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Speaker 1: You always had the feeling that there's something strange about reality.

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Speaker 1: According to the Stuff to Blow Your Mind podcast, there is.

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Speaker 1: On the show, post Robert Lamb and Joe McCormick examine

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Speaker 1: neurological quandaries, cosmic mysteries, evolutionary marvels, and much more. Prosthetics

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Speaker 1: are true testaments to not only human craftsmanship and ingenuity,

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Speaker 1: but also to the plasticity of the human brain. Listen

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Speaker 1: to Stuff to Blow Your Mind on the I Heart

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Speaker 1: Radio app or wherever you get your podcast. Brought to

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Speaker 1: you by doc dot Go. Protect your privacy online for

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Speaker 1: free with dot dot Go. After thirty years, it's time

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Speaker 1: to return to the halls of West Beverly High and

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Speaker 1: hang out at the peach pit. On the podcast nine

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Speaker 1: O two one o MG, visit Jenny Garth and Tory

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Speaker 1: Spelling for a rewatch of the hit series Beverly Hills

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Speaker 1: nine O two one oh. From the very beginning, we

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Speaker 1: get to tell the fans all of the behind the

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Speaker 1: scenes stories to actually happen, so they know what happened

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Speaker 1: on camera obviously, but we can tell them all the

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Speaker 1: good stuff to happen off camera. Listen to nine O

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Speaker 1: two one O MG on the I Heart Radio app,

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Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcass. Make sure

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Speaker 1: to check out Drink Champs, your number one music podcast.

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Speaker 1: On the Black Effect podcast Network, host n O r

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Speaker 1: E and d J E f N sat down with

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Speaker 1: artists and icon Yea, which Vulture called one most significant interviews.

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Speaker 1: I literally had to go like Danos and I don't

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Speaker 1: want to have to be the villain. But when I

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Speaker 1: went and did the Donda thing, he returned and anybody

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Speaker 1: had to sit back and watch the real leader. Check

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Speaker 1: out Drink Champs conversation with Yea and many more legendary

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Speaker 1: artists each and every Friday on the I Heart Radio app,

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Speaker 1: Apple podcast or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to Behind the Police, a production of I Heart Radio.

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Speaker 1: The Corps are Problems, Problems. I'm Robert Evans. This is

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Speaker 1: Behind the Bastards, normally a podcast about the worst people

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Speaker 1: in all of history, and it still is. But this

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Speaker 1: is the last of our sit episode mini series Behind

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Speaker 1: the Police. Um. That introduction started out rough, but it

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Speaker 1: came together in the end um much like the Police,

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Speaker 1: except for well no not really, uh my guest uh.

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Speaker 1: With this episode, as with all of the others is

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Speaker 1: Jason Petty, better known as the hip hop artist propaganda. Jason,

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Speaker 1: how are you doing? What's up? I'm breathing thin air

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Speaker 1: because I'm on the road. But let's hope that this

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Speaker 1: isn't the end of the police story and it does

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Speaker 1: turn out okay. Yeah, yeah, I think that I think

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Speaker 1: they might pull it together in the last the last quarter. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Let's let's just hope the last quarter isn't the year

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Speaker 1: four thousand. Yeah. Yeah. Now, I haven't been checking the

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Speaker 1: news in months, so I I don't know, um how

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Speaker 1: how how the police are nowadays? I assume everybody's happy

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Speaker 1: with them, yeah, or they're sticking to brand Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: um boy, Jason. As as I finished this up, it

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Speaker 1: became incredibly clear to me how much I was going

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Speaker 1: to have to leave out of this of this series,

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Speaker 1: like not just the fact that we're not really talking

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Speaker 1: about federal law enforcement, the FBI, the d e A,

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Speaker 1: the A, t f UM, just because I wanted to

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Speaker 1: focus on like, you know, cops, like normal straight up

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Speaker 1: specifically cops. Yeah, in your neighborhood cops. Um. There's but

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Speaker 1: there's like so much like we're not going to talk

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Speaker 1: much about the civil rights movement, just because a lot

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Speaker 1: of what the police did then was just kind of

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Speaker 1: like the same tactics that we already talked about them

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Speaker 1: doing in previous periods. Um, We're not going to talk

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Speaker 1: a lot about like the LGBT movement and violence against them.

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Speaker 1: We're not going to talk about the Green movement and

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Speaker 1: the suppression of that, um, just because I already wrote

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Speaker 1: sixteen pages for today. Yeah, so we're gonna we're gonna

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Speaker 1: talk about what I think is the right last subject

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Speaker 1: to end on a series that is inevitably not going

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Speaker 1: to cover everything that it would have been good to cover. Um,

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Speaker 1: And that is the military's nation of American Police. UM. Yes,

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Speaker 1: So that's where we're where we're going to today, and

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Speaker 1: it's important. It's important to note I'm gonna throw this

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Speaker 1: in there that like all the pieces that he's talking about, like, remember,

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Speaker 1: those are like lived experiences, So it's appiled on history

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Speaker 1: that emotionally and psychologically all of us who have lived

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Speaker 1: through it, like, no, it's there, But good god, if

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Speaker 1: there's no way to actually cover all of it in

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Speaker 1: a podcast, you know what I'm saying. No, I mean,

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Speaker 1: if we'd had another dozen episodes. Yeah, we wouldn't have

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Speaker 1: had to leave out much like we would have had

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Speaker 1: to leave out a lot, but we would have been

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Speaker 1: able to give broad coverage of all of the things.

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Speaker 1: But like, yeah, there's just this isn't going to be

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Speaker 1: you know, we had to had to stop somewhere. So militarization,

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Speaker 1: I think does kind of make sense, um to to

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Speaker 1: focus on in our last episode because it's kind of

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Speaker 1: the biggest aspect of where we are right now, UM,

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Speaker 1: in terms of like why the why the ship that's

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Speaker 1: happening right now is happening, Like a lot of it

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Speaker 1: has to do with militarization, and obviously the foundational issues

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Speaker 1: of racism that we're behind policing contributed to. Um. So

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Speaker 1: we're gonna talk about all that, um. But to start

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Speaker 1: us off today, we are going to get into one

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Speaker 1: of the aspects of the U s law enforcement that

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Speaker 1: we have thus far failed to cover it enough to

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Speaker 1: tail US policing and indigenous people's um. Yeah, yeah, because

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Speaker 1: this is really where we get to the very start

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Speaker 1: of militarized police in the United States. When people talk

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Speaker 1: about use that term today, militarized police, they're generally referring

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Speaker 1: to equipment, right, the transition of cops from the friendly

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Speaker 1: Andy Griffith style lawman who wore like maybe a gun

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Speaker 1: on his hip and a pair of handcuffs to like

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Speaker 1: the guys wearing heavy body armor in a tool belt

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Speaker 1: with like five different weapons on it. Um, you know,

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Speaker 1: police tanks and grenade launchers and a R fifteens. And

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Speaker 1: when people talk about that stuff, they kind of see

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Speaker 1: militarization as a new and worrying trend because the cops

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Speaker 1: they grew up with didn't look like that. Um. And

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Speaker 1: that's a part of police militarization. Um. And it is

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Speaker 1: a new part of police military. Well, it's not even

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Speaker 1: really a new part of it. It's worrying, but it's

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Speaker 1: not new. UM. So it's the most visually like, yeah, identifiable.

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Speaker 1: You know, somebody can get their brain around that. Like

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Speaker 1: we say there's a problem with militarization. You could go, yeah,

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Speaker 1: logically speaking, I am not an enemy insurgent, so I

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Speaker 1: don't understand what grenade launcher for. Yeah I didn't an Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: you didn't used to on a daily basis. See dudes

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Speaker 1: in like the middle of Los Angeles who looked like

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Speaker 1: they could have walked out of downtown, right and now

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Speaker 1: you do um b yeah, yeah, why hamo, Like, how

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Speaker 1: is it? What do you expect to happen in the Yeah?

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Speaker 1: The fucking I was at a cop right the other

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Speaker 1: day where like there were like a bunch of rapid

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Speaker 1: response guys and fucking uh and fucking like rural camo

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Speaker 1: and it was like, what are you. We're in the

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Speaker 1: middle of that in front of the Portland's Justice Center.

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Speaker 1: What do you think is going to happen? You're gonna

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Speaker 1: bland in. You need to be wearing some like cut

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Speaker 1: off dickies, wearing some sort of coffee stain on your shirt,

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Speaker 1: got some really tight jeans and a flannel shirt if

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Speaker 1: you want a camouflage into Portland, Like what do you

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Speaker 1: what do you fucking play? That wouldn't even camouflage you

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Speaker 1: in the goddamn woods? Thank you so? Um yeah. In

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Speaker 1: episode two of this mini series, we talked about how

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Speaker 1: the Philadelphia State Police were formed in direct imitation of

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Speaker 1: the Philippine Constabulary, a colonial police force the u S

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Speaker 1: form to suppress the natives of a conquered land, and

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Speaker 1: such colonial police forces were really common among like imperial

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Speaker 1: powers during the period of colonialism, or at least the

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Speaker 1: period where colonialism was kind of openly embraced by everyone. Um,

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Speaker 1: So all of the big European nations did this ship

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Speaker 1: and you know, the US did as well. The most

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Speaker 1: influential example of such a force in American history though,

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Speaker 1: because like you know, the British had a whole bunch

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Speaker 1: of different ones, they're probably the best at it. So

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Speaker 1: did the French, so did the Germans, um, and so

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Speaker 1: did the United States. But since we didn't have the

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Speaker 1: as as extensive and overseas empire as as those European

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Speaker 1: nations did, a lot of our colonial policing forces were

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Speaker 1: actually like deployed right here at home, you know, kind

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Speaker 1: of in frontier areas that weren't states yet. And the

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Speaker 1: most influential example of such a force in American history

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Speaker 1: is probably the Texas Rangers, who were formed officially in

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Speaker 1: eighteen thirty five. So we're talking about the Rangers today, baby,

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Speaker 1: not that not the not the sports team. They're broadly

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Speaker 1: George Bushy's team. Yeah, they're whatever we're talking about talking about.

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Speaker 1: The sport are the Rangers? Robert their baseball right, Oh

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Speaker 1: my god, I'm so proud Texas. I was like no, no, no, no,

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Speaker 1: no no no no no no, it's Texas. So he

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Speaker 1: knows that answer. Yes. Yeah. So I to tease my

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Speaker 1: Texas homeboys to be like, I know y'all go to

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Speaker 1: to Alamo every year, and I was like, at my

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Speaker 1: DJ I traveled with it from Texas. I was like, hey,

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Speaker 1: you know y'all lost the Alimo, right. He was like,

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Speaker 1: I didn't realize it until college because then every year

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Speaker 1: like y'all lost. Anyway, go on, So the Range speaking

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Speaker 1: of the Alamo and such, The Rangers started out kind

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Speaker 1: of in the period where Texas was doing its own

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Speaker 1: thing uh and not yet part of the United States,

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Speaker 1: and they were initially kind of just a small, irregular

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Speaker 1: band of hired tufts whose job was to protect newly

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Speaker 1: settled white families out on the frontier. UH. This put

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Speaker 1: them in constant conflict with local native tribes, the Cherokee

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Speaker 1: and the Comanche primarily, and it also pit them against

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Speaker 1: the Mexican population in the area. The Texas Rangers quickly

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Speaker 1: evolved into one of the most formidable forces for protecting

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Speaker 1: whiteness on the American frontier. When non white people were

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Speaker 1: accused of robbing or attacking white settlers. The Rangers acted

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Speaker 1: as designated vigilantes to see that justice was done. And

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Speaker 1: because we're talking about Texas in the period we're talking about,

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Speaker 1: we're actually talking about like what is today Texas, Oklahoma,

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Speaker 1: parts of New Mexico and even some Colorado. I think, um,

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Speaker 1: like it's that whole region. And and a lot of

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Speaker 1: this is like Comanche who were like this is there

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Speaker 1: where they've been living for a while, um, and the

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Speaker 1: the colode they started having conflicts with settlers, and settlers

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Speaker 1: would murder them. They would murder settlers, and the Texas

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Speaker 1: Rangers would be they act a lot as like scouts

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Speaker 1: and stuff, for like hunting down these bands and leading

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Speaker 1: militias to them and stuff. And that's kind of like

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Speaker 1: they're kind of like special forces in this period. And

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Speaker 1: I just can't just throwing it in, like I just

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Speaker 1: think like the the social interaction, just the humanity of

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Speaker 1: the moment. Of course, it's tints, of course, it's like, uh,

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Speaker 1: there's a lot of like bigger forces of like colonialism

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Speaker 1: and frontiers and all these things happening, but just the

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Speaker 1: human interaction of saying you're just waking up, gonna make

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Speaker 1: a cup of coffee, step out of your house and

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Speaker 1: someone's building a house in your lawn. Yeah, they looked

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Speaker 1: at you like you crazy. It's just like yeah, what

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Speaker 1: what like what do you? What are you doing? Man?

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Speaker 1: Do you well? And it's one of those I don't

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Speaker 1: want to I'm talking about my ass a little bit

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Speaker 1: now because it's been a long time since I read.

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Speaker 1: I've read like one good book about what happened to

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Speaker 1: like the conflict between the Comanches and the the the

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Speaker 1: white settlers in this period. But if I'm not mistaken,

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Speaker 1: like they were living somewhere else and yeah, we kicked

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Speaker 1: them out of it. Uh. And so they wound up

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Speaker 1: kind of in you know, the the broad Texas region,

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Speaker 1: and then we were like okay, but not here either,

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Speaker 1: like it was it was yeah, yeah, yeah, it's very

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Speaker 1: frustrating history. So white settlers quickly learned how to use

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Speaker 1: the Texas Rangers is like a mercenary force um, and

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Speaker 1: not just against and well not just against like indigenous peoples.

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Speaker 1: It became very common for white men to raid cattle

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Speaker 1: from Mexican ranches, uh, and then the Mexican would steal

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Speaker 1: their cattle back, and so the white folks would call

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Speaker 1: in the Texas Rangers to retrieve their stolen property um.

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Speaker 1: And you know, the Texas Rangers would murder people during

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Speaker 1: these raids to retrieve property like cattle they had owned

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Speaker 1: and had been stolen from them and that they'd taken

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Speaker 1: back as a rule in sort of the Texas Republic

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Speaker 1: period and the early period of statehood, when non whites

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Speaker 1: resisted the Rangers in any way, they could be killed, arrested,

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Speaker 1: or tortured. So the Texas Rangers go from being kind

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Speaker 1: of this like quasi military scouting force, like a counterinsurgency

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Speaker 1: um force, to like acting as kind of a law

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Speaker 1: force for for defending whiteness on the frontier um. And

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Speaker 1: over the course of several decades, the Texas Rangers acted

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Speaker 1: as the tip of a spear that gradually drove most

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Speaker 1: indigenous people's out of Texas, often very violently. For much

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Speaker 1: of the eighteen hundreds, the Rangers were yeah again, like

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Speaker 1: counterinsurgency was kind of their their bag, and they worked

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Speaker 1: with the militia or the military as basically special forces.

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Speaker 1: The Comanche Wars were a brutal series of conflicts that

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Speaker 1: crossed the line and to outright ethnic cleansing on a

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Speaker 1: number of occasions, and the Texas Rangers were very heavily involved.

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Speaker 1: One of these ethnic cleansing moments would be the Red

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Speaker 1: Fork Massacre of eighteen forty, when a team of Texas

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Speaker 1: Volunteer Rangers surrounded a Commanche village whose men were all outrating.

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Speaker 1: Rather than attempt to arrest the women, children, and elderly inside,

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Speaker 1: the rangers surrounded the camp and opened fire. When their

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Speaker 1: rifles ran out of ammunition, they closed in with pistols

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Speaker 1: to execute the survivors. Some hundred and forty Commanches were

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Speaker 1: gunned down, and probably another hundred and forty at least

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Speaker 1: died later from exposure. Their horses were stolen to pay

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Speaker 1: the rangers. Now, this was an act of genocide, UM.

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Speaker 1: It was also pretty much a fundamentally military endeavor. UM.

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Speaker 1: But as the and that's that's generally when you're we're

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Speaker 1: talking about like the the kind of cutting edge of

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Speaker 1: the genocide against the Native Americans, the intentional parts of it, UM,

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Speaker 1: we are often talking about a military endeavor, like policing

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Speaker 1: plays a role, but it's it's a lot of like

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Speaker 1: the U. S. Military UM, and the rangers, Yeah, move

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Speaker 1: into a different part of the country. But like when

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Speaker 1: you get into like the Little Big Horn and General

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Speaker 1: Custer stand that was a military move too, and in

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Speaker 1: a lot of ways, the ingredients were the same also

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Speaker 1: in the sense that like this is where the cron

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Speaker 1: nation lives. Uh, now we actually but we only live

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Speaker 1: here because y'all made us live here. And then you

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Speaker 1: discovered gold in the Black Hills and now you on

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Speaker 1: our land again. And yeah, so just this like obviously

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Speaker 1: in a Little Big Horn, it's because they grossly underestimated

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Speaker 1: um sitting bowl. But uh, but that but that, but

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Speaker 1: that continual like um like fake diplomacy, which was really

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Speaker 1: a militarized ethnic cleansing from what I know from the

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Speaker 1: first tour I ever did was twenty seven Native American reservations,

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Speaker 1: So first tour as a as an artist. So when

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Speaker 1: you start talking to them about the way that they

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Speaker 1: see these things, they were, yeah, it's in their mind

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Speaker 1: it's always been an act of military Yeah. Yeah, and

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Speaker 1: that that's part of I guess why we haven't kind

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Speaker 1: of gone into that aspect as much, um and one

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Speaker 1: of one of the just because like it's it's less

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Speaker 1: of a policing thing and more of a military thing.

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Speaker 1: Although those lines blur, and they blur, especially with the

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Speaker 1: Texas Rangers because while the Rangers kind of our start

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Speaker 1: out is a quasi military force, as the eighteen hundreds

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Speaker 1: turned into the nineteen hundreds and kind of the frontier fades,

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Speaker 1: the Rangers transitioned into a law enforcement agency and they

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Speaker 1: become they're broadly similar to the U. S. Marshals like today,

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Speaker 1: that's kind of like more or less where they land,

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Speaker 1: um and they're but they're like this weird Texas state

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Speaker 1: law enforcement agency that kind of resembles in a lot

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Speaker 1: of ways more of like a FED type agency than

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Speaker 1: it does you know, a beat cop. But their their

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Speaker 1: law enforcement now, so they and they still exist, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: they still exist. They go from being like okay, not

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Speaker 1: like uh, it's not like Queen Elizabeth like they actually

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Speaker 1: do no no no. If you fly into um, if

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Speaker 1: you fly into love Field Airport today in Dallas, which

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Speaker 1: is the airport you want to fly into and out

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Speaker 1: of in Dallas because DFW was a goddamn nightmare. There's

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Speaker 1: a statue. There's a statue of like a dude, a

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Speaker 1: cowboy looking dude with a six gun on his hip.

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Speaker 1: That's like a statue of the Texas Rangers. And I

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Speaker 1: think it's like the words written on it are one Ranger,

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Speaker 1: one Riot, which is their motto. And we'll be talking

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Speaker 1: about where where that motto really comes from now. But

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Speaker 1: they're no, they're still around. There's still a law enforcement

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Speaker 1: agency in Texas. And yeah, that's the they kind of

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Speaker 1: transition from being a military guerrilla warfare unit to being

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Speaker 1: like the law. Um. And and as a side note,

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Speaker 1: as a side note, I still don't know what a U. S.

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Speaker 1: Marshal does except for fly on a plane. You know

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Speaker 1: a lot of that's true. Yeah, the movie US Marshals,

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Speaker 1: I think is perfectly accurate. Just watched watch the movie

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Speaker 1: US Marshals with Robert Downey Jr. And uh and Tommy

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Speaker 1: Lee Jones, and I think that's a percent right. Um. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was like, so this is unnecessary. Your whole job

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Speaker 1: is unnecessary going so um, the new Texas Rangers as

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Speaker 1: law enforcement, um, didn't act as like military scouts anymore,

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Speaker 1: but they still enforced white supremacy. At the barrel of

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Speaker 1: a gun. In nineteen eighteen, at a place called Poor Veneer,

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Speaker 1: Texas Rangers gunned down fifteen unarmed Mexican people and drove

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Speaker 1: their families across the border into Mexico. I found a

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Speaker 1: fun article on the Rangers in the Texas Observer, which

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Speaker 1: is a great news source on Texas. The like really

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Speaker 1: good journalism. UH, and they interviewed historian and professor Monica

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Speaker 1: Martinez about the history of the Texas Rangers. UH. The

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Speaker 1: article notes quote martinez Is research posits the height of

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Speaker 1: Texas Ranger violence against Mexicans who have occurred from nineteen

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Speaker 1: fifteen to nineteen nineteen. Some three hundred ethnic Mexicans were

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Speaker 1: murdered between nineteen fifteen and nineteen sixteen alone. These dates

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Speaker 1: coincided with the reign of not only the disgraced Governor

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Speaker 1: James Poff Ferguson, but also, starting in nineteen seventeen, the

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Speaker 1: oft venerated William P. Hobby. Martinez is appropriately unsparing in

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Speaker 1: the detailing of hobbies consistently anti Hispanic, anti double a

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Speaker 1: CP agenda. In short, he is the Rangers as his

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Speaker 1: own personal goon squad and instigating intimidation tactics against minorities.

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Speaker 1: Hobby presided over an era that, according to Martinez, saw

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Speaker 1: the widespread practice of executing landowning Hispanic men to force

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Speaker 1: the sale of their land by their widows through threats

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Speaker 1: of physical violence. Much yeah, much the same Hobby from

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Speaker 1: the Houston Airport. Yeah wait same guy. Yeah I think so, yes, yes, yes, yes,

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Speaker 1: George Billson. Then there's Hobby. That's that's like, yeah, that's

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Speaker 1: Houston's love Field, you know what I'm saying. Yeah, their

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Speaker 1: other airport. Yeah yeah yeah much have said violence aided

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Speaker 1: and embed it if not directly perpetrated by the Rangers

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Speaker 1: with the state official state consent. Powerful US political elites

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Speaker 1: like Hobby made sure that any serious investigation of Ranger

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Speaker 1: crimes through official legal channels would be doomed to failure.

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Speaker 1: Now yeah, that is just just straight up ethnic cleansing again,

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Speaker 1: like like there's still ethnically cleansing people. Um. And obviously

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Speaker 1: I didn't learn any of that in Texas history classes.

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Speaker 1: I learned about them fighting the Comanche, but it was

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Speaker 1: it was framed as like, well, they were, you know,

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Speaker 1: both two sides in a war and they both did

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Speaker 1: bad things. Um yeah. Now uh it turns out that

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Speaker 1: and this is I also didn't learn in middle school.

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Speaker 1: It turns out that the Texas Mexican border was kind

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Speaker 1: of prior to this point where the Texas Rangers come

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Speaker 1: in and start murdering landloaders. It was a semi autonomous

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Speaker 1: region because it was both too remote and too close

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Speaker 1: to Mexico to really be controlled by any central government.

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Speaker 1: So people on the border from both countries would travel

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Speaker 1: freely and like cross the border kind of without even

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Speaker 1: noticing it was there. They built communities together, they had

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Speaker 1: families together, they traded together, um, and this was great

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Speaker 1: for them, but it was really bad for rich people

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Speaker 1: in racists who lived many hundreds of miles away. So

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Speaker 1: the Texas Rangers were sent in to secure the border,

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Speaker 1: and this was like the first time the border was

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Speaker 1: really secure. And again they did this by executing people

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Speaker 1: who owned land near the border and handing their stuff

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Speaker 1: actually Mexican people who owned land in the border, and

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Speaker 1: handing their stuff over to white people. Um. The dead

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Speaker 1: were portrayed as bandits and criminals, and heavily armed rangers

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Speaker 1: would pose for photographs with their bodies. By nineteen nineteen,

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Speaker 1: the sheer scale of the violence and forced to state

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Speaker 1: legislative hearing on extra judicial killings by the rangers. This

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Speaker 1: hearing resulted in no formal charges and the detailed record

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Speaker 1: of the Texas Rangers mass murder spree was sealed for

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Speaker 1: fifty years so as to not tarnish their record as

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Speaker 1: tex And heroes. Yeah, I bet, I bet. Also, also

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Speaker 1: there's parts of El Paso that are still like that.

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Speaker 1: Then you still can't tell where the border is and

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Speaker 1: isn't where there's a there's a high school down there.

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Speaker 1: I know because the kid came to a show where

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Speaker 1: the football field is in Mexico. Yeah, and then but

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Speaker 1: the rest of the school is in Texas, so nobody

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Speaker 1: really knows where. We really don't know where it is.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, anyway, I just thought that's interesting that, like

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Speaker 1: to this day that like it's important for us to

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Speaker 1: all remember that borders are made up. They're not we

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Speaker 1: made them up. You know, they're just by pain. Yeah. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: maybe it's not They're not real and they're yeah yeah,

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Speaker 1: enforced by pain is a good way to Yeah. Uh

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Speaker 1: So the Texas Rangers went well into the twentieth century

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Speaker 1: acting as a colonial police force. They didn't stop in

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Speaker 1: nineteen um and Alex Vitali, author of the end of

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Speaker 1: Policing Rights quote. In the sixties and seventies, local and

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Speaker 1: state elites used Rangers to suppress the political and economic

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Speaker 1: rights of Mexican Americans, and played a central role in

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Speaker 1: subverting farm worker movements by shutting down meetings, intimidating supporters,

401
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Speaker 1: and arresting and brutalizing picketers and union leaders. They were

402
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Speaker 1: also frequently called in to intimidate Mexican Americans out of

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Speaker 1: voting in local elections. Most Latinos were subject to a

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Speaker 1: kind of wan crow like it's a Jim Crow's thing,

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Speaker 1: in which they were denied the right to vote and

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Speaker 1: barred from private and public accommodations such as hotels, restaurants,

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Speaker 1: bus station waiting rooms, public pools, and bathrooms. This is

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Speaker 1: what that statue in love Field is referring to when

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Speaker 1: it says one ranger, one riot. That's the riot. Is

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Speaker 1: the is Mexicans being like, what if we had the

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Speaker 1: right to vote in Texas? Rangers saying what if we

412
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Speaker 1: shot you? You still have to say to yourself, like

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Speaker 1: if it's so you like everybody's a situation is so unique,

414
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Speaker 1: but like as a as a Texan Mexican where you

415
00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:23,760
Speaker 1: never moved, your house, never moved, it's just the land

416
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Speaker 1: up under you became Texas and then everybody acting like

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Speaker 1: you ain't supposed to be here that you ain't got right.

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Speaker 1: So he was like, I I've never left. I don't

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Speaker 1: understand how I don't have rights in land. I never left. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like you're the new guys. Yeah, it's just the mind

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Speaker 1: bender of that. Yeah, it's pretty cool. Yeah, it's pretty

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Speaker 1: cool and good. So the Rangers were eventually beaten back

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Speaker 1: to an extent in the early nineteen sixties when Tehanos

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Speaker 1: began to organize in a significant way. They set up

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Speaker 1: voter drives and fought, literally fought in some points to

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Speaker 1: get leaders elected on the local city council of a

427
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:06,400
Speaker 1: small town called Crystal City. This whole operation exploded into

428
00:23:06,400 --> 00:23:08,680
Speaker 1: a big fight, with Rangers cracking skulls and trying to

429
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:11,480
Speaker 1: break up rallies. Um, but this time they're victims. Attracted

430
00:23:11,480 --> 00:23:13,880
Speaker 1: the attention of the press, The Rangers eventually were forced

431
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:16,400
Speaker 1: to back down by public opinion, and the Tahanos won

432
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:19,119
Speaker 1: both the election and major civil rights concessions from the

433
00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:22,199
Speaker 1: white majority you know, all across Texas, and things started

434
00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:25,960
Speaker 1: to get better. Obviously they're still not perfect or even great,

435
00:23:26,040 --> 00:23:29,639
Speaker 1: but they got better. Um. Today, the Texas Rangers are

436
00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:32,800
Speaker 1: sort of just like a weird Texan variant of the U. S. Marshals.

437
00:23:33,000 --> 00:23:36,160
Speaker 1: They do a lot of unsolved crime investigations like cold

438
00:23:36,200 --> 00:23:39,680
Speaker 1: case murders, they investigate serial killers. UM. They also act

439
00:23:39,720 --> 00:23:42,080
Speaker 1: as kind of like they're supposed to be kind of

440
00:23:42,119 --> 00:23:45,080
Speaker 1: a watchdog for the police because they they investigate officer

441
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:48,720
Speaker 1: involved shootings and of course they do border security um.

442
00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:51,199
Speaker 1: And the fact that they have a I don't know

443
00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,760
Speaker 1: enough about how they do today to know how problematic

444
00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:55,960
Speaker 1: they are, and sort of currently in the vein of

445
00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:58,320
Speaker 1: the rest of law enforcement, I will say they have

446
00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:02,480
Speaker 1: a very positive reputation among just Texans um. And this

447
00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:05,359
Speaker 1: is not due to anything they actually do, but is

448
00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:09,000
Speaker 1: owed largely to the nineteen nineties TV show Walker Texas Ranger,

449
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:14,440
Speaker 1: in which Chuck Norris assumed because Chuck Norris, yeah, Chuck

450
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:18,679
Speaker 1: Norris basically erased the Centurion and change long history of

451
00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:23,120
Speaker 1: ethnic cleansing and genocide um by doing enough roundhouse kicks

452
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:25,719
Speaker 1: while wearing a badge on its chest that people were like,

453
00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:29,800
Speaker 1: They're okay, now he punched a bear. Look at at me,

454
00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:33,720
Speaker 1: punched a bear. Yeah, he's got to be a good guy. Yeah.

455
00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:36,480
Speaker 1: And in sort of in following this arc of like

456
00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:41,159
Speaker 1: committing genocide, acting as like a military force of ethnic

457
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:45,159
Speaker 1: cleansing and like like mass murder to suppress minorities, and

458
00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 1: then getting whitewashed by a TV show with Chuck Norris.

459
00:24:48,560 --> 00:24:51,280
Speaker 1: The Texas Rangers kind of perfectly encapsulate a lot of

460
00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:55,639
Speaker 1: law enforcement history in this country. That is the most

461
00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 1: a sinc sentence. Yeah, the most sinct sentence we've done

462
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:03,399
Speaker 1: this whole Yeah, they protested all six, they participated in

463
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 1: at least two genocides. But then Chuck Norris started kicking

464
00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:14,400
Speaker 1: all right, spinning roundhouse kid uh. Also also as a

465
00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:19,640
Speaker 1: native Californian who married a first Gin Mexican woman from

466
00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:25,080
Speaker 1: southern Mexico. I will go to my grave that I

467
00:25:25,119 --> 00:25:27,760
Speaker 1: am not a fan of tex mex food in that

468
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:30,600
Speaker 1: caso is terrible. No, No, that's the only thing I'll

469
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:34,159
Speaker 1: fight for about Texas is text mex Hey, man, Hey,

470
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:36,560
Speaker 1: I'll take your fajitas. They're great, But you can lead

471
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:44,600
Speaker 1: a caso alone, sucking Calimex, putting fish in everything. Come on, touche. Yeah,

472
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:47,879
Speaker 1: I mean it's actually all pretty incredible compared to the

473
00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 1: burritos we get up here in the Pacific Northwest. Yeah,

474
00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:54,040
Speaker 1: don't call those burritos. No, they're not. They're not burritos.

475
00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:56,439
Speaker 1: Somebody put keen Wa in one of them. I was just,

476
00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:59,840
Speaker 1: what are you that's a rap. It's just a rap.

477
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:03,000
Speaker 1: That's a rap. Come on, don't call this a fucking burrito.

478
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 1: So in our last episode of the series, we talked

479
00:26:07,800 --> 00:26:10,640
Speaker 1: about August Volmer. You remember Valmer, like the the good,

480
00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:12,640
Speaker 1: the best cop that we're we're going to talk about

481
00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:16,200
Speaker 1: the series. Yeah, um, probably the most influential police chief

482
00:26:16,200 --> 00:26:18,560
Speaker 1: in US history. Volmer was a big advocate of what

483
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 1: is called like the professional model of policing, of like

484
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,879
Speaker 1: what a police force should be. UM. He believed that

485
00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:27,560
Speaker 1: police officers should be trained professionals with college degrees. And

486
00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 1: when he thought trained professional, he was not thinking about killing, right, Like,

487
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:33,720
Speaker 1: their ability to handle a gun and shoot people was

488
00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:36,480
Speaker 1: kind of low on Volmer's list of what cops should

489
00:26:36,480 --> 00:26:39,359
Speaker 1: be professional at UM. He focused on the number one

490
00:26:39,359 --> 00:26:42,679
Speaker 1: their ability to kind of scientifically solve crimes UM. And

491
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:46,960
Speaker 1: their ability to interface with and be parts of communities. UM.

492
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:50,040
Speaker 1: And these are both still things. Yeah, broadly, there's still

493
00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:51,840
Speaker 1: problemat One of the things we won't get into enough

494
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,000
Speaker 1: is the number one. Like a lot of police science

495
00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:56,680
Speaker 1: fingerprinting and stuff works a lot less well than than

496
00:26:56,720 --> 00:26:59,440
Speaker 1: they say it does, so like and ship like yeah,

497
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:00,960
Speaker 1: like like there's a lot of problems with that. And

498
00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:04,119
Speaker 1: there's also people who argue that community policing doesn't like

499
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:06,880
Speaker 1: is better than you know, maybe what we're doing now,

500
00:27:06,920 --> 00:27:09,360
Speaker 1: but doesn't really work all that well. Like there's arguments

501
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,040
Speaker 1: to be made. We're not going to get into them enough.

502
00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:13,120
Speaker 1: I don't want to be saying that. Like his attitude

503
00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:15,920
Speaker 1: was perfect, but I think it was less problematic. Yeah,

504
00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:18,560
Speaker 1: was he like the like the precursor to like c

505
00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 1: S I Miami, you know, like yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely,

506
00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,800
Speaker 1: you gotta like scientifically solve these crimes and that everything

507
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:29,639
Speaker 1: that has a science degree in forensics is unimaginably gorgeous

508
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:33,760
Speaker 1: and they work in a lab that is looks more

509
00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:38,120
Speaker 1: like a club. Yeah yeah, it's really well, Yeah, it's

510
00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:41,480
Speaker 1: really well. Yeah. Volmer is the guy who advocates for

511
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:47,000
Speaker 1: like sexy, brilliant um doctor cops who like yeah, yeah, exactly,

512
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 1: that's that's that's kind of hiss. Yes, oh my god,

513
00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:54,199
Speaker 1: an incredible shape with abs, like like how do they

514
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:58,640
Speaker 1: get abs that nice? And also do police work. Yeah,

515
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:01,679
Speaker 1: so Volmer that's Mer's attitude. That's kind of the professional

516
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,280
Speaker 1: model of policing. But Volmer was not the only person

517
00:28:04,320 --> 00:28:06,280
Speaker 1: with a vision of what policing should be. And there

518
00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:08,760
Speaker 1: was a you know, in the nineteen twenties in particular,

519
00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:13,119
Speaker 1: a competing model of policing started to evolve. Now, if

520
00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:15,159
Speaker 1: you remember your high school history courses, you'll know that

521
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:17,760
Speaker 1: the period from like eighteen seventy seven to eighteen ninety

522
00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 1: five is referred to broadly as the Gilded Age. And

523
00:28:20,840 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 1: this was a time of massive wealth inequality, a period

524
00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:26,639
Speaker 1: that saw the USA's first multi millionaires rise, alongside a

525
00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:30,439
Speaker 1: devon stating series of economic recessions and depressions. Um, the

526
00:28:30,480 --> 00:28:34,520
Speaker 1: Gilded Age was a time of intense political polarization. Political

527
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:36,719
Speaker 1: parties got like at each other's throats in a way

528
00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 1: they really hadn't been, you know, you know, prior to

529
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:41,320
Speaker 1: the Civil War, which I guess hadn't been that long ago.

