1 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:05,760 Speaker 1: Troy Coleman split his formative years between California and the 2 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:09,520 Speaker 1: middle class Philadelphia neighborhood of Mount Airy, but while in Philly, 3 00:00:09,560 --> 00:00:12,280 Speaker 1: he attended a rough high school in Germantown, where he 4 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:17,240 Speaker 1: met Byron Johnson, Kareem Nobles, and Darren Keith Johnson. After 5 00:00:17,360 --> 00:00:20,959 Speaker 1: Troy graduated, Byron and Kareem were the muscle behind a 6 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:25,160 Speaker 1: cocaine operation that they all ran out of Troy's apartment. However, 7 00:00:25,360 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 1: a drug drought in the summer of nineteen eighty nine 8 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:31,720 Speaker 1: stimulated desperate behavior all over Philly, and while Troy was 9 00:00:31,720 --> 00:00:35,120 Speaker 1: away to Atlantic City on September twenty sixth, nineteen eighty nine, 10 00:00:35,520 --> 00:00:39,920 Speaker 1: Kareem allegedly set up a deal with two men, Kevin Jones. 11 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:40,640 Speaker 2: And Arthur Sanders. 12 00:00:41,040 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 1: Now. According to Sanders, he waited down the block while 13 00:00:44,800 --> 00:00:48,280 Speaker 1: Kevin Jones drove to Troy's apartment in his gray Dodge 14 00:00:48,280 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: with forty thousand dollars to buy cocaine. Nearly two hours later, 15 00:00:52,440 --> 00:00:56,000 Speaker 1: Sanders claimed to see two other men driving away in 16 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:59,280 Speaker 1: Kevin Jones's gray Dodge, a light skinned driver and a 17 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:02,600 Speaker 1: darker skin passenger wearing a hat with the brim pull 18 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:07,480 Speaker 1: down low Kevin's body was eventually found in the Gray Dodge. 19 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:11,480 Speaker 1: Sanders agreed that Troy's photo looked like the passenger with 20 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:15,480 Speaker 1: Sander's shaky id and the coerce and incentivized testimony of 21 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:18,800 Speaker 1: Darren Keith Johnson. Troy was sentenced to life in prison. 22 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:24,560 Speaker 1: Despite Darren's nineteen ninety eight recantation and Byron Johnson's twenty 23 00:01:24,680 --> 00:01:28,199 Speaker 1: nineteen confession to being the actual passenger in the Gray 24 00:01:28,240 --> 00:01:32,000 Speaker 1: Dodge that day, Troy continues to serve life for a 25 00:01:32,080 --> 00:01:36,520 Speaker 1: crime for which he was not even in Philadelphia to commit. 26 00:01:37,280 --> 00:01:57,560 Speaker 1: This is wrongful conviction with Jason Flamm. Welcome back to 27 00:01:57,640 --> 00:02:00,840 Speaker 1: wrongful conviction with Jason Flamm. That's me And today we 28 00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:04,200 Speaker 1: have a story that I think is going to rock 29 00:02:04,280 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 1: your world in a different kind of way right because 30 00:02:08,200 --> 00:02:11,760 Speaker 1: the person that we're interviewing today, Troy Coleman, has been 31 00:02:11,800 --> 00:02:14,520 Speaker 1: incarcerated for thirty one years in Pennsylvania for a crime 32 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:17,799 Speaker 1: he didn't commit. That being said, he wasn't a choir boy. 33 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 1: Some of the people we have on the show, we're 34 00:02:19,639 --> 00:02:22,320 Speaker 1: literal acchoir people before they were arrested. 35 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:23,480 Speaker 3: But he is. 36 00:02:23,600 --> 00:02:25,760 Speaker 1: Innocent of this crime. He wasn't even the same city 37 00:02:26,120 --> 00:02:30,079 Speaker 1: when it happened, or state for that matter. So Troy's 38 00:02:30,120 --> 00:02:34,040 Speaker 1: on the phone from prison. Troy, I'm glad you're here, 39 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 1: but I'm sorry you have to be here under these circumstances. 40 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:37,720 Speaker 3: How are you? 41 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:41,359 Speaker 1: I'm good? Thank you? And with Troy is Jerry Brown, 42 00:02:41,680 --> 00:02:45,760 Speaker 1: not the former governor of California, but an esteemed attorney 43 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: from Philadelphia. Thank you for joining us on the show today. Jason, 44 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 1: Let's go back, Troy. You grew up in a middle 45 00:02:53,760 --> 00:02:55,200 Speaker 1: class environment, right. 46 00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 3: I grew up in Mound Are, Philadelfia, which is a 47 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:03,079 Speaker 3: middle class neighborhood, and I was blessed to live with 48 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:06,400 Speaker 3: my grandmother, who was well off, and we had a 49 00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:10,079 Speaker 3: beautiful home, three bedroom home. And you know, everyone who 50 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:13,480 Speaker 3: came from that home came to be very successful, although 51 00:03:13,600 --> 00:03:16,720 Speaker 3: went to private school, even my father. And my father 52 00:03:16,880 --> 00:03:20,520 Speaker 3: moved to California, and when he moved to California, I 53 00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:23,519 Speaker 3: was going back and forth from California to Philadelphia from 54 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:27,520 Speaker 3: my grandmother house, which California school curriculum, our junior high 55 00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:30,919 Speaker 3: curriculum was equal to a high school curriculum here in Philadelphia. 56 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:33,960 Speaker 3: But you know, when I came back to high school 57 00:03:33,960 --> 00:03:37,040 Speaker 3: here in Philluppia Germantown High School. I was looked at 58 00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 3: as kind of nerdy, I guess, you know, because of 59 00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:42,600 Speaker 3: the academics. I guess that we came with versus where 60 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:45,600 Speaker 3: was over here at Philadelphia, and you know, you try 61 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:48,320 Speaker 3: your best to fit in and you want to be accepted. 62 00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:52,160 Speaker 3: That's where a lot of my de minds came from. 63 00:03:52,280 --> 00:03:55,720 Speaker 3: When I had got involved with drugs, not needing to 64 00:03:56,000 --> 00:03:58,960 Speaker 3: didn't have to, you know. Then my family was well 65 00:03:59,000 --> 00:04:01,200 Speaker 3: to do. However, you know, just to sit in and 66 00:04:01,240 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 3: be a part of this particular neighborhood that was in 67 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:07,160 Speaker 3: german Town, which is a little bit wasn't a good 68 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:09,000 Speaker 3: lifestyle that they lived down here. It was a little 69 00:04:09,080 --> 00:04:12,240 Speaker 3: more lower class again from Mound areas. So when I 70 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:15,240 Speaker 3: started boxing the DAGs being down there in the gym, 71 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:18,680 Speaker 3: that's how a couple of them guys from around the neighborhood. 72 00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:22,479 Speaker 3: After that, subsequently I got involved with them with the 73 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:26,400 Speaker 3: about the age of seventeen sixteen. We started out young 74 00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:28,920 Speaker 3: on the quarters, so that's when it began. 75 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:32,720 Speaker 1: So this must have put you on the radar of 76 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:35,440 Speaker 1: the local police. And we know that in that time 77 00:04:35,560 --> 00:04:39,039 Speaker 1: and place, this was a culture that it started with 78 00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:42,560 Speaker 1: Frank Rizzo, who as the police chief in Philadelphia from 79 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:45,520 Speaker 1: sixty eight to seventy one. The legacy of brutality and 80 00:04:45,560 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 1: corruption is widely known, and it thrived in the police 81 00:04:48,560 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 1: department after he became mayor. Really crazy that that guy 82 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:54,440 Speaker 1: became mayor, but seventy two to eighty and they were 83 00:04:54,480 --> 00:04:56,720 Speaker 1: just beating the shit out of everybody back then, and 84 00:04:56,760 --> 00:05:01,159 Speaker 1: it's really it's crazy that this was a major American city. So, Jerry, 85 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:04,039 Speaker 1: you were a college student at the University of Pennsylvania 86 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 1: at that time, and you experienced were at least aware 87 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 1: of this, Right, this is not hyperbole? 88 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:13,200 Speaker 4: Right? Oh no, If you had a little bit of 89 00:05:13,279 --> 00:05:16,840 Speaker 4: long hair like I did, you every time you walk 90 00:05:16,920 --> 00:05:19,279 Speaker 4: down the street at night, you were afraid that you 91 00:05:19,279 --> 00:05:21,760 Speaker 4: were going to stop and hassled by the police. And 92 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 4: I'm sure for people of color it was much worse. 