Speaker 1: Hello, good, how are you. It's so great to see.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for doing this. What do you
Speaker 1: think about all the sleeves getting into crypto? I think
Speaker 1: that that. I think it was more last hear um.
Speaker 1: You think it's kind of a way of it passed. No,
Speaker 1: I don't think so. But I think it's like any
Speaker 1: time that. Frankly, it's when a lot of other people
Speaker 1: get into crypto. Write other audiences too. It's once in
Speaker 1: the news a lot and when does that happen a
Speaker 1: lot of times when the prices are going out? Hi everyone,
Speaker 1: and welcome to this edition of Bloomberg Studio one point. Oh,
Speaker 1: I'm so excited about our guest today. She started her
Speaker 1: career as a federal prosecutor, going after gangs and the
Speaker 1: mob before being handed her most consequential assignment, taking down bitcoin.
Speaker 1: Katie Han soon realized this new technology was much more
Speaker 1: than a tool used by criminals. She dove deep and
Speaker 1: became a crypto convert, swapping her prosecutor hat for a
Speaker 1: board seat at coin Base and became the first female
Speaker 1: general partner at the venture capital firm and recent Horowitz. Han,
Speaker 1: now a prolific crypto investor, recently launched her own fund
Speaker 1: with one and a half billion dollars to deploy. It's
Speaker 1: the largest fund ever raised by a Soul investor. Here's
Speaker 1: my conversation with the CEO and founder of Han Ventures,
Speaker 1: Katie Han. Katie, it's so great to have you. Great
Speaker 1: to be back here in the studio with you. Emily,
Speaker 1: I want to start with a vibe check. Okay, what
Speaker 1: state of the crypto cycle are we in right now?
Speaker 1: It was hot and then it got pretty cold. Well,
Speaker 1: look Emily zooming back. Because I've been in crypto for
Speaker 1: a decade, if you can believe it, We've seen crypto
Speaker 1: be really hot and then all of a sudden not
Speaker 1: um and so we've seen this before. However, I think
Speaker 1: one of the things that's a little bit different now
Speaker 1: is with each new cryptocycle, more and more people come
Speaker 1: into it, and so it's more and more pronounced each cycle,
Speaker 1: and I would push back on it's not I think
Speaker 1: it depends on what area of the ecosystem you're looking at.
Speaker 1: We think developers think crypto and Web three is still
Speaker 1: really hot. I am seeing a lot less of those
Speaker 1: we're all going to make it hashtags. I'm seeing a
Speaker 1: lot less of them too, although I am spending less
Speaker 1: time on Twitter, so maybe that's why. Well, but with
Speaker 1: each cycle there are there are new acronyms. What hasn't
Speaker 1: happened is a crypto winter in the midst of kind
Speaker 1: of really serious global macro conditions. So we have inflation
Speaker 1: kind of record highs for our generation and in our
Speaker 1: lifetime UM, and then we have also a war that's
Speaker 1: broken out in the Ukraine, and we have a number
Speaker 1: of other factors going on here, so that's very different.
Speaker 1: There was some serious carnage out there, Sausius Luna three hours.
Speaker 1: What's been your takeaways from I don't want to sit
Speaker 1: here and tell you that algorithmic stable coins are bad,
Speaker 1: because I actually think they're really interesting UM. However, I
Speaker 1: think what happened is you had UM in this case.
Speaker 1: You mentioned Luna and Tara. You know that was an
Speaker 1: algorithmic stable coin UM that was getting pretty widespread adoption
Speaker 1: UM relative to what the tech could do. I didn't
Speaker 1: realize you spent your teenaged years living in Egypt and
Speaker 1: learning Arabic. Tell me about your upbringing. I was always uprooted. UM.
Speaker 1: My dad worked for a large company and we were
Speaker 1: always moving. Just when I would get comfortable in one space.
