't remember 116 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:14,880 Speaker 3: how many times we had spoken, but I vividly remember 117 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:16,760 Speaker 3: one conversation that I had with her, and it was 118 00:06:17,440 --> 00:06:19,719 Speaker 3: for like forty five minutes to an hour, and I 119 00:06:19,800 --> 00:06:22,720 Speaker 3: called the house looking for Tim and I don't think 120 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:25,440 Speaker 3: he was home yet or what have you, and you know, 121 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:26,440 Speaker 3: wound up talking to Beth. 122 00:06:26,520 --> 00:06:28,640 Speaker 1: And it wasn't for a story or like an interview. 123 00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:29,520 Speaker 1: It wasn't anything like that. 124 00:06:29,560 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 2: It was just which comes across in the story by the. 125 00:06:32,839 --> 00:06:36,520 Speaker 1: Way, Yeah, yeah, yeah. She was an outstanding person, just 126 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:37,440 Speaker 1: a beautiful soul. 127 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:42,320 Speaker 3: And we were talking about school and homework and classes, 128 00:06:42,440 --> 00:06:44,560 Speaker 3: and she wanted to know how Liam was doing and 129 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:48,720 Speaker 3: stuff like that. So when I say that, you know, 130 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:54,440 Speaker 3: I always I put a lot of pressure on myself 131 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:59,640 Speaker 3: to write features that have sensitive topics. I put a 132 00:06:59,680 --> 00:07:02,560 Speaker 3: lot of responsibility on myself to make sure that the 133 00:07:02,600 --> 00:07:07,880 Speaker 3: subject is comfortable and happy with how that story turns 134 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:12,400 Speaker 3: out that's incredibly important to me. And you know, there 135 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:15,280 Speaker 3: are times when like I have my process that I 136 00:07:15,320 --> 00:07:17,200 Speaker 3: go through when I write features, and it's not as 137 00:07:17,320 --> 00:07:20,880 Speaker 3: frequent anymore, but this one was different because it was 138 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:24,800 Speaker 3: personal and it just it meant a lot to make 139 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:29,680 Speaker 3: sure that the legacy of Beth and the way that 140 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:33,080 Speaker 3: it was read by the family it hit the right 141 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:37,720 Speaker 3: chord and delivered with the respect that it absolutely deserved 142 00:07:37,720 --> 00:07:38,200 Speaker 3: and needed. 143 00:07:41,640 --> 00:07:45,240 Speaker 2: You know, and I'm quite sure how to ask, but 144 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 2: why do you think or when you were talking to him, 145 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:51,320 Speaker 2: what you know sort of gave you the impression that 146 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:53,200 Speaker 2: he was sort of ready to talk about this now. 147 00:07:53,920 --> 00:07:56,760 Speaker 2: And it may not be a fair question because you're 148 00:07:56,800 --> 00:07:58,720 Speaker 2: not him, but you know, he had not talked about 149 00:07:58,720 --> 00:07:59,520 Speaker 2: this publicly before. 150 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:05,119 Speaker 3: Yeah, through you know, our connection. I've known the story 151 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 3: for you know, since it happened, and it was going 152 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:15,560 Speaker 3: down to Jacksonville two or three weeks ago whenever it 153 00:08:15,600 --> 00:08:20,200 Speaker 3: happened to be recently. Of course, I wanted to write 154 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:23,119 Speaker 3: a story about the person Liam Call and the person 155 00:08:23,680 --> 00:08:25,720 Speaker 3: in a way that I could write it, and I 156 00:08:25,840 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 3: wasn't sure what the direction would be. 157 00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:29,800 Speaker 1: I went down there. 158 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:33,960 Speaker 3: I'm with pages upon pages of different types of topics 159 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:36,880 Speaker 3: that we could address, and not knowing how much time 160 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:38,840 Speaker 3: we were going to have to hit on all of them, 161 00:08:39,080 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 3: you know, just trying to like fire off one at 162 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,880 Speaker 3: a time. And you know Liam, you know, he laughs 163 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:46,800 Speaker 3: at himself. He loves to talk. So you could ask 164 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:48,600 Speaker 3: a question. The next thing you know, you're seven minutes 165 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:51,320 Speaker 3: later and it's like, all right, I had sixteen different 166 00:08:51,360 --> 00:08:54,240 Speaker 3: follow ups, but that might that might take up our 167 00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:55,040 Speaker 3: entire window. 