WEBVTT - Tear It Up & Fighting Back for Trans Lives 0:00:05.040 --> 0:00:09.399 Do do do the thing. The thing, it's could happen here 0:00:09.680 --> 0:00:14.440 a podcast. No, it's it's it's your trying to happen, 0:00:14.520 --> 0:00:17.480 isn't it. They're really it's doing its best. You know, 0:00:17.840 --> 0:00:21.079 they're really going for us. What is you know that 0:00:21.079 --> 0:00:24.919 that thing by Yates, some great beasts slouching to be born, 0:00:25.000 --> 0:00:27.200 Time of Monsters, all that good stuff. That's what's going 0:00:27.240 --> 0:00:31.720 on here with it could happen here. It's the podcast Garrison. Hi, 0:00:32.200 --> 0:00:36.000 how are we doing? So? We're talking about the still 0:00:36.000 --> 0:00:40.120 ongoing and probably well seemingly never ending. Hopefully it will 0:00:40.200 --> 0:00:47.320 end eventually. Uh, the hold up on that one, Garrison, 0:00:50.120 --> 0:00:54.920 the escalating war on trusts people of Yeah, and uh, 0:00:55.160 --> 0:00:58.240 we've we've brought on some some people who have been 0:00:58.760 --> 0:01:01.760 working to organize again to the the kind of wave 0:01:02.000 --> 0:01:07.479 of bills and rhetoric and legislation targeting trans healthcare, targeting 0:01:07.640 --> 0:01:10.959 the just existence of trans people in general. We're talking 0:01:11.000 --> 0:01:14.560 to cat and Ada Roads from Tear it Up, a 0:01:14.760 --> 0:01:21.440 new newer organization, uh, dedicated to specifically specifically fighting against 0:01:21.480 --> 0:01:28.400 these these new bills. Hello, hey friends, Yes, thank you 0:01:28.480 --> 0:01:32.800 so much. Um, we've been we we've been we've been 0:01:32.800 --> 0:01:35.440 talking for a bit because of how these bills have 0:01:36.600 --> 0:01:38.880 been also a thing for a bit. And uh we 0:01:38.959 --> 0:01:43.839 initially met up for trans day visibility. Uh I tagged 0:01:43.880 --> 0:01:49.480 along to go to a protest in Idaho. Um, and 0:01:49.520 --> 0:01:52.360 then we we got on on trans day visibility. We 0:01:52.360 --> 0:01:56.120 we we we cooked up, cooked up plans to sit 0:01:56.160 --> 0:01:58.440 down and have this chat. So it is it. It 0:01:58.520 --> 0:02:02.800 is a little bit late, but it's it doesn't Maybe 0:02:02.800 --> 0:02:05.200 we can have more than one day. Maybe that's a 0:02:05.240 --> 0:02:09.240 good idea. Well, we're not getting remembrance too, so yeah, 0:02:09.360 --> 0:02:11.720 well hopefully we can have more than two days and 0:02:12.240 --> 0:02:15.840 one of them not be just sad um. Yeah, probably too, 0:02:15.880 --> 0:02:19.120 because you know they're still attacking. Oh did they not? 0:02:19.320 --> 0:02:22.520 Did they not stop? Nope? Nope. Our visibility did not, 0:02:22.600 --> 0:02:24.880 in fact scare them back into their cave. All right, 0:02:24.919 --> 0:02:27.200 this is why we need a trans day of one 0:02:27.280 --> 0:02:36.680 free murder. I love this plane. A few problems. Well 0:02:37.320 --> 0:02:40.480 that's a that's a great note to uh. I mean, look, 0:02:40.800 --> 0:02:47.320 Caitlyn Jenner already used hers. She's just christ it's going 0:02:47.360 --> 0:02:53.520 to be my contribution for the day. Wow, this is 0:02:54.800 --> 0:02:58.000 this is gonna really really convince all of the all 0:02:58.040 --> 0:03:00.400 of the on the edge libs who are somehow listening 0:03:00.440 --> 0:03:08.040 to this trying to find a recipe. They thought it 0:03:08.120 --> 0:03:10.600 was tear like a scale and they were like, I 0:03:10.680 --> 0:03:12.920 was trying to work my baking scale. What if I 0:03:12.960 --> 0:03:18.280 could measure of lentils and then arm all your local 0:03:18.320 --> 0:03:22.320 trans women. I would like to make a very very 0:03:22.400 --> 0:03:25.560 trans cooking video in the style of David Lynch's keen 0:03:25.639 --> 0:03:29.760 my video of but that is that is a deep 0:03:29.800 --> 0:03:31.919 cut for all of the lynch heads out there, as 0:03:32.240 --> 0:03:35.040 Lynch fans called themselves. Anyway, we're talking about all of 0:03:35.120 --> 0:03:39.280 all of all the bills talking about um, all of 0:03:39.320 --> 0:03:42.440 the rhetoric that we've