Speaker 1: And I think, actually that's pretty important if you fast
Speaker 1: toward and look at my career. Um, I'm comfortable being
Speaker 1: in uncomfortable situations, you know. I was. I didn't know
Speaker 1: a lot about venture when I got into it initially. Um,
Speaker 1: I didn't know a lot about crypto when I got
Speaker 1: into it initially, And I was okay asking questions. I
Speaker 1: was okay not knowing the local acronyms or a nomenclature
Speaker 1: of a particular field. And I'm you know, I'm taken
Speaker 1: right back to my teenagers in Cairo, moving from Houston,
Speaker 1: Texas one day to downtown Mahdi in Cairo the next day.
Speaker 1: You studied law. I did you clerked for Supreme Court
Speaker 1: Justice Anthony Kennedy? Right? You became a federal prosecutor. You
Speaker 1: were taking on prison gangs and the mafia. That must
Speaker 1: have taken a really thick skin, And I was doing
Speaker 1: it at um. And now, if I kind of take
Speaker 1: a step back, and you I think that happens at
Speaker 1: different points in your career, Like WHOA if I would
Speaker 1: have analyzed that a little more at the time, And
Speaker 1: I'm kind of in some ways glad I didn't. I
Speaker 1: just dove right in because I found it fascinating. There
Speaker 1: was a human aspect to it and people's stories, and
Speaker 1: I felt like those stories mattered. So I was drawn
Speaker 1: to criminal law and became a federal prosecutor, and I
Speaker 1: did cases involving violent crime, but then really mistrying cases,
Speaker 1: being back in the courtroom, being before the grand jury.
Speaker 1: Like the prosecutor you would see on TV going to
Speaker 1: try those murder case is doing those two hour closing argument.
Speaker 1: That's right. And so moved out here to California indict
Speaker 1: at the largest prison gang in the world at the time.
Speaker 1: UM outlaw, motorcycle gangs, hostage taking. Bank robberies are bank robberies.
Speaker 1: There was really not a kind of criminal case. By
Speaker 1: that point in my career I hadn't done. And it
Speaker 1: was right around that time two twelve one of my
Speaker 1: bosses came in and said, let's have that same energy
Speaker 1: that you brought to those gang cases, to those murder cases,
Speaker 1: and let's go ahead and have you investigate this new
Speaker 1: criminal technology that we really need to look into and
Speaker 1: possibly shut this down. So you created the first cryptocurrency,
Speaker 1: how would you describe it? Fortunately, several of us in
Speaker 1: the government realized at the time it's not possible, also
Speaker 1: not desirable, because bitcoin is not an entity. It's not
Speaker 1: a person um right, it's a protocol, And it would
Speaker 1: be like saying, let's go shut down cash, let's go
Speaker 1: shut down the Internet. It's not possible. Probably wouldn't be
Speaker 1: a good idea either. And I was using crypto and
Speaker 1: techno allergies like the bitcoin blockchain, because that's all it existed.
Speaker 1: Then this is to actually uncover criminal activity. So I
Speaker 1: didn't think that that technology was bad. Frankly, it was
Speaker 1: a tool that helped me uncover the various activity. And
Speaker 1: by the way, it was a step level function improvement
Speaker 1: better then compliance by banks. I'll just go ahead and
Speaker 1: say it. That's a little bit controversial, but I had
Speaker 1: spent a decade subpoenaing large financial institutions and five times
Speaker 1: out of ten didn't get back what I needed. One
Speaker 1: case I worked on and people always say, oh, you
Speaker 1: shot down the silk road. What actually happened. I was
Speaker 1: looking into something completely not having to do with anything
Speaker 1: at all of the silk road and came across some
Speaker 1: what looked to be some kind of odd activity, and
Speaker 1: it turns out that a couple of federal agents on
Speaker 1: the Silk Road test force out of Washington, d C.
Speaker 1: Were croaked. And that is the case that I ended
Speaker 1: up in dibting and I ended up prosecuting those agents
Speaker 1: sin they both went to prison. So that's the aspect
Speaker 1: of what the Silk Road case that I worked on.
