WEBVTT - Positively Gam: Black History Saved my Life w/ John Lucas & Ernest Crim III 0:00:00.480 --> 0:00:04.320 I just honestly feel like we need to have our 0:00:04.360 --> 0:00:08.840 own education programs for our children, because this is all 0:00:09.160 --> 0:00:13.280 by design. Us not knowing our history and not understanding 0:00:13.320 --> 0:00:17.000 who we are and where we came from is by design. 0:00:20.560 --> 0:00:24.800 What's up, everybody, I'm Gammy and this is positively gam 0:00:24.840 --> 0:00:28.600 Every week I have raw, in depth conversations with inspirational 0:00:28.680 --> 0:00:34.680 people pushing for change on everything from aging, relationships, politics, wellness, 0:00:34.800 --> 0:00:39.560 to the current issuing spacing the black community. So welcome everybody. 0:00:39.600 --> 0:00:42.840 In this episode, we're going to be discussing a really 0:00:42.880 --> 0:00:47.040 interesting and timely book entitled Black History Saved My Life 0:00:47.400 --> 0:00:50.199 by Ernest Krim The Third I had a friend that 0:00:50.280 --> 0:00:53.199 sent this book to me, and just the title alone 0:00:53.280 --> 0:00:58.000 really struck me. I really really believe so strongly that 0:00:58.200 --> 0:01:02.640 it is the last of knowledge that we have about 0:01:02.640 --> 0:01:08.520 our true history that keeps us so divided as a 0:01:08.600 --> 0:01:12.000 community and as a culture, and that is by design. 0:01:13.440 --> 0:01:17.440 Joining me on the podcast is John Lucas and Ernest Krim. 0:01:17.520 --> 0:01:21.319 John Lucas is an accomplished entertainment artist and president of 0:01:21.360 --> 0:01:25.200 the nonprofit organizations Step into the Light. Ernest is a 0:01:25.280 --> 0:01:29.000 high school teacher, activists and author of the book Black 0:01:29.040 --> 0:01:32.000 history saved my life, which is the topic of our discussion. 0:01:32.600 --> 0:01:35.039 So I want to start with you, John, because John 0:01:35.080 --> 0:01:38.040 and I met at a step in event. I am 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:41.080 I'm not from Chicago, but I love the Chicago step 0:01:41.400 --> 0:01:44.320 and that's where I met John and we became very 0:01:44.360 --> 0:01:48.440 good friends. You actually were the one that sent me 0:01:48.640 --> 0:01:51.680 the book. Yes, you sent me the book, that sent 0:01:51.760 --> 0:01:54.400 me Earnest book. So how did you and earnest me? 0:01:55.120 --> 0:01:57.680 The nonprofit that I have performing in my head? And 0:01:57.720 --> 0:01:59.600 I was like, I need to get back to the school. 0:02:00.000 --> 0:02:01.800 You know. I just got sick of going on social 0:02:01.800 --> 0:02:05.320 media and hearing about classmates having to bury their children 0:02:05.360 --> 0:02:08.080 they got shot, you know, or hearing that classmate's son 0:02:08.200 --> 0:02:11.120 is going to jail to do a bid whatever. And 0:02:11.160 --> 0:02:13.240 so I was like, let me go back and just 0:02:13.280 --> 0:02:16.000 see what I can do. So I still have connections there. 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:18.919 I know wonderful lady there that works in the principal's 0:02:18.919 --> 0:02:21.079 office who's one of the secretary of Her name is 0:02:21.160 --> 0:02:24.200 ms Ella Jenkins, and I've known her for a long 0:02:24.240 --> 0:02:26.239 time and so I was just telling her what I'm 0:02:26.240 --> 0:02:28.120 trying to do, and she was like, you need to 0:02:28.160 --> 0:02:32.120 meet Ernest Krim and and I she wasn't the first 0:02:32.120 --> 0:02:34.119 person to tell me that, but she was like, I'm 0:02:34.120 --> 0:02:36.720 going to see if he's available. And my other friend 0:02:36.720 --> 0:02:39.519 who also works at the school, she walked me down 0:02:39.600 --> 0:02:42.040 to his room, and that's where we first met and 0:02:42.040 --> 0:02:44.959 got a chance to talk and chat and and you know, 0:02:45.080 --> 0:02:46.600 just got a chance to get a feel for each 0:02:46.600 --> 0:02:49.600 other and what we're about. And I started to He 0:02:49.720 --> 0:02:52.920 actually has started a black student union at the high school, 0:02:53.440 --> 0:02:56.839 which I think is awesome because you know, usually black 0:02:56.840 --> 0:03:00.320 student unions start on the collegiate level, where you where 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:03.240 black kids can come together and talk about common issues. 