530
00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 1: So let's not pretend that hasn't always been an aspect

531
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 1: of our politics. But yeah, uh, And around the turn

532
00:28:46,200 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 1: of the century, um, the Gilded Age kind of gave

533
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:52,960
Speaker 1: way to what's called the Progressive era. And progressive today

534
00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 1: is the term we broadly used for just like folks

535
00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:57,160
Speaker 1: on the left, but back then it meant something different.

536
00:28:57,200 --> 00:29:00,000
Speaker 1: And like, progressives of this era kind of had things

537
00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:03,520
Speaker 1: in common with both our modern left and right. Um,

538
00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:05,080
Speaker 1: some of the values they had in common with, like

539
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 1: today's lefties, would be sort of a rejection of conservative

540
00:29:08,040 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 1: individualism in favor of more collective attitudes towards the common good.

541
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:14,800
Speaker 1: Progressives wanted to use state power to do things like

542
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 1: help lower class individuals, workers, immigrants, you know, the urban poor.

543
00:29:18,760 --> 00:29:21,240
Speaker 1: They stood against the greed of unchecked capitalism and the

544
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 1: corruption of a system of party bosses that had dominated

545
00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 1: urban politics and US cities during the Gilded Age. And

546
00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:30,440
Speaker 1: the progressives weren't really they progressive was a political orientation,

547
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:33,440
Speaker 1: but they didn't really care about They weren't like super

548
00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:35,560
Speaker 1: into parties. Like a lot of the progressive air was

549
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:37,800
Speaker 1: kind of a rejection of where party politics had led

550
00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:39,800
Speaker 1: things in the Gilded Age. That's a factor in this doo.

551
00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:41,920
Speaker 1: And when you when you read what I just read,

552
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:44,680
Speaker 1: the progressives kind of sound like lefties, but that's not

553
00:29:44,760 --> 00:29:48,520
Speaker 1: all they were. Many progressives also held deeply conservative attitudes

554
00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:52,800
Speaker 1: towards religion and acceptable social behavior. Progressives were by and

555
00:29:52,920 --> 00:29:57,320
Speaker 1: large a homogeneous, middle class, white Protestant group. Um. They

556
00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:01,320
Speaker 1: chewed political parties in favor of local in formal organizations

557
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:04,239
Speaker 1: like the Anti Saloon League. And as that last bit,

558
00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:06,719
Speaker 1: Mike Keia, we are in on a whole lot of uh,

559
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:10,640
Speaker 1: progressives were very jazzed about prohibition. Um. And it's also

560
00:30:10,680 --> 00:30:13,080
Speaker 1: progressives that also, you know, as an aside, that brings

561
00:30:13,120 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 1: us like early race science, um, for for some reasons

562
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:18,360
Speaker 1: we're going to get into. So the progressives are a

563
00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:22,960
Speaker 1: mix of left and right and problematic as all hell. Like. Yeah,

564
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:27,680
Speaker 1: it's also it's also a good lesson for the modern thinker,

565
00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:30,840
Speaker 1: the younger thinker to remember that, like even our terms

566
00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:34,240
Speaker 1: left and right are so malleable and they haven't always

567
00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:36,840
Speaker 1: meant the same thing that you can like find clips

568
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:39,240
Speaker 1: of like George Bush seen you're talking about climate change,

569
00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 1: because the talking points can vary in these just like

570
00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:48,520
Speaker 1: borders are made up terms and they are very malluable.

571
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:52,320
Speaker 1: So even just jumping into this time with a vocabulary

572
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:55,360
Speaker 1: list that you think you know in seeing that like nah,

573
00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:59,800
Speaker 1: you'd like those are also malleable too, is like super good.

574
00:30:59,840 --> 00:31:02,080
Speaker 1: That So, which is one reason why I love this

575
00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 1: this part of American history and politics. Yeah, and it's

576
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:10,680
Speaker 1: it's like it's fascinating. Um, it's very because they're like

577
00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:14,200
Speaker 1: part of why they get into race science is that

578
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:16,880
Speaker 1: like this idea that again we kind of think of

579
00:31:16,920 --> 00:31:20,200
Speaker 1: as broadly positive today, those of this idea that like, Okay,

580
00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:23,720
Speaker 1: the poor, it's like, we should use the government state

581
00:31:23,760 --> 00:31:27,920
Speaker 1: resources to help deal with things like homelessness and poverty. Um.

582
00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:30,480
Speaker 1: But the way a lot of progressives take that's like, okay, well,

583
00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:32,760
Speaker 1: let's figure out the root causes of homelessness and proverty. Boy,

584
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 1: it seems like certain races of people are more likely

585
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:37,560
Speaker 1: to be homeless, you're impoverished. Maybe part of what the

586
00:31:37,560 --> 00:31:40,280
Speaker 1: government should be doing to solve this problem is sterilized them.

587
00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:43,720
Speaker 1: That's that's where the thought process goes. It's just like

588
00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 1: a weird sharp left. Yeah, there's there's obviously there are

589
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:50,000
Speaker 1: certain things I think the government ought to be doing

590
00:31:50,040 --> 00:31:51,760
Speaker 1: that it shouldn't. But let's never forget that when you

591
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:54,080
Speaker 1: start talking about the government ought to do this or that,

592
00:31:54,080 --> 00:31:56,920
Speaker 1: that can go badly too, Which doesn't mean we shouldn't

593
00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:59,160
Speaker 1: try to solve problems, but let's all keep that in

594
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:05,800
Speaker 1: our fucking head to remember yes, Um. Yeah, So have

595
00:32:05,880 --> 00:32:10,160
Speaker 1: you ever read Justice by um Michael Sandow? No, I

596
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,280
Speaker 1: have not. Yeah, this is a good one, um, And

597
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:17,160
Speaker 1: it's a complete tangent knowing that you have forty five

598
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:21,640
Speaker 1: more pages to read. But uh, it is important to know,

599
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:24,840
Speaker 1: like what he talked about, what the basic premises, like

600
00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 1: you're what you see as just, um, and how you

601
00:32:30,160 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 1: define what justice is? If I if you can answer

602
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:35,200
Speaker 1: that question, it could tell me where you're probably gonna

603
00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:38,760
Speaker 1: land historically and politically. Like, for example, if you think

604
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:42,360
Speaker 1: just means the greatest good for all, so everybody looks

605
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 1: at like what's the greater good? How can the most

606
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:48,000
Speaker 1: amount of people see the most amount of flourishing, You're

607
00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:51,560
Speaker 1: probably gonna lean more liberal and progressive, right. Uh. If

608
00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:55,720
Speaker 1: you're like, no, justice means leave me alone to figure

609
00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:58,640
Speaker 1: out how I want to make things happen. It is

610
00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 1: unjust for you to limit my liberties. Well that's like

611
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:05,480
Speaker 1: libertarian and you know, moving into that area where like

612
00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:07,840
Speaker 1: justice means lead me alone, Right, you don't get to

613
00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:09,600
Speaker 1: tell me how to do things. But if you're like,

614
00:33:09,800 --> 00:33:13,120
Speaker 1: just this means there is a right way to do stuff,

615
00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:16,560
Speaker 1: and that right way we all need to fall in line,

616
00:33:16,600 --> 00:33:19,320
Speaker 1: and that's more a conservative lean. So if you say that,

617
00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 1: that's that, then that makes a just society. So if

618
00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:24,320
Speaker 1: you look at things like that, then when you jump

619
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:28,240
Speaker 1: into this region, you're going they're answering the question how

620
00:33:28,240 --> 00:33:30,800
Speaker 1: do we make how do we make a just society?

621
00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:33,920
Speaker 1: But their solution was, well, you know, brown people suck,

622
00:33:33,960 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 1: so they shouldn't have no more children. Yeah. Yeah, yeah,

623
00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:43,640
Speaker 1: it's complex, a complex period to talk about. Um and yeah,

624
00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:50,680
Speaker 1: so yeah, you know what doesn't support eugenics prop Well,

625
00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:54,920
Speaker 1: hopefully the products and services that advertise on this place.

626
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:58,320
Speaker 1: That's our that's our one line. Sophie calls every advertiser

627
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:01,800
Speaker 1: and and just says the word eugenics and kind of

628
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:07,840
Speaker 1: like that way. Have you ever measured a brain? Yeah?

629
00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 1: Do you do? You take skull measurements? Yes? Um, all right,

630
00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 1: here's some ads. Hi. I'm Robert sex Reese, host of

631
00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:24,960
Speaker 1: The Doctor sex re Show. And every episode I listened

632
00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:28,200
Speaker 1: to people talk about their sex and intimacy issues, and yes,

633
00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:31,879
Speaker 1: I despise every minute of it. And she she made

634
00:34:31,920 --> 00:34:36,239
Speaker 1: mistakes too, shell everyone at her wedding. But hell is real.

635
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:39,279
Speaker 1: We're all trapped here and there's nothing any of us

636
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:42,200
Speaker 1: can do about it, So join me, won't you? Listen

637
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:44,759
Speaker 1: to the Doctor Sex re Show every Tuesday on the

638
00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:47,960
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get

639
00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:50,960
Speaker 1: your podcast. Rafie is the voice of some of the

640
00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:57,160
Speaker 1: happiest songs of our generation, Baby So who is the

641
00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:01,560
Speaker 1: man behind Baby Bluga? Every human being wants to feel

642
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:06,080
Speaker 1: respected when we start with young actually, all good things

643
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:09,560
Speaker 1: can grow from there. I'm Chris Garcia, comedian, new dad

644
00:35:09,680 --> 00:35:12,319
Speaker 1: and host of Finding Raffie, a new podcast from my

645
00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:15,600
Speaker 1: Heart Radio and Fatherly. Listen every Tuesday on the I

646
00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:20,880
Speaker 1: Heart Radio app or wherever you get your podcasts. The

647
00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:25,200
Speaker 1: Gangster Chronicles podcast is a weekly conversation that revolves around underworld,

648
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:29,120
Speaker 1: the criminals and entertainers to victims's crime and law enforcement.

649
00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:32,640
Speaker 1: We cover all facets of the game. Gainster Chronicles podcast

650
00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:36,960
Speaker 1: doesn't glorify promotilised activities. We just discussed the ramifications and

651
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:40,040
Speaker 1: repercussions of these activities because at the Wall she played

652
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:43,600
Speaker 1: gamester games. You are ultimately rewarded with Gainster Prizes. Our

653
00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:46,440
Speaker 1: Heart Radio is number one for podcasts, but don't take

654
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:49,360
Speaker 1: our award for it. Find Against the Chronicles podcast and

655
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 1: my Heart Radio app or wherever you get your podcast

656
00:35:56,840 --> 00:35:59,320
Speaker 1: We're Back, We're Back, And I just I hope to

657
00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:01,279
Speaker 1: god that was not an ad for a company that

658
00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:06,240
Speaker 1: sells calipers. Um, tell me you're not selling calibers. Yeah, yeah, Sophie,

659
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:09,560
Speaker 1: I mean these calipers are just off with the promo

660
00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:14,719
Speaker 1: code bastards. On a personal note, On a personal note,

661
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:16,560
Speaker 1: I remember the first time I saw some of those

662
00:36:16,600 --> 00:36:20,440
Speaker 1: like phrenology, like like manuals and drawings. I was just

663
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:22,760
Speaker 1: a visual artist, so I was like, dude, that's so cool,

664
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:24,879
Speaker 1: and I wanted to buy one of those old ones.

665
00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:27,359
Speaker 1: And then then then my father looked at me and

666
00:36:27,400 --> 00:36:30,440
Speaker 1: was like, boy, if you don't get that out my house.

667
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:36,520
Speaker 1: A funny moment. Yeah. Anyway, So, um, all right, so

668
00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:39,560
Speaker 1: we we're talking about the progressives and particularly the fact

669
00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:41,680
Speaker 1: that they get they get a whole hog and the

670
00:36:41,719 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 1: motherfucking prohibition. Uh. And I'm gonna quote next from a

671
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:48,120
Speaker 1: paper by Ellen Leichtman, an associate professor from Eastern Kentucky

672
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:52,560
Speaker 1: University that's about early police militarization. She starts by kind

673
00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:55,960
Speaker 1: of talking about the genesis of a lot of progressive thought.

674
00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,200
Speaker 1: So she's talking about progressives here as the city's grew,

675
00:36:59,239 --> 00:37:00,960
Speaker 1: many of them began to yearned for a small town

676
00:37:01,000 --> 00:37:04,040
Speaker 1: pass that had existed mostly in their imaginations. These towns

677
00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:07,399
Speaker 1: were conceptualized as homogeneous villages where everyone knew everyone else

678
00:37:07,440 --> 00:37:09,920
Speaker 1: and looked after each other. While small towns still existed

679
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:12,359
Speaker 1: throughout the country, Progressives bemoaned the fact that these traits

680
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:15,080
Speaker 1: could not be transferred to urban living. Actually, many of

681
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 1: these traits could be found in urban immigrant neighborhoods, but

682
00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:20,600
Speaker 1: progressives could not transfer their idealized image of small town

683
00:37:20,640 --> 00:37:23,279
Speaker 1: living to a foreign environment. The small towns they had

684
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:26,360
Speaker 1: envisioned were based on Anglo Saxon Protestant ethics and culture,

685
00:37:26,560 --> 00:37:29,360
Speaker 1: not the Catholic, Italian and Irish, Eastern European Jewish and

686
00:37:29,440 --> 00:37:32,279
Speaker 1: other customs of the immigrant neighborhoods, which did not hold

687
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:35,279
Speaker 1: with many of the Sumptuary laws, especially that of prohibition.

688
00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 1: So dear to the progressives, hearts so they they're they're big,

689
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:43,719
Speaker 1: family oriented people. But the actual like, the people who

690
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:46,800
Speaker 1: are really living the kind of family oriented small towns

691
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:49,440
Speaker 1: sort of life within the big cities are these immigrants,

692
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:53,160
Speaker 1: and they drink and progressives hate that. Um. So progressives

693
00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:56,400
Speaker 1: get their way on prohibitions starting January seventeenth, nineteen twenty.

694
00:37:56,760 --> 00:37:58,960
Speaker 1: But it didn't go well, and the first two years

695
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:02,359
Speaker 1: of prohibition saw are all crime increased by twenty four

696
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:08,520
Speaker 1: percent nationwide. This included a increase in homicide and increase

697
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:11,359
Speaker 1: in assault and battery. Most of this violence was driven

698
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:14,120
Speaker 1: by the enforcement of prohibition. One study that compared South

699
00:38:14,200 --> 00:38:17,680
Speaker 1: Carolina counties that did and did not enforce prohibition found

700
00:38:17,719 --> 00:38:23,200
Speaker 1: that enforcement led to a thirty to sixty increase in homicides. Yeah,

701
00:38:23,640 --> 00:38:28,399
Speaker 1: a lot of people get killed when you prohibit drugs arbitrarily.

702
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:32,280
Speaker 1: It turns out this is the lesson maybe we should

703
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:35,520
Speaker 1: have learned. Yeah, yeah, Yeah, there's at some point somebody

704
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:37,880
Speaker 1: needs to go ahead and go in and explain how

705
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:43,800
Speaker 1: there was really no scientific reasoning behind prohibition, just snop

706
00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 1: political power. People just didn't like alcohol and wanted the

707
00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:51,360
Speaker 1: state to stop something they didn't like from happening. Uh So, Yeah.

708
00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:54,080
Speaker 1: The increase massive increase in violence as a result of

709
00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 1: prohibition infuriated a lot of progressives, and rather than recognized

710
00:38:57,719 --> 00:38:59,800
Speaker 1: that prohibition was maybe a bad idea, a lot of

711
00:38:59,840 --> 00:39:02,399
Speaker 1: them started pushing hard to use state power to put

712
00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:05,400
Speaker 1: an end to bootlegging in an organized fashion and This

713
00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:08,200
Speaker 1: is what led to the first major challenge to August

714
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:13,040
Speaker 1: Volmer's like professional model of of police, many progressives began

715
00:39:13,120 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 1: to push for an alternate idea, a military model of

716
00:39:17,040 --> 00:39:20,520
Speaker 1: a police force. And I'm gonna quote again from Professor Lakeman, Well,

717
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:23,800
Speaker 1: there was a substantial overlap between the professional and military models,

718
00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:26,040
Speaker 1: and that both insisted that the police be autonomous, be

719
00:39:26,120 --> 00:39:29,239
Speaker 1: subject to physical requirements, and used the latest technology to

720
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:31,880
Speaker 1: defeat crime. There was a difference in focus. For the

721
00:39:31,920 --> 00:39:34,640
Speaker 1: military model, the city and its police represented the nation

722
00:39:34,719 --> 00:39:37,080
Speaker 1: and its standing army. People who broke the law were

723
00:39:37,120 --> 00:39:39,880
Speaker 1: equated to enemies of the state, not citizens, and became

724
00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:42,600
Speaker 1: person and on grata in their own country. To fight

725
00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:45,320
Speaker 1: these adversaries, the uniformed branch of the police and the

726
00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:48,760
Speaker 1: detectives the non uniformed branch, were equated to different services

727
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:51,600
Speaker 1: of the military. Illegal behavior was seen as an attack

728
00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:54,360
Speaker 1: on the American way of life. To save the country,

729
00:39:54,640 --> 00:39:57,280
Speaker 1: the police had to engage in a war on crime.

730
00:39:57,719 --> 00:40:00,600
Speaker 1: Needless to say, many cities began recruiting the lilitarymen to

731
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:05,319
Speaker 1: run their departments. And Jason, one of these military men

732
00:40:05,400 --> 00:40:07,040
Speaker 1: was a fellow you and I discussed kind of off

733
00:40:07,120 --> 00:40:09,280
Speaker 1: handedly in one of the first episodes of the series.

734
00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:10,960
Speaker 1: You remember when I read you that quote from Marine

735
00:40:11,000 --> 00:40:15,360
Speaker 1: Corps Major General Smedley Butler. Yes, Smithley, Yeah, Now that

736
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:18,560
Speaker 1: quote was from kind of after he woke up a

737
00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 1: bit um and started to realize some problems with earlier

738
00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:25,200
Speaker 1: aspects of his career. Um. But in nineteen twenty four,

739
00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:27,839
Speaker 1: he was still a Marine Corps general in the city

740
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:31,200
Speaker 1: of Philadelphia elected Freeland Kendrick mayor on a law and

741
00:40:31,360 --> 00:40:35,200
Speaker 1: order platform. Kendrick, a Republican, was livid that his city

742
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:38,240
Speaker 1: had more speakeasies than perhaps any other area in the country.

743
00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:41,080
Speaker 1: The city of Brotherly Love had an estimated eight thousand

744
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:43,799
Speaker 1: of legal bars in liquor stores in nineteen three. Because

745
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:49,080
Speaker 1: it's Philly, you know, it's fucking Philly, right, yeah, yeah, yeah,

746
00:40:49,320 --> 00:40:53,440
Speaker 1: Philly is always on brand, So yes, Mark Kendrick decided

747
00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:56,359
Speaker 1: that a military man and a military model were needed

748
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:58,839
Speaker 1: to reform the Philadelphia p D into something that could

749
00:40:58,840 --> 00:41:01,880
Speaker 1: tackle the problem of vice, and he chose Marine Brigadier

750
00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:05,000
Speaker 1: General Smedley Darlington Butler to be the new Director of

751
00:41:05,040 --> 00:41:07,640
Speaker 1: Public Safety. And again, Butler was still in the military

752
00:41:07,680 --> 00:41:09,000
Speaker 1: at this point. He had to get like a special

753
00:41:09,360 --> 00:41:12,360
Speaker 1: a special like leave from the Marine Corps so that

754
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:16,440
Speaker 1: he could go be the director of public safety in Philadelphia. UM.

755
00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:18,920
Speaker 1: So he's still a general. He's still in the military

756
00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:22,040
Speaker 1: as he takes over a police force. UM. Now at

757
00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:25,799
Speaker 1: age forty two in nineteen forty two, General Butler had

758
00:41:25,840 --> 00:41:30,800
Speaker 1: survived fourteen campaigns and expeditions over twenty two years of service.

759
00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:34,120
Speaker 1: He had joined the military illegally as a literal child

760
00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:36,160
Speaker 1: after lying about his age in order to fight in

761
00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:40,120
Speaker 1: the Philippines. UM. During his time fighting for capitalism in

762
00:41:40,200 --> 00:41:42,000
Speaker 1: his own you know, that's how he framed it. Later,

763
00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:46,200
Speaker 1: Butler had earned the nicknames Old gimlet Ie, Hell's Devil Butler,

764
00:41:46,520 --> 00:41:49,360
Speaker 1: the Fighting Quaker, and old duck Boards. He had a

765
00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:53,719
Speaker 1: lot of nicknames. Fighting Quaker, Yeah, that's a that's a

766
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:58,200
Speaker 1: good nickname. That's a tattoo bro y, and he gets

767
00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:01,560
Speaker 1: the nickname waker. Like duckboards are like wood boards they

768
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:03,920
Speaker 1: would put down and like trench fighting because it was

769
00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:05,640
Speaker 1: like muddy so that you would be able to walk

770
00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:08,480
Speaker 1: and like basically they're during World War One, there was

771
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:10,759
Speaker 1: this fight where like everything was fucking muddy as ship

772
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:12,920
Speaker 1: and they needed to get boards into place and Butler,

773
00:42:12,960 --> 00:42:14,919
Speaker 1: who was like I think a general still at this point,

774
00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:17,880
Speaker 1: just picks up a funckload of boards and like runs

775
00:42:17,960 --> 00:42:20,200
Speaker 1: into the battlefield to like set them down, and like

776
00:42:20,239 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 1: he he's he won two medals of Honor and he

777
00:42:23,520 --> 00:42:26,480
Speaker 1: wanted to Yeah, and he wanted Distinguished Service Cross, which

778
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:30,160
Speaker 1: is like the British like award, like their medal of Honor.

779
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:32,080
Speaker 1: Like he he wins two of our medals of honor

780
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:34,400
Speaker 1: and like the British equivalent or inside they're British to

781
00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:37,759
Speaker 1: the French equivalent, like he's, he's he's not just like

782
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:41,520
Speaker 1: an officer who like commands troops in battle from like

783
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:44,520
Speaker 1: a safe position, like like Smedley Butler. Whatever else you

784
00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:47,120
Speaker 1: want to say about him, it's a fucking terrifying badass.

785
00:42:47,760 --> 00:42:50,120
Speaker 1: Um Like he was. He was just like one of

786
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:52,800
Speaker 1: these guys with like a contempt for his own safety

787
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:56,000
Speaker 1: and battle. Um. Yeah, man, hey, did you know any

788
00:42:56,080 --> 00:42:58,160
Speaker 1: kids like that when you were like in Texas growing

789
00:42:58,200 --> 00:42:59,560
Speaker 1: up where he's just a kid that you were just

790
00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:03,640
Speaker 1: like this guy, yeah, is dangerous and doesn't care about

791
00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:06,640
Speaker 1: his body, but I'm my friend. Yeah yeah, yeah, those

792
00:43:06,680 --> 00:43:10,560
Speaker 1: are good people to have be friends with. Um, outside

793
00:43:10,600 --> 00:43:15,719
Speaker 1: of certain situations. Yeah, yeah, yeah, so but that's that's

794
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:17,919
Speaker 1: Smedley Butler at this period. So he's kind of a legend.

795
00:43:18,000 --> 00:43:19,880
Speaker 1: He's still a general and he gets made the director

796
00:43:19,880 --> 00:43:23,520
Speaker 1: of public safety in Philadelphia. Um. And you know, Butler

797
00:43:23,640 --> 00:43:26,480
Speaker 1: himself was a progressive um and he he was also

798
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:29,160
Speaker 1: a drinker, like not a heavy one, but he drank um.

799
00:43:29,360 --> 00:43:33,839
Speaker 1: So he didn't like prohibition, but he was progressive progressive. Yeah,

800
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:37,560
Speaker 1: it was kind of his belief that even bad laws

801
00:43:37,680 --> 00:43:39,799
Speaker 1: had to be enforced for the sake of public good.

802
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:42,120
Speaker 1: And upon taking off, as he stated, I do not

803
00:43:42,320 --> 00:43:44,920
Speaker 1: care whether the state laws or city ordinances are right

804
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:48,280
Speaker 1: or wrong. From January seven, they are going to be enforced.

805
00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:50,719
Speaker 1: So like that's his attitude, is like that, and that's

806
00:43:50,760 --> 00:43:53,920
Speaker 1: such a military at yes, it is. Yeah, when you

807
00:43:54,080 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 1: when you said earlier, like I've never heard that train

808
00:43:56,760 --> 00:43:59,600
Speaker 1: of thought put in the order that you put it

809
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:04,319
Speaker 1: when you were like, um, an active crime is an

810
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:08,400
Speaker 1: act against the state. Therefore you are no longer a citizen,

811
00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:11,640
Speaker 1: you are now an enemy combatant. I've never heard that

812
00:44:11,719 --> 00:44:17,040
Speaker 1: train of logic because I never understood how if you're policeman,

813
00:44:17,080 --> 00:44:20,080
Speaker 1: how you like who are you fighting? And like you're

814
00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:22,120
Speaker 1: fighting the people you supposed to protect. Like, I don't

815
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:25,960
Speaker 1: get it. That sentence finally at least made me be

816
00:44:26,040 --> 00:44:27,759
Speaker 1: able to follow the logic. I just wanted to go

817
00:44:27,840 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 1: back and point that out. Yeah, and this is this

818
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:31,839
Speaker 1: is one of the things that we're seeing in Philadelphia

819
00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:36,120
Speaker 1: right now, is like the the first time where so

820
00:44:36,200 --> 00:44:41,000
Speaker 1: obviously you've had uh, um, you've had the police being

821
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:45,520
Speaker 1: used to suppress segments of the American pop the dangerous classes, right, Um,

822
00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:48,160
Speaker 1: and this like primarily black and brown people. In this

823
00:44:48,280 --> 00:44:50,759
Speaker 1: period of time, what we start to see happening with

824
00:44:50,800 --> 00:44:53,120
Speaker 1: the militarization of the Philadelphia police, it's kind of the

825
00:44:53,160 --> 00:44:55,719
Speaker 1: first time the police are at war with everyone in

826
00:44:55,800 --> 00:45:00,160
Speaker 1: the city like that. That because you know, white people broadly, Um,

827
00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:03,359
Speaker 1: if they weren't members of a dangerous racial group, um,

828
00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:06,520
Speaker 1: could see the police's protectors in this period. And that

829
00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:09,879
Speaker 1: starts to change in Philly because in Philly, like, yeah,

830
00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:11,880
Speaker 1: they they this is the first time like the police

831
00:45:12,080 --> 00:45:14,760
Speaker 1: like again, and the police in the twenties are heavily

832
00:45:15,080 --> 00:45:16,960
Speaker 1: corrupt and a lot of them are criminals, but they're

833
00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:19,000
Speaker 1: not as an organized force. They're not going to war

834
00:45:19,160 --> 00:45:21,920
Speaker 1: with the city. This is the first time that really happens,

835
00:45:22,640 --> 00:45:25,279
Speaker 1: because like you were selling drugs now, yeah, just calls

836
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:29,560
Speaker 1: nine yeah yeah yeah. Um. So. Butler gave his first

837
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:31,600
Speaker 1: address to the Philly p D in a uniform he

838
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:34,080
Speaker 1: had designed for himself, complete with a cape, which is

839
00:45:34,320 --> 00:45:38,440
Speaker 1: a flex like yeah, yeah, if you got if you

840
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:41,040
Speaker 1: got that many medals on the from multiple countries, you

841
00:45:41,120 --> 00:45:42,600
Speaker 1: can wear a cape. You get to wear a cape.

842
00:45:42,680 --> 00:45:46,160
Speaker 1: Yeah fuck it, yeah, ok. Yeah. He demanded the police

843
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:48,320
Speaker 1: stopped making bribes, and he told them that while the

844
00:45:48,640 --> 00:45:50,200
Speaker 1: rest of the city might see them as just a

845
00:45:50,239 --> 00:45:53,080
Speaker 1: bunch of corrupt gangsters, he saw them as soldiers like

846
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:55,719
Speaker 1: the Marines he'd spent years commanding in battle, and that's

847
00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:58,480
Speaker 1: what he planned to turn them into. So Butler launched

848
00:45:58,520 --> 00:46:01,960
Speaker 1: an immediate series of raids on bootleggers and speakeasy's changing

849
00:46:02,040 --> 00:46:04,680
Speaker 1: city policy by not informing the mayor first, I think

850
00:46:04,719 --> 00:46:06,440
Speaker 1: in part because he knew the mayor knew some of

851
00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:08,920
Speaker 1: these people and had been protecting them. And in a

852
00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:13,160
Speaker 1: matter of days, Butler's police closed down nine hundred illegal bars.

853
00:46:13,560 --> 00:46:15,640
Speaker 1: Now at the same time as he cracked down General

854
00:46:15,680 --> 00:46:18,680
Speaker 1: Butler began the process of transforming the Philadelphia Police into

855
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:21,520
Speaker 1: a military force. He created a new squad of three

856
00:46:21,600 --> 00:46:24,600
Speaker 1: hundred officers whose job was to spy on their fellow cops.

857
00:46:24,920 --> 00:46:27,160
Speaker 1: These men would be the teeth behind Butler's admonition that

858
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:30,200
Speaker 1: Philly cops had to stop taking bribes. Another of Butler's

859
00:46:30,239 --> 00:46:33,960
Speaker 1: first steps was to abolish the police training school see Volmer.

860
00:46:34,040 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 1: August Volmer wanted educated professionals with like degrees in criminal justice,

861
00:46:37,600 --> 00:46:40,920
Speaker 1: who like approached crime from a scientific standpoint. General Butler

862
00:46:40,960 --> 00:46:43,320
Speaker 1: thought that was bullshit. He thought that cops, like soldiers,

863
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:46,520
Speaker 1: learned best in the field. Um and before his term,

864
00:46:46,640 --> 00:46:49,799
Speaker 1: police training had taken more than three months. Butler's new

865
00:46:49,840 --> 00:46:52,400
Speaker 1: policies sent the cops that on the street almost immediately,

866
00:46:52,520 --> 00:46:54,680
Speaker 1: gave them like a booklet that outlined their duties and

867
00:46:54,840 --> 00:46:56,880
Speaker 1: was just like you'll figure it out once you're on

868
00:46:56,960 --> 00:47:03,919
Speaker 1: the street. You talk about buyinary thinking, Yeah, you either

869
00:47:04,080 --> 00:47:09,520
Speaker 1: a get trained for three months or be get a

870
00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:13,520
Speaker 1: little pamphlet. Get a little pamphlet. Yeah, go crack some heads.

871
00:47:13,560 --> 00:47:17,239
Speaker 1: You'll learn quick, you'll figure it out. Like there ain't

872
00:47:17,280 --> 00:47:20,839
Speaker 1: thought maybe they're somewhere in between there, maybe we could

873
00:47:20,880 --> 00:47:22,279
Speaker 1: pull a little bit of this, a little bit of that.

874
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:26,920
Speaker 1: Just those my two options, yep, and it's it's like so.

875
00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:31,360
Speaker 1: The one thing that's interesting is that Butler didn't actually

876
00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:35,240
Speaker 1: cancel all training. There was exactly one area where police

877
00:47:35,280 --> 00:47:37,560
Speaker 1: still trained because he thought it was important, and it

878
00:47:37,640 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 1: was in the use of firearms. Um. He had realized

879
00:47:40,520 --> 00:47:42,520
Speaker 1: early on that most cops barely knew how to use

880
00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:45,840
Speaker 1: their weapons, and even if fewer ever fired them. Butler

881
00:47:45,920 --> 00:47:47,719
Speaker 1: thought this was a problem because he again, he's treating

882
00:47:47,760 --> 00:47:50,760
Speaker 1: them as soldiers. So he mandated two weeks of marksmanship training,

883
00:47:51,640 --> 00:47:54,439
Speaker 1: which was the only training his cops received. He also,

884
00:47:55,160 --> 00:47:58,399
Speaker 1: rather bafflingly, decided to arm the fire department with forty

885
00:47:58,480 --> 00:48:01,000
Speaker 1: five caliber revolters, which, yeah, he gave. He gave all

886
00:48:01,040 --> 00:48:03,799
Speaker 1: the firefighters guns, and he required them to wear their

887
00:48:03,840 --> 00:48:08,080
Speaker 1: guns off duty. Um well, they had arresting powers. Firefighters

888
00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:10,400
Speaker 1: could arrest people in those days, so he was like,

889
00:48:10,920 --> 00:48:13,880
Speaker 1: when you're off duty, you're all auxiliary cops, and you

890
00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:16,040
Speaker 1: need to carry guns in case you have to shoot

891
00:48:16,080 --> 00:48:22,480
Speaker 1: some people. Basically, he viewed all public safety employees as

892
00:48:22,520 --> 00:48:24,680
Speaker 1: soldiers who might potentially get called in to fight a

893
00:48:24,760 --> 00:48:27,719
Speaker 1: war against the criminals within their city. And since every

894
00:48:27,800 --> 00:48:30,240
Speaker 1: criminal was now the same as a foreign combatant. Butler

895
00:48:30,280 --> 00:48:33,120
Speaker 1: started applying the same counterinsurgency tactics he'd learned in the

896
00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:36,279
Speaker 1: Philippines and throughout Latin America. He announced that he would

897
00:48:36,320 --> 00:48:39,400
Speaker 1: give a promotion to the first officer to kill a bandit.

898
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:42,280
Speaker 1: The bandit in question did not have to be committing

899
00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:45,080
Speaker 1: a violent crime. If he had a revolver in hand

900
00:48:45,239 --> 00:48:47,640
Speaker 1: or on his body while he was being chased, that

901
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:50,760
Speaker 1: was fair game for the Philadelphia p d. From Professor

902
00:48:50,840 --> 00:48:53,920
Speaker 1: Lichtman's paper quote. Butler took this further and stated that

903
00:48:54,040 --> 00:48:56,600
Speaker 1: like soldiers, those police who killed criminals should not be

904
00:48:56,719 --> 00:48:59,200
Speaker 1: called upon to either defend themselves or to contribute to

905
00:48:59,239 --> 00:49:01,960
Speaker 1: their defense. A policeman who shoots a bandit is serving

906
00:49:02,040 --> 00:49:04,360
Speaker 1: his city exactly as a soldier when firing at his

907
00:49:04,440 --> 00:49:07,760
Speaker 1: country's enemies. Butler said he saw no difference in context

908
00:49:07,800 --> 00:49:09,360
Speaker 1: between the role of the soldier and then of a

909
00:49:09,400 --> 00:49:14,759
Speaker 1: police officer. Uh, that's bad. Yeah, it's not great, I mean,

910
00:49:14,840 --> 00:49:17,440
Speaker 1: and we we wound up nationwide with the same ruling

911
00:49:17,480 --> 00:49:19,759
Speaker 1: Butler made that it's cool to shoot people running away.

912
00:49:19,800 --> 00:49:21,880
Speaker 1: It was like in the eighties of the early nineties

913
00:49:21,920 --> 00:49:24,080
Speaker 1: where the it was like the Supreme Court ruled that

914
00:49:24,520 --> 00:49:27,279
Speaker 1: if you a police officer can shoot you even if

915
00:49:27,320 --> 00:49:29,520
Speaker 1: you're not actively threatening them, if you're trying to get

916
00:49:29,560 --> 00:49:31,839
Speaker 1: away from an arrest, Like, that's a thing that could happen.

