1 00:00:00,720 --> 00:00:03,680 Speaker 1: Hey, guys, ready or not, twenty twenty four is here, 2 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:06,280 Speaker 1: and we here at breaking points, are already thinking of 3 00:00:06,320 --> 00:00:08,559 Speaker 1: ways we can up our game for this critical election. 4 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:11,680 Speaker 1: We rely on our premium subs to expand coverage, upgrade 5 00:00:11,680 --> 00:00:15,080 Speaker 1: the studio ad staff, give you, guys, the best independent 6 00:00:15,120 --> 00:00:17,400 Speaker 1: coverage that is possible. If you like what we're all about, 7 00:00:17,640 --> 00:00:20,040 Speaker 1: it just means the absolute world to have your support. 8 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:29,479 Speaker 1: But enough with that, Let's get to the show. Welcome 9 00:00:29,520 --> 00:00:32,960 Speaker 1: back to Counterpoints. I'm Ryan Grim here with Emily Kashinsky. Emily, 10 00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:35,960 Speaker 1: how you doing great? Happy Wednesday? Everyone, Counterpoints Wednesday. Let's 11 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:38,159 Speaker 1: make that all right. We've got a lot to talk 12 00:00:38,200 --> 00:00:41,120 Speaker 1: about today. We've got the FED is going to continue 13 00:00:41,159 --> 00:00:43,599 Speaker 1: to check up interstraights to continue to drive up unemployment, 14 00:00:43,600 --> 00:00:45,479 Speaker 1: according to Elizabeth Warren. We're going to talk about the 15 00:00:45,520 --> 00:00:49,199 Speaker 1: concentration between her and Chairman Jay Powell. We're going to 16 00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: talk about the battle between the Biden administration and House 17 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:56,160 Speaker 1: Republicans over the future of Medicare and tax policy. We're 18 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:59,160 Speaker 1: going to talk about the new dominion documents that are out. 19 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:04,080 Speaker 1: Also the latest on the Tucker Carlson controversy. I guess 20 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:06,080 Speaker 1: we can just call it that and your showdown with 21 00:01:06,200 --> 00:01:08,639 Speaker 1: Karie Jean Pierre in the White Rice Jumper. And also 22 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:11,840 Speaker 1: later today there will be a vote on the House 23 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:16,400 Speaker 1: floor on a War Powers resolution sponsored by Representative Matt 24 00:01:16,440 --> 00:01:20,000 Speaker 1: Gates and also backed by the Congressional Progressive Caucus to 25 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:23,800 Speaker 1: force Biden to end the occupation of Syria the roughly 26 00:01:23,880 --> 00:01:25,680 Speaker 1: one thousand troops that are still there. We'll talk about 27 00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:27,360 Speaker 1: that as well, But we wanted to start the show 28 00:01:27,720 --> 00:01:31,360 Speaker 1: because we were lucky enough to get Politser Prize winning 29 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 1: journalist Seymour Hirsch in for an interview. We talked to 30 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:39,319 Speaker 1: him about both his reporting on the North Stream pipeline 31 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:41,800 Speaker 1: and also his latest piece out today on his fifty 32 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 1: year relationship with Dan Ellsberg, who recently announced that he 33 00:01:46,360 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 1: has a terrible form of pancreatic cancer and has very 34 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:52,320 Speaker 1: little time left to live. So we're going to start 35 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:56,640 Speaker 1: with this interview. We're joined now by Puliter Prize winning 36 00:01:56,680 --> 00:02:00,440 Speaker 1: journalist Seymour Hirsch, who is out with a new piece 37 00:02:01,040 --> 00:02:04,560 Speaker 1: on his substack called My fifty Years with Dan Elsberg, 38 00:02:04,920 --> 00:02:07,360 Speaker 1: also joining us to talk about his reporting on the 39 00:02:07,400 --> 00:02:10,280 Speaker 1: nord Stream pipeline. Seymour Hirsh, thank you so much for 40 00:02:10,360 --> 00:02:13,840 Speaker 1: joining us. Oh, glad to be there, you guys, right, 41 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:16,320 Speaker 1: And so I wanted to I wanted to start by 42 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:20,359 Speaker 1: asking you what you thought of this new reporting from 43 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:23,440 Speaker 1: the New York Times and then also from the German press, 44 00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:27,480 Speaker 1: which in some ways supports what you had reported about 45 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 1: the nord Stream pipeline, in other ways contradiction. But first off, 46 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:34,280 Speaker 1: let's start with the sourcing. As a journalist, when you 47 00:02:34,320 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 1: looked at the New York Times report, what jumped out 48 00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:41,880 Speaker 1: to you about it? Well, first of all, my secret 49 00:02:41,880 --> 00:02:44,840 Speaker 1: thought always has been with Somalia. I think Somalia, and 50 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:47,040 Speaker 1: then I learned it was on the Indian Ocean. So 51 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:50,560 Speaker 1: I now make it a Paul. What am I supposed 52 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:53,840 Speaker 1: to think about it? It doesn't you know, Ryan and Emily, 53 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:57,119 Speaker 1: It doesn't matter what I think. I mean, it's it's 54 00:02:57,120 --> 00:03:00,920 Speaker 1: either a story or it's not a story. And in 55 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:04,120 Speaker 1: the first place, the thing I'm accused of is not 56 00:03:04,240 --> 00:03:07,919 Speaker 1: naming sources. And of course I noticed both the story 57 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:10,760 Speaker 1: in the New York Times in the Washington Post this morning. 58 00:03:10,760 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 1: I still will get the papers in print. I like 59 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 1: to see a paper. Both had no sources in it either. 60 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:18,720 Speaker 1: And when I worked for the New York Times for 61 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:22,160 Speaker 1: what seven years, during Watergate and Vietnam, I was hired 62 00:03:22,200 --> 00:03:24,360 Speaker 1: to do Vietnam. I was actually working at the New 63 00:03:24,440 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 1: Yorker and left the New Yorker to go work at 64 00:03:26,720 --> 00:03:29,119 Speaker 1: the New York Times because at that point in seventy two, 65 00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 1: it was a straight newspaper. In other words, there were 66 00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 1: guys in Saigon Homer Biggert and Dave Albersam and Neil 67 00:03:38,720 --> 00:03:42,080 Speaker 1: Shehaan who were doing great reporting. And the Washington Bureau was, 68 00:03:42,440 --> 00:03:45,640 Speaker 1: as it always was in those days, very pro president 69 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:49,160 Speaker 1: and the government. And I was hired to go make 70 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: whoopee there by Abrosenthal, and at that time it was 71 00:03:56,600 --> 00:04:00,080 Speaker 1: a different newspaper. I just, you know, I wrote maybe 72 00:03:59,880 --> 00:04:03,080 Speaker 1: a thousand stories in seven years, including stuff really important 73 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:07,760 Speaker 1: stories about Chile and the CIA at NSA, and ninety 74 00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:09,720 Speaker 1: nine percent of them had no sources, but they all, 75 00:04:10,160 --> 00:04:13,560 Speaker 1: you know, they trusted me. Even I wrote a story 76 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 1: about domestic spying that I didn't tell the editors about 77 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:19,240 Speaker 1: on Friday, and I wrote seven thousand words that day 78 00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:22,000 Speaker 1: and was on the paper Sunday, but mannor headlines and 79 00:04:22,080 --> 00:04:25,719 Speaker 1: nobody seven unnamed sources. And one editor asked me a question, 80 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:30,200 Speaker 1: when so it's a It's just a silly thing to 81 00:04:30,279 --> 00:04:34,160 Speaker 1: decide that because I don't name sources, or I don't 82 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:37,200 Speaker 1: put anybody in a meeting, which is a critical thing 83 00:04:37,279 --> 00:04:40,800 Speaker 1: not to do, that it doesn't exist. That's just an excuse. 84 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:46,120 Speaker 1: And so just in you know, the New York Times 85 00:04:46,160 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 1: has a lot of very good reporters on it, and 86 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:51,520 Speaker 1: I've you know, and ditto for the Washington Post. My 87 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:54,679 Speaker 1: argument has always been, since I left the newspaper business 88 00:04:54,720 --> 00:04:56,880 Speaker 1: and I saw who got promoted and who did not, 89 00:04:57,720 --> 00:04:59,680 Speaker 1: I'm convinced that we got rid of ninety percent of 90 00:04:59,680 --> 00:05:03,640 Speaker 1: the edit we'd be much better off. Do you get 91 00:05:03,640 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 1: the sense that your reporting shook the tree loose? To 92 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:10,320 Speaker 1: borrow a phrase that Ryan used earlier, on the rest 93 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:12,680 Speaker 1: of these stories that are now coming out where it 94 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:15,240 Speaker 1: seems that people in the intelligence community are either putting 95 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:19,840 Speaker 1: forward information that in some sense could fit into your 96 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:22,159 Speaker 1: reporting or an other sense could not. But do you 97 00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:24,000 Speaker 1: get the sense, though, that some of these people are 98 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:30,839 Speaker 1: coming forward because your report really did shake the tree loose? Well, 99 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: not here, not here in terms of the major media 100 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:36,960 Speaker 1: or even seeing you know, I think we're talking about 101 00:05:37,000 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 1: post Trump, and post Trump really changed the media landscape 102 00:05:42,560 --> 00:05:45,440 Speaker 1: you were a fox. You either fox or see it in. 103 00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:48,119 Speaker 1: I'm in MSBC and you're either the New York Post 104 00:05:48,720 --> 00:05:53,120 Speaker 1: and other papers like that or what that conservative, or 105 00:05:53,240 --> 00:05:55,440 Speaker 1: you with the New York Times and Washington Posts. And 106 00:05:55,560 --> 00:06:00,720 Speaker 1: so the papers just fell that way. And so when 107 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:02,920 Speaker 1: I come up with a story that's very anti Biden, 108 00:06:02,920 --> 00:06:06,520 Speaker 1: Look what's going on now in this White House is 109 00:06:06,600 --> 00:06:10,080 Speaker 1: terrifying to me. I don't know if anybody's paid attention 110 00:06:10,080 --> 00:06:14,719 Speaker 1: to what the I think the Prime Minister of China, 111 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:17,680 Speaker 1: the number two guy in China, has been saying that 112 00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 1: they're writing us along. They've had it with our snotty 113 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:24,159 Speaker 1: comments and canceling meetings because of a balloon. You know, 114 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:26,760 Speaker 1: a Secretary of State canceling a meeting with his counterpart 115 00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:30,320 Speaker 1: because of a balloon and publicly doing it and pointing 116 00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:33,159 Speaker 1: his finger at a public meeting at a senior Chinese official. 117 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:36,840 Speaker 1: I can tell you. I know. I know Americans who 118 00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:39,200 Speaker 1: have taken what Chinese is said in the government, who 119 00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:43,159 Speaker 1: have taken diplomats abroad serious guys. And one thing you 120 00:06:43,240 --> 00:06:47,560 Speaker 1: do is should never do what Tony Blincoln did at 121 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:50,800 Speaker 1: when he was in China, pointing a finger in public 122 00:06:51,200 --> 00:06:53,719 Speaker 1: to his counterpart. You just don't do that. And so 123 00:06:53,800 --> 00:06:59,560 Speaker 1: these guys, I don't know what Lincoln and Sullivan and Newland. 124 00:06:59,600 --> 00:07:01,560 Speaker 1: I call him Lincoln, Blincoln and not. If you've ever 125 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:03,799 Speaker 1: had kids, you know what I'm talking about, the children's story. 126 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 1: They're just out of their league here. They may have 127 00:07:07,080 --> 00:07:09,920 Speaker 1: wonderful degrees in the Plomas and experience it, just out 128 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 1: of their league. Do they really want to get into 129 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:16,560 Speaker 1: a NATO war? And there's no question we've been increasing 130 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:20,880 Speaker 1: the amount of American troops in Poland secretly and deploying 131 00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:24,040 Speaker 1: much more force, many more arms up in that area. 132 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:29,120 Speaker 1: Obviously with the idea, I would guess that the President 133 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:31,680 Speaker 1: may authorize or they may push for NATO actually to 134 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:35,040 Speaker 1: make a physical presence. It's going to be over in Ukraine. 135 00:07:35,080 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 1: It's just a question of when Putin pulls it. Whether 136 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 1: you like Putin or don't like Putin? How can you 137 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 1: like a guy that started most the bloodiest war in 138 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:48,080 Speaker 1: Western Europe since World War Two? We had the Balkans 139 00:07:48,080 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 1: and jest now, but this is not Malise, so you 140 00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:53,520 Speaker 1: have to fault him for that. But it isn't without 141 00:07:53,520 --> 00:07:58,360 Speaker 1: some reason, or at least some provocation. We expanded NATO 142 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:00,680 Speaker 1: to the east. Everybody's watching a show knows what I'm 143 00:08:00,680 --> 00:08:05,040 Speaker 1: talking about. We also put what we call defensive missiles 144 00:08:05,040 --> 00:08:07,720 Speaker 1: that can be turned overnight in the missiles that can 145 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 1: throw a nuclear nuclear bombs into in the Moscow eight 146 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 1: hundred miles away seven minutes, how far were to take. 147 00:08:15,000 --> 00:08:20,120 Speaker 1: We've also escalated that escalated the rhetoric. And I don't 148 00:08:20,120 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 1: know what the goal is. I don't know if they 149 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:25,880 Speaker 1: know what the goal is. You know, I guess historically 150 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:29,720 Speaker 1: presidents who have wars do better in elections. I mean, 151 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:34,280 Speaker 1: that's just a fact that the public rallies around a president. 152 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:36,040 Speaker 1: I don't know what's going on in that White House, 153 00:08:36,280 --> 00:08:40,680 Speaker 1: but it's very scary and very dumb. And then the 154 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:45,400 Speaker 1: story they put out yesterday is just another example of idiocy. 155 00:08:46,240 --> 00:08:49,440 Speaker 1: It's not working. What happened here, well, let me just 156 00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 1: say this. What happened here with the press blackout did 157 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 1: happen the rest of the world. It's all over the world. 158 00:08:57,360 --> 00:09:00,679 Speaker 1: Joe Biden made a decision to blow up the pipelines 159 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: because he was afraid that he learned then that there 160 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:07,000 Speaker 1: was a stalemate coming at best in or in Ukraine. 161 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:10,240 Speaker 1: He wanted more support from Europe, Western Europe and Germany, 162 00:09:10,640 --> 00:09:15,679 Speaker 1: and historically since the Kennedy years, American presidents this is 163 00:09:15,720 --> 00:09:18,280 Speaker 1: all part of the containment business that posts World War 164 00:09:18,360 --> 00:09:25,480 Speaker 1: two Russia containing communism and business. Historically presidents have been 165 00:09:25,960 --> 00:09:29,959 Speaker 1: frightened and worried about the Russian influence because of its little, 166 00:09:30,040 --> 00:09:32,880 Speaker 1: huge amounts of natural gas and oil that they were 167 00:09:32,880 --> 00:09:35,080 Speaker 1: selling in the Europe that always tried to stop it. It 168 00:09:34,960 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 1: It is nothing new. So there you are. We're in 169 00:09:38,160 --> 00:09:40,959 Speaker 1: a terrible place right now. The crap they put out 170 00:09:41,040 --> 00:09:45,160 Speaker 1: yesterday isn't going to work. Nobody's going to believe. Nobody's 171 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:47,440 Speaker 1: going to believe that what there Zeits said. Some guys 172 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,120 Speaker 1: in a yacht dropped it. We're talking about Sea four 173 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 1: with enough Sea four to blow up a major building 174 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:55,320 Speaker 1: in Washington or New York, even for each of the 175 00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:59,640 Speaker 1: pipe clinees. Just go ahead. I'm sorry, yeah, yeah. You 176 00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:02,400 Speaker 1: allude earlier to some of the criticism that that was 177 00:10:02,440 --> 00:10:06,960 Speaker 1: coming at your story around not not naming the key 178 00:10:07,040 --> 00:10:08,800 Speaker 1: source that it was based on. Are you are you 179 00:10:08,840 --> 00:10:11,840 Speaker 1: working on any any follow ups longest and are you 180 00:10:11,920 --> 00:10:15,880 Speaker 1: picking up dissent within the administration? Should we should we 181 00:10:15,960 --> 00:10:19,080 Speaker 1: look for any additional reporting or are you hoping that 182 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:23,080 Speaker 1: the press more generally picks us up and follows it. 183 00:10:24,760 --> 00:10:27,600 Speaker 1: I'm hoping that the major press is going to pick 184 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:31,520 Speaker 1: this up and follow it. I've had from the day 185 00:10:31,559 --> 00:10:36,360 Speaker 1: I wrote me Li, I've I've had. I've had people 186 00:10:36,679 --> 00:10:40,360 Speaker 1: for month's sake. Can't be true. When I wrote the 187 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:43,360 Speaker 1: story what was this? I mentioned the one about domestic spying, 188 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:45,839 Speaker 1: and I said the CEE I had been spying on 189 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:49,320 Speaker 1: literally hundreds of thousands of American anti war citizens and 190 00:10:49,400 --> 00:10:52,960 Speaker 1: reporters and congress people and the Washington Post for three 191 00:10:53,080 --> 00:10:56,080 Speaker 1: months every other week. My good friend Levy Ster and 192 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:58,200 Speaker 1: I adored him. Who is there, senior? One of their 193 00:10:58,240 --> 00:11:01,160 Speaker 1: senior editors and reporters was right the stories. I mean, 194 00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:03,440 Speaker 1: a buddy of mine saying Hirsh's dead. Wrong. It was 195 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:08,120 Speaker 1: the FBI. And then, of course, to his credit, Bill Colby, 196 00:11:08,600 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: the head of the CIA, had a hearing told the truth. 197 00:11:10,800 --> 00:11:13,679 Speaker 1: He said, yeah, there's something to it. But anyway, the 198 00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 1: bottom line is no, I'm not hoping for the American 199 00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:18,880 Speaker 1: pression to do anything. The only thing that's going to 200 00:11:18,920 --> 00:11:25,000 Speaker 1: happen is in Europe. You know, here's what the president did. 201 00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:27,360 Speaker 1: As far as I can tell and by the way, 202 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 1: I've been writing every Wednesday for my substack, and I wrote. 203 00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:33,560 Speaker 1: One of the pieces I wrote was all about Norway. 204 00:11:33,679 --> 00:11:36,360 Speaker 1: If you remember I said that Norroy was involved. I 205 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:38,959 Speaker 1: wrote a piece about how Norway worked with us early 206 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:42,120 Speaker 1: in the Vietnam War. We were going and provoking stuff 207 00:11:42,160 --> 00:11:46,840 Speaker 1: in sixty in nineteen sixty four, before North Vietnam even 208 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:49,960 Speaker 1: got into the war. We were seals were working on 209 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:54,960 Speaker 1: Norwegian Norwegian boats, advanced p T boats, a large, larger 210 00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:57,360 Speaker 1: PP boats than the one that Kennedy was in in 211 00:11:57,360 --> 00:12:00,400 Speaker 1: World War Two. They were going in deep and they 212 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 1: were driving up into on the coast of North Vietnam, 213 00:12:04,000 --> 00:12:08,560 Speaker 1: dropping seals off, going in gutsy guys and blowing trying 214 00:12:08,559 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 1: to blow up radar sites and military sites. And two 215 00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:14,360 Speaker 1: of the guys even got wounded badly and crawled back 216 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:17,480 Speaker 1: and made it back and got medals of honors secrets. 