93 00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 1: In my research, I mean, these were in the thirty 94 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:30,840 Speaker 1: ninth District, right, a section of North Philadelphia, which was 95 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:35,960 Speaker 1: a working class, poor black neighborhood. Police routinely made false arrests, 96 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:39,479 Speaker 1: planted drugs, robbed victims, and filed bogus reports to cover 97 00:05:39,560 --> 00:05:42,720 Speaker 1: up their actions. So all of this is known now, 98 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:46,119 Speaker 1: it's been documented. This is not us just having a 99 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:49,160 Speaker 1: a there's a trip down a very ugly memory lane 100 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:49,600 Speaker 1: right here. 101 00:05:50,000 --> 00:05:53,440 Speaker 4: In fact, there were fourteen hundred convictions that were overturned 102 00:05:53,520 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 4: due to the thirty ninth district. But they're not the 103 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 4: only ones. There was the one squad cases, the five 104 00:05:59,480 --> 00:06:03,720 Speaker 4: squad cases. I mean, there's been a history in Philadelphia, 105 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:06,440 Speaker 4: you know, and then in the nineties you have one 106 00:06:06,480 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 4: of the cops that was involved in this case, Martin Devlin. 107 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:12,080 Speaker 4: The number of cases have been overturned because of him. 108 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:15,280 Speaker 4: It's a very sordid history, right. 109 00:06:15,360 --> 00:06:18,400 Speaker 1: So this of course brings me back to another person 110 00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:20,880 Speaker 1: who was wrongful Convictoro's been on our show, Tony Wright, 111 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 1: which was ironically the same cop that was involved in 112 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,920 Speaker 1: Troy's case, Martin Devlin. And in the article of Rolling 113 00:06:27,920 --> 00:06:30,679 Speaker 1: Stone magazine about Tony's case, there was a pull quote 114 00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:33,919 Speaker 1: that said that in the nineteen eighties or nineties, a 115 00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:36,680 Speaker 1: black man had a better chance of getting justice in Philadelphia, 116 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:40,039 Speaker 1: Mississippi than in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. So let's go to that, 117 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 1: and of course Troy. This of course, what led up 118 00:06:43,480 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 1: to this, I think indirectly, is the fact that you 119 00:06:46,480 --> 00:06:49,479 Speaker 1: were involved, as you've been very honest about, in the 120 00:06:49,520 --> 00:06:52,279 Speaker 1: cocaine business. Can you tell us about that and the 121 00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:55,800 Speaker 1: people that were working under you at the time, because 122 00:06:55,839 --> 00:06:58,679 Speaker 1: they come to play a role in your wrongful conviction. 123 00:06:58,960 --> 00:07:01,440 Speaker 3: Well, we got involved. It was a couple of guys 124 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:04,840 Speaker 3: from that neighborhood, particularly down cross the Street, and this 125 00:07:05,080 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 3: is actually it's called the Jungle. Some of the guys 126 00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:12,239 Speaker 3: that's involved Barra Johnson, Garan, Keith Johnson, Raymond Nobles, and 127 00:07:12,400 --> 00:07:15,680 Speaker 3: his street name was Kareem. My street game at the 128 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:19,880 Speaker 3: time was Kassin with his was with his Kareem. So 129 00:07:19,920 --> 00:07:21,600 Speaker 3: he was an older guy, he just got out of 130 00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:24,240 Speaker 3: jail and all this time everybody looked up to him 131 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 3: as the tough Gert heights On and so forth. To me, 132 00:07:26,680 --> 00:07:28,920 Speaker 3: it was like imparative that I get him involved. It's 133 00:07:28,920 --> 00:07:31,280 Speaker 3: somewhat for the muscle as well as Byron. 134 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 2: So you had Byron Johnson, Darren Johnson and Kareem Nobles 135 00:07:37,880 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 2: were your underlings. They worked for you. 136 00:07:40,280 --> 00:07:43,679 Speaker 3: Yes, I guess my little intellect being involved in that 137 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:47,840 Speaker 3: allowed me to shoot up fast. So I had a 138 00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:50,960 Speaker 3: little apartment down in Mars Street. Klaski Town is what 139 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:53,160 Speaker 3: they called Eron, But we had an apartment in Kulaski 140 00:07:53,240 --> 00:07:55,800 Speaker 3: Town and that was just for you know, fun, dealing 141 00:07:55,840 --> 00:07:58,360 Speaker 3: with the drug stuff, girls and all that. Raymond Nobles 142 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:01,040 Speaker 3: Koree was actually staying in my part why I lived 143 00:08:01,400 --> 00:08:03,960 Speaker 3: in down area. I still had that place in firing 144 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 3: that keys to the apartment between that keys to the apartment, 145 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 3: so people had access to it. At that time, I 146 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:13,160 Speaker 3: was driving BMW's, had a nice amount of money and 147 00:08:13,200 --> 00:08:16,320 Speaker 3: I was okay. However, these guys that were working for me, 148 00:08:16,680 --> 00:08:20,360 Speaker 3: they were okay until a drought came in nineteen eighty nine. 149 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 3: The drought is when there's thaw drugs, particularly cocaine of 150 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:26,680 Speaker 3: elbow at that time in the city where it could 151 00:08:26,680 --> 00:08:29,280 Speaker 3: be purchased in so and this was a well known 152 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:34,200 Speaker 3: time because the homicidely rose significantly at that time and 153 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:36,520 Speaker 3: it was real bad. So when this drought came about, 154 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:39,880 Speaker 3: I was okay, these guys, I didn't have anything for him. 155 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:42,840 Speaker 3: So they actually ran them up for lack of retterfleet. 156 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 3: They just ran them up. They was just doing all 157 00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:47,199 Speaker 3: kinds of money stuff. And this day in particular in 158 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:51,079 Speaker 3: which this crime happened, myself and another gentleman by the 159 00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 3: name of Richard Crawford. That morning of September twenty sixth, 160 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:56,440 Speaker 3: we went to Atlantic City. And when I was in 161 00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 3: Atlantic City, I think I had no more than nine 162 00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:03,880 Speaker 3: ounces of cocaine left, and actually, you know, trusted between 163 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 3: to deal with that when I was going. And when 164 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:10,120 Speaker 3: I left on the twenty sixth, we get to Atlanta 165 00:09:10,160 --> 00:09:14,280 Speaker 3: City that morning was getting taking insights, you know, shopping, 166 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:18,160 Speaker 3: talking all that other stuff to girls whatever. So I 167 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:20,880 Speaker 3: was very intoxicated. I wasn't willing to drive back to 168 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:24,160 Speaker 3: the city, so that night we checked it two hotel. 169 00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:27,679 Speaker 1: Okay, so you were in Atlantic City having fun, intoxicated, 170 00:09:27,920 --> 00:09:30,240 Speaker 1: so drunk in fact, that you had a hard time 171 00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:34,160 Speaker 1: even remembering which hotel you had checked into and under 172 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:36,680 Speaker 1: what name. And the crazy thing is that the state 173 00:09:36,840 --> 00:09:41,080 Speaker 1: eventually used your own shaky memory to impeach you. But 174 00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:44,120 Speaker 1: it's so twisted because they actually presented evidence that was 175 00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:48,000 Speaker 1: exculpatory because it differed from your memory that you had 176 00:09:48,040 --> 00:09:50,800 Speaker 1: in fact stated valleys under your own name. I mean, 177 00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:54,320 Speaker 1: after all, wide, let evidence of you being in Atlantic 178 00:09:54,360 --> 00:09:58,280 Speaker 1: City get in the way of prosecuting a man we 179 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:01,160 Speaker 1: now know and I think they knew that him was innocent. 180 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:04,839 Speaker 1: That should have been the end of this podcast right there, 181 00:10:05,440 --> 00:10:08,640 Speaker 1: but it's not. So the crime itself. Back at the 182 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:12,439 Speaker 1: apartment in Philadelphia on September twenty sixth, nineteen eighty nine, 183 00:10:12,520 --> 00:10:15,280 Speaker 1: Kareem set up a deal with Kevin Jones and Arthur Sanders. 184 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:18,320 Speaker 1: According to Sanders, he and Kevin Jones arrived in the 185 00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:20,959 Speaker 1: area of the apartment in separate cars around one thirty 186 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:24,920 Speaker 1: pm with forty thousand dollars to buy cocaine. Now, Arthur 187 00:10:25,000 --> 00:10:27,840 Speaker 1: Sanders mentioned that the first preliminary hearing of this trial 188 00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:31,120 Speaker 1: that he was going to buy this cocaine from Kareem, 189 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:36,400 Speaker 1: not Troy or your street name, Casim, but Kareem, which 190 00:10:36,440 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 1: is why this case was initially thrown out as it 191 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:42,319 Speaker 1: should have been. But nonetheless, here we are, all these 192 00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:47,240 Speaker 1: years later, so again, according to Sanders, Jones continued down 193 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:50,400 Speaker 1: the street in a gray Dodge alone while Sanders waited 194 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 1: down the block. Then, about an hour and a half later, 195 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:57,720 Speaker 1: Sanders allegedly saw two men driving the gray Dodge passed him, 196 00:10:57,800 --> 00:11:01,360 Speaker 1: a light skinned man driving and a darker skinned man 197 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:03,520 Speaker 1: with the brim of his hat pulled down low in 198 00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 1: the passengers receipt. That night, the Jones family came to 199 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:11,240 Speaker 1: Troy's apartment armed looking for Kevin Jones. They threatened Troy's girlfriend. 