168 00:08:55,160 --> 00:08:57,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, there's a passion for educating that. I'm sure it 169 00:08:57,200 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 2: came from Beth. 170 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:02,040 Speaker 1: I mean absolutely. And I just asked. 171 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:07,120 Speaker 3: I was curious if he was comfortable speaking on that topic, 172 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:12,720 Speaker 3: and he was. And I really appreciate that, and I've 173 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:16,080 Speaker 3: told him that, and I just I really do. 174 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:18,000 Speaker 1: I appreciate anybody who's willing. 175 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:23,439 Speaker 3: To not just open up about a sensitive subject, but 176 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:29,400 Speaker 3: to almost welcome me as a person who they trust 177 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:30,280 Speaker 3: to tell that story. 178 00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:33,680 Speaker 1: And I don't ever take that lightly. 179 00:09:34,360 --> 00:09:38,200 Speaker 3: There's just so much responsibility and when somebody is going 180 00:09:38,240 --> 00:09:41,400 Speaker 3: to trust you with information like that, they deserve to 181 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:45,640 Speaker 3: have that story told the right way. And I tried 182 00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 3: like crazy to make sure I was able to do that. 183 00:09:49,320 --> 00:09:52,560 Speaker 2: I should you know, and I don't want this question 184 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:56,959 Speaker 2: to be a cliche, but in getting to know Tim 185 00:09:56,960 --> 00:09:59,400 Speaker 2: a little bit, because he's around a lot, and I 186 00:09:59,400 --> 00:10:01,760 Speaker 2: don't pretend know him know him, but you know, you 187 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 2: could tell what kind of guy is I think you 188 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:10,000 Speaker 2: know you mentioned it and I've been I just met 189 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:13,280 Speaker 2: Liam when he got here, but you can really tell. 190 00:10:13,840 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 2: I knew he was going to be a good offensive coordinator, 191 00:10:16,120 --> 00:10:19,400 Speaker 2: I mean, and a good play caller. What you didn't 192 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 2: know about him was how he would connect to players, 193 00:10:22,600 --> 00:10:25,280 Speaker 2: because as you know you've covered the league, that's the 194 00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:28,120 Speaker 2: most important thing and not every head coach can do 195 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:31,040 Speaker 2: it because a lot of coordinators can't do it because 196 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:34,360 Speaker 2: they've been coordinators of their lives. Yeah, he has been 197 00:10:35,160 --> 00:10:39,400 Speaker 2: obviously unbelievable at connecting with the locker room and being 198 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 2: a leader, which you just don't know about a head coach. 199 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:47,400 Speaker 2: I'm assuming that Tim and Beth the upbringing everything you know. 200 00:10:48,480 --> 00:10:50,400 Speaker 2: To me, that's got to be a huge part of 201 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:52,160 Speaker 2: why he's top tier at that. 202 00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:55,320 Speaker 1: And that was truly like the goal. 203 00:10:55,559 --> 00:11:01,160 Speaker 3: And if we didn't address, you know, the really sensitive 204 00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 3: stuff about Beth's story, that was still going to be 205 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:08,040 Speaker 3: part of the subject. Just growing up with this family, 206 00:11:08,200 --> 00:11:11,520 Speaker 3: because again, like I've seen it, I've seen how quality 207 00:11:11,640 --> 00:11:14,439 Speaker 3: these people are and this family is, and what a 208 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:17,720 Speaker 3: quality person Liam is and always has been. 209 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:21,480 Speaker 1: Just he just is, and so. 210 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:26,360 Speaker 3: You know, you just wanted to make sure that, however 211 00:11:26,440 --> 00:11:29,240 Speaker 3: he wanted to go about it, let's just try to 212 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:31,880 Speaker 3: make sure that we show people a side of Liam 213 00:11:31,920 --> 00:11:34,760 Speaker 3: that I've been fortunate enough to know for twenty years. 