217 00:12:17,520 --> 00:12:19,200 Speaker 1: I wrote a piece about that a couple of weeks later, 218 00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:22,920 Speaker 1: making the point that it's not unusual we have a 219 00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:25,840 Speaker 1: history of working with Norway. I actually have a photo 220 00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:30,960 Speaker 1: photograph of Bill calls Bill Colby, who was a lack 221 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 1: of a lot of these guys in the CIE. He 222 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:36,880 Speaker 1: was in the Office of Special Services OSS and he 223 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:41,880 Speaker 1: was behind enemy lines in Norway working with special forces 224 00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:44,200 Speaker 1: in Norway. Have photographs of him in forty five and 225 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:47,960 Speaker 1: forty four in the middle of winter doing all kinds 226 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 1: of crap against the Nazis. I mean, these guys, Helms 227 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:58,599 Speaker 1: and Coolby. I wrote a lot of bad stories about him, 228 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:01,720 Speaker 1: and to their credit, I mean Helms before he died. 229 00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:04,320 Speaker 1: He was ahead of the CI for many years and 230 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:07,600 Speaker 1: was involved in the Castro stuff and a lot of 231 00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:10,559 Speaker 1: stuff for the President that he couldn't tell the Congress about. 232 00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:13,000 Speaker 1: He called me in and we had a long talk 233 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:15,480 Speaker 1: before he died about what really was going on that 234 00:13:15,559 --> 00:13:19,960 Speaker 1: I couldn't use. But you know, you know, you know, 235 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:23,599 Speaker 1: the CIA doesn't work for the Congress or for the Constitution. 236 00:13:23,679 --> 00:13:26,760 Speaker 1: It works for the Crown, works for the president. Why 237 00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:29,440 Speaker 1: does the president keep a CIA around? You got a guy, 238 00:13:30,080 --> 00:13:35,560 Speaker 1: you know Obama, particularly this guy now Bien. He's not 239 00:13:35,559 --> 00:13:37,480 Speaker 1: going to get his way in Congress, but he can 240 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 1: take a walk in the Rose Garden with the head 241 00:13:39,120 --> 00:13:42,160 Speaker 1: of the CIA. Somebody can be heard eight thousand, eight 242 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 1: thousand miles away. That makes you feel pretty good. And 243 00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:49,240 Speaker 1: so that it's all just we're in a mess, That's 244 00:13:49,280 --> 00:13:51,200 Speaker 1: all there is to it. And we need a president 245 00:13:51,240 --> 00:13:56,440 Speaker 1: that has more integrity than this guy does. And not 246 00:13:56,520 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 1: that I'm all for his domestic program, but and but 247 00:14:00,520 --> 00:14:04,080 Speaker 1: not not to go a piss on the head of 248 00:14:04,080 --> 00:14:06,560 Speaker 1: the Chinese and quite as much as he did on Putin. 249 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:10,600 Speaker 1: Speaking of that go ahead, I was just gonna say, 250 00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 1: Putin couldn't have started that war three years ago. I 251 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:18,480 Speaker 1: was in Moscow four or five years ago. Nobody liked him. 252 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:21,080 Speaker 1: You had drinks with some businessmen, which I did. I 253 00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:23,520 Speaker 1: did a lot of I was doing something interesting there 254 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:27,520 Speaker 1: and you see somebody in ne Polerbero. They all nobody 255 00:14:27,640 --> 00:14:29,720 Speaker 1: liked the guy. We don't often don't like our presidents. 256 00:14:29,760 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 1: But Moscow was doing trade with America. Americans are on 257 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:38,080 Speaker 1: the street. If they knew you were American, they said hello, 258 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:42,240 Speaker 1: thank you for being our friend. And so by being there, 259 00:14:42,760 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 1: and I don't think he could have sold the war 260 00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 1: against Ukraine. Ukraine was always seen as a self culture 261 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:53,280 Speaker 1: by Russia. In nineteen thirty two, there was a famine 262 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:57,960 Speaker 1: and Stalin took all of the wheat from Ukraine and 263 00:14:58,040 --> 00:15:02,640 Speaker 1: twenty or twenty two billion Ukrainian Star in the nineteen 264 00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:05,560 Speaker 1: thirty two it was. I mean, it's a great moment 265 00:15:05,560 --> 00:15:08,160 Speaker 1: of history. What brutes they were, and always they viewed 266 00:15:08,160 --> 00:15:12,080 Speaker 1: the Ukraines were they but they were also a buffer 267 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:15,760 Speaker 1: between them and the rest of Europe. Anyway, what can 268 00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:20,080 Speaker 1: I tell you, It's just we're in a real crisis, 269 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:21,800 Speaker 1: and I don't know why the Posts and the Times 270 00:15:21,880 --> 00:15:24,200 Speaker 1: want to keep on playing the game that everything's going 271 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 1: to be okay, maybe in Ukraine, and that whatever the 272 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:30,000 Speaker 1: White House tells him in briefings is true. And to 273 00:15:30,040 --> 00:15:32,840 Speaker 1: that point, well, excuse me, go ahead, No, I was 274 00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 1: going to say to that point about us just being 275 00:15:34,840 --> 00:15:36,880 Speaker 1: in a mass and a crisis and maybe tomorrow a 276 00:15:36,920 --> 00:15:40,080 Speaker 1: phrase a quagmire. I wanted to ask about this wonderful 277 00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:42,680 Speaker 1: piece you have reflecting on your relationship with Daniel Elsberget's 278 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:45,360 Speaker 1: up on your substack right now. You talk about how 279 00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:47,520 Speaker 1: some reporting that you did in the New York Times 280 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:50,120 Speaker 1: led to the establishment of the Senate's Church Committee back 281 00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:53,040 Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy five. And one of the interesting things 282 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:56,200 Speaker 1: about that is Republicans, for obviously partisan reasons that stem 283 00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:58,360 Speaker 1: from what I would argue were partisan five s of 284 00:15:58,440 --> 00:16:02,359 Speaker 1: abuses in the last ten years have sought to recreate, 285 00:16:02,640 --> 00:16:04,760 Speaker 1: let's say, the magic, to recapture the magic of the 286 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:07,360 Speaker 1: original Church Committee, and it looks like that's just not 287 00:16:07,440 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 1: going to work. It looks like the country is not 288 00:16:09,200 --> 00:16:14,320 Speaker 1: capable of hosting another Church Committee because the divisions are 289 00:16:14,600 --> 00:16:17,560 Speaker 1: so strong in Congress right now. And I wanted to 290 00:16:17,560 --> 00:16:20,440 Speaker 1: get your thoughts on that, as you've been reflecting not 291 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:23,080 Speaker 1: only in your relationship with Elsberg but on some of 292 00:16:23,080 --> 00:16:26,040 Speaker 1: the reporting you were doing at the time. Do you 293 00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:29,800 Speaker 1: think we're capable of recapturing the magic of the Church 294 00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 1: Committee or of hosting anything like the Church Committee right 295 00:16:33,440 --> 00:16:36,960 Speaker 1: now in twenty twenty three. You know, it's such a 296 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:39,240 Speaker 1: good question because that's exactly what I've been thinking about 297 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:42,360 Speaker 1: a lot, because Church Committee has popped up quite a 298 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:44,360 Speaker 1: bit recently as a sort of a model. It was 299 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:46,960 Speaker 1: the first time to see I was ever investigated, and 300 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:48,960 Speaker 1: in the piece I wrote about Elsburg plays a big 301 00:16:49,040 --> 00:16:52,920 Speaker 1: role with my relationship with him in a way too. 302 00:16:53,760 --> 00:16:56,160 Speaker 1: One thing that came out of the Church Committee, a 303 00:16:56,240 --> 00:16:59,160 Speaker 1: frank church was a model. It was a liberal, It 304 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:02,760 Speaker 1: wasn't very popular. Guess what, Like like a lot of 305 00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:04,360 Speaker 1: the guys in the Senate. He got up every morning, 306 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:05,800 Speaker 1: he looked in the mirror of it and said, why 307 00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:09,359 Speaker 1: not me. You know, his ambition was pretty much overbearing, 308 00:17:10,200 --> 00:17:13,000 Speaker 1: but he was very bright and I actually I got 309 00:17:13,000 --> 00:17:15,760 Speaker 1: to know him obviously very well and his staff and 310 00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 1: he did the investigation was amazing because one of the 311 00:17:19,160 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 1: recommendations was for the House and Senate to have intelligence committees, 312 00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:25,560 Speaker 1: and they were taken very seriously. They set up staffs 313 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:28,879 Speaker 1: and in the particularly in the seventies and eighties, who 314 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:32,080 Speaker 1: had people like Ben Bradley, basketball player. He lived down 315 00:17:32,119 --> 00:17:35,160 Speaker 1: the street around the corner Ben Bradley for years when 316 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 1: he was in the Senate. The kids used to play 317 00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:39,959 Speaker 1: basketball outside. He walked by in the morning on summer 318 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:43,080 Speaker 1: mornings and they would beg him shoot take one, take one, 319 00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:45,000 Speaker 1: you know, take a shot, and he would walk and 320 00:17:45,080 --> 00:17:47,679 Speaker 1: finally he'd turn around and maybe from thirty feet just 321 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:50,160 Speaker 1: jump up and flip it right through the middle, never miss. 322 00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:55,360 Speaker 1: Unbelievable for a neighbor, and very hart. When they ran 323 00:17:55,400 --> 00:17:59,600 Speaker 1: those committees, mad men like me running around chasing stories. 324 00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:01,440 Speaker 1: They would only talk to me on the record, which 325 00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:05,399 Speaker 1: I thought was admirable. They really respected the boundaries and 326 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,199 Speaker 1: they had meetings, and they had intelligence, and they had 327 00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:11,520 Speaker 1: between the Democrats and Republicans, there was a sense of unity. 328 00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:14,800 Speaker 1: And just think of that now. I think I's been destroyed. 329 00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:19,000 Speaker 1: We've seen the last years in that, particularly in the 330 00:18:19,000 --> 00:18:20,800 Speaker 1: House Committee with Adam Schiff on one side and the 331 00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:23,440 Speaker 1: Republicans on the other side, steaming and yelling about everything. 332 00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 1: There's no there's no comedy anymore, there's no need. The 333 00:18:26,320 --> 00:18:30,160 Speaker 1: committees are useless the under the rules that were set up, 334 00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:33,920 Speaker 1: anytime the special operations have put into effect, there has 335 00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:36,040 Speaker 1: to be a finding, has to go to the Congress. 336 00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:38,360 Speaker 1: There's a secret committee I know about in the in 337 00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:40,320 Speaker 1: the in the House, I don't know how it works. 338 00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:43,120 Speaker 1: In the Senate, there's a secret four man group off 339 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 1: the in the House Appropriation subcommittee, one of them there's 340 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 1: that meets but the clerk and they monitor and they 341 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:51,680 Speaker 1: take records. Can you can you believe that this White 342 00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 1: House had something they wanted to do, like blowing up 343 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:57,199 Speaker 1: a pipeline? Would they briefit to speak of McCarthy? Are 344 00:18:57,200 --> 00:18:59,960 Speaker 1: you kidding? And by the way, terms when I was 345 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:02,880 Speaker 1: dealing with Vietnam in the seventies at the New York 346 00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:08,879 Speaker 1: Times and writing a lot, and then the Democrats were 347 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:12,720 Speaker 1: supporting getting out of the war, along with many Republicans. 348 00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:17,639 Speaker 1: There were a dozen moderate centrist Republicans. The War Powers 349 00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:20,480 Speaker 1: Act of nineteen seventy three that forbid any more troops 350 00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:23,240 Speaker 1: to be on the ground or even air in the war, 351 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:28,600 Speaker 1: was written by a moderate Republican and his staff. And 352 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:33,639 Speaker 1: now it's such a can you imagine Chuck Soumer now 353 00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:37,159 Speaker 1: speaking that runs the Senate calling for an investigation of 354 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:40,720 Speaker 1: this of a Democratic president not a chance. And in 355 00:19:40,760 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: the House, which has now Republicans in control, they're much 356 00:19:45,320 --> 00:19:49,080 Speaker 1: more interested in chasing Hunter Biden, and then they are 357 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:54,359 Speaker 1: investigating anything seriously. I just don't imagine why this guy Jordan, 358 00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:57,760 Speaker 1: I watched him in a hearing on financial matters, he 359 00:19:57,800 --> 00:20:01,320 Speaker 1: actually does his homework. Why somebody isn't even on the 360 00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:03,920 Speaker 1: Republican side, doesn't seem to want to jump on this. 361 00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 1: So there you are. We're in a quagmire. We're in 362 00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:11,040 Speaker 1: a mess, and and this White House is making worse. 363 00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:15,200 Speaker 1: I encourage everybody to read the read the latest piece 364 00:20:15,240 --> 00:20:17,159 Speaker 1: my fifty years with Dan Elsberg as well, is of 365 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:20,320 Speaker 1: course the all the previous reporting. Now, thank you, thank 366 00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:22,879 Speaker 1: you so much for joining us really appreciate it. We 367 00:20:22,960 --> 00:20:27,840 Speaker 1: have an update from Germany on the pipeline explosion over 368 00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:29,920 Speaker 1: the North Stream. So if we if we could put 369 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:32,960 Speaker 1: this first element up, so a coalition of German papers 370 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:34,639 Speaker 1: and you can just go ahead, you can Google this 371 00:20:34,720 --> 00:20:37,280 Speaker 1: and just click English on the translation. It's it's so 372 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:40,359 Speaker 1: nice this like we have to acknowledge the things that 373 00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:44,240 Speaker 1: have gotten better that you can now just read German papers. 374 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:46,960 Speaker 1: It's not going to be perfect, but you're gonna you're 375 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:49,280 Speaker 1: gonna very much get the gist of it. And so 376 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:52,320 Speaker 1: let's start connecting some dots here. So the other day 377 00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:54,560 Speaker 1: you have the New York Times come out with its 378 00:20:55,160 --> 00:20:59,919 Speaker 1: extraordinarily thinly sourced article that says, we don't really know 379 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:02,520 Speaker 1: anything and we can't say how we know anything, but 380 00:21:02,560 --> 00:21:05,040 Speaker 1: we definitely know that there were no Americans or British, 381 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:07,960 Speaker 1: which is also quite specific. Yes, no Americans are British 382 00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:11,680 Speaker 1: who participated in this pipeline bombing. But there's new intelligence 383 00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:15,879 Speaker 1: which leads us to a pro Ukrainian group. Now there 384 00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:18,600 Speaker 1: was zero details. The German press is out with what 385 00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:22,040 Speaker 1: appear to be a bunch of the details that the 386 00:21:22,119 --> 00:21:26,880 Speaker 1: US security services were referring to when they came when 387 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:29,199 Speaker 1: they said we have new intelligence. It seems like this 388 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:31,639 Speaker 1: is what they're talking about it would you say that 389 00:21:31,800 --> 00:21:34,360 Speaker 1: is a fair two dots to connect. That was absolutely 390 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:37,119 Speaker 1: my interpretation of all of it. And remember this conversation 391 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:39,760 Speaker 1: had basically gone away until the Seamer Hurst story. And 392 00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:41,800 Speaker 1: if you're watching this, you probably see seymour Hurst down 393 00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:44,480 Speaker 1: on the lower bar. He is slated to come on 394 00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:47,320 Speaker 1: the show. We're hoping everything goes yea right, he said, 395 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:49,119 Speaker 1: I'm running around this morning. Yeah, I'm gonna try to 396 00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:51,960 Speaker 1: make it, so we'll see if you make tivdy. But 397 00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 1: all of this was just cracked wide open. Nobody was 398 00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:56,960 Speaker 1: talking about this. None of those reports were coming out 399 00:21:57,040 --> 00:22:01,720 Speaker 1: until the American government was implicated in Hershe's subsect post, basically, 400 00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:05,119 Speaker 1: which renewed conversation about it. And that's where, again I 401 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:08,000 Speaker 1: think you start seeing these reports from the New York Times, 402 00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:11,040 Speaker 1: reports from the German press. It seems like that created 403 00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:14,200 Speaker 1: the momentum to get the intelligence community to respond, right, 404 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:17,240 Speaker 1: and so where the New York Times artc was lacking 405 00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:21,200 Speaker 1: in details, the German press is kind of overflowing in details, 406 00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:23,920 Speaker 1: and so we could read out a couple of fun ones. 407 00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,440 Speaker 1: So first of all, they said that it's so. It 408 00:22:27,520 --> 00:22:31,159 Speaker 1: was allegedly a yacht rented from a company based in 409 00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:35,400 Speaker 1: Poland owned by two Ukrainians. So that's the that's their 410 00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 1: first clue that they say is pointing to the you know, 411 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:42,199 Speaker 1: a pro Ukrainian group. They say there were six people, 412 00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:47,159 Speaker 1: five men and one woman. Now we're talking like a 413 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:50,840 Speaker 1: rather incredible level of detail, very specific, not just it 414 00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:55,800 Speaker 1: wasn't us, right, but although carefully read each one of 415 00:22:55,840 --> 00:23:03,040 Speaker 1: these articles for overlap between CIA US involvement and what 416 00:23:03,080 --> 00:23:06,119 Speaker 1: they're saying. So because so far none of this actually 417 00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:10,760 Speaker 1: contradicts it could the CIA or some other US you know, 418 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:16,000 Speaker 1: security apparatus rent a yacht from a Polish company that's 419 00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:19,879 Speaker 1: owned by two Ukrainians. Like, absolutely, does the CIA have 420 00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:24,840 Speaker 1: access to five men and one woman? Yes, presumably they 421 00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:27,520 Speaker 1: could do this. We've seen their videos. They're all about conversity, 422 00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:30,560 Speaker 1: so they certainly they certainly have women who can do diving. 