1 00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:10,119 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. You're listening to the 2 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch us live weekdays at 3 00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:17,440 Speaker 1: noon and five pm Eastern on Applecarclay and Android Auto 4 00:00:17,520 --> 00:00:20,680 Speaker 1: with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen on demand wherever you 5 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:24,960 Speaker 1: get your podcasts, or watch us live on YouTube. 6 00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:28,760 Speaker 2: The Tuesday edition on Bloomberg TV and Radio. A gorgeous 7 00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:31,120 Speaker 2: day here in Washington, even if it's a bit warm, 8 00:00:31,320 --> 00:00:33,600 Speaker 2: kind of like the core inflation reading this morning. But 9 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 2: we're watching shares of Nvidia and AMD just like we 10 00:00:37,440 --> 00:00:42,000 Speaker 2: were at this time yesterday, and nobody could seem to 11 00:00:42,120 --> 00:00:45,880 Speaker 2: care less about the news from China. They both closed 12 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:49,199 Speaker 2: hire yesterday after the fifteen percent story ran. Remember they 13 00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:53,000 Speaker 2: would agree to give fifteen percent of revenues from sales 14 00:00:53,479 --> 00:00:57,240 Speaker 2: of AI chips to China to the US government. Not 15 00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:02,160 Speaker 2: a thing. Now today we hear the opposite, China's turning course. 16 00:01:02,600 --> 00:01:05,400 Speaker 2: Stocks are still higher, and it comes against the backdrop 17 00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:07,880 Speaker 2: of a trade truce, if we can actually call it that, 18 00:01:07,920 --> 00:01:10,880 Speaker 2: because there are some tariffs in place that the President 19 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:15,560 Speaker 2: has continued here with Beijing. Just yesterday, which would have 20 00:01:15,560 --> 00:01:19,479 Speaker 2: been the deadline, we got another ninety days suggesting there 21 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:22,679 Speaker 2: could be more time to reach a deal and maybe 22 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:26,880 Speaker 2: exercise more deals like these with the chip makers. This 23 00:01:26,920 --> 00:01:29,959 Speaker 2: is where we want to start our conversation with a 24 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:33,920 Speaker 2: familiar guest. Nazakda Koktar is with US today, national Security 25 00:01:33,959 --> 00:01:37,600 Speaker 2: Practice group leader at Wiley and a voice of experience, 26 00:01:37,600 --> 00:01:39,840 Speaker 2: as I say, in being a former Assistant Secretary for 27 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:43,480 Speaker 2: Industry and Analysis at the International Trade Administration. Great to 28 00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:47,160 Speaker 2: see you in, Nazak, Thanks for coming in. So let's 29 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:51,160 Speaker 2: start big picture here. We just bought ourselves another ninety days. 30 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:53,960 Speaker 2: Is that enough to actually create a trade deal? Or 31 00:01:54,040 --> 00:01:56,720 Speaker 2: is just simply an indication that talks are continuing? 32 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,120 Speaker 3: You know, it's pretty much an indication of talks are 33 00:01:59,120 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 3: continuing trade especially if they're going to be comprehensive. They're 34 00:02:03,000 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 3: incredibly complex, they did They cover different sectors, they cover 35 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:10,360 Speaker 3: different measures with respect to goods within sectors. So ninety 36 00:02:10,440 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 3: day is really an indication of let's continue talks. At 37 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:15,480 Speaker 3: the end of the day, I think the consensus is 38 00:02:15,520 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 3: we're probably going to get a very narrow trade deal 39 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:21,120 Speaker 3: with China. But really the goal and all eyes aren't 40 00:02:21,160 --> 00:02:22,800 Speaker 3: getting some kind of trade deal. 41 00:02:22,840 --> 00:02:25,800 Speaker 2: Okay, does it rely on the President getting in the 42 00:02:25,880 --> 00:02:26,960 Speaker 2: room with President she. 43 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:30,079 Speaker 3: I think at the end of the day, probably are 44 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 3: these These trade deals also have especially based on which 45 00:02:33,639 --> 00:02:36,680 Speaker 3: each country is asking for. We're asking for magnets, they're 46 00:02:36,720 --> 00:02:42,600 Speaker 3: asking for wardships. These materials have incredible geopolitical consequences. They're 47 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:45,760 Speaker 3: sectors of the economy, really critical sectors of the US economy. 48 00:02:45,800 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 3: They're still not getting magnets that they need from China, 49 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:53,320 Speaker 3: and so this isn't going to be resolved unless both 50 00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:55,720 Speaker 3: country leaders get in a room and hash out what 51 00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 3: they need from each other. 52 00:02:56,919 --> 00:02:59,119 Speaker 2: Yes, well, it sounds like if the President had said 53 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:02,320 Speaker 2: at one point that we've got a deal upfront heat 54 00:03:02,440 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 2: The term he used was upfront providing of rare earths 55 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:10,560 Speaker 2: the batteries that are needed for these critical components. We're 56 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:12,560 Speaker 2: getting a sense that that did not happen exactly the 57 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:13,160 Speaker 2: way he wanted. 58 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 4: No. 59 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 3: I mean, you know, China's repeatedly said yeah, yea, yeah, 60 00:03:17,000 --> 00:03:19,919 Speaker 3: you'll get it. But China operates on its own time, 61 00:03:20,280 --> 00:03:22,600 Speaker 3: and just because you get a few doesn't mean all 62 00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:25,239 Speaker 3: the sectors that we're previously getting it from China for 63 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:28,079 Speaker 3: all the end used applications are going to get it. Yes, well, 64 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:31,079 Speaker 3: our auto OEMs get some of the things they need, absolutely, 65 00:03:31,280 --> 00:03:34,160 Speaker 3: but we've got still issues with our defense primes that 66 00:03:34,240 --> 00:03:37,640 Speaker 3: are not getting things industrial applications. They're not getting the 67 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:39,880 Speaker 3: magnets with our motors. At the end of the day, 68 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 3: China has just is slow walking it and they're playing game. 69 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:45,640 Speaker 2: Well, you just said it. OEMs are one thing, national 70 00:03:45,680 --> 00:03:48,840 Speaker 2: security defense is another. Does that suggest that China has 71 00:03:48,880 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 2: the leverage. 72 00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 3: China has a considerable amount of leverage. And I think 73 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:55,880 Speaker 3: what I've been trying to sort of educate the community 74 00:03:56,040 --> 00:03:59,760 Speaker 3: about is that, look, we are making enormous the United States, 75 00:04:00,400 --> 00:04:04,080 Speaker 3: so in critical mineral production and magnet production, we're going 76 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:06,760 Speaker 3: to need till twenty twenty eight to scale what the 77 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:08,560 Speaker 3: US government is heavily investing in. 78 00:04:08,880 --> 00:04:11,000 Speaker 5: So we really have about two years to solve for. 79 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:13,400 Speaker 3: And what I've been trying to socialize with the White 80 00:04:13,400 --> 00:04:16,640 Speaker 3: House is, you know, magnets can be refurbished. There are 81 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,719 Speaker 3: a lot of countries that use magnets that don't discard 82 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:21,680 Speaker 3: them at the end of the day. And this isn't recycling, 83 00:04:21,839 --> 00:04:25,400 Speaker 3: but we can recover magnets. I mean, I'm just just 84 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:29,480 Speaker 3: education talking to them about it, talking to them about options. Absolutely, 85 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:31,880 Speaker 3: just a few weeks ago, they had a summit to 86 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:33,839 Speaker 3: discuss this with key stakeholders. 87 00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:35,640 Speaker 5: It's it's it's resonating. 88 00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:38,240 Speaker 3: There's companies who've come in, raised their hand and said, 89 00:04:38,279 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 3: we're happy to do this for you White House if 90 00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:40,880 Speaker 3: if push. 91 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:41,440 Speaker 5: Comes to shove. 92 00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:45,039 Speaker 3: So the point is really making sure that we have 93 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:47,520 Speaker 3: a strategy in place and whether we're going to basically 94 00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:50,080 Speaker 3: cap to China anymore based on the fact that we're 95 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:51,760 Speaker 3: not as vulnerable as we think we are. 96 00:04:51,839 --> 00:04:54,000 Speaker 2: Well, i'd love to hear your insights on what's happened 97 00:04:54,040 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 2: in the last twenty four hours. Big Olive ranch to 98 00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:00,680 Speaker 2: the other side of the world, rebuffed by Beijing, and 99 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:02,120 Speaker 2: this is you know, we could talk about a lot 100 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:04,159 Speaker 2: of elements. I'd love your take on this deal that 101 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:06,360 Speaker 2: in Nvidia and AMD made as well to actually give 102 00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:10,599 Speaker 2: a chunk of proceeds from China sales to the US government. 