917
00:49:31,880 --> 00:49:33,560
Speaker 1: It's why cops get to shoot so many people in

918
00:49:33,640 --> 00:49:38,160
Speaker 1: the back. Um, it's it's fine. So Butler saw no

919
00:49:38,320 --> 00:49:40,840
Speaker 1: reason why his soldier cops shouldn't have access to the

920
00:49:40,920 --> 00:49:44,880
Speaker 1: latest in military grade weaponry. He ordered several customized armored

921
00:49:44,960 --> 00:49:48,000
Speaker 1: cars to enable his officers to get into motorized gunfights

922
00:49:48,080 --> 00:49:50,759
Speaker 1: with bootleggers. Rather than holding two men as with a

923
00:49:50,840 --> 00:49:53,960
Speaker 1: normal police car, these armored buggies held four officers. The

924
00:49:54,080 --> 00:49:55,920
Speaker 1: rear seats were set up back to back with the

925
00:49:56,000 --> 00:49:57,799
Speaker 1: front seats so that the men in the bat could

926
00:49:57,840 --> 00:50:01,000
Speaker 1: shoot directly at bandits without needing to turn around. Every

927
00:50:01,040 --> 00:50:03,120
Speaker 1: man in the car would carry a rifle, a sot

928
00:50:03,160 --> 00:50:05,480
Speaker 1: off shotgun, and a revolver and if you want to,

929
00:50:05,960 --> 00:50:09,520
Speaker 1: if you want I can't imagine a gesture that shows

930
00:50:09,560 --> 00:50:12,720
Speaker 1: more contempt for the people just living in the city

931
00:50:13,000 --> 00:50:16,240
Speaker 1: then firing a shot off shotgun from a moving vehicle.

932
00:50:17,040 --> 00:50:21,719
Speaker 1: That's a drive by. Yeah, I don't understand what drive by. Yeah,

933
00:50:21,880 --> 00:50:28,439
Speaker 1: it's that's so reckless. What do you like a sot

934
00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:31,399
Speaker 1: off shotguns not accurate and more than like fifteen feet

935
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:34,680
Speaker 1: in a good situation, and you're just shooting it from

936
00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:43,759
Speaker 1: a car moving one at that it's fucking nuts. Yeah, yeah,

937
00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:46,239
Speaker 1: fuck it? Yeah and again like one. Sorry I didn't

938
00:50:46,239 --> 00:50:48,080
Speaker 1: even note this at the start. One of Butler's like

939
00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:50,319
Speaker 1: requirements when he took the job, because he was used

940
00:50:50,360 --> 00:50:53,160
Speaker 1: to being a military officer in a foreign war zone,

941
00:50:53,560 --> 00:50:56,320
Speaker 1: was that no one questioned anything he did, like the city,

942
00:50:56,440 --> 00:51:02,759
Speaker 1: not like he'd basically be unaccountable. And they were like, share, yeah,

943
00:51:03,320 --> 00:51:05,759
Speaker 1: that's a lot. Yeah, it's a lot of wars. I

944
00:51:06,160 --> 00:51:09,479
Speaker 1: for the first time, uh, in a little personal news,

945
00:51:10,719 --> 00:51:16,719
Speaker 1: have shot big. This is my first positive experience with

946
00:51:16,840 --> 00:51:20,560
Speaker 1: guns this weekend that we're recording this. Every other experience

947
00:51:20,600 --> 00:51:23,239
Speaker 1: has been terrifying and life threatening. This is the first

948
00:51:23,239 --> 00:51:26,239
Speaker 1: time I've ever seen a gun in a very recreational place.

949
00:51:26,440 --> 00:51:31,400
Speaker 1: And I walk away with two really real thoughts, which is,

950
00:51:33,080 --> 00:51:38,600
Speaker 1: you must anyone holding these has to have a deep

951
00:51:38,760 --> 00:51:43,600
Speaker 1: respect for the deadly power in their hands, Like how

952
00:51:43,760 --> 00:51:48,000
Speaker 1: do you not revere this thing like you feel it's

953
00:51:48,040 --> 00:51:52,520
Speaker 1: power holding it? And then secondly, what has to click

954
00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:55,239
Speaker 1: off in your brain? To be able to point this

955
00:51:55,360 --> 00:52:02,840
Speaker 1: at another human like even reckless or with joy, or

956
00:52:02,960 --> 00:52:05,520
Speaker 1: just to not think about that. I'm like some about

957
00:52:05,560 --> 00:52:09,400
Speaker 1: your soul turned off because I just couldn't. I've kneeled

958
00:52:09,440 --> 00:52:12,000
Speaker 1: in front of a fifty cow, which is crazy, but

959
00:52:12,160 --> 00:52:15,400
Speaker 1: also hailed held to a R fifteen now shooting it

960
00:52:15,480 --> 00:52:17,520
Speaker 1: felt like the most powerful thing I did in my life.

961
00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:19,680
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie to you, I screamed and howled.

962
00:52:20,280 --> 00:52:23,400
Speaker 1: That was a redneck. I'm not gonna lie, I went, WHOA,

963
00:52:23,719 --> 00:52:26,759
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna lie. But I thought to myself, how

964
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:30,919
Speaker 1: could you point this at a person? Yeah? It's yeah,

965
00:52:31,239 --> 00:52:35,000
Speaker 1: I mean it it Um. There's a lot too, There's

966
00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:37,360
Speaker 1: a lot to say about like what what is emotionally

967
00:52:38,280 --> 00:52:41,880
Speaker 1: involved in that? And like I have, I have, unfortunately

968
00:52:41,920 --> 00:52:44,719
Speaker 1: been in a couple of situations, fortunately never where I

969
00:52:44,800 --> 00:52:46,879
Speaker 1: had to point my gun at a person, but where

970
00:52:46,920 --> 00:52:50,280
Speaker 1: I had a gun and somebody was doing something violent

971
00:52:50,360 --> 00:52:52,160
Speaker 1: with a weapon in their hand, and it was like

972
00:52:52,280 --> 00:52:56,280
Speaker 1: a There was like this thought process of like, where's

973
00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:59,879
Speaker 1: my line gonna be? Yes? Yeah, And That's what I'm saying.

974
00:53:00,160 --> 00:53:02,759
Speaker 1: You still have all your faculties. I believe you're fully

975
00:53:02,800 --> 00:53:05,440
Speaker 1: developed human. So you thought to yourself, there is a

976
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:09,080
Speaker 1: cost to this. Yeah, you know, and I don't know

977
00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:13,279
Speaker 1: if this juice is worth the squeeze. So what you're

978
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:21,480
Speaker 1: telling me is you put four dudes off just say

979
00:53:21,880 --> 00:53:26,880
Speaker 1: shoot wildly into the city. Yes, to stop people with

980
00:53:26,960 --> 00:53:31,360
Speaker 1: a couple of gallons of rum. Yes, yeah, it's pretty

981
00:53:31,640 --> 00:53:35,640
Speaker 1: pretty wild. Um. So Butler divided Philadelphia up like a

982
00:53:35,760 --> 00:53:38,840
Speaker 1: war zone with interlocking zones of control. Um that like

983
00:53:38,960 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 1: different patrols were set for and every patrol would have

984
00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:42,880
Speaker 1: like set routes that they were supposed to travel in

985
00:53:42,920 --> 00:53:45,040
Speaker 1: the event that they had to like intercept people. There

986
00:53:45,080 --> 00:53:48,120
Speaker 1: were convoys of armored vehicles, and he even set up

987
00:53:48,160 --> 00:53:51,839
Speaker 1: a number of military style outposts to allow for better

988
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:55,960
Speaker 1: monitoring that were fortified like fortresses within Philadelphia that we're

989
00:53:56,000 --> 00:53:58,719
Speaker 1: able to act as like outposts that there. We call

990
00:53:58,800 --> 00:54:02,239
Speaker 1: them fobs forward rating basis today in Afghanistan, Like what

991
00:54:02,440 --> 00:54:05,640
Speaker 1: he did in Philadelphia is exactly the same tactically as

992
00:54:05,680 --> 00:54:07,839
Speaker 1: what the US does an Afghanistan today. Like that's how

993
00:54:08,280 --> 00:54:12,800
Speaker 1: he divided Philly up for his police force. Um, because

994
00:54:12,800 --> 00:54:15,640
Speaker 1: he's he was like he was good at prosecuting an insurgency.

995
00:54:15,680 --> 00:54:18,000
Speaker 1: He knew what he he knew his business. Um, and

996
00:54:18,120 --> 00:54:20,040
Speaker 1: that's what he did to Philadelphia because it was a

997
00:54:20,120 --> 00:54:23,040
Speaker 1: military model police force. Now under Smedley Butler, the entirety

998
00:54:23,080 --> 00:54:25,880
Speaker 1: of Philadelphia's urban infrastructure was actually turned to the cause

999
00:54:26,160 --> 00:54:29,320
Speaker 1: of prosecuting his war on crime. He used the street

1000
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:32,920
Speaker 1: lights to broadcast blink codes to officers about what crimes

1001
00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:34,960
Speaker 1: were taking place where. So he would basically do like

1002
00:54:35,560 --> 00:54:41,239
Speaker 1: not semaphore, Um, what's it called? Like like like yeah,

1003
00:54:41,280 --> 00:54:43,440
Speaker 1: he would blink the street lights and morse code to

1004
00:54:43,880 --> 00:54:46,080
Speaker 1: so officers could see like, oh, there's a crime taking

1005
00:54:46,120 --> 00:54:51,200
Speaker 1: place in this street. Um. Yeah. He had four huge

1006
00:54:51,280 --> 00:54:55,799
Speaker 1: searchlights and like a big basically fucking billboard set up

1007
00:54:55,920 --> 00:54:59,560
Speaker 1: in city hall. Uh that would like display the license

1008
00:54:59,600 --> 00:55:03,080
Speaker 1: plates of cars of that like bandit vehicles that were

1009
00:55:03,120 --> 00:55:06,360
Speaker 1: in the area. Um like yeah, it's like some fucking

1010
00:55:06,520 --> 00:55:10,400
Speaker 1: Big Brothers ship. Smedley's tactics were very successful in closing

1011
00:55:10,480 --> 00:55:13,400
Speaker 1: down a huge number of Philadelphia speakeasies, but they were

1012
00:55:13,440 --> 00:55:16,960
Speaker 1: not successful and actually winning the war for prohibition. For

1013
00:55:17,080 --> 00:55:19,680
Speaker 1: one thing, a ton of officers drank, and so did

1014
00:55:19,760 --> 00:55:22,400
Speaker 1: many of the mayor's wealthy backers. These same men and

1015
00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:25,000
Speaker 1: women had a lot of business interests in upper class

1016
00:55:25,080 --> 00:55:28,240
Speaker 1: clubs and restaurants that had been serving alcohol illegally prior

1017
00:55:28,280 --> 00:55:30,480
Speaker 1: to Butler, but were forced to shut down due to

1018
00:55:30,600 --> 00:55:33,919
Speaker 1: his raids. He refused to treat the favorite watering holes

1019
00:55:33,960 --> 00:55:36,120
Speaker 1: of the wealthy any differently than hole in the wall

1020
00:55:36,239 --> 00:55:39,839
Speaker 1: slum speakeasies, and this caused increasing problems for the mayor

1021
00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:44,799
Speaker 1: who had hired him. Yeah It's Yeah, Professor Lichtman rights.

1022
00:55:45,120 --> 00:55:46,799
Speaker 1: In an attempt to divert what he saw as an

1023
00:55:46,840 --> 00:55:49,239
Speaker 1: imminent disaster, he asked Butler to meet with these men

1024
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:51,440
Speaker 1: and women, believing Butler could outline his plans and get

1025
00:55:51,480 --> 00:55:54,080
Speaker 1: their cooperation. But Butler was too brusque and did not

1026
00:55:54,239 --> 00:55:56,520
Speaker 1: handle the situation well. Instead of coming to some sort

1027
00:55:56,520 --> 00:55:59,000
Speaker 1: of compromise with these business people, he approached them as

1028
00:55:59,040 --> 00:56:01,200
Speaker 1: if he were a general informed that them that he

1029
00:56:01,280 --> 00:56:04,400
Speaker 1: intended to install a special squad of undercover detectives dressed

1030
00:56:04,400 --> 00:56:07,959
Speaker 1: in full evening attire to police these establishments. This began

1031
00:56:08,040 --> 00:56:10,920
Speaker 1: a two year battle between Butler and the hospitality industry.

1032
00:56:11,160 --> 00:56:13,040
Speaker 1: But there must have assumed that either the public would

1033
00:56:13,040 --> 00:56:15,279
Speaker 1: support these laws or that he that he could enforce

1034
00:56:15,360 --> 00:56:17,879
Speaker 1: them against public opinion. What he learned was what many

1035
00:56:17,960 --> 00:56:21,680
Speaker 1: occupying armies learned, it is often the oppressed that prevail culturally.

1036
00:56:22,000 --> 00:56:24,960
Speaker 1: Those arrested for liquor and fractions came before magistrates who

1037
00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:28,080
Speaker 1: released them for lack of evidence. When Butler began padlocking

1038
00:56:28,120 --> 00:56:32,160
Speaker 1: the establishments of persistent liquor violators, judges rejected his arguments

1039
00:56:32,200 --> 00:56:34,480
Speaker 1: and allowed the places to reopen. He also came to

1040
00:56:34,560 --> 00:56:37,239
Speaker 1: the realization that many policemen were in league with bootleggers,

1041
00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:40,920
Speaker 1: and regular citizens had their own bathroom stills. Most Philadelphians

1042
00:56:40,960 --> 00:56:43,360
Speaker 1: did not want prohibition and did everything in their power

1043
00:56:43,440 --> 00:56:49,920
Speaker 1: to thwart it. So yeah, look and and this lesson,

1044
00:56:50,680 --> 00:56:55,400
Speaker 1: this motif is so clear and so repeated everywhere that

1045
00:56:55,640 --> 00:56:59,640
Speaker 1: like you're just you're just holding onto power. And when

1046
00:56:59,680 --> 00:57:04,000
Speaker 1: you old onto power, even with ridiculous laws, you're gonna

1047
00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:06,839
Speaker 1: have to use violence. And people are going to turn

1048
00:57:06,880 --> 00:57:11,440
Speaker 1: against you because it's stupid. Yes, it's it's stupid. And

1049
00:57:11,560 --> 00:57:15,000
Speaker 1: and that's like Butler is good at running an insurgency

1050
00:57:15,200 --> 00:57:18,280
Speaker 1: the way our military has always run insurgencies. And if

1051
00:57:18,360 --> 00:57:21,280
Speaker 1: you have studied the history of our military and insurgencies,

1052
00:57:21,640 --> 00:57:25,919
Speaker 1: we almost always loose, like we don't have a great

1053
00:57:25,960 --> 00:57:29,600
Speaker 1: battgg record when it comes to fighting insurgents. Yeah, I

1054
00:57:29,720 --> 00:57:31,560
Speaker 1: think we come home. People think we come home like

1055
00:57:31,640 --> 00:57:34,200
Speaker 1: we did this country of favor and the whole country

1056
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:40,120
Speaker 1: looking at us like no, no, you know. It's interesting

1057
00:57:40,200 --> 00:57:43,160
Speaker 1: because the the U s mility, the modern US military

1058
00:57:43,440 --> 00:57:46,720
Speaker 1: is incredible at combat training, at like training people to

1059
00:57:46,960 --> 00:57:50,040
Speaker 1: fight in gunfights, and all of our training is cribbed

1060
00:57:50,120 --> 00:57:53,320
Speaker 1: and descended from German military training that started out at

1061
00:57:53,360 --> 00:57:56,919
Speaker 1: the end of World War One, um and like into

1062
00:57:57,000 --> 00:57:59,760
Speaker 1: World War two out trucks tactic is like the name

1063
00:57:59,800 --> 00:58:02,480
Speaker 1: of the kind of techniques, and the German military world

1064
00:58:02,520 --> 00:58:05,320
Speaker 1: War one and two was hands like not even brilliant,

1065
00:58:05,520 --> 00:58:08,920
Speaker 1: no fucking competition in their ability to train people to

1066
00:58:09,080 --> 00:58:13,960
Speaker 1: fight and gunfights. Yeah, historically speaking heads and shoulders, the

1067
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:17,120
Speaker 1: German military was above everybody and they lost both wars,

1068
00:58:18,320 --> 00:58:21,480
Speaker 1: which maybe is a lesson about the actual value in

1069
00:58:21,560 --> 00:58:23,840
Speaker 1: a broad sense of having your truth to be real

1070
00:58:23,920 --> 00:58:26,880
Speaker 1: fucking good at gunfights doesn't matter if you fail at

1071
00:58:26,920 --> 00:58:29,480
Speaker 1: the other ship. And that's what Butler fails at um

1072
00:58:29,760 --> 00:58:32,920
Speaker 1: is understanding the broader dimensions of the conflict he's got

1073
00:58:33,040 --> 00:58:35,320
Speaker 1: himself into. And he gets let go from his job

1074
00:58:35,400 --> 00:58:38,480
Speaker 1: running the Philadelphia Police after just two years, most of

1075
00:58:38,560 --> 00:58:41,120
Speaker 1: the changes he had instituted reverted back to the way

1076
00:58:41,200 --> 00:58:44,880
Speaker 1: things had been before. Philadelphia continued drinking, and eventually the

1077
00:58:44,920 --> 00:58:47,240
Speaker 1: whole country got over this absurd attempt to ban a

1078
00:58:47,320 --> 00:58:50,520
Speaker 1: widely used intoxicant. Now, during this period, a number of

1079
00:58:50,560 --> 00:58:53,560
Speaker 1: other cities did try the same military model police force

1080
00:58:53,640 --> 00:58:57,200
Speaker 1: tactics as Philadelphia, putting like military men in charge of

1081
00:58:57,240 --> 00:58:59,920
Speaker 1: their police. General Francis Green, you know in New York,

1082
00:59:00,200 --> 00:59:04,640
Speaker 1: Colonel James Everington in Los Angeles, Major Mattelis Funkhauser in Chicago,

1083
00:59:04,880 --> 00:59:08,800
Speaker 1: one of the best names I've ever heard. Yeah, so

1084
00:59:08,920 --> 00:59:11,200
Speaker 1: this is something we try. We try militarized police during

1085
00:59:11,240 --> 00:59:15,840
Speaker 1: Prohibition and a lot of the country, and it doesn't work. Um. Now,

1086
00:59:16,120 --> 00:59:18,880
Speaker 1: there are aspects of police militarization that get adopted in

1087
00:59:18,920 --> 00:59:20,720
Speaker 1: this period that kind of stay. For one thing, police

1088
00:59:20,840 --> 00:59:24,640
Speaker 1: nationwide begin adopting more military style weapons during this period,

1089
00:59:24,680 --> 00:59:27,600
Speaker 1: picking up automatic rifles because the gangsters have Tommy guns

1090
00:59:27,680 --> 00:59:29,760
Speaker 1: and b A. R S. You know. Um, that's the

1091
00:59:29,840 --> 00:59:31,800
Speaker 1: kind of ship that Bonnie and Clyde and you know,

1092
00:59:31,880 --> 00:59:34,760
Speaker 1: my cousin pretty boy Floyd or packing as machine guns.

1093
00:59:35,120 --> 00:59:38,360
Speaker 1: So cops get machine guns too. Uh. In general, though

1094
00:59:38,480 --> 00:59:41,480
Speaker 1: the military model of policing pursued by progressives in the

1095
00:59:41,520 --> 00:59:44,960
Speaker 1: nineteen twenties and thirties seemed to have died out with prohibition,

1096
00:59:45,120 --> 00:59:48,880
Speaker 1: the professional model espoused by Volmer was obviously superior. For

1097
00:59:48,960 --> 00:59:50,920
Speaker 1: a few decades. From the war years up until the

1098
00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:53,520
Speaker 1: nineteen sixties, the story of the US police was the

1099
00:59:53,560 --> 00:59:57,600
Speaker 1: story of growing professionalism and centralization. This was obviously an

1100
00:59:57,680 --> 01:00:00,760
Speaker 1: uneven an imperfect process, but most American probably would have

1101
01:00:00,880 --> 01:00:04,880
Speaker 1: assumed that professionalization and the professional model was pretty successful

1102
01:00:04,960 --> 01:00:07,320
Speaker 1: during this period of time. A good example would be

1103
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:09,880
Speaker 1: law enforcement success and putting an into lynching as a

1104
01:00:09,920 --> 01:00:12,600
Speaker 1: widespread phenomenon. Now, as we talked about that was not

1105
01:00:12,800 --> 01:00:15,120
Speaker 1: did not actually happen the way that it was into.

1106
01:00:15,600 --> 01:00:17,360
Speaker 1: But you gotta think about how like white people at

1107
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:20,520
Speaker 1: the time, Oh, people aren't getting lunched anymore. We fixed it. Yeah,

1108
01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:24,240
Speaker 1: you know people. Yeah, it's like give occasion where it's like,

1109
01:00:24,280 --> 01:00:28,920
Speaker 1: well crime dropped, yeah, yeah, where yea Yeah. So in

1110
01:00:29,080 --> 01:00:32,880
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty four, the TV show Dragnet first hit the airwaves,

1111
01:00:33,000 --> 01:00:36,560
Speaker 1: and Dragnet was probably the first TV show about modern

1112
01:00:36,640 --> 01:00:39,560
Speaker 1: law enforcement that or I think it was actually um,

1113
01:00:39,600 --> 01:00:41,600
Speaker 1: it was probably the first TV show about modern law

1114
01:00:41,680 --> 01:00:45,280
Speaker 1: enforcement that deliberately set out to be realistic. Every episode

1115
01:00:45,320 --> 01:00:47,440
Speaker 1: opened with the disclaimer that the cases in the series

1116
01:00:47,480 --> 01:00:49,400
Speaker 1: were all real, only the names had been changed to

1117
01:00:49,440 --> 01:00:51,880
Speaker 1: protect the innocent. Uh. The creator was a guy named

1118
01:00:51,960 --> 01:00:54,000
Speaker 1: Jack Webb, and he was also the star of the show.

1119
01:00:54,120 --> 01:00:57,920
Speaker 1: He was he was Officer Friday Um, and he partnered

1120
01:00:58,000 --> 01:00:59,960
Speaker 1: with the l a p D from the very beginning

1121
01:01:00,160 --> 01:01:02,480
Speaker 1: of the series is the very first time that ever happens,

1122
01:01:02,840 --> 01:01:04,800
Speaker 1: and partnering with the l a p D brings the

1123
01:01:04,880 --> 01:01:07,560
Speaker 1: production of Dragnet a ton of benefits. Number One, they

1124
01:01:07,560 --> 01:01:09,800
Speaker 1: were allowed to film anywhere they wanted to in the city.

1125
01:01:10,240 --> 01:01:12,959
Speaker 1: Their crew got access to police vehicles and police gear

1126
01:01:13,080 --> 01:01:15,720
Speaker 1: without paying for it. The department would even loan them

1127
01:01:15,800 --> 01:01:18,640
Speaker 1: real cops who uses extras on the show. All this

1128
01:01:18,800 --> 01:01:22,800
Speaker 1: saved the network just a fortune. Um. The only cost

1129
01:01:23,440 --> 01:01:25,400
Speaker 1: was that Dragnette scripts had to be approved by the

1130
01:01:25,560 --> 01:01:28,040
Speaker 1: l a p D before they could be filmed. Oh wow.

1131
01:01:29,840 --> 01:01:32,360
Speaker 1: Whole episodes were scrapped on the basis that the police

1132
01:01:32,400 --> 01:01:34,920
Speaker 1: didn't think they portrayed policing in a positive enough light.

1133
01:01:35,360 --> 01:01:38,200
Speaker 1: So obviously, Dragnet is not going to deal with problems

1134
01:01:38,240 --> 01:01:39,560
Speaker 1: in the l a p D. It's not going to

1135
01:01:39,680 --> 01:01:42,160
Speaker 1: deal with an equality, you know, in in in enforcement

1136
01:01:42,200 --> 01:01:46,200
Speaker 1: and stuff. Dragnet you know, legitimately broke new ground for

1137
01:01:46,240 --> 01:01:48,800
Speaker 1: American television. It was the first show to actually depict

1138
01:01:48,880 --> 01:01:52,080
Speaker 1: black and Hispanic cops, but it also failed to mention

1139
01:01:52,200 --> 01:01:57,720
Speaker 1: that the l a p D was segregated. Um. Yeah, yeah.

1140
01:01:58,400 --> 01:02:01,440
Speaker 1: There were very few instances of on Dragnet actually firing

1141
01:02:01,520 --> 01:02:04,160
Speaker 1: their guns, but whenever they did, those cops were shown

1142
01:02:04,200 --> 01:02:07,000
Speaker 1: to be calm and emotionally stable in the moment. Nobody

1143
01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:10,640
Speaker 1: ever fired in panic on dragnet Um, and the show

1144
01:02:10,760 --> 01:02:14,120
Speaker 1: helped shape a generation's attitudes towards law enforcement, portraying the

1145
01:02:14,240 --> 01:02:19,200
Speaker 1: ideal scientific, professionalized, vulmer police working almost flawlessly. Right, the

1146
01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:23,080
Speaker 1: police are just the facts, is Friday's right? Yeah, I

1147
01:02:23,160 --> 01:02:27,880
Speaker 1: was gonna a fact. Dragnet is the showing like the

1148
01:02:28,080 --> 01:02:32,440
Speaker 1: ideal of the professionalized police. That's what's depicted in dragnet Um,

1149
01:02:32,880 --> 01:02:35,000
Speaker 1: and the l a p D has a vested interest

1150
01:02:35,080 --> 01:02:37,920
Speaker 1: in wanting to make sure that gets depicted. Obviously. So

1151
01:02:38,160 --> 01:02:40,080
Speaker 1: Dragnet was so good for the l a p d

1152
01:02:40,200 --> 01:02:42,520
Speaker 1: s image and reputation that in nineteen fifty five, the

1153
01:02:42,560 --> 01:02:45,760
Speaker 1: commissioner of the California Highway Patrol demanded his Public Affairs

1154
01:02:45,800 --> 01:02:50,160
Speaker 1: division get us a show like Dragnet. Highway Patrol had

1155
01:02:50,200 --> 01:02:53,000
Speaker 1: its first season later that year. Yeah, so the Highway

1156
01:02:53,000 --> 01:02:56,000
Speaker 1: Patrol show launches next. And of course, the FBI gets

1157
01:02:56,080 --> 01:02:58,720
Speaker 1: their own version of this treatment in nineteen sixty five

1158
01:02:58,840 --> 01:03:02,560
Speaker 1: with the creatively named TV series The FBI. All of

1159
01:03:02,600 --> 01:03:05,440
Speaker 1: these shows push an idealized image of what law enforcement

1160
01:03:05,640 --> 01:03:08,720
Speaker 1: was and claimed that their fiction was very close to fact.

1161
01:03:09,240 --> 01:03:11,600
Speaker 1: Now to the extent that people bought into this myth.

1162
01:03:11,760 --> 01:03:14,360
Speaker 1: It started to puncture in nineteen sixty four as the

1163
01:03:14,400 --> 01:03:17,240
Speaker 1: civil rights movement took to the streets and US police

1164
01:03:17,280 --> 01:03:21,479
Speaker 1: responded by turning fire hoses and dogs on demonstrators. Many

1165
01:03:21,560 --> 01:03:25,360
Speaker 1: of the yeah, yeah, it's on TV. That shuts it down.

1166
01:03:26,720 --> 01:03:28,720
Speaker 1: Oh we didn't see this part of it on TV.

1167
01:03:29,280 --> 01:03:31,840
Speaker 1: Um this. These people don't seem to be interested in

1168
01:03:31,920 --> 01:03:34,120
Speaker 1: the facts. They seem to be interested in sticking dogs

1169
01:03:34,240 --> 01:03:39,320
Speaker 1: on folks. Yes, yeah, that that didn't make it into Dragnet,

1170
01:03:39,560 --> 01:03:44,120
Speaker 1: so yea. And most of the protests. Many of the

1171
01:03:44,200 --> 01:03:46,800
Speaker 1: protests and what we're called riots during this period were

1172
01:03:46,840 --> 01:03:49,880
Speaker 1: sparked one way or another by police brutality. The police

1173
01:03:49,920 --> 01:03:53,480
Speaker 1: tear gassed masses of young activists at the nine Chicago DNC,

1174
01:03:53,760 --> 01:03:55,680
Speaker 1: and from sixty seven to sixty eight there were two

1175
01:03:55,800 --> 01:03:58,640
Speaker 1: hundred ninety two mass demonstrations on a hundred and sixty

1176
01:03:58,680 --> 01:04:02,120
Speaker 1: three college campuses, Most were in opposition to the Vietnam War.

1177
01:04:02,680 --> 01:04:04,720
Speaker 1: By the end of nineteen sixty eight, vivid images of

1178
01:04:04,760 --> 01:04:07,720
Speaker 1: battered civil rights protesters, clouds of gas, and the corpses

1179
01:04:07,760 --> 01:04:11,000
Speaker 1: of those students at Kent State had very significantly reduced

1180
01:04:11,120 --> 01:04:14,800
Speaker 1: public opinion of law enforcement. Probably it's lowest EBB up

1181
01:04:14,880 --> 01:04:19,720
Speaker 1: till the present moment. Like my my grandpa was a

1182
01:04:19,840 --> 01:04:22,800
Speaker 1: lifetime military man, fought in World War Two in Korea,

1183
01:04:23,040 --> 01:04:26,960
Speaker 1: was like managing a hospital on Okinawa, on a military

1184
01:04:27,040 --> 01:04:30,160
Speaker 1: base in Japan when Kent State happens and was like

1185
01:04:30,360 --> 01:04:33,560
Speaker 1: very pro the Vietnam War, and he was fucking furious

1186
01:04:33,640 --> 01:04:36,560
Speaker 1: about Kent State because like like like that was the

1187
01:04:36,600 --> 01:04:38,400
Speaker 1: thing that Kent State lost, even like a lot of

1188
01:04:38,560 --> 01:04:40,760
Speaker 1: like pretty conservative milit because they were like, you know that,

1189
01:04:41,000 --> 01:04:43,080
Speaker 1: that's not what the militaries for. We're not supposed to

1190
01:04:43,080 --> 01:04:47,280
Speaker 1: shoot kids with signs on college campuses. Um, Like people

1191
01:04:47,600 --> 01:04:50,320
Speaker 1: get real pisted at law enforcement in this period of time.

1192
01:04:50,760 --> 01:04:53,240
Speaker 1: Uh And in nineteen sixty eight, in order to address

1193
01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:57,720
Speaker 1: the collapsing faith in law enforcement nationwide, the US Congress

1194
01:04:57,760 --> 01:05:01,960
Speaker 1: passes the Omnibus Crime Control Ole in Safe Streets Act, which,

1195
01:05:02,000 --> 01:05:05,400
Speaker 1: among other things, pumped a shipload of federal dollars into

1196
01:05:05,520 --> 01:05:08,360
Speaker 1: what dr Gary Potter, who you'll remember from other episodes,

1197
01:05:08,360 --> 01:05:12,960
Speaker 1: we've talked about calls rather cosmetic police community relations programs,

1198
01:05:13,000 --> 01:05:16,560
Speaker 1: which were mostly media focused attempts to improve the police image.

1199
01:05:16,920 --> 01:05:18,960
Speaker 1: So this is when you start getting like really advanced

1200
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:22,960
Speaker 1: public affairs departments and police departments hiring pr agencies to

1201
01:05:23,120 --> 01:05:26,040
Speaker 1: help them reform their image. And a lot of the

1202
01:05:26,120 --> 01:05:30,000
Speaker 1: effort in reforming police images was still landed on Hollywood.

1203
01:05:30,040 --> 01:05:32,920
Speaker 1: And of course in this period, Dragnet gets brought back

1204
01:05:32,960 --> 01:05:35,800
Speaker 1: for another three seasons, running from nineteen sixty seven to

1205
01:05:36,000 --> 01:05:38,760
Speaker 1: nineteen seventy. And the years that Dragnet comes back is

1206
01:05:38,800 --> 01:05:44,280
Speaker 1: not There's no coincidence there, right, Yeah, So propaganda did

1207
01:05:44,320 --> 01:05:46,880
Speaker 1: not protect the police from the economic downturns of the

1208
01:05:46,960 --> 01:05:50,480
Speaker 1: nineteen seventies, and cities nationwide started making massive cuts to

1209
01:05:50,560 --> 01:05:54,320
Speaker 1: police and other municipal workers just because the economy fell apart,

1210
01:05:54,360 --> 01:05:56,520
Speaker 1: and you know, part of this isn't a show about

1211
01:05:56,520 --> 01:05:58,120
Speaker 1: the economy, but a big part of what happens is

1212
01:05:58,240 --> 01:06:01,840
Speaker 1: like the US had started exporting a lot of manufacturing

1213
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:03,880
Speaker 1: jobs had been like this is like the first This

1214
01:06:03,920 --> 01:06:05,600
Speaker 1: is where we start to see the hollowing out of

1215
01:06:05,680 --> 01:06:08,200
Speaker 1: this middle class and of like these good union jobs

1216
01:06:08,520 --> 01:06:10,840
Speaker 1: that had persisted for decades since the end of the

1217
01:06:10,880 --> 01:06:13,880
Speaker 1: war in the seventies. This all falls to ship. Um,

1218
01:06:14,400 --> 01:06:17,280
Speaker 1: you start getting eaten alive economically by like Japan and

1219
01:06:17,360 --> 01:06:20,880
Speaker 1: other countries and its it's you know, this is when

1220
01:06:21,000 --> 01:06:24,680
Speaker 1: like services start to be cut nationwide, and one of

1221
01:06:24,720 --> 01:06:28,040
Speaker 1: the services that gets cut is policing um out of

1222
01:06:28,160 --> 01:06:35,080
Speaker 1: necessity of services. Yeah, you know what services won't be cut?

1223
01:06:35,640 --> 01:06:39,000
Speaker 1: Yeah that was good. So you know who doesn't hollow

1224
01:06:39,040 --> 01:06:44,520
Speaker 1: out the American middle class? Actually who hollows out there will? Yeah, yeah,

1225
01:06:44,600 --> 01:06:55,680
Speaker 1: there we go bred services. I'm Colleen with joined me

1226
01:06:55,880 --> 01:06:58,640
Speaker 1: the host of Eating Will Broke podcast While I eat

1227
01:06:58,680 --> 01:07:03,000
Speaker 1: a meal created by self made entrepreneurs, influencers and celebrities

1228
01:07:03,080 --> 01:07:04,959
Speaker 1: over a meal they once eight when they were broke.

1229
01:07:05,160 --> 01:07:08,360
Speaker 1: Today I have the lovely aj Crimson, the official Princess

1230
01:07:08,520 --> 01:07:13,040
Speaker 1: of Compton, Asia Kidding and Asia is the Professor. We're

1231
01:07:13,080 --> 01:07:15,840
Speaker 1: here on Eating While Broken. Today, I'm gonna break down

1232
01:07:16,400 --> 01:07:18,280
Speaker 1: my meal that got me through a time when I

1233
01:07:18,400 --> 01:07:20,920
Speaker 1: was broken. Listen to Eating While Broke on the I

1234
01:07:21,120 --> 01:07:24,080
Speaker 1: Heart Radio app, on Apple podcast or wherever you get

1235
01:07:24,160 --> 01:07:28,280
Speaker 1: your podcasts. Hey Leath the listeners take here. Last season

1236
01:07:28,320 --> 01:07:31,400
Speaker 1: on Lethal Lit, you might remember I came to Hollow

1237
01:07:31,480 --> 01:07:35,640
Speaker 1: Falls on a mission clearing my aunt best name and

1238
01:07:35,800 --> 01:07:40,520
Speaker 1: making sure justice was finally served. But I hadn't counted

1239
01:07:40,560 --> 01:07:43,280
Speaker 1: on a rash of new murders tearing apart the town.