423 00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:32,680 Speaker 1: They said one of the one of the six was 424 00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:37,520 Speaker 1: a doctor cias doctors for sure. But more seriously, they 425 00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:40,679 Speaker 1: say that the equipment for the secret operation was transported 426 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:43,159 Speaker 1: to the port and a delivery truck. So again like 427 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:45,720 Speaker 1: more specifics, like we don't, they don't. They don't have 428 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:47,840 Speaker 1: much about the sourcing here. They're sourcing it back to 429 00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:52,240 Speaker 1: kind of German investigators. But that level of detail is interesting. 430 00:23:52,320 --> 00:23:54,719 Speaker 1: I mean, how else are the explosives going to get 431 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:57,640 Speaker 1: there other than a truck? So perhaps that's just deduction, 432 00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:00,240 Speaker 1: Like I mean, you're not gonna you're not gonna own 433 00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:02,439 Speaker 1: fly him over and drop them into the yacht. Otherwise 434 00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:05,520 Speaker 1: you're not gonna have a wheelbarrel either, probably right truck. 435 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:08,560 Speaker 1: So uh. The yacht was then returned to the owner 436 00:24:08,560 --> 00:24:12,600 Speaker 1: in an unclean condition. The more details here, investigators found 437 00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:16,040 Speaker 1: traces of explosives on the table in the cabin. Now, 438 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:20,679 Speaker 1: some German observers have raised the possibility that some of 439 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:24,160 Speaker 1: this was done to kind of bait people into thinking 440 00:24:24,520 --> 00:24:27,800 Speaker 1: that this, you know, to throw breadcrumbs in a different direction. Yeah, 441 00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:30,800 Speaker 1: because like if it's the CIA, you know, they they 442 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:35,320 Speaker 1: probably either know how to clean up the explosives or 443 00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:38,479 Speaker 1: if that's difficult, they just sink the boat like you know, 444 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:39,960 Speaker 1: or they blow it up like they don't, you know, 445 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:42,199 Speaker 1: they don't, they don't really, they're not. They're not that 446 00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:45,840 Speaker 1: concerned about getting their deposit back on the rented yacht, 447 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:49,520 Speaker 1: like that's that's that's not the top ten you know 448 00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:52,680 Speaker 1: mission list. They can item they can shake the piggy 449 00:24:52,720 --> 00:24:56,440 Speaker 1: bank over the pentagony. Yeah yeah, yeah, figure as Kramer says, 450 00:24:56,480 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: that's a rite off. Yeah, that's just a write off. 451 00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:04,520 Speaker 1: And so interestingly, you know, some of this obviously conflicts 452 00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,639 Speaker 1: with what Seymour Hirsch reported. On the other hand, a 453 00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:11,879 Speaker 1: lot of it could align with it. And it is interesting. 454 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:15,359 Speaker 1: It does seem like Hirsh's reporting kind of shook the trees, yes, 455 00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:17,919 Speaker 1: and got some of this out. Yeah, absolutely, And this 456 00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:22,480 Speaker 1: creates I think new conversations between well, I'm curious and 457 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:24,439 Speaker 1: maybe if we back up a bit, how do you 458 00:25:24,520 --> 00:25:27,520 Speaker 1: think Putin is going to start responding if he does 459 00:25:27,560 --> 00:25:32,400 Speaker 1: start responding to this reporting. So interestingly, you know, Putin's 460 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:34,800 Speaker 1: claim was never that it was Ukraine that did this, 461 00:25:35,359 --> 00:25:36,960 Speaker 1: and you know, Putin can say whatever he wants. He 462 00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:39,160 Speaker 1: could like, he can say whatever he thinks is most 463 00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:44,119 Speaker 1: advantageous to him. The Russians were blaming British operatives and 464 00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:46,840 Speaker 1: Hirsh's article said no, it was actually actually the US 465 00:25:48,119 --> 00:25:53,760 Speaker 1: to have alleged kind of pro Ukrainian group involvement in 466 00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:58,200 Speaker 1: this I think makes it for very interesting politics, particularly 467 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:00,720 Speaker 1: in Germany, because if all of a sudd ud, you 468 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:03,639 Speaker 1: have a German public that says, wait a minute, so 469 00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:08,320 Speaker 1: we're paying these high electricity prices by energy prices because 470 00:26:08,359 --> 00:26:10,800 Speaker 1: the Ukrainians blew up the pipeline that we had been 471 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:13,879 Speaker 1: invested in building for all of these years, so that 472 00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:17,720 Speaker 1: they would force us to then continue, you know, cooperating 473 00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:21,199 Speaker 1: with their defense of the Russian invasion. You you know, 474 00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:24,359 Speaker 1: if if this catches hold in Germany and if it 475 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:26,359 Speaker 1: and if it becomes kind of a settled fact that 476 00:26:26,400 --> 00:26:29,240 Speaker 1: it was actually this pro Ukrainian group, although the CIA 477 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:32,920 Speaker 1: could also be described as a pro Ukrainian group, Uh, 478 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:36,080 Speaker 1: then uh then yeah, that that I think plays into 479 00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 1: the geopolitics and could sour you know, European public opinion 480 00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:44,520 Speaker 1: on support for this war. So the fact that the US, 481 00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:46,879 Speaker 1: by leaking this to the New York Times and the 482 00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:51,679 Speaker 1: German German investigators, you know, uh, playing with the German 483 00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 1: press in this way suggest they're kind of really playing 484 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:56,920 Speaker 1: with public opinion fire a little bit. And somebody brought 485 00:26:56,920 --> 00:27:01,080 Speaker 1: that information to Hirsh as well. So point yeah, public 486 00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:05,160 Speaker 1: information fire. That's absolutely what's happening here. So I think 487 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:07,760 Speaker 1: you're right, this is a huge development. And again this 488 00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:12,480 Speaker 1: is from German public prosecutors. It's a huge development geopolitically, 489 00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:17,080 Speaker 1: So you can't really understate what we're learning day to 490 00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:20,760 Speaker 1: day on this massively expensive pipeline that was I was 491 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:24,159 Speaker 1: gonna say that was geopolitically important for years before the 492 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:27,040 Speaker 1: war even broke out, and still is. And so latest 493 00:27:27,119 --> 00:27:30,439 Speaker 1: update of the AP reporting this morning. Germany's Defense minister 494 00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:33,119 Speaker 1: voiced caution wednesday over media reports that a pro Ukraine 495 00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:35,120 Speaker 1: group was involved in blowing up the North Stream gas 496 00:27:35,119 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 1: pipelines in the Baltic Sea last year. So you're running 497 00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:41,119 Speaker 1: into one of these situations again where you have some 498 00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:46,199 Speaker 1: elements of the German investigators kind of leaking information, then 499 00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:49,920 Speaker 1: you have official elements saying, well, well, well, let's be cautious, 500 00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:54,119 Speaker 1: we don't actually you know, our investigation remains incomplete, and 501 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:56,320 Speaker 1: so that you wind up with the public just kind 502 00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:59,119 Speaker 1: of sorting into its own groups of who and what 503 00:27:59,119 --> 00:28:00,800 Speaker 1: they're going to believe. Yeah, and I think that's going 504 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:02,280 Speaker 1: to be the case for decades to come. I don't 505 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:05,120 Speaker 1: think anyone's ever going to get to the real fact here. 506 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:07,560 Speaker 1: I don't think you know, you can make educated guesses 507 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:09,440 Speaker 1: based on the reporting that continues to come out, and 508 00:28:09,480 --> 00:28:11,760 Speaker 1: by the way, I expect this information will continue to 509 00:28:11,800 --> 00:28:13,400 Speaker 1: kind of drip out over the course of like when 510 00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:16,200 Speaker 1: people start writing books about the war in Ukraine. It's 511 00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:18,720 Speaker 1: like the details we get to CIA's behavior during the 512 00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:22,679 Speaker 1: Cold War that either come out during church committee hearing 513 00:28:23,119 --> 00:28:26,160 Speaker 1: or are fleshed out in someone's really well reported book. 514 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 1: I don't think we're ever going to know some diver 515 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,440 Speaker 1: wants to write that memoir right well, the credit Yeah, 516 00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:34,560 Speaker 1: in the near future, I don't expect we'll have any 517 00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:39,360 Speaker 1: confirmation from anybody's government or anybody involved about what actually 518 00:28:39,400 --> 00:28:45,560 Speaker 1: factually happened. And so moving on. The big economic news 519 00:28:45,920 --> 00:28:47,640 Speaker 1: came out of the Federal Reserve yesterday. If we can 520 00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:50,640 Speaker 1: put up a one here, this is a FED chair 521 00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:53,400 Speaker 1: Jerome Pwell saying that he's actually going to be ramping 522 00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:57,400 Speaker 1: up interest rate increases much more significantly than he had 523 00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:02,880 Speaker 1: planned in the past to Congress yesterday and was grilled 524 00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 1: by Massachusetts Senator Elizabeth Warren on what the implications would 525 00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:11,720 Speaker 1: be for unemployment. Let's roll Warren here, Chair Pale, if 526 00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:14,120 Speaker 1: you hit your projections do you know how many people 527 00:29:14,200 --> 00:29:16,840 Speaker 1: who are currently working, going about their lives will lose 528 00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:20,960 Speaker 1: their jobs. I don't have that number in front of me. 529 00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:24,080 Speaker 1: I will say it's amended consequence, but it is and 530 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:25,880 Speaker 1: it's in your report, and that would be about two 531 00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:28,360 Speaker 1: million people who would lose their jobs, people who are 532 00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:30,800 Speaker 1: working right now making their mortgages. So, chair pal, if 533 00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:33,360 Speaker 1: you could speak directly to the two million hard working 534 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:36,400 Speaker 1: people who have decent jobs today who you're planning to 535 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:38,960 Speaker 1: get fired over the next year, what would you say 536 00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:40,479 Speaker 1: to them? How would you explain your view that they 537 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:42,760 Speaker 1: need to lose their jobs. I would explain to people 538 00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 1: more broadly, that inflation is extremely high and it's hurting 539 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:48,360 Speaker 1: the working people of this country badly. All of them, 540 00:29:48,480 --> 00:29:49,719 Speaker 1: not just two million of them, but all of them 541 00:29:49,720 --> 00:29:52,560 Speaker 1: are suffering under high inflation. And we are taking the 542 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:55,560 Speaker 1: only measures we have to bring inflation down, and putting 543 00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,000 Speaker 1: two million people out of work is just part of 544 00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:58,800 Speaker 1: the cost. Let me ask you about what happens if 545 00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:01,360 Speaker 1: you do this. Since the of World War Two, there 546 00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:03,840 Speaker 1: have been twelve times in which the unemployment rate has 547 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:07,120 Speaker 1: increased by one percentage point within one year. Exactly what 548 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:09,320 Speaker 1: you're aiming to do right now, how many of those 549 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 1: times did the US economy avoid falling into a recession? 550 00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:16,880 Speaker 1: You know, it's it's not as black and white as 551 00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:18,640 Speaker 1: very just look at the numbers. It actually is pretty 552 00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:20,800 Speaker 1: blacks written book on this end, there have been twelve 553 00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:23,640 Speaker 1: times that we've seen a one point increase in the unemployed, 554 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:26,320 Speaker 1: in the unemployment rate in a year. That's exactly what 555 00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:28,880 Speaker 1: your FED report has put out as the projection and 556 00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:30,520 Speaker 1: the plan based on how you're going to keep raising 557 00:30:30,560 --> 00:30:33,080 Speaker 1: these interest rates. How many times do the economy fail 558 00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:35,120 Speaker 1: to fall into a recession after doing that? Out of 559 00:30:35,160 --> 00:30:36,840 Speaker 1: twelve times, I think the number zero. I think the 560 00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:39,520 Speaker 1: number is zero. That's exactly right. What I like about 561 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:43,320 Speaker 1: this is that it's a clash of of real conflicting values. 562 00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:46,840 Speaker 1: That's a good point. On the one hand, Elizabeth Warren 563 00:30:47,200 --> 00:30:51,920 Speaker 1: talking about the millions, you know, two million unemployed people 564 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:57,560 Speaker 1: that Powell's policy will produce, Like that's not only is 565 00:30:57,560 --> 00:30:59,920 Speaker 1: that two million people who are who are now paying 566 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:02,520 Speaker 1: able to pay their bills, you know, finding dignity in 567 00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:05,120 Speaker 1: their work that no longer can and no longer do. 568 00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:09,080 Speaker 1: But then you then, you know, push fear all the 569 00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:12,800 Speaker 1: way through the workforce, and you discipline the workforce, and 570 00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:16,040 Speaker 1: a militant worker who might want to have wanted to 571 00:31:16,120 --> 00:31:18,080 Speaker 1: organize the you know, into a union or push for 572 00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:20,480 Speaker 1: a raise, or push back against sexual harassment or other 573 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:22,920 Speaker 1: abuse in the workplace. Now all of a sudden, hmm, 574 00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 1: I'm not going to be able to get another job 575 00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:27,960 Speaker 1: if I lose this one, and so everybody's life gets 576 00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:32,800 Speaker 1: worse versus the other value of prices arising too fast, 577 00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:35,760 Speaker 1: and that sucks for people. Right. What was your response 578 00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:37,560 Speaker 1: to that, Well, that's exactly what I was going to say. 579 00:31:37,600 --> 00:31:39,640 Speaker 1: It's hard for me to give Elizabeth Warren the moral 580 00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:42,600 Speaker 1: high ground in that question, and obviously that generally applies 581 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:45,560 Speaker 1: to conversations about politicians. But when you're saying, you know, 582 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:49,360 Speaker 1: how much spending, for instance, did Elizabeth Warren support that 583 00:31:49,480 --> 00:31:53,280 Speaker 1: has been making working people's bank accounts bleed because the 584 00:31:53,280 --> 00:31:55,480 Speaker 1: price of eggs is exploding, and it's not just eggs, 585 00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:57,920 Speaker 1: of course, it's the entire consumer price in the X 586 00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:00,520 Speaker 1: If you look at your basket of groceries the last 587 00:32:00,600 --> 00:32:03,600 Speaker 1: several months, the last year and a half, basically, how 588 00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:06,880 Speaker 1: much of the spending that contributed to those price hikes 589 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:09,800 Speaker 1: has Elizabeth Warren supported, and so part of this is 590 00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:12,440 Speaker 1: putting everyone between a rock and a hard place. Either 591 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:15,080 Speaker 1: Jerome Powell and Elizabeth Warren like both of them between 592 00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:18,040 Speaker 1: a rock and a hard place, because from Elizabeth Warren's perspective, 593 00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,080 Speaker 1: and sometimes I think correctly, we need to spend more 594 00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 1: on X, Y and Z package, but we also know 595 00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:26,720 Speaker 1: that we'll contribute in some ways to a rise in inflation. 596 00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:30,520 Speaker 1: We're nowhere near a hike that looks like vulgar right like, 597 00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:34,120 Speaker 1: we're not exactly back to that time period, yet we're 598 00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:37,320 Speaker 1: not suffering under anything quite to that point. Hopefully it 599 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:40,840 Speaker 1: doesn't get to that, but the point is getting letting 600 00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:43,360 Speaker 1: inflation get out of control, and supporting measures that let 601 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:46,560 Speaker 1: inflation get out of control. I don't think gives you 602 00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:48,520 Speaker 1: the moral high ground then to go to Jerome Powell 603 00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:53,560 Speaker 1: and say, basically, you're intentionally putting people out of work, 604 00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:56,200 Speaker 1: because that's part of the story. It might be true, 605 00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:58,240 Speaker 1: but it's part of the story. And to me, the 606 00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:00,920 Speaker 1: problem here is that it's not necessarily the case that 607 00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:03,840 Speaker 1: the treatment is going to cure the disease. And I 608 00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:06,640 Speaker 1: worry that twenty years from now, if we have some 609 00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:11,479 Speaker 1: more sophisticated economic modeling capacity. Maybe chat GPT can do 610 00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:14,600 Speaker 1: that for us. We'll look back and be like, what 611 00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:18,600 Speaker 1: were these economists thinking, Like, well, I mean, you'll have 612 00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:21,480 Speaker 1: left wing economists saying, well, we know what they were thinking. 613 00:33:21,480 --> 00:33:23,280 Speaker 1: They were serving the interests of the lead. But the 614 00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:26,360 Speaker 1: ones who were saying, let's let's pretend and take for granted, 615 00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:29,120 Speaker 1: they're actually trying to kind of manage the economy in 616 00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:32,560 Speaker 1: the most effective way possible. It's almost as if these 617 00:33:32,560 --> 00:33:34,960 Speaker 1: are doctors who are bleeding a patient because they have 618 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:36,920 Speaker 1: a fever. The know, the way that George Washington had 619 00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:41,800 Speaker 1: like eight different doctors, you know that each individually bled him, 620 00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:45,040 Speaker 1: and they would and then because you would have some 621 00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:48,320 Speaker 1: people who recovered after they were bled, right you had 622 00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:51,240 Speaker 1: the medical profession, You're like, well, you know, bleeding actually works. 