0:03:03.280 --> 0:03:05.520 And so he would have me come in and allow 0:03:05.600 --> 0:03:07.239 me to come in and talk to the kids about 0:03:07.240 --> 0:03:10.040 my experiences and get a chance to connect with them 0:03:10.120 --> 0:03:13.079 so that those children can see my face. And so 0:03:13.360 --> 0:03:16.200 when he said, hey, I have this book, you know, 0:03:16.480 --> 0:03:18.720 I was more than happy to pass it along because 0:03:18.760 --> 0:03:22.200 he's doing wonderful things not just for the children, but 0:03:22.320 --> 0:03:24.639 for the community in which they live in and try 0:03:24.680 --> 0:03:27.880 to navigate. Ernest. So, tell the listeners a little about 0:03:27.880 --> 0:03:32.200 your background and why you decided to write the book. Yeah. 0:03:32.240 --> 0:03:34.640 So I'm from the South Side of Chicago, born in 0:03:34.680 --> 0:03:38.600 the late eighties, and I was raised by parents who 0:03:38.640 --> 0:03:42.120 were very aware, and I say I was blessed because 0:03:42.160 --> 0:03:45.240 I had parents who whenever I asked the question, whenever 0:03:45.280 --> 0:03:48.440 I had an inquiry, they always answered my question. I 0:03:48.560 --> 0:03:51.000 was that why why why? Why? Why? Kid? And they 0:03:51.040 --> 0:03:53.400 always had a response, and if they didn't have a response, 0:03:53.440 --> 0:03:55.680 they led me in that direction to find the answer. 0:03:55.680 --> 0:03:57.560 And this is before Google, so that's a big deal. 0:03:58.160 --> 0:04:01.120 We have the encyclopedias go on the basement. It was 0:04:01.160 --> 0:04:03.360 from the sixties though, don't get it twisted, but we 0:04:03.400 --> 0:04:05.760 still had a chance to read through them. Being caught 0:04:05.800 --> 0:04:07.680 in two worlds. Really on the South Side, like I 0:04:07.680 --> 0:04:10.040 saw my friends who were, you know, called up in 0:04:10.120 --> 0:04:11.960 the street life. But then I also had parents in 0:04:12.000 --> 0:04:13.760 the family who was like, that's not gonna be you 0:04:14.120 --> 0:04:15.840 like you going to college. We ain't gonna be able 0:04:15.840 --> 0:04:17.320 to get you all the Jordan's. We ain't gonna be 0:04:17.320 --> 0:04:19.200 able to get you everything you want, but we're gonna 0:04:19.200 --> 0:04:21.800 get you give you access to all the knowledge you need. 0:04:22.080 --> 0:04:24.080 And throughout my life I began to realize that I 0:04:24.120 --> 0:04:26.799 always had this question about our condition as black people, 0:04:26.800 --> 0:04:29.200 but I wasn't really connecting the dot yet. And I 0:04:29.240 --> 0:04:32.640 guess my inquiry started with, for one, not being able 0:04:32.680 --> 0:04:35.880 to be friends with a pair of twins white friends 0:04:35.880 --> 0:04:37.680 that I had that because they didn't want to come 0:04:37.680 --> 0:04:41.080 to our neighborhood. And then that snowballed into being nine 0:04:41.160 --> 0:04:43.160 years old and asking my mom why we had never 0:04:43.200 --> 0:04:45.120 had a black president, and then she told me that 0:04:45.160 --> 0:04:47.840 would be me. And then it became a situation where 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:50.720 I have a black friend from Nigeria who's kicked out 0:04:50.760 --> 0:04:52.880 of the Mount Greenwood neighborhood where I went to school 0:04:52.920 --> 0:04:55.720 because they were spray painting. Go back to African in words. 0:04:55.960 --> 0:04:58.000 So as you this is all before like the age 0:04:58.000 --> 0:05:00.880 of eleven. So I just kept having as your current theme. 