214 00:11:34,800 --> 00:11:40,400 Speaker 3: And it's easy to get lost in, you know, some 215 00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 3: of the side stuff. I mean, they drove me crazy 216 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:47,080 Speaker 3: when like the Duval thing took off, Like I understand it, 217 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:49,320 Speaker 3: but I was like, man, like I just I just 218 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:53,559 Speaker 3: want people to see that, Like there is a completely, 219 00:11:54,320 --> 00:11:58,400 Speaker 3: a much more genuine, sincere side of Liam that is 220 00:11:58,440 --> 00:12:01,720 Speaker 3: going to make him a successful head coach. You know, 221 00:12:01,840 --> 00:12:05,679 Speaker 3: the fiery stuff with Sala after the game, Like there 222 00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:09,080 Speaker 3: are those those are all genuine parts of you know, 223 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:11,319 Speaker 3: these are parts to him. He's not going to shy 224 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 3: away from who he is as a person, right, but 225 00:12:13,880 --> 00:12:15,600 Speaker 3: like there are these other sides and they're not going 226 00:12:15,679 --> 00:12:18,720 Speaker 3: to draw the attention just because that's that's just not 227 00:12:18,800 --> 00:12:20,719 Speaker 3: the way that you know, some of these it is 228 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:23,040 Speaker 3: not the way the new cycle works a lot of times, right, 229 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:25,760 Speaker 3: So it was you know, how can we go there 230 00:12:25,880 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 3: and do this the right way if that's the way 231 00:12:28,080 --> 00:12:29,800 Speaker 3: that he wants to be able to do it. And 232 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:35,200 Speaker 3: that's just really how it all came together. And yeah, 233 00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:37,080 Speaker 3: I think there was something else, oh, you know, just 234 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:39,000 Speaker 3: in terms of like the coaching and who's going to 235 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:39,760 Speaker 3: be successful. 236 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:40,320 Speaker 1: You know. 237 00:12:40,679 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 3: So I covered the Patriots from oh nine to twenty 238 00:12:43,080 --> 00:12:45,960 Speaker 3: one before I transitioned into our one of our top 239 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:50,160 Speaker 3: NFL reporters, and I really started to learn or gain 240 00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:53,560 Speaker 3: more of an appreciation for how difficult of a job 241 00:12:53,559 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 3: it is to be a head coach, and especially the 242 00:12:55,920 --> 00:12:58,520 Speaker 3: first time guys, like the the amount of commitments that 243 00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:00,560 Speaker 3: they have that are that have noting to do with 244 00:13:00,600 --> 00:13:03,559 Speaker 3: football they have to take on, especially in the offseason. 245 00:13:04,120 --> 00:13:06,600 Speaker 3: It's like through the roof. There's just so many different 246 00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:08,359 Speaker 3: people pulling you in a lot of different. 247 00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:10,640 Speaker 2: Directions, and coaching anymore you're managing. 248 00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. 249 00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:16,720 Speaker 3: So like I can rattle off probably ten people in 250 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:19,600 Speaker 3: the last five years who I was convinced we're going 251 00:13:19,679 --> 00:13:22,160 Speaker 3: to be really not ten, ten is probably five to 252 00:13:22,280 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 3: seven people who I was convinced we're gonna be good 253 00:13:24,840 --> 00:13:27,440 Speaker 3: head coaches and it didn't work out, and maybe it 254 00:13:27,480 --> 00:13:29,720 Speaker 3: was because of their own mistakes, maybe it was because 255 00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:34,440 Speaker 3: of organizational issues. Whatever it could be any reason, you 256 00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:39,520 Speaker 3: truly never know. And you know, the next big challenge, well, 257 00:13:39,559 --> 00:13:41,720 Speaker 3: I mean, aside from like the second half of the season, 258 00:13:41,720 --> 00:13:42,959 Speaker 3: the second half of the season is going to be 259 00:13:42,960 --> 00:13:46,080 Speaker 3: an extraordinary challenge for the Jaguars to continue trying to make. 260 00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:47,040 Speaker 1: A push for the playoffs. 