seen been specifically increasing the past, 0:03:42.520 --> 0:03:45.600 like the past week as of recording broad past, you know, 0:03:46.000 --> 0:03:48.400 maybe a week or two as of time of release 0:03:49.520 --> 0:03:52.360 for they're like they're they're really going for it, for 0:03:52.480 --> 0:03:56.480 trying to get people to do like just violence against 0:03:56.600 --> 0:03:59.400 people who don't look like how they want them to look. 0:03:59.680 --> 0:04:01.560 And that see, that's basically what they're trying to do. 0:04:02.120 --> 0:04:06.160 And we we'renna, we'renna talking. We're talking a variety of 0:04:06.200 --> 0:04:09.920 topics between we're gonna talk. We're gonna unfortunately discuss like 0:04:09.960 --> 0:04:11.680 the groomer thing. We'll talk about all the bills that 0:04:11.720 --> 0:04:14.000 have and haven't passed in different ways that we can 0:04:14.080 --> 0:04:17.280 kind of stand up against this this this thing that's 0:04:17.320 --> 0:04:20.240 really trying to take take a hold. Um, I guess 0:04:20.240 --> 0:04:23.400 I would like to start by discussing the origin of 0:04:23.520 --> 0:04:25.560 of of Tear it Up and like, how you know 0:04:25.640 --> 0:04:29.000 what what happened to I mean, obviously we know what 0:04:29.160 --> 0:04:31.640 happened to cause this distuct, to cause this thing to 0:04:31.640 --> 0:04:33.560 be prompted, but yeah, what was what was like the 0:04:33.560 --> 0:04:36.440 specific process of being like okay, it's it's all these 0:04:36.480 --> 0:04:39.640 things are happening. Let's actually get a group of people 0:04:39.720 --> 0:04:44.360 together to organize this thing across the country. Yeah, um, 0:04:44.400 --> 0:04:48.320 I guess I can talk about that. So Tear it 0:04:48.400 --> 0:04:53.320 Up actually group pretty directly out of a previous group 0:04:53.360 --> 0:04:56.560 called TROT and Texas, which is the trans Resistance of Texas, 0:04:57.200 --> 0:05:02.040 which started last year during their legislative session, um, and 0:05:02.040 --> 0:05:04.880 then really started to grow during the special sessions in 0:05:04.920 --> 0:05:10.160 response to this constant line of attack and realizing that 0:05:11.480 --> 0:05:15.520 the techniques and the strategy is being employed by a 0:05:15.600 --> 0:05:19.200 lot of the existing more liberal leaning groups were really 0:05:19.200 --> 0:05:23.280 focused on like back room conversations and deals and using 0:05:23.320 --> 0:05:26.640 like procedure to defeat things instead of actually like mobilizing 0:05:26.680 --> 0:05:34.360 people against anti trans state violence. Um and uh. From 0:05:34.400 --> 0:05:37.719 there we started to adopt things like louder, more obnoxious protests, 0:05:37.960 --> 0:05:44.560 a lot of stickering, firing posters. Um. And then this year, 0:05:46.080 --> 0:05:48.880 I so, I originally started TROT, but I moved across 0:05:48.880 --> 0:05:50.960 the country and I was like, wow, ship, things are 0:05:50.960 --> 0:05:54.280 just getting worse everywhere. Um, and I have a lot 0:05:54.279 --> 0:05:57.200 of friends all over the country, from living in Portland 0:05:57.240 --> 0:06:00.560 and New York and Texas and Colorado now the Midwest, 0:06:00.800 --> 0:06:03.880 and reached out to sort of pull together a bunch 0:06:03.920 --> 0:06:07.240 of humans that I knew would be willing to fight 0:06:07.279 --> 0:06:10.839 back and to try and experiment with methods that we 0:06:10.880 --> 0:06:14.880 can pick up from our predecessors, like act up and 0:06:16.160 --> 0:06:19.719 bring more attention and mobilize people more towards taking direct 0:06:19.760 --> 0:06:24.800 action instead of relying on these back room lobbying groups 0:06:24.839 --> 0:06:27.440 I don't think really give a funk about trans people, 0:06:27.520 --> 0:06:31.279 but love to use attacks on us to raise money. Yeah. Yeah, 0:06:31.320 --> 0:06:34.359 I mean there's a number of number of examples we 0:06:34.360 --> 0:06:36.280 could point to, but I think we could be more 0:06:36.279 --> 0:06:42.160 productive and just talk about you guys instead of yeah. 0:06:42.800 --> 0:06:48.400 So yeah, I really the transnational thing is