Speaker 1: I would never never have been able to uncover that
Speaker 1: criminal activity by those agents because they were federal agents,
Speaker 1: they knew how to cover their tracks. Had they not
Speaker 1: used bitcoin blockchain, right that, so that technology right there,
Speaker 1: if they had just used wires or cash or bank wires,
Speaker 1: we would never have uncovered that. So you became kind
Speaker 1: of a crypto convert after this. You joined the board
Speaker 1: of coin base very early on. How did you in
Speaker 1: coin Base and Brian Armstrong come together. I hosted UM
Speaker 1: an event here in San Francisco at the Federal Reserve Bank,
Speaker 1: and I believe it was there that it wasn't just Brian.
Speaker 1: It was a lot of what I'll call legitimate actors
Speaker 1: and crypto who wanted to usher in this new UM wave,
Speaker 1: this new ecosystem UM. And then we brought together the
Speaker 1: heads of all kinds of agencies really in an effort
Speaker 1: to kind of talk about building bridges. You know, the
Speaker 1: government and the crypto industry. We're never going to see
Speaker 1: eye eye on a lot of things, but we did
Speaker 1: think there were some commonalities. Coin Based is a company
Speaker 1: that has suffered. They've been losing share, the valuation of
Speaker 1: the public markets has plummeted. Why do you think that
Speaker 1: is and how do you think it can be fixed? Yeah, well,
Speaker 1: I think again a few things. It's tied to one,
Speaker 1: a large aspect of coin BASAs business now of course,
Speaker 1: as trading revenue, and that's down when prices are down,
Speaker 1: and you know, the company has been very transparent about
Speaker 1: that long before going public. I mean also, if you
Speaker 1: look at its S one, it's specifically identifies that um
Speaker 1: and just how volatile crypto cycles are. So I think
Speaker 1: that's part of it. It's judged, you know, by public
Speaker 1: markets as a technology stock or as a financial services company.
Speaker 1: By the way, I think it's both. I think it's
Speaker 1: not just a financial services company. I think it's so
Speaker 1: much more. I think it's really a portal to this
Speaker 1: whole new ecosystem. You are also on the board of
Speaker 1: openc until recently, Uh, there's an insider trading situation or
Speaker 1: accusation going on. Their coin Base has also had employees
Speaker 1: accused of insider trading. How much is this happening within
Speaker 1: crypto companies and within the industry and how big a
Speaker 1: problem is? I think crypto is under the microscope. So
Speaker 1: where you have a case, two cases, three cases in
Speaker 1: crypto ecosystem, which now is a trillion dollar industry um,
Speaker 1: I think multi billion approaching trillion dollar industry, UM, You're
Speaker 1: always going to be able to find examples like that.
Speaker 1: So I don't want to make too much out of
Speaker 1: a handful of cases. That said, the company, coin Base
Speaker 1: opency take these things incredibly seriously. Along with your position
Speaker 1: at coin Base, you became a partner at one of
Speaker 1: the most story venture capital firms and Silicon valiant, that
Speaker 1: is Andres and Horowitz. What was your experience at a
Speaker 1: sixteen Z like there. I met Chris Dixon, and I
Speaker 1: met Ben Horowitz, and I met Mark Andreison, and I
Speaker 1: had worked with them for just about a year, maybe
Speaker 1: a little bit over when they asked me to come
Speaker 1: and co run their crypto funds at Andreas and Hearts. Again,
Speaker 1: I jumped at that chance, and I think, really that
Speaker 1: speaks to the fact that, as I've said before, things
Speaker 1: are hell yes or there are no. And it was
Speaker 1: a hell yes for me. So Andrewson Harwars is the
Speaker 1: kind of place where if you make partner, you don't leave.
Speaker 1: How did Mark and Ben respond when you said, I
Speaker 1: want to leave to start a crypto fund of my own.
Speaker 1: As you might know, Emily, Um, they're an anchor. Uh,
Speaker 1: They're an anchor check into my fund. And I'm very
Speaker 1: grateful for that. You know, Mark and Chris and folks
Speaker 1: like them are also personal LPs um. So I felt
Speaker 1: very supported um when I shared that decision. Um. And
Speaker 1: I will say that it was not running away from
Speaker 1: Anderson Harts. It was running to another opportunity. And you know,
Speaker 1: crypto is not what do they say, It's not a
Speaker 1: spectator sport. It's like you're in it, excuse very young.