1240
01:07:44,160 --> 01:07:48,040
Speaker 1: My mission put myself and my friends in danger. Though

1241
01:07:48,480 --> 01:07:52,080
Speaker 1: it wasn't all bad, I'm going to be realisty take

1242
01:07:53,000 --> 01:07:56,200
Speaker 1: I like you, But now all signs point to a

1243
01:07:56,320 --> 01:08:00,560
Speaker 1: new serial killer in Hollow Falls. If this game is starting,

1244
01:08:01,040 --> 01:08:05,720
Speaker 1: you better believe I'm gonna win. I'm tig Torres and

1245
01:08:05,920 --> 01:08:09,680
Speaker 1: this is Lethal Lit. Catch up on season one of

1246
01:08:09,720 --> 01:08:12,400
Speaker 1: the hit murder mystery podcast Lethal Lit, a tig Tara's

1247
01:08:12,440 --> 01:08:14,960
Speaker 1: mystery out now, and then tune in for all new

1248
01:08:15,040 --> 01:08:18,920
Speaker 1: thrills in season two, dropping weekly starting February nine. Subscribe

1249
01:08:18,960 --> 01:08:21,080
Speaker 1: now to devern miss an episode. Listen to Leave the

1250
01:08:21,160 --> 01:08:23,600
Speaker 1: Lit on the I Heart Radio app Apple podcasts or

1251
01:08:23,640 --> 01:08:28,760
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. I call the Union Hall

1252
01:08:29,080 --> 01:08:32,120
Speaker 1: as his male life and death. I thank these peeples

1253
01:08:32,120 --> 01:08:36,760
Speaker 1: of planning to kill Dr King. On April four, Dr

1254
01:08:36,840 --> 01:08:39,320
Speaker 1: Martin Luther King was shot and killed in Memphis. A

1255
01:08:39,439 --> 01:08:42,920
Speaker 1: petty criminal named James Earl Ray was arrested. He pled

1256
01:08:43,000 --> 01:08:45,000
Speaker 1: guilty to the crime and spent the rest of his

1257
01:08:45,080 --> 01:08:50,519
Speaker 1: life in prison. Case closed right, James L. Ray was

1258
01:08:50,720 --> 01:08:55,200
Speaker 1: upon for the official story. The authorities would pray at

1259
01:08:55,240 --> 01:08:58,160
Speaker 1: all we found a gun the James el Ray bought

1260
01:08:58,200 --> 01:09:02,400
Speaker 1: in Birmingham, the kill ductor, except it wasn't the gun

1261
01:09:02,479 --> 01:09:05,679
Speaker 1: that killed Dr. King. One of the problems that came

1262
01:09:05,720 --> 01:09:09,160
Speaker 1: out when I got the Ray case was that some

1263
01:09:09,400 --> 01:09:12,439
Speaker 1: of the evidence, as far as I was concerned, did

1264
01:09:12,520 --> 01:09:16,840
Speaker 1: not match the circumstances. This is the MLK tapes. The

1265
01:09:16,880 --> 01:09:20,040
Speaker 1: first episodes are available now. Listen on the I Heart

1266
01:09:20,160 --> 01:09:23,640
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

1267
01:09:28,640 --> 01:09:33,360
Speaker 1: We're back so um police departments in this period, you know,

1268
01:09:33,640 --> 01:09:36,600
Speaker 1: budgets get cut, municipal workers get cut, uh and a

1269
01:09:36,640 --> 01:09:38,600
Speaker 1: lot of the blame like as these cities who in

1270
01:09:38,640 --> 01:09:40,600
Speaker 1: a lot of cases like their budgets got fucked, not

1271
01:09:40,720 --> 01:09:42,680
Speaker 1: just because the economy was bad, bad because of like

1272
01:09:42,760 --> 01:09:45,439
Speaker 1: massive corruption, but they blame it on union workers, and

1273
01:09:45,439 --> 01:09:47,280
Speaker 1: of course police are some of the union workers in

1274
01:09:47,320 --> 01:09:49,519
Speaker 1: this period, so they get some big gas cuts and

1275
01:09:49,920 --> 01:09:53,200
Speaker 1: out of necessity because their budgets are being trimmed. UM

1276
01:09:53,240 --> 01:09:57,240
Speaker 1: police departments nationwide embark on a process called tailorization, which

1277
01:09:57,360 --> 01:10:00,439
Speaker 1: is tailorization hat doesn't just happen to the least. It's

1278
01:10:00,479 --> 01:10:04,559
Speaker 1: like a scientific optimization of of of of of an organization, right.

1279
01:10:04,640 --> 01:10:10,040
Speaker 1: It's attempting to cut manpower and reduce costs without cutting efficiency.

1280
01:10:10,640 --> 01:10:13,160
Speaker 1: UM officers started going from two cop to one cop

1281
01:10:13,240 --> 01:10:15,639
Speaker 1: per patrol car and nine on one lines, and computers

1282
01:10:15,680 --> 01:10:19,120
Speaker 1: became more widespread and put control of the police UH

1283
01:10:19,320 --> 01:10:23,280
Speaker 1: is centralized more so police administrators gain more power. Civilian

1284
01:10:23,320 --> 01:10:25,920
Speaker 1: employees are also brought in to do jobs that had

1285
01:10:25,960 --> 01:10:28,160
Speaker 1: been done by police employees in order to reduce the

1286
01:10:28,240 --> 01:10:32,120
Speaker 1: number of highly paid union workers. So this is tailorization.

1287
01:10:32,200 --> 01:10:34,840
Speaker 1: And while all this is happening inside the US, the

1288
01:10:34,920 --> 01:10:37,640
Speaker 1: Cold War is also happening outside of the US, So

1289
01:10:37,760 --> 01:10:41,839
Speaker 1: inside the country, professionalism is kind of like the professional

1290
01:10:41,960 --> 01:10:44,640
Speaker 1: model of police are still dominant, and they're also like

1291
01:10:44,760 --> 01:10:48,240
Speaker 1: that becomes even more powerful and ideas as the number

1292
01:10:48,280 --> 01:10:50,080
Speaker 1: of police are cut and they have to get more

1293
01:10:50,160 --> 01:10:52,680
Speaker 1: efficient to try to do the same work. So that's

1294
01:10:52,720 --> 01:10:56,840
Speaker 1: what's happening in the US. Outside the US, though, international

1295
01:10:56,920 --> 01:11:00,479
Speaker 1: policing is having something very different happened to it. And

1296
01:11:00,880 --> 01:11:03,000
Speaker 1: this is as a result of the Cold War. So

1297
01:11:03,640 --> 01:11:06,880
Speaker 1: as the Cold War really starts to kick off, our

1298
01:11:06,960 --> 01:11:10,080
Speaker 1: government finds itself trying to prop up friendly states all

1299
01:11:10,120 --> 01:11:13,519
Speaker 1: around the world, you know, anti communist states, particularly in

1300
01:11:13,600 --> 01:11:17,080
Speaker 1: Latin America and Southeast Asia, and we go, Yeah, this

1301
01:11:17,240 --> 01:11:19,960
Speaker 1: proved problematic because a lot of these regimes were corrupt

1302
01:11:20,000 --> 01:11:22,360
Speaker 1: in brutal and people didn't really like living underneath them.

1303
01:11:22,760 --> 01:11:24,800
Speaker 1: H And as a rule, our government responded to that

1304
01:11:24,920 --> 01:11:28,480
Speaker 1: by pouring money into training foreign police to murder dissidents,

1305
01:11:28,560 --> 01:11:31,160
Speaker 1: because that works a lot better than training the army

1306
01:11:31,200 --> 01:11:35,320
Speaker 1: in a lot of cases. So from nineteen sixty two

1307
01:11:35,360 --> 01:11:39,160
Speaker 1: to nineteen seventy four, the US government operated the Office

1308
01:11:39,240 --> 01:11:41,840
Speaker 1: of Public Safety, an agency that worked closely with the

1309
01:11:41,920 --> 01:11:44,760
Speaker 1: CIA to train police and nations racked by conflict due

1310
01:11:44,800 --> 01:11:49,920
Speaker 1: to the Cold War. These nations included South Vietnam, Iran, Uruguay, Argentina, Brazil,

1311
01:11:50,040 --> 01:11:52,880
Speaker 1: and Colombia. Tens of thousands of people were tortured or

1312
01:11:52,960 --> 01:11:55,679
Speaker 1: killed by various police departments who received over two hundred

1313
01:11:55,720 --> 01:11:58,600
Speaker 1: million dollars in US aid for firearm and equipment. And

1314
01:11:58,640 --> 01:12:00,360
Speaker 1: I'm gonna quote now from an art cold in the

1315
01:12:00,400 --> 01:12:03,000
Speaker 1: Age before you get there, there's there's one that's off

1316
01:12:03,040 --> 01:12:05,400
Speaker 1: the papers, which I know you haven't done an episode on,

1317
01:12:05,560 --> 01:12:08,560
Speaker 1: but like there is there is the Nicaragua one that

1318
01:12:09,840 --> 01:12:12,000
Speaker 1: they wasn't supposed to be spending money on, which is

1319
01:12:12,080 --> 01:12:15,360
Speaker 1: the B line. Y'all, looklyly, look, I'm excited, but I

1320
01:12:15,400 --> 01:12:17,360
Speaker 1: don't want to remove. I don't want to ruin the reveal.

1321
01:12:17,760 --> 01:12:20,880
Speaker 1: But what he's talked about right now leads directly to

1322
01:12:21,000 --> 01:12:23,599
Speaker 1: the crack attack and the war on drugs. But yeah,

1323
01:12:24,040 --> 01:12:25,760
Speaker 1: and I know we're gonna get to that. No, we're not,

1324
01:12:25,960 --> 01:12:28,400
Speaker 1: not nearly, because I I I don't want to half

1325
01:12:28,400 --> 01:12:31,240
Speaker 1: asked that one, like, because there's there's so much. Yeah,

1326
01:12:31,280 --> 01:12:34,080
Speaker 1: well we will, we will do, we will get into that,

1327
01:12:34,240 --> 01:12:36,920
Speaker 1: we'll dip in because because it's all tied in, it's

1328
01:12:36,960 --> 01:12:39,400
Speaker 1: the beginning of it. Even this like pr stuff. I

1329
01:12:39,520 --> 01:12:42,040
Speaker 1: grew up with the DARE program, you know, the drug

1330
01:12:42,120 --> 01:12:45,280
Speaker 1: abuse where with a cop car pulled up with the

1331
01:12:45,360 --> 01:12:48,640
Speaker 1: sirens at my elementary school to try to convince me

1332
01:12:48,760 --> 01:12:50,599
Speaker 1: that this cop is cool, you know what I'm saying.

1333
01:12:51,720 --> 01:12:55,519
Speaker 1: But yeah, anyway, were paying for wars and we got

1334
01:12:55,600 --> 01:13:00,799
Speaker 1: paid in crack. Yeah yeah, so um yeah. The CIA

1335
01:13:01,080 --> 01:13:03,360
Speaker 1: and you know, the US government starts training cops and

1336
01:13:03,439 --> 01:13:07,679
Speaker 1: all of these countries to suppress uh, you know, primarily

1337
01:13:07,760 --> 01:13:10,920
Speaker 1: left wing like political movements. And I'm gonna quote now

1338
01:13:10,960 --> 01:13:13,240
Speaker 1: from an article in the Asia Pacific Journal by scholar

1339
01:13:13,320 --> 01:13:16,360
Speaker 1: Jeremy Kazmarov, who's like one of the top like people

1340
01:13:16,520 --> 01:13:21,120
Speaker 1: studying this particular phenomenon. Quote. During the mid nineteen sixties,

1341
01:13:21,160 --> 01:13:24,080
Speaker 1: the director of United States Agency of International Development USA,

1342
01:13:24,240 --> 01:13:27,960
Speaker 1: David Bell, commented in congressional testimony that the police are

1343
01:13:28,120 --> 01:13:30,920
Speaker 1: the most sensitive point of contact between the government and

1344
01:13:31,000 --> 01:13:33,519
Speaker 1: people close to the focal points of unrest, and more

1345
01:13:33,560 --> 01:13:36,160
Speaker 1: acceptable than the army as keepers of order over long

1346
01:13:36,240 --> 01:13:38,840
Speaker 1: periods of time. The police are frequently better trained and

1347
01:13:38,880 --> 01:13:42,480
Speaker 1: equipped than the military to deal with minor forms of violence, conspiracy,

1348
01:13:42,560 --> 01:13:46,160
Speaker 1: and subversion. Robert W. U Comber, who served as the

1349
01:13:46,320 --> 01:13:49,679
Speaker 1: National Security Council advisor to President John F. Kennedy, further

1350
01:13:49,760 --> 01:13:52,839
Speaker 1: stress that the police were more valuable than Special Forces

1351
01:13:52,920 --> 01:13:56,560
Speaker 1: and our global counter insurgency efforts, and particularly useful in

1352
01:13:56,640 --> 01:13:59,600
Speaker 1: fighting urban insurrections. We get more from the police in

1353
01:13:59,680 --> 01:14:03,000
Speaker 1: terms of preventative medicine than from any single U S program,

1354
01:14:03,080 --> 01:14:05,360
Speaker 1: he said. They are cost effective while not going for

1355
01:14:05,479 --> 01:14:08,559
Speaker 1: fancy military hardware. They provide the first line of defense

1356
01:14:08,600 --> 01:14:12,759
Speaker 1: against demonstrations, riots, and local insurrections. Only when the situation

1357
01:14:12,840 --> 01:14:15,160
Speaker 1: gets out of hand, as in South Vietnam does the

1358
01:14:15,200 --> 01:14:18,080
Speaker 1: military have to be called in. So again that's that's

1359
01:14:18,120 --> 01:14:21,719
Speaker 1: the police. The police are especially as Vietnam goes badly

1360
01:14:22,120 --> 01:14:24,680
Speaker 1: in other countries, we increasingly see if you if you

1361
01:14:24,920 --> 01:14:28,439
Speaker 1: train the police to stop this ship before there's a

1362
01:14:28,479 --> 01:14:32,040
Speaker 1: strong left wing movement, you don't have a Vietnam which

1363
01:14:32,080 --> 01:14:35,720
Speaker 1: you then lose. Right, That's that's what Yeah, So that's

1364
01:14:35,760 --> 01:14:38,840
Speaker 1: internationally what the US is doing to other police agencies.

1365
01:14:38,920 --> 01:14:42,240
Speaker 1: As our police agencies, you know, pull back from the

1366
01:14:42,280 --> 01:14:45,519
Speaker 1: militarization of the twenties and thirties and towards professionalism. We

1367
01:14:45,840 --> 01:14:48,760
Speaker 1: we push militarization in a lot of ways. Outside of

1368
01:14:48,800 --> 01:14:52,120
Speaker 1: the United States. Some fifteen hundred Americans were involved in

1369
01:14:52,200 --> 01:14:55,200
Speaker 1: training more than a million foreign police officers during this time.

1370
01:14:55,520 --> 01:14:57,759
Speaker 1: Now many of those cops did fail in their duties,

1371
01:14:57,800 --> 01:15:00,160
Speaker 1: which is part of why South Vietnam is no anger

1372
01:15:00,240 --> 01:15:03,200
Speaker 1: a country and why Iran does not have a shot anymore. Um,

1373
01:15:03,720 --> 01:15:06,639
Speaker 1: but the suppression tactics taught by US police educators were

1374
01:15:06,760 --> 01:15:10,000
Speaker 1: successful in many other nations. Like it does not always fail.

1375
01:15:10,120 --> 01:15:12,280
Speaker 1: We are not always bad at training these people to

1376
01:15:12,400 --> 01:15:15,080
Speaker 1: brutally stop left wing uprising because it works a lot

1377
01:15:15,160 --> 01:15:17,160
Speaker 1: of the time. And when the office is they're like,

1378
01:15:17,400 --> 01:15:19,519
Speaker 1: oh wait, real quick, this is like the perfect time

1379
01:15:20,040 --> 01:15:23,519
Speaker 1: to like take like a take a take a slice

1380
01:15:23,560 --> 01:15:26,679
Speaker 1: from like the hood politics way a way of thinking things,

1381
01:15:26,960 --> 01:15:31,760
Speaker 1: thinking of things because sometimes like using these terms can

1382
01:15:32,200 --> 01:15:34,360
Speaker 1: they're so lofty and big if you don't know history

1383
01:15:34,479 --> 01:15:37,599
Speaker 1: or military politics, like it's hard to understand them. It's

1384
01:15:37,880 --> 01:15:41,479
Speaker 1: this moment in history is so like it's so simple

1385
01:15:42,200 --> 01:15:47,519
Speaker 1: because it's just eighth grade. So like you, you're there,

1386
01:15:47,640 --> 01:15:50,160
Speaker 1: You and this you and this other boy or girl

1387
01:15:50,280 --> 01:15:54,439
Speaker 1: are beefan, but y'all never actually fight. You just keep

1388
01:15:54,520 --> 01:15:59,240
Speaker 1: bringing other kids around the fight. So by and I'll

1389
01:15:59,280 --> 01:16:01,840
Speaker 1: prove it. Mass out of the playground is better because

1390
01:16:01,920 --> 01:16:05,080
Speaker 1: this kid from who I propped up and trained and

1391
01:16:05,240 --> 01:16:08,040
Speaker 1: gave a rock through at another kid who's got a

1392
01:16:08,160 --> 01:16:10,439
Speaker 1: rock that's on your side of the playground, and that's

1393
01:16:10,520 --> 01:16:14,600
Speaker 1: proven that I'm hard. But it's really they fighting a

1394
01:16:14,760 --> 01:16:17,240
Speaker 1: fight that me and you are supposed to fight. But

1395
01:16:17,360 --> 01:16:19,680
Speaker 1: we got sense enough to know we've probably been not

1396
01:16:19,800 --> 01:16:22,720
Speaker 1: fight this fight, so I'm gonna let you fight it. Really,

1397
01:16:22,800 --> 01:16:26,280
Speaker 1: that's the Cold War is yeah, you're you're going, I'm

1398
01:16:26,320 --> 01:16:28,920
Speaker 1: gonna go get my little homeboy to funk up yo,

1399
01:16:29,000 --> 01:16:35,000
Speaker 1: little homeboy. That's that's that's the Cold War. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly,

1400
01:16:35,760 --> 01:16:40,320
Speaker 1: um so yeah, uh so yeah, we we we have

1401
01:16:40,600 --> 01:16:43,760
Speaker 1: we we spend fucking a decade or more training all

1402
01:16:43,840 --> 01:16:48,800
Speaker 1: these foreign police agencies to act homeboys. Yeah, counter insurgey Yeah,

1403
01:16:48,800 --> 01:16:51,920
Speaker 1: our little homeboys to access counterinsurgency forces. Uh And when

1404
01:16:51,960 --> 01:16:54,559
Speaker 1: the Office for Public Safety closes in nineteen seventy four,

1405
01:16:55,000 --> 01:16:58,400
Speaker 1: these police trainers needed still needed work. Like these guys

1406
01:16:58,400 --> 01:17:01,080
Speaker 1: who'd spent more than a decade training foreign cops, and

1407
01:17:01,160 --> 01:17:04,400
Speaker 1: they find more work, and it's inside of the United States.

1408
01:17:04,479 --> 01:17:07,400
Speaker 1: It's this time alex fatality rights in the end of

1409
01:17:07,439 --> 01:17:10,639
Speaker 1: policing quote. Many of the trainers moved in large numbers

1410
01:17:10,680 --> 01:17:14,320
Speaker 1: into law enforcement, including the Drug Enforcement Agency FBI and

1411
01:17:14,439 --> 01:17:16,880
Speaker 1: numerous local and state police forces, bringing with them a

1412
01:17:16,920 --> 01:17:20,080
Speaker 1: more militarized vision of policing steeped in Cold War imperatives

1413
01:17:20,120 --> 01:17:25,120
Speaker 1: of suppressing social movements through counterintelligence, militarized riot suppression techniques,

1414
01:17:25,280 --> 01:17:29,400
Speaker 1: and heavy handed crime control. Now in the middle of

1415
01:17:29,439 --> 01:17:32,519
Speaker 1: this period, like right before that office closes, really like

1416
01:17:32,600 --> 01:17:34,439
Speaker 1: in nineteen seventy one, so a couple of years before

1417
01:17:34,479 --> 01:17:37,600
Speaker 1: we stopped training the police, you know, foreign police in

1418
01:17:37,680 --> 01:17:40,679
Speaker 1: this kind of organized way. Uh, not that we stopped entirely,

1419
01:17:40,760 --> 01:17:42,559
Speaker 1: but like the way we had been, you know, we're

1420
01:17:42,600 --> 01:17:45,759
Speaker 1: even less of it. In nineteen seventy one, Richard Millhouse

1421
01:17:45,840 --> 01:17:50,120
Speaker 1: Nixon declared drug abuse public Enemy number one. Soon after

1422
01:17:50,200 --> 01:17:52,880
Speaker 1: that declaration, US press began to discuss a new war

1423
01:17:53,080 --> 01:17:56,600
Speaker 1: on drugs. Now, this war was launched just as the

1424
01:17:56,720 --> 01:17:59,680
Speaker 1: US war in Vietnam started to finally end and spoilers,

1425
01:18:00,160 --> 01:18:03,800
Speaker 1: it wasn't any more successful. Nixon's goal, though, had never

1426
01:18:03,880 --> 01:18:06,559
Speaker 1: actually been to stop drug use. He started the war

1427
01:18:06,640 --> 01:18:08,720
Speaker 1: on drugs because he wanted to win the support of

1428
01:18:08,800 --> 01:18:12,760
Speaker 1: southern white voters who had gone Democratic for generations. These

1429
01:18:12,800 --> 01:18:16,040
Speaker 1: people were furious about segregation, and they were pushing back

1430
01:18:16,120 --> 01:18:20,400
Speaker 1: at the success of desegregation. Um, they considered civil rights

1431
01:18:20,479 --> 01:18:22,560
Speaker 1: marchers to have been just looters and rioters, but the

1432
01:18:22,640 --> 01:18:26,439
Speaker 1: weak LBJ administration had failed to murder these people. Professor

1433
01:18:26,520 --> 01:18:30,599
Speaker 1: in legal scholar Michelle Alexander explains quote posters and political

1434
01:18:30,680 --> 01:18:33,639
Speaker 1: strategists that found that thinly veiled promises to get tough

1435
01:18:33,760 --> 01:18:36,800
Speaker 1: on them, a group suddenly not so defined by race,

1436
01:18:37,120 --> 01:18:40,080
Speaker 1: was enormously successful in persuading poor and working class whites

1437
01:18:40,120 --> 01:18:43,200
Speaker 1: did effect from the Democratic New Deal Coalition and joined

1438
01:18:43,200 --> 01:18:46,720
Speaker 1: the Republican Party and droves. Ultimately, this backlash against the

1439
01:18:46,720 --> 01:18:49,280
Speaker 1: civil rights movement was occurring at precisely the same moment

1440
01:18:49,520 --> 01:18:52,599
Speaker 1: that there was economic collapse in communities of color, intercity

1441
01:18:52,600 --> 01:18:55,519
Speaker 1: communities across America. And of course, again we're talking about

1442
01:18:55,520 --> 01:18:57,360
Speaker 1: the seventies. We're going at a period where the economy

1443
01:18:57,400 --> 01:19:01,960
Speaker 1: contracts massively and it hits black inner city communities worse

1444
01:19:02,040 --> 01:19:05,519
Speaker 1: than anyone else. Um. And what is the number one

1445
01:19:05,560 --> 01:19:10,160
Speaker 1: predictor of crime, particularly pop property crime. It's poverty. Yeah.

1446
01:19:10,800 --> 01:19:14,720
Speaker 1: And and we're there's even like a a tie to

1447
01:19:14,800 --> 01:19:21,640
Speaker 1: that moment now of how changing the language from we

1448
01:19:21,840 --> 01:19:26,160
Speaker 1: just hate black people too, we're having a war on

1449
01:19:26,360 --> 01:19:31,000
Speaker 1: drugs um we're the fact that we call weed marijuana.

1450
01:19:32,160 --> 01:19:34,760
Speaker 1: It's just it's just a Spanish word for cannabis. But

1451
01:19:34,920 --> 01:19:39,400
Speaker 1: that's marketing because you because if we already hate Mexicans

1452
01:19:39,680 --> 01:19:42,680
Speaker 1: as a nation and you use this drug and you

1453
01:19:42,840 --> 01:19:45,720
Speaker 1: just refer to it by its Spanish name, now it

1454
01:19:45,840 --> 01:19:48,920
Speaker 1: seems more evil. It was just it was a racist

1455
01:19:49,040 --> 01:19:53,759
Speaker 1: marketing that we call cannabis marijuana. But just and that's Nixon.

1456
01:19:53,840 --> 01:19:58,960
Speaker 1: I just want y'all knowe Nixon did that anyway, Yeah, yeah,

1457
01:19:59,400 --> 01:20:03,320
Speaker 1: m so yeah. The backlash against the success of the

1458
01:20:03,320 --> 01:20:05,400
Speaker 1: civil rights movement reaches its height kind of just as

1459
01:20:05,560 --> 01:20:08,000
Speaker 1: unemployment in the inner city peaks and the consequences of

1460
01:20:08,080 --> 01:20:11,519
Speaker 1: the industrialization and globalization hit the U. S economy, so

1461
01:20:11,600 --> 01:20:15,000
Speaker 1: crime sores and suddenly a shipload of people find themselves

1462
01:20:15,080 --> 01:20:18,000
Speaker 1: impoverished and desperate without options, and the war on drugs

1463
01:20:18,120 --> 01:20:20,840
Speaker 1: gives the government a way to take huge numbers of

1464
01:20:20,880 --> 01:20:23,760
Speaker 1: these people, primarily these black and brown people, off the

1465
01:20:23,840 --> 01:20:28,040
Speaker 1: street and satisfy white voters that they're doing something about crime. Now,

1466
01:20:28,160 --> 01:20:31,440
Speaker 1: drug use was actually falling when Nixon made his announcement,

1467
01:20:31,479 --> 01:20:33,880
Speaker 1: and it had been falling for years drug abuse, but

1468
01:20:34,000 --> 01:20:37,799
Speaker 1: blaming drugs rather than unregulated capitalism, hollowing out the American

1469
01:20:37,800 --> 01:20:40,360
Speaker 1: middle class, and exchange for corporate profits worked a lot

1470
01:20:40,479 --> 01:20:46,760
Speaker 1: better from a messaging standpoint for the Republican president in yeah, exactly,

1471
01:20:47,320 --> 01:20:50,160
Speaker 1: in nineteen eighty two, Ronald Reagan doubled down declaring an

1472
01:20:50,200 --> 01:20:52,960
Speaker 1: official war on drugs, even though only three percent of

1473
01:20:53,000 --> 01:20:55,200
Speaker 1: Americans at the time considered drug abuse to be the

1474
01:20:55,280 --> 01:20:59,280
Speaker 1: nation's most pressing issue. Since the existing tailorized US police

1475
01:20:59,320 --> 01:21:02,280
Speaker 1: were ill equipped to fight a war, President Reagan had

1476
01:21:02,320 --> 01:21:04,639
Speaker 1: to start pouring tens of millions of dollars of federal

1477
01:21:04,760 --> 01:21:08,519
Speaker 1: funds into turning law enforcement into an army. Now, the

1478
01:21:08,640 --> 01:21:11,400
Speaker 1: broad trend, so this occurs. Reagan starts pumping all this

1479
01:21:11,560 --> 01:21:14,000
Speaker 1: money in as these these guys who had been these

1480
01:21:14,120 --> 01:21:16,920
Speaker 1: US guys who have been training foreign military forces oversee

1481
01:21:17,120 --> 01:21:19,679
Speaker 1: sees start coming back to the country and training cops.

1482
01:21:19,920 --> 01:21:21,599
Speaker 1: So there's a number of things kind of happening at

1483
01:21:21,640 --> 01:21:24,560
Speaker 1: the same time that lead to and are are a

1484
01:21:24,680 --> 01:21:29,040
Speaker 1: part of police militarization. Um. Now, the broad trend that

1485
01:21:29,080 --> 01:21:31,519
Speaker 1: occurs throughout the nineteen seventies and eighties as a result

1486
01:21:31,560 --> 01:21:35,000
Speaker 1: of all this is that US police nationwide turn away

1487
01:21:35,080 --> 01:21:38,920
Speaker 1: from the professional model and towards a military model, not

1488
01:21:39,160 --> 01:21:41,680
Speaker 1: a different in a military model pretty similar to the

1489
01:21:41,720 --> 01:21:45,720
Speaker 1: one that General Butler proposed to defeat bootlegging in Philadelphia. Um.

1490
01:21:45,960 --> 01:21:49,120
Speaker 1: This process was not smooth or uniform, and it was

1491
01:21:49,200 --> 01:21:52,200
Speaker 1: not all due to the War on drugs. The Watts

1492
01:21:52,240 --> 01:21:55,759
Speaker 1: Rebellion of nineteen sixty five was a major inciting incident

1493
01:21:55,840 --> 01:21:58,360
Speaker 1: for the militarization of US police. And the short story,

1494
01:21:58,640 --> 01:22:02,120
Speaker 1: the almost criminal lee short story of the Watts Rebellion

1495
01:22:02,320 --> 01:22:05,800
Speaker 1: is this, a black motorist was was pulled over, um

1496
01:22:06,000 --> 01:22:08,400
Speaker 1: and like there was a confrontation again with the police.

1497
01:22:08,479 --> 01:22:11,160
Speaker 1: Conmmunity members confronted the cops as like this guy was

1498
01:22:11,200 --> 01:22:14,760
Speaker 1: getting arrested, and a fight ensued. Um one of the

1499
01:22:14,840 --> 01:22:17,800
Speaker 1: cops I injured a pregnant woman, or at least people

1500
01:22:18,280 --> 01:22:20,600
Speaker 1: in the crowd believed that a cop had injured a

1501
01:22:20,640 --> 01:22:23,960
Speaker 1: pregnant woman and kind of rage over this whole incident

1502
01:22:24,160 --> 01:22:26,800
Speaker 1: boils over and like acts as a match stick. So like,

1503
01:22:26,840 --> 01:22:29,719
Speaker 1: obviously the l A p d had been hideously racist

1504
01:22:29,760 --> 01:22:31,240
Speaker 1: for a long time. One of the things that happens

1505
01:22:31,240 --> 01:22:33,680
Speaker 1: when Jim crow Win's is that the police chief of

1506
01:22:33,840 --> 01:22:37,720
Speaker 1: l A starts liberally courting Southern police officers who are like,

1507
01:22:37,880 --> 01:22:40,080
Speaker 1: this is history. Yeah, if you're if you're pissed about

1508
01:22:40,160 --> 01:22:42,840
Speaker 1: Jim Crow ending, come to Los Angeles, We'll let you

1509
01:22:42,920 --> 01:22:45,360
Speaker 1: beat the ship out of black people. M making this

1510
01:22:45,439 --> 01:22:48,000
Speaker 1: stuff up? Yeah, I could not. I thought we brought

1511
01:22:48,040 --> 01:22:50,439
Speaker 1: this up before and one of the older episodes we

1512
01:22:50,520 --> 01:22:52,760
Speaker 1: didn't get into it or not. Did you get into it? Yeah?

1513
01:22:53,439 --> 01:22:55,880
Speaker 1: Did I tell you all my watch Riot story? No? No, no,

1514
01:22:56,040 --> 01:22:57,800
Speaker 1: please do. This is a good time for it. Yeah,

1515
01:22:57,920 --> 01:23:00,479
Speaker 1: it's a good time for it. So it was during

1516
01:23:00,520 --> 01:23:02,880
Speaker 1: the La Riots. It is how my story starts. Um,

1517
01:23:03,640 --> 01:23:07,679
Speaker 1: my grandmother, you know La Riots was you know Florence

1518
01:23:07,720 --> 01:23:11,559
Speaker 1: and Normandy. Right, grandmother lived off Florence Engage, so it's

1519
01:23:11,560 --> 01:23:15,680
Speaker 1: just a few more blocks to the east. Um, my

1520
01:23:15,880 --> 01:23:19,559
Speaker 1: father calls my grandmother and she said, and he says, like, hey,

1521
01:23:19,600 --> 01:23:21,240
Speaker 1: why don't you come stay with us? We were living

1522
01:23:21,280 --> 01:23:24,559
Speaker 1: like maybe a fifteen minutes east. Right, So he says,

1523
01:23:24,880 --> 01:23:26,760
Speaker 1: why don't you come stay with us? You're out of

1524
01:23:26,880 --> 01:23:30,519
Speaker 1: like the hotspot in South Central And my grandmother says,

1525
01:23:31,760 --> 01:23:35,720
Speaker 1: if I'm lying, I'm flying. She says, baby, unless there's

1526
01:23:35,760 --> 01:23:38,519
Speaker 1: tanks coming down this street, I ain't going nowhere this house.

1527
01:23:39,200 --> 01:23:42,360
Speaker 1: And I and I went, my grandma's a gangster. That's

1528
01:23:42,400 --> 01:23:44,519
Speaker 1: the hardest thing I ever heard in my life. Right,

1529
01:23:44,880 --> 01:23:46,559
Speaker 1: and then my but my parents looked at each other

1530
01:23:47,120 --> 01:23:51,200
Speaker 1: and I was like, tanks, she's hard. They go, she

1531
01:23:51,360 --> 01:23:55,240
Speaker 1: lived in the Watts Riots and the like history came alive.

1532
01:23:55,680 --> 01:23:57,800
Speaker 1: They're like, yo, she she lived through the watch Riots.

1533
01:23:58,040 --> 01:24:00,719
Speaker 1: That's what she's referring to. Tanks came down our streets.

1534
01:24:01,080 --> 01:24:04,560
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, because I thought the l A

1535
01:24:04,680 --> 01:24:07,320
Speaker 1: Riots was the end of the world. SE's what I'm saying. Like,

1536
01:24:07,720 --> 01:24:09,439
Speaker 1: you know, I'm a preteen during its time, so I

1537
01:24:09,560 --> 01:24:11,400
Speaker 1: was like, this is the end of the world. Grandma

1538
01:24:11,479 --> 01:24:16,880
Speaker 1: is like, no, baby, tanks come down the streets anyway. Yeah. Yeah.

1539
01:24:17,000 --> 01:24:21,280
Speaker 1: And that's like the Watts Riot is is fucking wild. Um. So,

1540
01:24:22,240 --> 01:24:24,960
Speaker 1: like there's a ton of anger, uh and like black

1541
01:24:25,000 --> 01:24:27,519
Speaker 1: and Hispanic communities towards the lap. Another thing that's happening

1542
01:24:27,600 --> 01:24:29,560
Speaker 1: is like the l a PD is also separately but

1543
01:24:29,760 --> 01:24:33,960
Speaker 1: but at the same time horrifically suppressing the Chicano Liberation movement,

1544
01:24:33,960 --> 01:24:36,800
Speaker 1: which is like the like Mexicans and Latinos in l

1545
01:24:36,840 --> 01:24:39,439
Speaker 1: a UM and like at one point murders a journalist

1546
01:24:39,479 --> 01:24:41,240
Speaker 1: who's like drinking at a bar by shooting him in

1547
01:24:41,240 --> 01:24:42,840
Speaker 1: the back of the head with a tear gas grenade.

1548
01:24:42,920 --> 01:24:45,760
Speaker 1: Hunter Thompson actually wrote one of his best pieces of

1549
01:24:45,840 --> 01:24:48,960
Speaker 1: investigative journalism about all of that, and in fact, Fear

1550
01:24:49,000 --> 01:24:52,280
Speaker 1: and Loathing in Las Vegas. Yeah, oh yeah, shit, yeah,

1551
01:24:52,880 --> 01:24:54,559
Speaker 1: it happened in my neighborhood. I live in Boyle Heights,

1552
01:24:54,640 --> 01:24:57,880
Speaker 1: like ship, Oh yeah, that happened the neighborhood. Yeah yeah,

1553
01:24:57,960 --> 01:25:00,800
Speaker 1: Ruben Salazar and like so if like Fear and Loathing

1554
01:25:00,800 --> 01:25:03,080
Speaker 1: in Las Vegas, like the funny, silly Hunter Thompson movie,

1555
01:25:03,080 --> 01:25:04,960
Speaker 1: we all know the actual genesis of that. The real

1556
01:25:05,080 --> 01:25:07,600
Speaker 1: thing that happened that he was actually writing about was

1557
01:25:07,680 --> 01:25:09,880
Speaker 1: one of the leaders at the Chicano Liberation movement was

1558
01:25:09,960 --> 01:25:13,240
Speaker 1: this guy Oscar at Costam, who was Hunter's lawyer, and

1559
01:25:14,040 --> 01:25:17,160
Speaker 1: he like the reason that he and Hunter Thompson drove

1560
01:25:17,400 --> 01:25:20,000
Speaker 1: to Las Vegas is that they needed to have a

1561
01:25:20,080 --> 01:25:22,400
Speaker 1: conversation about what the l a p d Was doing

1562
01:25:22,479 --> 01:25:26,840
Speaker 1: to murder Hispanic activists in Los Angeles. And the only

1563
01:25:26,920 --> 01:25:30,640
Speaker 1: place that wouldn't be bugged would be a fucking a

1564
01:25:30,760 --> 01:25:33,439
Speaker 1: convertible car with the top down driving through the desert

1565
01:25:33,600 --> 01:25:36,680
Speaker 1: in New Mexico. Or not New Mexico and uh yeah,

1566
01:25:36,760 --> 01:25:38,519
Speaker 1: you know, you know what I'm talking about. Like that's

1567
01:25:38,880 --> 01:25:40,560
Speaker 1: that's what fear and loathing is. Is like this is

1568
01:25:40,600 --> 01:25:42,280
Speaker 1: all tied up in this so like all of this

1569
01:25:42,400 --> 01:25:47,880
Speaker 1: ship fucking explodes um into into anger uh at the

1570
01:25:48,080 --> 01:25:51,200
Speaker 1: or like into the Watts riots in in nineteen sixty five,

1571
01:25:51,640 --> 01:25:53,479
Speaker 1: and like the stuff that happened with Ruben Salazar and

1572
01:25:53,520 --> 01:25:55,040
Speaker 1: stuff was like five years after this, but like all

1573
01:25:55,120 --> 01:25:57,639
Speaker 1: of these this like racism and stuff is still happening.

