1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,880 Speaker 1: Welcome to Katie's Crib, a production of Shonda land Audio 2 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:06,720 Speaker 1: in partnership with I Heart Radio. All the gender biases 3 00:00:07,120 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 1: that we experience as women or anyone that identifies in 4 00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:17,120 Speaker 1: a feminized way, it's it's so layered in deep, it's 5 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:19,520 Speaker 1: it's it's about the kind of care we get in 6 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:22,239 Speaker 1: our bodies. It's about you know, what ends up in 7 00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:25,159 Speaker 1: our bank account. It's about you know, the language we 8 00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:28,120 Speaker 1: used to describe ourselves, and so you know, I think 9 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:31,800 Speaker 1: learning about your body and having that baseline understanding is 10 00:00:31,880 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 1: really the beginning of that of that type of activism, 11 00:00:35,479 --> 00:00:47,200 Speaker 1: baseline level exactly. Hello everybody, and welcome back to Katie's Crib. 12 00:00:48,080 --> 00:00:51,839 Speaker 1: I am so um happy with this episode and how 13 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:56,400 Speaker 1: it came out. I learned so much um while we 14 00:00:56,400 --> 00:00:59,040 Speaker 1: were recording it. Um. I have the one and only 15 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:03,040 Speaker 1: Erica chi the on the podcast today. I've wanted to 16 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:07,080 Speaker 1: get her on for so long. Um. She's the co 17 00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:11,039 Speaker 1: founder and CEO at LOOM, which is a well being 18 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:15,160 Speaker 1: platform empowering women through sexual and reproductive health education. She 19 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:19,320 Speaker 1: was a DULA health educator, She's an author. She has 20 00:01:19,360 --> 00:01:22,480 Speaker 1: helped you guys, like literally thousands of women strengthen their 21 00:01:22,480 --> 00:01:26,199 Speaker 1: ability to care for themselves and others. She's the author 22 00:01:26,280 --> 00:01:29,280 Speaker 1: of a book called Nurture, a Modern Guide to Pregnancy, birth, 23 00:01:29,319 --> 00:01:34,559 Speaker 1: and Early Motherhood. Let's welcome the one and only Erica 24 00:01:34,720 --> 00:01:41,680 Speaker 1: Cheating So, Erica, it's a pleasure to meet you. Thank 25 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:44,039 Speaker 1: you so much for giving us the time and the 26 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:47,440 Speaker 1: space to talk to you about all the incredible work 27 00:01:47,480 --> 00:01:50,920 Speaker 1: you are doing. First and foremost, can you tell me 28 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:54,200 Speaker 1: the moment that you realized becoming a duela was the 29 00:01:54,240 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 1: path for you. That's such a great question, and it's 30 00:01:57,680 --> 00:02:03,360 Speaker 1: always hard for me to really get super clear on 31 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:07,000 Speaker 1: exactly when that moment was. But what I will say 32 00:02:07,560 --> 00:02:11,720 Speaker 1: was that I had dabbled in quite a few things 33 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:16,760 Speaker 1: before becoming Adua, had a little bit of a circuitous journey. 34 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,280 Speaker 1: That said, I think all the things that I did 35 00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:22,919 Speaker 1: really laddered up well to that work, which then laddered 36 00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:28,639 Speaker 1: up well to running a text startup. But I am 37 00:02:28,680 --> 00:02:31,239 Speaker 1: I probably am like I'm a self described polymouth. I 38 00:02:31,360 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 1: like to do a lot of things. Growing up, it 39 00:02:33,639 --> 00:02:38,240 Speaker 1: was a little strange having so many complex not obviously 40 00:02:38,280 --> 00:02:42,120 Speaker 1: connected in dress. But I think as I've come into 41 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:44,640 Speaker 1: myself as an adult, it all makes way more sense. 42 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:48,280 Speaker 1: But in terms of knowing when I wanted to be 43 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:52,440 Speaker 1: a dua, it actually was more about realizing that, you know, 44 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:57,000 Speaker 1: one of my best skills is is talking, is taking 45 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:01,799 Speaker 1: people through things, is creating simplicity at very complex topics. 46 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:07,560 Speaker 1: And what I realized about pregnancy and postpartum was that 47 00:03:07,639 --> 00:03:12,400 Speaker 1: there was such a lack of understanding about the just 48 00:03:12,639 --> 00:03:16,720 Speaker 1: baseline experience of being in a pregnant body or becoming 49 00:03:17,240 --> 00:03:20,760 Speaker 1: a parent. And when I realized that what do List 50 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:25,480 Speaker 1: did was everything that was not clinical and everything that 51 00:03:25,600 --> 00:03:30,400 Speaker 1: was psychosocial and educational, I really felt that that was 52 00:03:30,440 --> 00:03:33,480 Speaker 1: such a perfect place for me to sit because I 53 00:03:33,520 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 1: grew up in a really medical home. My dad's an 54 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:38,800 Speaker 1: entrechronologies and infect to see specialist. My mom's a nurse, 55 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:41,240 Speaker 1: so a lot of time in the hospital doing around 56 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 1: with my dad. So I felt a lot of comfort 57 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:46,000 Speaker 1: in spaces where people tend to feel very uncomfortable and 58 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:51,720 Speaker 1: tend to operate pretty uh easily without those kind of 59 00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: more traditional emotions showing up. And so I really felt like, oh, 60 00:03:56,720 --> 00:04:02,040 Speaker 1: so I can be this guide during this time where 61 00:04:02,080 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 1: there tends to be such little support and people are 62 00:04:05,080 --> 00:04:07,960 Speaker 1: coming to this experience with such a little information. That's 63 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:10,640 Speaker 1: a sweet spot for me. It's you're such a gift. 64 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:13,560 Speaker 1: It makes me so It also, at the same time, 65 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:15,200 Speaker 1: which we'll get into this, all the work you do 66 00:04:15,240 --> 00:04:18,880 Speaker 1: it makes me so like, oh, it makes me so 67 00:04:18,920 --> 00:04:21,600 Speaker 1: sad and frustrated and makes me feel like the work 68 00:04:21,600 --> 00:04:23,640 Speaker 1: you're doing and the work we do here on Katie's crib, 69 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:27,119 Speaker 1: it's so important because this is a space, like there's 70 00:04:27,279 --> 00:04:32,039 Speaker 1: so little known about it, work done around it. I 71 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 1: mean honestly, people through insurance get more covered when they 72 00:04:36,080 --> 00:04:41,119 Speaker 1: blow out their knee than the postpartum experience. It's absolutely 73 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:44,719 Speaker 1: bananas um. And also so many people are focused on 74 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:46,920 Speaker 1: the labor, the labor, the labor, which I read you 75 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:51,800 Speaker 1: talk about that the postpartum situation is is often forgotten 76 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:55,559 Speaker 1: or not even thought about. It is, actually, to be honest, 77 00:04:55,560 --> 00:05:00,679 Speaker 1: the most important part, primarily because birth is going to happen. 