Speaker 1: It's seven, it's global, and it's hustle and at this
Speaker 1: and that's a trade off. It's a life trade off.
Speaker 1: And at this point in my career and in my life,
Speaker 1: if I was going to continue to make that trade off,
Speaker 1: I just wanted to do it and do it in
Speaker 1: a way that was really true to me. So you
Speaker 1: struck out on your own to launch on ventures. What
Speaker 1: gave you the courage to do that? What was the
Speaker 1: spark that like the fire? Yeah, that got you to say,
Speaker 1: I need to do this and do this now. Sure.
Speaker 1: What I set out to do was to continue to
Speaker 1: invest in this ecosystem that I think is so broad.
Speaker 1: That decision was very purposeful and the timing was very purposeful.
Speaker 1: We have an early stage fund that does seed stage,
Speaker 1: Series A, even Series B, and then we have what
Speaker 1: we call an acceleration fund, which is it's not a
Speaker 1: growth fund, it's a crypto growth fund, and I think
Speaker 1: those are different things. But later stage it might be
Speaker 1: crypto publics um certain kinds of public tokens were set
Speaker 1: up to hold tokens to participate in the token ecosystem
Speaker 1: or later stage companies. I mean, you know there are
Speaker 1: now several crypto many crypto unicorns. Space has become really competitive.
Speaker 1: Even though you say, um, you know, crypto has had
Speaker 1: its kind of ups and downs. The thing is a
Speaker 1: lot of people in some of those last cycles have
Speaker 1: seen the kind of venture style returns that can be
Speaker 1: had in crypto, and so you've had a lot of
Speaker 1: new funds enter space. And that's driven up competition. So
Speaker 1: what differentiates on ventures then from you know, all of
Speaker 1: these other crypto funds or even the more traditional venture
Speaker 1: capitalists like Couentries and Horowitz or Schekoia they also have
Speaker 1: crypto funds. Well, I think a lot of traditional venture
Speaker 1: capital funds now have crypto funds. It used to just
Speaker 1: be like a regulatory designation. It was like, are you
Speaker 1: an r i A, which is registered investment advisor. I
Speaker 1: would say for crypto founders today, um, it's not enough
Speaker 1: to just be an r i A. Right they frankly,
Speaker 1: I don't even know if a lot of them care
Speaker 1: that's a regulatory designation. What crypto founders today want to
Speaker 1: know is do you live in breath crypto? Do you
Speaker 1: inhale the discords? Are you part of the community, do
Speaker 1: you participate in governance? Are you going to be um
Speaker 1: staking these kind of crypto verbs um out there? And
Speaker 1: if you're not really in this space full time, I
Speaker 1: think it's very hard to run a successful crypto fund.
Speaker 1: We don't have a hedge fund component, so we're not
Speaker 1: sitting here buying and trading and selling. Um that's a
Speaker 1: hedge fund. Star sure, and there are crypto hedge funds. Um,
Speaker 1: we're not one. We're making seven to ten yere bets.
Speaker 1: Just how hard is it to launch a crypto fund
Speaker 1: from scratch? You know it's hard, but it's not impossible,
Speaker 1: and we not have a crystal ball. I don't know.
Speaker 1: I can't predict cycles, but I knew that we were
Speaker 1: in a cycle where you saw so much forever an
Speaker 1: excitement around the space. And I already talked about what
Speaker 1: makes us different. But I think one thing also is
Speaker 1: we are a nimble strike force. We don't fish in
Speaker 1: the same pond we have the crypto natives. We have
Speaker 1: a fish and execution. We have operators, seasoned operators who
Speaker 1: really know how to stick the landing. And I think
Speaker 1: that's reflected on our culture. I would say the only
Speaker 1: thing that's changed in our strategy as a result of
Speaker 1: the market correction is really more of a focus on
Speaker 1: early stage. But we still have our late stage fund
Speaker 1: and when we see valuations, which I think we'll still
Speaker 1: see correct um spoiler, I think we'll continue to see
Speaker 1: some corrections and um, so we might deploy our later
Speaker 1: stage fund a little bit more slowly. It might not
Speaker 1: be on an even cadence and that's okay. Long term,
Speaker 1: our strategy hasn't changed. Long term, We're committed to this space.