623 00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:56,840 Speaker 1: Look here this happens. And so the question that becomes 624 00:33:57,440 --> 00:34:02,840 Speaker 1: how does kind of raising the unam employment rate affect prices? 625 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:07,719 Speaker 1: If prices are either related to you know, ecological or 626 00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:12,920 Speaker 1: viral logical crises or to corporate greed. There's there have 627 00:34:12,960 --> 00:34:16,480 Speaker 1: been reports out that's up to fifty percent of the 628 00:34:16,520 --> 00:34:21,520 Speaker 1: price increases that we've seen have have come from corporations 629 00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:26,360 Speaker 1: who have opportunistically raised prices and didn't have to because 630 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:30,320 Speaker 1: wholesale prices arising, So that's half. We also note if you, 631 00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:33,920 Speaker 1: as an you know, you mentioned the eggs, well, the 632 00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:37,840 Speaker 1: bird flu has wiped out like millions approaching billions of 633 00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:40,879 Speaker 1: birds around the world, and there's no interest rate move 634 00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:43,840 Speaker 1: And I think that makes us kind of sad as humans, 635 00:34:43,840 --> 00:34:46,240 Speaker 1: as economists, because we want to be able to control everything. 636 00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:48,600 Speaker 1: We want to think, well, if we, if we, you know, 637 00:34:48,640 --> 00:34:52,840 Speaker 1: do something about our quantitative easing policy, then we're the 638 00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:57,240 Speaker 1: avian flu. Avian flu. With what's seventy five percent confidence, 639 00:34:57,280 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 1: we can predict that the avian flu will be negated 640 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:03,440 Speaker 1: by our interest rate measures, right. I think I think 641 00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:07,400 Speaker 1: some pro Iranian militias launched some strike on a chicken 642 00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:10,919 Speaker 1: farm in Syria, like maybe that'll do it, Maybe that'll 643 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,400 Speaker 1: do something about bird flu. But that happened pretty recently. 644 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:16,560 Speaker 1: But so this and the same is true when it 645 00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:19,920 Speaker 1: comes to kind of ecological crises, that if the planet 646 00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:23,839 Speaker 1: is not able just to function in the way that 647 00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:28,440 Speaker 1: it does at this carbon concentration for these eight nine 648 00:35:28,520 --> 00:35:31,319 Speaker 1: billion people, as it was for six billion people out 649 00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:33,960 Speaker 1: of lower carbon concentrations. What does that do to our 650 00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:38,040 Speaker 1: economic models? And what? You know, how does moving the 651 00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:42,279 Speaker 1: interest rate and moving the unemployment rate actually help there? Well? Yeah, 652 00:35:42,320 --> 00:35:45,960 Speaker 1: and that's there's the two million number, which he didn't 653 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:47,879 Speaker 1: even have off the top of his head. I think 654 00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:49,920 Speaker 1: that was a pretty bad luck, first and foremost, that 655 00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:52,200 Speaker 1: it was in his own report, as Elizabeth Warren pointed out, 656 00:35:52,200 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 1: and Jerome Powell couldn't mention. Maybe he didn't want to 657 00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:57,080 Speaker 1: say the number, but it seemed like perhaps he was 658 00:35:57,120 --> 00:35:59,080 Speaker 1: just entirely ignorant of it, which I think is telling 659 00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:02,080 Speaker 1: in and of itself, because it treats people or it 660 00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:05,799 Speaker 1: contributes this idea that the mentality among people sitting at 661 00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:09,120 Speaker 1: the FED is that people are numbers and numbers can 662 00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:11,279 Speaker 1: be massaged and we can take care of this with 663 00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:13,680 Speaker 1: the formula, which may or not be the case for 664 00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:15,640 Speaker 1: everybody over at the FED. But when you don't have 665 00:36:15,680 --> 00:36:18,160 Speaker 1: that number or from your own report, and you're unwilling 666 00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:21,279 Speaker 1: to say it, then yeah, that's a problem. So but 667 00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:24,000 Speaker 1: the question then, also, I think, becomes what does all 668 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:26,040 Speaker 1: of this do to wages? What does all of that 669 00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:28,920 Speaker 1: do to corporate profits? To your point, I think that's 670 00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:31,560 Speaker 1: one area of the right has totally missed an opportunity. 671 00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:33,720 Speaker 1: Over the course of last year. There is good reporting 672 00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:35,719 Speaker 1: on how corporate greed has contributed to all of that, 673 00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:39,239 Speaker 1: and obviously Elizabeth Warren would be on the right side 674 00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:44,160 Speaker 1: of that conversation. But I mean, their models can't really 675 00:36:44,200 --> 00:36:46,719 Speaker 1: account for a lot of that's right, And just to 676 00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:49,160 Speaker 1: underline the point about work or power, you often see 677 00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:51,319 Speaker 1: a lot of people who will say, well, look, I'm 678 00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:52,920 Speaker 1: sorry that one or two million people are going to 679 00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:55,040 Speaker 1: lose their job, but three hundred and thirty million people 680 00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:58,880 Speaker 1: are suffering through higher prices. Yeah, but the reason that 681 00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:03,720 Speaker 1: unemployment drives down wages is because it spreads fear throughout 682 00:37:03,719 --> 00:37:07,319 Speaker 1: the entire economy, like they're not just going to, you know, 683 00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:10,080 Speaker 1: fire these one or two million people and then magically 684 00:37:10,600 --> 00:37:14,200 Speaker 1: wages go down and prices go down. It's because they're 685 00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:17,160 Speaker 1: firing those people as a warning to you. So every 686 00:37:17,200 --> 00:37:20,480 Speaker 1: single person in the workforce, and every single person who 687 00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:23,440 Speaker 1: depends on someone in the workforce, which almost gets to 688 00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:26,440 Speaker 1: three hundred and some million people, is actually going to 689 00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:29,400 Speaker 1: suffer from high higher unemployment rate. So I think, and 690 00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:32,360 Speaker 1: perhaps we've had low unemployment now for so long that 691 00:37:32,400 --> 00:37:35,279 Speaker 1: people forget that what that fear and what that pain 692 00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:38,759 Speaker 1: is like, and they might regret getting what they asked for. Yeah, 693 00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:40,080 Speaker 1: and there's not going to be some sort of like 694 00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:44,000 Speaker 1: patriotic hug from corporate America to workers as a reaction 695 00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:47,240 Speaker 1: to the organizing, which, like the numbers on the increase 696 00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:50,840 Speaker 1: in organizing over year to year have been really really 697 00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:56,200 Speaker 1: like staggering just and organizing exactly and a direct consequence 698 00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:59,040 Speaker 1: of full unemployment. And that goes away when you lose 699 00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:03,000 Speaker 1: full unemployment, which is why somebody liked Jeroam Pal would 700 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:04,560 Speaker 1: like to see the numbers go up a little bit. 701 00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:07,799 Speaker 1: And he's not wrong that there are trade offs, and 702 00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:11,439 Speaker 1: I think Elizabeth Warren is maybe glossing over that for 703 00:38:11,480 --> 00:38:14,080 Speaker 1: the sake of asking those questions in a way, in 704 00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:17,879 Speaker 1: a very particular way. But to your point, yeah, there's 705 00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:21,719 Speaker 1: a there's a broader aperture to make those trade offs 706 00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:24,480 Speaker 1: with them. And speaking of trade offs, let's put up 707 00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:29,120 Speaker 1: b one here. Joe Biden has put forward his plan 708 00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:34,240 Speaker 1: both for defosit reduction and for shoring up medicare challenging 709 00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:38,000 Speaker 1: Republicans to come up with their own plan. This flows 710 00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:41,640 Speaker 1: from that kind of iconic moment in his State of 711 00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:45,760 Speaker 1: the Union where Marjorie Taylor Green and others were saying, 712 00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:47,640 Speaker 1: you're a liar. We don't want to cut Medicare and 713 00:38:47,680 --> 00:38:51,719 Speaker 1: solid security, and Biden kind of paused the conversation and said, okay, 714 00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:54,120 Speaker 1: so let me make sure everybody's on board here. So 715 00:38:54,239 --> 00:38:58,280 Speaker 1: what you're saying is cuts to social Security and Medicare 716 00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:01,920 Speaker 1: are off the table, and they all said off the table. 717 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:04,520 Speaker 1: And so he's like, okay, so here's how work. I'm 718 00:39:04,560 --> 00:39:07,400 Speaker 1: going to shure up Medicare and basically has two He 719 00:39:07,440 --> 00:39:12,520 Speaker 1: has two planks, very simple. One, he's going to allow 720 00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:16,560 Speaker 1: Medicare to further negotiate drug prices, save some two hundred 721 00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:19,480 Speaker 1: billion dollars over ten years, and all of that money 722 00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:22,719 Speaker 1: goes to the Medicare Trust Fund to extend it. And 723 00:39:22,760 --> 00:39:26,359 Speaker 1: then secondly, the ACA put in. And if you're rich, 724 00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,960 Speaker 1: you know this and you're angry about it. Three point 725 00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:33,400 Speaker 1: eight percent kind of basically investment tax over over four 726 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:35,720 Speaker 1: hundred thousand. If you make more than four hundred thousand 727 00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:38,560 Speaker 1: dollars a year, you pay this three point eight percent hit. 728 00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:41,920 Speaker 1: And he wants to raise that from three point eight 729 00:39:42,000 --> 00:39:45,520 Speaker 1: to five percent. Now when they initially passed this three 730 00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:47,960 Speaker 1: point eight percent thing. It was one of the most 731 00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:51,280 Speaker 1: significant kind of class war things that was actually in 732 00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:54,560 Speaker 1: the ACA, and it became the thing that Republicans worked 733 00:39:54,600 --> 00:39:58,160 Speaker 1: to repeal incessantly and actually failed. Said that the sky 734 00:39:58,320 --> 00:39:59,960 Speaker 1: was going to fall, the markets are going to tang 735 00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:02,200 Speaker 1: like you're you know, we're not going to have We're 736 00:40:02,200 --> 00:40:03,560 Speaker 1: not going to have a free market, and the kind 737 00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:05,520 Speaker 1: of free people will cease to exist because of this 738 00:40:05,600 --> 00:40:08,520 Speaker 1: three point eight percent. They'll fee that you're that you're 739 00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:10,640 Speaker 1: attacking on top of people making four hundred thousand dollars 740 00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:13,440 Speaker 1: on their investments. Here we are most people don't even 741 00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:16,200 Speaker 1: know it exists. Markets have you done fine? And not 742 00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:17,840 Speaker 1: done fine? It doesn't seem to have anything to do 743 00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:19,879 Speaker 1: with that. So these are his two plans. This is it. 744 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:22,520 Speaker 1: The rich pay a little bit more and we're going 745 00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:25,960 Speaker 1: to negotiate with big Pharma. And with that, the Medicare 746 00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:30,520 Speaker 1: Trust Fund rolls out to twenty fifty. So now the 747 00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:34,120 Speaker 1: shoe is on the foot of Republicans. Yeah, exactly, the 748 00:40:34,160 --> 00:40:36,560 Speaker 1: balls in the court of Republicans use a better cliche. Sure, 749 00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:39,520 Speaker 1: it's not a bad place for negotiations to begin, and 750 00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:41,560 Speaker 1: that's what this looks like it looks like he's using 751 00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:43,400 Speaker 1: the New York Times up ed to kick off and 752 00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:47,040 Speaker 1: say this is point A, and negotiations obviously always are 753 00:40:47,040 --> 00:40:49,280 Speaker 1: going to go from A to Z and his starting 754 00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:51,600 Speaker 1: point here, it's really not bad you highlighted. And I 755 00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:54,879 Speaker 1: think we have this element a Washington Post article on 756 00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:58,640 Speaker 1: the advisor to Kevin McCarthy, who's formerly an advisor to 757 00:40:58,840 --> 00:41:01,280 Speaker 1: New Ganger. So there's some great quotes from John Bayer 758 00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:06,239 Speaker 1: in this article basically saying, you know, this particular advisor, 759 00:41:06,800 --> 00:41:09,080 Speaker 1: Kevin McCarthy doesn't like to tell people know this isn't 760 00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:12,920 Speaker 1: the piece, but he will Dale Meyer will, yeah, And 761 00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:17,160 Speaker 1: I think that's actually probably accurate. But to your point, Ryan, 762 00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:20,040 Speaker 1: there's this question about how Republicans can kind of make 763 00:41:20,080 --> 00:41:24,680 Speaker 1: the math work on their end if they don't and 764 00:41:24,719 --> 00:41:29,080 Speaker 1: a lighter but Republicans could possibly make this math work 765 00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:33,520 Speaker 1: if they don't want to touch entitlements period that they've 766 00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:35,319 Speaker 1: said it's off the table. They don't want to do that. 767 00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:38,600 Speaker 1: If they don't want to, I'm sorry, strengthen entitlements our 768 00:41:38,600 --> 00:41:41,600 Speaker 1: favorite euphemism. Hearing counterpoints, they don't want to strengthen entitlements, 769 00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:43,640 Speaker 1: how do they make the math work. Now, what was 770 00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:46,200 Speaker 1: interesting to me about this article is that russ Vote 771 00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:50,240 Speaker 1: the Omb under Donald Trump has a plan on how 772 00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:54,200 Speaker 1: Republicans can make that math work without touching entitlements. It's 773 00:41:54,239 --> 00:41:56,400 Speaker 1: a really interesting plan. You can go and read it 774 00:41:56,440 --> 00:41:58,799 Speaker 1: on the internet, and basically what it does is look 775 00:41:58,880 --> 00:42:01,799 Speaker 1: for a bunch of that that can be trimmed bureaucratically 776 00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:05,560 Speaker 1: around these sort of cultural leftist priorities some people may 777 00:42:05,600 --> 00:42:08,799 Speaker 1: call them woke priorities, and he makes the math work 778 00:42:08,840 --> 00:42:10,320 Speaker 1: that way. He's in charge of the budget during the 779 00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:12,960 Speaker 1: Trump administration, knows his way around O ANDB obviously as 780 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:15,200 Speaker 1: a former head of it. What was interesting to me 781 00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:17,000 Speaker 1: about the Washington Post article that you just saw on 782 00:42:17,040 --> 00:42:20,560 Speaker 1: the screen by Jeff Stein basically is that Dan Meyer, 783 00:42:20,719 --> 00:42:24,600 Speaker 1: I can only imagine it's not paying attention to that paper. 784 00:42:25,239 --> 00:42:27,960 Speaker 1: And does he run that veterans group now, I'm not sure, 785 00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:30,600 Speaker 1: a conservative veterans group, Yeah, I'm not sure, which would 786 00:42:30,640 --> 00:42:33,840 Speaker 1: which would suggest that maybe he'll check out the Pentagon, 787 00:42:33,920 --> 00:42:36,080 Speaker 1: look under that hood, see if there's a couple trillion 788 00:42:36,520 --> 00:42:39,840 Speaker 1: that could come out of there. I would think that 789 00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:43,680 Speaker 1: that Meyer will be looking wherever he can, because if 790 00:42:43,719 --> 00:42:45,880 Speaker 1: he's going to make a good faith effort, which I 791 00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:48,920 Speaker 1: think that's all he's going to do, is like and 792 00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:51,520 Speaker 1: by good faith, I mean Clinton's old phrase where he 793 00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:53,839 Speaker 1: used to say, I want to get caught trying, which 794 00:42:53,880 --> 00:42:56,239 Speaker 1: meant you're actually not going to succeed, but you want 795 00:42:56,239 --> 00:42:58,959 Speaker 1: to look like you're at least like, Look, I'm doing 796 00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:01,080 Speaker 1: the best that I can, just to prove to you 797 00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:03,839 Speaker 1: that my best is not good enough, because like you said, 798 00:43:03,840 --> 00:43:06,279 Speaker 1: if you're not cutting the Pentagon, and if you're not 799 00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:09,600 Speaker 1: cutting Social Security and Medicare, then there isn't the money 800 00:43:10,239 --> 00:43:13,840 Speaker 1: out there to do what Republicans want to do. Now 801 00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:16,040 Speaker 1: there is the money if you're willing to do what 802 00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:17,719 Speaker 1: Biden is willing to do, and we can put this 803 00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:19,680 Speaker 1: other one up there. This came out this morning in 804 00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:22,319 Speaker 1: the New York Times. This is Biden previewing what his 805 00:43:22,480 --> 00:43:25,240 Speaker 1: deficit reduction plan is going to be. And it's annoying 806 00:43:25,280 --> 00:43:28,400 Speaker 1: that Biden is focusing on deficit reduction rather than actual 807 00:43:28,680 --> 00:43:31,680 Speaker 1: investment priorities. But whenever, this is Joe who Joe Biden is, 808 00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:33,480 Speaker 1: and it's the world we're in. If he's got to 809 00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:35,480 Speaker 1: do it, I do like the way he's doing it. 810 00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:38,759 Speaker 1: He suggests basically a wealth tax on everybody making more 811 00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:41,319 Speaker 1: than one hundred million dollars or worth more than one 812 00:43:41,360 --> 00:43:43,120 Speaker 1: hundred million dollars a year. I think it is rather 813 00:43:43,160 --> 00:43:46,520 Speaker 1: than making more you would and you for those people, 814 00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:49,640 Speaker 1: they have to pay on their asset growth, in their 815 00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:54,000 Speaker 1: stock growth. So if you're Elon Musk and you're stuck, 816 00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:58,880 Speaker 1: you know the value of your portfolio increased by fifty 817 00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:01,560 Speaker 1: percent in a year, you have to figure out ways 818 00:44:01,560 --> 00:44:05,799 Speaker 1: to pay on that. And so that that plus some 819 00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:08,960 Speaker 1: other kind of corporate taxes and you know other like 820 00:44:09,600 --> 00:44:13,760 Speaker 1: basic progressive stuff that just hits the rich and major corporations, 821 00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:18,759 Speaker 1: he ends up reducing the deficit by two trillion dollars 822 00:44:18,760 --> 00:44:21,719 Speaker 1: over like ten years, which is a big number, and 823 00:44:21,920 --> 00:44:25,440 Speaker 1: which is a number that Republicans, unless you can think 824 00:44:25,440 --> 00:44:27,480 Speaker 1: of some way they can do it, just simply can't 825 00:44:27,480 --> 00:44:30,440 Speaker 1: meet because they're unwilling to raise taxes, unwilling to go 826 00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:33,719 Speaker 1: after the Pentagon, and unwilling to and they'd love to 827 00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:35,759 Speaker 1: go after Medicare and soeleecurity, but they've taken it off 828 00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:37,799 Speaker 1: the table. Well, I was going to say, yeah, they 829 00:44:38,760 --> 00:44:40,839 Speaker 1: may be willing to go after the Pentagon. We've seen 830 00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:43,440 Speaker 1: even the President of the Heritage Foundation at this point 831 00:44:43,760 --> 00:44:47,520 Speaker 1: calling for things to that extent, there's a real app 832 00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:50,280 Speaker 1: for going after the Pentagon, at least in the conservative movement, 833 00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:52,320 Speaker 1: if not in the Republican Party. I think it's basically 834 00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:55,680 Speaker 1: impossible to take even if something that the president of 835 00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:58,080 Speaker 1: the Heritage Foundation wants to do, and then when it 836 00:44:58,080 --> 00:45:01,040 Speaker 1: comes to the Pentagon, push that through the Republican Party. 