0:05:01.160 --> 0:05:03.159 And my mom and dad were always in my life, 0:05:03.160 --> 0:05:05.080 Like I wanted to go to Denny's one time, as 0:05:05.080 --> 0:05:06.960 the readers will find out, and my mom was like, no, 0:05:07.040 --> 0:05:10.280 we ain't going because they don't serve black people, you know. 0:05:10.760 --> 0:05:15.800 So this all comes to a culmination in where my 0:05:15.839 --> 0:05:19.040 wife and I are at a festival in Chicago. Okay, 0:05:19.080 --> 0:05:20.960 hold on, hold on, I don't want to get to 0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:24.279 that yet. You have a motto earnest black children will 0:05:24.320 --> 0:05:28.640 perform better if they have pride in their history. Yes, 0:05:28.880 --> 0:05:31.400 and I would like to preface this by saying that 0:05:31.440 --> 0:05:34.000 we already know these things to be true, because, for example, 0:05:34.000 --> 0:05:36.040 I saw a study today by Harvard and they said 0:05:36.320 --> 0:05:38.560 the reason why there are so many black people in 0:05:38.640 --> 0:05:42.480 prison is because DNA systemic racism. So we know these 0:05:42.520 --> 0:05:45.279 things already. My life is a testament. John's life is 0:05:45.279 --> 0:05:47.800 a testament. Your life is a testament to your kids 0:05:47.800 --> 0:05:51.360 are as well. So this Harvard study says that when 0:05:51.400 --> 0:05:54.360 black children are talked to have racial pride, they perform 0:05:54.400 --> 0:05:57.960 better academically because they are aware of the hurdles they 0:05:58.000 --> 0:06:00.120 may come in contact with. And also, to me, it 0:06:00.120 --> 0:06:02.719 gives them prime to understanding that it's not their fault 0:06:02.920 --> 0:06:05.520 that these hurdles exist, but they exist, and this is 0:06:05.560 --> 0:06:08.080 how you work your way around them or dismantle them completely. 0:06:18.400 --> 0:06:21.200 I want to talk about some of the passages in 0:06:21.279 --> 0:06:24.440 the book that really resonated with me, and I want 0:06:24.440 --> 0:06:27.320 to start with a quote that you had in the 0:06:27.320 --> 0:06:31.560 book that we all that most black people are familiar with, 0:06:31.680 --> 0:06:36.400 and that is Malcolm X question is who taught you 0:06:36.440 --> 0:06:40.040 how to hate yourself? And that kind of in your 0:06:40.080 --> 0:06:43.960 book that leads you into the discussion about where this 0:06:44.080 --> 0:06:46.320 all began with slavery talked to us a little bit 0:06:46.320 --> 0:06:48.880 about that, and you know, I have to say, Malcolm 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:51.839 mex is probably to me the most important historical figure 0:06:51.880 --> 0:06:54.240 because I think, you know, he taught me how to 0:06:54.320 --> 0:06:57.200 value myself as a person. And what I discussed in 0:06:57.240 --> 0:06:59.279 that book is just really how I believe that we 0:06:59.360 --> 0:07:02.040 as African and Americans, as black people in this country 0:07:02.040 --> 0:07:05.160 were taught systemically to hate ourselves. Like we're at a 0:07:05.200 --> 0:07:08.279 place now where we're not technically on the plantation, but 0:07:08.320 --> 0:07:11.000 everything that we're taught and fed and bombarded with allows 0:07:11.080 --> 0:07:14.120 us to stay there mentally. And if you don't intervene 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:16.520 with the child, a black child, then they're going to 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:19.960 fall within that system just regularly. That's how we're supposed 0:07:20.000 --> 0:07:22.040 to be set up. If you think about the areas 0:07:22.080 --> 0:07:24.560 of which we populate the most in this system, which 0:07:24.560 --> 0:07:27.160 I'll talk about in the book, we're overrepresented in the 0:07:27.200 --> 0:07:33.760 prison population, were overrepresented in in in sports, basketball, football, ramping, 0:07:33.960 --> 0:07:36.680 you know, But we don't have ownership in these companies, 0:07:37.120 --> 0:07:39.480 you know. So my thing is if we if they 0:07:40.000 --> 0:07:43.280 quote allowed us to get into these systems without any 0:07:43.320 --> 0:07:46.240 barriers anymore, you know, shout out to Jackie Robinson, Bill 0:07:46.320 --> 0:07:49.560 russeling people like that, and we completely dominated it. Then 0:07:49.600 --> 0:07:52.080 what would happen if we knew what we could actually 0:07:52.160 --> 0:07:55.080 be outside of that, because that's the trick they plays. 