200 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:14,800 Speaker 1: The apartment was searched, but alas no Kevin. So at 201 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 1: this point, Troy, you didn't know it yet, but you 202 00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:19,680 Speaker 1: were in a lot of trouble. And I don't mean 203 00:11:19,679 --> 00:11:24,240 Speaker 1: what the cops. The cops actually kind of inadvertently saved you. 204 00:11:24,679 --> 00:11:27,240 Speaker 3: When I got back to Philadelphia that next day, I 205 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:29,360 Speaker 3: was stopped by the police. You know, had my license 206 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:32,280 Speaker 3: and registration and everything was legit, but they found a 207 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:34,199 Speaker 3: bag of marijuana in the car. And that might have 208 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:36,760 Speaker 3: been a good thing, because I got arrested that evening 209 00:11:37,120 --> 00:11:39,640 Speaker 3: and when I called home, and that's when I heard everything, 210 00:11:39,679 --> 00:11:42,480 Speaker 3: everybody saying, yeah, these guys are looking for you if 211 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:44,520 Speaker 3: you stated and want to take it. So when I 212 00:11:44,640 --> 00:11:47,080 Speaker 3: was built out, my girlfriend at the time as well 213 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:50,319 Speaker 3: as my mother, had bags in the car and the 214 00:11:50,440 --> 00:11:54,360 Speaker 3: tickets with me. And that's the very next day I 215 00:11:54,480 --> 00:11:55,800 Speaker 3: was in California. 216 00:11:55,920 --> 00:11:58,200 Speaker 1: Okay, So even though you had nothing to do with this, 217 00:11:58,360 --> 00:12:00,480 Speaker 1: you had to leave town just to be safe in 218 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:03,880 Speaker 1: California at least for now. And at this point the 219 00:12:03,920 --> 00:12:06,880 Speaker 1: cops aren't even involved yet, and we find out much 220 00:12:06,920 --> 00:12:11,040 Speaker 1: later that Kareem. Of course, Kareem was Raymond Nobles killed 221 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 1: Kevin Jones and got Byron Johnson to help him dispose 222 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:17,200 Speaker 1: of the body. These are the two men that Arthur 223 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 1: Sanders allegedly saw rolling by him in the Gray Dodge, 224 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:24,080 Speaker 1: but we don't find that out until much later. Now, 225 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:27,160 Speaker 1: between the time of this crime and when it's investigated, 226 00:12:27,559 --> 00:12:32,960 Speaker 1: Kareem Raymond Nobles died. Now call me crazy, but it 227 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:35,960 Speaker 1: just might have been. The Jones has had something to 228 00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:40,040 Speaker 1: do with that. So anyway, Now, November twenty first, nineteen 229 00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:42,800 Speaker 1: eighty nine, the police discovered Kevin Jones's body in the 230 00:12:42,840 --> 00:12:45,520 Speaker 1: trunk of the Gray Dodge and the John Wannamaker parking 231 00:12:45,559 --> 00:12:49,760 Speaker 1: lot in Abington Township. The body was bound with electrical cord, 232 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:53,160 Speaker 1: blanket sheets and some insulation. By that time it was 233 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:56,760 Speaker 1: badly decomposing, but it's clear that his face had been 234 00:12:56,800 --> 00:13:00,240 Speaker 1: struck with a blunt object several times and then one, 235 00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:05,200 Speaker 1: and this is important, one hard contact, high velocity gunshot. 236 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:07,319 Speaker 1: When was the cause of death And we'll get to 237 00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:11,479 Speaker 1: why that's important later. So anyway, the investigation begins, and initially, 238 00:13:11,800 --> 00:13:14,360 Speaker 1: after being pressured by both the Jones family and the 239 00:13:14,400 --> 00:13:18,840 Speaker 1: notoriously corrupt detective Martin Devlin. Arthur Sanders implicated Troy. 240 00:13:19,200 --> 00:13:22,959 Speaker 4: According to him, never seen Troy before, and he's sitting 241 00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:24,680 Speaker 4: there waiting for a now and a half. Suddenly a 242 00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:27,120 Speaker 4: car comes by. Now, when you I mean just. 243 00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:29,520 Speaker 2: Logically, when you think about it, if suddenly you see 244 00:13:29,559 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 2: a car, first of all, you go, you know, that 245 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:35,000 Speaker 2: car looks familiar, and then in your mind you go, oh, yeah, 246 00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:38,480 Speaker 2: that looks like it's Kevin's car. And then he looks 247 00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:41,880 Speaker 2: at the driver and says, that's not Kevin. It's a 248 00:13:41,960 --> 00:13:44,760 Speaker 2: light skin guy. Then he looks at the passenger, who 249 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:48,120 Speaker 2: has his hat over his head, and he's able to 250 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:50,920 Speaker 2: identify him. Now, all this is happening in two or 251 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:54,679 Speaker 2: three seconds. According to Sanders testimony. 252 00:13:54,160 --> 00:13:57,640 Speaker 3: Off sad to say that the passenger was a real 253 00:13:58,120 --> 00:14:00,960 Speaker 3: sit He had a baseball cap, one pull down over 254 00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:04,440 Speaker 3: his forehead, slouts in the seat and in a photo 255 00:14:04,440 --> 00:14:07,400 Speaker 3: where you said, I look like the passenger putting me 256 00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:09,360 Speaker 3: in the city at the time. However, I'm in the 257 00:14:09,360 --> 00:14:12,160 Speaker 3: Atlantic City. It's a possible identification to me. 258 00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:16,000 Speaker 2: So the inference I would take is that I'm sure 259 00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:19,080 Speaker 2: somebody in the police department in Devlin certainly was willing 260 00:14:19,160 --> 00:14:22,640 Speaker 2: to do something like this to create false evidence, because 261 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 2: he's done. 262 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 4: It on multiple occasions, as you all know. And there's 263 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:28,160 Speaker 4: other cases that you didn't mention that I'm aware of, 264 00:14:28,800 --> 00:14:33,080 Speaker 4: So he probably said, isn't this the guy? And you know, 265 00:14:33,160 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 4: Sanders is pretty scared to death anyway, because the family 266 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:40,160 Speaker 4: is really upset with him. This is an element that's 267 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:44,600 Speaker 4: not unwilling to use gun play if necessary. That's kind 268 00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:46,880 Speaker 4: of the background of all this and part of the 269 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:51,640 Speaker 4: reason why Arthur Sanders' statement is so flaky, if you will. 270 00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:54,800 Speaker 4: He's being pressured by the police to give up somebody 271 00:14:54,800 --> 00:14:57,040 Speaker 4: on the one hand, he's being pressured by the family 272 00:14:57,120 --> 00:14:59,880 Speaker 4: on the other, and you know, he says, yeah, that 273 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:03,200 Speaker 4: it looks like the guy. Now that they are focusing 274 00:15:03,280 --> 00:15:08,200 Speaker 4: on Troy Coleman, they start to focus in on his associates, 275 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:12,480 Speaker 4: one of whom is Darren Keith Johnson, who was a 276 00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:17,680 Speaker 4: eighteen year old five foot three, one hundred and twenty 277 00:15:17,720 --> 00:15:22,760 Speaker 4: five pounds, soaking wet youth essentially who's brought into homicide 278 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 4: and who first says. 279 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:28,400 Speaker 2: I don't know anything about anything, and then they proceed 280 00:15:28,640 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 2: to scare the hell out of him by saying, we 281 00:15:31,360 --> 00:15:35,440 Speaker 2: know you do, and the homicide cops pressured him to 282 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,640 Speaker 2: give a statement. They told him that if he didn't 283 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:41,120 Speaker 2: give a statement, that he was going to go to jail, 284 00:15:41,800 --> 00:15:44,480 Speaker 2: that he wouldn't see his mother again. I'm sure they 285 00:15:44,520 --> 00:15:47,240 Speaker 2: told him that if he went to prison that he 286 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:50,200 Speaker 2: would be molested there because he was so small. He 287 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:53,440 Speaker 2: told him that they didn't want the dead guy Kareem Nobles. 288 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:56,560 Speaker 2: Detective Cohen said, we think that he was involved, but 289 00:15:56,720 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 2: we want Troy because this apartment was rented by Troy, 290 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:04,760 Speaker 2: so he's scared to death and he finally gives up trouy. 