837 00:45:01,640 --> 00:45:04,360 Speaker 1: So yes, I agree with that point, But it's also 838 00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:08,640 Speaker 1: a matter of russ vote proposes is cutting the size 839 00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:11,480 Speaker 1: of the federal guocracy and not just purely for the 840 00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:16,360 Speaker 1: making the numbers all work out and just balancing balance, 841 00:45:16,640 --> 00:45:18,840 Speaker 1: getting the balance sheet in order, but also for the 842 00:45:18,880 --> 00:45:21,880 Speaker 1: sake of like, well, hey, how did they justify the 843 00:45:21,920 --> 00:45:26,319 Speaker 1: COVID vaccine mandate in an obscure provision of the act 844 00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:30,160 Speaker 1: that established OSHA. There's some of these things that are 845 00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:35,080 Speaker 1: very real extra constitutional encroachments on the everyday American's freedom 846 00:45:35,160 --> 00:45:38,680 Speaker 1: that can be paired back, and that can make some 847 00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:42,040 Speaker 1: of this maths start to work without touching entitlements and 848 00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:45,280 Speaker 1: maybe with you know, minor cuts the Pentagon or something 849 00:45:45,480 --> 00:45:47,600 Speaker 1: something to that extent. I just don't have a lot 850 00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:50,919 Speaker 1: of faith that that's what's on the table as Kevin 851 00:45:51,000 --> 00:45:55,719 Speaker 1: McCarthy's office and his advisors are looking to make these 852 00:45:55,719 --> 00:46:02,320 Speaker 1: balance sheets check out. Meanwhile, Republicans seem to be notching 853 00:46:02,360 --> 00:46:05,560 Speaker 1: some wins on immigration, and I'm curious how the right 854 00:46:05,640 --> 00:46:09,840 Speaker 1: is viewing this. So recently the Biden administration flowed basically 855 00:46:09,880 --> 00:46:12,560 Speaker 1: a trial balloon suggesting and this appears to be coming 856 00:46:12,600 --> 00:46:16,320 Speaker 1: from Susan Rice, who people might forget, bizarrely is running 857 00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:20,480 Speaker 1: domestic policy for the administration, foreign policy expert. Her entire 858 00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:23,759 Speaker 1: career in BID's like, yeah, you'll do domestic policy. She 859 00:46:23,920 --> 00:46:26,719 Speaker 1: has been one of the most hawkish internally when it 860 00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:31,680 Speaker 1: comes to cracking down on the border, and so it 861 00:46:31,760 --> 00:46:33,960 Speaker 1: is assumed that that's where this is, that this trial 862 00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:37,120 Speaker 1: balloon is coming from, saying that the Biden administration is 863 00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:42,360 Speaker 1: considering returning to family detention. Now, I know how a 864 00:46:42,360 --> 00:46:44,120 Speaker 1: lot of progressives respond to this. They just kind of 865 00:46:44,160 --> 00:46:46,399 Speaker 1: want to not think about it because it's just kind 866 00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:49,680 Speaker 1: of too painful because it reminds them of all of 867 00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:52,000 Speaker 1: the things that they said about Trump when he was 868 00:46:52,040 --> 00:46:54,960 Speaker 1: doing things like this, and things they didn't say about Obama, 869 00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:56,840 Speaker 1: things they didn't say about Obama, and then things that 870 00:46:56,840 --> 00:46:59,000 Speaker 1: they would be forced to say about Biden if they 871 00:46:59,239 --> 00:47:01,879 Speaker 1: focused on the issue. So they kind of just keep 872 00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:05,200 Speaker 1: it moving and hope that maybe nobody presses them on 873 00:47:05,239 --> 00:47:06,960 Speaker 1: it and they don't have to think about it. But 874 00:47:07,000 --> 00:47:10,680 Speaker 1: I'm curious what the reaction among Republicans is. If it's 875 00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:15,399 Speaker 1: some sense a vindication, or if there's a we told 876 00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:19,120 Speaker 1: you so, or this is actually cynical and we don't 877 00:47:19,120 --> 00:47:22,160 Speaker 1: believe you're going to do it. So how did Republicans 878 00:47:22,200 --> 00:47:25,120 Speaker 1: respond to this trial balloon? Yeah, I don't think anybody 879 00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:27,759 Speaker 1: on the right considers what's been coming out of Biden 880 00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:30,319 Speaker 1: administration or anything like this will win. And I'm not 881 00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:32,800 Speaker 1: saying that because I believe that they're just like heroes. 882 00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:35,440 Speaker 1: I'm saying that because the numbers I don't think are 883 00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:38,080 Speaker 1: going to be affected. So long as the Biden administration. 884 00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:42,319 Speaker 1: Child separation is awful and one thing, but so long 885 00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:45,800 Speaker 1: as the Biden administration continues its program of humanitarian parole 886 00:47:45,880 --> 00:47:50,120 Speaker 1: right now, and humanitarian parole sounds like a really good thing. 887 00:47:50,520 --> 00:47:53,760 Speaker 1: What it is basically is passage into the United States 888 00:47:53,840 --> 00:47:56,240 Speaker 1: if you can turn yourself in at a border crossing. 889 00:47:56,800 --> 00:47:58,880 Speaker 1: They took these steps basically to say people from certain 890 00:47:58,880 --> 00:48:01,040 Speaker 1: countries and this is all over the last couple of months, 891 00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:05,759 Speaker 1: will not be eligible for asylum if they're caught crossing illegally. 892 00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:08,720 Speaker 1: What that is is like sort of a math trick 893 00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:11,680 Speaker 1: to get it to look like the illegal crossings are 894 00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:15,200 Speaker 1: lower while they're granting humanitarian parole to more and more people. 895 00:48:15,480 --> 00:48:17,560 Speaker 1: It sounds again like a great thing. What it does 896 00:48:17,719 --> 00:48:20,880 Speaker 1: is set people up for this like tragic existence in 897 00:48:20,920 --> 00:48:25,279 Speaker 1: the shadows of America's civic civil society and is going 898 00:48:25,360 --> 00:48:29,400 Speaker 1: to continue being a pole factor for millions of people 899 00:48:29,480 --> 00:48:31,960 Speaker 1: coming up through Central America and Mexico. We've talked about 900 00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:34,839 Speaker 1: this many times before. Everybody pays a cartel to get 901 00:48:34,880 --> 00:48:39,200 Speaker 1: up there. The cartels then turn around and terrorize these countries, 902 00:48:39,320 --> 00:48:44,400 Speaker 1: overrun these countries. Many people are sexually assaulted, kidnapped along 903 00:48:44,440 --> 00:48:47,959 Speaker 1: the journey. So I don't think if you're not going 904 00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:53,320 Speaker 1: to pair child separation with like a real closure of 905 00:48:53,560 --> 00:48:56,319 Speaker 1: the border so that people don't believe what happens is 906 00:48:56,320 --> 00:49:00,319 Speaker 1: people you know, WhatsApp everyone down the line back home 907 00:49:00,400 --> 00:49:03,680 Speaker 1: and say you have to turn yourself in and you 908 00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:07,040 Speaker 1: get a court date two years from now. But other 909 00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:09,440 Speaker 1: than that, you can sort of exist in a sanctuary city, 910 00:49:09,560 --> 00:49:11,799 Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera. Even if you don't turn yourself in, 911 00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:14,960 Speaker 1: you can exist in the sanctuary city. So unless it's paired, 912 00:49:15,040 --> 00:49:20,520 Speaker 1: I think with some really like serious uniform legal policy 913 00:49:21,320 --> 00:49:23,680 Speaker 1: in terms of what's happening when people do turn themselves in, 914 00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:28,319 Speaker 1: I don't even think that's. What's even more sad is 915 00:49:28,320 --> 00:49:30,160 Speaker 1: that they would be doing if they brought this back, 916 00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:32,400 Speaker 1: which I doubt they will, they would be doing child 917 00:49:32,440 --> 00:49:35,719 Speaker 1: separation with this other inhumane policy, and that is just 918 00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:39,840 Speaker 1: the worst of both worlds. And maybe it's hard to 919 00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:43,719 Speaker 1: figure out what's driving these types of decisions coming from 920 00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:46,399 Speaker 1: this White House, but maybe they're doing that Trump thing 921 00:49:46,760 --> 00:49:49,920 Speaker 1: where they try to make they try to kind of 922 00:49:50,480 --> 00:49:54,440 Speaker 1: express toughness. Yeah, say like, look, I think they are like, 923 00:49:54,480 --> 00:49:57,200 Speaker 1: it's a deterrent like this, it's trying to act as 924 00:49:57,200 --> 00:49:59,480 Speaker 1: a deterrent to people even if they're not going to 925 00:49:59,480 --> 00:50:01,400 Speaker 1: do it. I think that's totally right, and that is 926 00:50:01,440 --> 00:50:05,560 Speaker 1: actually an important part of immigration policy. One pastor a 927 00:50:06,040 --> 00:50:07,960 Speaker 1: shelter that I talked to him outa Mooros last year, 928 00:50:08,000 --> 00:50:11,480 Speaker 1: said he begs people in the American government to put 929 00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:14,040 Speaker 1: out a message in plane Spanish that was his quote 930 00:50:14,080 --> 00:50:16,759 Speaker 1: saying don't come, and he said, we tell them that 931 00:50:16,840 --> 00:50:20,280 Speaker 1: month after month in our meetings, and they never do it. 932 00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:23,560 Speaker 1: It's obviously a very important part of immigration policy, the posture, 933 00:50:23,680 --> 00:50:26,600 Speaker 1: and if you talk to migrants, they'll look to Joe 934 00:50:26,600 --> 00:50:30,799 Speaker 1: Biden and say, no estrastica como Trump, He's not the 935 00:50:30,840 --> 00:50:35,040 Speaker 1: same level of you can expect perhaps something almost like 936 00:50:35,120 --> 00:50:38,760 Speaker 1: dhaka right under a Joe Biden administration. Migrants of agency, 937 00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:42,000 Speaker 1: they know exactly what they're doing, and so they do 938 00:50:42,080 --> 00:50:44,480 Speaker 1: pick up on that kind of posturing and signaling. So 939 00:50:44,560 --> 00:50:47,399 Speaker 1: it is an element of that. But I think that's 940 00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:49,080 Speaker 1: the same thing that he was doing with saying if 941 00:50:49,120 --> 00:50:53,319 Speaker 1: you come from Venezuela or Cuba and you don't, you 942 00:50:53,440 --> 00:50:56,160 Speaker 1: don't come in and apply for asylum, turn yourself in, 943 00:50:56,360 --> 00:50:58,759 Speaker 1: you're not eligible for asylum. If you cross illegally, you're 944 00:50:58,760 --> 00:51:01,520 Speaker 1: not eligible for asylum. It is part of a posture, 945 00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:04,480 Speaker 1: but again it's also to make those numbers look different. 946 00:51:04,880 --> 00:51:08,359 Speaker 1: And they also have implemented this new policy that you 947 00:51:08,440 --> 00:51:12,640 Speaker 1: can't cross other countries and get asylum, which to me 948 00:51:12,760 --> 00:51:16,759 Speaker 1: seems entirely counterintuitive. Like if if you're let's say you're 949 00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:19,560 Speaker 1: in Guatemala, yeah, and you and you're trying to get 950 00:51:19,600 --> 00:51:22,600 Speaker 1: asylum in the United States, how do you do that? 951 00:51:22,640 --> 00:51:25,160 Speaker 1: You can't go to the embassy, Like that's basic, basic, 952 00:51:25,239 --> 00:51:28,080 Speaker 1: That path is basically shut off. The only way is 953 00:51:28,080 --> 00:51:31,759 Speaker 1: to go through Mexico and then apply for asylum there 954 00:51:31,920 --> 00:51:36,839 Speaker 1: unless like charter a private plane. Yeah, that was great 955 00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:41,399 Speaker 1: fly and that's the really the one vineyard, and it 956 00:51:41,440 --> 00:51:44,239 Speaker 1: has happened. I mean, there there are flights that you 957 00:51:44,280 --> 00:51:48,279 Speaker 1: can get from A to B without actually paying to 958 00:51:48,360 --> 00:51:51,040 Speaker 1: go through Mexico on a bus or by foot some 959 00:51:51,200 --> 00:51:53,680 Speaker 1: part of the way. But yeah, I mean it's just 960 00:51:53,840 --> 00:51:56,920 Speaker 1: it's a this patchwork policy that's the problem. Like it 961 00:51:57,000 --> 00:52:01,600 Speaker 1: is just completely inhumane to have such patrick policy. That again, 962 00:52:01,640 --> 00:52:06,880 Speaker 1: when we're talking about like Cuban refugees, Venezuelan refugees, a 963 00:52:06,880 --> 00:52:09,320 Speaker 1: lot of the Venezuelan migrants have lived in other countries 964 00:52:09,360 --> 00:52:11,440 Speaker 1: for a long time before they're playing for asylum. I 965 00:52:11,440 --> 00:52:13,759 Speaker 1: get it. It's the same thing with the Haitians. But 966 00:52:13,920 --> 00:52:16,600 Speaker 1: what you end up doing is just closing the door 967 00:52:16,680 --> 00:52:21,279 Speaker 1: to people. Our asylent policy exists to help. And going 968 00:52:21,280 --> 00:52:24,440 Speaker 1: back to the Jpal point about unemployment, there's an irony 969 00:52:24,440 --> 00:52:26,960 Speaker 1: that there seem to be a lot of people who 970 00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:30,719 Speaker 1: will say, yes, we need to raise interest rates because 971 00:52:30,760 --> 00:52:33,600 Speaker 1: we need to high unemployment rate, because inflation's out of control, 972 00:52:34,040 --> 00:52:37,040 Speaker 1: we need to get that down. But those same people 973 00:52:37,400 --> 00:52:40,799 Speaker 1: will not say, all right, well, then how about we 974 00:52:41,200 --> 00:52:44,920 Speaker 1: bring in two million more workers? When the effect when 975 00:52:44,920 --> 00:52:47,440 Speaker 1: the effect if you believe, I don't think it. I 976 00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:49,920 Speaker 1: don't actually think it would have the effect on wages 977 00:52:49,920 --> 00:52:53,719 Speaker 1: that people think it would. Because those workers produce economic activity, 978 00:52:53,960 --> 00:52:59,400 Speaker 1: they increase GDP, and that increased GDP then results in 979 00:53:00,040 --> 00:53:04,320 Speaker 1: higher wages out of that more economic activity. But obviously 980 00:53:04,360 --> 00:53:06,719 Speaker 1: if you have there's some level at which you get 981 00:53:06,800 --> 00:53:10,200 Speaker 1: so much immigration, so much competition for jobs, that you 982 00:53:10,239 --> 00:53:13,600 Speaker 1: would see wages come down. But it's curious, why are 983 00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:17,120 Speaker 1: people okay with wages coming down? Because you've disciplined the 984 00:53:17,120 --> 00:53:20,480 Speaker 1: American workforce and fired millions of people and you know, 985 00:53:20,520 --> 00:53:23,719 Speaker 1: stoked fear you know in workplaces across the country, but 986 00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:29,520 Speaker 1: they're deeply hostile to producing you know, more labor through 987 00:53:29,680 --> 00:53:33,840 Speaker 1: immigration policy. Like what like what's it? Why are you 988 00:53:33,840 --> 00:53:36,240 Speaker 1: okay with one but not another? It's a serious problem. 989 00:53:36,320 --> 00:53:38,319 Speaker 1: I mean, it's a huge problem. And it goes to 990 00:53:38,440 --> 00:53:41,000 Speaker 1: even like what people refer to as high skilled labor 991 00:53:41,040 --> 00:53:43,240 Speaker 1: when we talk about semiconductors here. One of the biggest 992 00:53:43,280 --> 00:53:45,279 Speaker 1: problems is that who are you going to get to 993 00:53:45,320 --> 00:53:49,439 Speaker 1: manage the semiconductor like facility? Seriously, because our for years 994 00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:51,680 Speaker 1: to get somebody from India to get in, Yeah, exactly, 995 00:53:51,680 --> 00:53:53,919 Speaker 1: and are so called like best and brightest now all 996 00:53:53,960 --> 00:53:57,000 Speaker 1: work for Meta right, like all of people that could 997 00:53:57,000 --> 00:53:59,479 Speaker 1: be doing this. We're funneled into Silicon Valley for years 998 00:53:59,520 --> 00:54:03,720 Speaker 1: and years and are just making us worse people instead 999 00:54:03,719 --> 00:54:05,440 Speaker 1: of making us more security as a country, and just 1000 00:54:05,440 --> 00:54:07,680 Speaker 1: to round out the block. I think that's probably why 1001 00:54:07,800 --> 00:54:10,200 Speaker 1: Susan Rice is on this issue. One thing the media 1002 00:54:10,239 --> 00:54:12,800 Speaker 1: doesn't report a lot. And believe me, I understand the 1003 00:54:13,480 --> 00:54:16,239 Speaker 1: terrorist watch list has plenty of its own problems, but 1004 00:54:16,400 --> 00:54:18,719 Speaker 1: there are dozens of people that crossed just last year 1005 00:54:18,920 --> 00:54:21,880 Speaker 1: that are on the terrorist watch list. There are reports 1006 00:54:22,080 --> 00:54:26,160 Speaker 1: every single month of people who we should be able 1007 00:54:26,200 --> 00:54:29,560 Speaker 1: to screen better. There's something like fifty one thousand known 1008 00:54:29,640 --> 00:54:34,040 Speaker 1: god aways last month alone somewhere around there, which is 1009 00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:37,560 Speaker 1: higher than about fifty thousand from the previous January. These 1010 00:54:37,560 --> 00:54:40,239 Speaker 1: are huge numbers, and when you're seeing the people who 1011 00:54:40,360 --> 00:54:44,160 Speaker 1: we're actually able to apprehend at the border, dozens of 1012 00:54:44,160 --> 00:54:46,719 Speaker 1: people on the terrorists watch lists that were actually apprehended. 1013 00:54:47,160 --> 00:54:50,880 Speaker 1: Your mind can sort of extend how many people might 1014 00:54:50,960 --> 00:54:53,600 Speaker 1: be in this country that we should at least be 1015 00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:56,319 Speaker 1: aware of them being in this country, let alone maybe 1016 00:54:56,360 --> 00:54:58,880 Speaker 1: have turned away from getting into this country. So it 1017 00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:01,280 Speaker 1: does make sense that Susan looking at the Biden policy 1018 00:55:01,320 --> 00:55:03,480 Speaker 1: and thinking what the hell are we doing here as 1019 00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:06,440 Speaker 1: a kind of hawkish person, but in general, our immigration 1020 00:55:06,480 --> 00:55:09,359 Speaker 1: policy is just not serving anyone. Well, I would agree 1021 00:55:09,360 --> 00:55:11,160 Speaker 1: with that, except for the fact that it makes sense 1022 00:55:11,160 --> 00:55:14,680 Speaker 1: that Susan Rice is looking at any domestic policy. What's 1023 00:55:14,719 --> 00:55:18,080 Speaker 1: she doing in domestic policy? Role absurd from the beginning, 1024 00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:21,120 Speaker 1: makes no sense. Let's move on to China, because I 1025 00:55:21,120 --> 00:55:23,560 Speaker 1: think this is a story that's playing out this week 1026 00:55:23,600 --> 00:55:27,640 Speaker 1: getting not enough attention in the press. Here's NPR. Chinese 1027 00:55:27,719 --> 00:55:30,680 Speaker 1: leader Sheijinpang name checked the United States and remarks during 1028 00:55:30,680 --> 00:55:33,239 Speaker 1: the annual session of Parliament underway and Beijing this week, 1029 00:55:33,280 --> 00:55:35,680 Speaker 1: saying it was leading Western countries in an effort to 1030 00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:39,920 Speaker 1: encircle and suppress China. This is a quote from Xi 1031 00:55:40,000 --> 00:55:44,359 Speaker 1: jinpaning Western countries, led by the US, have implemented comprehensive containment, 1032 00:55:44,560 --> 00:55:49,560 Speaker 1: encirclement and suppression against US, bringing unprecedented, severe challenges to 1033 00:55:49,600 --> 00:55:54,480 Speaker 1: our country's development. Now, on Tuesday, the Foreign Minister also 1034 00:55:54,640 --> 00:55:59,520 Speaker 1: criticized the United States by name. Here's a quote from him. 1035 00:55:59,680 --> 00:56:01,960 Speaker 1: The US claims it wants to compete to win with 1036 00:56:02,080 --> 00:56:04,440 Speaker 1: China and does not seek conflict. But in fact, the 1037 00:56:04,480 --> 00:56:07,560 Speaker 1: so called competition by the US is all around containment 1038 00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:09,960 Speaker 1: and suppression, a zero sum game of life and death. 1039 00:56:10,160 --> 00:56:12,279 Speaker 1: Why does the US ask China not to provide weapons 1040 00:56:12,320 --> 00:56:14,879 Speaker 1: to Russia, Well, it keeps selling arms to Taiwan. One 1041 00:56:14,880 --> 00:56:16,719 Speaker 1: more quote to hit you with here. When the US 1042 00:56:16,760 --> 00:56:19,320 Speaker 1: says it wants to install guardrails and have no conflict 1043 00:56:19,360 --> 00:56:22,160 Speaker 1: in China US relations, it really means that the US 1044 00:56:22,239 --> 00:56:25,520 Speaker 1: requires China not to fight back when hit or scolded. 