really interesting 0:06:48.440 --> 0:06:51.400 point how it's like, I know, for trans Day visibility, 0:06:51.440 --> 0:06:54.960 there was there was an organized die ins and protests 0:06:55.000 --> 0:06:58.440 all across the country to happen at the same day. Obviously, 0:06:58.640 --> 0:07:02.960 Um there was one night of which I was lucky 0:07:03.040 --> 0:07:06.680 enough to join in on. UM. And yeah, but there 0:07:06.800 --> 0:07:08.880 was there was, there was a lot of them, and 0:07:10.680 --> 0:07:13.240 I guess, yeah, it's on on the lead up to 0:07:14.120 --> 0:07:18.160 like as as all of these bills are escalating. Um. 0:07:18.240 --> 0:07:20.440 And then there was the whole there was the whole 0:07:20.520 --> 0:07:23.520 um wave of organizing against trans people for the so 0:07:23.600 --> 0:07:26.320 called like the Transition Day, which is really unfortunate because 0:07:26.640 --> 0:07:28.320 there actually it would be a great discussion to be 0:07:28.360 --> 0:07:31.320 had there on people who choose to not continue on 0:07:31.360 --> 0:07:34.960 with transition, but it's been so used by turfs and 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:37.880 the gender critical movement that it's now just like it's 0:07:37.880 --> 0:07:42.400 just it's just another day for more transphobia. Just really unfortunate. UM. 0:07:42.440 --> 0:07:44.160 But we had that happening at the same time as 0:07:44.200 --> 0:07:46.800 all of all of these bills, and then we're like, okay, 0:07:46.880 --> 0:07:49.440 so what what what what was what was kind of 0:07:49.440 --> 0:07:52.000 the stuff that prompted all of the guy ins And 0:07:52.120 --> 0:07:54.280 how are you like, um talking with people in all 0:07:54.280 --> 0:07:56.560 the in all the different states to kind of organize 0:07:56.600 --> 0:07:59.760 this thing together, but still also like separately for each location. 0:08:01.760 --> 0:08:03.360 One of the points that I like to come back to, 0:08:03.400 --> 0:08:05.360 like we're going to talk a little bit more about 0:08:05.400 --> 0:08:07.800 the details of the you know, some some of the 0:08:07.840 --> 0:08:11.480 specific legislation that has that hassessed land law and some 0:08:11.520 --> 0:08:13.440 of the other legislation that has not been able to 0:08:13.440 --> 0:08:16.200 pass into law. Um. And you know, we're we're drawing 0:08:16.200 --> 0:08:18.600 a contrast between ourselves and some of Tear it Up 0:08:18.640 --> 0:08:21.520 is drawing a contrast between itself and some of these 0:08:21.560 --> 0:08:26.480 more you know, institutionalist liberal organizations. Um. Not because that 0:08:26.560 --> 0:08:31.480 they not because they can't succeed in their stated goals. Sometimes, right, 0:08:31.560 --> 0:08:33.240 like the A c L you will sue on some 0:08:33.320 --> 0:08:38.000 of these things of those lawsuits, maybe maybe something worth celebrating. 0:08:38.080 --> 0:08:40.040 What's happening in Texas right now is a great example 0:08:40.080 --> 0:08:42.680 of that. But that said, right, so, like we we 0:08:42.760 --> 0:08:46.960 can acknowledge that these that these more institutionalist tactics can 0:08:47.040 --> 0:08:49.600 can lead to, you know, like it's a better outcome 0:08:49.720 --> 0:08:52.800 that these laws do not succeed obviously, Um. But there's 0:08:52.960 --> 0:08:56.280 the impacts of this legislation and the discussion around this 0:08:56.400 --> 0:09:00.360 legislation is so much bigger and so much more found 0:09:00.840 --> 0:09:04.760 than any of these individual laws. You know, is specifically 0:09:04.880 --> 0:09:07.400 looking at them, um in terms of their like material 0:09:07.440 --> 0:09:11.040 impact in people's lives, which are already abysmally fucking awful. 0:09:11.559 --> 0:09:14.760 But like the what the place that teared up is 0:09:14.760 --> 0:09:20.720 looking to kind of champion is but kind of hell 0:09:20.840 --> 0:09:25.120 raising that like enables us to empower each other, that 0:09:25.280 --> 0:09:28.720 enables us to be visible in a way that shows 0:09:28.920 --> 0:09:33.040 people on the ground all across the country that like 0:09:33.480 --> 0:09:37.120 that we are not just a a minority to be 0:09:37.679 --> 0:09:41.120 destroyed and ignored. That we're going to fight for ourselves. 