291 00:16:05,000 --> 00:16:07,840 Speaker 2: Darren Johnson says, yeah, Troy admitted to me he had 292 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:11,640 Speaker 2: to lay somebody down. Those two pieces of evidence Arthur 293 00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:15,400 Speaker 2: Sanders sort of ID and Darren Johnson. Now they have 294 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:17,280 Speaker 2: enough to get an arrest warrant. 295 00:16:17,560 --> 00:16:20,760 Speaker 1: And this is from Darren Johnson's statement about what Troy 296 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:24,280 Speaker 1: allegedly told him. And now I'm gonna quote, okay ready, 297 00:16:25,440 --> 00:16:29,280 Speaker 1: quote I had to lay somebody down over some drugs. 298 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:31,680 Speaker 1: Let me tell you how I did it. I put 299 00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:33,640 Speaker 1: my gun up to him and told him to give 300 00:16:33,680 --> 00:16:36,800 Speaker 1: it up. I shot him two to the head. End 301 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:39,360 Speaker 1: quote how would I know, but it sure sounds like 302 00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:41,400 Speaker 1: it might have been written by somebody other than the 303 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:43,200 Speaker 1: person who was saying it. Okay, and I'll let your 304 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:46,280 Speaker 1: imagination take it from there. Now, not only is this 305 00:16:46,360 --> 00:16:49,320 Speaker 1: statement not specific to the victim, Kevin Jones, but it 306 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:53,720 Speaker 1: also has a very important hallmark of false statements, which 307 00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:58,120 Speaker 1: is factually inaccurate information. As I mentioned earlier, Kevin Jones 308 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 1: was shot once according to the medical examiner a trial, 309 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:04,000 Speaker 1: not twice, and from what I understand, they used both 310 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:09,200 Speaker 1: the carrot and the stick to get this statement from Darren. Subsequently, 311 00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:12,280 Speaker 1: and this will surprise exactly no one in our audience, 312 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:16,320 Speaker 1: he received leniency for multiple drug charges and this quid 313 00:17:16,320 --> 00:17:18,400 Speaker 1: pro quot and the fact that it was hidden from 314 00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:21,640 Speaker 1: the defense is something that Troy litigated through pro say 315 00:17:21,720 --> 00:17:26,120 Speaker 1: postconviction motions but unfortunated no avail. But the point ends 316 00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:29,200 Speaker 1: up being moved here as Darren Keith Johnson has signed 317 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:33,760 Speaker 1: multiple affidavits starting in nineteen ninety eight to recant his testimony, 318 00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:36,840 Speaker 1: for which the prosecutor not only threatened him with perjury, 319 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,520 Speaker 1: but we find out later that Darren and his mother 320 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:44,320 Speaker 1: received ominous threats from the police to stick to the 321 00:17:44,320 --> 00:17:47,760 Speaker 1: original statement. However, back in nineteen ninety, with Arthur Sanders 322 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:51,680 Speaker 1: and Darren Johnson, they moved forward with your arrest Troy, 323 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:56,120 Speaker 1: and on to what ends up being really interesting preliminary hearing. 324 00:17:56,840 --> 00:18:00,639 Speaker 3: Yes it was. It was murder, robbery, conspiracy, possession of 325 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:04,000 Speaker 3: the instament of krun. The preliminary here was April twelfth, 326 00:18:04,080 --> 00:18:09,920 Speaker 3: nineteen ninety and at this preliminary here in Arthus Sanders rightfully, 327 00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:12,840 Speaker 3: I guess he slipped up because he said that we 328 00:18:12,840 --> 00:18:16,119 Speaker 3: were going to see Kareem, and this is throughout the 329 00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:18,280 Speaker 3: preliminary here, and that we were going to see Kareem 330 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:20,119 Speaker 3: Kareem and is Raymond Nobles. 331 00:18:20,359 --> 00:18:23,959 Speaker 5: My name was not mentioned, which is probably why Judge Merriweather, 332 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:27,200 Speaker 5: it was a decent judge, decided to dismiss the case 333 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:30,720 Speaker 5: because if you're going to see Kareem, that's not him. 334 00:18:31,119 --> 00:18:34,840 Speaker 1: Right, Sanders accidentally told the truth even though he had 335 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:38,239 Speaker 1: been pressured to lie. But they're not nearly done with 336 00:18:38,320 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: you yet. 337 00:18:39,160 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 3: So after Judge Maryweather dismissed the case, then it was 338 00:18:42,280 --> 00:18:44,960 Speaker 3: about a week or two and they rearrested me again 339 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:49,199 Speaker 3: with the same as that inflammation, and they switched to judges, 340 00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:51,159 Speaker 3: and they put it before another man I think they 341 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 3: was Judge Eigens, and he held it over for. 342 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:56,479 Speaker 1: Trial, and it may have ended it in not guilty 343 00:18:56,600 --> 00:18:59,520 Speaker 1: verdict if you hadn't been screwed over by Ed Geiger, 344 00:19:00,160 --> 00:19:04,200 Speaker 1: private investigator who your own family had hired. He was 345 00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:06,320 Speaker 1: supposed to go down to Atlantic City and gather your 346 00:19:06,320 --> 00:19:09,720 Speaker 1: alibi defense. But instead we now believe that he never 347 00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:12,760 Speaker 1: went to Atlantic City or spoke with Richard Crawford, your 348 00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:16,000 Speaker 1: alibi witness, Otherwise he would have found out what the 349 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:19,640 Speaker 1: state had already discovered, that you stayed at Bally's under 350 00:19:19,680 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 1: your own name. Geiger, on the other hand, came back 351 00:19:23,080 --> 00:19:26,560 Speaker 1: with no alibi evidence and told you that your alibi witness, 352 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:30,359 Speaker 1: Richard Crawford, wasn't willing to testify on your behalf. But 353 00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:34,000 Speaker 1: you don't fully get this picture until two thousand and 354 00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:37,360 Speaker 1: nine though, so at trial you just have your fuzzy, 355 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:41,280 Speaker 1: drunken memory of ac You thought that you had stayed 356 00:19:41,320 --> 00:19:44,679 Speaker 1: at the ridgemont In under the name Robert Irving. So 357 00:19:44,800 --> 00:19:48,120 Speaker 1: when the state presents Marlene Smith, a Bally's clerk who 358 00:19:48,200 --> 00:19:51,440 Speaker 1: testified to you staying at Bally's under your own name, 359 00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:55,119 Speaker 1: it actually hurt your credibility and put your rock solid 360 00:19:55,160 --> 00:20:00,800 Speaker 1: alibi on shaky ground. Then the state presents the least chemist, 361 00:20:00,920 --> 00:20:05,440 Speaker 1: Lewis Joca, who testified that the betting electrical cord and 362 00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 1: insulation that Jones was wrapped in matched items from the apartment, 363 00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:13,040 Speaker 1: which just established the setting of the crime, but doesn't 364 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:17,000 Speaker 1: necessarily implicate you, Troy. So what was presented at trial 365 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:20,520 Speaker 1: that convinced the jury that they should find you guilty 366 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:23,840 Speaker 1: of second degree murder, which, of course they ended up 367 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:25,240 Speaker 1: doing well. 368 00:20:25,400 --> 00:20:27,680 Speaker 3: I believe that it was the testimony of Derek and 369 00:20:27,800 --> 00:20:30,880 Speaker 3: Junge and coupled with the testimony of Office Sanders. However, 370 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:34,199 Speaker 3: one of the things that were said in closing was 371 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:37,560 Speaker 3: that testimony page seven to fifty one by the prosecutor. 372 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:41,160 Speaker 3: He said, is in fact Troy was in Atlantic City, 373 00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:43,600 Speaker 3: and you believe that he was still involved or he 374 00:20:43,680 --> 00:20:45,600 Speaker 3: put these guys up to it, and this is this 375 00:20:45,680 --> 00:20:47,720 Speaker 3: is something that was said to the jury. You could 376 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:51,359 Speaker 3: find them guilty of conspiracy and you know, second degree murder. 377 00:20:51,440 --> 00:20:54,440 Speaker 3: So so forth, and then undefeld the murder is actually 378 00:20:54,640 --> 00:20:58,520 Speaker 3: saying that as a result of that robbery, a death occurred. 379 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:01,480 Speaker 3: We don't believe that he had the take to kill right, 380 00:21:01,640 --> 00:21:03,200 Speaker 3: and that's what secondly we murdered. 381 00:21:03,040 --> 00:21:08,080 Speaker 4: Is here, Well, there's certain enumerated felonies, one of which 382 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:11,200 Speaker 4: is robbery, and if you during a robbery, if a 383 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:16,760 Speaker 4: murder occurs, that becomes felony murder, which is unfortunately in Pennsylvania. 