0:07:55.200 --> 0:07:57.360 We were talking about this yesterday, John, the fact that 0:07:58.280 --> 0:08:00.240 we can only go as far as we expose too. 0:08:00.920 --> 0:08:03.200 Because we always see the rappers on TV, we see 0:08:03.200 --> 0:08:05.240 the athletes on TV. We don't understand that the person 0:08:05.360 --> 0:08:08.120 sitting up in that box office, the box were signing 0:08:08.160 --> 0:08:10.200 the check has way more money than the whole team. 0:08:10.720 --> 0:08:13.160 And feel free to jump in, John, you said, I 0:08:13.200 --> 0:08:16.000 see you shaking your head. I think that it's important. 0:08:16.040 --> 0:08:18.800 One thing that I always try to tell kids, but 0:08:18.880 --> 0:08:22.160 especially their parents, A child's gaze is only as far 0:08:22.400 --> 0:08:26.040 as their parents, their family, and the people in their community. 0:08:26.160 --> 0:08:28.680 If they the people in the community actually want to 0:08:28.720 --> 0:08:32.600 give the information. If the community's gaze is limited, then 0:08:32.640 --> 0:08:35.560 the child's gaze is going to be limited. And so 0:08:36.240 --> 0:08:39.480 and unfortunately one problem we do have to say, we 0:08:39.480 --> 0:08:42.280 don't share information with one another. A lot of times 0:08:42.320 --> 0:08:45.080 there are just simple, you know, things that you think 0:08:45.120 --> 0:08:48.560 as menial that could change the life of someone else 0:08:48.600 --> 0:08:52.120 if they just had that tidbit of information or encouragement. 0:08:52.720 --> 0:08:55.120 So I think we need to really work to get 0:08:55.120 --> 0:08:59.040 the information to our youth so that to broaden their 0:08:59.080 --> 0:09:02.280 kind of spectrum. You will on what could be possible 0:09:02.400 --> 0:09:04.880 and show up so that they can see that it 0:09:05.000 --> 0:09:09.320 is possible. You know, kids believe what they see. Okay, 0:09:09.320 --> 0:09:12.120 So this brings us to another quote I want to 0:09:12.120 --> 0:09:15.600 read from the book Earnest, and that is on page 0:09:15.640 --> 0:09:18.680 one eighty. You say, if history has taught us anything, 0:09:19.200 --> 0:09:24.040 it's that racist whites will continue their destructive tendencies. So 0:09:24.120 --> 0:09:27.920 what must change is our approach. We must change our 0:09:28.000 --> 0:09:32.120 perception of ourselves. Are you beautiful to yourself? Do you 0:09:32.200 --> 0:09:36.880 love your skin, your nose, your lips, your hips? Do 0:09:36.920 --> 0:09:43.080 you hate your august, volutinous parentheses, nappy hair? What do 0:09:43.160 --> 0:09:46.000 you see when you look in the mirror? Because I 0:09:46.040 --> 0:09:49.760 feel like, how can we expect to be treated with 0:09:50.040 --> 0:09:54.600 dignity and respect if we don't truly believe that we 0:09:54.960 --> 0:09:59.719 deserve it? And so do the kids really and honestly 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:05.480 trust that they are worthy? I would answer that adamantly 0:10:05.520 --> 0:10:08.200 with the no. And again it goes back to the program. 0:10:08.200 --> 0:10:10.240 And this is also as connected to the Malcolm X 0:10:10.360 --> 0:10:13.480 quote you brought up earlier. When we grow up, everything 0:10:13.520 --> 0:10:16.280 we hear about black is negative. Think about the scene 0:10:16.280 --> 0:10:18.480 in the Malcolm X movie. You think about the fact 0:10:18.480 --> 0:10:20.400 that we're not speaking our first language. So when you 0:10:20.440 --> 0:10:23.280 see the connotation of what black is in the English dictionary, 0:10:23.480 --> 0:10:26.240 it always means something negative, whereas when we're talking about 0:10:26.280 --> 0:10:29.560 ancient Egypt or kimm it, it meant something glorious and regal. 