261 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:49,040 Speaker 3: But there's going to be that challenge when the Ross 262 00:13:49,080 --> 00:13:52,320 Speaker 3: dress were reset again and going into year two, you 263 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:54,760 Speaker 3: look at Brian Daball, who had a really good first 264 00:13:54,760 --> 00:13:57,000 Speaker 3: season with the Giants, and then you get a little 265 00:13:57,040 --> 00:13:59,560 Speaker 3: farther or a little further away from that previous regime 266 00:13:59,559 --> 00:14:01,360 Speaker 3: and the Ross starts turnover a little more. 267 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:02,600 Speaker 1: You want to bring in more players. 268 00:14:02,920 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 3: Sometimes you know that success is not always in a 269 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:11,000 Speaker 3: straight straight line, so there are always these different types 270 00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:13,960 Speaker 3: of challenges and levels of adversity the coaches are going 271 00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:17,800 Speaker 3: to take. But it was cool to see the Jaguars 272 00:14:17,840 --> 00:14:21,560 Speaker 3: start off successfully, to have the high profile wins against 273 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:23,800 Speaker 3: the Niners and the Chiefs, to beat the Chiefs on 274 00:14:23,880 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 3: Monday Night football for the whole world to see, and 275 00:14:26,760 --> 00:14:29,360 Speaker 3: to kind of let the league know that, yes, this 276 00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:33,200 Speaker 3: this guy can coach. And you know, I don't want 277 00:14:33,200 --> 00:14:34,880 Speaker 3: to blow smoke and say that I knew that he 278 00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:36,480 Speaker 3: was going to be a head coach in the NFL 279 00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:39,080 Speaker 3: or whatever, but I certainly started to wake up to 280 00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:40,840 Speaker 3: that fact when he joined the Rams and I saw 281 00:14:40,840 --> 00:14:43,640 Speaker 3: how much Sehn McVay appreciated him. And then you see 282 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:46,200 Speaker 3: the way that mcveigh's tree started to go out and 283 00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:48,840 Speaker 3: have success on their terms, and knowing that eventually the 284 00:14:48,880 --> 00:14:51,640 Speaker 3: clock was starting to tick on Liam's time. And then 285 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:53,680 Speaker 3: he has all that success as the play caller for 286 00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:56,960 Speaker 3: the first time with Kentucky, which is a huge challenge, 287 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 3: and you know he was great at it, and you know, 288 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 3: kind of back and forth between the Kentucky and the Rams, 289 00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:04,920 Speaker 3: and then you know, having all that success in Tampa. 290 00:15:05,480 --> 00:15:07,760 Speaker 3: I thought, once once things started to go really well 291 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:09,480 Speaker 3: in Tampa, it was only a matter of time before 292 00:15:09,520 --> 00:15:13,760 Speaker 3: he became a head coach. And you're seeing the the 293 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:16,200 Speaker 3: Jaguars are currently reaping the benefits of the way that 294 00:15:16,240 --> 00:15:19,720 Speaker 3: he is able to connect with players and to scheme 295 00:15:19,800 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 3: up an opponent. 296 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:24,880 Speaker 2: What you know, I'm not sure if this question applies. 297 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:26,360 Speaker 2: We talked about a lot of it, But I'll ask 298 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 2: it anyway. I know from writing the kind of story 299 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 2: that you wrote, you research a million things to get 300 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:39,080 Speaker 2: to five or six things that you can really emphasize, right, 301 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:41,840 Speaker 2: Anything that you didn't get in the story that you 302 00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:43,840 Speaker 2: would want people to know about Liam. 303 00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:45,760 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. 