384 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:20,040 Speaker 4: Even if you're convicted of second degree murder, it's life. 385 00:21:20,200 --> 00:21:23,600 Speaker 1: Troy, can you describe for us that awful and probably, 386 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:25,400 Speaker 1: I mean, I'm guessing must have been the worst moment 387 00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:28,199 Speaker 1: of your life when the jury came back in. 388 00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:31,000 Speaker 3: I found you guilty, he said guilty. It was like 389 00:21:32,359 --> 00:21:33,560 Speaker 3: I was just like shocked. 390 00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:33,879 Speaker 1: I was. 391 00:21:34,800 --> 00:21:36,879 Speaker 3: It was so shocking to me that the first couple 392 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:40,560 Speaker 3: of years they believe Wait only you know, we lost 393 00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:42,720 Speaker 3: a lot of family. My mother died, my grandmother and 394 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:49,480 Speaker 3: my grandmother died. Ah Domino offend the pain and what happened. 395 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:52,800 Speaker 3: But I just couldn't believe in believing year we are 396 00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:53,840 Speaker 3: hearing were years later. 397 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:10,480 Speaker 1: This episode is underwritten by Paul Weiss Rifkin, Porton and Garrison, 398 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:14,160 Speaker 1: a leading international law firm. Paul Weiss has long had 399 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:18,480 Speaker 1: an unwavering commitment to providing impactful pro bono legal assistance 400 00:22:18,520 --> 00:22:21,040 Speaker 1: to the most vulnerable members of our society and in 401 00:22:21,080 --> 00:22:24,879 Speaker 1: support of the public interest, including extensive work in the 402 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:26,040 Speaker 1: criminal justice area. 403 00:22:34,560 --> 00:22:37,679 Speaker 3: First all prise to our creative getting me through this 404 00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:42,120 Speaker 3: in constan having that hope that you know it will 405 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 3: come to it. However, it was a time and actually 406 00:22:44,960 --> 00:22:48,680 Speaker 3: be honest with you. Its just recently when they said 407 00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:50,960 Speaker 3: I was negatived by I know, I was posting, I 408 00:22:51,000 --> 00:22:55,000 Speaker 3: was an infirmity with COVID and I was oh, I 409 00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:57,439 Speaker 3: was deadly sick. I never had a film pane like 410 00:22:57,800 --> 00:23:00,800 Speaker 3: at that time. And this is once ago. I pray, 411 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:04,640 Speaker 3: ask the Lord, I say that this is I re go. Now, 412 00:23:05,480 --> 00:23:07,640 Speaker 3: don't even gorge no more than you see you feel. 413 00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:10,359 Speaker 3: I wouldn't feel suicidal. But I was like, I was 414 00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:13,120 Speaker 3: okay with I was okay with Nan. I just praise 415 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:14,920 Speaker 3: that this is a time and I'm not going to 416 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:18,359 Speaker 3: I'm not going to go home. I'm reve and that 417 00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:24,640 Speaker 3: was my praio. Subsequently, you'll all the same. It's going 418 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:30,760 Speaker 3: a little hope for me, But yeah. 419 00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:31,720 Speaker 1: You know, you're inspiring other people not to give up hope. 420 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:34,280 Speaker 1: So I'm glad you're here to talk about this, and 421 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:38,000 Speaker 1: I'm glad you're fighting. And I think now in Pennsylvania 422 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:40,679 Speaker 1: there's you know, the progress and and then and that 423 00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:43,920 Speaker 1: should give hope, hopefully to you and many many other 424 00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:48,200 Speaker 1: people who need relief in the Pennsylvania criminal system. Talk 425 00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:51,879 Speaker 1: a little about the post conviction litigation, because this is 426 00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:54,760 Speaker 1: a crazy I mean, like a lot of these cases 427 00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:56,440 Speaker 1: are when they go on this long. I mean, it 428 00:23:56,520 --> 00:23:58,960 Speaker 1: should have been reversed. It should have been freed back 429 00:23:59,000 --> 00:24:00,160 Speaker 1: in ninety three. 430 00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 3: That conspiracy commission in nineteen ninety three has since been 431 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:06,760 Speaker 3: reversed by the Superior Court of Pensivey, that in it 432 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:09,639 Speaker 3: of itself was a reason to overturn this case and 433 00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 3: retry me or to let me let me go. However 434 00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:15,400 Speaker 3: that hasn't been the case, which is. 435 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:18,520 Speaker 1: Just insane to me. Without the conspiracy and being in 436 00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:21,520 Speaker 1: Atlantic City, how are you involved in the murder in 437 00:24:21,680 --> 00:24:25,600 Speaker 1: any degree? Well, they continue to square that circle with 438 00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:29,000 Speaker 1: the two bogus witnesses, Arthur Sanders saying you were in 439 00:24:29,000 --> 00:24:31,480 Speaker 1: the car and Darren Johnson saying that you confess to 440 00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:35,239 Speaker 1: having to quote lay somebody down over some drugs. So 441 00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:38,399 Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety eight, Darren Johnson wanted to come clean 442 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:41,280 Speaker 1: and finally recanted, and he did so. In an affidavit, 443 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:44,080 Speaker 1: But as we find out later, he and his mother 444 00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:48,480 Speaker 1: were threatened repeatedly by the police and the prosecutor openly 445 00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:51,560 Speaker 1: threatened him with perjury. So when he came to court 446 00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:55,240 Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety eight to affirm his recantation, he pleaded 447 00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:58,560 Speaker 1: the fifth. Obviously, he would not have needed to plead 448 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:00,879 Speaker 1: the fifth if he was just going to repeat his 449 00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:05,520 Speaker 1: bogus testimony. So Troy does most of his post conviction 450 00:25:05,640 --> 00:25:09,040 Speaker 1: litigation pro say meaning by himself from his president, acting 451 00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:12,399 Speaker 1: as his own lawyer, trying to undermine Darren Johnson's trial 452 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:16,560 Speaker 1: testimony by proving that he had been incentivized by a 453 00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:19,560 Speaker 1: deal for leniency in his own drug charges, and that 454 00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:23,200 Speaker 1: the defense had never been notified about any such deals. 455 00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:26,800 Speaker 3: When Darren he was asked by the prosecutor, David Desiderio, 456 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,760 Speaker 3: do you have any open cases at this time? Darren 457 00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:33,240 Speaker 3: Keith Johnson said yes, one five years pulbation. That's a 458 00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:38,480 Speaker 3: direct quote notes of testimony basedly thirty seven. However, unbeknownst 459 00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:41,879 Speaker 3: to us, that was a lie made all his criminal history, 460 00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,159 Speaker 3: where he never spent all five years pul viation. The 461 00:25:44,280 --> 00:25:47,120 Speaker 3: jury is listening to this, did jury say oh, okay, 462 00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 3: he has five years folcation. Okay, so he don't have 463 00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:52,560 Speaker 3: any incentive to testify falsely against this guy because he's 464 00:25:52,600 --> 00:25:56,080 Speaker 3: already been sentenced. Again, unberknownst to us that was a lie. 465 00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:59,000 Speaker 3: Darren actually had open case at that time, which was 466 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:01,760 Speaker 3: resolved sixty on these after I got convicted. 467 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:05,400 Speaker 1: But unfortunately, so far post conviction litigation on this matter 468 00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 1: has been totally ignored. The court sided with the DA 469 00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:12,399 Speaker 1: finding him more credible than Darren Johnson. However, that's not 470 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:15,080 Speaker 1: the last we're going to hear from Darren Johnson. But 471 00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:18,359 Speaker 1: first two thousand and nine, you find out what I 472 00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:21,639 Speaker 1: had mentioned earlier, that your investigator at the time of 473 00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:24,280 Speaker 1: trial lied to you about not being able to find 474 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:28,920 Speaker 1: any alibi evidence in ac and your alibi witness, Richard Crawford, 475 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:33,399 Speaker 1: being unwilling to testify. But you hired another private investigator 476 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:36,159 Speaker 1: later on, Walter P. Lee, And in two thousand and 477 00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:38,760 Speaker 1: nine he finally caught up with Richard Crawford. 