0:10:29.800 --> 0:10:32.680 So when we when we crack jokes as kids, you 0:10:32.679 --> 0:10:35.240 know we're talking, oh you dark, you as dark as this, 0:10:35.360 --> 0:10:38.640 your your wife knows, your big lips, your your bogus hair. 0:10:39.080 --> 0:10:41.719 Everything that we used to demean each other is a 0:10:41.840 --> 0:10:45.920 relation and directly to our natural African esthetic. And I 0:10:45.960 --> 0:10:49.000 think that's something that again when we're pushing our kids 0:10:49.000 --> 0:10:51.080 to the school system, if we don't intervene, like I 0:10:51.120 --> 0:10:53.640 was saying before, then they're that's all they're gonna believe. 0:10:53.720 --> 0:10:56.360 Our kids are saying, you know, the pledge every day, 0:10:56.400 --> 0:10:59.079 even on Zoom virtual calls, but they're not making a 0:10:59.160 --> 0:11:01.440 pledge to themselves else, they're not making a players to 0:11:01.440 --> 0:11:05.200 their blackness. They're not seeing positive attributes. And again, for me, 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:08.199 if we don't have something that's I think from right 0:11:08.200 --> 0:11:09.960 now at this point in history, what we understand is 0:11:09.960 --> 0:11:13.280 that we have to have some type of at homeschooling 0:11:13.360 --> 0:11:16.480 system set up that's in conjunction with what they learned. 0:11:16.480 --> 0:11:18.400 So it's like, Yo, what did you learn in history 0:11:18.400 --> 0:11:20.559 class today? Oh, Columbus of the Ocean blow and fort 0:11:20.679 --> 0:11:23.600 Unity two? Let me tell you what he did right after? Yeah, 0:11:23.880 --> 0:11:27.880 that's so true. That's that's so true because you know, 0:11:27.960 --> 0:11:30.840 I have to use the Jewish culture as an example. 0:11:31.559 --> 0:11:34.760 You know, the Jewish culture is not putting the responsibility 0:11:34.960 --> 0:11:40.319 on public education or any private school to teach their 0:11:40.440 --> 0:11:44.559 children their history and their religion, you know. And I 0:11:44.960 --> 0:11:49.160 just honestly feel like we need to have our own 0:11:49.320 --> 0:11:53.720 education programs for our children. Whether it's because this is 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:57.560 all by design us not knowing our history and not 0:11:57.760 --> 0:12:01.080 understanding who we are and where we came from is 0:12:01.160 --> 0:12:05.920 by design, you know, And we've got to be responsible 0:12:06.559 --> 0:12:11.800 for taking control over the information that goes into our kids. 0:12:11.840 --> 0:12:15.439 As exactly I was gonna say that. It's also it's 0:12:15.520 --> 0:12:17.679 before you even start to school, just to have a comment, 0:12:17.800 --> 0:12:20.880 just a regular conversation with your child. I think a 0:12:20.920 --> 0:12:25.160 lot of these children's their minds are not being stretched, 0:12:25.160 --> 0:12:28.200 if you will, buy their own parents or their family members. 0:12:28.280 --> 0:12:31.079 I think one of the biggest mistakes that a lot 0:12:31.120 --> 0:12:34.840 of black parents make is believing that because their child 0:12:34.920 --> 0:12:38.480 has a black parents and black siblings, they must love 0:12:38.520 --> 0:12:42.800 black people automatically. And that is not the case. Just 0:12:42.840 --> 0:12:44.839 because you grew up in a black family doesn't mean 0:12:44.880 --> 0:12:48.840 you love black people because the society and in the 0:12:49.160 --> 0:12:51.199 all the imagery and so on and so forth, and 0:12:51.280 --> 0:12:54.040 the media has taught you not to love your people 0:12:54.240 --> 0:12:57.440 before you even realize it, you know, So make sure 0:12:57.600 --> 0:12:59.680 you know, making sure that we're able to just have 0:12:59.800 --> 0:13:03.720 a honest dialogue with our children. I think this book 0:13:03.760 --> 0:13:06.839 is so great because a lot of our history that 0:13:06.880 --> 0:13:10.120 we have here a lot of times was not talked 0:13:10.160 --> 0:13:14.120 about by our our seniors, if you will, because if 0:13:14.120 --> 0:13:16.560 it came trauma, and they didn't want to talk about 0:13:16.600 --> 0:13:20.240 it because they would relive the trauma. But unfortunately, we 0:13:20.400 --> 0:13:22.320 get the short end of the stick because