103 00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 2: But that was the concern yesterday. Now the concern is 104 00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:15,200 Speaker 2: where they're going to buy it at all. Beijing is 105 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:19,039 Speaker 2: telling Chinese companies don't buy Nvidia, don't buy AMD. And 106 00:05:19,080 --> 00:05:21,000 Speaker 2: this whole arrangement is something that we talked about last 107 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 2: evening with Congressman Roger Christi Morphy, Democrat from Illinois, important 108 00:05:24,800 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 2: as he's ranking member on the House China Select Committee. 109 00:05:27,400 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 2: Here's his take on what we're discussing right now. 110 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:33,800 Speaker 4: He declared our national securities for sale. It's a disaster, 111 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:35,080 Speaker 4: dereliction of duty. 112 00:05:35,440 --> 00:05:35,640 Speaker 6: You know. 113 00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:38,440 Speaker 4: The first thing that the commander in chief and the 114 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:41,599 Speaker 4: president needs to do is to protect our country. And 115 00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:44,479 Speaker 4: so when he basically says that our national securities for 116 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:49,760 Speaker 4: sale that are crown jewels can be obtained through some 117 00:05:49,880 --> 00:05:53,440 Speaker 4: kind of revenue sharing agreement with the United States government, 118 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:57,520 Speaker 4: that is a horrible sign to our adversaries. What are 119 00:05:57,520 --> 00:06:00,039 Speaker 4: we going to do next? Sell aircraft carriers to the 120 00:06:00,120 --> 00:06:03,400 Speaker 4: Chinese and the government takes a twenty percent cut. This 121 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:06,839 Speaker 4: is horrible. We should not be engaged in the sale 122 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:09,440 Speaker 4: of these Age twenty chips to the CCP. And the 123 00:06:09,520 --> 00:06:12,680 Speaker 4: fact that he would even broach the topic of these 124 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:17,400 Speaker 4: Blackwell processors potentially being for sale to the Chinese means 125 00:06:17,440 --> 00:06:22,600 Speaker 4: that they're salivating at the prospect of basically taking those chips, 126 00:06:23,200 --> 00:06:27,479 Speaker 4: inserting them into their military systems, which would be used 127 00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:30,359 Speaker 4: against us and our allies, friends and partners in the 128 00:06:30,360 --> 00:06:34,560 Speaker 4: Indo Pacific and then also used against various minorities in 129 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:37,719 Speaker 4: perpetration of human rights abuses. So this is a really, 130 00:06:37,800 --> 00:06:41,080 Speaker 4: really dark day for our national security. 131 00:06:42,320 --> 00:06:44,440 Speaker 2: All right, he just said a lot. So let's unpack 132 00:06:44,480 --> 00:06:47,120 Speaker 2: a little bit of this with regard to the arrangement 133 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:49,920 Speaker 2: that the White House gets sort of, the government gets 134 00:06:49,960 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 2: a fifteen percent take. These licenses have just been approved, 135 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:59,720 Speaker 2: and there is an air of whether these were bought 136 00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:03,160 Speaker 2: in paid for, and whether we're compromising. You just heard 137 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:05,960 Speaker 2: the congressman say our national security. How do you respond 138 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:06,159 Speaker 2: to that? 139 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:10,520 Speaker 3: I think, look, first of all, first and foremost, what's 140 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:12,840 Speaker 3: really important for folks to understand is that when we 141 00:07:12,960 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 3: license chips, we're also licensing the technology then know how 142 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:18,600 Speaker 3: that goes with it. Right, So when on one hand, 143 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:21,520 Speaker 3: folks are saying, well, these are sort of lower grade. 144 00:07:21,320 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 5: Chips, these are still exquisite chips. 145 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:27,640 Speaker 3: China has huge market access barriers against the United States. 146 00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:30,040 Speaker 3: If they can indigenize it, it doesn't want it from us. 147 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:31,360 Speaker 3: If it wants it from us. 148 00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 5: There's a strategic need for it. 149 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:35,440 Speaker 3: Right, So the transfer of know how to me, I 150 00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:37,120 Speaker 3: think we've got to be very careful about. 151 00:07:37,320 --> 00:07:40,520 Speaker 2: Because Wawei has developed a similar chip to the. 152 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:45,000 Speaker 3: H China's entire semiconductor industry and the industry that which 153 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 3: is powering their defense capabilities, their military capabilities that they're 154 00:07:49,880 --> 00:07:54,280 Speaker 3: using right now offensively to terrorize our allies, and also 155 00:07:54,360 --> 00:07:57,880 Speaker 3: AID and I bet the Russians in Iran that has 156 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:01,280 Speaker 3: been built make no mistake on US technology that we 157 00:08:01,400 --> 00:08:02,800 Speaker 3: transfer to China. 158 00:08:03,120 --> 00:08:05,600 Speaker 5: So there are accumulative risks there. 159 00:08:05,640 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 3: But in terms of the fifteen percent your question, I 160 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:10,400 Speaker 3: think this is really in the domain of Congress to 161 00:08:10,480 --> 00:08:14,000 Speaker 3: decide whether they want these types of transactions to allow 162 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 3: the US government to collect revenue. I think when you 163 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 3: look at the laws, it seems a little bit the 164 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:21,720 Speaker 3: laws are silent on this kind of issue. I think 165 00:08:22,000 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 3: different folks had to interpretations. On one hand, the government 166 00:08:25,400 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 3: can't collect revenue unless Congress authorizes it. On the other hand, 167 00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:32,080 Speaker 3: they haven't explicitly banned it. So it's really up to 168 00:08:32,120 --> 00:08:35,280 Speaker 3: Congress to say whether this is permissible or not. But certainly, 169 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 3: do we want the National Security Bureau to potentially make 170 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:41,520 Speaker 3: money off of sales depending on how they use it 171 00:08:41,600 --> 00:08:44,079 Speaker 3: and depending on how they're exercising judgment, these are all 172 00:08:44,160 --> 00:08:44,920 Speaker 3: open questions. 173 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 2: Well, I guess so you wonder if Beijing makes these 174 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:51,200 Speaker 2: even more sought after by making them taboo in the process, 175 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:54,360 Speaker 2: But in our remaining moment, no zok does all this 176 00:08:54,520 --> 00:08:57,160 Speaker 2: noise that we're talking about right now give you an 177 00:08:57,160 --> 00:08:59,640 Speaker 2: indication that a trade deal is more elusive, or that 178 00:08:59,640 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 2: we're at getting down to some business and might arrive 179 00:09:02,640 --> 00:09:04,720 Speaker 2: at the finish line here with China. 180 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:05,959 Speaker 3: The way that China, So I look at sort of 181 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:09,160 Speaker 3: China's behavior. It's made commitments, it hasn't honored it. It 182 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 3: makes commitments, it hasn't honored it. It is asking for 183 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:15,760 Speaker 3: more and more and more, and not signaling. This is 184 00:09:15,840 --> 00:09:19,280 Speaker 3: really important to watch. China is not signaling at all 185 00:09:19,400 --> 00:09:22,800 Speaker 3: that it wants a deal. It's just just playing with us. 186 00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:25,440 Speaker 3: It's drawing down the timeline. It's it's I think it's 187 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:27,840 Speaker 3: China is also trying to make the president look bad 188 00:09:28,600 --> 00:09:31,240 Speaker 3: during this process. If I were to read China, and 189 00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:33,280 Speaker 3: I've been doing China for twenty five years, studying it, 190 00:09:33,400 --> 00:09:36,400 Speaker 3: dealing with China and trade, national security, China doesn't want 191 00:09:36,400 --> 00:09:38,800 Speaker 3: to deal. It's just it's playing us, and it wants 192 00:09:38,840 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 3: the public to see how they're playing. 193 00:09:40,600 --> 00:09:42,240 Speaker 2: It doesn't sound like we're ever getting to a deal. 194 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:44,880 Speaker 2: Then China doesn't want a deal. There's no deal. If 195 00:09:44,880 --> 00:09:47,040 Speaker 2: you're Jensen Wong, then you're going to China to try 196 00:09:47,080 --> 00:09:49,120 Speaker 2: to make the sales pitch for your own chip cell over. 197 00:09:49,240 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 3: This is a chess game, our countermove, but China's getting 198 00:09:51,920 --> 00:09:54,240 Speaker 3: extracted as much as it can from us without a deal. 199 00:09:54,400 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 2: I'm so happy you came in. I really appreciate the insights, 200 00:09:57,559 --> 00:09:59,800 Speaker 2: just the voice that we needed today from Nozak Nacoctor. 