78 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,680 Speaker 1: Your physical physiologically set up to do that. Whether it's 79 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:08,760 Speaker 1: a vaginal unmedicated or medicated birth or cesarean birth, it's 80 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:12,800 Speaker 1: going to take place. And birth at its maximum is 81 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:17,239 Speaker 1: seventy two hours five days. If you're having for drill labor, 82 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:20,520 Speaker 1: we pray that's not the experience but that's the top end, right, 83 00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 1: Whereas postpartum, the experience of being postpartum is weeks months 84 00:05:26,960 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 1: and there's typically such a little preparation done for that, 85 00:05:30,680 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 1: and so you know, to me, it's really that period 86 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:36,800 Speaker 1: of time that's so important. And I think even where 87 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,800 Speaker 1: I see a lot of the challenge culturally, because I'm 88 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:41,840 Speaker 1: such a words person, you know, where it's really a 89 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:46,720 Speaker 1: matter when we talk about postpartum. Oftentimes people describe themselves 90 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:50,760 Speaker 1: as having postpartum as a postpartum is a thing to have, 91 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:55,479 Speaker 1: whereas being postpartum is a physiological experience it's normal. What 92 00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:59,279 Speaker 1: is less normal, although it is very common, is to 93 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:02,680 Speaker 1: have as part of mood disorder like anxiety or depression 94 00:06:02,760 --> 00:06:05,920 Speaker 1: or o c D or psychosis. And you know, that 95 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:10,920 Speaker 1: is really the more common experience for most women, people, parents, 96 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:13,480 Speaker 1: you know, in the United States, because there is such 97 00:06:13,560 --> 00:06:17,840 Speaker 1: a lack of infrastructure postpartum one. And the infrastructure lack 98 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:20,000 Speaker 1: is actually just the lack of understanding of hey, like 99 00:06:20,080 --> 00:06:22,040 Speaker 1: you're gonna bleed for eight weeks, whether you have a 100 00:06:22,120 --> 00:06:25,680 Speaker 1: vaginal or cesarian birth. Hey, you know, breastfeeding or chest 101 00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:28,480 Speaker 1: feeding is not just like do that twice or three 102 00:06:28,480 --> 00:06:30,120 Speaker 1: times a day. It's like, no, you're gonna do it 103 00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:32,919 Speaker 1: about ten to twelve times a day, and it's going 104 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:35,000 Speaker 1: to take you about half an hour or nine evenuts 105 00:06:35,040 --> 00:06:38,760 Speaker 1: each time, and that's before you've eaten, shower, talk to anybody, 106 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:41,960 Speaker 1: and you're so sleep deprived you can't even like making 107 00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:45,840 Speaker 1: a decision. Seems like you're you're not a stable person 108 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:49,280 Speaker 1: the let alone hormonally exactly. Yeah, I found that too 109 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:52,960 Speaker 1: because I had I was diagnosed with postpartum depression. I 110 00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:56,920 Speaker 1: had mood disorders and chose to go on medication for you. 111 00:06:57,560 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 1: But when I talked about it with people, people like, oh, 112 00:06:59,480 --> 00:07:02,800 Speaker 1: I had part um, and I'm like, wait, I'm confused. 113 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 1: If you birthed a child, whether I was vagulucies or whatever, 114 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:09,680 Speaker 1: we were all in a postpartum period. But I had 115 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 1: post a mood disorder like I postparted, something called postpartum depression, 116 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 1: postpartum anxiety. But you can't have postpartum no, No, you 117 00:07:17,640 --> 00:07:20,720 Speaker 1: are postpart you are a post part of you are 118 00:07:20,880 --> 00:07:23,360 Speaker 1: a postpartum person. And then you know there's there's new 119 00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 1: there's some movements that are happy now where people like 120 00:07:25,320 --> 00:07:28,680 Speaker 1: your postpartum forever because you will always be postpaping a child. 121 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:33,280 Speaker 1: Why is it so weird? What the hell? You know? 122 00:07:33,760 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 1: But you know, the thing is, it's just like, we 123 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:37,840 Speaker 1: live in this culture that hates women. We live in 124 00:07:37,880 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 1: this culture that is so patriarchal, so we are going 125 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:42,720 Speaker 1: to be like, I don't know, let's have this like 126 00:07:42,760 --> 00:07:46,680 Speaker 1: shadow language for this really important thing, and let's make 127 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:49,040 Speaker 1: it hard for women to talk about it or people 128 00:07:49,080 --> 00:07:51,160 Speaker 1: to talk about it so that it continues to not 129 00:07:51,280 --> 00:07:54,240 Speaker 1: be resolved. Every time I talk, I'm on any kind 130 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:57,480 Speaker 1: of thing, I'm always just like postpartum is a physiological 131 00:07:57,480 --> 00:08:02,400 Speaker 1: experience that's normal, postpartum sort of different and also postporder 132 00:08:02,440 --> 00:08:04,600 Speaker 1: mood disorder. It's so important to talk about it in 133 00:08:04,680 --> 00:08:08,200 Speaker 1: a little bit more detail because there is variability in there. 