we don't 0:13:22.320 --> 0:13:24.400 get our history. But in order for us to get it, 0:13:24.480 --> 0:13:27.680 they have to relive that trauma. And so it's always 0:13:27.679 --> 0:13:29.959 that conflict there. A lot of our great grandparents and 0:13:30.000 --> 0:13:32.720 grandparents wouldn't tell us about how they had to flee 0:13:33.080 --> 0:13:35.080 to get out of the South to make it North 0:13:35.160 --> 0:13:38.280 for a better life because it was traumatic for them. 0:13:38.320 --> 0:13:40.840 But as is, you get a group of you get 0:13:40.840 --> 0:13:43.960 a generation of kids that don't appreciate what's done for 0:13:44.040 --> 0:13:58.960 them to get them where they are. So true, so true. So, Ernest, 0:13:59.080 --> 0:14:04.480 you drafted it a lesson that you described as the 0:14:04.600 --> 0:14:08.040 lesson of your career, and it was around the Trayvon 0:14:08.520 --> 0:14:12.360 Martin murder. Yeah. So you know what was interesting about 0:14:12.520 --> 0:14:15.040 that whole experience was now, when I look in hindsight, 0:14:15.400 --> 0:14:18.760 I devoted five chapters to the trauma that I dealt 0:14:18.760 --> 0:14:21.560 with surrounded black men and woman being killed. And this 0:14:21.720 --> 0:14:24.480 work when I released it a couple of months before 0:14:24.960 --> 0:14:28.360 this whole incident happened with Black Lives Matter. So when 0:14:28.400 --> 0:14:30.360 I was talking about in that situation right there with 0:14:30.400 --> 0:14:32.880 Trayvon Martin, it was one of the first times that 0:14:33.040 --> 0:14:35.880 story had been reached on a global scale. It was 0:14:35.920 --> 0:14:37.800 something even though we didn't have video, it was something 0:14:37.800 --> 0:14:40.320 that everybody heard about. We were all watching the NBA 0:14:40.400 --> 0:14:42.760 All Star Game and then we all heard the call 0:14:42.840 --> 0:14:45.480 when we heard the screens and the gunshots, and I 0:14:45.520 --> 0:14:47.880 just remember that was like my first second year teaching, 0:14:48.320 --> 0:14:51.160 having to go to work the next day with that 0:14:51.200 --> 0:14:53.760 weight on me was something I just couldn't really fathom 0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:56.360 the only other time I had heard something like that 0:14:56.480 --> 0:14:59.000 or seeing something similar was with the Oscar Grant situation 0:14:59.080 --> 0:15:00.720 and I was still in co it. So we can 0:15:00.760 --> 0:15:02.600 go to class and talk about it. So for me 0:15:02.720 --> 0:15:06.359 is I don't care what I have planned today. My mindset, 0:15:06.440 --> 0:15:09.120 my kids mindset is the most important thing right now. 0:15:09.160 --> 0:15:11.440 And again that's something that we're doing often discussing school. 0:15:11.600 --> 0:15:14.720 We have physical education, but not mental education. So I 0:15:14.760 --> 0:15:16.960 went there and it was like a spurred the moment thing. 0:15:17.040 --> 0:15:19.040 And maybe that's why I think I'm I'd be able 0:15:19.080 --> 0:15:20.600 to talk about things on the drop of a dime 0:15:20.640 --> 0:15:23.160 because I just said, what can I do to make 0:15:23.240 --> 0:15:26.400 this a real to them? So I grabbed the box 0:15:26.680 --> 0:15:28.960 and I typed up a sheet real quick, and it 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:31.280 was like, basically, you know, you know what it what 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:33.240 it means to be trade von Martin, what it means 0:15:33.240 --> 0:15:34.720 to be a black young man, what it means to 0:15:34.720 --> 0:15:37.400 be a black young lady. And it was a powerful demonstration, 0:15:37.400 --> 0:15:39.120 and they put these in the boxing. It was something 0:15:39.120 --> 0:15:41.600 that they were able to embrace. But I always remember 0:15:41.640 --> 0:15:45.560 that student of mine adamantly against it because he's like well, look, 0:15:45.600 --> 0:15:47.960 we you know, our dudes dying every day in the streets. 