0:09:41.160 --> 0:09:42.960 We're going to fight for each other. We're gonna fight 0:09:43.000 --> 0:09:45.079 for our kids, we're gonna fight for our families, and 0:09:45.120 --> 0:09:47.199 we're going to fight for our rights, and we're gonna 0:09:47.200 --> 0:09:49.800 do it loud and as ugly as we need to 0:09:50.200 --> 0:09:54.040 in order to make sure that trans pain is visible. Yeah, 0:09:54.280 --> 0:10:01.080 And building on that, um that when we look at 0:10:01.120 --> 0:10:08.040 the start of last month March or I guess late February, UM, 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:12.199 I think Texas was really kind of the flash point 0:10:12.280 --> 0:10:14.120 and a lot of the country on this where we 0:10:14.200 --> 0:10:16.839 had a lot of these bills sort of boiling. UM. 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:21.240 I believe they are around seven dy active at that point. 0:10:21.880 --> 0:10:24.880 Um we're now down to like the high sixties, so 0:10:24.920 --> 0:10:29.360 that's better. But that was really where stuff started to 0:10:29.360 --> 0:10:35.280 boil over on this and we looked around and saw 0:10:35.280 --> 0:10:37.719 that the fight needed to focus on trans survival more 0:10:37.760 --> 0:10:42.040 than just the bills. And the bills are important to 0:10:42.120 --> 0:10:46.680 defeat because there things trying to exterminate us. There's things 0:10:46.720 --> 0:10:50.160 that are trying to take families apart, to take away 0:10:50.200 --> 0:10:52.559 the things that are helping people stay alive, and to 0:10:53.360 --> 0:10:58.160 remove trans people from accessing public life, and that's going 0:10:58.200 --> 0:11:01.320 to really ruin a lot of humans. But we need 0:11:01.360 --> 0:11:04.440 to not just look at that individual fight and remember 0:11:04.440 --> 0:11:06.880 we're fighting for survival and we're fighting for each other 0:11:07.840 --> 0:11:11.280 and trans people as a community. We've always had to 0:11:11.679 --> 0:11:14.480 kind of rely on each other via various means, be 0:11:14.559 --> 0:11:19.240 at like Susan's place or like go back to like Transvestia, 0:11:19.320 --> 0:11:23.320 even and like these systems that weren't necessarily always and 0:11:23.360 --> 0:11:28.520 these forms of communication that weren't always focused on um 0:11:29.280 --> 0:11:32.880 necessarily legal winds in the more traditional sense, and more 0:11:32.920 --> 0:11:36.120 just like forming community, even if those communities weren't necessarily great. 0:11:36.160 --> 0:11:40.000 In the case of like Transvestia and like some of 0:11:40.040 --> 0:11:45.200 those much more, um, respectable leaning groups. Could you a 0:11:45.200 --> 0:11:48.040 little talk a little bit about what Transvestia and Susan's 0:11:48.080 --> 0:11:49.839 place work, because I'm gonna guess a lot of people 0:11:49.880 --> 0:11:52.480 listening are not going to be super familiar with that history. 0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:56.480 I kind of am only casually heard anything about it. Yeah, 0:11:56.559 --> 0:11:59.560 so I'm a bit of a queer history nerd um, 0:11:59.600 --> 0:12:01.440 and you could heard a lot about this. Actually I 0:12:01.520 --> 0:12:06.600 have a can I plug my podcast? What we would 0:12:06.600 --> 0:12:08.640 like to do is provide people with an ability to 0:12:08.760 --> 0:12:11.600 learn more about this kind of stuff. So yeah, please Yeah. 0:12:11.679 --> 0:12:15.800 So I'm part of the totally trans podcast network. Um 0:12:15.960 --> 0:12:19.120 you can pronounce some parrot twitter at like totally TransPod. Um. 0:12:19.160 --> 0:12:22.280 But we talked a lot about trans and queer history 0:12:22.360 --> 0:12:24.400 through the lens of like looking at it through pop 0:12:24.440 --> 0:12:29.240 culture and reading stuff into like The Little Mermaid and things. Um. 0:12:29.280 --> 0:12:31.720 So we go in a lot about Virginia Prince and 0:12:31.720 --> 0:12:34.120 transvestian there because I'm kind of obsessed with this human 0:12:34.679 --> 0:12:37.440 from the nineteen sixties who is like the first Twitter 0:12:37.520 --> 0:12:43.760 trans girl. Um. She was very problematic, super racist and classist, 0:12:43.880 --> 0:12:46.280 and her argument was she led to a lot of 0:12:46.360 --> 0:12:53.040 twentieth century confusion by saying, uh that there's like heterosexual transvestites, 0:12:53.280 --> 0:12:55.680 which are what we would now just call like trans lesbians, 0:12:55.920 --> 0:12:58.560 and then like the homosexual trans sexual, which is now 0:12:58.559 --> 0:13:03.440 what we would call straight trans folks, and that the 0:13:03.480 --> 0:13:07.320 homosexual transsexuals are bad and should be shunned, but the 0:13:07.320 --> 0:13:12.160 heterosexual transvestite should maintain all of her previous privileges. Uh, 0:13:12.200 --> 0:13:15.960 And she put out this magazine called Transvestia. She famously 0:13:16.000 --> 0:13:18.480 also got in trouble for sending nudes in the mail 0:13:18.600 --> 0:13:24.400 to another trans girl across the country. Um. Yeah, fascinating 0:13:24.440 --> 0:13:28.640 historical figure who kind of the curve historically in terms 0:13:28.679 --> 0:13:35.920 of sending nudes. That's that's groundbreaking with stuff. But Transvestia though, 0:13:36.880 --> 0:13:39.920 did have this big cultural impact on sort of being 0:13:39.960 --> 0:13:42.360 an early trans zine. Shortly after it, we start to 0:13:42.400 --> 0:13:45.840 see Drag, which um was much more focused on like 0:13:45.960 --> 0:13:51.200 the homosexual trans sexual and more like sexually liberated takes 0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:54.320 through like the seventies, and then later um my favorite 0:13:54.320 --> 0:13:58.680 scene like gender Trash from how which uh was out 0:13:58.720 --> 0:14:01.800 of Toronto and like the nineties and was very confrontational 0:14:02.880 --> 0:14:06.680 about trans rights. So we sort of exist in this 0:14:06.800 --> 0:14:10.560 larger history where we're looking at how trans community has 0:14:10.760 --> 0:14:16.280 survived informed and learning from things like star UM, which 0:14:16.320 --> 0:14:19.840 was the Street Transvestitate Action Revolutionaries UM out of New 0:14:19.920 --> 0:14:23.400 York with Marcia P. Johnson and Sylvia Rivera, as well 0:14:23.440 --> 0:14:27.400 as um act up and HIV activism. And we're trying 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:30.120 to take what we can learn from our ancestors and 0:14:30.160 --> 0:14:33.760 apply it to our current survival and play you with 0:14:33.800 --> 0:14:37.120 it a little bit and update some of their tactics 0:14:37.160 --> 0:14:43.160 because I don't think traditional non violent protests the way 0:14:43.160 --> 0:14:47.760 it existed in the past gets attention anymore. UM, I 0:14:47.760 --> 0:14:49.920 think when you figure out ways to be louder about it. 0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:53.760 And I'm a I'm personally a devout pacivist. Other people aren't, 0:14:53.760 --> 0:14:57.240 and that's a okay. Um, I'm a good Quaker girl. 0:14:57.800 --> 0:15:01.480 But um, we need to be seen. We need our 0:15:01.520 --> 0:15:03.520 lives to be seen, and we know our value as 0:15:03.600 --> 0:15:08.240 humans to be seen so that we can love ourselves 0:15:08.240 --> 0:15:10.840 and each other enough to survive this horrible ship that's 0:15:10.840 --> 0:15:13.040 going to continue happening to us over the next couple 0:15:13.080 --> 0:15:17.360 of years. Yeah, I'm wanna big back on that with 0:15:17.360 --> 0:15:20.000 with one thought that, um, we're talking about this sort 0:15:20.040 --> 0:15:22.800 of like this history of trans people drawing together to 0:15:22.800 --> 0:15:25.560 take care of each other, and you know, I'm just 0:15:25.600 --> 0:15:30.600 thinking about how today, Uh, Marjorie Taylor Green releases a 0:15:30.680 --> 0:15:34.760 video that, amongst a bunch of other just like terrifying, 0:15:34.920 --> 0:15:40.280 awful and occasionally super funny in its incredible stupidity. Um 0:15:40.520 --> 0:15:43.280 things that she's claiming in this video or that like 0:15:43.360 --> 0:15:47.840 trans