1045 00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:29,719 Speaker 1: But this cannot be done. Now, China, you have two 1046 00:56:29,800 --> 00:56:32,480 Speaker 1: high ranking officials, including Xijen Ping himself, calling out the 1047 00:56:32,560 --> 00:56:35,279 Speaker 1: United States by name this week. By the way, as 1048 00:56:35,320 --> 00:56:39,359 Speaker 1: they continue to basically support Putin's invasion of Ukraine. This 1049 00:56:39,400 --> 00:56:42,359 Speaker 1: is a really big development. The Wall Street Journal has 1050 00:56:42,400 --> 00:56:45,920 Speaker 1: a long, long story out this week probing whether America 1051 00:56:46,120 --> 00:56:50,319 Speaker 1: is prepared in any capacity for a potential battle over 1052 00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:53,879 Speaker 1: Taiwan and what that could escalate into between in terms 1053 00:56:53,920 --> 00:56:56,279 Speaker 1: of a war between the United States and China, a 1054 00:56:56,280 --> 00:56:58,879 Speaker 1: hot war between the United States and China. So very 1055 00:56:59,000 --> 00:57:01,920 Speaker 1: very very very big deal that she Didn't Ping himself 1056 00:57:01,960 --> 00:57:04,319 Speaker 1: called the United States out by name, including the and 1057 00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:06,520 Speaker 1: the foreign ministers. While I've been reading actually a bunch 1058 00:57:06,520 --> 00:57:09,160 Speaker 1: of she Didn't Ping speeches this week, actually really over 1059 00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:11,680 Speaker 1: the last couple of weeks. The fact that he used 1060 00:57:11,920 --> 00:57:15,600 Speaker 1: the name the United States. Obviously a lot of China 1061 00:57:15,640 --> 00:57:18,120 Speaker 1: observers picked up on that right away. Ryan, what do 1062 00:57:18,160 --> 00:57:22,200 Speaker 1: you make of it? The argument that the Chinese are 1063 00:57:22,200 --> 00:57:24,960 Speaker 1: making is that the US says it has put up 1064 00:57:25,000 --> 00:57:30,240 Speaker 1: guardrails around it's kind of China confrontation that will prevent 1065 00:57:31,360 --> 00:57:35,640 Speaker 1: a cold war from developing into a hot war. And 1066 00:57:35,720 --> 00:57:38,840 Speaker 1: they're saying that, no, if you are barreling down the 1067 00:57:38,920 --> 00:57:41,240 Speaker 1: road out of control at this speed, there are no 1068 00:57:41,280 --> 00:57:44,120 Speaker 1: amount of guardrails that are going to prevent an accident. 1069 00:57:44,640 --> 00:57:47,280 Speaker 1: And I do think that the United States, the people 1070 00:57:47,280 --> 00:57:49,720 Speaker 1: of the United States, need to be deeply worried about that. Yeah, 1071 00:57:51,360 --> 00:57:55,360 Speaker 1: At the same time, we shouldn't forget that the Chinese 1072 00:57:55,400 --> 00:57:57,920 Speaker 1: government around two thousand and seven, you know, two thousand 1073 00:57:57,920 --> 00:58:01,760 Speaker 1: and eight, in the wake of the financial crisis, you know, 1074 00:58:02,040 --> 00:58:07,320 Speaker 1: seeing the United States weakening, you know, really it embarked 1075 00:58:07,320 --> 00:58:12,160 Speaker 1: aggressively on a policy, an intentional policy of confronting the 1076 00:58:12,240 --> 00:58:15,760 Speaker 1: United States and under and under and undermining uh, the 1077 00:58:15,840 --> 00:58:18,200 Speaker 1: United States. And it's in a significant way, you know, 1078 00:58:18,280 --> 00:58:22,720 Speaker 1: helping to know our our politicians participated in this eagerly. 1079 00:58:23,240 --> 00:58:25,600 Speaker 1: But uh, you know, there was a there was an 1080 00:58:25,600 --> 00:58:31,720 Speaker 1: explicit kind of goal to hollow out American manufacturing the 1081 00:58:31,840 --> 00:58:35,320 Speaker 1: middle class. And you know, and I think that you 1082 00:58:35,320 --> 00:58:39,240 Speaker 1: you occasionally see people talk about fentanyl in this in 1083 00:58:39,280 --> 00:58:45,800 Speaker 1: this context. But you know, an authoritarian country like like China, 1084 00:58:46,080 --> 00:58:50,000 Speaker 1: which is able to you know, so you know, effectively 1085 00:58:50,080 --> 00:58:54,360 Speaker 1: kind of monitor social media, uh, you know, keep control 1086 00:58:54,400 --> 00:58:57,400 Speaker 1: of their economy, isn't going to have a multi billion 1087 00:58:57,480 --> 00:59:03,120 Speaker 1: dollar fentanyl export industry operating without kind of the approval 1088 00:59:03,960 --> 00:59:07,160 Speaker 1: of the of the leaders of the Chinese Communist Party. 1089 00:59:07,200 --> 00:59:10,200 Speaker 1: Absolutely they know exactly how much of those precursor chemicals 1090 00:59:10,240 --> 00:59:13,160 Speaker 1: are being shipped to Mexico, right they could and you know, 1091 00:59:13,200 --> 00:59:17,680 Speaker 1: and you know, similarly to the United States having you know, 1092 00:59:17,720 --> 00:59:20,520 Speaker 1: some awareness, some involvement that oh, our allies are the 1093 00:59:20,560 --> 00:59:23,160 Speaker 1: ones that are actually shipping this in. Well, it's important, 1094 00:59:23,320 --> 00:59:26,040 Speaker 1: it's important for our allies to have this funding source. 1095 00:59:26,080 --> 00:59:27,840 Speaker 1: So we're going to kind of look look the other way. 1096 00:59:29,200 --> 00:59:30,720 Speaker 1: On the on the Chinese side, it's like, well this, 1097 00:59:31,040 --> 00:59:33,840 Speaker 1: you know, this is actually this is weakening our trade rival. 1098 00:59:34,560 --> 00:59:37,760 Speaker 1: It's helping to hollow out a manufacturing base. It's it's 1099 00:59:37,800 --> 00:59:46,160 Speaker 1: really efiscerating, you know, an entire generation of people. Uh so, uh, 1100 00:59:46,200 --> 00:59:48,840 Speaker 1: all of those things tied in, you know, make it 1101 00:59:49,080 --> 00:59:51,960 Speaker 1: make me, you know, look a little cynically at some 1102 00:59:52,040 --> 00:59:56,480 Speaker 1: of the complaints the crocodile tears from from the Chinese there, Well, 1103 00:59:56,520 --> 00:59:58,960 Speaker 1: the flirting with Vladimir Putin makes me look at all 1104 00:59:59,000 --> 01:00:01,640 Speaker 1: of it various weekly as well when we're talking about 1105 01:00:01,720 --> 01:00:05,520 Speaker 1: an actual invasion. Now what the Chinese scene in that 1106 01:00:05,840 --> 01:00:09,120 Speaker 1: is a rebuke to NATO, It is a rebuke to 1107 01:00:09,200 --> 01:00:11,560 Speaker 1: the West. It is a rebuke to what they see 1108 01:00:11,600 --> 01:00:14,720 Speaker 1: as Western expansionism. And so obviously it makes sense that 1109 01:00:14,760 --> 01:00:17,680 Speaker 1: they come in and look at Putin's invasion of Ukraine 1110 01:00:18,000 --> 01:00:21,480 Speaker 1: as a sort of strength, a powerful rebuke, something that 1111 01:00:21,560 --> 01:00:23,760 Speaker 1: can genuinely very much weak in the West. I want 1112 01:00:23,800 --> 01:00:27,880 Speaker 1: to ask about reports which I've seen some interesting debate 1113 01:00:27,960 --> 01:00:34,040 Speaker 1: over that China may be considering supplying weapons to Vladimir Putin. 1114 01:00:34,400 --> 01:00:38,200 Speaker 1: I've seen skepticism of those reports as basically saying this 1115 01:00:38,280 --> 01:00:42,640 Speaker 1: is unsubstantiated warmongering, and I'm entirely prepared to believe that's 1116 01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:45,120 Speaker 1: the case. It also wouldn't surprise me if it was 1117 01:00:45,160 --> 01:00:48,000 Speaker 1: true in some capacity as well, So all of this 1118 01:00:48,080 --> 01:00:51,000 Speaker 1: coming on the heels of that I think is relevant too. Yeah, 1119 01:00:51,040 --> 01:00:53,560 Speaker 1: and what we can know for sure thanks to the 1120 01:00:53,640 --> 01:00:57,040 Speaker 1: Chinese diplomats here is that the US is in fact 1121 01:00:57,160 --> 01:01:01,240 Speaker 1: pressuring China not to supply weapons to Russia. Because the 1122 01:01:01,320 --> 01:01:04,640 Speaker 1: Chinese just complained that the US is pressuring China not 1123 01:01:04,680 --> 01:01:08,280 Speaker 1: to supply weapons to Russia. So how seriously China is 1124 01:01:08,280 --> 01:01:11,080 Speaker 1: actually considering doing that, I think it's an open question. 1125 01:01:11,120 --> 01:01:14,560 Speaker 1: I think it's clear that Russia has asked for that support. 1126 01:01:14,640 --> 01:01:17,720 Speaker 1: I think that that reporting is pretty solid, and it's 1127 01:01:17,760 --> 01:01:22,120 Speaker 1: also completely intuitive, like the manufacturing base of the Russian 1128 01:01:22,160 --> 01:01:26,160 Speaker 1: economy with under sanctions, is able to create only so 1129 01:01:26,280 --> 01:01:30,680 Speaker 1: many missiles, only so many tanks, only so much material 1130 01:01:30,760 --> 01:01:34,560 Speaker 1: for its invasion, So we're it would stand a reason 1131 01:01:34,560 --> 01:01:37,400 Speaker 1: that they would go to China, and so China this week, 1132 01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:42,840 Speaker 1: complaining that it's unfair, like how come you know, sounds 1133 01:01:42,880 --> 01:01:46,520 Speaker 1: like a seven year olds Wait, how come you get 1134 01:01:46,560 --> 01:01:49,840 Speaker 1: to fund Ukraine and you get to supply Ukraine with weapons, 1135 01:01:49,880 --> 01:01:53,360 Speaker 1: but we can't supply Russia with weapons? And there's actually 1136 01:01:53,440 --> 01:01:56,240 Speaker 1: no good answer to that other than because we're the 1137 01:01:56,280 --> 01:01:59,280 Speaker 1: empire and we say som h no, and the Chinese 1138 01:01:59,280 --> 01:02:03,120 Speaker 1: economy isn't. Keep in mind here obviously not where Hugen 1139 01:02:03,200 --> 01:02:05,760 Speaker 1: Ping would want it to be at this moment post COVID, 1140 01:02:06,240 --> 01:02:08,240 Speaker 1: but I would say when you look at the Wall 1141 01:02:08,240 --> 01:02:11,520 Speaker 1: Street Journal, reporter reporting and other reporting that we've covered 1142 01:02:11,560 --> 01:02:13,720 Speaker 1: here for a long time, one thing that worries me 1143 01:02:13,800 --> 01:02:15,920 Speaker 1: is this is coming. This could be coming faster than 1144 01:02:15,960 --> 01:02:18,280 Speaker 1: people realize. And I'm not talking about, you know, at 1145 01:02:18,280 --> 01:02:21,160 Speaker 1: the nuclear scale, just some level of conflict over Taiwan 1146 01:02:21,200 --> 01:02:24,800 Speaker 1: which could get which could escalate very quickly in the 1147 01:02:24,800 --> 01:02:27,120 Speaker 1: same sense that we are now dealing with those concerns 1148 01:02:27,560 --> 01:02:31,480 Speaker 1: in Ukraine. Any hot confrontation over Taiwan, obviously you have 1149 01:02:31,600 --> 01:02:34,320 Speaker 1: the same type of risk and that could be coming 1150 01:02:34,400 --> 01:02:39,480 Speaker 1: more quickly than people realize. Specifically because China understands we 1151 01:02:39,640 --> 01:02:42,600 Speaker 1: have a limited time frame or they have a limited 1152 01:02:42,600 --> 01:02:45,320 Speaker 1: time frame before we are able to rebuild our defense 1153 01:02:45,360 --> 01:02:49,120 Speaker 1: capacity to meet some of what would be needed in 1154 01:02:49,400 --> 01:02:54,480 Speaker 1: an amphibious sort of amphibious situation, hot war situation over 1155 01:02:54,520 --> 01:02:58,400 Speaker 1: those islands in the South China Sea, over Taiwan. That's 1156 01:02:58,600 --> 01:03:02,720 Speaker 1: a huge, huge, huge concerned. They know that that narrows 1157 01:03:02,800 --> 01:03:06,080 Speaker 1: every single month that they have in front of them, 1158 01:03:06,200 --> 01:03:09,640 Speaker 1: because the more that we're resupplying ourselves some of these 1159 01:03:09,680 --> 01:03:11,800 Speaker 1: weapons that have actually gone to Ukraine that would be 1160 01:03:12,200 --> 01:03:15,920 Speaker 1: useful in a hot confrontation over time. One the semiconductors 1161 01:03:15,920 --> 01:03:18,760 Speaker 1: that we're able to reshure again, that can happen in 1162 01:03:18,800 --> 01:03:21,400 Speaker 1: about three years as the estimate, and it started about 1163 01:03:21,440 --> 01:03:24,320 Speaker 1: six months ago. So these are things that genuinely keep 1164 01:03:24,320 --> 01:03:26,680 Speaker 1: me up at night. And one amendment to what I 1165 01:03:26,720 --> 01:03:29,800 Speaker 1: said earlier, you actually could you can make a plausible 1166 01:03:29,840 --> 01:03:32,560 Speaker 1: argument for why it's okay to fund obviously the defense 1167 01:03:32,640 --> 01:03:36,560 Speaker 1: of Ukraine versus the offense of Russia as Russia invaded Ukraine. 1168 01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:39,240 Speaker 1: Ukraine did not invade Russia. But from the Chinese perspective, 1169 01:03:39,240 --> 01:03:42,280 Speaker 1: and I think this is what's important. They don't see 1170 01:03:42,640 --> 01:03:47,040 Speaker 1: in any circumstance the United States acting as just merely 1171 01:03:47,200 --> 01:03:50,800 Speaker 1: you know, defensive and merely a defensive posture, like they 1172 01:03:50,840 --> 01:03:54,600 Speaker 1: see us offensive presence all over the world. And so 1173 01:03:54,960 --> 01:03:57,280 Speaker 1: every action that they see the United States taking they 1174 01:03:57,320 --> 01:04:01,120 Speaker 1: see as a projection of a mayor and power, not 1175 01:04:01,280 --> 01:04:05,440 Speaker 1: a defense of just ideals of liberty and democracy. Well yeah, 1176 01:04:05,480 --> 01:04:08,960 Speaker 1: and it's this is world history and perpetuity for the future, 1177 01:04:09,040 --> 01:04:11,479 Speaker 1: by the way, because it's what happens in high tech 1178 01:04:11,560 --> 01:04:14,960 Speaker 1: nuclear order. No matter what, you're going to continue trying 1179 01:04:15,040 --> 01:04:18,040 Speaker 1: to like untangle and get to the bottom of who 1180 01:04:18,120 --> 01:04:21,640 Speaker 1: started what. But Belton Road is like a euphemism for 1181 01:04:21,800 --> 01:04:25,680 Speaker 1: Chinese expansionism. And euphemism I say that that's just the 1182 01:04:26,040 --> 01:04:29,920 Speaker 1: language itself, but the policy it's a friendly face for exactly. 1183 01:04:29,960 --> 01:04:32,840 Speaker 1: And again when you read speeches from hujin Ping, it's 1184 01:04:32,960 --> 01:04:37,720 Speaker 1: very clear how they see Chinese expansionism socialism with Chinese characteristics. 1185 01:04:38,000 --> 01:04:40,600 Speaker 1: It's sort of undermining the West, not just they talk 1186 01:04:40,640 --> 01:04:44,080 Speaker 1: about mankind and humankind a lot, not just undermining the 1187 01:04:44,160 --> 01:04:49,440 Speaker 1: United States, but spreading outside just China. And so when 1188 01:04:49,480 --> 01:04:52,880 Speaker 1: you have nuclear technology, everybody shares a border. The great 1189 01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:55,000 Speaker 1: powers share a border. If you have a nucle share 1190 01:04:55,000 --> 01:04:57,080 Speaker 1: a border with every single other country in the world. 1191 01:04:57,400 --> 01:04:59,560 Speaker 1: So we will if it feels like echoes of the 1192 01:04:59,560 --> 01:05:02,920 Speaker 1: Cold War, as people say over and over again, yes, 1193 01:05:03,080 --> 01:05:05,760 Speaker 1: but that's only because we are one hundred years into 1194 01:05:05,840 --> 01:05:09,800 Speaker 1: nuclear history. Human history looks like this. Nuclear technology changes 1195 01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:11,640 Speaker 1: and is just a straight line up, and we are 1196 01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:14,720 Speaker 1: in the very early stages of that era. So it's 1197 01:05:15,040 --> 01:05:18,000 Speaker 1: these echoes of the Cold War. Get used to it. Yea. 1198 01:05:18,040 --> 01:05:19,680 Speaker 1: And I wish Belton Road was the way that the 1199 01:05:19,760 --> 01:05:22,200 Speaker 1: US would express its power instead of just blowing up 1200 01:05:22,240 --> 01:05:25,080 Speaker 1: belts and roads, and we showed it worked with the 1201 01:05:25,120 --> 01:05:27,520 Speaker 1: Marshall Plan. Well, that was one of our most effective 1202 01:05:27,880 --> 01:05:31,320 Speaker 1: kind of diplomatic forays of the entire second half of 1203 01:05:31,320 --> 01:05:34,000 Speaker 1: the twentieth century rebuilding Europe. And then we pivoted to 1204 01:05:34,360 --> 01:05:36,000 Speaker 1: we're going to we're going to break unions, were going 1205 01:05:36,040 --> 01:05:38,920 Speaker 1: to break social democracies. We're going to keep wages low 1206 01:05:39,160 --> 01:05:43,200 Speaker 1: so that our corporations continue can continue funneling cheap goods 1207 01:05:43,200 --> 01:05:46,000 Speaker 1: into the country, so that we can then you know, 1208 01:05:46,360 --> 01:05:49,200 Speaker 1: suppress our own kind of discontent within the country, could 1209 01:05:49,200 --> 01:05:51,600 Speaker 1: buy you know, making sure that the price of TVs 1210 01:05:51,640 --> 01:05:54,840 Speaker 1: continues to go down. I mean Belton Road, there is 1211 01:05:54,960 --> 01:05:57,000 Speaker 1: debt trapped to Palmacy Base. We talked about the World 1212 01:05:57,040 --> 01:05:59,360 Speaker 1: Bank last week. I mean, it's it's debt trapped diplomacy 1213 01:05:59,440 --> 01:06:03,160 Speaker 1: that is used to blackmail developing countries. Not great better 1214 01:06:03,200 --> 01:06:07,120 Speaker 1: than death squad, That's what I would argue. You got 1215 01:06:07,160 --> 01:06:11,040 Speaker 1: to have one form or the other. Well, now in 1216 01:06:11,080 --> 01:06:13,200 Speaker 1: local news, we're going to be talking about the d 1217 01:06:13,280 --> 01:06:16,640 Speaker 1: C Crime bill that's grabbed national headlines for interesting reasons 1218 01:06:16,680 --> 01:06:19,080 Speaker 1: because the District of Columbia where we are right now 1219 01:06:19,360 --> 01:06:21,640 Speaker 1: is a federal district. Is the federal district that is 1220 01:06:21,680 --> 01:06:24,640 Speaker 1: in trend in the constitution. Ryan and I almost certainly disagree, 1221 01:06:24,640 --> 01:06:26,040 Speaker 1: al though I don't know that we've ever talked about 1222 01:06:26,080 --> 01:06:28,760 Speaker 1: this before, over the question of home rule in DC statehood. 1223 01:06:28,760 --> 01:06:31,440 Speaker 1: But the bill itself grabbed a lot of headlines because 1224 01:06:31,480 --> 01:06:34,920 Speaker 1: Republicans in Congress latched onto it after it looked as 1225 01:06:34,960 --> 01:06:36,640 Speaker 1: though and this is where I take issue with some 1226 01:06:36,680 --> 01:06:38,960 Speaker 1: of the media coverage, including from d CST which had 1227 01:06:38,960 --> 01:06:41,840 Speaker 1: a pretty good write up of at WMU DCUs that 1228 01:06:41,960 --> 01:06:45,920 Speaker 1: said the bill got scuttled by Republican backlash. Well, Mrel 1229 01:06:45,920 --> 01:06:47,920 Speaker 1: Bowser did not want to sign this bill. Joe Biden 1230 01:06:48,040 --> 01:06:52,200 Speaker 1: himself tweeted that while he supports home rule and DC statehood, 1231 01:06:52,200 --> 01:06:55,000 Speaker 1: I have the exact quote right here. While he supposed 1232 01:06:55,120 --> 01:06:58,360 Speaker 1: it supports home rule in DC statehood, he was also 1233 01:06:59,520 --> 01:07:01,760 Speaker 1: yet here said I support DC statehood and home rule, 1234 01:07:01,800 --> 01:07:04,320 Speaker 1: but I don't support some of the changes DC Council 1235 01:07:04,400 --> 01:07:07,520 Speaker 1: put forward over the mayor's objections, such as lowering penalties 1236 01:07:07,520 --> 01:07:09,720 Speaker 1: for carjackings. At the Senate votes to overturn what DC 1237 01:07:09,840 --> 01:07:12,560 Speaker 1: Council did, I'll sign it the Carjacking provision of this 1238 01:07:12,800 --> 01:07:16,400 Speaker 1: very complicated bill that over that attempts to make some 1239 01:07:16,520 --> 01:07:20,800 Speaker 1: modifications to a nineteen oh one criminal code. By the way, 1240 01:07:20,800 --> 01:07:26,000 Speaker 1: that's before people had cars to jack. Probably it's a 1241 01:07:26,040 --> 01:07:30,480 Speaker 1: car jack. Yeah right, it's totally been massaged, like any 1242 01:07:30,560 --> 01:07:34,360 Speaker 1: nuance has been out the window in this national conversation. Ryan, 1243 01:07:34,560 --> 01:07:37,000 Speaker 1: you have a good point to make though about the 1244 01:07:37,040 --> 01:07:40,960 Speaker 1: maximum penalty for carjackings being changed. Oh yeah, maybe we 1245 01:07:41,040 --> 01:07:46,360 Speaker 1: have that element here. But what's amazing is the way 1246 01:07:46,440 --> 01:07:51,120 Speaker 1: that this reduction in maximum penalties from what forty years 1247 01:07:51,120 --> 01:07:53,880 Speaker 1: to something like twenty four years is getting talked about 1248 01:07:54,440 --> 01:08:00,200 Speaker 1: as this lowering of penalties. Yes, like technically that's it's 1249 01:08:00,240 --> 01:08:02,480 Speaker 1: a lowering of penalties, as if it's going to spur 1250 01:08:03,120 --> 01:08:06,880 Speaker 1: some like soft on crime explosion of carjackings around Washington, DC, 1251 01:08:07,600 --> 01:08:11,240 Speaker 1: Something like ninety nine percent of the sentences that are 1252 01:08:11,280 --> 01:08:15,080 Speaker 1: doled out for carjacking now are significantly under what is 1253 01:08:15,120 --> 01:08:18,360 Speaker 1: the maximum, Like the current maximum allows for like forty 1254 01:08:18,400 --> 01:08:21,600 Speaker 1: years for an armed carjacking, and so they lowered that 1255 01:08:21,640 --> 01:08:26,080 Speaker 1: to like twenty something. The mandatory minimums for carjackings in 1256 01:08:26,520 --> 01:08:30,000 Speaker 1: DC currently and even in the new Criminal Code if 1257 01:08:30,040 --> 01:08:33,360 Speaker 1: it were enacted, would still be higher. And we were 1258 01:08:33,360 --> 01:08:35,839 Speaker 1: pointing us out. Then in say Tennessee, where Bill Haggerty 1259 01:08:36,720 --> 01:08:40,719 Speaker 1: is leading the charge against this thing, the Tennessee's law 1260 01:08:41,080 --> 01:08:43,960 Speaker 1: is more liberal when it comes to carjackings and armed 1261 01:08:44,080 --> 01:08:47,960 Speaker 1: car more liberal. Though it's basically just a normal penalty. Yeah, 1262 01:08:48,000 --> 01:08:52,120 Speaker 1: it's a gigantic mandatory minimum that like set sixty years ago. 1263 01:08:52,160 --> 01:08:54,760 Speaker 1: People would be like, you're gonna that's insane, Like, how 1264 01:08:54,800 --> 01:08:56,360 Speaker 1: on earth you're going to put people in prison for 1265 01:08:56,439 --> 01:08:59,040 Speaker 1: that long. Now we just be like, oh, fifteen years 1266 01:08:59,040 --> 01:09:01,479 Speaker 1: for this. Yeah, you're gonna do fifteen years of this. 1267 01:09:01,680 --> 01:09:05,840 Speaker 1: So they're barely loosening the penalties, and it's in a 1268 01:09:06,120 --> 01:09:08,759 Speaker 1: rewrite of an entire code. And to have Joe Biden 1269 01:09:08,840 --> 01:09:12,160 Speaker 1: say I support a thing in principle, but not when 1270 01:09:12,160 --> 01:09:16,640 Speaker 1: it might cause me some short term political cost potential 1271 01:09:16,960 --> 01:09:20,559 Speaker 1: political costs because and he may now have brought more 1272 01:09:20,640 --> 01:09:23,840 Speaker 1: cost on himself because now everything the DC Council does, 1273 01:09:24,240 --> 01:09:26,559 Speaker 1: reporters are going to get to say, Hey, Joe Biden, 1274 01:09:26,920 --> 01:09:28,280 Speaker 1: what do you think of this, because there's a DC 1275 01:09:28,439 --> 01:09:33,280 Speaker 1: Council provision that is allowing non US citizens, would allow 1276 01:09:33,320 --> 01:09:36,040 Speaker 1: non US citizens to vote in local elections. To me, 1277 01:09:36,240 --> 01:09:39,599 Speaker 1: I think if you are subject to the laws of 1278 01:09:40,040 --> 01:09:43,880 Speaker 1: an area where you live, then principle says you should 1279 01:09:43,880 --> 01:09:48,000 Speaker 1: have some say, no matter what, even if you're in prison, 1280 01:09:48,360 --> 01:09:51,519 Speaker 1: you should have some say over what those laws are. 1281 01:09:53,400 --> 01:09:55,120 Speaker 1: But you can disagree with that. But now, all of 1282 01:09:55,160 --> 01:09:58,120 Speaker 1: a sudden, that's gonna be something Joe Biden's gonna have 1283 01:09:58,120 --> 01:09:59,680 Speaker 1: to He's gonna have to answer for everything that the 1284 01:10:00,200 --> 01:10:03,240 Speaker 1: Council does. Yesterday I heard reporters on Capitol Hill asking 1285 01:10:03,360 --> 01:10:06,080 Speaker 1: Republican senators what do you think of allowing non citizens 1286 01:10:06,120 --> 01:10:09,240 Speaker 1: to vote? And me, a DC resident, thinking, oh, really, 1287 01:10:09,280 --> 01:10:13,200 Speaker 1: that's interesting. How about citizens who can't actually vote for 1288 01:10:13,360 --> 01:10:15,439 Speaker 1: senators or members the House? Resident, all of a sudden, 1289 01:10:15,439 --> 01:10:17,160 Speaker 1: you're you know, you're so concerned about the right to 1290 01:10:17,240 --> 01:10:19,479 Speaker 1: vote and they're like and they're shaking their head like 1291 01:10:20,240 --> 01:10:23,080 Speaker 1: don't don't. We don't approve of it. It's like, we 1292 01:10:23,120 --> 01:10:25,519 Speaker 1: shouldn't have to ask you, Like, it's one thing that 1293 01:10:25,560 --> 01:10:29,000 Speaker 1: we don't get to vote, you know, for House, for Senate. 1294 01:10:29,400 --> 01:10:31,519 Speaker 1: They have a workaround so that we can vote for president. 1295 01:10:31,960 --> 01:10:33,519 Speaker 1: But then you're going to come in and you're going 1296 01:10:33,600 --> 01:10:37,320 Speaker 1: to kind of line at it our criminal code and say, actually, 1297 01:10:37,600 --> 01:10:40,000 Speaker 1: twenty four years for carjacking. I think it should be forty. 