478 00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,920 Speaker 3: Well, my private investigator, Walter Lee went to school interview. 479 00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:44,480 Speaker 3: Rich Crawbey said that's something that he never said to 480 00:26:44,640 --> 00:26:46,879 Speaker 3: Edgeier said, no, one never came to see me and 481 00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 3: told me nothing about I was whitting in Atlantic City, 482 00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 3: and I would have said that I was whitting in 483 00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:53,720 Speaker 3: Atlantic City, and we had his statement nail, but he 484 00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:56,639 Speaker 3: said that never happened, So that d of himself was probably. 485 00:26:56,359 --> 00:26:56,800 Speaker 4: Not for me. 486 00:26:56,960 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 3: With Daniell Richards will sistified, and this is something saw 487 00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:04,720 Speaker 3: some significant mid Crawford called from the hotel. He called 488 00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:09,000 Speaker 3: home to his wife shrill. The prosecutor had the phone 489 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:12,159 Speaker 3: numbers and those phone calls, and a couple of the 490 00:27:12,160 --> 00:27:15,760 Speaker 3: phone calls was to Richard Crawford's address on McNay Street 491 00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:18,040 Speaker 3: in Philadelphia. They never turned this stuffore. 492 00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:23,160 Speaker 1: So now the evidence is mounting and Darren Johnson recants 493 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:26,720 Speaker 1: and they don't want to hear it. Your investigator, Walter Lee, 494 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:29,879 Speaker 1: unearthed your alibi witness, shedding even more light on the 495 00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:33,879 Speaker 1: state's misdeeds in this case, hiding that exculpatory evidence and 496 00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:37,080 Speaker 1: ambushing you with it to undermine the truth, which was 497 00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:39,320 Speaker 1: what they had already known, which is that you were 498 00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:44,080 Speaker 1: in Atlantic City, not Philadelphia. However, if that alibi evidence 499 00:27:44,119 --> 00:27:46,280 Speaker 1: wasn't enough for them to stop pursuing you in nineteen 500 00:27:46,359 --> 00:27:48,760 Speaker 1: ninety why would it stop them in nineteen ninety eight 501 00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:52,160 Speaker 1: or two thousand and nine or ever, so another ten 502 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:56,480 Speaker 1: years go past, and Byron Johnson, who everyone was rightfully 503 00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:59,400 Speaker 1: scared of and wouldn't think of snitching on in two 504 00:27:59,440 --> 00:28:02,520 Speaker 1: thousand and nine. Eineteen, had suffered a non fatal gunshot, 505 00:28:02,520 --> 00:28:05,160 Speaker 1: would it. I guess he didn't want to die without 506 00:28:05,240 --> 00:28:08,639 Speaker 1: having told the truth, so he finally came forward. But 507 00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:12,200 Speaker 1: oddly enough he was shot and killed the following year 508 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:13,800 Speaker 1: on Juneteenth, twenty twenty. 509 00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:17,040 Speaker 3: The person who was actually in the car and the 510 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:20,480 Speaker 3: passengers even the car, Bynan Johnson, has confessed to this. 511 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:23,960 Speaker 3: In twenty nineteen, he did come and he confessed to 512 00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:27,520 Speaker 3: the Crown of disposure of the body, helping Kareem and 513 00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:29,840 Speaker 3: everything else, that he was always a prompt respect who 514 00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:30,640 Speaker 3: was never arrested. 515 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:34,119 Speaker 4: And there was a fellow named Herb Hartisan who was 516 00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:38,000 Speaker 4: with Byron Johnson who had just been shot, and he 517 00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:41,560 Speaker 4: got in touch with the spell of Artisan and he said, 518 00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:43,920 Speaker 4: get me to somebody, because I want to be able 519 00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:48,160 Speaker 4: to tell the truth about this before I die. And 520 00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:50,640 Speaker 4: he knew that the end was near for him and 521 00:28:50,680 --> 00:28:52,640 Speaker 4: he wanted to do the right thing here, and he 522 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:55,760 Speaker 4: came and he gave a statement. Hartisan I interviewed him, 523 00:28:55,800 --> 00:28:58,520 Speaker 4: took a statement from him. Walter Lee took the statement 524 00:28:58,600 --> 00:29:02,200 Speaker 4: from Byron Johnson. Byron came in. He said that Kareem 525 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:06,640 Speaker 4: Nobles called him. He said something about moving some furniture 526 00:29:06,800 --> 00:29:10,040 Speaker 4: or something like that, and he went over and he 527 00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:12,320 Speaker 4: saw the dead body and Kareem said, look, you. 528 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:13,360 Speaker 2: Help me get rid of his body. 529 00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:17,560 Speaker 4: I'll give you five thousand dollars. And Byron goes, okay, 530 00:29:17,800 --> 00:29:19,760 Speaker 4: I mean that's easy money. What he's going to do 531 00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:21,960 Speaker 4: is put the body in a car and drive away 532 00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,920 Speaker 4: and leave the car out in Abington at the John 533 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 4: Wannamaker store, which they did. 534 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:30,000 Speaker 3: Byron Johnson was actually a prompt suspect in this case 535 00:29:30,000 --> 00:29:33,840 Speaker 3: and actually Baron K. Johnson. As he was interviewed by 536 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:36,440 Speaker 3: Room and others, he made it clear that the reason 537 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:39,480 Speaker 3: why they got Barren took five against me is because 538 00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:42,360 Speaker 3: when I was in California, they believed that I want 539 00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:44,959 Speaker 3: to come back. Until everything they had been watched, I 540 00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:48,800 Speaker 3: didn't know enough to till and he said that Byron, 541 00:29:49,080 --> 00:29:49,920 Speaker 3: you know, put him up. 542 00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:54,320 Speaker 4: Bryron Johnson was a very very violent guy, as Darren 543 00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:56,280 Speaker 4: said in his things. He was good with his fist, 544 00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:58,680 Speaker 4: with knives and with guns. And he was scared to 545 00:29:58,800 --> 00:30:02,120 Speaker 4: death of byron reaction if he were to rat him out. 546 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:06,240 Speaker 4: So I think that he was finally comfortable enough to 547 00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:10,040 Speaker 4: come forward, which is newly discovered evidence he was unwilling 548 00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:13,400 Speaker 4: to state until after Byron died, and he said the 549 00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:18,840 Speaker 4: same thing that Byron said in his statement, which was 550 00:30:18,920 --> 00:30:21,960 Speaker 4: that Nobles called him got him to help him move 551 00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:27,440 Speaker 4: the body. Byron and Darren Johnson essentially corroborate each other 552 00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 4: as to what happened to her, and so did the 553 00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,520 Speaker 4: police because the police believed that Kareem Nobles was. 554 00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:36,800 Speaker 1: Involved, So the two men in the Gray Diedes that 555 00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:42,920 Speaker 1: Sanders allegedly saw were Kareem Nobles and Byron Johnson. Byron's 556 00:30:42,960 --> 00:30:49,040 Speaker 1: confession and Darren's recantation impeached Sanders's shaky id. The cops 557 00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:52,400 Speaker 1: new Kareem was involved, and perhaps the Joneses did too, 558 00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:55,000 Speaker 1: since he wound up dead before the police had a 559 00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:58,960 Speaker 1: chance to nab him. This murder happened in Troy's apartment 560 00:30:59,040 --> 00:31:02,560 Speaker 1: while he was party in ac Other than letting his 561 00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:05,120 Speaker 1: friends use his apartment while he was out of town, 562 00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 1: there was literally nothing else that connected Troy to this crime. 563 00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:13,760 Speaker 4: Troy, you know there's no evidence that he was ever 564 00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:16,480 Speaker 4: involved in any violent crimes. The one time he got 565 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:20,520 Speaker 4: arrested afterwards, when he was stopped, what did they find 566 00:31:20,560 --> 00:31:24,320 Speaker 4: on marijuana? No guns, no nothing. You could be sure 567 00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:27,640 Speaker 4: that he was stopped because he was driving while black 568 00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:32,080 Speaker 4: in Philadelphia, so they would have searched the hell out 569 00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:33,880 Speaker 4: of that car and that's what they found. 