201 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:03,000 Speaker 2: Highly many thanks for the insights. As always, I want 202 00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:04,800 Speaker 2: to play this to the panel. Rick Davis and Genie 203 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:08,120 Speaker 2: Shanzano have thoughts on this Bloomberg Politics contributors. Rick, of 204 00:10:08,160 --> 00:10:11,760 Speaker 2: course partner at Stone Court, Capitol Republican strategist. Genie is 205 00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:14,319 Speaker 2: Senior Democracy Fellow at the Center for the Study of 206 00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:17,559 Speaker 2: the Presidency in Congress. What's your thought on this, Rick, 207 00:10:17,600 --> 00:10:19,839 Speaker 2: and boy, how quickly the news can change. We were 208 00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:23,760 Speaker 2: talking yesterday about this new opening in the market for 209 00:10:23,880 --> 00:10:27,600 Speaker 2: Nvidia and AMD. Investors felt good about it, even if 210 00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:31,400 Speaker 2: they were losing fifteen percent. Now China is telling Chinese 211 00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:35,079 Speaker 2: companies not to buy American How does this pan out 212 00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 2: in the end? 213 00:10:36,920 --> 00:10:39,319 Speaker 7: Well, it's a kind of a smart play on China's 214 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 7: part as and as I was saying, they need to 215 00:10:41,600 --> 00:10:46,160 Speaker 7: build their capability. Nothing builds it like demand, and I'm 216 00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:49,800 Speaker 7: sure they're feeling vulnerable to manipulation of this market. If 217 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:53,400 Speaker 7: Donald Trump can bestow them with the gift of having 218 00:10:53,440 --> 00:10:55,920 Speaker 7: these for sale in China, he can take it away. 219 00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 7: And the last thing that Chinese want to do is 220 00:10:57,760 --> 00:11:01,280 Speaker 7: be a the beck and call of Donald Trump. So honestly, 221 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 7: this is a game that's been going on for a 222 00:11:02,559 --> 00:11:06,600 Speaker 7: long time. Investment from the US investors into China tech 223 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:11,319 Speaker 7: has been fueling the Red Army build up against us, 224 00:11:12,120 --> 00:11:15,360 Speaker 7: and this is just another example of them taking us 225 00:11:15,440 --> 00:11:16,520 Speaker 7: to the cleaners. 226 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:21,839 Speaker 2: Taking us to the cleaners. Jeanie was is zak onto 227 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:26,000 Speaker 2: something or the Chinese just trying to embarrass Donald Trump 228 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 2: or make them look bad? 229 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:33,240 Speaker 8: I think for sure, But I think they're more interested 230 00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:37,600 Speaker 8: in ensuring their prominence in the economy and the world 231 00:11:37,640 --> 00:11:40,280 Speaker 8: as we go forward. And you know, a lot of 232 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 8: people are predicting we are facing a China Shock two 233 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:46,760 Speaker 8: point zero and it's going to come as a result 234 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 8: of their long term investments in these frontier economies, and 235 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:55,400 Speaker 8: they are doing a magnificent job growing in that area, 236 00:11:55,840 --> 00:11:59,920 Speaker 8: which is why so many national security experts and all 237 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:03,640 Speaker 8: but particularly as we think about national security, have been 238 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:09,000 Speaker 8: concerned about Donald Trump's decisions in many areas, particularly as 239 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 8: it pertains to chips, but also as it pertains to 240 00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:17,000 Speaker 8: alienating one of the United States' biggest strengths to combat China, 241 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:20,800 Speaker 8: which is our allies. The reality is we are far 242 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:24,440 Speaker 8: smaller in terms of a labor force than China. To 243 00:12:24,600 --> 00:12:28,200 Speaker 8: confront China, we need the support of allies that make 244 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:31,320 Speaker 8: us stronger and bigger and better. And as opposed to 245 00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 8: confronting China, what he is doing is for some reason, 246 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:39,520 Speaker 8: confronting our allies, Canada, Mexico, Switzerland. I mean, the list 247 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:42,560 Speaker 8: goes on and on. They turn away from us. It 248 00:12:42,600 --> 00:12:45,000 Speaker 8: doesn't even matter if they turn to China, which some 249 00:12:45,080 --> 00:12:47,720 Speaker 8: of them are looking at, but they rob us of 250 00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:50,600 Speaker 8: an enormous strength. So, you know, I think this is 251 00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:54,360 Speaker 8: China doing what nations do and what the United States 252 00:12:54,360 --> 00:12:59,360 Speaker 8: should be doing in this escalating confrontation and competition. But 253 00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:03,840 Speaker 8: Donald from decisions in many areas suggest that he doesn't 254 00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:04,679 Speaker 8: quite get it. 255 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:09,319 Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I'll tell you. As we consider the interactions 256 00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 2: of the two biggest economies in the world, we wonder 257 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:17,240 Speaker 2: if it's possible to gauge the status of the biggest economy, 258 00:13:17,280 --> 00:13:19,920 Speaker 2: and that is ours. On this CPI day, Rick Davis, 259 00:13:19,920 --> 00:13:22,079 Speaker 2: we have news from the President of the United States. 260 00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:25,520 Speaker 2: There's a new leader of the BLS Bureau of Labor Statistics, 261 00:13:25,520 --> 00:13:29,440 Speaker 2: remembering he fired the former commissioner about a week ago 262 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 2: on Jobs Day when he did not like the numbers 263 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:35,040 Speaker 2: and he thought that there was some political rigging. I 264 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 2: think the rigged was the word that he used over 265 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:40,080 Speaker 2: and over again. The President has named EJ and Tony 266 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:43,800 Speaker 2: to lead BLS, according to a True Social post, writing 267 00:13:43,840 --> 00:13:47,080 Speaker 2: that he will ensure that the numbers released are honest 268 00:13:47,480 --> 00:13:51,280 Speaker 2: and accurate. Knowing that Antoni has been very vocal about 269 00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 2: his concerns with BLS jobs data and revisions, and we'll 270 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:56,400 Speaker 2: get into some of the things that he has said, Rick, 271 00:13:56,480 --> 00:13:59,480 Speaker 2: but a big part of the conversation in financial circles 272 00:13:59,520 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 2: this morning was can we trust the data? And when 273 00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:04,840 Speaker 2: you're hearing questions like that on Wall Street, does it 274 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:07,199 Speaker 2: mean you've already lost What do you think of this pick? 275 00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 7: Yeah, this was not a pick that you will send 276 00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:15,440 Speaker 7: a message to the Wall Street community that we're going 277 00:14:15,520 --> 00:14:17,960 Speaker 7: to make sure these numbers are accurate, regardless of whether 278 00:14:18,000 --> 00:14:20,520 Speaker 7: they're good or bad. This is a pick that says 279 00:14:20,680 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 7: we'll never have a bad number as long as Donald 280 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:26,280 Speaker 7: Trump is going to be president of the United States, 281 00:14:26,280 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 7: and that's something that Congress is going to have to 282 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:31,040 Speaker 7: really focus on in their confirmation hearing. 283 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:36,400 Speaker 2: So, Genie, let's talk a little bit about what mister 284 00:14:36,480 --> 00:14:40,040 Speaker 2: Antoni has said. His comments from a Fox Business News 285 00:14:40,080 --> 00:14:43,800 Speaker 2: interview are making the rounds today as he suggests that 286 00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:49,400 Speaker 2: it would be wise to pause monthly jobs reports monthly 287 00:14:49,480 --> 00:14:54,360 Speaker 2: jobs readings over accuracy concerns, instead maybe updating the markets 288 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:58,920 Speaker 2: quarterly with jobs data to find more accurate numbers. Is 289 00:14:58,960 --> 00:14:59,840 Speaker 2: that about to happen? 290 00:15:01,800 --> 00:15:05,840 Speaker 8: It absolutely could if indeed he is takes the position 291 00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 8: is confirmed and everything else. The reality is that the 292 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:15,440 Speaker 8: Bureau has problems, and the previous commissioner talked about those. 293 00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:18,840 Speaker 8: Part of those deal with the cuts that they've experienced, 294 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:22,000 Speaker 8: the amount of funding they need to get an accurate count. 295 00:15:22,560 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 8: And this is why if the President was truly concerned 296 00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:28,560 Speaker 8: about the quality of this data, he may not have 297 00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:32,840 Speaker 8: fired her but taken her suggestions and many others seriously. 298 00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:36,120 Speaker 8: But he didn't do that because he doesn't like the data, 299 00:15:36,400 --> 00:15:41,960 Speaker 8: he fires her and appoints the new commissioner. And the 300 00:15:42,040 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 8: reality is is it doesn't make anybody feel safe that 301 00:15:46,640 --> 00:15:49,640 Speaker 8: these numbers that we're going to see are politically neutral. 302 00:15:50,040 --> 00:15:52,880 Speaker 8: And that is a real problem because let's not forget 303 00:15:53,280 --> 00:15:56,640 Speaker 8: states like the United States and all fifty states within 304 00:15:56,720 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 8: it depend on accurate numbers, as do people to make 305 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 8: big decisions. If we can't trust the data are politically neutral, 306 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:07,760 Speaker 8: that is going to make decision making that much harder. 