134 00:08:08,360 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 1: There's o c D. There's a post order o c 135 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:12,840 Speaker 1: D which is actually such an interesting type of mood 136 00:08:12,880 --> 00:08:15,280 Speaker 1: disorder that's less discussed, which has a lot to do 137 00:08:15,320 --> 00:08:19,480 Speaker 1: with ritualistic behavior and aversions and like rigidity, which a 138 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:21,880 Speaker 1: lot of women that I've seen over the years that 139 00:08:22,080 --> 00:08:24,680 Speaker 1: I've worked with and people actually have and it's been 140 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:27,040 Speaker 1: lesser of seen and discussed. It's starting to kind of 141 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:30,080 Speaker 1: like crest now we're talking about it. But I think 142 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 1: being able to be like, oh, I had this specific 143 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:35,559 Speaker 1: mood disorder, like I was super anxious or I was 144 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:39,600 Speaker 1: super compulsive. Like that's really helpful to not just feel 145 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:41,960 Speaker 1: like it's a waste basket term like I just had 146 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:44,520 Speaker 1: this thing, and like I was like a little depressed 147 00:08:44,520 --> 00:08:48,440 Speaker 1: and I was this and that the specificity is support, right, 148 00:08:48,559 --> 00:08:50,680 Speaker 1: So I just think it's so important for us to 149 00:08:50,679 --> 00:08:54,200 Speaker 1: be like, what actually happened. We are so lucky that 150 00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:57,080 Speaker 1: you are here. We are so lucky you are here, 151 00:08:57,320 --> 00:09:09,800 Speaker 1: is all I feel like. So you do not have 152 00:09:09,880 --> 00:09:13,360 Speaker 1: children yourself, right, No, I don't. You are also an 153 00:09:13,400 --> 00:09:16,200 Speaker 1: advocate for people who don't have children to be a 154 00:09:16,200 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 1: part of the birth experience. Can you explain that? Yeah, 155 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 1: thanks to that question. You know, I remember when I 156 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:24,079 Speaker 1: started off, you know, do or who? I was really 157 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: on them thirty five now, so I guess it was 158 00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:28,600 Speaker 1: maybe like twenty four or somewhere ever or something like that. 159 00:09:29,200 --> 00:09:32,200 Speaker 1: I always like, oh, like, maybe there's a stigma because 160 00:09:32,200 --> 00:09:34,960 Speaker 1: I don't have a child, But the reality is that 161 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:39,800 Speaker 1: we as a culture need to have what a term 162 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 1: that I've concept that this idea of biological empathy, right, 163 00:09:43,400 --> 00:09:48,120 Speaker 1: so even if you haven't had the experience, we should 164 00:09:48,160 --> 00:09:52,680 Speaker 1: have enough health education, health information to be empathetic to 165 00:09:52,880 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 1: someone that has gone through something that we have not 166 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:58,800 Speaker 1: yet experienced. You know, a great example of just like 167 00:09:58,920 --> 00:10:02,200 Speaker 1: active biological empathy to me is when I see someone 168 00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 1: see a pregnant persons either body, and then be like, Okay, 169 00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:08,360 Speaker 1: open the door for you. Oh do you need that there? 170 00:10:08,440 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 1: Take my seat in a subway, here, take my seat 171 00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:13,840 Speaker 1: in the blah blah bae exactly. But you know, wouldn't 172 00:10:13,840 --> 00:10:17,840 Speaker 1: it be really wonderful if that type of desire or 173 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:21,559 Speaker 1: action was present whether you saw the person was pregnant 174 00:10:21,640 --> 00:10:24,040 Speaker 1: or not, if you could not tell. In terms of 175 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:26,600 Speaker 1: the reason why I think non pregnant people or people 176 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:28,920 Speaker 1: have not had children need to be able to step 177 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:32,400 Speaker 1: in and be supportive and and and be around it 178 00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 1: is because really, when people become pregnant, there is this 179 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 1: like divorce that happens from their life as they knew it. 180 00:10:38,720 --> 00:10:41,120 Speaker 1: They're like, oh, I don't have any mom friends or 181 00:10:41,120 --> 00:10:42,800 Speaker 1: parent friends. Now I got to go out into the 182 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:45,440 Speaker 1: pasture and go find these new people. And you know, 183 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:47,560 Speaker 1: to me, it's like, what would it look like if 184 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:51,360 Speaker 1: your current community could hold you could evolve with you, 185 00:10:51,559 --> 00:10:54,240 Speaker 1: because the truth is, you know, if they don't have kids, 186 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:56,240 Speaker 1: I can come over. I can do all kinds of 187 00:10:56,240 --> 00:10:58,360 Speaker 1: ship for you. I could like do a grocery run. 188 00:10:58,360 --> 00:11:00,080 Speaker 1: I can like, you know, come hold the big off 189 00:11:00,080 --> 00:11:01,760 Speaker 1: you whant you take a shower? Like you know, I 190 00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:03,880 Speaker 1: can take your dog for a walk. It's like having 191 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 1: non non child friends when you have children is a 192 00:11:08,240 --> 00:11:11,280 Speaker 1: boon if they know how to show up for you 193 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 1: and so to me, a lot of times I say 194 00:11:13,520 --> 00:11:16,200 Speaker 1: people they don't have kids, read my book, like or 195 00:11:16,480 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 1: you know, take a childbirth ed class. You know, especially 196 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:21,880 Speaker 1: we might say to people what we're doing at LOOM 197 00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:25,880 Speaker 1: with our current first program that's pregnancy and postpartum. I'm 198 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:28,600 Speaker 1: I'm very much in the head space of yes, it 199 00:11:28,679 --> 00:11:30,600 Speaker 1: is for pregnant and post part of people, but it's 200 00:11:30,600 --> 00:11:32,840 Speaker 1: also for people that aren't who have a lot of people. 201 00:11:32,840 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 1: If you have five people in your life they're pregnant, 202 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:37,880 Speaker 1: take the program, check it out. Have some things that 203 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,920 Speaker 1: you can bring to the conversation besides how you're doing. 