people are basically like the you know, the barbarian 0:15:48.000 --> 0:15:51.560 hordes that have come to destroy Western civilization. And she's 0:15:51.640 --> 0:15:53.480 you know, she says with a straight face, like, you know, 0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:59.400 the late Rome and modern America are very similar of 0:15:59.480 --> 0:16:03.320 us rely heavily on Verrangian mercenaries in order to maintain 0:16:03.360 --> 0:16:06.320 the sanctity of our borders. I always wanted to be 0:16:06.360 --> 0:16:08.640 a wizard, but I guess I'm a barbarian. But I 0:16:08.920 --> 0:16:11.760 bring that up because there is this impression of trans 0:16:11.800 --> 0:16:15.560 power that like trans people, that is a result of 0:16:15.560 --> 0:16:18.640 our increased visibility, you know, like what the media called 0:16:19.480 --> 0:16:22.120 the transgender tipping point, because suddenly people were like, oh, 0:16:22.160 --> 0:16:26.280 I guess Liver and Cox gets to exist. But like, uh, 0:16:26.440 --> 0:16:28.960 with this increased visibility is this impression that we have 0:16:29.040 --> 0:16:33.960 this like incredible magical cosmic powers to seduce your people 0:16:34.080 --> 0:16:37.840 and ruin your civilization or whatever. And like actually, like 0:16:37.880 --> 0:16:41.320 when I so I came out in two four, three five, 0:16:41.880 --> 0:16:44.480 and like I never imagined a world where we could 0:16:44.520 --> 0:16:47.200 even get healthcare covered when I was, like I was 0:16:47.240 --> 0:16:50.160 like a kid organizing with Camp trans out in the 0:16:50.160 --> 0:16:53.120 woods of Michigan, and like I knew people who got 0:16:53.200 --> 0:16:58.280 orchiectomys in Barns. I every single trans woman, I knew 0:16:58.640 --> 0:17:03.120 everything that they knew about how to like get hormones 0:17:03.160 --> 0:17:07.040 and like manage their own transition and like Endercrian system 0:17:08.000 --> 0:17:12.040 they learned from message boards. It was the only collective 0:17:12.160 --> 0:17:15.600 knowledge in existence that was like accessible to people. Because 0:17:15.720 --> 0:17:18.040 if you went to your doctor, unless you lived in 0:17:18.040 --> 0:17:21.240 San Francisco or New York and we're particularly well connected, 0:17:21.520 --> 0:17:24.879 the response you were going to get is, I don't know, 0:17:24.920 --> 0:17:28.040 are you a demon? Right? Yeah? No, absolutely that That's 0:17:28.080 --> 0:17:30.840 the one thing I found it um really insightful talking 0:17:30.880 --> 0:17:33.320 to the older trans people that I know, because I'm like, 0:17:33.359 --> 0:17:37.359 you know about Jim gen Z gender queer person on hormones, 0:17:37.400 --> 0:17:40.239 And it's very different because when when when I've been 0:17:40.240 --> 0:17:44.040 talking to the my my transgender friends who are older, 0:17:44.040 --> 0:17:47.280 It's like, yeah, all of these bills are just are 0:17:47.320 --> 0:17:51.320 a reaction to the increased visibility and increased well being 0:17:51.320 --> 0:17:53.840 of trans people. Right, it's putting, it's putting things that 0:17:53.960 --> 0:17:57.040 used to be kind of just like unspoken or like 0:17:57.160 --> 0:18:00.200 obvious bigotry, it's putting now that that's actually progressed thing. 0:18:00.320 --> 0:18:03.160 It's now putting that that old bigotry into actual law 0:18:03.480 --> 0:18:05.040 because they're like, oh no, we don't want things to 0:18:05.080 --> 0:18:08.720 progress further. So it's a it's a purposeful sliding back. Um. 0:18:08.840 --> 0:18:10.679 So it's just like for a lot of people who 0:18:10.680 --> 0:18:12.800 are older, it doesn't even seem that new. It's just 0:18:12.840 --> 0:18:15.240 seemed to be. It's it's resurfacing. The things that were 0:18:15.320 --> 0:18:18.280 used to be normalized are now becoming you know, are 0:18:18.320 --> 0:18:21.520 becoming more obviously bigoted. But they're putting that bigotry into 0:18:21.560 --> 0:18:24.959 actual law. Um. And that's the Yeah, that's the kind 0:18:24.960 --> 0:18:27.920 of interesting point is because for there's a whole bunch 0:18:27.920 --> 0:18:32.240 of people who believe that like