304 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:50,520 Speaker 3: Between yeah, I'd like eight and ten thousand words of quotes, 305 00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:52,560 Speaker 3: and I think it was a story that probably didn't 306 00:15:52,880 --> 00:15:56,200 Speaker 3: surpass twenty five hundred words. So there was I could 307 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:58,200 Speaker 3: write like a half a book off of the stuff 308 00:15:58,280 --> 00:15:58,760 Speaker 3: that I had. 309 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:02,040 Speaker 2: I say, it's probably because you know him. You you 310 00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:04,880 Speaker 2: know him so well. There's so much, but you know 311 00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 2: it's uh again, honest, gonna put you on the spot. 312 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:12,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, look, I'll go back. I'll tell anybody who will listen. 313 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:15,800 Speaker 3: He was a damn good college quarterback. I mean he 314 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:17,840 Speaker 3: he gets kind of takes a shot at himself in 315 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:19,880 Speaker 3: that story. I immediately was like, man, you're not giving 316 00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:22,960 Speaker 3: yourself enough credit. Like he was a good player for 317 00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:25,480 Speaker 3: a high quality U mass team in the one double 318 00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:27,920 Speaker 3: A level. I mean they didn't go to the national 319 00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:31,240 Speaker 3: championship by Fluke. That was something that was years in 320 00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 3: the making and great coaching, phenomenal defense, I mean, Brandon 321 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:39,280 Speaker 3: London was his top receiver before Victor Cruz. Brandon London 322 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:41,320 Speaker 3: won a Super Bowl at the Giants and seven, like 323 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:42,920 Speaker 3: there's this is a team that had a lot of 324 00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:45,280 Speaker 3: James ahead of bo started in the Super Bowl for 325 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:48,440 Speaker 3: the Patriots and eleven. You know, there were some quality 326 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:50,600 Speaker 3: players on that team, and it was like he just 327 00:16:50,640 --> 00:16:52,640 Speaker 3: had to come in and play decent football and play 328 00:16:52,680 --> 00:16:55,680 Speaker 3: responsible football. And then it eventually kind of morphed and 329 00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:58,560 Speaker 3: it turned into, hey, this guy's pretty good. Let's let's 330 00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:00,800 Speaker 3: kind of expand the playbook. Let's start throwing it deep 331 00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:04,439 Speaker 3: to London. And you know, Jason Peebler and Rashid Rancher, 332 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 3: a bunch of guys who I'm garing not a lot 333 00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:10,359 Speaker 3: of people on this podcast had heard of. But you know, 334 00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:13,600 Speaker 3: Steve Baylark was a really good running back and they 335 00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:15,600 Speaker 3: just they were a really good team. But he was 336 00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:18,120 Speaker 3: a good player. He knew how to manage the game. 337 00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:21,200 Speaker 3: But he had really accurate ball. He was smart, he 338 00:17:21,280 --> 00:17:23,120 Speaker 3: knew where to put it, he didn't turn it over. 339 00:17:23,520 --> 00:17:26,280 Speaker 3: He did everything that you want out of a quarterback. 340 00:17:26,320 --> 00:17:30,199 Speaker 3: And I truly believe, like or I shouldn't say that, 341 00:17:30,680 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 3: I wanted to see what it would have been like 342 00:17:32,800 --> 00:17:34,240 Speaker 3: if he had a chance, Like if it weren't for 343 00:17:34,280 --> 00:17:36,240 Speaker 3: that elbow, what would it have been like if he 344 00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:37,960 Speaker 3: got a chance in an NFL camp? But I'm not 345 00:17:38,000 --> 00:17:39,560 Speaker 3: saying he was going to be a starter or anything 346 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:41,840 Speaker 3: like that, But like I keep going back to, I 347 00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:45,520 Speaker 3: just used this example somewhere else, Like Brian Hoyer was 348 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:47,760 Speaker 3: an undrafted free agent with the Patriots and O. Nine 349 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:51,840 Speaker 3: when I started covering them and winds up beating out 350 00:17:52,640 --> 00:17:56,200 Speaker 3: actually I think Kevin O'Connell, and there were like four 351 00:17:56,280 --> 00:17:57,720 Speaker 3: quarterbacks on that roster No. 352 00:17:57,880 --> 00:17:58,040 Speaker 1: Nine. 353 00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 