204 00:11:41,120 --> 00:11:44,480 Speaker 1: You know, I have a few friends who don't have kids, 205 00:11:44,520 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 1: and my goodness, like when they come over and just 206 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 1: help me be a hand for a bedtime with my 207 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:56,319 Speaker 1: two it's the best because they're available and completely capable. Yeah, 208 00:11:56,679 --> 00:12:02,199 Speaker 1: I think definitely in America, at least in white American culture, 209 00:12:02,320 --> 00:12:05,160 Speaker 1: there is a lack of It's very well, how's a 210 00:12:05,160 --> 00:12:07,240 Speaker 1: lot to do with this idea of like the nuclear family, 211 00:12:07,360 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 1: that you should be self reliant, that two people should 212 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:13,360 Speaker 1: take care of one baby, which is nonsense, especially when 213 00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:18,320 Speaker 1: people people don't really understand that newborns have constant need. 214 00:12:18,520 --> 00:12:23,640 Speaker 1: They've come out of being in the ters where they 215 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:29,959 Speaker 1: had constant movement, constant tempt, regulation, constant connection ten fours 216 00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:31,480 Speaker 1: a day, some days a week. Then all of a 217 00:12:31,480 --> 00:12:34,080 Speaker 1: sudden they come into the world and they're kind of like, Hi, 218 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:37,680 Speaker 1: I'd like that to continue in some way, shape or form. 219 00:12:38,000 --> 00:12:42,839 Speaker 1: And then you are just like who you're fun. You 220 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:45,880 Speaker 1: don't even I pat the new board stage. I can't 221 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:49,200 Speaker 1: do it ever again. Like I literally thought I was 222 00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:52,720 Speaker 1: going to be like admitted into some place where I 223 00:12:52,760 --> 00:12:57,240 Speaker 1: was unfit for parenting. Like newborn stage is so bananas 224 00:12:57,320 --> 00:12:59,800 Speaker 1: to me and not for everyone. And I've had friends 225 00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:03,720 Speaker 1: with polar opposite experiences where the love bubble that they 226 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:07,600 Speaker 1: are existing in that they are crying of overwhelmed with 227 00:13:07,679 --> 00:13:11,240 Speaker 1: how happy they are. You couldn't get more opposite for 228 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 1: my new born experience. Like I really hear that. I mean, 229 00:13:15,480 --> 00:13:17,440 Speaker 1: and I've seen both sides, and I'll tell you and 230 00:13:17,880 --> 00:13:20,880 Speaker 1: I'll make a bet. I bet you that the women 231 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:24,679 Speaker 1: or people who are describing this overwhelmed have a very 232 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:28,559 Speaker 1: supportive partner, have like a parent that they like, maybe 233 00:13:28,559 --> 00:13:31,240 Speaker 1: they've got a postpartum dulah, maybe they have a night nurse, 234 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:37,000 Speaker 1: like there's some their packet heat. You're not, I mean, 235 00:13:37,120 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 1: you're not, just like I'm by myself, you know what? Yes? 236 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:43,280 Speaker 1: Like true? So your life leading you to DULA work, 237 00:13:43,360 --> 00:13:47,360 Speaker 1: Dula work leading you to LOOM. Tell us all about Loom, 238 00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:52,760 Speaker 1: tell us what it offers. Loom is this wonderful, exciting 239 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:57,080 Speaker 1: platform that is all about helping women and people optimize 240 00:13:57,160 --> 00:13:59,960 Speaker 1: or sexual reproductive health. And we're doing that through educate 241 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:03,719 Speaker 1: sationing community. So that we opened in Seen is a 242 00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:06,560 Speaker 1: brick and mortar space, but we launched our first program 243 00:14:06,880 --> 00:14:11,360 Speaker 1: and the digital platform in this summer, and so our 244 00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:14,080 Speaker 1: first programs pregnancy and postpartum, and you know, we've been 245 00:14:14,080 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 1: talking all about that experience, but it's a really amazing 246 00:14:17,679 --> 00:14:21,000 Speaker 1: comprehensive program that really focuses on the first three weeks 247 00:14:21,040 --> 00:14:24,160 Speaker 1: or pregnancy through about the first two to three months postpartum. 248 00:14:24,200 --> 00:14:27,560 Speaker 1: And it's really basically taking at your own pace essentially 249 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:31,160 Speaker 1: like masterclass, but you know, making pregnancy and postpartum. And 250 00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 1: then there's also live group support through this kind of 251 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:41,960 Speaker 1: weekly gathering event that's actually called gather where women and 252 00:14:42,200 --> 00:14:45,520 Speaker 1: parents of people can come together and check in all 253 00:14:45,600 --> 00:14:49,400 Speaker 1: through the different trimesters and postpartum. So are you guys 254 00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:52,600 Speaker 1: all hearing this? Like everyone listening to this? This is 255 00:14:53,480 --> 00:14:57,920 Speaker 1: fucking genius. It is There is a real hole and 256 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:03,680 Speaker 1: need for this. Uh now, more than ever, this sense 257 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:08,840 Speaker 1: of community is I mean I hear more than anything 258 00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 1: from this podcast is is women just doing things alone 259 00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:16,240 Speaker 1: and how much better they are and feel and can 260 00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:19,600 Speaker 1: face all of it when they don't feel that way. 261 00:15:19,760 --> 00:15:23,040 Speaker 1: Um and loom just sounds like I mean, obviously the 262 00:15:23,080 --> 00:15:26,840 Speaker 1: weekly class is called Gather people. Yeah, we're getting together. 263 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:30,920 Speaker 1: Put we're putting people together. Uh. But yeah, it's it's 264 00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:33,840 Speaker 1: it's been. It's been a really wonderful experience to see 265 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:37,920 Speaker 1: how much it's already improving people's lives in terms of 266 00:15:37,920 --> 00:15:41,240 Speaker 1: from a mental health perspective, you know, the ability to 267 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:45,360 Speaker 1: re really be able to know what to expect before 268 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:48,720 Speaker 1: moving into you know, your birthing experience, to know what's 269 00:15:48,760 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 1: really happening. For a part of in the way that 270 00:15:50,840 --> 00:15:55,200 Speaker 1: the curriculum is structured is it's not just like, okay, 271 00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:59,040 Speaker 1: here's how to breathe, you know. You know, there's a lesson, 272 00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: uh in the program that's called how to Push where 273 00:16:02,920 --> 00:16:05,000 Speaker 1: I really break down the fact that you know, when 274 00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:08,120 Speaker 1: you're pushing, you're not trying to take a big poop. 275 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:11,280 Speaker 1: You know, those are your anti your pelvic floor. Yeah, 276 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:14,200 Speaker 1: you're not trying to ship. You're actually trying to use 277 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:18,200 Speaker 1: your your anterior public floor muscles, like the muscles that 278 00:16:18,240 --> 00:16:19,760 Speaker 1: you use when you're peeing or if you're trying to 279 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:22,320 Speaker 1: push a tampon out or push a construal cut. And 280 00:16:22,360 --> 00:16:24,920 Speaker 1: most people don't realize that because everyone's