1574
01:25:58,000 --> 01:26:01,240
Speaker 1: So like the this fight winds up just kind of

1575
01:26:01,320 --> 01:26:03,360
Speaker 1: for whatever reason being the thing that ignites all of

1576
01:26:03,400 --> 01:26:05,640
Speaker 1: the anger in in this part of Los Angeles, and

1577
01:26:06,040 --> 01:26:09,040
Speaker 1: it's the Watts riots is what most history text will

1578
01:26:09,080 --> 01:26:11,360
Speaker 1: call it. The Uprising is another thing you'll hear that

1579
01:26:11,400 --> 01:26:14,400
Speaker 1: I think is probably more accurate. And the uprising included

1580
01:26:14,439 --> 01:26:17,720
Speaker 1: a shipload of angry black folks breaking into gun stores, um,

1581
01:26:17,880 --> 01:26:21,160
Speaker 1: getting guns and then sniping at l A p D officers.

1582
01:26:21,560 --> 01:26:24,080
Speaker 1: This is a thing that happens, and it the cops

1583
01:26:24,240 --> 01:26:26,960
Speaker 1: flip the funk out about it. Um. The police chief

1584
01:26:27,080 --> 01:26:30,160
Speaker 1: gets on television and compares what's happening and Watts to

1585
01:26:30,200 --> 01:26:33,240
Speaker 1: what the insurgency in Vietnam. He compares the rioters to

1586
01:26:33,280 --> 01:26:36,559
Speaker 1: the Viet Cong, and he states that a paramilitary response

1587
01:26:36,640 --> 01:26:39,839
Speaker 1: is the only thing possible. The Governor Pat Brown announces

1588
01:26:39,960 --> 01:26:42,320
Speaker 1: the l a p D was quote dealing with guerillas

1589
01:26:42,360 --> 01:26:45,720
Speaker 1: fighting with gangsters. Um, the National Guard called in and

1590
01:26:45,800 --> 01:26:50,200
Speaker 1: the uprising was brutally suppressed. And you know, generally when

1591
01:26:50,240 --> 01:26:52,040
Speaker 1: you hear because this is a key movement in the

1592
01:26:52,080 --> 01:26:54,720
Speaker 1: militarization of police, and generally when it's talked about, you

1593
01:26:54,800 --> 01:26:57,680
Speaker 1: will hear about like the person writing about it will

1594
01:26:57,720 --> 01:27:00,800
Speaker 1: pivot from like rioters looting guns and sniping at the

1595
01:27:00,960 --> 01:27:04,000
Speaker 1: l a p d h to like the National Guard

1596
01:27:04,080 --> 01:27:05,200
Speaker 1: coming in to kind of make the case that the

1597
01:27:05,320 --> 01:27:08,200
Speaker 1: l a p d was just overwhelmed by armed citizens.

1598
01:27:08,720 --> 01:27:12,800
Speaker 1: This is not what happened, um. Only three sworn personnel

1599
01:27:13,000 --> 01:27:15,760
Speaker 1: were killed during the Watts riots. One was an l

1600
01:27:15,840 --> 01:27:18,760
Speaker 1: A firefighter who died in a structure fire, one was

1601
01:27:18,880 --> 01:27:22,799
Speaker 1: that Los Angeles Sheriff's deputy who was shot by another

1602
01:27:22,920 --> 01:27:26,599
Speaker 1: deputy when that deputy accidentally fired his shotgun and during

1603
01:27:26,640 --> 01:27:30,000
Speaker 1: a clash with rioters. And another was another Los Angeles

1604
01:27:30,040 --> 01:27:32,519
Speaker 1: police officer who was shot by another one of his

1605
01:27:32,600 --> 01:27:36,760
Speaker 1: fellow cops. Accidentally during a fight with rioters. No Los

1606
01:27:36,840 --> 01:27:42,000
Speaker 1: Angeles police were killed by by rioters with guns. Um. Meanwhile,

1607
01:27:42,320 --> 01:27:44,960
Speaker 1: the l a p D killed twenty three, mostly black

1608
01:27:45,040 --> 01:27:48,840
Speaker 1: people during the Watts Riots. The National Guard killed seven. Um.

1609
01:27:49,120 --> 01:27:51,920
Speaker 1: So again, the image of the Watts riots is that

1610
01:27:52,000 --> 01:27:54,000
Speaker 1: like these writers, which is so heavily armed that like

1611
01:27:54,160 --> 01:27:57,639
Speaker 1: it inspired the militarization of police because cops needed more

1612
01:27:57,760 --> 01:28:00,679
Speaker 1: weapons and tactical teams in order to deal such threats.

1613
01:28:00,960 --> 01:28:04,600
Speaker 1: The reality is that like the fucking no no, no,

1614
01:28:04,760 --> 01:28:08,519
Speaker 1: no cops even got killed by bye rioters. Like it's

1615
01:28:08,680 --> 01:28:10,840
Speaker 1: it's definitely accurate to say that like the l A

1616
01:28:11,000 --> 01:28:17,040
Speaker 1: Police had been like more uh more militant, I think

1617
01:28:17,080 --> 01:28:19,320
Speaker 1: than other police departments, but not like not like a

1618
01:28:19,439 --> 01:28:22,760
Speaker 1: tactical way, just in a way of seeing themselves as fighting.

1619
01:28:22,800 --> 01:28:25,000
Speaker 1: They saw themselves as fighting and is fighting a war

1620
01:28:25,080 --> 01:28:27,519
Speaker 1: against the non white population of the city that was

1621
01:28:27,600 --> 01:28:29,439
Speaker 1: the l A p D in this period. Yeah. There

1622
01:28:29,560 --> 01:28:34,280
Speaker 1: there's this idea of like returning to the America they remember,

1623
01:28:34,840 --> 01:28:39,719
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, and the Watts riots kind of scare cops

1624
01:28:39,760 --> 01:28:44,280
Speaker 1: around the country into all adopting a lot more paramilitary

1625
01:28:44,360 --> 01:28:47,000
Speaker 1: tactics in order to defend themselves. From the people they're

1626
01:28:47,000 --> 01:28:50,000
Speaker 1: supposed to be protecting. Now, the Watts riots are like

1627
01:28:50,120 --> 01:28:51,960
Speaker 1: one of the one of two things that will be

1628
01:28:52,040 --> 01:28:55,000
Speaker 1: generally cited as the justification behind the creation of the

1629
01:28:55,120 --> 01:28:58,400
Speaker 1: very first SWAT teams, which you know means special weapons

1630
01:28:58,439 --> 01:29:01,600
Speaker 1: and tactics. Another you're inciting incident for the creation of

1631
01:29:01,640 --> 01:29:03,720
Speaker 1: the SWAT teams was the nineteen sixty six u T.

1632
01:29:03,880 --> 01:29:08,360
Speaker 1: Austin clock tower sniper Charles Whitman, who killed sixteen people. Um.

1633
01:29:08,439 --> 01:29:11,840
Speaker 1: The basic idea was that police were easily overwhelmed by

1634
01:29:11,880 --> 01:29:14,760
Speaker 1: snipers and other dangerous criminals. Like cops just couldn't handle

1635
01:29:14,840 --> 01:29:18,360
Speaker 1: these threats, and so specialized warrior cops were necessary to

1636
01:29:18,479 --> 01:29:21,680
Speaker 1: handle these incidents. So SWAT teams took off as a

1637
01:29:21,760 --> 01:29:24,559
Speaker 1: concept in the late nineteen sixties, and before long every

1638
01:29:24,640 --> 01:29:26,880
Speaker 1: department in America was fighting to get a SWAT team

1639
01:29:26,920 --> 01:29:29,599
Speaker 1: of their own, whether or not they needed one. Today,

1640
01:29:29,720 --> 01:29:33,120
Speaker 1: the vast majority of police agencies serving populations of fifty

1641
01:29:33,160 --> 01:29:35,719
Speaker 1: thousand or more in the United States have some form

1642
01:29:35,760 --> 01:29:39,240
Speaker 1: of SWAT team. Nationwide, SWAT teams are deployed tens of

1643
01:29:39,400 --> 01:29:42,400
Speaker 1: thousands of times per year, and since these teams were

1644
01:29:42,479 --> 01:29:46,320
Speaker 1: formed and exists to handle extraordinary situations of exceptional danger.

1645
01:29:46,800 --> 01:29:49,880
Speaker 1: You might picture these tens of thousands of SWAT raids

1646
01:29:49,960 --> 01:29:55,840
Speaker 1: as like pulse pounding gunfights against really dangerous people. And if, yeah, if,

1647
01:29:56,160 --> 01:29:58,599
Speaker 1: if that's the picture in your head, you are wrong.

1648
01:29:59,360 --> 01:30:02,400
Speaker 1: Most states very deliberately do not provide US with statistics

1649
01:30:02,439 --> 01:30:05,160
Speaker 1: for their SWAT deployments. Maryland is one of two that does,

1650
01:30:05,320 --> 01:30:08,600
Speaker 1: and in Maryland, ent of SWAT raids are just for

1651
01:30:08,760 --> 01:30:12,080
Speaker 1: serving search warrants. Half of those warrants are for non

1652
01:30:12,240 --> 01:30:15,719
Speaker 1: violent drug crimes, and one third of those raids result

1653
01:30:15,800 --> 01:30:18,880
Speaker 1: in no arrests. So a third of the time when

1654
01:30:18,920 --> 01:30:22,120
Speaker 1: SWAT teams go out, they don't even get to arrest anybody. Now,

1655
01:30:22,400 --> 01:30:25,000
Speaker 1: almost all of the SWAT raids in Maryland at least

1656
01:30:25,080 --> 01:30:27,800
Speaker 1: are for drug crimes. Utah is the only other state

1657
01:30:27,840 --> 01:30:30,600
Speaker 1: that requires police agencies to report on SWAT deployment, and

1658
01:30:30,680 --> 01:30:32,599
Speaker 1: the first batch of numbers that they released in two

1659
01:30:32,600 --> 01:30:34,800
Speaker 1: thousand and thirteen showed that eighty three percent of their

1660
01:30:34,800 --> 01:30:38,320
Speaker 1: SQUAT deployments were serving search warrants for drug crimes. Less

1661
01:30:38,360 --> 01:30:41,200
Speaker 1: than five percent of deployments were too violent crimes in

1662
01:30:41,320 --> 01:30:44,000
Speaker 1: process a k a. The sort of thing SWAT teams

1663
01:30:44,040 --> 01:30:47,280
Speaker 1: were formed to deal with just three of the states

1664
01:30:47,360 --> 01:30:50,559
Speaker 1: reported five hundred and fifty nine raids. Half a percent

1665
01:30:50,960 --> 01:30:55,080
Speaker 1: turned up illegal firearms. Now half I bring all the

1666
01:30:55,200 --> 01:30:58,559
Speaker 1: half percent. Yeah, I bring all this up because when

1667
01:30:58,560 --> 01:31:00,760
Speaker 1: I talk about the possibility of police abolition with people,

1668
01:31:00,800 --> 01:31:02,800
Speaker 1: one of the first things they will generally bring up is, like,

1669
01:31:02,880 --> 01:31:05,200
Speaker 1: who will protect us from all of like the violent madmen.

1670
01:31:05,200 --> 01:31:07,960
Speaker 1: They're pictually like cartel guys and stuff gangsters. And of

1671
01:31:08,040 --> 01:31:10,560
Speaker 1: course those people do exist. There's very dangerous criminals in

1672
01:31:10,600 --> 01:31:12,680
Speaker 1: this country who are heavily armed. That that's that's that

1673
01:31:12,840 --> 01:31:15,080
Speaker 1: is a thing that exists, but it is not the

1674
01:31:15,240 --> 01:31:18,360
Speaker 1: scale of problem that you think it is. Um and

1675
01:31:18,560 --> 01:31:21,120
Speaker 1: like it's also people will talk about, like who's protect

1676
01:31:21,200 --> 01:31:23,880
Speaker 1: us from mass shooters? And I would ask, can anyone

1677
01:31:24,120 --> 01:31:26,280
Speaker 1: listen to this podcast name a mass shooter who's been

1678
01:31:26,280 --> 01:31:30,680
Speaker 1: stopped by a squat team. I'm gonna guess exactly not

1679
01:31:30,800 --> 01:31:33,280
Speaker 1: that it hasn't happened. If you did, you can find

1680
01:31:33,320 --> 01:31:35,679
Speaker 1: a couple of cases where swat teams stopped a shooting

1681
01:31:35,720 --> 01:31:37,920
Speaker 1: in progress that can be defined as a mass shooting.

1682
01:31:38,240 --> 01:31:40,120
Speaker 1: But you have to really rack your brain to think

1683
01:31:40,120 --> 01:31:42,559
Speaker 1: of a situation where it did happen, or to think

1684
01:31:42,600 --> 01:31:45,920
Speaker 1: of a situation where the cops successfully stopped a mass

1685
01:31:45,960 --> 01:31:48,200
Speaker 1: shooting as opposed to like what happened during the Parkland

1686
01:31:48,200 --> 01:31:50,240
Speaker 1: shooting where the officer I think, drove his car into

1687
01:31:50,280 --> 01:31:53,080
Speaker 1: a ditch. Like yeah, like they're not good at this.

1688
01:31:53,240 --> 01:31:55,120
Speaker 1: Or you can think about the Virginia Tech shooting. We're

1689
01:31:55,120 --> 01:31:57,320
Speaker 1: swat teams were posted up outside the buildings, but we're

1690
01:31:57,360 --> 01:32:00,240
Speaker 1: scared to enter while the shooter was killing people, um,

1691
01:32:01,160 --> 01:32:03,559
Speaker 1: get it? Or or even saying this if like big

1692
01:32:03,680 --> 01:32:07,120
Speaker 1: drug cartels, these drug bosses are like such a problem,

1693
01:32:07,520 --> 01:32:09,920
Speaker 1: I would ask that person, Hey, do you know any

1694
01:32:10,640 --> 01:32:13,560
Speaker 1: do you know any drug drug cartel bosses? Okay, you

1695
01:32:13,640 --> 01:32:15,679
Speaker 1: never met one? All right, word, do you know anybody

1696
01:32:15,760 --> 01:32:19,280
Speaker 1: that's like stolen some soda out of a out of

1697
01:32:19,320 --> 01:32:21,680
Speaker 1: a liquor store. Yeah, we know a lot of those.

1698
01:32:21,720 --> 01:32:25,880
Speaker 1: So what I'm saying is maybe you you're saying this

1699
01:32:26,080 --> 01:32:28,200
Speaker 1: is a big problem, but you don't know nobody that

1700
01:32:28,360 --> 01:32:30,560
Speaker 1: done that. But we are instole something out of a

1701
01:32:30,680 --> 01:32:33,960
Speaker 1: out of a liquor store, So maybe there's more problems there,

1702
01:32:34,520 --> 01:32:37,840
Speaker 1: and maybe you don't need to be specially trained for that. Yeah,

1703
01:32:37,960 --> 01:32:41,000
Speaker 1: maybe we can solve people. Jack and shipped from liquor

1704
01:32:41,080 --> 01:32:43,720
Speaker 1: stores to the extent that that's a problem without Yes,

1705
01:32:44,080 --> 01:32:48,960
Speaker 1: machine guns, maybe snipers are necessary for this. Yeah. I

1706
01:32:49,080 --> 01:32:51,599
Speaker 1: walked into the room. I walked into the room. Uh,

1707
01:32:52,400 --> 01:32:56,759
Speaker 1: and my daughter was with a hammer and a shoe,

1708
01:32:57,400 --> 01:33:01,439
Speaker 1: and I was like, the hell are you doing. She's

1709
01:33:01,479 --> 01:33:03,280
Speaker 1: standing on one side of the room. The other side

1710
01:33:03,280 --> 01:33:09,320
Speaker 1: of the room was a daddy long leg just a spider.

1711
01:33:10,160 --> 01:33:14,040
Speaker 1: And I'm like, what you got a hammer for. She's like,

1712
01:33:14,640 --> 01:33:21,840
Speaker 1: I gotta kill this spider. M hmm. And I have

1713
01:33:22,760 --> 01:33:27,519
Speaker 1: a deep distrust for anything with eight legs or six legs.

1714
01:33:27,960 --> 01:33:33,600
Speaker 1: I get it, But a hammer, baby, Harry yesterday, the

1715
01:33:33,720 --> 01:33:39,680
Speaker 1: swiffer is fine. I don't so when you put a

1716
01:33:39,760 --> 01:33:42,639
Speaker 1: hole on this wall, I mean, I'm gonna be honest

1717
01:33:42,640 --> 01:33:45,080
Speaker 1: with you, prob I I have my Air fifteen right

1718
01:33:45,120 --> 01:33:47,040
Speaker 1: here next to the table in case I see a spider,

1719
01:33:47,560 --> 01:33:49,560
Speaker 1: which you know there's a lot. I gonna lie to you.

1720
01:33:50,240 --> 01:33:52,960
Speaker 1: That's an issue. Yeah, yeah, that's what That's what the

1721
01:33:53,040 --> 01:33:56,240
Speaker 1: police say. Um that that is also what my neighbors say.

1722
01:33:56,920 --> 01:34:00,880
Speaker 1: You know what is Yeah, what the police say is accurate.

1723
01:34:01,400 --> 01:34:04,760
Speaker 1: That's exactly what you mean. Find me to show you

1724
01:34:05,080 --> 01:34:07,400
Speaker 1: the spider bite that I got that sent me to

1725
01:34:07,479 --> 01:34:14,519
Speaker 1: the hospital. Next the hammer. Okay, that's different. Let's talk

1726
01:34:14,560 --> 01:34:16,760
Speaker 1: about speaking of hammers, because I actually have a number

1727
01:34:16,760 --> 01:34:20,479
Speaker 1: of hammer analogies coming up here. So um yeah yeah.

1728
01:34:20,560 --> 01:34:23,400
Speaker 1: So again, the point of all these statistics, to the

1729
01:34:23,479 --> 01:34:25,479
Speaker 1: extent that we have them, is that it really looks

1730
01:34:25,520 --> 01:34:28,559
Speaker 1: like swat teams are actually kind of ship at fighting,

1731
01:34:28,640 --> 01:34:30,680
Speaker 1: the one kind of crime that expired their existence in

1732
01:34:30,720 --> 01:34:33,160
Speaker 1: the first place. Because again, you actually have an easier

1733
01:34:33,240 --> 01:34:36,759
Speaker 1: time finding cases of people with concealed handguns stopping shootings

1734
01:34:37,120 --> 01:34:40,040
Speaker 1: than you will swat teams stopping shootings like mass shootings

1735
01:34:40,080 --> 01:34:42,960
Speaker 1: in progress, like our traditional like, and that doesn't happen

1736
01:34:43,000 --> 01:34:45,439
Speaker 1: often either, Like usually mass shooters get to do whatever

1737
01:34:45,439 --> 01:34:47,800
Speaker 1: they're gonna do and then shoot themselves or whatever turn

1738
01:34:47,880 --> 01:34:51,600
Speaker 1: themselves in like they generally don't get stopped. Um, but

1739
01:34:51,760 --> 01:34:54,120
Speaker 1: you you will. You'll have trouble finding swat teams taking

1740
01:34:54,160 --> 01:34:56,400
Speaker 1: out these guys because it's usually over it before they

1741
01:34:56,400 --> 01:34:59,360
Speaker 1: can scramble. Um. Now. Well, which is not to say

1742
01:34:59,400 --> 01:35:01,800
Speaker 1: that there's no a place for them, because I think

1743
01:35:01,840 --> 01:35:03,680
Speaker 1: any society as large as ours, you're gonna need to

1744
01:35:03,720 --> 01:35:06,840
Speaker 1: have some rapid response units. But we're not using them

1745
01:35:06,920 --> 01:35:09,479
Speaker 1: for that, and there's way too many of them now.

1746
01:35:09,840 --> 01:35:12,519
Speaker 1: While state data on SWAT deployments is lacking, I did

1747
01:35:12,640 --> 01:35:15,840
Speaker 1: find a fascinating report by two researchers, David Klinger and

1748
01:35:15,920 --> 01:35:18,880
Speaker 1: Jeff Rojack, using funds provided by the Department of Justice

1749
01:35:18,920 --> 01:35:22,320
Speaker 1: in two thousand eight, they analyzed thousands of SWAT raids nationwide,

1750
01:35:22,360 --> 01:35:24,400
Speaker 1: and what they found was fascinating. Out of tens of

1751
01:35:24,439 --> 01:35:28,360
Speaker 1: thousands of deployments they analyzed, SWAT officers only fired their

1752
01:35:28,400 --> 01:35:32,200
Speaker 1: weapons in three hundred and forty two incidents. Those officers

1753
01:35:32,240 --> 01:35:35,240
Speaker 1: shot two hundred citizens, killing one hundred and thirty nine

1754
01:35:35,320 --> 01:35:38,880
Speaker 1: of them. In seventy of these shootings, fewer than ten

1755
01:35:39,080 --> 01:35:43,240
Speaker 1: rounds were used. Now, this suggests that military grade weaponry

1756
01:35:43,280 --> 01:35:46,120
Speaker 1: may not be necessary for SWAT teams, since again, you

1757
01:35:46,200 --> 01:35:50,080
Speaker 1: don't need it. Yeah, they're not getting into gunfights. They

1758
01:35:50,680 --> 01:35:52,760
Speaker 1: sometimes they shoot people, but like and a lot of

1759
01:35:52,800 --> 01:35:54,719
Speaker 1: the time those a lot of those guys who died

1760
01:35:54,960 --> 01:35:58,400
Speaker 1: were wounded by SWAT and then killed themselves. Um, yeah,

1761
01:35:58,479 --> 01:36:03,080
Speaker 1: it's it's yeah. Meanwhile, during this same span of time,

1762
01:36:03,439 --> 01:36:08,080
Speaker 1: SWAT officers had thirty nine accidental discharges, so shot two

1763
01:36:08,160 --> 01:36:12,559
Speaker 1: hundred citizens and accidentally fired their own weapons thirty nine times.

1764
01:36:12,880 --> 01:36:15,800
Speaker 1: This means that accidental gunfire. We're looking at three three

1765
01:36:16,320 --> 01:36:20,160
Speaker 1: forty two um incidences where SWAT officers fired, and thirty

1766
01:36:20,280 --> 01:36:23,640
Speaker 1: nine of those are accidents. That's not an insignificant percentage

1767
01:36:23,680 --> 01:36:28,280
Speaker 1: of all SWAT weapons discharges. Like that's that's that's noteworth all.

1768
01:36:29,960 --> 01:36:33,960
Speaker 1: The study authors right quote. This data indicates that something

1769
01:36:34,120 --> 01:36:36,479
Speaker 1: is substantially amiss with the way that at least some

1770
01:36:36,640 --> 01:36:39,840
Speaker 1: SWAT officers handled their weapons, and strongly suggests that this

1771
01:36:40,000 --> 01:36:42,720
Speaker 1: problem is rooted in training. That more than one in

1772
01:36:42,840 --> 01:36:44,920
Speaker 1: tent of the incidents in which those who are supposed

1773
01:36:44,920 --> 01:36:47,240
Speaker 1: to be the most highly trained officers in their agency

1774
01:36:47,560 --> 01:36:52,080
Speaker 1: fired shots involved accidental discharges is simply unacceptable in our minds.

1775
01:36:52,520 --> 01:36:55,280
Speaker 1: Among the aforementioned hundred thirty nine citizens who died after

1776
01:36:55,320 --> 01:36:57,760
Speaker 1: being struck by SWAT gunfire were two who fatally shot

1777
01:36:57,800 --> 01:37:00,360
Speaker 1: themselves after being hit by SWAT bullets. In addition to

1778
01:37:00,439 --> 01:37:02,840
Speaker 1: these two, we have firm data that three seventy nine

1779
01:37:02,920 --> 01:37:06,320
Speaker 1: other individuals killed themselves in situations in which they were

1780
01:37:06,400 --> 01:37:09,040
Speaker 1: not shot by SWAT officers. It is thus clear that

1781
01:37:09,120 --> 01:37:12,080
Speaker 1: in the current data that it is more likely citizen

1782
01:37:12,160 --> 01:37:15,479
Speaker 1: will take their own lives during SWAT operations than be

1783
01:37:15,600 --> 01:37:18,240
Speaker 1: killed by SWAT officers by a margin of more than

1784
01:37:18,320 --> 01:37:21,639
Speaker 1: two point five to one point five. Finally, the data

1785
01:37:21,680 --> 01:37:24,479
Speaker 1: indicate that nearly one in four citizens struck by SWAT

1786
01:37:24,520 --> 01:37:29,120
Speaker 1: gunfire wished to be shot, as respondents classified their actions

1787
01:37:29,160 --> 01:37:31,960
Speaker 1: as indicating they wish to commit suicide by cop. If

1788
01:37:32,000 --> 01:37:35,519
Speaker 1: respondents classifications are correct, this indicates that an even higher

1789
01:37:35,600 --> 01:37:38,440
Speaker 1: portion of the citizen deaths and SWAT operations involved individuals

1790
01:37:38,600 --> 01:37:42,639
Speaker 1: who wished to die that of the SWAT officers struck

1791
01:37:42,720 --> 01:37:45,879
Speaker 1: by gunfire and the current data were shot by fellow officers.

1792
01:37:46,160 --> 01:37:49,160
Speaker 1: Suggests that while the most substantial threat officers face comes

1793
01:37:49,200 --> 01:37:52,519
Speaker 1: from armed suspects, the prospect of fratricide looms large and

1794
01:37:52,600 --> 01:37:56,720
Speaker 1: tactical operations. So you're more likely to get shot by

1795
01:37:56,720 --> 01:38:00,439
Speaker 1: your homeboy. Not more likely, but pretty like lead Yeah

1796
01:38:00,479 --> 01:38:03,920
Speaker 1: about when when SWAT officers are shot. More than one

1797
01:38:03,960 --> 01:38:06,160
Speaker 1: intent of SWAT cops who get shot are shot by

1798
01:38:06,160 --> 01:38:09,439
Speaker 1: their own guys, and one in ten times when SWAT

1799
01:38:09,479 --> 01:38:13,920
Speaker 1: officers shoot, they're shooting negligently without meaning to fire. So

1800
01:38:14,000 --> 01:38:19,120
Speaker 1: again the whole elite SWAT team thing. There are some

1801
01:38:20,439 --> 01:38:23,280
Speaker 1: well trained swat teams out there. It's also real fucking

1802
01:38:23,320 --> 01:38:27,320
Speaker 1: easy to to just give guys military grade weaponry, call

1803
01:38:27,400 --> 01:38:29,360
Speaker 1: him a SWAT team, and then they funk up. But

1804
01:38:29,479 --> 01:38:32,120
Speaker 1: more than anything, SWAT teams don't get into a lot

1805
01:38:32,160 --> 01:38:36,479
Speaker 1: of serious gunfights on a nationwide level. Um, and most

1806
01:38:36,600 --> 01:38:40,680
Speaker 1: of the people they encounter who are seriously armed like

1807
01:38:40,760 --> 01:38:44,519
Speaker 1: our fucking want to kill themselves. Yeah, they want to die,

1808
01:38:45,040 --> 01:38:47,240
Speaker 1: which is maybe suggests that a SWAT team isn't the

1809
01:38:47,320 --> 01:38:50,599
Speaker 1: thing to bring to that person. They shouldn't go. Yeah,

1810
01:38:50,920 --> 01:38:54,360
Speaker 1: maybe just a dude who's a good therapist having a

1811
01:38:54,439 --> 01:38:59,360
Speaker 1: conversation would have better odds of resolving this without gun fire. Yeah.

1812
01:39:00,080 --> 01:39:03,320
Speaker 1: Uh yeah. So the conclusions here are pretty clear. Number one,

1813
01:39:03,400 --> 01:39:05,920
Speaker 1: swat teams virtually never do these sort of work their

1814
01:39:06,000 --> 01:39:09,639
Speaker 1: portrayed doing in movies and tv I directly engaging dangerous

1815
01:39:09,680 --> 01:39:12,639
Speaker 1: bad guys. And number two, swat teams kind of suck

1816
01:39:12,720 --> 01:39:17,040
Speaker 1: at their job regularly shooting people and each other by accident.

1817
01:39:17,360 --> 01:39:20,639
Speaker 1: And perhaps no story illustrates the second point better than

1818
01:39:20,720 --> 01:39:26,120
Speaker 1: the case of Wanas Thava. Uh now, good job, many,

1819
01:39:26,479 --> 01:39:30,360
Speaker 1: I'm doing my best here. And on Wanas sold a

1820
01:39:30,400 --> 01:39:35,080
Speaker 1: small amount of methamphetamine uh to a confidential informant um

1821
01:39:35,320 --> 01:39:37,160
Speaker 1: or bought a yea so sold a small amount of

1822
01:39:37,200 --> 01:39:40,600
Speaker 1: methemphetamine too a confidential informant um. Several hours later, on

1823
01:39:40,640 --> 01:39:43,960
Speaker 1: the morning of the seven man swat team from the Cornelia,

1824
01:39:44,040 --> 01:39:47,600
Speaker 1: Georgia Police Department carried out a raid on wannass home. Now,

1825
01:39:47,680 --> 01:39:50,200
Speaker 1: because Wannas had a previous weapons charge on his record,

1826
01:39:50,280 --> 01:39:53,080
Speaker 1: officers were given a no knock warrant. They broke through

1827
01:39:53,120 --> 01:39:55,400
Speaker 1: Wannas's door with a battering ram and as they were

1828
01:39:55,439 --> 01:39:57,920
Speaker 1: pushing the door in, they noticed there was resistance behind

1829
01:39:58,040 --> 01:40:00,840
Speaker 1: the door and this led that what the officers in

1830
01:40:00,880 --> 01:40:03,400
Speaker 1: the swat team to believe that they're like someone had

1831
01:40:03,479 --> 01:40:06,760
Speaker 1: barricaded the door, so they tossed a flash bang in. Now,

1832
01:40:06,840 --> 01:40:08,720
Speaker 1: it turned out that the thing that had actually been

1833
01:40:08,760 --> 01:40:12,679
Speaker 1: against the door was the playpen where wannass nineteen month

1834
01:40:12,760 --> 01:40:16,560
Speaker 1: old child was sleeping. Uh. The flash bang ignited the

1835
01:40:16,720 --> 01:40:20,200
Speaker 1: nineteen month old child, burning it badly and tearing the

1836
01:40:20,280 --> 01:40:23,439
Speaker 1: child's face and chest open um. The kid was put

1837
01:40:23,479 --> 01:40:27,280
Speaker 1: into a coma and very very nearly died. The swat

1838
01:40:27,400 --> 01:40:29,880
Speaker 1: and was you know, suffered permanent injury as a result

1839
01:40:29,920 --> 01:40:32,559
Speaker 1: of the police flash bang igniting it. The swat team

1840
01:40:32,600 --> 01:40:35,000
Speaker 1: found only a small amount of meth residue in the

1841
01:40:35,080 --> 01:40:38,599
Speaker 1: home and no wet weapons. No arrests were made. When

1842
01:40:38,600 --> 01:40:42,599
Speaker 1: the Bonus EVA sued, a local prosecutor threatened to charge

1843
01:40:42,680 --> 01:40:46,160
Speaker 1: them for their child's injuries. In the end, no officers

1844
01:40:46,200 --> 01:40:49,599
Speaker 1: were indicted for horrifically maiming a small child. I found

1845
01:40:49,680 --> 01:40:52,240
Speaker 1: one CNN article that interviewed the sheriff in charge of

1846
01:40:52,240 --> 01:40:55,559
Speaker 1: the swat team, a guy named Tarrell. Quote in hindsight,

1847
01:40:55,640 --> 01:40:57,880
Speaker 1: Tarrell said, at the time, officers would have conducted the

1848
01:40:57,960 --> 01:41:00,000
Speaker 1: raid differently had they known there was a child inside

1849
01:41:00,000 --> 01:41:01,719
Speaker 1: at the home, but there was no sign of children

1850
01:41:01,800 --> 01:41:04,320
Speaker 1: during the alleged drug purchase that prompted the raid. We

1851
01:41:04,439 --> 01:41:06,120
Speaker 1: might have gone in through a side door, he said.

1852
01:41:06,240 --> 01:41:09,680
Speaker 1: We would not have used a flash bang, like and

1853
01:41:09,920 --> 01:41:12,600
Speaker 1: that showed defense, big homie. Yeah, that's interesting to me

1854
01:41:12,680 --> 01:41:15,639
Speaker 1: because it shows it. It never occurs to this guy

1855
01:41:15,720 --> 01:41:18,880
Speaker 1: that like, maybe maybe a dude selling a small amount

1856
01:41:18,880 --> 01:41:22,760
Speaker 1: of meths, maybe sending in an army to funk with

1857
01:41:22,880 --> 01:41:25,800
Speaker 1: that guy, and that army having grenades and battering rams.

1858
01:41:25,960 --> 01:41:29,160
Speaker 1: Maybe that's inherently reckless in a bad way to deal with. Again,

1859
01:41:29,360 --> 01:41:32,479
Speaker 1: a small amount of meth being sold. Yeah, and it's

1860
01:41:32,520 --> 01:41:34,080
Speaker 1: just it kind of feels like to me, like if

1861
01:41:34,120 --> 01:41:36,960
Speaker 1: I'm the swat guy, I feel a little insulted. Yeah,

1862
01:41:37,520 --> 01:41:40,600
Speaker 1: you think I'm so incompetent. That has got to be

1863
01:41:40,880 --> 01:41:45,720
Speaker 1: nineteen of us with with sucking fifty cows to come

1864
01:41:45,800 --> 01:41:47,800
Speaker 1: get this one dude that just sold a little men

1865
01:41:49,000 --> 01:41:51,640
Speaker 1: imposibly most get like, you think I'm that weak that

1866
01:41:51,760 --> 01:41:55,280
Speaker 1: I can't just Yeah, it's it's fucking It's the problem

1867
01:41:55,320 --> 01:41:58,120
Speaker 1: with militarization in general, which is that like it. It

1868
01:41:58,840 --> 01:42:02,240
Speaker 1: means that you're going to have a military situation if

1869
01:42:02,320 --> 01:42:05,280
Speaker 1: the police are going it's fucking Waco. When you start

1870
01:42:05,439 --> 01:42:09,840
Speaker 1: the conversation with tanks and machine guns and snipers, You're

1871
01:42:09,880 --> 01:42:12,439
Speaker 1: not going to end it in a good way. You're

1872
01:42:12,439 --> 01:42:16,080
Speaker 1: going to end it by burning seventy children alive. Because

1873
01:42:16,120 --> 01:42:19,120
Speaker 1: that's this is how that works. This is so true

1874
01:42:19,240 --> 01:42:21,679
Speaker 1: in every area of your life. If you're in any

1875
01:42:21,720 --> 01:42:25,439
Speaker 1: sort of relationship, whether it's a monogonous one or a

1876
01:42:25,880 --> 01:42:30,880
Speaker 1: romantic or a or a friendship or a sibling, if

1877
01:42:30,920 --> 01:42:34,479
Speaker 1: you come in guns ablazing, it's just not gonna work.