3: He wasn't beating out Brady, but he beat out every 354 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,000 Speaker 3: everybody else to the point where they only carried two 355 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:04,160 Speaker 3: of them. And then Brian Hoyer had a really good 356 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:07,280 Speaker 3: NFL career ban early as a backup, And you just 357 00:18:07,359 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 3: wondered if Liam's instincts and smarts and creativity with the 358 00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:14,000 Speaker 3: offense was going to be able to lead the way 359 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:15,080 Speaker 3: for that type of success. 360 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:17,320 Speaker 1: But you know, the elbow, The elbow had other ideas. 361 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:22,240 Speaker 2: Sure, what just a final thought, you know, we talked 362 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:26,399 Speaker 2: about Beth a lot, uh as we should have Tim's 363 00:18:26,400 --> 00:18:28,840 Speaker 2: around here a lot. What kind of influence do you 364 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:30,160 Speaker 2: think he had on clear. 365 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:33,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, he was because you see both sides of him, 366 00:18:33,520 --> 00:18:36,400 Speaker 3: and especially in the story, I was happy with how 367 00:18:36,400 --> 00:18:38,520 Speaker 3: that came out, because you got the tough and rugged 368 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:41,400 Speaker 3: side as the football coach, and you know the dad 369 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:45,760 Speaker 3: who's's got that old school mentality, and you know the 370 00:18:45,800 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 3: grandfather has that old school mentality. I mean, there was 371 00:18:49,119 --> 00:18:51,560 Speaker 3: It was a part of the story where Tim opened 372 00:18:51,600 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 3: up about how he had a heart attack in Florida 373 00:18:53,800 --> 00:18:57,480 Speaker 3: at age twenty two and when his family, his parents 374 00:18:57,520 --> 00:19:00,000 Speaker 3: were flying down to go visit him in the hospital, 375 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:02,080 Speaker 3: Tim was like, well, I can't show I can't make 376 00:19:02,119 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 3: them nervous. So even though I just had a heart attack, 377 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:06,960 Speaker 3: I need the nurses to kind of let me know 378 00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:08,720 Speaker 3: when they're walking down the hall so I can prop 379 00:19:08,760 --> 00:19:13,000 Speaker 3: myself up and show everybody that I'm okay. And they 380 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:15,679 Speaker 3: were just you know, stories like that. But then like 381 00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:18,639 Speaker 3: there's the softer side. So you know you're talking about 382 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:22,600 Speaker 3: like Northeast football, whether it's at Salve Regina where Tim 383 00:19:22,720 --> 00:19:24,840 Speaker 3: was the first head coach at D three program, or 384 00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:27,520 Speaker 3: the high school stuff, or you know, you kind of 385 00:19:27,560 --> 00:19:29,679 Speaker 3: go through the New England circle where Liam was Brown 386 00:19:30,119 --> 00:19:32,879 Speaker 3: RII U Mass which made a big. 387 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:35,480 Speaker 2: Deal up there. People down here don't realize, but that's 388 00:19:35,480 --> 00:19:36,480 Speaker 2: a big deal up there. 389 00:19:36,760 --> 00:19:37,119 Speaker 1: Yeah. 390 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:39,920 Speaker 3: And but like these athletic departments don't have a lot 391 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:41,800 Speaker 3: of money, so they're you know, especially at some of 392 00:19:41,800 --> 00:19:45,119 Speaker 3: the smaller schools where these athletes are lucky to get 393 00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 3: a couple pairs of shorts and a T shirt. You know, 394 00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:49,679 Speaker 3: you got to like sign out like a pair of 395 00:19:49,920 --> 00:19:53,680 Speaker 3: radial gym shorts. Like these are places that don't have 396 00:19:53,800 --> 00:19:55,840 Speaker 3: the luxury stuff that you get at a lot of 397 00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:57,320 Speaker 3: the bigger programs down south. 