okay, when you push, 281 00:16:24,920 --> 00:16:26,560 Speaker 1: you you're just like you're taking a big poop, and 282 00:16:26,560 --> 00:16:28,720 Speaker 1: it's like it's not actually the right it's not the 283 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:31,400 Speaker 1: right muscles. So things like that because these like kind 284 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:34,840 Speaker 1: of who came up with that? It's like it also 285 00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:37,840 Speaker 1: why the tail, It's a little bit of that it's 286 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:41,000 Speaker 1: like you're doing something like that, but it's not exactly that. 287 00:16:41,040 --> 00:16:43,119 Speaker 1: It's at the same thing when we talked about postpartum, 288 00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:44,720 Speaker 1: it's like I had postpartum. It's like, you know, you 289 00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:46,680 Speaker 1: had to postport a mood disorder. It's like, Okay, when 290 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:48,680 Speaker 1: you push, it's like you're taking a ship. It's like, no, actually, 291 00:16:48,720 --> 00:16:51,160 Speaker 1: it's sup pushing on a tamp on your peeing. It's 292 00:16:51,160 --> 00:16:53,360 Speaker 1: a different It's just like trying to get out of 293 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:57,320 Speaker 1: the globe and get into the details. And then you know, 294 00:16:57,600 --> 00:16:59,800 Speaker 1: one of my favorite topics in the program is gonna 295 00:16:59,800 --> 00:17:03,480 Speaker 1: go you and advocate. That's all about teaching pregnant people 296 00:17:03,520 --> 00:17:07,520 Speaker 1: how to negotiate with their care providers because most you know, 297 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:09,639 Speaker 1: my my thought was in our thought at LOOM was 298 00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:14,439 Speaker 1: most women have trouble negotiating pay, trouble negotiating their sexual needs, 299 00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:16,320 Speaker 1: you know, all of those things. So you know, of 300 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:18,800 Speaker 1: course you're gonna have trouble negotiating you know, an induction 301 00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:22,000 Speaker 1: or cesarian birth, or you know they're just stational diabetes 302 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:24,360 Speaker 1: testing or you know, whatever the things they need to negotiate. 303 00:17:24,480 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: So your scripts in there to be like, okay, here's 304 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:29,879 Speaker 1: how to talk to your care provider. Uh so, and 305 00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:31,680 Speaker 1: then you know, we go into sex, we talk about 306 00:17:31,720 --> 00:17:35,119 Speaker 1: just like what to expect like during the pregnancy afterwards, 307 00:17:35,640 --> 00:17:37,720 Speaker 1: and then things like just your food. I mean, most 308 00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:40,280 Speaker 1: people don't realize that when you're pregnant, you actually are 309 00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:44,080 Speaker 1: in a diabetogenic state, meaning that you essentially physiologically are 310 00:17:44,119 --> 00:17:46,600 Speaker 1: functioning like you have babies. So what you need to 311 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:50,600 Speaker 1: be eating is like complex carbohydrates, like really pulling back 312 00:17:50,640 --> 00:17:53,879 Speaker 1: on sugar, eating more protein. And if people know that 313 00:17:53,960 --> 00:17:57,440 Speaker 1: right from the beginning, I did not know that. I 314 00:17:57,560 --> 00:18:00,280 Speaker 1: did not know that. I don't know. It's a it's 315 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:02,840 Speaker 1: a metabolic shift that if you have an awareness of it, 316 00:18:03,240 --> 00:18:05,960 Speaker 1: you can like steer away from just stational diabetes, you know, 317 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:08,520 Speaker 1: because a lot of people like eat for two and like, sure, 318 00:18:08,680 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 1: eat hungry. I would eat everything that you need to, 319 00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:13,240 Speaker 1: but let's try to make it for these groups of 320 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:16,480 Speaker 1: foods so that we land where you need to. Yeah. 321 00:18:16,480 --> 00:18:20,040 Speaker 1: And also if you push the proteins and the complex carbohydrates, like, 322 00:18:20,160 --> 00:18:22,640 Speaker 1: you'll probably feel fuller and then you won't be grabbing 323 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:25,440 Speaker 1: like the crap, which then does not help the gestational 324 00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:38,879 Speaker 1: diabetes in twenty weeks or whatever. Wow, exactly exactly in 325 00:18:39,000 --> 00:18:41,000 Speaker 1: your New York Times article, you list a number of 326 00:18:41,640 --> 00:18:46,240 Speaker 1: language samples um that women can use when speaking to 327 00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 1: their care providers, and then I think in The York 328 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:53,520 Speaker 1: Times are black women specifically? Can you talk to me 329 00:18:53,560 --> 00:19:00,840 Speaker 1: about that? Yeah, so that article which is now become 330 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:07,199 Speaker 1: a grant that we're working on with Stanford. Yeah, that's awesome, 331 00:19:07,640 --> 00:19:12,440 Speaker 1: it's very exciting. But basically the the article was really 332 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:17,439 Speaker 1: about protecting black birth and I concepted this idea and 333 00:19:17,480 --> 00:19:20,960 Speaker 1: then co uh executed on it with Dr k Hill. 334 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:24,080 Speaker 1: Dr Eric K. Hill is an amazing o Begunde researcher 335 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:28,880 Speaker 1: epidemiologist at Stanford, and I for a long time, way 336 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:32,840 Speaker 1: before it hit the press cycle around the mortual mortality 337 00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:34,320 Speaker 1: rates for a black woman, I was I have been 338 00:19:34,359 --> 00:19:36,880 Speaker 1: aware of it for years and had had a look 339 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 1: at that early data, and by the time it became 340 00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:42,920 Speaker 1: this major talking point, I was already exhausted and frustrated 341 00:19:42,920 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 1: by the situation, and really where I was landing inside 342 00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:51,239 Speaker 1: of it was we need to actually be able to 343 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:54,280 Speaker 1: talk about racial anxiety. We need to be able to 344 00:19:54,280 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 1: talk about the fact that because of the way that 345 00:19:57,080 --> 00:20:00,080 Speaker 1: I look, I am more than likely going to to 346 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:04,080 Speaker 1: get some hard care when it comes to my pregnancy 347 00:20:04,119 --> 00:20:08,440 Speaker 1: and postpartum experience. And so to me, I felt, especially 348 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:10,960 Speaker 1: for years and years with dual work, knowing that you know, 349 00:20:11,040 --> 00:20:13,399 Speaker 1: when people come up with earth preferences and they're taking 350 