the transgenderisms and the 0:18:32.320 --> 0:18:35.719 gender ideology is like a point of power. It's like 0:18:35.760 --> 0:18:40.080 because it's affiliated with the left, um, and the left 0:18:40.160 --> 0:18:43.640 is seen as like the power. It's it's then like 0:18:44.040 --> 0:18:46.280 therefore you're actually punching up on it, which is of 0:18:46.280 --> 0:18:48.760 course entirely backwards like that, none of that. If you 0:18:48.760 --> 0:18:51.240 have any political analysis, you'll you'll know like, oh, that's 0:18:51.240 --> 0:18:54.359 not how anything works. But yeah, these people in their minds, 0:18:54.359 --> 0:18:57.199 they think they're actually pushing up against like the like 0:18:57.280 --> 0:19:01.320 the powerful forces of transgenderism. You're like, no, we're just 0:19:01.359 --> 0:19:04.040 like pugs who are poor, who are trying to who 0:19:04.040 --> 0:19:06.600 are trying to get our homeown injections like leave us alone. 0:19:07.080 --> 0:19:11.840 I can't remember. It was like Tom Cotton or Matt Gates, 0:19:10.920 --> 0:19:15.760 yea one of those guys, one of the Pentagone guys, right, 0:19:15.920 --> 0:19:19.919 being like yelling at him because you know, our military 0:19:20.000 --> 0:19:23.080 is being destroyed because somebody put the class about like 0:19:23.160 --> 0:19:26.560 respecting someone's pronouns and the guy's responses like we can 0:19:26.560 --> 0:19:30.320 obliterate any target on the entire planet with no effort. 0:19:30.440 --> 0:19:34.720 Like what the are you talking about? There's there's that 0:19:34.880 --> 0:19:37.959 great there's that hortable, great tweet about the person that 0:19:38.040 --> 0:19:42.520 runs that four Chune trans account. Who's who is who 0:19:42.600 --> 0:19:44.359 is like this this trends person who is like a 0:19:44.359 --> 0:19:48.040 war criminal because they sell weapons. It was, it was, 0:19:49.920 --> 0:19:51.920 it was a wonderful tweet for a few days ago. 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:54.919 I mean one of I mean famously a lot of 0:19:54.960 --> 0:19:57.880 companies in the arms industry like Raytheon have a great 0:19:57.880 --> 0:20:01.080 reputation for hiring trans people because all Raytheon cares about 0:20:01.240 --> 0:20:03.560 is you can go to missile guidance chip. That's all 0:20:03.560 --> 0:20:08.120 that matters to Ray Theon. They're they're they're very woke. Yeah, 0:20:08.200 --> 0:20:10.480 but it is, it is. It is intriguing to watch 0:20:10.640 --> 0:20:14.439 these people really justify their transphobia as a form of 0:20:14.480 --> 0:20:18.240 fighting against the system because they have somehow affiliated of 0:20:18.920 --> 0:20:21.840 being trans with the Democratic Party. Therefore it's affiliated with 0:20:21.880 --> 0:20:25.400 the establishment. Therefore it's actually this force of power, which 0:20:25.680 --> 0:20:28.840 none none of that's, none of that's true. But that 0:20:28.880 --> 0:20:31.800 propaganda is showing to be very effective. But people seem 0:20:31.800 --> 0:20:33.760 really convinced by that because it's it's it's a story 0:20:33.800 --> 0:20:35.919 that's easy to glom onto. And as long as we 0:20:35.920 --> 0:20:37.720 have a story that we can glom onto, then it 0:20:37.760 --> 0:20:39.800 doesn't matter what's true or not. It's it's all of 0:20:39.840 --> 0:20:43.439 the stories are what's actually true. Um So, yeah, that 0:20:43.520 --> 0:20:48.600 is an intriguing, an intriguing point in terms of how, yeah, 0:20:48.640 --> 0:20:51.680 how how it's how stuff has changed from like transphobia 0:20:51.720 --> 0:20:55.960 ten years ago for the transphobia now, how that's resurfacing 0:20:56.000 --> 0:20:58.320 some things that used to be they used to just 0:20:58.400 --> 0:21:04.640 take shape in a slightly different form. Yeah. Well, and 0:21:04.800 --> 0:21:07.040 so Cat's experiences in two thousand and four if you 0:21:07.119 --> 0:21:11.840 pass forward a decade, because I'm a little younger than Cat, 0:21:12.359 --> 0:21:17.280 but not a lot younger than Cat. Um around like 0:21:19.000 --> 0:21:20.920 when I was trying to get on hormones, we also 0:21:20.960 --> 0:21:24.119 