307 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:12,160 Speaker 2: The quote from Fox Business until it's corrected, referring to 308 00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:15,440 Speaker 2: what he sees as corrupt data. The BLS should suspend 309 00:16:15,480 --> 00:16:19,440 Speaker 2: issuing the monthly jobs reports, but keep publishing the more accurate, 310 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:23,200 Speaker 2: though less timely quarterly data. Rick Davis and Genie Shanzy, 311 00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:26,920 Speaker 2: no Bloomberg Politics contributors, thank you for the analysis. Congressman 312 00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:31,880 Speaker 2: Jake Auchincloss of Massachusetts ways in next. Only here on Bloomberg. 313 00:16:33,600 --> 00:16:37,080 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 314 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:40,600 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on Apple, 315 00:16:40,640 --> 00:16:43,680 Speaker 1: Cocklay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. You 316 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:47,160 Speaker 1: can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship 317 00:16:47,240 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 1: New York station. Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty over. 318 00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:55,040 Speaker 2: We've got breaking news. Here's coming from the White House 319 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:57,640 Speaker 2: briefing room. Caroline Levitt is talking to reporters right now. 320 00:16:57,640 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 2: There's a live look for you on Bloomberg TV and 321 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 2: on YouTube. We were just talking about this, the President's 322 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:09,040 Speaker 2: pick to run BLS and his thoughts on what to 323 00:17:09,160 --> 00:17:14,119 Speaker 2: do with the jobs data coming from that agencyj and 324 00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:17,760 Speaker 2: Tony saying this was by the way, before he was 325 00:17:17,840 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 2: named to the job by President Trump, until it is corrected. 326 00:17:22,119 --> 00:17:24,520 Speaker 2: Referring to problems with the data that of course led 327 00:17:24,560 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 2: to the firing of the former BLS commissioner, he says, quote, 328 00:17:28,080 --> 00:17:31,439 Speaker 2: the BLS should suspend issuing the monthly jobs reports, but 329 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:35,960 Speaker 2: keep publishing the more accurate, though less timely, quarterly data. 330 00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:39,120 Speaker 2: He went on to add major decision makers from Wall 331 00:17:39,160 --> 00:17:41,800 Speaker 2: Street to DC rely on these numbers, and a lack 332 00:17:41,840 --> 00:17:45,760 Speaker 2: of confidence the data has far reaching consequences. Well, some 333 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:47,840 Speaker 2: folks do have a lack of confidence in the data, 334 00:17:47,880 --> 00:17:50,480 Speaker 2: which is how we got here. But the White House 335 00:17:50,520 --> 00:17:53,399 Speaker 2: is not about to cancel monthly job reports. This is 336 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:56,879 Speaker 2: the news. Caroline Levett, the Press Secretary, just now telling 337 00:17:56,920 --> 00:18:00,600 Speaker 2: reporters the plan is for BLS to continue to put 338 00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:04,639 Speaker 2: out jobs reports. That part won't change the terminal just 339 00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:09,800 Speaker 2: crossing that headline a moment ago, also headlines coming from Ukraine. 340 00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:12,639 Speaker 2: President Zelenski met with reporters a bit earlier today and 341 00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:16,000 Speaker 2: it's giving us a little bit more information ahead of 342 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,640 Speaker 2: the summit on Friday in Alaska, when President Trump sits 343 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 2: down with Vladimir Putin. This is not going to be easy, 344 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:25,840 Speaker 2: remembering that the idea floated for a truce would include 345 00:18:25,920 --> 00:18:30,000 Speaker 2: freezing lines in place, effectively giving up the eastern part 346 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:33,159 Speaker 2: of Ukraine, the dun Boss and Crimea to Russia. That's 347 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:35,960 Speaker 2: what Vladimir Putin was calling for, not that we even 348 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:40,040 Speaker 2: know that it would be in a final deal. President 349 00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:45,200 Speaker 2: Zelenski sat down with reporters a short time ago saying no, 350 00:18:45,480 --> 00:18:48,280 Speaker 2: he will not withdraw troops from the Dunbas and will 351 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:52,920 Speaker 2: not give the Donetsky and Lahansk regions to Russia if 352 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:57,040 Speaker 2: it means unlocking a ceasefire. Here's the quote for Russians, 353 00:18:57,640 --> 00:19:01,399 Speaker 2: the Dunbas is a bridgehead for a future new offensive. 354 00:19:03,359 --> 00:19:06,560 Speaker 2: Any of territorial issues, he says, cannot be separated from 355 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:11,080 Speaker 2: security guarantees. It's where we start our conversation with Congressman 356 00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:15,359 Speaker 2: Jake Auchincloss, the Democrat from Massachusetts fourth District, is with 357 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:17,920 Speaker 2: us now live on Bloomberg TV and radio. It's great 358 00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 2: to see you, Congressman. As a marine combat veteran, I 359 00:19:21,840 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 2: know you have very strong feelings about this. When you 360 00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:28,080 Speaker 2: hear language like this from President Zelenski, it doesn't sound 361 00:19:28,119 --> 00:19:31,320 Speaker 2: like we are any closer to a deal with Vladimir Putin? 362 00:19:31,400 --> 00:19:33,680 Speaker 2: Why are we hosting him for peace talks this week? 363 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:37,440 Speaker 6: Good afternoon, and good question. 364 00:19:38,119 --> 00:19:41,800 Speaker 9: This public fracture underscores why it has been so critical 365 00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:46,080 Speaker 9: for NATO and Ukraine to collectively define victory in the 366 00:19:46,119 --> 00:19:50,760 Speaker 9: public imagination as well as, most importantly in the Ukrainian imagination. 367 00:19:50,880 --> 00:19:52,520 Speaker 9: And I've been saying this for two years. I said 368 00:19:52,520 --> 00:19:54,080 Speaker 9: it to Joe Biden, I'm saying it to Donald Trump. 369 00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:58,280 Speaker 9: So it's not partisan, it's policy. We need to define victory, 370 00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:02,600 Speaker 9: and that's three things. One secure eastern border, two its 371 00:20:02,680 --> 00:20:06,120 Speaker 9: freedom of navigation in the Black Sea, and three it's 372 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:10,399 Speaker 9: Ukrainian accession to the European Union. You deliver those three things, 373 00:20:10,520 --> 00:20:14,440 Speaker 9: you have a sovereign, prosperous, democratic Ukraine. 374 00:20:14,760 --> 00:20:15,560 Speaker 6: That's a victory. 375 00:20:16,920 --> 00:20:19,639 Speaker 2: Okay, does that sound like something that President Trump can 376 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:21,359 Speaker 2: accomplish on Friday. 377 00:20:21,720 --> 00:20:25,960 Speaker 9: No, what he could accomplish on Friday would be to 378 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:29,720 Speaker 9: issue an ultimatum to Vladimir Putin that Putin must release 379 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:35,119 Speaker 9: the kidnap Ukrainian children as a good faith beginning to negotiations. 380 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:40,440 Speaker 9: There will be no deal in this summit, but Vladimir 381 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:43,320 Speaker 9: Putin's release of Ukrainian children who have been kidnapped and 382 00:20:43,400 --> 00:20:47,760 Speaker 9: held in captivity, held under false premises, would I think 383 00:20:48,119 --> 00:20:51,160 Speaker 9: be a good faith marker towards what could be productive 384 00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:53,320 Speaker 9: negotiations around that definition of victory. 385 00:20:54,359 --> 00:20:55,840 Speaker 2: Well, there a been a lot of questions about why 386 00:20:55,960 --> 00:21:00,159 Speaker 2: were the host nation here, beyond why these talks or 387 00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:02,800 Speaker 2: even happening at all. Even in the pursuit of peace, 388 00:21:02,840 --> 00:21:07,160 Speaker 2: typically there are agreements that are made, there's a framework 389 00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:10,120 Speaker 2: before the two leaders sit down at the table, so 390 00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:13,840 Speaker 2: you don't have any major surprises. The idea of having 391 00:21:13,920 --> 00:21:18,080 Speaker 2: Vladimir Putin on American soil, presumably, and you can tell 392 00:21:18,119 --> 00:21:21,200 Speaker 2: me if you know differently on an American military base. 393 00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:23,160 Speaker 2: This is going to be somewhere in Alaska. I don't 394 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 2: know what the facility will be. Has been compared with 395 00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:28,879 Speaker 2: for instance, yourself having served in Afghanistan where you let 396 00:21:28,920 --> 00:21:36,080 Speaker 2: an infantry patrol, almost like George W. Bush hosting Osama 397 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 2: bin Laden for peace talks. Am I going too far 398 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:41,080 Speaker 2: with this, Congressman? How do you see it? 399 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,480 Speaker 9: You're addressing what is Donald Trump's approach to most foreign 400 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:51,480 Speaker 9: policy issues, which is that he's all showhorse, no workhorse. 401 00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:53,080 Speaker 6: He doesn't want to actually do the. 402 00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:57,520 Speaker 9: Hard work of mid level and high level negotiations between 403 00:21:57,520 --> 00:22:03,160 Speaker 9: officials that would a principles level meeting between the presidents. 