00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:17,080 Speaker 1: their care provider through it, there is some support that 351 00:20:17,119 --> 00:20:19,199 Speaker 1: happens there. And so my feeling was, what would it 352 00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:22,639 Speaker 1: be like if we could put the words to the 353 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:25,840 Speaker 1: page of hey, like, here's what's going on as a 354 00:20:25,880 --> 00:20:29,560 Speaker 1: result of my you know, existence as the black woman, 355 00:20:29,640 --> 00:20:31,720 Speaker 1: I might be more susceptible to X, Y and Z. 356 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:34,600 Speaker 1: How can you support me around this? You know? And 357 00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:38,280 Speaker 1: so that really was the basis of the tool, which 358 00:20:38,359 --> 00:20:40,560 Speaker 1: is what that that was. And you know, the decision 359 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:42,879 Speaker 1: that Eric and I both made, or Dr Khill and 360 00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:44,840 Speaker 1: I both made, was that instead of just trying to 361 00:20:44,880 --> 00:20:47,840 Speaker 1: put this straight into research and get it into journal articles, 362 00:20:48,119 --> 00:20:50,440 Speaker 1: because what happens is when things get published in a journal, 363 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:52,680 Speaker 1: it takes anywhere from like eight to ten years for 364 00:20:52,720 --> 00:20:55,440 Speaker 1: it to go from the journal down to the hospital floor, 365 00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:59,560 Speaker 1: was to do a reverse process of putting into the media, 366 00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:01,920 Speaker 1: letting the media take hold of it, and having people 367 00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:04,720 Speaker 1: just actively start to use that tool in their own 368 00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:06,800 Speaker 1: way and then be able to go from there and 369 00:21:06,840 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 1: put it back into research. So we're working on a 370 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:15,400 Speaker 1: qualitative study right now with that tool to basically improve 371 00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:17,920 Speaker 1: it UM and hopefully over time be able to get 372 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:20,120 Speaker 1: it into clinical settings where you know, when you walk 373 00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:24,040 Speaker 1: into especially like a big hospital group or magna hospital, 374 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:26,320 Speaker 1: say a Kaiser or u c l A. If you 375 00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 1: are bipoc or if you're a black woman, it just 376 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:32,280 Speaker 1: becomes a part of the care tools that you're getting UM. 377 00:21:32,320 --> 00:21:34,360 Speaker 1: The way you get a birth preference plan to take 378 00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:37,359 Speaker 1: home UM, you would have that be a part of 379 00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:39,879 Speaker 1: your part of your care because I think you know, 380 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:42,160 Speaker 1: if we're really thinking about protecting black birth, it can't 381 00:21:42,480 --> 00:21:44,159 Speaker 1: it can't be up to black women to do it. 382 00:21:44,200 --> 00:21:48,280 Speaker 1: There needs to be a a dual support system, and 383 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:52,120 Speaker 1: so really putting that putting that onus back on care 384 00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:55,160 Speaker 1: providers and giving them tools and frameworks to be able 385 00:21:55,200 --> 00:21:57,960 Speaker 1: to address it is so important. In the Pregnancy and 386 00:21:58,000 --> 00:22:01,399 Speaker 1: Postpartum program, there's a specific module is for black women 387 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:04,960 Speaker 1: to help them prepare around their birth experience. But the 388 00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:07,600 Speaker 1: actual New York Times article, which is free and available 389 00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 1: to everyone, has the full script there, so people are 390 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:15,199 Speaker 1: able to use that as well. Oh my god, I 391 00:22:15,200 --> 00:22:18,199 Speaker 1: mean this is I have goofed. I mean it's just 392 00:22:18,359 --> 00:22:23,359 Speaker 1: so important and so I don't know how things like 393 00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:26,240 Speaker 1: this will get better. But without all the work you're doing, 394 00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:31,359 Speaker 1: it's not going to happen. So yeah, it's just so 395 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:36,840 Speaker 1: I'm so happy that you're doing all the things you're doing. Um. 396 00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:39,879 Speaker 1: I also love this which I read that you believe 397 00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:43,000 Speaker 1: women fighting and taking up space and responsibility for their 398 00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 1: reproductive health is a form of activism. I do. I 399 00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:50,639 Speaker 1: really feel that way, and I think, you know, any 400 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:55,040 Speaker 1: type of reclamation that we can't do for ourselves is 401 00:22:55,440 --> 00:22:58,800 Speaker 1: a form of justice, is a form of activism. And 402 00:22:58,880 --> 00:23:01,600 Speaker 1: you know, for me, when what reproducted us is, it's 403 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:05,880 Speaker 1: it goes beyond just access to safe sexual reproductive care, 404 00:23:06,160 --> 00:23:10,840 Speaker 1: access to a safe abortion, access to health education about 405 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:15,080 Speaker 1: your body. It's also being paid you know, equally as well, 406 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 1: and when you're in a position to also employ people, 407 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:20,080 Speaker 1: making sure that you're paying them what they need to 408 00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:25,040 Speaker 1: be paid. Because all the gender biases that we experience 409 00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 1: as women or anyone that identifies in a feminized way, 410 00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:34,560 Speaker 1: it's it's so layered in deep, it's it's it's about 411 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:36,480 Speaker 1: the kind of care we get to in our bodies. 412 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:39,560 Speaker 1: It's about you know, what ends up in our bank account, 413 00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,920 Speaker 1: It's about you know, the language we use to describe ourselves. 414 00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:45,800 Speaker 1: And so you know, I think learning about your body 415 00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:49,520 Speaker 1: and having that baseline understanding is really the beginning of 416 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:52,919 Speaker 1: that of that type of activism. And I think what 417 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:55,760 Speaker 1: we're doing with loom as we're growing. You know, we're 418 00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:57,840 Speaker 1: in the process right now of working on an app 419 00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:01,400 Speaker 1: that will launch you know later next Steater that's really 420 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,880 Speaker 1: going to explore the entire sexual reproductive health spectrum, so 421 00:24:05,040 --> 00:24:09,600 Speaker 1: everything from menopause to fertility, hybroids, you know, all of 422 00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 1: these different My god, Erica, this is amazing. It's really exciting. 