Speaker 1: How much do you think valuations are going to correct?
Speaker 1: You know, it's just I can't give you a one
Speaker 1: size fits all answer because crypto is not a monolith.
Speaker 1: You have some crypto companies that really follow more of
Speaker 1: an enterprise sas business model. You have others that are
Speaker 1: layer one protocols UM. You have still others that are
Speaker 1: consumer facing applications. And I think one of the things
Speaker 1: we're seeing right now is the infrastructure layer, and that's
Speaker 1: where we're spending a lot of our time, by the way,
Speaker 1: and we think more and more use cases will come
Speaker 1: about when the infrastructure layers in place. UM So, my
Speaker 1: own view is we are not rushing to deploy. We're
Speaker 1: certainly not getting caught up. Do you get VC try
Speaker 1: not to avoid that. You know, Look, I think it's
Speaker 1: very easy to get into that mindset, right. It's because
Speaker 1: it's a competitive sport. It's a competitive space, and I
Speaker 1: think I'd be lying if I said that that doesn't
Speaker 1: influence anyone. I try to what I do, and I
Speaker 1: think I do differently is I try to take stock
Speaker 1: of that Oh, that's the foam of mentality kicking in.
Speaker 1: That's bad um. Again, you don't want to over correct, though.
Speaker 1: What we look for is we look for amazing founders.
Speaker 1: It doesn't matter if I think valuations will correct. If
Speaker 1: there are amazing founders, there's a huge tam We also
Speaker 1: look for what's your regulatory plan if you're launching a token,
Speaker 1: what's your plan to comply with the law. What's your
Speaker 1: plan for security? By the way, we've seen a lot
Speaker 1: of hacks in the space. We want to really dive
Speaker 1: in there and make sure that the founders have been
Speaker 1: thoughtful about especially if they're custoding customer funds, keeping those
Speaker 1: funds secure. If it's a cross chain bridge, what are
Speaker 1: the exploits? Have you changed your strategy at all given
Speaker 1: the downturn? Have you backed out of any deals? Are
Speaker 1: decided not to do certain deals because the conditions have changed?
Speaker 1: Don't you raise the fund We have decided not to
Speaker 1: do certain deals. We've never backed out of a deal.
Speaker 1: We have decided not to do a few deals because
Speaker 1: we think that pricing was ahead of progress, candidly, and
Speaker 1: we might have been wrong about that, Emily, we might
Speaker 1: have been wrong about that. But I think if we
Speaker 1: were wrong not to do a couple of deals, um
Speaker 1: better that we might have been right, because if we
Speaker 1: were wrong about that, I think we can find a
Speaker 1: way to still invest in those projects later. Well, one
Speaker 1: thing I'm here is that a lot of dry powder
Speaker 1: has just stacked up because all these funds raised a
Speaker 1: lot of money. You raised what what? What was the
Speaker 1: biggest fund ever for a single person, not just a
Speaker 1: woman anyone. Are you confident you're gonna have to a
Speaker 1: place to put all that money? I am, But if
Speaker 1: I don't have a place to put it, I'm not
Speaker 1: just going to go willing nearly deploy it. One of
Speaker 1: the things that we told our LPs, even during the
Speaker 1: period when we raised our fund, which was when Crypto
Speaker 1: was undeniably still on a bull run, we said that
Speaker 1: we are going to be pretty steadfast sticking to it,
Speaker 1: to your deployment cycle. Um. And you know, I think
Speaker 1: one thing that's changed is that might have lengthened. Um.
Speaker 1: It certainly hasn't shortened, But we will again we have
Speaker 1: We feel very good that we have the capital to
Speaker 1: back greet teams when we see them. What about n
Speaker 1: f T s and are you concerned about the declining demand.