0:15:48.000 --> 0:15:50.160 Why does this matter to me? Why should I care? 0:15:50.600 --> 0:15:53.080 And I really distinctively remember hearing that, because, for one, 0:15:53.120 --> 0:15:55.200 it did make me even question that because we're hearing 0:15:55.200 --> 0:15:57.400 about all the death in Chicago. There was a dairy 0:15:57.480 --> 0:16:00.880 and our situation, Blair Hope situation, and somebody is caught 0:16:00.880 --> 0:16:02.760 on camera with the c T A buss and everything, 0:16:03.080 --> 0:16:04.800 and I really have to think about it. And then 0:16:05.120 --> 0:16:06.680 you know, you hear that all the time, now what 0:16:06.720 --> 0:16:08.880 about black on black crime? And I had to come 0:16:08.920 --> 0:16:11.120 to the conclusion to let him know, it's an entire system, 0:16:11.160 --> 0:16:13.720 young man. What you see happen in tray Von Martin 0:16:13.680 --> 0:16:16.400 and George Zimmerman is the same reason why you walk 0:16:16.440 --> 0:16:18.440 and get killed in your neighborhood and nobody cares, the 0:16:18.480 --> 0:16:20.640 same reason why guns and drugs are allowed to be 0:16:20.720 --> 0:16:23.240 funneled into your neighborhood without anybody care. But just to 0:16:23.240 --> 0:16:25.160 wrap it up and bring it back around, I just 0:16:25.200 --> 0:16:27.920 felt that they had to see something and feels something 0:16:27.960 --> 0:16:30.160 to let them know what they are and what they aren't. 0:16:30.320 --> 0:16:33.600 Because when they put up those gun range pictures of 0:16:33.640 --> 0:16:36.040 Trayvon Martin with a hoodie and they put up a 0:16:36.080 --> 0:16:38.920 picture of him grimace and like a child having fun, 0:16:39.000 --> 0:16:40.600 as if that was something bad, or they tried to 0:16:40.640 --> 0:16:43.240 talk about him with marijuana used just to demonize him. 0:16:43.440 --> 0:16:46.080 It's just age old pattern of trying to criminalize us 0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:49.960 to justify their pernicious activity. So I felt like that 0:16:50.080 --> 0:16:52.320 was like my the beginning of me saying, you know what, 0:16:52.480 --> 0:16:55.000 whenever we have something like this happened, we're talking about 0:16:55.000 --> 0:16:57.560 it right now. The lesson will happen eventually, But what 0:16:57.600 --> 0:17:00.400 was the actual lesson? What did you actually have them do? 0:17:00.960 --> 0:17:03.160 So they had it was a sheet of paper and 0:17:03.200 --> 0:17:05.280 they had to write down, you know, I am Trey 0:17:05.359 --> 0:17:08.600 von Martin. Then they put a bunch of positive adjectives 0:17:08.720 --> 0:17:10.920 under that, so it was something that they can see. 0:17:11.320 --> 0:17:12.960 You know, it's something that I do even now when 0:17:12.960 --> 0:17:16.399 I'm speaking, it's who are you actually? The media says 0:17:16.480 --> 0:17:19.560 you're this, Yeah, but you are like Tray Von Martin, 0:17:19.600 --> 0:17:22.840 you are actually this. And just because that man wanted 0:17:22.920 --> 0:17:25.640 to follow you home, and just because that person thought 0:17:25.680 --> 0:17:27.320 you were a criminal, that is not You are not 0:17:27.400 --> 0:17:30.280 the archetype. You don't actually fit the profile. And they 0:17:30.280 --> 0:17:32.280 were actually able to put this in a box, and 0:17:32.280 --> 0:17:34.720 it was something that they can see as you take 0:17:34.760 --> 0:17:37.880 it out afterwards, you are someone who actually is outside 0:17:37.880 --> 0:17:41.399 of that box, that paradigmin that stereotype that lesson upbout 0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:44.120 the trade Von Martin. I think about what's going on 0:17:44.560 --> 0:17:47.480 in the world today and I feel like I could 0:17:47.520 --> 0:17:50.359 be wrong, but I feel like it's something that still 0:17:50.400 --> 0:17:54.280 applies today. Do you still use that in the classroom today? 