423 00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:17,359 Speaker 1: So that's that's currently in the works and we're really 424 00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:19,760 Speaker 1: heads down, you know, doing what we need to do 425 00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 1: to get that done. It's very clear that the more 426 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:26,399 Speaker 1: education that we can put in the hands of women 427 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:28,320 Speaker 1: and people to be able to know what's going on 428 00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 1: with their bodies at a baseline level, baseline level. I 429 00:24:32,320 --> 00:24:35,280 Speaker 1: was like, I'm starting interrupting now. When I was trying 430 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:38,320 Speaker 1: to get I had a miscarriage and then you know, 431 00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:40,960 Speaker 1: someone was like, you should go to this um fertility 432 00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:43,800 Speaker 1: acupuncturist like on the East Side in l A And 433 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:45,879 Speaker 1: and she can help you get your periods back to 434 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:48,080 Speaker 1: normal since you had a d n C. And I 435 00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:51,919 Speaker 1: wasn't getting periods regularly, and I know, I felt like 436 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:56,560 Speaker 1: a it was really fucked up. And I went to her, 437 00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,280 Speaker 1: thank you. But I went to her and she was 438 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:03,600 Speaker 1: the first person that sat me down at thirty six 439 00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,879 Speaker 1: years old with an app and explained to me what 440 00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:11,520 Speaker 1: the different mucus is coming out of my vagina mean. 441 00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 1: And I was mortified, like that I was learning this 442 00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:20,159 Speaker 1: for the first time, like because she was helping me 443 00:25:20,240 --> 00:25:22,440 Speaker 1: try to get pregnant again. And she was like, okay, 444 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:24,520 Speaker 1: so when you know, you stick your finger up there 445 00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 1: and this comes out and it looks like this texture 446 00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:31,960 Speaker 1: in this liquid. And I'm like, how have I not known? Focus? 447 00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,439 Speaker 1: Is this is on purpose? Like this has to be 448 00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:38,879 Speaker 1: on this is a nightmare. It was completely the first 449 00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:42,320 Speaker 1: time that I ever even realized that I hadn't been 450 00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:45,200 Speaker 1: taught any of these things, and then started to critically think, 451 00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:48,880 Speaker 1: was that on purpose? Yeah? It is on purpose. That's 452 00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:51,399 Speaker 1: the thing I think. When we boil it all down, 453 00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:56,199 Speaker 1: you know, we are very much under his eyes patriarchy, 454 00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:59,639 Speaker 1: it's misogyny, it is it is very dark if we 455 00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:03,159 Speaker 1: really sit with it. At the same time, though, at LOOM, 456 00:26:03,160 --> 00:26:05,040 Speaker 1: when we're still open in a brick and mortar and 457 00:26:05,080 --> 00:26:07,800 Speaker 1: they would teach them, I would teach our periods class. 458 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 1: One of the disclaimers I would always kick off with 459 00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: was saying, look, if you feel shame or discomfort tonight 460 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:21,400 Speaker 1: as I'm unpacking this information, that's okay, Like it's welcome. 461 00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:24,920 Speaker 1: It's okay for that emotion to be here because our 462 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:27,119 Speaker 1: culture has been designed for you not to know this. 463 00:26:27,800 --> 00:26:32,240 Speaker 1: So just feel a sense of ease with the shame 464 00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 1: because it's by design. And so when I hear you 465 00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:39,840 Speaker 1: talking about that, it's it's it's such a gentle reminder 466 00:26:39,880 --> 00:26:42,960 Speaker 1: for me because it was such a big part of 467 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:47,760 Speaker 1: the education. Was really just like shame metabolization, you know, 468 00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:50,159 Speaker 1: like how do you just get more comfortable? Because if 469 00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:51,840 Speaker 1: you can get more comfortable with the shame, that you 470 00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:53,280 Speaker 1: can just be like, well, fuck it, I guess I 471 00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:55,119 Speaker 1: don't know any of this ship, So can I just 472 00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:56,960 Speaker 1: read a couple of books? Can you talk to me 473 00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:58,960 Speaker 1: about it? You know what I mean. It's made me 474 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:02,119 Speaker 1: so empowered too to help other friends get pregnant. Like, 475 00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:04,520 Speaker 1: I've sat down and had so many coffees with women 476 00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:06,520 Speaker 1: who were like, I'm so sad. I don't know what's 477 00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:08,040 Speaker 1: going on. I don't know my body, I don't know 478 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:09,720 Speaker 1: what's wrong. And I'm like, Okay, well, let's like really 479 00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 1: talk about it. Have you really sat down and like 480 00:27:13,240 --> 00:27:15,440 Speaker 1: studied yourself? I mean when women are like I don't 481 00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 1: really understand when I'm ovulating, Like I don't really know, 482 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:26,080 Speaker 1: and I'm like, what the fuck this is crazy? Um? 483 00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:30,119 Speaker 1: You moonlight as a co host of a Goop podcast. 484 00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:36,600 Speaker 1: That's awesome. Yeah, it's super super fun, super fun. Who 485 00:27:36,640 --> 00:27:41,240 Speaker 1: has been your favorite chat so far? Like regarding reproductive health? 