398 00:19:57,520 --> 00:19:59,480 Speaker 1: And so Tim. 399 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:02,119 Speaker 3: Would I go to the you know, U URI and 400 00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:04,720 Speaker 3: Brown and the other colleges in the area and just say, hey, 401 00:20:04,960 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 3: do you have any old equipment that you're not using anymore, 402 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:09,080 Speaker 3: because I want to give it to some kids in 403 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:11,600 Speaker 3: the neighborhood or in town who don't who can't go 404 00:20:11,640 --> 00:20:13,960 Speaker 3: out and afford it. So he would like wander around 405 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:17,119 Speaker 3: and just start giving out cleats and shorts and T shirts. 406 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:18,840 Speaker 3: And it might be a might give a Brown T 407 00:20:18,960 --> 00:20:22,040 Speaker 3: shirt to somebody and Ri cleats to somebody else. But hey, 408 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:23,840 Speaker 3: now all of a sudden, that kid's got a little 409 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:27,440 Speaker 3: college football pride in somebody close to him and maybe 410 00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 3: he wants to come out and give football a try. 411 00:20:29,520 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 3: And it was you know, Tim always wanted to look 412 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:34,560 Speaker 3: out for his players. He had them over the house 413 00:20:34,600 --> 00:20:37,439 Speaker 3: a lot. I was always like, you know, try to 414 00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:39,480 Speaker 3: set them up if they needed money, if they need 415 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 3: you know, with work to get a job, to try 416 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 3: to make sure they weren't getting into any trouble anywhere. 417 00:20:45,359 --> 00:20:47,160 Speaker 3: So he looked out for them and he noticed that 418 00:20:47,160 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 3: that was going to help them play harder for him. 419 00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:53,240 Speaker 3: And you look at the way Liam operates, you know, 420 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:55,159 Speaker 3: he had a quote in the story, it was like, 421 00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:57,399 Speaker 3: if I could get these guys to play hard with me, 422 00:20:57,440 --> 00:20:59,600 Speaker 3: it's gonna make my job easier. And a lot of 423 00:20:59,600 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 3: that stuff kind of continues to hold true with him 424 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:04,280 Speaker 3: as coach. The first time coach, he was very much 425 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:07,200 Speaker 3: aware that he is going to have some shortcomings. It's 426 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:09,119 Speaker 3: hard to figure out how to manage a game and 427 00:21:09,359 --> 00:21:12,399 Speaker 3: be the head coach and call plays and be in 428 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:15,880 Speaker 3: charge of timeouts and replays and all this other stuff. 429 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:19,040 Speaker 1: He's gonna make mistakes. But if these guys see how 430 00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:21,200 Speaker 1: hard he works, and he does. 431 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:24,480 Speaker 3: He doesn't have a share in his offices like he 432 00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:26,680 Speaker 3: doesn't want to sit like he has a chair around 433 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:28,280 Speaker 3: some tables, but he does not have a chair at 434 00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:28,760 Speaker 3: his desk. 435 00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:30,880 Speaker 1: So he's not a guy who's gonna sit down. 436 00:21:30,920 --> 00:21:33,440 Speaker 3: He's always gonna be bouncing from room to room and 437 00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:36,679 Speaker 3: throwing creative ideas of people. And you know, Josh heinz 438 00:21:36,720 --> 00:21:39,040 Speaker 3: Allen was saying something like, you know, I know he's 439 00:21:39,080 --> 00:21:40,840 Speaker 3: not a defensive coach, but he can talk to me 440 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:43,080 Speaker 3: about defensive stuff. And I know it's not just him 441 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:46,399 Speaker 3: regurgitating something that somebody else just told him, like this 442 00:21:46,480 --> 00:21:51,119 Speaker 3: is he's speaking for U him knowledge. And I'm not 443 00:21:51,160 --> 00:21:53,280 Speaker 3: gonna throw anybody else under the bus, but I can 444 00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:56,600 Speaker 3: think of coaches who were put into situations where they 445 00:21:57,680 --> 00:22:02,760 Speaker 3: were trying to fake it and see through that. There 446 00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 3: are you know, if you're going to be if you 447 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:10,000 Speaker 3: want that old school hardcore mentality, no nonsense, you know 448 