570 00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,120 Speaker 1: And I want to just read a quick quote here 571 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,760 Speaker 1: from Darren Johnson, because it's one thing for us to 572 00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,040 Speaker 1: talk about this one said this and the other one 573 00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:44,360 Speaker 1: said that. But this is from an affid David on 574 00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:47,560 Speaker 1: September third, twenty twenty that he courageously signed, and he 575 00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:50,920 Speaker 1: said quote. Before the trial, the police kept trying to 576 00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:52,640 Speaker 1: get me to come to court, and I really didn't 577 00:31:52,640 --> 00:31:55,760 Speaker 1: want to. I knew my testimony was a lie. They 578 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:58,040 Speaker 1: and the prosecutor just told me to follow the script. 579 00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:00,280 Speaker 1: They even went to my mother's house and harassed her 580 00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:02,240 Speaker 1: and threatened her and told her to tell me to 581 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:05,440 Speaker 1: come back to court or something would happen to both 582 00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:08,320 Speaker 1: of us. That's why in nineteen ninety eight, nineteen ninety nine, 583 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:10,480 Speaker 1: I tried to testify, but again was threatened and I 584 00:32:10,600 --> 00:32:12,400 Speaker 1: chickened out because I was told that I would go 585 00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:15,480 Speaker 1: to jail for several years for perjury. I was still 586 00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 1: frightened because I was small. The public defender they gave 587 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:20,400 Speaker 1: to me that day told me to plead the fifth 588 00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:22,560 Speaker 1: and I did. Not only was I small, but I 589 00:32:22,640 --> 00:32:24,760 Speaker 1: only had an eighth grade education. Was a whole lot 590 00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:27,640 Speaker 1: less smart than I am now. I regret then not 591 00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:30,840 Speaker 1: having the courage to go through with telling the truth. 592 00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:34,880 Speaker 1: He goes on to say, still quoting someone might say 593 00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:36,680 Speaker 1: that I'm angry with the police and the district attorney 594 00:32:36,680 --> 00:32:38,560 Speaker 1: because they promised me that I probably wouldn't go to 595 00:32:38,640 --> 00:32:40,840 Speaker 1: jail and then I did. That is not the truth. 596 00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:43,320 Speaker 1: I keep coming back, and I'm willing to testify because 597 00:32:43,360 --> 00:32:45,560 Speaker 1: I know this is the truth, and this lie I 598 00:32:45,680 --> 00:32:49,720 Speaker 1: told that Troy's trial has been bothering me for three decades, 599 00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:53,120 Speaker 1: no matter what anyone threatens me with. Now, I'm not 600 00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:54,840 Speaker 1: going to cave in. I should have done this years 601 00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:56,680 Speaker 1: ago and told the truth about Byron, but I was 602 00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:58,800 Speaker 1: afraid he would kill me or have me killed. I 603 00:32:58,840 --> 00:33:01,280 Speaker 1: would like the opportunity for the court to see me 604 00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:04,320 Speaker 1: in person and know it is in my heart that 605 00:33:04,360 --> 00:33:15,600 Speaker 1: Troy Coleman is not guilty. End quote. 606 00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:24,640 Speaker 6: Other than the testimony of these two people, there's not 607 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:31,640 Speaker 6: one shread of physical evidence that ties Troy Coleman to 608 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:32,280 Speaker 6: this crime. 609 00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:35,480 Speaker 1: Nothing. And to hear the words I just read from 610 00:33:35,520 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 1: Darren Johnson and add that to Byron Johnson's confession where 611 00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:41,640 Speaker 1: he admits to being the passengor of the car. Does 612 00:33:42,040 --> 00:33:46,600 Speaker 1: Arthur Sanders' shaky id even matter anymore? I mean, the 613 00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:50,160 Speaker 1: guy who would actually be in the gray Dodge told 614 00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:54,200 Speaker 1: us it does not. But if that, somehow is still 615 00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 1: not enough for you, consider some of the things that 616 00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:00,520 Speaker 1: are known about Arthur Sanders. He began with not knowing 617 00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:03,800 Speaker 1: Troy Coleman at all, then switched to he knew him 618 00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:07,760 Speaker 1: from around the neighborhood. More importantly, he had Kevin Jones's 619 00:34:07,800 --> 00:34:11,600 Speaker 1: pager and keys in his possession when Kevin went missing. 620 00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:14,760 Speaker 1: To be in possession of a missing, dead guy's things, 621 00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:17,760 Speaker 1: you're gonna want to place blame on someone else quickly. 622 00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:21,680 Speaker 1: So let's say Sanders actually did see these two guys 623 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:24,799 Speaker 1: in the passing grade Dodge. I've been saying allegedly this 624 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:28,120 Speaker 1: entire time, as you might have noticed, But let's just 625 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:30,399 Speaker 1: suppose for a second that it actually happened. That way, 626 00:34:30,680 --> 00:34:34,000 Speaker 1: Troy and Byron do resemble one another. Now, let me 627 00:34:34,040 --> 00:34:36,440 Speaker 1: be clear, I'm not just some random white dude giving 628 00:34:36,680 --> 00:34:40,920 Speaker 1: cross racial misidentification. Troy can back me up here, Troy, 629 00:34:40,960 --> 00:34:41,920 Speaker 1: that tracks right. 630 00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:43,319 Speaker 3: Yeah, I will see that. 631 00:34:43,520 --> 00:34:47,920 Speaker 1: Barie Johnson, now you too, don't look exactly like but 632 00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:51,080 Speaker 1: enough to say they look like one another. And that's 633 00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:55,040 Speaker 1: while you're staring right let alone. While if one were 634 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,000 Speaker 1: to see a guy in a passing car behind glass 635 00:34:58,239 --> 00:35:01,320 Speaker 1: at twenty miles an hour for less than three seconds, 636 00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:04,560 Speaker 1: that's if we even accept that this passing Great Didge 637 00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:09,440 Speaker 1: identification actually happen. It's also entirely possible that this was 638 00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:13,480 Speaker 1: a fabrication to steer the investigation and the Jones is 639 00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:17,480 Speaker 1: away from Sanders and at least in the direction of 640 00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:22,160 Speaker 1: Kareem and Byron. So that said, Jerry, where does this 641 00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:24,440 Speaker 1: case stand now currently? 642 00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:27,799 Speaker 4: I have an emotion for discovery that's still open. I 643 00:35:27,800 --> 00:35:31,080 Speaker 4: think I filed a supplemental in April. It's still open. 644 00:35:31,120 --> 00:35:33,520 Speaker 4: The Commonwealth was going to respond to both of them, 645 00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:36,600 Speaker 4: and I think that's where we're at right now. 646 00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:40,560 Speaker 2: From my perspective, it, I mean, the system has to 647 00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:43,239 Speaker 2: play out itself. I think that they're so busy in 648 00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:46,719 Speaker 2: the CiU, which is a conviction integrity unit, that they 649 00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:51,880 Speaker 2: are just overwhelmed. They have thirteen fourteen hundred cases and 650 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:55,319 Speaker 2: they've got six or eight, maybe ten people working on them. 651 00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:56,560 Speaker 2: They're all homicides. 652 00:35:57,080 --> 00:35:59,520 Speaker 1: Well, we've been seeing some really great things out of 653 00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: the philadel your CiU. Patricia Cummings, Larry Krasner. We know 654 00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:05,759 Speaker 1: they're going to keep up the hard work. I mean, 655 00:36:06,320 --> 00:36:08,960 Speaker 1: just think if you had to research and re litigate 656 00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:12,239 Speaker 1: the last thirty to fifty years of corrupt cases at a 657 00:36:12,320 --> 00:36:16,440 Speaker 1: place like Billy Chicago, New Orleans. Trying to right those 658 00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:20,440 Speaker 1: wrongs is no easy tasks. So your hard work is 659 00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:24,560 Speaker 1: not going unappreciated here. Maybe us shining a light on 660 00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:26,480 Speaker 1: a case like Troy's will help bring it to the 661 00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:28,760 Speaker 1: top of their very formidable pile. 662 00:36:29,280 --> 00:36:29,719 Speaker 3: God will. 663 00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:33,799 Speaker 1: So after hearing all of this, Troy, I know I 664 00:36:33,880 --> 00:36:35,919 Speaker 1: want to do all that I can, and I'm sure 665 00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:39,080 Speaker 1: our audience feels the same way. Is there anything that 666 00:36:39,120 --> 00:36:39,640 Speaker 1: they can do? 667 00:36:40,200 --> 00:36:42,080 Speaker 3: If you want to know more about my case, go 668 00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:46,279 Speaker 3: to chroycolmiancase dot com. Everything from the confession to the 669 00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:49,840 Speaker 3: conspiracy reverbs to the we can't testimony of Marrikee Johnson 670 00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:52,760 Speaker 3: to his deal that he received to go to choicolmicase 671 00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:54,560 Speaker 3: dot com to see it for yourself. 