1878
01:42:34,960 --> 01:42:37,920
Speaker 1: You know, this is your Yeah, this is exactly why

1879
01:42:37,960 --> 01:42:39,960
Speaker 1: I was able to improve a lot of my personal

1880
01:42:40,040 --> 01:42:42,640
Speaker 1: relationships propped when I stopped having the B A. T.

1881
01:42:42,880 --> 01:42:45,479
Speaker 1: F Um show up with tanks to support me. You

1882
01:42:45,560 --> 01:42:49,200
Speaker 1: know that that really was was a game changer for me. Um.

1883
01:42:49,320 --> 01:42:51,680
Speaker 1: I imagine, man, a lot less of my friends get

1884
01:42:51,720 --> 01:42:56,320
Speaker 1: burnt to death in in basement compounds outside of Waco. Now, yeah, yeah,

1885
01:42:56,400 --> 01:42:59,840
Speaker 1: that's good man, because I you live and learn, because

1886
01:42:59,840 --> 01:43:03,719
Speaker 1: I reference in here, Robert, just like a Waco reference

1887
01:43:03,760 --> 01:43:08,360
Speaker 1: in everywhere. Hey Man, talk about talk about Waco. Talk

1888
01:43:08,400 --> 01:43:17,240
Speaker 1: about a rebranding. Boy has gotten Yeah, yeah, I mean

1889
01:43:17,360 --> 01:43:21,200
Speaker 1: it was now the Home and Garden TV network. That's

1890
01:43:21,280 --> 01:43:24,479
Speaker 1: we have some sort of oversized initial letter in your

1891
01:43:24,560 --> 01:43:29,560
Speaker 1: room and uh a refurbished wood panel. So you have

1892
01:43:29,640 --> 01:43:33,360
Speaker 1: a farmhouse store and a farmhouse sink and yeah, and

1893
01:43:33,479 --> 01:43:39,160
Speaker 1: you admire Joanna Gaines there it is build an empire.

1894
01:43:39,800 --> 01:43:43,280
Speaker 1: She built it. She built an empire out of a

1895
01:43:43,400 --> 01:43:47,280
Speaker 1: city that was known for burning seventy babies. Well, I

1896
01:43:47,360 --> 01:43:49,720
Speaker 1: don't understand most of what we're talking about here, but

1897
01:43:49,840 --> 01:43:52,320
Speaker 1: you know what I do understand is that we're gonna

1898
01:43:52,920 --> 01:43:55,320
Speaker 1: we're gonna talk about another kind of Waco type thing

1899
01:43:55,439 --> 01:43:58,200
Speaker 1: where a bunch of children get burned by militarized police.

1900
01:43:58,240 --> 01:44:00,200
Speaker 1: At the end of this, that's gonna be fun um

1901
01:44:00,320 --> 01:44:03,080
Speaker 1: all right, fun is the wrong word anyway. So like

1902
01:44:03,240 --> 01:44:05,280
Speaker 1: the the the again, Like the point here is that

1903
01:44:05,400 --> 01:44:08,600
Speaker 1: like the worst case scenario of like what happened with

1904
01:44:09,520 --> 01:44:12,559
Speaker 1: Wanas and his family without the police is that like, oh,

1905
01:44:12,760 --> 01:44:16,400
Speaker 1: these parents might be selling small amounts of meth amphetamine

1906
01:44:16,600 --> 01:44:18,519
Speaker 1: and that maybe isn't great for a kid, and that

1907
01:44:19,040 --> 01:44:22,160
Speaker 1: this is a problem that does need a solution to it. Um.

1908
01:44:22,680 --> 01:44:26,320
Speaker 1: But the solution that they got a grenade, burning their

1909
01:44:26,400 --> 01:44:29,920
Speaker 1: child alive. It was worse than probably anything that would

1910
01:44:29,920 --> 01:44:32,360
Speaker 1: have happened if they had just been left selling math, right,

1911
01:44:32,720 --> 01:44:36,519
Speaker 1: like or just or take fifteen minutes more to do

1912
01:44:36,800 --> 01:44:39,439
Speaker 1: just a little bit of investigation on the guy and

1913
01:44:39,560 --> 01:44:43,080
Speaker 1: be like, oh he's a parent, Yeah, it's it's it's

1914
01:44:43,120 --> 01:44:45,040
Speaker 1: always that's like with Waco, like there was there was

1915
01:44:45,080 --> 01:44:47,320
Speaker 1: a problem, David Koresh was doing some fucked up ship.

1916
01:44:47,720 --> 01:44:49,760
Speaker 1: You could have just arrested him and not burned Like

1917
01:44:49,880 --> 01:44:52,439
Speaker 1: those kids, whatever they were going through under Koresh, getting

1918
01:44:52,479 --> 01:44:56,479
Speaker 1: burnt alive was worse for them. Absolutely. The police made

1919
01:44:56,520 --> 01:45:00,920
Speaker 1: it worse. And it's because militarized police are a hammer,

1920
01:45:00,960 --> 01:45:02,720
Speaker 1: and we've got a hammer. Every single problem looks like

1921
01:45:02,800 --> 01:45:05,599
Speaker 1: a nail. And like, if that hammer is a hammer

1922
01:45:05,680 --> 01:45:07,880
Speaker 1: in the hands of a cop, it's specifically going to

1923
01:45:07,920 --> 01:45:09,840
Speaker 1: be used to hammer the faces of black people. Um,

1924
01:45:09,960 --> 01:45:13,200
Speaker 1: because that's how cops work. As we've previously discussed, I've

1925
01:45:13,240 --> 01:45:15,439
Speaker 1: had a two thousand eighteen study published by the National

1926
01:45:15,479 --> 01:45:18,160
Speaker 1: Academy of Sciences. It uses a geo coded census of

1927
01:45:18,200 --> 01:45:21,800
Speaker 1: swat team deployments in Maryland and shows that quote, militarized

1928
01:45:21,800 --> 01:45:24,160
Speaker 1: police units are more often deployed in communities with large

1929
01:45:24,200 --> 01:45:27,000
Speaker 1: shares of African American residents, even after controlling for local

1930
01:45:27,080 --> 01:45:31,320
Speaker 1: crime rates. Further, using nationwide panel data on local police militarization,

1931
01:45:31,520 --> 01:45:34,639
Speaker 1: I demonstrate that militarized policing fails to enhance officers safety

1932
01:45:34,760 --> 01:45:38,519
Speaker 1: or reduce local crime. So after controlling for variables like

1933
01:45:38,600 --> 01:45:40,800
Speaker 1: local crime rates, the author of the study calculated that

1934
01:45:40,920 --> 01:45:43,360
Speaker 1: for every ten percent increase in the black population of

1935
01:45:43,360 --> 01:45:45,600
Speaker 1: a zip code, there is a ten percent increase and

1936
01:45:45,640 --> 01:45:48,439
Speaker 1: the likelihood of that zip code experiencing a swat rate

1937
01:45:48,960 --> 01:45:51,760
Speaker 1: now and again. He also showed that swat raids and

1938
01:45:51,840 --> 01:45:56,639
Speaker 1: swat teams don't reduce violent crime, so they're they're they're

1939
01:45:57,520 --> 01:46:01,160
Speaker 1: kind of what you're seeing here. Sure looks like they're

1940
01:46:01,200 --> 01:46:04,240
Speaker 1: just being used vindictively against black people, you know, whether

1941
01:46:04,320 --> 01:46:06,360
Speaker 1: or not there's intention behind it. That's how the data

1942
01:46:06,439 --> 01:46:10,800
Speaker 1: really looks, now. Yeah. Yeah. A Washington Post write up

1943
01:46:10,800 --> 01:46:13,400
Speaker 1: of the research notes telling Lee Uh he found no

1944
01:46:13,520 --> 01:46:16,760
Speaker 1: statistically significant change in the killings of police officers, which

1945
01:46:16,760 --> 01:46:19,799
Speaker 1: were too infrequent to measure, or assaults on police officers.

1946
01:46:19,840 --> 01:46:21,960
Speaker 1: So again, part of the justification of swat teams is that, like,

1947
01:46:22,800 --> 01:46:25,080
Speaker 1: police are in so much danger that we need special,

1948
01:46:25,120 --> 01:46:28,840
Speaker 1: heavily armored police. And it's like, actually, when SWAT teams

1949
01:46:28,840 --> 01:46:30,640
Speaker 1: are used all the time, cops still get killed with

1950
01:46:30,720 --> 01:46:34,599
Speaker 1: the same right, it has no impact. Yeah, so SWAT

1951
01:46:34,720 --> 01:46:39,040
Speaker 1: raids also get just so many dogs killed. My so

1952
01:46:39,360 --> 01:46:42,439
Speaker 1: so many dogs getting killed by fucking swat teams. If

1953
01:46:42,479 --> 01:46:44,439
Speaker 1: you want to know what swat teams love to do most,

1954
01:46:44,520 --> 01:46:48,200
Speaker 1: it's it's shoots some goddamn dogs. Um, it's impossible to

1955
01:46:48,720 --> 01:46:51,120
Speaker 1: to separate the number of dogs killed by swat from

1956
01:46:51,120 --> 01:46:53,160
Speaker 1: the number of dogs killed by regular cops serving the

1957
01:46:53,200 --> 01:46:56,880
Speaker 1: same kind of search warrants, because again, regular cops regularly

1958
01:46:57,000 --> 01:47:00,280
Speaker 1: served the exact same kind of search warrants swat cops serve,

1959
01:47:00,320 --> 01:47:02,280
Speaker 1: which maybe suggests that why do we have squat teams?

1960
01:47:02,320 --> 01:47:07,120
Speaker 1: If yea also but yeah, um either way, a ship

1961
01:47:07,200 --> 01:47:10,000
Speaker 1: let of fucking dogs get killed when police serve warrants,

1962
01:47:10,080 --> 01:47:12,200
Speaker 1: and a lot of those warrants are served tens of

1963
01:47:12,240 --> 01:47:15,080
Speaker 1: thousands of them are served by swat teams. Um. We

1964
01:47:15,160 --> 01:47:18,800
Speaker 1: will never know how many dogs get killed exactly um

1965
01:47:19,000 --> 01:47:21,320
Speaker 1: by police in this country. But in two thousands sixteen,

1966
01:47:21,360 --> 01:47:24,120
Speaker 1: one Justice Department expert called the police shooting of dogs

1967
01:47:24,160 --> 01:47:27,439
Speaker 1: and epidemic. It is estimated that cops shoot twenty five

1968
01:47:27,520 --> 01:47:30,679
Speaker 1: dogs in this country every single day, and some estimates

1969
01:47:30,800 --> 01:47:33,560
Speaker 1: range as high as five hundred dogs per day. It

1970
01:47:33,720 --> 01:47:37,200
Speaker 1: is very likely that police use their guns to shoot

1971
01:47:37,320 --> 01:47:39,559
Speaker 1: dogs more than they use their guns for any other

1972
01:47:39,680 --> 01:47:44,400
Speaker 1: purpose nationwide. Why because they fucking I mean, you know,

1973
01:47:44,439 --> 01:47:46,040
Speaker 1: I have to actually talk to some cops about this,

1974
01:47:46,280 --> 01:47:48,160
Speaker 1: um and including I talked to a cop who had

1975
01:47:48,200 --> 01:47:50,160
Speaker 1: to who was in a justified shoot of a dog,

1976
01:47:50,200 --> 01:47:52,519
Speaker 1: a dog that like maim turned to the point that

1977
01:47:52,840 --> 01:47:55,080
Speaker 1: her life has never been the same since, Like, obviously

1978
01:47:55,320 --> 01:47:57,679
Speaker 1: the dog is tearing you apart. Yeah, you're gonna shoot

1979
01:47:57,680 --> 01:48:01,759
Speaker 1: that dog. Um, Like I've talked to some police about

1980
01:48:01,800 --> 01:48:04,280
Speaker 1: this and like one theorious why it happens so much

1981
01:48:04,360 --> 01:48:06,640
Speaker 1: without like there are some justific like a lot of

1982
01:48:06,880 --> 01:48:09,920
Speaker 1: like sometimes fucking people who have dog fighting rings get

1983
01:48:10,000 --> 01:48:12,120
Speaker 1: rated and like, yeah, yeah, you're gonna shoot some of

1984
01:48:12,160 --> 01:48:14,160
Speaker 1: those dogs because they're just like they've been broken and

1985
01:48:14,200 --> 01:48:17,479
Speaker 1: they're dangerous. Um. But also a lot of cops are

1986
01:48:17,560 --> 01:48:20,160
Speaker 1: terrified of dogs. And if cops are terrified, they get

1987
01:48:20,240 --> 01:48:24,240
Speaker 1: to shoot UM. So even in situations where there's no

1988
01:48:26,360 --> 01:48:29,760
Speaker 1: exactly a lot of the time, probably most of the time,

1989
01:48:30,320 --> 01:48:37,519
Speaker 1: there's no justification for the animals. That's that's that's yeah, yeah,

1990
01:48:37,680 --> 01:48:40,320
Speaker 1: And one out of five, training makes you scared, and

1991
01:48:40,439 --> 01:48:42,840
Speaker 1: that's what I want to get into. The training makes

1992
01:48:42,880 --> 01:48:45,639
Speaker 1: you scared. And in one out of five of these

1993
01:48:45,680 --> 01:48:49,400
Speaker 1: incidents of a police dog shootings, a child was either

1994
01:48:49,560 --> 01:48:53,040
Speaker 1: in the direct line of fire or standing nearby. And

1995
01:48:53,160 --> 01:48:55,840
Speaker 1: one horrifying too. That's in fifteen case, a four year

1996
01:48:55,840 --> 01:48:57,920
Speaker 1: old girl was shot in the leg by a police

1997
01:48:57,920 --> 01:49:00,720
Speaker 1: officer who was trying to shoot her dog. UM. And

1998
01:49:00,840 --> 01:49:04,599
Speaker 1: this dog was not threatening this police officer necessarily UM.

1999
01:49:04,880 --> 01:49:08,400
Speaker 1: Thus the officer felt threatened, like he felt like he

2000
01:49:08,520 --> 01:49:11,400
Speaker 1: might get bit, and even fear of a minor injury

2001
01:49:11,640 --> 01:49:14,080
Speaker 1: um is enough to make an officer completely immune to

2002
01:49:14,160 --> 01:49:17,280
Speaker 1: any consequences for shooting a dog. Meanwhile, I should note

2003
01:49:17,320 --> 01:49:20,519
Speaker 1: people who kill police dogs regularly face longer sentences than

2004
01:49:20,600 --> 01:49:22,719
Speaker 1: child molestus. You'll go away for life if you shoot

2005
01:49:22,720 --> 01:49:26,680
Speaker 1: a police dog. Um. But police can imagine. Yeah, can

2006
01:49:26,720 --> 01:49:28,920
Speaker 1: you imagine having the right to slap the ship out

2007
01:49:28,920 --> 01:49:31,559
Speaker 1: of somebody because you think they might slap you. Yeah,

2008
01:49:32,280 --> 01:49:36,559
Speaker 1: it's pretty pretty crazy, pretty bad. So this may seem

2009
01:49:36,600 --> 01:49:37,920
Speaker 1: like it's getting a little bit off the topic of

2010
01:49:37,960 --> 01:49:40,360
Speaker 1: police militarization, but it really is not. A lot of

2011
01:49:40,439 --> 01:49:43,240
Speaker 1: times when liberals talk about reforming police, they discussed the

2012
01:49:43,320 --> 01:49:46,479
Speaker 1: need for more police training, but police actually go through

2013
01:49:46,560 --> 01:49:48,960
Speaker 1: a shipload of training. Like there's there's a bunch of

2014
01:49:49,000 --> 01:49:51,320
Speaker 1: billboards or like placards them going in a protest that

2015
01:49:51,360 --> 01:49:53,680
Speaker 1: like talked about how much less cops training cops need

2016
01:49:53,760 --> 01:49:56,880
Speaker 1: than like hair stylists, And that's true, but that's true

2017
01:49:56,920 --> 01:49:58,960
Speaker 1: for how much cops training. Cops need to get on

2018
01:49:59,000 --> 01:50:02,599
Speaker 1: the street. They take a lot of training after becoming cops,

2019
01:50:02,960 --> 01:50:05,639
Speaker 1: and a lot of that training makes them more dangerous

2020
01:50:05,760 --> 01:50:08,160
Speaker 1: as cops. Um. And this is part of the problem

2021
01:50:08,280 --> 01:50:11,160
Speaker 1: we talk about like needing to train police more. Over

2022
01:50:11,240 --> 01:50:15,000
Speaker 1: the last twenty years, police training has become increasingly paramilitary,

2023
01:50:15,240 --> 01:50:18,519
Speaker 1: with military veterans like Lieutenant Colonel David Grossman and companies

2024
01:50:18,600 --> 01:50:22,920
Speaker 1: like Close Quarters Battle CQB providing training that deliberately bills

2025
01:50:22,960 --> 01:50:26,519
Speaker 1: itself as military style and refers to officers as warriors,

2026
01:50:26,720 --> 01:50:28,719
Speaker 1: all while convincing them that they are in more danger

2027
01:50:28,760 --> 01:50:31,719
Speaker 1: than cops have ever faced. From the end of policing.

2028
01:50:31,800 --> 01:50:35,200
Speaker 1: Quote Sef Stoughton, a former police officer turned law professors,

2029
01:50:35,200 --> 01:50:38,040
Speaker 1: shows how officers are repeatedly exposed to scenarios in which

2030
01:50:38,080 --> 01:50:41,280
Speaker 1: seemingly innocuous interactions with the public, such as traffic stops,

2031
01:50:41,360 --> 01:50:44,439
Speaker 1: turned deadly. The endlessly repeated point is that any encounter

2032
01:50:44,560 --> 01:50:46,800
Speaker 1: can turn deadly in a split second. Of officers don't

2033
01:50:46,840 --> 01:50:50,240
Speaker 1: remain ready to use lethal force at any moment. So

2034
01:50:51,840 --> 01:50:54,320
Speaker 1: take the case of John Crawford, an African American man

2035
01:50:54,439 --> 01:50:56,799
Speaker 1: shot to death by a police officer in Walmart and Ohio.

2036
01:50:57,200 --> 01:50:59,200
Speaker 1: Crawford had picked up an air gun off the shelf

2037
01:50:59,280 --> 01:51:01,840
Speaker 1: and was carrying it around the store while shopping. Another

2038
01:51:01,880 --> 01:51:03,800
Speaker 1: shopper called nine one one to report a man with

2039
01:51:03,880 --> 01:51:06,800
Speaker 1: a gun in the store. The stores video camera shows

2040
01:51:06,840 --> 01:51:09,120
Speaker 1: that one of the responding officers shot without warning while

2041
01:51:09,160 --> 01:51:11,720
Speaker 1: Crawford was talking on the phone. In Ohio, it is

2042
01:51:11,800 --> 01:51:14,479
Speaker 1: legal to carry a gun openly, but the officer had

2043
01:51:14,520 --> 01:51:18,080
Speaker 1: been trained to use deadly force upon seeing a gun. Similarly,

2044
01:51:18,160 --> 01:51:20,519
Speaker 1: in South Carolina, a state trooper drove up to a

2045
01:51:20,600 --> 01:51:22,160
Speaker 1: young man in his car at a gas station and

2046
01:51:22,200 --> 01:51:24,800
Speaker 1: asked him for his driver's license. He leaned into the

2047
01:51:24,880 --> 01:51:27,679
Speaker 1: car to comply, and the officers shot him without warning.

2048
01:51:28,000 --> 01:51:31,880
Speaker 1: See Unexpected movement shoot. This is again what you get

2049
01:51:31,960 --> 01:51:34,920
Speaker 1: with more police training. This is what I'm saying, The

2050
01:51:35,000 --> 01:51:38,720
Speaker 1: training makes you scared. Yes, yeah, more training is not

2051
01:51:38,920 --> 01:51:42,439
Speaker 1: the solution because this is what the training does. Yeah,

2052
01:51:42,560 --> 01:51:45,000
Speaker 1: you could argue maybe different training is the solution, but

2053
01:51:45,080 --> 01:51:47,120
Speaker 1: you also still have tens of thousands of cops who

2054
01:51:47,160 --> 01:51:49,080
Speaker 1: already have this ship in their heads. What do you

2055
01:51:49,120 --> 01:51:51,559
Speaker 1: do with them? If they're still on the force, how

2056
01:51:51,600 --> 01:51:54,559
Speaker 1: do you how do you cleanse that from them? Are

2057
01:51:54,600 --> 01:51:58,439
Speaker 1: you confident you can? Now? Modern police US cops are

2058
01:51:58,439 --> 01:52:01,559
Speaker 1: equipped with military grid weaponry, but not with military grade training.

2059
01:52:01,640 --> 01:52:03,680
Speaker 1: They're told that their own safety is their number one

2060
01:52:03,720 --> 01:52:06,680
Speaker 1: concern and anything they do to protect themselves is justified.

2061
01:52:07,040 --> 01:52:09,960
Speaker 1: We have essentially raised and equipped a military, told them

2062
01:52:10,000 --> 01:52:11,760
Speaker 1: that they are at war every day with the people

2063
01:52:11,800 --> 01:52:13,560
Speaker 1: of this country, and then sent them out to the

2064
01:52:13,600 --> 01:52:15,799
Speaker 1: streets with a license to kill if they feel scared

2065
01:52:15,880 --> 01:52:18,640
Speaker 1: for any reason. And this is not a simple right

2066
01:52:18,880 --> 01:52:22,519
Speaker 1: versus left issue. After Democrat Michael Ducacus was defeated in

2067
01:52:22,600 --> 01:52:25,080
Speaker 1: nineteen eighty eight for being soft on crime via a

2068
01:52:25,320 --> 01:52:29,280
Speaker 1: super racist ad, Democrats pivoted to Yeah, the Willie Horton ad.

2069
01:52:29,680 --> 01:52:33,240
Speaker 1: Democrats pivoted to endorsing right wing law and order politics.

2070
01:52:33,520 --> 01:52:36,560
Speaker 1: Bill Clinton's nine Crime Bill added tens of thousands of

2071
01:52:36,600 --> 01:52:39,320
Speaker 1: police nationwide and expanded the drug war. And in fact,

2072
01:52:39,360 --> 01:52:43,120
Speaker 1: it wasn't until Clinton's second term that widespread police militarization

2073
01:52:43,240 --> 01:52:46,479
Speaker 1: was even made possible. In nineteen a bunch of heavily

2074
01:52:46,600 --> 01:52:48,880
Speaker 1: armed and armored gunmen try to rob some businesses again

2075
01:52:48,920 --> 01:52:50,960
Speaker 1: to a big gunfight with Los Angeles cops. Is the

2076
01:52:51,240 --> 01:52:54,920
Speaker 1: North Hollywood shoot out? Um? Yeah, police side arms were

2077
01:52:54,960 --> 01:52:57,320
Speaker 1: incapable of piercing their armor, and cops had to borrow

2078
01:52:57,400 --> 01:53:00,240
Speaker 1: high caliber rifles from a nearby gun store. When the

2079
01:53:00,360 --> 01:53:03,479
Speaker 1: National Defense Authorization Act was passed later that year, it

2080
01:53:03,600 --> 01:53:06,479
Speaker 1: included the ten thirty three program, a provision that allowed

2081
01:53:06,560 --> 01:53:11,000
Speaker 1: law enforcement agencies to acquire military hardware. Between nine and

2082
01:53:11,080 --> 01:53:14,519
Speaker 1: two thousand fourteen, five point one billion dollars in material

2083
01:53:14,640 --> 01:53:18,000
Speaker 1: was transferred from the Department of Defense to local law enforcement.

2084
01:53:18,800 --> 01:53:20,759
Speaker 1: Now near the end of his time in office, President

2085
01:53:20,840 --> 01:53:24,280
Speaker 1: Obama attempted to belatedly halt this massive transfer of military

2086
01:53:24,400 --> 01:53:27,800
Speaker 1: armaments to police, but President Trump reversed that and accelerated

2087
01:53:27,800 --> 01:53:30,200
Speaker 1: the transfer of military weapons to cops. And this is

2088
01:53:30,240 --> 01:53:33,160
Speaker 1: why in a ten year period, forty nine m wraps

2089
01:53:33,280 --> 01:53:36,240
Speaker 1: mine resistant patrol vehicles were handed out to police departments

2090
01:53:36,280 --> 01:53:39,240
Speaker 1: in Florida alone. Many of these went to lightly populated

2091
01:53:39,320 --> 01:53:43,439
Speaker 1: rural counties like Baker population seven thousand. In Ohio, the

2092
01:53:43,520 --> 01:53:47,880
Speaker 1: Department of Natural Resources received two hundred and forty fully

2093
01:53:47,880 --> 01:53:51,639
Speaker 1: automatic rifles. The Los Angeles County Sheriff's Department got seven

2094
01:53:51,760 --> 01:53:54,479
Speaker 1: hundred and sixty eight fully automatic rifles. By the way,

2095
01:53:54,720 --> 01:53:56,679
Speaker 1: I found all of this in a Forbes breakdown, which

2096
01:53:56,760 --> 01:53:59,240
Speaker 1: notes that U. S cops also received more than six

2097
01:53:59,320 --> 01:54:02,799
Speaker 1: thousand bay anets between two thousand six and two thousand seventeen.

2098
01:54:03,160 --> 01:54:06,320
Speaker 1: What do you need six thousand like our milits? Our

2099
01:54:06,400 --> 01:54:09,719
Speaker 1: soldiers don't even fucking use bayonets anymore because they're useless

2100
01:54:10,120 --> 01:54:12,840
Speaker 1: and modern. They weren't even that useful when bayonets were

2101
01:54:12,840 --> 01:54:17,280
Speaker 1: actually used in combat. Um So, remember the study that

2102
01:54:17,360 --> 01:54:19,519
Speaker 1: showed SWAT teams were more likely to be deployed in

2103
01:54:19,600 --> 01:54:23,080
Speaker 1: black neighborhoods. Well, it also found that quote seeing militarized

2104
01:54:23,080 --> 01:54:26,360
Speaker 1: police and news reports made diminish police reputation in the

2105
01:54:26,439 --> 01:54:28,960
Speaker 1: mass public. And this is you know there's that news

2106
01:54:28,960 --> 01:54:31,200
Speaker 1: story about like the the l A school police having

2107
01:54:31,240 --> 01:54:33,360
Speaker 1: an m wrap. These are the tanks, Like they're not

2108
01:54:33,440 --> 01:54:36,240
Speaker 1: really tanks, but they're huge armored trucks. And I have

2109
01:54:36,320 --> 01:54:41,120
Speaker 1: a story about huge armored trucks prop because when I

2110
01:54:41,200 --> 01:54:43,200
Speaker 1: was in Moses, most of the people I was inbedded

2111
01:54:43,240 --> 01:54:45,080
Speaker 1: with were the Iraqi army, and they mostly drove a

2112
01:54:45,160 --> 01:54:48,360
Speaker 1: mix of like technicals which are just like Toyota trucks

2113
01:54:48,440 --> 01:54:50,440
Speaker 1: with guns in the bed uh and old U S

2114
01:54:50,520 --> 01:54:52,880
Speaker 1: military hum vs. They didn't have a whole lot of

2115
01:54:52,960 --> 01:54:57,000
Speaker 1: heavy military vehicles. The only time you saw US police

2116
01:54:57,360 --> 01:54:59,680
Speaker 1: in the places, or the US cops or not cops,

2117
01:54:59,720 --> 01:55:01,560
Speaker 1: sorry the him you say, US soldiers in the places

2118
01:55:01,600 --> 01:55:03,880
Speaker 1: where I was was when they were rolling around in

2119
01:55:03,960 --> 01:55:05,880
Speaker 1: em wraps and usually be a patrol of like three

2120
01:55:05,920 --> 01:55:09,440
Speaker 1: of these gigantic I can't exaggerate how fucking big an

2121
01:55:09,480 --> 01:55:13,560
Speaker 1: im wrap looks there. They are nightmarishly large vehicles, and

2122
01:55:13,600 --> 01:55:16,240
Speaker 1: they look like The first time I remember seeing one

2123
01:55:16,360 --> 01:55:18,880
Speaker 1: is I'm on the out, like maybe a quarter of

2124
01:55:18,880 --> 01:55:20,400
Speaker 1: a mile back from the front line, and I'm like

2125
01:55:20,520 --> 01:55:24,120
Speaker 1: literally sitting and smoking a cigarette with um my photographer

2126
01:55:24,200 --> 01:55:26,840
Speaker 1: and some friends on a pile of rubble, like listening

2127
01:55:26,880 --> 01:55:29,440
Speaker 1: to a gunfight occur in the distance, and there's like

2128
01:55:29,520 --> 01:55:31,880
Speaker 1: little kids running around and stuff, trying to sell us

2129
01:55:31,960 --> 01:55:34,120
Speaker 1: things and whatnot. Like we all stopped for a second

2130
01:55:34,160 --> 01:55:37,000
Speaker 1: as this US patrol rolls by, and these three giant

2131
01:55:37,160 --> 01:55:39,520
Speaker 1: m wraps, And the first thing I think of when

2132
01:55:39,560 --> 01:55:41,640
Speaker 1: I see them up close and personal for the first

2133
01:55:41,680 --> 01:55:48,720
Speaker 1: time is like, these look like a T eighties. That's

2134
01:55:48,760 --> 01:55:50,760
Speaker 1: what these are is. These are these are the These

2135
01:55:50,800 --> 01:55:54,520
Speaker 1: are the fucking Imperial Stormtroopers T eight You can't see

2136
01:55:54,600 --> 01:55:57,560
Speaker 1: the human beings inside, you can't see people. It is

2137
01:55:57,680 --> 01:56:03,480
Speaker 1: just this. It's this, this physical manifestation of the violent

2138
01:56:03,600 --> 01:56:05,560
Speaker 1: power of the state. That's what it felt like. And

2139
01:56:05,640 --> 01:56:07,600
Speaker 1: that's what I could see. These little Iraqi kids on

2140
01:56:07,680 --> 01:56:10,600
Speaker 1: the ground, like we're seeing that that was what a U. S.

2141
01:56:10,680 --> 01:56:14,360
Speaker 1: Soldier was to them, was like was was a fucking machine.

2142
01:56:14,920 --> 01:56:18,600
Speaker 1: And that's what seeing these in the hands of cops

2143
01:56:18,760 --> 01:56:20,840
Speaker 1: makes you think about cops, Like police want to wonder,

2144
01:56:20,960 --> 01:56:23,280
Speaker 1: like why people don't like them or expect them anymore.

2145
01:56:23,640 --> 01:56:26,200
Speaker 1: It's because we see you as pieces of an armed

2146
01:56:26,320 --> 01:56:30,320
Speaker 1: machine and nobody likes Yeah, you rolled up like the

2147
01:56:30,440 --> 01:56:33,760
Speaker 1: Sith Lord, like you look like you look like Darth Vader,

2148
01:56:33,880 --> 01:56:35,800
Speaker 1: like you, you know what I'm saying, Yeah, yeah, you

2149
01:56:35,960 --> 01:56:39,800
Speaker 1: look like Stormtroopers. We don't like stormtroopers. No, they're not

2150
01:56:39,920 --> 01:56:43,760
Speaker 1: the good guys. Yeah. Now, I could go on and

2151
01:56:43,880 --> 01:56:46,480
Speaker 1: on about like the insane weaponry cops are given these days,

2152
01:56:46,480 --> 01:56:48,600
Speaker 1: and I could lest repeated anecdotes about how often they

2153
01:56:48,680 --> 01:56:50,800
Speaker 1: badly misuse it. But I think the most important point

2154
01:56:50,840 --> 01:56:52,800
Speaker 1: to end on for this episode and for this series

2155
01:56:53,200 --> 01:56:56,000
Speaker 1: is how fucking much we spend on militarized police for

2156
01:56:56,080 --> 01:56:59,760
Speaker 1: how fucking little we get. The Minneapolis Police Department takes

2157
01:56:59,840 --> 01:57:03,080
Speaker 1: up thirty five percent of the city's general fund, The

2158
01:57:03,200 --> 01:57:06,760
Speaker 1: Chicago p D are thirty seven percent of their city's budget.

2159
01:57:07,000 --> 01:57:09,800
Speaker 1: Atlanta and Detroit police come in and about thirty percent.

2160
01:57:10,080 --> 01:57:11,960
Speaker 1: The l A p D is a quarter of Los

2161
01:57:12,040 --> 01:57:16,080
Speaker 1: Angeles's budget. Many cities spend up to of their municipal

2162
01:57:16,160 --> 01:57:19,760
Speaker 1: budgets on their police department, making the basically making like

2163
01:57:20,000 --> 01:57:21,600
Speaker 1: a lot of cities in the US are basically like

2164
01:57:21,760 --> 01:57:25,040
Speaker 1: small armies with towns attached to them. Up until the

2165
01:57:25,120 --> 01:57:27,520
Speaker 1: nineteen eighties, the U. S government spent about as much

2166
01:57:27,520 --> 01:57:30,200
Speaker 1: money on criminal justice as we did on cash welfare,

2167
01:57:30,240 --> 01:57:33,160
Speaker 1: on like welfare programs that deliberately like directly hand out

2168
01:57:33,280 --> 01:57:36,440
Speaker 1: like aid to people um. Up until the nineteen eighties, Yeah,

2169
01:57:36,840 --> 01:57:39,000
Speaker 1: about equal what we spent on law enforcement we spent

2170
01:57:39,080 --> 01:57:42,680
Speaker 1: on welfare. In the decades since, welfare spending has declined

2171
01:57:42,760 --> 01:57:45,680
Speaker 1: and police funding has soared. Today we spend more than

2172
01:57:45,720 --> 01:57:47,960
Speaker 1: twice as much money on law and order as we

2173
01:57:48,080 --> 01:57:51,280
Speaker 1: do on social welfare, and we get very little for

2174
01:57:51,400 --> 01:57:53,880
Speaker 1: our money. For all the weapon really buy our cops,

2175
01:57:54,080 --> 01:57:56,800
Speaker 1: the vast majority of police officers will never fire a

2176
01:57:56,880 --> 01:57:59,520
Speaker 1: weapon in the line of duty, for all the police,

2177
01:58:00,320 --> 01:58:03,360
Speaker 1: not once, not once. For all that police advocates talk

2178
01:58:03,360 --> 01:58:07,000
Speaker 1: about dangerous criminals, most police officers make no more than

2179
01:58:07,080 --> 01:58:10,560
Speaker 1: one felony arrest per year. And when it comes to

2180
01:58:10,600 --> 01:58:12,920
Speaker 1: the question of how good police are it actually solving crimes?