Speaker 1: We are going to increasingly live in a digital world,
Speaker 1: and I happen to think that if you live in
Speaker 1: a dual world, you're going to want to own digital goods.
Speaker 1: In that world, you're not just going to be satisfied
Speaker 1: to rent them, which is what we do now. We
Speaker 1: buy our content from walled gardens without digital scarcity, which
Speaker 1: is what n f T s unlock. You don't really
Speaker 1: own anything. You're subject to the whims of a platform.
Speaker 1: And I think n f T s and digitally scarce
Speaker 1: goods fundamentally change that. I think you'll see n f
Speaker 1: T s back again. Um, but we are spending a
Speaker 1: lot of time in the infrastructure layer, like I tell you,
Speaker 1: zero knowledge, technologies, scalability. We think of that as like
Speaker 1: the plumbing. If you think of the fiber optic cables,
Speaker 1: remember you couldn't have had YouTube and Netflix with dial up.
Speaker 1: You couldn't have streamed content. The same is true of
Speaker 1: crypto use cases. We think that there will be a
Speaker 1: lot of new use cases unlocked when the infrastructure is there,
Speaker 1: when it's more efficient, when it's more user friendly, and
Speaker 1: so we're spending a lot of our time there. President
Speaker 1: buying issues. This Crypto Executive Order, there a number of
Speaker 1: ports that are coming to What do you want to
Speaker 1: see from the administration when it comes to regulation and
Speaker 1: are you optimistic that we will get there? Yeah, we
Speaker 1: were so delighted to see that executive order. This is
Speaker 1: not something you should normally be delighted about. But why
Speaker 1: we were is because it was to us a real
Speaker 1: recognition that this is the US government saying this field
Speaker 1: isn't going anywhere. This field is growing, is growing so
Speaker 1: much that we are going to direct every single agency
Speaker 1: in the federal government to come up with a plan. Here.
Speaker 1: I think, you know, we take a step forward, but
Speaker 1: then you see, you know, we're a big government, we're
Speaker 1: a big system. We have states, we have local entities.
Speaker 1: So we take a step forward with the EO, and
Speaker 1: then we take some steps back sometimes too. And I
Speaker 1: think what I UM see as crypto founders are confused
Speaker 1: by that. They're starting to think, well, I could go
Speaker 1: to this jurisdiction where there's a single regulator and you
Speaker 1: don't have fifty states with different rules. It's the U.
Speaker 1: S Government that needs to start taking stock of the
Speaker 1: fact that right now, Emily in China, UM there's a
Speaker 1: quarter of a billion e c N y wallets, a
Speaker 1: quarter of a billion. Um. We're still talking about whether
Speaker 1: there should be a government central bank digital currency. We're
Speaker 1: still studying that. So you think we're going to fall
Speaker 1: behind the United I think we already are falling behind behind.
Speaker 1: We're falling behind. What are the dangers of falling behind
Speaker 1: China and the rest of the world. This is years ahead,
Speaker 1: So I don't want people to take a headline and say, oh,
Speaker 1: I think the US dollar will be you know, no
Speaker 1: longer the global currency reserve, global currency. I'm not saying
Speaker 1: that now. But fast forward decades and if you no
Speaker 1: longer need to use the dollar because you have an alternative, Um,
Speaker 1: I think that's a real problem. What would we use instead? Well,
Speaker 1: I think that there are going to be stable coins
Speaker 1: out there that people who have access to a smartphone
Speaker 1: will use. There is a demand for it. We saw
Speaker 1: two year of your growth with stable coins, so people
Speaker 1: are clearly liking the idea of this. Now again, there
Speaker 1: have been some spectacular failures too, but not all stable
Speaker 1: coins are created the same. But I think the important
Speaker 1: thing is that we really do need to not quahtion innovation.