1298 01:10:40,360 --> 01:10:43,600 Speaker 1: Like you get out of here, Okay, So getting we 1299 01:10:43,640 --> 01:10:46,080 Speaker 1: are hitting on where we disagree with this, because here's 1300 01:10:46,600 --> 01:10:50,120 Speaker 1: a National Reviewer go actually cited a Madison quote from 1301 01:10:50,120 --> 01:10:52,759 Speaker 1: Federalist forty three. Now I sound like a real loser. 1302 01:10:53,400 --> 01:10:56,160 Speaker 1: He says, the indispensable necessity of complete authority at the 1303 01:10:56,200 --> 01:10:59,120 Speaker 1: seat of government carries its own evidence with it. Without it, 1304 01:10:59,160 --> 01:11:01,679 Speaker 1: not only the public might be insulted and its proceedings 1305 01:11:01,680 --> 01:11:04,200 Speaker 1: interrupted with impunity. But a dependence of the members of 1306 01:11:04,240 --> 01:11:06,400 Speaker 1: the General Government on the state, comprehending the seat of 1307 01:11:06,479 --> 01:11:08,920 Speaker 1: government for protection and the exercise of their duty, might 1308 01:11:08,960 --> 01:11:12,280 Speaker 1: bring on the National Councils and imputation of awe or influence. 1309 01:11:12,320 --> 01:11:16,080 Speaker 1: Equally dishonorable to the government and dissatisfactory to the other members. 1310 01:11:16,640 --> 01:11:19,800 Speaker 1: So I would just say of the Confederacy, this is 1311 01:11:19,800 --> 01:11:23,240 Speaker 1: in the era of the Federalist papers. So I think 1312 01:11:23,280 --> 01:11:25,240 Speaker 1: there's we could have a whole debate one day about 1313 01:11:25,360 --> 01:11:27,920 Speaker 1: home rule and DC statehood. But I do think the 1314 01:11:27,920 --> 01:11:32,240 Speaker 1: federal city should be subject to federal rule and by 1315 01:11:32,280 --> 01:11:34,639 Speaker 1: a wide scope. And this is in the broader context. 1316 01:11:34,640 --> 01:11:37,800 Speaker 1: And I think to your point actually about why this 1317 01:11:37,840 --> 01:11:40,280 Speaker 1: is such a ridiculous thing for Bill Haggerty from Tennessee 1318 01:11:40,280 --> 01:11:44,880 Speaker 1: to be swooping in and like line item vetoing City 1319 01:11:44,880 --> 01:11:48,160 Speaker 1: Council crime overhauls, is that it is obvious if you 1320 01:11:48,200 --> 01:11:51,479 Speaker 1: walk around the District of Columbia post pandemic, that there's 1321 01:11:51,520 --> 01:11:53,280 Speaker 1: a lot of recovery that needs to happen. It is 1322 01:11:53,360 --> 01:11:56,600 Speaker 1: obvious that we are dealing with particular crime surges, not 1323 01:11:56,720 --> 01:12:00,679 Speaker 1: across the board. Actually, violent crime did decrease from twenty 1324 01:12:00,720 --> 01:12:04,599 Speaker 1: twenty one to twenty twenty two according to Axios, though 1325 01:12:04,640 --> 01:12:06,559 Speaker 1: for the second year in a row, DC exceeded two 1326 01:12:06,680 --> 01:12:09,639 Speaker 1: hundred murders in twenty twenty two, and some crimes did 1327 01:12:09,920 --> 01:12:12,280 Speaker 1: we got chart, Yeah, we also have a chart. But 1328 01:12:12,439 --> 01:12:14,760 Speaker 1: that's where we are. So far in twenty twenty three 1329 01:12:14,800 --> 01:12:17,320 Speaker 1: here in the district. So in twenty twenty two, robberies 1330 01:12:17,320 --> 01:12:20,240 Speaker 1: were up two percent, car thefts were up eight percent, 1331 01:12:20,320 --> 01:12:22,000 Speaker 1: like in a lot of cities, and carjackings are up 1332 01:12:22,000 --> 01:12:23,680 Speaker 1: fourteen percent. If you look at the chart that's on 1333 01:12:23,720 --> 01:12:26,439 Speaker 1: the screen right now, you can see, for instance, between 1334 01:12:26,439 --> 01:12:28,639 Speaker 1: twenty twenty two to twenty twenty three, the same day 1335 01:12:28,640 --> 01:12:31,760 Speaker 1: in March March seventh, we are from twenty nine to 1336 01:12:31,800 --> 01:12:34,679 Speaker 1: thirty nine homicides. That's a thirty four percent increase three 1337 01:12:34,680 --> 01:12:37,120 Speaker 1: months into the year, one hundred and twenty percent increase 1338 01:12:37,160 --> 01:12:42,760 Speaker 1: in sex abuse theft in general, we're up to I 1339 01:12:42,760 --> 01:12:44,599 Speaker 1: can't read them and run the screen, but it is up. 1340 01:12:45,560 --> 01:12:49,000 Speaker 1: It looks like eighteen percent. Car theft up from auto 1341 01:12:49,400 --> 01:12:52,080 Speaker 1: twenty two percent. Who those were mined, Oh that's right, 1342 01:12:53,439 --> 01:12:57,479 Speaker 1: leave right alone. Motor vehicle theft up one hundred and 1343 01:12:57,520 --> 01:13:00,880 Speaker 1: ten percent. So again these are early number, but it's 1344 01:13:00,960 --> 01:13:03,800 Speaker 1: obvious to everybody why there is no appetite, even from 1345 01:13:03,800 --> 01:13:07,280 Speaker 1: the Washington Post, which editorialized that the bill would make 1346 01:13:07,320 --> 01:13:10,599 Speaker 1: DC quote a more dangerous city by decreasing quote punishments 1347 01:13:10,600 --> 01:13:14,000 Speaker 1: for violent crimes such as carjackings, home invasion, burglaries, robberies, 1348 01:13:14,000 --> 01:13:16,599 Speaker 1: and even homicides and tying quote the hands of police 1349 01:13:16,600 --> 01:13:19,719 Speaker 1: and prosecutors will overwhelming courts. That's other stuff in this bill. 1350 01:13:19,800 --> 01:13:22,560 Speaker 1: It's a very big bill that can be debated is 1351 01:13:22,600 --> 01:13:25,000 Speaker 1: what this would do to the court system. There are arguments, 1352 01:13:25,040 --> 01:13:27,360 Speaker 1: I think serious arguments that it would overwhelm the court 1353 01:13:27,439 --> 01:13:30,519 Speaker 1: system because of changes there. And so when you even 1354 01:13:30,520 --> 01:13:34,400 Speaker 1: have the Washington Post maryel Bowser coming out against a 1355 01:13:34,439 --> 01:13:37,800 Speaker 1: bill like this, I do think it signals despite this 1356 01:13:37,920 --> 01:13:41,880 Speaker 1: weird conversation about carjackings we've had, and especially when Republicans 1357 01:13:41,920 --> 01:13:46,000 Speaker 1: insert themselves national Republicans into this local conversation, there's just 1358 01:13:46,120 --> 01:13:48,800 Speaker 1: no appetite in so many big cities right now for 1359 01:13:49,120 --> 01:13:51,800 Speaker 1: criminal justice reform. Even if some of it, by the way, 1360 01:13:52,080 --> 01:13:56,120 Speaker 1: would reduce crime and would make cities safer, Nobody wants 1361 01:13:56,160 --> 01:13:59,600 Speaker 1: to talk about it period, because there's our cities do 1362 01:14:00,000 --> 01:14:01,599 Speaker 1: feel dirty to a lot of people, they feel less 1363 01:14:01,600 --> 01:14:04,360 Speaker 1: safer to a lot of people. And I think National 1364 01:14:04,360 --> 01:14:06,320 Speaker 1: Democrats have a lot to answer for, not just in 1365 01:14:06,400 --> 01:14:08,880 Speaker 1: terms of the criminal code, but really just in terms 1366 01:14:08,920 --> 01:14:11,800 Speaker 1: of the way they govern these cities. And you know, 1367 01:14:11,800 --> 01:14:15,000 Speaker 1: a significant bomb in the crime way came out of 1368 01:14:15,520 --> 01:14:19,040 Speaker 1: the pandemic, people frustrated that fewer people on the street, 1369 01:14:19,080 --> 01:14:22,479 Speaker 1: allowing people to commit more crimes of opportunity, but also 1370 01:14:22,600 --> 01:14:27,200 Speaker 1: arguably undercutting of police, both with rhetoric and legally well. 1371 01:14:28,520 --> 01:14:31,559 Speaker 1: Undercutting of police. Police having their feelings hurt and deciding 1372 01:14:31,560 --> 01:14:33,479 Speaker 1: not that they're not going to do their job anymore, 1373 01:14:33,520 --> 01:14:35,720 Speaker 1: I think is a serious thing, and we're having their 1374 01:14:35,760 --> 01:14:39,000 Speaker 1: power curtailed in neighborhoods by the way, were black residents 1375 01:14:39,040 --> 01:14:42,200 Speaker 1: said they wanted more police and not less police. As 1376 01:14:42,240 --> 01:14:45,679 Speaker 1: the national movement pushed a lot of people in places 1377 01:14:45,680 --> 01:14:48,400 Speaker 1: like San Francisco, even London breed walked back some of 1378 01:14:48,400 --> 01:14:52,120 Speaker 1: those policies. I don't think there's necessarily been any evidence 1379 01:14:52,200 --> 01:14:56,679 Speaker 1: yet that places that did criminal justice reform and police 1380 01:14:56,680 --> 01:15:00,719 Speaker 1: reform have had a different crime increase is then places 1381 01:15:00,720 --> 01:15:03,120 Speaker 1: that didn't. So like if you look at you know, 1382 01:15:03,520 --> 01:15:05,479 Speaker 1: if you look at like red states around the country, 1383 01:15:05,520 --> 01:15:08,040 Speaker 1: you see the same crime bump even in places that 1384 01:15:08,120 --> 01:15:12,320 Speaker 1: never had never got much police reform traction. What you 1385 01:15:12,479 --> 01:15:15,040 Speaker 1: what you did see is it did see a slow 1386 01:15:15,080 --> 01:15:18,400 Speaker 1: down in call response, and like Baltimore being like the 1387 01:15:18,400 --> 01:15:21,720 Speaker 1: most egregious response where they were like cool, you don't 1388 01:15:21,720 --> 01:15:23,840 Speaker 1: like the way we do our jobs. How about we 1389 01:15:23,880 --> 01:15:25,639 Speaker 1: just don't do our jobs at all? Or a lot 1390 01:15:25,680 --> 01:15:28,599 Speaker 1: of police departments are now severely hampered because nobody wants 1391 01:15:28,640 --> 01:15:33,280 Speaker 1: to work in them, given how demonized they feel. Recruiting 1392 01:15:33,320 --> 01:15:36,280 Speaker 1: as big as right, recruiting for any job anyone, which 1393 01:15:36,520 --> 01:15:39,599 Speaker 1: has become a problem, and it's acute within the within 1394 01:15:39,640 --> 01:15:42,800 Speaker 1: the police force. But yeah, now, Ryan, I'm excited for 1395 01:15:42,840 --> 01:15:46,920 Speaker 1: this next block because this is a Ryan Grim question 1396 01:15:47,240 --> 01:15:49,799 Speaker 1: and the White House Press briefing to Karine Jean Pierre, 1397 01:15:50,160 --> 01:15:51,960 Speaker 1: a question that I don't think anybody else or topic 1398 01:15:52,000 --> 01:15:54,040 Speaker 1: I don't think anybody else has asked about so far. 1399 01:15:54,360 --> 01:15:56,640 Speaker 1: You want to and you can see why based on 1400 01:15:56,840 --> 01:15:59,840 Speaker 1: her answer. So yeah, this is from this week and 1401 01:16:00,320 --> 01:16:05,519 Speaker 1: in the press briefing you might recognize this voice. Last week, 1402 01:16:05,600 --> 01:16:09,640 Speaker 1: the Department of Justice acknowledged that in twenty twenty they 1403 01:16:09,640 --> 01:16:12,719 Speaker 1: had used the FBI had used seven oh two authorities 1404 01:16:12,720 --> 01:16:15,200 Speaker 1: to illegally spy on a member of Congress. Can you 1405 01:16:15,240 --> 01:16:17,680 Speaker 1: tell us who that member of Congress was? Has that 1406 01:16:17,720 --> 01:16:20,479 Speaker 1: member of Congress been briefed by the White House? I 1407 01:16:20,479 --> 01:16:22,280 Speaker 1: would refer you to a Department of Justice. Just not 1408 01:16:22,320 --> 01:16:24,320 Speaker 1: going to speak to that from here again. Thanks. I 1409 01:16:24,320 --> 01:16:27,360 Speaker 1: think she so effectively calls on the next person, and 1410 01:16:27,800 --> 01:16:30,000 Speaker 1: then the next person has a question, so there's no 1411 01:16:30,120 --> 01:16:31,880 Speaker 1: room for a follow up, and I see very smooth 1412 01:16:32,720 --> 01:16:34,880 Speaker 1: she's like, I'm not going to answer that question. You 1413 01:16:34,960 --> 01:16:38,200 Speaker 1: go ahead, please ask a different one. And I feel 1414 01:16:38,200 --> 01:16:40,519 Speaker 1: like the White House Press Corps needs just so much 1415 01:16:41,120 --> 01:16:45,960 Speaker 1: better coordination and willingness to kind of work collectively that 1416 01:16:46,120 --> 01:16:49,280 Speaker 1: And you see this, You see this occasionally from the 1417 01:16:49,280 --> 01:16:52,160 Speaker 1: White House Press Corps. You'll see it on the Hill 1418 01:16:52,920 --> 01:16:55,799 Speaker 1: for sure, and you'll see it with foreign press corps 1419 01:16:56,120 --> 01:17:02,240 Speaker 1: where a reporter asked a question, the person that they're 1420 01:17:02,240 --> 01:17:05,200 Speaker 1: asking the question too, refuses to answer it, and then 1421 01:17:05,560 --> 01:17:08,280 Speaker 1: the next reporter, rather than the question that they had 1422 01:17:08,320 --> 01:17:11,439 Speaker 1: scripted ready for you know, the German chancellor or whatever, 1423 01:17:11,680 --> 01:17:14,200 Speaker 1: they will go back and they'll say, I would actually 1424 01:17:14,240 --> 01:17:17,799 Speaker 1: like first to ask you to answer that last question. 1425 01:17:18,200 --> 01:17:22,320 Speaker 1: You didn't answer that question, because you know, if nobody 1426 01:17:22,720 --> 01:17:25,519 Speaker 1: can get a follow up in, then all somebody has 1427 01:17:25,640 --> 01:17:27,840 Speaker 1: to do to dodge a questions just dodge the question 1428 01:17:27,960 --> 01:17:30,479 Speaker 1: once and they move on. And then there becomes a 1429 01:17:30,479 --> 01:17:33,960 Speaker 1: political cost to not answering the question. Like eight times 1430 01:17:34,200 --> 01:17:36,200 Speaker 1: and the press Corps knows how to do this. If 1431 01:17:36,240 --> 01:17:40,760 Speaker 1: you remember a year ago when the war drums were 1432 01:17:40,760 --> 01:17:45,559 Speaker 1: being beaten for fighter jets to be sent to Ukraine, 1433 01:17:46,160 --> 01:17:49,600 Speaker 1: when the press, when the White House Press Secretary said no, 1434 01:17:49,760 --> 01:17:51,720 Speaker 1: we're not we're not going to do that, then the 1435 01:17:51,760 --> 01:17:53,760 Speaker 1: next person would be like, so you said you're not 1436 01:17:53,800 --> 01:17:56,840 Speaker 1: going to send fighter jets over to Ukraine? How about 1437 01:17:56,880 --> 01:17:59,760 Speaker 1: sending fighter jets? What do you think of doing that? 1438 01:18:00,240 --> 01:18:02,200 Speaker 1: I'm going to give time for my colleague to beat 1439 01:18:02,240 --> 01:18:06,599 Speaker 1: the war drums. Yes, what if Estonia asked to send wardrump? 1440 01:18:06,680 --> 01:18:07,680 Speaker 1: That was one of the That was one of them. 1441 01:18:07,840 --> 01:18:09,920 Speaker 1: They were looking for every single way to ask a 1442 01:18:09,960 --> 01:18:13,360 Speaker 1: follow up. And while the substance of that I thought 1443 01:18:13,640 --> 01:18:19,360 Speaker 1: was deeply disturbing, the cohesion of it was impressive. It 1444 01:18:19,439 --> 01:18:22,280 Speaker 1: was like it was getting the Press corps to really 1445 01:18:22,360 --> 01:18:26,759 Speaker 1: push the administration on a question that they were actually 1446 01:18:26,800 --> 01:18:29,639 Speaker 1: happy to answer. Like she kept giving an answer. Of course, 1447 01:18:29,640 --> 01:18:33,240 Speaker 1: it just wasn't the answer that they wanted. In this case, 1448 01:18:33,400 --> 01:18:36,040 Speaker 1: She's just not answering. And I didn't ask if the 1449 01:18:36,040 --> 01:18:39,800 Speaker 1: Department of Justice had briefed Congress. I asked if the 1450 01:18:39,840 --> 01:18:42,800 Speaker 1: White House has brief Congress, and asked if she would 1451 01:18:42,880 --> 01:18:45,760 Speaker 1: tell us who the White House spied on, and this 1452 01:18:45,800 --> 01:18:47,800 Speaker 1: could be a situation where she just throws the Trump 1453 01:18:47,800 --> 01:18:50,360 Speaker 1: administration uder the bus, because like this was twenty twenty, 1454 01:18:50,680 --> 01:18:55,680 Speaker 1: this was the FBI under under the Trump administration. But 1455 01:18:56,560 --> 01:19:00,400 Speaker 1: maybe it was a Democrat, and so maybe it was 1456 01:19:00,400 --> 01:19:03,200 Speaker 1: a Democrat that was illegally spied on, and you could 1457 01:19:03,479 --> 01:19:05,680 Speaker 1: then kind of spin something up about that, but then 1458 01:19:05,720 --> 01:19:07,519 Speaker 1: you might not want to necessarily talk about it. Like 1459 01:19:07,560 --> 01:19:11,920 Speaker 1: so the speculation out there. All we can do is guess. 1460 01:19:12,000 --> 01:19:14,040 Speaker 1: But we know that kind of Eric Swalwell was in 1461 01:19:14,080 --> 01:19:18,320 Speaker 1: the news around that time for some liaison with the 1462 01:19:18,560 --> 01:19:22,080 Speaker 1: woman who turned out to be perhaps connected to Chinese intelligence, 1463 01:19:23,160 --> 01:19:26,160 Speaker 1: and so it wasn't that, But we don't know. That's 1464 01:19:26,280 --> 01:19:30,799 Speaker 1: absolutely pure speculation. We do know, based on Wired reporting 1465 01:19:30,960 --> 01:19:35,439 Speaker 1: that's based on an internal audit of FBI seven oh 1466 01:19:35,439 --> 01:19:38,679 Speaker 1: two practices, that they did spy on some unnamed member 1467 01:19:38,720 --> 01:19:40,320 Speaker 1: of Congress. We don't know the party, We don't know 1468 01:19:40,360 --> 01:19:43,040 Speaker 1: the name, and White House is declining to say who. 1469 01:19:43,160 --> 01:19:46,120 Speaker 1: If they were confident in their substantiation, I think they 1470 01:19:46,120 --> 01:19:49,040 Speaker 1: would say it, because especially if it was a Republican 1471 01:19:49,120 --> 01:19:51,519 Speaker 1: and they felt confident in their substantiation I think that 1472 01:19:51,880 --> 01:19:53,720 Speaker 1: they know the Democratic base at this point, is it 1473 01:19:53,760 --> 01:19:58,080 Speaker 1: going to be upset about exercising seven h two power too? 1474 01:19:58,439 --> 01:20:00,760 Speaker 1: And we saw this on of the course, nothing to 1475 01:20:00,760 --> 01:20:04,040 Speaker 1: worry about. Yeah, well, how much criticism did Carter Page 1476 01:20:04,120 --> 01:20:08,240 Speaker 1: get on MSNBC and CNN, Washington Post, New York Times 1477 01:20:08,240 --> 01:20:12,160 Speaker 1: for like years until they stopped talking about it? Basically? 1478 01:20:12,240 --> 01:20:14,560 Speaker 1: But I mean, if they felt confident in their substantiation. 1479 01:20:14,640 --> 01:20:17,080 Speaker 1: But I think you're touching on a really important point here, 1480 01:20:17,120 --> 01:20:20,000 Speaker 1: which is there is no cohesion on this question. And 1481 01:20:20,000 --> 01:20:22,240 Speaker 1: this is why I still like that the press briefings 1482 01:20:22,240 --> 01:20:24,800 Speaker 1: are televised, even though it feels like theater. I still 1483 01:20:24,880 --> 01:20:27,200 Speaker 1: like that they're televised specifically because they show where the 1484 01:20:27,240 --> 01:20:29,640 Speaker 1: priorities of the White House Press corps are and you 1485 01:20:29,680 --> 01:20:32,240 Speaker 1: get answers to questions like this one. Every once in 1486 01:20:32,240 --> 01:20:34,200 Speaker 1: a while, someone asks a really good question that the 1487 01:20:34,240 --> 01:20:36,439 Speaker 1: White House just doesn't want to answer, and you see, 1488 01:20:36,520 --> 01:20:38,200 Speaker 1: not only does she say the White House doesn't have 1489 01:20:38,240 --> 01:20:40,200 Speaker 1: a comment on that, she says, I'm going to refer 1490 01:20:40,280 --> 01:20:42,919 Speaker 1: you to the DOJ. When you didn't ask about the DOJ. 1491 01:20:43,080 --> 01:20:45,360 Speaker 1: You asked about the White House. And there's a reason 1492 01:20:45,439 --> 01:20:47,400 Speaker 1: nobody else in the press corps wants to talk about 1493 01:20:47,439 --> 01:20:49,960 Speaker 1: seven oh two powers. It's because either they don't care 1494 01:20:50,280 --> 01:20:52,439 Speaker 1: or they love that seven oh two powers exist. Because 1495 01:20:52,479 --> 01:20:54,600 Speaker 1: everybody that they talk to in the intelligence community is 1496 01:20:54,600 --> 01:20:57,680 Speaker 1: tripping in their ear about all of these false stories 1497 01:20:57,720 --> 01:21:01,360 Speaker 1: on how the country was saved from destruction by seven 1498 01:21:01,400 --> 01:21:05,360 Speaker 1: oh two. And that is I think very much worth 1499 01:21:05,400 --> 01:21:08,160 Speaker 1: televising these briefings. I love that we get to reflect 1500 01:21:08,200 --> 01:21:10,559 Speaker 1: on that when Ryan goes and asks a damn good 1501 01:21:10,640 --> 01:21:12,680 Speaker 1: question about seven oh two that nobody else wants to 1502 01:21:12,680 --> 01:21:15,080 Speaker 1: talk about. I did reach out to the Department Justice, said, hey, 1503 01:21:15,120 --> 01:21:17,040 Speaker 1: Kareine says you should answer this question, and what did 1504 01:21:17,080 --> 01:21:20,080 Speaker 1: they say? And yet I'll report back when I get 1505 01:21:20,120 --> 01:21:27,800 Speaker 1: something out of that, turning to the House of Representatives. Actually, 1506 01:21:27,880 --> 01:21:31,080 Speaker 1: while while we were while we're producing this show, very 1507 01:21:31,120 --> 01:21:35,640 Speaker 1: strange development in the world of kind of cross ideological coalitions, 1508 01:21:35,720 --> 01:21:40,360 Speaker 1: Matt Gates shared my Intercept story. This is really on 1509 01:21:40,439 --> 01:21:46,080 Speaker 1: Twitter basically, and he said, he says, contact you represent 1510 01:21:46,120 --> 01:21:48,479 Speaker 1: him today and ask them to support my legislation to 1511 01:21:48,600 --> 01:21:52,679 Speaker 1: withdraw US troops from Syria. Voting today with a link 1512 01:21:52,680 --> 01:21:55,040 Speaker 1: to an article that I have up in the Intercept today, 1513 01:21:55,040 --> 01:22:01,240 Speaker 1: which is responsible Statecraft wrote about this Matt Gates effort recently, 1514 01:22:02,120 --> 01:22:06,120 Speaker 1: So essentially there are there are still almost roughly nine 1515 01:22:06,200 --> 01:22:11,840 Speaker 1: hundred American troops helping to occupy Central Syria, along with 1516 01:22:11,920 --> 01:22:15,840 Speaker 1: an unknown number of contractors and other other kind of 1517 01:22:15,920 --> 01:22:20,880 Speaker 1: associated allies in the area backing up the Syrian defense forces, 1518 01:22:21,000 --> 01:22:26,519 Speaker 1: mostly mostly Kurdish element of what is is what remains 1519 01:22:26,560 --> 01:22:32,000 Speaker 1: kind of the opposition that isn't isis Yesterday evenings, as 1520 01:22:32,000 --> 01:22:35,280 Speaker 1: I reported, the Congressional Progressive Caucus sent out a note 1521 01:22:35,360 --> 01:22:39,240 Speaker 1: to its membership urging a yes vote and noting that 1522 01:22:39,280 --> 01:22:43,800 Speaker 1: this that his legislation is similar to legislation that had 1523 01:22:43,840 --> 01:22:48,400 Speaker 1: been put forward on the NDAA by by Jamal Bowman previously, 1524 01:22:48,439 --> 01:22:53,240 Speaker 1: which had set a one year timeline. I also reported 1525 01:22:53,240 --> 01:22:59,840 Speaker 1: that Ambassador Robert Ford, who was the Obama administration's ambassador 1526 01:23:00,320 --> 01:23:06,479 Speaker 1: and who had previously been a staunch advocate of more 1527 01:23:06,600 --> 01:23:08,800 Speaker 1: and more kind of US intervention in the area, more 1528 01:23:08,800 --> 01:23:12,360 Speaker 1: support for the opposition, you know, in an attempt to 1529 01:23:12,520 --> 01:23:16,600 Speaker 1: get Asad to the negotiating table that would lead they 1530 01:23:16,600 --> 01:23:20,120 Speaker 1: would hope to Asad stepping down, so one of and 1531 01:23:20,200 --> 01:23:23,120 Speaker 1: he eventually resigned in twenty fourteen because he felt like 1532 01:23:23,320 --> 01:23:26,120 Speaker 1: the Obama administration wasn't being aggressive enough to accomplish the 1533 01:23:26,160 --> 01:23:30,720 Speaker 1: goal its goals. He's now supporting this Gates measure, and 1534 01:23:31,080 --> 01:23:33,160 Speaker 1: I interviewed him yesterday. I said, sounds like what you're 1535 01:23:33,200 --> 01:23:35,599 Speaker 1: basically saying is go big or go home, and if 1536 01:23:35,600 --> 01:23:37,120 Speaker 1: you're not going big, you might as well go home. 1537 01:23:37,479 --> 01:23:39,800 Speaker 1: He said, yes, he said, except I would add that 1538 01:23:40,000 --> 01:23:42,679 Speaker 1: you have to remember that going big is no guarantee 1539 01:23:42,680 --> 01:23:44,840 Speaker 1: of success either. If you look at the Iraq War, 1540 01:23:44,880 --> 01:23:47,280 Speaker 1: we went pretty big and what we got what he 1541 01:23:47,360 --> 01:23:49,800 Speaker 1: called mixed results. So the vote is going to be 1542 01:23:49,800 --> 01:23:53,519 Speaker 1: held this evening. When this came to the floor under 1543 01:23:54,120 --> 01:23:58,960 Speaker 1: Jamal Bowman, sixty percent of the Democratic Caucus voted for it. 1544 01:23:58,960 --> 01:24:01,960 Speaker 1: It'll be interesting to see if they pick some up 1545 01:24:02,040 --> 01:24:04,320 Speaker 1: because the CPC is officially calling for them to vote 1546 01:24:04,320 --> 01:24:06,280 Speaker 1: for it, or if they lose some because it's associated 1547 01:24:06,280 --> 01:24:08,559 Speaker 1: with Gates and that Biden is in the White House. 