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:13,200 Speaker 3: it's my way or no way that that doesn't work 449 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:18,040 Speaker 3: in the NFL anymore. You need a otherwise, you need 450 00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:22,600 Speaker 3: an unbelievable amount of credibility already built in. And it's 451 00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:25,320 Speaker 3: just guys want to play for coaches who are invested 452 00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:27,400 Speaker 3: in them as people, and you're going to see more 453 00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:29,840 Speaker 3: and more and more of that you already are, but 454 00:22:29,880 --> 00:22:32,720 Speaker 3: that's been one of the biggest changes in all of coaching, 455 00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:35,560 Speaker 3: I think in the last ten years, more so in 456 00:22:35,600 --> 00:22:36,280 Speaker 3: the last five. 457 00:22:36,800 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 1: And somebody like Liam is perfect for that. 458 00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:43,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, that that's an outstanding place to close because it's 459 00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:46,159 Speaker 2: sort of what I've been searching for in terms of 460 00:22:46,280 --> 00:22:50,480 Speaker 2: you know, when you look at Liam, you know that's 461 00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:52,879 Speaker 2: the nut graph right there, right, I mean, like he 462 00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:57,760 Speaker 2: is the guy who can connect with these players because 463 00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:01,679 Speaker 2: of the credibility he brings in And it's hard as 464 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:04,880 Speaker 2: we with the Jaguars have been trying to sort of uh, 465 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:08,119 Speaker 2: you know, tell his story. Part of it is the 466 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:10,879 Speaker 2: locker room speech is part of it is you know, uh, 467 00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:14,320 Speaker 2: just having won the podium and hearing them. But Jeff, 468 00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:19,159 Speaker 2: your story and you saying these things today sort of 469 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:22,480 Speaker 2: weaves through that and it shows that what we're saying, 470 00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:25,600 Speaker 2: what we're showing is real, right, I mean, like you've 471 00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:30,760 Speaker 2: seen it behind the scenes. So again, outstanding job and uh, 472 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:34,080 Speaker 2: you know saying that in your story and on this podcast, 473 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:36,040 Speaker 2: it's it's it's much appreciated. 474 00:23:36,680 --> 00:23:37,040 Speaker 1: Thank you. 475 00:23:37,119 --> 00:23:40,159 Speaker 3: I will I'll say my running joke with him is 476 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 3: h I coach my daughter's fifth grade soccer team, and 477 00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:45,480 Speaker 3: I was like, man, you gotta stop stealing my post 478 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:49,440 Speaker 3: game speeches. So you gotta get them to we gotta 479 00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:51,600 Speaker 3: get them to cut, like, come up with your own stuff. Man, 480 00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:53,800 Speaker 3: Like I gotta, I gotta stop sharing with him what 481 00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:55,640 Speaker 3: I'm saying to the team because it's, you know, word 482 00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:56,680 Speaker 3: for word a lot of times. 483 00:23:56,840 --> 00:24:02,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'll bet it's word for word. Hey, Jeff, I 484 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:03,920 Speaker 2: can't thank you enough. I know you took about a 485 00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:06,080 Speaker 2: half an hour of your day to do this. I 486 00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:08,399 Speaker 2: know you're promoting the story, but it's also above and 487 00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:12,879 Speaker 2: beyond again outstanding story. I know how hard it is 488 00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:15,280 Speaker 2: to write those well, and you wrote it very very well. 489 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 2: Thank you for joining the ozone podcast. 490 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:19,399 Speaker 1: Jeff. Of course, thanks so much for having me. I 491 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:20,320 Speaker 1: really appreciate it. 492 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:20,359 Speaker 2: You