Speaker 1: What do you think of how Gary Gensler, the chair
Speaker 1: of the SEC, and how he's approaching it. One of
Speaker 1: the things that I hear from founders is that they're
Speaker 1: very confused because they get told come in, register, just
Speaker 1: come in and talk to us. But you have the
Speaker 1: one company who has done the ultimate act of going
Speaker 1: in and registering coin based filed and s one UM
Speaker 1: and still, you know, there's a lot of saber rattling
Speaker 1: still going on. I think, UM, And again, I don't
Speaker 1: want to single out the sec um, you know, and
Speaker 1: I don't want to suggest that anything they're doing is bad.
Speaker 1: I do think though, that right now there's a lot
Speaker 1: of confusion, and one of the pieces of confusion stems
Speaker 1: from the fact that you know, and it started with
Speaker 1: the I c oh mania back in what twenty I
Speaker 1: can't even remember which year now, where the SEC was
Speaker 1: very loud about securities. A lot of them were securities.
Speaker 1: But the space has changed, and so to still view
Speaker 1: it through the I c O lens when so much
Speaker 1: has happened over the last five years in the space, UM,
Speaker 1: I think it's a miss stake. What do you have
Speaker 1: to say that the skeptics out there who just don't
Speaker 1: believe in the future of WHIM three and don't see
Speaker 1: where this is going. I would say, don't judge the
Speaker 1: current state of innovation by the end state of innovation.
Speaker 1: I hear from a lot of these skeptics, and by
Speaker 1: the way, I'm friends with a lot of these skeptics too.
Speaker 1: I don't only want to live in a crypto bubble.
Speaker 1: They want to see the use cases, especially if they're
Speaker 1: not technical. Well, when am I going to use it?
Speaker 1: What will I use it for? And I think one
Speaker 1: of the things that's not appreciated is how quickly the
Speaker 1: infrastructure here is catching up. And once you have kind
Speaker 1: of once you have really scalable blockchains that can handle
Speaker 1: um a lot of thoroughput on are very efficient. I
Speaker 1: think that unlocks a whole lot of use cases. People
Speaker 1: are spending more time on screens. That curve is up
Speaker 1: into the right, whether we like it or not, that
Speaker 1: is the future. I mean, those who have kids know
Speaker 1: that kids spend more time online. They want digital things too,
Speaker 1: and I think to dismiss it, it is a bit generational.
Speaker 1: I do find not always, but is a bit generational.
Speaker 1: If you talk to kids about being able to have
Speaker 1: money online they instantly get that concept. They're comfortable not
Speaker 1: having to hold something in their hand to think it
Speaker 1: has value. Take us to the end state. Do Google
Speaker 1: and Amazon and Facebook and Apple still exists? I believe
Speaker 1: they will still exist. I mean it depends what you
Speaker 1: talk about when you talk about the end state. I
Speaker 1: mean I think that you know, I think for decades
Speaker 1: those companies will still be around. But the important thing is,
Speaker 1: I think this new ecosystem is going to represent a
Speaker 1: challenge to them. I do think that those entities, um,
Speaker 1: decentralized forces are coming and we'll cut into those entities
Speaker 1: profits and revenues. So we have a little rapid fire section.
Speaker 1: If you could belong to any alt coin tribe, gosh, um,
Speaker 1: there is no way I'm answering that because I will
Speaker 1: get trolled on Twitter by every other al coin tribe. Um,
Speaker 1: I'm a crypto maximalist. I'm a crypto max Alright, we'll
Speaker 1: not picking one book or podcast you're binging now, Hey,
Speaker 1: I'm I yes, I am. Oh gosh, I'm benching on
Speaker 1: wheat crash. Something that brings you simple joy, you know,
Speaker 1: one of the things that I love and I've missed
Speaker 1: being away from this summer is swimming. I just love
Speaker 1: I find like some of my best thoughts come to
Speaker 1: me while I'm moving. Career philosophy, Yeah, do a job
Speaker 1: where you know fifty of the job and we're're gonna
Speaker 1: learn fifty percent of the job. Um. Again, that goes
Speaker 1: back to no growth in the comfort zone, No comfort
Speaker 1: in the growth zone. Studio one Point I was produced
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