672 00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:58,400 Speaker 1: Well, we'll definitely link your site in the episode bio. 673 00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:01,160 Speaker 1: And with that we now go to my favorite part 674 00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:03,520 Speaker 1: of the show, where I first of all, thank both 675 00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:06,320 Speaker 1: of you so much for joining me here and sharing 676 00:37:06,360 --> 00:37:09,520 Speaker 1: your story. And now I'm going to kick back in 677 00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:12,880 Speaker 1: my chair, turn off my microphone and just listen to 678 00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:15,880 Speaker 1: whatever else you'd like to say. No offense, Jerry, but 679 00:37:16,040 --> 00:37:18,800 Speaker 1: we'll be saving the best for last, our guest of honor, 680 00:37:19,120 --> 00:37:20,879 Speaker 1: which means you'll be leading off. 681 00:37:21,160 --> 00:37:24,560 Speaker 4: Well, thank you Jason for giving me this opportunity to 682 00:37:25,080 --> 00:37:29,320 Speaker 4: address Troy's case. Obviously, there is a lot of facts 683 00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:32,839 Speaker 4: and circumstances here that are extremely troubling. One of the 684 00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:39,400 Speaker 4: problems is back when Troy was arrested, Philadelphia was in 685 00:37:39,440 --> 00:37:43,600 Speaker 4: the midst of one of its worst homicide waves and 686 00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:48,960 Speaker 4: its history. Troy was also dealing with a secondary problem 687 00:37:49,120 --> 00:37:53,600 Speaker 4: in that he had a court appointed counsel. He was 688 00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:58,840 Speaker 4: also dealing with homicide police that wanted to clear cases 689 00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:01,839 Speaker 4: and do it in the convenient way because they were 690 00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:06,520 Speaker 4: being pressured to do so, and therefore they used some 691 00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:09,440 Speaker 4: of the cases, I've seen some shortcuts in order to 692 00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:12,920 Speaker 4: achieve that goal, and one of the shortcuts is that 693 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:17,400 Speaker 4: they would pressure witnesses, and in this case they had 694 00:38:17,680 --> 00:38:21,640 Speaker 4: two very good subjects that they could pressurize. 695 00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:25,600 Speaker 2: So these are the only two pieces of evidence that. 696 00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:29,040 Speaker 4: Were the backbone and the heart and soul of the 697 00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:32,960 Speaker 4: Commonwealth's case. Once they've been debunked, which I believe they 698 00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:36,400 Speaker 4: have been, and there's been new evidence that's come forward 699 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:40,080 Speaker 4: from Byron Johnson who said that Kareem Nobles told him 700 00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:43,239 Speaker 4: that he was the shooter and asked him to help 701 00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:46,759 Speaker 4: him dispose of the body. Johnson, unfortunately is dead, but 702 00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:50,160 Speaker 4: he's kind of taken the wraps off of Darren Johnson 703 00:38:50,360 --> 00:38:52,600 Speaker 4: because he was scared to death of this man who 704 00:38:52,640 --> 00:38:55,759 Speaker 4: was extremely violent and that's why he died a violent death. 705 00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:59,320 Speaker 4: But in any way, once these pieces have been debunked, 706 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:03,120 Speaker 4: it is pretty clear that Troy Coleman is not guilty. 707 00:39:03,600 --> 00:39:05,160 Speaker 1: All right, Troy, over to you. 708 00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:08,840 Speaker 3: I would like to thank everyone for a long to 709 00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:12,200 Speaker 3: have this opportunity, and at this time I would like 710 00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:14,640 Speaker 3: to say I'm to be narrow guying, I mean all 711 00:39:14,680 --> 00:39:17,840 Speaker 3: press due to our Lord. I don't think anything is 712 00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:20,000 Speaker 3: going to come to fruition in regards to this case 713 00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:23,600 Speaker 3: except by the will of our creative God, the Most High. 714 00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:28,440 Speaker 3: I would like to thank Jason and my attorney and 715 00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:31,840 Speaker 3: Connor and all that was involved in this, my family 716 00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:35,480 Speaker 3: who has been supported me through this and my message 717 00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:37,680 Speaker 3: or I like to have a takeaway even if you 718 00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:40,879 Speaker 3: know it's just not about me, but you know at 719 00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:43,640 Speaker 3: this time what got me through these years. And I 720 00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:46,319 Speaker 3: want to encourage a lot of the youth because we're 721 00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:49,800 Speaker 3: actually going through about with our youth today with killing 722 00:39:49,960 --> 00:39:53,279 Speaker 3: and crime and all that is. I want to push 723 00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:57,400 Speaker 3: education and vocational skills that's needed. I'm a founder and 724 00:39:57,520 --> 00:40:01,279 Speaker 3: facilitator of a group of titled Youth Mister Acronym and 725 00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:06,520 Speaker 3: Young Offenders Understanding their habitual Shackles, which is facilitated by myself, 726 00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:10,239 Speaker 3: Technic Boweman and Tracy Box, and we push forward to 727 00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:12,560 Speaker 3: try to help the youth put between agent and eighteen 728 00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:17,480 Speaker 3: and three this and or holding their education and vocational skills. 729 00:40:17,600 --> 00:40:20,600 Speaker 3: I would also like to lasts like Ceichester, which is 730 00:40:20,600 --> 00:40:23,600 Speaker 3: one of the most progressive jails right now for criminal 731 00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:27,359 Speaker 3: justice reform, and at this institution we have more guys 732 00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:29,640 Speaker 3: who went out on commutation, and I would like to 733 00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:32,080 Speaker 3: also move back that I need to file for commutation 734 00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:36,520 Speaker 3: under actual innocence. Perchance it's the falling, definitely, God willing, 735 00:40:36,600 --> 00:40:39,880 Speaker 3: they won't. But this jail has been good for and 736 00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:42,600 Speaker 3: they allow me to do this podcast, and I'm very 737 00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:45,520 Speaker 3: grateful for that. And I hope that other institutions can 738 00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:47,960 Speaker 3: mirror what's going on at our institution here. So I 739 00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:51,759 Speaker 3: would like to take Tastipintendent Islamis and Superintendent east Sign 740 00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:55,040 Speaker 3: and w Wall because these are smart progressives here that 741 00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:58,799 Speaker 3: you know, push for education and vocation and allowing you know, 742 00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:01,560 Speaker 3: college courses and stuff goals if it's not going to 743 00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:05,040 Speaker 3: double jobs. But I'm very grateful for everyone, and God 744 00:41:05,160 --> 00:41:09,320 Speaker 3: will not get me speak about this on the street 745 00:41:09,400 --> 00:41:12,160 Speaker 3: as opposed to you know, for the peditetary that will 746 00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:13,280 Speaker 3: in Icula. 747 00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:25,120 Speaker 1: Thank you for listening to Wrongful Conviction with Jason Flamm. 748 00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:28,680 Speaker 1: Please support your local innocence projects and go to the 749 00:41:28,719 --> 00:41:30,680 Speaker 1: link in our bio to see how you can help. 750 00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:34,719 Speaker 1: I'd like to thank our production team Connor Hall, Jeff Clyburn, 751 00:41:34,800 --> 00:41:38,080 Speaker 1: and Kevin Wardis. The music on the show as always 752 00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:41,680 Speaker 1: is by three time Oscar nominated composer Jay Ralph. Be 753 00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:44,960 Speaker 1: sure to follow us on Instagram at Wrongful Conviction and 754 00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:49,320 Speaker 1: on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction podcast. Wrongful Conviction with Jason 755 00:41:49,360 --> 00:41:51,800 Speaker 1: Flamm is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts and 756 00:41:51,880 --> 00:42:08,480 Speaker 1: association with Signal Company Number one