404 00:22:03,320 --> 00:22:05,080 Speaker 9: He doesn't want to do that work. He wants a 405 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:07,680 Speaker 9: photo op. He wants to wine and dine in Vladimir 406 00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:10,760 Speaker 9: Putin because he has always sought Vladimir Putin's approval. It's 407 00:22:10,760 --> 00:22:14,119 Speaker 9: like this weird fanboy thing that he has, and nothing's 408 00:22:14,119 --> 00:22:16,439 Speaker 9: going to come of it, and it's going to further 409 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:19,800 Speaker 9: a road America's geopolitical standing when we need to be 410 00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:24,840 Speaker 9: spending that political capital on appropriating Russian frozen assets and 411 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:27,920 Speaker 9: Brussels and taking that three hundred billion euros and sending 412 00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:30,879 Speaker 9: it to Ukraine to strengthen their military industrial complex, On 413 00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:34,520 Speaker 9: getting Ukraine to join the European Union's Lisbon Treaties, collective 414 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:37,960 Speaker 9: defense article, on authorizing Ukraine to use long range missiles 415 00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:43,000 Speaker 9: to strike Russia, on tightening oil price caps on Russian exports, 416 00:22:43,040 --> 00:22:46,160 Speaker 9: all of these things that are geopolitically. 417 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 6: Achievable but intensive. 418 00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:50,640 Speaker 9: Those are the hard work that Donald Trump is not 419 00:22:50,800 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 9: doing that could have actually made a summit productive. Instead, 420 00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:58,120 Speaker 9: it's going to be, you know, yet another sizzle without 421 00:22:58,160 --> 00:23:00,120 Speaker 9: the staked. 422 00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:02,200 Speaker 2: At one point of I think want to invite or 423 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:05,920 Speaker 2: suggested inviting the Taliban to Camp David. What should be 424 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 2: the parameters then for this meeting? Should it be on 425 00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:11,520 Speaker 2: a military base. Should these guys put two chairs out 426 00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:13,439 Speaker 2: on the runway and talk this out? Because if it's 427 00:23:13,800 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 2: nothing more than a photo op, why should he enjoy 428 00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:19,840 Speaker 2: the hospitality of the United States. 429 00:23:20,359 --> 00:23:23,640 Speaker 9: Yeah, I'm not a protocol officer. I'm not getting into 430 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:28,360 Speaker 9: the details on that because it doesn't matter because it's 431 00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:30,639 Speaker 9: not going to actually achieve the outcomes that we want. 432 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:35,240 Speaker 9: The outcome that I want from this poorly conceived summit, 433 00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:39,080 Speaker 9: the only achievable outcome here would be an ultimatum about 434 00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:42,280 Speaker 9: releasing the kidnapped Ukrainian children as a beginning, not as 435 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,679 Speaker 9: a conclusion to negotiations. 436 00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:47,520 Speaker 2: Okay, that's a good answer. Congressman, I'd like to ask you, 437 00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:50,200 Speaker 2: as a former member of the House China Select Committee, 438 00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:52,639 Speaker 2: about some of the headlines we've been hearing about trade 439 00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:56,119 Speaker 2: with China. The President has allowed another ninety days for 440 00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:59,680 Speaker 2: talks to continue and has now made an arrangement within 441 00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:03,200 Speaker 2: and AMD, two of the most important American companies, never 442 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:07,400 Speaker 2: mind important chip makers, to give fifteen percent of their 443 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:10,520 Speaker 2: sales of AI chips to China to the US government. 444 00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:13,600 Speaker 2: It's been called unprecedented. I don't know if you see 445 00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:15,320 Speaker 2: it that way. I don't know where the money is going. 446 00:24:15,359 --> 00:24:17,280 Speaker 2: We haven't heard that either, But is that the cost 447 00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:18,040 Speaker 2: of doing business? 448 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:25,119 Speaker 9: My one question is how many Trump meme coins does 449 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:29,439 Speaker 9: in Video's senior leadership own, because that kind of deal 450 00:24:29,760 --> 00:24:34,320 Speaker 9: is so grotesquely inappropriate and contrary one to the interest 451 00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:37,639 Speaker 9: of Nvidia and two to American interests that I just 452 00:24:37,720 --> 00:24:40,160 Speaker 9: have to question whether they're buying Trump coins on the side, 453 00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:43,320 Speaker 9: because we know that the Trump coin allows foreign policy 454 00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:47,840 Speaker 9: excuse me, foreign officials and senior executives at corporations to 455 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:52,119 Speaker 9: buy influence with the president anonymously but securely. And I 456 00:24:52,240 --> 00:24:54,560 Speaker 9: question whether they bought those Trump coins because this deal 457 00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:58,639 Speaker 9: is hugely inappropriate. It basically makes the federal government a 458 00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:02,720 Speaker 9: co partner in helping China leap progress on AI. 459 00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:08,560 Speaker 2: Wow. You could also suggest that the government is now 460 00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:11,480 Speaker 2: going to be invested in the chip industry. And you 461 00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:14,879 Speaker 2: could also ask shareholders who bought stock in companies like 462 00:25:15,200 --> 00:25:18,680 Speaker 2: in Vidia and AMD if they're comfortable with the government 463 00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:21,159 Speaker 2: getting fifteen percent of the revenue that they may have 464 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:24,440 Speaker 2: factored into the stock price. Congressman, will there be oversight 465 00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:25,359 Speaker 2: from Congress here? 466 00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:26,959 Speaker 6: There should be. 467 00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:30,080 Speaker 9: Republicans will say one thing in private and do nothing 468 00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:33,560 Speaker 9: in public, as is their norm, because this, as I said, 469 00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:37,320 Speaker 9: is one I think a violation of Nvidia's piduciary responsibility 470 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:41,800 Speaker 9: to shareholders, but also grossly inappropriate for the American public. 471 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:45,800 Speaker 9: Why would we be helping to equip China to surpass 472 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:48,200 Speaker 9: us in AI. We did the Chips Act, We made 473 00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:50,760 Speaker 9: investments in the semiconductor industry which I voted for, which 474 00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:54,600 Speaker 9: was bipartisan, precisely so that we would have the lead. 475 00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:58,960 Speaker 9: And this deal makes me shudder to consider what a 476 00:25:59,000 --> 00:26:02,239 Speaker 9: TikTok deal look like, what an ultimate tariff deal might 477 00:26:02,359 --> 00:26:06,720 Speaker 9: look like. And again, orbiting around these considerations is who 478 00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 9: is buying the Trump coin this is the central issue 479 00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:14,440 Speaker 9: of corruption of his first year in office. More than 480 00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:16,399 Speaker 9: half of his net worth is tied up in this coin. 481 00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:18,560 Speaker 9: We have no idea who owns it. The people who 482 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:20,840 Speaker 9: showed up at the White House for this crypto dinner, 483 00:26:20,880 --> 00:26:22,440 Speaker 9: those are just the ones who want to be seen. 484 00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:26,240 Speaker 9: The Kataris, the Turks, the Venezuelans, the Chinese. They probably 485 00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:29,200 Speaker 9: didn't want to be seen. We don't know who's bought him. 486 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:31,359 Speaker 2: Okay, you've brought this up a couple times, and this 487 00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:33,240 Speaker 2: is serious, Congressman, how do you find out? 488 00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:38,600 Speaker 9: Well, Senator Warren and I have asked both the sec 489 00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:40,480 Speaker 9: and the Treasury to investigate. 490 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:40,840 Speaker 6: They're not. 491 00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:44,639 Speaker 9: Ultimately, this is going to have to be when Democrats 492 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:46,800 Speaker 9: take back control of the House and hopefully the Senate, 493 00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:51,480 Speaker 9: and we can do subpoenas and investigations without having to 494 00:26:51,600 --> 00:26:55,160 Speaker 9: be obstructed by the cowardice of Congressional Republicans because Congression 495 00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:57,720 Speaker 9: Republicans have made clear that they're courtiers, they're not members 496 00:26:57,720 --> 00:26:59,560 Speaker 9: of Congress, and they don't want to hold them to 497 00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:02,840 Speaker 9: account for what is the most grotesque example of corruption 498 00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:06,399 Speaker 9: that this president has yet exhibited. It And I understand 499 00:27:06,440 --> 00:27:08,240 Speaker 9: how high of a bar that is, but I'm standing 500 00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:08,600 Speaker 9: by it. 501 00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:12,639 Speaker 2: Wow. So if Democrats take the House, prepare for an 502 00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:17,000 Speaker 2: investigation into the Trump coin. I think is what we've learned. Congressman, 503 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:18,920 Speaker 2: we've got a minute left. Do you expect to deal 504 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:21,080 Speaker 2: with China? We've got another ninety days? Is that enough 505 00:27:21,080 --> 00:27:21,439 Speaker 2: to do it? 506 00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:24,520 Speaker 6: I doubt it in ninety days. 507 00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:26,840 Speaker 9: Let me say one thing more to the point though, 508 00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:29,800 Speaker 9: about this back and forth with China. What he has 509 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:32,840 Speaker 9: done is he has bundled in fentanyl, tariffs, TikTok into 510 00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:37,680 Speaker 9: one giant, sort of performative set of negotiations. It's a mistake. 