2181
01:58:13,120 --> 01:58:17,320
Speaker 1: About forty of murders go unsolved, only about fifty three

2182
01:58:17,400 --> 01:58:20,720
Speaker 1: percent of aggravated assaults are solved, less than thirty percent

2183
01:58:20,800 --> 01:58:24,720
Speaker 1: of robberies are solved, and only about of automobile thefts

2184
01:58:24,800 --> 01:58:28,480
Speaker 1: are solved. The FBI's Uniform Crime Reports says that thirty

2185
01:58:28,760 --> 01:58:31,320
Speaker 1: percent of rapes are solved, but that number doesn't really

2186
01:58:31,400 --> 01:58:33,280
Speaker 1: tell the whole story. And I'm gonna quote from the

2187
01:58:33,320 --> 01:58:36,240
Speaker 1: Guardian for this one because again, this is like the

2188
01:58:36,320 --> 01:58:37,720
Speaker 1: reason I bring this up is that like that's one

2189
01:58:37,720 --> 01:58:39,840
Speaker 1: of the number one things. Like people who will argue

2190
01:58:39,840 --> 01:58:42,400
Speaker 1: about like police abolition. Other folks will say like, well,

2191
01:58:42,400 --> 01:58:44,000
Speaker 1: who are you gonna call if you're getting raped? Well,

2192
01:58:44,080 --> 01:58:47,360
Speaker 1: let's talk about how good police do it solving Only

2193
01:58:47,440 --> 01:58:50,000
Speaker 1: that I hear the argument like, no, they need more money,

2194
01:58:50,040 --> 01:58:52,800
Speaker 1: they're underfunded, and I'm like, actually, they're more funded than

2195
01:58:52,880 --> 01:58:57,560
Speaker 1: every other program. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, significantly more. I'm

2196
01:58:57,560 --> 01:58:59,880
Speaker 1: gonna quote from the Guardian for this one quote. The

2197
01:59:00,040 --> 01:59:03,000
Speaker 1: fact is that the police never investigate most sexual violence

2198
01:59:03,040 --> 01:59:05,760
Speaker 1: because most sexual violence goes and reported. According to the

2199
01:59:05,880 --> 01:59:08,760
Speaker 1: Rape and Incest National Network or RAIN, a little less

2200
01:59:08,760 --> 01:59:12,040
Speaker 1: than twenty of sexual assaults are reported to police significantly

2201
01:59:12,120 --> 01:59:14,640
Speaker 1: less than other violent crimes. The reasons are myriad, but

2202
01:59:14,720 --> 01:59:17,400
Speaker 1: an often cited one is a distrust and fear of

2203
01:59:17,520 --> 01:59:21,320
Speaker 1: the police, which obviously is increased by militarization. One survey

2204
01:59:21,400 --> 01:59:24,080
Speaker 1: of sexual assault survivors found that of those who chose

2205
01:59:24,160 --> 01:59:26,880
Speaker 1: not to report, fient feared that the police could not

2206
01:59:27,040 --> 01:59:29,480
Speaker 1: or would not do anything to help. An additional seven

2207
01:59:29,560 --> 01:59:32,040
Speaker 1: percent did not want to expose their attacker to the police.

2208
01:59:32,720 --> 01:59:35,560
Speaker 1: A two thousand eighteen study of the Austin, Texas Police

2209
01:59:35,600 --> 01:59:38,960
Speaker 1: Department found that officers tasked with investigating sexual assaults could

2210
01:59:39,000 --> 01:59:42,640
Speaker 1: not read lab reports on DNA evidence and often lacked

2211
01:59:42,680 --> 01:59:46,320
Speaker 1: a basic understanding of female anatomy. I have to google.

2212
01:59:46,680 --> 01:59:50,160
Speaker 1: I listen to fucking this, I have to google stuff

2213
01:59:50,440 --> 01:59:56,520
Speaker 1: like labia majora. One officer said that guy shouldn't be

2214
01:59:56,600 --> 02:00:01,760
Speaker 1: investigating sex cribes invigating sex crist here and but but

2215
02:00:01,960 --> 02:00:04,200
Speaker 1: rather than paying for him to learn what a volva is,

2216
02:00:04,840 --> 02:00:06,880
Speaker 1: big home, he got a bayonet. Oh, I'll bet he

2217
02:00:06,960 --> 02:00:09,880
Speaker 1: knows how to use a machine gun, all of the

2218
02:00:09,960 --> 02:00:13,960
Speaker 1: parts of a machine gun. So sometimes police failures to

2219
02:00:14,040 --> 02:00:17,200
Speaker 1: investigate sexual violence look like the result of not just stupidity,

2220
02:00:17,400 --> 02:00:20,280
Speaker 1: but of outright duplicity. One study of the New York

2221
02:00:20,280 --> 02:00:23,520
Speaker 1: Police Department discovered that it was knowingly under counting rapes

2222
02:00:23,560 --> 02:00:26,360
Speaker 1: and its public figures, using a deliberately strict definition of

2223
02:00:26,480 --> 02:00:28,560
Speaker 1: rape in order to shrink the number of reported cases

2224
02:00:28,600 --> 02:00:31,280
Speaker 1: in New York. An inquiry into the NYPD found that

2225
02:00:31,360 --> 02:00:34,280
Speaker 1: it's Special Victims Division to be grossly dysfunctional, with officers

2226
02:00:34,360 --> 02:00:40,040
Speaker 1: instructed to simply not investigate misdemeanor sexual assault cases. First

2227
02:00:40,080 --> 02:00:42,080
Speaker 1: of all, the fact that that's a thing, a misdemeanor

2228
02:00:42,120 --> 02:00:45,160
Speaker 1: sexual assault is already a problem. Now you're not going

2229
02:00:45,200 --> 02:00:48,640
Speaker 1: to investigate. Yeah, well, and like, this is actually kind

2230
02:00:48,680 --> 02:00:51,280
Speaker 1: of a pattern with the NYPD, and I assume other

2231
02:00:51,320 --> 02:00:54,240
Speaker 1: departments of like, so they're under counting rape and its

2232
02:00:54,320 --> 02:00:56,520
Speaker 1: public figures, so it seems like they solve more rapes

2233
02:00:56,560 --> 02:00:58,680
Speaker 1: than they do. There was a study that came out

2234
02:00:58,760 --> 02:01:02,040
Speaker 1: about how often the NYPD hits when they shoot people

2235
02:01:02,080 --> 02:01:04,200
Speaker 1: with their firearms, right, which is something you want to know,

2236
02:01:04,280 --> 02:01:06,080
Speaker 1: especially since the YPD is considered to be one of

2237
02:01:06,080 --> 02:01:08,320
Speaker 1: the best trained police departments in the country, and the

2238
02:01:08,440 --> 02:01:10,480
Speaker 1: NYPD was very proud of the fact that they had

2239
02:01:10,520 --> 02:01:15,080
Speaker 1: a thirty percent hit rate um in gunfights, um, which

2240
02:01:15,080 --> 02:01:16,720
Speaker 1: is actually, like, I mean, I'm gonna be honest with you,

2241
02:01:17,160 --> 02:01:19,240
Speaker 1: people very rarely hit when they are shooting at each

2242
02:01:19,240 --> 02:01:21,240
Speaker 1: other in a gunfight because it's stressful. A lot of

2243
02:01:21,320 --> 02:01:23,840
Speaker 1: fucking misses. It's very hard to be accurate, not to fit.

2244
02:01:23,920 --> 02:01:25,720
Speaker 1: But like that was their their number was, like we

2245
02:01:25,840 --> 02:01:27,760
Speaker 1: hit thirty percent of the time when we just charge

2246
02:01:27,760 --> 02:01:30,920
Speaker 1: our weapons in like a a violent situation. But then

2247
02:01:31,160 --> 02:01:34,280
Speaker 1: people who analyze the NYPD data found that the NYPD

2248
02:01:34,400 --> 02:01:38,840
Speaker 1: was only hitting because they were including police officers suicides

2249
02:01:38,960 --> 02:01:47,360
Speaker 1: as one shot stops. Wait, they were they were they

2250
02:01:47,400 --> 02:01:50,520
Speaker 1: were goofing their own numbers by including their suicides. Is like,

2251
02:01:51,360 --> 02:01:53,800
Speaker 1: I mean, yeah, they're They're basically saying, like that cop

2252
02:01:53,880 --> 02:01:58,520
Speaker 1: took a dangerous man off the streets himself. Count it counts,

2253
02:01:59,240 --> 02:02:04,320
Speaker 1: It counts. Yeah, it's pretty pretty wild. So conservative estimates

2254
02:02:04,360 --> 02:02:06,920
Speaker 1: suggest that US police have two hundred thousand untested rape

2255
02:02:06,960 --> 02:02:10,320
Speaker 1: kits in their possession nationwide. Rain's best estimate is that

2256
02:02:10,480 --> 02:02:13,560
Speaker 1: only about four point six percent of sexual assaults ever

2257
02:02:13,680 --> 02:02:16,280
Speaker 1: lead to an arrest, and less than one percent are

2258
02:02:16,320 --> 02:02:19,480
Speaker 1: ever referred to police by prosecutors. So if you are

2259
02:02:19,560 --> 02:02:21,560
Speaker 1: raped and you refuse to talk to the cops. Your

2260
02:02:21,560 --> 02:02:24,000
Speaker 1: odds of getting justice are more or less the same

2261
02:02:24,080 --> 02:02:25,960
Speaker 1: as someone who dials and nine one one right away.

2262
02:02:26,920 --> 02:02:30,120
Speaker 1: She's And then, of course there's the fact that cops

2263
02:02:30,160 --> 02:02:33,600
Speaker 1: commit just a shipload of rape. Bowling Green State University,

2264
02:02:34,120 --> 02:02:36,040
Speaker 1: you know you're gonna get I was gonna say, when

2265
02:02:36,080 --> 02:02:37,920
Speaker 1: you're talking about rape, I was like, they're not reporting

2266
02:02:37,960 --> 02:02:39,720
Speaker 1: them because they're doing it. They are doing a lot

2267
02:02:39,760 --> 02:02:42,760
Speaker 1: of them. Yeah. Bowling Green State University documented at least

2268
02:02:42,760 --> 02:02:45,080
Speaker 1: four hundred in five rapes by police officers on duty

2269
02:02:45,120 --> 02:02:47,520
Speaker 1: between two thousand five and two thirteen. That is an

2270
02:02:47,560 --> 02:02:50,680
Speaker 1: offer an average of forty five per year. They also

2271
02:02:50,760 --> 02:02:54,320
Speaker 1: documented six and thirty six instances of forcible fondling. These

2272
02:02:54,400 --> 02:02:56,480
Speaker 1: numbers are only a fraction of the real total, since

2273
02:02:56,520 --> 02:02:58,920
Speaker 1: most sexual assaults are never reported and most rapists have

2274
02:02:59,000 --> 02:03:01,240
Speaker 1: at least five victim is over the course of their career.

2275
02:03:01,760 --> 02:03:04,320
Speaker 1: The CNN article I found about this investigation into cop

2276
02:03:04,440 --> 02:03:06,440
Speaker 1: rape includes one of the most horrifying lines have ever

2277
02:03:06,480 --> 02:03:09,560
Speaker 1: read in an article, quote about half of the victims

2278
02:03:09,600 --> 02:03:12,560
Speaker 1: their children, researchers, say Stinson, one of the researchers, has

2279
02:03:12,560 --> 02:03:15,640
Speaker 1: gotten accustomed to hearing his research assistants proclaimed during their work,

2280
02:03:15,920 --> 02:03:25,160
Speaker 1: Oh my god, it's another fourteen year old. Oh again, Yeah, yeah,

2281
02:03:25,200 --> 02:03:30,760
Speaker 1: that I have a guttural physical response to that. Yeah. So.

2282
02:03:32,080 --> 02:03:34,280
Speaker 1: One of the first arguments you'll get against police abolition

2283
02:03:34,360 --> 02:03:36,440
Speaker 1: is against some version of the question without cops, who's

2284
02:03:36,440 --> 02:03:38,560
Speaker 1: who you're gonna call if you know, rape or whatever,

2285
02:03:38,720 --> 02:03:41,840
Speaker 1: if X crime happens to you. The second argument is

2286
02:03:41,960 --> 02:03:44,440
Speaker 1: usually that even if the cops aren't necessarily great at

2287
02:03:44,480 --> 02:03:48,720
Speaker 1: solving crimes, they prevent violence and crime by their presence

2288
02:03:48,760 --> 02:03:51,960
Speaker 1: and areas. And Alex Vitali, the author of the End

2289
02:03:51,960 --> 02:03:54,760
Speaker 1: of Policing, strikes back at that claim quote it is

2290
02:03:54,840 --> 02:03:57,720
Speaker 1: largely a liberal fantasy that the police exists to protect

2291
02:03:57,800 --> 02:04:00,280
Speaker 1: us from the bad guys. As the veteran police scholar

2292
02:04:00,400 --> 02:04:03,440
Speaker 1: David Bailey argues, the police do not prevent crime. This

2293
02:04:03,560 --> 02:04:05,560
Speaker 1: is one of the best kept secrets of modern life.

2294
02:04:05,800 --> 02:04:08,280
Speaker 1: Experts know it, the police know it, but the public

2295
02:04:08,360 --> 02:04:10,400
Speaker 1: does not know it. Yet. The police pretend that they

2296
02:04:10,440 --> 02:04:13,320
Speaker 1: are society's best defense against crime and continually argue that

2297
02:04:13,400 --> 02:04:16,280
Speaker 1: they if they are given more resources, especially personnel, they

2298
02:04:16,320 --> 02:04:19,160
Speaker 1: will be able to protect communities against crime. This is

2299
02:04:19,320 --> 02:04:21,960
Speaker 1: a myth, and he is very right when he says

2300
02:04:22,000 --> 02:04:24,400
Speaker 1: that a lot of data backs this argument up. The

2301
02:04:24,600 --> 02:04:27,200
Speaker 1: raw number of police in this country has declined for

2302
02:04:27,280 --> 02:04:29,520
Speaker 1: the last five years straight, and the rate of police

2303
02:04:29,560 --> 02:04:33,000
Speaker 1: officers per one thousand residents in the United States has

2304
02:04:33,040 --> 02:04:35,320
Speaker 1: been dropping for twenty years. You know what else has

2305
02:04:35,360 --> 02:04:38,920
Speaker 1: been dropping for twenty years? Prop? What the crime rate?

2306
02:04:39,440 --> 02:04:43,200
Speaker 1: The crime rate? Yeah, the police lost twenty three thousand

2307
02:04:43,360 --> 02:04:45,920
Speaker 1: net officers nationwide from two thousand and thirteen to two

2308
02:04:45,920 --> 02:04:49,240
Speaker 1: thousand and sixteen, with no corresponding surgeon crime. Now, despite

2309
02:04:49,240 --> 02:04:51,400
Speaker 1: the fact that crime has dropped sadly for twenty years,

2310
02:04:51,600 --> 02:04:55,360
Speaker 1: most Americans believe that crime rates have increased throughout their lifetimes.

2311
02:04:56,160 --> 02:04:58,720
Speaker 1: Why are people like that? Why are people like that?

2312
02:04:58,800 --> 02:05:01,640
Speaker 1: I have an answer for you. Up, Yeah, I have

2313
02:05:01,720 --> 02:05:03,520
Speaker 1: a fucking answer for you. Are you ready for this?

2314
02:05:04,040 --> 02:05:10,320
Speaker 1: Are you ready to talk about Hollywood again? Yea be yeah,

2315
02:05:10,600 --> 02:05:14,840
Speaker 1: A lot, yeah, a lot of you know, like when

2316
02:05:14,880 --> 02:05:21,400
Speaker 1: you're like, okay, you know what you know what prevents crime? Jobs? Yeah? Resources,

2317
02:05:21,960 --> 02:05:26,120
Speaker 1: It's just easy giving people heroin if they're addicted, you know,

2318
02:05:26,800 --> 02:05:30,160
Speaker 1: maybe maybe laws that shouldn't be laws, like and making

2319
02:05:30,200 --> 02:05:32,040
Speaker 1: sure that the person handing them that heroin says, Hey,

2320
02:05:32,280 --> 02:05:34,760
Speaker 1: there's some doctors or some professionals over here if you

2321
02:05:34,800 --> 02:05:37,040
Speaker 1: want to stop this, like we can. We can help

2322
02:05:37,120 --> 02:05:39,480
Speaker 1: you out with this, but nobody's gonna fuck you up

2323
02:05:39,520 --> 02:05:42,200
Speaker 1: for doing this. Here's a couch. Yeah. It turns out

2324
02:05:42,240 --> 02:05:44,960
Speaker 1: that actually objectively works better in every single place that

2325
02:05:45,400 --> 02:05:50,480
Speaker 1: he works. Yeah. Um. So the answer to why people

2326
02:05:50,560 --> 02:05:53,280
Speaker 1: think that police are just absolutely critical and holding back

2327
02:05:53,320 --> 02:05:54,880
Speaker 1: a tide of violence has a lot to do with

2328
02:05:54,920 --> 02:05:57,520
Speaker 1: the TV show Dragnet and its descendants. In the fall

2329
02:05:57,560 --> 02:06:00,920
Speaker 1: of two thousand nineteen, more than six percent of primetime

2330
02:06:01,040 --> 02:06:06,200
Speaker 1: dramas on TV were about police, crime and the legal system.

2331
02:06:06,760 --> 02:06:09,280
Speaker 1: Many of these shows, like Cops and Live p D

2332
02:06:09,480 --> 02:06:12,480
Speaker 1: worked directly with law enforcement and receive approval from departments

2333
02:06:12,520 --> 02:06:15,200
Speaker 1: for every episode they aired, the same way Dragnet did.

2334
02:06:15,480 --> 02:06:18,240
Speaker 1: That's Cops. Cops got like the the Cops sign off

2335
02:06:18,280 --> 02:06:21,320
Speaker 1: on every episode of Cops, which is why that show

2336
02:06:21,400 --> 02:06:24,120
Speaker 1: doesn't show. There's a wonderful podcast you should all listen

2337
02:06:24,160 --> 02:06:26,640
Speaker 1: to after this called Running from Cops um and it

2338
02:06:26,800 --> 02:06:29,160
Speaker 1: it is a show, a podcast about the TV show

2339
02:06:29,200 --> 02:06:31,840
Speaker 1: Cops and about live TV And it's one of the

2340
02:06:31,920 --> 02:06:33,960
Speaker 1: things that they showcases. In the very first episode of

2341
02:06:34,040 --> 02:06:38,080
Speaker 1: Cops like they got access to the unaired footage that

2342
02:06:38,320 --> 02:06:41,120
Speaker 1: was shot for that episode of Cops, and like it

2343
02:06:41,280 --> 02:06:43,520
Speaker 1: showed that in the in this episode of Cops, like

2344
02:06:43,600 --> 02:06:45,720
Speaker 1: it showed them like busting this like family and like

2345
02:06:45,840 --> 02:06:48,160
Speaker 1: taking the kid, and like the the female officer who

2346
02:06:48,200 --> 02:06:49,600
Speaker 1: took the kid was like, it's okay, we're gonna get

2347
02:06:49,600 --> 02:06:50,960
Speaker 1: you to a safe place tonight. You're gonna have anice

2348
02:06:51,000 --> 02:06:53,400
Speaker 1: warm bed and toys and stuff. And in the part

2349
02:06:53,480 --> 02:06:56,880
Speaker 1: that wasn't aired, she took that child to like the

2350
02:06:56,920 --> 02:06:58,880
Speaker 1: place that she was supposed to take this kid after

2351
02:06:59,040 --> 02:07:01,680
Speaker 1: arresting the kids parents and they just put the kid

2352
02:07:01,760 --> 02:07:03,800
Speaker 1: in basically a cell because they didn't have a better

2353
02:07:03,840 --> 02:07:05,520
Speaker 1: or any toys. And like the lady cop is like

2354
02:07:05,680 --> 02:07:08,920
Speaker 1: in tears and like enraged when she realizes how fucked

2355
02:07:09,000 --> 02:07:14,360
Speaker 1: up the situation is that didn't they're on cops Like no, um,

2356
02:07:14,800 --> 02:07:17,560
Speaker 1: so again, watch Running from Cops. It's a great or

2357
02:07:17,640 --> 02:07:20,040
Speaker 1: listen to it. It's a great fucking podcast. Um. But

2358
02:07:20,280 --> 02:07:22,360
Speaker 1: one of the things they did on Running from Cops

2359
02:07:22,440 --> 02:07:26,800
Speaker 1: is they tried to analyze, like they watched eight episodes

2360
02:07:26,800 --> 02:07:29,800
Speaker 1: of the show, um and like analyzed the race of

2361
02:07:29,840 --> 02:07:32,400
Speaker 1: all of the people involved analyzed um the kind of

2362
02:07:32,440 --> 02:07:35,360
Speaker 1: crimes they're arrested for, and like put together data on

2363
02:07:35,480 --> 02:07:39,040
Speaker 1: like the world as presented by Cops as opposed to

2364
02:07:39,240 --> 02:07:41,400
Speaker 1: the actual world, and how crime actually works in our

2365
02:07:41,440 --> 02:07:44,000
Speaker 1: real world. Um, and I'm gonna quote from from an

2366
02:07:44,120 --> 02:07:47,600
Speaker 1: article written by one of the guys behind Running from Cops. Now,

2367
02:07:48,640 --> 02:07:51,600
Speaker 1: what we discovered was that, contrary to early press predictions,

2368
02:07:51,800 --> 02:07:54,560
Speaker 1: the world portrayed on Cops is not like the real world.

2369
02:07:54,800 --> 02:07:57,400
Speaker 1: There are about four times more violent crimes and cops

2370
02:07:57,480 --> 02:08:00,240
Speaker 1: than in reality, and three times more drug arrests and

2371
02:08:00,280 --> 02:08:02,960
Speaker 1: about ten times more arrests for sex work. The cops

2372
02:08:03,040 --> 02:08:05,960
Speaker 1: on the show are also, statistically speaking, extremely good at

2373
02:08:05,960 --> 02:08:08,840
Speaker 1: their jobs. Segments on the show in and arrest eighty

2374
02:08:08,920 --> 02:08:11,600
Speaker 1: four point four percent of the time. That number reflects

2375
02:08:11,640 --> 02:08:15,160
Speaker 1: a change over time from back in nineteen ninety tone

2376
02:08:15,960 --> 02:08:19,000
Speaker 1: and the most recent season in Cops World, law enforcement

2377
02:08:19,040 --> 02:08:21,680
Speaker 1: officers are so effective it's basically a given that a

2378
02:08:21,760 --> 02:08:27,480
Speaker 1: crime will end in an arrest. Now, that's interesting to me. Um,

2379
02:08:27,720 --> 02:08:29,600
Speaker 1: there's a lot that's interesting to me, including Like, one

2380
02:08:29,640 --> 02:08:30,920
Speaker 1: of the things they find in the show is that

2381
02:08:31,800 --> 02:08:34,320
Speaker 1: early on Cops like showed a hell of a lot

2382
02:08:34,400 --> 02:08:36,840
Speaker 1: more non white people getting arrested and like the double

2383
02:08:36,880 --> 02:08:39,520
Speaker 1: a CP complained and Cops fixed the problem and switched

2384
02:08:39,560 --> 02:08:43,160
Speaker 1: over to showing mostly white criminals. And part of yeah,

2385
02:08:43,440 --> 02:08:45,200
Speaker 1: part of how they did it was by just filming

2386
02:08:45,240 --> 02:08:51,200
Speaker 1: in Portland, Oregon. That's hilarious. I didn't know that, Yeah, yeah,

2387
02:08:51,280 --> 02:08:55,280
Speaker 1: but I did know, like, wow, it seems the black

2388
02:08:55,320 --> 02:08:58,840
Speaker 1: people no more. Yeah, yeah they did. They did fix

2389
02:08:58,920 --> 02:09:01,600
Speaker 1: that particular problem, m um. And you know, I gotta

2390
02:09:01,640 --> 02:09:03,480
Speaker 1: give it to him. Moving to Portland's a smart way

2391
02:09:03,520 --> 02:09:09,880
Speaker 1: to do that. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So most people who

2392
02:09:09,960 --> 02:09:12,040
Speaker 1: even like most fans of Cops Williganola is that the

2393
02:09:12,040 --> 02:09:14,640
Speaker 1: show has always been, you know, kind of trashy. But

2394
02:09:14,760 --> 02:09:18,160
Speaker 1: even lea yeah, and and like you would have found

2395
02:09:18,200 --> 02:09:19,880
Speaker 1: a lot more people who'd be willing to argue that

2396
02:09:19,960 --> 02:09:23,600
Speaker 1: Cops was harmful back before this most recent uprising. Then

2397
02:09:23,640 --> 02:09:25,280
Speaker 1: you would get to argue that there was a harm

2398
02:09:25,360 --> 02:09:28,160
Speaker 1: and shows like for example, Law and Order. But even

2399
02:09:28,240 --> 02:09:31,000
Speaker 1: shows like Law and Order contribute to our distorted cultural

2400
02:09:31,000 --> 02:09:33,680
Speaker 1: beliefs about the police. Now, obviously Law and Order doesn't

2401
02:09:33,720 --> 02:09:36,360
Speaker 1: push the militarized police angle. There's Law and Orders very

2402
02:09:36,440 --> 02:09:39,040
Speaker 1: much like a tribute to like Volmer's idea, of the

2403
02:09:39,120 --> 02:09:43,320
Speaker 1: police as scientists. Um, yeah, but it's still has a

2404
02:09:43,400 --> 02:09:46,720
Speaker 1: negative effect. Robert Thompson, a professor at Syracuse University who

2405
02:09:46,720 --> 02:09:49,480
Speaker 1: studies television and pop culture, noted in an interview with

2406
02:09:49,520 --> 02:09:52,040
Speaker 1: the Desiree News, quote, the very thing that keeps law

2407
02:09:52,040 --> 02:09:54,200
Speaker 1: and order going is the idea that they keep showing

2408
02:09:54,240 --> 02:09:57,600
Speaker 1: this efficient process over and over. Law and order gives,

2409
02:09:57,680 --> 02:09:59,920
Speaker 1: at least in part, some feel for this being an

2410
02:10:00,000 --> 02:10:03,600
Speaker 1: efficiently well oiled machine. And it just isn't. We already

2411
02:10:03,640 --> 02:10:06,560
Speaker 1: went through the statistics of how few crimes the police solved,

2412
02:10:06,600 --> 02:10:10,760
Speaker 1: because again, most of these scientific policing methods don't work

2413
02:10:10,840 --> 02:10:14,520
Speaker 1: nearly as well as as there they TV portrays them

2414
02:10:14,560 --> 02:10:18,520
Speaker 1: as yeah. Now. Color of Change released a report in

2415
02:10:18,640 --> 02:10:20,800
Speaker 1: January of this year based on a study of twenty

2416
02:10:20,880 --> 02:10:24,360
Speaker 1: six scripted crime dramas. It found that quote, these shows

2417
02:10:24,440 --> 02:10:27,960
Speaker 1: rendered racism invisible and dismissed any need for police accountability.

2418
02:10:28,240 --> 02:10:30,920
Speaker 1: They made a legal destructive and racist practices within the

2419
02:10:31,000 --> 02:10:35,920
Speaker 1: criminal justice system seem acceptable, justifiable, and necessary, even heroic.

2420
02:10:36,480 --> 02:10:39,200
Speaker 1: The study noted that of the writers for these shows

2421
02:10:39,320 --> 02:10:43,200
Speaker 1: were white men, only nine percent were black. Now. In

2422
02:10:43,280 --> 02:10:46,320
Speaker 1: the immediate aftermath of George Floyd's murder and this whole

2423
02:10:46,400 --> 02:10:49,160
Speaker 1: uprising thing. Both Cops and Live p D were canceled,

2424
02:10:49,240 --> 02:10:51,640
Speaker 1: and I I really think most people don't get what

2425
02:10:51,720 --> 02:10:53,720
Speaker 1: a big victory it is to have fucking cops off

2426
02:10:53,760 --> 02:10:57,480
Speaker 1: the air. Um. Yeah, I think they'll understand a little

2427
02:10:57,520 --> 02:10:59,960
Speaker 1: better after this. It does seem likely that other police

2428
02:11:00,040 --> 02:11:02,640
Speaker 1: procedurals will wind up dying out rather soon. And everyone

2429
02:11:02,760 --> 02:11:06,280
Speaker 1: has their favorite We've all we've all enjoyed some cop dramas, um,

2430
02:11:07,000 --> 02:11:09,480
Speaker 1: I and I and I will say I don't think

2431
02:11:09,600 --> 02:11:11,880
Speaker 1: that the wire is a part of the problem. I

2432
02:11:11,920 --> 02:11:13,560
Speaker 1: think they actually did a real good job of making

2433
02:11:13,600 --> 02:11:18,520
Speaker 1: everybody see, like Jesus Christ, policing's fucked. It just wasn't enough. Yeah. Um,

2434
02:11:19,400 --> 02:11:21,320
Speaker 1: there's a lot of you know, Brooklyn nine nine. I

2435
02:11:21,440 --> 02:11:23,200
Speaker 1: know a lot of people who love Brooklyn nine nine,

2436
02:11:23,200 --> 02:11:25,320
Speaker 1: And I know a lot of Brooklyn nine nine fans

2437
02:11:25,400 --> 02:11:27,400
Speaker 1: are apprehensive and like a little bit guilty right now

2438
02:11:27,480 --> 02:11:29,360
Speaker 1: and wondering like, is there a way to like fix

2439
02:11:29,440 --> 02:11:31,640
Speaker 1: this show, to make it like not contribute to the problem,

2440
02:11:32,080 --> 02:11:34,360
Speaker 1: and like, you know, the show does. The show does

2441
02:11:34,440 --> 02:11:36,440
Speaker 1: has leaned in at a few points to some problems

2442
02:11:36,520 --> 02:11:38,800
Speaker 1: in policing in a way that most police dramas don't

2443
02:11:39,400 --> 02:11:42,080
Speaker 1: um and it is one of those things where, like

2444
02:11:43,040 --> 02:11:45,840
Speaker 1: I think a lot of folks will argue that, like

2445
02:11:46,040 --> 02:11:48,400
Speaker 1: there's a room for escapism and that this stuff isn't

2446
02:11:48,480 --> 02:11:51,320
Speaker 1: really harmful, but but it it just is. There is

2447
02:11:51,360 --> 02:11:53,800
Speaker 1: a lot of documentation about how it is harmful. And

2448
02:11:53,840 --> 02:11:55,960
Speaker 1: I'm gonna quote from just one piece of this documentation,

2449
02:11:56,040 --> 02:11:59,840
Speaker 1: an article in Pacific Standard magazine quote crime dramas There's

2450
02:12:00,000 --> 02:12:02,720
Speaker 1: insistently ranked among the most watch shows by Nielsen Media.

2451
02:12:02,760 --> 02:12:05,360
Speaker 1: According to the authors. What's more, as many as forty

2452
02:12:05,400 --> 02:12:08,600
Speaker 1: percent of Americans believe that such shows are somewhat or

2453
02:12:08,800 --> 02:12:11,520
Speaker 1: very true to real life. So to find out how

2454
02:12:11,640 --> 02:12:14,760
Speaker 1: the simplistic portrayal of police officers on television might influence

2455
02:12:14,840 --> 02:12:18,080
Speaker 1: public opinion of the profession, researchers from St. John Fisher

2456
02:12:18,160 --> 02:12:20,920
Speaker 1: College and Wayne State University first had to analyze how

2457
02:12:20,960 --> 02:12:24,600
Speaker 1: popular crime shows portray police work. The researchers also surveyed

2458
02:12:24,640 --> 02:12:27,920
Speaker 1: a nationally representative sample of over two thousand Americans. They

2459
02:12:28,000 --> 02:12:30,360
Speaker 1: found that those who watched crime shows view police as

2460
02:12:30,440 --> 02:12:34,520
Speaker 1: better behaved, more successful at combating crime, and relatively responsible

2461
02:12:34,560 --> 02:12:38,520
Speaker 1: in their use of force than those who don't. Yes,

2462
02:12:39,160 --> 02:12:40,800
Speaker 1: if you want to know why there's so many back

2463
02:12:40,880 --> 02:12:43,360
Speaker 1: the Blue folks. It's these shows that we all have,

2464
02:12:43,600 --> 02:12:46,560
Speaker 1: some we enjoy, but they're part of the problem. You

2465
02:12:46,760 --> 02:12:50,440
Speaker 1: may say. The one for me is first forty. Yeah,

2466
02:12:50,600 --> 02:12:52,840
Speaker 1: that's the one that gets me the most because it

2467
02:12:52,960 --> 02:12:58,200
Speaker 1: always takes place in like Memphis, in the deepest of

2468
02:12:58,240 --> 02:13:01,120
Speaker 1: the Section eight projects, in the way that like, I know,

2469
02:13:01,240 --> 02:13:04,440
Speaker 1: our people are portrayed where it's like, again, it's not

2470
02:13:04,560 --> 02:13:08,360
Speaker 1: like crime don't exist, but this the way that you're

2471
02:13:08,400 --> 02:13:13,880
Speaker 1: painting this is so basic, so binary, and so easy

2472
02:13:14,000 --> 02:13:15,920
Speaker 1: that like I tried to watch it. I tried to

2473
02:13:15,960 --> 02:13:17,440
Speaker 1: get into it because that had a friend that liked it.

2474
02:13:17,800 --> 02:13:19,200
Speaker 1: So I tried to get into it, and I was like,

2475
02:13:19,280 --> 02:13:24,280
Speaker 1: I can't, I can't. I can't even finish this. I

2476
02:13:24,280 --> 02:13:27,320
Speaker 1: don't have anything else. Yeah, yeah, no, it's it's like

2477
02:13:30,240 --> 02:13:33,800
Speaker 1: it's just hurtful. It's really bad because you know, it's

2478
02:13:33,840 --> 02:13:36,080
Speaker 1: not real, you know what I'm saying, But you're telling

2479
02:13:36,120 --> 02:13:40,040
Speaker 1: me this is like a uh reality show, and it

2480
02:13:40,200 --> 02:13:44,080
Speaker 1: means it's not real. And like, just given by how

2481
02:13:44,120 --> 02:13:46,760
Speaker 1: few Americans have an experience with violent crime, and how

2482
02:13:46,960 --> 02:13:50,920
Speaker 1: even how an even smaller chunk of those Americans actually

2483
02:13:51,000 --> 02:13:53,560
Speaker 1: have the police do something about the thing that they suffer.

2484
02:13:53,880 --> 02:13:57,520
Speaker 1: That's a tiny fraction of us. When people say what

2485
02:13:57,720 --> 02:13:59,720
Speaker 1: about you know, and then they list their things that

2486
02:13:59,800 --> 02:14:02,440
Speaker 1: we the police, for most of them aren't thinking about

2487
02:14:02,480 --> 02:14:04,240
Speaker 1: a real thing that's happened to them, our friend. They're

2488
02:14:04,240 --> 02:14:06,200
Speaker 1: thinking about something they saw on TV like that that

2489
02:14:06,360 --> 02:14:08,600
Speaker 1: like like they wouldn't say that, but that's what's actually

2490
02:14:08,680 --> 02:14:13,839
Speaker 1: going on. Um. Yes, yeah. The militarization of US police

2491
02:14:14,000 --> 02:14:16,880
Speaker 1: started from a mix of fear over specific incidents of

2492
02:14:16,920 --> 02:14:20,600
Speaker 1: shocking violence uh and and cruel calculus by soulless politicians.

2493
02:14:20,880 --> 02:14:22,720
Speaker 1: But part of why it has been allowed to continue

2494
02:14:22,760 --> 02:14:25,600
Speaker 1: for so long, and why American voters traditionally react very

2495
02:14:25,680 --> 02:14:28,200
Speaker 1: negatively to the idea of cutting police funds, is that

2496
02:14:28,360 --> 02:14:31,280
Speaker 1: decades of Hollywood depictions of law enforcement have convinced many

2497
02:14:31,360 --> 02:14:34,200
Speaker 1: of us that the police are completely necessary to save

2498
02:14:34,320 --> 02:14:37,520
Speaker 1: us from a constant, imminent threat of violence and barbarism.

2499
02:14:37,840 --> 02:14:40,840
Speaker 1: The weight of pro cop cultural inertia is only increased

2500
02:14:41,400 --> 02:14:43,200
Speaker 1: by the fact that a decent number of the seven

2501
02:14:43,600 --> 02:14:46,720
Speaker 1: thousand cops in our country do useful in good things

2502
02:14:46,800 --> 02:14:48,920
Speaker 1: from time to time, like that there are like most

2503
02:14:49,040 --> 02:14:50,600
Speaker 1: cops on the force will have a period where that

2504
02:14:50,680 --> 02:14:53,040
Speaker 1: even cops who are critical later will it will be

2505
02:14:53,080 --> 02:14:55,640
Speaker 1: able to point to individual things they did that we're good. Um,

2506
02:14:55,760 --> 02:14:57,920
Speaker 1: the question is not whether or not cops ever do

2507
02:14:58,080 --> 02:15:00,720
Speaker 1: things that are good. It's whether or not it's the cost,

2508
02:15:01,000 --> 02:15:03,640
Speaker 1: whether or not the benefits we gain from having police

2509
02:15:03,880 --> 02:15:06,480
Speaker 1: Number one can be gained from something that's not the police,

2510
02:15:06,680 --> 02:15:09,800
Speaker 1: and number two are worth the price of having police.