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:58.440 You're accurate in the fact that it's still irrelevant. Restructured 0:17:58.480 --> 0:18:00.320 it quite quite a bit now because of the thing, 0:18:00.359 --> 0:18:02.959 of course is digital and virtual right now. But it's 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:05.119 still something I do and because I speak to a 0:18:05.119 --> 0:18:07.240 lot of kids now in the area across the country, 0:18:07.520 --> 0:18:10.080 I'll do something similar with that activity, especially if I'm 0:18:10.080 --> 0:18:12.160 working with a smaller group. And I guess the most 0:18:12.200 --> 0:18:15.040 disheartening thing is the fact that it is very relevant 0:18:15.160 --> 0:18:16.720 and I think we can see it now more than 0:18:16.720 --> 0:18:19.000 ever because and I've had to stop myself. I don't 0:18:19.040 --> 0:18:21.840 watch those videos anymore because it does something to my psyche. 0:18:22.000 --> 0:18:24.119 But again, if our kids are always seeing this and 0:18:24.160 --> 0:18:27.920 then they're watching, you know, violent movies, playing violent video games, again, 0:18:28.040 --> 0:18:31.600 juxtaposed that to what the media portrays us as athletes 0:18:32.000 --> 0:18:35.359 and criminals, and we're all in a sense, we're often 0:18:35.440 --> 0:18:38.400 choosing that same thing on our own will. So it's 0:18:38.440 --> 0:18:42.160 definitely relevant unfortunately, but I'm hoping that it it impacts 0:18:42.240 --> 0:18:44.600 us in a way that allows us to research our 0:18:44.680 --> 0:18:47.480 history more and portray ourselves differently too. And what's even 0:18:47.520 --> 0:18:51.000 more sad is that, now look at all the different 0:18:51.119 --> 0:18:54.800 names that you can insert into that lesson. Besides Trayvon Martin, 0:18:54.920 --> 0:18:57.600 you can use George Floyd, you can use any number 0:18:57.600 --> 0:19:01.880 of names. So it's just really discardening. And that's that's 0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:04.639 still a small percentage of all of all, you know, 0:19:04.840 --> 0:19:06.240 and that's I think that's what a lot of people 0:19:06.280 --> 0:19:11.120 also don't realize. That could be like ten of what 0:19:11.119 --> 0:19:15.080 what has really transpired with police mutality. We only know 0:19:15.240 --> 0:19:18.320 those because that was captured on film. It was captured 0:19:18.320 --> 0:19:30.280 on film. Absolutely. So now I want to move on 0:19:30.480 --> 0:19:34.399 to discuss the hate crime that you and your wife 0:19:34.480 --> 0:19:37.280 were victims of. Tell us a little bit about that 0:19:37.359 --> 0:19:42.000 earnest and you said that actually went viral in the media. 0:19:42.080 --> 0:19:45.040 Can you describe the incident for us? Yeah, So, just 0:19:45.119 --> 0:19:48.679 to provide some context, it was four years ago. My 0:19:48.760 --> 0:19:51.000 wife and I had just gotten back from Jamaica, and 0:19:51.000 --> 0:19:53.920 it was like around the time of July, there have 0:19:54.000 --> 0:19:56.120 been a lot of incidents just now. There was Philando 0:19:56.200 --> 0:19:58.959 Castile who was shot on Facebook Live. There was Elton 0:19:59.040 --> 0:20:02.680 Sterling who was murdered for selling bootleg CDs in Louisiana. 0:20:03.040 --> 0:20:05.640 So we wanted to take our mind off of that hysteria. 0:20:05.720 --> 0:20:07.159 And then we also knew in the back of our 0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:08.679 head that we had to go back to school as 0:20:08.680 --> 0:20:10.760 soon as teachers. So the a lot of thirty if 0:20:10.800 --> 0:20:13.760 we go to this festival in Chicago, and then we're 0:20:13.760 --> 0:20:16.320 having a great time as music, as you know, a 0:20:16.359 --> 0:20:18.919 lot of people, as food, all of that. So towards 0:20:18.920 --> 0:20:20.880 the end of the event, we're decided to head out 0:20:20.880 --> 0:20:23.240 and I noticed there was an open being bad game 0:20:23.320 --> 0:20:26.240 that's called cornhole, So usually at a function like this 0:20:26.320 --> 0:20:28.800 you can't really find that station being open, so I 0:20:29.200 --> 0:20:32.080 realized that we walked over there, I noticed they only 0:20:32.119 --> 0:20:34.720 had one being bag, so that was the issue, of course. 0:20:35.040 --> 0:20:37.399 So I looked to my left and then I noticed 0:20:37.440 --> 0:20:39.680