511 00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:41,480 Speaker 9: There is bipartisan supporting Congress and legislation that I've helped 512 00:27:41,560 --> 00:27:45,480 Speaker 9: draft with Republicans on getting much tougher on China for fentanyl. 513 00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,520 Speaker 9: China exports about ninety eight percent of fentinal precursors. 514 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:50,600 Speaker 6: That issue needs to be addressed. 515 00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:54,080 Speaker 9: Right now on its own merits, because it's unacceptable that 516 00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:57,360 Speaker 9: China is directing state sponsored poisoning of the American public 517 00:27:57,600 --> 00:28:00,840 Speaker 9: seventy thousand deaths every year from opioid overdose. Tackle that 518 00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:03,560 Speaker 9: don't tie it into TikTok and tariffs. 519 00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 2: I was great to spend some time with you Congressman, 520 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:08,480 Speaker 2: and I appreciate it. I hope your summer's going well. 521 00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:12,720 Speaker 2: Jake Auchincloss, the Democrat from Massachusetts, we'll talk to Republican 522 00:28:12,800 --> 00:28:14,720 Speaker 2: Tim Burchett of Tennessee. Coming up. You don't want to 523 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:22,200 Speaker 2: leave right here on Bloomberg TV and Radio. 524 00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:24,040 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Balance of Power podcast. Catch 525 00:28:24,119 --> 00:28:27,119 Speaker 1: us live weekdays at noon and five pm Eastern on 526 00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 1: Almalcarklay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. Listen 527 00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:34,159 Speaker 1: on demand wherever you get your podcasts, or watch us 528 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:35,600 Speaker 1: live on YouTube. 529 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:39,000 Speaker 2: I'm glad you're with us here on the Tuesday edition. 530 00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:43,280 Speaker 2: Our conversation with Congressman Tim Burchett, the Republican from Tennessee, 531 00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:45,520 Speaker 2: will be with us in just a moment, as we 532 00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:47,840 Speaker 2: begin here on the cover of the new business week 533 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 2: magazine Bloomberg Business Week with the Scott Besant coin and 534 00:28:52,760 --> 00:28:55,640 Speaker 2: the author of this wonderful piece that looks behind the 535 00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:57,600 Speaker 2: scenes at the Treasury Department. It gives us a little 536 00:28:57,600 --> 00:28:59,360 Speaker 2: bit more of an idea of what makes Scott Besent 537 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 2: tick when it comes to policy. When it comes to 538 00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:04,760 Speaker 2: his view of the economy, Dan Flatley and Eric Shatzker 539 00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:07,480 Speaker 2: share the byline, and Dan's with us right now here 540 00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:11,040 Speaker 2: in Washington, d C. Congrats again on this great piece. 541 00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:15,200 Speaker 2: I wonder if you learn much about Scott Besson the man, 542 00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:18,120 Speaker 2: because this is someone we see a lot, a lot 543 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,960 Speaker 2: more than Treasury secretaries. When you think of Janet Yellen 544 00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:23,920 Speaker 2: or recent folks who've had that job, maybe a little 545 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:27,600 Speaker 2: bit different for Tim Geitner. You go on TV maybe 546 00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:30,000 Speaker 2: every six to nine months or something like that. Scott 547 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:33,440 Speaker 2: Bessen is out there day after day telegraphing to the markets, 548 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:37,920 Speaker 2: taking complex questions on trade. Is that just the cadence 549 00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:41,000 Speaker 2: of this White House or is that the man who 550 00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:43,040 Speaker 2: you got to spend so much time with. Yeah, it's 551 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:43,560 Speaker 2: a good question. 552 00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:46,200 Speaker 10: I mean it is interesting. I mean he told us 553 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:50,280 Speaker 10: that he was very private before he decided to get 554 00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:55,600 Speaker 10: into politics, and you know he didn't really He followed 555 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,280 Speaker 10: the news and he was very and he's known, I think, 556 00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:01,720 Speaker 10: to be a voracious reader, both the big Biogy. We 557 00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:04,120 Speaker 10: talked to somebody who said, you know, I went into 558 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:05,920 Speaker 10: his office to talk to him about something and I 559 00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 10: left with a you know, a brick about Charles de Gaull. 560 00:30:10,120 --> 00:30:11,920 Speaker 10: So you know, he he reads a lot, he pays 561 00:30:11,960 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 10: attention to the media. Obviously, for the Trump administration, TV 562 00:30:16,080 --> 00:30:19,840 Speaker 10: and media appearances are very important, right. I think he's 563 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:23,640 Speaker 10: merged kind of as a spokesperson in many respects for 564 00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:25,960 Speaker 10: a lot of the economic policies that the Trump administration 565 00:30:26,040 --> 00:30:28,920 Speaker 10: is undertaking, and he plays that role very well, and 566 00:30:28,960 --> 00:30:32,000 Speaker 10: I think it's one that he relishes quite frankly, but 567 00:30:32,120 --> 00:30:34,840 Speaker 10: it is somewhat at odds because when you talk to 568 00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:37,160 Speaker 10: him in person, he's a little bit more sort of 569 00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:43,560 Speaker 10: I wouldn't say he's just reserved, a bit, a bit reserved, very. 570 00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:44,560 Speaker 2: Gentlemanly, courtly. 571 00:30:45,480 --> 00:30:48,920 Speaker 10: He's not really a bombastic personality, but he does go 572 00:30:48,960 --> 00:30:51,400 Speaker 10: on TV a lot, and you know, we talked a 573 00:30:51,480 --> 00:30:54,080 Speaker 10: little bit about that, and it was interesting because one 574 00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:56,200 Speaker 10: of the things that he told us in our interview, 575 00:30:56,200 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 10: which which unfortunately didn't make it into the piece just 576 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:00,560 Speaker 10: because there was enough space for it, but he does 577 00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:02,800 Speaker 10: say that he knows he has to be very careful 578 00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:06,720 Speaker 10: about what he says on TV, and he really worries about. 579 00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:08,680 Speaker 2: The audience of one. Yeah, I think it's audio. 580 00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:13,040 Speaker 10: You know, he's obviously wants to speak to the president's priorities, 581 00:31:13,080 --> 00:31:15,200 Speaker 10: and when we know that Trump, you know, watches TV, 582 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:18,320 Speaker 10: but also he wants to be careful that. You know, 583 00:31:18,400 --> 00:31:21,000 Speaker 10: if he says I think the FED should there should 584 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:22,600 Speaker 10: be an investigation at the FED, well, what does he 585 00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:25,800 Speaker 10: actually mean by that? It's you know, what he says, 586 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,440 Speaker 10: he meant is that the FED should do an internal 587 00:31:28,480 --> 00:31:31,280 Speaker 10: review of its non monetary policies. What he said on 588 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:33,880 Speaker 10: TV a few days before that was a little bit 589 00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:37,600 Speaker 10: more open to interpretation and was reported in various places 590 00:31:37,640 --> 00:31:39,640 Speaker 10: that he was calling for an investigation of the FED. 591 00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:43,640 Speaker 10: So he obviously thinks a lot about that. But what 592 00:31:43,720 --> 00:31:45,560 Speaker 10: he says is that, you know, we talked a little 593 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:47,280 Speaker 10: bit about this earlier, Joe, is that he gives the 594 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:51,320 Speaker 10: president options and outcomes and he manages the narrative. So 595 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:53,400 Speaker 10: it's part of his role. And the President has called 596 00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:56,240 Speaker 10: him soothing and said he's doing a great job this stuff. 597 00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:57,680 Speaker 10: But it's part of his role, and I think he 598 00:31:58,120 --> 00:32:01,120 Speaker 10: views it as part of his job to talk his book, 599 00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:02,000 Speaker 10: talk the president's book. 600 00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:04,400 Speaker 2: Yes, that's what he does. Well, it's fascinating and I 601 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:06,760 Speaker 2: want to point everyone to the terminal into Bloomberg Business 602 00:32:06,800 --> 00:32:10,480 Speaker 2: Week Scott Beston on Terriff's deficits and Trump's economic plan. 603 00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:14,040 Speaker 2: Dan and Eric spent hours with him in an exclusive conversation. 