2511
02:15:10,360 --> 02:15:12,000
Speaker 1: Hollywood has spent a lot of time and made a

2512
02:15:12,040 --> 02:15:14,120
Speaker 1: lot of money showing us what we get from law

2513
02:15:14,240 --> 02:15:17,000
Speaker 1: enforcement at its best, and again the statistics show that

2514
02:15:17,040 --> 02:15:19,240
Speaker 1: they are lying about what we get from law enforcement.

2515
02:15:19,720 --> 02:15:22,560
Speaker 1: So perhaps we should spend more time as a culture

2516
02:15:23,000 --> 02:15:26,000
Speaker 1: thinking about what law enforcement costs us. And I think

2517
02:15:26,680 --> 02:15:30,320
Speaker 1: my best way of doing this is always an anecdotal example.

2518
02:15:30,360 --> 02:15:32,520
Speaker 1: You know, because we do talk about the statistics, we

2519
02:15:32,560 --> 02:15:34,320
Speaker 1: talk about the broad problem. The broad The broad problem

2520
02:15:34,360 --> 02:15:36,160
Speaker 1: is that a thousand people a year are killed by

2521
02:15:36,280 --> 02:15:40,000
Speaker 1: US police, many of them in shady circumstances, many of them,

2522
02:15:40,120 --> 02:15:42,920
Speaker 1: most of them without real investigations that are are open

2523
02:15:43,000 --> 02:15:45,320
Speaker 1: to the public taking place, and that that number is

2524
02:15:45,400 --> 02:15:48,720
Speaker 1: for example, more than die have died in every school

2525
02:15:48,760 --> 02:15:51,400
Speaker 1: shooting in American history. Every year the police kill more

2526
02:15:51,440 --> 02:15:55,000
Speaker 1: people than school shooters have ever killed. Like yeah, like

2527
02:15:55,320 --> 02:15:57,680
Speaker 1: people like people flip out about a R fifteen. And

2528
02:15:57,720 --> 02:16:00,320
Speaker 1: I'm not saying you're wrong to be scared heard or

2529
02:16:00,400 --> 02:16:03,240
Speaker 1: frightened about the easy availability of air fifteens. Like four

2530
02:16:03,360 --> 02:16:05,760
Speaker 1: hundred Americans every year are killed by long guns that

2531
02:16:05,800 --> 02:16:09,480
Speaker 1: are air fifteens are similar weapons. The police kill a thousand.

2532
02:16:09,920 --> 02:16:12,240
Speaker 1: You're not saying one's not not saying one's not a problem,

2533
02:16:12,320 --> 02:16:14,600
Speaker 1: but like does it suck? Yeah, Well, if we're gonna

2534
02:16:14,760 --> 02:16:19,480
Speaker 1: yeah anyway, it's it's an issue. Um. But I think

2535
02:16:19,520 --> 02:16:22,240
Speaker 1: that when it comes to getting people to really emotionally

2536
02:16:22,320 --> 02:16:27,720
Speaker 1: understand the cost of police, individual horrific anecdotes are are

2537
02:16:28,200 --> 02:16:30,320
Speaker 1: the thing that drives it home to people. Um, and

2538
02:16:30,400 --> 02:16:33,039
Speaker 1: that's certainly what the police do. Individual anecdotes of cops

2539
02:16:33,120 --> 02:16:34,880
Speaker 1: doing good to talk about why we need them. So

2540
02:16:34,959 --> 02:16:36,680
Speaker 1: we might as well respond in kind. And I'm going

2541
02:16:36,760 --> 02:16:39,279
Speaker 1: to respond in kind by talking about something that happened

2542
02:16:39,280 --> 02:16:45,440
Speaker 1: in Philadelphia in nineteen five, the move bombing. So have

2543
02:16:45,600 --> 02:16:49,280
Speaker 1: you heard of the move bombing? I have, Yeah, Yeah,

2544
02:16:49,440 --> 02:16:53,160
Speaker 1: I had a feeling. Yeah. Move was a strange organization

2545
02:16:53,200 --> 02:16:54,320
Speaker 1: that we're not going to get into a lot of

2546
02:16:54,400 --> 02:16:56,880
Speaker 1: detail about It was founded by a guy named John Africa,

2547
02:16:56,959 --> 02:16:59,200
Speaker 1: and every member of move took on Africa as a surname.

2548
02:16:59,240 --> 02:17:01,280
Speaker 1: They were not all black, actually, it was a mixed

2549
02:17:01,360 --> 02:17:05,320
Speaker 1: race organization. There were hard to pin down ideologically, but

2550
02:17:05,360 --> 02:17:07,200
Speaker 1: it would be fair to say that they expressed a

2551
02:17:07,360 --> 02:17:10,480
Speaker 1: deep hatred of technology. Um They did some like protests

2552
02:17:10,520 --> 02:17:13,240
Speaker 1: at zoos against animal cruelty, They ate natural diet. They're

2553
02:17:13,240 --> 02:17:15,720
Speaker 1: They're like a hard group to pin down. They did

2554
02:17:15,800 --> 02:17:18,760
Speaker 1: a lot of shouting into bullhorns though. Um So. The

2555
02:17:18,879 --> 02:17:22,560
Speaker 1: organization briefly wound up squatting in Powellton Village in West Philly,

2556
02:17:22,760 --> 02:17:25,120
Speaker 1: um and they kind of fortified a house they were

2557
02:17:25,160 --> 02:17:27,200
Speaker 1: squatting in there, and they they've piste off a lot

2558
02:17:27,240 --> 02:17:30,240
Speaker 1: of their neighbors by regularly brandishing firearms and shouting at

2559
02:17:30,240 --> 02:17:33,040
Speaker 1: the neighborhood through a megaphone. They eventually were raided by

2560
02:17:33,040 --> 02:17:35,440
Speaker 1: the Feds, who found a bunch of guns and pipe bombs.

2561
02:17:36,080 --> 02:17:39,400
Speaker 1: Police barricaded several blocks around the compound and basically laid

2562
02:17:39,480 --> 02:17:41,840
Speaker 1: siege to it for fifty six days. This all can

2563
02:17:41,879 --> 02:17:44,600
Speaker 1: do ahead when the cops moved into forcibly evict them,

2564
02:17:44,840 --> 02:17:46,840
Speaker 1: there was a gun battle and a cop was killed

2565
02:17:46,840 --> 02:17:50,320
Speaker 1: while sixteen other officers and firefighters were injured. Eventually, the

2566
02:17:50,400 --> 02:17:53,000
Speaker 1: MOVE people all surrendered and the cops beat the ever

2567
02:17:53,160 --> 02:17:54,920
Speaker 1: loving ship out of one of them, a guy who

2568
02:17:54,959 --> 02:17:56,720
Speaker 1: had not taken part in the gunfight but who had

2569
02:17:56,800 --> 02:17:59,000
Speaker 1: been on the bullhorn heckling them. They just beat the

2570
02:17:59,120 --> 02:18:02,280
Speaker 1: piss out of this it in broad daylight. Um Nine

2571
02:18:02,480 --> 02:18:05,080
Speaker 1: of the members of Move were convicted of third degree

2572
02:18:05,400 --> 02:18:08,320
Speaker 1: murder and sent to prison after this, so Move was

2573
02:18:08,400 --> 02:18:11,440
Speaker 1: not taken out though as an organization continued. They moved

2574
02:18:11,520 --> 02:18:13,880
Speaker 1: on and set up a new base on Osage Avenue,

2575
02:18:13,879 --> 02:18:16,840
Speaker 1: which was a middle class black neighborhood that was doing

2576
02:18:16,920 --> 02:18:19,600
Speaker 1: really well. It's kind of like a Black Wall Street situation, right,

2577
02:18:19,680 --> 02:18:22,640
Speaker 1: Like Osage Avenue is like doing well, and Move moves

2578
02:18:22,680 --> 02:18:26,000
Speaker 1: in and they were out there welcome pretty quickly because

2579
02:18:26,040 --> 02:18:28,680
Speaker 1: they again turned their house into a fortified bunker, like

2580
02:18:28,680 --> 02:18:31,160
Speaker 1: they build a literal bunker on top. They yelled at

2581
02:18:31,160 --> 02:18:34,080
Speaker 1: a lot of people through bullhorns. They're not physically harming people,

2582
02:18:34,080 --> 02:18:36,360
Speaker 1: but they're like kind of annoying people, and like people

2583
02:18:36,400 --> 02:18:38,520
Speaker 1: in the neighborhood don't know what to do, but called

2584
02:18:38,560 --> 02:18:41,320
Speaker 1: the city and the city calls the police, and the

2585
02:18:41,400 --> 02:18:44,360
Speaker 1: police do what the police do, which is escalate the

2586
02:18:44,400 --> 02:18:49,640
Speaker 1: situation into another siege. In May, uh, Philadelphia brings in

2587
02:18:49,760 --> 02:18:52,840
Speaker 1: five dred militarized officers armed with flak jacket, swat gear,

2588
02:18:52,920 --> 02:18:55,960
Speaker 1: fifty caliber machine guns, and an anti tank rifle. The

2589
02:18:56,040 --> 02:18:58,440
Speaker 1: cops move in to serve arrest warrants on folks that

2590
02:18:58,480 --> 02:19:00,640
Speaker 1: they believe we're living in the compound, and they estimated

2591
02:19:00,720 --> 02:19:04,879
Speaker 1: six adults and twelve children were inside. The movers opened

2592
02:19:04,959 --> 02:19:08,200
Speaker 1: fire on these militarized police, and the police responded with

2593
02:19:08,320 --> 02:19:12,240
Speaker 1: just an insane torrent of wild gun fire, pouring ten

2594
02:19:12,440 --> 02:19:16,600
Speaker 1: thousand rounds into the building in ninety minutes. Now, thankfully,

2595
02:19:16,680 --> 02:19:19,440
Speaker 1: the police had evacuated most of the neighborhood, telling everyone

2596
02:19:19,480 --> 02:19:21,600
Speaker 1: they'd be able to come back home quickly. But they're

2597
02:19:21,640 --> 02:19:25,400
Speaker 1: just firing wildly into the neighborhood. Swat team's next try

2598
02:19:25,440 --> 02:19:27,520
Speaker 1: blowing holes in the sides of the building, but nothing

2599
02:19:27,600 --> 02:19:29,720
Speaker 1: worked to breach the compound because the move folks had

2600
02:19:29,840 --> 02:19:32,760
Speaker 1: really done a good job before. Yeah, they were good

2601
02:19:32,800 --> 02:19:35,920
Speaker 1: at this ship. Um. The police began lobbying Mayor good,

2602
02:19:36,040 --> 02:19:38,320
Speaker 1: the first black mayor of Philadelphia, for the go ahead

2603
02:19:38,360 --> 02:19:41,200
Speaker 1: to drop a bomb they built on the compound, and

2604
02:19:41,360 --> 02:19:45,320
Speaker 1: after hours of ferocious gunfire, the mayor agreed. The police

2605
02:19:45,600 --> 02:19:50,720
Speaker 1: dropped a bomb on this building in Philadelphia, an Osage Avenue,

2606
02:19:51,240 --> 02:19:53,959
Speaker 1: and it fails to crack the bunker that Move had

2607
02:19:54,000 --> 02:19:56,640
Speaker 1: built atop their house, and it doesn't in the stalemate,

2608
02:19:56,879 --> 02:19:59,280
Speaker 1: but it did start a fire that spread very quickly

2609
02:19:59,360 --> 02:20:02,240
Speaker 1: to the roofs of other homes clustered around the Move building.

2610
02:20:02,640 --> 02:20:06,080
Speaker 1: The police commissioner ordered firefighters to stand down, later telling

2611
02:20:06,120 --> 02:20:08,760
Speaker 1: the city commission I communicated that I would like to

2612
02:20:08,879 --> 02:20:11,959
Speaker 1: let the fire burn. In forty five minutes, three more

2613
02:20:12,040 --> 02:20:14,120
Speaker 1: homes on the black were burning. Then the roof of

2614
02:20:14,160 --> 02:20:17,560
Speaker 1: the Move house collapsed. The police did not allow firefighters

2615
02:20:17,600 --> 02:20:19,680
Speaker 1: in until more than ninety minutes had passed and the

2616
02:20:19,879 --> 02:20:22,760
Speaker 1: entire north side of Osage Avenue was burning. I'm gonna

2617
02:20:22,800 --> 02:20:25,280
Speaker 1: quote now from an NPR article on what happened next.

2618
02:20:26,680 --> 02:20:29,360
Speaker 1: Philadelphia streets are famously narrow, which made it easy for

2619
02:20:29,400 --> 02:20:31,240
Speaker 1: the fire to leap from burning trees on the north

2620
02:20:31,320 --> 02:20:33,760
Speaker 1: side to even more homes on the south side. From there,

2621
02:20:33,840 --> 02:20:36,320
Speaker 1: the flames spilled over to the homes behind six two

2622
02:20:36,400 --> 02:20:39,520
Speaker 1: to one Ossage to Pine Street. By evening three rows

2623
02:20:39,560 --> 02:20:42,840
Speaker 1: of homes were completely on fire, a conflagration so large

2624
02:20:42,879 --> 02:20:44,879
Speaker 1: that the flames could be seen from planes landing at

2625
02:20:44,879 --> 02:20:48,640
Speaker 1: Philadelphia International Airport more than six miles away. The smoke

2626
02:20:48,760 --> 02:20:51,720
Speaker 1: was visible across the city. By the time firefighters brought

2627
02:20:51,760 --> 02:20:55,240
Speaker 1: the fire under control a little before midnight, sixty houses

2628
02:20:55,280 --> 02:20:57,800
Speaker 1: on the once tidy block had been completely destroyed. Two

2629
02:20:58,200 --> 02:21:01,040
Speaker 1: and fifty people were suddenly shockingly without homes. It was

2630
02:21:01,120 --> 02:21:04,120
Speaker 1: the worst residential fire in the city's history. In the end,

2631
02:21:04,320 --> 02:21:07,520
Speaker 1: eleven people died in that fire on Osage Avenue, including

2632
02:21:07,640 --> 02:21:10,480
Speaker 1: five children. Weeks passed before the police were able to

2633
02:21:10,560 --> 02:21:13,600
Speaker 1: identify their remains. This is what I mean when I'm

2634
02:21:13,640 --> 02:21:15,960
Speaker 1: talking about Sorry, Yeah, I was like, this is the

2635
02:21:16,040 --> 02:21:19,120
Speaker 1: story I was referring to in the first episode about

2636
02:21:20,280 --> 02:21:23,280
Speaker 1: like a bomb being dropped on Americans. It turns out

2637
02:21:23,320 --> 02:21:26,120
Speaker 1: that's a long Yeah, there's a lot of parallels between

2638
02:21:26,160 --> 02:21:28,120
Speaker 1: this and Tulsa. But you know Tulsa, it was a

2639
02:21:28,240 --> 02:21:31,920
Speaker 1: mob of random citizens. The move bombing was was mostly

2640
02:21:32,000 --> 02:21:37,760
Speaker 1: white police um and the organization moved. That was part

2641
02:21:37,760 --> 02:21:40,119
Speaker 1: of what I'm talking about. Counting the cost here move

2642
02:21:40,280 --> 02:21:42,520
Speaker 1: was a problem. They caused real issues for their neighbors.

2643
02:21:42,560 --> 02:21:44,880
Speaker 1: And their neighbors problems should not be discounted. Like they

2644
02:21:45,040 --> 02:21:48,360
Speaker 1: they they their neighbors had a serious issue with these

2645
02:21:48,400 --> 02:21:50,080
Speaker 1: people that needed to be dealt with, and they called

2646
02:21:50,120 --> 02:21:52,120
Speaker 1: the city to help them deal with it, and the

2647
02:21:52,240 --> 02:21:56,800
Speaker 1: city brought the police. In any any reasonable society would

2648
02:21:56,800 --> 02:21:59,200
Speaker 1: have need to have a way to deal something with

2649
02:21:59,280 --> 02:22:01,240
Speaker 1: like a bunch of people fortifying a building in a

2650
02:22:01,280 --> 02:22:03,520
Speaker 1: neighborhood and shouting at everyone in a bullhorn until they

2651
02:22:03,520 --> 02:22:06,720
Speaker 1: can't sleep. That's a problem. That's a problem that merits

2652
02:22:06,760 --> 02:22:10,039
Speaker 1: a solution. The solution the police brought to this problem

2653
02:22:10,360 --> 02:22:14,720
Speaker 1: was to burn down the entire neighborhood. Yeah, that's not

2654
02:22:16,440 --> 02:22:19,560
Speaker 1: that didn't need to happen. You didn't have to do that. Yeah,

2655
02:22:19,959 --> 02:22:23,320
Speaker 1: this there there were ways to deal with these people,

2656
02:22:23,760 --> 02:22:26,120
Speaker 1: because again, the members of Move never went out murdering

2657
02:22:26,160 --> 02:22:28,520
Speaker 1: people at random. That was not what they did. They

2658
02:22:28,720 --> 02:22:34,720
Speaker 1: they they're problematics and they were annoying, and yeah, they

2659
02:22:34,800 --> 02:22:40,760
Speaker 1: weren't just killing strangers. That police did that. Yeah, the

2660
02:22:40,879 --> 02:22:44,480
Speaker 1: Philadelphia police did succeed in dealing with the issue of

2661
02:22:44,560 --> 02:22:48,320
Speaker 1: the Move organization. They did not harangue neighbors on loudspeakers

2662
02:22:48,400 --> 02:22:51,080
Speaker 1: anymore after this, and whatever possibly illegal weapons they may

2663
02:22:51,080 --> 02:22:53,400
Speaker 1: have had on the property were incinerated, along with sixties

2664
02:22:53,440 --> 02:22:56,160
Speaker 1: something black homes and businesses. You could argue that some

2665
02:22:56,440 --> 02:22:58,760
Speaker 1: problems of law and order were solved by bombing the

2666
02:22:58,840 --> 02:23:02,480
Speaker 1: move compound. Question is like was the price worth it?

2667
02:23:02,640 --> 02:23:05,320
Speaker 1: And that's broadly the question we need to be asking

2668
02:23:05,440 --> 02:23:10,680
Speaker 1: and answering about our police. Is the cost worth it? Guys?

2669
02:23:11,440 --> 02:23:14,480
Speaker 1: You know what would wipe out your COVID nineteen? You

2670
02:23:14,560 --> 02:23:18,400
Speaker 1: could drink the bleach. You're right, it will end it.

2671
02:23:19,480 --> 02:23:23,720
Speaker 1: I'm like, you will die. Yeah. Did you ever listen

2672
02:23:23,760 --> 02:23:27,840
Speaker 1: to Chris Christofferson prop? Yeah? Yeah. Do you ever listen

2673
02:23:27,840 --> 02:23:31,280
Speaker 1: to a song The Laws for Protection of the People? No?

2674
02:23:32,080 --> 02:23:34,480
Speaker 1: It you'd like that song. It's a good example of

2675
02:23:34,600 --> 02:23:37,200
Speaker 1: like early country, you know, now country, there's like a

2676
02:23:37,240 --> 02:23:40,680
Speaker 1: lot of popular country is like very kind of reflectively patriotic,

2677
02:23:40,800 --> 02:23:44,200
Speaker 1: PROCP pre military. Old country was like it was like

2678
02:23:44,280 --> 02:23:48,600
Speaker 1: punk music but played differently, right um, And Chris Christofferson

2679
02:23:48,640 --> 02:23:50,120
Speaker 1: embodies that in a lot of ways. And The Law

2680
02:23:50,240 --> 02:23:52,320
Speaker 1: Is for Protection of the People is a song about cops,

2681
02:23:52,360 --> 02:23:54,520
Speaker 1: and it's like they're like the first verses about like

2682
02:23:54,640 --> 02:23:57,440
Speaker 1: a drunk guy that like falls down drunk on the

2683
02:23:57,480 --> 02:24:00,960
Speaker 1: sidewalk and the six squad cars come streaming to the

2684
02:24:01,040 --> 02:24:03,640
Speaker 1: rescue to haul him off to jail. And the refrain

2685
02:24:03,720 --> 02:24:06,440
Speaker 1: of the song is because the laws for protection of

2686
02:24:06,520 --> 02:24:09,720
Speaker 1: the people rules or rules, and anyone can see we

2687
02:24:09,840 --> 02:24:12,280
Speaker 1: don't need no drunks like Billy Dalton is the name

2688
02:24:12,280 --> 02:24:14,440
Speaker 1: of the drunk scaring decent folks like you and me.

2689
02:24:14,720 --> 02:24:17,840
Speaker 1: And the second verses about a hippie who like a

2690
02:24:17,920 --> 02:24:21,160
Speaker 1: bunch of brave cops come surround and like beat down

2691
02:24:21,320 --> 02:24:23,879
Speaker 1: and shave his head forcibly, and you know there's another

2692
02:24:24,000 --> 02:24:26,840
Speaker 1: version of that refrain, and then the last verse is,

2693
02:24:27,040 --> 02:24:32,640
Speaker 1: um uh so, thank your lucky stars, you've got protection,

2694
02:24:33,120 --> 02:24:36,360
Speaker 1: walk the line and never mind the cost. Don't think

2695
02:24:36,440 --> 02:24:39,760
Speaker 1: of who them lawman was protecting when they nailed the

2696
02:24:39,879 --> 02:24:48,280
Speaker 1: Savior to the cross. But Chris, Chris Stofferson, bring it

2697
02:24:48,320 --> 02:24:50,920
Speaker 1: at home, Yeah, bring it at home. Hey, you know

2698
02:24:51,000 --> 02:24:57,360
Speaker 1: what pressus Savior? Crooked justice system? Awesome, awesome trumped up charges. Yep,

2699
02:24:58,200 --> 02:25:01,960
Speaker 1: So my into the cost is I guess the end

2700
02:25:02,080 --> 02:25:06,680
Speaker 1: message I want to have for this podcast? Yes, like

2701
02:25:07,000 --> 02:25:11,320
Speaker 1: this was the Lord's work. Robert whatever you what if

2702
02:25:11,360 --> 02:25:13,640
Speaker 1: you wind up agreeing with us or not about what

2703
02:25:13,720 --> 02:25:16,640
Speaker 1: should be done with the police. When you think about

2704
02:25:16,720 --> 02:25:19,280
Speaker 1: what should be done with the police, think about what

2705
02:25:19,600 --> 02:25:22,040
Speaker 1: the price you're paying for them is, and ask is

2706
02:25:22,080 --> 02:25:28,039
Speaker 1: it worth it? Yes? Do you protect your children by

2707
02:25:29,400 --> 02:25:31,600
Speaker 1: strapping them to their bed and barbed buying the door?

2708
02:25:33,480 --> 02:25:36,800
Speaker 1: Or do you protect your children by loving them and

2709
02:25:36,879 --> 02:25:39,320
Speaker 1: caring for them and teaching them better ways to take

2710
02:25:39,360 --> 02:25:44,080
Speaker 1: care of themselves and their felling neighbors? Yeah? Yeah, And

2711
02:25:44,200 --> 02:25:48,040
Speaker 1: it's people get aspects of this, Like people get aspects

2712
02:25:48,080 --> 02:25:50,000
Speaker 1: of this when like folks who are pro gun talk

2713
02:25:50,080 --> 02:25:53,119
Speaker 1: to liberals about like, oh, you know, people should defend

2714
02:25:53,160 --> 02:25:55,640
Speaker 1: themselves and like always carry a gun, and a lot

2715
02:25:55,640 --> 02:25:57,760
Speaker 1: of liberals will like rightly point out, like it sounds

2716
02:25:57,760 --> 02:25:59,720
Speaker 1: like a miserable world if everyone has to have a

2717
02:25:59,760 --> 02:26:01,840
Speaker 1: gun at them at all times. I don't. I don't

2718
02:26:01,879 --> 02:26:03,720
Speaker 1: like that vision of the world. But it's like, but

2719
02:26:03,920 --> 02:26:06,400
Speaker 1: do you support their being police who always have a

2720
02:26:06,400 --> 02:26:08,440
Speaker 1: shipload of weapons on them, who walk around with like

2721
02:26:08,600 --> 02:26:11,200
Speaker 1: five different weapons that are potentially lethal on their belt

2722
02:26:11,240 --> 02:26:17,240
Speaker 1: at any given time, Like that's part of it. I agree,

2723
02:26:17,600 --> 02:26:19,920
Speaker 1: it's better if there aren't a ton of weapons all

2724
02:26:20,000 --> 02:26:24,480
Speaker 1: over the place, all of the time in the public sphere. Um, yeah,

2725
02:26:25,120 --> 02:26:28,040
Speaker 1: let's deal with that problem, and let's recognize that it

2726
02:26:28,160 --> 02:26:31,520
Speaker 1: really starts with police in our society. UM, let's just

2727
02:26:31,640 --> 02:26:41,880
Speaker 1: be honest. Yeah everybody, yep, yeah, that was a lot

2728
02:26:41,959 --> 02:26:47,160
Speaker 1: of words. There was a lot of works. Yes, and

2729
02:26:47,280 --> 02:26:49,640
Speaker 1: my facts. Do care about your feelings, props. So how

2730
02:26:49,680 --> 02:26:52,520
Speaker 1: are you feeling? Man? That was great? I like that,

2731
02:26:53,320 --> 02:26:59,280
Speaker 1: Thank you. I am feeling disgusting. Uh, I'm a little tired,

2732
02:26:59,320 --> 02:27:01,800
Speaker 1: but I'm also in little hopeful because of the response

2733
02:27:02,160 --> 02:27:05,800
Speaker 1: we've been getting from this pod. Good, very hopeful. Yeah, yeah,

2734
02:27:05,840 --> 02:27:13,879
Speaker 1: it has been a great response. It's good to be hopeful. Yeah, yeah, yeah, man,

2735
02:27:14,840 --> 02:27:21,879
Speaker 1: be hopeful. Defund to the man. Um, there's better ideas.

2736
02:27:23,320 --> 02:27:25,840
Speaker 1: We can we can come up with a better idea, guys, Yeah,

2737
02:27:26,400 --> 02:27:28,920
Speaker 1: we can, we can, we can, we can. We can

2738
02:27:29,120 --> 02:27:32,400
Speaker 1: come up with so many better ideas. UM, for example,

2739
02:27:32,800 --> 02:27:37,119
Speaker 1: what if we just what if we were placed all

2740
02:27:37,160 --> 02:27:39,520
Speaker 1: of our cops with like, you know, those dogs that

2741
02:27:39,600 --> 02:27:41,360
Speaker 1: they have in the mountains somewhere in Europe that have

2742
02:27:41,440 --> 02:27:44,720
Speaker 1: liquor around their necks. Those are rad. Let's try that.

2743
02:27:45,400 --> 02:27:48,720
Speaker 1: Let's just fill the streets with those dogs. Those are

2744
02:27:48,840 --> 02:27:54,000
Speaker 1: so rad it'll work. Maybe. Yeah, if if if A,

2745
02:27:54,200 --> 02:27:57,600
Speaker 1: if A husky walked up with up to me and

2746
02:27:57,760 --> 02:28:01,480
Speaker 1: have whiskey on his neck. I would be like, this

2747
02:28:01,600 --> 02:28:03,400
Speaker 1: is the coolest husky I've ever met in my life.

2748
02:28:04,280 --> 02:28:07,120
Speaker 1: I will stop whatever crime I'm doing because I just

2749
02:28:07,200 --> 02:28:09,880
Speaker 1: want to see this dog with whiskey. Yeah, and like

2750
02:28:09,959 --> 02:28:12,840
Speaker 1: a bunch of huge, well trained dogs everywhere, probably gonna

2751
02:28:12,840 --> 02:28:15,240
Speaker 1: stop more rapes than the cops, I'll tell you what,

2752
02:28:15,560 --> 02:28:20,480
Speaker 1: because everybody scared it dogs except for Sophie. Except for Sophie. Yeah,

2753
02:28:22,320 --> 02:28:30,959
Speaker 1: well well jinks ye oh blood time. Yeah. I kind

2754
02:28:31,000 --> 02:28:34,160
Speaker 1: of do that. Yeah, profit pop dot com where I

2755
02:28:34,240 --> 02:28:38,840
Speaker 1: don't sell weapons. Um, that's good. Good. I challenge you

2756
02:28:38,920 --> 02:28:43,080
Speaker 1: to think of better ways to organize the world. And

2757
02:28:43,600 --> 02:28:46,960
Speaker 1: I sell coffee stuff. Um. I do music and poetry

2758
02:28:47,160 --> 02:28:50,800
Speaker 1: and that's all of the things are at prop hip

2759
02:28:50,840 --> 02:28:54,680
Speaker 1: hop dot com. And I do not sell weapons yet,

2760
02:28:54,800 --> 02:28:57,080
Speaker 1: but when I moved to my compound in Ohio, I'll

2761
02:28:57,080 --> 02:29:00,920
Speaker 1: start legally manufacturing sought off shotguns so that the the

2762
02:29:01,120 --> 02:29:03,920
Speaker 1: the A t F will will finally raid me. Um

2763
02:29:04,440 --> 02:29:06,520
Speaker 1: you know that's the that was a that was a

2764
02:29:06,600 --> 02:29:10,560
Speaker 1: ruby ridge. Think. Yeah, I actually really think you gotta

2765
02:29:10,600 --> 02:29:13,879
Speaker 1: market there, I do, I do. You could start branding

2766
02:29:13,959 --> 02:29:20,160
Speaker 1: some weapons yeah, Uncle Robert's legal homemade shotguns. Yes, I

2767
02:29:20,280 --> 02:29:23,040
Speaker 1: just couldn't into something. I couldn't repeatedly Waco in this

2768
02:29:23,160 --> 02:29:25,840
Speaker 1: episode without dropping a Ruby Ridge in there. Um, So

2769
02:29:26,200 --> 02:29:29,120
Speaker 1: it's not fair, that's no. And it's not fair that

2770
02:29:29,160 --> 02:29:30,760
Speaker 1: we talked about Waco all the time but not the

2771
02:29:30,800 --> 02:29:33,120
Speaker 1: move bombing, because like they're both cases of like out

2772
02:29:33,200 --> 02:29:36,560
Speaker 1: of control militarized police burning children to death. Yeah yeah,

2773
02:29:37,520 --> 02:29:40,400
Speaker 1: yeah because those black people. Yeah, it's sucked up. Yeah

2774
02:29:40,760 --> 02:29:44,640
Speaker 1: yeah yeah. Find a way to make the move bombing

2775
02:29:45,000 --> 02:29:47,240
Speaker 1: Waco again. I don't know what the that's not a

2776
02:29:47,280 --> 02:29:50,320
Speaker 1: good moral. Um, they need a Netflix series where they

2777
02:29:50,400 --> 02:29:55,280
Speaker 1: hire a sexy guy to be John Africa. Yeah yeah,

2778
02:29:57,080 --> 02:29:59,920
Speaker 1: they could play like do it or something. Yeah yeah,

2779
02:30:00,000 --> 02:30:03,000
Speaker 1: I haven't. Haven't have a Blue s concert. Is there

2780
02:30:03,040 --> 02:30:08,160
Speaker 1: being bombed? Just throw that in there for no reason, unnecessary.

2781
02:30:09,080 --> 02:30:12,200
Speaker 1: That was the wildest thing about the Waco show was like, Okay,

2782
02:30:12,280 --> 02:30:14,199
Speaker 1: so you guys are just you guys just turning David

2783
02:30:14,280 --> 02:30:19,120
Speaker 1: Koresh into a rock star. Alright, Like what that's a stance.

2784
02:30:19,879 --> 02:30:23,240
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, And now I want to see the fucking

2785
02:30:23,440 --> 02:30:25,520
Speaker 1: I want to see them like do a Jim Jones

2786
02:30:25,600 --> 02:30:28,560
Speaker 1: mini series. He turned him into like a stand up comedian.

2787
02:30:29,560 --> 02:30:33,120
Speaker 1: He's just hilarious. That's what we all go. Yeah, we

2788
02:30:33,520 --> 02:30:39,480
Speaker 1: we cast David Chappelle's Jim Jones. Fuck it, No one

2789
02:30:39,560 --> 02:30:47,840
Speaker 1: gives a ship where Netflix? Oh lord, alright podcast is out.

2790
02:30:48,400 --> 02:30:51,720
Speaker 1: This podcast has to stop go to fund your local police.

2791
02:30:55,920 --> 02:30:58,040
Speaker 1: Behind the Police is a production of I Heart Radio.

2792
02:30:58,280 --> 02:31:00,920
Speaker 1: For more podcast from my Heart Radio, visit the iHeart

2793
02:31:01,000 --> 02:31:04,920
Speaker 1: Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

2794
02:31:05,959 --> 02:31:08,040
Speaker 1: Make sure to check out Drink Champs, your number one

2795
02:31:08,160 --> 02:31:11,440
Speaker 1: music podcast on the Black Effect podcast Network. Host n

2796
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Speaker 1: O r E and d J E f N sat

2797
02:31:13,280 --> 02:31:16,320
Speaker 1: down with artists and icon Yea, which Vulture called one

2798
02:31:17,360 --> 02:31:21,440
Speaker 1: most significant interviews. I literally had to go like Danos

2799
02:31:21,480 --> 02:31:22,880
Speaker 1: and I don't want to have to be the villain.

2800
02:31:23,200 --> 02:31:25,960
Speaker 1: But when I went and did the Donda thing, he

2801
02:31:26,320 --> 02:31:29,720
Speaker 1: returned and Abod had to sit back and watch the

2802
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Speaker 1: real leader. Check out Drink Champs conversation with Yea and

2803
02:31:32,879 --> 02:31:35,720
Speaker 1: many more legendary artists each and every Friday on the

2804
02:31:35,760 --> 02:31:38,600
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen

2805
02:31:38,680 --> 02:31:43,959
Speaker 1: to your favorite shows. Once the last time you took

2806
02:31:44,000 --> 02:31:46,920
Speaker 1: a time out, I'm Ev Rodsky, author of The New

2807
02:31:47,000 --> 02:31:50,160
Speaker 1: York Times bestseller Affair Play and Find your Unicorn space,

2808
02:31:50,560 --> 02:31:54,320
Speaker 1: activists on the gender division of labor, attorney and family mediator.

2809
02:31:54,680 --> 02:31:58,080
Speaker 1: And I'm Dr Addina Rucar, a Harvard physician and medical

2810
02:31:58,160 --> 02:32:01,439
Speaker 1: correspondent with an expertise in the side of stress, resilience,

2811
02:32:01,600 --> 02:32:05,400
Speaker 1: mental health and burnout. We're so excited to share our podcast,

2812
02:32:05,560 --> 02:32:09,320
Speaker 1: Time Out, a production of I Heart Podcasts and Hello Sunshine,

2813
02:32:09,720 --> 02:32:12,400
Speaker 1: repealing back the layers around why society makes it so

2814
02:32:12,520 --> 02:32:15,440
Speaker 1: easy to guard men's time like it's diamonds and treat

2815
02:32:15,480 --> 02:32:19,240
Speaker 1: women's time like it's infinite like sand. And So, whether

2816
02:32:19,280 --> 02:32:22,080
Speaker 1: you're partnered with or without children, or in a career

2817
02:32:22,120 --> 02:32:24,440
Speaker 1: where you want more boundaries, this is the place for

2818
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Speaker 1: you for people of all family structures. So take this

2819
02:32:28,120 --> 02:32:32,440
Speaker 1: time out with us to learn, get inspired, and most importantly,

2820
02:32:33,040 --> 02:32:37,160
Speaker 1: reclaim your time. Listen to Time Out, a fair play

2821
02:32:37,200 --> 02:32:40,920
Speaker 1: podcast on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or

2822
02:32:41,000 --> 02:32:48,400
Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. Look for your children's eyes

2823
02:32:48,840 --> 02:32:51,800
Speaker 1: and you will discover the true magic of a forest.

2824
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Speaker 1: Find a forest near you and start exploring it. Discover

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Speaker 1: the forest dot Org brought to you by the United

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Speaker 1: States Forest Service and the at Unsel