had like r l E. The kiddos these days know 0:21:24.160 --> 0:21:29.960 what that was the real So it's real life experience, yeah, um, 0:21:30.040 --> 0:21:34.120 which is basically having to socially transition and come out 0:21:34.280 --> 0:21:36.680 and do all of this under the care of a 0:21:36.720 --> 0:21:40.080 therapist and a physician for between six months and a 0:21:40.119 --> 0:21:45.199 couple of years before they'll allow you to access hormones. Um. 0:21:45.359 --> 0:21:49.840 And uh. That was kind of like the stepping stone 0:21:49.920 --> 0:21:53.800 between the previous experiments where it was just like d 0:21:53.920 --> 0:21:58.639 I Y or nothing, um what was or impossible gatekeeping 0:21:58.760 --> 0:22:01.760 and then now where there's like more informth incentence model 0:22:01.800 --> 0:22:03.320 which is what I which is what I do now? 0:22:03.440 --> 0:22:08.040 Yeah yeah um. And a lot of these laws are 0:22:08.080 --> 0:22:12.639 just kind of reiterating that weight that comes from a 0:22:12.680 --> 0:22:16.720 really like flawed please like that weight didn't in any 0:22:16.720 --> 0:22:20.520 way benefit anyone is really it's just torturing people and 0:22:20.520 --> 0:22:25.880 trying to kind of like, um like beat the traine 0:22:25.880 --> 0:22:28.359 out of you, uh, make you go to the mall 0:22:28.600 --> 0:22:31.600 presenting as a woman while you feel incredibly awkward and 0:22:31.600 --> 0:22:33.480 get yelled at by some guy for like trying to 0:22:33.520 --> 0:22:37.560 buy shoes and he's like yeah, right, yeah, Like if 0:22:37.840 --> 0:22:41.840 if you're a nine year old who is experiencing precocious puberty, 0:22:41.960 --> 0:22:44.679 it is completely acceptable and no one is going to 0:22:44.800 --> 0:22:49.320 question whether or not, um, you know, prescribing puberty blockers 0:22:49.880 --> 0:22:52.800 to just make make make like to make it so 0:22:52.840 --> 0:22:55.000 that you can experience puberty at it what feels like 0:22:55.040 --> 0:23:00.840 a more appropriate developmental age. Uh sis. People, politicians, the 0:23:00.920 --> 0:23:04.400 right wing generally people agree that that is an acceptable practice. 0:23:04.560 --> 0:23:08.160 But to use that same practice in order to help 0:23:08.200 --> 0:23:11.880 a trans child not die, that is a sin against 0:23:11.880 --> 0:23:15.600 God and leading to the decline of Western civilization. We 0:23:16.480 --> 0:23:21.600 wish whatever whatever. People are like, yeah, like trans people 0:23:21.640 --> 0:23:24.400 are are leading into this degeneracy that's going to bring 0:23:24.440 --> 0:23:27.520 down Western civilization. You're like, oh, wow, that's sure. It 0:23:27.560 --> 0:23:42.639 does sound cool for me. Hormones worked so quickly, and 0:23:42.680 --> 0:23:46.440 I would having to live through like a year of 0:23:46.640 --> 0:23:50.360 trying to present in specific ways, well not on hormones. 0:23:50.400 --> 0:23:53.760 Sounds like complete hell, because it is. I was very 0:23:53.760 --> 0:23:57.840 surprised at how fast even like mindset things changed. Um 0:23:57.880 --> 0:24:00.239 how it is like they're very like hormon it's are 0:24:00.320 --> 0:24:02.680 very useful and very interesting and how they and how 0:24:02.720 --> 0:24:05.560 they affect changes and being forced to I guess as 0:24:06.480 --> 0:24:09.159 the term now is like boy moting or girl moting. 0:24:09.480 --> 0:24:10.879 This is this is this is this is what the 0:24:10.960 --> 0:24:14.000 zoomer the Zoomer kids call whenever they have to like 0:24:14.000 --> 0:24:18.199 like almost like code switch gender. Um, having having to 0:24:18.280 --> 0:24:21.760 like present in the way that you want to without 0:24:21.760 --> 0:24:23.800 these systems of hormones for a while, to even be 0:24:23.840 --> 0:24:27.119 allowed to have hormones as mi a zoomer now sounds 0:24:27.119 --> 0:24:31.400 like horrible. It's literally dangerous, like ye, actually an incredibly 0:24:31.480 --> 0:24:34.719 dangerous thing to put people like experience, to put people into. 0:24:34.840 --> 0:24:38.760 And I think that like that kind of gate keeping. Uh, 0:24:39.160 --> 0:24:41.320