604 00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:17,120 Speaker 2: You'll probably learn a lot from that. Bloomberg Business Week. 605 00:32:17,120 --> 00:32:19,880 Speaker 2: Many thanks, Dan Flantley, as always now covering the Treasury 606 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,080 Speaker 2: for us here in Washington. I'm Joe Matthew I and 607 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:24,600 Speaker 2: glad you're with us on the Tuesday edition of Balance 608 00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:27,040 Speaker 2: of Power. With a lot to talk about here today, 609 00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:31,480 Speaker 2: as members of Congress enjoy their August recess, there's still 610 00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:33,680 Speaker 2: a lot of news here in the nation's capital that 611 00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:35,920 Speaker 2: we want to talk to Tim Burchett about, and he's 612 00:32:35,920 --> 00:32:39,840 Speaker 2: with us right now, the Republican representing Tennessee's second District, 613 00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:44,240 Speaker 2: live on Bloomberg TV and Radio. Congressman, it's great to 614 00:32:44,280 --> 00:32:46,800 Speaker 2: have you welcome. I know that you had a bit 615 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,920 Speaker 2: of an injury involving a horse a couple of weeks ago, 616 00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:51,760 Speaker 2: and I want to start by wishing you well. How's 617 00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:52,360 Speaker 2: the recovery. 618 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:56,360 Speaker 11: Well, it only hurts when I'm buried. My heart beats. 619 00:32:56,480 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 12: I'll laugh or anything if I have to cut off, 620 00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:03,080 Speaker 12: because I don't want y'all to see me cry. 621 00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:06,960 Speaker 2: Oh God, I hope that means it's going well. Congressman, you, 622 00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:09,280 Speaker 2: of course serve on the Foreign Affairs Committee, and I'd 623 00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:11,880 Speaker 2: like to start there with you at the beginning of 624 00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:14,360 Speaker 2: what's going to be a very important week for geopolitics. 625 00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:15,920 Speaker 2: The President is going to be sitting down, as you 626 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:19,080 Speaker 2: well know, on Friday, with Vladimir Putin in Alaska talking 627 00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:22,360 Speaker 2: about the war in Ukraine. Should the United States be 628 00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:26,000 Speaker 2: the host nation for someone that many see as a 629 00:33:26,080 --> 00:33:27,680 Speaker 2: pariah on the world stage. 630 00:33:27,800 --> 00:33:30,960 Speaker 11: Yeah, he's a third world today. He's a thug. 631 00:33:31,320 --> 00:33:35,560 Speaker 12: You know, the GDP of Russia is somewhere between France 632 00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:38,880 Speaker 12: and Canada. You know, everybody knows his history. But we 633 00:33:39,000 --> 00:33:41,080 Speaker 12: got to get him to the table. And I think 634 00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:45,120 Speaker 12: that I've been with Trump President Trump many times, and 635 00:33:45,200 --> 00:33:48,720 Speaker 12: nothing is by accident. And it's no accident that he's 636 00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:52,120 Speaker 12: in Alaska, some of the largest ore reserves, and I 637 00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:55,480 Speaker 12: believe that's part of his mission in this is to 638 00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:58,760 Speaker 12: tell Russia, y'all your playball are going to shut y'all 639 00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:03,120 Speaker 12: down and with the energy, because we'll have the capabilities 640 00:34:03,120 --> 00:34:07,280 Speaker 12: of fluctuating markets and doing those things. And I'd rather 641 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:09,919 Speaker 12: that than boys and girl American boys and girls down 642 00:34:11,080 --> 00:34:13,480 Speaker 12: in a far away land that most members of Congress, 643 00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,600 Speaker 12: although some of them are profiting from that. Literally the 644 00:34:16,640 --> 00:34:21,160 Speaker 12: war pimps and others. But I would rather them have 645 00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:24,200 Speaker 12: that discussion of whether it be an economic situation instead 646 00:34:24,239 --> 00:34:26,240 Speaker 12: of American boys and girls lives in their. 647 00:34:26,160 --> 00:34:33,800 Speaker 2: Life understood with that, says, should we lower our expectations 648 00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:37,040 Speaker 2: on what happens Friday? Do you expect a deal of 649 00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:39,960 Speaker 2: truce to come from this? The President says he's looking 650 00:34:40,000 --> 00:34:42,960 Speaker 2: to feel him out, and from what we're understanding from 651 00:34:43,360 --> 00:34:45,880 Speaker 2: President Zelensky in Ukraine, he's not willing to give up 652 00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:48,120 Speaker 2: any land now, and. 653 00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:52,680 Speaker 12: I understand that, but there's eventually though, America is going 654 00:34:52,680 --> 00:34:53,200 Speaker 12: to get tired. 655 00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:55,160 Speaker 11: We've got over two hundred billion dollars. You know. 656 00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:58,799 Speaker 12: Zelensky's made some comment about not sure where all the 657 00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:01,959 Speaker 12: money went, half the money win or whatever. So there's 658 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,560 Speaker 12: America's growing tired of the world's growing tired of it. 659 00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:09,440 Speaker 12: I'm tired of seeing Russians send mercenaries into another country. 660 00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:12,160 Speaker 12: I'm tired of seeing people snatched off the street Ukraine 661 00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:13,719 Speaker 12: to go fight in this war. 662 00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:15,560 Speaker 11: It needs to be put to. 663 00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:18,640 Speaker 12: An end, and we're going really tired of it, and 664 00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,160 Speaker 12: it's just not happening. And and I have a theory 665 00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:23,879 Speaker 12: about this, A fary of it in America and everywhere else. 666 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:26,239 Speaker 11: People sometimes in leadership. 667 00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:28,239 Speaker 12: You see it in the Middle East some too, they 668 00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:32,000 Speaker 12: really don't want peace because if they have peace, then 669 00:35:32,040 --> 00:35:34,480 Speaker 12: they're not in control. They're not going to be the leaders. 670 00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:38,600 Speaker 12: And we always have these wartime people, then we throw 671 00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:42,440 Speaker 12: them out. Case in point in history, Winston Churchhill literally 672 00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:45,520 Speaker 12: saved the world, saved the world. America got involved, course, 673 00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:51,040 Speaker 12: but he was the iron peg out there holding Europe together. 674 00:35:51,480 --> 00:35:54,640 Speaker 12: And then what happened just shortly after the war was over, 675 00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,919 Speaker 12: they voted him out of office. So you know, there's 676 00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:03,680 Speaker 12: a lot going on. Honestly, sir, financially, a lot of people, 677 00:36:04,360 --> 00:36:08,920 Speaker 12: k Street lobbyist, members of Congress, people's portfolios are profiting 678 00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:11,440 Speaker 12: from this. Case in point, we sent our missile defense 679 00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:17,600 Speaker 12: system to Ukraine. We automatically replenished oars and a no bid, 680 00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:21,680 Speaker 12: multi billion dollar contract. Members of Congress on both sides 681 00:36:21,719 --> 00:36:23,560 Speaker 12: of the aisle of what I understand, some of them 682 00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:26,520 Speaker 12: bought that stock up to two weeks prior to Joe 683 00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 12: Biden issue in that executive order. And it's not on Biden, 684 00:36:30,680 --> 00:36:33,440 Speaker 12: it's on members of Congress that they profited from that 685 00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:37,160 Speaker 12: because they owned stock in those companies. There's a lot 686 00:36:37,200 --> 00:36:39,919 Speaker 12: going on behind the scenes, and it makes me sit 687 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:42,719 Speaker 12: to my core of it that young people and old 688 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:45,920 Speaker 12: people too are dying and people are profiting from it. 689 00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:48,799 Speaker 2: Well, listen, I hear you, and I this is why 690 00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:52,839 Speaker 2: there's a conversation about stopping insider trading on Capitol Hill, 691 00:36:52,840 --> 00:36:55,879 Speaker 2: which we could have a whole other conversation about here. 692 00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:58,279 Speaker 2: I guess when it comes to Russia in Ukraine, though, 693 00:36:58,280 --> 00:36:59,920 Speaker 2: do you worry that Russia is about to be real 694 00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:01,640 Speaker 2: awarded for its behavior? 