1548 01:24:08,560 --> 01:24:10,320 Speaker 1: Although Biden was in the White House for the last one. 1549 01:24:11,120 --> 01:24:13,559 Speaker 1: But I'm also curious on the Republican side, there were 1550 01:24:13,600 --> 01:24:16,320 Speaker 1: twenty five Republicans last time, twenty one the first time 1551 01:24:16,320 --> 01:24:18,880 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty one, then twenty five in twenty twenty 1552 01:24:18,880 --> 01:24:24,559 Speaker 1: two who voted to end the occupation of Syria. Do 1553 01:24:24,600 --> 01:24:28,120 Speaker 1: you think Gates gets more than twenty five or is 1554 01:24:28,200 --> 01:24:33,080 Speaker 1: he so toxic in the Republican Party that it's that 1555 01:24:33,240 --> 01:24:34,840 Speaker 1: he's not gonna be able to pull that off. What's 1556 01:24:34,880 --> 01:24:38,519 Speaker 1: your sense of how effective he'll be at doing kind 1557 01:24:38,520 --> 01:24:41,000 Speaker 1: of his part of this? Yeah, I think you good 1558 01:24:41,040 --> 01:24:44,280 Speaker 1: at some of that in your reporting, which is it's 1559 01:24:44,320 --> 01:24:48,400 Speaker 1: just the process even itself on how Matt Gates cobbled 1560 01:24:48,400 --> 01:24:51,200 Speaker 1: together the legislation and then was able to work with 1561 01:24:51,240 --> 01:24:55,599 Speaker 1: elhan Omar and cobbling together some coalition, some support. Right, 1562 01:24:56,120 --> 01:24:58,320 Speaker 1: his first version of this a couple of weeks ago 1563 01:24:58,840 --> 01:25:04,920 Speaker 1: allowed fifteen days fit troops, which you know, just you're 1564 01:25:05,600 --> 01:25:08,519 Speaker 1: isn't going to happen because nobody's going to support that, 1565 01:25:08,640 --> 01:25:12,120 Speaker 1: And he immediately dreamed to six months, right, And interestingly, 1566 01:25:12,280 --> 01:25:15,559 Speaker 1: Alan Omer worked directly with him, right and said, look, 1567 01:25:15,600 --> 01:25:19,040 Speaker 1: you got it, these are rookie numbers, man, or you 1568 01:25:19,040 --> 01:25:21,519 Speaker 1: got to bump these numbers up. And he's like, okay, fine, 1569 01:25:21,520 --> 01:25:23,439 Speaker 1: well let's let's let's do it to six months. Because 1570 01:25:23,439 --> 01:25:24,840 Speaker 1: she's like, you're just not You're not going to get 1571 01:25:24,880 --> 01:25:27,439 Speaker 1: any democratic support for this. So what would what's the 1572 01:25:27,479 --> 01:25:29,880 Speaker 1: point of doing this, You're going to you're able to 1573 01:25:29,880 --> 01:25:32,240 Speaker 1: get a floor vote, Like, why blow it on something 1574 01:25:32,280 --> 01:25:34,760 Speaker 1: that everybody's just going to vote against? And so they 1575 01:25:34,960 --> 01:25:37,400 Speaker 1: so they came up with this six month threshold. So 1576 01:25:37,439 --> 01:25:40,439 Speaker 1: does that signal that Matt Gates thinks there's no chance 1577 01:25:41,040 --> 01:25:44,560 Speaker 1: of getting significant support either from Republicans or centrist Democrats, 1578 01:25:44,640 --> 01:25:46,479 Speaker 1: so you might as well just put the fifteen days in? 1579 01:25:47,400 --> 01:25:49,760 Speaker 1: Or does it signal that someone on his policy team 1580 01:25:49,840 --> 01:25:52,519 Speaker 1: just and he just did something really dumb with the 1581 01:25:52,520 --> 01:25:55,519 Speaker 1: timeline the question The jury is still out on that question, 1582 01:25:56,200 --> 01:25:59,240 Speaker 1: but I would actually predict a slight increase in that number. 1583 01:25:59,240 --> 01:26:01,760 Speaker 1: I think that would probably tick up from twenty five, 1584 01:26:01,880 --> 01:26:06,639 Speaker 1: especially amidst problems in Europe, amidst problems in the staff 1585 01:26:06,680 --> 01:26:08,760 Speaker 1: trying to see I think, you know, there's a real, 1586 01:26:09,160 --> 01:26:12,080 Speaker 1: even among people who are more hawkish in the Republican Party, 1587 01:26:12,120 --> 01:26:16,920 Speaker 1: there's a real concern that we're expending military power in 1588 01:26:17,040 --> 01:26:22,280 Speaker 1: places that are draining military power that should be re 1589 01:26:23,160 --> 01:26:26,280 Speaker 1: prioritized and in places that should be reprioritized. So I 1590 01:26:26,360 --> 01:26:29,760 Speaker 1: actually would would predict you know, it's not a like 1591 01:26:29,920 --> 01:26:33,240 Speaker 1: solid prediction. I don't have any particular intelligence right now 1592 01:26:33,240 --> 01:26:35,839 Speaker 1: on this, but I would expect that number to be higher. 1593 01:26:37,080 --> 01:26:39,800 Speaker 1: All right, Well, that'll be nice to say it's unlikely 1594 01:26:39,920 --> 01:26:42,680 Speaker 1: to get to two eighteen. Yeah at this point, but 1595 01:26:43,800 --> 01:26:46,519 Speaker 1: you know, a serious show of force I think at 1596 01:26:46,600 --> 01:26:50,880 Speaker 1: least puts pressure. And Mark Millie was just there that 1597 01:26:50,920 --> 01:26:53,200 Speaker 1: I don't think that's a coincidence at all. You know, 1598 01:26:53,439 --> 01:26:55,240 Speaker 1: he went it's the first time he's been there in 1599 01:26:55,280 --> 01:26:57,640 Speaker 1: a very long time, and I think it was he 1600 01:26:57,760 --> 01:27:00,560 Speaker 1: was there to kind of, you know, show confidence in 1601 01:27:00,600 --> 01:27:04,800 Speaker 1: the US presence there, which also we should note is illegal. 1602 01:27:05,439 --> 01:27:10,000 Speaker 1: Like so there was. It's crazy I covered the vote 1603 01:27:10,320 --> 01:27:14,799 Speaker 1: or the whipping or the vote in twenty thirteen around 1604 01:27:14,840 --> 01:27:18,360 Speaker 1: this precise issue ten years. I've been doing this for 1605 01:27:18,400 --> 01:27:23,360 Speaker 1: too long. And Obama eventually pulled it off the floor 1606 01:27:23,479 --> 01:27:26,200 Speaker 1: after our whipcount showed two hundred and forty three nose 1607 01:27:26,240 --> 01:27:28,599 Speaker 1: and leaning nose. So he was going to lose. He 1608 01:27:28,640 --> 01:27:29,920 Speaker 1: was going to lose the vote. He wasn't going to 1609 01:27:30,000 --> 01:27:33,559 Speaker 1: get authorization for this use of force. Half posts whipcount, yeah, 1610 01:27:33,600 --> 01:27:36,040 Speaker 1: half posted, even like Daily Coast was doing its own 1611 01:27:36,120 --> 01:27:39,800 Speaker 1: kind of separate whip count back back in the days 1612 01:27:39,800 --> 01:27:42,280 Speaker 1: when there was a little bit more skeptical of US 1613 01:27:42,400 --> 01:27:48,320 Speaker 1: interventions and so there is not that authority. So therefore 1614 01:27:48,320 --> 01:27:51,160 Speaker 1: they're relying on the two thousand and one a UMF, 1615 01:27:51,240 --> 01:27:54,200 Speaker 1: the Authorization of the Use of Military Force, which allows 1616 01:27:54,680 --> 01:27:56,519 Speaker 1: the US to go to war anywhere at once as 1617 01:27:56,520 --> 01:27:59,479 Speaker 1: long as it's against al Qaeda, and the Taliban was 1618 01:27:59,520 --> 01:28:02,080 Speaker 1: thrown in there as well, and they've since said, okay, 1619 01:28:02,080 --> 01:28:04,639 Speaker 1: well al Qaeda anybody kind of similar to al Qaida 1620 01:28:05,320 --> 01:28:08,439 Speaker 1: was hiding under the North Stream, right, Yes, well that 1621 01:28:08,479 --> 01:28:14,080 Speaker 1: was a pro Ukrainian group, and so the but the 1622 01:28:14,439 --> 01:28:17,439 Speaker 1: administration in the press has been saying that the purpose 1623 01:28:17,720 --> 01:28:22,040 Speaker 1: of this deployment of troops overseas is to counter Iran 1624 01:28:22,240 --> 01:28:27,639 Speaker 1: and pro Iranian militias in Syria. And there's just now 1625 01:28:27,680 --> 01:28:29,640 Speaker 1: if you were going to say, well, they're there to 1626 01:28:29,640 --> 01:28:33,519 Speaker 1: fight isis only then you could maybe say, okay, well, 1627 01:28:33,560 --> 01:28:37,240 Speaker 1: isis is derivative enough of al Qaeda that you know 1628 01:28:37,280 --> 01:28:39,080 Speaker 1: you're not going to win a court case over this. 1629 01:28:39,600 --> 01:28:44,000 Speaker 1: But there's just no interpretation of the two thousand and 1630 01:28:44,000 --> 01:28:47,880 Speaker 1: one AUMF that authorise as a president to go to 1631 01:28:47,920 --> 01:28:51,000 Speaker 1: war against Iran or pro run milits like that's just 1632 01:28:51,000 --> 01:28:52,439 Speaker 1: just can't do it. And so then the question is 1633 01:28:53,280 --> 01:28:57,040 Speaker 1: does that matter? Clearly doesn't. What about the rules based order? 1634 01:28:57,240 --> 01:28:59,639 Speaker 1: It clearly doesn't matter to the people who are acture 1635 01:28:59,720 --> 01:29:02,280 Speaker 1: us constantly about the rules based order, and like sure 1636 01:29:02,280 --> 01:29:04,479 Speaker 1: other countries about the rules based order. I know where 1637 01:29:04,520 --> 01:29:08,320 Speaker 1: suckers to even take it seriously. But yeah, what we're 1638 01:29:08,320 --> 01:29:10,960 Speaker 1: supposed to do this for the hell of it, pretend 1639 01:29:11,040 --> 01:29:17,200 Speaker 1: the rules based order matter. What's your point today? All right, Well, 1640 01:29:17,240 --> 01:29:19,479 Speaker 1: we're going to be talking about Tucker Carlson and new 1641 01:29:19,560 --> 01:29:23,360 Speaker 1: Fox News reporting before Tucker started releasing new footage from 1642 01:29:23,360 --> 01:29:26,519 Speaker 1: the Capitol in January sixth. Just this Monday, he actually 1643 01:29:26,600 --> 01:29:30,000 Speaker 1: prefaced his show with an interesting admission. As he covers 1644 01:29:30,000 --> 01:29:34,040 Speaker 1: the video this week, Carlson said, many mystery mysteries will 1645 01:29:34,080 --> 01:29:37,600 Speaker 1: remain unsolved, and in fact, there were many examples of 1646 01:29:37,680 --> 01:29:39,840 Speaker 1: behavior we saw in those tapes that didn't seem to 1647 01:29:39,920 --> 01:29:44,000 Speaker 1: make sense. Men and civilian clothes holding doors open for protesters, 1648 01:29:44,320 --> 01:29:47,400 Speaker 1: escorting others through the capitol, et cetera. We would love 1649 01:29:47,439 --> 01:29:50,000 Speaker 1: to know who these people were, but as of tonight, 1650 01:29:50,040 --> 01:29:52,320 Speaker 1: we don't know. And because we don't know, we're not 1651 01:29:52,320 --> 01:29:54,240 Speaker 1: going to put their faces on the screen and suggest 1652 01:29:54,280 --> 01:29:57,439 Speaker 1: they were federal agents. So video of men and civilian clothing. 1653 01:29:57,680 --> 01:30:00,960 Speaker 1: Holding doors open for protesters and escorting others through the 1654 01:30:00,960 --> 01:30:03,840 Speaker 1: Capitol should have been explained by the Special Committee House 1655 01:30:03,880 --> 01:30:07,240 Speaker 1: Democrats and paneled to investigate January six. In new video, 1656 01:30:07,280 --> 01:30:11,280 Speaker 1: for instance, Carlson showed nearly ten officers calmly escorting the 1657 01:30:11,320 --> 01:30:15,799 Speaker 1: so called QAnon shaman around the Capitol building on January sixth. 1658 01:30:16,040 --> 01:30:18,519 Speaker 1: Maybe this was a crowd control technique. I actually have 1659 01:30:18,640 --> 01:30:20,800 Speaker 1: no idea, but I was there as a reporter, and 1660 01:30:20,920 --> 01:30:22,719 Speaker 1: right away it was clear to me that different parts 1661 01:30:22,760 --> 01:30:26,920 Speaker 1: of the building were experiencing very different versions of events. 1662 01:30:27,120 --> 01:30:29,559 Speaker 1: To be clear, I think the bottom line about January 1663 01:30:29,640 --> 01:30:32,560 Speaker 1: six is that a group of Trump supporters, not Antifa 1664 01:30:32,680 --> 01:30:35,879 Speaker 1: or the FBI, were so persuaded by the former president 1665 01:30:35,880 --> 01:30:38,639 Speaker 1: and so furious at the political establishment that they gave 1666 01:30:38,680 --> 01:30:41,479 Speaker 1: into mob mentality and violence, thinking it was their last 1667 01:30:41,520 --> 01:30:44,080 Speaker 1: chance to save the country. You could feel it snowballing. 1668 01:30:44,360 --> 01:30:48,200 Speaker 1: But that doesn't mean the FBI didn't have informants involved. 1669 01:30:48,360 --> 01:30:51,519 Speaker 1: We now know definitively they did, And it doesn't mean 1670 01:30:51,720 --> 01:30:56,080 Speaker 1: the media's coverage was true. We now know definitively it wasn't. 1671 01:30:56,200 --> 01:30:59,320 Speaker 1: For instance, here are some questions the media should be wondering, 1672 01:30:59,400 --> 01:31:03,120 Speaker 1: why does Tuck have videoed the January sixth Committee seems 1673 01:31:03,200 --> 01:31:06,800 Speaker 1: to have contradicted even though they had it in their possession. 1674 01:31:07,240 --> 01:31:10,720 Speaker 1: Why did attorneys for the January sixth defendants, as one 1675 01:31:10,720 --> 01:31:14,040 Speaker 1: said on Laura Ingram Show last night, not get that video? 1676 01:31:14,200 --> 01:31:16,639 Speaker 1: And why is the media more upset? And why are 1677 01:31:16,680 --> 01:31:21,000 Speaker 1: some establishment Republicans from Tom Tillis to Kevin Kramer to 1678 01:31:21,080 --> 01:31:24,360 Speaker 1: Mitch McConnell who trotted out a prop yesterday. Why are 1679 01:31:24,400 --> 01:31:27,879 Speaker 1: they more upset with Tucker Carlson than with the January 1680 01:31:27,880 --> 01:31:31,000 Speaker 1: sixth Committee or with the media that just completely swallowed 1681 01:31:31,000 --> 01:31:35,759 Speaker 1: the January sixth Committee's narrative whole cloth. So to pivot 1682 01:31:35,800 --> 01:31:38,559 Speaker 1: just slightly here, hundreds of pages of new documents in 1683 01:31:38,560 --> 01:31:41,880 Speaker 1: the dominion lawsuit against Fox News dropped yesterday, and there 1684 01:31:41,960 --> 01:31:45,799 Speaker 1: is surely plenty to dive into over the coming days. Meanwhile, 1685 01:31:45,840 --> 01:31:48,559 Speaker 1: on Capitol Hill, as I just mentioned, Republican senators from 1686 01:31:48,600 --> 01:31:51,719 Speaker 1: Tillis to Kramer to McConnell have been whining about Tucker 1687 01:31:51,760 --> 01:31:55,200 Speaker 1: Carlson's coverage of the January sixth tapes. Chuck Schumer actually 1688 01:31:55,200 --> 01:31:59,479 Speaker 1: called on Rupert Murdoch to yank Tucker Carlson off the 1689 01:31:59,560 --> 01:32:02,599 Speaker 1: air recently. You can see this tweet from Republican Senator 1690 01:32:02,680 --> 01:32:04,719 Speaker 1: jd Vance who said, today, I was asked by multiple 1691 01:32:04,760 --> 01:32:07,200 Speaker 1: reporters about Tucker's show last night. I was ast zero 1692 01:32:07,280 --> 01:32:09,559 Speaker 1: times about one of the most powerful figures in government 1693 01:32:09,640 --> 01:32:13,960 Speaker 1: actively promoting corporate censorship. Jeter said, censorship. But you can 1694 01:32:14,000 --> 01:32:17,200 Speaker 1: add the word corporate censorship of a media figure. The 1695 01:32:17,240 --> 01:32:22,040 Speaker 1: assault on quote our democracy is this again. He's asking 1696 01:32:22,120 --> 01:32:26,080 Speaker 1: questions about where Republican senators from Mitch McConnell to Kevin Cramer, 1697 01:32:26,160 --> 01:32:29,680 Speaker 1: A Tom Taylis and Mitt Romney are placing their priorities. 1698 01:32:29,720 --> 01:32:31,800 Speaker 1: And that is a useful question to apply to the 1699 01:32:31,880 --> 01:32:34,639 Speaker 1: media as well. And here's where it's useful to think 1700 01:32:34,680 --> 01:32:39,360 Speaker 1: about the balance overall in American media. Every single corporate 1701 01:32:39,520 --> 01:32:44,960 Speaker 1: media institution regularly attacks Fox News, sometimes with reason but 1702 01:32:45,120 --> 01:32:48,599 Speaker 1: other times without it. Plus nearly every single reporter now 1703 01:32:48,720 --> 01:32:53,000 Speaker 1: feasting on these dominion documents has helped spread destructive false 1704 01:32:53,080 --> 01:32:55,479 Speaker 1: narratives in recent years, and many of them have done 1705 01:32:55,520 --> 01:32:59,120 Speaker 1: it while deceiving their audience by pretending to be neutral 1706 01:32:59,200 --> 01:33:02,040 Speaker 1: and a political So you don't have to shed any 1707 01:33:02,120 --> 01:33:05,799 Speaker 1: tears for Fox News to recognize that While the network 1708 01:33:05,920 --> 01:33:10,200 Speaker 1: is powerful, the combined powers of their enemies is beyond 1709 01:33:10,280 --> 01:33:15,160 Speaker 1: Rupert Murdoch's wildest imagination. And those enemies are much more 1710 01:33:15,240 --> 01:33:20,040 Speaker 1: powerful and much more guilty because they feign superiority. So 1711 01:33:20,160 --> 01:33:23,520 Speaker 1: let's pivot for a minute again and enjoy this delightful 1712 01:33:23,520 --> 01:33:27,479 Speaker 1: clip of Russell Brand calmly making NBC analyst John Holman 1713 01:33:27,680 --> 01:33:31,040 Speaker 1: look foolish from last Friday's edition of Real Time. John, 1714 01:33:31,160 --> 01:33:33,280 Speaker 1: I've not known you long, but I love you already. 1715 01:33:33,360 --> 01:33:36,639 Speaker 1: But I have to say that it's disingenuous to claim 1716 01:33:36,680 --> 01:33:39,200 Speaker 1: that the biases they're exhibited on Fox News are any 1717 01:33:39,240 --> 01:33:43,000 Speaker 1: different from the biases exhibited on MSNBC. It's difficult to 1718 01:33:43,040 --> 01:33:47,640 Speaker 1: suggest that these corporations operate as anything other than mouthpieces 1719 01:33:47,680 --> 01:33:51,160 Speaker 1: for their affiliate owners in Black Rock and Vanguard. And 1720 01:33:51,560 --> 01:33:54,960 Speaker 1: unless we start to embrace and it also mate like 1721 01:33:55,160 --> 01:33:57,559 Speaker 1: just spiritually, if I may use that word in your 1722 01:33:57,560 --> 01:34:02,720 Speaker 1: great country, we have to take responsibility for our own perspectives. 1723 01:34:02,880 --> 01:34:05,880 Speaker 1: I've been on that MSNBC, mate, it was propaganda. It's 1724 01:34:06,040 --> 01:34:09,400 Speaker 1: nut crackery. I went on a strength called Morning Joe. 1725 01:34:09,640 --> 01:34:12,439 Speaker 1: It was absurd the way they carried Morning Joe. Yeah, 1726 01:34:12,600 --> 01:34:14,280 Speaker 1: I don't know what it was. It wasn't morning. There 1727 01:34:14,320 --> 01:34:16,320 Speaker 1: was no one called Joe there, no one could concentrate. 1728 01:34:16,360 --> 01:34:20,240 Speaker 1: They didn't understand the basic tenets of journalism. No one 1729 01:34:20,439 --> 01:34:23,559 Speaker 1: was willing to stick up for genuine American heroes like 1730 01:34:23,800 --> 01:34:26,200 Speaker 1: Edward Snow. Then no one was willing to talk about 1731 01:34:26,280 --> 01:34:28,960 Speaker 1: Julian Assange and what he suffered trying to bring real 1732 01:34:29,080 --> 01:34:33,400 Speaker 1: journalism to the American people. And I think to sit 1733 01:34:33,520 --> 01:34:39,160 Speaker 1: within the castle of MSNBC throwing rocks Fox News is ludicrous. 1734 01:34:39,560 --> 01:34:45,639 Speaker 1: Make MSNBC better, Make MSNBC great again, Make MSNBC great again, 1735 01:34:45,840 --> 01:34:49,320 Speaker 1: make the entire media grade again. Maybe Brian's point came 1736 01:34:49,400 --> 01:34:52,040 Speaker 1: amid a discussion on the show of recent legal disclosures 1737 01:34:52,080 --> 01:34:55,320 Speaker 1: that are showing certain hosts and executives at Fox News 1738 01:34:55,320 --> 01:34:58,679 Speaker 1: were unhappy with other people the network's coverage of genuine 1739 01:34:58,720 --> 01:35:02,920 Speaker 1: disinformation about the twenty twenty election. Since I've written this 1740 01:35:03,160 --> 01:35:05,679 Speaker 1: script that I'm reading now, we're getting even more from 1741 01:35:05,720 --> 01:35:08,560 Speaker 1: the dominion documents. But as he was being criticized for 1742 01:35:08,640 --> 01:35:13,200 Speaker 1: misrepresenting facts, John Heilman, then mister represented the facts about 1743 01:35:13,200 --> 01:35:16,519 Speaker 1: the Fox lawsuit. But that's neither here than there. My 1744 01:35:16,560 --> 01:35:19,640 Speaker 1: only quibble with Brand's point is that Fox News recognizes 1745 01:35:19,920 --> 01:35:22,439 Speaker 1: there's money to be made by being the only corporate 1746 01:35:22,479 --> 01:35:26,720 Speaker 1: media outlet willing to air anti establishment voices. Unlike on 1747 01:35:26,840 --> 01:35:29,720 Speaker 1: MSNBC or CNN. These days, on Fox News, you will 1748 01:35:29,760 --> 01:35:33,240 Speaker 1: actually hear Glenn Greenwald and Tulsea Gabbard's perspectives. You'll hear 1749 01:35:33,320 --> 01:35:37,280 Speaker 1: absolutely forbidden critiques of the left's excesses like censorship and 1750 01:35:37,320 --> 01:35:41,200 Speaker 1: puberty blockers and neo racism. These are closer to the 1751 01:35:41,200 --> 01:35:43,719 Speaker 1: perspectives you'd hear in a bar in my Wisconsin hometown 1752 01:35:43,760 --> 01:35:47,200 Speaker 1: than anything on MSNBC or CNN. We're questioning the dogma 1753 01:35:47,240 --> 01:35:51,920 Speaker 1: of rich educated liberals is uncouth and bigoted and intolerable. Again, 1754 01:35:51,960 --> 01:35:56,120 Speaker 1: I'm sure Rupert Murdoch understands this fundamentally as a business strategy, 1755 01:35:56,280 --> 01:35:59,920 Speaker 1: not an altruistic one. Still over on MSNBC and CNN, 1756 01:36:00,080 --> 01:36:01,479 Speaker 1: and in the pages of The New York Times and 1757 01:36:01,479 --> 01:36:04,200 Speaker 1: the Washington Post and even Rupert murdocks Wall Street Journal, 1758 01:36:04,479 --> 01:36:07,480 Speaker 1: it's rare to hear serious critiques of the military industrial 1759 01:36:07,479 --> 01:36:11,439 Speaker 1: complex or corporate power, unless those critiques are about the 1760 01:36:11,479 --> 01:36:15,559 Speaker 1: military being racist or corporations needing bigger HR departments. Fox 1761 01:36:15,640 --> 01:36:19,400 Speaker 1: platforms warmongers too, that's true. That's true, but they know 1762 01:36:19,439 --> 01:36:23,280 Speaker 1: it's more entertaining than to air other perspectives alongside of them. 1763 01:36:23,640 --> 01:36:27,080 Speaker 1: So while corporate media winds about Kevin McCarthy granting Tucker 1764 01:36:27,080 --> 01:36:30,120 Speaker 1: Carlson access to the January sixth tapes, it's possible to 1765 01:36:30,200 --> 01:36:33,760 Speaker 1: question the decision but recognize that corporate media itself is 1766 01:36:33,960 --> 01:36:37,040 Speaker 1: the problem. That Tucker seeing the j six footage after 1767 01:36:37,120 --> 01:36:41,920 Speaker 1: a purportedly bipartisan select committee left relevant video out of 1768 01:36:41,960 --> 01:36:46,080 Speaker 1: their hearings and reports, and that media never questioned them. 1769 01:36:46,360 --> 01:36:48,880 Speaker 1: If you're talking about Fox and Tucker and not talking 1770 01:36:48,960 --> 01:36:52,400 Speaker 1: about the broader universe of other networks and journalists who've 1771 01:36:52,400 --> 01:36:55,880 Speaker 1: made a habit of lying and deceiving for partisan purposes, 1772 01:36:56,120 --> 01:36:58,760 Speaker 1: you're getting sucked into a stupid game. Just like all 1773 01:36:58,800 --> 01:37:02,320 Speaker 1: those Republican senators choosing to waste breath on Tucker, they 1774 01:37:02,320 --> 01:37:05,120 Speaker 1: would never use to critique the entire corporate press and 1775 01:37:05,200 --> 01:37:10,280 Speaker 1: intelligence community for exploiting the tragedy. Ryan, Again, there's a 1776 01:37:10,360 --> 01:37:15,920 Speaker 1: lot coming out of the dominion lawsuits. All right, Well, 1777 01:37:15,960 --> 01:37:18,080 Speaker 1: thank you for joining us. As you may have noticed, 1778 01:37:18,080 --> 01:37:20,519 Speaker 1: if you're watching this on YouTube, we're doing something different. 1779 01:37:20,680 --> 01:37:22,960 Speaker 1: Posting just a couple of the clips. You can find 1780 01:37:23,000 --> 01:37:26,000 Speaker 1: the rest of them, as you know, on the podcast version, 1781 01:37:26,400 --> 01:37:29,479 Speaker 1: also on the premium version, you know, you get to 1782 01:37:29,520 --> 01:37:31,960 Speaker 1: part with ten year dollars every month to hear that, 1783 01:37:32,000 --> 01:37:33,720 Speaker 1: but then you get it add free, that's right, and 1784 01:37:33,800 --> 01:37:36,960 Speaker 1: you get it emailed into your inbox an hour early. 1785 01:37:38,760 --> 01:37:40,360 Speaker 1: I don't know. Its been a good show though, another 1786 01:37:40,400 --> 01:37:43,160 Speaker 1: typical Wednesday, meaning we are bursting at the seams with 1787 01:37:43,240 --> 01:37:45,960 Speaker 1: breaking news. There you go, exactly, all right, Well, we 1788 01:37:46,000 --> 01:37:59,720 Speaker 1: will see you guys next Wednesday.