486 00:27:41,840 --> 00:27:45,920 Speaker 1: Oh yeah? Um. Lm or Cleghorn who wrote a book 487 00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:50,040 Speaker 1: called Unwell Women really really interesting. She's basically the UK. 488 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:55,000 Speaker 1: She's a medical historian art historian too. But the book 489 00:27:55,040 --> 00:27:58,080 Speaker 1: is all about just medical myths and just kind of 490 00:27:58,080 --> 00:28:01,160 Speaker 1: a tyranny of misogyny and the jerpey and how it's 491 00:28:01,200 --> 00:28:03,800 Speaker 1: really created a lot of issues for women around healthcare. 492 00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:07,480 Speaker 1: For example, the fact that cardiac issues are the number 493 00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:10,280 Speaker 1: one killer of women. Most women don't really understand what 494 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:13,200 Speaker 1: they need to be taking care of their cardiac health. 495 00:28:14,520 --> 00:28:18,240 Speaker 1: So things like that. But great book, not a happy topic, 496 00:28:18,359 --> 00:28:21,840 Speaker 1: but really interesting. Yes, but this is the information we need. 497 00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:25,480 Speaker 1: What is it called one more Time Unwell Women? Unwell Women? 498 00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:29,159 Speaker 1: Tell me? What are the other things in the works 499 00:28:29,200 --> 00:28:36,800 Speaker 1: for loom in. We've got the app, which is sounds insane. Yeah, 500 00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:40,240 Speaker 1: app is gonna be great, and um yeah, we're actually 501 00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:42,920 Speaker 1: going to be kicking back off our newsletter, so folks 502 00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:44,959 Speaker 1: should definitely like sign up for that. It's gonna be 503 00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:47,920 Speaker 1: really fun and juicy and filled with like all the 504 00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:51,680 Speaker 1: good sr H things, s R exception predict health and 505 00:28:52,040 --> 00:28:55,080 Speaker 1: um yeah there's other things, but sign up for the 506 00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 1: newsletter day like keep posted and for the newsletter, we 507 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:01,760 Speaker 1: could just go on the loom site and sign up correct, Yeah, 508 00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:05,800 Speaker 1: it'll it'll be right there. But also I will well, 509 00:29:05,840 --> 00:29:08,040 Speaker 1: I'll follow up and give you all the all the goods. 510 00:29:08,640 --> 00:29:11,480 Speaker 1: Like definitely we've like posting and sharing to all of 511 00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:16,400 Speaker 1: our listeners. This is this is needed needed. Do you 512 00:29:17,400 --> 00:29:22,360 Speaker 1: have a personal lifelong dream that you want to accomplish 513 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:26,200 Speaker 1: within the sexual and reproductive health field? I think for me, 514 00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,600 Speaker 1: really my lifelong dream in terms of sexual with corrective 515 00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:37,120 Speaker 1: health is to really feel that I've made an impact 516 00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:40,280 Speaker 1: in how women and people talk about their bodies and 517 00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:42,760 Speaker 1: understand their bodies. And so I feel like I'm at 518 00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:45,760 Speaker 1: base camp right now of that dream in terms of, 519 00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:49,400 Speaker 1: you know, kind of building that out. And I think, honestly, 520 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:52,080 Speaker 1: I'm excited to write more books. I've you know, I'm 521 00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:54,280 Speaker 1: kind of working on my second book right now, which 522 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:58,680 Speaker 1: will be a big highlighted focus on sexually productive health 523 00:29:58,880 --> 00:30:01,760 Speaker 1: because my first book was only about pregnancy and postpartum 524 00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:03,200 Speaker 1: and what is the name of the book for all 525 00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:06,560 Speaker 1: of us listening. The first book is called Nurture, a 526 00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:10,240 Speaker 1: Modern Guide to Pregnancy, birth, and early motherhood and trusting 527 00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:12,800 Speaker 1: your body and trusting yourself. That is the bold title. 528 00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:16,160 Speaker 1: And I feel really grateful, not lucky, as my mom 529 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:19,800 Speaker 1: would say. I'm grateful that, you know, I'm getting the 530 00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:24,760 Speaker 1: chance to uh really show up and and and have 531 00:30:24,880 --> 00:30:27,800 Speaker 1: these kinds of conversations. And you know, I've I've been 532 00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:31,200 Speaker 1: a little bit in the background over the past kind 533 00:30:31,240 --> 00:30:34,120 Speaker 1: of year and a half, really heads down doing all 534 00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:36,360 Speaker 1: the things that we needed to do to get LOOM 535 00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:38,719 Speaker 1: where it is right now. But I'm really excited to 536 00:30:38,960 --> 00:30:42,240 Speaker 1: step forward a little bit more and and we dialogueing 537 00:30:42,360 --> 00:30:45,080 Speaker 1: like this and just you know, creating the space especially 538 00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:47,160 Speaker 1: you know, for me as a black woman, is a 539 00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:52,120 Speaker 1: woman holding all these different experiences and wanting to be 540 00:30:52,160 --> 00:30:55,680 Speaker 1: able to speak to just sexually productive health from this 541 00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:59,840 Speaker 1: more marginalized perspective too, I think is so important. Erica, 542 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:04,400 Speaker 1: this is amazing. I'm very blown away and I'm so 543 00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:09,360 Speaker 1: grateful you're here doing this because you're pushing the biggest 544 00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:14,720 Speaker 1: Boulder bill. She's out here. I mean, you were out there, 545 00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:27,800 Speaker 1: you are doing it. Bye, thank you guys so much 546 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:30,280 Speaker 1: for listening to today's episode. I want to hear from you. 547 00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:34,959 Speaker 1: Let's chat questions, comments, concerns. Let me know you can 548 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:41,120 Speaker 1: always find me at Katie's Crib at Shonda land dot com. 549 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,560 Speaker 1: Katie's Crib is a production of Shonda land Audio in 550 00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 1: partnership with I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from Shanda 551 00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:49,440 Speaker 1: land Audio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 552 00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:53,280 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.