695 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:06,920 Speaker 12: I do, I do, But I think President Trump is 696 00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:09,759 Speaker 12: a good deal maker. People don't like him. They like 697 00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:12,080 Speaker 12: him in my district. They like him in Tennessee. You know, 698 00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:14,000 Speaker 12: they said, oh, you're not going to get that big, 699 00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:16,160 Speaker 12: beautiful bill out. I was one of those that thought 700 00:37:16,200 --> 00:37:17,880 Speaker 12: it was a little bigger and a little more beautiful 701 00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:20,200 Speaker 12: than I thought it needed to be. I was the 702 00:37:20,239 --> 00:37:23,600 Speaker 12: only non Freedom Caucus member in the Roosevelt Room meeting 703 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:26,600 Speaker 12: with President Trump. I was sitting two seats away from him. 704 00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:28,560 Speaker 12: And you know, he went around that room and answered 705 00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:30,640 Speaker 12: every dad gam question. When he didn't know the answer, 706 00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:32,640 Speaker 12: He had jd Vance there to answer a question. He 707 00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:35,600 Speaker 12: had his economic guy, he had his military people hit 708 00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:37,800 Speaker 12: some people behind him, and he called on them to 709 00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:39,880 Speaker 12: answer the question. Something you don't see a lot in 710 00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:42,400 Speaker 12: the media. He didn't cost us, he didn't belittle us. 711 00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:45,640 Speaker 12: Two hours he took with us, answered every Dad Gham question. 712 00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:48,200 Speaker 12: And you know what, fourth of July he was signing 713 00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:50,840 Speaker 12: that bill. The other one, of course, that recent memory. 714 00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:55,239 Speaker 12: My friend Senator Hagerty out of Tennessee, he had the 715 00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:58,319 Speaker 12: cryptocurrency bill and he called me and said, Tim, you know, 716 00:37:58,560 --> 00:38:00,600 Speaker 12: we're trying to get this thing doneished out and get 717 00:38:00,680 --> 00:38:02,960 Speaker 12: on the floor, get it to the president by Friday. 718 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:06,120 Speaker 12: You think there's any chance, And I said, I have 719 00:38:06,239 --> 00:38:08,080 Speaker 12: no doubt there's a chance. I sitting in a room, 720 00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:11,160 Speaker 12: I'm sitting right next to Whip Emmer between Speaker Johnson, 721 00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:13,200 Speaker 12: and we were talking about it. 722 00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:14,400 Speaker 11: We had some questions. 723 00:38:14,760 --> 00:38:18,080 Speaker 12: I fear crypto, I fear all this AI stuff and everything. 724 00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:19,560 Speaker 12: I fear that you got a bunch of men and 725 00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:21,880 Speaker 12: women that still listen to eight track tape players are 726 00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:24,920 Speaker 12: going to be regulating something they don't have any idea 727 00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:27,000 Speaker 12: what it's about. And the Chinese get ahead of us, 728 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:32,759 Speaker 12: and sure enough President Trump called started answering questions. 729 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:35,319 Speaker 11: Around the room, and he did it fascinating and it 730 00:38:35,360 --> 00:38:37,520 Speaker 11: was guess what it was on his desk by Friday. 731 00:38:37,600 --> 00:38:41,000 Speaker 12: So you want to discount somebody, discount Tim Burchett, But 732 00:38:41,080 --> 00:38:43,920 Speaker 12: don't discount Donald J. Trump, because that guy's a deal maker. 733 00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:47,040 Speaker 12: I don't know, you know, heck he if he can 734 00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:49,440 Speaker 12: handle the teamsters in New York City, I think he 735 00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:51,400 Speaker 12: can handle Vladimir Putting easily. 736 00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:54,880 Speaker 2: Well. I look, I love the story bringing us in 737 00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:56,680 Speaker 2: the room, Congressman, and I know that you're close to 738 00:38:56,719 --> 00:38:59,040 Speaker 2: the president and you support him and that you respect him. 739 00:38:59,040 --> 00:39:02,239 Speaker 2: You've also been very spoken in your efforts to have 740 00:39:02,360 --> 00:39:05,080 Speaker 2: the Jeffrey Epstein files released, and this is something that 741 00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:08,440 Speaker 2: you'll take back up. I presume when members return to Washington. 742 00:39:08,440 --> 00:39:11,160 Speaker 2: There's been a lot of promises from the administration in 743 00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:14,320 Speaker 2: different forms and from different people about releasing this information. 744 00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:17,600 Speaker 2: Do you worry about what it means that it has 745 00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:18,399 Speaker 2: not come out yet? 746 00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:22,840 Speaker 12: I worry that it went four years under the previous administration. 747 00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:25,080 Speaker 12: I'm not worried about Trump being on it, because, let's 748 00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:27,719 Speaker 12: be honest, if Trump is on that thing, Biden want 749 00:39:27,760 --> 00:39:28,759 Speaker 12: to put that stuff out. 750 00:39:29,640 --> 00:39:30,719 Speaker 11: Here's my first. 751 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:33,879 Speaker 12: Worry, my first worry of the thousand young girls who 752 00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:36,080 Speaker 12: are now adults. Some of them have probably taken their 753 00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:38,480 Speaker 12: own life. That are in there, the innocent ones that 754 00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:41,799 Speaker 12: were violated by these dark bags, and anybody that did 755 00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:44,200 Speaker 12: that to a kid. I hope they're going to be 756 00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:46,920 Speaker 12: I'd like to arrange for their meeting in hell pretty quick. 757 00:39:47,239 --> 00:39:47,439 Speaker 11: Look. 758 00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:49,720 Speaker 12: I passed some of the toughest laws in the country 759 00:39:49,760 --> 00:39:53,080 Speaker 12: ikak internet crimes against children. I passed a death penalty form. 760 00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:56,840 Speaker 12: It was really unconstitutional for these child molesters. Then the 761 00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:59,759 Speaker 12: state legislature brought it up basically the same bail, different 762 00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:03,200 Speaker 12: cour It's constitutional. I even had a chemical carastration bill. 763 00:40:03,520 --> 00:40:05,960 Speaker 12: Everybody flipped out over it, but it turns out it's 764 00:40:06,000 --> 00:40:10,320 Speaker 12: probably makes a lot of sense. I've held the hands 765 00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:13,440 Speaker 12: of people that have been molested. Look, I'm a Christian, 766 00:40:13,440 --> 00:40:15,280 Speaker 12: I'm not a very good one. The Bible talks about 767 00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:17,360 Speaker 12: how you treat the least amongst you, and on my 768 00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:20,239 Speaker 12: judgment day, when God asked how did you treat the 769 00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:22,320 Speaker 12: least amongst you, will say, Dad, youam I did everything 770 00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:25,560 Speaker 12: I could Lord. Because we've got to get to this thing. 771 00:40:25,719 --> 00:40:28,200 Speaker 12: We've got to nail these people to the wall. We've 772 00:40:28,239 --> 00:40:31,160 Speaker 12: got to eliminate this and the number one the number 773 00:40:31,200 --> 00:40:33,919 Speaker 12: one country in the world for bringing in child porn 774 00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:34,680 Speaker 12: and all this stuff. 775 00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:36,120 Speaker 11: United States of America. 776 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:39,120 Speaker 12: We've got to clean our act up, brother, and I'm 777 00:40:39,200 --> 00:40:41,680 Speaker 12: sick about it. We'll go after it. I don't think 778 00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:44,120 Speaker 12: I'm not worried about President Trump being on it. Look, 779 00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:50,520 Speaker 12: he banned Epstein fifteen years ago from Mary Lago and I, 780 00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:53,600 Speaker 12: you know, and before he was suicided. I don't think 781 00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:57,360 Speaker 12: he committed suicide. I think somebody took him out somehow. 782 00:40:57,400 --> 00:41:00,640 Speaker 12: But that's just me so sorry, I talk too much. 783 00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:03,360 Speaker 12: I'm emotional about that issue. That's a huge issue for me. 784 00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:05,839 Speaker 2: Well, I do you don't listen that you just said 785 00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:08,839 Speaker 2: a lot? Congressmen, we only have a minute left. Are 786 00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,520 Speaker 2: you concerned that Glene Maxwell will be pardoned? 787 00:41:13,120 --> 00:41:16,719 Speaker 12: No, No, I'm not. I don't think that's it. I 788 00:41:16,760 --> 00:41:19,520 Speaker 12: don't think that's gonna happen. I just can't see that. 789 00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:21,759 Speaker 12: That's why I asked a subpoena. Caused a lot of 790 00:41:22,239 --> 00:41:25,560 Speaker 12: heart feelings. But yeah, I think we need to get 791 00:41:25,560 --> 00:41:28,480 Speaker 12: her in. She might lie, she might not, she's proven lies. 792 00:41:28,600 --> 00:41:31,400 Speaker 12: She'll go back to prison for a full time. 793 00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:34,640 Speaker 2: Let's talk when you get back to town because I 794 00:41:34,640 --> 00:41:37,560 Speaker 2: know this story isn't going away. Tim Burchett, Tennessee's second 795 00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:40,680 Speaker 2: District Republican Congressman, thank you, as always for joining us 796 00:41:40,719 --> 00:41:43,160 Speaker 2: on Bloomberg TV and Radio. A lot to think about 797 00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:47,960 Speaker 2: there following our conversations with Congressman Burchett and Congressman Awkin class. 798 00:41:52,840 --> 00:41:56,040 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Balance of Power podcast. Make 799 00:41:56,080 --> 00:41:59,000 Speaker 2: sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 800 00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:01,880 Speaker 2: or wherever you get yours, and you can find us 801 00:42:01,920 --> 00:42:05,440 Speaker 2: live every weekday from Washington, DC at noontime Eastern at 802 00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:06,960 Speaker 2: Bloomberg dot com.